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The Legendary Haenyeo · Stuff Mom Never Told You

0:05
Speaker 1: Hey, this is Anny and Samantha. I'm welcome to stuff.
0:07
Speaker 1: Will never told your prediction of iHeartRadio.
0:18
Speaker 2: Oh and this is gonna be a fun episode, I
0:20
Speaker 2: hope as a short one. But we in a very
0:24
Speaker 2: patriarchal world. We often see women at the bottom of
0:28
Speaker 2: the social hierarchy, economical too, all those things and left
0:33
Speaker 2: behind because it is an assumption that women have their
0:37
Speaker 2: really just one place, and that's oftentimes in the home,
0:40
Speaker 2: serving their husbands or men in general. But when you
0:44
Speaker 2: look into the details, you find some wonderful treasures in
0:49
Speaker 2: the form of stories or legends that talk about the
0:51
Speaker 2: way women in the marginalized community often help their community
0:55
Speaker 2: survive through the hard times and even change the course
0:58
Speaker 2: of how we got here today. And a lot of
1:01
Speaker 2: what we know about the past, we get all of
1:04
Speaker 2: that and lovely treasures and those little groves of are like,
1:07
Speaker 2: look at that story. We need to talk about this more,
1:09
Speaker 2: and today we are exploring one such story slash legend
1:13
Speaker 2: slash group that still does exist specifically to South Korea.
1:18
Speaker 2: It's the older group of women or mostly older group
1:21
Speaker 2: of women known as the Haino, and the Haino or
1:25
Speaker 2: sea women are largely again made up of older women
1:28
Speaker 2: from the Jju Islands in South Korea, a big hot
1:32
Speaker 2: spot for tourism if you're on any South Korean TikTok
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Speaker 2: at all, and these legendary women are seen as some
1:39
Speaker 2: of the most respected people.
1:40
Speaker 3: Of the island.
1:41
Speaker 2: Being a part of their crew is seen as an
1:43
Speaker 2: honor today. Now, of course, they've been around for a while,
1:47
Speaker 2: so this level of honor came much later. So the
1:52
Speaker 2: Haynos are a community of women free divers who work
1:56
Speaker 2: and live on Jju Island, and we're focusing on j Island,
2:00
Speaker 2: but there are other places that the Hanos have popped
2:04
Speaker 2: up or have been. They just I guess haven't really
2:07
Speaker 2: talked about it, and they weren't originated from there, so
2:09
Speaker 2: we will talk about them a little bit later. But
2:12
Speaker 2: for the most part, that's that's where they're located. So
2:14
Speaker 2: here's some information from Kyotojournal dot org. They dive as
2:18
Speaker 2: deep as ten meters below the surface without the help
2:21
Speaker 2: of air tanks or modern diving equipment, with little insulation
2:25
Speaker 2: from the cold South China Sea, and then the a
2:28
Speaker 2: little more information from a recent Evoke article about the
2:31
Speaker 2: Hainos in recent meaning January twenty twenty four. The Haino,
2:35
Speaker 2: who are part of South Korea's UNESCO Cultural Heritage Protection status,
2:39
Speaker 2: have been practicing muljiu, the Korean word that refers to
2:43
Speaker 2: their diving activities, since at least the sixth century AD.
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Speaker 2: According to records, muljil requires an intimate knowledge of the
2:50
Speaker 2: ocean and its physics, as well as superior physical fitness.
2:54
Speaker 2: Divers would often stay underwater for up to three minutes
2:57
Speaker 2: without the help of any modern dive equipment, a feat
3:01
Speaker 2: that tests their lung capacity and ability to fill and
3:04
Speaker 2: withstand water pressure, as well as estimate ocean depths.
3:08
Speaker 1: Yes, and it is within these ocean depths that they
3:11
Speaker 1: are able to collect different foods and supplements for their
3:14
Speaker 1: community and for their livelihoods. Here's some more information from
3:19
Speaker 1: Heytera Travel Journal. Hanyo our sea women have for centuries
3:24
Speaker 1: been the primary divers in Korean culture. During the sixteen hundreds,
3:28
Speaker 1: as men were increasingly drawn away to war and conquest,
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Speaker 1: women were left behind to provide for their families and communities. Eventually,
3:35
Speaker 1: they became known as Korea's first working moms. The reversal
3:40
Speaker 1: of traditional gender roles made Heinyo an outlier in the
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Speaker 1: country's traditionally patriarchal society, and diving became exclusively female. The
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Speaker 1: work these women do, I had read is perilous, most
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Speaker 1: of them over the age of sixty. They submerged themselves
3:56
Speaker 1: into oftentimes freezing conditions for six hours a day, holding
4:00
Speaker 1: their breath for minutes at a time to plug abaloni, clam, seaweed,
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Speaker 1: sea cucumber, sea urchin, and squid from the bottom of
4:07
Speaker 1: the strait. As the article states, the Heinos are first
4:12
Speaker 1: mentioned in the sixteen hundreds, when many speculate that men
4:16
Speaker 1: were originally doing the diving as well, and they were
4:20
Speaker 1: called into the army or had died, which left only
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Speaker 1: women to do the diving. It seemed that the ruler
4:26
Speaker 1: at the time demanded a lot from the people, including
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Speaker 1: a tribute of delicious seafood such as abalone. There is
4:34
Speaker 1: speculation that they also imposed attacks on men for their earnings.
4:39
Speaker 1: Here's a bit from Oceanographic Magazine quote. The Haino or
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Speaker 1: women of the Sea, are an icon of South Korea,
4:46
Speaker 1: a unique culture found on the island of Jaiju. The
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Speaker 1: women have been in charge of diving for seafood to
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Speaker 1: provide for their families since the seventeenth century, when many
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Speaker 1: of the men were either conscripted to the army or
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Speaker 1: had lost their lives at sea while fishing. Additionally, the
5:02
Speaker 1: Korean ruler at that time had imposed heavy taxes on
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Speaker 1: the earnings of men, but exempted the labor of women.
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Speaker 1: The women folk of the island had no choice but
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Speaker 1: to become the main breadwinners of their families. This evolved
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Speaker 1: into a system where only girls were trained to perform
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Speaker 1: the dangerous free diving work of the Haino to harvest
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Speaker 1: items such as avaloni, conch, seaweed, sea urchin, and octopus
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Speaker 1: from the ocean floor.
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Speaker 2: So for many this new occupation was an empowering road.
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Speaker 2: And here's a quote from sidetrack dot com. The Haino
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Speaker 2: culture sprung up during a time when oppressive legislation was
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Speaker 2: forced upon Korean women. Women should be limited to domestic
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Speaker 2: work and the care of children. They had no access
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Speaker 2: to education, no right to inheritance. They were discouraged from
5:48
Speaker 2: walking in public spaces. When they did, their faces should
5:51
Speaker 2: be hidden by a veil. Divorce procedures could only be
5:54
Speaker 2: initiated by men. Husbands could abandon their wives should they
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Speaker 2: fail to bear a male child. Unshackled and free. The
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Speaker 2: Hano have stood as paragons for female empowerment, and like
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Speaker 2: most of the World warren oppression has been a factor
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Speaker 2: with its continued decreasing of numbers of Hainos, as there
6:10
Speaker 2: are less and less of them as the years go by.
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Speaker 2: So here's some more information from that sidetracked article. The
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Speaker 2: Haino reached their peak at the end of the nineteen fifties.
6:20
Speaker 2: In nineteen forty five, the USA and USSR liberated Korea
6:23
Speaker 2: from Japanese oppression, but began using the peninsula as a
6:27
Speaker 2: pawn in the Cold War. The Korean people woke from
6:30
Speaker 2: their colonial nightmare to find themselves politically divided by the
6:33
Speaker 2: thirty eighth parallel to the north communist interests led by
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Speaker 2: Soviet Russia to the south, a territory aligned to capitalists America.
6:40
Speaker 2: The Korean War from nineteen fifty nineteen fifty three consolidated
6:44
Speaker 2: the former occupied zones into two separate countries at the
6:47
Speaker 2: high cost of more than three million lives and the
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Speaker 2: destruction of their basic infrastructure. Despite its relative isolation, JG
6:55
Speaker 2: was not spared from these hard times. Violence, unemployment, famine,
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Speaker 2: and sts took over the island, as well as another
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Speaker 2: exodus of young adult males. However, an economic upsearch followed.
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Speaker 2: In between nineteen sixty five and the nineteen seventy the
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Speaker 2: number of Haino decreased from twenty three thousand, eighty one
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Speaker 2: to fourteen thousand, one hundred and forty three. Today, only
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Speaker 2: around four thousand, five hundred are still active. Most Hanos
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Speaker 2: are now between sixty five and seventy five years of age.
7:24
Speaker 2: Despite government incentives such as promoting annual festivals and building
7:28
Speaker 2: a museum and a school for the Reinho, a few
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Speaker 2: young women are willing to embrace the lifestyle of their grandmothers.
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Speaker 1: Since then, the culture and legend of the Hainos have
7:37
Speaker 1: gained more and more attention and revelry. In fact, the
7:41
Speaker 1: Kyoto Journal even talked about it helping establish a semi
7:45
Speaker 1: matriarchal society. They write quote the Haino have elevated social
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Speaker 1: status and in otherwise patriarchal South Korea. But it is
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Speaker 1: unclear why free diving became a female dominated profession on JJ.
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Speaker 1: Explanations range from men dying in deep sea fishing accidents
8:02
Speaker 1: or wars, to physiological reasons. For example, women's fat reserves,
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Speaker 1: supposedly making them more resistant to cold water. Historically, so
8:11
Speaker 1: many families depended on the income of the heino that
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Speaker 1: a semimatriarchal society developed in Jaju. It was not unheard
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Speaker 1: of for women to be the main breadwinners while men
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Speaker 1: would stay home and take care of the children. One
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Speaker 1: way in which non standard gender roles were manifested was
8:28
Speaker 1: through the payment of dowry to the family of the
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Speaker 1: bride instead of the groom. Unlike families in mainland South Korea,
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Speaker 1: families on Jaiju would wish for the birth of baby
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Speaker 1: girls rather than boys, which.
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Speaker 2: Is fun fast, fascinating and though the original divers may
8:44
Speaker 2: have started in four hundred and thirty four AD, the
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Speaker 2: traditions and practices changed as the people who took over
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Speaker 2: changed from men to more women in the seventeenth century. Historically,
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Speaker 2: the practice would be passed down from mother to daughter,
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Speaker 2: starting at the age about ten or eleven, but things
9:00
Speaker 2: change and the numbers have changed since then. So here's
9:02
Speaker 2: a bit more information from a Financial Times article. Traditionally
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Speaker 2: a job handed down from mother to daughter. Hanyo life
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Speaker 2: has been shunned in recent decades by nearly all the
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Speaker 2: girls born in Jaju's seaside villages, which have tended to
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Speaker 2: favor more comfortable lives in the islands two cities or
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Speaker 2: on the mainland. For more than fourteen thousand in the
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Speaker 2: nineteen seventies, the number of hanos has dwindled to fewer
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Speaker 2: than four thy five hundred today. So there are levels
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Speaker 2: that the Hano use for their expertise, and in order
9:29
Speaker 2: to be a part of one, it does take the
9:32
Speaker 2: villager's approval to get to that point. So here's some
9:35
Speaker 2: more information from wonder Wisdom dot com. Becoming a Hanyo
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Speaker 2: also is not an easy task. A new recruit has
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Speaker 2: to earn a yes vote from every woman in their village.
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Speaker 2: It can take up to five years for any woman
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Speaker 2: to reach an expert level after crossing various levels like
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Speaker 2: Sengun or novice Jungan, which is a middle level and
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Speaker 2: Hagen expert level. A Hagun can reach depth of more
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Speaker 2: than thirty feet, can stay more than two minutes underwater
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Speaker 2: at a.
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Speaker 1: Time, and some additional information thanks to Oceanographic Magazine quote.
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Speaker 1: This evolved into a system where only girls were trained
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Speaker 1: to perform the dangerous free diving work of the haino
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Speaker 1: to harvest items such as abalony, conch, seaweed, sea urchin,
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Speaker 1: and octopus from the ocean floor. To become a hano
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Speaker 1: is indeed a dangerous and tiring path. These women train
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Speaker 1: from the age of ten or younger to dive to
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Speaker 1: depths of up to twenty meters and hold their breath
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Speaker 1: for up to two minutes underwater. They dive with no
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Speaker 1: protective equipment other than their wetsuits, clippers, goggles, and weighted
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Speaker 1: vest or belts to help them dive deeper. Lives can
10:37
Speaker 1: and have been lost during these dives, right.
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Speaker 2: I think I read one article when a woman was
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Speaker 2: talking about how in the last I think like ten
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Speaker 2: to I want to say, five maybe five years, maybe
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Speaker 2: ten years, so they had lost fourteen people.
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Speaker 4: Wow.
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Speaker 2: And of course they talk about whether it's like the
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Speaker 2: pressure underneath and causing heart attacks or just losing them,
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Speaker 2: and like there're so many things. But I was like, dang,
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Speaker 2: that's all well for a small village, that's a lot.
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Speaker 4: Yeah.
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Speaker 2: So of course, with all the traditions and dangers, they
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Speaker 2: do all of this with love and respect for their environment.
11:18
Speaker 2: We were researching these amazing groups of women, most of
11:21
Speaker 2: them talked about what they do with a lot of
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Speaker 2: respect for their land and their area, and they talk
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Speaker 2: about the need of sustainability and safeguarding the ecosystem. So
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Speaker 2: Young Meet talks about it specifically to UNESCO. We're going
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Speaker 2: to talk more about their articles because they celebrate all
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Speaker 2: the women there. As j Juhanio, we adhere to a
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Speaker 2: small but essential rule. We avoid over harvesting. We respect
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Speaker 2: seasonal and size restrictions for marine products. For instance, during
11:47
Speaker 2: the abalone season, we only gather those that are at
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Speaker 2: least seven centimeters in size. Similarly, when catching conch, they
11:53
Speaker 2: must be over seven centimeters long. If we cannot assess
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Speaker 2: their size underwater, we check after surfacing and returned under
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Speaker 2: sized specimens to the sea, allowing them to grow naturally.
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Speaker 2: This approach ensures that we harvest marine products in a
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Speaker 2: sustainable manner as they continue to thrive and contribute to
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Speaker 2: the ecosystem.
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Speaker 1: And beyond just being conscientious of their harvesting, they actually
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Speaker 1: collect garbage in order to restore the water. Here's a
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Speaker 1: quote from goodyeworld dot com. As part of their civic responsibility,
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Speaker 1: Younger Hanyo regularly dive into the sea to extract garbage, plastics,
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Speaker 1: fishing nets, bottles, cans, oyster traps, styrofoam, and other human litter. Tourism,
12:33
Speaker 1: over development, a naval base, and plans for a second
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Speaker 1: airport also threaten their survival. In pre COVID years, soul
12:40
Speaker 1: Jju consistently ranked as the world's busiest air route, with
12:44
Speaker 1: an average of nearly two hundred flights per day. Unfazed
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Speaker 1: by the attention of tourists and the media for their prowess,
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Speaker 1: Haino views themselves simply as ordinary workers. Their propitious legacy
12:56
Speaker 1: is best summed up by oceanographer Sylvia A. Earle. If
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Speaker 1: we failed to take care of the ocean, nothing else matters.
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Speaker 1: No ocean know us. We need to protect the ocean
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Speaker 1: the same way we protect the land. The ocean is
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Speaker 1: the galaxy of life.
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Speaker 2: Right And just so y'all know, there's a lot of research,
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Speaker 2: I mean legitimate research papers based on what the heynos
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Speaker 2: have done and helping the ecosystem and helping to protect
13:22
Speaker 2: the ecosystem.
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Speaker 3: As well as the way that they breathe.
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Speaker 2: They have actually gone out of their way to see
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Speaker 2: what makes them so different and how they're able to
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Speaker 2: handle the temperatures as well as going underwater and surviving
13:33
Speaker 2: without equipment like oxygen and speaking of just to add
13:37
Speaker 2: to the hard coordinates to it, if you are using
13:41
Speaker 2: scuba gear or oxygen, that's cheating. That's what they told
13:45
Speaker 2: one reporter when they were like, why don't you do
13:47
Speaker 2: these new equipments And they're like, oh, no, that's cheating.
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Speaker 2: Why would we do that? And this again our sixty
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Speaker 2: five to eighty five year old women. And it wasn't
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Speaker 2: until the seventies that they decided not to use sojungi
13:57
Speaker 2: or muldruk sum or essentially cotton swim suits and from
14:00
Speaker 2: what I gather.
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Speaker 3: Is like long, robish type of outfits.
14:05
Speaker 2: And they started actually wearing wetsuits to protect themselves. And
14:08
Speaker 2: with that, I think we already mentioned, but they would
14:10
Speaker 2: have diving masks. Sometimes they would wear fins, they would
14:14
Speaker 2: wear gloves, chest weights, and often the ones that like
14:17
Speaker 2: oh that could cause cancer, that type of metal You
14:19
Speaker 2: sure you want to use that? They're like, yeah, it's fine,
14:22
Speaker 2: really just like eh. And then a weeding hoe and
14:26
Speaker 2: a net attached to a flotation device. And I have
14:29
Speaker 2: a feeling that some of my K drama people have
14:33
Speaker 2: seen this welcome to someone Dari I think is one
14:37
Speaker 2: that's specifically talking about Jju Island and the Hanyos and some.
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Speaker 1: Like tragedy of that.
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Speaker 3: And then our Blues has them too, and they were mean.
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Speaker 2: They are a click apparently, but they do it because
14:50
Speaker 2: they have to keep each other safe. That they don't
14:51
Speaker 2: trust each other, then they can't do it right. So
14:54
Speaker 2: the all these things, But if you want to talk
14:56
Speaker 2: about dramatized versions, there's plenty out there, and there's a
14:58
Speaker 2: lot of actually recent documentaries too, So if you all
15:01
Speaker 2: want to a little more.
15:02
Speaker 3: In depth, look at that.
15:04
Speaker 2: And with that, not just with the k dramas, we
15:07
Speaker 2: do want to talk about some of the legends and
15:08
Speaker 2: individual stories that were told, and also some of the
15:12
Speaker 2: funniest things. If you all, if you want to go
15:14
Speaker 2: look this up and just look up the Hanyos or
15:17
Speaker 2: the Korean Sea women, you'll see all these amazing pictures.
15:21
Speaker 2: Because photographers are so interested about this culture and they
15:25
Speaker 2: want to preserve it. They're to that point they understand
15:27
Speaker 2: this is a big deal. But like these women are like,
15:30
Speaker 2: oh my god, stop asking for my picture. I just
15:33
Speaker 2: want to go home. I just want to count my food,
15:35
Speaker 2: Like it is amazing, like this is the harmonies the
15:38
Speaker 2: Grandma's that.
15:39
Speaker 3: I'm like, yeah, that's about right. This is amazing.
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Speaker 2: But the pictures are beautiful and so interesting to just
15:45
Speaker 2: look at, so you should definitely take a look. But
15:47
Speaker 2: with that, yes, we do want to talk about some
15:48
Speaker 2: of the stories. There are a few that were featured
15:50
Speaker 2: for the YENESCO articles, and one of them was again
15:55
Speaker 2: we've already mentioned her, young me Joung. She's a fifty
15:59
Speaker 2: five year veteran, so not fifty five years old. She's
16:01
Speaker 2: been in the Hanyo community for fifty five years and
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Speaker 2: she talks about it. Life as a Hano has its
16:08
Speaker 2: share of challenges, especially for women. I've faced my own difficulties.
16:11
Speaker 2: In my case, economic hardships forced me to dive not
16:14
Speaker 2: only in local waters, but also in places like Japan.
16:18
Speaker 2: I've dedicated fifty five years to this profession, working tirelessly
16:21
Speaker 2: to earn a living. It's incredibly gratifying to see our
16:24
Speaker 2: recognition and appreciation on a global scale now that the
16:27
Speaker 2: culture of Jiju Haino is inscribed as a UNESCO Heritage Element.
16:31
Speaker 2: I firmly believe that being a Hano is one of
16:34
Speaker 2: the best professions for women even without formal education. Personally,
16:38
Speaker 2: I didn't have much formal education, but I take pride
16:41
Speaker 2: in what I've learned as a Hano. I have a
16:43
Speaker 2: daughter and a daughter in law, and my goal is
16:45
Speaker 2: to pass down this tradition to them, to make them
16:47
Speaker 2: Hanos as well. I'm committed to ensuring that this invaluable
16:51
Speaker 2: heritage continues to thrive and be transmitted to future generations.
16:55
Speaker 2: And she even talks about her own tactics and diving
16:57
Speaker 2: and says, quote, there are no special technique. My approach
17:01
Speaker 2: is quite simple. I hold my breath as long as
17:03
Speaker 2: I can. However, I emphasized to fellow divers not to
17:07
Speaker 2: push themselves too hard, as overexertion can be life threatening.
17:11
Speaker 2: The fundamental lesson I have been taught is to do
17:13
Speaker 2: what we can within our limits, in showing safety above
17:16
Speaker 2: all else.
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Speaker 1: The UNESCO article also talked about Kim Hyung m and
17:20
Speaker 1: her story as a Hano. Quote, I decided to become
17:24
Speaker 1: a Hano because my mother was also a Hano. After
17:27
Speaker 1: my divorce, I found myself raising two children on my own.
17:31
Speaker 1: Juggling work and taking care of my kids made it
17:34
Speaker 1: challenging to provide them with the care they needed, especially
17:36
Speaker 1: when they were sick. So I half jokingly, half seriously
17:40
Speaker 1: asked my mother if I could join her in diving.
17:43
Speaker 1: She mentioned that being a Hano would offer a more
17:45
Speaker 1: conducive environment for raising children, so I decided to give
17:48
Speaker 1: it a try. Of course, working as a Hano is
17:51
Speaker 1: physically demanding in the sea, but it gives me the
17:54
Speaker 1: flexibility to prioritize my children's well being when necessary. That's
17:58
Speaker 1: why I ultimately chose to pursue a career as a heno.
18:02
Speaker 1: And she continues specifically addressing the typical question of holding
18:06
Speaker 1: her breath underwater. Quote, The question of how long we
18:10
Speaker 1: can hold our breath underwater is when I frequently encounter
18:13
Speaker 1: no matter where I go. While being a Heino demands
18:16
Speaker 1: extended periods of breath holding, it's more akin to a marathon.
18:20
Speaker 1: Our work as divers often requires us to spend over
18:23
Speaker 1: four hours in the sea. When needed, we can hold
18:27
Speaker 1: our breath for more than two minutes, but we must
18:29
Speaker 1: be cautious not to overextend ourselves. If we hold our
18:32
Speaker 1: breath for too long, we risk losing our rhythm, which
18:35
Speaker 1: can impede our ability to continue working underwater. Typically, our
18:38
Speaker 1: breath holding time is around thirty five seconds or so.
18:41
Speaker 1: Going beyond that duration can have adverse effects on our
18:45
Speaker 1: bodies and our work, so we aim to keep it
18:47
Speaker 1: within that range. And with all of that, she talks
18:51
Speaker 1: about her daily routines. Quote. My daily routine as a
18:54
Speaker 1: j Ju Heno involves a combination of diving work and
18:57
Speaker 1: engaging in cultural and environmental activities. After completing my diving task,
19:02
Speaker 1: I dedicate time to practicing hano folk songs, a cultural
19:06
Speaker 1: tradition deeply rooted in my village. On days when I
19:09
Speaker 1: don't go diving, I participate in ocean cleanup practices aimed
19:13
Speaker 1: at removing debris from the sea and the coastline. In
19:17
Speaker 1: addition to being a hano I approached this cleanup work
19:20
Speaker 1: with the mindset of preserving and cleaning up our marine environments.
19:24
Speaker 1: My village is unique because we place importance on both
19:27
Speaker 1: our cultural heritage such as folk songs, and environmental conservation.
19:32
Speaker 1: This blend of traditions and responsibilities keeps me quite busy
19:35
Speaker 1: in my life as a Henio.
19:36
Speaker 2: Yeah, we're going to talk about those songs in a minute,
19:38
Speaker 2: but before that, nothing will slow them down, not even
19:43
Speaker 2: giving birth. So here's one story from a sixty five
19:46
Speaker 2: year old veteran Haino from huckmag dot org. A lot
19:51
Speaker 2: of women continued diving despite health challenges or during pregnancy,
19:55
Speaker 2: as did several of the women in Bosun's living room.
19:58
Speaker 3: Which is a person who hosts all the hainyos.
20:01
Speaker 2: Kim Sunja, sixty five year old even gave birth while
20:05
Speaker 2: she was at sea during spring. She was picking seaweed
20:08
Speaker 2: close to the shore and suddenly her water broke and
20:11
Speaker 2: she had no time to call somebody for help. I
20:13
Speaker 2: just climbed up the sea shore and gave birth to
20:15
Speaker 2: my daughter. When the others realized that I was missing,
20:18
Speaker 2: they found me and helped me back home with my
20:20
Speaker 2: baby safely. It was quite normal to give birth on
20:23
Speaker 2: the seashore, she told me, as her three youngest recruits
20:26
Speaker 2: looked thoroughly surprised. They would never be that calm, they proclaimed.
20:30
Speaker 2: The older Haino believed they had healthy babies because they
20:32
Speaker 2: were working in the sea while being pregnant, not a
20:36
Speaker 2: practice I would want.
20:38
Speaker 1: That is tense. That's some times, and age is only
20:44
Speaker 1: a number. A bit more from young Mejong, the first
20:48
Speaker 1: veteran Haino. We were talking about quote, I'm not the
20:51
Speaker 1: oldest among us. There's a remarkable ninety three year old
20:54
Speaker 1: Haino among our ranks. To her and others, I'd like
20:57
Speaker 1: to say, please take good care of yourself and consider
21:00
Speaker 1: stepping back from diving. We have many talented young Hainho
21:04
Speaker 1: emerging and your contributions have been invaluable. While I'm among
21:09
Speaker 1: the senior members, there are others who have more years
21:12
Speaker 1: of experience.
21:13
Speaker 2: Right. There are so many stories right after that being
21:15
Speaker 2: like they were talking about seventy three year old woman
21:18
Speaker 2: and there was an age she's like, oh, my sister,
21:20
Speaker 2: my older sister, she's still a Hano. Like they're all
21:23
Speaker 2: talking about the fact that they continue going well beyond
21:27
Speaker 2: I think that was one that was like one hundred.
21:30
Speaker 1: Wow.
21:31
Speaker 2: I'm not sure that that was a record or she
21:34
Speaker 2: still is a part of it. Like, there's so many
21:37
Speaker 2: conversations about the fact that they didn't start till much later,
21:40
Speaker 2: or they still continued and they don't exist anymore. So
21:43
Speaker 2: those are the average ages, especially when they started when
21:46
Speaker 2: they were ten. But of course this would be around
21:48
Speaker 2: the prime time of women being a part of this community.
21:52
Speaker 2: The camaraderie within the Haino community. It's inspiring and is
21:56
Speaker 2: something they passed down to the younger generation of Haino's
21:59
Speaker 2: Here's another quote the UNESCO article. The Haino community operates
22:02
Speaker 2: as a close knit group. Skilled divers may catch ten
22:05
Speaker 2: kilograms of seafood, while less experienced divers might not even
22:08
Speaker 2: reach one kilogram. However, everything is gathered together and shared equally,
22:13
Speaker 2: whether someone had a bountiful catch or a modest one.
22:16
Speaker 2: While younger divers may be honing their underwater skills, they
22:20
Speaker 2: actively contribute when out of the water. This equal sharing
22:24
Speaker 2: of earnings is a well organized system that attracts new recruits.
22:28
Speaker 2: The younger generations appreciate being treated equally and sharing earnings uniformly,
22:32
Speaker 2: while experienced Hano value the enthusiasm and respect of their
22:35
Speaker 2: younger counterparts. This mutual appreciation and strengthens our sense of
22:39
Speaker 2: community and reinforces the importance of preserving the culture of
22:42
Speaker 2: Jju Haano as an enduring tradition that should never be
22:46
Speaker 2: lost but passed on to future generations, and as a
22:50
Speaker 2: part of a lot of their history and tradition. Singing
22:52
Speaker 2: and songs are.
22:53
Speaker 3: A part of that culture.
22:55
Speaker 2: Here's some information from Atlas Obscure dot com. Chua Hueikyng,
22:59
Speaker 2: who has written at extensively about Haino for decades, says
23:02
Speaker 2: that writing the biography of a Doen, the first guardian
23:05
Speaker 2: of Heineo's songs, was one of the most memorable experiences
23:08
Speaker 2: of her career. The first time I heard her sing,
23:11
Speaker 2: I remember sobs in her voice, and before I knew it,
23:14
Speaker 2: I was crying too, She says. Haino songs served as
23:17
Speaker 2: practical purposes. Starting in the mid nineteenth century, Hainyo rode
23:21
Speaker 2: their boats to work far from Jju Island to distant
23:24
Speaker 2: locales such as Busan, gong Wan Province, and even Japan.
23:28
Speaker 2: To pass the time as they rode, the women sing
23:31
Speaker 2: simple melodies in six ' eight time to the rhythm
23:33
Speaker 2: of the sea waves. The song lyrics varied, but often
23:36
Speaker 2: women singing lamenting the day they were born, complaining about
23:40
Speaker 2: their incompetent husbands, and in protest of the government.
23:44
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I could understand that.
23:46
Speaker 2: So here's the lyric from one of the songs that
23:48
Speaker 2: I'm not going to sing because I don't know how
23:50
Speaker 2: to do six fight times, So I'm just going to
23:51
Speaker 2: read it to y'all. Bae baying dove into the sea,
23:55
Speaker 2: skipped the day's three meals and learned diving as a
23:58
Speaker 2: way to be slowly saved up one coin at a
24:01
Speaker 2: time to take a step at my husband's bar.
24:03
Speaker 1: Tab that's so.
24:05
Speaker 3: Sad in good the news.
24:06
Speaker 2: There's no sheet music for Haino songs, and a few
24:09
Speaker 2: of the nearly ten thousand known tunes have titles. Sometimes
24:13
Speaker 2: the songs are called yodo sauna because these two words
24:17
Speaker 2: appear often within the lyrics of Haino music, but no
24:20
Speaker 2: one is really sure what the term means. Some say
24:23
Speaker 2: yodo sana refers to a mythical island, a fantasy haven
24:26
Speaker 2: where problems cease to exist, or even a heavenly afterlife.
24:30
Speaker 2: Others say the words have no meaning at all.
24:34
Speaker 1: And the article goes on. The songs are poems filled
24:38
Speaker 1: with irony and tragedy, but a closer look reveals that
24:41
Speaker 1: they are a testament to these women's will to survive.
24:45
Speaker 1: And these songs are still sung today, and apparently some
24:48
Speaker 1: have tried to remix some of the originals, causing some debate.
24:52
Speaker 1: But one thing is for sure, the legacy of these
24:55
Speaker 1: songs remains an important part of the Haino culture.
25:09
Speaker 3: So what's happening today.
25:10
Speaker 2: We kind of already talked about it, but we're gonna
25:12
Speaker 2: delve a little deeper. The artistry of Haino has garnered
25:15
Speaker 2: more interests recently, with museums that are dedicated to the
25:19
Speaker 2: years and years of tradition and to the fact that
25:22
Speaker 2: UNESCO has placed them on the Intangible Cultural Heritage list.
25:26
Speaker 2: They have become a cultural and tourist phenomenon. And here's
25:30
Speaker 2: some more information from that Kyoto Journal article quote. In
25:33
Speaker 2: twenty sixteen, the Henya culture was assigned to the list
25:35
Speaker 2: of UNESCO Intangible Cultural Heritage due to its unique history
25:39
Speaker 2: and the rapid decline of female divers. Its elevated status
25:43
Speaker 2: due to the UNESCO listing has resulted in a new
25:45
Speaker 2: tourist industry and increased protection and funding for the women
25:49
Speaker 2: in the industry and the natural environment of the island.
25:52
Speaker 2: The government provides free healthcare and the necessary diving equipment,
25:55
Speaker 2: and has opened a diving school again and a museum.
25:58
Speaker 1: So there's that.
25:59
Speaker 2: However, while the new heritage status has brought benefits for
26:02
Speaker 2: the community, it has made the women into living artifacts
26:05
Speaker 2: who perform their work for tourist audiences. There are now
26:08
Speaker 2: places where you can pay to watch the women dive
26:11
Speaker 2: and buy their catch. I would be interested in doing
26:14
Speaker 2: that because I bet it's real good.
26:16
Speaker 1: I'd be interested in it. But I'm also like, I
26:18
Speaker 1: hope I'm not bothered.
26:20
Speaker 2: Well, I think as long as you're giving money, Yeah,
26:23
Speaker 2: that's that.
26:24
Speaker 3: They're cool with that.
26:24
Speaker 2: Like, don't bother them, don't come ask for pictures and selfies,
26:28
Speaker 2: just buy their food.
26:29
Speaker 3: Now, I'm good with that.
26:30
Speaker 1: Give that.
26:33
Speaker 2: So and from wonder Wisdom dot com. Yes, the tradition
26:37
Speaker 2: is dying, particularly as a neo generation have decided to
26:40
Speaker 2: take jobs in cities, but the Hano is still one
26:42
Speaker 2: of the most honored and respected women on the island.
26:45
Speaker 2: The strong work ethic and the decisive role they have
26:47
Speaker 2: played in society have given them international acclaim. In addition
26:51
Speaker 2: to the Hano becoming inscribed on the UNESCO List of
26:54
Speaker 2: Korea's Intangible Cultural Heritage in twenty sixteen, there's even the
26:57
Speaker 2: Hano Museum in Jju today, and tourists visit this picturesque
27:01
Speaker 2: island just to see them in action. As one Haino
27:04
Speaker 2: Moon Bulkhoi says, wherever I go, I tell people that
27:07
Speaker 2: I'm Haino.
27:08
Speaker 1: Proudly there are still those who are both looking to
27:12
Speaker 1: be a part of the tradition as well as teach
27:14
Speaker 1: the traditions. From gloriosport dot com quote. In recent years,
27:18
Speaker 1: a small number of young women have left their lives
27:21
Speaker 1: on the Korean mainland to become Hano, parting with their
27:24
Speaker 1: stressful city careers in order to reconnect with nature. The
27:27
Speaker 1: Hano we spoke with stressed the importance of national policy
27:31
Speaker 1: in preserving traditions, but insisted the responsibility lies with the
27:35
Speaker 1: senior divers to support and educate an emerging generation of
27:39
Speaker 1: divers and teach the wisdom of the waters. In many ways,
27:43
Speaker 1: Haino are agents of change an invaluable source of wisdom.
27:47
Speaker 1: Their lives depend on an intricate understanding of the ecosystem
27:50
Speaker 1: in which they play a part, owing to their profound
27:53
Speaker 1: respect for the environment. In spite of dwindling numbers of divers,
27:57
Speaker 1: the Haino represent an alternative vision for the future. Their
28:00
Speaker 1: century long tradition is teaching a more considered approach to
28:03
Speaker 1: fishing that might be the antidote to our broken, pillaged ecosystem.
28:08
Speaker 1: In the wake of unprecedented global environmental activism emerging from
28:12
Speaker 1: the bottom up, the tradition of Haino is far from disappearing.
28:16
Speaker 1: It's evolving and taking different forms on an international scale.
28:20
Speaker 2: And yeah, exactly like this. The practice has spread beyond
28:24
Speaker 2: just Jaju. Their newer groups to join the legendary crew,
28:27
Speaker 2: such as located on GoJ Island, still in South Korea.
28:31
Speaker 2: But as a populator has grown, there have become schools
28:34
Speaker 2: that are available to train future hano's, one in Jju
28:38
Speaker 2: and one in Kojo. So here's a quote from hunkmag
28:40
Speaker 2: dot org. The sixty nine year old who was being
28:44
Speaker 2: interviewed for this article admitted that when she first started
28:47
Speaker 2: to recruit new divers, she was skeptical. Hunting in the
28:50
Speaker 2: deep is a tough and dangerous job with no room
28:52
Speaker 2: for error. The fishing nets moved back and forth and
28:55
Speaker 2: can trap you quickly if you don't pay attention, she said,
28:57
Speaker 2: confessing that she has sworn to keep the three recruit
29:00
Speaker 2: on her boat safe. Originally from Jju, Lee moved to
29:03
Speaker 2: Koj as a child, and at that time daughters were
29:07
Speaker 2: supposed to work. They had no choice but to do this,
29:09
Speaker 2: She explained. It was hard to even go back inside.
29:12
Speaker 2: My mother kept saying, no, go out, go back, in
29:15
Speaker 2: the water, and this is kind of her beginning her
29:18
Speaker 2: time with the Hayinos obviously, as well as wanting to
29:23
Speaker 2: teach others and then spreading that. So they talked about
29:26
Speaker 2: what that process was for that island and how similar
29:28
Speaker 2: it is to Jju, but why it's important to keep
29:31
Speaker 2: going and keep teaching. So she had a lot of wisdom.
29:35
Speaker 3: For these young recruits.
29:36
Speaker 2: And yet there was one who I think she was
29:38
Speaker 2: thirty four talking about she just really fell in love
29:42
Speaker 2: with the idea of going away from the city and
29:45
Speaker 2: doing something close to nature. Again, I don't wonder. I'm
29:49
Speaker 2: thinking that that might have been me. Had I been
29:51
Speaker 2: in South Korea, I'd be like, I'm done with this
29:52
Speaker 2: because I was born in Seoul, like near Seoul, so
29:56
Speaker 2: I wasn't near the islands. But damn, I don't know that.
29:58
Speaker 2: I don't like the undersea They s freak me out,
30:01
Speaker 2: so maybe not.
30:03
Speaker 1: Yes, agreed, And I will also add on to that
30:08
Speaker 1: just to reiterate, like this so difficult physically to do
30:13
Speaker 1: what they're doing. But also over on my other podcast Saver,
30:17
Speaker 1: we did an episode on sea urchins. They're difficult to
30:22
Speaker 1: just get like that is hard right to do it?
30:26
Speaker 1: Takes a lot of skill, and I really love that
30:32
Speaker 1: they're so cognizant of the water and wanting to protect
30:38
Speaker 1: it and doing it like protecting the culture, protecting the water,
30:45
Speaker 1: protecting traditions. But it is it's difficult, It is so.
30:50
Speaker 2: Hard, so I think it needs to be like a
30:52
Speaker 2: lot of the times they get on a boat, go
30:54
Speaker 2: out far out into the ocean, far enough out, and
30:58
Speaker 2: then they jump in like they are through free divers
31:00
Speaker 2: I'm not saying they're just walking.
31:01
Speaker 3: In and storkling. That's not what they're doing.
31:06
Speaker 2: And they do try to keep together as a crew
31:07
Speaker 2: so they can watch each other just in case they
31:10
Speaker 2: are in distress because they don't have anything. But that
31:12
Speaker 2: floating device like that, to me is like what And
31:14
Speaker 2: it's all like decorated from what I've seen. Again, this
31:18
Speaker 2: is kay dramas.
31:21
Speaker 3: To show who is who.
31:22
Speaker 2: I think this is how they keep up with each other,
31:24
Speaker 2: and so it's part of what they do. But like it, Yeah,
31:26
Speaker 2: it's not what you think of. Just like they just
31:28
Speaker 2: walk out to the sea and then nah, they pick
31:30
Speaker 2: up No, like that one woman who was heavily pregnant,
31:33
Speaker 2: still needing to work and gather things. Sure, she might
31:35
Speaker 2: have been closer to the shore, but most of the
31:38
Speaker 2: time they are in boats and they all go out
31:41
Speaker 2: and then they dive in to go and retrieve whatever
31:44
Speaker 2: they can. And like areas, I think abaloni are harder
31:48
Speaker 2: to get because of the way they're like a little
31:50
Speaker 2: off from the main areas that they stay in. So
31:53
Speaker 2: it's a whole thing from what I've gathered, and it
31:56
Speaker 2: is it is very dangerous and the fact that these
31:58
Speaker 2: are elder like elder who are doing this is so
32:01
Speaker 2: amazing to even talk about. But again, if you have
32:05
Speaker 2: time to watch any of these documentaries, read any of
32:07
Speaker 2: these articles, you really should. Apparently sea urchins have hats anything.
32:12
Speaker 1: That's my favorite fact from our Savor episode on sea
32:17
Speaker 1: urchins is that they wear little hats and people usually
32:22
Speaker 1: it's like a shell or seaweed, you know, and it
32:24
Speaker 1: is to protect from the sun. During the pandemic, we
32:27
Speaker 1: were all depressed and so people started printing out like
32:30
Speaker 1: three D like Viking hats or which is hats, and
32:33
Speaker 1: the sea urchins will put them on, ye, and sometimes
32:36
Speaker 1: they will reject the hat if it's not good enough. Yes,
32:38
Speaker 1: and that makes me love them even more. Yes.
32:41
Speaker 2: Well, I was also saying that I had seen a
32:42
Speaker 2: video of an octopus. Yeah, be gifted a hat and
32:46
Speaker 2: like the because they had like trash and a diver
32:51
Speaker 2: was trying to bargain with this octopus and got rejected
32:54
Speaker 2: like three or four times to finally the perfect shell.
32:56
Speaker 2: And he was willing to give up the other hat
32:58
Speaker 2: to take that one, like it was a whole thing.
33:01
Speaker 2: Secrets are amazing and scary to me.
33:05
Speaker 1: Agreed. Agreed, but I cannot recommend enough. Look up seursians
33:10
Speaker 1: wearing hats if you need a boosts. Also, yeah, the boat,
33:18
Speaker 1: both of them.
33:19
Speaker 4: Uh huh.
33:20
Speaker 1: Well, listeners, If you have any thoughts about this, please
33:24
Speaker 1: let us know. We would love to hear from you.
33:26
Speaker 1: You can email us at Stepanie mom Stuff at iHeartMedia
33:28
Speaker 1: dot com. You can find us on Twitter at mom
33:30
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33:34
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Speaker 1: we have a book you can get wherever you get
33:37
Speaker 1: your books. Thanks always to our super producer Christina, our
33:40
Speaker 1: executive producer Maya, and our contributor Joey. Thank you and
33:43
Speaker 1: thanks to you for listening. Stuffan Never Told You is
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Speaker 1: protection of my heart.
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