Latest / Mini Scroll / MINI TECH SCROLL: Elon Musk to revive Vine(?), Amazon cuts Wondery, Reddit drops paywalls + Anna Guerrero interview

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MINI TECH SCROLL: Elon Musk to revive Vine(?), Amazon cuts Wondery, Reddit drops paywalls + Anna Guerrero interview · Mini Scroll

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  This episode of Mini Tech Scroll is brought to you by Blackbird,
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  a venture capital firm investing in Aussie and Kiwi startups from
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  the very beginning. Blackbird invests in all kinds
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  at the end of today's episode. But if you've got an idea and
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  mentor, check out the link in our show notes and get your
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  application in. Hey everyone, and welcome to
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  Mini Scroll. The daily Internet culture
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  podcast bring you the biggest stories from social media, the
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  creator economy, and the digital space every Monday through
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  Thursday and sometimes Fridays. My name is Annabelle and I'm
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  your Wednesday Mini Tech Scroll host and also the deputy editor
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  of the youth digital media brand Centennial World.
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  Welcome back to Mini Tech Scroll everyone.
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  As you probably gathered from the top of the episode this
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  week, this is the first week where Mini tech Scroll is a
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  officially sponsored. So a big thank you to Blackbird
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  for keeping the pod going. But before we get into this
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  week's episode, I wanted to also thank everyone for signing up to
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  subscribe and stick around to the end of the episode if you
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  want to hear Lauren's interview with the founder of Clove.
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  I find it really interesting, obviously working in a small
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  business, to hear founders talk about their journey, even though
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  I am not a founder myself and there are obviously timestamps
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  in the description like there are in every episode.
• 1:49
  As for when that interview starts, OK, let's get into the
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  content for this week. So the first story I wanted to
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  talk about is about how Elon Musk is trying to bring back
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  Vine question mark here at Mini Tech scroll.
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  I really try and limit how often I talk about Elon Musk because I
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  don't really think you guys really want to hear me cover him
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  every single week. But I definitely thought this
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  story was worth mentioning because it feels like it really
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  fits right in the intersection of Internet culture and tech.
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  I'm sure you guys all know what Vine is, and if you don't, I
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  actually feel ancient. But Vine was really popular
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  throughout the 20 tens, and it was known for its six second
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  clips that would play on. We actually did a deep dive into
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  Vine's origins as a platform last year, and I remember
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  finding out that the decision to make a Vine video 6 seconds long
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  was actually strategic because it launched in 2012, which was a
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  time where phone plans had really strict data limits.
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  So that obviously helped offset those limits.
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  And it's crazy to think of just how much times have changed
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  since then. Anyway, Vine was definitely a
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  cultural engine for its time. I'm sure so many of us can just
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  remember off the top of our head our favorite Vines and how they
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  go, and Vine even introduced us to the likes of Mag Con and
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  other iconic influences of course like Crime, Blackwell,
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  and maybe less beloved ones like David Dobrik.
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  I will say though, I was never a Mag Con girl.
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  I was. Far too.
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  Deep in the believer world to care about anything else but the
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  chokehold that Mag Con had was crazy.
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  I remember so many girls in my year at school were absolutely
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  obsessed with them. So the power and success of Vine
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  was pretty evident from the get go where Twitter acquired it in
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  2012, hence how Elon Musk is involved today.
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  But its cultural relevance was short lived where the platform
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  ended up closing completely in 2017.
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  Much has been said about the downfall of Vine, where many
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  commentators have put it down to a number of competing factors,
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  including the lack of monetization strategies on the
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  platform, Vines kind of negative relationship with its creators,
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  and a string of leadership changes that really left the
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  company in shambles. Well, Vine didn't really have
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  the cultural capital that it once had.
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  By the time it had closed, I definitely remember people were
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  very upset about losing the videos and the archive and
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  absolutely everything related to the platform.
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  Anyway, over the past week or so there have been reports that
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  Elon Musk is trying to bring back fine.
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  This all started with a post on X where on August 3rd Elon wrote
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  quote Grok imagine is AI Vine. So Grok imagine is X's new AI
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  powered text to video generator. It works like other video
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  generators where you can type in a sentence or a scene that you
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  would like to see animated into a video.
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  I will say though, I have already seen unquestionable
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  reports about this feature where TechCrunch reported that users
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  can generate not safe for work videos on a so-called quote
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  spicy mode, which I doubt will end well for anyone, especially
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  with all the recent scandals around Grok spewing anti-Semitic
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  and misogynistic rhetoric that I didn't even get into a mini text
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  scroll because it was just so bad.
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  Anyway, in the same tweet though, Elon added that quote.
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  By the way, we recently found the Vine video archive, thought
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  it had been deleted, and we are working on restoring user access
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  so you can post them if you want.
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  Elon Musk has been toying with the idea of bringing back Vines
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  since not long after he purchased Twitter, and he hasn't
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  really come through yet, obviously.
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  So unsurprisingly, many social media users are skeptical about
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  X actually bringing back the platform and or its archive,
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  especially if they are described in Grok as Vine's new
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  counterpart. But say Vine does actually come
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  back. I think this is quite an
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  interesting prospect because these days we definitely don't
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  have a need for Vine in the same way as we did back then.
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  Obviously, TikTok Reels Shorts have essentially replaced what
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  made Vine so special, the short form component, because that
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  just like wasn't really a thing back then.
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  And I think this goes to show obviously how much the digital
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  landscape has changed and of course, the content styles and
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  humor that came with it. On top of this, though, I do
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  think it's kind of funny that X would be leaning into short form
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  now. Like short form video is
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  definitely still popular, but long form has been having a
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  renaissance, as we have spoken about for years at this point.
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  More on that later, actually. But having said that, Elon's
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  interest in short form video is just another example of the
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  everything app quote, UN quote that he is trying to create with
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  X. This plan was basically a
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  strategy that Elon put forth in 2023.
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  Me just calling him Elon like I know him one-on-one, but OK.
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  He essentially intended for X to become an application that
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  encompasses everything, replacing everything from
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  YouTube, LinkedIn to TikTok. He was essentially setting out
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  to mimic WeChat, which is China's all inclusive media
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  system. Obviously he hasn't really
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  achieved that yet, but he may be trying to, especially by
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  introducing all these new features into the platform.
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  But even though I still scroll on X and I still have my account
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  along with Blue Sky, the app is just so far gone at this point.
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  I don't know how even if he made it and everything app, how it
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  would have the same impact or reach as Twitter once did.
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  But obviously I guess Elon caters to a different audience
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  now, much more conservative, much more right wing.
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  So maybe it will become the quote UN quote everything app
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  for that. My next story for today is a
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  little bit more of an industry based one, and that is that
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  Amazon is gutting 1 Drake. So 1 Drake is a popular podcast
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  studio. They have produced a lot of
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  really successful and popular podcast.
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  Some examples include scam, fluency and also various
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  celebrity hosted podcasts like the Travis Kelsey one with his
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  brother. Wondery was acquired by Amazon
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  at the end of 2020 with a $300 million deal.
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  But as reported by Bloomberg earlier this week, quote
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  Amazon.com Inc is breaking up the operations of its Wondery
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  podcast network as part of a broad reorganization of the
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  business. Around 110 people will be losing
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  their jobs and existing podcasts under Wondery will become part
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  of Amazon's Audible banner or the Quote Creative Services
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  team. Much of the commentary about the
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  decision, at least what I have seen, is putting it down to the
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  way that the podcasting industry has completely embraced video
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  instead of just audio podcasts. With that being said, Ashley
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  Carmen and Lucas Shaw, in the same Bloomberg article, noted
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  that this is a sign that Amazon's foray into podcasting
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  may have not been as successful as they had hoped for.
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  So I'll read you a quote from the article.
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  The moves are an acknowledgement that Amazon's big push into
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  podcast hasn't worked out as planned.
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  Despite signing some of the biggest names in the business,
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  the online retailer is shifting strategies to compete better
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  with platforms like Spotify technology and Alphabet Inc's
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  YouTube as podcast shift to video formats from audio only.
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  On top of this, the change also came after two of the biggest
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  shows under Wondering, Morbid and Smartlist moved to SiriusXM.
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  In a statement to The Verge, though, Amazon spokesperson Alex
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  Jo spoke to the shift towards video and essentially verified
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  that this was a major reason behind Amazon's decision, at
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  least the reason that they are putting forward as it reads,
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  quote, the podcast landscape has evolved significantly in the
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  past few years, particularly with the rise of video forward
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  creator LED content. These changes reflect the
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  evolution and will streamline how wandering integrates further
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  into Amazon. So yeah, I think it's obvious
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  that Amazon's decision regarding wandering is just another
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  example of how podcasting is going absolutely all in on
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  video. This isn't really surprising
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  because YouTube has become the most popular podcasting
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  platform. It was reported earlier this
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  year that 1 billion people are tuning into podcasts every month
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  on YouTube. And according to Edison research
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  from last year, 31% of weekly podcast listeners who are age 13
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  or older say that YouTube is the service they use the most to
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  listen to podcasts. Obviously, with this shift
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  towards video, we are also seeing the very definition of
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  podcasting and what we expect from podcasting change and
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  expand. Obviously a lot of them are
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  still formatted like this, what you are watching or listening to
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  right now. I feel like I'm breaking the 4th
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  wall. But obviously a lot of them are
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  someone just sitting down and talking to a camera or into a
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  microphone. But we're also seeing the rise
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  of vlog cast where hosts take their audiences around with
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  them, much like a vlog. This is something that Alex L
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  has leaned into with the relaunch of Hot Mess.
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  And obviously, that's also being a little bit of a hot topic this
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  week with the Alex L and Alex Cooper beef, back and forth
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  fallout, whatever you want to call it, entering once again,
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  which I'm pretty sure Lauren covered on Monday's episode.
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  But yeah, I definitely think the move towards video allows for a
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  little bit more flexibility and creativity when it comes to the
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  format of podcasting. Although some people might argue
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  that these vlog casts aren't really podcasts at all.
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  But to some degree, the embrace of video in the podcasting world
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  I do think can raise the barrier to entry a little bit simply
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  because I don't think everyone would want to be on camera.
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  OK, And my final story before the interview today was I did
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  just want to share a quick update on a story we reported on
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  earlier this year. So back in February, Reddit CEO
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  Steve Huffman confirmed in a pre recorded Q&A that Reddit will be
• 11:07
  implementing paywalls on certain subreddits at some point through
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  2025. This was actually first
• 11:12
  suggested a year prior, and it was described as a way for
• 11:16
  Reddit to diversify and increase its revenue, which is something
• 11:19
  that Reddit has definitely been doing with its foray into AI,
• 11:23
  which I've discussed before. But it appears that Reddit is
• 11:27
  taking a step back from this plan.
• 11:29
  In a post on the platform, Huffman, whose username is Spez,
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  wrote quote. To stay focused on what matters
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  most, we're shifting resources away from a few areas, such as
• 11:38
  work on the user economy. This includes what some have
• 11:41
  referred to as paid subreddits. It's still an opportunity we
• 11:44
  believe in, but right now we're all in on strengthening alcohol
• 11:48
  products, making Reddit the go to place for such, and
• 11:51
  accelerating international growth.
• 11:53
  This interest in such is definitely something I have
• 11:56
  noticed the platform leaning into recently.
• 11:58
  I was scrolling on Reddit the other day and I was reading
• 12:01
  through some of the comments on one thread and I remember seeing
• 12:03
  that a couple of words in one of the comments had been
• 12:06
  hyperlinked and when I clicked on it, it led to search results
• 12:10
  on Reddit for that time. And I'd never seen that before.
• 12:13
  So it's kind of reminding me of the search bar on TikTok and
• 12:16
  obviously the blue like magnifying glass comments.
• 12:20
  So I can definitely see Reddit going in this direction.
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  But yeah, I just wanted to share this quick story because
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  obviously we reported on it before and I think it's
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  definitely positive news as far as access to information goes
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  that they aren't pay walled, especially as we're going
• 12:34
  through this period that is quite disruptive in times of
• 12:37
  search and browsers as the digital world transitions to AI.
• 12:42
  And I feel like people are obviously relying on Reddit more
• 12:45
  and more for information, whether that is a good thing or
• 12:48
  a bad thing. OK, so for finishing up with
• 12:51
  this weeks episode, we have Lawrence interview with Anna
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  Guerrero, the founder of Clove. Once again, thank you to
• 12:57
  Blackbird. Hi.
• 12:58
  Everyone, it's me. OK, so I don't think Annabelle
• 13:03
  explained this yet, but for the next few months you'll be
• 13:07
  getting interviews from me with other founders at the end of a
• 13:11
  few of the mini tech episodes that are sponsored by Blackbird.
• 13:15
  And today we're launching this initiative with Anna Guerrero,
• 13:18
  former Canva exec turned founder of Clove, an app that takes the
• 13:22
  chaos out of cooking. In this interview, we chat about
• 13:25
  Anna's career, her app Clove, and the highs and lows of being
• 13:29
  a female founder. Reminder.
• 13:31
  Click the link in the description if you have an idea
• 13:34
  that you want to take to the next level.
• 13:36
  Enjoy. Thank you so much Anna for
• 13:38
  joining me today. Thank you.
• 13:39
  For having me. OK.
• 13:41
  So I wanted to hear about your career journey before we get
• 13:46
  into what you're doing now, because that is so interesting
• 13:49
  to me, like how people get to where they're launching their
• 13:52
  own business or they found that kind of success.
• 13:55
  Yes, totally. And so for me it was quite
• 13:58
  unexpected. So I actually studied journalism
• 14:01
  and worked as a journalist for a very short period of time and
• 14:05
  fell into tech. So I was really lucky to find an
• 14:09
  awesome company called Canva very early on.
• 14:11
  There was about 15 people there. It was a very early stage
• 14:15
  startup and they needed someone to jump into marketing.
• 14:18
  So I hadn't done a lot of marketing, but I decided to give
• 14:21
  it a shot and yeah, ended up joining the company and staying
• 14:26
  for about 9 years where I almost had every job I could think of
• 14:30
  in the company. So I worked across marketing and
• 14:32
  growth and product and ended up building out and leading out the
• 14:37
  marketplace program at Canva. So that was awesome.
• 14:40
  And then it took a bit of a break from tech after an
• 14:44
  incredible chapter there to dive into something that I love
• 14:47
  deeply, which is cooking, and then funnily enough, fell back
• 14:50
  into tech. So, yeah, I have this theory
• 14:53
  that you really can't plan all of the great things that happen
• 14:55
  happened to you. And that was definitely true on
• 14:57
  On the Journey, yeah. That's really cool.
• 15:00
  So you went from scaling at Canva to cooking.
• 15:05
  OK, tell me about that shift. Was it just you wanted to move
• 15:09
  into like a passion project? Did you feel a bit burnt out?
• 15:11
  Like what was your mindset there?
• 15:13
  Yep, definitely. So when I left Canva, I was the
• 15:16
  head of content and discovery. So I ran all of the kind of
• 15:20
  creative marketplace programs that were part of the design
• 15:24
  product. And while I loved it, it was
• 15:26
  this huge role. I was running a massive team.
• 15:29
  I had almost 500 people and had just been, I guess, working on a
• 15:34
  problem space for a while and had started to kind of lose
• 15:38
  touch with something that I loved deeply, which was cooking.
• 15:40
  And I was really struggling to balance, you know, doing this
• 15:43
  kind of incredible big tech job with kind of finding time for,
• 15:49
  yeah, I guess a more creative side of my personality.
• 15:53
  And so I decided to take a bit of a break, and I had no idea
• 15:55
  where I would end up and actually enrolled in culinary
• 15:58
  school, which was like a total pivot.
• 16:01
  Yeah. But I guess I love learning.
• 16:03
  I wanted a change of saying I definitely can't relax, I guess,
• 16:07
  if I'm taking time off. So yes, I took a bit of time
• 16:10
  off, went to culinary school and then ended up having a very
• 16:13
  unexpected year, ended up getting a job in in a Michelin
• 16:17
  star restaurant, which was just unbelievable.
• 16:21
  But yeah. And then ended up kind of
• 16:22
  through that journey coming up with the idea for Clove.
• 16:25
  So yeah, I guess it was just a bit of a chance to kind of dive
• 16:29
  back into something that I wanted to explore more and go
• 16:31
  deeper into, but not knowing exactly what that would mean
• 16:34
  initially, yeah. OK, so let's get into clove.
• 16:37
  Tell me, what is clove? For our listeners who aren't
• 16:41
  across it, what is clove? How did you come up with the
• 16:43
  idea? Where are you at now?
• 16:45
  Yep. Totally.
• 16:46
  So Clove is a cooking app that helps you build a plan for the
• 16:50
  week based on recipes that you love.
• 16:52
  So our big goal is to really close the gap between
• 16:55
  inspiration and there's so much great recipe and cooking
• 16:58
  inspiration out there, but actually taking that and making
• 17:01
  a plan for the week that you will cook.
• 17:03
  So everything that you need to kind of discover recipes or save
• 17:07
  recipes is in the platform. We've got our own create a
• 17:10
  marketplace, which is growing and is awesome.
• 17:12
  And then we've got all of this awesome tech that just helps you
• 17:14
  make sense of all that content. And yeah, create a plan that is
• 17:18
  really right and perfect for your goals.
• 17:21
  And so in terms of how I came up with the idea.
• 17:24
  So as I mentioned, I didn't exactly know what I would do
• 17:27
  after Canberra and spent this time kind of exploring the world
• 17:30
  of cooking and food. And I guess eventually
• 17:33
  reconnected with that love and decided that I wanted to share
• 17:38
  it with other people. But I had this moment.
• 17:40
  I remember when I was cooking at at the restaurant and it was
• 17:44
  this really beautiful, elegant restaurant in, in the Dolomites
• 17:48
  in, in Italy. And it had 7 tables.
• 17:52
  So all day we would kind of slave away and cook for these 7
• 17:56
  tables that would have the most amazing experience.
• 17:58
  But I guess being in tech for so long and working on a product
• 18:02
  that was used by, you know, hundreds of millions of people,
• 18:05
  I realized that cooking for seven people a day would
• 18:09
  probably not scale. Yeah.
• 18:11
  And so really just wanted to figure out how I could bring
• 18:13
  that love to more people and really started thinking about
• 18:17
  what problems people actually have in their day-to-day and why
• 18:20
  cooking is so hard to fit into daily life.
• 18:22
  So our apps have been live for just over three months, so very
• 18:27
  early days. So we yeah.
• 18:29
  So when we were initially developing Clove, we spent the
• 18:32
  time getting the apps and the kind of cool tech built, but
• 18:36
  also building our creator community.
• 18:38
  So one of the things that makes Clove different to other recipe
• 18:41
  and cooking apps is that everything that you need to cook
• 18:44
  is in one place. So it's not just a tool to save
• 18:47
  recipes and it's not just another media brand where you
• 18:50
  can discover recipes you love. It's actually a combination of
• 18:53
  both. So we launched the wrap, the
• 18:56
  app, the wrap. Maybe we need a wrap.
• 18:59
  We launched the app with 1000 incredible recipes from over 40
• 19:04
  creators. And so that kind of program is
• 19:07
  growing now and we've started to build out, yeah, I guess our
• 19:11
  early user base of home cooks. And we have thousands of people
• 19:14
  cooking on cloves. So yeah, it's really exciting to
• 19:16
  see those two worlds come together, and there's obviously
• 19:20
  a lot to do ahead of us. Yeah.
• 19:21
  Yeah, amazing. Okay, so I talk pretty openly on
• 19:25
  the pod and with our audience about my trials and tribulations
• 19:30
  as a female founder. I am really interested to hear
• 19:34
  about your experience with the journey, the hardest things that
• 19:37
  you found, and some of the best things that you found.
• 19:40
  Yeah. Totally.
• 19:41
  Great question. So, yeah, so starting a business
• 19:44
  is incredibly challenging. And I think if you, it's almost
• 19:47
  better to not know what you're getting yourself into.
• 19:50
  Otherwise, you know, it can be daunting to start.
• 19:53
  But you know, every day there are problems to solve.
• 19:56
  You're dealing with the unknown. You have to learn a new job.
• 19:59
  And it's just constant. At the same time, you know,
• 20:01
  you're you're growing your team. You want things to be clear, you
• 20:05
  want to set the vision. And so you're just juggling a
• 20:08
  lot. And it can feel like a lot, but
• 20:11
  it also means that when you do have a win or you get something
• 20:15
  across the line, it is 100% you and your team.
• 20:18
  Yeah. Which I think is one of the most
• 20:20
  rewarding things. So, yeah, So it's definitely
• 20:23
  been, it's definitely. Challenging and I think what was
• 20:26
  interesting for me is, you know, I was so fortunate to learn so
• 20:29
  much at Canva, growing it from a small start up to a amazing
• 20:33
  global company. But when I started Clove, there
• 20:36
  was still so much to learn. So I think it's really important
• 20:40
  to remember that you are always learning, and that's almost one
• 20:43
  of the best skills you can develop is not just like the
• 20:46
  kind of experience in the resume, but actually the ability
• 20:49
  to, you know, be curious, learn and just throw yourself into
• 20:53
  challenges and I guess figure out how to navigate that and
• 20:57
  just stay focused on the vision. Yeah.
• 20:59
  One of the best pieces of advice that I heard last year when I
• 21:02
  first became a solo founder and I was in the thick of it, like I
• 21:06
  was in the trenches. So tough.
• 21:08
  So tough and somebody, I heard somebody on a podcast say you
• 21:13
  have to fall in love with problem solving.
• 21:16
  Yeah. And I don't know that just like
• 21:17
  unlocked something in my brain. OK.
• 21:19
  So is there anything that you wish you knew or had done prior
• 21:25
  to launching your brand? Yeah.
• 21:27
  Such a such a great question. I'm sure you wish you knew a lot
• 21:30
  of things, but in terms of things that you feel like you
• 21:33
  actually could, actions you could have taken but you didn't.
• 21:39
  I. Guess launching a new.
• 21:40
  Brand is such a big challenge and and maybe you can actually
• 21:43
  feel like, you know, there is a right path to do that.
• 21:45
  But maybe one thing that was surprising about it is that a
• 21:47
  brand actually evolves from lots of small decisions and lots of
• 21:51
  small moments. So you know, it's not just one
• 21:53
  campaign. It's definitely not your logo or
• 21:55
  your brand color, but it's you know, how you show up, how you
• 21:59
  sound, how you make your customers feel.
• 22:01
  And so I think that's, you know, at the beginning of Clove, I was
• 22:06
  really like, I had this clear vision in my head and I really
• 22:09
  wanted the first impression to be right.
• 22:12
  But, you know, after a while, I realized that, like, it's just
• 22:15
  these constant first impressions and your brand is evolving and
• 22:18
  you're evolving. So I think it's less important
• 22:20
  to just get it right or to have one set of experience that you
• 22:23
  can apply to it, but just to keep showing up and to actually
• 22:27
  just not wait. Like the sooner you can get
• 22:29
  something out there, the sooner you'll learn.
• 22:31
  Yeah. And you can constantly evolve
• 22:33
  like that is something I felt very, I was very rigid in my
• 22:37
  early days. Like, no, we are dot com, a
• 22:39
  digital publisher. Like, I was a writer.
• 22:41
  I was very, like, passionate about our website and the
• 22:44
  written word. And, you know, I really had to
• 22:47
  just break out of that a couple years in and be like, I need to
• 22:50
  be flexible. Like, I need to be able to
• 22:52
  constantly change and evolve and go with the flow.
• 22:56
  Otherwise this will die. Like, the industry changes so
• 22:58
  fast. Yeah.
• 22:59
  Because you also learn what your customers want, right?
• 23:01
  Yeah. And so the most important thing
• 23:03
  is to just have those feedback channels and to really know who
• 23:06
  you're building for and yeah, to make sure that you are solving a
• 23:10
  problem for them. So it's constant learning.
• 23:12
  Yeah, yeah. Speaking.
• 23:13
  Of solving problems. What do you see?
• 23:17
  I guess sets Clove apart from other cooking apps, yeah.
• 23:20
  Totally. So cooking is such a complex
• 23:23
  process and there's so many problems to solve.
• 23:25
  So there are so many great apps out there, but generally they
• 23:28
  focus on one part of the process of cooking.
• 23:31
  So, you know, you've got amazing kind of brands like New York
• 23:35
  Times Cooking that has incredible recipes, very
• 23:38
  trusted. You've got apps that will help
• 23:40
  you to organize your recipes. And there are so many different
• 23:44
  solutions. You know, there's meal planning,
• 23:46
  there's nutrition apps, there's all these different things.
• 23:48
  And So what we're really trying to do with Clove is to just
• 23:52
  simplify all the noise and bring everything you need into one
• 23:56
  really beautifully simple and intuitive platform.
• 23:59
  So all the way from saving a recipe from TikTok or Instagram
• 24:03
  to discovering a new creator, to generating a shopping list,
• 24:07
  making a meal plan, and actually, you know, sharing that
• 24:10
  meal plan with someone in your household as well.
• 24:12
  Everything you need is is streamlined.
• 24:14
  So, yeah, so really being a platform for other brands and
• 24:18
  and you know, different types of customers to plug into as well.
• 24:22
  And yeah, just be there for the kind of whole journey.
• 24:24
  Yeah, that's. Cool.
• 24:25
  It sounds very Gen. ZI think our audience would love
• 24:29
  it. Do you have any advice for
• 24:31
  aspiring female founders? Our audience are largely young
• 24:35
  women, like late teens, early 20s.
• 24:37
  What advice would you give them? Or just career advice in
• 24:40
  general? Yeah, great.
• 24:41
  Question So I think one of the things that is the most daunting
• 24:45
  about starting something new or maybe just big challenges in
• 24:48
  life is a fear of the unknown. And you know, it is there are
• 24:52
  less examples of awesome female founders out there that are
• 24:55
  doing things that you can point to and that you can relate to,
• 24:59
  but they are there. And I think the world of
• 25:01
  startups is so amazing and you learn so much and if you're the
• 25:04
  kind of person that loves it and throws yourself into it, it can
• 25:07
  just take you to so many places. So I guess my advice would be to
• 25:11
  just get into it and it doesn't matter what your first role is
• 25:16
  or it doesn't matter where you end up, but just get started.
• 25:19
  Like when I came to, I'm from Perth and I moved to Sydney for
• 25:25
  this. Really.
• 25:26
  I don't know if I can say a really terrible job, right?
• 25:30
  I was reading the news overnight, so I was doing the
• 25:34
  graveyard shift, and that's news on weekends.
• 25:38
  But if I wasn't there, then I wouldn't have taken my second
• 25:41
  job, which was in the same neighborhood as Canva.
• 25:44
  I wouldn't have ended up at Canva, and then I wouldn't have
• 25:46
  ended up here. So I think you just really need
• 25:48
  to get started, find people you can learn from.
• 25:51
  I've always been really obsessed with finding smart people to
• 25:54
  work with and to learn from. And yeah, and just kind of
• 25:58
  slowly start to chip away at that unknown and yeah, really
• 26:02
  kind of start to make sense of it.
• 26:04
  And I think once you get stuck in, you realize that like, we
• 26:07
  can do it and you can figure it out and all problems can be
• 26:11
  solved. Yeah.
• 26:12
  Hopefully yes, Yeah, yeah. No.
• 26:15
  I always say to like, because most of my team are Gen.
• 26:19
  Z and they're always like, I don't know what I want to do.
• 26:21
  And they'll ask me for advice and I'm like, I like, still have
• 26:24
  no idea what's going on. Like you know, you, you.
• 26:26
  Just don't know, no. Like, you know, you just try
• 26:29
  different things. I had so many different lives in
• 26:31
  my 20s, and you won't know what you do like and you won't know
• 26:34
  what you don't like unless you just try different things.
• 26:37
  Yeah. So to end off, can you tell us a
• 26:40
  little bit about Cloves vision for the next few years?
• 26:44
  What's next for you guys now that you're out of beta?
• 26:46
  Yeah. Definitely.
• 26:47
  So we are really committed to helping more people get in the
• 26:51
  kitchen and cook. So there's two parts of that.
• 26:56
  So one is finding the time when you're really busy.
• 26:59
  So cooking can feel like it's just a hobby or it's like a
• 27:03
  passion program, a project, but it's not, it's also a job and
• 27:07
  it's something that we all need to do everyday.
• 27:09
  So finding the time and building the confidence.
• 27:12
  So yeah, so really kind of just making it something that feels
• 27:15
  approachable and feels I guess like it can be a really great
• 27:20
  part of everyday life and doesn't have to just be this
• 27:22
  like one off thing that happens on a weekend or every now and
• 27:25
  then. So, yeah, so finding I guess
• 27:28
  just all the ways that we can help do that, removing the
• 27:30
  friction that keeps people out of the kitchen and also really,
• 27:34
  I guess eventually helping people to develop that love of
• 27:37
  cooking and and bring it into their lives.
• 27:40
  I love that. Thank you so much for sharing
• 27:42
  your experience with us. Thank you.
• 27:44
  For having me, thank you. Well, that is everything for
• 27:48
  Mini Tech Scroll today. I hope you guys enjoyed the
• 27:51
  stories and of course the interview.
• 27:53
  I will be back for a another episode of Mini Tech Scroll next
• 27:56
  week and Lauren will speak to you guys tomorrow.
• 28:00
  Thanks for listening. Bye.