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Plato Knew It All Along - Teachers, Transmission & Trustworthy Impact · The Conscious Classroom

• 0:10
  Amy: Welcome to the Conscious Classroom podcast, where we're exploring tools and perspectives that support educators and anyone who works with teens to create more conscious, supportive and enriching learning environments.
• 0:22
  Amy: I'm your host, amy Edelstein, and I'll be sharing transformative insights and easy-to-implement classroom supports that are all drawn from mindful awareness and systems thinking.
• 0:32
  Amy: The themes we'll discuss are designed to improve your own joy and fulfillment in your work and increase your impact on the world we share.
• 0:40
  Amy: Let's get on with this next episode.
• 0:50
  Amy: Hello, my name is Amy Edelstein.
• 0:57
  Amy: Welcome to this episode of the Conscious Classroom.
• 1:01
  Amy: I'd like to start with an interesting quote from Plato, and it'll illuminate, in the very direct and fun way that Plato has, what we're going to talk about today and why it's so important and often overlooked in education.
• 1:27
  Amy: So this is a quote from Plato's Republic, from the sixth book, and in this dialogue they're discussing what qualities a good teacher or ruler should have.
• 1:56
  Amy: So Socrates starts his argument and he says is it clear whether the guardian who is to keep watch over anything ought to be blind or keen of sight?
• 2:10
  Amy: Glaucon says of course it is clear, and Socrates goes on.
• 2:17
  Amy: Do you think, then, that there's any appreciable difference between the blind and those who are veritably deprived of the knowledge of the veritable being of things, those who have no vivid pattern in their souls and so cannot, as painters look to their models, fix their eyes on the absolute truth and, always with reference to that ideal and in the exactest possible contemplation of it, establish in this world the laws of the beautiful, the just and the good when it is needful, or guard and preserve those that are established.
• 2:52
  Amy: Glaucon says no, by heaven there's not much difference, socrates says.
• 3:00
  Amy: Shall we then appoint these blind souls as our guardians, rather than those who've learned to know the ideal reality of things and who do not fall short of the others in experience and are not second to them in any part of virtue?
• 3:17
  Amy: Glaucon, of course, answers it would be strange indeed to choose others than the philosophers, provided that they were not deficient in other respects, for this very knowledge.
• 3:32
  Amy: So if the translation from the Greek is a little stilted and a little hard to understand, in this passage Plato is making clear that if you want somebody to guard something precious, you want them to be keen of sight.
• 3:48
  Amy: No point in having a blind guard protecting something that's most important to you, and if you want someone who is of keen sight to guard your most precious things keen sight to guard your most precious things, then of course you want somebody who is of keen sight in the ways of virtue, of the good, the true and the beautiful, in order to rule, in order to teach and in order to serve as role models for their students.
• 4:27
  Amy: So, way back in the time of the Republic, plato is making the case for teachers and politicians, rulers, as exemplars of virtue.
• 4:45
  Amy: So in the conscious classroom, I often speak about the role that teachers play as one of a role model being the most important, more important than just teaching a subject matter.
• 5:05
  Amy: And it's for this very reason that when we want somebody to shape and guide our young people, then it's essential that that teacher be an exemplar, a role model, because what happens between teacher and student is more than just the learning of facts.
• 5:33
  Amy: It is also the absorption of the teacher's quality of being, and the younger the students, the more impressionable they are.
• 5:46
  Amy: But I would argue that adolescents are looking in fact more closely to their educators to be role models of direction, meaning, purpose, joy, balance of a life well lived, fairness, equality, justice, compassion, connection.
• 6:09
  Amy: And when students don't have teachers who can connect with them on a human level.
• 6:16
  Amy: It exacerbates alienation, isolation and a sense of loneliness which is already endemic throughout adolescent life.
• 6:29
  Amy: One of the biggest ills facing young people today is that sense of loneliness, and loneliness, fortunately, is something that can be ameliorated by human connection.
• 6:46
  Amy: Schools are filled with human beings and our classrooms need to be filled with human connection.
• 6:52
  Amy: You can stuff a classroom full of people, but unless you have people who are keen of sight, as Plato was saying, unless we have these moral exemplars who are developed in character and ethical behavior and who can teach that to others, then students will feel that loneliness in the midst of other people and I think this role of role model is something that is similar.
• 7:38
  Amy: So let's think about the word transmission and let's think about how it applies in the educational space.
• 7:46
  Amy: Transmission, when it's coupled with a spiritual context, often means directly imparting knowledge or wisdom or illumination from one to another, and it's not just a transfer of book knowledge but a transfer of a living connection, and that living connection can inspire and motivate and transform the recipient when we think about the transfer of secular ethics and values and a hierarchy of goodness, of order and care and concern for the well-being of others that teachers impart quite specifically at young ages, when they teach their grade school students how to wait for others, how to share, how to listen, how to be kind, how to express themselves, how to accept disappointment.
• 9:01
  Amy: And while this gets more and more subtle, the older the students get and deeper and deeper, this role of imparting what's valuable to students remains an essential element of education.
• 9:20
  Amy: And so what are the elements of transmission and what are the parallels between, when we think of transmission in other contexts, with a structured secular education container like a public school?
• 9:38
  Amy: Transmission is all about a personal, immediate experience.
• 9:48
  Amy: It's about understanding the nature of things and how life and reality works firsthand.
• 9:58
  Amy: So you can read Plato, but when you grasp the meaning, as if you were sitting and discussing with Socrates that you were taking in these questions and considering the examples and considering their veracity on your own, so that it really lands and the light bulb goes off.
• 10:29
  Amy: That's that direct experience.
• 10:31
  Amy: When we think about transmission, we're also often thinking about the very close and personal relationship that a guide or a teacher or a mentor has.
• 10:50
  Amy: One of the things that seems to be missing more and more is that adult mentorship of young people, partly because in postmodern culture adults seem unwilling and reluctant to take responsibility for themselves as adult human beings, wanting optionality to opt out, to be a mess, to not show up up.
• 11:28
  Amy: Now, being honest and vulnerable about one's shortcomings, as Brene Brown, the psychologist, articulates so poignantly, is humility.
• 11:39
  Amy: Abdicating responsibility is never a quality of a good leader or teacher, and so I think in teachers, as educators, we would be well served by taking Brene Brown's advice and learning the difference between vulnerability and humility and abdication of responsibility, oversharing, being irresponsible, wanting somebody else to pick up the pieces.
• 12:08
  Amy: So we're not at all advocating that, but what we're advocating, we think about that humility and courage and vulnerability that a teacher can have, and courage and vulnerability that a teacher can have.
• 12:27
  Amy: Guiding a student to be open, innocent, curious about life, curious about the people around them, is something that our young people need examples of today and being willing to recognize that, like it or not, especially when there is an age difference or a status differential, there's a big difference between being a student and being a teacher.
• 12:55
  Amy: Students are going to absorb from us, they are going to receive transmission.
• 13:01
  Amy: So let's not make it a muddy one, let's make it a clear one and, in order to be clear, have a clear transmission, a clear imprint, a clear impact on our students.
• 13:15
  Amy: We need to embody what we want our students to learn Now.
• 13:24
  Amy: Oftentimes teachers are so overwhelmed, tired, beleaguered, that they think it's too much to embody.
• 13:36
  Amy: One more thing.
• 13:36
  Amy: But what I'm saying here is that the most important thing is to really live one's life in the present tense, fully now being present, giving life full attention, being available, noticing.
• 14:05
  Amy: Being available, noticing, and that brings us joy as people, as teachers, as educators, and it brings our young people joy as well.
• 14:19
  Amy: My fifth grade teacher, mrs McVeigh, was one of those teachers who had transmission.
• 14:28
  Amy: She set my heart on fire and touched me in a way that set my life on a path, and I don't know what would have catalyzed my own love of writing and listening and interpreting and reflecting had it not been her.
• 15:01
  Amy: I suspect that something else might have taken that place.
• 15:06
  Amy: But in that fifth grade class at Linden Elementary School on South Linden Avenue in Pittsburgh, pennsylvania, is where my fifth grade teacher, mrs McVeigh, had that transmission.
• 15:23
  Amy: I don't know if she did that for other people, but she certainly did it for me.
• 15:29
  Amy: You know she had short, short brown hair, cut above her shoulders in a good, kindly schoolteacher cut.
• 15:43
  Amy: She was a little bit round, not heavy, just round like a mom or a huggable person, and I adored her.
• 15:59
  Amy: She had us constantly creating stories.
• 16:04
  Amy: She had us constantly creating stories, writing our observations Science was always about creation and writing and she would display our projects on the bulletin board so you could read everybody's stories and all I remember about being in her room was that it was there that the world of ideas took multiple dimensions for me, that they became stories that you could write, and stories were not two-dimensional things with lines of pencil neatly written between the lines, with the lowercase letters carefully touching the dotted lines and the uppercase letters carefully meeting the top and bottom straight lines on those little printed pages.
• 17:10
  Amy: It's where stories took on life and dialogue and wisdom beyond what I knew.
• 17:20
  Amy: Things were flowing out of my pencil that were more than what I had thought and they created something.
• 17:32
  Amy: And they created something and that love of something coming into being through me, that was me and more than me, that was my idea, were my ideas, and more than my ideas happened in her class.
• 17:53
  Amy: So you could say it was an alchemy of sorts.
• 17:57
  Amy: You could say that it was some mysterious medieval element turning the dross of powder into gold.
• 18:08
  Amy: You could say it was her interest or her heart that encouraged me.
• 18:16
  Amy: You could say that it was her consciousness, but I'm not even sure that she knew how deeply she affected me.
• 18:24
  Amy: All I knew is I knew and it was real, and it catapulted me into a life of ideas and writing and learning and discovery that has shaped my entire next 50 years.
• 18:45
  Amy: It's a long time.
• 18:49
  Amy: When I went to grade school, teachers were not personal with students.
• 18:55
  Amy: They very much were a role and a figure, and I never really knew that Mrs McVeigh had a life outside of school.
• 19:03
  Amy: All I knew about her was she was in that class when I walked in and she stayed in that class when I walked out and it was as if my 11-year-old brain never really contemplated that she would go home to a family and a house, just like my mom went home to a family and a house.
• 19:26
  Amy: One Christmas that year or the next year, actually, she wasn't in school.
• 19:37
  Amy: I'd heard that she was sick, but I didn't really understand what that meant and I asked my mom if she would take me to see her and I created a beautiful story for her on colored paper, carefully written in my best handwriting with illustrations and decorations.
• 20:07
  Amy: And we drove to her house on this warm but wintry night and knocked on a knocker on her door and, lo and behold, the door opened up and there was my teacher, not in her room, not in lyndon school, but in a house, like a regular house, like a house that I lived in, and I told her that I had brought her a story and I wanted her to have this story, and I don't know what else I said to her.
• 20:43
  Amy: I know she listened.
• 20:45
  Amy: I know she looked down at me.
• 20:46
  Amy: I know she smiled.
• 20:48
  Amy: I know she took my gift and offering as carefully as if it was the most delicate cloisonne artifact from the finest jewelers of Vienna.
• 21:06
  Amy: And there she was and she took it and somehow the conversation ended.
• 21:14
  Amy: We said goodbye and I never saw Mrs McVeigh again.
• 21:19
  Amy: I don't know if she went back to school, I don't know how many more years she taught or how many more students she taught, but when I think about her, I think about her transmission of safety, security, welcome, love, value, interest.
• 21:45
  Amy: I felt like a full person with her, not a child.
• 21:51
  Amy: I felt like I had ideas that were relevant and important to express.
• 22:00
  Amy: So when I think about the role of teachers in a conscious classroom and an education of the future.
• 22:14
  Amy: In a conscious classroom and an education of the future.
• 22:18
  Amy: I know that as we move more and more into a digital age, the human role model, the human factor of classroom teachers becomes elevated.
• 22:30
  Amy: Their behavior, their values, their attitudes, motivate and inspire.
• 22:38
  Amy: The way they think and listen, affect how young people will think and listen and what they'll value in thinking and listening.
• 22:59
  Amy: Now, I'm not saying that mixing agendas in a classroom is what's needed, is what's needed.
• 23:12
  Amy: I'm saying that this cultivation of wisdom and virtue, of what Plato referred to as the good and the true and the beautiful, is what's needed to shine through.
• 23:26
  Amy: That's what makes a true mentorship.
• 23:29
  Amy: That's what makes a teacher be more, far, far more valuable than the smartest large language model artificial intelligence could ever be.
• 23:48
  Amy: That trusting and respectful and personal connection is part of the teacher's transmission, where students feel that they're important, they feel that they matter and they feel that they belong.
• 24:15
  Amy: And, just like Socrates demonstrated to Plato, questioning critical thinking, making sure to go step by step, by step, so students can absorb the meaning simply like if Socrates had said students can absorb the meaning Simply, like if Socrates had said oh yes, we need rulers who are philosopher kings and who can see clearly, and that's essential.
• 24:46
  Amy: You know, plato or Glaucon could have said of course makes sense to me sounds good.
• 24:52
  Amy: But because the dialogue moved and built carefully, carefully, carefully, from the absurd.
• 25:02
  Amy: Would you want a sentry, a guardsman, who was blind, or would you want one who was keen of sight and builds, and builds, and builds, so that you take a teacher, a good teacher, a role model teacher, a teacher who wants to transmit intelligence to their students, will take their students through a journey of critical thinking where they really discern their own answers to the question, coming at a final conclusion through their own logic and feeling.
• 25:42
  Amy: So, as we think about how we're going to teach and as we have time in our summer vacation to reflect, let's really allow ourselves to drop deep into our own being, to settle into the heart of what's most important, to allow ourselves to teach at the edge of what we know is most valuable.
• 26:15
  Amy: That, in the end, is what's going to change lives.
• 26:20
  Amy: That, in the end, is going to be what will make us become the Mrs McVeigh's for our students.
• 26:32
  Amy: Let's close this episode of the Conscious Classroom with a short mindfulness practice, a meditation on value and meaning and purpose.
• 26:46
  Amy: So if you're driving, of course, please hold this for later.
• 26:52
  Amy: Of course, please hold this for later.
• 26:56
  Amy: Allow yourself to come into a focused and calm posture where you allow the world outside to settle, you allow the drumbeat of activity to fade into the distance, like a marching band moving on to the next block.
• 27:22
  Amy: And as the drumbeat of activity fades into the distance, allow the drumbeat of your heart to come closer to the surface of yourself, Feeling in each pulse of your heart the warmth and energy flowing through your body.
• 27:54
  Amy: Imagine any blockages and limitations melting and picture the flow of that hard energy, just like the flow of your physical energy, the oxygenated blood, the freshness, the liveliness to animate your whole being.
• 28:26
  Amy: Imagine each of your cells waking up, filling your cells waking up, filling with this energy and light and love.
• 28:45
  Amy: Imagine your whole body resonant, glowing.
• 28:58
  Amy: And imagine, in this focus on your own vitality, on the pulse of your heart, that all of the tiredness and staleness washes away and your cells come alive with vitality and elasticity, nourished and healed with the love that is the essential current of life.
• 29:44
  Amy: Let your attention focus on your breath and on that vitality.
• 29:59
  Amy: And on that vitality, allow a smile to spread across your face and imagine that each of your cells were like raindrops, dewdrops reflecting that smile all throughout your body.
• 30:19
  Amy: Take a last deep breath in and deep breath out and take with you the sense that who you are and the pulse of your heart and the vitality of your love is the most important thing to make your classroom a truly conscious one.
• 31:04
  Amy: Thank you for listening to the Conscious Classroom.
• 31:06
  Amy: I'm your host, amy Edelstein.
• 31:12
  Amy: Please check out the show notes on www.
• 31:14
  Amy: innerstrengtheducation.
• 31:15
  Amy: org for links and more information and if you enjoyed this podcast, please share it with a friend and pass the love on.