Latest / Veterinary Ramblings / Ep 23: Rabbit Care & Sepsis Awareness with Jo Hinde RVN

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Ep 23: Rabbit Care & Sepsis Awareness with Jo Hinde RVN · Veterinary Ramblings

0:00
Mike Brampton: To all of you
0:00
Mike Brampton: joining us tonight or today or
0:03
Mike Brampton: in the morning, or to everybody
0:03
Mike Brampton: who is joining us all over the
0:06
Mike Brampton: world.
0:08
Mike Brampton: Welcome to the next episode of
0:08
Mike Brampton: Veterinary Ramblings.
0:11
Mike Brampton: So yes, start the show after
0:11
Mike Brampton: we've started rambling.
0:15
Julian Hoad: We've rambled for
0:15
Julian Hoad: about half an hour already,
0:17
Julian Hoad: folks, we're well into it.
0:19
Mike Brampton: Yeah, you can
0:19
Mike Brampton: bless your cotton socks, and
0:22
Mike Brampton: feel really grateful that the
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Mike Brampton: production team have cut it all.
0:26
Mike Brampton: So you just joined us at this
0:26
Mike Brampton: point in time.
0:28
Mike Brampton: So I'll raise a glass to our
0:28
Mike Brampton: production team, thank you very
0:30
Mike Brampton: much indeed, on behalf of all of
0:30
Mike Brampton: our listeners, having not had to
0:34
Mike Brampton: put up with the previous half an
0:34
Mike Brampton: hour.
0:46
Mike Brampton: So we've got a guest tonight
0:48
Julian Hoad: Yeah, yeah, really
0:48
Julian Hoad: excited about tonight's guest.
0:51
Julian Hoad: I know, I'm always excited about
0:51
Julian Hoad: our guests because they are
0:54
Julian Hoad: always brilliant.
0:56
Julian Hoad: But here is a guest who has
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Julian Hoad: literally come back from the
1:00
Julian Hoad: grave just to be on Veterinary
1:00
Julian Hoad: Ramblings
1:02
Mike Brampton: Indeed, indeed.
1:02
Mike Brampton: This particular guest was due to
1:06
Mike Brampton: be starring and recording stuff
1:06
Mike Brampton: for you all, I think it was
1:12
Mike Brampton: probably about 10 weeks ago.
1:15
Mike Brampton: And we'd got it all set up and
1:15
Mike Brampton: everything was ready to go. And
1:19
Mike Brampton: they just disappeared off the
1:19
Mike Brampton: scene completely.
1:22
Julian Hoad: We thought it was
1:22
Julian Hoad: something we'd said.
1:24
Mike Brampton: Well, I was sure
1:24
Mike Brampton: it was something you'd said
1:26
Julian Hoad: Usually, usually is
1:28
Mike Brampton: Usually would be,
1:28
Mike Brampton: but we will ask her more about
1:32
Mike Brampton: this.
1:33
Julian Hoad: We shall indeed.
1:34
Mike Brampton: A lady who
1:34
Mike Brampton: particularly likes fast cars,
1:38
Julian Hoad: and old men.
1:40
Mike Brampton: No old things,
1:41
Julian Hoad: old things, old
1:41
Julian Hoad: things,
1:42
Mike Brampton: Old things, I
1:42
Mike Brampton: don't think she likes old men.
1:46
Julian Hoad: I put my special
1:46
Julian Hoad: shirt on everything.
1:48
Mike Brampton: Well, I can see
1:48
Mike Brampton: that but never mind.
1:50
Mike Brampton: Yeah, lovely flowery shirt. Lots
1:50
Mike Brampton: of bright colours.
1:53
Julian Hoad: I'm wearing my
1:53
Julian Hoad: rabbit skin underpants because
1:56
Julian Hoad: she likes that, doesn't she?
1:59
Mike Brampton: I don't think Jo
1:59
Mike Brampton: would be very keen on that
2:01
Mike Brampton: because
2:02
Julian Hoad: Hold on, I'll look
2:02
Julian Hoad: at a bio.
2:04
Mike Brampton: Yeah, Jo is
2:04
Mike Brampton: particularly into animal
2:07
Mike Brampton: welfare.
2:08
Julian Hoad: She's a vegan.
2:08
Julian Hoad: Absolutely.
2:09
Mike Brampton: She's a vegan.
2:09
Mike Brampton: She's into animal welfare. She
2:12
Mike Brampton: has a strong interest in
2:12
Mike Brampton: rabbits.
2:15
Mike Brampton: And in fact, it was how I first
2:15
Mike Brampton: met her. I'd known about Jo for
2:18
Mike Brampton: a long time. But she invited me
2:18
Mike Brampton: to speak at the advanced rabbit
2:23
Mike Brampton: anaesthesia conference.
2:25
Mike Brampton: I did a couple of experiments,
2:25
Mike Brampton: including one on Dead Space live
2:31
Mike Brampton: to illustrate the importance of
2:31
Mike Brampton: dead space.
2:35
Mike Brampton: And what I did was nearly kill
2:35
Mike Brampton: my volunteer live onstage
2:40
Mike Brampton: demonstrating the importance and
2:40
Mike Brampton: the significance of dead space.
2:45
Mike Brampton: We'll ask her about that maybe.
2:49
Mike Brampton: I can see she's in the waiting
2:49
Mike Brampton: room
2:50
Julian Hoad: It's Jo Hinde
2:54
Mike Brampton: Ex president of
2:54
Mike Brampton: the BVNA.
2:57
Julian Hoad: Indeed
2:58
Mike Brampton: So let's get her
2:58
Mike Brampton: in. And heres Jo!
3:04
Julian Hoad: Jo!
3:06
Mike Brampton: Hi, Joe. How you
3:06
Mike Brampton: doing?
3:07
Jo Hinde: I'm good. Thank you,
3:07
Jo Hinde: you?
3:09
Mike Brampton: Excellent. Thank
3:09
Mike Brampton: you very much indeed. Julian and
3:12
Mike Brampton: I were just rambling on as we
3:12
Mike Brampton: want to do.
3:15
Julian Hoad: We do that.
3:17
Jo Hinde: Surely not
3:17
Mike Brampton: He said that
3:17
Mike Brampton: you're into old men.
3:20
Mike Brampton: I corrected him and said you're
3:20
Mike Brampton: into old things. That's the
3:25
Mike Brampton: Goodwood Festival of Speed and
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Mike Brampton: antiques and stuff that you
3:28
Mike Brampton: particularly enjoy is it not?
3:30
Jo Hinde: Yeah, absolutely.
3:30
Jo Hinde: It's, fast cars is the thing.
3:35
Jo Hinde: You may say fast men, but I'm
3:35
Jo Hinde: yet to catch any
3:38
Jo Hinde: But yeah, fast cars. So the
3:38
Jo Hinde: Goodwood Festival of Speed is,
3:43
Jo Hinde: it's a bit of a passion of mine.
3:43
Jo Hinde: I do enjoy going to that and
3:47
Jo Hinde: seeing that.
3:48
Julian Hoad: Are you a member?
3:49
Jo Hinde: I'm not a member. I
3:49
Jo Hinde: was actually on the waiting list
3:52
Jo Hinde: to be a member for four years to
3:52
Jo Hinde: join the GRRC. The Goodwood Road
3:58
Jo Hinde: Racing Club or whatever.
4:00
Jo Hinde: And then it came through at a
4:00
Jo Hinde: very inopportune time that I
4:05
Jo Hinde: made it to top of the list when
4:05
Jo Hinde: I could no longer play that game
4:07
Jo Hinde: anymore.
4:08
Jo Hinde: So unfortunately, not a member.
4:08
Jo Hinde: But nevermind.
4:13
Julian Hoad: I'm a member. I'll
4:13
Julian Hoad: sneak you in some time.
4:15
Jo Hinde: Oh, well, you would be
4:15
Jo Hinde: wouldn't you? It's not what you
4:19
Jo Hinde: know. It's who you know.
4:20
Julian Hoad: Absolutely.
4:23
Mike Brampton: For our American
4:23
Mike Brampton: viewers and listeners, the
4:27
Mike Brampton: Goodwood Festival of Speed is a
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Mike Brampton: aerodrome with a motor racing
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Mike Brampton: circuit running around the
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Mike Brampton: outside.
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Mike Brampton: And a good old stately home
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Mike Brampton: Goodwood house in the grounds
4:39
Mike Brampton: and every year, they put on two
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Mike Brampton: well, they do two main events
4:42
Mike Brampton: don't they?
4:45
Julian Hoad: There's the
4:45
Julian Hoad: revival, where you have to get
4:48
Julian Hoad: dressed up in ludicrously old
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Julian Hoad: clothes. So I just get whatevers
4:51
Julian Hoad: at the back of the wardrobe. My
4:51
Julian Hoad: 1930s collection.
4:56
Mike Brampton: Yeah, and then
4:56
Mike Brampton: there's the Festival of Speed
4:58
Mike Brampton: which is more of a racing
4:58
Mike Brampton: environment, is it not Jo?
5:02
Jo Hinde: it is. Yeah. So they
5:02
Jo Hinde: have a lot of different
5:04
Jo Hinde: paddocks. It is a very unique
5:04
Jo Hinde: event actually, because there's
5:09
Jo Hinde: very few red ropes and barriers.
5:13
Jo Hinde: So usually you can get right up
5:13
Jo Hinde: close to all of the cars,
5:16
Jo Hinde: there's f1 cars. There's
5:16
Jo Hinde: motorbikes. There's old things,
5:20
Jo Hinde: new things.
5:21
Jo Hinde: There's brand new supercar
5:21
Jo Hinde: paddock is where I hang out.
5:24
Jo Hinde: That's my favourite is in over
5:24
Jo Hinde: there, and all the drivers and a
5:28
Jo Hinde: lot of the owners as well
5:29
Jo Hinde: and it's a real kind of hands on
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Jo Hinde: event and there's an auction in
5:33
Jo Hinde: the house as well. Which is
5:33
Jo Hinde: really nice to attend the
5:36
Jo Hinde: auction and see some real prize
5:36
Jo Hinde: pieces going up for sale
5:41
Julian Hoad: And you've got to
5:41
Julian Hoad: be very careful to fold your
5:42
Julian Hoad: arms.
5:43
Jo Hinde: Yes, absolutely.
5:47
Jo Hinde: Have a scratch.
5:49
Mike Brampton: Have you got your
5:49
Mike Brampton: sights set on taking over from
5:53
Mike Brampton: supercar Blondie?
5:55
Jo Hinde: Oh, my goodness. I
5:55
Jo Hinde: mean, as if I could fill those
5:58
Jo Hinde: shoes. I don't have the
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Jo Hinde: dimensions. shall we say. to fit
6:04
Jo Hinde: that role.
6:07
Julian Hoad: What's your
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Julian Hoad: favourite car? If someone were
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Julian Hoad: to say look, here's a supercar
6:11
Jo Hinde: A Nissan GTR NISMO
6:11
Jo Hinde: edition that is my favourite.
6:15
Julian Hoad: I believe, maybe,
6:15
Julian Hoad: is it Jeremy Clarkson's or the
6:20
Julian Hoad: hamsters?
6:21
Jo Hinde: Oh, I don't know.
6:21
Jo Hinde: Actually. I don't know. I can't
6:25
Jo Hinde: imagine it would be Clarkson's
6:25
Jo Hinde: but he's not that keen on
6:28
Jo Hinde: Japanese is he?
6:30
Julian Hoad: Do you know i
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Julian Hoad: think, oddly enough, its James
6:33
Julian Hoad: Mays favourite.
6:35
Jo Hinde: Oh.
6:40
Jo Hinde: Thanks Julian right are we done
6:40
Jo Hinde: with this now.
6:42
Julian Hoad: Have you driven
6:42
Julian Hoad: one?
6:45
Jo Hinde: No, not yet. sat in a
6:45
Jo Hinde: few but not driven it. I'm late
6:49
Jo Hinde: to driving actually, I've only
6:49
Jo Hinde: been driving six years
6:51
Julian Hoad: Right
6:53
Jo Hinde: Yeah, yeah, I've
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Jo Hinde: always been chauffeured which
6:55
Jo Hinde: has been lovely. And I've not
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Jo Hinde: had to drive.
6:59
Julian Hoad: My favourite, my
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Julian Hoad: absolute favourite would be an E
7:01
Julian Hoad: type jag, now they are not as
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Julian Hoad: fast
7:04
Jo Hinde: Classy
7:06
Julian Hoad: They are buggers to
7:06
Julian Hoad: start sometimes so I've heard,
7:08
Julian Hoad: but I drove one once around
7:08
Julian Hoad: Goodwood, one of those driving
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Julian Hoad: experiences.
7:15
Julian Hoad: And it was absolutely amazing.
7:15
Julian Hoad: absolutely incredible.
7:20
Jo Hinde: And the noise from
7:20
Jo Hinde: them, I think, it's like this
7:22
Jo Hinde: revolution of electric vehicles.
7:22
Jo Hinde: I mean, we need it, I'm a big
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Jo Hinde: fan of it for the environment.
7:27
Jo Hinde: However it's such a loss to lose
7:27
Jo Hinde: those engine notes. And it's not
7:33
Jo Hinde: the same when it's piped in as
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Jo Hinde: music.
7:36
Jo Hinde: And you can pick which, if you
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Jo Hinde: drive a Tesla and you can pick
7:39
Jo Hinde: which engine notes you want and
7:39
Jo Hinde: you think that's
7:41
Mike Brampton: Can you really?
7:42
Jo Hinde: Yeah, yeah,
7:43
Julian Hoad: yeah, yeah, you can
7:43
Julian Hoad: get to the sound like a Robin
7:45
Julian Hoad: Reliant if you want
7:48
Mike Brampton: Awesome!
7:51
Mike Brampton: God. Oh, I didn't realise that!
7:53
Jo Hinde: All you need to do
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Jo Hinde: Mike is you just need to put a
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Jo Hinde: CD in your car and you can play,
7:56
Jo Hinde: you can have, whatever you want.
8:00
Mike Brampton: Does it change as
8:00
Mike Brampton: you speed up and slow down does
8:04
Mike Brampton: it actually?
8:05
Jo Hinde: Yeah. Supposedly,
8:05
Jo Hinde: completely recreates it, its
8:09
Jo Hinde: just mapping it really and you
8:09
Jo Hinde: pick which car you want to sound
8:14
Jo Hinde: like.
8:16
Jo Hinde: Yeah, yeah. Well, not you
8:16
Jo Hinde: personally, obviously you don't
8:18
Jo Hinde: sit there.
8:20
Julian Hoad: Well, I, I do. No I
8:20
Julian Hoad: don't. But what I used to do, I
8:25
Julian Hoad: used to have a two CV so this
8:25
Julian Hoad: is, you know, way, way ago. And
8:31
Julian Hoad: two CV and I'd drive it to
8:31
Julian Hoad: college at potters bar.
8:34
Julian Hoad: I drove up on a Monday morning
8:34
Julian Hoad: and drive down on the Friday
8:37
Julian Hoad: night on the M25. And the thing
8:37
Julian Hoad: about two CV is that their
8:41
Julian Hoad: brilliant cars absolutely
8:41
Julian Hoad: amazing gearboxes, but they're
8:45
Julian Hoad: not very robust.
8:47
Julian Hoad: You can't lock them properly. So
8:47
Julian Hoad: well at least I couldn't lock
8:50
Julian Hoad: mine, so I didn't have a stereo,
8:50
Julian Hoad: because I had a stereo and I
8:53
Julian Hoad: brought it and it got nicked.
8:54
Julian Hoad: I got another one and it got
8:54
Julian Hoad: nicked that night. So I thought
8:57
Julian Hoad: after that I;m not going to
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Julian Hoad: bother with a stereo.
8:59
Julian Hoad: So what I did was I had one of
8:59
Julian Hoad: those harmonica holders and I
9:04
Julian Hoad: stuck around my neck to play the
9:04
Julian Hoad: harmonica while I was driving
9:07
Julian Hoad: along.
9:09
Julian Hoad: And it was all okay until I was
9:09
Julian Hoad: driving back on the M25 one
9:12
Julian Hoad: night much, much like tonight,
9:12
Julian Hoad: where its peeing down and my
9:16
Julian Hoad: windscreen wiper often didn't
9:16
Julian Hoad: work.
9:20
Julian Hoad: So I was perched on the very
9:20
Julian Hoad: front of my seat, holding the
9:23
Julian Hoad: steering wheel, leaning out of
9:23
Julian Hoad: the window with my squeegee
9:26
Julian Hoad: wiping the windscreen.
9:29
Julian Hoad: I'm playing a little song on the
9:29
Julian Hoad: harmonica, I suddenly noticed
9:33
Julian Hoad: this sort of flashing light in
9:33
Julian Hoad: my latural vision.
9:37
Julian Hoad: And there was this policeman
9:37
Julian Hoad: matching my speed, he was going
9:41
Julian Hoad: very very slowly. And he just
9:41
Julian Hoad: looked at me and went
9:49
Julian Hoad: He said "I have no words for how
9:49
Julian Hoad: stupid that is. Promise me.
9:56
Julian Hoad: You'll leave the M25 now and
9:56
Julian Hoad: never, ever get on again."
10:03
Jo Hinde: See, that's why you've
10:03
Jo Hinde: always got to keep emergency
10:05
Jo Hinde: string because you can tie the
10:05
Jo Hinde: string on the wipers and just do
10:07
Jo Hinde: this, from inside the car,
10:14
Jo Hinde: I have been in a car and had to
10:14
Jo Hinde: do that. And luckily I was only
10:16
Jo Hinde: the passenger, not the driver.
10:16
Jo Hinde: But yeah, it was a thing. Alfa
10:21
Jo Hinde: Romeos that definitely don't
10:21
Jo Hinde: like the UK definitely don't
10:24
Jo Hinde: like the rain.
10:25
Julian Hoad: They love rust.
10:26
Jo Hinde: They do love rust
10:30
Julian Hoad: Well, I think we've
10:30
Julian Hoad: pretty much done cars to death
10:32
Julian Hoad: haven't we, bearing in mind its
10:32
Julian Hoad: Veteirnayr Ramblings not Motor
10:34
Julian Hoad: Ramblings.
10:37
Mike Brampton: We have already
10:37
Mike Brampton: on numerous occasions being
10:39
Mike Brampton: compared to the Top Gear boys.
10:42
Jo Hinde: Oh.
10:45
Jo Hinde: I'm not gonna say who is who I'm
10:45
Jo Hinde: not gonna go there.
10:51
Julian Hoad: We're twins
10:51
Julian Hoad: separated at birth
10:54
Mike Brampton: It's not the
10:54
Mike Brampton: current Top Gear guys either.
10:56
Julian Hoad: So, you're into
10:56
Julian Hoad: rabbits in a bit of a way,
11:00
Julian Hoad: aren't you?
11:01
Jo Hinde: I am rather keen on a
11:01
Jo Hinde: bunny or two, absolutely, yes.
11:05
Jo Hinde: It's been a passion of mine my
11:05
Jo Hinde: entire life really, I had them
11:08
Jo Hinde: as a small child. I thought it
11:08
Jo Hinde: was wrong as a very small child.
11:13
Jo Hinde: Why is it kept in this tiny
11:13
Jo Hinde: hutch. So Dad diligently went
11:18
Jo Hinde: and made a non small Hutch for
11:18
Jo Hinde: it to live in this kind of you
11:21
Jo Hinde: know, castle, and we did the
11:21
Jo Hinde: best we could.
11:23
Jo Hinde: And obviously we fed it muesli
11:23
Jo Hinde: food and did all the things that
11:26
Jo Hinde: you're not supposed to. And
11:26
Jo Hinde: there wasn't vaccinations and
11:30
Jo Hinde: nutrients and things back then.
11:30
Jo Hinde: But life evolves.
11:33
Jo Hinde: And yeah, so there's always been
11:33
Jo Hinde: a passion for rabbits. And when
11:38
Jo Hinde: I got into the veterinary side
11:38
Jo Hinde: of things, because again, I
11:40
Jo Hinde: always wanted to be a veterinary
11:40
Jo Hinde: nurse.
11:42
Jo Hinde: But when I left college, I
11:42
Jo Hinde: couldn't afford to take minimum
11:46
Jo Hinde: wage. I needed some extra money
11:46
Jo Hinde: to help the family out.
11:50
Jo Hinde: And so I went into more normal
11:50
Jo Hinde: work and did some other bits and
11:54
Jo Hinde: pieces and diversifications.
11:57
Jo Hinde: And when I finally could afford
11:57
Jo Hinde: to get into veterinary, nobody
12:01
Jo Hinde: wanted to do rabbits, because
12:01
Jo Hinde: they just died and everyone was
12:05
Jo Hinde: I thought, that's the species
12:05
Jo Hinde: for me. So, so yeah, that's how
12:05
Jo Hinde: scared of them.
12:10
Jo Hinde: that came about. And tried to
12:10
Jo Hinde: champion them ever since really.
12:14
Mike Brampton: I was explaining
12:14
Mike Brampton: to Julian, how we first met. You
12:17
Mike Brampton: very kindly asked me to speak at
12:17
Mike Brampton: the anaesthesia conference.
12:21
Jo Hinde: Yeah.
12:22
Mike Brampton: And how I nearly
12:22
Mike Brampton: killed my volunteer doing a live
12:28
Mike Brampton: dead space.
12:31
Jo Hinde: I mean, absolutely
12:31
Jo Hinde: brilliant. If only we had it on
12:34
Jo Hinde: video.
12:37
Mike Brampton: Got that point
12:37
Mike Brampton: across that too much dead space
12:39
Mike Brampton: can be dangerous.
12:40
Jo Hinde: Absolutely. Too much
12:40
Jo Hinde: dead space can lead to dead.
12:42
Jo Hinde: Yeah,
12:43
Julian Hoad: Absolutely. You say
12:43
Julian Hoad: you've championed the course of
12:48
Julian Hoad: rabbits, I think you really have
12:48
Julian Hoad: and, and you've been to some
12:52
Julian Hoad: extent recognised for that,
12:52
Julian Hoad: haven't you?
12:54
Julian Hoad: You were awarded the Blue Cross
12:54
Julian Hoad: Veterinary Nurse of the Year in
12:57
Julian Hoad: 2014.
12:59
Julian Hoad: Very, very high accolade. The
12:59
Julian Hoad: RCVS Innovation Award in 2017.
12:59
Julian Hoad: Yeah
13:05
Julian Hoad: And the same year the the IFAW
13:05
Julian Hoad: Animal Advocate Award.
13:09
Julian Hoad: So congratulations Jo, really
13:09
Julian Hoad: really well deserved. And what a
13:17
Julian Hoad: feather in the cap for
13:17
Julian Hoad: veterinary nurses in general,
13:19
Julian Hoad: but you particularly.
13:21
Mike Brampton: I'll raise a
13:21
Mike Brampton: glass to that, what you're
13:21
Mike Brampton: drinking tonight in Jo?
13:24
Jo Hinde: I have a very exciting
13:24
Jo Hinde: cherry cordial and soda water.
13:32
Jo Hinde: So sadly, ill health has meant
13:32
Jo Hinde: less bubbles in my life, which
13:35
Jo Hinde: is really not a good thing.
13:38
Jo Hinde: So yes, I'm on the softs, but no
13:38
Jo Hinde: the awards, it still doesn't
13:45
Jo Hinde: kind of feel right. You know, I
13:45
Jo Hinde: just feel like I'm doing my job
13:50
Jo Hinde: and living my life and, and just
13:50
Jo Hinde: trying to, you know,
13:53
Jo Hinde: raise standards of welfare
13:53
Jo Hinde: through education really, that's
13:58
Jo Hinde: kind of my thing. And I think
13:58
Jo Hinde: you know, when you are in a
14:03
Jo Hinde: position where you can reach
14:03
Jo Hinde: more people.
14:06
Jo Hinde: So being a veterinary nurse, for
14:06
Jo Hinde: example, you get to speak to a
14:09
Jo Hinde: lot of owners, I do think we
14:09
Jo Hinde: have a duty, certainly a moral
14:13
Jo Hinde: duty, at least,
14:13
Jo Hinde: to impart as much education and
14:13
Jo Hinde: wisdom as we put as we possibly
14:17
Jo Hinde: can. And it's not about trying
14:17
Jo Hinde: to make people mini vets
14:20
Jo Hinde: or trying to make owners self
14:20
Jo Hinde: sufficient without vets. It's
14:23
Jo Hinde: just if we empower them with the
14:23
Jo Hinde: tools that we've got to, to try
14:27
Jo Hinde: and help understand,
14:29
Jo Hinde: do body condition scoring and
14:29
Jo Hinde: understand how to do weight
14:32
Jo Hinde: clinics at home, in conjunction
14:32
Jo Hinde: with your weight nurse.
14:37
Jo Hinde: We are effectively building
14:37
Jo Hinde: communication, building trust
14:40
Jo Hinde: with our clients. And then we're
14:40
Jo Hinde: seeing these animals in a better
14:44
Jo Hinde: condition, they're not going as
14:44
Jo Hinde: far,
14:46
Jo Hinde: so we can help more just by
14:46
Jo Hinde: spreading a bit of information
14:51
Jo Hinde: and it's not releasing trade
14:51
Jo Hinde: secrets and all these sorts of
14:54
Jo Hinde: things. It is just you know,
14:55
Jo Hinde: sharing the information and and
14:55
Jo Hinde: just really helping so
14:59
Julian Hoad: Absolutely because
14:59
Julian Hoad: believe it or not, vets and
15:01
Julian Hoad: nurses actually want pets to be
15:01
Julian Hoad: healthy.
15:04
Jo Hinde: I know revolutionary.
15:08
Julian Hoad: If they do this,
15:08
Julian Hoad: they won't get ill, we won't
15:10
Julian Hoad: make any money. We love healthy
15:10
Julian Hoad: animals.
15:14
Jo Hinde: Absolutely. And that's
15:14
Jo Hinde: why we do our job, you know, we
15:14
Jo Hinde: And, and certainly in my rabbit
15:14
Jo Hinde: world, you know, we're so keen
15:16
Jo Hinde: want them to be healthy. That's
15:16
Jo Hinde: why we're so keen on
15:19
Jo Hinde: preventative medicine.
15:25
Jo Hinde: on husbandry, because that
15:25
Jo Hinde: really is the cornerstone to
15:28
Jo Hinde: health.
15:28
Jo Hinde: So, so pushing through with
15:28
Jo Hinde: that, and that's not just owner
15:31
Jo Hinde: education that's trying to
15:31
Jo Hinde: change government and
15:33
Jo Hinde: legislation, and what can be
15:33
Jo Hinde: sold and what can't be sold.
15:36
Jo Hinde: And a minimum sizes for
15:36
Jo Hinde: enclosures, and all these
15:39
Jo Hinde: different things are all part of
15:39
Jo Hinde: this jigsaw, that kind of need
15:43
Jo Hinde: to be tackled to,
15:45
Jo Hinde: to improve the awareness and by
15:45
Jo Hinde: doing that we improve the
15:51
Mike Brampton: There was quite a
15:51
Mike Brampton: campaign last year wasn't there?
15:51
Mike Brampton: welfare.
15:54
Mike Brampton: On size, and companionship?
15:59
Jo Hinde: Yes, yeah. Yeah,
15:59
Jo Hinde: absolutely.
16:02
Jo Hinde: And as the BVNA, we were very
16:02
Jo Hinde: happy to sign up to that joint
16:05
Jo Hinde: statement with the BVA with
16:05
Jo Hinde: regards to companionship in
16:10
Jo Hinde: rabbits and how important it is.
16:13
Jo Hinde: And we are, if we look back,
16:13
Jo Hinde: even over the last 10 years,
16:16
Jo Hinde: rabbit health has really come on
16:16
Jo Hinde: leaps and bounds, or hops should
16:19
Jo Hinde: we say. It really has.
16:22
Jo Hinde: Yeah, I know too much time with
16:22
Jo Hinde: Mike.
16:25
Mike Brampton: Sorry Jo, Julian
16:25
Mike Brampton: does the jokes
16:27
Jo Hinde: Oh,
16:30
Jo Hinde: yeah, it really has come on
16:30
Jo Hinde: well, and when you think back 10
16:35
Jo Hinde: years ago, and we were talking
16:35
Jo Hinde: about muesli mix and how rabbits
16:38
Jo Hinde: should eat a pellet, not a
16:38
Jo Hinde: muesli,
16:40
Jo Hinde: And rabbit should eat hay. And,
16:40
Jo Hinde: you know, now we're having
16:42
Jo Hinde: conversations about urinary
16:42
Jo Hinde: issues, and bladder sludge,
16:47
Jo Hinde: as commonplace first things that
16:47
Jo Hinde: owners are saying on forums. So
16:51
Jo Hinde: we really have come a long way,
16:51
Jo Hinde: there's a lot of work still to
16:53
Jo Hinde: do,
16:54
Jo Hinde: but we're definitely coming a
16:54
Jo Hinde: long way. And the PDSA paw
16:57
Jo Hinde: report is testament to that as
16:57
Jo Hinde: well. And something I'm very,
17:00
Jo Hinde: very keen advocate of,
17:03
Jo Hinde: and the results of the most
17:03
Jo Hinde: recent, trending because they're
17:07
Jo Hinde: coming up to their 10 year
17:07
Jo Hinde: anniversary of the paw report.
17:12
Jo Hinde: And some really good stats in
17:12
Jo Hinde: there as well, looking at how
17:16
Jo Hinde: things are getting better, but
17:16
Jo Hinde: there's still work to do.
17:20
Mike Brampton: What are the key
17:20
Mike Brampton: points that we should be looking
17:22
Mike Brampton: at to improve rabbit welfare in?
17:27
Jo Hinde: I think it's, as I
17:27
Jo Hinde: say, multifaceted. So I think
17:32
Jo Hinde: even though we work in the
17:32
Jo Hinde: veterinary sphere, I think we
17:34
Jo Hinde: need to look at the owner,
17:37
Jo Hinde: I nearly said owner penetration
17:37
Jo Hinde: then. And that is not what I
17:39
Jo Hinde: meant.
17:43
Julian Hoad: That's a different
17:43
Julian Hoad: sort of rabbit actually isn't
17:45
Julian Hoad: it.
17:48
Jo Hinde: whole different
17:48
Jo Hinde: sponsor.
17:53
Jo Hinde: We need to look at owner
17:53
Jo Hinde: engagement as well as what we do
17:59
Jo Hinde: within clinic and outside of
17:59
Jo Hinde: clinic. So I think again,
18:02
Jo Hinde: husbandry really is so
18:02
Jo Hinde: important, and getting that
18:07
Jo Hinde: right.
18:09
Jo Hinde: And so we need prepurchase
18:09
Jo Hinde: appointments, which is a devil's
18:14
Jo Hinde: own job to try and get pre
18:14
Jo Hinde: purchase appointments for a
18:17
Jo Hinde: prized items such as a cat and a
18:17
Jo Hinde: dog,
18:19
Jo Hinde: let alone rabbits that often are
18:19
Jo Hinde: picked up on a whim. So I think
18:24
Jo Hinde: we need to do a lot of education
18:24
Jo Hinde: there. We have a big problem.
18:29
Jo Hinde: Well, yeah, problem actually I'm
18:29
Jo Hinde: going to stick by that, within
18:33
Jo Hinde: the veterinary field, that we're
18:33
Jo Hinde: not taught enough about rabbits
18:36
Jo Hinde: as we train as vets and nurses.
18:39
Jo Hinde: We generally, depending on which
18:39
Jo Hinde: University you go to, we have
18:42
Jo Hinde: very little training, rabbit
18:42
Jo Hinde: specific training, they are the
18:46
Jo Hinde: third most popular pet in the
18:46
Jo Hinde: UK.
18:49
Julian Hoad: Yeah, I agree. I
18:49
Julian Hoad: qualified for 24 years ago. We
18:54
Julian Hoad: had, in my training, we had one
18:54
Julian Hoad: day on rabbit medicine in the
19:00
Julian Hoad: five year course.
19:02
Julian Hoad: And we expected them from day
19:02
Julian Hoad: one graduation to be able to
19:05
Julian Hoad: treat them adequately. I have to
19:05
Julian Hoad: say I'd been on many courses
19:09
Julian Hoad: since then,
19:09
Julian Hoad: and read around the subjects and
19:09
Julian Hoad: gain a lot of experience. But I
19:14
Julian Hoad: will still be happy to refer
19:14
Julian Hoad: rabbits for more complex
19:19
Julian Hoad: procedures on to specialists.
19:21
Julian Hoad: I think that's a very
19:21
Julian Hoad: underutilised tool in the
19:25
Julian Hoad: veterinary field as well, the
19:25
Julian Hoad: acknowledgement that rabbits
19:29
Julian Hoad: have specialist nurses,
19:29
Julian Hoad: specialist vets
19:33
Julian Hoad: because they have speciality
19:35
Jo Hinde: Yes, very much so and
19:35
Jo Hinde: the main thing is they're a prey
19:39
Jo Hinde: species not a predator and we're
19:39
Jo Hinde: used to dealing with predators.
19:42
Jo Hinde: And we're taught in general how
19:42
Jo Hinde: to deal with predators apart
19:46
Jo Hinde: from if you're talking about
19:46
Jo Hinde: large animals and you know, hoof
19:48
Jo Hinde: stock and things but,
19:51
Jo Hinde: our whole body language, our
19:51
Jo Hinde: whole way of working, everything
19:54
Jo Hinde: needs to change for these prey
19:54
Jo Hinde: species. And, and yeah, we just
19:58
Jo Hinde: don't talk enough.
20:00
Jo Hinde: We don't communicate enough. And
20:00
Jo Hinde: I find in the exotics world,
20:03
Jo Hinde: we're a lot happier to share our
20:03
Jo Hinde: opinions and to,
20:08
Jo Hinde: I can pick up the phone and I
20:08
Jo Hinde: can speak to a rabbit specialist
20:10
Jo Hinde: like this. And vice versa, they,
20:10
Jo Hinde: you know, a normal clinician,
20:15
Jo Hinde: run of the mill GP clinician,
20:17
Jo Hinde: Can go through referrals, or
20:17
Jo Hinde: they can, there are some tame
20:22
Jo Hinde: exotic pets out there that are
20:22
Jo Hinde: more than happy to take emails
20:26
Jo Hinde: and calls about
20:27
Jo Hinde: 'oh, my God, I've got this, what
20:27
Jo Hinde: do I do?' And I think we're
20:32
Jo Hinde: better at doing that in the
20:32
Jo Hinde: exotic side of things, then then
20:34
Jo Hinde: we are in the mainstream cats
20:34
Jo Hinde: and dogs really.
20:37
Jo Hinde: But I think I'd like to see more
20:37
Jo Hinde: veterinary teams do that, I'd
20:41
Jo Hinde: like to see them open a book
20:41
Jo Hinde: more, be honest to the client
20:47
Jo Hinde: and say, "Actually, you know
20:47
Jo Hinde: what, I don't know, "
20:50
Jo Hinde: "I really don't know, however, I
20:50
Jo Hinde: will find out for you." And that
20:54
Jo Hinde: can be within a matter of
20:54
Jo Hinde: minutes, or that could be a
20:56
Jo Hinde: matter of weeks.
20:57
Jo Hinde: But either way, just be honest
20:57
Jo Hinde: with the client. And go you know
20:59
Jo Hinde: what, I'm happy to see Flopsy.
20:59
Jo Hinde: But it's not my area of
21:02
Jo Hinde: expertise, you know, I can give
21:02
Jo Hinde: pain relief,
21:05
Jo Hinde: I can give the emergency
21:05
Jo Hinde: treatment that we need to get
21:08
Jo Hinde: you through whilst I get
21:08
Jo Hinde: information from another
21:11
Jo Hinde: colleague, and also use your
21:11
Jo Hinde: team.
21:13
Jo Hinde: So I'm a nurse, I'm not allowed
21:13
Jo Hinde: to diagnose. However, I have a
21:18
Jo Hinde: lot of private knowledge. I
21:18
Jo Hinde: teach all sorts of rabbit
21:23
Jo Hinde: things,
21:23
Jo Hinde: including surgeries that I'm not
21:23
Jo Hinde: allowed to actually do myself, I
21:26
Jo Hinde: teach vets how to do them,
21:26
Jo Hinde: students how to do them.
21:30
Jo Hinde: And I think we need to remember
21:30
Jo Hinde: that team cohesiveness and go
21:34
Jo Hinde: actually, there may be someone
21:34
Jo Hinde: on that team that is a nutrition
21:37
Jo Hinde: specialist,
21:38
Jo Hinde: we're not allowed to be a
21:38
Jo Hinde: specialist, a nutrition expert,
21:40
Jo Hinde: or a rabbit expert or diabetes
21:40
Jo Hinde: expert. And again, use that
21:45
Jo Hinde: whole team,
21:46
Jo Hinde: go okay, I might be the vet, but
21:46
Jo Hinde: actually, let's have a clinical
21:50
Jo Hinde: discussion about this and see
21:50
Jo Hinde: the best thing we can do for our
21:52
Jo Hinde: patients.
21:53
Julian Hoad: Yeah, absolutely.
21:55
Mike Brampton: You own and run a
21:55
Mike Brampton: company called LagoLean don't
21:58
Mike Brampton: you Jo?
21:58
Mike Brampton: I do indeed
21:59
Mike Brampton: What was the motivation behind
21:59
Mike Brampton: LagoLearn? And what are you
22:04
Mike Brampton: aiming to achieve with it?
22:06
Jo Hinde: So LagoLearn was
22:06
Jo Hinde: twofold. One. As I said, I
22:12
Jo Hinde: always wanted to be a veterinary
22:12
Jo Hinde: nurse.
22:13
Mike Brampton: Right
22:14
Jo Hinde: So I got my dream,
22:14
Jo Hinde: struggled through my training,
22:17
Jo Hinde: had an awful training practice,
22:17
Jo Hinde: a terrible clinical coach, I had
22:23
Jo Hinde: a motorbike accident during
22:23
Jo Hinde: that.
22:25
Jo Hinde: So I was in a wheelchair with a
22:25
Jo Hinde: busted up leg for some of it. So
22:28
Jo Hinde: it was a real slog trying to get
22:28
Jo Hinde: through my training, got through
22:32
Jo Hinde: my training, brilliant.
22:36
Jo Hinde: Few years into that, going on a
22:36
Jo Hinde: home euthanasia visit of a 32
22:41
Jo Hinde: kilo Labrador. And vet refuses
22:41
Jo Hinde: to help me lift said dead dog
22:46
Jo Hinde: back to the car,
22:47
Jo Hinde: going through the house as
22:47
Jo Hinde: nicely as you can, pop goes a
22:50
Jo Hinde: disk in my spine. Roll on 12
22:50
Jo Hinde: years now, something like that.
22:57
Jo Hinde: And I've had four spinal
22:57
Jo Hinde: operations and still waiting for
23:01
Jo Hinde: a final one to fuse through my
23:01
Jo Hinde: vertebrae. And so basically, at
23:07
Jo Hinde: one point,
23:08
Jo Hinde: I woke up in the morning and I
23:08
Jo Hinde: was paralysed from the waist
23:10
Jo Hinde: down because I've gone into full
23:10
Jo Hinde: cord recliner.
23:13
Jo Hinde: So that was a bit of a wake up
23:13
Jo Hinde: call and no more bending or
23:16
Jo Hinde: lifting thus forth. So that does
23:16
Jo Hinde: not make for a very good or
23:21
Jo Hinde: useful veterinary nurse.
23:22
Jo Hinde: So what the bloody hell do I do?
23:22
Jo Hinde: I've just got, you know, the job
23:25
Jo Hinde: I want. So I thought, right,
23:25
Jo Hinde: let's diversify. I'm not going
23:28
Jo Hinde: to give up because I'm not one
23:28
Jo Hinde: for giving up.
23:31
Jo Hinde: And I thought what can I do? I
23:31
Jo Hinde: thought well, those that can do
23:35
Jo Hinde: those that can't teach so I'll
23:35
Jo Hinde: go and teach. That's what I'll
23:38
Jo Hinde: do.
23:41
Jo Hinde: And, and so obviously my
23:41
Jo Hinde: wheelhouse is rabbits, I found a
23:45
Jo Hinde: vet that was willing to come
23:45
Jo Hinde: into it with me. I work with
23:51
Jo Hinde: Ivan Crotaz, who isn't a
23:51
Jo Hinde: certified specialist.
23:54
Jo Hinde: However, he has a wealth of
23:54
Jo Hinde: rabbit knowledge. And we talked
23:58
Jo Hinde: together internationally on a
23:58
Jo Hinde: few different lectures and
24:00
Jo Hinde: things and we just come up one
24:00
Jo Hinde: day
24:02
Jo Hinde: and we said what are we doing?
24:02
Jo Hinde: You know, let's do this together
24:04
Jo Hinde: and let's make it a thing so
24:04
Jo Hinde: that's how LagoLearn was born.
24:08
Jo Hinde: And basically we do teach, until
24:08
Jo Hinde: the rona came to town, we do
24:12
Jo Hinde: teach face to face globally
24:12
Jo Hinde: around the world.
24:17
Jo Hinde: And its aim is just to bring up
24:17
Jo Hinde: to date factual and useful
24:23
Jo Hinde: rabbit medicine tips and
24:23
Jo Hinde: surgical tips to veterinary
24:28
Jo Hinde: staff, anyone that wants to
24:28
Jo Hinde: learn
24:31
Jo Hinde: so if you work on reception, you
24:31
Jo Hinde: can come to a surgery course, we
24:34
Jo Hinde: don't care because we see the
24:34
Jo Hinde: importance of everybody
24:38
Jo Hinde: understanding what's going on.
24:40
Jo Hinde: So for example, and another
24:40
Jo Hinde: reason for taking that stance is
24:44
Jo Hinde: as a nurse, there were many
24:44
Jo Hinde: large organisation CPD events
24:50
Jo Hinde: that I wished to attend,
24:51
Jo Hinde: that I was not allowed to attend
24:51
Jo Hinde: because I was not a vet. And I
24:55
Jo Hinde: said Oh, can I pay it and just
24:55
Jo Hinde: stay to the side and not do the
24:58
Jo Hinde: practicals? No, you can't.
25:01
Jo Hinde: Whereas in my mind, if a nurse
25:01
Jo Hinde: is allowed to learn what's going
25:05
Jo Hinde: on with that surgery, then that
25:05
Jo Hinde: nurse is going to know
25:09
Jo Hinde: where the potential points are
25:09
Jo Hinde: for increased analgesia is going
25:13
Jo Hinde: to be needed, even though
25:13
Jo Hinde: they're not doing the wobbly bit
25:16
Jo Hinde: of surgery themselves, you know,
25:18
Jo Hinde: everybody understands a bit more
25:18
Jo Hinde: what's going on. So I think
25:22
Jo Hinde: there's value and if you want to
25:22
Jo Hinde: learn, we'll teach you.
25:25
Julian Hoad: You're absolutely
25:25
Julian Hoad: right. And I'm involved with the
25:31
Julian Hoad: BSAVA is, as I've mentioned, a
25:31
Julian Hoad: lot of times before,
25:35
Julian Hoad: and and we're we're trying to
25:35
Julian Hoad: put together the programme for
25:42
Julian Hoad: the Congress 2021, which is
25:42
Julian Hoad: going to be virtual.
25:45
Julian Hoad: And we would very much taken the
25:45
Julian Hoad: decision that all lectures
25:51
Julian Hoad: should be team appropriate. They
25:51
Julian Hoad: aren't going to be, these are
25:55
Julian Hoad: vet lectures, these are nurse
25:55
Julian Hoad: lectures
25:57
Julian Hoad: These are team appropriate. And
25:57
Julian Hoad: there's a huge amount, as you
26:00
Julian Hoad: say, of crossover cross
26:00
Julian Hoad: training, almost.
26:05
Julian Hoad: The vet could do a absolutely
26:05
Julian Hoad: brilliant job of surgery on a
26:09
Julian Hoad: dead rabbit because he hasn't
26:09
Julian Hoad: spotted the signs that he could
26:13
Julian Hoad: have used to alert the nurse to
26:13
Julian Hoad: deterioration.
26:17
Julian Hoad: Yeah, similarly, the nurse could
26:17
Julian Hoad: do absolutely fantastic job of
26:20
Julian Hoad: monitoring an anaesthetic, but
26:20
Julian Hoad: not appropriate, perhaps to that
26:24
Julian Hoad: surgery.
26:25
Julian Hoad: So there's got to be an
26:25
Julian Hoad: integrative approach,
26:30
Jo Hinde: Very much so, and one
26:30
Jo Hinde: of the things that we've been
26:31
Jo Hinde: doing as LagoLearn is, we teach
26:31
Jo Hinde: together.
26:36
Jo Hinde: So Ivan and I will often teach
26:36
Jo Hinde: together and we've moved that
26:39
Jo Hinde: through because we're sponsored
26:39
Jo Hinde: by Supreme petfoods.
26:40
Jo Hinde: And we've moved that through to
26:40
Jo Hinde: lectures as well. So at BSAVA
26:45
Jo Hinde: twice now I think we've done and
26:45
Jo Hinde: what we term and it takes two
26:49
Jo Hinde: lecture.
26:50
Jo Hinde: And it's usually Molly Varga and
26:50
Jo Hinde: myself. And, and we had one
26:54
Jo Hinde: today actually, that, sadly,
26:54
Jo Hinde: I've not been well enough to do,
26:56
Jo Hinde: I was due to do one with Molly,
26:56
Jo Hinde: but her nurse Craig stepped in
26:59
Jo Hinde: and did it today. And they did
26:59
Jo Hinde: an amazing job.
27:02
Jo Hinde: But yeah, so it's the it takes
27:02
Jo Hinde: two and basically you have the
27:06
Jo Hinde: nurse and the vet presenting at
27:06
Jo Hinde: the same time on the front of
27:09
Jo Hinde: the screen.
27:10
Jo Hinde: So you go through rabbit
27:10
Jo Hinde: dentistry or whatever the case
27:15
Jo Hinde: may be. And you do both things
27:15
Jo Hinde: together.
27:19
Jo Hinde: So that, you know the vet says
27:19
Jo Hinde: there bit, the nurse say there
27:22
Jo Hinde: bit, and again, it just brings
27:22
Jo Hinde: this cohesiveness of actually
27:25
Jo Hinde: how you do need to have clinical
27:25
Jo Hinde: discussions.
27:27
Jo Hinde: It's not just, you know, this
27:27
Jo Hinde: one person does this and someone
27:30
Jo Hinde: else does that. And it's good to
27:30
Jo Hinde: learn as well.
27:34
Jo Hinde: And I had this, for a few years
27:34
Jo Hinde: now I've run a lecture on
27:40
Jo Hinde: holistic anaesthesia. And I've
27:40
Jo Hinde: done it in multiple places
27:44
Jo Hinde: around the world, which has been
27:44
Jo Hinde: amazing.
27:48
Jo Hinde: However, if I was to call this
27:48
Jo Hinde: course, husbandry, or the talk
27:53
Jo Hinde: husbandry, I just get nurses,
27:53
Jo Hinde: and when I changed it to
27:57
Jo Hinde: holistic anaesthesia then I got
27:57
Jo Hinde: vets attending
28:01
Jo Hinde: and I got vets attending and
28:01
Jo Hinde: telling me multiple times. "Do
28:05
Jo Hinde: you know what, this is all stuff
28:05
Jo Hinde: that I never knew. I don't want
28:08
Jo Hinde: to know. But I need to know."
28:10
Jo Hinde: "And thank you because actually,
28:10
Jo Hinde: it's very beneficial moving
28:13
Jo Hinde: forward."
28:14
Jo Hinde: And I think that's another thing
28:14
Jo Hinde: we've got to remember that we do
28:17
Jo Hinde: need to be clever with marketing
28:17
Jo Hinde: as well. So as much as we can
28:20
Jo Hinde: offer these things,
28:21
Jo Hinde: we've got to be clever and
28:21
Jo Hinde: entice stubborn vets and
28:24
Jo Hinde: stubborn nurses and stubborn,
28:24
Jo Hinde: you know A&A's and receptionists
28:27
Jo Hinde: in to
28:28
Jo Hinde: to try and learn stuff that they
28:28
Jo Hinde: don't think they need to know.
28:32
Jo Hinde: And they maybe don't want to
28:32
Jo Hinde: know. But it's actually really
28:35
Jo Hinde: important to the whole thing.
28:38
Julian Hoad: I like that, that's
28:38
Julian Hoad: really nice. Cheers, everyone.
28:40
Mike Brampton: Oh, cheers.
28:40
Mike Brampton: Cheers Julian, Cheers.
28:42
Jo Hinde: I'll just sit and have
28:42
Jo Hinde: my you know
28:45
Mike Brampton: Well, we'll drink
28:45
Mike Brampton: for you.
28:49
Jo Hinde: Thanks, that has been
28:49
Jo Hinde: done before. So yeah.
28:52
Mike Brampton: You mentioned
28:52
Mike Brampton: there, you crashed out on a
28:54
Mike Brampton: lecture today because you wanted
28:54
Mike Brampton: to appear with us this evening?
29:00
Jo Hinde: Absolutely.
29:01
Mike Brampton: I was saying in
29:01
Mike Brampton: the introduction how we'd got
29:06
Mike Brampton: you booked. It seems like a
29:06
Mike Brampton: lifetime ago. And you were just
29:11
Mike Brampton: about ready to join us on the
29:11
Mike Brampton: show.
29:13
Mike Brampton: And do a recording. And then you
29:13
Mike Brampton: just disappeared?
29:18
Jo Hinde: Yes. Poof! Just like
29:18
Jo Hinde: bad magic.
29:21
Mike Brampton: Yeah, it seemed
29:21
Mike Brampton: like it and it took several
29:23
Mike Brampton: weeks before I was able to catch
29:23
Mike Brampton: up with you. And to find out
29:27
Mike Brampton: that you were actually seriously
29:27
Mike Brampton: ill in hospital.
29:30
Jo Hinde: Yes, it's been
29:30
Jo Hinde: emotional as one film would say.
29:37
Jo Hinde: And it's been a real roller
29:37
Jo Hinde: coaster. Actually, I had a very,
29:41
Jo Hinde: very simple procedure to have a
29:41
Jo Hinde: contraceptive coil put in.
29:49
Jo Hinde: Really oversharing but there we
29:49
Jo Hinde: go. And I was one of the one in
29:54
Jo Hinde: 1500 that it perforated my
29:54
Jo Hinde: uterus. And it's a known side
30:00
Jo Hinde: effect but very, very rare.
30:02
Jo Hinde: And things just spiralled and
30:02
Jo Hinde: got worse and worse. So the
30:06
Jo Hinde: clipnotes version is that I
30:06
Jo Hinde: ended up with pelvic infection
30:10
Jo Hinde: which went to peritonitis
30:11
Jo Hinde: which led to, I had a
30:11
Jo Hinde: pneumococcal infection in my
30:14
Jo Hinde: bladder, I had silent pneumonia,
30:14
Jo Hinde: two of my lower lung lobes
30:19
Jo Hinde: collapsed.
30:21
Jo Hinde: I had to have emergency surgery
30:21
Jo Hinde: because we didn't know what was
30:24
Jo Hinde: going to kill me first, the
30:24
Jo Hinde: sepsis or the actual operation
30:31
Jo Hinde: to kind of take the pus out of
30:31
Jo Hinde: y abdomen.
30:35
Jo Hinde: So I was staved for three days,
30:35
Jo Hinde: while my chances of survival
30:40
Jo Hinde: went from 30% to 40% to 50%,
30:42
Jo Hinde: we went right 50% we'll do this,
30:42
Jo Hinde: we'll give it a go. They took
30:47
Jo Hinde: 800 mils of pus out of my
30:47
Jo Hinde: abdomen, and stiched me back up,
30:53
Jo Hinde: sent me back upstairs.
30:55
Jo Hinde: And then I went into septic
30:55
Jo Hinde: shock. And so tried to die
31:00
Jo Hinde: again, which is rather rude,
31:00
Jo Hinde: three times in total, my body
31:04
Jo Hinde: decided it had enough and I'm
31:04
Jo Hinde: just too stubborn and held on.
31:09
Jo Hinde: And it all resulted, it ended
31:09
Jo Hinde: with me being on multiple drugs.
31:15
Jo Hinde: I mean, I ended up I was on four
31:15
Jo Hinde: different types of IV
31:17
Jo Hinde: antibiotics plus oral
31:17
Jo Hinde: antibiotics.
31:21
Jo Hinde: Some days, I was taking 28
31:21
Jo Hinde: tablets three times a day, as
31:25
Jo Hinde: well as IV medicines
31:25
Jo Hinde: exceptionally poorly and ended
31:31
Jo Hinde: up in a psychotic episode break
31:31
Jo Hinde: for three days as well.
31:35
Jo Hinde: So the sepsis was trying to get
31:35
Jo Hinde: to my brain. And my body had two
31:39
Jo Hinde: choices, it could either go into
31:39
Jo Hinde: a coma, or it could go into a
31:42
Jo Hinde: psychotic break
31:43
Jo Hinde: and have lots of audio and
31:43
Jo Hinde: visual hallucinations. And
31:48
Jo Hinde: unfortunately, it chose the
31:48
Jo Hinde: psychotic break, which I would
31:51
Jo Hinde: have actually chosen the coma
31:51
Jo Hinde: over
31:53
Jo Hinde: because it was the most horrific
31:53
Jo Hinde: thing I've ever had in my life.
31:57
Jo Hinde: I've never been so scared in all
31:57
Jo Hinde: of my life. Part of my psychosis
32:03
Jo Hinde: was that people were trying to
32:03
Jo Hinde: kill me
32:05
Jo Hinde: and the doctors and nurses were
32:05
Jo Hinde: trying to kill me as well. So in
32:09
Jo Hinde: that setting that can then be
32:09
Jo Hinde: very difficult to trust anybody.
32:14
Jo Hinde: All of this happens whilst I was
32:14
Jo Hinde: on holiday, down in in lovely
32:17
Jo Hinde: Dartmouth. So I was taken to
32:17
Jo Hinde: Torbay hospital where the staff
32:21
Jo Hinde: were amazing.
32:22
Jo Hinde: But again, due to the corona
32:22
Jo Hinde: being in town, no visits, and my
32:27
Jo Hinde: family all have to leave Five
32:27
Jo Hinde: days later as well, because
32:29
Jo Hinde: we've only had kind of a week's
32:29
Jo Hinde: holiday booked.
32:31
Jo Hinde: So I was all on my lonesome for
32:31
Jo Hinde: three weeks in the hospital, so
32:37
Jo Hinde: yeah, it's been quite horrific.
32:37
Jo Hinde: I've been exceptionally poorly.
32:44
Jo Hinde: I'm still exceptionally poorly,
32:44
Jo Hinde: even though I won't actually
32:46
Jo Hinde: accept that I'm exceptionally
32:46
Jo Hinde: poorly.
32:49
Jo Hinde: And I'm suffering from a lot of
32:49
Jo Hinde: complications and side effects
32:53
Jo Hinde: from the sepsis and the
32:53
Jo Hinde: operation.
32:57
Jo Hinde: So part of that is I have quite
32:57
Jo Hinde: a lot of gastric ulcers, and
33:01
Jo Hinde: gastritis and colitis. So that
33:01
Jo Hinde: makes eating and moving
33:07
Jo Hinde: generally exceptionally painful.
33:10
Jo Hinde: And limited pain relief, I do
33:10
Jo Hinde: not have multimodal analgesia,
33:14
Jo Hinde: and where is my lidercane CRI
33:14
Jo Hinde: goddamnit?
33:20
Jo Hinde: So, so yeah, and it's a long
33:20
Jo Hinde: recovery as well. So we're
33:22
Jo Hinde: looking at at least six months.
33:22
Jo Hinde: And it can be years for some of
33:27
Jo Hinde: these things, too.
33:29
Mike Brampton: Can I ask because
33:29
Mike Brampton: I knew virtually nothing about
33:35
Mike Brampton: sepsis. And it comes up quite
33:35
Mike Brampton: often in respiratory physiology.
33:45
Mike Brampton: A lot of work is done in
33:45
Mike Brampton: ventilation, and ventilator
33:49
Mike Brampton: parameters for life support for
33:49
Mike Brampton: patients with sepsis.
33:53
Mike Brampton: But I've always taken that from
33:53
Mike Brampton: the research, sepsis. Yeah, this
34:01
Mike Brampton: is where it's useful. And this
34:01
Mike Brampton: is where we need to know and we
34:03
Mike Brampton: need to know how to support lung
34:03
Mike Brampton: tissue.
34:08
Mike Brampton: But I've always viewed it as a
34:08
Mike Brampton: ventilator, respiratory thing.
34:15
Mike Brampton: And the sepsis is sort of tagged
34:15
Mike Brampton: on the slide,
34:19
Mike Brampton: that was my knowledge of sepsis
34:19
Mike Brampton: and my exposure to what about
34:23
Mike Brampton: you Julian?
34:26
Julian Hoad: We were told simply
34:26
Julian Hoad: at college sepsis, or
34:30
Julian Hoad: septicemia, leading to
34:30
Julian Hoad: septicemic, or septitoximic
34:36
Julian Hoad: shock,
34:38
Julian Hoad: was either a primary event where
34:38
Julian Hoad: you get a bug going directly
34:43
Julian Hoad: into the bloodstream or more
34:43
Julian Hoad: usually, a secondary event a
34:47
Julian Hoad: complication of a infection
34:47
Julian Hoad: elsewhere
34:51
Julian Hoad: that travels to the bloodstream.
34:51
Julian Hoad: And this is 24 years ago, as I
34:56
Julian Hoad: said, when I studied we were
34:56
Julian Hoad: told, I'm afriad really not a l
35:01
Julian Hoad: t you can do for sepsis.
35:03
Julian Hoad: Because from sepsis you get
35:03
Julian Hoad: disseminated intravascular
35:07
Julian Hoad: coagulation DIC, and the joke
35:07
Julian Hoad: was then it was called Death is
35:13
Julian Hoad: coming, DIC, death is coming.
35:14
Julian Hoad: Because you know, once you got
35:14
Julian Hoad: that, nothing you can do, there
35:18
Julian Hoad: must be something?
35:23
Julian Hoad: Stick in tocks was a mix of of
35:23
Julian Hoad: antibodies raised against 12 or
35:40
Julian Hoad: so of the common suspects, the
35:40
Julian Hoad: usual suspects in toxaemia.
35:47
Julian Hoad: Because it's not necessarily the
35:47
Julian Hoad: bacteria. And it's the toxins
35:50
Julian Hoad: and bacteria produced that that
35:50
Julian Hoad: cause the problems.
35:54
Julian Hoad: And so you give them an
35:54
Julian Hoad: injection of the antibodies
35:58
Julian Hoad: against these, these toxins, and
35:58
Julian Hoad: they're fine again, they're not
36:03
Julian Hoad: in practice,
36:04
Julian Hoad: because what happens is, you've
36:04
Julian Hoad: got decreased renal perfusion,
36:07
Julian Hoad: and you get perimeter
36:07
Julian Hoad: glomerulonephritis quite rapidly
36:11
Julian Hoad: due to these antibody antigen
36:11
Julian Hoad: complex formations within the
36:16
Julian Hoad: bloodstream.
36:16
Julian Hoad: So was eventually taken off for
36:16
Julian Hoad: these reasons. And for the fact
36:21
Julian Hoad: it didn't seem to do much good,
36:21
Julian Hoad: lot of harm not much good.
36:24
Mike Brampton: So is it similar
36:24
Mike Brampton: for you, Jo, before you actually
36:28
Mike Brampton: contracted it?
36:29
Jo Hinde: Yeah, I always thought
36:29
Jo Hinde: sepsis and septicemia were the
36:32
Jo Hinde: same thing. And basically, I
36:32
Jo Hinde: thought it was blood poisoning,
36:35
Jo Hinde: and septicemia is blood
36:35
Jo Hinde: poisoning, sepsis is not.
36:42
Jo Hinde: So the clinical definition I've
36:42
Jo Hinde: since learned from the UK sepsis
36:46
Jo Hinde: trust, who are quite an amazing
36:46
Jo Hinde: resource. And I've since learned
36:51
Jo Hinde: from them that there are red
36:51
Jo Hinde: flags.
36:53
Jo Hinde: And basically you have two or
36:53
Jo Hinde: more concurrent infections, plus
36:58
Jo Hinde: one organ that is starting to
36:58
Jo Hinde: fail. And then you are
37:02
Jo Hinde: clinically considered to have
37:02
Jo Hinde: sepsis
37:05
Jo Hinde: and that can then spiral up you
37:05
Jo Hinde: can have 3-4-5 concurrent
37:08
Jo Hinde: infections and multiple organ
37:08
Jo Hinde: failure.
37:10
Julian Hoad: Absolutely.
37:11
Julian Hoad: But it has to fulfil these three
37:11
Julian Hoad: basic criteria first before you
37:14
Julian Hoad: call it sepsis, so absolutely.
37:21
Julian Hoad: And the problem is, the big
37:21
Julian Hoad: problem, of course, is that it
37:27
Julian Hoad: leads to failure of organs.
37:31
Jo Hinde: yeah, and you've
37:31
Jo Hinde: literally, you've got a golden
37:34
Jo Hinde: hour, which mine unfortunately
37:34
Jo Hinde: was missed.
37:39
Jo Hinde: When the ambulance arrived to
37:39
Jo Hinde: come and collect me, because as
37:42
Jo Hinde: you do as veterinary
37:42
Jo Hinde: professional, you think, well, I
37:46
Jo Hinde: can't be that bad.
37:47
Jo Hinde: They told me to expect like a
37:47
Jo Hinde: bad period pain. So there's me
37:51
Jo Hinde: in agony, and you know, but
37:51
Jo Hinde: thinking, well, it can't be that
37:54
Jo Hinde: bad. I'm not going to waste
37:54
Jo Hinde: anybody's time.
37:56
Jo Hinde: And the ambulance crew turn up
37:56
Jo Hinde: and say you're two hours off a
37:59
Jo Hinde: coma, and you go, Oh, okay. But
37:59
Jo Hinde: um, but I wasn't actually
38:03
Jo Hinde: diagnosed with sepsis.
38:06
Jo Hinde: For the first week, really. So
38:06
Jo Hinde: my therapy wasn't started as
38:13
Jo Hinde: quickly as it could. But that's
38:13
Jo Hinde: no detriment to the hospital.
38:18
Jo Hinde: That's just a thing with sepsis.
38:18
Jo Hinde: And I think we suffer from it in
38:23
Jo Hinde: the veterinary field as well.
38:23
Jo Hinde: You go looking for that one
38:25
Jo Hinde: thing.
38:26
Jo Hinde: And because I had a reason to be
38:26
Jo Hinde: there, I had this coil
38:29
Jo Hinde: implanted, therefore, it must be
38:29
Jo Hinde: something to do with that.
38:32
Jo Hinde: And that only, you get blinded
38:32
Jo Hinde: by the one thing when actually
38:36
Jo Hinde: again, it's multifactorial thing
38:36
Jo Hinde: that's going on.
38:40
Mike Brampton: This slide is
38:40
Mike Brampton: from sepsis trust, which is the
38:43
Mike Brampton: organisation you've just
38:43
Mike Brampton: mentioned there Jo
38:45
Jo Hinde: Yes, thank you.
38:45
Julian Hoad: So you're showing a
38:45
Julian Hoad: poster there from the UK sepsis
38:50
Julian Hoad: trust,do you want to talk us
38:50
Julian Hoad: through that poster Mike?
38:53
Mike Brampton: me, I don't feel
38:53
Mike Brampton: qualified i think i mean
38:59
Jo Hinde: I'll give it a go
39:00
Mike Brampton: We have somebdy
39:00
Mike Brampton: here that survived and is still
39:03
Mike Brampton: suffering. Yeah, it's obviously,
39:03
Mike Brampton: it's not a on you're poorly, off
39:08
Mike Brampton: you're better thing, this is
39:08
Mike Brampton: going to drag on for a long time
39:11
Mike Brampton: for Jo.
39:13
Jo Hinde: Potentially. And I
39:13
Jo Hinde: think there's a statistic I read
39:16
Jo Hinde: from the sepsis trust, because
39:16
Jo Hinde: I've done that, again, I've done
39:19
Jo Hinde: the typical thing of reading
39:19
Jo Hinde: lots of information about it.
39:21
Jo Hinde: Only factual information, not
39:21
Jo Hinde: kind of just Dr. Google and chat
39:25
Jo Hinde: rooms. But it's really scary
39:25
Jo Hinde: stuff. 50% of people never go
39:30
Jo Hinde: back to normal after having
39:30
Jo Hinde: sepsis
39:33
Jo Hinde: and I'm just thankful I wasn't
39:33
Jo Hinde: normal before. But yeah, there's
39:40
Jo Hinde: long term cognitive issues, long
39:40
Jo Hinde: term muscle issues. For example,
39:44
Jo Hinde: you know, lots of people lose
39:44
Jo Hinde: limbs.
39:46
Jo Hinde: Thankfully, I have all of mine.
39:46
Jo Hinde: But it's picking up these signs
39:51
Jo Hinde: early, and you can get slightly
39:51
Jo Hinde: different red flag warnings for
39:56
Jo Hinde: children as well.
39:57
Jo Hinde: And these posters are perfect, I
39:57
Jo Hinde: think, for any workplace to just
40:02
Jo Hinde: be aware of any friends or
40:02
Jo Hinde: family, just be aware of, you
40:05
Jo Hinde: know, because and that's why
40:07
Jo Hinde: since coming out of hospital,
40:07
Jo Hinde: I've shared my story very
40:09
Jo Hinde: publicly and quite graphically,
40:09
Jo Hinde: very cringe worthy for me, I'm
40:14
Jo Hinde: kind of hiding behind my
40:14
Jo Hinde: keyboard as I type this stuff,
40:17
Jo Hinde: but just a thought, if I can
40:17
Jo Hinde: help one person, ask their
40:21
Jo Hinde: medical professional Is there
40:21
Jo Hinde: any chance this is sepsis? That
40:25
Jo Hinde: could save their life or their
40:25
Jo Hinde: limb, or you know,
40:28
Jo Hinde: so things like having slurred
40:28
Jo Hinde: speech, I had all of these
40:31
Jo Hinde: things at home but just didn't,
40:31
Jo Hinde: didn't pick up on it.
40:40
Jo Hinde: The extreme shivering and muscle
40:40
Jo Hinde: pain, I felt like I had really,
40:44
Jo Hinde: really bad flu, you know, flu,
40:44
Jo Hinde: where you've got that 50 pound
40:47
Jo Hinde: test
40:47
Jo Hinde: that 50 pound notes on the end
40:47
Jo Hinde: of the bed, and you can't even
40:50
Jo Hinde: reach to get it because you feel
40:50
Jo Hinde: so poorly.
40:54
Jo Hinde: No passing of urine or very
40:54
Jo Hinde: reduced passing of urine.
40:59
Jo Hinde: And the breathlessness. I put
40:59
Jo Hinde: down to pain because my whole
41:02
Jo Hinde: abdomen was in severe pain. Of
41:02
Jo Hinde: course, that pushes on your
41:05
Jo Hinde: diaphragm.
41:06
Jo Hinde: And that means you can't breathe
41:06
Jo Hinde: well anyway. So again, a little
41:10
Jo Hinde: bit of medical knowledge in my
41:10
Jo Hinde: brain is going well, I'm only
41:12
Jo Hinde: breathless because I'm in pain
41:13
Jo Hinde: and it can't be that serious.
41:13
Jo Hinde: And I personally didn't feel
41:17
Jo Hinde: like I might die at that point.
41:17
Jo Hinde: After that, I did quite a few
41:24
Jo Hinde: times
41:27
Jo Hinde: Yeah, there was three times when
41:27
Jo Hinde: one of the consultants came to
41:32
Jo Hinde: see me, on three separate
41:32
Jo Hinde: occasions, and said, Do you want
41:36
Jo Hinde: Do you want to have those phone
41:36
Jo Hinde: calls that you know, it might be
41:36
Jo Hinde: to ring your family?
41:40
Jo Hinde: the last chance to have those
41:40
Jo Hinde: phone calls, thats a strange
41:44
Jo Hinde: position.
41:46
Jo Hinde: Because you, you kind of, you
41:46
Jo Hinde: also want to protect your loved
41:51
Jo Hinde: ones, so you don't. So you do
41:51
Jo Hinde: ring them and you do have these
41:54
Jo Hinde: conversations,
41:55
Jo Hinde: but you don't say, I'm ringing
41:55
Jo Hinde: you, it might be the last time I
41:58
Jo Hinde: speak to you because you know,
41:58
Jo Hinde: I'm going to theatre or, I'm in
42:01
Jo Hinde: ICU or this, this and this
42:03
Jo Hinde: and you kind of hide things from
42:03
Jo Hinde: them to chill them.
42:08
Jo Hinde: And mottled skin, I didn't have
42:08
Jo Hinde: mottled skin, but I was quite
42:12
Jo Hinde: exceptionally pale, but flushed
42:12
Jo Hinde: in the face and blue.
42:16
Jo Hinde: And there's a thing called post
42:16
Jo Hinde: sepsis syndrome PSS, which I'm
42:24
Jo Hinde: officially in. And it is a term,
42:24
Jo Hinde: it is not a well recognised term
42:29
Jo Hinde: within doctors again,
42:31
Jo Hinde: it's something that I'm trying
42:31
Jo Hinde: to raise awareness of, that it
42:34
Jo Hinde: s not like a broken leg or a hea
42:34
Jo Hinde: t attack that you just have t
42:37
Jo Hinde: e treatment and then generally g
42:37
Jo Hinde: t bette
42:40
Jo Hinde: This is something where you do
42:40
Jo Hinde: have to change your life for
42:44
Jo Hinde: quite some time, possibly the
42:44
Jo Hinde: rest of it, to kind of deal with
42:48
Jo Hinde: it and get around things. So
42:51
Julian Hoad: And that's all
42:51
Julian Hoad: really related to the impacts
42:54
Julian Hoad: that these toxins this endotoxic
42:54
Julian Hoad: state has on potentially every
43:00
Julian Hoad: single organ of your body.
43:01
Jo Hinde: Yeah, absolutely.
43:01
Jo Hinde: Because your body basically
43:04
Jo Hinde: attacks itself. And it chews at
43:04
Jo Hinde: anything and everything because
43:08
Jo Hinde: it's overrun with bacteria, and
43:08
Jo Hinde: it can't see good from bad.
43:11
Jo Hinde: And so yeah, every organ gets
43:11
Jo Hinde: it. So thankfully, as yet we
43:16
Jo Hinde: don't think I have any kidney
43:16
Jo Hinde: damage, which I'm very, very
43:20
Jo Hinde: thankful for.
43:22
Jo Hinde: And there is a bit of damage to
43:22
Jo Hinde: my lungs. Certainly, my right
43:28
Jo Hinde: lung was the worst collapsed.
43:30
Jo Hinde: And my SPO2 was averaging at
43:30
Jo Hinde: 88%. And that was even with
43:38
Jo Hinde: supplementation. So I was very
43:38
Jo Hinde: close to having to go on a
43:41
Jo Hinde: ventilator,
43:41
Jo Hinde: but again, too stubborn, and
43:41
Jo Hinde: saying just you know, up the
43:46
Jo Hinde: flow rate, we'll be fine.
43:49
Mike Brampton: Nothing worse
43:49
Mike Brampton: than being attached to a
43:52
Mike Brampton: ventilator. Yeah.
43:54
Jo Hinde: You know, I've seen
43:54
Jo Hinde: what these people with
43:56
Jo Hinde: ventilators do. So
43:58
Julian Hoad: you don't want to
43:58
Julian Hoad: be on a ventilator if you can
44:00
Julian Hoad: help it can you?
44:01
Jo Hinde: No, absolutely not.
44:01
Jo Hinde: Absolutely not.
44:06
Julian Hoad: You made it
44:06
Julian Hoad: through. I mean, my goodness,
44:08
Julian Hoad: what
44:08
Jo Hinde: thank you.
44:13
Julian Hoad: And thanks so much
44:13
Julian Hoad: for sharing your story with us
44:16
Julian Hoad: about that.
44:17
Julian Hoad: I know, it must have dragged up
44:17
Julian Hoad: and continues to drag up,
44:22
Julian Hoad: horrific memories to do that.
44:22
Julian Hoad: But I think, as you say, if
44:25
Julian Hoad: listening to this helps just one
44:25
Julian Hoad: person.
44:29
Jo Hinde: Absolutely. Just be
44:29
Jo Hinde: aware, just have a look on the
44:32
Jo Hinde: website. Have a look at the UK
44:32
Jo Hinde: sepsis trust just to see those
44:36
Jo Hinde: red flags.
44:37
Jo Hinde: And if your child your mother,
44:37
Jo Hinde: your brother, your sister, your
44:39
Jo Hinde: friend, your colleague is
44:39
Jo Hinde: unwell.
44:41
Jo Hinde: And I think certainly in
44:41
Jo Hinde: veterinary you know, we're
44:44
Jo Hinde: getting bitten or scratched all
44:44
Jo Hinde: the time. This must be an
44:46
Jo Hinde: underbelly of sepsis survivors
44:46
Jo Hinde: within our own community.
44:49
Jo Hinde: And I've had a little bit of a
44:49
Jo Hinde: poke around on the social media
44:52
Jo Hinde: forums on Facebook, and a few
44:52
Jo Hinde: people have come forward and
44:56
Jo Hinde: said yes, you know, I've been
44:56
Jo Hinde: through it as well
44:59
Jo Hinde: and I think we're probably one
44:59
Jo Hinde: of those, no one knows why a
45:04
Jo Hinde: person will go into sepsis or
45:04
Jo Hinde: won't, there's no underlying
45:09
Jo Hinde: thing. It's not genetic.
45:10
Jo Hinde: It's not you know, there there's
45:10
Jo Hinde: no reason behind it. However, I
45:15
Jo Hinde: think because we are at a
45:15
Jo Hinde: greater risk of having our, you
45:19
Jo Hinde: know, our skin injured,
45:21
Jo Hinde: then obviously we are at greater
45:21
Jo Hinde: risk of getting infections and
45:25
Jo Hinde: getting unwell and I would be
45:25
Jo Hinde: interested to look and see,
45:29
Jo Hinde: actually how many people have
45:29
Jo Hinde: been affected
45:31
Jo Hinde: or know someone that's been
45:31
Jo Hinde: affected and survived or not,
45:35
Jo Hinde: sadly through sepsis, because it
45:35
Jo Hinde: really is a hidden killer and
45:40
Jo Hinde: I can't remember the exact
45:40
Jo Hinde: stats, but I think it's
45:43
Jo Hinde: something like, sepsis kills in
45:43
Jo Hinde: the UK more people per year,
45:47
Jo Hinde: then a couple of the cancers
45:47
Jo Hinde: combined.
45:50
Jo Hinde: And you think how much we know
45:50
Jo Hinde: about cancer and how much we're
45:53
Jo Hinde: aware about that as a problem.
45:53
Jo Hinde: And yet this is something that
45:57
Jo Hinde: is just silently running around
45:57
Jo Hinde: our hospitals.
46:02
Julian Hoad: It is a horrific
46:02
Julian Hoad: thing. And as you say that vets
46:05
Julian Hoad: and nurses, anyone in the animal
46:05
Julian Hoad: profession, we tend to be a bit
46:09
Julian Hoad: gung ho don't we
46:10
Julian Hoad: Bitten by a cat and you can go
46:10
Julian Hoad: and wash you hand, that's
46:14
Julian Hoad: alright
46:15
Jo Hinde: bit of iodine and
46:15
Jo Hinde: it'll be fine
46:21
Julian Hoad: All of these things
46:21
Julian Hoad: need to be taken very seriously.
46:26
Julian Hoad: Could I ask and don't answer
46:26
Julian Hoad: this if you don't want to but
46:34
Julian Hoad: do you take a stand now against
46:34
Julian Hoad: IUDs? The the risks were there
46:40
Julian Hoad: but they were tiny and
46:41
Jo Hinde: yeah, no, absolutely
46:41
Jo Hinde: not.
46:43
Jo Hinde: I don't have an issue against
46:43
Jo Hinde: IUDs I think they have their
46:48
Jo Hinde: place in treatments. Mine was
46:48
Jo Hinde: purely for contraceptive
46:51
Jo Hinde: reasons,
46:52
Jo Hinde: a lot of people need them for
46:52
Jo Hinde: actual guinee health reasons.
46:58
Jo Hinde: And I was just a statistic, I
46:58
Jo Hinde: was just unlucky. And that's
47:03
Jo Hinde: just the way it goes.
47:06
Jo Hinde: Do I wish I'd never gone for it?
47:06
Jo Hinde: Absolutely, and in my remedial
47:10
Jo Hinde: surgery, Did I say take it out!
47:10
Jo Hinde: then yes, it is gone, it has
47:14
Jo Hinde: left the building.
47:17
Julian Hoad: Thats a different
47:17
Julian Hoad: question isn't it?
47:18
Jo Hinde: Absolutely. But no,
47:18
Jo Hinde: definitely I would never, I
47:23
Jo Hinde: think, I'm a bit too pragmatic
47:23
Jo Hinde: for that, I'm not the sort of
47:25
Jo Hinde: person that's going to scream
47:25
Jo Hinde: and shout
47:27
Jo Hinde: and say that there's a
47:27
Jo Hinde: miscarriage of justice and that
47:29
Jo Hinde: these items are not suitable to
47:29
Jo Hinde: be on the market because
47:32
Jo Hinde: absolutely that's not the case.
47:34
Jo Hinde: We have risks with everything we
47:34
Jo Hinde: do. Everything we do to our
47:38
Jo Hinde: bodies put in and take out of
47:38
Jo Hinde: them. That's just the way that
47:43
Jo Hinde: the cookie crumbles.
47:43
Jo Hinde: And unfortunately, as I tend to
47:43
Jo Hinde: in my life, if I'm going to do
47:49
Jo Hinde: something I'll go ahead and
47:49
Jo Hinde: jolly well do it to the best of
47:51
Jo Hinde: my ability and apparently that
47:51
Jo Hinde: that goes for dying too.
47:56
Mike Brampton: So we're not
47:56
Mike Brampton: going to see you campaigning
47:59
Mike Brampton: against IUD outside the houses
47:59
Mike Brampton: of parliament waving plackades
48:07
Jo Hinde: I do like to Badger
48:07
Jo Hinde: Parliament shall we say but not
48:12
Jo Hinde: for against IUDs. No, absolutely
48:12
Jo Hinde: not.
48:16
Julian Hoad: I think I think we
48:16
Julian Hoad: know what the response would be
48:18
Julian Hoad: don't we? "Oh, you're perfectly
48:18
Julian Hoad: at liberty to use these devices
48:25
Julian Hoad: if you want its up to you.
48:27
Julian Hoad: But But please if you if you do
48:27
Julian Hoad: wear an IUD don't go to work. Or
48:34
Julian Hoad: Barnard castle unless you want
48:34
Julian Hoad: to keep everyone safe. Thank
48:39
Julian Hoad: you"
48:41
Jo Hinde: perfect, perfect.
48:42
Mike Brampton: Who let him in?
48:46
Julian Hoad: I love wearing the
48:46
Julian Hoad: wig it's great my heads warm
48:49
Julian Hoad: when I wear it
48:50
Mike Brampton: So I'm going to
48:50
Mike Brampton: share a couple more photographs,
48:52
Mike Brampton: I'm gonna share my screen again
48:52
Mike Brampton: here and share a couple more
48:54
Mike Brampton: photographs
48:55
Mike Brampton: because you have been known to
48:55
Mike Brampton: protest outside the Houses of
49:01
Mike Brampton: Parliament haven't you?
49:03
Jo Hinde: Absolutely.
49:06
Mike Brampton: Here is apicture
49:06
Mike Brampton: of you holding a placard saying
49:09
Mike Brampton: skin test is inconclusive and
49:09
Mike Brampton: out of date, not fit for purpose
49:14
Mike Brampton: hashtag wake up Defra.
49:18
Mike Brampton: And here's a photograph of lots
49:18
Mike Brampton: of smartly dressed gentlemen.
49:22
Mike Brampton: And you've picked the guy with
49:22
Mike Brampton: the bright orange coat on and
49:27
Mike Brampton: the shagly white hair.
49:29
Jo Hinde: Absolutely. I think
49:29
Jo Hinde: thats one of his favourite rat
49:31
Jo Hinde: coats that's you know, that's
49:31
Jo Hinde: how that's how he rolls.
49:36
Julian Hoad: Could I just say
49:36
Julian Hoad: that this is amazing. There's a
49:38
Julian Hoad: picture of of Jo outside the
49:38
Julian Hoad: house of parliaments
49:46
Jo Hinde: Slightly further,
49:46
Jo Hinde: Yeah. Yes, yes, Brian May.
49:52
Jo Hinde: I'm a big fan of the Save Me
49:52
Jo Hinde: Trust which Bri set up and pre
50:02
Jo Hinde: bvna presidency, I took part in
50:02
Jo Hinde: quite a lot of evidence based
50:11
Jo Hinde: research
50:12
Jo Hinde: and campaigning against the
50:12
Jo Hinde: ineffective and failing badger
50:16
Jo Hinde: cull. As such, there was lots of
50:16
Jo Hinde: parliamentary meetings and
50:20
Jo Hinde: protests as well,
50:22
Jo Hinde: that I attended with a group of
50:22
Jo Hinde: vets and nurses, called vets and
50:28
Jo Hinde: nurses against badger cull
50:30
Mike Brampton: McGill here in
50:30
Mike Brampton: the background.
50:31
Jo Hinde: Ian McGill lurking in
50:31
Jo Hinde: the background absolutely, he
50:34
Jo Hinde: heads it all up. And sadly,
50:34
Jo Hinde: presidential duties come first
50:38
Jo Hinde: and political views have to be
50:38
Jo Hinde: put to one side.
50:41
Jo Hinde: However, political views never
50:41
Jo Hinde: actually go away. You just have
50:46
Jo Hinde: other things to be dealing with.
50:46
Jo Hinde: So those that know me know that
50:53
Jo Hinde: I will be that voice of the
50:53
Jo Hinde: voiceless.
50:55
Jo Hinde: And, however, I do like to think
50:55
Jo Hinde: I'm always pragmatic, and it is
51:00
Jo Hinde: evidence based, and well
51:00
Jo Hinde: researched. I'm not just
51:03
Jo Hinde: shouting for shouty sake.
51:06
Julian Hoad: yes, to our
51:06
Julian Hoad: American cousins listening in to
51:11
Julian Hoad: the show or watching us.
51:14
Julian Hoad: At the moment, we have this
51:14
Julian Hoad: horrific thing going on this
51:17
Julian Hoad: sort of middle aged witch hunt,
51:17
Julian Hoad: whereby badgers, Britain's
51:26
Julian Hoad: largest Preditor, are being
51:26
Julian Hoad: hunted down
51:33
Julian Hoad: and shot, to try and curb the
51:33
Julian Hoad: spread of bovine tuberculosis.
51:41
Julian Hoad: This, despite the fact that it's
51:41
Julian Hoad: been shown by pretty much every
51:46
Julian Hoad: study that culling badges
51:50
Julian Hoad: does not have a long term effect
51:50
Julian Hoad: on reducing bovine tuberculosis.
51:59
Julian Hoad: In fact, it increases the range
51:59
Julian Hoad: and spread of bovine
52:03
Julian Hoad: tuberculosis in most studies.
52:06
Julian Hoad: It is barbaric, its inhumane.
52:06
Julian Hoad: And in a, an era where we're
52:11
Julian Hoad: losing so many wonderful
52:11
Julian Hoad: animals, because we can't keep
52:15
Julian Hoad: the fucking planet safe.
52:17
Julian Hoad: We are deliberately going out
52:17
Julian Hoad: and shooting these wonderful
52:21
Julian Hoad: creatures. Mike and I are quite
52:21
Julian Hoad: emotional a few months back into
52:25
Julian Hoad: this subject.
52:26
Julian Hoad: And I think we will again if
52:26
Julian Hoad: we're not careful, but please
52:29
Julian Hoad: anyone who's listening and can
52:29
Julian Hoad: exert a little bit of pressure.
52:32
Julian Hoad: Just say it's not working. Stop
52:32
Julian Hoad: it.
52:35
Julian Hoad: Oh, and Mike's got someone on
52:35
Julian Hoad: the phone. Now. Mike is on the
52:39
Julian Hoad: hotline to Johnson saying, Okay,
52:39
Julian Hoad: I'll stop it. Now, I didn't
52:42
Julian Hoad: realise there's no evidence,
52:44
Julian Hoad: I always contact Sage to ask
52:44
Julian Hoad: them for information. On this
52:48
Julian Hoad: occasion. On this occasion
52:48
Julian Hoad: alone, they appear to have given
52:50
Julian Hoad: me incorrect or out of date
52:50
Julian Hoad: information.
52:53
Julian Hoad: So I'm very much changed, I
52:53
Julian Hoad: think Thank you for letting me
52:57
Julian Hoad: know. So thanks, Boris for
52:57
Julian Hoad: stopping the badger cull.
53:00
Mike Brampton: That was MI5
53:00
Mike Brampton: saying that Veterinary Ramblings
53:03
Mike Brampton: is beginning to tread very
53:03
Mike Brampton: closely to extreme political
53:09
Mike Brampton: views that are not held by Defra
53:09
Mike Brampton: or the UK government.
53:13
Mike Brampton: The phone call that was the
53:13
Mike Brampton: second one I've had this
53:15
Mike Brampton: evening.
53:16
Jo Hinde: Absolutely. And the
53:16
Jo Hinde: BVA putting a big caveat that Jo
53:20
Jo Hinde: Hinde is not representing their
53:20
Jo Hinde: views right now, either.
53:24
Jo Hinde: I think the other thing that
53:24
Jo Hinde: really frustrates me about the
53:27
Jo Hinde: Badger cull, is the fact that it
53:27
Jo Hinde: is just that carrot of shame
53:32
Jo Hinde: given to the farmers,
53:33
Jo Hinde: these farmers need help, they
53:33
Jo Hinde: need assistance, they need
53:38
Jo Hinde: guidance, and they need tools
53:38
Jo Hinde: that work and things that
53:41
Jo Hinde: actually make a difference.
53:42
Jo Hinde: And the cull is costing them
53:42
Jo Hinde: money, it's costing their
53:46
Jo Hinde: livelihoods, and some of them
53:46
Jo Hinde: it's costing their lives.
53:49
Jo Hinde: And we, as a nation, are failing
53:49
Jo Hinde: them by using methods that are
53:56
Jo Hinde: not going to cure the problem.
53:56
Jo Hinde: So as much as it's about the
54:00
Jo Hinde: cute fluffy endangered
54:00
Jo Hinde: creatures.
54:03
Jo Hinde: For me, also, it's the human
54:03
Jo Hinde: impact, let alone the herd
54:07
Jo Hinde: impact of what they have to go
54:07
Jo Hinde: through. But the human impact of
54:10
Jo Hinde: how this, you know, this tears
54:10
Jo Hinde: their lives apart,
54:14
Jo Hinde: and there are there are better
54:14
Jo Hinde: ways.
54:19
Jo Hinde: Do look it up if you're able to
54:19
Jo Hinde: again, through through the save
54:23
Jo Hinde: me trust
54:30
Mike Brampton: very good point
54:30
Mike Brampton: very well made that Jo, in that
54:34
Mike Brampton: it's very easy to demonise a
54:34
Mike Brampton: whole group of people like the
54:39
Mike Brampton: farmers and
54:41
Mike Brampton: unfortunately a lot of them are
54:41
Mike Brampton: not that knowledgeable or
54:44
Mike Brampton: skilled in biosecurity, etc. And
54:44
Mike Brampton: we tend these days to jump to
54:49
Mike Brampton: these extreme views, don't we?
54:50
Jo Hinde: Yeah, very much so and
54:50
Jo Hinde: you know, it doesn't help when
54:57
Jo Hinde: we ideally need the veterinary
54:57
Jo Hinde: factions all to come together
55:00
Jo Hinde: and sing the same way but
55:00
Jo Hinde: they're never going to.
55:04
Jo Hinde: And so it makes guidance quite
55:04
Jo Hinde: difficult. Yeah, it's a very,
55:10
Jo Hinde: it's a very difficult and
55:10
Jo Hinde: politically sensitive topic.
55:14
Jo Hinde: However, in my mind anyway, if
55:14
Jo Hinde: we look at evidence based
55:18
Jo Hinde: medicine and evidence based
55:18
Jo Hinde: research, then we've got our
55:21
Jo Hinde: information there on what can
55:21
Jo Hinde: and does work.
55:25
Jo Hinde: And really, that should be
55:25
Jo Hinde: pushed through and upheld for
55:28
Jo Hinde: the sake of everybody and
55:28
Jo Hinde: everything. But as you say,
55:31
Jo Hinde: polarising views of what the
55:31
Jo Hinde: world wants in these modern kind
55:37
Jo Hinde: of days in the last few years.
55:37
Jo Hinde: Really, it's been more about
55:40
Jo Hinde: polarisation I feel and
55:40
Jo Hinde: socialisation in,
55:43
Jo Hinde: in general, has become more and
55:43
Jo Hinde: more polarised and yeah, we've
55:50
Jo Hinde: got ourselves into quite a
55:50
Jo Hinde: pickle, really, I think, and the
55:54
Jo Hinde: lovely hashtag of Be kind.
55:57
Jo Hinde: Just really, you know, just
55:57
Jo Hinde: just, it can actually be that
56:02
Jo Hinde: simple. If you just spend your
56:02
Jo Hinde: day going, you know what, I'm
56:04
Jo Hinde: not going to be an ass.
56:05
Jo Hinde: I'm actually just going to be
56:05
Jo Hinde: kind and you can still have a
56:07
Jo Hinde: bad day, and rant and rave and
56:07
Jo Hinde: you know, kick kick, the washing
56:11
Jo Hinde: machine. It doesn't matter
56:12
Jo Hinde: But I'm sure washing machines
56:12
Jo Hinde: lives matter to at some point,
56:16
Jo Hinde: but you know, just take that
56:16
Jo Hinde: take that step back and say,
56:23
Julian Hoad: we're not going to
56:23
Julian Hoad: say white goods Lives Matter.
56:28
Jo Hinde: No.
56:32
Julian Hoad: We don't need to
56:32
Julian Hoad: get into that smeg
56:34
Jo Hinde: No.
56:35
Julian Hoad: We have a challenge
56:35
Julian Hoad: for you, Jo if you feel up to it
56:44
Jo Hinde: Oh, Yeah,
56:46
Mike Brampton: we've got a thing
56:46
Mike Brampton: on the show that we call 60
56:48
Mike Brampton: second CPD. This is the
56:48
Mike Brampton: challenge
56:52
Jo Hinde: Yes,
56:53
Mike Brampton: let's get the
56:53
Mike Brampton: clock ready.
56:56
Jo Hinde: like the countdown
56:56
Jo Hinde: timer doo doo doo doo doo doo.
57:00
Julian Hoad: For legal reasons
57:00
Julian Hoad: we can't use that.
57:03
Jo Hinde: Other game shows are
57:03
Jo Hinde: available.
57:07
Mike Brampton: Here we go then.
57:07
Mike Brampton: We've got the timer. Ready for
57:11
Mike Brampton: 60 second CPD with Jo Hinde.
57:11
Mike Brampton: What are you going to talk about
57:14
Mike Brampton: Jo?
57:15
Jo Hinde: I'm going to talk
57:15
Jo Hinde: about rabbit nutrition,
57:17
Mike Brampton: rabbit nutrition.
57:17
Mike Brampton: Okay, 60 seconds starting now.
57:22
Jo Hinde: Okay, so the
57:22
Jo Hinde: cornerstone to good rabbit
57:24
Jo Hinde: health is good nutrition. And
57:24
Jo Hinde: it's really important, you know
57:28
Jo Hinde: what that comprises off.
57:29
Jo Hinde: So hay is the most important
57:29
Jo Hinde: thing. And it's a vital part of
57:32
Jo Hinde: their diet, they should eat a
57:32
Jo Hinde: ball of hay, at least the same
57:36
Jo Hinde: size of their body every single
57:36
Jo Hinde: day.
57:38
Jo Hinde: As well as this they can have
57:38
Jo Hinde: some pellets, they need to be
57:41
Jo Hinde: good quality and extruded
57:41
Jo Hinde: pellets.
57:43
Jo Hinde: And there's only two companies
57:43
Jo Hinde: on the market at the moment that
57:46
Jo Hinde: provide extremely pellets. So
57:46
Jo Hinde: look out for those.
57:48
Jo Hinde: And they need to be very high in
57:48
Jo Hinde: crude fibre, not beneficial
57:51
Jo Hinde: fibre, but crude fibre. They
57:51
Jo Hinde: only need, adults only need a
57:55
Jo Hinde: tablespoon of pellets per kilo
57:55
Jo Hinde: of ideal weight per day.
58:00
Jo Hinde: And they can also have some
58:00
Jo Hinde: fresh herbs and veggies. That's
58:03
Jo Hinde: no bigger than a small handful
58:03
Jo Hinde: no bigger than the rabbits own
58:05
Jo Hinde: head per day.
58:07
Jo Hinde: So everything is about that hay
58:07
Jo Hinde: and alfalfa is not the devil. It
58:11
Jo Hinde: has vital calcium in it so
58:11
Jo Hinde: pellets made of alfalfa are fine
58:15
Jo Hinde: they're not going to cause any
58:15
Jo Hinde: damage to healthy rabbits.
58:19
Julian Hoad: Wow
58:20
Mike Brampton: good
58:22
Julian Hoad: and were there
58:23
Jo Hinde: There we go.
58:24
Julian Hoad: Do you remember
58:24
Julian Hoad: when a certain, I won't say the
58:27
Julian Hoad: name of the food because i'll be
58:27
Julian Hoad: sued but it was a man's name
58:33
Julian Hoad: rabbit and it's a mix
58:36
Julian Hoad: a lovely little mix of food and
58:36
Julian Hoad: he said, at the time we're all
58:42
Julian Hoad: told as vets, that's fine as a
58:42
Julian Hoad: good food is a very well rounded
58:46
Julian Hoad: food but you must make sure they
58:46
Julian Hoad: eat the peas
58:48
Julian Hoad: and the sweet corn because
58:48
Julian Hoad: otherwise and so we were saying
58:52
Julian Hoad: to people is he eating more
58:52
Julian Hoad: peas?
58:55
Julian Hoad: Definitely. Can you can you
58:55
Julian Hoad: take some of the peas out?
59:02
Jo Hinde: it's bizarre it's
59:02
Jo Hinde: bizarre things we do but we do
59:05
Jo Hinde: it to the best of our knowledge
59:05
Jo Hinde: at that time
59:09
Julian Hoad: clients want to
59:09
Julian Hoad: feed something that looks to
59:12
Julian Hoad: them nice
59:14
Jo Hinde: Absolutely. And and
59:14
Jo Hinde: you know any vet professional
59:20
Jo Hinde: knows, that owners think that
59:20
Jo Hinde: their pets get bored with their
59:24
Jo Hinde: food and they don't, we know
59:24
Jo Hinde: they don't,
59:29
Jo Hinde: they're just happy to have food
59:29
Jo Hinde: but if we've got someone as a
59:32
Jo Hinde: you know we can put our floppy
59:32
Jo Hinde: ears on and our puppy eyes on
59:35
Jo Hinde: and and get something more yummy
59:37
Jo Hinde: then we're going to push it and
59:37
Jo Hinde: rabbits are no different and
59:40
Jo Hinde: they've got an exceptionally
59:40
Jo Hinde: sweet tooth. So yes, they love
59:44
Jo Hinde: all the things they shouldn't
59:44
Jo Hinde: love.
59:48
Jo Hinde: But yeah, we have we have a duty
59:48
Jo Hinde: to keep them well and as I tend
59:51
Jo Hinde: to say in my lectures is if my
59:51
Jo Hinde: parents had never fed me cake, I
59:55
Jo Hinde: would be thin.
59:58
Jo Hinde: If you've never had it, you
59:58
Jo Hinde: don't miss it. And things are
1:00:02
Jo Hinde: always evolving, you know, it
1:00:02
Jo Hinde: was only probably about 5-6.
1:00:06
Jo Hinde: Actually, I'm probably kidding
1:00:06
Jo Hinde: myself probably about 10 years
1:00:08
Jo Hinde: ago now that the hay and greens
1:00:08
Jo Hinde: diet was the way to go and
1:00:11
Jo Hinde: pellets wre the devil
1:00:12
Jo Hinde: and you shouldn't have them. And
1:00:12
Jo Hinde: and it's just simply not true.
1:00:15
Jo Hinde: You know, pellets are a vital
1:00:15
Jo Hinde: part of the foodstuff, they are
1:00:20
Jo Hinde: the vitamin supplement,
1:00:21
Jo Hinde: we cannot provide the whole
1:00:21
Jo Hinde: range of nutrients and in the
1:00:26
Jo Hinde: correct quantities and
1:00:26
Jo Hinde: percentages that these rabbits
1:00:29
Jo Hinde: need, just through hay and veg
1:00:29
Jo Hinde: alone.
1:00:32
Jo Hinde: Because a wild rabbit has access
1:00:32
Jo Hinde: to the whole supermarket, our
1:00:36
Jo Hinde: domestic rabbits have access to
1:00:36
Jo Hinde: half an aisle with what we give
1:00:39
Jo Hinde: them.
1:00:39
Jo Hinde: And if we were to try and give
1:00:39
Jo Hinde: them all of their, I think it's
1:00:53
Jo Hinde: 26 different nutrients that they
1:00:53
Jo Hinde: need, we need to know the RDA
1:00:56
Jo Hinde: for that rabbit at that age, at
1:00:56
Jo Hinde: that weight
1:00:59
Jo Hinde: with whatever co-morbidities is
1:00:59
Jo Hinde: got. And then look at that piece
1:01:02
Jo Hinde: of cabbage and say, right, of
1:01:02
Jo Hinde: those 26 nutrients, what's in
1:01:07
Jo Hinde: there, at what percentage,
1:01:08
Jo Hinde: then we've got to add that to
1:01:08
Jo Hinde: something else, and do the math
1:01:12
Jo Hinde: to work out what they need for
1:01:12
Jo Hinde: that day. Otherwise, we're under
1:01:15
Jo Hinde: or over feeding.
1:01:16
Jo Hinde: I mean, no one's got time for
1:01:16
Jo Hinde: that, even if we could,
1:01:20
Julian Hoad: They haven't got
1:01:20
Julian Hoad: the intimate knowledge of the
1:01:24
Julian Hoad: RDA for all these things.
1:01:25
Jo Hinde: Absolutely.
1:01:28
Julian Hoad: So we do the best
1:01:28
Julian Hoad: we can and I think your
1:01:31
Julian Hoad: encapsulation of that subject in
1:01:31
Julian Hoad: 60 seconds is absolutely
1:01:37
Julian Hoad: incredible.
1:01:39
Julian Hoad: We are well recognised, mainly
1:01:39
Julian Hoad: by just the two of us, actually,
1:01:44
Julian Hoad: but we're recognised as
1:01:44
Julian Hoad: suppliers of a good quality CPD.
1:01:49
Julian Hoad: And, and we I think we need a
1:01:49
Julian Hoad: certificate
1:01:54
Mike Brampton: Have we got a
1:01:54
Mike Brampton: certificate?
1:01:56
Julian Hoad: Let me have a look.
1:01:56
Julian Hoad: I do actually just here.
1:02:00
Jo Hinde: lovely choice of car
1:02:00
Jo Hinde: there. Look at that. Hey,
1:02:03
Julian Hoad: I'm going to be
1:02:03
Julian Hoad: wrong here. I think that's a
1:02:07
Julian Hoad: Jaguar D type. But it's about
1:02:07
Julian Hoad: 1960s 1950s and that was taken
1:02:17
Julian Hoad: at Goodwood during the festival
1:02:17
Julian Hoad: speed,
1:02:19
Jo Hinde: Fabulous
1:02:20
Julian Hoad: There's a rabbit
1:02:21
Mike Brampton: there's a picture
1:02:21
Mike Brampton: of a rabbit there.
1:02:23
Jo Hinde: Oh, but you failed
1:02:23
Jo Hinde: Julian, he's on his own.
1:02:28
Julian Hoad: There are 50 others
1:02:28
Julian Hoad: he was okay.
1:02:31
Julian Hoad: That's a wild rabbit.
1:02:32
Jo Hinde: I know a little
1:02:32
Jo Hinde: Cottontail
1:02:36
Julian Hoad: and look at it,
1:02:36
Julian Hoad: you'll appreciate this because
1:02:39
Julian Hoad: you said one of your other
1:02:39
Julian Hoad: pleasures is trying to find a
1:02:41
Julian Hoad: decent vegan restaurant.
1:02:43
Julian Hoad: Ah, and so I've got a picture
1:02:43
Julian Hoad: here of red onion being chopped
1:02:47
Julian Hoad: up. Because the vegan meal I
1:02:47
Julian Hoad: made, it just looked a bit like
1:02:52
Julian Hoad: slops.
1:02:53
Julian Hoad: But there's this lovely picture
1:02:53
Julian Hoad: of that
1:02:56
Jo Hinde: brilliant
1:02:57
Julian Hoad: and the certificate
1:02:57
Julian Hoad: says 'A certificate to show
1:03:01
Julian Hoad: we've done it again. Veterinary
1:03:01
Julian Hoad: Ramblings has aced the eclectic
1:03:06
Julian Hoad: CPD. Didn't we do well, thats
1:03:06
Julian Hoad: signed him and me, Mike and
1:03:13
Julian Hoad: Julian.'
1:03:15
Jo Hinde: Fabulous.
1:03:16
Mike Brampton: Download that
1:03:16
Mike Brampton: certificate
1:03:18
Jo Hinde: cricket clap.
1:03:19
Mike Brampton: Yeah. Download
1:03:19
Mike Brampton: that certificate present that to
1:03:22
Mike Brampton: the RCVS as certification of
1:03:22
Mike Brampton: completing your CPD.
1:03:26
Julian Hoad: Well we've had the
1:03:26
Julian Hoad: CPD thrust at us. We've got it.
1:03:32
Julian Hoad: We've got reflect on it.
1:03:34
Jo Hinde: It's all about the
1:03:34
Jo Hinde: reflection. reflection.
1:03:38
Mike Brampton: So Jo, would you
1:03:38
Mike Brampton: be kind enough, May I invite you
1:03:41
Mike Brampton: to reflect upon the CPD that we
1:03:41
Mike Brampton: have provided this evening?
1:03:48
Jo Hinde: Gosh, well, I think I
1:03:48
Jo Hinde: mean, it's been an eclectic mix
1:03:52
Jo Hinde: for sure. Absolutely. I mean,
1:03:52
Jo Hinde: superb delivery from both of the
1:03:59
Jo Hinde: hosts, obviously. Brilliant.
1:04:07
Julian Hoad: Very nice. So we're
1:04:07
Julian Hoad: just gonna reflect so we're
1:04:11
Julian Hoad: gonna just oh
1:04:22
Jo Hinde: hmm.
1:04:30
Julian Hoad: Never had sound
1:04:30
Julian Hoad: effects before
1:04:32
Mike Brampton: Your the first
1:04:32
Mike Brampton: guest who has done sound effects
1:04:34
Mike Brampton: for us it's good stuff.
1:04:39
Julian Hoad: Good stuff.
1:04:40
Mike Brampton: Indeed. So you're
1:04:40
Mike Brampton: gonna spoil the whole show with
1:04:42
Mike Brampton: a joker then Julian?
1:04:44
Julian Hoad: I'm gonna ruin the
1:04:44
Julian Hoad: whole thing with a joke. We
1:04:48
Julian Hoad: haven't had a rude joke for ages
1:04:53
Jo Hinde: that's not my
1:04:53
Jo Hinde: influence in any way, shape or
1:04:56
Jo Hinde: form.
1:04:56
Mike Brampton: Brace yourself,
1:04:56
Mike Brampton: Jo.
1:04:57
Julian Hoad: I wanted to do
1:04:57
Julian Hoad: something surgical, but fairly
1:05:00
Julian Hoad: light hearted But yeah, I
1:05:00
Julian Hoad: couldn't find any jokes,
1:05:05
Julian Hoad: fortunately, about sepsis. And
1:05:05
Julian Hoad: please don't send us any jokes
1:05:09
Julian Hoad: in about sepsis it will be the
1:05:09
Julian Hoad: height of bad taste
1:05:12
Jo Hinde: Send them to me
1:05:14
Julian Hoad: But this man, he
1:05:14
Julian Hoad: goes to the doctor and he says
1:05:16
Julian Hoad: "I don't know what's wrong but
1:05:16
Julian Hoad: recently I've had severe pain it
1:05:21
Julian Hoad: starts, starts on my left side,
1:05:21
Julian Hoad: waist level,
1:05:25
Julian Hoad: and it goes all the way up,
1:05:25
Julian Hoad: round by my shoulders, around
1:05:28
Julian Hoad: the back of the neck, round my
1:05:28
Julian Hoad: other shoulder, all the way down
1:05:32
Julian Hoad: the other side, ends up right
1:05:32
Julian Hoad: hand side roundabout,
1:05:35
Julian Hoad: around the waist level, really
1:05:35
Julian Hoad: severe pain" and the doctor says
1:05:39
Julian Hoad: "there could be a number of
1:05:39
Julian Hoad: things, he says let's examine,
1:05:45
Julian Hoad: take your clothes off"
1:05:46
Julian Hoad: so he takes his clothes off,
1:05:46
Julian Hoad: takes his shirt off, takes his
1:05:49
Julian Hoad: trousers off, and the doctor
1:05:49
Julian Hoad: goes "Whoa. Goodness me that's
1:05:53
Julian Hoad: a, very proud of that aren't
1:05:53
Julian Hoad: you, sir."
1:05:59
Julian Hoad: "Rather,rather large for your
1:05:59
Julian Hoad: fella down there." "Thanks very
1:06:08
Julian Hoad: much." "I think that's the
1:06:08
Julian Hoad: problem." "What do you mean?"
1:06:14
Julian Hoad: "I think thats the problem, i
1:06:14
Julian Hoad: think i think it's the weight of
1:06:17
Julian Hoad: that and it's it's sort of a
1:06:17
Julian Hoad: pulling your whole groin area
1:06:20
Julian Hoad: and causing this pain"
1:06:22
Julian Hoad: He said "Your joking?" " No, I
1:06:22
Julian Hoad: think that's what it is. I'll
1:06:27
Julian Hoad: refer you to a specialist" so he
1:06:27
Julian Hoad: sees a specialist
1:06:29
Julian Hoad: and the specialist says "How can
1:06:29
Julian Hoad: I help?" "Well I've got this
1:06:34
Julian Hoad: pain starts waist level on the
1:06:34
Julian Hoad: left hand side, goes to the
1:06:40
Julian Hoad: shoulders,
1:06:40
Julian Hoad: back of my neck, round, back
1:06:40
Julian Hoad: down to the right hand side.
1:06:47
Julian Hoad: Cause a real twinging pain on
1:06:47
Julian Hoad: the right hand side"
1:06:52
Julian Hoad: "the doctor thinks its penile
1:06:52
Julian Hoad: gravitas doesn't he, pop the
1:06:57
Julian Hoad: trouser down let's have a look."
1:06:57
Julian Hoad: "Well Goodness me. Yes, that's
1:07:03
Julian Hoad: certainly the problem."
1:07:04
Julian Hoad: "So well how can I get rid of
1:07:04
Julian Hoad: it? Because this is really my
1:07:08
Julian Hoad: life, I can't, this pain it
1:07:08
Julian Hoad: starting again right around the
1:07:12
Julian Hoad: waist."
1:07:17
Julian Hoad: We're gonna have to perform a
1:07:17
Julian Hoad: penile amputation. Yes, take
1:07:22
Julian Hoad: the most of it off."
1:07:25
Julian Hoad: "There's no other way." "No, no
1:07:25
Julian Hoad: other way I'm afraid No. You
1:07:31
Julian Hoad: will never look back and you'll
1:07:31
Julian Hoad: be fine."
1:07:32
Julian Hoad: So he books him in and the guy
1:07:32
Julian Hoad: needs something, he's in such
1:07:36
Julian Hoad: pain, so he goes in for the
1:07:36
Julian Hoad: surgery and has it done and he
1:07:42
Julian Hoad: lifts the sheet up afterwards.
1:07:46
Julian Hoad: Almost all gone. And, and he's
1:07:46
Julian Hoad: bereft and you know, a month
1:07:53
Julian Hoad: later he still is still feeling
1:07:53
Julian Hoad: very depressed about all this.
1:07:57
Julian Hoad: But the pain is still there.
1:07:57
Julian Hoad: He's wearing loose clothes so
1:08:05
Julian Hoad: nothing's pressing on there but
1:08:05
Julian Hoad: the pain is diminished a bit but
1:08:08
Julian Hoad: it's still there.
1:08:09
Julian Hoad: And he goes to see a
1:08:09
Julian Hoad: psychologist he says to him
1:08:14
Julian Hoad: "you've got low self esteem
1:08:14
Julian Hoad: because you had this huge great
1:08:19
Julian Hoad: tally whacker and it's been it's
1:08:19
Julian Hoad: been removed,
1:08:21
Julian Hoad: a tiny little thing now." "So
1:08:21
Julian Hoad: what do I do? Do I need
1:08:24
Julian Hoad: antidepressants?" "You just need
1:08:24
Julian Hoad: to make yourself feel good, tell
1:08:29
Julian Hoad: you what I'll give you the name
1:08:29
Julian Hoad: of my tailor
1:08:31
Julian Hoad: Saville Row Tailor, you go to
1:08:31
Julian Hoad: him, get a new suit, you'll be a
1:08:37
Julian Hoad: new man honestly, you'll feel so
1:08:37
Julian Hoad: wonderful wandering around in
1:08:40
Julian Hoad: the streets
1:08:42
Julian Hoad: Everyone will look at you and
1:08:42
Julian Hoad: say oh what a nice suit and
1:08:44
Julian Hoad: you'll think well gosh I must be
1:08:44
Julian Hoad: someone, it'll really help."
1:08:48
Julian Hoad: So he goes to the tailor and the
1:08:48
Julian Hoad: tailor measures him up and "yeah
1:08:53
Julian Hoad: that's all good, inside leg,
1:08:53
Julian Hoad: There we go." And he says "so.
1:08:57
Julian Hoad: Which side do you dress"
1:09:00
Julian Hoad: "sorry?" "Which side do you
1:09:00
Julian Hoad: dress?" Well I dunno" he sort of
1:09:08
Julian Hoad: thinks probably changed now
1:09:08
Julian Hoad: hasn't it?
1:09:13
Julian Hoad: "Does it matter?" "Oh, yes, if
1:09:13
Julian Hoad: you dress up in the wrong side
1:09:16
Julian Hoad: you get an awful pain that
1:09:16
Julian Hoad: starts off on the left, and it
1:09:19
Julian Hoad: goes right up to the shoulder
1:09:19
Julian Hoad: and back to the other side"
1:09:31
Mike Brampton: Have you not got
1:09:31
Mike Brampton: a rabbit joke?
1:09:36
Julian Hoad: Go on tell us the
1:09:36
Julian Hoad: rabbit joke.
1:09:37
Mike Brampton: Well, the one
1:09:37
Mike Brampton: about the rabbit that goes to
1:09:39
Mike Brampton: the pub.
1:09:39
Julian Hoad: Yeah,
1:09:40
Mike Brampton: He goes "I'll
1:09:40
Mike Brampton: have pint of beer and a toasty
1:09:42
Mike Brampton: please". Barman says "okay"
1:09:42
Mike Brampton: gives him a pint of beer, makes
1:09:47
Mike Brampton: him a cheese toastie.
1:09:48
Mike Brampton: Rabbit drink the beer, eats the
1:09:48
Mike Brampton: toasty, goes back to the bar
1:09:52
Mike Brampton: says "pint of beer and cheese
1:09:52
Mike Brampton: toastie"
1:09:55
Mike Brampton: Barman says "sorry we've run out
1:09:55
Mike Brampton: of cheese, you'll have to have a
1:09:57
Mike Brampton: ham toasty." "Okay, pint of beer
1:09:57
Mike Brampton: and ham toasty."
1:10:01
Mike Brampton: So gets a ham toasty. Drinks the
1:10:01
Mike Brampton: beer. Eats the ham toasty.
1:10:06
Mike Brampton: Goes back up to the bar "pint of
1:10:06
Mike Brampton: beer and a ham toasty." "Sorry,
1:10:10
Mike Brampton: Mr. Rabbit. We've run out of ham
1:10:10
Mike Brampton: now. I could do you tuna melt
1:10:15
Mike Brampton: toasty or something like that."
1:10:15
Mike Brampton: "Okay."
1:10:18
Mike Brampton: "Pint of beer, tuna melt
1:10:18
Mike Brampton: toasty." Drinks the beer, eats
1:10:22
Mike Brampton: the toasty. "Last orders,
1:10:22
Mike Brampton: please"
1:10:25
Mike Brampton: The rabbit goes out to the front
1:10:25
Mike Brampton: of the pub as if he's looking t
1:10:30
Mike Brampton: leave, and he throws up all o
1:10:30
Mike Brampton: er the front door of the pub.
1:10:35
Mike Brampton: And the barman said, "you silly
1:10:35
Mike Brampton: Mr. Rabbit. You shouldn't have
1:10:39
Mike Brampton: drunk all that beer." Rabbit
1:10:39
Mike Brampton: looks at him and says "it wasn't
1:10:43
Mike Brampton: beer. It's because I'm mixing me
1:10:43
Mike Brampton: toasties"
1:10:54
Jo Hinde: Definitely get your
1:10:54
Jo Hinde: rabbits vaccinated.
1:10:58
Mike Brampton: Have your rabbits
1:10:58
Mike Brampton: vaccinated against myxomatosis,
1:11:01
Mike Brampton: its not a very pleasant diseases
1:11:01
Mike Brampton: is it?
1:11:03
Jo Hinde: No really quite awful.
1:11:05
Mike Brampton: I don't know.
1:11:05
Mike Brampton: There we go. So have you enjoyed
1:11:07
Mike Brampton: yourself, Jo?
1:11:08
Jo Hinde: Fabulous. It's been
1:11:08
Jo Hinde: really nice. Thank you. It's
1:11:11
Jo Hinde: been great to see you guys
1:11:11
Jo Hinde: because it feels like a very
1:11:14
Jo Hinde: long time since catching up.
1:11:16
Julian Hoad: Thank you so so
1:11:16
Julian Hoad: much for coming onto the show
1:11:19
Julian Hoad: tonight. And sharing so much
1:11:19
Julian Hoad: with us.
1:11:24
Jo Hinde: Thank you for having
1:11:24
Jo Hinde: me.
1:11:26
Mike Brampton: It's been a great
1:11:26
Mike Brampton: experience. Thank you very much,
1:11:28
Mike Brampton: Jo So Jo Hinde. Thank you very
1:11:28
Mike Brampton: much indeed for joining us on
1:11:33
Mike Brampton: veterinary ramblings.
1:11:34
Mike Brampton: And remember, if you've enjoyed
1:11:34
Mike Brampton: what you've heard, or enjoyed
1:11:37
Mike Brampton: what you've seen, don't forget
1:11:37
Mike Brampton: to click like, follow and share
1:11:42
Mike Brampton: to all your friends
1:11:42
Mike Brampton: or anybody else that you may
1:11:42
Mike Brampton: think will enjoy what we put
1:11:48
Mike Brampton: out. And don't forget to
1:11:48
Mike Brampton: subscribe so that we can keep
1:11:52
Mike Brampton: doing what we do.
1:11:53
Mike Brampton: Jo Hine, Thank you very much
1:11:53
Mike Brampton: indeed. My your dog go with you.
1:11:57
Julian Hoad: May your dog go
1:11:57
Julian Hoad: with you. Thank you, Jo.
1:12:00
Jo Hinde: May your dog go with
1:12:00
Jo Hinde: you
1:12:01
Mike Brampton: Good night. Cut.
1:12:05
Jo Hinde: Thank you. So yeah,
1:12:05
Jo Hinde: no, no really good. And really
1:12:08
Jo Hinde: nice to actually do something if
1:12:08
Jo Hinde: that makes sense.
1:12:13
Jo Hinde: This is week. Well, I don't even
1:12:13
Jo Hinde: know what week, 24th of
1:12:17
Jo Hinde: September was the last time I
1:12:17
Jo Hinde: was well.
1:12:21
Jo Hinde: So so it feels like a very long
1:12:21
Jo Hinde: time since since I've done
1:12:25
Jo Hinde: anything.
1:12:26
Jo Hinde: And certainly anything career
1:12:26
Jo Hinde: related, veterinary related.
1:12:29
Jo Hinde: So yeah, it's really nice to,
1:12:29
Jo Hinde: even though it's just rambling
1:12:34
Jo Hinde: on but then again, that's kind
1:12:34
Jo Hinde: of what I do anyway.
1:12:38
Jo Hinde: My lecture style.
1:12:41
Julian Hoad: That's why we set
1:12:41
Julian Hoad: it up. So we found that
1:12:42
Julian Hoad: actually, out of our lectures,
1:12:42
Julian Hoad: there's 5 minutes take home
1:12:46
Julian Hoad: message if if that and the rest
1:12:46
Julian Hoad: is rambling,
1:12:50
Julian Hoad: which is all good fun, and very
1:12:50
Julian Hoad: much needed. I think in the
1:12:53
Julian Hoad: world.
1:12:54
Jo Hinde: I like this rambling
1:12:54
Jo Hinde: style of just just being real, I
1:12:57
Jo Hinde: think and just being open and
1:12:57
Jo Hinde: honest.
1:13:02
Julian Hoad: Well, we've enjoyed
1:13:02
Julian Hoad: having you. Thank you.
1:13:03
Jo Hinde: Thank you. Appreciate
1:13:03
Jo Hinde: it. Thanks, guys.
1:13:07
Mike Brampton: Brilliant. You
1:13:07
Mike Brampton: mind how you go and get well
1:13:08
Mike Brampton: soon.
1:13:09
Jo Hinde: Yep. Take care. Bye.
1:13:09
Jo Hinde: Bye.
1:13:16
Julian Hoad: It's amazing. What
1:13:16
Julian Hoad: a hell of a journey.
1:13:21
Mike Brampton: What a story.
1:13:21
Mike Brampton: Yeah, what a story.