Latest / Hart & Hustle Podcast / The Unexpected Journey from Manufacturing to Ministry
Transcript
- Efrain: We are back on the Heart and Hustle Podcast with Mr Newman in the house. Mr Newman, where are you visiting us from virtually, man? Newman: Man, I have the privilege of speaking to you today from Fort Wayne, Indiana. I'm sitting here in my in my office at the chapel, which is the church that I call home and also have the privilege of working. Efrain: Love it, man. How long have you been there? Newman: I have been attending the chapel since we moved to Fort Wayne, Indiana about eighteen years ago. I've been on staff here a little over eight and a half, almost nine years. Efrain: Is that a UA on your shirt? Is it is that it's something else we got there? What is that? Newman: that it's an Auburn University. I'm a diehard Auburn Tiger fan, but that teaches me a lot of patience and a lot of tolerance and Efrain: Ha ha ha. Newman: they keep me humble. Efrain: Hey, if just think about the New York Knicks, man. They if they got to see the finish line after all those years, I I believe in the team as well. Newman: I hope so. I hope so. Efrain: So what brings you to an organization like this, man? I feel like definitely it's a calling, right? It is something that you do for pa out of passion and out of purpose. And I think that's why I love to have these conversations because the leaders that we do bring on the podcast, they're not doing it for the money, man. They're doing it self, they're doing it. You know, they're doing selfless work, I would always say, not selfish work. But what brings you to this organization? Newman: Well, I like the fact that you said selflish because I kinda feel a little selfish doing this. I I can't believe they let me do this. I serve here at the chapel as the missions and outreach pastor. so one of my many responsibilities is taking the Great Commission not only to Fort Wayne, but literally around the world. I tell everybody I have a front row seat to see what God's doing through amazing people in amazing places. And I wake up every day excited to do this, but there's also a little bit behind the scenes going, man, I'm not qualified. I didn't go to seminary. I'm not a trained pastor. I spent 25 plus years in the manufacturing business and I had this amazing opportunity to come to my home church, a place that I love, and get to do something that I love. And that's just to serve others. Efrain: It's always amazing when we feel like, one, that we do selfish work, 'cause these podcasts always feel like it's a little selfish. I get to learn from everybody that I get, you know, I have on here, the stories. I feel empowered, inspired. it provides hope when we get to really just be authentically us, Newman. So and I know that we'll do that through this conversation. But when you just mentioned, like, man, I ask myself, what am I doing here? I ask myself that all the time, man. You know, but it it it is truly a blessing to know that it does not feel like work to us because all we want to do is see people win. But also thinking along your journey, there's things that you learn. You mentioned being so many, I mean, two decades plus in the manufacturing company. There was something you were learning there, man. What do you think you walked away from that you now kind of implement into what you're doing today? Newman: Man, there's so many takeaways. I worked for a very large company, a multinational company, and I had the opportunity to meet individuals from all walks of life, literally. When you work in a factory of 2,000 people, you're going to have MBA graduates, you're going to have folks that barely made it out of high school, you're gonna have folks from all different ethnicities, languages, character, religious viewpoints. And so what I learned from that group. Is just showing up and giving your best effort means a lot to people. But what really gets the job done is getting to know people on a personal level because people are not machines. I don't care where you work. If it's a bakery, a factory, a restaurant, the people need to feel like they have a purpose. They need to feel like they're good at what they do and they need to be trained well to do that. So I got a great fun foundation and the fundamentals of learning how to relate to people where they are. Know where you want them to go and love them along the way instead of forcing them to go somewhere. And that has carried on to the church life. Volunteers, everything we do through here at the church is through volunteers, and you got to know where they are, you got to train them well, you got to love them through whatever's going on in their life, and you've got to say we are all working collectively towards this one goal, and they feel like it's a journey, and you got to appreciate everybody along the way. Way. Efrain: Yeah, man. What a blessing, right? Meet people are where they're at is really ideally where we we want to be as well. how big is it the church? Newman: So we're your average North American church as far as attendance, the frequency of attendance. we have about five thousand people that call the chapel home. because the North American church takes church attendance the way we do, average person in North America attends chur attends church one point eight times a month. So we have about two thousand to twenty one hundred that show up every weekend. Efrain: So a lot of communication, a lot outreach. Newman: Yeah. sometimes I like to say I don't know if we're a a big church that acts like a small church or kind of a small church that's trying to act like a big church. 'Cause yeah, there's a lot of communication, a lot of outreach. But then again, people need to wanna be n they wanna be known when they come into this church. They wanna they wanna have their name known, their face known, their story known, and they wanna feel like they belong, not just one of two thousand people. Efrain: how do you do that effectively, man? Just be able to communicate at that level. is it technology? Are you using things like AI nowadays that could allow you to still be the human in the space, but allow kind of those frequently asked questions maybe to be answered? What does that even look like for your non human? Newman: Okay, so the chapel does it a little different than Newman does it. The chapel, we have an amazing communications director. She's young enough that she gets all the social media, she gets all the technology, and she has an amazing gift. She was a senior marketing for a very large company here in Fort Wayne. She came to work with us about a year ago. She's amazing. Newman doesn't get technology that well, and I don't Efrain: Ha ha ha. Newman: I don't do all the social media stuff. Everything I do is through relationships. I just see people. they might be wearing a different sports team on their shirt on Sunday and I'm like, hey, let's talk about that. Or man, that kid's cute. Tell me about your family. Everything is through relationship. and you just you get to know people. you try to take this big group that is the chapel and carve it up into little small pockets of activity, whether it's a small group, a Bible study, a kids organization, break it up into small groups so you have opportunity just to get to know people. Efrain: You're just like me, man. I would sit here and even if I'm doing something virtual like this, I'll look at the room and I see where I can have a talking point. I can, you know, I'll ask you a question. And once I realize I got something, it's like I'll lean in it because it it allows really for that wall to come down. And a lot of the times people put up these walls and how do we slowly take that wall down? And I think it's really God's gift that I've had I realized over time that people ask me, my wife would do this. She was like, How the heck did you find out his biography in five minutes? And I'm like, easy. I just found the one thing where there was his shoes, the color of his hair, where he's from. And you just kinda go down that path. And I know a lot of nothing, I would say. So it's really easy for me to have a conversation. Is that kind of who you are, Newman? Newman: And I love it. I am I am I'm an extroverted extrovert. And one of the things that I've had to learn and be very intentional about is I don't talk about me. People don't want to hear me talk. And so the way I engage in conversation is asking open-ended questions so that people will talk about themselves, get to know their story, their family, their history, their passions, their desires. And that gives us an opportunity to have real conversation. I don't like to go real deep real fast because people don't go deep unless they trust you. so man, I'll talk all the superficial stuff. I love dogs, I love animals, I love sports. I'll find something that we can connect on, find some common ground, and then let the individual pour their heart and their passion out about something, and then I'll just kind of come alongside that with some deep questions once we've established a relationship. Efrain: Love that. How did you know that you were get here? Like, does this happen by accident? You were looking forward to this. How did you get into the seat? Newman: that's a great question. had I predicted ten years ago that I would be a pastor at this church, I would have laughed. And I think anybody else would have laughed. Early on I knew that I was called to some form of ministry. and that has different variations and iterations for different people, but I knew that very early on that I was called. and I think that that calling is to be engaged in my faith. I made some really poor decisions in my youth, early twenties. I just made some dumb choices, and I honestly thought that my poor choices in my past disqualified me for serving the way that I do now. Thank God for grace and his mercies Efrain: Yes, sir. Newman: because they don't. But how I got here is very simple. I took small steps. Everything I've ever done, working in the factories or the restaurants or even other things, I give it 100%. but as I'm doing that, whether it's a hobby, whether it's a volunteer opportunity, I'm going at it the best I can. I was created to serve, so I'm gonna serve to the best of my ability. So I started serving at church. I also started serving in our high school, some other areas, and that as our church got to know me and poured into me, there was a lot of discipling that had to happen to Newman to get Newman to this point. They trusted me with small tasks and I did them to the best of my ability. And after several years, 10 years of my growth and development, whether it's attending certain activities here at the church, leading of small groups, ministry, working with our youth, going on mission trips, leading mission trips. I say out of the blue, it was not out of the blue, but our church reached out to me and said, We are going to hire the next missions pastor. And my business background, I'm like, great. I will I'll help you write a job description. I'll help you. Do the job survey. I'll get all of this. You know, I was serving on the missions team then, but I didn't think I was qualified to be a pastor. So I'm like, great, I'll help you do all of these things and I'll do the interviews. I'll help you set all this up. And the pastor at the time said, No, Newman, we want you to interview for the job. And I remember looking at my phone going, Are you sure you're talking to Newman here? This is did you butt dial me or something? so how did I get here? It's a series of small steps, it's being a Obedient where you are right then to being the best person that you can be, giving yourself a lot of grace for the mistakes, and then just trying to figure out how can I use my gifts, my talents where I am right now, and let God direct my path down the road. Efrain: Amen to that, because in reality, no one's perfect, man. We all have our our flaws. We've all done our wrongs. I I don't know that you could point me in a direction of someone that has lived a, you know, clean life from now to, you know, when they were just a little baby boy or girl. And I also think that sometimes it goes back to someone seeing something in us, Newman. They've seen something in you before you even seen it in yourself. And that's the that's the beauty of life, man. Even I can imagine that you do that now. That you you see the good in someone, you see the potential, or you see the talent in somebody before they even see it in themselves. And and that's what someone's seen in you was the talent, was the ability to to do good work. And sometimes you just thought I'm just I'm just going to be doing the manufacturing job, and that was it. You're you're probably comfortable there. Was this uncomfortable? Newman: Was coming to the chapel uncomfortable? Efrain: Yeah. Newman: big time. so I had when I accepted this position at the church, I had two kids in college that we were trying to fund through college. yours at two and five aren't quite there yet, but you're gonna realize, man, that costs some money. So There was a an adjustment where I had to go home and so I I handled this all the wrong way. the right way that they tell you to do this is when they make you an offer to come work in ministry, that you pray and you meditate and you and your spouse walk through this journey together to truly divine God's will. And I was so excited about this that I told this the founding pastor of this church, told him on the phone, Great man, I'll start tomorrow. Great. Didn't ask the pay, didn't ask any of this. And then I got off. off the phone and I realized, wait a minute, I didn't talk to my wife. I've got to go home and tell her that My income's gonna go way down. man, okay, how do I do this? And so I just went in, grabbed my wife and said, All right, took a position at the church and she looked at me, she said, What took you so long? Efrain: wow. Newman: because she knew before I did that this is where I was supposed to be and what I was supposed to be doing. Efrain: Yeah. Newman: And to her credit, she went out and got three or four part-time jobs. you name it, she's like, Okay, we know that there's gonna be a hit financially, but she was all in way before. before I was all in. and so we managed to overcome the challenges of finance, which if you think about it really aren't that many. It's just adjusting to the right lifestyle versus what we were doing. So yeah, it Efrain: Yeah. Newman: was tough. but anything that's worth doing isn't gonna be easy. Efrain: Easy. Yeah. Or everybody would do it. and that kind of kind of goes back to the conversation we were having even before we hit record, man, about these wives that just seen something in us before we seen in ourselves that loved us for who we are, but knew that we were we were destined to be greater. And for us sometimes we think so small and and they see the big picture. I I don't know if that means that they're just tapped into to God a little bit more than we are, or what does that really mean? But I I tell you a funny story as well that my mo my my wife and my neighbor really like looked at me like I I d did the wrong thing, Newman. So I remember having a conversation with my wife around something and she says something along the lines of what God would want in a man, right? And and I was like, Man, what does God God want in a man? So, you know, my curiosity starts to kinda wander. So I went to my friend called Claude or ChatGPT, whichever one someone may use. And I just, you know, because it knew a lot about me. So I said, make it make sense. And I and I come back and thinking that I was doing the right thing. And I was like, babe, you wouldn't you would never believe it. And that so I tell her the example. And she looked at me and she says, Are you crazy? She says, if you ever have a question like that, you need to go to God. You need to open up the Bible. And then same thing with my neighbor. He looked at me like you would have thought that I I I'd then killed somebody at this point, Newman. And you know, from that point on, I realized, you know, we're we're we're just learning along the ways, man. That that's what life is about, is that you're not gonna get it right all the time. but learning from your mistakes, learning what actually is right and what's wrong. And in this in this lifetime that we have, man, it's about learning. It's about growing. Do not stay stagnant. And I can imagine, Newman, that you are still learning and growing. Is that correct? Newman: man. yes. I I I have been blessed with being surrounded by real professionals in missions and in ministry. So I go into every project, every task, every trip with okay, who are the people that are really doing things with excellence the right way, and how can I learn something for them? In missions, that's really key because the North American church had kind of has this stigma like we want to go over and save everybody. And just because the North American Church does it a specific way doesn't mean it's the best way to do it. When you're working cross-culturally, you've got to learn the culture and you've got to be willing to say, okay, somebody knows more about what's impactful and effective here. So I'm going to learn in every aspect. So yeah, I learn every day. The most difficult times that I have are when I think I know everything and don't want to learn. And then I can get humbled pretty quick. Efrain: Of course, man. That's what li that's what usually happens in our lives. And then we we got to quickly pivot, not panic, I say. So how do we pivot through those times? man, I I I think it is pretty cool and where God had really brought you, you know, in in life. And I think that there's obviously so much more on the horizon, but that you've been in this space to really impact and empower others and move people. Do you recall a time? Because sometimes we also kind of get in in comfortable situations and we have to ask ourselves, what is the why? Why do I do what I do? Do you recall a story man that immediately gives you the man, this is why and fills your cup? Newman: Yes. so coming from max manif manufacturing, everything is measured. How many units of productivity did you do a a day? What was your quality? What was your cost? What was your all of these things, everything is measured. and so when I got into ministry I I tried to take all of the metrics from manufacturing and bring into what I'm doing now. and how do you measure real impact in mentorship, discipleship, those kind of things? so it was a challenge. one of my mentors who has been guiding me and teaching me and correcting me when wrong since I got in this job, he has served as a full-time missionary in China, in several different other countries. and I got very frustrated the first time I went with him because I took a team of ten people and I thought that well fifty would have been so much better because it's a bigger number. So look at me, I can get 50 people there. And he quickly assured me that no, the number of people that you go doesn't have near the impact as the relationships that you build, the attitude that you go with, and the discipling that happens there. So I quickly learned early on to change my metrics from actual numbers to trying to figure out what real impact is. one of the key things that I've learned early on, and this goes back to my history in manufacturing The metrics of what I do. How do you measure the impact that you have and the real impact of discipleship and mentoring? when I started this, I had a mentor who was a or still is a full-time missionary in Southeast Asia. and I took a group to him, and I was so worried and frustrated and a little ashamed that this was a small group. It was only eight to ten people, and I was embarrassed because in my mind I had real success being look at Newman, I can get 50 people on. plane to come see you and he had to correct me on that he said Newman wait a minute the number isn't as important as the impact and so change Efrain: Mm. Newman: your metrics for impact through relational through discipleship through real relationships that is being built instead of numbers Efrain: That is so good, Newman. because I I I that's really good because I'm actually in a place where I'm putting on an event next Friday, right? and this was weeks ago, but I was stressing out. I I think if I stress out enough, I would have lost my hair like yours, Newman. And you know, I was sitting here, my wife says, Ephraine, it's not about how many people are in the room, right? The people that need to be there will be there. And when she told me that, I had to realize, like, yeah, we're so quick on wanting to put so many people in a room. But it is true. The people that need to be there will be there. So is that what you took out of that, Newman, out of that whole conversation? Newman: yeah. I remember when you and I first talked, you were telling me the story about you in high school and now that you've got your foundation that wants to pour back into your high school. The key is you're gonna find that one kid, like somebody found you, and that Efrain: Yeah. Newman: kid is not gonna say, well, I'm one of 500 that were reached. He's gonna go, Efrain cared about me. And so it's less I I try to get the the old manufacturing numbers and the old metrics of how many did we send and what was the cost and what was all of this, throw all that out of the way and just say, How do you truly measure the real impact? And it's made in one life change at a Time. So yeah, your event's coming up. If it rains and you got to go inside, you might lose half the crowd. If it's bad weather or the mosquitoes are heavy, half the people just might not care to show up. But there will be one person that shows up to your event that you will pour into, or somebody on your staff will pour into, or they will meet somebody there that chooses them and it'll be life-changing. So the metrics aren't as important as the impact. Efrain: So would you say, especially in a organization like yours, do you guys worry about data as much? Like do you guys look at the numbers? Like Newman: So we are very data driven. interestingly enough at our executive team level and on all of our operational teams, we use EOS systems to measure track performance and track tasks. So, yes, we run a lot of the operations and finance side of our church through a business-like EOS system. And it's been hugely impactful for our executive team and our performance. But what you have to you can't do either or you you know to be a good steward of everything. Everything that you've been given, you have to track it well, you have to manage it well, but you also have to remember that that's not the whole story of an organization or a church. Efrain: Got it. Yeah, man. I always wondered, like, you know, I'm one that would go to church and I don't think a lot of times we know what's happening on in the the background of things, but you're really giving us some insight on what it looks like when it is not a Sunday or when it's not a Saturday and people are not in the church. Is this what you guys are doing, trying to just make sure everything is running good and and operating smoothly on the back end? Newman: Well, so we hope we're hoping that it looks like we operate smoothly, but it's just organized chaos. Our church does about six hundred events a month. so that means the rooms Efrain: Well Newman: have to be set up, prepared, ready, the tech has to be great, the curriculum has to be great, the leaders have to be sharp, the snacks have to be set out, and then we gotta tear it down, clean it up, and set it all over again for the next person. On top of being Sunday ready, Monday night when the Bible studies here, and Tuesday on the other side. Of town when they need us for something. So yeah, you have to, everything you do, we're called to do with excellence, not for our glory, but for the glory of God. so yeah, we if you're not if you don't manage it well, the chaos or overwhelms you and you cannot perform excellently. And nobody wants to be a part of an organization, whether it's a church, a nonprofit, or a school, nobody wants to be part of an organization that's not run well. Efrain: Yeah, that goes back to c the communication piece. I've seen someone say hello to them. I don't know who was that. They they're they're gone. They peep the head. They realize, hey, that that's life. That's life. I mean Newman: okay. Sorry about that. Like I said, chaos. Efrain: I could imagine that you've heard my young child scream at one or two times. At one point earlier he was climbing a door, Dad, let me in. And I'm like and I'm not I'm just sitting here just laughing, but always gotta bring in the conversation, right? Don't make it too awkward. no man, this is this is definitely insightful, I would say, because I don't know that people know what happens truly in the background of a church. I mean really in the background of a lot of organizations. We talk about just a nonprofit and and while people are going to attend and it looks great and and it looks really pretty from you know the perspective of those two hundred folks, or in your case, two thousand, it's a lot of work going on in the background. There is a lot of, you know, work even offline that we do at home that starts to cut because I would say cause you are in a passion and purpose space. A lot of the times we do the work and realize we don't need a paycheck for it. We really just care. We really want to do good. We want people to have the ex same experiences that we've had. And it seems like Newman, you truly are now in the space where you're able to pour into others at a high level. But I ask you, in a space that we get to pour in because sometimes our cups are full, at some points they go empty. Who's pouring into you, Newman? Newman: What a great question. I am in a very unique position with this church that we have one of the pastors on staff, that is his passion, is pouring in he's been a senior pastor of a church for many, many, many years, and he saw firsthand how people in a church are so busy pouring into that they don't allow anybody else to pour into them. So he has been very, very intentional with the blessings of our senior pastor, our leadership team, and our elders to say we're going to focus on every individual staff member. so we are very intentional with our time. We have Bible studies that the staffs go through on a regular basis. We'll have a book that we're reading and going through together. Every Tuesday we join together as a staff, whether it's the preschool teachers, the facilities, Facilities team, the mowing guys, the tech team, everybody gathers together every Tuesday for about an hour and a half, and we have this amazing prayer time together where we talk about the good, the bad, the ugly, the fun, and we'll cry, we laugh, we do life together as a staff. Doesn't mean we're perfect, doesn't mean we love each other all the time, but the chapel has been very intentional about pouring into those that pour into others because like you said, if you know, if your cup's always going out, nothing's coming in. now I don't always do that well. I am built like the Efrain: Yeah. Newman: Energizer Buddy. I love the the podcast name Hustle because I'm Efrain: Yeah. Newman: I'm Efrain: That's it. Newman: I'm wired to go and to move and to do. And the concept of abiding in Christianity where you're just be still and knowing that he is God, man, that's not me. That's not natural. And so I've had to force myself to purposefully pause and just rest. And I'm not good at that because I'm energized by activity and people and let's go. So yeah, I it's it's a conscious thing. I'm so glad that I have a staff and a church here that wants to pour into me. But I've also got to be willing to slow down and abide when I wanna just be go, go, go, go, go. Efrain: That is me, man. I once my feet touch the floor, I thank God first of all that I get to see another day and I will not stop until my head hits that pillow and then I'm knocking out cold. And I sometimes think to myself, I just want to be a couch potato. Like what does that feel like? Newman: Ha ha ha. Efrain: Because but it it's not in us, man. We have this drive of of just not only wanting to be great ourselves, but allowing others to know that they too can be great. And Newman, you've really showcased that on this conversation through a lot of the things that you shared, a lot of the stories. So we definitely thank you for just being authentically you, for always never doing things for a selfish reason, but really because it is a selfless work that you are doing God's work. You're pouring into others. We thank you. What is the website? If people want to know more about the organization, where could they kind of tap into? Newman: our chapel is just thechapel dot net here in Fort Wayne, Indiana. We are a non denominational church. we say that we're a church for all generations and we just want anybody, whether you're seeking to hear the good news for the first time or you want an active place where you can live out your faith, just come check us out. We do a fantastic Sunday morning services. Our online presence is really great. Efrain: I was gonna ask, are you guys doing online? So I'm glad you talked about it. Newman: I I don't I don't have anything to do with that because it's worship, preaching, and technology, the three things that I you know, I can't Efrain: Yeah. Newman: sing, can't play an instrument or any of that. But we really put a lot of effort into making sure that our online experience mirrors what an in-person experience has. We believe that you need to come to church in person because there's a community that you can have in person. but we also wanna to be able to reach out those that can find us online and and want to grow that online community. So look at thechapel.net and find Fort Wayne, Indiana. We'd love just to see what you think. Efrain: Newman, thank you for your time, man. We'll definitely catch you on the next one. My name is Eve Franny. This is Mr. Newman. Talk to you latest. Newman: Have a great day.