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Thirst Quencher - Fight Club · Thirsty For More - Movie Review

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so where is mine? Mine? Where where? Dude? Also,
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: first drill of Thirsty for More is thirst Quenchers. Dude. Yeah,
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: welcome to thirst Quenchers. Nice to meet you.
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: Welcome to thirst Quenchers.
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: We've been doing these episodes that are one offs that
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: people seem to be really enjoying. It's getting people engaged
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: in the show again. And uh, it's been fun because
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: we kind of get to just choose some movies. You know,
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: we're not we're not working on any particular season. Yeah,
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: we're just kind of keeping it loose. So today we've
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: got nineteen ninety nine's David Fincher's iconic famous movie and
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: The Brothers Fight Club exactly. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, very that
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: very Yeah, all all like legends and icons of their time,
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: giving all of their gen X energy, gen X energy
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: and like greatest will ever. You know, like just like
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: it's a really interesting movie and I feel like there's
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: a lot to unpack with it. I do. I do
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: feel very much like I was like caught up in
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: arguments in my head during the whole movie, you know. Yeah, yeah,
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: because there's like stuff that's like really relevant, that's still relevant,
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: that's very interesting and useful and there's stuff that's like
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: so gen X cringe in a way that's like, oh, man,
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: you guys really did feel the sadness of not having
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: a war or depression.
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, like, here's the thing, And like, I
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: think that when we do approach this, I don't want
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: it to come off as like.
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: You're wrong, because you're not wrong. You're It's it's.
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: Not that that I'm I was worried about when talk
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: when we wanted to talk about the movie. What I'm
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: kind of worried about is sort.
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: Of, oh, I'm not worried about anything.
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: No, yeah, totally, it's just like unpacking it in a
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: way that's that's a little bit too narrow, because I
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: do think that the movie takes that into account, where uh,
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: these guys very particularly think that the problem is, oh,
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: we didn't have a war, we didn't have a depression.
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: We we are you and I went through a fucking depression,
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: uh in when we were teens and twenties.
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: Uh, and then we went to a fucking pandemic, so
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: like you know, and it didn't make us any better
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: or or like more manly. It just radicalized people in
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: a totally insane way and I think that the interesting
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: thing about this movie in general is that in instead
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: of thinking about it in a way that's like again
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: like very specific about Oh it's so cringey that they
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: thought about this, it's I think it's more interesting as
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: this is how people feel when they feel alienated and
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: they don't have meaning and they don't have feelings about
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: certain things. They feel empty, right, And at the end
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: of the movie, it feels like the emptiness is filled
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: and the void is filled by hey, like, you can
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: love people, you can feel good about yourself and fuck
• 3:34
  Speaker 2: like you want to fuck be who you want to be.
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: Like it's like those memes. It's like those memes, dude,
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: you see those memes where it's like, uh, ever, people
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: on the internet be like the fucking and they'll say
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: some really extreme radical review and then and people in
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: real life, hey man, what's up?
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, casual And it's true and it does feel like this,
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: and emptiness and and sadness does feel like this.
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: It feels like.
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: Things are are devoid of meaning in your life, and
• 4:08
  Speaker 2: then people find other ways to fill that whole, like
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: like radicalism.
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: That's like, I like, I feel like we're very much
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: living in the aftermath of the world that this movie
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: is describing, like extreme capitalism. It occupying every like facet
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: of our lives, and like, I don't know, like because
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: the movie, you know, I feel like you can't talk
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: about this movie without talking about capitalism. Like it's like
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: the whole idea is like that there's this kind of
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: underground working class revolution that that that is organized by
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: a mentally ill you know, like office clerk who who
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: feels underappreciated and decides to like create an alter ego
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: to outlive out this like outlandish you know, fantasy of
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: being a revolutionary leader, but then.
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: Has to deal with the consequences of being a revolutionary leader,
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: which is that it's messy and not good and like
• 5:08
  Speaker 2: pulls in psychos like.
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: Well, yeah, exactly, it kind of it kind of ends
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: up being something that feeds itself.
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And like the interesting thing is there are so
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: many variables that go on that because they're vague enough
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: to be applicable to enough people, but extreme enough that
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: it attracts the type of people who are disillusioned. You Like,
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: I've seen memes about this movie where they're like, oh,
• 5:43
  Speaker 2: he's so sad that he has a stable job, and
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: a good home and a call and can own a
• 5:47
  Speaker 2: condo and stuff like that, and it's like, that's funny,
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: And the only reason it is funny is because those
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: are things that everybody to some degree wants. But everybody
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: also wants to be the cool revolution guy.
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: No. But but the difference now, I think is that
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: is that like a lot of people and a lot
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: more people are reduced and I say that in quotations,
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: but like reduced to this like point where we're not
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: even you know, we haven't even achieved that much like
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: our generation, right and the generation after us gen Z
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: like like hasn't even achieved that much in like the
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: terms of like what the American dream is financially and
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: like in terms of like stability, right, like a lot
• 6:33
  Speaker 1: of us haven't. And so like I think that like
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: this idea of radicalization, it's kind of interesting if you
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: want to look at it in parallel to like how
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: people are sort of like behaving online and stuff now,
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: because like we have more of a preview to that
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: kind of thing, you know what I mean. And like
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: we've seen radicalized politics in the form of like you know,
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: alt right politics. We've seen you know, like we've seen
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: all different kinds of life like these sort of this
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: prediction almost like it's that's the thing is, like the
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: movie is cringe in the way that we like sort
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: of know this reality in a way, right, like people
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: getting more radicalized than like the more anti establishment ideas
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: being on the forefront, right, whether or not, like they're
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: debated and good and like you know, whether it's like
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: an anarchist kind of point of view or whether it's
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: like just like a libertarian Yahoo kind of point of view.
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: Like it's like the movie doesn't deal in that, And
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: I find that to be the great benefit of the movie,
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: but also to great sort of like oversight of the movie,
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: you know, because like the movie makes a lot of
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: really interesting parallels that even the book doesn't make. For instance,
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: like the book doesn't make the parallel between the franchises
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: the different sort of like franchises of Fight Club being
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: like replicating sort of patterns in capitalism that are like
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: hierarchical and like create this sort of like tiered system
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: that has like a punishment element, you know what I mean,
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: or like a you know what I'm saying, No, how
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: can I make it clearer? I got lost in the sauce.
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: Where was I, Well, like the idea that franchises as
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: they as they multiply and grow, you know, sort of
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: replicate the same kind of system that exists that it
• 8:38
  Speaker 2: exists in, right.
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: Right, and so like it creates also within that, it
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: creates the conditions for something like that to replicate. Right,
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: So all of the toxic behaviors just are like now
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: part and parcel of this thing. But there's a collectivist
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: sort of like ideology behind it, right.
• 8:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And but I just think that that's like inherent
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: to being a person, you know.
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: Well, But it's interesting though, because it's seen through this
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: idea of this very much individual who is kind of
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: like really taking it upon himself to create this revolution.
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: But he's like galvanizing people over like a mutual sense
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: of like disillusion uselessness in society. So they're just like
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: raging against the machine, but the machine is just themselves.
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: Like they're the own sort of like their own kind
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: of like fascistic rule based society that they're recreating. They're
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: just rebelling against being civil.
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they are rebelling against being civil.
• 9:41
  Speaker 1: Idea that civility is like sort of limiting because it
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: creates like this like exploitative working class sort of.
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: No, well, I mean maybe it does. I think it's
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: less about that and more just about lack of because
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: they mentioned war and they mentioned depression. There's a lack
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: of faith in them as people, as gen xers, because
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: he mentions constantly, Tyler Durdon mentions constantly like we aren't
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: our fathers, we aren't our grandfathers. We don't have great wars,
• 10:17
  Speaker 2: we don't have whatever, we don't have struggle, and struggle
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: is what creates you.
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: Right, right, But that's such to me, like that's the
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: most like new metal part of this one. Oh totally, dude,
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: what do you say?
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: I mean, that's that's what Jordan Peterson is, that's what
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: he he tapped into.
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: Oh man, because it's kind of wild because it's just
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: like such a narrow view of what society is like
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: it and it's so like it's very myopic. It's like
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: I don't really understand, you know, like I do understand
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: how somebody would buy into something like that, but like
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: just there's.
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: What's what's great about it is that And I'll link
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: this with with the idea that we just talked to,
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: which is you're right, it is myopic, and the problem
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: is that that my myopia replicates itself, the idea that
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: it's a copy of a copy of a copy. It's
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: a meme that gets taken from one thing of civility bad,
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: right in a certain context, that gets stripped out of,
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: like the context gets stripped entirely out of a phrase
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: like that civility bad, and then just replicates as civility bad.
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: It must get destroyed. We have to kill it. That's
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: the mission, you know what I mean. Like, it happens
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: all the time. Like I remember a couple of years
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: ago when people were like hating on civil quote unquote
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: civility politics. And part of that is that there's a
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: necessary critique of having to be civil in every point
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: in time.
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: Well, yeah, the expectation of I think, specifically black people.
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: Too, to be civil at a specific te So.
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: Like, yeah, I think very like that that's the problem
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: with vility politics.
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: But like, but what ends up happening is that gets
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: memified and gets stripped of its context, and then all
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: of a sudden you just get to a point of
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: civility bad. Right, You just get these ideas of uh,
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: like well, you know what, in the same way that
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: things like nature, natural, those words get freedom entirely gets
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: stripped of context, and then all of a sudden you
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: get like, well, I don't have the freedom to pick
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: my own doctor, to get my own like medicai, you know.
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: What I mean.
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: Like it becomes those types of things where it's like, Okay,
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: I understand how you're using that term, whether it be
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: a vague term like freedom or nature or natural like,
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: and I guess you're applying it to this thing. It's
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: weaponized and exploits exploitable in such an interesting way, which
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: is what happens in the movie. Like he does all
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: the things Tyler Diurton does all the things that he's
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: being criticized in the movie. He's a boss, he has order,
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: he has like all.
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: These like it kind of it undermines itself in a
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: way that even I think Chuck Paholniak didn't get.
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: Well, no, it doesn't undermine itself. It strengthens. That's what
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: satire is. It lends itself to being the most extreme
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: version of itself.
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: So this is I think this is the This is
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: my question because I think, like there's this movie is
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: really rich for a text, like we can sort of
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: mine it quite a bit. Do you want to go
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: through what do you want to I think we should
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: start going through it. That's why that's this is where
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: I was going with this because I think we need
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: to talk about it in context.
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: So at the beginning of the movie, Tyler Dirden and
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: the narrator are in a building. Tyler has a gun
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: in the narrator's mouth, and we're getting the narrator's perspective
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: on how this all happened. It's literally pausing and then
• 13:59
  Speaker 2: being like, I.
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: Am Jack's soiled underwear.
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: No, it's it's I am Jack's How did how did
• 14:06
  Speaker 2: I get into this situation? Well let me tell you?
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And like it's a cool device because it draws
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: you in. But this is what I kept wanting to
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: ask you, dude, like, and this is what I want
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: to get at uh, And I want to get at
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: it very early because I think we're going to be
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: talking about it throughout the movie.
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: I know this because we like when knows this, Okay, So.
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: This is this is this is what I This is
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: what I want to say. The knowing knowing that they're
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: that they're the one and the same person to me
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: makes this movie better. Oh yeah, because like you're sort
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: of like constantly seeing what he's unable to see in himself,
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: and there's a real dramatic irony. I remember when the
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: reveal happened. It was such a gag because everything that
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: was leading up to it was written in so well
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: wife exactly and like, and as a result, it was
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: it really like you know, I think it was just
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: really it really hits hard because of that, and so
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: we're seeing that I didn't realize there were this many
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: Tyler Dirdan's places this there's like.
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: Five, five or six, so like right in the first
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: act of that, when you know that they're there, like
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: it becomes so it's so obvious because it's very much
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: like but like the like we kept going, yeah, now,
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: something something that I wanted to talk about with you
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: because you had such an interesting reaction to this, and
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: it's not wrong necessarily. I don't think it's wrong. That's
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: not what I'm saying. I didn't say that.
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: This was my most interesting watching of this movie. I
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: have to say, good movie. It's such a good movie.
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: But the one thing that I wanted to to point out,
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: which is and it's not you're not wrong. It's you.
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: You point clocked it in a very overt way. But
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: I'll talk to you about it in a sec which
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: is meeting Bob for the first time where he's got
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: bitch hits and we're you sort of pointed out the
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: fact that it's like kind of making fun of the
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: people who are in these groups who need help and
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: they confide in each other and they make them that
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: each other feel better, which I think.
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: Is this is okay. Can I clarify? Yeah, because I
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: think that we're we're meant to see it through the
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: very cynical view of the narrator exactly, and so I
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: think that that's like the watching the movie that way
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: where you're like, oh, this is all skewed narrator perspective.
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah it's not. He's not real, even like he's barely
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: real in the movie.
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: You know. But then the movie is also asking you
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: to participate in some of this stuff because as kids,
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: I remember, like I used to think this was cool
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: and there was like a real sort of like truth
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: saying element to it where you're like, man, these guys
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: are really telling it the way it is, and like,
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: but now.
• 17:01
  Speaker 2: The Tyler Jrton and those guys right.
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, like the Tyler like Project Mayhem.
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: I believe in the cause of Projects Mayhem. I believe
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: in you know, Occupy Wall Street. You know what I mean.
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: I am gen X, you know, like like.
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: Through and through, I am Jax jen X.
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: I am Jack jen X's younger brother. But like I
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: feel like there's like a real interesting parallel to be
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: made and like sort of like cross generational gap to
• 17:30
  Speaker 1: be drawn. Like this movie drawn into the twenty first
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: century is really interesting. Yeah, totally because it is such
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: a reflection of all of the things that gen X
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: got I don't want to say wrong at that time,
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: but like some of the glaring mistakes are there, and
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: they are Jack's sort of like hidden the Freudian slip.
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: You know. That's how I feel. It's like this movie
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: is like telling on itself in many ways, you know,
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: in an interesting way.
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: Like it's like because I see it, I've always seen
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: it as a criticism of the things.
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: Please let's let's let's elaborate.
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: Let's elborate, like a criticism of hyper masculinity. Ye, despite
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: being constantly hyper masculine.
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's pathetic. Yeah, like all of it is pathetic,
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: Like when you see him fighting alone, it's it's not cool.
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: It's not cool.
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: In fact, fights in general are pretty uncool. They suck,
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: they hurt. It doesn't make you, it makes you. It
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: can make you feel invigorated at the time, but like,
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: man does it fucking suck having to deal with the
• 18:40
  Speaker 2: aftermaths of it.
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: But I think the hypermasculinity sorry is like in this
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: like because there's very much a homo like and so
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: I need to do a queer reading of this movie
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: because like there's very much a I'm sure this has
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: been talked about like a homo erotic undertone with Tyler
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: Dirden between Tyler Diurdon and and the narrator, and I
• 19:02
  Speaker 1: think also with some of the other characters, like the
• 19:05
  Speaker 1: real sort of like subservient and dominant. There's even even
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: almost like a bit of a kinky vibe in the
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: movie where there's a kind of like you leaning into
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: the hierarchy. There's a kind of fetishism of like, sir,
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: it's taken care of, yeah, totally, And there's a real
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: kind of like sort of like sexual tone. So I
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: feel like the movie is kind of like making fun
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: of that, but also like sort of like enjoy Like
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: there's a reveling in it and I think that's cool.
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and also the sexual element is and.
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: It's bisexual by the way.
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: They just let me fucking finish the sentence, please. I
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: appreciate the joke, but what fuck I forgot the what
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: I was gonna say? Shit, Oh, where the there's a
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: rob robbery of the main character's sexuality. He's very desexualized
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: at the beginning of the movie, and the times that
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: he cries, so the vulnerable times that he cries to
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: alleviate his insomnia at these like groups. There's a lack
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: of vulnerability in his life. There's a desexualized nature in
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: his life. He's cooked by himself, he's coucked by himself. Yeah,
• 20:24
  Speaker 2: literally and figuratively. We get his job where everybody's kind
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: of automatonic. Yeah, and they make silly jokes to avoid
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: feeling sad about the job that they have, which is
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: very depressing.
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: Totally.
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: They feel a sense of a different kind of hierarchical
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: structure where it's like, well, I have to answer to
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: this person who's kind of a fucking loser, and I'm
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: better than this guy.
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: There's a real kind of like rebellious but juvenile rebellious
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: spirit in the like kind of fuck my boss energy
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: of the movie, because it's like it's not really fuck
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: my boss, it's fuck everyone, it's fuck the boss. You know,
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: it's fucked the system, yeah, totally, And the movie does
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: go to that extent of fuck the system. Yeah, absolutely,
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: it wants to bring it all down.
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: And also it does a thing that I noticed a
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: lot of this isn't old and it is a gen
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: X trope. It's the the narrator going, wait a minute,
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: let me pull back. They still do this on fucking
• 21:32
  Speaker 2: American Life, and it's like they'll they'll do this thing
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: where it's like set up like with a bang and
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: then like, oh, let.
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: Me tell you how.
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: I think it's a useful it is.
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: It is storytelling kind of trope, and I think like
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: it served to make this movie. Like I remember the
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: the It's part of what makes this movie gen X
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: two is the like kind of like edgy filmmaking aspect
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: of it, which.
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: I'm like, but this was just that's just a style.
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: This was the music video era of people like making shit,
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: you know what I mean. So it was like true, like,
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: of course it's gonna look like this, but it looks fantastic.
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: It holds up really really well, like the filmmaking all
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: of it. The VFX hold up really fucking well. That
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: part where he's reading the catalog on the toilet and
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: the like images are all coming up. That's like that's
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: hours and hours and millions of dollars to do, and
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: now you can do it in afternoon, you know what
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: I mean.
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: Like, but it looks. The look of it, though, is
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: also very like specific. The look of all of the
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: CG and the movie even like even when like the
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: plane like falls apart and stuff like that, the graphic
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: or like the kind of like the kind of like
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: field that you get while you're watching it. You know
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: it's not real, but like part of those scenes also
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: has a very kind of like edgy dark look.
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: That's everything's super dark.
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: And yeah, it like saturated to shadow.
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it's it's like certain colors are very saturated,
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: like the yellows, things that make it look like Barfee
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: a little bit. Yeah, and I remember disgusting and sweaty.
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: I remember this is like the first movie I really
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: started noticing like the colors of the scenes and like
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: how much green and yellow.
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: I'm seeing and green thing you're wearing. That's provocative, and
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: even like things like commentary about the medical system in
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: America where you've got him asking his doctor, Hey, dude,
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: I'm in.
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: Pain and there's no I can't sleep.
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and there's no sense and he's like, eat some
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: of this route, take some Valerian road, you'll be fine.
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: No one ever died of insomnia. I'm like, I'm pretty
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: sure that's not true. There's sometimes like movies in the nineties,
• 23:51
  Speaker 2: especially like they would just say something, they would have
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: someone in authority say something that was kind of like condescending,
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: like cut to the doctor being like, no one ever died.
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: But maybe then he goes you want to see pain.
• 24:05
  Speaker 2: But it was like.
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: That check out the cancer war. Yeah, And I'm like,
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: did you actually go to the doctor? Did you imagine
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: the doctor?
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: I mean that's the thing too, is that well, we
• 24:15
  Speaker 2: can get to that theory if you want, where Marla
• 24:17
  Speaker 2: is also an imagination. Oh god, because also like you
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: watched the movie and no one interacts with her, no
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: one ever talks to her.
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: That's a ghost Marla theory is amazing.
• 24:29
  Speaker 2: I like ghost Marla theory.
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: Okay, okay, we'll get to that. Yeah.
• 24:34
  Speaker 2: So he goes to his first meeting and he finds
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: this was the scene you pointed out where the guy
• 24:41
  Speaker 2: was like, and it is funny. It's definitely meant to
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: make fun of the guy and the situation, but as
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: the movie goes on, you do kind of he does
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: kind of reflect on it in a way where he's like, actually,
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: you know what, this was a good way of trying
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: to approach this problem, like being vulnerable, talking to people
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: making friends, Like, yeah, dude, that's a good thing. And
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: then he but he does it, and he does it
• 25:11
  Speaker 2: in the worst and surrounds himself by narcissistic, lunatic losers.
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: And yeah, like the just the like the like channeling
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: of toxicity. The fact that it's based in violence is
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: like it's so interesting. Like this it seems like very
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: like straight repressed culture like trying to cannibalize itself, you
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: know what I mean, And like they sort of take
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: the violence of that, but like they're out there living
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: out the most homo erotic thing without actually ever getting
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: truly gay, you know what I mean.
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, But the thing is what I like about this
• 25:57
  Speaker 2: movie is that it kind of just applies to everything,
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: like you can get you can get really into weird territory.
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: There's nothing gayer than repression.
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: So I mean, yeah, that's true, but in the sense that,
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: like how this kind of radicalism evolves in people isn't
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: necessarily based on one individual sort of ideology or idea.
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: It seems to grow out of like whatever context you're
• 26:32
  Speaker 2: in and then taking whatever ideology you have and then
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: applying it to how you're feeling. Right, So it's like,
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: you know, it's that kind of adage that I never
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: used to accept, which is like, you know, a Christian guy,
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: it's not just the Christianity that's going to like radicalize
• 26:49
  Speaker 2: this person, or it's going to be a particular context.
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: It's going to be a particular worldview. It's going to
• 26:55
  Speaker 2: take a like you know what I mean, So we
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: can just be applied to anything, you know, like a
• 26:59
  Speaker 2: plus like I mean. The homo eroticism definitely is a
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: major major theme in the movie, probably in part because
• 27:12
  Speaker 2: of Chuck Palinak being gay.
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like there's there's no way that like a gay
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: person didn't write this. Yeah, sure, it's like literally just
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: be gay, do crime. It's like it's the kind of
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: essentially that.
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: Yeah, And I think I think it's I think it's
• 27:31
  Speaker 3: interesting because it is it's kind of honing in on
• 27:35
  Speaker 3: a very real sort of anxiety in the culture.
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: But it's it's interesting because I don't think it's like
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: honestly reckoning with it.
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: You know, really, I think it is. You think.
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: I just think that there's a part of the there's
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: such a lack, there's such a joylessness in it. And
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: I think, really, what do you mean. I don't know.
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: He's just like he seems like he's just like stressed
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: the fuck out the whole time.
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean he is, but then he gets joy
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: and like beating the ship of other people.
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: That's true, and like starting this and he is, he's
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: getting a thrill out of starting this.
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: He's getting it. Yeah, he wants to start the call.
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: Because people are also serring him as well.
• 28:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he's he is.
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: An important figure.
• 28:21
  Speaker 2: He's an important figure. He's a narcissist too, like he's
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: the But I want to comment on a few things
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: before we continue. Number One, Meat Loaf's performance incredible, incredible. Yeah,
• 28:32
  Speaker 2: like that talk about vulnerability that in an in the
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: nineties playing this character with so much grace and so
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: much care.
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: Can I ask you a question about me? Love? Yeah,
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: like what happened? Because no, but no, no, no, hold on,
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: hold on, hold on. The thing to me though, is
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: like the guy is saying, so well, oh now he's
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: like and like what happened in his like both like
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: he was like I remember after shows he would like
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: have to be on oxygen masks and stuff. And apparently
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: he like blew out his voice, but he can't hit
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: a note anymore, Like he's like he doesn't, he's never
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: it's not his pitch is bad, Like I'm like, do
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: you not know how to sing anymore?
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: I mean maybe he doesn't dude.
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: Anyway for what he can't do anymore in the like
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: kind of like vocal acrobatic department he's able to make
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: up for in such like strange like to have like
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: such insight into a character. It's played like a musician
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: would play.
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: It's totally played like totally. It's like some sort of
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: extra thing that's not taught as like an actor how
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: you would. It's because he plays it almost like childlike
• 29:59
  Speaker 2: at certain point where he's like excited. It's like it's
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: like a naive adult man, Like I bet people like
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: this where it's like they're just like yeah, they're almost
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: like children where it's like really where it's like he's
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: excited to tell you about a thing and that's what
• 30:16
  Speaker 2: he gets. Well, the first rule is I'm not supposed
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: to talk about.
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: It, but you know, like I think that that was
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: really interesting actually, and I'm glad you brought Bob up
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: because he's there's a real desire within him, like there's
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: a real passion within him about wanting to like do good,
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: you know, like do something like useful exactly.
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: Because that's what men in the culture for like a
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: long time have felt like it's like useful.
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: But this is such a tool. But it's such a
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: gen x trope to be like you know, that sadness
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: of that of like, oh I was never useful. That's
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: why I didn't, you know, like yeah, it's kind of
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: like a okay, dude, Like I don't know they dealt
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: with it in such a weaner way like they did.
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: Why do they like slope their shoulders and like cry
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: in the corner? You know, why did they cook themselves?
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: Because I think that well, as I've been getting older,
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: and the more.
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: I'm the more coocked I've been getting.
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah. No, but but like in the in the world
• 31:26
  Speaker 2: of being thirty closer to this person's age than I
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: was yeah when I now yeah, now past thirty, Yeah,
• 31:38
  Speaker 2: and like being more a person that's learned or or
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: understands something a little better than than being just angry
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: about a thing or about a lot of things, justified
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: or unjustified. It feels a little bit like, oh, maybe
• 31:57
  Speaker 2: this new thing that's happening now is just actually repeats
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: of the same old things that have been happening, and
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: like it's all just like yeah, I mean.
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: That's all just like hard. That's why I say there's
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: like a there's a juvenile energy to the movie. You know,
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: there's a kind of like there's a kind of like
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: this is yeah, like this isn't like this.
• 32:19
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's a story. It has to neither's mental
• 32:22
  Speaker 2: illness isn't like this, I know, but like you have
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: to like frame it in some way for the point
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: to come across.
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: Of course, and I think the movie does a really
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: good job of that, And that's why it's still like
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: in quotations holds up and like I don't want to
• 32:36
  Speaker 1: like be like, I think this movie holds up absolutely
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: because you just like you, when you put on different glasses,
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: when you look at things through different lenses, there's still
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: like stuff to be mined. Like we we we are
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: still even though we're in a new place, we're still
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: evolving out of this culture, you know what I mean.
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: Like we all saw these movies. We all felt and
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: now movies don't mean anything, well no, but we all
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: felt that that that kind of like as a kid,
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: when you remember watching this movie and like the real
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: kind of like a fuck you rebellious quality. There was
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: something very like alluring about that. And every time he
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: says something that's like, you know, kind of clever, you
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: you are charmed by it.
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, of course, of course, And that's why people fall
• 33:26
  Speaker 2: for like goons like this is because they're like, oh, yeah,
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: that is close. So people fell for Jordan Peterson because
• 33:34
  Speaker 2: he was like, oh I'm actually they didn't understand what
• 33:38
  Speaker 2: I'm saying. I have big boy words and they they
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: just misquote me or take me out of context.
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: Well, this is the importance of law, right, Like this
• 33:48
  Speaker 1: is what builds his own lore exactly. Yeah, this is
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: like why everybody is so thirsty for.
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: Law, thirsty for Laura. Indeed, speaking of thirsty for Law,
• 34:00
  Speaker 2: the lore building in this where he's going to these
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: different groups and then he hits on the meditation group
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: of the cave and the the you know this.
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: Power animal or whatever.
• 34:12
  Speaker 2: The interesting thing about scenes like that is that, like
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: those things are hype, can be hyper hyper useful, especially
• 34:20
  Speaker 2: for people who suffer from things that aren't necessarily physically
• 34:31
  Speaker 2: what am I trying to say, express themselves physically necessarily, right,
• 34:37
  Speaker 2: So they're mental pains, and these can be extremely useful.
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: And then in the two thousands that got really like
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: out of sync and people started hating on things that
• 34:49
  Speaker 2: were like Deepak Chopra and no, no, no, the kind
• 34:52
  Speaker 2: of like meditation guruy kind of thing, and it fell
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: very out of favor. Although it's all sort of in
• 35:00
  Speaker 2: favor because people just kind of replace pick and choose
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: and replace their gurus now. But it's interesting that that
• 35:09
  Speaker 2: stuff like that, watching the him like go through his
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: meditative state and the animal being like slide like those
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: like I said before, those things can be really helpful.
• 35:22
  Speaker 2: They can be like really liberating to just kind of
• 35:26
  Speaker 2: be at peace with yourself and and just imagine a thing,
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: you know.
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: But let's break it down though for a second. If
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: if a guy went to like a group for a
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: support group for for for like specific like ailments like this,
• 35:44
  Speaker 1: I think that would be like really kind of like
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: fuck up behavior, you know, like exploit for someone who
• 35:51
  Speaker 1: is like kind of like going to these things. I mean,
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: like I guess he's not hurting anybody, but there's something
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: really like, yeah that the tourist aspect of it, the
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: dis missed the aspect of it, the like yeah, emotional
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: catharsis of it. Like there's like something about the perversion
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: of it that that is like interesting because and it's
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: even more supposed to be twisted, right, it's even.
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: More interesting that he knows, and he knows because Marla
• 36:16
  Speaker 2: comes in. But it's it makes it interesting to the
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: ghost Marla theory makes it really interesting because nobody says
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: anything to her. They could be it could be just
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: because she's kind or they're kind and they don't want
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: to alienate her.
• 36:31
  Speaker 1: No, she's like a bit of a conscience for him
• 36:33
  Speaker 1: because exactly he can't feel good in the groups anymore
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: when she starts showing up. When she's kind of like
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: a guardian angel. She comes in angel theory.
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: But but here's the interesting thing is that him him
• 36:47
  Speaker 2: feeling guilty about it seems like it also actually advances
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: the idea that she's not real, because it's like, oh no,
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: the thing that I thought I was getting out of this,
• 36:57
  Speaker 2: I'm not actually getting out of it. I keep having
• 37:01
  Speaker 2: this thing, this sadness, because she could just be like
• 37:06
  Speaker 2: that sadness, guilt, fear, anger, fear of of even fear
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: of his own sexuality.
• 37:14
  Speaker 1: At one point, well, right, because like he's because it's
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: so involved with he's so involved with all these men
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: and like he needs to fuck.
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: Her to sort of can't have gay feelings like sadness,
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: and that's why vulnerab But that's why.
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: It's interesting, like that he he fucks her with Tyler.
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: Tyler's dick, Yeah exactly, and like and he's so he's
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: so miserable, but she's around. It's so funny because it's
• 37:41
  Speaker 2: kind of like over the top. He's like a petulant child.
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: But it's so like it's almost like the like aspirational
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: masculinity of gen X. You know, if we're looking I
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: keep kind of toggling between viewpoints on this, you know,
• 37:54
  Speaker 1: because I'm like at one point talking about the queerness
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: but then also talking about like the real sort of
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: like dated generational kind of stuff that like just isn't
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: like now we're like now past this sort of like
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: totally this crisis and we're in a different new one.
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: Do you differently totally different? It almost reflected, Yeah, are
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: a different crisis of masculinity for a different slightly like weirder,
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: just weirder.
• 38:23
  Speaker 1: Well everything got weirder.
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, everything got really weird. But what what I want
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: to just avoid using dated just because like it's an
• 38:33
  Speaker 2: of its time movie in the same way that like
• 38:35
  Speaker 2: when I remember when somebody said Taxi Driver was dated
• 38:38
  Speaker 2: to me, and I was like, that's doesn't really fit
• 38:41
  Speaker 2: the you know what I mean because it is set
• 38:43
  Speaker 2: and you know in that era.
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: I know what you. I know what you mean. I
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: just I just know you. I know, when held up
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: to like a lens, like like I said, we were,
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: we're toggling between lenses, but like it when held up
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: to certain lenses of like right now, you can help
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: but be like, well I noticed that this, this, this,
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: and this is different and if this movie is saying X,
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: and the conclusion of X wasn't like that, you know
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: what I mean. It's like watching what a future movie
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: got wrong when you get to that year, you know
• 39:14
  Speaker 1: what I mean, Like, Oh, they thought this was going
• 39:17
  Speaker 1: to be the solution, when really it's actually just like this,
• 39:19
  Speaker 1: you know what I mean?
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: Well, yeah, I mean, but that's that's also imposing solutions
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: into the movie, which I don't think it is. I
• 39:25
  Speaker 2: think it's it's I think it's very critical of specific
• 39:28
  Speaker 2: things capitalism, corporatism for sure. Yeah, there's like advertisements throughout
• 39:34
  Speaker 2: the entire.
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: Movie, absolutely, But but what I want to say is
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: like there's a cynicism to the advertisements in the movie
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: because it's kind of playing into the games of like
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: you know, it's using sort of like this like anti establishment.
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: It's aestheticizing anti establishment behavior, right, like.
• 39:51
  Speaker 2: Well the people wear it as an aesthetic.
• 39:54
  Speaker 1: And corporatizing it.
• 39:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and they do, and they do yeah, so like
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: and and the true believers are the ones who do
• 40:00
  Speaker 2: fucking bombsh it.
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: And you're like like I.
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: Don't want that. Wait, well, let's bring civility back, you
• 40:07
  Speaker 2: know what I mean. That's that's the game that it's playing.
• 40:12
  Speaker 2: It's like when do you be the revolutionary? When is
• 40:15
  Speaker 2: it okay? When those questions are definitely asked, And then
• 40:20
  Speaker 2: when you get to like people who are like weird
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: narcissists who like cultify it, and it's like it's not
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: about like the people that I think really skirted that
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: line where it's like, well, it's a cultural personality, but
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: it's not like somebody like a Chevara is like a
• 40:37
  Speaker 2: guy who was just like, well, I did a revolution here,
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: see you later. I'm going to the next place.
• 40:41
  Speaker 1: You know. That's the kind of thing that's that's really franchises, dude.
• 40:45
  Speaker 2: But but like in terms of but like he did it,
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: and he didn't make up an imaginary friend to do it.
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: You know, he really believed in it, whereas this guy
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: doesn't believe.
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: This, doesn't want to thing that he wants the aesthetic, right,
• 41:02
  Speaker 1: that's the whole thing. That's that's why I think it's
• 41:05
  Speaker 1: really interesting in this movie because like he's he's just
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: and he builds something that is greater than himself unintentional,
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: unintentional exactly because he doesn't actually believe it. He wants
• 41:17
  Speaker 1: all the things he just doesn't have. Also, he doesn't.
• 41:21
  Speaker 1: He doesn't think yet he doesn't. Yeah, he doesn't believe
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: in himself.
• 41:24
  Speaker 2: That's very I I find that gen xers and millennials
• 41:30
  Speaker 2: are so similar in that sense, and that's kind of
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: why that repetition of toxic masculinity happened with like.
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: We looked at the lens, looking at the lens exactly. Yeah.
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: So now it's like a weird lobster man and a
• 41:45
  Speaker 2: weird like sex trafficker who somehow like now a Muslim
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: and like has this like cult following about him or
• 41:54
  Speaker 2: like entertained, or like Donald Trump being this epitome of
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: masculinity where it's like what this guy, this guy who
• 42:01
  Speaker 2: you would never you'd be, You'd be Tyler Dirton being
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: like you are two fucking old fatty, you know what
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: I mean, Like that's what you would be like.
• 42:11
  Speaker 1: But I want to I want to get to wants
• 42:14
  Speaker 1: like young white men and his in his crew, like
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: young white shaved head men. Yeah, but very blonde.
• 42:21
  Speaker 2: Well now it's now it's totally different. Now it's like
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: you get people like Nick Fuentes and like that that
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: what's that?
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: Oh? Yeah, the guy who is who's running.
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: The Proud Boys, like the Cuban dude, like where it's
• 42:34
  Speaker 2: like multi ethnic gags of lunatics, like white supremacis what.
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: But I want to shout out this performance because she's
• 42:44
  Speaker 2: both a Danny maulroon and it's such a good fucking
• 42:49
  Speaker 2: juicy moment where Chloe is like, I have pornographic movies
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: and she's like blowing those, I have lubricant, lubricants nor
• 43:00
  Speaker 2: side nitros oxide or.
• 43:03
  Speaker 1: Nitrates something nic something.
• 43:06
  Speaker 2: Like both so funny but like so vulnerable, damaged and
• 43:13
  Speaker 2: so psychologically hurt by the fact that she's gonna die
• 43:16
  Speaker 2: totally and like but like that human need of touch
• 43:20
  Speaker 2: and everyone's discomfort with it. Showing panning across to show
• 43:25
  Speaker 2: that show people just kind of like just with their
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: eyes looking and.
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: Breathing in yeah, and everyone having their own sort of
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: like kind of reactive moment really shows like how much
• 43:38
  Speaker 1: David Fincher is directing, you know.
• 43:40
  Speaker 2: Plus all the people like not just knowing that like
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: it's uncomfortable, but understanding it in a way that's so
• 43:46
  Speaker 2: personal to them. The reason they feel so uncomfortable is
• 43:49
  Speaker 2: because they see themselves in Chloe reflected. And then we
• 43:55
  Speaker 2: get and finally we can we can get to to
• 43:58
  Speaker 2: Marla because she gets like dialogue, she gets to be introduced.
• 44:02
  Speaker 2: So she's just very cool aesthetically in the movie, not
• 44:06
  Speaker 2: just iconic looking frizzy tim Burton hare and the Tim
• 44:11
  Speaker 2: Burton aesthetic and married to Tim Burton.
• 44:17
  Speaker 1: Johnny Depp or Tim Burton.
• 44:20
  Speaker 2: Did Tyler himself too?
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah?
• 44:24
  Speaker 4: Absolutely he got he got Marlin got Marla. Yeah he is.
• 44:29
  Speaker 4: He lived out the fantasy guaranteed. They had like a
• 44:34
  Speaker 4: three way.
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: And and tim Burton just watched, yeah, and he was
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: happy about it. Yeah, I mean, of course everything.
• 44:42
  Speaker 2: So she's like smoking, getting like dollies into her face
• 44:46
  Speaker 2: and like slow mo, and then the the brilliance of
• 44:50
  Speaker 2: having Edward Norton come up to her, pull her aside,
• 44:56
  Speaker 2: and as she's getting coffee, and then the like subtle
• 44:59
  Speaker 2: things like her overfilling the coffee cup.
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: And I love that I saw your practicing. And then
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: that's what I was gonna say. You go ahead, sorry,
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: sorry she was. He was like, listen, I don't know,
• 45:12
  Speaker 1: I don't know, I don't know it that well. I
• 45:14
  Speaker 1: just know that I saw you practicing line. And he's like, uh,
• 45:19
  Speaker 1: you know, you've done. What does he say to her?
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: He basically calls her out for being a quote unquote
• 45:26
  Speaker 2: and he she catches him off guard by saying, I
• 45:32
  Speaker 2: saw you practicing this like monologue you were gonna do
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: at me, because she notices him, and also nobody else
• 45:39
  Speaker 2: seems to notice either of them.
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, or really pay attention to any of their like
• 45:44
  Speaker 1: kind of like obviously like arguing.
• 45:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, or like flirtation, like her crying and like mushing
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: herself him in a way that's like very intimate, in
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: a different kind of intimate way than the rest of them.
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: The rest of them. It's like I need this touch
• 46:00
  Speaker 2: because I feel lonely, or I feel lonely in the
• 46:04
  Speaker 2: way that people who don't under normies who don't understand
• 46:08
  Speaker 2: the pain of cancer, sickle cell anemia, brain parasites, whatever
• 46:14
  Speaker 2: groups they're going to, but distilled in that is a
• 46:19
  Speaker 2: kind of human sadness that they all sort of feel.
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: But do you think that Marla like is just like
• 46:28
  Speaker 1: this kind of like gothic cherub, that he's just like
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: imagined like to be like this like kind of empathetic, yeah,
• 46:38
  Speaker 1: compassionate sex doll, Yeah, kind of what's it called almost pre.
• 46:44
  Speaker 2: Manic pixie dream girl? Right, both aesthetic, although she does
• 46:49
  Speaker 2: have a lot more character in three dimensions than a
• 46:53
  Speaker 2: lot of.
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: Marla's, Like god, like, even some of her lines are
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: like like, there's just so much character in the like
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: totally saying the line like I haven't been fucked like
• 47:02
  Speaker 1: this since grade school is like really shocking, and like
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: says a lot about a character and the way she
• 47:09
  Speaker 1: acts it all there is just.
• 47:12
  Speaker 2: Like confident, determined, but also.
• 47:14
  Speaker 1: But also you know, a joker with the damaged dritt.
• 47:20
  Speaker 2: And and then but also keeping up with him in
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: terms of like, hey, you get four days a week
• 47:28
  Speaker 2: and I only get two. We got to split this up.
• 47:30
  Speaker 1: Even, you know what I mean.
• 47:32
  Speaker 2: And and then and then her like doing the robbing,
• 47:35
  Speaker 2: robbing the fucking laundry bat and then going to sell
• 47:39
  Speaker 2: the clothes that like stuff like that, which is completely
• 47:43
  Speaker 2: unsaid totally and just like and then what he condescends
• 47:48
  Speaker 2: to her being like you're selling you're selling these and
• 47:51
  Speaker 2: he's like, yes, I'm selling these clothes.
• 47:55
  Speaker 1: But there's also just like this l of you know,
• 48:03
  Speaker 1: kind of like these like little anti establishment moments where
• 48:09
  Speaker 1: like she's taking clothes from someone else to sell to
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: make a quick buck, you know, for like whatever she
• 48:16
  Speaker 1: she might need, like the way that.
• 48:17
  Speaker 2: People point she like, I'm not destitute, She's just not poor.
• 48:26
  Speaker 1: Anyway, Go ahead, sorry, Well, so, like are we to
• 48:29
  Speaker 1: believe that Marla is like she's just getting like is
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: she imaginary or is she just getting by? Like what
• 48:36
  Speaker 1: does she do? Is she just like mentally ill and does.
• 48:41
  Speaker 2: Like some sort of social assistance or something. We don't
• 48:44
  Speaker 2: get that kind of necessarily that amount of detail. But
• 48:47
  Speaker 2: she's but it's unimportant.
• 48:49
  Speaker 1: But it is in a way because she's part of
• 48:51
  Speaker 1: this like crew that is like a left behind crew,
• 48:56
  Speaker 1: you know what I mean, like like forgotten misfits, and like,
• 49:00
  Speaker 1: you know, like she that's why she's like going to
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: these meetings and fucking with this guy that's like, you know,
• 49:04
  Speaker 1: kind of kind of like a sketchy dude, you know
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: what I mean, He's.
• 49:07
  Speaker 2: Kind of a sketchy person. She's doing the same thing,
• 49:10
  Speaker 2: I guess, yeah, And that that part what's great also
• 49:13
  Speaker 2: is the foreshadowing, like she's like, are you what's wait,
• 49:17
  Speaker 2: you didn't write your name when when you when you
• 49:19
  Speaker 2: got my number? Is your name Rupert or Travis or
• 49:22
  Speaker 2: any of the stupid names. But what's awesome about the
• 49:29
  Speaker 2: scene where where she because she also walks into the
• 49:32
  Speaker 2: street and like one of the cars are stopping. But
• 49:38
  Speaker 2: what's what's also incredible about this scene in particular where
• 49:42
  Speaker 2: they have this interaction of splitting up the days, is
• 49:45
  Speaker 2: that she goes in like pretty hard on him, is
• 49:48
  Speaker 2: like all right, dude, like I don't want to like
• 49:52
  Speaker 2: fuck with you, and then he's like, well, can I
• 49:54
  Speaker 2: have your number? And then she's like she knows what
• 49:58
  Speaker 2: he's doing, but she's kind of in it too because
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: it's like all right, cool, like yeah, she's like it's
• 50:04
  Speaker 2: hard to get they're both sort of playing hard to get.
• 50:07
  Speaker 1: No, But the way she acted it too is like
• 50:11
  Speaker 1: there's a real like that's why, well.
• 50:14
  Speaker 2: Can I get your number? You know if we want
• 50:16
  Speaker 2: to switch days? And she's like, okay, all right, if
• 50:19
  Speaker 2: you want to switch days.
• 50:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, the movie's so much better when you
• 50:24
  Speaker 1: know that it's that it's all.
• 50:27
  Speaker 2: And then we expand on what his job is, which
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: is a lot of travel, a lot of seeing crashes
• 50:35
  Speaker 2: and demolition. He works for an insurance company.
• 50:37
  Speaker 1: Okay, so this is the other thing that I wanted
• 50:39
  Speaker 1: to say. The reason that this movie takes like it's
• 50:42
  Speaker 1: interesting choice giving him the role of being an insurance
• 50:47
  Speaker 1: guy because insurance companies exactly, because nowhere is it more
• 50:54
  Speaker 1: obvious the kind of failings of capitalism when he's doing
• 50:58
  Speaker 1: that nihilistic calculation, right when when he takes us through
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: that nihilistic calculation of like you know, the the the
• 51:06
  Speaker 1: amount of like I don't know what the statistics are,
• 51:10
  Speaker 1: like it was like X versus marks X times X
• 51:15
  Speaker 1: divided by you whatever.
• 51:16
  Speaker 2: It is, is like whatever amount we'd pay for the
• 51:22
  Speaker 2: replacement of every car, H, B would be the amount
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: we'd pay the individual covering up the thing, and C
• 51:30
  Speaker 2: would be and then you would get the value of X,
• 51:32
  Speaker 2: which is like how much a company the loss of
• 51:38
  Speaker 2: the company us like a reputation versus how much money
• 51:42
  Speaker 2: they would have to pay out to like replace every
• 51:44
  Speaker 2: car or whatever. It doesn't but it's that in a
• 51:47
  Speaker 2: basic nutshell. And that woman also fucking hilarious Danny maul Room.
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: Which reacts to him telling her that story. I'm sorry,
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: am I skipping ahead? No?
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: No, we're here. Are There a lot of these sort
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: of accidents.
• 52:03
  Speaker 1: Which one which would for a major one.
• 52:07
  Speaker 2: It's so good, it's so funny.
• 52:08
  Speaker 1: And there's something like it informs his perspective because he's nihilistic.
• 52:14
  Speaker 1: Because of that, he feels like like very much like
• 52:18
  Speaker 1: because life doesn't matter. It's this weird calculation. He's also
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: kind of employing that in his like practices totally.
• 52:26
  Speaker 2: But I also don't think that that's necessarily a bad
• 52:30
  Speaker 2: thing about uh, neither capitalism nor having to do those
• 52:36
  Speaker 2: kinds of calculations, just because of the fact that, like
• 52:38
  Speaker 2: we do them all the time. You know, we do
• 52:40
  Speaker 2: them in life every day. You know, we like we
• 52:44
  Speaker 2: go to work, drive cars, which like statistically are incredibly dangerous.
• 52:49
  Speaker 2: We like we do things in life constantly where we
• 52:53
  Speaker 2: kind of eliminate the real quote unquote real life danger
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: that might exist with those things all the time. And
• 53:02
  Speaker 2: just like a plant, extrapolating it into a societal structure
• 53:06
  Speaker 2: is a necessary evil that you just kind of have
• 53:08
  Speaker 2: to do, right because like society's collapse based on constant
• 53:14
  Speaker 2: chaos of like, no, you have to do it like this. No,
• 53:18
  Speaker 2: it's actually like this. No, it's actually like this.
• 53:20
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 53:20
  Speaker 2: It's it's like the kind of anarchistic sense of like
• 53:26
  Speaker 2: I I need everyone to be on the same level
• 53:32
  Speaker 2: all the time in some way, like we we exist
• 53:35
  Speaker 2: in a place where it's like, yeah, they're leaders and
• 53:38
  Speaker 2: this followers. But I'd rather be a dick than a swallow,
• 53:42
  Speaker 2: you know what I mean. Like most people are just
• 53:44
  Speaker 2: followers in most categories we try we have to have
• 53:48
  Speaker 2: like some sort of trust.
• 53:50
  Speaker 1: I think that's a lot what the movie is leaning
• 53:52
  Speaker 1: on that premise a lot. I would say, yeah, I
• 53:55
  Speaker 1: think so. And like it's like it's like talking about
• 53:57
  Speaker 1: how like we don't re lee want you know, Like
• 54:03
  Speaker 1: I feel like the men that the men's rights activists
• 54:07
  Speaker 1: that end up finding Tyler Diurden and his crew, like
• 54:10
  Speaker 1: they're like very much they want to be like, well,
• 54:16
  Speaker 1: I don't, like, let's get there, let's get there, Let's
• 54:18
  Speaker 1: get to the cult of the kid.
• 54:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, speaking of He's he's introduced in such a great
• 54:25
  Speaker 2: way because there's the Tyler the narrator talking to Edward
• 54:32
  Speaker 2: Nordan's character talking to the lady who's so cocked he
• 54:36
  Speaker 2: doesn't even have a name in the movie.
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, he's like, doesn't have an identity, gen X,
• 54:42
  Speaker 1: doesn't have an identity.
• 54:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And he's talking to a lady explaining the terribleness
• 54:47
  Speaker 2: of his job, and then he pictures himself dying in
• 54:50
  Speaker 2: a plane crash, and then he wakes up to Tyler Dirden,
• 54:53
  Speaker 2: who's very cool, very suave, has the same briefcase as
• 54:58
  Speaker 2: him as that crispy haircut that so many people had
• 55:03
  Speaker 2: in the nine.
• 55:03
  Speaker 1: Oh man with a slight frosted tip, and like the
• 55:07
  Speaker 1: wax it was when we started using muddeling wax.
• 55:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure, this was pre what was that called again,
• 55:16
  Speaker 2: not manscaping?
• 55:20
  Speaker 1: What was that? People used to wear guyliner?
• 55:29
  Speaker 2: It used to be.
• 55:30
  Speaker 1: Metrosexual, metrosexual man, this pre metrosexual.
• 55:34
  Speaker 2: Pre metrosexual man. Why didn't that stay around?
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: That?
• 55:37
  Speaker 2: That was such a healthier.
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: Way of I think what it evolved into is just
• 55:44
  Speaker 1: like it's kind of normal to like if you're like,
• 55:47
  Speaker 1: I think it's been more normalized that, like people are
• 55:51
  Speaker 1: kind of care about how they their their appearances, regardless
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: of like how hyper masculine they are. I think things
• 55:58
  Speaker 1: have been estheticized and enough that we don't have a
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: need to like create a separate category. Yeah, I don't know,
• 56:05
  Speaker 1: that's my read. I don't know, like I feel like
• 56:07
  Speaker 1: it's like not necessary.
• 56:09
  Speaker 2: I actually do think that a single serving friend is
• 56:12
  Speaker 2: very clever.
• 56:13
  Speaker 1: I do think it's clever and I already clever.
• 56:16
  Speaker 2: Like by the way they play it is that it's
• 56:18
  Speaker 2: like he's supposed to be. He kind of like snickers
• 56:20
  Speaker 2: at him and is like scoffs at the idea of it. Yeah,
• 56:25
  Speaker 2: but I do think that's clever. I think it's very clever.
• 56:28
  Speaker 1: I think it's clever too.
• 56:29
  Speaker 2: I never thought of that before this movie.
• 56:31
  Speaker 1: No exactly. And when he says when he kind of
• 56:34
  Speaker 1: like makes fun of him for it, it's it's weird
• 56:36
  Speaker 1: because I also think, like, you know, there's a kind
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: of thing of like like oh, disposable, blah blah blah.
• 56:43
  Speaker 1: It's like, okay, but like sometimes you sometimes a connection
• 56:48
  Speaker 1: is a short connection, you know what I mean.
• 56:50
  Speaker 5: Like he's negging him. He begs him in the scene
• 56:53
  Speaker 5: that's that's yeah, that is it is ye because it's
• 56:57
  Speaker 5: he does admit that it's clever. He says that it's clever,
• 57:02
  Speaker 5: and he calls him a clever guy.
• 57:03
  Speaker 2: Jerry Seinfeld Edward Norton is a clever guy.
• 57:07
  Speaker 1: Okay. So this guy named Sweet Tim that I met
• 57:10
  Speaker 1: at at karaoke yesterday, he was doing this to me.
• 57:14
  Speaker 1: He was he was also like positively neggivy, but like
• 57:18
  Speaker 1: looking at me really intensely as he says a super
• 57:20
  Speaker 1: intense thing, and then I'm like, what he's like, because
• 57:23
  Speaker 1: you're really great.
• 57:24
  Speaker 2: It's it's like that kind of what's it called. It's
• 57:28
  Speaker 2: that it's the cult cult leader unbalancing of a person
• 57:33
  Speaker 2: where they charm you with something that's kind of very
• 57:37
  Speaker 2: aggressive and you're caught off guards.
• 57:39
  Speaker 1: It's like, fuck you man, you're so awesome. Yeah, exactly exactly,
• 57:43
  Speaker 1: and like but sweet Tim was like this, he was
• 57:46
  Speaker 1: like he told me, he was like the way he's
• 57:48
  Speaker 1: saying deftones, Oh what's that? Yeah? And then I was
• 57:56
  Speaker 1: like and then I was like, I was like, oh what. Yeah.
• 57:59
  Speaker 1: I was like because it was really awesome, and I
• 58:01
  Speaker 1: was like, oh my god, you're so deense. I used
• 58:05
  Speaker 1: to do that all the time. I know, aggressively nice Alex.
• 58:08
  Speaker 1: I always like sometimes I see I sometimes I see
• 58:11
  Speaker 1: it happen in the wild, and I'm like, I don't
• 58:16
  Speaker 1: know what this other person thinks, Like are they how
• 58:19
  Speaker 1: are they reacting to this? It feels kind of like
• 58:21
  Speaker 1: mama esque behavior sometimes.
• 58:24
  Speaker 2: Probably it came from a lot of anxiety about being
• 58:26
  Speaker 2: around people, so I'd have to like zero in on
• 58:29
  Speaker 2: a person and make them like me. Speaking of making
• 58:32
  Speaker 2: people like them, that guy who was the wanted so
• 58:36
  Speaker 2: badly to say that it was a dildo in Edward RAN's.
• 58:39
  Speaker 6: Bag was so excited to tell him, but nine times
• 58:45
  Speaker 6: out of ten it's an electric razer, one time out
• 58:48
  Speaker 6: of st and like, I.
• 58:51
  Speaker 2: Don't own did and then he interrupts him on the phone.
• 58:55
  Speaker 1: I mean that part also kind of like this like
• 58:57
  Speaker 1: idea that there could be a dila. We don't know
• 59:00
  Speaker 1: what he's doing that hour that he's not awake.
• 59:02
  Speaker 2: That's the thing is that like that dude. So many
• 59:06
  Speaker 2: dudes in the movie are ripe for a place like
• 59:10
  Speaker 2: fight club, you know what I mean, they're right to.
• 59:12
  Speaker 2: They get so excited by like.
• 59:14
  Speaker 1: The I'm not gay but I don't know, but there's
• 59:20
  Speaker 1: nothing gay about being manly with a bunch of dude.
• 59:24
  Speaker 1: It's very spartan. Yeah, it's very like, well, I'm not
• 59:28
  Speaker 1: gay and they were, but I'm gay. Yeah, No, I'm
• 59:33
  Speaker 1: not gay because the gayest thing would be not to
• 59:36
  Speaker 1: be fucking dude.
• 59:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, that's.
• 59:39
  Speaker 1: How straight they are. Yeah, it's very mask for mask.
• 59:42
  Speaker 1: It's like it's extremely a mask for mask.
• 59:45
  Speaker 2: And the interesting thing about the next scene where all
• 59:48
  Speaker 2: of his shit is exploded, you said something funny about
• 59:53
  Speaker 2: him being like, how embarrassing only condiments in his friend
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 2: when he said comments on it. And what's what was
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 2: funny about your reaction is that you said, what, that's
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 2: not embarrassing, But in that moment, that's what this guy's thinking.
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 1: That's interesting.
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 2: It opens up the richest of the movie. It opens
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 2: up him as a character being like, man, you're embarrassed
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 2: about this. Your fucking apartment just got destroyed. Yeah, it's
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 2: such a funny and interesting like line to explore.
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 1: Well, it's his disillusionment too, right, He's like he's like, oh, man,
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 1: I don't even have stuff and I just lost.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 2: Everything totally totally. And then he calls Marla first because
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 2: he feels close enough to this person, not having any
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 2: real friends, it seems like, and he hangs up on
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 2: her because there's too much of vulnerability.
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 1: So he's almost gonna pick the angel and said he
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 1: picks the devil exactly.
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 2: And they and they have this like very really very
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 2: twenties conversation of like fuck Martha Stewart and like this
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 2: kind of like sumrism, man, like every time every time
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 2: you talk about capitalism.
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 1: It feels like this, I'm sorry, okay, but I mean like,
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 1: I'm sorry, that's at this feels a little dismissive, but okay,
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 1: I I I will take the hid.
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 2: And then he's drinking alone and then gives himself. It
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 2: gives Tyler a beer and he's like, just ask, man,
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 2: just ask, and he's like, well, can I suck your day? Whoa?
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 2: I thought you were gonna fight me, dude?
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 1: Oh I mean yeah, I mean yeah.
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 2: Also, because that's what this this seed is. It's definitely
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 2: mask for mask. D L met some dude on Craigslist
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 2: and was like, hey, do you want to punch me?
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 1: Do you? Oh? I thought we were gonna drink each
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 1: other off. I mean, then they have to get the
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 1: basement dude, and there that this is like there are
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 1: two steps away from being z and like having get
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 1: the underground dungeon.
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 2: That scene, that scene is that it's dead but also
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 2: man like that kind of like that that scene is
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 2: fucked in a way that's like.
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 1: Dude, yeah, dude, yeah, dude, that's fucked in the way that's.
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 2: Kind of shot the way where it's like, whoa, dude,
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 2: am I supposed to be laughing at this because.
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 1: I know, but they do. It is shot to be
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 1: funny in a way that this movie has some parts
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 1: where I'm like, oh man, like this is just so violent.
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 2: Oh man, that part was the unveil's fucking face destroyed,
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 2: brains flattering out, but that like the dead eyed.
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 1: Like oh man, oh my god, it was wild. Yeah.
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 2: But they come to this disgusting house on Paper Street.
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 1: Wait, so, like, so this is what I was asking you, Like,
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 1: knowing that he's just talking to himself, is like this
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 1: is just his like conversation with himself about making the
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 1: decision to become a squatter, and.
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 2: Like he's been renting this place too. He's been renting
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 2: this place and set up this whole thing for months
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 2: before it's under his name.
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 1: I have a question for you. I have a question
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 1: for you. Oh.
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 2: By the way, they've also had their first fight. They've
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 2: had he punches, don't you guess was a mistake. He
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 2: actually punched him in the ear and he actually did
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 2: improvise that. He was like you in the ear man perfect.
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 1: That moment does feel real in a way that like
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 1: is like very nineties, like, oh yeah, I captured real.
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 1: Use it. Just use it use it one yeah.
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 2: Not like our boy are our best friend David Fincher hell,
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 2: And also another how.
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 1: Did you guess?
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 2: Is very good friends with Steven Soderberg, which also totally
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 2: makes sense, like it somehow they're they're gen x vibes
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 2: are totally one and the same in a way that
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 2: like it feels like David Fincher evolved into more of
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 2: a guy who was like super cynical and was like, no,
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 2: I'm just gonna be cold for the rest of my life,
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 2: and and Soderberg.
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna bene girl for the rest of my life.
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 2: Basically, and Soderberg went the opposite way, where it's.
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 1: Like he's like, no, wonder yeah talking, yeah, exactly, let
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 1: them all talk, dude. Amazing movie. Everyone should see it. Yeah,
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 1: so really really cool, really cool movie. It's like this
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 1: this movie.
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 2: They also do a really good job at building their
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 2: friendship together while at the same time building fight club together,
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 2: because you see him fighting with Tyler later on revealing
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 2: that he's fighting with himself in a hilarious scene.
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 1: But like, guys are noticing that there's a fight club
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 1: and then they become members of the fight club, like
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 1: and so what's magical about this movie is like, where
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 1: are these like disaffected guys coming from. Like they're just
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 1: like workers, They're regular workers that like start rumors among
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 1: each other about this club. You know that they're not
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 1: supposed to talk about. So it's like, do you think
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 1: that it's indicative? And we're going to talk about the
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 1: rules because the rules, it's the rules. The first rule
• 1:05:49
  Speaker 1: of fight club is you do not talk about fight club. Now,
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 1: do you think that the second rule undermines the first
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 1: rule because of the unnecessary repetition or is it reinforcing
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 1: the importance of not talking about it, because it's kind
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 1: of like saying, yes, make fight club an open secret.
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what it is. And it's that same thing
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 2: that cult leaders do, which is shifting give.
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 1: Him the stick, No, don't give him the stick.
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's shifting the expectations of what you should
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 2: be doing because the fact that he's saying it twice
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 2: incentivizes people to talk about it constantly. Otherwise it would
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 2: just be a normal rule, Right, it would just be
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 2: once and you'd have to follow it and you'd get
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 2: punished for it. But you within the rules structure, you
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 2: get punished for it. Anyway, because you have to get
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 2: more people there, and the first the people who are
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 2: there who haven't fought have to be the ones who fight.
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 2: So it's built into the mechanism, the manipulation, perpetuating the
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 2: manipulation is built into the rules so that they all
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 2: come there. For there is there is a capitalistic element
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 2: and a self sort of well no, let's not, let's
• 1:07:05
  Speaker 2: take capitalism out of it. There is a self cannibalizing
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 2: element to this system that fight club functions under, right, Yeah,
• 1:07:15
  Speaker 2: that that is replicated from the society that it it
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 2: comes from. Yeah, yes, sorry, sorry, I'm just it's because
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 2: it's the it's the free version. I have to like
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 2: skip through.
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 1: The ads or what. Oh, okay, that's fine.
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 2: You're just getting a lot of asses.
• 1:07:34
  Speaker 1: You have to. You're just streaming along to help us.
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 1: Where are we.
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 2: We are at? We're at the first time that Tyler
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 2: Durdon sorry the narrator.
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 1: Edward Norton, I mean they're one of the same.
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 2: They're one of the same, dude, don't spoil it.
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 1: Cut this out.
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 2: Uh, And where he first says the thing when you
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 2: get into fights, the world the world gets turned down
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 2: and the boss comes in the Kevin Spacey like boss
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 2: comes in, uh, and and he talks to him and he's.
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 1: Like, uh, do you have those files for me? And
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 1: oh yeah, he's kind of like Charlie Brown, not for
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 1: for exactly. Yeah, And like I like this idea. It's interesting,
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 1: sort of like the Catharsis of this disaffected guy finding
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 1: sort of joy and freedom in taking control of your
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 1: own life by sort of like channeling the thing that
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 1: you might be most afraid of. And that's like, you know, confrontation,
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 1: fighting violence, like all of the sort of like things
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 1: that we have not been faced with as generations because
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 1: there hasn't been the war or the Great Depression or
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 1: the whatever, you know, like even though we've been through
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 1: our own we've been through a pandemic.
• 1:09:01
  Speaker 2: That's then that's the thing that I find really, that's
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 2: the thing that I find really sad about, whether it
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 2: be something like my own radicalization into things like new
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 2: atheism or other people's radicalization into religion or their political
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 2: movements or anything like that, is that you get this
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 2: fulfillment that doesn't last quite quite enough time to feel
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 2: like actual fulfillment. It runs out and then you because
• 1:09:43
  Speaker 2: it's like a drug, you Chase it more and more,
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 2: and then.
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 1: It's like Chase moments you Chase.
• 1:09:50
  Speaker 2: Slaps the fucking I like this moron whose you know.
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 1: But it's empty, but it's ultimately empty.
• 1:09:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's completely.
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 1: It's like the anti Swifties or or.
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, totally or any anti establishment dude, like anti establishmentism.
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 2: The problem with anti establishmentism is that there's no principle
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 2: behind it, so like when it happens, it's like okay,
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 2: but like I can be any sort of.
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 1: Well, yeah, stuff doesn't happen in a vacuum.
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, So like.
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 1: Stuff happens within historical context.
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and in response to other things, right, So unfortunately,
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 2: trying to like put that into some sort of easily
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 2: frameable thing where it's like, oh, this used to be
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 2: so much better when it was this, it's like.
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 1: Well that just missed the point.
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 2: But it's just it's now now, So like looking back
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 2: is useful sometimes.
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 1: Well, like that's what we're doing and talking about this movie,
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 1: and that's why I was really excited to talk about
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 1: this movie, because like I don't know if this exactly
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 1: conversation has been had about this movie, you know what
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 1: I mean?
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 2: Like, yeah, for sure, I feel like people.
• 1:11:05
  Speaker 1: Have their takes on this movie, and there's like the
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 1: people that think it's cool and the people that you know,
• 1:11:09
  Speaker 1: like or.
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 2: The people that like wanna like jam it into like
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 2: because there was the hatred of this movie the first
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 2: for the first, like, there was like a good while
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 2: where people loved the movie, critics loved the movie, and
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 2: it became like the thing, and then there was the
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 2: period of time we're back hated it, and then there
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 2: was a period of time where people were like, oh man,
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 2: it's actually a gay love story, which is fine, Like
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 2: I like that interpretation, but also people like latched onto
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 2: that and like almost weaponize that too, where it's like okay,
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 2: but there's like other things in this movie of course.
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 1: And of course I don't know that. I don't know
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 1: that that. I don't know that just because something chooses
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 1: to take on a certain worldview means that it's negating
• 1:11:56
  Speaker 1: other worldviews.
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 2: No, I don't. In fact, I'm not saying that at all.
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 2: What I'm saying is that it sometimes a conversation can
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 2: drown out like other important aspects just because.
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 1: It focuses on itself.
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 2: No, it just found a new audience. So it's like
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 2: oh yeah, like we're the correct ones. They actually got
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 2: it wrong. Tyler Durdan was never cool. But it's like, yeah,
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 2: but like those guys also found their their cool guy
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 2: and they wanted to emulate this thing.
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 1: He's undoubtedly cool. There's just like, I think we just
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 1: surpassed the the edginess of this world view. No, no,
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 1: I know that.
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 2: I'm just saying that that we surpassed the edgyis. But
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 2: that doesn't make the edgingis not exist at all, Like no, No, in.
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 1: Fact, like that, that's why it's important to still watch
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 1: the movie through the eyes of the time as well, because.
• 1:12:55
  Speaker 2: Time or even now, or even how it applies now
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 2: versus how it applied then, Like how we talk about
• 1:13:02
  Speaker 2: capitalism now I think is probably a lot more healthy
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 2: than it was then, but it wouldn't.
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 1: It takes more things into consideration.
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 2: But also it wouldn't have happened if it didn't have
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 2: if we didn't have that conversation back then.
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 1: No, exactly, so this will be propelled that it fueled,
• 1:13:22
  Speaker 1: like this was happening, you know, around the G twenty,
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 1: G twenty fucking the G twenty, like big riots and
• 1:13:31
  Speaker 1: like all of that anti establishment stuff. Like the like Walls,
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 1: the Occupy Wall Street movie, even the Proud Boys, Yeah,
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 1: exactly like and even restorming the Capitol.
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 2: Storming the Capital. And that's why, like there is a
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 2: value in both understanding why people like this ache for
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 2: things like this, because there is an ache for all
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 2: of these men to do a thing, to feel important,
• 1:13:59
  Speaker 2: to feel special, and like people don't for some reason
• 1:14:03
  Speaker 2: when when it's this class I understand why because it's
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 2: not only is it cringe, but it's also like did
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 2: you have everything like you have? Like when when people
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 2: made that joke of like you have an apartment, you
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 2: have a fuck your biggest complaint is like that you
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 2: can shop at Ikea for your shit, like when people
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 2: can't do that. But there is an ach that's very
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 2: real for those people, and it's sad.
• 1:14:29
  Speaker 1: It's it is sad. It's like, oh, no, that's what.
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 2: You care about rather than like it being you.
• 1:14:37
  Speaker 1: Think that's what you care about in what context?
• 1:14:40
  Speaker 2: Like oh, that's that's the kind of thing you feel
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 2: bad about, Like that's the kind of thing that that
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 2: you because why because there's a lack of meaning for them, right,
• 1:14:52
  Speaker 2: And but people don't really see it as a lack
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 2: of meaning. They see it more as like you're throwing
• 1:14:58
  Speaker 2: a tantrum, you're being a you're not being an adult
• 1:15:01
  Speaker 2: about this, right.
• 1:15:03
  Speaker 1: But the the.
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 2: Like, I think what what will make the point clearer
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 2: is is, uh, there's a great Margaret Atwood quote that's
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 2: men feel afraid that women will laugh at them, and
• 1:15:21
  Speaker 2: women are afraid that men will kill them. It's something
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 2: like that. I'm butchering it. But but the interesting thing
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 2: about that is that in the time it's a that's
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 2: also a very gen x thing to say, yeah, because
• 1:15:34
  Speaker 2: there's there was a time in where there was an
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 2: understanding that yes, physical violence, physical trauma and physical things
• 1:15:44
  Speaker 2: are are scary and and we should try and to
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 2: limit it and like narrow that as as much as
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 2: possible to very specific people who can use that. But
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 2: it ignores how much feeling is important to us as
• 1:16:00
  Speaker 2: a species, as humans, and because we've transcended to some degree,
• 1:16:08
  Speaker 2: like men's quote unquote usefulness as like I'm a working
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 2: person to earn a fucking paycheck.
• 1:16:16
  Speaker 1: And that's like, yeah, like I go to battle.
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 2: Exactly, instead of approaching it as women have and have
• 1:16:27
  Speaker 2: had to fight for for a really long time, where
• 1:16:31
  Speaker 2: they have some semblance of equal opportunity, some sense of
• 1:16:34
  Speaker 2: equality amongst men. Men haven't done the hard.
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 1: Work of because men need to be.
• 1:16:40
  Speaker 2: Forming bonds between each other in a healthy way, emotional intelligence,
• 1:16:46
  Speaker 2: things like that.
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 1: I think that in order to do that, men need
• 1:16:50
  Speaker 1: to like actually honestly confront like all of the all
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 1: of the like sort of like the violence in plicit
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 1: in in masculinity, in toxic masculinity, and and like the
• 1:17:05
  Speaker 1: sort of fear that we are all under because because
• 1:17:11
  Speaker 1: of ourselves, you know what I mean, Like the fear
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 1: that that that we that is self perpetuating because we
• 1:17:17
  Speaker 1: can't like you know, there's just like there's like like
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 1: this sort of like fear response. It's not it's not. Yeah,
• 1:17:27
  Speaker 1: we don't understand, uh, the threat that we all are
• 1:17:30
  Speaker 1: actually to each other, even men.
• 1:17:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean I think we do actually understand that.
• 1:17:36
  Speaker 2: I think that we understand that very well. We just
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 2: don't have the trust in in society or culture to
• 1:17:43
  Speaker 2: have for men to occupy those spaces, right, So like
• 1:17:49
  Speaker 2: in part, women do perpetuate it in the sense that
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 2: like I don't know, I wouldn't want to give up
• 1:17:53
  Speaker 2: certain things if I were a woman like for for
• 1:17:59
  Speaker 2: the sake of men, you know, classic stupid things like
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 2: oh they I didn't I want to don't want to
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 2: pay for my you know, stupid things like that, whatever,
• 1:18:08
  Speaker 2: little frivolities that we think of as like being separate
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 2: as men and women. In part, it's difficult to take
• 1:18:17
  Speaker 2: that out of culture and society, and and like it's
• 1:18:22
  Speaker 2: it's hard to evolve societally sometimes things like loop side
• 1:18:28
  Speaker 2: and grow in very weird in different directions. It's not
• 1:18:31
  Speaker 2: just like linear where it's like, well, you know, women
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 2: can can do these things that are masculine. It's much
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 2: more difficult culturally to be like men can do these
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 2: things that are feminine. It's it's much more to do
• 1:18:46
  Speaker 2: the the opposite thing, because it's like, I.
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 1: Mean, but this this this movie, this movie, it's not
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 1: it's useless talking about like this movie is about men
• 1:18:55
  Speaker 1: and their feelings and like men not being able to
• 1:18:59
  Speaker 1: like have a healthy outlet for their feelings. So it
• 1:19:03
  Speaker 1: will lead to you know, sort of but like it's
• 1:19:07
  Speaker 1: it's more than that. It's like there is a disaffection, uh,
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 1: and there is a like a purposelessness that is like
• 1:19:16
  Speaker 1: very much being raged against in this movie. You know,
• 1:19:19
  Speaker 1: it's like it's like I'm targeting the system because I
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 1: have nothing else to like believe in, you know, like
• 1:19:27
  Speaker 1: I don't believe in anything. It's it's nihilism. It's nihilism,
• 1:19:31
  Speaker 1: absolutely damn it.
• 1:19:37
  Speaker 2: Sorry, I'm just like skipping through porno as cornor movies.
• 1:19:43
  Speaker 2: I put that in a script actually recently.
• 1:19:47
  Speaker 1: Of course you did porn movies. M Yeah.
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 2: The like, the nice thing about the sort of first
• 1:19:57
  Speaker 2: act about this movie is that there is an elation
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 2: with all the other men that like comes from fighting
• 1:20:04
  Speaker 2: each other. They do end up feeling a thing. They
• 1:20:06
  Speaker 2: do end up embodying an ideology that ends up becoming
• 1:20:10
  Speaker 2: toxic because it doesn't have to. That's the interesting thing
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 2: about the seeds of an idea when when you create
• 1:20:19
  Speaker 2: a club like this, totally fine, why not make a
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 2: fight club? Who cares?
• 1:20:24
  Speaker 1: Well? I was really listening to I was listening to
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 1: Dan Savage recently, and he was talking about how like
• 1:20:30
  Speaker 1: he thinks that people that men like straight men like sports,
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 1: specifically football, because they get to like it's an excuse
• 1:20:42
  Speaker 1: to like get together and only be with each other
• 1:20:44
  Speaker 1: and touch each other and like hug and stuff and
• 1:20:48
  Speaker 1: like be affectionate with each other, and like he talked
• 1:20:51
  Speaker 1: about it, and he was like, I think that's what
• 1:20:52
  Speaker 1: it is, Like what else could it be? You know,
• 1:20:54
  Speaker 1: it's just they get some guy some strake I called it. No,
• 1:20:58
  Speaker 1: we don't want to touch each other. Can assure you,
• 1:21:01
  Speaker 1: it's just because we like fucking we fucking like the game.
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 1: That's ridiculous, And like he's like, that's ridiculous, and I'm
• 1:21:08
  Speaker 1: just like, it seems like there's just like showing it
• 1:21:15
  Speaker 1: like a hidden desire, though showing it like a hidden
• 1:21:19
  Speaker 1: desire of like I want to be The rules are
• 1:21:22
  Speaker 1: your shirtless and shoeless, and you're punching each other, and
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 1: you have to fight the first home, you have to
• 1:21:27
  Speaker 1: get gaga the first time you're there. It's a rule,
• 1:21:30
  Speaker 1: it's the rules.
• 1:21:31
  Speaker 2: But here's the thing that that I think what often
• 1:21:35
  Speaker 2: bothers me about. I don't know if this is just
• 1:21:39
  Speaker 2: like a narrowness in sort of queerness or like this
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 2: idea that everything has to be framed in this way
• 1:21:50
  Speaker 2: of like like it's a repression or it's an it's
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 2: a hidden desire because like in my mind, like people
• 1:22:00
  Speaker 2: used to watch people hang, people used to watch people
• 1:22:02
  Speaker 2: get fucking killed. Yeah, and I think that there's just
• 1:22:06
  Speaker 2: a bloodlust in people that they do want to like
• 1:22:09
  Speaker 2: see violence.
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And I don't deny that.
• 1:22:13
  Speaker 2: No, no, no, I'm not saying that you do. I'm just
• 1:22:15
  Speaker 2: saying that what sometimes feels like a thing of it
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 2: just ends up being what sometimes feels like just a
• 1:22:29
  Speaker 2: direction of avoiding all of like history of human beings
• 1:22:38
  Speaker 2: being like terrible to each other. We often want to
• 1:22:41
  Speaker 2: find one solution to it, and it feels like sometimes
• 1:22:46
  Speaker 2: that solution jumps from one thing to another depending on
• 1:22:49
  Speaker 2: the extent of the violence that exists in human nature,
• 1:22:55
  Speaker 2: which is like, oh, war is caused by capitalism, and
• 1:22:58
  Speaker 2: it's like yeah, but wars exist.
• 1:23:00
  Speaker 1: Forever resources and but yeah.
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 2: But even that, like like some I'm sure there's been
• 1:23:07
  Speaker 2: wars between tribes that have been like whoa dude, this
• 1:23:10
  Speaker 2: wasn't even about resource. It was about like you've offended
• 1:23:14
  Speaker 2: this particular thing.
• 1:23:15
  Speaker 1: Sure, you know what I mean.
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 2: And and then like when it comes to certain things like.
• 1:23:20
  Speaker 1: It's usually about resources. I mean, I'm sure there's yeah,
• 1:23:25
  Speaker 1: like I'm sure, like it's like things have started over
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 1: like small things, but it's like about having land, keeping land,
• 1:23:32
  Speaker 1: taking land, away, taking away, roots taking you know, it's
• 1:23:35
  Speaker 1: like wars about those kinds of things, Like it's like,
• 1:23:38
  Speaker 1: I don't know, like it's I don't know. I was
• 1:23:40
  Speaker 1: sure like misunderstandings have happened, not.
• 1:23:43
  Speaker 2: Even like I'm not saying I'm not saying misunderstanding. I'm
• 1:23:45
  Speaker 2: just saying that, like, like it's not just like a
• 1:23:50
  Speaker 2: narrow subset of things from now, like wars existed forever.
• 1:23:55
  Speaker 2: That's just an an sure internal thing that we desire,
• 1:23:59
  Speaker 2: and violence to some degree is an internal thing that
• 1:24:01
  Speaker 2: we desire, right And like the just kind of shirking
• 1:24:06
  Speaker 2: it off to like, well they're secretly gay. It feels
• 1:24:10
  Speaker 2: like the same kind of thing that when people say, oh,
• 1:24:14
  Speaker 2: like people are super anti gay, the most anti gay
• 1:24:17
  Speaker 2: people are gay, and it's like not sometimes that's true
• 1:24:21
  Speaker 2: like a lot of the time. But at the same time,
• 1:24:24
  Speaker 2: it does feel like, hey, man, like does it matter
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 2: at this point of that?
• 1:24:28
  Speaker 1: You know, it does in a sense because there's so
• 1:24:31
  Speaker 1: much violence done onto oneself that it really does shift
• 1:24:38
  Speaker 1: the way that you think and feel and forces you
• 1:24:42
  Speaker 1: to have to compartmentalize in a way that like can
• 1:24:46
  Speaker 1: lend itself to some really like behaviors that like break
• 1:24:52
  Speaker 1: you and others around you down.
• 1:24:55
  Speaker 2: And I think that's why when the movie evolves from
• 1:24:58
  Speaker 2: fight Club, which I think it's actually a pretty I mean,
• 1:25:02
  Speaker 2: it's not the healthiest way of expressing that kind of thing.
• 1:25:06
  Speaker 2: But I do think that there is like every revolution
• 1:25:10
  Speaker 2: starts out with some semblance of like, you know what,
• 1:25:13
  Speaker 2: this actually isn't that bad. Like they're all fighting each
• 1:25:16
  Speaker 2: other consensually, they're all expressing themselves in a way that's
• 1:25:21
  Speaker 2: like they're all in it together. They formed a bond.
• 1:25:26
  Speaker 1: Uh. They they're like there's like cleaning around the house
• 1:25:30
  Speaker 1: and like maintaining each job.
• 1:25:33
  Speaker 2: They don't seem like they're they're anti black, anti gay.
• 1:25:38
  Speaker 1: Well, I don't know about that, because there's no there's
• 1:25:41
  Speaker 1: like there was like maybe one black person in the
• 1:25:44
  Speaker 1: there's a there's.
• 1:25:45
  Speaker 2: A couple of well, let me tell you something. Initially
• 1:25:48
  Speaker 2: there's a couple of black people in fight Club. Then
• 1:25:51
  Speaker 2: it turns into a weird racist.
• 1:25:54
  Speaker 1: Right, there's like a kind of like shaved head vibe.
• 1:25:57
  Speaker 1: Did they do that on purpose? They did that on purpse.
• 1:26:00
  Speaker 1: I feel like to create more of a sinister like
• 1:26:02
  Speaker 1: to like dissuade.
• 1:26:04
  Speaker 2: Part of it is to the militarization of it, right,
• 1:26:09
  Speaker 2: Like there isn't an aspect of oh, we're all monkeys,
• 1:26:12
  Speaker 2: none of us are special, you know what I mean?
• 1:26:14
  Speaker 2: And like that's also a thing of cults, which is
• 1:26:19
  Speaker 2: like breaking down people's personalities into like you don't have
• 1:26:24
  Speaker 2: any individualism at all.
• 1:26:25
  Speaker 1: You know what I mean.
• 1:26:26
  Speaker 2: It's not just like it's not just like collectivist ideology.
• 1:26:29
  Speaker 2: It's like, you don't have a personality. You are not you.
• 1:26:34
  Speaker 1: You are not a special snowflake.
• 1:26:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you're not a snowflake. Exactly where are we in
• 1:26:40
  Speaker 2: the movie? In the movie, we're at we've gone through
• 1:26:44
  Speaker 2: a bunch of fight club growing and we've gone through
• 1:26:47
  Speaker 2: several scenes of Marla having sex with or Marla. So sorry,
• 1:26:56
  Speaker 2: doesn't Marla calls? Yeah, Marla calls or well, she calls.
• 1:27:02
  Speaker 1: The narrative narrator.
• 1:27:03
  Speaker 2: And he ignores her, and then Tyler picks up the phone.
• 1:27:08
  Speaker 2: She's taken a bunch of medication while Tyler's doing karate
• 1:27:14
  Speaker 2: is he Yeah, he's doing like nunchuck moves in that crowd.
• 1:27:18
  Speaker 2: He's so Joe Rogan, Like it's so Joe Rogan.
• 1:27:21
  Speaker 1: There's a real meathead quality, but like.
• 1:27:25
  Speaker 2: Sensitive meathead, you know, Oh, yeah, because Rogan talks about
• 1:27:28
  Speaker 2: feelings all the time and how men should actually be
• 1:27:31
  Speaker 2: open with their feelings and shit but not include women.
• 1:27:35
  Speaker 2: Really no, no, I mean he does. He does have
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 2: like a.
• 1:27:39
  Speaker 1: I don't listen to Joe Rogan. I just know that,
• 1:27:41
  Speaker 1: like I I yeah, like I know that, Like a
• 1:27:44
  Speaker 1: lot of people have allowed opinions about him.
• 1:27:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and a lot of people listen to him, and
• 1:27:48
  Speaker 2: it's I mean whatever, I have my opinions, but we
• 1:27:52
  Speaker 2: can talk about it. I've expressed them several times. Tyler
• 1:27:56
  Speaker 2: Tyler slashed the narrator has like a weird dream that
• 1:28:00
  Speaker 2: that's a c g I mush of Alien three imagery with.
• 1:28:07
  Speaker 1: The penguin. Dude. Yeah, I was one time Mama did
• 1:28:11
  Speaker 1: like like find my spirit animal regression for me, and
• 1:28:19
  Speaker 1: just because I was like influenced by this movie, I
• 1:28:22
  Speaker 1: just told her my spirit animal was I just imagined
• 1:28:26
  Speaker 1: this scene when she was carrying me through that and
• 1:28:28
  Speaker 1: I was like, I don't know a penguin that tells
• 1:28:31
  Speaker 1: me to slide, And she's like, oh, I've never seen
• 1:28:36
  Speaker 1: Fight Club Milan, remember.
• 1:28:41
  Speaker 2: But this is this scene where they have sex with
• 1:28:43
  Speaker 2: each other and there's condoms in the toilet, dirty toilet,
• 1:28:49
  Speaker 2: like the Condon imagery, Like first of all comms in
• 1:28:54
  Speaker 2: the toilet.
• 1:28:55
  Speaker 1: Come on, guys. I mean it's amazing in a proper way,
• 1:28:59
  Speaker 1: but like, yeah, the fact that it's it's such a
• 1:29:02
  Speaker 1: disgusting toilet, there's something is suzy, you're athletic.
• 1:29:10
  Speaker 2: But but great is the interaction between the narrator and
• 1:29:18
  Speaker 2: Marla right after she comes downstairs and they've fucked for
• 1:29:24
  Speaker 2: all intentsive purposes, they've had sex, and then his reaction
• 1:29:27
  Speaker 2: being like, what are you doing? What you like is
• 1:29:30
  Speaker 2: such an insane amazing.
• 1:29:33
  Speaker 1: Hot and cold and knowing that, knowing that he's like appearing,
• 1:29:37
  Speaker 1: knowing that he's like to her appearing to be such
• 1:29:40
  Speaker 1: a piece of shit, is like really great because her
• 1:29:44
  Speaker 1: reactions she plays it like she knows ow Man.
• 1:29:48
  Speaker 2: Her performance. Her performance is the type of performance Willem
• 1:29:52
  Speaker 2: Dafoe had in American Psycho every time what's her name?
• 1:29:58
  Speaker 1: Fuck?
• 1:30:01
  Speaker 2: Mary Harron told him to in one clip know that
• 1:30:06
  Speaker 2: he's doing it, know that Patrick Maayman killed the people,
• 1:30:10
  Speaker 2: and in another totally innocently not know. And that contrast
• 1:30:14
  Speaker 2: is amazing because we also get through this is also
• 1:30:19
  Speaker 2: another vulnerability thing. We get only the vulnerability of him
• 1:30:24
  Speaker 2: wanting to save Marla through Tyler, Like Tyler is the
• 1:30:29
  Speaker 2: guy who saved Marla, not him, like he doesn't care
• 1:30:33
  Speaker 2: about Marla, but like really the real feelings are poking
• 1:30:37
  Speaker 2: through through Tyler. And that's the interesting thing too about
• 1:30:41
  Speaker 2: these kinds of the clash in oneself about how to
• 1:30:46
  Speaker 2: express vulnerability, how to express being you. It has to
• 1:30:50
  Speaker 2: be through this like cocky person or cocky personality rather
• 1:30:55
  Speaker 2: than like being like, hey, I like you, you seem like
• 1:30:57
  Speaker 2: a pretty person.
• 1:30:58
  Speaker 1: Well, they're in a situation ship.
• 1:31:00
  Speaker 2: They're totally like this is like.
• 1:31:03
  Speaker 1: Very proto situationship because like this kind of like also
• 1:31:08
  Speaker 1: the deterioration of the family and the family unit, there's
• 1:31:13
  Speaker 1: something to be said about like could that be like
• 1:31:16
  Speaker 1: a conservative view, right, Like, like could it be a
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 1: conservative view to be like, well, people aren't getting married
• 1:31:22
  Speaker 1: anymore at thirty. They're fucking and and fucking up each
• 1:31:26
  Speaker 1: other's lives because they're all entangled. They're not really together.
• 1:31:30
  Speaker 2: I mean, like that's the thing too, is that, like
• 1:31:32
  Speaker 2: I think that's like a pretty valuable thing. Like family
• 1:31:37
  Speaker 2: is incredibly important, you know.
• 1:31:39
  Speaker 1: Sure, but it can look so many different ways, and
• 1:31:42
  Speaker 1: you can have like friends that are like family.
• 1:31:45
  Speaker 2: Different thing, you know, Like what I'm saying is like
• 1:31:49
  Speaker 2: family as just a like it doesn't have to be
• 1:31:52
  Speaker 2: You're right, it doesn't centering.
• 1:31:53
  Speaker 1: That's the problem with centering. Centering like an economic unit
• 1:31:57
  Speaker 1: around just like a couple that is like together. Like
• 1:32:01
  Speaker 1: there's been a lot of like discussion about like how
• 1:32:04
  Speaker 1: what role friends can play in a new sort of
• 1:32:07
  Speaker 1: paradigm of like sure, you know kind of like asset sharing,
• 1:32:11
  Speaker 1: but like that's why, Like I think like this movie
• 1:32:14
  Speaker 1: doesn't know, Like it's like everything's topsy turvy now, you know,
• 1:32:18
  Speaker 1: Like people are are scared and alone and angry and
• 1:32:24
  Speaker 1: confused because they've never been a war. They don't know
• 1:32:26
  Speaker 1: what life is worth.
• 1:32:27
  Speaker 2: Well, people fall back on those kinds of stories because
• 1:32:31
  Speaker 2: they try and explain it through those kinds of stories.
• 1:32:33
  Speaker 1: Right, what do you mean?
• 1:32:35
  Speaker 2: Like people fall back on on grand narratives when they
• 1:32:39
  Speaker 2: don't know like what things are happening now things are
• 1:32:44
  Speaker 2: just weird so that it's like, oh, yeah, well religion,
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 2: remember when that was a thing, And then they'll fall
• 1:32:49
  Speaker 2: back on that, like mom and thought that, like I
• 1:32:51
  Speaker 2: thought that was never religious. Now he's like a weird psycho,
• 1:32:55
  Speaker 2: Like yeah, Jillie, yeah, talking about angels. It's like you
• 1:33:00
  Speaker 2: didn't give a ship about any of this.
• 1:33:02
  Speaker 1: Well, brainwashed long enough by mama, and like he has
• 1:33:05
  Speaker 1: to like he has to, she says, jump.
• 1:33:08
  Speaker 2: He says, how hard, Like I won't say anything about
• 1:33:12
  Speaker 2: anything about like will never will always defend Mama.
• 1:33:16
  Speaker 1: Now there's no he's thought that drunk the poison. Yeah, completely,
• 1:33:21
  Speaker 1: he's he's had the kool aid. Yeah, you all get
• 1:33:27
  Speaker 1: to that place, you know, Yeah, totally.
• 1:33:30
  Speaker 2: One of my favorite scenes though, is when the boss
• 1:33:32
  Speaker 2: comes into the narrator's office and it's like you can't
• 1:33:36
  Speaker 2: smoke in here, and he turns around like aggressively, get
• 1:33:43
  Speaker 2: yourself cleaned up, get out of here. And then when
• 1:33:46
  Speaker 2: he's like walking down the stairs and pushes that woman.
• 1:33:51
  Speaker 1: Which woman you know when when oh yeah, he walks
• 1:33:53
  Speaker 1: down the stairs and he's so aggressive and like everybody
• 1:33:57
  Speaker 1: it's it's interesting because, like I remember, I also had
• 1:34:01
  Speaker 1: a reaction to this part because there's like a kind
• 1:34:03
  Speaker 1: of like it's supposed to signal to us that like
• 1:34:07
  Speaker 1: he's like free, but what we see him doing is
• 1:34:10
  Speaker 1: like just like being a complete ass, like careless and
• 1:34:15
  Speaker 1: like not thinking about other people, asshole, just like that's
• 1:34:20
  Speaker 1: what his new sense of like fuck you freedom has
• 1:34:23
  Speaker 1: gotten him is, like you know, being kind of just
• 1:34:26
  Speaker 1: like confrontational.
• 1:34:27
  Speaker 2: I'm so glad you said that, because the thing is
• 1:34:30
  Speaker 2: he is free. That is freedom. That is a type
• 1:34:33
  Speaker 2: of freedom for sure, and the like having that sense
• 1:34:38
  Speaker 2: of freedom can be very liberating. The problem is is
• 1:34:42
  Speaker 2: that no one can function that way all the time,
• 1:34:44
  Speaker 2: well exactly, And that's the uselessness of terms like that
• 1:34:49
  Speaker 2: is like Okay, yeah, you're free to cough on people,
• 1:34:53
  Speaker 2: but you're spreading fucking COVID. So in order to have
• 1:34:58
  Speaker 2: that dissonance solved for people, they have to deny the
• 1:35:01
  Speaker 2: existence of it, right, instead of engaging in a complex
• 1:35:05
  Speaker 2: conversation about what that is or why certain freedoms might
• 1:35:09
  Speaker 2: be taken away in one context and not in another.
• 1:35:13
  Speaker 2: And sometimes you have to like, you know, do things
• 1:35:16
  Speaker 2: that are shitty in order for things to be better,
• 1:35:20
  Speaker 2: like you know, things.
• 1:35:23
  Speaker 1: Like collective good stuff. Yeah, like and this movie very much.
• 1:35:28
  Speaker 1: I think that's one of the ways it kind of
• 1:35:30
  Speaker 1: like misses the mark by like celebrating so much this
• 1:35:34
  Speaker 1: kind of idea of like just like you know, who
• 1:35:37
  Speaker 1: fucking cares man, I'm not gonna do what the man says.
• 1:35:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but like breaking it that much, I think that
• 1:35:46
  Speaker 2: it's it's the same problem people do see this.
• 1:35:48
  Speaker 1: Movie, and that they were going to deify these characters.
• 1:35:52
  Speaker 2: Course, but that's what makes it effective for everybody to watch.
• 1:35:55
  Speaker 1: You know what I mean, That's true. It's what makes
• 1:35:57
  Speaker 1: it evergreen. Everyone finds a message in it every where.
• 1:36:00
  Speaker 1: Are We Happened?
• 1:36:02
  Speaker 2: This is where we find out that the cop, the
• 1:36:06
  Speaker 2: detective who called him initially about his explode exploded apartment,
• 1:36:11
  Speaker 2: tells him that there was some uh free on sprayed
• 1:36:17
  Speaker 2: in his locks, and he tells him that there was
• 1:36:22
  Speaker 2: dynamite found in and the way he answers it, Oh,
• 1:36:25
  Speaker 2: that's very concerning to me. Like Dead Eyed Disassociated. I
• 1:36:32
  Speaker 2: loved it because he plays it really nicely where it's
• 1:36:35
  Speaker 2: like he did kind of disassociate there is because this
• 1:36:38
  Speaker 2: is one of the only moments in the movie where
• 1:36:40
  Speaker 2: he does that where it's like in real time you're
• 1:36:43
  Speaker 2: seeing the effect that Tyler has on him, and like
• 1:36:47
  Speaker 2: Tyler's kind of whispering things in his ear throughout the movie,
• 1:36:50
  Speaker 2: but like this is the first time you see him
• 1:36:52
  Speaker 2: doing it actively and telling him kind of what to say.
• 1:36:56
  Speaker 1: Oh okay, so this is what I keep wanting to
• 1:36:58
  Speaker 1: ask you. When Tyler and the narrator are having conversations,
• 1:37:05
  Speaker 1: are people hearing the responses that Tyler is giving or
• 1:37:10
  Speaker 1: the things that Tyler is saying, or that they're just
• 1:37:12
  Speaker 1: hearing the one side of the conversation.
• 1:37:14
  Speaker 2: No, I think he's just just totally disassociating and not
• 1:37:16
  Speaker 2: talking about He's not talking at all.
• 1:37:18
  Speaker 1: He's just like exactly. That would be scarier if he's
• 1:37:24
  Speaker 1: like just sitting there dead, just like.
• 1:37:27
  Speaker 2: Dude. I think that that's that's part of it. I
• 1:37:29
  Speaker 2: think the fact that he's dead eyed it makes him
• 1:37:32
  Speaker 2: more heroic. People see him as stow, like a stoic.
• 1:37:36
  Speaker 1: Kind, see him as a Sigma.
• 1:37:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what. That's why they're constantly like, oh my god, like, wow,
• 1:37:42
  Speaker 2: he's so strong. He look at him, he shot himself
• 1:37:45
  Speaker 2: in the face. He's still. There's a Mets building because
• 1:37:49
  Speaker 2: when you're silent and strong quote unquote strong silent, you
• 1:37:53
  Speaker 2: project on sigma. Yeah, you project you just learned sigma.
• 1:37:57
  Speaker 1: That's yeah, the Sigma is the strong silent type.
• 1:38:01
  Speaker 2: Well it's like stoic, Yeah.
• 1:38:04
  Speaker 1: Stoic is the Yeah, but that's what you would like
• 1:38:06
  Speaker 1: in a short. I guess this strong silent.
• 1:38:10
  Speaker 2: But so so people are projecting what they what they
• 1:38:14
  Speaker 2: want in him. They're like, oh my god, he's amazing.
• 1:38:17
  Speaker 1: It's like Gary Cooper. Whatever happened to guys like Gary Cooper?
• 1:38:21
  Speaker 1: I guess a strong silent type. I'm quoting sopranos.
• 1:38:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. And then we have another scene of of
• 1:38:30
  Speaker 2: Marla and him fighting. God we're only an hour and
• 1:38:34
  Speaker 2: but one of the best best scenes, dude, one of
• 1:38:39
  Speaker 2: the best I think performances. Fuck, I wish I knew
• 1:38:42
  Speaker 2: this guy's name. I used to know this guy's name.
• 1:38:43
  Speaker 2: But the boss coming up and going, look, I found
• 1:38:48
  Speaker 2: this in the copier. The first rule of fight club
• 1:38:50
  Speaker 2: is do you do not talk about The second rule
• 1:38:53
  Speaker 2: of fight club is this yours.
• 1:38:56
  Speaker 1: Dismiss the most. It's crazy for.
• 1:39:01
  Speaker 2: Totally because he knows it's kind of fucking loser, totally
• 1:39:07
  Speaker 2: totally like your old man a loser, because this is
• 1:39:12
  Speaker 2: the this is the this is the real like that
• 1:39:16
  Speaker 2: kind of like what the fuck is this middle management?
• 1:39:20
  Speaker 1: Fucking guy, Look, man, this is just my branch. Okay,
• 1:39:24
  Speaker 1: that's the thing. That's what it is.
• 1:39:26
  Speaker 2: And like the real thing that people like, who love
• 1:39:31
  Speaker 2: this movie on ironically in a way that's like like
• 1:39:35
  Speaker 2: disastrous for our culture and missed. The point of the
• 1:39:38
  Speaker 2: movie is that we're all this guy. That's who we
• 1:39:41
  Speaker 2: all are. We're all upset about the way the world is.
• 1:39:45
  Speaker 1: I don't think the movie is like I don't think
• 1:39:48
  Speaker 1: the movie is saying that we aren't that guy, you know, Like,
• 1:39:51
  Speaker 1: I think it's just like showing us the perspective of.
• 1:39:53
  Speaker 2: Totally it's from the narrator's perspective, that's the thing. And
• 1:39:57
  Speaker 2: then we get right after that we get the real
• 1:40:02
  Speaker 2: kind of sad thing about I think that the point
• 1:40:07
  Speaker 2: of cutting these two scenes together is actually a really
• 1:40:10
  Speaker 2: really good interesting point, which is you get this guy
• 1:40:12
  Speaker 2: who's like what is this, Like, come on, dude, what
• 1:40:15
  Speaker 2: is this?
• 1:40:16
  Speaker 1: And then we can get the psycho threat.
• 1:40:19
  Speaker 2: We get we get the psycho threat, but then right
• 1:40:23
  Speaker 2: after we get fucking meat Loaf coming in, being like
• 1:40:26
  Speaker 2: the first rule of fight Club. The first rule is
• 1:40:29
  Speaker 2: I'm not supposed to tell you.
• 1:40:31
  Speaker 1: Jordan Peterson He's read the twelve rules.
• 1:40:34
  Speaker 2: Had the twelve rules, and it's it's that kind of
• 1:40:38
  Speaker 2: thing where it's like, oh, this is kind of like this.
• 1:40:41
  Speaker 1: Is they're obsessed with the rules all the in cell
• 1:40:44
  Speaker 1: fucking like it's the rules, ed lord. Alpha wannabes are
• 1:40:49
  Speaker 1: obsessed with like following the daddy's rules. Dude.
• 1:40:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but but like what I'm what I mean.
• 1:40:55
  Speaker 1: And then you to ask say that there isn't something
• 1:40:58
  Speaker 1: to like the repression, something to the repression of Jordan
• 1:41:02
  Speaker 1: Peterson that makes him that toxic. I think it's. I
• 1:41:06
  Speaker 1: think it's inextrissibly inextricably tied to this kind of like
• 1:41:11
  Speaker 1: worldview that there is a queerness and a repression of
• 1:41:15
  Speaker 1: and I think a queer lens can actually offer like
• 1:41:18
  Speaker 1: a very insightful perspective into like how this movie is,
• 1:41:24
  Speaker 1: just how layered this movie is. Yeah, because it creates
• 1:41:28
  Speaker 1: more intersections that you can, more lenses that you can
• 1:41:32
  Speaker 1: kind of like, no, I mean that you wouldn't have
• 1:41:35
  Speaker 1: to be limited to.
• 1:41:37
  Speaker 2: But you're but you're ascribing the one lens to it
• 1:41:42
  Speaker 2: and then being like.
• 1:41:43
  Speaker 1: I'm not describing it, it's in it.
• 1:41:45
  Speaker 2: You just think what you just described just now, was
• 1:41:50
  Speaker 2: this one lens that I'm putting to allows for all
• 1:41:54
  Speaker 2: these other lenses to show up? When I'm saying that
• 1:41:57
  Speaker 2: all those other lenses are already there are already there,
• 1:42:01
  Speaker 2: and and having just the one framework kind of narrows
• 1:42:05
  Speaker 2: you in this one way.
• 1:42:07
  Speaker 1: But I think I think zoom I don't. I don't agree,
• 1:42:10
  Speaker 1: because I think that zooming in and looking outwards is
• 1:42:13
  Speaker 1: also like an interesting perspective to take. It's also an.
• 1:42:16
  Speaker 2: Interesting when did I say that? That wasn't it that
• 1:42:19
  Speaker 2: that wasn't a good thing to do?
• 1:42:21
  Speaker 1: No, but I mean you did. You You're just well,
• 1:42:24
  Speaker 1: I don't know, You're just I think you're being like, well,
• 1:42:27
  Speaker 1: you're saying that it's dismissive. Uh, you're saying that that
• 1:42:33
  Speaker 1: you're implying that having a queer lens and looking at
• 1:42:36
  Speaker 1: it as if there's these other ones. But the focusing
• 1:42:39
  Speaker 1: in on that small part is like not like a
• 1:42:44
  Speaker 1: a like an interesting take or something or not.
• 1:42:47
  Speaker 2: No, what I'm saying is is there's a queer lens.
• 1:42:51
  Speaker 2: Good thing we can go through that. That's awesome. What
• 1:42:54
  Speaker 2: it's felt like you were saying was the queer lens
• 1:42:58
  Speaker 2: is actually opening up all these other lenses. It might
• 1:43:01
  Speaker 2: be doing that for you, but all those other lenses
• 1:43:03
  Speaker 2: exist already, okay, and the queer lens is just the
• 1:43:07
  Speaker 2: one lens was just.
• 1:43:08
  Speaker 1: Like a miss Yeah, okay, disagreement and yeah, sure, where were.
• 1:43:19
  Speaker 2: We We're at the point where I think this is
• 1:43:22
  Speaker 2: where the movie starts implying that there are there have
• 1:43:26
  Speaker 2: been different franchises of the fight clubs, because he goes
• 1:43:30
  Speaker 2: to a different place. He goes to the place where
• 1:43:33
  Speaker 2: Bob got fight clubbed, and it's in a different building.
• 1:43:37
  Speaker 1: Well, he's like, I go Tuesdays and Thursdays.
• 1:43:39
  Speaker 2: Day, yeah, and I go Saturdays.
• 1:43:43
  Speaker 1: And this is where, like it's interesting because like, so,
• 1:43:47
  Speaker 1: how much do you think Tyler is machiavellian and how
• 1:43:51
  Speaker 1: much do you think he's actually just losing the plot
• 1:43:53
  Speaker 1: and the things are spiraling out of his control? Or
• 1:43:56
  Speaker 1: is it both things at the same time.
• 1:43:57
  Speaker 2: Both things at the same time. And also the notion
• 1:44:02
  Speaker 2: of Edward Norton's character wanting to feel special is coming
• 1:44:06
  Speaker 2: out in this part because him not knowing he starts like.
• 1:44:10
  Speaker 1: Gets excited by the idea.
• 1:44:12
  Speaker 2: He gets excited, but also is suspicious of Bob understanding
• 1:44:16
  Speaker 2: this thing in a very different way than he understands.
• 1:44:19
  Speaker 1: Comes out to like, dude, Tomorrow's Tomorrow's already.
• 1:44:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm gonna get one of the best scenes where
• 1:44:27
  Speaker 2: I'm fucking lou Who to fuck are you?
• 1:44:30
  Speaker 1: Oh dude?
• 1:44:32
  Speaker 2: Man like sweaty, bloody, like the meat slapping.
• 1:44:37
  Speaker 1: Though this is something that like the violence where I'm like,
• 1:44:41
  Speaker 1: man if people like getting beaten like CTE, like just
• 1:44:45
  Speaker 1: like destroyed. But I'm like, that's the other thing that
• 1:44:49
  Speaker 1: I kind of don't buy, Like I understand why it is.
• 1:44:53
  Speaker 1: The violence. It's very representative and doesn't need to be.
• 1:44:56
  Speaker 1: It's like the violence within us and like whatever, blah
• 1:44:59
  Speaker 1: blah blah. Like it's interesting that the movie doesn't focus
• 1:45:03
  Speaker 1: on like the other carnal pleasures. You know, it's not
• 1:45:06
  Speaker 1: very sexual, it's not very.
• 1:45:08
  Speaker 2: Well but you did you pointed out earlier that all
• 1:45:11
  Speaker 2: all of the fighting is very sexual.
• 1:45:15
  Speaker 1: Right, but like there's no hedonism though no one's enjoying pleasure.
• 1:45:20
  Speaker 1: It's all suffering.
• 1:45:21
  Speaker 2: No, but everybody's enjoying the the the carnal pleasure of pain.
• 1:45:26
  Speaker 1: Right, but there's no there's no celebration of it in
• 1:45:30
  Speaker 1: a in a in a like in that kind of way.
• 1:45:33
  Speaker 1: It's all very like stoic. You have to just like
• 1:45:35
  Speaker 1: be like semen retaining no.
• 1:45:38
  Speaker 2: Man, they're all like hugging each other at the end,
• 1:45:40
  Speaker 2: like those two guys who fought each other and they
• 1:45:42
  Speaker 2: cried in each other's arms, and like the guy who
• 1:45:45
  Speaker 2: the dude who the dude who smashes Edward Norton's face
• 1:45:51
  Speaker 2: to the ground and is like next week and he's
• 1:45:53
  Speaker 2: like how about next month?
• 1:45:55
  Speaker 1: You know, and then like well okay. But then but
• 1:45:57
  Speaker 1: then the fight with lou is also interesting because he
• 1:46:02
  Speaker 1: uses it to like show him that he's not afraid
• 1:46:06
  Speaker 1: to die.
• 1:46:07
  Speaker 2: To die, yeah, yeah, and that's like a really scary
• 1:46:09
  Speaker 2: moment and somebody slobbering on you is so scary.
• 1:46:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's God that he does that. I forgot.
• 1:46:21
  Speaker 2: Come on, it drools the blood man, because that kind
• 1:46:27
  Speaker 2: of ship is way more scary than totally.
• 1:46:34
  Speaker 1: Man so Italian, Sure whatever you crazy fu Fine it
• 1:46:39
  Speaker 1: was yeah, but it wasn't over.
• 1:46:41
  Speaker 2: It one over totally totally has the sexibility of that
• 1:46:47
  Speaker 2: where it's.
• 1:46:47
  Speaker 1: Like like, yeah, but but it won over. He won over, man, dude,
• 1:46:53
  Speaker 1: he's got problems man, emotional emotional smoky.
• 1:46:58
  Speaker 2: And then and then we get to that scene where
• 1:47:00
  Speaker 2: where the narrator does that that thing where he starts
• 1:47:03
  Speaker 2: punching himself in front of Kevin Spacey and he's like,
• 1:47:07
  Speaker 2: I thought about my first fight with Tyler.
• 1:47:09
  Speaker 1: I love that line. I love it. It's great because
• 1:47:12
  Speaker 1: when when they're like you, you don't realize how much
• 1:47:15
  Speaker 1: they're beating you over the head with it, but all
• 1:47:19
  Speaker 1: of the beating you over the head for it with
• 1:47:20
  Speaker 1: it informs the big reveal because when the big reveal,
• 1:47:24
  Speaker 1: I'm so glad the big reveal worked on us and
• 1:47:27
  Speaker 1: we were it wasn't spoiled, it wasn't Yeah, like totally.
• 1:47:30
  Speaker 2: I remember being so surprised and there's still like thirty minutes.
• 1:47:34
  Speaker 1: Of the movie left. It's not really I realize. Yeah, yeah, well,
• 1:47:37
  Speaker 1: because they have to kind of like bring to a
• 1:47:40
  Speaker 1: head all of the things that have like start, I
• 1:47:42
  Speaker 1: think really like the way it's narratively structured is quite effective. Yeah,
• 1:47:46
  Speaker 1: and the way it reveal, Oh, I agree.
• 1:47:50
  Speaker 2: Well.
• 1:47:50
  Speaker 1: I think a lot of people have commented how it's
• 1:47:53
  Speaker 1: it's it's kind of an interesting rewrite of the book.
• 1:47:56
  Speaker 2: And it's it's narrows down themes of the book in
• 1:48:00
  Speaker 2: a much better way.
• 1:48:02
  Speaker 1: It's there's a conciseness, and there's a kind of like
• 1:48:07
  Speaker 1: well with Chuck as a writer in general, there's a real.
• 1:48:11
  Speaker 2: Painful it's painful. It's like watching this is like, oh man,
• 1:48:15
  Speaker 2: that's so new metal. Reading anything by him now is
• 1:48:19
  Speaker 2: new metal.
• 1:48:19
  Speaker 1: It just feels like it feels like Bukowski in a way,
• 1:48:22
  Speaker 1: like in the same way where it's like Pukowski's so
• 1:48:25
  Speaker 1: much better. No, but but I mean what I mean
• 1:48:29
  Speaker 1: is like it's the way I feel when I read
• 1:48:32
  Speaker 1: some Bukowski where I'm like, I win set some of
• 1:48:34
  Speaker 1: it where I'm like, I know what you're doing, but
• 1:48:38
  Speaker 1: it's actually like, you know, like I don't know, I
• 1:48:41
  Speaker 1: don't know if you know what you seem like now.
• 1:48:44
  Speaker 2: I definitely think that Bukowski is a person who's very,
• 1:48:49
  Speaker 2: very aware of the kind of I think Bukowski is
• 1:48:54
  Speaker 2: like a death Grips in the way that it's like
• 1:48:57
  Speaker 2: that guy's like creating a character.
• 1:48:59
  Speaker 1: Well okay, but with with with the sardonic quality of
• 1:49:06
  Speaker 1: it takes away well, I mean I think that that
• 1:49:11
  Speaker 1: like there's there's an aspirational sort of like edginess to
• 1:49:16
  Speaker 1: the to the like and I don't mean Edginus in
• 1:49:18
  Speaker 1: the like edge Lord fashion. I mean like edgy filmmaking
• 1:49:22
  Speaker 1: that feels like cutting edge or like it's doing something
• 1:49:26
  Speaker 1: that's very like the book I'm talking about. Well, I'm
• 1:49:30
  Speaker 1: talking about the book. He writes like that. Yeah, like
• 1:49:36
  Speaker 1: there's a real confrontational kind of like.
• 1:49:39
  Speaker 2: I would say, it's like if I were to make
• 1:49:41
  Speaker 2: a film comparison, I would be like, bla, like.
• 1:49:48
  Speaker 1: I don't think I've seen.
• 1:49:51
  Speaker 2: Is like a group of a category. It's like it's Korean.
• 1:49:55
  Speaker 2: It's it's people who are like very aggressive in entire style.
• 1:50:00
  Speaker 1: Inspired by Dogma ninety five filmmaking. Who uh these this
• 1:50:07
  Speaker 1: this movement in film a falter reblu. Yeah, I don't.
• 1:50:11
  Speaker 1: I don't think so they're inspired by Dogma ninety five.
• 1:50:16
  Speaker 2: I don't know.
• 1:50:17
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 1:50:17
  Speaker 2: Oh okay, yeah, it's or or like you know, French
• 1:50:21
  Speaker 2: new extremity, like people who are like they rely on
• 1:50:25
  Speaker 2: a thing, like it's like a gimmick. And I think
• 1:50:29
  Speaker 2: he's very even though I think Chuck Palinnak is very smart.
• 1:50:33
  Speaker 2: I think it's just like he there's like a gimmick
• 1:50:36
  Speaker 2: he has.
• 1:50:37
  Speaker 1: There's a that's the thing it is. It is gimmick.
• 1:50:39
  Speaker 1: It feels like it feels like like you know m
• 1:50:42
  Speaker 1: Night Shyamalan. Oh yeah, totally.
• 1:50:47
  Speaker 2: This scene where Tyler pulls out the gun and he
• 1:50:53
  Speaker 2: uses it on the store clerk.
• 1:50:57
  Speaker 1: Okay, so like this scene actually I remember I remember
• 1:51:03
  Speaker 1: I remember as a kid though, being really inspired by
• 1:51:07
  Speaker 1: this scene, being being like, he's right, he should go
• 1:51:11
  Speaker 1: and but it's kind of interesting, like you're not really
• 1:51:15
  Speaker 1: taking into consideration like this is where like I feel
• 1:51:18
  Speaker 1: like his like narrow worldview comes into play because he's
• 1:51:22
  Speaker 1: not taking into consideration like the fact that this guy
• 1:51:25
  Speaker 1: is an immigrant working like like he's not gonna be
• 1:51:28
  Speaker 1: Maybe you haven't asked him why he's not able to
• 1:51:30
  Speaker 1: like continue his studies to be a veterinarian. You like
• 1:51:33
  Speaker 1: pulled him out of his job, put a gun to
• 1:51:36
  Speaker 1: his head, like gave him all of this like trauma,
• 1:51:38
  Speaker 1: and you're like tomorrow is gonna be the best days
• 1:51:40
  Speaker 1: of his best day of his life. And it was like, no, dude,
• 1:51:44
  Speaker 1: he's gonna be traumatized for the rest of his life
• 1:51:46
  Speaker 1: and not trust like like people to come into the store.
• 1:51:50
  Speaker 2: Not just that, but like the notion that some gain
• 1:51:55
  Speaker 2: quote unquote might have been made by like oh I
• 1:51:58
  Speaker 2: kicked him in the ass, he did his thing. It
• 1:52:01
  Speaker 2: just it feels like so.
• 1:52:05
  Speaker 1: Such a misunderstanding of like what people need.
• 1:52:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, like I mean people need support and people
• 1:52:11
  Speaker 2: need the ability to do something. They don't need somebody
• 1:52:16
  Speaker 2: to scare the ship out of.
• 1:52:18
  Speaker 1: Them into Yeah, Like it's not like you stopped, what's
• 1:52:21
  Speaker 1: your did you ever want to be a store clerk?
• 1:52:23
  Speaker 1: It's like whoa buddy, hold on, who do you think
• 1:52:25
  Speaker 1: store clerks are are? Yeah?
• 1:52:27
  Speaker 2: Exactly, And that's that's also an interesting like talk about
• 1:52:32
  Speaker 2: when this is what what wide privilege means. It's or
• 1:52:36
  Speaker 2: or that kind of male privilege means.
• 1:52:38
  Speaker 1: It's the ease of not having to think about these
• 1:52:41
  Speaker 1: things and those and also to project onto others.
• 1:52:44
  Speaker 2: Exactly. That's that's the aspect, that's the privileged part, because like,
• 1:52:48
  Speaker 2: not understanding those things is fine. Like the narrator is
• 1:52:52
  Speaker 2: a good example of literally not understanding when things are happening,
• 1:52:57
  Speaker 2: and that's fine.
• 1:52:58
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 1:52:59
  Speaker 2: It's it's Tyler who goes around swinging dick.
• 1:53:03
  Speaker 1: Being like because Tyler is doing dude, Tyler's doing things
• 1:53:07
  Speaker 1: of consequence and he's not thinking about other people totally.
• 1:53:12
  Speaker 2: And thinking of other people. Not thinking about other people
• 1:53:16
  Speaker 2: is what Project Mayhem seems to be about. It's about
• 1:53:20
  Speaker 2: we're all the same. There is no difference between us,
• 1:53:24
  Speaker 2: and that no difference between us. I'm going to exploit
• 1:53:28
  Speaker 2: by making myself different from you and controlling you.
• 1:53:33
  Speaker 1: Oh dude, you know every time I or a lot
• 1:53:36
  Speaker 1: of the times when we say project Mayhem, I have
• 1:53:39
  Speaker 1: a project made him drop. Yeah, there's a song by
• 1:53:42
  Speaker 1: this band called Finch that the singer of Glass Shaw
• 1:53:46
  Speaker 1: sings on Darryl Palombo and it's very it's very like aggressive,
• 1:53:52
  Speaker 1: and it's called Project Mayhem nice and it's a good
• 1:53:55
  Speaker 1: song man.
• 1:53:57
  Speaker 2: That speaking of Project may Big, like not for the
• 1:54:01
  Speaker 2: fate of Heart, when fucking Brad Pitt comes out and
• 1:54:04
  Speaker 2: screams a beat loaf about being too fat to be
• 1:54:08
  Speaker 2: in the club and then like poor Edward Norton being like,
• 1:54:13
  Speaker 2: hey man, it's okay, we're still friends.
• 1:54:16
  Speaker 1: But he also tells him that he if he, if
• 1:54:19
  Speaker 1: he does stay there and does the endurance test there,
• 1:54:21
  Speaker 1: enjoy it.
• 1:54:22
  Speaker 2: And it's like it sucks because, like, dude, this guy
• 1:54:25
  Speaker 2: was this guy was literally your only friend, like your
• 1:54:28
  Speaker 2: only actual like friend.
• 1:54:30
  Speaker 1: And that's why I think Bob is an interesting character.
• 1:54:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's and like Marla's is something that like a
• 1:54:41
  Speaker 2: certain type of American man will do where it's like
• 1:54:46
  Speaker 2: you're just some person that I dump all my problems
• 1:54:49
  Speaker 2: onto because I don't have any male friends that I
• 1:54:52
  Speaker 2: can do this with like women friends do, where like
• 1:54:55
  Speaker 2: I can have emotional supports, So I just like dump
• 1:54:59
  Speaker 2: on you and then like this was the closest guy
• 1:55:02
  Speaker 2: who had tits. That's why.
• 1:55:05
  Speaker 1: That's why I like, do you think that you think
• 1:55:07
  Speaker 1: that the tits play like a maternal role in the movie,
• 1:55:12
  Speaker 1: Like I think giving him kind of like access to
• 1:55:15
  Speaker 1: at least well also of the vulnerability of crying with someone,
• 1:55:20
  Speaker 1: because that's why, like.
• 1:55:20
  Speaker 2: When he puts him in his chest, it's almost like
• 1:55:24
  Speaker 2: a maternal thing of like you can cry in me.
• 1:55:29
  Speaker 1: If it necessarily needs to be gendered, but like it's
• 1:55:31
  Speaker 1: it's like, I mean it's gendered in the movie.
• 1:55:34
  Speaker 2: It is like it talks about his bitch tits.
• 1:55:37
  Speaker 1: Right, and then they they do have they talk about
• 1:55:41
  Speaker 1: the like the hormone stuff, right.
• 1:55:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. Oh he took steroids his body.
• 1:55:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's interesting. That's interesting. I never thought about. Yeah,
• 1:55:57
  Speaker 1: Bob is a great character and like so wonderful we played.
• 1:56:00
  Speaker 1: The side casting of the movie was really.
• 1:56:04
  Speaker 2: Jared Letto, Dude, Jared Leto is amazing also for Finch,
• 1:56:11
  Speaker 2: but Fincher to see this guy be like this guy
• 1:56:14
  Speaker 2: is such a douche, he would totally take try and
• 1:56:18
  Speaker 2: take take the love of a character from such a douche,
• 1:56:23
  Speaker 2: like like Tyler Durdon, he would totally because he does.
• 1:56:27
  Speaker 2: He like, what's his name, Brad Pitt has a sort
• 1:56:29
  Speaker 2: of blondish like like right, there's like a sort of
• 1:56:33
  Speaker 2: like his name is Angel face. Yeah, he's gotta fucking
• 1:56:37
  Speaker 2: beat the ship out of Angel's face.
• 1:56:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and he's like bleach blonde dude. Yeah. I mean
• 1:56:44
  Speaker 1: a little bit of queerness in there too. I mean
• 1:56:47
  Speaker 1: everyone who looks at the blonde guy when when you're
• 1:56:50
  Speaker 1: young and you're like, oh man, that guy's maybe gay,
• 1:56:53
  Speaker 1: but but yeah, like when he the guy who doesn't
• 1:56:59
  Speaker 1: get accept it into a project Mayhem for a long
• 1:57:02
  Speaker 1: time and then he comes out and he says.
• 1:57:05
  Speaker 2: You're too fucking bond. Get out of here, the both
• 1:57:09
  Speaker 2: of you.
• 1:57:11
  Speaker 1: It's interesting though, like in cults, part of like creating
• 1:57:17
  Speaker 1: the like strength of the cult is the violence perpetuated.
• 1:57:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, because like what he does is as soon
• 1:57:25
  Speaker 2: as he gets radicalized, well no, as soon they're already radicalized.
• 1:57:31
  Speaker 2: That's why you can fucking do this. But as soon
• 1:57:33
  Speaker 2: as he gets into the house some semblance of power.
• 1:57:38
  Speaker 2: He immediately turns it onto the weakest link and that's
• 1:57:43
  Speaker 2: how they reinforce it too. So it's like the structure
• 1:57:46
  Speaker 2: is built into itself again where it's like, Okay, well
• 1:57:50
  Speaker 2: I did this to you, you do this to them,
• 1:57:53
  Speaker 2: and like it's brainwashing, brainwashing the person the next person
• 1:57:58
  Speaker 2: and help use it almost like uh, the first dude
• 1:58:03
  Speaker 2: is a bottom bitch to like get the other you know,
• 1:58:08
  Speaker 2: get the other person to trust in the process, like
• 1:58:11
  Speaker 2: look where I got, Like you can be like me,
• 1:58:14
  Speaker 2: you know what I mean, and do this to the
• 1:58:16
  Speaker 2: next person.
• 1:58:16
  Speaker 1: You know, what did you think of the change in
• 1:58:18
  Speaker 1: rules from the fight Club rules to the Project Mayhem rules.
• 1:58:22
  Speaker 1: The first rule of Project Mayhem is do not ask questions? Yeah,
• 1:58:26
  Speaker 1: so like decidedly more sinister rule and less less open
• 1:58:32
  Speaker 1: to uh like free thought. You know, it's like meant
• 1:58:35
  Speaker 1: to you are not a snowflake. And it's so interesting
• 1:58:38
  Speaker 1: that this movie gave birth to the idea of snowflake
• 1:58:42
  Speaker 1: because now that's something that conservatives apply to like what
• 1:58:47
  Speaker 1: they consider to be like pussy liberals.
• 1:58:49
  Speaker 2: And it's like even though they are they're.
• 1:58:51
  Speaker 1: Just there's no well they're but they're the ones that
• 1:58:54
  Speaker 1: like literally melt down over everything. It's like every day
• 1:59:00
  Speaker 1: it's rich from them to hear stuff like because no
• 1:59:03
  Speaker 1: one ever calls them that. Well they do, yeah, they
• 1:59:06
  Speaker 1: do as but only in reaction too.
• 1:59:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they just like it's it's hard because like they're
• 1:59:13
  Speaker 2: a lot of them are so diluted, and like the
• 1:59:17
  Speaker 2: reason conservatives are much i think, much easier to pick
• 1:59:21
  Speaker 2: on in regards to this is because they just end
• 1:59:25
  Speaker 2: up feeling like there's just so much more of them
• 1:59:29
  Speaker 2: and it's so much more mainstream in the sort of
• 1:59:32
  Speaker 2: conservative worldview that like it's it's pathetic and fucking sad
• 1:59:39
  Speaker 2: that like every day it's just a new culture war
• 1:59:43
  Speaker 2: bullshit nonsense thing that they complain about. And sure like
• 1:59:47
  Speaker 2: lefties and liberals do it too, but like, man, oh man,
• 1:59:52
  Speaker 2: is it like a new Dylan mulvany with the fucking
• 1:59:58
  Speaker 2: they still complain about that they still and it's the
• 2:00:01
  Speaker 2: same fucking four jokes. It's a wheelchair person that's for
• 2:00:06
  Speaker 2: modern audiences. Oh, we remade this with a transfer. It's like, okay, guys,
• 2:00:13
  Speaker 2: Christ shut up, put a woman in it and make
• 2:00:17
  Speaker 2: her gay and.
• 2:00:20
  Speaker 1: This is this is like not even like this has
• 2:00:28
  Speaker 1: already happened, like there is already like precedent for it.
• 2:00:32
  Speaker 1: It's nothing, it's none. Nothing about it is new, Yeah,
• 2:00:36
  Speaker 1: nothing about it.
• 2:00:37
  Speaker 2: Speaking of new the cop, the Danny Mulroon cop who's
• 2:00:42
  Speaker 2: like that's somehow connected to underground boxing clubs. I love
• 2:00:47
  Speaker 2: this guy where he's like at the like you know,
• 2:00:51
  Speaker 2: police ball or whatever. And Tyler Durden explains that how
• 2:00:57
  Speaker 2: we're everywhere.
• 2:00:58
  Speaker 1: We're all of us. Are are your teachers and your
• 2:01:02
  Speaker 1: your janitors and your service people. It's it's kind of
• 2:01:06
  Speaker 1: interesting though, like, so is this a working class revolution?
• 2:01:09
  Speaker 1: They never there's never any like talk of real ideology.
• 2:01:15
  Speaker 1: It all just seems to be anarchistic but like kind
• 2:01:19
  Speaker 1: of like blindly like unorganized anarchy. It's not. Well, they're
• 2:01:23
  Speaker 1: organized and they're doing a lot of shit, but they're
• 2:01:25
  Speaker 1: just sowing chaos. It's like, right, yes, that's my name.
• 2:01:30
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I mean like it's the exploitation of populist rhetoric.
• 2:01:39
  Speaker 2: You know, it's all that kind of stuff. But to
• 2:01:41
  Speaker 2: what end, well, to fuel this person's ego, what do
• 2:01:45
  Speaker 2: you mean?
• 2:01:45
  Speaker 1: To what end?
• 2:01:46
  Speaker 2: What all cult leaders do? That's what Jonestown was too,
• 2:01:49
  Speaker 2: Like that, dude, what's his name again, James Jones. Yeah, yeah,
• 2:01:59
  Speaker 2: James Jones. Yeah, like that dude started out as like
• 2:02:03
  Speaker 2: a socialist preacher that like learned what's it called, like
• 2:02:09
  Speaker 2: learned what was it? He like learned how to preach,
• 2:02:13
  Speaker 2: and then in university became like a Marxist Leninist and
• 2:02:17
  Speaker 2: then like formed a church around that, and then bought
• 2:02:21
  Speaker 2: an island with these people and then fucking murdered them,
• 2:02:25
  Speaker 2: you know, like it like it's all to fuel this
• 2:02:30
  Speaker 2: person's ego, and like you can do that with any ideology,
• 2:02:34
  Speaker 2: but with this the ideology is just happens to be
• 2:02:38
  Speaker 2: starting from fighting and then it grows into like yeah,
• 2:02:43
  Speaker 2: it's well, it grows into terror cells, right, And that's
• 2:02:46
  Speaker 2: why he keeps trying to break him down. Right, he
• 2:02:49
  Speaker 2: can remember when he's like, oh you haven't hit bottom,
• 2:02:53
  Speaker 2: hit burn? Does burnt hand?
• 2:02:56
  Speaker 1: Did we talk about that pass that passed?
• 2:02:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 2:03:00
  Speaker 1: He I mean cool, compelling seen the lie that.
• 2:03:03
  Speaker 2: The explion of why people's clothes were were cleaner at
• 2:03:10
  Speaker 2: a certain point in history because of this the burning
• 2:03:12
  Speaker 2: of bodies or whatever and the combination of of water
• 2:03:17
  Speaker 2: and a certain type of chemical that like.
• 2:03:21
  Speaker 1: Cleaned the people's clothes it's it's interesting, like all of
• 2:03:24
  Speaker 1: the like soap that eat the rich themes, the the fat,
• 2:03:30
  Speaker 1: the liposuction, the sucking, the the using the human fat,
• 2:03:34
  Speaker 1: selling the like soap back to the like the women,
• 2:03:37
  Speaker 1: the very same women that whose asses we were fucking,
• 2:03:41
  Speaker 1: you know, like or not, you know what I mean,
• 2:03:43
  Speaker 1: whose asses we were we were like making soap out
• 2:03:46
  Speaker 1: of so like yeah, like I just it's it's interesting
• 2:03:53
  Speaker 1: to me because it feels like the enemy is still
• 2:03:56
  Speaker 1: kind of nebulous, you know, like two big to really
• 2:04:00
  Speaker 1: comprehend or understand. It's just like small reactionary cells.
• 2:04:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think the great thing about the
• 2:04:10
  Speaker 2: movie is that you can fill in the gaps within
• 2:04:16
  Speaker 2: like anything that's making you upset, uncomfortable dealing with harsh.
• 2:04:23
  Speaker 1: Truths of.
• 2:04:26
  Speaker 2: Modern living the real world, which is like just a
• 2:04:29
  Speaker 2: very difficult thing.
• 2:04:30
  Speaker 1: But it's not just the real world. It's the way
• 2:04:32
  Speaker 1: that this particular world is set up.
• 2:04:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, like you can fix you can say that,
• 2:04:39
  Speaker 2: but that's still too granular, you know what I mean,
• 2:04:42
  Speaker 2: It's still too hard to encompass what will make the
• 2:04:46
  Speaker 2: world a better place because you have your perspective that's
• 2:04:50
  Speaker 2: like coming from the context you are in, where you're from,
• 2:04:54
  Speaker 2: how much money you have, what jobs you have, all
• 2:04:57
  Speaker 2: those things influence you, and it's literally impossible to have
• 2:05:02
  Speaker 2: to frame that in any sort of spectrum kind of way.
• 2:05:06
  Speaker 2: Did this, you know thing where I tripped years ago
• 2:05:12
  Speaker 2: influence how I feel about milkshakes? You know, like those
• 2:05:17
  Speaker 2: kinds of through lines you can make, You could create
• 2:05:20
  Speaker 2: stories around them, but it's it's hard to quantify those
• 2:05:24
  Speaker 2: things because they're so complex. It ends up becoming you know,
• 2:05:30
  Speaker 2: you have unintended consequences from a lot of things that
• 2:05:34
  Speaker 2: might be good in the moment but have terrible outcomes
• 2:05:39
  Speaker 2: in the end, and like dealing with that is hard.
• 2:05:43
  Speaker 2: It's an existential threat to to believe that the world
• 2:05:50
  Speaker 2: is that complicated. It has to be more narrowed. It
• 2:05:53
  Speaker 2: has to be as simple as making fight clubs will
• 2:05:58
  Speaker 2: make the world a better place or make me happier.
• 2:06:02
  Speaker 2: It's not that like my life was actually pretty good
• 2:06:06
  Speaker 2: and now it's.
• 2:06:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah point, which is like the the kind of button
• 2:06:12
  Speaker 1: on the movie. But where where where are we? I mean,
• 2:06:15
  Speaker 1: you're making you're making like.
• 2:06:17
  Speaker 2: We're right at the part where he had Tyler told
• 2:06:20
  Speaker 2: him that he has to let go and that letting
• 2:06:23
  Speaker 2: go is actually literally just crashing a car into a street.
• 2:06:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 2:06:29
  Speaker 2: Also, what's funny about this is that if you see
• 2:06:32
  Speaker 2: the car flipped over, he's on the passion. He's on
• 2:06:34
  Speaker 2: the driver's side, so he was driving the whole time.
• 2:06:37
  Speaker 2: Tyler pulls him out of the driver's side.
• 2:06:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's did the other two guys survive?
• 2:06:45
  Speaker 2: The other two guys survived, And this is where Tyler leaves.
• 2:06:48
  Speaker 2: This is where Tyler feels like, oh, yeah, you're birth.
• 2:06:51
  Speaker 2: I've birthed you into the man that you are. Now
• 2:06:54
  Speaker 2: you can go free.
• 2:06:55
  Speaker 1: So he just disappears, and it turns out that he's
• 2:06:58
  Speaker 1: been doing a lot of traveling, yeah, using the travel credits. So, like,
• 2:07:02
  Speaker 1: did you say that when when the narrator does like
• 2:07:08
  Speaker 1: beats himself up in front of the fake Kevin Spacey,
• 2:07:11
  Speaker 1: that he implies that Kevin space he threatens Kevin Spacey
• 2:07:15
  Speaker 1: and implies that he he beat him up in order
• 2:07:18
  Speaker 1: to like blackmail him into giving him like a continuous
• 2:07:23
  Speaker 1: like company salary to keep his mouth shut about like
• 2:07:26
  Speaker 1: what their practices are. It's not he's going to become
• 2:07:29
  Speaker 1: a whistleblower. Yeah, and so like and in exchange, he
• 2:07:33
  Speaker 1: like gets like resource like traveling resources, unlimited travel, and yeah,
• 2:07:38
  Speaker 1: which is cool because that's how he's able to sort
• 2:07:40
  Speaker 1: of like spread the message, spread the project Mayhem totally.
• 2:07:44
  Speaker 2: And as he comes as the narrator comes to and
• 2:07:48
  Speaker 2: comes downstairs, he sees that the message has gone so
• 2:07:51
  Speaker 2: far it's gone viral. It's gone viral that like the
• 2:07:56
  Speaker 2: cohesive worldview that he's created or these people has taken
• 2:08:01
  Speaker 2: on a life of its own and doesn't really need
• 2:08:03
  Speaker 2: him anymore, so much so that you see one character
• 2:08:06
  Speaker 2: slapping another character being like you are not you were
• 2:08:10
  Speaker 2: just a fucking.
• 2:08:13
  Speaker 1: What does he say? You're like not an individual? You're
• 2:08:16
  Speaker 1: not an.
• 2:08:17
  Speaker 2: Individual snowflake, and like, man, uh, it's it's pretty brutal,
• 2:08:24
  Speaker 2: it's it's pretty it's that it's a pretty nihilistic movie. Yeah,
• 2:08:30
  Speaker 2: at this point, it's got a kind of happy ethnic
• 2:08:34
  Speaker 2: which we'll get to, but yeah, he's basically trying to
• 2:08:41
  Speaker 2: seek out where Tyler is and where he's gone and
• 2:08:47
  Speaker 2: like what places he knows something bad is happening and
• 2:08:51
  Speaker 2: something bad is gonna happen. And the result, like the
• 2:08:57
  Speaker 2: the eye opening moment for him is when a mission
• 2:09:04
  Speaker 2: that he's set out fails and it ends up costing
• 2:09:08
  Speaker 2: him his only friend, and he does it is really
• 2:09:12
  Speaker 2: his only friend.
• 2:09:13
  Speaker 1: He's like, totally, this was my friend. This was my friend.
• 2:09:18
  Speaker 2: And he tries to like look through the files of
• 2:09:21
  Speaker 2: each of the buildings or whatever that the street names,
• 2:09:24
  Speaker 2: and Angel Face is like, no, sir, We've already taken
• 2:09:28
  Speaker 2: care of everything.
• 2:09:29
  Speaker 1: Wait, but do we do? We say the most famous
• 2:09:32
  Speaker 1: line of I see in Death Project maheam does have
• 2:09:36
  Speaker 1: a name.
• 2:09:38
  Speaker 2: Is Robert Paulson. Right before that happens, Marla comes to
• 2:09:42
  Speaker 2: visit him and she's like, Tyler's not here, Tyler's gone,
• 2:09:46
  Speaker 2: and she seems like really heartbroken about it, and he's
• 2:09:49
  Speaker 2: like alcoholizing himself, and.
• 2:09:51
  Speaker 1: Her reaction to him, saying that essentially that he's not
• 2:09:55
  Speaker 1: there is really interesting because like she's emotionally react to him.
• 2:10:01
  Speaker 1: It's it means that he's not there for.
• 2:10:03
  Speaker 2: Her, yeah, and that that he's decided to Yeah, it's
• 2:10:13
  Speaker 2: such a sad moment. He's decided to sort of leave
• 2:10:17
  Speaker 2: her in this way that he's disassociating himself in front
• 2:10:24
  Speaker 2: of her, and she's sad that this guy that she
• 2:10:28
  Speaker 2: really liked that some sometimes is like really nice and
• 2:10:32
  Speaker 2: kind to her and like they bang a lot and
• 2:10:35
  Speaker 2: have a nice time, and then.
• 2:10:38
  Speaker 1: Well she's feeling kind of like hot and cold and
• 2:10:40
  Speaker 1: totally gaslighted by him, like she doesn't know what the
• 2:10:43
  Speaker 1: fuck is going on.
• 2:10:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and the reason Paul Robert dies is because of
• 2:10:49
  Speaker 2: such a stupid It's such a stupid reason.
• 2:10:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Like they they they two birds with one stone.
• 2:10:58
  Speaker 1: We blow up one piece of corporate art and rolled
• 2:11:02
  Speaker 1: that corporate art into like a corporate chain or a franchise,
• 2:11:09
  Speaker 1: and they couldn't make it any specific one. But they
• 2:11:12
  Speaker 1: blow up this like globe looking thing and it like
• 2:11:14
  Speaker 1: rolls into like a Starbucks like thing. And then some
• 2:11:18
  Speaker 1: like rent a cop guy shoots shoots a fucking buddy
• 2:11:23
  Speaker 1: in the head, Paulson in the head. And this part
• 2:11:28
  Speaker 1: seems very like shit really got real, And it's kind
• 2:11:31
  Speaker 1: of interesting because the steaks are pretty low, like, yes,
• 2:11:37
  Speaker 1: these are expanding cells and everything, but it's still just
• 2:11:40
  Speaker 1: like Bob, their friend that in this shitty like act
• 2:11:44
  Speaker 1: of small vandalism, gets like murdered, and it's actually of consequence,
• 2:11:49
  Speaker 1: you know, yeah, totally.
• 2:11:50
  Speaker 2: I mean, this is like a death that happens in
• 2:11:54
  Speaker 2: the movie that has been built towards and built on
• 2:11:59
  Speaker 2: through like heavy, heavy amounts of violence and like they
• 2:12:03
  Speaker 2: just didn't think something like this would happen. And he
• 2:12:08
  Speaker 2: says that Edward Norton has like a level of self
• 2:12:14
  Speaker 2: awareness that he's like, what did you think was gonna happen?
• 2:12:17
  Speaker 2: And but like then you're like, dude, what did you
• 2:12:20
  Speaker 2: think was gonna happen? You started a club based on
• 2:12:23
  Speaker 2: fucking violence where a bunch of psychos got together, and
• 2:12:27
  Speaker 2: we're like, yeah, this is how we're gonna express ourselves.
• 2:12:31
  Speaker 2: It's like, what did you think was gonna happen? And
• 2:12:35
  Speaker 2: then and then like and the perfect Jared Letto is
• 2:12:39
  Speaker 2: totally like this that part where he's like we have
• 2:12:42
  Speaker 2: to bury the evidence and get it out of get
• 2:12:45
  Speaker 2: the body out of here, and and and and he's
• 2:12:50
  Speaker 2: like it's not a piece of evidence, he's a person.
• 2:12:54
  Speaker 2: And then they and then they misc its true that
• 2:12:57
  Speaker 2: because they're so involca they are pilled, they are one
• 2:13:01
  Speaker 2: hundred percent. That's why.
• 2:13:03
  Speaker 1: That's I love the misconstruing. It's really it's an interesting element. Yes,
• 2:13:08
  Speaker 1: that's why, because it's what people are going to do
• 2:13:10
  Speaker 1: to the message of the movie.
• 2:13:12
  Speaker 2: It's what people are going to do the message of
• 2:13:13
  Speaker 2: the movie. It's what people did with Peterson every time,
• 2:13:16
  Speaker 2: like somebody would try and call him on his ship
• 2:13:19
  Speaker 2: and not really understand or know how to do that.
• 2:13:21
  Speaker 1: But platform his twelve rule.
• 2:13:23
  Speaker 2: They would all be like, well, you just misunderstood him.
• 2:13:26
  Speaker 2: You misunderstood you haven't listened to him eleventh hour of
• 2:13:30
  Speaker 2: of whatever. You're just taking him out of context. It's like,
• 2:13:33
  Speaker 2: I'm not smart enough to understand it.
• 2:13:35
  Speaker 1: Thanks. Yeah, And and that's such a cop out. It's like,
• 2:13:38
  Speaker 1: well then it's not engaging to make it understandable. Absolutely absolutely,
• 2:13:44
  Speaker 1: it's his responsibility to make his point understandable if you're
• 2:13:47
  Speaker 1: gonna say that, like, what, so I'm just not smart enough.
• 2:13:50
  Speaker 2: Well, that's the thing is that that that's where the
• 2:13:52
  Speaker 2: dissonance comes in. It's like, that's why he says, Oh,
• 2:13:56
  Speaker 2: I understand in this worldview that I've I've been and
• 2:14:01
  Speaker 2: he does have he does have a name, Robert. They
• 2:14:06
  Speaker 2: turned and but that's how.
• 2:14:07
  Speaker 1: He turned death into a martyr.
• 2:14:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's what But that's what like religions do
• 2:14:11
  Speaker 2: to you know, that's what like, that's what cults do
• 2:14:13
  Speaker 2: as well, they have to like it's the conspiracies do
• 2:14:17
  Speaker 2: this all the time, where it's like no evidence means
• 2:14:20
  Speaker 2: that the evidence is being covered up, and evidence is provided,
• 2:14:25
  Speaker 2: there's even more even in evidence. Yeah, absolutely, I mean.
• 2:14:29
  Speaker 1: Like what happened to Building seven? Dude definitely controlls like exactly, Like, so.
• 2:14:38
  Speaker 2: What happens is Tyler U the narrator figures that Tyler
• 2:14:44
  Speaker 2: has been making traveling plans and like forming these cells. Uh,
• 2:14:49
  Speaker 2: so he goes to track them all down and then
• 2:14:52
  Speaker 2: he eventually realizes.
• 2:14:55
  Speaker 1: You've already is this. I love that he clearly got
• 2:14:59
  Speaker 1: beaten up by Tyler Durton, and he's kind of respecting
• 2:15:02
  Speaker 1: it us scared of him, like someone who got beat
• 2:15:06
  Speaker 1: up would be. Are you sure this isn't a test?
• 2:15:08
  Speaker 1: And then he asks again yeah, and he's like, you're
• 2:15:11
  Speaker 1: the one who gave me this, and he shows the
• 2:15:16
  Speaker 1: star kiss mark.
• 2:15:18
  Speaker 2: And yeah. So he figures out that Tyler is imaginary
• 2:15:24
  Speaker 2: and he goes to call Marlon.
• 2:15:27
  Speaker 1: The moment is cool, though, and it is very The
• 2:15:29
  Speaker 1: worst shot is like you you're Taylor dur And then
• 2:15:33
  Speaker 1: like having that realization, he's just like mar and he's
• 2:15:36
  Speaker 1: just like kind of panicking. I love him. Panicking. Kind
• 2:15:40
  Speaker 1: of reminds me of Walter White panic.
• 2:15:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, totally Walter White panic for.
• 2:15:46
  Speaker 1: Sure, until he adopts the like persona. Yeah.
• 2:15:51
  Speaker 2: I love the part where he tries to adopt the
• 2:15:53
  Speaker 2: persona everyone and he doesn't have the confidence. Yeah, he's like,
• 2:15:59
  Speaker 2: all right, by Tyler, he said, you definitely say that.
• 2:16:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 2:16:03
  Speaker 2: I love the he said you definitely say that. But
• 2:16:06
  Speaker 2: that scene where he's like that scene where he's in
• 2:16:11
  Speaker 2: the room with shaved head Tyler UH and and fur
• 2:16:15
  Speaker 2: coat Tyler uh smoking the cigarette and then the cigarette
• 2:16:19
  Speaker 2: being in the astray across from from Edward Norton and
• 2:16:24
  Speaker 2: like pleading with him, like being like hey, dude, like
• 2:16:28
  Speaker 2: we fucked up. This is not this is not this
• 2:16:31
  Speaker 2: is not what I wanted, you know. Yeah, And then
• 2:16:38
  Speaker 2: he goes back home, uh to figure out like what
• 2:16:41
  Speaker 2: Tyler's next move is, and he realizes that he's been
• 2:16:44
  Speaker 2: making phone calls to the different buildings that they're gonna explode,
• 2:16:50
  Speaker 2: including Billity seven and and he goes to the cops
• 2:16:55
  Speaker 2: to fucking tell the police officer who who found out
• 2:16:59
  Speaker 2: that he exploded his own apartment that guy is such
• 2:17:02
  Speaker 2: a good actor, and I have plans I very around
• 2:17:08
  Speaker 2: the entire country.
• 2:17:12
  Speaker 1: But before he's like some of this stuff jets. So
• 2:17:14
  Speaker 1: this I love this.
• 2:17:17
  Speaker 2: Because you know who you're reminded me of here reminded
• 2:17:20
  Speaker 2: me of what's it called the cops in Terminator, the
• 2:17:24
  Speaker 2: kind of like whole like kind of ignorant of what's happening,
• 2:17:29
  Speaker 2: the grandiosity of what's happening. So they kind of play
• 2:17:32
  Speaker 2: off like as though it's a joke. But before that scene,
• 2:17:38
  Speaker 2: he talks to Marla and he he like, really, what's
• 2:17:41
  Speaker 2: nice about this scene is I've had this with with
• 2:17:43
  Speaker 2: people in my life who I've kind of not like
• 2:17:46
  Speaker 2: unknowingly slash subconsciously knowingly slash have knowingly mistreated them and
• 2:17:53
  Speaker 2: then been like regretted and been like like, I was
• 2:17:56
  Speaker 2: such an asshole. I shouldn't have done this at this point,
• 2:17:59
  Speaker 2: and and like like kind of like not pleading with them,
• 2:18:03
  Speaker 2: but like being like, look, dude, I know you're mad
• 2:18:06
  Speaker 2: at me, and I don't want anything from you, but
• 2:18:08
  Speaker 2: I do want to be like I like I fucked up,
• 2:18:12
  Speaker 2: and like it wasn't good. And at some points I knew,
• 2:18:15
  Speaker 2: but at other points I didn't know, and at some
• 2:18:17
  Speaker 2: points you knew.
• 2:18:19
  Speaker 1: And that's kind of brain breaking sort of dissociation one
• 2:18:25
  Speaker 1: can do in situations in like situationships or just like
• 2:18:30
  Speaker 1: intimate romantic relationships where you're like, you know, there's like
• 2:18:34
  Speaker 1: hot and cold issues, trust issues, power issues exactly, and
• 2:18:38
  Speaker 1: it's all it's all part of the toxic masculinity though,
• 2:18:42
  Speaker 1: which is interesting, Like it's not just him being well, like,
• 2:18:45
  Speaker 1: it's not just him being like a not self aware guy.
• 2:18:48
  Speaker 1: That's part and parcel of it, right, it's like consideration.
• 2:18:51
  Speaker 2: Also, she's like not a very good person.
• 2:18:54
  Speaker 1: I mean, like they're both.
• 2:18:55
  Speaker 2: Very toxic, right, So, and they both feed into each
• 2:18:58
  Speaker 2: other too, because she's totally Also there's a reason they're attacked.
• 2:19:02
  Speaker 2: She's also constantly like being like, yeah, dude, like I'll
• 2:19:06
  Speaker 2: be in this relationship.
• 2:19:08
  Speaker 1: Broken tattooed on her forehead, dude. Yeah.
• 2:19:10
  Speaker 2: Absolutely, she's Harley Quinn.
• 2:19:13
  Speaker 1: She is definitely Harley Quinn.
• 2:19:14
  Speaker 2: But her performance is incredible. This scene where they have
• 2:19:19
  Speaker 2: the sit down at the diner where where she's like
• 2:19:22
  Speaker 2: exploiting the fact that she he's he's got free food
• 2:19:26
  Speaker 2: and then he's like clean food, please, then may.
• 2:19:31
  Speaker 1: I advise against gross?
• 2:19:40
  Speaker 2: Uh And the fact that like he looks over at
• 2:19:43
  Speaker 2: the cooks and they all nodded him and stuff.
• 2:19:46
  Speaker 1: Oh man, it's so great, those those those small moments.
• 2:19:49
  Speaker 2: And then he gets her to leave on a bus
• 2:19:52
  Speaker 2: and then four her menacing dudes step up onto the
• 2:19:56
  Speaker 2: bus and they kidnap her to bring her later over
• 2:20:01
  Speaker 2: to the the building that's Building seven that's gonna explode.
• 2:20:07
  Speaker 2: And then like you know, she has her moment of like,
• 2:20:10
  Speaker 2: you know, you're like such an awesome guy, but why
• 2:20:12
  Speaker 2: do you treat me like shit? You fucking asshole? Like
• 2:20:15
  Speaker 2: why would I put up with this? You know, why
• 2:20:18
  Speaker 2: would I do why would I stop to even talk
• 2:20:20
  Speaker 2: to you now? And then he's like, yeah, you're right,
• 2:20:23
  Speaker 2: just go just tell I'm telling you to just leave
• 2:20:26
  Speaker 2: the city, you know. And then he goes to try
• 2:20:29
  Speaker 2: and and basically give himself up to the cops, and
• 2:20:34
  Speaker 2: they do the ball cutting thing when the lead detective leaves,
• 2:20:39
  Speaker 2: and he's like, right before he goes, there's something to this.
• 2:20:43
  Speaker 1: There's very there's oh, yeah, there's something to that. Well no, no,
• 2:20:46
  Speaker 1: he says. He says that as they're doing it, because
• 2:20:49
  Speaker 1: the first they're like, we've got to say, this is
• 2:20:51
  Speaker 1: very admirable what you're doing, this sacrifice. I love them,
• 2:20:56
  Speaker 1: Like interpreting the Disciples, the Flying Monkeys, interpreting the like
• 2:21:03
  Speaker 1: the like behavior, you know, because like all narcissists end
• 2:21:06
  Speaker 1: up having flying monkeys, and this is what happens in
• 2:21:08
  Speaker 1: cal like behaviors too. It was just like that that
• 2:21:11
  Speaker 1: article about the anti Swifties. It's it's from a reddit
• 2:21:18
  Speaker 1: that's now called swiftly Neutral. Amazing.
• 2:21:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, like, and things form around I noticed
• 2:21:25
  Speaker 2: this that, like people form a lot of their identities
• 2:21:28
  Speaker 2: around hating things too, Like the anti woke shit is like, hey, guys,
• 2:21:33
  Speaker 2: like it's so like weird that like, you guys all
• 2:21:37
  Speaker 2: found this one common thing that you hate. But like
• 2:21:41
  Speaker 2: then when when all of the rest of the group
• 2:21:44
  Speaker 2: kind of disappears, they all find reasons to hate each other.
• 2:21:49
  Speaker 2: And it's like new new groups form around it. And
• 2:21:52
  Speaker 2: it's like whoa this, like this is so boring and stupid,
• 2:21:57
  Speaker 2: you know, and it's it happened. It happens with this too.
• 2:22:01
  Speaker 2: It's like fight Club becomes boring and stupid because it's
• 2:22:04
  Speaker 2: like tame. So they have to like up the ante
• 2:22:07
  Speaker 2: with Project Mayhem, you know what I mean.
• 2:22:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's true. That's true. Yeah, they
• 2:22:12
  Speaker 1: have to be they're escalating the situation. Yeah, and oh man,
• 2:22:17
  Speaker 1: this part's really exciting because it's like everyone's drunk the
• 2:22:22
  Speaker 1: kool aid and there's this real sort of like it's
• 2:22:24
  Speaker 1: really taken over, like it's actually like really caught on,
• 2:22:29
  Speaker 1: which means that a lot of people do feel the
• 2:22:32
  Speaker 1: same way. But he's not even he wasn't even aware
• 2:22:35
  Speaker 1: of the kind of beast he was creating. And they
• 2:22:37
  Speaker 1: want to like chop his balls up, but he like
• 2:22:39
  Speaker 1: steals a gun and he's like panicking on.
• 2:22:41
  Speaker 2: I love this where he like awkwardly tries to like
• 2:22:46
  Speaker 2: maneuver around the table. If anybody else you gonna you
• 2:22:50
  Speaker 2: gonna lead salad? Yeah, kind of sad, like pathetic. It's
• 2:22:54
  Speaker 2: definitely Walter White totally. And then he like runs away
• 2:22:58
  Speaker 2: from everybody and and he he gets to the building seven,
• 2:23:08
  Speaker 2: and they go.
• 2:23:10
  Speaker 1: How were they?
• 2:23:10
  Speaker 2: What was supposed to happen? Like was he supposed to
• 2:23:13
  Speaker 2: kill himself? Because the bomb that they dislodge.
• 2:23:18
  Speaker 1: Is inane the building that he's gonna be And yeah,
• 2:23:21
  Speaker 1: well no, I think he realizes because he dislodged it,
• 2:23:24
  Speaker 1: he's already going to maintain that it's dislodged. It's like
• 2:23:27
  Speaker 1: might as well have a good event. Yeah, I guess so.
• 2:23:29
  Speaker 2: But he calls up the friends or whatever. Maybe he
• 2:23:32
  Speaker 2: wasn't a different building, maybe it was just he was
• 2:23:34
  Speaker 2: going to watch it.
• 2:23:35
  Speaker 1: But one thing we do know for sure is that
• 2:23:38
  Speaker 1: charge controlled like demolitions like this would blow out the
• 2:23:41
  Speaker 1: glass from the other place.
• 2:23:43
  Speaker 2: To totally absolutely and also like they would kill people.
• 2:23:48
  Speaker 2: That's the weird that's the funny interesting thing about the movie.
• 2:23:50
  Speaker 1: All the people are all the people are.
• 2:23:52
  Speaker 2: Gone, and it's like, are you fucking kidding me? You
• 2:23:54
  Speaker 2: get the fuck out of here?
• 2:23:56
  Speaker 1: Delusional to but no, but he but he says like no,
• 2:23:59
  Speaker 1: but some people will be here. It's like they're casualties,
• 2:24:02
  Speaker 1: like Bob casualties in our war, a couple of broken
• 2:24:05
  Speaker 1: egg broken eggs. So he does address it. He does
• 2:24:08
  Speaker 1: address it, and it's just been radicalized, and that part
• 2:24:11
  Speaker 1: of casualties where he's like collateral damage when he has complicated, when.
• 2:24:18
  Speaker 2: He has the gun in his mouth, and the ending
• 2:24:21
  Speaker 2: mirrors the beginning and he's like, tell tell me whatever,
• 2:24:28
  Speaker 2: and he's like, I still can't think of anything. Yeah,
• 2:24:34
  Speaker 2: it's just a really nice, nicely formed structure of a movie.
• 2:24:39
  Speaker 1: Oh you didn't wait, so like you should clarify that.
• 2:24:42
  Speaker 1: So in the beginning he's like, I can't think of anything.
• 2:24:45
  Speaker 2: Do you have any last words? He asks him, and
• 2:24:47
  Speaker 2: he's like, I can't think of anything.
• 2:24:48
  Speaker 1: And then they come to the same scene that the
• 2:24:51
  Speaker 1: movie starts from later on where it's continuing from.
• 2:24:55
  Speaker 2: He says, I still still can't think of anything, and.
• 2:25:01
  Speaker 1: They bring in.
• 2:25:03
  Speaker 2: The people, bring in Marla from the bus.
• 2:25:08
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, we didn't say the like great observation you
• 2:25:11
  Speaker 1: had of Like when he sends Marla off onto the bus,
• 2:25:16
  Speaker 1: we see just like far away the disciples.
• 2:25:20
  Speaker 2: All together together together and they have their uh. Tyler
• 2:25:26
  Speaker 2: and the narrator have their final confrontation. The climax of
• 2:25:32
  Speaker 2: the movie is interesting because the climax seems to happen
• 2:25:34
  Speaker 2: in two parts. It happens when there he's dislodging the
• 2:25:39
  Speaker 2: bomb and really kind of in the sense that like
• 2:25:43
  Speaker 2: they have their final fight in that area right until
• 2:25:47
  Speaker 2: the like epic like shoot in the face whatever, right,
• 2:25:52
  Speaker 2: and like he realizes that he does have power in
• 2:25:55
  Speaker 2: himself and that to control of his life.
• 2:25:59
  Speaker 1: Which is what gen X needs to do to take
• 2:26:02
  Speaker 1: control of its life.
• 2:26:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, as individuals obviously never helping anybody, never helping anybody else.
• 2:26:08
  Speaker 1: But what's what's cool is while they can still afford property,
• 2:26:11
  Speaker 1: Yes they can.
• 2:26:12
  Speaker 2: But figuring out like, oh, he actually I don't have
• 2:26:17
  Speaker 2: the gun. He doesn't have the gun. I have the gun,
• 2:26:20
  Speaker 2: and then being like, listen to me very carefully, Tyler,
• 2:26:25
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna shoot myself in the face, and you're going
• 2:26:28
  Speaker 2: to have a hole in the back of your head,
• 2:26:29
  Speaker 2: but my face is going to be have a cool
• 2:26:32
  Speaker 2: scar is going to be tark so far, I mean
• 2:26:36
  Speaker 2: that dude's face would be off Vanilla's Skuyde.
• 2:26:40
  Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, dude, great movie too. We should cover that.
• 2:26:42
  Speaker 1: I really want to. Let's do it next.
• 2:26:45
  Speaker 2: He shoots himself in the face.
• 2:26:46
  Speaker 1: Then would we also do no just but we if
• 2:26:53
  Speaker 1: we're doing a Tom Cruise season, we can't do Vanilla
• 2:26:55
  Speaker 1: skuy is a one off, that's true.
• 2:26:57
  Speaker 2: We could do Tom Cruise running next, and that would be.
• 2:27:03
  Speaker 1: Why not.
• 2:27:05
  Speaker 2: He blows, blows Tyler away, kills him. Marla comes up
• 2:27:09
  Speaker 2: with a group of people. They they even take the
• 2:27:14
  Speaker 2: hole in the face as oh my god, he's amazing.
• 2:27:19
  Speaker 2: It adds to the lore.
• 2:27:21
  Speaker 1: And he tells them to go downstairs and see you're
• 2:27:24
  Speaker 1: still standing, And.
• 2:27:27
  Speaker 2: He takes Marla and he tells her that he's met
• 2:27:32
  Speaker 2: her at a weird time in his life, and all
• 2:27:35
  Speaker 2: of a sudden, the buildings start blowing up and the
• 2:27:38
  Speaker 2: Pixies play in the.
• 2:27:40
  Speaker 1: With your feet on Me and on the ground.
• 2:27:43
  Speaker 2: It's such a good song. It's so epic.
• 2:27:47
  Speaker 1: Can I say, like why it's so good? It's got
• 2:27:52
  Speaker 1: this sort of like syreeny off kilter melody. It's got
• 2:27:59
  Speaker 1: this kind of like majestic acceptance of there's this like
• 2:28:05
  Speaker 1: real grandiosity, and there's this kind of like in the grandiosity,
• 2:28:10
  Speaker 1: there's this like the howling sort of like sound. The
• 2:28:16
  Speaker 1: vocals that that are like howling in the background. It
• 2:28:20
  Speaker 1: really serves to kind of give this like eerie out
• 2:28:24
  Speaker 1: of place, out of time, but familiar and and epic quality.
• 2:28:32
  Speaker 1: So I think it's like a it's it's rich. It's
• 2:28:34
  Speaker 1: a rich it's rich melodically, it's rich like lyrically too.
• 2:28:39
  Speaker 1: It talks about collapse and the feet on the air
• 2:28:41
  Speaker 1: and he handle the ground, you know, like it's like, yeah,
• 2:28:43
  Speaker 1: where is my mind?
• 2:28:44
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 2:28:45
  Speaker 1: Like it's like and I think like the movie itself
• 2:28:49
  Speaker 1: is trying to kind of answer this question where is
• 2:28:52
  Speaker 1: my mind? That's why it's like such an effective ending.
• 2:28:55
  Speaker 2: And yeah, and mister Robot is the meta modern like, right,
• 2:29:01
  Speaker 2: you got to see it, dude, just the first season, Dude,
• 2:29:04
  Speaker 2: just go through the first season, Okay and just talk
• 2:29:06
  Speaker 2: to me about it.
• 2:29:07
  Speaker 1: Okay, okay, all right, But yeah, so, like I don't
• 2:29:12
  Speaker 1: know what, how how even do we go about rating
• 2:29:15
  Speaker 1: a movie.
• 2:29:15
  Speaker 2: Like this, I mean as a movie easily easily a
• 2:29:20
  Speaker 2: nine out of ten?
• 2:29:21
  Speaker 1: Would I would agree for all the reasons that we said.
• 2:29:25
  Speaker 2: Yes, the reason I would dock at a point.
• 2:29:32
  Speaker 1: It's kind of like a sad problem to have. I know.
• 2:29:37
  Speaker 1: That's that's why I dock it. It's like it's like
• 2:29:41
  Speaker 1: it's like it's great and like what it achieves through
• 2:29:44
  Speaker 1: sort of like leaning into this problem and leaning into
• 2:29:48
  Speaker 1: the like patheticness and sadness of it and like nihilistic
• 2:29:51
  Speaker 1: emptiness of it. It's what makes it work. But it's
• 2:29:54
  Speaker 1: also what just makes it imperfect for me.
• 2:29:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I'm glad that that the perfection exists.
• 2:30:01
  Speaker 1: It makes it interesting to talk.
• 2:30:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, It's it's one of those things that it could
• 2:30:05
  Speaker 2: never be. It could never be fully pantheon in the
• 2:30:11
  Speaker 2: way that we we like are like in the way
• 2:30:14
  Speaker 2: that like Nightmare Almis three three is pantheon, you know
• 2:30:17
  Speaker 2: what I mean. But it is pantheon for a kid
• 2:30:20
  Speaker 2: that's like twenty or whatever now, And I'm like, all right,
• 2:30:24
  Speaker 2: cool man, you know, yeah, yeah, you're gonna misunderstand this
• 2:30:27
  Speaker 2: for a little bit and then you're gonna grow up
• 2:30:29
  Speaker 2: gay And it's fine.
• 2:30:31
  Speaker 1: It's true. It's true. Everything will be okay. You'll be fine. Yeah,
• 2:30:35
  Speaker 1: you'll be fine. Like Edward Norton was fine in this
• 2:30:38
  Speaker 1: movie with a bully tarks of jaw. But that's fine.
• 2:30:45
  Speaker 2: But really, like I mean, it is like one of
• 2:30:47
  Speaker 2: Fincher's best I think probably Fincher's best.
• 2:30:50
  Speaker 1: They're probably David Fincher's third best film. And I know,
• 2:30:54
  Speaker 1: like I like a lot of the other ones just
• 2:30:57
  Speaker 1: as much.
• 2:30:58
  Speaker 2: But man, this is so you can mind this ship forever.
• 2:31:01
  Speaker 2: It's so good.
• 2:31:02
  Speaker 1: It's rich. It's a rich text. It's a rich talking.
• 2:31:06
  Speaker 2: Such a good movie.
• 2:31:07
  Speaker 1: And you know what it it.
• 2:31:09
  Speaker 2: It's not the movies better than the book, and it
• 2:31:12
  Speaker 2: makes the book better.
• 2:31:13
  Speaker 1: It does make the book. I agree. I agree with.
• 2:31:17
  Speaker 2: Like pelnak into the stratosphere of like, yeah, dude, like
• 2:31:21
  Speaker 2: and they are interesting and cool.
• 2:31:23
  Speaker 1: You suck. Also, it also proved that he's also a
• 2:31:27
  Speaker 1: little bit lightning in a bottle and wasn't able to
• 2:31:29
  Speaker 1: recap never recapture the same. Yeah, sort of like excitement, and.
• 2:31:35
  Speaker 2: You know I would do a fincher season.
• 2:31:38
  Speaker 1: I mean, I feel like we already have a little
• 2:31:40
  Speaker 1: bit alien alien three Gone girl would be in a
• 2:31:46
  Speaker 1: great conversation. Yeah, I would give the movie a nine
• 2:31:51
  Speaker 1: for the same reasons. I would give it, like, you know,
• 2:31:53
  Speaker 1: it's like ten bread.
• 2:31:55
  Speaker 2: Pits, Yeah, ten bread pits. Ten Edward Norton's tens nine evers. Yeah,
• 2:32:02
  Speaker 2: the only the primal fear is the only ten Edward
• 2:32:04
  Speaker 2: Norton's where he also plays a split personality.
• 2:32:09
  Speaker 1: I mean, like I would give it like seventeen bottom carters. Yeah,
• 2:32:12
  Speaker 1: I would give it ten out of ten. Marla's uh yeah,
• 2:32:18
  Speaker 1: meat loaf, I would give it seven slices of meat loaf.
• 2:32:22
  Speaker 2: I would give it to man. I would eat that
• 2:32:24
  Speaker 2: hole meat load. This was Jared Leto's best performance, getting
• 2:32:28
  Speaker 2: punched in the face.
• 2:32:29
  Speaker 1: Over no regain. I agree, I agree, and like Jared
• 2:32:32
  Speaker 1: Leto like was way better as a as a guy
• 2:32:35
  Speaker 1: that Yeah, he was.
• 2:32:39
  Speaker 2: He was a great. He was a great character actor
• 2:32:43
  Speaker 2: and also a great up and coming actor.
• 2:32:46
  Speaker 1: He never talked about his mushy face when after he
• 2:32:48
  Speaker 1: gets mushy faced, it doesn't matter. He's not worth talking
• 2:32:51
  Speaker 1: about more than we did. Anyway.
• 2:32:55
  Speaker 2: I hope you guys enjoyed the episode. Maybe these this.
• 2:32:58
  Speaker 1: Will be the format of the show for a while.
• 2:33:00
  Speaker 2: Maybe and follow.
• 2:33:02
  Speaker 1: Ushat thirsty for more percents on Instagram at more thirsty
• 2:33:05
  Speaker 1: on Twitter. Guys, if you like what we do, please
• 2:33:09
  Speaker 1: join us on Patreon and consider, like, you know, like
• 2:33:13
  Speaker 1: the Patreon right now is able to like sustain the
• 2:33:17
  Speaker 1: production of the show. I don't have to pay out
• 2:33:20
  Speaker 1: of pocket for anything, which is great. It would be
• 2:33:22
  Speaker 1: really nice if we could, like, you know, like make
• 2:33:27
  Speaker 1: a little bit of money from producing the show and
• 2:33:30
  Speaker 1: if you guys can help support that. We've made Patreon
• 2:33:33
  Speaker 1: very accessible. It's a dollar fifty, it's a flat right,
• 2:33:37
  Speaker 1: you get every there's no tiered it's not a tiered
• 2:33:40
  Speaker 1: system anymore. And it's just there to like so that
• 2:33:43
  Speaker 1: you guys can hear. So if you're thirsty for more,
• 2:33:46
  Speaker 1: you can quench your thirst with the thirst quench. See
• 2:33:48
  Speaker 1: you next week.