Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Loving Dad of 3 at Son's College Family Weekend, Shot Dead in Hotel Lobby

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Loving Dad of 3 at Son's College Family Weekend, Shot Dead in Hotel Lobby · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

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Speaker 1: Nancy Grace. Get your free ticket now again. That's October
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Speaker 1: twelfth at the GPB Studios at seven pm. Crime Stories
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Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace. When you think of your own children,
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Speaker 1: you spend a lifetime happily giving them all your love,
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Speaker 1: all your attention. I was up with my son last
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Speaker 1: night till eleven fifteen, editing his essay, and I was
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Speaker 1: happy to do it. Years years go into helping them
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Speaker 1: advance even one tiny bit in life. Finally you get
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Speaker 1: them to college. Right. I grew up in an area
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Speaker 1: where nobody went to college, so it was a big
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Speaker 1: deal for all three of us to go. I remember
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Speaker 1: my dad working night shifts, my mom being gone at
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Speaker 1: five thirty in the morning to her job, so we
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Speaker 1: could go to college. So this dad gets his son
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Speaker 1: to college, and a really good one too, and it's
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Speaker 1: family weekend. He goes and he is shot. Debt at
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Speaker 1: the family weekend. I Nancy Grace, this is crime Stories.
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Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us here at Fox Nation
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Speaker 1: and Serious Sex one eleven. Of course, we can't bring
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Speaker 1: him back, but you know what we can do. We
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Speaker 1: can seek justice. Take a listen to this. The hotel
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Speaker 1: is just under five miles from the college campus. Police
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Speaker 1: say the parent had been staying at the Marriott during
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Speaker 1: Marist's Family Weekend, a yearly event with football games and performances.
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Speaker 1: Maria students in disbelief, shock, disbelief and also just confusion,
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Speaker 1: I think, and just deep sadness for the family, for
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Speaker 1: the victims. Police still trying to figure out the events
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Speaker 1: that led up to the shooting. No word yet on
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Speaker 1: a motive. No word on a motive. Of course, the
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Speaker 1: state doesn't have to prove a motive. But out of
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Speaker 1: the blue, this dad goes to see his child at
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Speaker 1: college on family weekend and he ends up dead at
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Speaker 1: a perfectly respectable hotel. You were just hearing our friends
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Speaker 1: at Fox five, But now take a listen to our
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Speaker 1: friends at NBC four their new developments revealing the violence
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Speaker 1: and danger guests faced at a hotel in Poughkeepsie when
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Speaker 1: someone opened fire and killed a visitor. The shooting piercing
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Speaker 1: the courtyard by Marriott yesterday morning, where many people were
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Speaker 1: staying to attend family weekend at nearby Marris College. The
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Speaker 1: bullets shattered the lobby windows, left behind bullet holes and
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Speaker 1: other windows. Police believe the shooter fired two dozen rounds.
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Speaker 1: We cleared that section of the hotel, room the rooms
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Speaker 1: aside at just in case, and continued to look for
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Speaker 1: wounded individuals make sure everybody was okay in the hotel.
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Speaker 1: While further cursory looked at the room, they also then
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Speaker 1: found manuals that were handbooks on how to make bombs.
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Speaker 1: So the tactical unit that was on scene at that
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Speaker 1: point requested the rest of the hotel be evacuated. So
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Speaker 1: at that we evacuated the hotel, moved them to safe locations,
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Speaker 1: relocated them, and then we conducted bomb sweeps as if
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Speaker 1: it couldn't get any worse. Here you are at what
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Speaker 1: is considered a quiet town, at a quiet hotel with
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Speaker 1: respectable people staying there, and a dad gets gunned down
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Speaker 1: and then they find bomb making materials. This is with
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Speaker 1: the islandy, the dichotomy of the fact that this is
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Speaker 1: the Marist College mr St which is of the Order
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Speaker 1: of Mary, the Mother of Christ, and it is named
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Speaker 1: that you may ask why name and after Mary as
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Speaker 1: opposed to Christ, because the view of the Order of Marists,
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Speaker 1: the Order of Mary, is that she did so many
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Speaker 1: good works on Earth that she answered God's calling without question.
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Speaker 1: And with that backdrop, bullets fly in the hotel. A
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Speaker 1: family weekend with me an all star panel to make
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Speaker 1: sense of what we know right now. But first I
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Speaker 1: want to go to an investigative reporter with Newsday. You
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Speaker 1: can find her at newsday dot com and on Twitter
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Speaker 1: at Joan Growl and Joan thank you for being with us.
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Speaker 1: I'm just having a hard time letting this soak in.
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Speaker 1: My friend just went to her son's college parents' day.
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Speaker 1: We just had parents' day at my children's high school.
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Speaker 1: And to think this could happen in a family setting,
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Speaker 1: I mean It's not like they're out selling dope on
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Speaker 1: the street. It's not like this guy's a member of
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Speaker 1: a gang. I mean, I'm talking about a dad Paul kuts,
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Speaker 1: three sons, a wife left behind because of this. Just
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Speaker 1: tell me the beginning, Joan, how did the whole thing start? Well?
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Speaker 1: At seven twenty nine the police am on Sunday, the
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Speaker 1: police got a call of the disturbance and during that
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Speaker 1: call they say the individual calling reported shots fired. Okay,
6:15
Speaker 1: hold on, John, because you've already hit me with a
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Speaker 1: bag of cement right there. Let me go straight out
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Speaker 1: to Wilburt Chapman, former NYPD Deputy Commissioner. Did you hear
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Speaker 1: what the Newsday reporter John Garlogist said, seven twenty nine am. Now, listen,
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Speaker 1: I have investigated thousands of cases, prosecuted so many I
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Speaker 1: can't count them. It's really rare to get violent crime
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Speaker 1: when most people are up having their first cup of coffee.
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Speaker 1: You usually see that after the dope pads wake up
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Speaker 1: at about three or four o'clock in the afternoon, then
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Speaker 1: the bullets start flying. But seven twenty nine am at Poughkeepsie, Really, well, Nancy,
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Speaker 1: this is a partinually difficult situation for me because the
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Speaker 1: Deputy Commission of Training in the NYPD we had a
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Speaker 1: particularly close relationship with Maris College, So it's really incredulous
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Speaker 1: that you have this type of crime that early in
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Speaker 1: the morning. However, we live in different times now and
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Speaker 1: people have absolutely no respect for what as you put
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Speaker 1: at the dopets used to get up at noon, and
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Speaker 1: we were prepared in policing for one o'clock go on
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Speaker 1: and expected them to go late in the morning, late
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Speaker 1: into the evening and early morning. Now they're starting early
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Speaker 1: in the morning. And when people have this kind of
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Speaker 1: antisocial and criminal behavior, there is no way of predicting
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Speaker 1: exactly when or how they will strike. You know what,
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Speaker 1: Wilbert Chatman, you can say that again. You can say
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Speaker 1: that again statistically grow as you know from reporting it newsday.
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Speaker 1: Of course, krink can happen at any time, but seven
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Speaker 1: twenty nine am and the hotel lobby of the Maryat
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Speaker 1: Courtyard usually don't expect bullets to fly, but they did.
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Speaker 1: Sorry I cut you off in like what sentence? Three
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Speaker 1: go ahead, Joan Well. And one of the mysteries that
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Speaker 1: I think explains the national attention this tragedy has brought
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Speaker 1: and are used a TV reporter Cecilia. Dad spoke with
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Speaker 1: the neighbors and this is a really wonderful family with
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Speaker 1: just a very caring dad. They all described is how
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Speaker 1: heavily armed. Heavily armed in a hotel lobby a family
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Speaker 1: weekend at the Marist College. Take a listen to the
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Speaker 1: chief of the Poughkeepsie Police Department, Chief Joseph Cavalery. Responding
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Speaker 1: officers set up a perimeter. They began to treat the wounded.
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Speaker 1: Once it was secure, MS was allowed in. They took
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Speaker 1: over the treatment of the victim. The victim was transported
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Speaker 1: to man Hunts and Regional Hospital, where it was later
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Speaker 1: pronounced dead. The officers on scene continued to secure the hotel.
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Speaker 1: They went to check a room. They noticed some suspicious items,
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Speaker 1: some of which to be materials that they we determined
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Speaker 1: could be combined to create an explosive. Guests gathered and
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Speaker 1: evacuated because bomb making manuals and flash grenades and other
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Speaker 1: possible bombom components found in the hotel room. Moved them
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Speaker 1: to safe locations, relocated them, and then we conducted bomb
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Speaker 1: sweeps crime stories with Nancy Grace. You know too, Doctor
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Speaker 1: Bethany Marshall joining us for now Psychoanalyst joining us out
9:59
Speaker 1: of bar Really Hills. You can find her at doctor
10:02
Speaker 1: Bethany Marshall dot com. She's a star of a new
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Speaker 1: Netflix series, Bling Empire. Doctor Bethany, you heard what Joan
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Speaker 1: Garrala said from the Newsday and what Wilburt Chapman said,
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Speaker 1: former NYPD Deputy Commissioner, Right, crime can happen anytime. But
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Speaker 1: I'm still reeling from the dichotomy of this being the
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Speaker 1: Marist College and what it stands for. In Poughkeepsie, which
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Speaker 1: is not known for high crime like New York City
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Speaker 1: or Inner City Atlanta or Chicago or Detroit. You don't think, Wow, Pokeepsie,
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Speaker 1: I'm not gonna go there. I'll get shot dead. And
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Speaker 1: you're at the family the college family weekend, Doctor Bethany,
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Speaker 1: I know. I mean that's enough for a nightmare for parents.
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Speaker 1: I'm about to visit a friend in Middlebury, Vermont. He's
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Speaker 1: just spotted in there. He's been there for about a year.
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Speaker 1: And it's a college town and Nancy, you know, when
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Speaker 1: you walk down the street, people are dulling homemade pies.
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Speaker 1: Everybody knows each other, there are kids everywhere. It's so
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Speaker 1: family friendly. You know, the most exciting activity in the
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Speaker 1: town is the book club. Because people are connected, they're engaged.
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Speaker 1: There is really no bad element usually in these small towns.
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Speaker 1: But here's what really alarms me as a psychoanalyst, a
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Speaker 1: mental health professional. The seven thirty in the morning, I
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Speaker 1: think is significant because that tells me whoever did this
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Speaker 1: had enormous amounts of energy. When somebody comes into my
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Speaker 1: office and their sleep wing cycle if turned around, I
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Speaker 1: become alarmed. I think about drug use, bipolar disorder, rage,
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Speaker 1: rage directed to other people. What are they doing all night?
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Speaker 1: What are they thinking all night? I think meth head,
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Speaker 1: I think PCP. I think I have to evaluate for
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Speaker 1: all these things because most people are not. You know,
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Speaker 1: they may get in an argument with their spouse late
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Speaker 1: at night, maybe too many cocktails, a dysfunctional abuse marriage.
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Speaker 1: But didn't they fall asleep this early morning hour? I
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Speaker 1: think is a very crucial part of the story. Now,
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Speaker 1: another crucial part of the story is Joe Grawa has
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Speaker 1: told us take a listen to our friends at w
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Speaker 1: ABC seven and I have been on the phone with
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Speaker 1: the US Attorney's office through last evening and this morning.
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Speaker 1: We are working in conjunction. We for each other as
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Speaker 1: this moves forward to determine what exactly we are dealing
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Speaker 1: with now. The FBI and the ATF have been looped
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Speaker 1: into this investigation with regards specifically to those bomb making
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Speaker 1: materials and other charges could stem from this arrest. As
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Speaker 1: for the fifty three year old victim, we are not
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Speaker 1: releasing his name and the family at this point has
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Speaker 1: asked for privacy. Peter Smith joining me high profile lawyer
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Speaker 1: out of New York City. He's with the law office
12:51
Speaker 1: of Ken Belkin at Belkin Law dot com. Peter, whoever
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Speaker 1: this is that has bullets flying at seven twenty nine
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Speaker 1: am at the Emily Weekend at Marist College the Order
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Speaker 1: of Mary up in a room. I mean, you can't
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Speaker 1: just discount them as you know, Hey, they're probably dopeatics,
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Speaker 1: they're bomb making materials, bomb making materials. You've already got
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Speaker 1: one dad of three shot dead, had no idea who
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Speaker 1: these people are, and now bomb making materials. Yeah, I mean, Nancy,
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Speaker 1: that just adds to the fright that this case is
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Speaker 1: causing in the community. That we don't know what their
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Speaker 1: intentions were. They're they're heavily armed, they're hopped up on
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Speaker 1: all sorts of dope, and clearly they're they're ready to
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Speaker 1: explode at any moment. I mean, given what the reporting
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Speaker 1: has suggested, you know, it's probably some minuscule argument that
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Speaker 1: happened down in in the lobby that shet them off,
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Speaker 1: some small confrontation, maybe the trigger, and of course under
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Speaker 1: the law, that means nothing. I'm just thinking through Bob
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Speaker 1: making materials in Poughkeepsie at family weekend at Marist College.
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Speaker 1: I mean, whenever I travel out of town to work
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Speaker 1: on a case and everybody's saying, where are you gonna say,
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Speaker 1: I'm like, I don't know the Marrior at Courtyard for
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Speaker 1: pizez sake, don't they have free breakfast and WiFi. Everybody
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Speaker 1: goes to stays at a place like that, Free WiFi,
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Speaker 1: breakfast in the morning, you can smell the coffee when
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Speaker 1: you wake up. Everybody goes down to the lobby, everything
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Speaker 1: safe and secure. But not this time. I've got a
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Speaker 1: father of three dead. They couldn't save him over what
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Speaker 1: take a listen to this our friends at w CBS.
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Speaker 1: One person is dead after a shooting at a hotel
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Speaker 1: in Poughkeepsie near Marist College during family weekend. Police say
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Speaker 1: someone opened fire around seven thirty this morning at the
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Speaker 1: Courtyard Marriott. We're told the victim was a relative of
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Speaker 1: a Merrist student, but that person has not been identified.
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Speaker 1: During a search of the hotel, police say they found
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Speaker 1: materials that could be used as explosives inside a room.
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Speaker 1: Safe bomb squad is investigating. We cleared that section of
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Speaker 1: the hotel room the rooms aside at just in case,
15:14
Speaker 1: and continued to look for wounded individuals, make sure everybody
15:20
Speaker 1: was okay in the hotel while further cursory look at
15:24
Speaker 1: the room. They also then found manuals that were handbooks
15:29
Speaker 1: on how to make bombs. So the tactical unit that
15:35
Speaker 1: was on scene at that point requested the rest of
15:37
Speaker 1: the hotel be evacuated. So at that point, we evacuated
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Speaker 1: the hotel, moved them to safe locations, relocated them, and
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Speaker 1: then we conducted bomb sweeps. We are now learning even more.
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Speaker 1: Take a listen to Jonathan Dents at NBC four, who
15:56
Speaker 1: was around seven am. Investigators say that two suspects were
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Speaker 1: smoking a PCP like substance in their room. One went
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Speaker 1: down to the lobby and got into an argument with staff.
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Speaker 1: It was then he allegedly took out the handgun and
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Speaker 1: began firing. Innocent individuals convening in the lobby of a
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Speaker 1: hotel going about their business, were tragically impacted in one
16:20
Speaker 1: life horrifically taken straight out to Wilbert Chapman form an
16:25
Speaker 1: NYPD Deputy Commissioner PCP. What is it? Is it mind
16:31
Speaker 1: or altering drug that can cause behavior to be amplified
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Speaker 1: to the Greek, to the degree where you lose all
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Speaker 1: sense of reality, you think you're super strong, you forget
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Speaker 1: all types of reasoning, and it usually is involved in
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Speaker 1: conduct that closes serious injury to others or in this case,
16:53
Speaker 1: the complete loss of life. But Nancy, it's also a hallucinogenic,
16:58
Speaker 1: So these people are hallucinating that committed the crime. They're
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Speaker 1: hallucinating who God knows what that they're seeing the devil
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Speaker 1: that they're saving the world. I have a patient who
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Speaker 1: I used PCP for years now, a multi millionaire plumber
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Speaker 1: in Beverly Hills. He has a great life, four kids,
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Speaker 1: but he was a gang banger for many, many years,
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Speaker 1: and he recalls stories of breaking into homes, breaking into houses.
17:23
Speaker 1: He said he once hit an old lady over the
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Speaker 1: heads so he could grab her purse. I mean, really
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Speaker 1: sort of frightening violent crimes, and sometimes they're just barely
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Speaker 1: at the edges of his memory because he was so
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Speaker 1: high most of that time, and most of the therapists
17:39
Speaker 1: been talking about how really, what's a horrible violent criminal
17:43
Speaker 1: he was? He spent eight years in federal prison. So
17:46
Speaker 1: this drug they were on, I mean, do you remember
17:49
Speaker 1: that case, Nancy, where a guy was on PCP and
17:52
Speaker 1: ate the face off a homeless person. We covered that
17:55
Speaker 1: story many years ago. This reminds me of that, Yes,
17:59
Speaker 1: I remember. It is commonly known as angel dust, fan Cyclodyne,
18:04
Speaker 1: rocket tool. Yeah, let me go to doctor Jeffrey M. Jensen,
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Speaker 1: Professor forensic Pathology, Director of Autopsy Forensic Services, University Michigan
18:13
Speaker 1: Medical School, former medical examiner in Milwaukee, Doctor Jenson, what welcome.
18:19
Speaker 1: What does PCP do to you? Commonly known as angel dust. Well, again,
18:24
Speaker 1: as that was described with the psychosis that occurs these
18:30
Speaker 1: individuals can have. In addition to the psychotic disconnection and disorientation,
18:36
Speaker 1: they can express excessive strength and force. They're typically very
18:44
Speaker 1: violent and and react to and are stimulated by excessive
18:51
Speaker 1: outside noise and and threats. So I'm thinking to Joan Grolo,
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Speaker 1: jointing US Investigate, a reporter with news Day Newsday dot Com.
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Speaker 1: Here's his dad visiting his son. He's got three sons,
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Speaker 1: two of them are twins. He's visiting one son at
19:10
Speaker 1: Mary's College, Poughkeepsie. He's mining his own business in the lobby,
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Speaker 1: probably getting that free coffee the Marriott gives you, and
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Speaker 1: all of a sudden, here come these two a holes
19:23
Speaker 1: technical legal term, hopped up on angel dust and they
19:28
Speaker 1: get into an argument with the staff, the Marriott's staff.
19:32
Speaker 1: What do we know about that, Joan, That's not something
19:35
Speaker 1: I have reported on, I confess. One of the questions
19:40
Speaker 1: swirling around us is the two individuals accused of this
19:46
Speaker 1: shooting are described as homeless, and the Duchess County executive
19:51
Speaker 1: wants to make it very clear that the county was
19:55
Speaker 1: not putting them up at this hotel, so they very
19:57
Speaker 1: well may not be homeless. Speaking of the two, take
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Speaker 1: a listen to our friends at w ABC seven. She
20:04
Speaker 1: pursued that gentleman and at taking him down at gunpoint.
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Speaker 1: A twenty six year old gunman taken down by a
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Speaker 1: female officer in the courtyard of this Poughkeepsie hotel. Sunday
20:16
Speaker 1: morning in a shooting that killed a fifty three year
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Speaker 1: old father of the mayor's college student simply visiting per
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Speaker 1: family weekend. Roy A. Johnson Junior faced his second degree
20:26
Speaker 1: murder and weapons charges. Devin M. Taylor, the first suspect
20:30
Speaker 1: taken into custody, also facing weapons charges. He reached into
20:34
Speaker 1: a fanny pack and threw an item away from him.
20:40
Speaker 1: That item was later recovered and turned out to be
20:42
Speaker 1: a handgun straight back out to Wilbert Chapman, former NYPD
20:47
Speaker 1: Deputy Commissioner. You know, I'm very surprised as female cop
20:51
Speaker 1: didn't gun him down right there, because when you're in
20:54
Speaker 1: pursuit and you know you've already got one dead victim
20:58
Speaker 1: in the lobby and he reaches into their fannie pack
21:03
Speaker 1: or their pocket or their jacket, how do you know
21:06
Speaker 1: they're not pulling out a gun to fire at you.
21:10
Speaker 1: But she didn't. She managed to take him down without
21:15
Speaker 1: shooting him dead. And according to Johan Groa with Newsday,
21:20
Speaker 1: there have been some reports, not by her, but by
21:23
Speaker 1: others that they were homeless. I'm not sure that I
21:27
Speaker 1: believe that. Well, well, let's start. Let's start with the
21:30
Speaker 1: police tactic. Okay. Obviously, because we're in a place where
21:33
Speaker 1: there are a lot of innocent people, the police are
21:36
Speaker 1: going to do everything they can to minimize any injury
21:40
Speaker 1: to anybody other than the individual they are trying to apprehend.
21:45
Speaker 1: It was clearly an excellent police response. The officers should
21:48
Speaker 1: be praised for her tactics and bringing down of this
21:52
Speaker 1: criminal without without any injury or any property damage other
21:57
Speaker 1: than the focus than the focus on the individuals. In
22:02
Speaker 1: terms of looking at homelessness, there is a there is
22:06
Speaker 1: a real correlation between homelessness and crime. And it's unfortunate
22:09
Speaker 1: because the social workers will tell you that it's a
22:12
Speaker 1: condition beyond people's control. But yes, one can be homeless,
22:16
Speaker 1: but that does not allow them or give them excuse
22:19
Speaker 1: that would engage in unlocal activity. I'm not convinced these
22:22
Speaker 1: two guys are homeless. If they're homeless, what are they
22:24
Speaker 1: doing shut up a Marriott courtyard and from what I understand,
22:28
Speaker 1: they've got a car. Guys, take a listen to NBC four.
22:32
Speaker 1: These are the two Marriotte Courtyard hotel suspects. The lobby
22:36
Speaker 1: was a shooting zone Sunday morning. Bullet holes still visible.
22:40
Speaker 1: At least one of those bullets killing a visiting relative
22:44
Speaker 1: of a maristed college student. The suspect did not know
22:49
Speaker 1: the victim. We believe it's a random act. This is
22:53
Speaker 1: a photo of one of the weapons, a so called
22:55
Speaker 1: ghost gun assault style rifle. The other the weapon you used,
23:00
Speaker 1: a glock nine millimeter like this with a switch to
23:05
Speaker 1: make it automatic. When the weapon was later found in
23:08
Speaker 1: the parking lot, it's thirty round magazine was empty. Well
23:13
Speaker 1: with Chatman, explain what it's a ghost gun. A ghost
23:15
Speaker 1: gun is a gun that's manufactured to ensure that there
23:21
Speaker 1: is no serial number and it cannot be traced. It
23:24
Speaker 1: is a real problem for law enforcement because these ghost
23:27
Speaker 1: guns are being manufactured and sold over the internet and
23:30
Speaker 1: through the mail, and anyone can get their hands on them,
23:33
Speaker 1: rather than going through the normal legal channels of getting
23:36
Speaker 1: a weapon with a serial number and making sure that
23:39
Speaker 1: it's cracked so you know who sold it and purchased it.
23:43
Speaker 1: To challenge the law enforcement and until there is legal
23:47
Speaker 1: action to make sure that the production of them is ceased,
23:50
Speaker 1: we're going to continue to have these guns in circulation
23:53
Speaker 1: and endangering our population. What do you make of the glock?
23:56
Speaker 1: A glock was a standard weapon in the NYPD for years.
24:01
Speaker 1: It's an excellent weapon, but it can be It can
24:05
Speaker 1: be altered by arranged so that it shoots as an
24:08
Speaker 1: automatic weapon, in which case will it will fire a
24:12
Speaker 1: large number of rounds in a short period of time,
24:14
Speaker 1: and can be exceedingly dangerous if not handled appropriately and
24:18
Speaker 1: deadly if the intent is to inflict the injury. Take
24:22
Speaker 1: a lot st our friends at WABC seven. Port records
24:24
Speaker 1: indicate police recovered a nine millimeter glock from Johnson and
24:28
Speaker 1: also recovered an AAR style rifle with the serial number
24:31
Speaker 1: removed and we the people stamped on the weapon from Taylor.
24:35
Speaker 1: Investigators are reviewing surveillance video from the hotel and bodycam
24:39
Speaker 1: footage from other responding agencies to try to piece together
24:43
Speaker 1: the events leading up to the shooting. We're still investigating
24:47
Speaker 1: well everything that led up to it, so we're not
24:50
Speaker 1: ready to get into the more of the details, and
24:53
Speaker 1: investigators say up on a search of the suspects hotel room,
24:55
Speaker 1: they found bomb making materials a bomb making manual, leading
24:59
Speaker 1: to hotel evacuation, but an active explosive device was never found.
25:04
Speaker 1: To Joan Gaula joining me from Newsday, she's been on
25:07
Speaker 1: the case at the very beginning. This was a nine
25:09
Speaker 1: a nine millimeter glock that had a switch to make
25:13
Speaker 1: it automatic, which made you hold the trigger and many
25:18
Speaker 1: many bullets. There's a spray of bullets, not just bang
25:22
Speaker 1: bang each time you pull the trigger. And the weapon
25:25
Speaker 1: was found in the parking lot with a thirty round
25:28
Speaker 1: magazine empty well. One of the curiosities, and mister Kunst
25:33
Speaker 1: shot in the chest and tours of the police say
25:36
Speaker 1: that assault rifle as the other guests that had no
25:40
Speaker 1: serial number, but it was stamped with the phrase quote
25:43
Speaker 1: lead the people unquote, which is one of the curiosities
25:47
Speaker 1: that surrounds this case and might possibly go to possible motivation,
25:53
Speaker 1: but all of that is very speculative at this point.
25:56
Speaker 1: So the gun had what an engraving on it or
26:00
Speaker 1: stamp we the people correct a ghost gun with an
26:04
Speaker 1: identifying marker, you get a ghost gun, so there's no
26:07
Speaker 1: serial number on it. It can't be traced. Yet you
26:12
Speaker 1: market with a phrase that no one will forget we
26:17
Speaker 1: the people. A lot is being made of these two
26:20
Speaker 1: being homeless. I'm not buying it for one minute. I
26:24
Speaker 1: don't think they're homeless me neither. I don't buy their homeless.
26:28
Speaker 1: These men had so many resources for homeless people. They're
26:32
Speaker 1: staying at the Marriott that is not cheap. They have
26:35
Speaker 1: the clothing and the appearance of normal people, so that
26:39
Speaker 1: they looked a little strange, but they're they're walking in
26:42
Speaker 1: out of the hotel. They don't look, smell, act like
26:45
Speaker 1: homeless people. Perhaps costs a lot of money to get
26:49
Speaker 1: the gun and bomb making women, dontor beth Is this
26:52
Speaker 1: doctor Bethany talking doctor Bethany? You're right? What about it,
26:55
Speaker 1: John Garrala. I don't think these two were homeless. I
26:57
Speaker 1: think they just don't want to give up their address. Why,
27:00
Speaker 1: because they're wanted. They're fugitives. Their home address will identify
27:04
Speaker 1: who they are, and I could just jump in real quick.
27:08
Speaker 1: I think that you're absolutely right that these individuals are
27:11
Speaker 1: not homeless in the traditional sense that they were on
27:13
Speaker 1: the run from other crimes committed downsta. Are you trying
27:17
Speaker 1: to suggest that a fugitive is actually homeless, Peter Smith,
27:21
Speaker 1: Not at all, Nancy, I'm saying that it sounds like
27:24
Speaker 1: but homeless. I think that they had new resources to
27:29
Speaker 1: actually initially flee law enforcement from the South, and that
27:34
Speaker 1: they were continuing Atlanta specifically no lack of dope business
27:39
Speaker 1: in Atlanta. Take a listen to Jonathan Dance NBC four.
27:43
Speaker 1: The two suspects have a history of arrests, including for
27:45
Speaker 1: robbery and assault, but the hotel shooting this weekend comes
27:48
Speaker 1: as the two suspects were already under investigation for a
27:52
Speaker 1: drug related killing in August, and it appears the pair
27:55
Speaker 1: might have known police were closing in on them. Both
27:59
Speaker 1: men have past felony convictions, and police say both were
28:03
Speaker 1: being investigated for possible involvement in a past gang related
28:07
Speaker 1: murder in the Pokeepsie area. Fox Nation is coming to
28:19
Speaker 1: Atlanta Wednesday, October twelfth. Join Nancy Grace for America's Crime
28:23
Speaker 1: Crisis Live Summit seven pm at the Georgia Public Broadcasting Studios.
28:28
Speaker 1: Here from local law enforcement, victims and leading experts on
28:31
Speaker 1: whether crime policies are leading to skyrocketing crime rates, what
28:34
Speaker 1: can be done to control the fentinel crisis, and is
28:36
Speaker 1: there a way to make our street safer. Be part
28:39
Speaker 1: of the live audience. Go to Crime online dot com
28:41
Speaker 1: look for the banner at the top of the page.
28:43
Speaker 1: Click to get your free ticket. Seating is limited for
28:46
Speaker 1: America's Crime Crisis Live Summit with Nancy Grace. Get your
28:49
Speaker 1: free ticket now again. That's October twelfth at the GPB
28:53
Speaker 1: Studios at seven pm. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. This
29:06
Speaker 1: dad gets his son to college and it's family weekend.
29:13
Speaker 1: He goes and he is shot dead. Take a listen
29:20
Speaker 1: to our friends at NBC four. A day after the
29:23
Speaker 1: father of a Marist college student was shot to death
29:26
Speaker 1: in this Poughkeepsie hotel lobby, two men are charged in
29:30
Speaker 1: the killing. Police were covered two guns, including this rifle,
29:33
Speaker 1: a ghost gun with no serial number, according to law
29:36
Speaker 1: enforcement sources, and bomb making materials in the hotel room
29:40
Speaker 1: where police say the two men were staying. Roy Johnson
29:43
Speaker 1: Junior and Devin Taylor, both homeless with previous felony convictions
29:47
Speaker 1: and charged in this case. Law enforcement sources tell News
29:50
Speaker 1: four Johnson fired dozens of gunshots inside and outside the
29:54
Speaker 1: Marriott Courtyard Sunday morning after those sources say he got
29:58
Speaker 1: into an argument in the lobby. Joan Growa, Newsday, what
30:02
Speaker 1: can you tell me about these two guys criminal history
30:04
Speaker 1: that explains to where they've been living part of the
30:07
Speaker 1: time anyway in jail. Well, yes, you're absolutely correct, and
30:11
Speaker 1: the problem is that the Poughkeepsie police are well, they're
30:18
Speaker 1: being extremely cautious, which makes perfect sense, honoring the family's
30:22
Speaker 1: wishes about not releasing the victim's name, for example, which
30:27
Speaker 1: we only got as reporters from the charging papers. But
30:30
Speaker 1: the past history and the violence of this crime and
30:33
Speaker 1: the weapons sounds might explain why the individual charged with
30:39
Speaker 1: the shooting was remanded and the second individual while his
30:44
Speaker 1: bail was set at five hundred thousand dollars in cash
30:46
Speaker 1: or a million dollars bond or five million partly secured,
30:50
Speaker 1: which you're hefty amounts. What exactly is the bond? Did
30:53
Speaker 1: you say? The second individual not the shooter? His bail
30:57
Speaker 1: was set at five hundred thousand dollars in cash, a
31:00
Speaker 1: one million dollar bond or five million partially secured. Guys,
31:04
Speaker 1: let's go straight to our cut. Seventeen Johathan danced w NBC.
31:09
Speaker 1: Roy Johnson was a wanted man. Johnson was labeled a
31:13
Speaker 1: criminal fugitive by the sheriff in Fulton County, Georgia. Johnson
31:17
Speaker 1: allegedly skipped court after his arrest on felony gun and
31:22
Speaker 1: cocaine dealing charges. The Sheriff's office says a warrant for
31:26
Speaker 1: his arrest, was put into a national database in July.
31:30
Speaker 1: In the database in July. Yet here they are at family.
31:34
Speaker 1: We can at Marist take a listener more. In August
31:38
Speaker 1: of this year, law enforcement sources say Johnson was being
31:41
Speaker 1: investigated in the Poughkeepsie area, being looked at as a
31:44
Speaker 1: key suspect in connection with a gang related murder. Several
31:49
Speaker 1: law enforcement sources say while some investigators wanted to make
31:52
Speaker 1: an arrest, they say the DA and others wanted to
31:55
Speaker 1: wait for DNA and fingerprint evidence to come back. During
31:59
Speaker 1: that August murder investigation, it seems at no time did
32:03
Speaker 1: police or prosecutors act on that warrant out of Georgia. Okay,
32:10
Speaker 1: what about it, Chapman, He's got a felony warrant out
32:15
Speaker 1: of Fulton County, where I prosecuted for ten years, a
32:18
Speaker 1: felony warrant. Guns and dope. They know it's him. He
32:23
Speaker 1: suspected in another murder right there, and they do nothing.
32:29
Speaker 1: And now this father of three is dead. There's a
32:32
Speaker 1: lot of explaining that's got to be done relative to
32:35
Speaker 1: this case. What the extent of the investigation was, why
32:39
Speaker 1: it was necessary to wait longer before apprehension, and I
32:43
Speaker 1: think until the police and the prosecutor come forward and
32:48
Speaker 1: say exactly what their reasons were, there is great reason
32:51
Speaker 1: to be concerned about what the practice was. Concern my
32:56
Speaker 1: rear in concern you go tell that to the three
32:58
Speaker 1: boys that don't have a father and a mother having
33:01
Speaker 1: to raise a family on her own. Take a listen
33:04
Speaker 1: to w NBC. The suspect, Johnson is accused of using
33:07
Speaker 1: a glock with a thirty round magazine to open fire
33:11
Speaker 1: in and around the hotel, allegedly killing cuts Another man,
33:15
Speaker 1: Devin Taylor, also charged with weapons possession so called ghost
33:19
Speaker 1: gun assault style rifle, and possible bomb making parts found
33:23
Speaker 1: in their hotel room. Earlier, the District Attorney's office in
33:26
Speaker 1: Georgia told us if police here in New York knew
33:29
Speaker 1: where Johnson was this past summer, they would have wanted
33:32
Speaker 1: Johnson arrested and sent back to Georgia on his guns
33:37
Speaker 1: and drugs charges. Okay, you got, I can jump in.
33:41
Speaker 1: I'm sorry if I could just say one thing about
33:43
Speaker 1: the father, one of the saddest things. He was killed
33:47
Speaker 1: the day before his twins turned twenty twenty two, and
33:52
Speaker 1: they also attended marist I believe the father was visiting
33:56
Speaker 1: the third son, the younger son, who by all accounts
33:59
Speaker 1: is extremely accomplished student. Yeah, and Nancy, this is doctor Jensen.
34:04
Speaker 1: This is where the forensic evidence would be helpful and
34:09
Speaker 1: helping to explain to the circumstances. We would look to
34:13
Speaker 1: do X rays to determine whether it was a high
34:16
Speaker 1: velocity round that struck the victim or whether it was
34:22
Speaker 1: from the glock handgun. And we can also tell what
34:26
Speaker 1: we describe as atypical entrance gunshot wounds, and this would
34:30
Speaker 1: be indicative of a bullet coming through some kind of
34:34
Speaker 1: an object, such as the glass. There may be also
34:37
Speaker 1: some determination of whether the bullet was a ricochet or
34:41
Speaker 1: actually was pointed at the individual. So these are the
34:45
Speaker 1: kind of questions we try to answer just by routine
34:52
Speaker 1: processing of a gunshot wound, X rays, examining the bullet
34:56
Speaker 1: fragments and the weapon. Can I ask you a question,
34:59
Speaker 1: doctor j and how do you stay so calm when
35:02
Speaker 1: you're looking at body after body after body? And I mean,
35:08
Speaker 1: I'm just thinking about their children. I mean, it's hard
35:13
Speaker 1: for me to take in. It's always the good people
35:16
Speaker 1: they get gunned down or murdered. He ran an accounting
35:19
Speaker 1: firm with his brother for the last thirty plus years, married,
35:23
Speaker 1: one time, great family, faithful, loyal, hard worker. Ma'am, he's
35:29
Speaker 1: dead and these two dopeheads are walking for I mean,
35:32
Speaker 1: they're alive. They'll probably get bond and what free You
35:36
Speaker 1: bring up an interesting point, Nancy, because most pathologists are
35:41
Speaker 1: characterized as being stuck in their basement laboratories. But it's
35:48
Speaker 1: the forensic pathologist that has intimate contact with both the
35:51
Speaker 1: victim and the victim's family. So it's not uncommon that
35:56
Speaker 1: when I'm at a crime scene, I'll encounter the big
36:00
Speaker 1: his family an attempt to give them my condolences and
36:05
Speaker 1: to give them a detailed idea of how we were
36:08
Speaker 1: going to treat their loved one. John Garralla, what happens next? Oh,
36:12
Speaker 1: that's a great question. The family is asking for all
36:16
Speaker 1: of us to respect their privacy. And if you mentioned
36:20
Speaker 1: the accounting firm run with his brother, while apparently the
36:25
Speaker 1: father was known for arriving very early, like six am,
36:29
Speaker 1: always with a smile on his face. And if you
36:32
Speaker 1: look at the company website, you see they even list
36:36
Speaker 1: their dog Luna, who provides comic relief, they say, and
36:41
Speaker 1: emotional support in her role as an office companion, and
36:44
Speaker 1: will soon try to prepare your tax returns. This guy
36:47
Speaker 1: reminds me so much, and my dad and my husband
36:52
Speaker 1: just good. Through and through. We wait as justice and
36:58
Speaker 1: false Nancy Grace Crumbs voice sad enough