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The Leadership Shift No One Teaches ft Lois Burton · University of Why

0:00
[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to the University of Y. I'm your host, Dr. Sonya Chopra, a board certified end-adownist, educator, side-hustler-turned-business owner, mother of three, and devoted wife.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I wanna show the world that it's possible to have a thriving career, loving family life and a sense of personal wellness and fulfillment without overcomplicating things.
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[SPEAKER_00]: You see life isn't just about what we do, it's about why we do it.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Together we'll explore the core motivations behind our choices.
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[SPEAKER_00]: The purpose behind our pursuits and the beliefs that shape who we are.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So we can redefine success on our own terms and build a life full of health, confidence, love and vitality.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Today's guest is Lois Burton.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I met her in a mastermind together and it was really empowering to see so many women really working in their zone of genius and being in full alignment with what they do best.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Lois is an innovative and progressive executive coach, conference speaker, facilitator and leadership team coach, whose career has included work with many of the most complex issues of individuals and organizations over the last 25 years.
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[SPEAKER_00]: She has been privileged during her career to work alongside some of the most significant figures in the international coaching and leadership development field, including Peter Blocker, first chair and co-founder of the European mentoring and coaching council.
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[SPEAKER_00]: and the late Sir John Whitmore, author of Coaching for Performance and Pioneer of Coaching in both US and the UK.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Lois is really, really masterful in what she teaches, and today we are going to dive deep into how leadership has changed over time.
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[SPEAKER_00]: we are going to dive deep into our values, our own personal values, and how can we get crystal clear on those values and how we want to lead our teams and ourselves.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And maybe even our families.
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[SPEAKER_00]: we're really going to understand a little bit.
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[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to dive into our nervous systems a little bit and how when we are working under pressure, working in a high-paced environment, and we feel a little bit burned out, how can we stay in alignment to those values?
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[SPEAKER_00]: This to me is really critical because this is where I feel like I have a weak spot because I fall to my triggers
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[SPEAKER_00]: And then I don't lead in the way that I want to lead.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So I don't know if any of you are feeling that way and that you feel like you kind of go back into your cycle, your glitch.
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[SPEAKER_00]: But I hope today's conversation supports you in a way that allows you to be in more alignment every moment that you lead.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome, Lois.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to the show.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I am so honored to have you as a guest today.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Well, thank you so much, Sonia, and I feel really honored to be here today, and I'm really looking forward to this.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, so great.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I really, I really love conversations with people who can help us be better leaders and more in alignment with really how we want to show up in a given day.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Great.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So why don't you introduce yourself a little bit to the audience, tell us a little bit about yourself how you
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[SPEAKER_00]: have started on this journey and you've been on this journey for a little bit of time and what originally sparked you to do this work and how have you evolved over time?
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[SPEAKER_01]: So I've been doing this work now for 25 years and
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[SPEAKER_01]: What sparked me was two things.
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[SPEAKER_01]: I was in corporate life, I was a leader in corporate life, I had worked in many different sectors.
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[SPEAKER_01]: One of the things that really struck me was that
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[SPEAKER_01]: the impact of greatly the ship, but also the impact of poor leadership.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And initially I kind of fell into those conversations a little bit accidentally when I was in retail.
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[SPEAKER_01]: We set up something that was quite informal when I was in retail, which I think in today's world would be more of a coaching group or an action learning set.
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[SPEAKER_01]: where just as leaders we used to share what was going on and and and and how we were approaching things.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So that was that was the start of it that I got really interested in leadership, the impact of leadership and also what helps great leaders to develop.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So that was the initial start.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And then I was offered the opportunity to work with some of the early pioneers of coaching.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Your audience may or may not know these people, but John Whitmore was one of them.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And he set up, he set up what was the first large coaching consultants in the UK.
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[SPEAKER_01]: But he worked in the US for quite a while and in California.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So that was a real opportunity because he was somebody who was passionate about both leadership and coaching, and he was a real guide and mentor to me.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So I then decided that I wanted to qualify as a coach and that the arena that I wanted to work in was leadership.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So that's what I did, and back in 2000 at the turn of the millennium, and it, you know, leadership development was kind of in early stages, it's been around for a while, but in a fairly operational sense, and coaching was very new to the UK at that time.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So kind of walking into that space felt
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[SPEAKER_01]: So that was the beginning for me and then of the years I've been very privileged to work with many, many great senior leaders across all sorts of sectors and both nationally and internationally.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And I just love this work because I say I think it's so important, the way that we show
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[SPEAKER_01]: both in a positive and a negative way, and also for themselves, how important to them when they make choices about how they're going to show up, that they can show up in a way that feels authentic, feels real, and you know, helps other people as well as themselves to be the best that they can be.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I wish I had more conversations like this at the beginning of my career.
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[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I'm a dentist and we do not learn any of this in dental school.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, as a dentist, we're expected to heal other people.
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[SPEAKER_00]: We are expected to hold space for patients, hold space for our team members.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I really
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[SPEAKER_00]: we can be better providers if we have a great team to support us.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And if you ask any dentist, when the number one thing that we probably gripe about the most is, is our team.
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[SPEAKER_00]: because it is really hard for us to manage a team and treat patients at the same time.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And this is really interesting because my mom, she's a physician, my brother's a physician, but they both work in places where they're not required to manage the team.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And so when people look at Dennis and why we can be an unhappy group and why we really suffer from a lot of burnout, it's because we have to hold space for
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[SPEAKER_00]: the moments were being a clinician and healing patients and also when we're also holding space for a team.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And a lot of times that can be so much.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And so I had a really hard time at the beginning of my career, understanding how I wanted to show up as a leader.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Nobody ever sat me down and said, oh, define your core values.
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[SPEAKER_00]: you know, and have a vision and they never instructed us to share those things with our team as well.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And so I had a really rocky beginning and I find that a lot of my colleagues that I speak to, they also have a really rocky beginning when they're just coming out of dental school.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And now all of a sudden, not only are there, is there a lot of pressure to do the dentistry really well?
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[SPEAKER_00]: show up really well.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And that was really hard for me.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So I wish I had exposure to these types of conversations.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Way back in the day 17 years ago when I was starting my practice.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I want to ask you like, how would you recommend to someone who's just starting out?
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[SPEAKER_00]: and they are a leader and they've never really had any leadership training.
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[SPEAKER_00]: What would you recommend for them, like, as a starting point?
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[SPEAKER_01]: So definitely the starting point.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Well, there are two three things I'd recommend, actually.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And there is lots of books out there.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Now, lots of books that focus around, that focus around leadership.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And I think just starting with having a look at that body of literature.
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[SPEAKER_01]: and dipping into that and starting to find some of the things that really, that really resonate with you.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm happy if you would like me to send you a kind of a starting reading list if you wanted to share that.
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[SPEAKER_01]: with your audience.
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[SPEAKER_00]: You have a favorite book.
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[SPEAKER_01]: I have two or three.
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[SPEAKER_01]: One of the ones that I really, that I really love that has been and a real bestseller, which isn't just for leaders, but I think really speaks to leadership is atomic habits by James Clare.
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[SPEAKER_01]: I think that one's great.
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[SPEAKER_01]: I have a friend and colleague called Lynn Scott who has written a book called Leader and Locked and I think she's tackled a lot of the very current challenges and I've actually written a book myself, a co-authored it with another friend and colleague called Deborah Dally and that is called the art of influencing and focuses on the traits of highly influential leaders.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So, those are three that I would start with, but there are many, I mean, Daniel Goldman's work is really, really good in terms of, and the newly does it was written, you know, quite a while ago now, but it's so relevant.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So, so that that one is definitely another go to, for me.
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[SPEAKER_01]: I'll share the full list with you if you want to share that with your audience.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I think great.
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[SPEAKER_00]: We can put that in the shoutouts for sure.
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[SPEAKER_01]: The other thing I would say is very seriously consider getting yourself both a coach and a mentor.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So to have a coach that will really focus on you as an individual leader, because obviously there is loads of great development out there and you can get a lot of stuff online now as well as in person and there are qualifications.
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[SPEAKER_01]: But I think some of you can really help you
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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's very important.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And also, I meant to us, somebody who has, you know, kind of what that past before.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So I would be saying there is such a lot of material out there and there's a lot of people available to help you.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So don't, don't try and do this on your own, don't try and figure it out on your own.
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[SPEAKER_01]: I tried to do it on my own and it didn't work.
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[SPEAKER_01]: It's so hard, it's so hard, and really there's no need because there is a lot of help out that today.
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[SPEAKER_01]: One of the, one of the places you've, you've mentioned values, and I've been an affiliate of the Barrett Values Centre for a number of years.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And that is Values Centre.com.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And I would really encourage people to have a look at that.
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[SPEAKER_01]: If that interested,
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[SPEAKER_01]: in doing some exploration of their own values and how that shows up in the world.
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[SPEAKER_00]: You said it's valuescenter.com?
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[SPEAKER_01]: Yep.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Yep.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And it's the guy who founded it.
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[SPEAKER_01]: He's called Richard Barrett.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And he's written a number.
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[SPEAKER_01]: He's written a number of great books about building values-centered organizations and values-centered leadership.
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[SPEAKER_01]: He's great guy.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Great, because I really think that this like understanding your values is something that we can easily skip over.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And if we don't understand our values, like we can't attract people with the same values, we can't eliminate people with different values.
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[SPEAKER_00]: We just don't end up building that support team around us.
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[SPEAKER_00]: probably.
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[SPEAKER_00]: One thing I notice that happens to me when I'm really stressed out because I'm basically like a emergency room for teeth.
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[SPEAKER_00]: That's my job.
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[SPEAKER_00]: People can be like dying in pain and so I have to work people into my day.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I may have already been scheduled with the busy day.
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[SPEAKER_00]: and then I have to work more people and who are not in the best mood.
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[SPEAKER_00]: They haven't slept for days.
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[SPEAKER_00]: They have just come in with it bad.
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[SPEAKER_00]: They just don't feel good, right?
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[SPEAKER_00]: They're not really who they are.
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[SPEAKER_00]: But in that moment, they're not feeling great.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And they need to be put out of pain in a jiffy, right?
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[SPEAKER_00]: They just, they won't help right now.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And sometimes that's a lot of pressure for me to hold.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm sure I hold like so many people agree with that statement.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And when I'm under pressure, when I find that I'm having a very fast day,
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[SPEAKER_00]: I can be snippy, right?
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[SPEAKER_00]: Or just really like not cold, but just like very direct.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And I know that my personality is very direct.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So it is a part of my personality that I need to soften.
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[SPEAKER_00]: but I find it in those moments, it's really hard for me to hold my values.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Can you help us kind of just unpack values, the value of values, and how can we stay true to our values in a stressful situation?
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[SPEAKER_01]: So I think first and foremost, what you said at the beginning about understanding our values is where they start.
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[SPEAKER_01]: because many people have values, you know, if everyone has values.
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[SPEAKER_01]: But they may not have even articulated them that clearly to themselves, and they haven't thought about what that means on a day by day basis.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know,
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[SPEAKER_01]: for instance, that one of your values is respect, which is a very common one that many people hold here.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So you know that you believe in respect, that is one of your deep-seated values, but have you really thought about what that means on a day by day basis?
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[SPEAKER_01]: And again, you could do
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[SPEAKER_01]: and my current cohorts of leading with resilience, people, that's one of the things I encourage them to do is to journal regularly, I find that an incredibly helpful practice.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Under you can talk about this with your coach or your mentor, or if you have a peer group,
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[SPEAKER_01]: that you know where you help each other to learn.
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[SPEAKER_01]: But the important thing is to start to understand what that means on a day by day basis.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And it will be different for different people.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So if for instance you think, oh so respect for me means that I always start with courtesy or I always start with believing the best of people.
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[SPEAKER_01]: and you pay attention to that on a day by day basis.
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[SPEAKER_01]: It's one of the reasons that I talked about habit earlier on because it is actually about building a habit.
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[SPEAKER_01]: In the same way that we might build physical habits, such as whatever exercise we do if we do meditation, that we make it
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[SPEAKER_01]: to connect to our values and if there's a little bit of time at the beginning of the day we think you know what what my value is going to mean to me today.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So if in the you know example that you that you that you guys on you you was thinking okay so I know that today I am going to be under pressure.
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[SPEAKER_01]: what other things that, you know, what do my values mean to me today?
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[SPEAKER_01]: How do I want to show up?
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[SPEAKER_01]: And you start that off intentionally because very often when we kind of slip, it's not an intentional thing.
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[SPEAKER_01]: It's just that the pressure piles aren't and we haven't consciously thought about how we get a handle that today.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So I would say that's a starting point.
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[SPEAKER_01]: The other thing I would say,
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[SPEAKER_01]: is that, you know, if you're on direct strain pressure and that flips a little bit,
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[SPEAKER_01]: beat yourself up, but it's not going to be helpful.
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[SPEAKER_01]: All you can do really is then go back and do a bit of reflection on, you know, the day after and say, okay, so if I have that kind of day again, how might I change that?
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[SPEAKER_01]: So it is really being intentional about those things,
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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, so is it the feeling of responsibility that you've got some of those you say who's an extreme pain and you need to really make sure that you deal with that and everything else just kind of goes to the side.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, that is a trigger, you know, how do I do I don't very intentionally.
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[SPEAKER_01]: make sure that that isn't impacting me too much.
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[SPEAKER_01]: How can I change that?
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[SPEAKER_01]: I've worked with people over the years where we've really talked about, you know, I'm a great fund of meditation, I think you probably are too.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.
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[SPEAKER_01]: The actually training our brain into a more peaceful,
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[SPEAKER_01]: still place, really helps its money to those moments of pressure, but I think it's not intentionality, but makes the difference.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's important that you say that because I remember in the beginning when I couldn't understand why I would be so triggered and why I would like fly off the handle a little bit, I didn't understand, but then once I took the time to reflect like, okay, what in that
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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, I'm focused.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm focused doing this route now.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And I have this, I have a team member saying, okay, Dr. Trooper, I have this upset patient on the phone about their bill.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm like, I'm working on a human.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I can't really put that fire out right now.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So I understood, okay, what was actually making me upset or triggered in that moment.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And it was, I really don't enjoy when I'm wearing my clinical hat.
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[SPEAKER_00]: to also wear my manager hat at the same time.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And that was such an aha moment for me.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I was like, oh, wow.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, but guess what, I've never really declared that for myself and nor have I ever shared that with my team.
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[SPEAKER_00]: But I think I do share that with my team.
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[SPEAKER_00]: They would totally get it.
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[SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure they would.
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[SPEAKER_00]: That was such a huge step for me as was like making that claim and number like understanding myself, making the claim and then sharing that healthy boundary.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I think sometimes people find boundaries to be like a little too sticky, but like that was a really healthy one and it started to ship the way that I communicated.
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[SPEAKER_00]: It started to shift my relationship with my team.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I was able to soften in the moment.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And so that understanding that pressure and that trigger and giving myself time to reflect on that was huge.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And then now I start my day, my working day, where I know I'm gonna have a fast day.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I go into my meditation corner even if I only have five or 10 minutes in the morning.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I just make sure I kind of asked for protection, you know, I kind of put myself in a little bubble and I'm like, please protect me today.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Please allow me to always speak from love and kindness and compassion.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I know that sometimes my team may not be having a good day.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I know that sometimes my patients are in pain and I need to make sure that I I show up with that kind of integrity
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[SPEAKER_00]: And sometimes, you know, it even happened yesterday at the end of the day, I couldn't notice I was getting a little, you know, I was getting tired and I could see and sometimes I've, I've, I've changed the way I schedule my day because I noticed that that happened all the time, some constantly paying attention.
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[SPEAKER_00]: A constant and making shifts to adjust so that it can always stay in that integrity and also just kind of making sure that I ask for protection as well.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's so great.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And what you mentioned there about sharing, sharing with your team, when you have those aha moments, it's so important.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, I often talk to some of the leaders that I work with about their values.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And I often ask that question about, you know, how much do your team know about your values?
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[SPEAKER_01]: And quite often, still people will say, oh, you know, I haven't really shared that much with my team.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I would always encourage people to do that because then that also opens up that dialogue
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[SPEAKER_01]: with you, and you can have those discussions, but what might be triggering how to just everybody stay in that integrity, and you can support one another to do it.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And if you said, you know, teams, people will understand that, they will get that.
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[SPEAKER_01]: They don't expect you to be infallible.
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[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's just more of that truth and transparency that really helps.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and it's funny because this morning I woke up, I forgave myself for getting a little bit out of alignment yesterday, but I wasn't as out of alignment as I've been in the past, but I forgave myself and I said, okay, you are allowed to try even better tomorrow, so I gave myself forgiveness and again, I think another
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[SPEAKER_00]: benefit of sharing with your team is like now when I when I am stressed out or I have a hard day, I don't just reflect by myself, I reflect with my team and I'll be like, I'll talk to my front desk, crystal, be like hey crystal, like that one, that was really tough for me.
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[SPEAKER_00]: She's and then she'll come up with a solution.
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[SPEAKER_00]: She's like oh well do you think if we move this part of the schedule
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[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm like, oh my gosh, that really would.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And so we'll, she'll help me come up with the solution to that stressful moment.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And you can actually like tackle things together, you know, through collaboration as opposed to just kind of being on this lonely island by yourself.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely, absolutely.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And on my podcast this week, I was answering questions from and that people that people had sent in.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And one of them was about, you know, how do you handle it with your team?
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[SPEAKER_01]: If you've made an error, if you've made a mistake, and that might be a behavioural mistake or it might just be, you know, a general mistake.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And I talked about that, but we'll talk to them, you know, don't, they do not expect
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[SPEAKER_01]: and they can help you.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, think but how how things can be better.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And you you all got best together then.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it really it's just it is better to do things together.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I really
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[SPEAKER_00]: leadership has changed over time because I feel like how I thought I was supposed to lead 17 years ago is really not how I want to lead now.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Have you seen an evolution in leadership?
25:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Definitely.
25:01
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, this is kind of the whole theme of the work I'm doing now, my podcast and a lot of the work is that the way we legislate today is not going to lead us in tomorrow.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So back in the day, I think there was, again, this idea that a leader should be quite distant, that they should direct.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And that has evolved a lot over the years.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And I think, you know, we recognize the power
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[SPEAKER_01]: of, you know, emotional intelligence and pass it lead to shit and, you know, certainly to shit some of the stuff that Jim Collins talks about and all of those things have been recognized over the years.
25:44
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think we're a surreal tipping point now and and I think, you know, that that's partly because of all of the all of the things that we've experienced over the last few years, the pandemic, the impact of that
25:57
[SPEAKER_01]: you know, the kind of the shifting world of society.
26:00
[SPEAKER_01]: All of those things are impacting on leadership.
26:05
[SPEAKER_01]: I think some of the things that are really important what we've just been talking about.
26:10
[SPEAKER_01]: People are really, really looking for values led lead to leadership.
26:13
[SPEAKER_01]: it's important people want to know who you are and not just what you can do.
26:20
[SPEAKER_01]: So they're not just interested in what are your skills and talents in your in your given area and you know and I don't know whether that's something you've experienced on you because I know you're a brilliant dentist.
26:34
[SPEAKER_01]: but people want to know more about, you know, they want to know what you stand for, what your values are, who you are.
26:40
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's what encourages people to follow and, you know, leaders.
26:46
[SPEAKER_01]: And I don't mean that in a subservient way.
26:49
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think the other thing is,
26:52
[SPEAKER_01]: that we've got to be able to adapt really quickly.
26:56
[SPEAKER_01]: The world is changing so fast.
27:00
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, there are so many factors involved in that.
27:04
[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, we could be, we could be planning this strategy.
27:08
[SPEAKER_01]: You know six months ago and then so many things have changed in that last six months and we've really got to adapt And one of the One of the comments I got on LinkedIn was and the other day was how do you help people lead in this time of wild uncertainty?
27:24
[SPEAKER_01]: And that was the phrase This guy used wild uncertainty.
27:28
[SPEAKER_01]: I think as a leader you have to be that stabilizing force and you have to be a meaning maker Those things are much more important than they than they then they used to be
27:37
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think there is still the still place for vision that I think that's very important, celebrate a place for people saying that this is the direction we're had to do then, but there's also a place for understanding, as I say, who you are, what you stand for, making meaning of the situation we're in, offering
27:58
[SPEAKER_01]: what I call resilient optimism, so not just a positivity that ignores what is happening, just going to go so it's all going to be okay, but actually can say this is what's going on.
28:13
[SPEAKER_01]: I believe that we have the capacity to figure this out together.
28:19
[SPEAKER_01]: and being that trailblazer in that way.
28:24
[SPEAKER_01]: So those are the things that I think are a really important and the other thing is courage.
28:29
[SPEAKER_01]: I think we've got to be brave, think leaders have got to be brave and they used to be in order to help other people to navigate this
28:40
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
28:41
[SPEAKER_00]: I agree with everything you just said.
28:43
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like the more authentic I am, the more that I kind of share my principles, you know, and one of my hardest things to do is to be vulnerable in front of my team, but also that vulnerable-based leading has
29:00
[SPEAKER_00]: really opened up more connection with my team.
29:03
[SPEAKER_00]: I've been very transparent with how I want to do my form of dentistry.
29:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Like my form of dentistry is very different than other people.
29:14
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I I'm on a mission to
29:17
[SPEAKER_00]: make a change in the dental world and the way we do root canals.
29:20
[SPEAKER_00]: I know it's not the very a very sexy topic but I'm so proud that I have a team that is actually so aligned with that mission and it really is a shared mission and it really
29:33
[SPEAKER_00]: You can see this unifying thread through all of us like they help me outside of the practice to run my what I thought was supposed to be a side hustle That's actually turned into its own living heartbeat of a business and without my team I could never
29:52
[SPEAKER_00]: help these dentists and their teams understand how to provide good root canal therapy.
30:00
[SPEAKER_00]: But it really didn't click and it didn't start moving until I started to share all this with my team.
30:06
[SPEAKER_00]: And really it started to have like radical responsibility for
30:10
[SPEAKER_00]: what I believe and and my truth and then sharing all that.
30:15
[SPEAKER_00]: So, man, I love this.
30:18
[SPEAKER_00]: I love, I just love the, the collaboration piece of what you keep pointing to in this conversation.
30:26
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's, it's really, really important.
30:29
[SPEAKER_00]: The hierarchy,
30:31
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like it doesn't work anymore.
30:33
[SPEAKER_00]: That traditional hierarchy of leadership, it really doesn't work anymore.
30:37
[SPEAKER_00]: I love collaborating my team.
30:39
[SPEAKER_00]: I now, I respect their decisions so much.
30:43
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that they can come with solutions to the problem before I even ask them for anything.
30:48
[SPEAKER_00]: It's great.
30:49
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's so marvelous to hear that passion.
30:53
[SPEAKER_01]: because I think that's the other part of leadership is to have a real authentic passion that you believe in and that other people can then align with.
31:03
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's fabulous.
31:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, absolutely fabulous.
31:07
[SPEAKER_00]: And you know what's happened?
31:07
[SPEAKER_00]: I've lost a lot of team members too because they weren't aligned with the values.
31:12
[SPEAKER_00]: They weren't aligned with the vision and they just kind of fell away naturally.
31:16
[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't bad.
31:18
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
31:18
[SPEAKER_00]: I think sometimes that can be really scary and maybe we'll hold some people back.
31:23
[SPEAKER_00]: They're like, oh, I don't want to share it because I'm afraid I'm going to lose this person in this person.
31:27
[SPEAKER_00]: But you end up attracting people who are more aligned with you and you end up being better than how you started.
31:34
[SPEAKER_00]: And so you do.
31:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the uncertainty piece, it's everywhere, but you're right, you need a leader who's going to be resilient and trust the process and trust that it's actually everything is going to be okay and I had I had this almost exact conversation with with one of the people that I coach and this week and he is he's battling with this the moment he's he took a roll on and
32:02
[SPEAKER_01]: And when he went into this so many things of emerge that he didn't expect to emerge but he's got a real vision and passion around making this organisation that he's in excellent in quality full of integrity.
32:19
[SPEAKER_01]: And he has lost people along the way because of that because they haven't been fully aligned with that.
32:26
[SPEAKER_01]: And as you say, it's quite scary.
32:28
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but it's a gift.
32:33
[SPEAKER_01]: He's going to make such a difference to the place that he's in and to the wide world in the sector he's in.
32:41
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that.
32:42
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that.
32:42
[SPEAKER_00]: I know things can be scary, but if we just trust that it will be better than before, you speak about the oxygen mask principle that leaders build their own, they must build their own resilience first.
32:56
[SPEAKER_00]: How, like, you know, as a female, sometimes we can put so many other people first before ourselves.
33:03
[SPEAKER_00]: Can you talk about this and what is, what is this actually supposed to look like in real life?
33:09
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll address that one first because you talked about it earlier on.
33:13
[SPEAKER_01]: I talk about boundaries all the time and you write, I mean, I do know that there are
33:20
[SPEAKER_01]: They're a man who do the same thing, but it tends to be more common with women.
33:25
[SPEAKER_01]: And the conditioning that everyone else needs, much more than ours do.
33:35
[SPEAKER_01]: And so it shows that, you know, with people, they'll push themselves to work ridiculous hours.
33:42
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, dashing around, trying to just solve everybody's problems.
33:49
[SPEAKER_01]: and for me it's about unpacking that pattern and helping people to actually do some things different, even if they haven't quite caught up with that feeling comfortable yet.
34:05
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I talk about the fact that sometimes you have to do things that feel uncomfortable and then that starts to change.
34:13
[SPEAKER_01]: So you change your behavior and then that's not to change how you think and feel about it.
34:18
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a real time example that you know that I was talking to some of the people on my course about was I've got somebody who's just started a new role.
34:31
[SPEAKER_01]: in a new organisation and she was saying that just where her office is and there's kind of a glass plate and that people are coming by in a morning and they're saying heights which is really lovely.
34:45
[SPEAKER_01]: She said, but then I'm fine in the time that she'd sat aside to, you know, do some strategic thinking, do some strategic work.
34:54
[SPEAKER_01]: She, you know, people were popping their head round her door
34:57
[SPEAKER_01]: And she wasn't getting to the things that she needed to get to, because she was chatting to everyone else.
35:04
[SPEAKER_01]: And in a very simple way, she literally has removed herself first thing in a morning to go work somewhere where people can't see her.
35:13
[SPEAKER_01]: So that isn't that she is not going to communicate with her team and empathize with her team.
35:19
[SPEAKER_01]: And she has taught them and said, you know, just this period of time in a morning, it's really important for me to do some thinking and set my day out and all of that.
35:28
[SPEAKER_01]: And of course they understand.
35:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
35:30
[SPEAKER_01]: And so it's a really kind of simple example,
35:39
[SPEAKER_01]: not respond to what other people like to do in terms of, say, heights me in a morning because I need a bit of space and time.
35:49
[SPEAKER_01]: And together with the group as well, we re-adjusted that thinking.
35:55
[SPEAKER_01]: And she said it felt very uncomfortable when she did it the first few times, but she's continued to do it.
36:00
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, how do you give somebody permission to put the sign on the door that says, good morning but do not disturb, right?
36:07
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, exactly, exactly, so, but I do think it's about, it comes back again to recognizing what your own patterns are, recognizing which ones are serving you and which ones are not and being prepared to hold those boundaries.
36:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I find that tuning into the reaction in my body is really important.
36:30
[SPEAKER_00]: My body will always give me the sign that it's like not a hell yes, right?
36:36
[SPEAKER_00]: And you have to have feel that power to say no sometimes.
36:41
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
36:42
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
36:43
[SPEAKER_01]: And this is one of the things that you talked about people, it's okay to say no.
36:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
36:48
[SPEAKER_01]: You can say kindly.
36:50
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, you don't have to say it in an aggressive way, but you can still be firm about, you know, this is what's important to me right now.
36:59
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
36:59
[SPEAKER_00]: So I mean, I have to take a breath, right?
37:01
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I remember, I was actually listening to your podcast, Leadership Horizons.
37:07
[SPEAKER_00]: And I really got hooked on this one episode.
37:09
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel bad I can't remember who your guest was, but it was about the nervous system and leadership and the nervous system.
37:17
[SPEAKER_00]: And I find that this is such a, it's being talked about a lot now,
37:26
[SPEAKER_00]: more like cameras on it.
37:29
[SPEAKER_00]: So can you kind of share your experience with understanding the nervous system when it comes to leadership and how can we, how can we be more mindful of it and how can we use it to our benefit and you know just let ourselves relax a little bit more.
37:47
[SPEAKER_01]: So, the statistic, I would have to check it, but I'm pretty sure it's like this is right.
37:54
[SPEAKER_01]: The statistic is that around about 93% of people who are in not just leadership roles, but significant roles that carry complexity and stress with them will suffer from a disregulated nervous system.
38:12
[SPEAKER_01]: And that basically, you know, the physical cause you'll be familiar with this is adrenaline and cortisol and the impact that that has on our body and also then on our emotions and our nervous system which can drive us into those fight, flight, freeze or fall patterns.
38:36
[SPEAKER_01]: And so the first thing is to notice when that's happening, again, so much of this is about paying attention to yourself and, you know, you said that your body will give you the signal.
38:49
[SPEAKER_01]: I can instantly feel kind of round about my solar plexus if, you know, if I'm starting to get really tense, that's where I get it.
38:58
[SPEAKER_01]: And the other thing is, once you've noticed it doing something about it, so some of those things are things like our energy management, our stress, and our cope, our coping with stress, and
39:15
[SPEAKER_01]: strategies, but you've got, you've got a notice first of all in order to do something about it.
39:21
[SPEAKER_01]: It's the meditation, the meditation can come in so strongly and all of the all of those things.
39:28
[SPEAKER_01]: are really, really important.
39:31
[SPEAKER_01]: And once we notice them and we understand them, then we can get strategies to actually help them.
39:38
[SPEAKER_01]: I was working with a coach here about a month ago and she emailed me to say, have you got any time this afternoon?
39:49
[SPEAKER_01]: Something has happened.
39:50
[SPEAKER_01]: She had an incident with
39:54
[SPEAKER_01]: with another colleague, and she was in a real state of stress.
39:58
[SPEAKER_01]: And the first thing that we talked about was you need, can you, and if you can, get outside.
40:04
[SPEAKER_01]: Get outside, unburied, get socks into your body, because that will then start to allow some of that cost as ultra-subside.
40:13
[SPEAKER_01]: It will allow your brain to start working again.
40:16
[SPEAKER_01]: So sometimes it's those kind of in-the-moment things, where we have to say, I have to,
40:23
[SPEAKER_01]: move out of this high adrenaline, high cortisol.
40:27
[SPEAKER_01]: That is very often about physical strategies.
40:31
[SPEAKER_01]: So, and then, as that starts to kick in, then we can start to think and think more calmly and think about not just what do I need to do to cope with this situation, but how do I
40:49
[SPEAKER_01]: And as I say, energy management, stress management, strategies, breathing, meditation, making sure that you do spend time in the outdoor world, if you possibly can.
41:05
[SPEAKER_01]: And exercise, do this to many people, some people run or swim or whatever works for you.
41:14
[SPEAKER_01]: But we have to understand what works for us.
41:18
[SPEAKER_01]: I know movement, I know movement works for me and I know that I have to get outside.
41:22
[SPEAKER_01]: If I'm really getting into that heightened state, walking in nature, that is so important to me.
41:30
[SPEAKER_01]: And again, building that in on a regular basis so that you don't have those episodes too often.
41:37
[SPEAKER_01]: But just again, recognising that this is
41:40
[SPEAKER_01]: It's normal, so many people experience this, but we can't, we can't actually change our nervous and emotional state.
41:51
[SPEAKER_01]: It's possible to do that.
41:53
[SPEAKER_01]: We have to be intentional about it.
41:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Step one is just recognizing, because again, for me, I was very unconscious to the fact
42:05
[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't even realize my nervous system was trying to tell me something.
42:09
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, we're not supposed to be in this state of stress all the time.
42:15
[SPEAKER_00]: And your nervous system is just knocking on your door saying like, hello, like, time to wake up and understand and like scan your body.
42:25
[SPEAKER_00]: Where do you feel that in your body?
42:27
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you feel it in your neck and your shoulders,
42:35
[SPEAKER_00]: And what can we do to shift it?
42:38
[SPEAKER_01]: Daniel Goldman again, with the emotional intelligence, he talks about the amygdala, which is the part of our brain that responds to stress.
42:50
[SPEAKER_01]: The Dix still fairly primitive, that bits of our brain have not really evolved since the end of the time.
42:58
[SPEAKER_01]: And so,
43:00
[SPEAKER_01]: It still reacts to an email that we find triggering in the same way would have reacted to a saboteu tiger, which is not really very helpful in today's world.
43:14
[SPEAKER_01]: And so he said, you know, the amygdala, if you think of it as a set of traffic lights, it is meant to be on either red or green.
43:22
[SPEAKER_01]: It's meant to be on red if there is extreme danger and it needs to, you need to deal with that situation.
43:29
[SPEAKER_01]: The rest of the time it should be on green, it should not even be our operating, but he said in our world.
43:36
[SPEAKER_01]: so much of the time.
43:38
[SPEAKER_01]: It's hovering on number.
43:40
[SPEAKER_01]: So we only take something quite small to take it into a red.
43:45
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's why, again, meditation, mindfulness, building in the healthy habits that help our brain stay calm as well as our body.
43:54
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's really important.
43:56
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, man.
43:56
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like sometimes I would only see red and never green.
44:02
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just going back in time to when I was really like a bad boss.
44:07
[SPEAKER_00]: And had I just been conscious to it?
44:10
[SPEAKER_00]: I would have been, my life would have been a lot simpler.
44:14
[SPEAKER_00]: And what I've noticed now, because I think if I go outside, I wouldn't ever come back.
44:20
[SPEAKER_00]: That's why I don't even take a lunch, which is probably really bad, but I know if I leave, I'm just gonna be like, oh, it's really fun out there, I'm not gonna come back.
44:29
[SPEAKER_00]: So I usually don't move for lunch, and I just try to work through lunch, because if I slow down, it's hard for me to ramp back up, but I noticed that what works for me,
44:40
[SPEAKER_00]: is just taking a pause.
44:43
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't have to do anything special.
44:45
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just going to pause.
44:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I'm going to stop.
44:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, my team will remember, I'll be like, okay, it's time to numb your patient.
44:51
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'll be like,
44:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Can I just get three minutes to pause?
44:54
[SPEAKER_00]: And they're like, sure, Dr. Cherira had a schedule.
44:57
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm like, great, thanks.
44:58
[SPEAKER_00]: So I will, and now they're happy to give me that because I'm in a much better mood, much better mood.
45:05
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll have to say, my team is like, kind of loving me these days and I'm really happy about that because it took me a long time to figure out how I was supposed to show up.
45:16
[SPEAKER_00]: I would say that this year alone has been probably my best year at the office.
45:23
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's wonderful.
45:24
[SPEAKER_00]: That's wonderful.
45:25
[SPEAKER_00]: This personal discovery journey.
45:28
[SPEAKER_00]: I started it in 20 2018 is really when it started to be like a full-time job.
45:37
[SPEAKER_00]: That's seven years ago.
45:40
[SPEAKER_00]: Seven years ago.
45:42
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
45:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Takes a while.
45:44
[SPEAKER_01]: It just takes a while.
45:45
[SPEAKER_01]: And again, I remember, you know,
45:49
[SPEAKER_01]: I still feel this, and somebody said it seemed abusive, like they said, you know, just when you think you've got to the top of the mountain then another peak appears that you were as, oh, I've got more learning to do.
46:02
[SPEAKER_01]: So it isn't something that ever stops, I think.
46:04
[SPEAKER_01]: And what a whole is that we can also find joy along the way that, you know, we are peeling
46:18
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
46:19
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you shared when you, you know, you gave me your bio and all the things and you have this quote.
46:26
[SPEAKER_00]: that when I read it, I felt so connected to you.
46:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Do you mind if I read it?
46:31
[SPEAKER_00]: Let me show a plane.
46:32
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, at least there.
46:33
[SPEAKER_00]: This is your personal philosophy of leadership change and transition.
46:38
[SPEAKER_00]: You say, I believe that we are all leaders in the making and understanding our own unique talents and honoring our personal evolution is an inherent part of the human experience.
46:48
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that.
46:50
[SPEAKER_00]: Leveraging our remark woke capacity for adaptability is not merely a survival mechanism but a pathway to fulfilling a higher purpose.
46:59
[SPEAKER_00]: I approach the transition into the best leaders we can be by balancing empathy,
47:03
[SPEAKER_00]: with the challenge to stretch.
47:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Understanding that each person's transition timeline is unique in that resistance often masks deeper fears are losses that deserve acknowledgment.
47:15
[SPEAKER_00]: By creating space for people to process their own individual path, encouraging their quest for growth and gradually embrace new possibilities, I believe we can help others and ourselves move into leadership in ways
47:28
[SPEAKER_00]: that not only preserve our authenticity, but elevate it and allowing us to grow toward our fullest potential and contribute meaningfully to something greater than ourselves.
47:40
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
47:43
[SPEAKER_00]: So resonate with that, so much.
47:46
[SPEAKER_00]: It is so deep, it is so beautiful.
47:48
[SPEAKER_00]: And...
47:50
[SPEAKER_00]: It is my hope and desire for everyone to be able to find themselves and become the leader that they truly truly want to be and I'm so happy that you are there to help people in that role for themselves.
48:11
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, one last question.
48:13
[SPEAKER_00]: In the spirit of the University of Y, when you look at your own journey, what feels like your deeper Y behind helping people grow into the most authentic impactful leaders they can be.
48:23
[SPEAKER_01]: My deep why is that I look around.
48:29
[SPEAKER_01]: I believe that we need leaders who can be the best that they can be to help move our world forward.
48:37
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's a side to forward.
48:38
[SPEAKER_01]: And we look around and sometimes you can, you know, you could watch the nightly news and you can just think, ah, it's all going wrong.
48:46
[SPEAKER_01]: But actually, I believe that with one person at a time, one leader at a time,
48:52
[SPEAKER_01]: doing the best they can be and the best that they can be.
48:55
[SPEAKER_01]: We change things for good.
48:58
[SPEAKER_01]: That is my date.
48:59
[SPEAKER_01]: That is my date for why.
49:00
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the thing that gets me out of bed in a morning.
49:04
[SPEAKER_00]: So beautiful.
49:05
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's okay if you're two.
49:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Half a percent better tomorrow than you aren't in your age.
49:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
49:11
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
49:12
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
49:12
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, thank you, Lois.
49:13
[SPEAKER_00]: I want to make sure everyone listening
49:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Tell us how you can support somebody who's maybe listening to us today.
49:26
[SPEAKER_00]: What do you have cook in in your kitchen that I can maybe support a budding leader?
49:31
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, well, I would thank you for mentioning in early.
49:34
[SPEAKER_01]: I would love people to check out the podcast.
49:37
[SPEAKER_01]: she said it's leadership horizons, it's on all the platforms so please check that out and I always started it in February this year but it's done so well and we are now into 37 countries which it blows my mind so I would love people to check that out and
49:57
[SPEAKER_01]: We will have coming up in April, we will have a new cohort of my leading with resilience program, which I'm really passionate about, which is to help people in all the ways we've been talking about, to develop their own resilience and to help that be sustainable, give them sustainable strategies.
50:20
[SPEAKER_01]: So, if you go to my website, which is www.loisbuttononline.com, you'll see the the the pre-insamation there and you can you can download a resilient audit that you can that you can do for yourself in your team and if you're happy to be on our email list you will get the information as that comes out those are the things.
50:45
[SPEAKER_01]: So, thank you.
50:46
[SPEAKER_00]: Perfect.
50:46
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you so much for being here today.
50:49
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you for bringing your gifts to this world.
50:51
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you for your positive outlook and I look forward to seeing you again really soon.
50:58
[SPEAKER_01]: Me too.
50:59
[SPEAKER_01]: And thank you for having me, Sonia.
51:00
[SPEAKER_01]: It's been a joy.
51:02
[SPEAKER_01]: It's been a joy and right back at you with all of those things.
51:05
[SPEAKER_01]: I love your passion and the way that you're honoring your own journey and that of your team.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So thank you.
51:12
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
51:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you so much for tuning into the University of Y.
51:17
[SPEAKER_00]: The podcast that's meant to be a reflection of you.
51:20
[SPEAKER_00]: I hope today's episode inspired you to think a little more deeply about who you are and realign with your own Y and take steps towards creating the life you've always dreamed up.
51:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't forget to subscribe or share your thoughts by just leaving a simple review and follow me
51:34
[SPEAKER_00]: on social media for further insights on leadership, finding fulfillment in your work, family, and community.
51:40
[SPEAKER_00]: Until next time, keep pursuing your purpose with passion.