Latest / The Midlife Momma Podcast - Empty nest mom, Parenting adult children, Midlife transition, Christian mom / 242. How to Stay Steady When Your Adult Child is Struggling with Therapist Carol Moore

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242. How to Stay Steady When Your Adult Child is Struggling with Therapist Carol Moore · The Midlife Momma Podcast - Empty nest mom, Parenting adult children, Midlife transition, Christian mom

• 0:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Christian parenting.
• 0:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome to the Midlife Mama podcast, the place for faith friendship and real talk for emptiness moms.
• 0:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm your host Pamela Hengman and I'm so glad you've tuned in.
• 0:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's nothing easy about watching your child struggle, whether they're making choices you don't agree with dealing with this appointment or simply having a hard season.
• 0:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: Every mom wants to step in and make it better.
• 0:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: But when does helping become rescuing?
• 0:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: And how do we manage our own fear and emotions?
• 0:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: So we can actually be a steady presence for our kids.
• 0:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Today, I'm talking with therapist Carol Moore.
• 0:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: No, not Instagram is Hey Mom.
• 0:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: Carol is a therapist coach, writer, and author of Bridges, Not Barriers.
• 0:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: A mother of two grown sons, she brings together her professional background and counseling psychology with her lived experience of motherhood.
• 0:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: Today we'll talk about how to stay calm, connected, and supportive when your adult child is struggling.
• 0:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome, Carol.
• 0:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
• 1:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Thanks for having me.
• 1:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: I would love you to tell us the heart behind your wildly popular Instagram account, Hey Mom.
• 1:09
  [SPEAKER_00]: All, that's a great question.
• 1:10
  [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you for asking.
• 1:11
  [SPEAKER_00]: I have to really say that was a call by the Holy Spirit.
• 1:15
  [SPEAKER_00]: For me, gosh, it's been almost four years, five years ago.
• 1:18
  [SPEAKER_00]: And I had gone through a difficult season.
• 1:22
  [SPEAKER_00]: What are my kings?
• 1:24
  [SPEAKER_00]: What's a little bit challenging for me?
• 1:26
  [SPEAKER_00]: And I felt like I had someone crapped a cone and I felt compelled to share it.
• 1:31
  [SPEAKER_00]: And so I was not familiar with social media, really.
• 1:34
  [SPEAKER_00]: I had no expertise at all and so I just went into the media and just started writing my feelings and then I just grew and I continued to evolve as my kids have grown and again, I continued to let the whole spirit guide this page because I don't feel like it's mine.
• 1:48
  [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like it's his.
• 1:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's awesome.
• 1:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: I love it.
• 1:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's so encouraging.
• 1:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's so honest.
• 1:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're vulnerable.
• 1:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think you offer just a sweet perspective.
• 1:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that moms can relate to why would you say it's so emotionally difficult for moms to watch an adult child struggle.
• 2:08
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think this might be one of the deepest challenges of motherhood because for so many years we have control over our children's for a lot of the parts of their lives, we're spending time with what they're doing for a long time, what they're eating, what they're wearing and then they grow up and they start to make their own choices and they struggle, they're going to struggle inevitably, but we're not, we're no longer really in a space where we should be controlling
• 2:33
  [SPEAKER_00]: these decisions and outcomes.
• 2:35
  [SPEAKER_00]: And so it's loving them the same way as we did when they were home and little, but having to learn new approaches to letting them navigate their own life and an Atari scary.
• 2:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think that's the crux of it.
• 2:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's learning to do it a different way.
• 2:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: We can't swoop in and rescue.
• 2:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: We literally have to have this kind of hands off.
• 2:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's see what happens.
• 2:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's see what they can do.
• 2:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's help them be responsible for themselves.
• 3:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's
• 3:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: What do you think happens inside of us when fear takes over?
• 3:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Every mom can relate to this, the sleepless nights, the worry that what's going to happen.
• 3:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: Why do you think we immediately want to fix or advise or rescue or control?
• 3:19
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think it comes down to read this one, our kids feel, okay, really.
• 3:22
  [SPEAKER_00]: We want them to be safe, we want them to be in good relationships, we want them to be healthy, we want them to make sound decisions and sometimes they don't.
• 3:32
  [SPEAKER_00]: And I think that's part of their journey, but letting them have this part of their journey is a huge act of letting go.
• 3:40
  [SPEAKER_00]: Because this is the place where our kids grow.
• 3:42
  [SPEAKER_00]: This is Renee Bell, the resiliency.
• 3:43
  [SPEAKER_00]: This is where they may find their faith.
• 3:46
  [SPEAKER_00]: It's in the heart moments, but it's painful for us to watch someone we love, go through heart moments.
• 3:53
  [SPEAKER_00]: It just is really painful.
• 3:54
  [SPEAKER_00]: So what do we do with that pain?
• 3:58
  [SPEAKER_00]: My tool really is relying on God and trusting that he has got my children and he's got them on a path that's specific redesign for them and that includes them really hard stuff that happens to them.
• 4:12
  [SPEAKER_00]: I will turn to that comfort when I'm really worried or when something's going not well.
• 4:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: And I think it's also important to remember
• 4:21
  [SPEAKER_00]: our lives, some of their lives, I think, because they live at home for 18 more or more years, our lives feel very intertwined.
• 4:29
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think there is that, like, two abilical chords and one really never wants to get kind, and realizing that their struggles are not our struggles, they're not ours to carry their theirs.
• 4:39
  [SPEAKER_00]: Our journalists to guide and to support what when they ask, but it's really not our parents to own.
• 4:45
  [SPEAKER_00]: It's not fair to take them from them.
• 4:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ooh, that's so good.
• 4:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: Did you hear that, Mama?
• 4:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's not fair for us to take them from them.
• 4:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think this idea of understanding that we literally are separate from our kids, our adult kids stand alone.
• 5:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: They are autonomous.
• 5:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that's part of the goal, the dream, the job of moms is to allow our kids to be autonomous, to make their own choices, to build their own relationship with God.
• 5:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: way more challenging than we ever would have anticipated, right?
• 5:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, moms have to get comfortable with their kids being uncomfortable.
• 5:29
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, kids mind, I've got through heart breaks and difficult things and it makes me really uncomfortable when my kids are in pain and I had to get to some level of being comfortable with them being uncomfortable.
• 5:42
  [SPEAKER_00]: So how did you do that?
• 5:44
  [SPEAKER_00]: What does that look like?
• 5:46
  [SPEAKER_00]: It's a lot of self-talk, a lot of talking to my husband, a lot of processing, a lot of prayer, when even conversations with my kids about it, they will talk about a relationship that might not be going well or decision to get a tattoo or a speeding ticket when processing with them and allowing them to, to navigate it first because if we step in and try to navigate for them, we're doing a disservice and our kids, oh.
• 6:11
  [SPEAKER_00]: They're amazing.
• 6:12
  [SPEAKER_00]: They have great wisdom, and God is equipping them to Nampugate-based difficulties.
• 6:18
  [SPEAKER_00]: We're not God in their lives.
• 6:20
  [SPEAKER_00]: We're not the one that can see where they're going or where he's taking them.
• 6:23
  [SPEAKER_00]: So what you might think is like helping Nampugate actually be a deterrent to grow for that God isn't tending for them.
• 6:31
  [SPEAKER_00]: So what's uncomfortable for me, I remind myself that this is God's plan and to direct you for my kids and he's got them.
• 6:37
  [SPEAKER_00]: He's with them.
• 6:37
  [SPEAKER_00]: He's not left them.
• 6:39
  [SPEAKER_00]: And so that helps me be less uncomfortable.
• 6:43
  [SPEAKER_00]: Not that it takes it completely away, but it gives me some peace.
• 6:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, we work on our just our connection with God in going to him with this understanding that he knows everything.
• 6:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: A 100% knows what's going on with our adult children and he's just saying trust me with it, just trust me with it.
• 7:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's just part of the growth or moms in this season.
• 7:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oops, did I just say that?
• 7:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: We've all been there one tiny comment and suddenly you're adult child pulls away or shuts down.
• 7:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: As moms, we mean well, but some phrases do more harm than good.
• 7:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's why I created a free guide just for you.
• 7:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: 10 things not to say to your adult child and five ways to stop yourself from saying them.
• 7:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's packed with practical wisdom to help you speak with love, not regret.
• 7:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: Grab your copy today at the link in the show notes.
• 7:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: and start buildingconnection.conflict.
• 7:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now let's get back to our conversation.
• 7:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: So what would you say to a mom who just doesn't know how to remain emotionally steady?
• 7:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: What are some things that she could do?
• 7:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: Are there any things that you've done specifically with your sons?
• 7:56
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's important for our mom to notice to understand her triggers, because often times our biggest struggles are something that's unhealed in ourselves.
• 8:05
  [SPEAKER_00]: So if maybe we feel like our child is being left out of something, maybe that's something that happened us and we haven't really healed that.
• 8:12
  [SPEAKER_00]: So I think where the deepest trigger is the deepest healing in ourselves personally.
• 8:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think we can navigate this journey with our adult children unless we are healing ourselves.
• 8:24
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's imperative to being able to allow them to grow and make mistakes.
• 8:28
  [SPEAKER_00]: Look in, first, I had to look in, even when my, especially when my son was a teenager, I had to look into my own stuff to see why I was named for Gerd by his step.
• 8:40
  [SPEAKER_00]: And when I began to heal, our relationship began to really heal and grow.
• 8:44
  [SPEAKER_00]: Because we really can't control what they're doing, but we can control our mental state and our mental health.
• 8:50
  [SPEAKER_00]: And if that's solid and sturdy,
• 8:53
  [SPEAKER_00]: And we're going to be able to navigate, tolerate, allow a lot more discomfort.
• 8:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: That's happening in their lives.
• 9:01
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure if that answered your question.
• 9:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, no, that was good.
• 9:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: You said pay attention to your triggers because oftentimes it's.
• 9:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: When a child is experiencing something that triggers us, then we're like, now I feel like them, when really it's an indication of a place that you just need the Lord to heal that in you.
• 9:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And when the Lord is healed that, then you're able to maintain this steadiness because I think that's what our adult kids need when they're struggling.
• 9:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: They need us to be steady.
• 9:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: They don't need us to be
• 9:35
  [SPEAKER_00]: us to be regulated so they can be disregulated and that makes us safe and that makes us a place that they can come to and share what's going on and that has been my whole goal and really a lot of my message on my Instagram pages be the place where your kids can come to talk because they have choices when they're little they don't it's kind of or no one and maybe their friends but as they become adults and get married and even
• 9:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: they don't have to come and talk to us about anything.
• 10:02
  [SPEAKER_00]: It's a choice and I've always wanted it to be a choice and for that and for me to be one of our choices it has to feel safe.
• 10:08
  [SPEAKER_00]: Me if I have to say a lot less than I suppose what I'm saying.
• 10:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's a map of key.
• 10:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Fail lot less than we want to say.
• 10:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: So what are the things are you doing to become a safe place for your sons?
• 10:23
  [SPEAKER_00]: like we just said, saying a lot less than I want to say.
• 10:26
  [SPEAKER_00]: I have to listen.
• 10:27
  [SPEAKER_00]: They might be talking about something that I know is not good for them, or don't want for their life, or don't agree, but if I was to come in and state my opinion, or my perspective, like that's not really what they need, or how to ask for in that situation.
• 10:42
  [SPEAKER_00]: And really what they want is to process.
• 10:45
  [SPEAKER_00]: And so if I can be a place where they can, like my goal is for them to get there on their own.
• 10:50
  [SPEAKER_00]: in the processing so they can process with me without me giving them a lot of advice or information.
• 10:56
  [SPEAKER_00]: And then I think we're both winning.
• 10:58
  [SPEAKER_00]: And then if they do ask, I mean, I had my son come with me during a break up and I asked him very clearly at this late night, he came over to you on and I just find out you wanted to listen, he's like, no, please give me advice.
• 11:10
  [SPEAKER_00]: And so that opens that opened up an opportunity.
• 11:13
  [SPEAKER_00]: And then I did, but I still think when he really needed
• 11:19
  [SPEAKER_00]: down because we spent years teaching like that didn't just go away when they turned 18 those all of bad, all of those conversations remain in there and they have a lot of internal wisdom and they really just need to say it out loud somewhere that they're not going to be judged and they're not going to be the untouched really or ashamed and that they can just go through and go through it with someone who can just hold face and so that's what I try to do
• 11:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: revolve in there.
• 11:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: We have all been there and go, boy, I would really like to say something right now, but I know that would not be good.
• 11:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know that would not be good.
• 11:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: So holding space and not being judgmental, not being critical, I love that you asked your son the question, do you want me to just listen or you need some advice?
• 12:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think it's so good.
• 12:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: to be okay with whatever our kids want.
• 12:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, that's growth for moms, to just step back and say, do you want me to listen or do you want advice?
• 12:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: If we did that alone, think what that could do for our relationships.
• 12:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: All of them, all of our relationships, all of them too.
• 12:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Our husbands, our girlfriends, you name them.
• 12:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: What has healthy support actually sound like?
• 12:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: When an adult child has made a poor decision, what does that look like in the real world?
• 12:41
  [SPEAKER_00]: The first word that comes to mind is grace.
• 12:43
  [SPEAKER_00]: I want my kids to make bad choices and bad decisions.
• 12:46
  [SPEAKER_00]: Hopefully they're not catastrophic.
• 12:47
  [SPEAKER_00]: That's been my goal that the more mistakes they make, the more they learn and the more resilient they become.
• 12:53
  [SPEAKER_00]: My goal is always to give grace.
• 12:54
  [SPEAKER_00]: I certainly made my share of mistakes.
• 12:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: I expect them to make mistakes and to come in with let's judge injury.
• 13:01
  [SPEAKER_00]: That's not who I want to be.
• 13:02
  [SPEAKER_00]: I want to be counsel.
• 13:03
  [SPEAKER_00]: I want to be the support for that.
• 13:05
  [SPEAKER_00]: And so yeah.
• 13:06
  [SPEAKER_00]: And again, with the shame, I don't, my kids ever feel like they've made a mistake.
• 13:10
  [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm around that they are ashamed to come to me and they are embarrassed or like, no, you know, I've tried to make it very clear.
• 13:16
  [SPEAKER_00]: There's nothing you can, nothing you can do.
• 13:19
  [SPEAKER_00]: That would make me love you less or think less of you.
• 13:22
  [SPEAKER_00]: This is just your process.
• 13:23
  [SPEAKER_00]: So I think I think the word is grace.
• 13:25
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think this is our kids need.
• 13:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: I love that too.
• 13:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, let's never shame our kids because that's not going to get us anywhere.
• 13:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: The same grace that is extended to us is extended to our kids.
• 13:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's just the beauty of the savior, right?
• 13:40
  [SPEAKER_00]: Amen.
• 13:40
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
• 13:41
  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think we're in.
• 13:42
  [SPEAKER_00]: thing mark, only any mother wouldn't tend that.
• 13:45
  [SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes just saying, why would you do that?
• 13:48
  [SPEAKER_00]: Or maybe for new better, or again, or those are inadvertent shame statements and not meaning it, we can actually cause that.
• 13:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: So what about if we can see clearly that our child is heading in the wrong direction?
• 14:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: When should we speak up and when should we stay quiet?
• 14:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's
• 14:10
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think it is tough and I personally, I will drop small messages, maybe not even directive and then maybe like an in general statement that I'm hoping they pick up a queue or plan to seed.
• 14:25
  [SPEAKER_00]: So if it's a real concern, I will come out and just say it really concerns me the direction that you're headed or this decision might cause consequences that you haven't bought all the way through.
• 14:36
  [SPEAKER_00]: But then I also then say, but it's still in your choice.
• 14:40
  [SPEAKER_00]: So, I know it's my job, I've lived a lot more life, it's my job to offer that and I'm a group of supposed to be so powerful that they're wandering aimlessly, but I say it West, this is what I know, this is what I see, but it's still a precision to make and I still your choice and choice.
• 14:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's good, that's good, because that's the reality.
• 15:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, what would you say to the mom who feels like she can't be okay until her child is okay?
• 15:09
  [SPEAKER_00]: that goes back to inner work.
• 15:11
  [SPEAKER_00]: What causes you to be connected to your child's life that you can't be okay if they're not okay.
• 15:18
  [SPEAKER_00]: What's the work in there that needs to be done?
• 15:20
  [SPEAKER_00]: Why is that in camps?
• 15:21
  [SPEAKER_00]: Separate.
• 15:22
  [SPEAKER_00]: Where aren't you being fulfilled?
• 15:24
  [SPEAKER_00]: Where are you?
• 15:25
  [SPEAKER_00]: do you have things in your life that are meaningful or are you just waiting for them to connect with you or be okay?
• 15:32
  [SPEAKER_00]: So I think that's where I think motherhood is the ultimate system that God created that we have to constantly be working and growing.
• 15:41
  [SPEAKER_00]: It's a constant.
• 15:42
  [SPEAKER_00]: Now it's not just when they're ever diapers, not just when they go to college, it's not just when they get married
• 15:53
  [SPEAKER_00]: So I feel if you can't be okay if your kids not okay, there's something inside us.
• 15:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: That means some healing and I would just encourage someone to explore that, but that is.
• 16:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, absolutely.
• 16:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: Explore it with a therapist, explore it with a coach, you name it.
• 16:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Work, work with somebody.
• 16:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's so much healing.
• 16:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think motherhood refines us.
• 16:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, it's a mirror.
• 16:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a magnifier.
• 16:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, ooh, Lord, but you know, got to so kind and so tender and so compassionate to the mom who needs to learn how to separate herself, who needs to accept that our children will struggle.
• 16:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: The Lord said it in his word, you will have trials.
• 16:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that includes our kids, right?
• 16:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: But if we graciously accept that God is near, he sees them, he knows them, and all as we get to do is just hang on to him and trust, and then also do that in a work like you talked about.
• 16:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that's what happened.
• 16:51
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
• 16:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: Awesome.
• 16:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Carol, I want to thank you for joining me today.
• 16:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: Can you tell my listeners where they can find your work online?
• 16:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: Instagram at
• 17:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Look at that, how easy-peasy I will leave that link in the show notes.
• 17:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mama, your adult child struggles doesn't have to become your emotional emergency.
• 17:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: You can love them deeply without fixing everything for them.
• 17:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Here's your coaching tip of the week.
• 17:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: In each episode, I will give you one actionable step to improve your life.
• 17:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: Remember, you can't change everything, but you can take one step to be better.
• 17:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want you to sit with this question.
• 17:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: Can you be comfortable with your child being uncomfortable?
• 17:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want you to pray on it, process it, and see what God shows you.
• 17:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mama, remember this, our kids will struggle.
• 17:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's just part of being human, but sometimes the most loving thing we can do is first calm ourselves and then lean into God's strength.
• 17:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: And as we learn to study ourselves, we can release our kids into God's capable hands, trusting that he is at work even when we can't see it.
• 17:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Grace and peace mama, you've got this and God's got you.
• 17:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you so much for spending time with me on the midlife mama podcast.
• 18:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: My hope is that you leave each episode feeling encouraged, grounded, and clearer.
• 18:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Clearer about what you're feeling, what God may be stirring in you, and how to move forward in the season of the empty nest.
• 18:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: Through these conversations, I'm not just sharing stories, I'm coaching you, helping you name what's happening beneath a service, challenging the thoughts that keep you stuck and take intentional steps toward peace and confidence as a midlife mom.
• 18:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: If you're ready to go deeper and want personalized coaching support, I invite you to apply for coaching.
• 18:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: Coaching is a focused, one-on-one space where we work together to gain clarity, process emotions, and discern what God is calling you to in this next chapter.
• 18:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: You'll find the application linked in the show notes, and let's stay connected.
• 18:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: You can find me on Instagram at P-Hinkleman, that's P-H-E-N-K-E-L-M-A-N, for on Facebook at Pamela Hinkleman, M-D-N-S-Coach.
• 18:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: You don't have to figure out the season alone, Mama.
• 19:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Support and direction are possible, and I'm here when you're ready.