Latest / The Women Behind the WOW / The Shortest Retirement Ever! Running a Business with Your Wife Toddler Sense Cardiff East
Transcript
- Lee Whitwell: Welcome to Women Behind the Well, I'm Lee Whitwell and today I'm chatting with Lisa and Dawn. They ran Toddlersense in Cardiff East and they run it together. Lisa and Dawn are actually married couple. So not only do they share their lives, but they share a business too. They also have grandparent duties to juggle. So I'm really interested to hear how they make it all work. What it's like running a business together. and whether they ever managed to switch off work. I'm really looking forward to getting to know them both. So let's get into it. Hello. Lisa & Dawn: Bye. Lee Whitwell: The first question is, so if a customer comes to your door for the very first time, they don't know anything about what you do, what do you do? Lisa & Dawn: we do? That's a good question. So our classes are very adventurous so a child would walk through our doors and they would go straight into our adventure play area which looks amazing when you walk through the door. So it's like a huge soft play and it's award-winning and the the toddler will come straight in, off, and jump straight on. There's no waiting with us, we know toddlers don't do waiting very well. There's no structured activity to start with, it's very much... shoes off, get in and get active straight away. Burn that energy off. Yeah, that endless energy. Some toddlers, they just take a little bit more time to adjust and so that's fine. They just stay with their mermen. We just let them settle in. don't, you know, jump on them straight away or take that big jump on them out. So yeah, and then they just come in happy and just have fun and get burn that energy off all over the soft play. So that's the 30 minutes. And then we, and then once they kind of settled and they've had like to explore and be independent and crawl, bounce, jump. run, whatever they need to do. Then we do our tidy up song, which they play and they absolutely love and the parents are all amazed that they're actually tidying up like this in class. They ask if we can play it at home, see if it has the same effect, not always it does. And then we do our structured activities then. So then it becomes a bit more adult focus, adult led. But yeah, it's amazing. We love the classes. We love what we do and it's just fun to be part of. So they don't have to join in the activities. if they don't want to. Some, like I said earlier, some take a little bit time just to come around. They just like to sit back and observe with their adults. Some just live to run around the mats and that's fine as well. We always say to the parents, let them be them. You know, if they're happy to join in, that's great, but it can take three weeks for them to settle in and then come to the mats and join in activities with us. Some are just very keen to just join in the activities straight away. Every toddler is different. We get them. yeah. Lee Whitwell: I think as well, think, in creating that environment for, well, so parents feel really, really comfortable and Lisa & Dawn: Hmm. Lee Whitwell: relaxed, then, because, yeah, every child, every adult is different, isn't it? So they need different things. Yeah. So, I'm sorry. Lisa & Dawn: Definitely, yeah. Yeah. And also on the AP, when we do the 30 minutes on our adventure play when they came, when they first come in, we try and go round to introduce ourselves to the parents and, ask them a little bit about themselves, if they feel happy too. And just find out a little bit more, just try and help that build that relationship up a little bit more with the parents as well and the adults. Lee Whitwell: So how long have you been doing this? Actually, yeah, how long have you been doing it? How? Why? Lisa & Dawn: Well our first year anniversary is coming up now on November the 7th so it's just under a year now, 11 and a half months is it. So we were both in education in schools and I left after 20 years because the girls, our daughters were both having babies together. So I wanted to be around with them that much more. So I took very early retirement. then Lee Whitwell: nice. Lisa & Dawn: you had to learn, it just wasn't the same anymore teaching or anything. So Dawn decided to leave as well a few months after. And then you still needed to have a little part-time job so my daughter knew. So our daughter Chloe saw this advertisement on social media advertising Toddler Sense. So we went to Swansea, looked at a couple of classes up there and thought that is for us. was absolutely amazing. Just what we wanted. The best parts of teaching without the the politely the kind of red tape and the know the prep you have to do at home and things and yeah it's just what we loved about teaching without the yeah so I came out of it don't drag me out to retirement it was the shortest retirement ever to do a partnership so so it's three days so we still got we still have the grandchildren three days and then three days Toddler Sense Lee Whitwell: you do it so you run it together nice Lisa & Dawn: Yes. Lee Whitwell: really nice Lisa & Dawn: not sure who's the boss, not sure. So for 20 years, when we were in education, I was Lisa's line manager at the time. So I think it's roles are reversed a little bit now. we're... Well, you're the boss of the social media. You take control of that. I take control of all the admin and the bookings and the bookkeeping. So yeah, we've got our roles. So it all works out well. Yeah, and we're still married. Lee Whitwell: I was going to say, how does it work? You what? Sorry. Lisa & Dawn: still married at the moment which is great when you're in! Lee Whitwell: you're spending life together but you're also is there any downtime is then ever not speaking about business Lisa & Dawn: Well, it's either the business, the grandchildren, the dogs, or we got a camper van, so we do get some time away and we just like we head off down to West Wales and things and just have some time time. But yeah, we. Life is crazy busy, but it's the best. The best, crazy busy. We do take Todd the Toddler Sense mascot with us on our camp profile and we're always taking photos for our social media. he is always with us, work side is with us. is. Toddler Sense is always on the go with us. Yeah. But we love it. Yeah. Lee Whitwell: So, nearly a year's anniversary. So you say, that it's different work, isn't it? You're just saying about the teaching. there's Lisa & Dawn: Yeah. Lee Whitwell: still a lot. So did you start from scratch or did you buy a business? Lisa & Dawn: We started from scratch, so it was a brand new territory. And with Amy, our franchise, who has just been the absolute best, we wouldn't be here without Lee Whitwell: is the best. Lisa & Dawn: her. We lucked out there. Yes, we started from scratch and we had Amy by our side through every step of the business because it's huge for us. So we felt confident with the... the children part of it, teaching if you like. the parents. Yeah, but the whole business set up for us was alien, you know, it was just, and that was our kind of worry if you like, but they say we've been so, so well supported with Amy that she's been there every step of the way with us. Lee Whitwell: What has been the shock in taking on a business? What things did you never think were part of running a business? Lisa & Dawn: I think it's just that the constant of it. So because we run term by term, I suppose it's the advertising is ongoing, the marketing is ongoing. And luckily, we're getting out there with word of mouth now. So, you know, families are able to refer to different friends and things. But I think it's just the sheer amount of kind of doing it all the time. You know, it's yeah, it's. It's just, yeah. It is the social media is ongoing, but we're trying to make that as as fun as we can. Like sometimes we video ourselves and put ourselves out there. So even though it is constantly the social media, it is also the fun side of it as well. because they were doing it for us, it doesn't feel like work. So. it's our business. We're invested. We, you know, we're passionate about what we do. So it, it almost feels a bit of a hobby as well as work, if that makes sense. I don't think we've ever, I think that's the first time we've called it work. We never say, we got work tomorrow. always say we've got Toddler Sense tomorrow. Cause it just really doesn't feel like work. Cause it's just fun and energetic and it just makes you smile and yeah. we're doing it together. We used Lee Whitwell: Yeah Lisa & Dawn: to drive to work back in the day and say, we used to phone each other because obviously we were in the same school place and we'd say, what can we do? Let's just try and have a business together. can we do? What can we do? So this really is a dream come true for us. As corny as that sounds, it's the truth. Yeah. Lee Whitwell: It's gorgeous, though it sounds gorgeous. I just think it is a joyous job and I Lisa & Dawn: It is, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Lee Whitwell: And I had gone from the corporate world, where really, what was ever one of those, what was a thank you, what was a, to literally every day looking around and knowing that you're doing a good thing, and having parents telling you, how much they're enjoying what you're doing. So I think it's, it is a joyous, it's joyous job. Lisa & Dawn: Yeah. It is without a doubt. is and even, know, most weeks parents will say to us, they woke up today and they're singing How Do You Do? That's the welcome song we sing, How Do You Do? They tap their rhythm sticks and we got their tod. And they say, they woke up this morning, they're singing How Do You Do? Or you've brainwashed my child. And that's all they want to do is sing How Do You Do? take, they take Todd Lee Whitwell: Yeah. Lisa & Dawn: on holidays, send us videos. And it's just, you just can't help smiling when, you're doing it. it's, yeah. Lee Whitwell: Yes. Lisa & Dawn: It's a feel good job. Yeah. Absolutely is. I know. Yeah. And we've loved the Lee Whitwell: So you're only halfway through the plans. You've got two years worth of plans. Lisa & Dawn: plans. Like they just, mean, obviously. know the amount of research and expertise has gone into creating the Toddler Sense plans is off the scale because obviously Dr. Linda is just incredible at what she does, what she did back you know when she was doing it herself but the plans are just written so well and they just are so suited for toddlers you know you can see the reasons why the plans are in place and what they're there to do and every week we're like this is our favorite and then next week we're like no, this is our favourite now, so we just keep going. There's been one or two, I'll be honest, I've said to Amy or Amy I'm not feeling this plan this week, trust the plan, trust it. Lee Whitwell: Yeah. Lisa & Dawn: That's motto. Amy, I love that plan, I loved it. She's like I told you so. Lee Whitwell: with all the programs actually so yeah so Baby Sensory, all of them you look at it our role is to bring it off the paper but you look at it and you think no but yeah and I think it's it's the simple things as well isn't it that they work Lisa & Dawn: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, they do. really do. Because tried and tested, definitely. Yeah, we've learnt now, trust the plan. That's We're not feeling it. Trust the plan. And then we're loving it. Lee Whitwell: Yes. So, Toddler Sense I know is going now into nurseries. I think it sounds like you've got your three days. So that's what you want because you've got your grandchildren. But are you thinking Lisa & Dawn: Yeah. Lee Whitwell: that you might go into nurseries? Are you thinking, would you think of taking on anyone else to do that? Or, or is it you're just, this is what we want. This is where we want to be. Lisa & Dawn: I think to start we were kind of and again this is with Amy we talked through our know the bigger picture is there are plans in terms of you know hopefully kind of having a permanent venue in time and you know we were brand new in Cardiff so we wanted to establish ourselves and you know we're really proud of where we've come from so far from zero customers up to you know we've got we're running two four six six classes a week you know and they're well attended so Never say never. Lisa's going to kill me now because she's come out of retirement for this. So she's probably nudging me going, what are you saying? What are you me into now? But yeah, I mean, think because you're so passionate about the program, I'd love to get into nurseries. know, coming from a reception teacher background and Lisa working in nursery for years and that early years passion, you know, if it was up to me, every child would have to come to Toddler Sense because the skills they develop for preschool. you know, just a foundation is just brilliant. I think if every reception teacher could see or nursery teacher what's happening in Toddler Sense and they come with those skillset, you know, they're going to start primary school with such a good footing. It's the confidence they build up as well. They build up so much confidence in that and like say, independent skills and you know, we taught, I I taught four or five year olds and a tidy up time. know, the toddlers got nothing on them. Toddlers, they were just, so like these are talking like one and a half, two year olds, putting resources away, getting resources out independently. It just blew us away, didn't it? is, yeah. And as soon as they hear that music, that split second to the tidy up song, they're off. They're there. And even before we're singing the last verse of How Do You Do, they had to bring their ribbon sticks back over in the box. They're walking up to put their rhythm sticks back. It's incredible. It just teaches them so much. really does. And I'm Lee Whitwell: Yeah. Lisa & Dawn: not saying never for nurseries. was in nursery for 20 years. You were in reception. But maybe when the grandchildren are in nursery themselves, you've got a little bit more time then. But yeah, I would love to get in there as well. Who knows? Who knows? Lee Whitwell: Yeah, who knows? You mentioned a WOW centre. I've got a WOW centre. So we've got a centre. Lisa & Dawn: have you? So I just think that's so special having somewhere where you're kind of, you know, that's your base and parents know when they come to you and, you know, I just think it's, yeah. Lee Whitwell: especially if you're Toddler Sense, that's a lot of equipment. Lisa & Dawn: Yeah, it is. going down to a bit of an art now. So yeah, the camper van was bought Three four years ago even before we knew obviously about this and it's coming real handy in terms of the kit and things But we got a bit of a yeah We're timing ourselves and try and get a bit quicker each time with the kit and set up and stuff and so we take the camper van Don takes the camper van with all the adventure play equipment Which is the bigger ones and then I take the car then with all the resources needed for for that day So it's worked out well. We've got our own little niche. We've sorted the garage out, bought proper storage and the garage is just all neatly stacked labels with all the toddler center resources. We've had the attic boarded for seasonal Christmas, Easter, Mother's Day and all the seasonal activities. Everything has a place and if anything's out of place I'm in trouble for that. She really is, Yeah, to be fair, think we are a good team. Yeah, We are a good team. Yeah. Lee Whitwell: This is a good team you've got going on here. This is a good team. Yeah. So you said about social media. in terms of because social media is about that much, isn't it? Of, getting our customers, but it changes all the time. So had you had, mean, obviously, I'm sure I've been on Facebook and all those things, but in terms of advertising, had you done all that before? This is just a complete different. Lisa & Dawn: No, it's the same because coming from a school you had to keep yourself very private so we were never on Facebook. I was only on Facebook, we both were for the gym and that was all. So coming into this now you have to really get yourself out there. It just felt a bit strange in the beginning thinking, you know, we've got to ourselves out there, show our faces, our voices. So, and we didn't really have a clue what to do. So our daughters being up there with the IT, they taught us everything that we know on social media now. And also told us off when we were doing things that weren't appropriate for or on trend and things for social media. Yeah, it was a completely, completely different world for us what to do. And yeah, apart from the world of COVID and lockdown when I was teaching on a laptop and like, you know, doing that, but literally for us, wouldn't really kind of, yeah, it's, wouldn't put ourselves out there on social media. Now we love it. I can't get off it sometimes. come on. I'm always saying to Dawn, you've got to cut this video out to 30 seconds because nobody's going to listen to a 10 minute video of us Dawn. We're learning, still learning. we're not polished. Lee Whitwell: Do you know what, nowadays though, it shouldn't be polished. think nowadays in the world of AI, think now marketing, the best marketing is just talking at the camera and just being real and just, I think that's definitely the visibility, the buzzword, visibility, but it is about being real and visible out there, isn't it? And in your community. Lisa & Dawn: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. think we're very real and very real. a bit too real sometimes. a giggles on on there. Yeah we did go live once. We tried it live for the first time but we weren't planned live for an announcement. I think it was one of our terms coming up. was was a raffle for Tommy's charity we did. did the announcement of the raffle winners. we didn't realize obviously because we weren't very IT and social kind of media buffs but we could only go live on Instagram if we had more than a thousand followers. This is quite early in the day, we didn't, we have now, but we didn't at the time. So we were about to go live and luckily our daughter's with us because she didn't trust us with the live of social media. So we had to very quickly go live on Facebook which was... a bit of a fath and stuff. got on, we got because obviously we told our families, join us on, our first ever live on social media and things. We told the whole world. We did tell the whole world. And then, then we were live and there was little things coming up on the screen and we were going, hello, they're there. And our daughter was giving us like props of things, to say, cues, like enough. Lee Whitwell: Thank Lisa & Dawn: But yeah, it's all new to us. Yeah. So we're learning as we go along. Learning and loving it and laughing at our mistakes. Lee Whitwell: Have you had a favourite moment with one of your families or children? Lisa & Dawn: I got a funny moment from you. What's that? So it was our first ever class. Amy was there. It was the first, it was the launch class. What did I do? And Lisa got her hair stuck in a fan. So we had the fan blowing for the balloons and petals. And... So I was leading, because we take turns to lead the class, we do a bit of a double app, but I was leading it and I turned round and I just saw Lisa like this, with a fan. So I was like, what are you doing? She's like, I've got my hair stuck in the fan. thought, do I just stay here and hope nobody recognises me? Do I just carry on the class with Dawn with this fan stuck in my, do I hide behind the screen? And luckily Lee Whitwell: Ha ha. Lisa & Dawn: Beth, our daughter was there and she noticed and she just to yank my hair. I should have been a hair mixer from the... That was number one. Very first class. Yeah. No! It went to my Lee Whitwell: I like the idea of thinking you thinking well no one will notice I've got this massive band that I've just got an old ear. Lisa & Dawn: head. Just smelled burning and a bit of a... yeah. when it happens, go, what am going to do? am going to do? yeah. So... Lee Whitwell: How did you feel on your first class? Lisa & Dawn: so nervous. Nervous. So nervous. Very nervous. It was a surreal moment because even though... the parents had booked on, I think it was quite a full class, our very first class. And you know, I thinking, say nobody turns up, say nobody turns up, even though they paid, you're always anxious, say they don't turn up. And yeah, you've got the dry mouth, the, you know, the... And Amy was there as well, which we were, you know, obviously she's been amazing. We wanted to do it well, we wanted to do it right, and we wanted to... do all the things we've done in our training to try and make it, as best it can be. Do Amy proud as well, really. Yeah. But yeah, but after the first class, was like, I loved it. I loved it. Yeah. And we actually, for our opening, we bought ourselves balloons to say congratulations and pretended they were off people. I'm Lee Whitwell: What? Lisa & Dawn: not sure we should be admitting to this really, but. Lee Whitwell: Hopefully on your first anniversary you'll get an actual balloon from something. Lisa & Dawn: Hopefully. Well we'll buy some just in case. we're by each other. Hint. Please. Well it's Lee Whitwell: Well, know, share this interview with them, know, that they, they, and Dawn want a balloon on their anniversary of a year. Lisa & Dawn: on a Saturday, we're doing a class special for our anniversary. So they will know, they do know it's for our first anniversary. We will buy some just in case. Lee Whitwell: Any regrets? Lisa & Dawn: No. No, I think just regret not finding it sooner. know, if that's, you know, because the last couple years of teaching for me was not, you know, I'm so passionate about early years. All I wanted to do was teach and be with young children. And I just wish we'd got into this sooner. But no regrets on the business side. No, none at all. No, we're very... Very happy in life now. Very passionate about it. Naked, but happy. Lee Whitwell: you Lisa & Dawn: You can't be saying that because it might put people off if they ever want to do Toddler Sense or Baby Sensory. Yeah, but look how happy we are. We're tired. it's a happy tired. It is, yes. Lee Whitwell: Yeah, it's good knackered. mean, not even start running a business. is an emotional roller coaster. The programs are all very physical, and emotional roller coaster because we're so passionate, like you said, it doesn't feel like work, but we're so passionate about it. It is hard work, it's not easy. Lisa & Dawn: It is, yeah, no, it's not easy. It hasn't been an easy journey, but it's been made easier by the support that we've had. Yeah, and the passion we've got in it. And our experience, from teaching, but it's also been a steep learning curve in terms of like, tax accountants, know, companies house registrations, all those which we'd never, never thought of before. know, Chat GPT is coming very handy in terms of asking what things Lee Whitwell: Thank Lisa & Dawn: mean and what you our name has been on speed dial a lot. But she's still on speed dial. She probably looks at us and thinks, it's those two again. I think that the really worrying thing that we were afraid of because When you go to Baby Sensory, just, a lot of them, sleep, don't they? They, they just sleep anywhere. They don't have their certain nap times. And we were thinking, because we obviously we got the grandchildren and they were the perfect age, like with the nap times as well. And we were trying to work the classes out with the nap times. well, you can't have it there because that's probably banging with the toddlers' nap times. So that was really, really worrying. And we did have an afternoon class, 12.30, and we had to cut that. because it just wasn't working with the nap times. And so that was really worrying thinking, but. It's and error, I having that confidence, which we didn't at the time. And again, was Amy with us, but to try things. If they don't work, pull it back. and we wanted to go in all guns blazing, every class full, and be at the top of our game. She probably thinking, you nutters. And the game you put us now with. pulled out of trucks a then. Just be little bit realistic, she said. But yeah, it's having the confidence to... Yeah, it is. Lee Whitwell: It takes time to build a business. It takes time and it takes a lot of resilience and it takes, and like you say, the marketing is constant. you've, mean, Baby Sensory, you, what, 13 months of a customer, you've got three years of a customer, but it's constantly, constantly getting new customers in, isn't it? I think that is the, you can't sit at any point on your. Lisa & Dawn: Yeah. Yeah. No, no. Anyway. Lee Whitwell: you're Laurels, is that really? Laurels, what's a Laurel? What's a Laurel? Yeah, just on those. Lisa & Dawn: Especially when you the end of the term is coming then you can't well even before the peaks and troughs thinking we're full now and then we think about Got a few weeks to go and they said the new term starting so it's the almost a panic again of filling classes, isn't Yeah, it does Majority of them do book on again for the next term and then you know, they somebody's been with us now for for the year So they're just going off exploring something else now and they just had a new baby so their baby's going to go to Baby Sensory but the majority of them they do book back on don't they for the following term and so it is really lovely to welcome new parents in as well yes really lovely and yeah Lee Whitwell: And you're a brand new area, a brand new business. It just takes time and eventually, it works. So, I'd like to go to your classes just to watch you both. make me laugh. Lisa & Dawn: Yeah. come along. I'll certainly make you do that. We have got one of our parents who comes along and she said, if there's ever a day where my toddler is ill, can I just come along anyway, just for you two? We're like, it's fine, carry on. You get it, like, I'm at a certain age, well, we both are at a certain age, I get, I get like a mind. You menopause blocks don't you? then we're like... today it was Todd's birthday, his 10th birthday, the mascot and they had to, we had to dance around with streamers. No pom poms. And I couldn't think of the word pom poms so it's a good job we are together because I have to say to Dawn, what are they called? Like in front said they begin with a P. yeah, pom poms. I just get a mental block sometimes. So we're very natural, we don't... Yeah. Lee Whitwell: time. I hear you, I hear you. When I'm, when I'm, sharing with the, children some scientific method or scientific equipment, the equipment of pipette and I'll say what is this and a child will say squeezy thing and I can't think of anything other than squeezy thing. I know it's got a better word than that and I go, yeah, that's it. Lisa & Dawn: That is a good description. Yeah. I know. It's just... So yeah, if it for Dawn being there, I would... I wouldn't be able to name half the resources. I'd have a mental block on all of them. I think that's why the parents take to us a bit because we are very normal. There's no A's and Graces with us. We are what we are and you know we're very welcoming and love having you in the class but this is us and yeah we like to have a little joke and a giggle and yeah we don't take ourselves too seriously. Thank you. Lee Whitwell: Nice nice well it's been lovely chatting to you both. I'm to ask one more question if anybody was thinking about doing this umming and ahring could they do this what would you say? Lisa & Dawn: I would say go and observe a few classes, speak to the franchisor and just do it. It's scary but it's worth the risk and you certainly wouldn't regret it. There's more highs than lows. It's not easy but nothing worth having is easy so definitely give it a go and persevere and you will. You will get your gold at the end of the rainbow, I guess. You will. Lee Whitwell: What a great end.