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IDAHO STUDENT MURDERS: SUSPECT ARRESTED · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace in the last hours what
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Speaker 1: we have all been waiting on and arrest, finally at
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Speaker 1: arrest and the slayings of four beautiful Idaho students found
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Speaker 1: dead in their beds. I Nancy Grace, this is Crime Stories.
0:32
Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us here at Fox Nation
0:34
Speaker 1: and Serious XM one eleven. How did it go down?
0:38
Speaker 1: Take a listen to our friends at FOXNAS. But Brian
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Speaker 1: Coburger is being held right now, just about twelve hours
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Speaker 1: after his arrest early this morning. This mystery, of course,
0:50
Speaker 1: finally getting the break that we have all been waiting
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Speaker 1: for as federal, state, and local law enforcement descended upon
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Speaker 1: this area, taking him into custody twenty five hundred miles
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Speaker 1: away from the crime scene in Idaho, twenty five hundred
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Speaker 1: miles away. Joining me in I'll star Palem. But first
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Speaker 1: to Stephanie Pagona's crime reporter with Fox News Digital. Stephanie,
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Speaker 1: what happened three am? That's correct, Nancy, just around three am.
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Speaker 1: In fact, it might have been even a little earlier.
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Speaker 1: A man named Brian Christopher Coburger was taken into custody
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Speaker 1: in Allbrightsville, Pennsylvania. That is nearly three thousand miles away,
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Speaker 1: in fact, much more more than twenty five hundred miles
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Speaker 1: away from the crime scene here in Moscow, Idaho. Now
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Speaker 1: he remains in Pennsylvania as we speak. He is being
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Speaker 1: held without bond until he can appear in court on
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Speaker 1: Tuesday afternoon, when he will make his extradition hearing appearance. Now,
1:51
Speaker 1: once he is in court for his extradition hearing, he
1:54
Speaker 1: will have the chance either to waive his extradition or
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Speaker 1: not to waive his extradition. If he chooses to fight
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Speaker 1: his extradition, this could be a little bit of a
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Speaker 1: battle between crossecutors here to to push for his return
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Speaker 1: to Moscow. Okay, hold on, you know what everybody thinks
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Speaker 1: that extradition is so hard They take about fifteen minutes
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Speaker 1: for a full on extradition hearing. Let me go out
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Speaker 1: to Dell Carson, I profile a lawyer joining me out
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Speaker 1: of Jacksonville and former FBI agent, author of Arrest Proof Yourself.
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Speaker 1: He's at del Carson Law dot com. Dell, can we
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Speaker 1: just take off your defense at for a moment extradition hearing?
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Speaker 1: It's not are you guilty? Are you innocent? Is have
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Speaker 1: we broken any laws? Was there in illegal confession. Oh
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Speaker 1: h w L No, all it is is I confirm
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Speaker 1: that you are, in fact Delle Carson. Admit your Del Carson.
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Speaker 1: I'll just do a fingerprint comparison right there in the courtroom.
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Speaker 1: Right in the federal system, is called an identity hearing,
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Speaker 1: and you either are the person named in the warrant
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Speaker 1: or you're not. So there's a federal warrant, a youth
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Speaker 1: AFT warrant, an unlawful flight to avoid prosecution warrant issued
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Speaker 1: by the federal government, and the SOG team has been
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Speaker 1: following him for maybe two weeks, the Special Operations Group
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Speaker 1: out of the Bureau, tracking and watching him. It's going
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Speaker 1: to be fasting to find out what they overheard during
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Speaker 1: his conversations, if it was electronically monitored as well. Okay, no,
3:21
Speaker 1: wait a minute, Del Carson. Do you have reason to
3:23
Speaker 1: believe he was electronically monitored? Special operation groups do that,
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Speaker 1: And if he's got a federal warrant out for him,
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Speaker 1: it's likely that they have the necessary search wart to
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Speaker 1: do those kinds of So let me go back to
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Speaker 1: Stephanie pagun Is joining us from Fox News Digital before
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Speaker 1: I go to the rest of the panel. Stephanie. I
3:41
Speaker 1: heard del Carson say that he had been surveiled for
3:45
Speaker 1: about two weeks. I know that he had been surveilled
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Speaker 1: for four days because he up suddenly, he jumped up
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Speaker 1: and left where he was in Pullman, that's near Washington
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Speaker 1: State University. I guess he had what a house or
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Speaker 1: an apartment there, and then he had something to mommy's place.
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Speaker 1: So how long has it been since he left Washington State?
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Speaker 1: You know, it's hard to pinpoint exactly from law enforcement
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Speaker 1: when he drove or however he got home to Pennsylvania.
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Speaker 1: But I can say that just this morning, law enforcement,
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Speaker 1: including Laytalk County Prosecutor Bill Thompson, were at his apartment
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Speaker 1: in Pullman, Washington. This is only a twenty one minute
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Speaker 1: drive eleven miles from the crime scene, and it is
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Speaker 1: on WSU Pullman campus. He was a graduate student at
4:39
Speaker 1: WSU Pullman. I was just there this morning where law
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Speaker 1: enforcement were conducting or executing a search warrant at that apartment.
4:46
Speaker 1: It was a much lower key scene than what we
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Speaker 1: have seen at eleven twenty two King Road, the scene
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Speaker 1: of the crimes, but we could see law enforcement going
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Speaker 1: in with protective gear and neighbors I can tell you
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Speaker 1: were shocked. No one expected this from what we could tell,
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Speaker 1: and frankly, many people didn't even recognize mister Koburger. One
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Speaker 1: person said he had saw him going back and forth
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Speaker 1: from the mailbox to his apartment. But otherwise I'm hearing
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Speaker 1: this is a relatively quiet neighborhood that was definitely shocked
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Speaker 1: that this was happening. Letting me guess he's a loner,
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Speaker 1: kept to himself, only spotty going back and forth to mailbox.
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Speaker 1: This is what I know so far. I know that
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Speaker 1: he's about six feet tall. It's a white male. I've
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Speaker 1: heard he's got blue eyes and brown hair. I'm looking
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Speaker 1: right at him. I can't make out his eye color.
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Speaker 1: They appeared to be blue. I know that he was
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Speaker 1: a quote obsessive vegan. He is a libertarian, and he
5:45
Speaker 1: got his master's degree from what I understand, at de
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Speaker 1: Sales in Pennsylvania, and was getting his PhD at WSU
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Speaker 1: Washington State University, about twelve miles away from the murder house.
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Speaker 1: I also know that he was working on a research
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Speaker 1: project in which he sent out questionnaires two criminals violent
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Speaker 1: criminals to better understand their emotions, their thinking, and their
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Speaker 1: decision making as they were committing a crime night. You
6:21
Speaker 1: know what, I'm not a shrink, but I can tell
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Speaker 1: you this right now, a guy all wrapped up and
6:26
Speaker 1: studying the thinking and the emotions of violent criminals got
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Speaker 1: way too wrapped up in it. And as pictures, he
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Speaker 1: looks very pale. Okay, yeah, as a matter of fact,
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Speaker 1: he does. Joining you right now, Cheryl McCullum, director of
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Speaker 1: the Coldcase Research Institute. You can find her at Colcase
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Speaker 1: crimes dot org. Okay, Cheryl, jump in. Isn't it just
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Speaker 1: what we said? Look under mommy's bed, that's where the
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Speaker 1: killer will be hiding out. Absolutely, they always run to mama.
6:59
Speaker 1: What they're going to be doing right now on this guys,
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Speaker 1: they're going to be looking at his old line activity
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Speaker 1: to see whether or not he bought that knife, old line,
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Speaker 1: whether there's any connection with any type of writing on
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Speaker 1: his academic papers. He is not going to be able
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Speaker 1: to hide this fascination that he has. He's not going
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Speaker 1: to be able to do it. And furthermore, I believe
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Speaker 1: in that apartment they're going to find a lot of
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Speaker 1: things written down that are going to be able to
7:26
Speaker 1: connect from dots for them there's no doubt in my mind. Well,
7:29
Speaker 1: you know what, he seems to be very fastidious to
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Speaker 1: the nth degree. The fact that he was described what
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Speaker 1: about it, Jackie described as obsessively vegan. And he's only
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Speaker 1: seen by the neighbors going to and from the mailbox.
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Speaker 1: There's no mention as anybody heard about a girlfriend, a
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Speaker 1: x a high school sweetheart and anything. Is it possible
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Speaker 1: he's an end cell Joining me along with Dell Carson,
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Speaker 1: Cheryl McCollum, Stephanie pogonas is Joe Scott Morgan, Professor Forensics,
8:02
Speaker 1: Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet and
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Speaker 1: host of Body Bags the Joe Scott Morgan on iHeart Okay,
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Speaker 1: Joe Scott, we understand. Wait a minute, wait wait, wait,
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Speaker 1: hold on, Jo Scott, Stephanie Pogonis. The white Hyunday Elantra
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Speaker 1: was outside his home? Was it outside Mommy's home or
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Speaker 1: was it outside his place in Pullman? And I guess
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Speaker 1: his place in Pullman was a house. He lived in
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Speaker 1: a house. He lived in the second floor apartment of
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Speaker 1: an apartment building on WSU campus. And yes, we are
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Speaker 1: hearing from multiple reports that the Hunday Elantra was taken
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Speaker 1: from the home in Pennsylvania, not Pullman, mommy's home. Hold on.
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Speaker 1: I'm making him a flow chart. Stephanie Begana's mommy's home.
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Speaker 1: Who lives there? Does the mom and the dad live there?
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Speaker 1: It's unclear whether Momma died, but I do believe there
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Speaker 1: is a sibling who is also listed as living there
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Speaker 1: or in the things day. Now a question if there's
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Speaker 1: not a mother or father there, whose home is that?
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Speaker 1: I know I've seen at least they should say records
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Speaker 1: show that a mother lives there. I just am not
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Speaker 1: positive about a second parental figure. Okay, Jackie is waving
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Speaker 1: at me, wildling in the background, trying to tell me,
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Speaker 1: are you saying it's the parents' home? Jack She's saying
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Speaker 1: she's found it's the parents' hum be curious to find
9:18
Speaker 1: out as the mom and dad were there, I mean,
9:21
Speaker 1: what about it. Nobody thought it was odd that he
9:24
Speaker 1: came home and never went back. I also understand, Stephanie.
9:27
Speaker 1: Did he just graduate with his PhD in December? You know,
9:31
Speaker 1: I can't say for Suton for certain. Unfortunately, I don't
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Speaker 1: have that answer, but I know that he has lived
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Speaker 1: in the Pullman apartment for quite some time now, at
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Speaker 1: least several months from what I'm told now, I understood
9:43
Speaker 1: that he got his masters from to Sales University in
9:47
Speaker 1: le High, Pennsylvania in criminal justice and was trying to
9:50
Speaker 1: get his doctorate degree. So if he got that, and
9:56
Speaker 1: I've got May of twenty two, there's no way he
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Speaker 1: could have been could be through with his doctrine degree
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Speaker 1: that quickly. So he's working on his doctrinate degree, Okay,
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Speaker 1: Joe Scott Morgan. So the car is parked in front
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Speaker 1: of mommy's house, you know, Joe Scott, you'd think a
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Speaker 1: criminal justice major or criminology major would know to get
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Speaker 1: rid of the car. Huh, yeah, you would think. So. Uh.
10:25
Speaker 1: What's curious about this is that is it does this
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Speaker 1: go to his arrogance or does it go to his carelessness?
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Speaker 1: You know, he's had quite a bit of time with
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Speaker 1: his vehicle since this slaughter took place. He's traveled across
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Speaker 1: the country in it, Nancy, apparently. And but yet there
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Speaker 1: it sits, doesn't it? And so you're going to have connection, Nancy.
10:46
Speaker 1: That car is a rolling crime scene and the fact
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Speaker 1: I like that crime scene. Okay, I'm stealing that you
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Speaker 1: didn't say that I did. And I think I think
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Speaker 1: that there's going to be a key, and not just
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Speaker 1: the physical evidence that can be found in there. Nancy.
11:04
Speaker 1: What's fascinating is this long journey that was taken across
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Speaker 1: the country. You know what it's reminding me of. It's
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Speaker 1: reminding me of um, Gabby Petito's fiance, Brian Laundry, who
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Speaker 1: leaves her body out and dispersed camping in Wyoming and
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Speaker 1: then heads all the way across the country back to
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Speaker 1: Florida in the car, in the van in which he
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Speaker 1: likely murdered Gabby Petito. Go ahead, Jo Scott. You know
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Speaker 1: every every CCTV that he passed, every gas station that
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Speaker 1: he went to, every burger joint that he stopped at,
11:44
Speaker 1: well not burger joints, cousin Vegan, wherever he went to dine,
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Speaker 1: all right to to you know, fuel himself. There's going
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Speaker 1: to be an electronic signature either it's gonna be documented.
11:56
Speaker 1: These will be his phone if he's got this thing
11:58
Speaker 1: with him, it'll be pining a long way or hold on,
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Speaker 1: I'm getting another banner from Jackie. And you know I
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Speaker 1: can cut your guys, Mike, but I can't cut Jackie
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Speaker 1: how where she's sitting right in there? She's holding up
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Speaker 1: a sign that says Fellows. Student tells the New York
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Speaker 1: Times suspect had few friends at school. Okay, am I
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Speaker 1: smelling an in cell? Is that what I'm smelling? I'm
12:20
Speaker 1: not sure, but I'm getting a whiff of something. Few friends,
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Speaker 1: According to The New York Times, he had this fellow
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Speaker 1: student says he appeared he wanted to socialize, but had
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Speaker 1: made offensive remarks in the past that had left him
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Speaker 1: somewhat isolated. Offensive remarks in the past that left him isolated.
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Speaker 1: What were the offensive remarks, Jackie? Don't give me half
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Speaker 1: of the puzzle and make me go crazy for Pete's sake. Okay,
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Speaker 1: back to you, just Scott, what were you saying? You know,
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Speaker 1: his image is going to be captured, the car's image,
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Speaker 1: the tag readers, all of that stuff. And this is
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Speaker 1: documented all the way across the country. Nancy, We're talking
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Speaker 1: over two thousand miles. This would be you know, they
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Speaker 1: made a big deal, and I understand why they did it.
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Speaker 1: They were saying, remember they said they had the twenty
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Speaker 1: four mile loop that the cops had gone to around
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Speaker 1: Moscow where they've collected the CC Listen, in this case,
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Speaker 1: we're talking about over two thousand miles that they're going
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Speaker 1: to be collecting this videography of this trip along the way.
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Speaker 1: So yeah, there's a lot to be gleaned from this
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Speaker 1: car and his movements in it. Well, Joe Scott, they're
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Speaker 1: going to be looking for the blood residue in the car,
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Speaker 1: from the clothing you war when it got back in
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Speaker 1: the car after this flaw? Is this Delle Carson? Yeah,
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Speaker 1: you know what Dell Carson exactly when Joe Scott Morgan said,
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Speaker 1: a rolling crime scene, not just the car, but everything
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Speaker 1: in that Pullman apartment. Now, Stephanie Pogonis, when I say
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Speaker 1: Pullman is at the city of Pullman, is at the
13:48
Speaker 1: Pullman campus, what do they mean by Pullman? So this
13:52
Speaker 1: is located within the city of Pullman, but yes, it
13:55
Speaker 1: is on w Washington State University Pullman campus. This is
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Speaker 1: camp housing which is typically inhabited by graduate students, many
14:04
Speaker 1: of whom have kids or families, or those who work
14:08
Speaker 1: with the university. So, Nancy, from this guy while with you,
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Speaker 1: I actually just heard from Washington State University. I want
14:18
Speaker 1: to correct myself. You were correct. He had graduated just
14:21
Speaker 1: in June twenty twenty two from the sales, but he
14:26
Speaker 1: actually had completed his first semester as a PhD student
14:31
Speaker 1: with Washington State University's Criminal Justice program. That was just
14:35
Speaker 1: earlier this month that he completed his first semester. Right,
14:38
Speaker 1: was I actually ride on something. I'm so happy. Keep
14:42
Speaker 1: that clip. So he completed his first semester of his PhD.
14:46
Speaker 1: Guys also with me Chris McDonough directtal Case Foundation, former
14:51
Speaker 1: homicide detective, and I found him on the Interview Room podcast.
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Speaker 1: Chris mcdonnah, what do you make of all this? Well,
15:00
Speaker 1: you know, Nancy just listening, I mean, all the ideas
15:02
Speaker 1: that we've been talking about, the plus you know, waste
15:06
Speaker 1: or two on this guy. He it's obvious he's an
15:08
Speaker 1: ego driven type of killer. Right, and he thought about
15:14
Speaker 1: doing this in a very cool headed reflection idea, meaning
15:18
Speaker 1: he sat back, he processed, you know what direction he
15:23
Speaker 1: was going to go. He obviously sounds like he had
15:26
Speaker 1: the education behind it at least two, you know, think
15:29
Speaker 1: through some ideas. So I'm going to lean on a
15:33
Speaker 1: research that was done by Columbia University and doctor Gary Brocado,
15:38
Speaker 1: who he mentioned years ago he has the largest database
15:43
Speaker 1: of mass murders in the country. And if we look
15:46
Speaker 1: at this four victims as a mass murder event, this
15:51
Speaker 1: guy was on the road to becoming a serial killer
15:55
Speaker 1: because all the indications are at this point, from what
15:58
Speaker 1: I can find out, this guy had not killed before
16:03
Speaker 1: because he had a very difficult time establishing the needed
16:07
Speaker 1: relationships with other people. So that longer point you just
16:11
Speaker 1: made a minute ago is right on target with this guy,
16:14
Speaker 1: especially if he's living with his mom. Time Stories with
16:29
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace. Guys, we don't know who is living here,
16:37
Speaker 1: but it's still listed according to Jackie as the parents home,
16:41
Speaker 1: so either the mom and or the dad are living there.
16:45
Speaker 1: We understand there's a sibling as well. No word yet
16:48
Speaker 1: of any prior girlfriends or romances, no engagements, no nothing. Guys,
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Speaker 1: Let's take another Listen to our friend Laura Goal at
17:01
Speaker 1: Fox News the mugshot you've been seeing. Twenty eight year
17:04
Speaker 1: old Brian Christopher Coburger was taken into custody three a
17:07
Speaker 1: m southeast of Scranton, Pennsylvania, at a private residence on
17:12
Speaker 1: a Fugitive from Justice warrant. Now, there are reports that
17:15
Speaker 1: law enforcement also recovered a white vehicle you'll remember, a
17:19
Speaker 1: white Hyundai Elantra, was the subject of a nationwide search
17:23
Speaker 1: after one that was spotted near the scene of the
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Speaker 1: crime in Moscow, Idaho, in the early morning hours of
17:28
Speaker 1: November thirteenth, where four University of Idaho students were found
17:31
Speaker 1: murdered inside their off campus rental home. Now, Coburger was
17:36
Speaker 1: arraigned early this morning and sent here to the Monroe
17:39
Speaker 1: County Correctional Facility pending extradition. After Okay, what's he charged with,
17:44
Speaker 1: stephan Ifgonas tell us, he is charged with four counts
17:49
Speaker 1: of felony murder, one count each for each of the
17:51
Speaker 1: four victims. Of course, then he's also charged with committing burglary,
17:56
Speaker 1: and that is, of course, for breaking into the home
17:59
Speaker 1: on November thirty, he allegedly, of course. Now, question, you
18:02
Speaker 1: said he's charged with felony murder. Is he charged with
18:05
Speaker 1: first degree murder or felony murder? How did they phrase
18:08
Speaker 1: at Stephanie, I'm sorry I misspoke there. It is first
18:11
Speaker 1: degree murder, first degree murder, and felony burglary. Thank you
18:15
Speaker 1: for calling me. Okay, no, no, actually, Stephanie, I'm glad.
18:18
Speaker 1: I'm glad you did that because when this case goes
18:22
Speaker 1: to trial, I predict these are just the initial charges.
18:27
Speaker 1: I think when a grand jury here's the evidence, that
18:32
Speaker 1: they're going to add felony murder to that charge. I
18:36
Speaker 1: think they're going to charge him in the alternative, of course,
18:38
Speaker 1: Dell Carson, when you've got to murder, one charge which
18:41
Speaker 1: is premeditated, and that can be the premeditation can be
18:44
Speaker 1: formed in a twinkling of a moment, the moment it
18:48
Speaker 1: takes you to raise the gun and pull the trigger
18:51
Speaker 1: or blink your eye. Premeditation doesn't have a time on it.
18:54
Speaker 1: So the fact that he broke into the home, and
18:58
Speaker 1: it says, of course burg he is breaking entering a
19:02
Speaker 1: home with the intent to commit a felony a crime
19:06
Speaker 1: in sight, that's burglary, and this actually states that he
19:12
Speaker 1: entered the home with the intent to commit murder, which
19:16
Speaker 1: means he didn't try to sex assault anybody, he did
19:19
Speaker 1: not try to take anything. He went in the home
19:23
Speaker 1: with the intent to commit a murder. I think, of course,
19:28
Speaker 1: at trial, Dell Carson, they could put it to the
19:32
Speaker 1: jury a felony murder as well, But they may go
19:35
Speaker 1: ahead and charge felony murder with the underlying felony being burglary?
19:40
Speaker 1: What about that, Dell Carson, Then you don't have to
19:42
Speaker 1: even prove the intent. They could certainly do that, you know,
19:46
Speaker 1: when he's charged with the murder. Clearly it was organized,
19:50
Speaker 1: Clearly it was planned. They're not going to have any
19:52
Speaker 1: problem with that. My biggest curiosity is did he confess
19:56
Speaker 1: he's been interviewed by if you speak as that said
20:01
Speaker 1: that Chris McDonough. We were told that upon his arrest
20:06
Speaker 1: he said, has anybody else been charged? Has anybody else
20:10
Speaker 1: been arrested? That tells me is a sort of an admission,
20:14
Speaker 1: an admission of sorts. But is there is it possible
20:18
Speaker 1: there's another perp? Chris? Well, you know that's an interesting comment,
20:21
Speaker 1: right Nancy, I mean, is she saying that for again
20:25
Speaker 1: that ego driven side of things, you know, like Dennis
20:29
Speaker 1: Raider right BTK back in the day where he would say,
20:32
Speaker 1: you know, every job, So that may be an insult
20:36
Speaker 1: to his ego by making that comment. If they would
20:40
Speaker 1: have responded, yeah, there are other people that were looking
20:43
Speaker 1: at so it's gonna be interesting she how had unfold?
20:46
Speaker 1: Now listen to this. I want everybody to weigh in
20:49
Speaker 1: on this. Remember we're not having high tea at Windsor Castle.
20:52
Speaker 1: What we understand is cops still searching for Idaho suspects weapon.
20:57
Speaker 1: He charged with four counts of murder. They trace his
21:00
Speaker 1: white Hyundai too, his parents Pennsylvania address, and they cross
21:06
Speaker 1: matched DNA found at the crime scene. Okay, Cherry'm gonna
21:10
Speaker 1: call him jump in. Well, that's outstanding. So what that
21:13
Speaker 1: means is you've got DNA in one spot, in DNA
21:18
Speaker 1: another spot and it matches. And you're you're saying, okay,
21:21
Speaker 1: so this person went from A to B to see
21:24
Speaker 1: areas in that home, and that cannot be overstated. You know,
21:29
Speaker 1: that's one hundred percent. There's not going to be another
21:31
Speaker 1: way that happened except that killer. So here's the no okay,
21:38
Speaker 1: because if he's been in that apartment partying before his
21:41
Speaker 1: DNA please please stop. He only goes to the mailboxing back.
21:46
Speaker 1: He has not been in the house partying. Just stop
21:50
Speaker 1: right there. This ain't a party guy. I mean, look
21:53
Speaker 1: at him. Look at his mug shot. He looks very
21:58
Speaker 1: free kid proper. I could just see these eyes Cheryl
22:02
Speaker 1: McCollum staring in the window at me changing clothes. Cheryl,
22:09
Speaker 1: right there, jump in I'm here, And here's the thing, Nancy,
22:12
Speaker 1: they're obviously going to try to establish. And they probably
22:15
Speaker 1: asked him the second question, have you ever been in
22:17
Speaker 1: this house? He probably either said no or he had
22:21
Speaker 1: whatever reason or then where in the house did you go?
22:26
Speaker 1: Kansas Are He had a season to go to the
22:28
Speaker 1: third floor. He had no reason to hutch a bedspread,
22:31
Speaker 1: he had no reason to touch a windowsill, he had
22:34
Speaker 1: no reason to touch the sliding glass door and the
22:37
Speaker 1: front door. He's gonna have a hard time explaining that.
22:40
Speaker 1: And I'll say something else. It's gonna be in that car,
22:42
Speaker 1: Sat Jay Simpson. I can't I can't hear I can't
22:45
Speaker 1: hear you. What's gonna be in the car? Think about O. J. Simpson?
22:49
Speaker 1: That one drop of blood on the outside of the
22:51
Speaker 1: bronco that had more than one victim's blood swirled in it.
22:56
Speaker 1: That's gonna be key. There's no way he clicked that
23:00
Speaker 1: haul well enough, not possible. If if there's a transfer,
23:03
Speaker 1: that's one hundred pot I agree with that one thousand percent.
23:05
Speaker 1: If they have both victims of blood anywhere in that
23:08
Speaker 1: guy's car, he's chose yeah. And the reality is, of course,
23:12
Speaker 1: Joe Scott Morgan that there's no way unless he bathes
23:16
Speaker 1: his car in black swan myriadic acid, there's no way
23:19
Speaker 1: he's going to get rid of DNA. Plus he can't
23:21
Speaker 1: see all the DNA. But this guy is a criminologist.
23:26
Speaker 1: He's got his master's degree for Pete's sake. Man, if
23:29
Speaker 1: you let me jump in here, please about that and
23:32
Speaker 1: just put people's mind at ease. I can memorize the
23:35
Speaker 1: rules of cricket, but I couldn't officiate a game. He
23:39
Speaker 1: can study things all he wants to, but when he
23:42
Speaker 1: tries to put something in action, that's a different ball game.
23:46
Speaker 1: You can't come back right, Cheryl Sabin in your you know,
23:52
Speaker 1: one person might wake up, one person might fight you.
23:55
Speaker 1: He's never experienced that type of incident. There's no way
24:00
Speaker 1: he can prepare for that from a textbook. Well, we
24:03
Speaker 1: don't know that he hadn't killed other guys. Can I
24:05
Speaker 1: get back to my original question? Have I ever cut
24:09
Speaker 1: Del Carson's mic in life? Because it's coming, It's coming,
24:13
Speaker 1: Chris mcdonnah help me here, anybody help me? Because what
24:17
Speaker 1: I understand is officers trace the white Hyundai to his
24:21
Speaker 1: mommy's address in Pennsylvania, then they cross match his DNA
24:26
Speaker 1: found at the scene, So his DNA has found at
24:30
Speaker 1: the scene. I wonder, Chris mcdonnah, how they isolated his
24:35
Speaker 1: DNA from all the other DNA they found at the
24:38
Speaker 1: party house, unless what Cheryl was saying is correct, that
24:42
Speaker 1: it was in places it shouldn't have been, like in
24:45
Speaker 1: one of the murder beds, in the second murder bed,
24:49
Speaker 1: maybe within the blood. What do you make of it, Chris,
24:53
Speaker 1: I think there's all of those possibilities in that it
24:57
Speaker 1: could be in cast off of some sort if there
24:59
Speaker 1: were a struggle, which we know there were defensive wounds
25:02
Speaker 1: from the victims, so you know, the possibility of the
25:06
Speaker 1: suspect cutting himself is high on the lift, and so
25:10
Speaker 1: that cross mixture could be separated pretty easily. And then
25:14
Speaker 1: immediately they can do what they call an Andy test
25:17
Speaker 1: a n d I, and that is a rapid DNA
25:21
Speaker 1: test that immediately can identify this guy, not necessarily who
25:26
Speaker 1: he is, but his DNA makeup. And then when they
25:30
Speaker 1: come across like the car or I had a case
25:33
Speaker 1: one time where the suspect put the knife back in
25:35
Speaker 1: his pocket and we found blood inside of the pocket
25:39
Speaker 1: of the suspect's pants, so that blood, if it's the
25:44
Speaker 1: DNA that they're looking for, is pretty easy to get.
25:48
Speaker 1: Or they followed him and they picked up a cup
25:50
Speaker 1: the old remember that, Nancy, back in the day. You
25:53
Speaker 1: pick up a cup, you pick up a cigarette, and dingle,
25:57
Speaker 1: you're in town. So yeah, I was one. Do you
26:00
Speaker 1: think possibly jo Scott Morgan. That's why they were surveiling him,
26:04
Speaker 1: to catch him throw out a pizza box or toss
26:08
Speaker 1: away fast food so they could get done for all
26:10
Speaker 1: the care of the want to be criminologists might have
26:13
Speaker 1: he got stupid. I think they've had a team sit
26:16
Speaker 1: in on this guy, they being the FEDS. More than
26:20
Speaker 1: likely they've been watching him very closely, and he got stupid.
26:25
Speaker 1: He cast something off and as you know as an attorney,
26:27
Speaker 1: once you throw it in the trash, it's no longer yours,
26:30
Speaker 1: so they can go collected. It would end its sourced DNA.
26:33
Speaker 1: It comes directly from him, so you know, back to
26:36
Speaker 1: what the other other guests have mentioned, this unknown that
26:40
Speaker 1: would have been in dwelling at the scene, and remember
26:42
Speaker 1: they said they identified his DNA there if he injured
26:46
Speaker 1: himself or if it was sourced from another fluid from
26:50
Speaker 1: his body that originated from him. Then they can compare
26:54
Speaker 1: those two with this evidence, this DNA, this rich DNA
26:57
Speaker 1: that they're why do you say, why do you talk
26:59
Speaker 1: like that another DNA source that originated from him. Let's
27:03
Speaker 1: either's blood, there's saliva, and their sperm. It's got to
27:08
Speaker 1: be one of those three, right, yes, yeah, that or
27:10
Speaker 1: sweat as well. And keep in mind, again a lot
27:14
Speaker 1: has been made over the fact that this is a
27:16
Speaker 1: sharp force injury case. He would have had to have
27:19
Speaker 1: used this knife over and over and over again. By
27:22
Speaker 1: the time you get to the fourth person, you're going
27:24
Speaker 1: to be perspiring as well. So I remember there was
27:29
Speaker 1: sweat DNA found in Stephen Avery's car, the guy who
27:34
Speaker 1: murdered Teresa Hallenback amateur photographer, well actually a pro photographer,
27:38
Speaker 1: and it was found I think, on the steering wheel
27:41
Speaker 1: of her car, which was hidden at the edge of
27:44
Speaker 1: his property. And if you don't know those names, you
27:47
Speaker 1: wouldn't know the name making a murderer by was it
27:50
Speaker 1: HBO or Netflix? Yeah, who seemingly tried to make Stephen
27:55
Speaker 1: Avery appear innocent? Yeah, and wet. So how do you
28:02
Speaker 1: think they isolated his DNA? Did you say, Joe Scott,
28:05
Speaker 1: are you going along with Ryl mccollms theory? Yeah, Yeah,
28:08
Speaker 1: I am. Actually I think she's right on the money
28:10
Speaker 1: with this. It would be a commingled, which just means
28:14
Speaker 1: that it's mixed together with everything else. This scene is
28:17
Speaker 1: going to be evidence rich relative to the victims. There's
28:21
Speaker 1: a lot of bloodshedding. You're going to have the commingling.
28:24
Speaker 1: And I mentioned this a couple of times over the weeks,
28:27
Speaker 1: where you're going from body to body to body, so
28:29
Speaker 1: you're commingling DNA from victim A with B, with C
28:33
Speaker 1: with D and then you throw his into the mix.
28:37
Speaker 1: They can identify those very specifically, those four victims. And
28:40
Speaker 1: there's also touch DNA that's at the scene. Remember they
28:43
Speaker 1: keep using this term party house, party, party house. There's
28:46
Speaker 1: a lot of DNA there from other people. So they're
28:50
Speaker 1: having to go through this task of eliminating everybody. They've
28:54
Speaker 1: isolated all of these unknowns. Maybe his was appearing in
28:58
Speaker 1: various sights, you know, from all over these rooms and
29:01
Speaker 1: maybe from the bodies themselves, and so he did something
29:05
Speaker 1: to screw this up where he cast something off. They
29:09
Speaker 1: were able to capture this and compare and then it's
29:12
Speaker 1: it's academic at that point, and it's it's not a big,
29:15
Speaker 1: big ask at that point to try to identify something's
29:18
Speaker 1: gonna remind everybody that Idaho does have the death penalty. Jackie,
29:22
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure it's lethal death by needle. But I
29:26
Speaker 1: want to go to this thought. Fry refuses to rule
29:29
Speaker 1: out the possibility of an accomplice. You know, I've never
29:33
Speaker 1: bought into the accomplice theory in this case. Who would
29:36
Speaker 1: go along with the murders of four people and never
29:38
Speaker 1: say a word or screw up and get caught plus
29:43
Speaker 1: one weapon? We think, you know, jump in Sorry, Nancy, Well,
29:46
Speaker 1: you know what's interesting to that point is just earlier today,
29:49
Speaker 1: I'd say, you know, just a matter of hours ago,
29:52
Speaker 1: Chief James Fry from Mosco PD had the chance to
29:55
Speaker 1: say they have captured the only suspect that they think
29:59
Speaker 1: they need. He was specifically asked if he thought anyone
30:03
Speaker 1: else was potentially wanted in this case, and he did
30:05
Speaker 1: not respond to the question. He did not answer the
30:08
Speaker 1: question directly. All he said was he thinks that he
30:11
Speaker 1: has captured someone who have committed these crimes. Now, police
30:15
Speaker 1: have said, even in the press release announcing this conference
30:17
Speaker 1: today that this is an ongoing case. But they have
30:21
Speaker 1: not said, and they have not said that they have
30:24
Speaker 1: captured everyone they need so far, which I did find interesting.
30:27
Speaker 1: During a press conference. Yeah, his exact words, we have
30:30
Speaker 1: an individual in custody who committed these horrible crimes. He
30:34
Speaker 1: did not say it was the only individuals. Interesting. Now,
30:39
Speaker 1: let's figure this out. The martyrs occurred November thirteen. He's
30:45
Speaker 1: arrested forty eight days later. Do you believe that any
30:50
Speaker 1: scratches or injuries he sustained during a potential struggle would
30:56
Speaker 1: have faded and gone away by now, because I do,
31:00
Speaker 1: unless it's a dike cut, unless it's what a knife cut,
31:04
Speaker 1: a knife cut? Okay, all right. We know the extradition
31:08
Speaker 1: will most likely be a very quick procedure and he
31:12
Speaker 1: will be on his way back to Idaho at that time.
31:15
Speaker 1: We understand that the arrest warrant and the supporting affidavit
31:20
Speaker 1: will be unsealed and we can learn more. We know
31:23
Speaker 1: this guy has no prior arrest, which I believe all
31:26
Speaker 1: of us predicted a while back, or he would have
31:28
Speaker 1: already been matched to the DNA data bank. What can
31:33
Speaker 1: you tell me about a court order Stephanie Begonus a
31:38
Speaker 1: court order regarding cleaning out cleaning out the house. I'm
31:44
Speaker 1: so happy you asked, Nancy, because I was actually going
31:46
Speaker 1: to interject earlier about this. Yes, so a cleaning crew,
31:50
Speaker 1: a professional cleaning crew hired by law enforcement, all but
31:56
Speaker 1: entered the crime scene this morning. They arrived at the
31:59
Speaker 1: home to trucks and a trailer, prepared to enter the
32:03
Speaker 1: home and begin to clean it of any buyer hazards
32:05
Speaker 1: and chemicals that were used in the process of gathering evidence.
32:08
Speaker 1: But before they could even really get make any headway
32:11
Speaker 1: with this, they received what was called the legal requests
32:15
Speaker 1: by the court to halt any processes there. So they
32:20
Speaker 1: basically got there all but began before they were told
32:24
Speaker 1: to call it off for the time being. So the
32:27
Speaker 1: home remains an active crime scene in the custody of
32:30
Speaker 1: Moscow Police Department for the time being. Well, why would
32:32
Speaker 1: they have released it if they think they need they
32:34
Speaker 1: still need to get evidence. It's an excellent question and
32:37
Speaker 1: one that many people have asked about. I believe even
32:39
Speaker 1: Joseph Scott Morgan and I had been discussing this just
32:42
Speaker 1: yesterday before we get carried away on the court order
32:47
Speaker 1: you do know that, according to sources, this guy forced
32:55
Speaker 1: his parents to buy kneepots and pans which had never
32:58
Speaker 1: touched meat. To let that's so ken for a moment,
33:03
Speaker 1: he's so against killing animals, but yet he's slaughtered for
33:09
Speaker 1: beautiful university students. But Nancy talked about from the beginning,
33:16
Speaker 1: he's fared. I was just wondering how long it was
33:19
Speaker 1: going to take you to bring out the dog, Cheryl,
33:21
Speaker 1: because that's been your focus from the very beginning. Spirit
33:25
Speaker 1: dogs sat me because again, you know people, you can
33:31
Speaker 1: tell them a story, and you can tell them, hey,
33:33
Speaker 1: I worked this homicide and this happened to that person,
33:35
Speaker 1: and then this happened to the dog, and they will
33:38
Speaker 1: react more about what harm came to the dog. I
33:41
Speaker 1: get it. I understand that heartstring being pulled for an animal.
33:45
Speaker 1: But what I'm saying is, when you've got somebody that
33:48
Speaker 1: can slaughter four people but not harm the animal, that
33:53
Speaker 1: tells you about this person and again we're finding out
33:58
Speaker 1: he's against any kind of animal. Old Well, it checked out.
34:02
Speaker 1: But can I say one more thing about his academic prowess? Again,
34:07
Speaker 1: if you were the prosecutor on this case, I can
34:09
Speaker 1: see you right now in court, Nancy saying, this person
34:14
Speaker 1: is a trained professional, he was at the PhD level
34:18
Speaker 1: with criminal justice and criminology. Yet for forty eight days,
34:23
Speaker 1: he never contacted law enforcement about his car being in
34:27
Speaker 1: the area. Not once. Yeah, go ahead, jump in, you'll
34:31
Speaker 1: to dub Jawna. Cheryl's thought is this guy enjoyed striking
34:35
Speaker 1: fear not only in the community, about women as a whole.
34:39
Speaker 1: And you know, I think I don't think it's over
34:42
Speaker 1: for him. I think the court proceeding, he's going to
34:45
Speaker 1: eat it up. And he's you know, because he's sitting
34:49
Speaker 1: back watching you know a lot of I think what
34:52
Speaker 1: is being said. If he has access obviously to the media,
34:56
Speaker 1: which he probably does, because I think that question that
35:00
Speaker 1: you asked earlier, Nancy, is indicative of the way he's thinking,
35:04
Speaker 1: meaning are there other people arrested? I think that thought
35:08
Speaker 1: process can go into and this is my own opinion,
35:12
Speaker 1: his ego and or an accessory after the fact, somebody
35:16
Speaker 1: that loaned him the car. They may have information that
35:19
Speaker 1: type of deal, but I still believe that he's the
35:22
Speaker 1: loan suspect in this incident. And you know that I
35:27
Speaker 1: think he's going to enjoy every piece of this going
35:30
Speaker 1: forward forward, because he's getting a great deal of satisfaction
35:33
Speaker 1: out of it. I am still stymied at this chilling
35:37
Speaker 1: survey created by kay Berger asking criminals how they felt
35:43
Speaker 1: while they committed their crimes. I mean, yeah, is he
35:49
Speaker 1: doing his own research? Right? Was he doing his own
35:52
Speaker 1: research into himself? Y'all have pulled him, he'd get involved
35:58
Speaker 1: on it. Any talk to him about a calm and
36:02
Speaker 1: tell me what you feel right before? What did you
36:05
Speaker 1: feel doing? What did you feel after that? Incite him
36:23
Speaker 1: time stories with Nancy Grace. Now we've been told that
36:31
Speaker 1: he had a quote quiet, blank stare when he was
36:35
Speaker 1: arrested by local cops and the FBI on Friday morning.
36:41
Speaker 1: I've seen defendants like that, I've seen killers like that.
36:44
Speaker 1: I don't know what exactly it depicts. Guys, take a
36:47
Speaker 1: listen again to our friend Laura Ingole at Fox needs
36:52
Speaker 1: so many questions still unanswered with it. We hope to get.
36:55
Speaker 1: You know, what connects this suspect to the victims, what
36:57
Speaker 1: was the motive, was there possible DNA of against that
37:00
Speaker 1: connects him to the crime, And of course the location
37:03
Speaker 1: of the murder weapon. A source tells us that Koburger
37:06
Speaker 1: is a student at Washington State University in Pullman, and
37:09
Speaker 1: that's just about fifteen minutes away from the scene of
37:11
Speaker 1: the crime. He was pursuing a master's in criminal justice.
37:15
Speaker 1: We know he is from Pennsylvania from what we've been told,
37:18
Speaker 1: and lived in Washington State. We have reached out to
37:20
Speaker 1: numerous family members here with no response back so far.
37:24
Speaker 1: A search of his Washington State apartment was conducted earlier today.
37:27
Speaker 1: After a search, warrant was served. No word on what
37:30
Speaker 1: was removed or sought in his apartment. And taking a
37:33
Speaker 1: look at more information on Cohler interesting Kolberger. He had
37:37
Speaker 1: a birthday recently, turning twenty eight years old. It would
37:41
Speaker 1: have been about one week after these murders occurred. Now
37:43
Speaker 1: we know his sister, Melissa, as a mental health nurse
37:46
Speaker 1: in New Jersey. She specializes in quote, trauma and emotion regulation.
37:54
Speaker 1: I wonder why that is her chosen field. We know
37:58
Speaker 1: his dad file from bankruptcy a really long time ago
38:01
Speaker 1: in twenty ten. What more do we know? He completed
38:06
Speaker 1: a bachelor's degree in twenty twenty a master's degree in
38:10
Speaker 1: twenty twenty two. I know who's attending had attended a
38:14
Speaker 1: Catholic School, Moscow. Cops have been hunting this exact vehicle
38:22
Speaker 1: in the last weeks in connection with the killings, and
38:25
Speaker 1: they found it. What more do we know, Stephanie Pagans
38:29
Speaker 1: it was three am, or you say a little earlier
38:32
Speaker 1: when a swat team swarmed on his parents' home in Pennsylvania, Scranton, Pennsylvania.
38:39
Speaker 1: What more do we know? You know? Unfortunately, Nancy, not
38:44
Speaker 1: much beyond what you have already shared. And police are
38:47
Speaker 1: citing Idaho laws for the reason why they can't share anything.
38:51
Speaker 1: I asked Chief Fry earlier today if he could even
38:54
Speaker 1: tell us how long police might have had their eyes
38:57
Speaker 1: on him, and if there were any tips, and if so,
39:00
Speaker 1: how many that related directly to mister Koburger. But right
39:04
Speaker 1: now police are staying quiet, and they're saying as soon
39:07
Speaker 1: as the as soon as the affidavit is available, it
39:10
Speaker 1: will be in court records, but we should not expect
39:13
Speaker 1: that until at least his extradition hearing on Tuesdays. So, guys,
39:17
Speaker 1: let's figure out. Had he targeted one of the victims,
39:22
Speaker 1: he only lived about twelve miles away from the party house.
39:26
Speaker 1: What do you make of a del Carson Well? I
39:29
Speaker 1: think as you know that he surveiled that house for
39:33
Speaker 1: an extended period of time, and it may have been
39:36
Speaker 1: the one victim's departure that precipitated or triggered his conduct.
39:43
Speaker 1: The question I have is how did he monitor those behaviors?
39:47
Speaker 1: And were there wires illegal over here? Mike's in the
39:52
Speaker 1: rooms you know today you can produce those that don't
39:55
Speaker 1: give a signal unless you turn them on. They're very
39:58
Speaker 1: difficult to find, and that's why I'd always upset me
40:01
Speaker 1: that they would turn over the house without thoroughly going
40:05
Speaker 1: through it in a way that would satisfy me at least,
40:08
Speaker 1: that there weren't other mechanisms involved here that allowed him
40:12
Speaker 1: to do this horrible crime. Yeah, Chris mcdonnah joining me
40:15
Speaker 1: director a Cold Case Foundation. You can find them at
40:17
Speaker 1: the interview room on YouTube. Chris, I'm just wondering. I mean,
40:22
Speaker 1: we've we've all agreed that this was targeted. Now, that
40:25
Speaker 1: could mean anything from following them home from class, meeting
40:30
Speaker 1: them at a bar, walking by their house one day.
40:33
Speaker 1: It could mean anything. He lived close enough that he
40:36
Speaker 1: could surveil them anytime he wanted to. What do you think,
40:39
Speaker 1: Chris mcdonnah, Yeah, Nancy Shole. I think he was methodically
40:46
Speaker 1: monitoring these victims some way, shape or another in terms
40:50
Speaker 1: of if it's one or if it's multiple, and that
40:55
Speaker 1: there's something we don't know obviously about his motive and
41:02
Speaker 1: relationship to his ego that has driven him to such hatred.
41:09
Speaker 1: And and I would submit that that hatred was was
41:13
Speaker 1: you know, pointed specifically at the women, and that Ethan
41:18
Speaker 1: found himself in a very you know, wrong place at
41:23
Speaker 1: the wrong time, and I don't think the suspect anticipated
41:26
Speaker 1: him being there. So, you know, I think this guy
41:31
Speaker 1: is not only driven by this anger towards women. But
41:38
Speaker 1: I again, I'm going to go back to this thought
41:40
Speaker 1: that he's not done. Is he's going to keep driving
41:44
Speaker 1: the court system because it's continually shedding, Uh, you know,
41:48
Speaker 1: something that he's been missing in his life for quite
41:52
Speaker 1: some time that's been driving his ego. So there's a
41:55
Speaker 1: wound to his ego somewhere in this whole process, and
41:59
Speaker 1: him to sneak up like this without a sexual component,
42:03
Speaker 1: that means she really is much more dangerous. And I'm
42:06
Speaker 1: glad they caught him. Why do you say he's more
42:08
Speaker 1: dangerous because there was not a sex attack well, because
42:11
Speaker 1: he tasted you know, he treated this event like it's
42:14
Speaker 1: a major event in our lives, right, like we're planning
42:18
Speaker 1: a wedding or we're planning a graduation. Well, he was
42:21
Speaker 1: planning this mass murder, and he was very methodical and
42:26
Speaker 1: doing it evident of the fact that it's taken the
42:28
Speaker 1: time that it's taken for him to come to the surface. Wow, okay, sure,
42:32
Speaker 1: I'm gonna callum more. They targeted. Oh, I don't think
42:34
Speaker 1: there's any question about that. That house, the way it
42:37
Speaker 1: sat in that little cul defact area. You had to
42:40
Speaker 1: know that house, You had to know how to get
42:42
Speaker 1: to it. It wasn't just an easy in and out exit.
42:46
Speaker 1: And again, most people men, specifically, they do not make
42:50
Speaker 1: any crime more difficult. They don't put things in their path.
42:54
Speaker 1: So I believe that he had a watch area which
42:57
Speaker 1: was up on that hill where he could sit and
42:59
Speaker 1: watch how they came and went. I think that he
43:02
Speaker 1: understood the day he was going to do it, at
43:04
Speaker 1: the time he was going to do it. I think
43:06
Speaker 1: it was all planned out. And again I think there's
43:09
Speaker 1: going to be evidence of that, either in an online
43:12
Speaker 1: type manifesto or somewhere in that apartment where he was
43:15
Speaker 1: keeping almost like a journey. I think that's very possible.
43:18
Speaker 1: What about it, Joe Scott Morgan's he has been watching
43:22
Speaker 1: them and this little town it's not someplace you wind
43:27
Speaker 1: up by accident. And I've held that this is he
43:31
Speaker 1: would have had a familiarity with it, may not have
43:35
Speaker 1: ever been in the home, but it's it's a cul decyce. Essentially,
43:40
Speaker 1: you can make a round and come back out, but
43:42
Speaker 1: there's only one way out in a car. It's a
43:46
Speaker 1: dead end. It's not a location that you're just going
43:49
Speaker 1: to happen upon. You have to be going there to
43:51
Speaker 1: get there. And he, for some reason, one of these women,
43:56
Speaker 1: one of these three women, drew his attention. I think
43:59
Speaker 1: one of the really kind of interesting pieces to all
44:03
Speaker 1: of this, Nancy, is that the people downstairs survived and
44:07
Speaker 1: didn't survive. They had no indication allegedly that anything was
44:12
Speaker 1: going on. Why these four? Why these four on the
44:16
Speaker 1: second and the third floor? And I know that that
44:18
Speaker 1: can be easily you know, you can say, well, he
44:20
Speaker 1: entered on the second floor. But if he had been
44:22
Speaker 1: surveilling the location, wouldn't he have had an indication that
44:26
Speaker 1: other people lived in the house. Did he make his
44:28
Speaker 1: way down there? Is there evidence that he came down
44:31
Speaker 1: the staircase, Maybe he touched the door knobs on their doors,
44:33
Speaker 1: or whatever the case might be. I don't know. I
44:36
Speaker 1: think that that's kind of an interesting piece to this
44:38
Speaker 1: What was so attractive to him about these three victims.
44:43
Speaker 1: And one of the piece here that that's really kind
44:46
Speaker 1: of chilling to me that will always stick with me
44:48
Speaker 1: about this case is that TikTok video that those young
44:52
Speaker 1: ladies made. It was a real intimate look into that
44:55
Speaker 1: environment where they're imitating one another, they're dancing about, and
44:59
Speaker 1: it was done and fun. But if you're on the
45:01
Speaker 1: outside looking in, and he had he had a view
45:06
Speaker 1: into there, the whole world, did what their life looked like?
45:09
Speaker 1: This kitchen area, the commons area, He could see the
45:12
Speaker 1: stairwells and there you could even see that big bank
45:15
Speaker 1: of windows where the slaughters were. And for me, that
45:19
Speaker 1: was a real chilling point in this whole case. I'm
45:22
Speaker 1: going to be interested to see what his Internet activity
45:25
Speaker 1: is if he had, you know, kind of been watching
45:28
Speaker 1: them visa visa okay, Stephanie forgonus, what are we leaving out?
45:33
Speaker 1: You know, Nancy, I think there is still so much
45:36
Speaker 1: more to come. I think really the first trove, if
45:42
Speaker 1: you made the first treasure trove, might come as soon
45:45
Speaker 1: as Tuesday, when we finally have a better idea from
45:48
Speaker 1: a probable cause After David, I think there is so
45:52
Speaker 1: much that is currently being left out simply because we're
45:54
Speaker 1: not being told. But I do think now that this
45:58
Speaker 1: man has been arrested, in his name is out there,
46:01
Speaker 1: we will most certainly begin to hear more about him,
46:05
Speaker 1: what he's done, how he might have made people feel,
46:09
Speaker 1: or what they might have witnessed from him. I think
46:11
Speaker 1: this is only just the beginning. Oh yes, it's just
46:13
Speaker 1: the beginning. And I can guarantee you one thing. If
46:16
Speaker 1: a guy was so fastidious, so obsessive, that he insisted
46:23
Speaker 1: his parents get rid not wash in the dishwasher with
46:27
Speaker 1: baking heat cycles, but get rid of pots and pans
46:32
Speaker 1: that had ever cooked meat for him to use those
46:35
Speaker 1: pots and pans. If he was that fastidious about pots
46:39
Speaker 1: and pans, this was pre planned, and he has left
46:43
Speaker 1: a trail as we speak, a team of technicians and
46:49
Speaker 1: experts combing through his Pullman apartment and car. God help them.
46:59
Speaker 1: Nancy Gray signing off good bicy