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Unwanted Robots, Disappearing Red Bull, and Shoppers to Light Up Morrisons | GrocerTalk · GrocerTalk

• 0:00
  It's Grocery Shop Week and we are recording in person in Las Vegas on the eve of the show.
• 0:05
  This is the week for grocery retail technology.
• 0:09
  Yet tech is nothing without adoption from either colleagues or shoppers.
• 0:14
  And we have two timely stories today that puts all this into focus.
• 0:18
  One, an emerging use case from an existing technology.
• 0:21
  And the second, where the people of Sheffield, England said, not so much.
• 0:26
  Plus, as many of you make the trip out to the desert, we give you our grocery shop preview.
• 0:31
  So welcome to Grocertalk.
• 0:35
  I feel like last year it was like, AI is here, it's happening.
• 0:38
  And this year it's like, okay, what are you actually doing about it?
• 0:40
  What's working?
• 0:41
  What's changing?
• 0:42
  We need it as an industry to move to volume based growth, not value based growth.
• 0:49
  We have the technology, but we do not have the infrastructure.
• 0:53
  Another public delisting to make points.
• 0:56
  Well, I love their PDPs.
• 0:58
  I do have to say, well, first of all, I do not support vandalism.
• 1:01
  There is a beautiful Las Vegas skyline out to us.
• 1:04
  The app is helping you discover new things and then in store, this tech is helping you find the products.
• 1:12
  Hello, everyone.
• 1:13
  I'm your host, Ben Miller.
• 1:14
  And this week we've got yet another fantastic guest host.
• 1:18
  So a very warm welcome to Lauren Levak Gilbert, executive director of the Digital Shelf Institute.
• 1:26
  Hi, Lauren.
• 1:26
  Hi, Ben.
• 1:27
  Thanks so much for having me.
• 1:28
  It's nice to see you.
• 1:28
  Oh, my gosh.
• 1:29
  Welcome to Las Vegas.
• 1:30
  Thank you.
• 1:31
  It's so cool to be here actually in person doing this.
• 1:34
  I know it's rare that we get to do that from across the pond to Boston.
• 1:37
  I love it.
• 1:38
  This is great.
• 1:38
  Love it.
• 1:39
  Look.
• 1:39
  So, Lauren, for anybody who's not familiar with the Digital Shelf Institute, what do you guys do there?
• 1:44
  Yeah.
• 1:44
  So the Digital Shelf Institute, or the DSI for short, because sometimes that's a lot of words to say.
• 1:49
  It is a community of brands, retailers, thought leaders, partners in the space.
• 1:53
  We have about 11,000 members, which I'm really excited about.
• 1:56
  That's a lot.
• 1:57
  Yes.
• 1:57
  We hit 11,000 this year.
• 1:59
  Congratulations.
• 1:59
  Thank you.
• 2:00
  And we focus on creating content, doing events, bringing people together, and focusing on the crazy world of commerce we live in.
• 2:06
  Love that, love that alone.
• 2:08
  What does your week here at Grocery Shop hold?
• 2:11
  You're going to be on stage, aren't?
• 2:12
  Yes, I'm really excited.
• 2:14
  I'm presenting with Ashley Becker from Craft.
• 2:16
  So.
• 2:16
  So our session is on Wednesday at 9:50.
• 2:18
  Check us out.
• 2:20
  We're really excited.
• 2:20
  We're going to talk about all things the digital shelf, the agentic shelf, and how you should be thinking about your content and your pdp.
• 2:27
  So I'm really excited about that.
• 2:28
  And then I have a presentation with Instacart tomorrow.
• 2:31
  I'm really excited about that as well.
• 2:32
  And I'm recording a couple podcasts.
• 2:34
  Very good, very good.
• 2:35
  Well, keeping you busy.
• 2:36
  I thought we'd like.
• 2:37
  And look, it's a really big week this week for Grossertalk and Omnitalk Constant.
• 2:42
  Chris and I have both got a couple of onstage sessions that we're doing, and we've got an amazing lineup of retail executives that are going to join us for interviews.
• 2:49
  So we're going to be interviewing executives from Kroger, Sam's Club, Hy Vee, Costco, Albertsons, Instacart, Ajo Delez.
• 2:57
  Oh, my goodness, you got a stack there.
• 3:00
  It's going to be rammed.
• 3:01
  So I think we've got about 12 interviews and we're going to bring them all right across the Omnitalk podcast network.
• 3:06
  So look, we're here with our partners, Fusion, and we're going to be on stand 913 for the full show.
• 3:12
  So do please come and say hello and catch all of our interviews across all of our channels as the week goes on.
• 3:18
  Excited to listen to those.
• 3:20
  All right, let's get into this one.
• 3:21
  Let's get into this week's Grocery Talk, which is of course brought to you with the help and support of Instacart Enterprise, Portager, Vuzion and Sifter.
• 3:31
  And in this week's Grocery Talk, we've got news on Target appointing a new chief marketing and guest experience, Morrisons, to launch Shop to Light for its customers, Kroger pulling Red Bull from its stores.
• 3:45
  And we preview the week ahead here at Grocery Shop 2026.
• 3:50
  But we start with news out of the UK and for a setback for autonomous delivery.
• 3:56
  Headline number one is brought to you by Instacart Enterprise, which gives grocery businesses the technology to grow online and in store with one modular platform built for how grocery actually work, built to scale with you.
• 4:09
  Learn more at company.instacart.com GroceTalk and headline number one comes from retailsystems.com which shares the findings of a YouGov survey even which found that 49% of a sample of over 5,000 British adults felt that delivery robots should not be
• 4:32
  allowed on pavement, and only 30% believe they should.
• 4:36
  A further four in five of those surveyed had concerns of the impact on those with mobility or sight issues.
• 4:44
  The article went on to report that the poll had been commissioned by Living Street, a charity dedicated to the promotion of protecting everyday walking environments.
• 4:55
  So make of that what you will for.
• 4:57
  The campaign comes on the heels of news last month that autonomous delivery company Starship Technologies had ended its pilot in Sheffield, uk, after just five months, amid reports of deliberate damage, including graffiti reading off our streets straight onto
• 5:14
  the robots and traffic cones being placed behind them to stop them moving.
• 5:20
  Lauren, we've covered a number of stories on the expansion of drone delivery on Grossertalk recently, so I'm really keen to hear your thoughts on autonomous delivery for commerce.
• 5:30
  Do the good people of Sheffield demonstrate legitimate concerns here, or should we next be expecting them to be out breaking farm machinery?
• 5:41
  Well, first of all, I do not support vandalism, ever.
• 5:43
  So let's.
• 5:44
  Let's put that out for the record.
• 5:45
  I think the other thing is we've seen this in a lot of different places.
• 5:48
  I was in Chicago a couple of weeks ago, and there was a big backup of robots on the sidewalk, and they were all trying to get around each other, and they couldn't, and they were blocking the sidewalk.
• 5:57
  So this happens in a lot of different places.
• 5:59
  And I think it's a perfect example of we have the technology, but we do not have the infrastructure.
• 6:05
  Okay.
• 6:06
  And I think that's a theme that we're seeing around a lot of the new AI technology that's come out.
• 6:12
  This is great.
• 6:13
  Yes.
• 6:13
  It gets you things faster.
• 6:15
  You don't have to worry about interacting with someone if you don't want to.
• 6:18
  Like, it increases the ability for restaurants to fulfill orders.
• 6:22
  But at the same time, our sidewalks, our streets, our traffic lights, all of those things are not really equipped for robots.
• 6:30
  Yep.
• 6:30
  And so I just think it's kind of that catch 22 of technology is there, but maybe the infrastructure isn't.
• 6:37
  And I think that people are feeling that because it's disrupting ways of life.
• 6:42
  And for people who are.
• 6:43
  Who have impairments, I could see that being incredibly frustrating.
• 6:47
  Right.
• 6:48
  Do you think this is, like, just teething problems, or do you think it speaks to a broader concern that people have for autonomous delivery?
• 6:57
  Whether it's drones in the sky, robots in the pavements, or kind of driverless cars.
• 7:02
  I think it's a broader concern.
• 7:03
  I mean, there's a level of trust when it comes to having a robot do a job for you or execute a task.
• 7:09
  I mean, we're seeing the same things with.
• 7:11
  I'm air quoting agentic commerce because the definition of agentic commerce is not super clear, but there's Little trust of giving a credit card to an agent and actually performing a task.
• 7:21
  I think we're very far away from a world where a robot is going to perform a task 100% without any human supervision in someone's home or doing something in their personal life.
• 7:32
  So I just don't think we're there yet from a trust perspective.
• 7:36
  And I think it's an interesting contradiction between kind of robotics out in public spaces versus actually the interest that they generate when you see them in store.
• 7:47
  So people love their tallies.
• 7:49
  You know, my local store has just installed robotic cleaning.
• 7:54
  And yeah, I see people actually stopping and taking selfies with the robots.
• 7:58
  That's amazing.
• 7:59
  There is the kind of, the novelty, the interest.
• 8:01
  I think it's when it's out in a public space where the infrastructure isn't quite right.
• 8:05
  But I think the difference between a cleaning robot and a delivery robot is a cleaning robot's kind of like in the background, right?
• 8:11
  Like you're not necessarily interacting with it, but it's cool because it's doing this other work that you might not be seeing.
• 8:16
  But a delivery robot is actually interacting with humans and it's providing a service and it's replacing something that existed before with a human.
• 8:26
  So I think that's the difference where people like to look at it and it's like, hey, cool, I'll interact with that robot, but I don't want them to do something for me.
• 8:33
  Does that make sense?
• 8:34
  Oh, completely.
• 8:35
  And I mean, I think, look, this, obviously there is one agenda driven survey, but you know, public opinion is a fickle thing.
• 8:44
  You don't want to get the wrong side off.
• 8:45
  You know, Starship are running their robots in other UK cities.
• 8:51
  I think they've been in Milton Keynes with the cooperatives in 2018.
• 8:55
  So it does one city, but it's one of those things where I feel there's a real need.
• 9:00
  Lauren, I don't know what you think for a bit of a, kind of a sensitive and a sensible public discourse of where this is all going to go.
• 9:07
  You know, okay, robots on the pavement is one thing, but some of the standard of the driving of all of the delivery vehicles that are now, you know, within residential areas, there's a balancing act and I think I'd
• 9:23
  probably like to see more of that conversation take place.
• 9:26
  I agree, I completely agree.
• 9:27
  And if you think about autonomous cars, right, I was on my way here from the airport, I saw this crazy looking one that I'd never seen before.
• 9:33
  But they work really well if all cars are autonomous, right?
• 9:37
  Because then the infrastructure is there, then they're all communicating with each other.
• 9:40
  But when you have humans with autonomous cars and robots and you're trying to figure out how to work together, there's not enough conversations about what are the right rules, where are the right places that they should be, what
• 9:51
  are the guardrails put in place so that we all live together?
• 9:54
  Yeah.
• 9:55
  Yeah.
• 9:55
  Sounds like a movie, doesn't it?
• 9:56
  We tried really hard to get one of those last night to bring us back to the restaurant, but we were just out of zone and the waiting list was really long.
• 10:04
  So I think the waiting time.
• 10:05
  So, okay, I think they're popular.
• 10:08
  It was much bigger than anyone I'd ever seen.
• 10:10
  They were like very tall.
• 10:11
  And the zoo.
• 10:11
  Zoot.
• 10:12
  Yeah, they're pretty cool.
• 10:13
  Okay, let's move on to headline number two, which is brought to you by Sifter.
• 10:17
  Sifter Solutions powerful API seamlessly integrates advanced medically tailored dietary and nutritional filtering into virtually any grocery or wellness platform.
• 10:30
  Sifter makes healthy outcomes possible.
• 10:32
  So learn more@siftasolutions.com okay, headline number two this week comes from Progressive Grocer.
• 10:38
  We've then used that.
• 10:39
  Target has named Mark Weinstein, or Weinstein to be the newly combined role of Chief marketing and guest Experience officer.
• 10:50
  Effective immediately, Weinstein will work on the retailer's growth strategy, Target said, and how shoppers experience and connect to the Target brand.
• 11:00
  He'll also oversee Roundel, Target's retail media network and the Target plus marketplace.
• 11:08
  Previously, Weinstein had served as global CMO of Hilton's 28 brands and the Hilton Honors program, as well as head of luxury brands at Hilton, leaving the role after 18 years with the company.
• 11:22
  And this concludes Target's seven month search for a new external CMO.
• 11:29
  Okay, Laurent, really keen to hear your thoughts on this, especially as his remit is to give a more and I quote, connected experience across all of Target's shoppers touchpoints, which I think is right up your street.
• 11:42
  So what changes do you want to see Target's new CMO bring to the company?
• 11:48
  Well, I kind of feel like this is a make or break moment for Target.
• 11:50
  Right.
• 11:51
  There's a lot going on.
• 11:53
  I mean, I think they've struggled over the past couple of quarters.
• 11:56
  Their store experience is not the same as it used to be.
• 11:59
  And I think this is a moment where they can bring back the Target effect.
• 12:02
  Right.
• 12:03
  Where you walk into target to spend $10 and you walk out with $250 worth of something.
• 12:07
  I know I'm very Guilty of doing that.
• 12:09
  Right.
• 12:09
  But it was so much of that Target experience.
• 12:12
  It was trending.
• 12:13
  We were talking about it.
• 12:14
  Everybody would go and just shop at Target as a date night.
• 12:17
  Right.
• 12:17
  And that.
• 12:18
  That has changed a little bit with challenges with store shelves and stocking and just some of the other things that they're going through.
• 12:24
  So I think this makes a lot of sense that he is the experience officer.
• 12:29
  Yep.
• 12:30
  So he's gonna be thinking about how to take the physical digital and hopefully the agentic shelf, the third shelf.
• 12:36
  Okay.
• 12:36
  All together in that one experience.
• 12:39
  So I'm excited.
• 12:40
  I think it makes a lot of sense, but I do think it's a make or break moment where they really have to get this right.
• 12:46
  Okay.
• 12:46
  And I think that means digital experiences in store.
• 12:50
  More activation, more partnership with brands to really bring back that culture of Target and Target shopping.
• 12:59
  So, Lauren, the digital shelf is your expertise.
• 13:03
  What would you see Target like to do?
• 13:06
  What would you.
• 13:06
  Even better.
• 13:07
  What would you like to see Target do differently in terms of their digital shelf experience?
• 13:12
  Well, I love their PDPs.
• 13:14
  I do have to to say I love the carousel.
• 13:16
  They have a lot of opportunity for lifestyle imagery and UGC content.
• 13:20
  I think it's about pulling that through to in store because I actually think they do a great job on their PDPs.
• 13:26
  Right.
• 13:26
  And they have a lot of tagging around allergens or popular things in specific categories.
• 13:31
  But how when you are at the shelf, do you know that it's gluten free or it's soy free or it's paraben free or whatever that looks like?
• 13:39
  How can you pull through some of that to your physical experience?
• 13:42
  Because I actually think they have a really great digital experience, especially on the pdp.
• 13:47
  But when I'm in store, can I use the app and am I incentivized for a coupon or is there an ad that directs me to a new experience if I like this product or recommend something else?
• 13:59
  So I think they can take it kind of one step further to that connected experience.
• 14:03
  But I actually really love their pdps.
• 14:05
  Okay.
• 14:06
  Love that.
• 14:07
  I'm really pleased to see this.
• 14:09
  I've spoken before.
• 14:10
  In my eyes, there was a trifecta of what I think Target needed to do to improve their experience.
• 14:17
  And you know, on credit to Fidelke, we're starting to see some of the early progress from this.
• 14:22
  The first one was install standards availability, and we've seen progress on that.
• 14:27
  The second one was bringing back excitement into the merchandising mix.
• 14:31
  The target effect.
• 14:33
  Exactly.
• 14:33
  And that comes from products that people want to buy, that people weren't expecting the unique and the different.
• 14:38
  And we've certainly seen some evidence there is distance to go on that one.
• 14:43
  But we're starting to see some progress.
• 14:44
  And the third level was in the storytelling, that excitement.
• 14:48
  I mean you've only got to look at what Richard Dickson and the team have done at Gap for how you can create a turnaround and a core brand through, yes, product but amazing storytelling.
• 15:01
  And I noticed that the Weinstein has got some kind of drama in his background.
• 15:05
  You know, he's been a producer on Broadway.
• 15:08
  Oh, I didn't know that.
• 15:10
  In theatre.
• 15:10
  So look, it's a bit different to some of the caliber of the specialisms that have been brought into Gap.
• 15:17
  But it to me signals moving in the right direction.
• 15:21
  Now when you've done all that, the fourth thing you've got to move on to is the broader digital ecosystem which as you say is in isolation.
• 15:29
  Bits are working okay if you compare to where Walmart is, for example, on the extent of its digital ecosystem.
• 15:36
  Target has still got a lot of catch up to do.
• 15:38
  They had to get the install standards right, they've got to get the storytelling right.
• 15:41
  And I hope this is the next step in that.
• 15:44
  But then there's a whole bigger how do you join everything together?
• 15:47
  But that's, you know, everyone's trying to figure that out.
• 15:50
  Ben.
• 15:51
  If they get it right, I mean I think they will have a huge opportunity to bring back a lot of that love for Target.
• 15:57
  Yeah.
• 15:58
  Do you remember the activations they used to do?
• 16:00
  They would bring like a specific brand in and there would be a specific part of the part of the store where it would be spotlight that brand and have this kind of like micro store in the store and
• 16:09
  things like that, bringing those experiences back.
• 16:11
  Because Gen Z likes to go to the store like they like to go back to the store to purchase gifts or to have an experience.
• 16:18
  So how can they really kind of take that and run with it?
• 16:21
  Yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly.
• 16:23
  Okay.
• 16:23
  Headline number three.
• 16:24
  Headline number three is brought to you by our proud sponsor Vuzion, the global leader in connected retail solutions, helping grocers improve productivity, execution and customer experience.
• 16:36
  From shelf to check out.
• 16:38
  So visit Vuzion.com and headline number three comes from Retail Week which reported that UK grosser Morrisons is set to introduce shop by light utilizing the blinking light functionality of digital shelf labels to help shoppers find products.
• 16:55
  Morrisons already utilizes Pictolite for its E commerce orders for the pickers in store and it is currently developing the technology to make it available to shoppers to use with a locator tool within the Morrisons app.
• 17:12
  Morrison said it plans to roll out the tool to more than 200 Morrison stores that already have digital shelf labels in place and they are provided by the aforementioned grocer tool partner, Vuzion.
• 17:23
  And the plan is for that to be live by the end of November.
• 17:26
  So turn this around fast.
• 17:29
  This news was shared by Morrison's group productivity director, Gordon McPherson, speaking at NRF Europe in Paris earlier this week, a session that was on the keynote stage and also featured Fusion CMO Roy Horgan, and was moderated by our
• 17:45
  very own Chris Walton.
• 17:46
  So kudos to Chris for the scoop on this one.
• 17:49
  Lauren.
• 17:50
  As more grocers invest in digital shelf label technologies, do you see Shop to Light as a value add ad for shoppers or is this just tech for tech's sake?
• 18:02
  Well, first of all, I would love this in the grocery store.
• 18:05
  I have been waiting for this for so long and the reason for that is because I hate going to a grocery store and having an inefficient shop.
• 18:12
  Right.
• 18:13
  Like, I'm not going to hang out in a grocery store.
• 18:15
  I want to get what I need to get and I want to leave.
• 18:17
  So you see date night in Target, but a grocery store?
• 18:19
  No.
• 18:20
  Yeah, in and out, in and out, in and out.
• 18:22
  So I mean, I think this is really exciting.
• 18:24
  And to our last conversation around Target, this is a perfect example of Omni Channel.
• 18:28
  I think you're taking the digital and the physical and you're combining them together because you're allowing someone to kind of plan their shop and then go in the store and easily find what they need by by connecting those
• 18:41
  two experiences together in the app or online and in store.
• 18:45
  Yeah.
• 18:45
  What I would love to see is take this one step further and think about that agentic shelf.
• 18:51
  What if they had an agent and a shopper says, okay, plan me five dinners and I have a child who's gluten free and someone's allergic to seafood.
• 18:59
  They plan it out and then they plan your route through the store and your shopping list and then you can check out through the app.
• 19:05
  Nice.
• 19:06
  To me, that's the definition of like true omnichannel, connecting all those things together.
• 19:11
  So this is a step in the right direction.
• 19:12
  Okay.
• 19:13
  So you are not concerned about the number of blinking lights that might be down there or even getting in the way of people trying to do their shop, the pickers using pictolite.
• 19:24
  I mean, if you do it right, I don't think so.
• 19:26
  And I mean, adoption of something like this, I think is going to be like a slow rollout.
• 19:31
  But I also think there's a way that maybe they can do it through the app that doesn't require everything to continuously flash.
• 19:37
  Right.
• 19:38
  They're going to have to test that out.
• 19:39
  If it becomes more at scale, is it colors, is it using AR VR vision with the app, what does it look like?
• 19:46
  But I think for right now, I wouldn't be concerned about the flashing.
• 19:50
  Are you concerned about the flashing?
• 19:51
  That's a good point.
• 19:52
  Look, I think when I think about this, I think of it two perspectives.
• 19:56
  One is, is there genuinely a value add for shoppers?
• 20:01
  Convenience?
• 20:02
  Yeah, exactly.
• 20:03
  And the second one is, is it going to get in the way?
• 20:06
  Now, these tags have, I think it's seven or eight different colors in a light.
• 20:13
  So I think it's quite straightforward to reserve one or two of those just for shoppers and still use your pickers with six different colors.
• 20:21
  And I know that the way that it works is one for a picker, when they are looking for a product, there's only the next product is flashing.
• 20:29
  When they've picked it and flashed and bleeped it on the scanner, which you have to do, it stops flashing and it moves on to the next one.
• 20:36
  So I think maybe they might need something like that from a shopper perspective, that once you've found the product, you need to let the app know that you've got it.
• 20:42
  But I think that's, that's quite straightforward.
• 20:46
  And at first I was thinking about, is it useful?
• 20:49
  Can I imagine planning my shop?
• 20:52
  But then the more you think about when you're shopping for others as well, you know, if you, if you've got, you need to go and do a shop for your elderly parents, we can plan it.
• 21:01
  You might not know where the products that they usually buy are.
• 21:04
  That's going to be helpful.
• 21:05
  Yeah, 100%.
• 21:06
  And I'm gluten free.
• 21:07
  So sometimes when I go to a new grocery store, I'm like, oh my goodness, where did they put the gluten free section?
• 21:12
  Because it's never with everything else.
• 21:13
  And I would love to just go straight in, go to what I need to get and then leave Again, efficiency for me for grocery shopping.
• 21:19
  But I also think that there's a world where in the app it can map out the different places you need to go and then you can choose when it lights up.
• 21:27
  Right.
• 21:27
  So this is a perfect, perfect example of how you can use consumers to test this and really understand what is the value add and how do they want to see this change?
• 21:37
  And I really hope that they do do that.
• 21:39
  And I'd not thought.
• 21:40
  This is why I love having these conversations.
• 21:42
  I hadn't thought about the agentic idea.
• 21:44
  The idea of the app is helping you discover new things and then in store this tech is helping you find.
• 21:50
  The products and then you're using those recipes when you get home and then you've got your meals for the week.
• 21:54
  Right.
• 21:55
  I really like that.
• 21:55
  That's really interesting.
• 21:57
  Efficiency and scalability.
• 22:00
  And then of course the last thing is the potential saving on the, on the store teams.
• 22:05
  You know, so many grocers, you know, certainly people I work with, they've moved the policies always don't tell show.
• 22:13
  So don't tell your customer where to find a product.
• 22:16
  If they can't find it, take them to it, which is great service.
• 22:19
  But you know, I've worked in grocery stores, it takes time off the people.
• 22:24
  So if there's a tech to help some people with that, that's a great move.
• 22:28
  But also think about retail media, right?
• 22:30
  Could you flash a light on an end cap that you're like, hey, I saw that you purchased Oreos, we have milk on sale or something like that.
• 22:38
  You know, you can create this like journey and experience curated because you know what people are shopping for and you're guiding their journey.
• 22:46
  I just see there's so many opportunities with that.
• 22:48
  Fantastic.
• 22:49
  Okay, come on, let's move on to headline number four, which is sponsored by Portager, a groundbreaking purpose built AI platform for retail negotiations and joint business planning, helping merchants prepare smarter, negotiate stronger and maximize value.
• 23:04
  So visit Portager AI to learn more.
• 23:08
  And our fourth headline this week comes from Yahoo Finance, which reported that Kroger has stopped selling Red Bull's iconic energy drinks at all of its stores and fuel centres nationwide.
• 23:20
  Yahoo covered reporting from the Cincinnati Enquirer.
• 23:25
  And we've got a lot of titles getting the first mentions this week which stated the Kroger has sold its last of its inventory in August with Red Bull coolers and displays being removed from stores from August 31st.
• 23:38
  Kroger has confirmed this has taken place, but declined the opportunity to explain why.
• 23:43
  And neither has Red Bull.
• 23:46
  With brands like Monster and Rockstar still on its shelves, this is clearly a direct move against Red Bull rather than the wider energy drinks category.
• 23:55
  Commentators haven't hesitated this link and this surprising merchandising decision back to CEO Greg Foran's comments during their Q2 results, which we covered on Grocery Talk last week.
• 24:08
  Where he said Kroger would push back against vendors that use inflation to justify price increases at times when shoppers are under financial pressure and is prepared to rely more on its private brand products.
• 24:24
  Grocery Dive found that when it searched some Kroger banner websites, it received the message that Red Bull is currently out of stock while we work with our suppliers to keep prices affordable for you.
• 24:39
  So that makes things pretty clear.
• 24:41
  One last point.
• 24:42
  The story has also been linked to reporting in Supermarket News that Kroger has started phasing out Boar's Head deli products from three marketplace format stores where shoppers have been invited to try Kroger's premium deli selection instead.
• 24:57
  Okay, Lauren, a lot of read.
• 24:59
  Let's go for this.
• 25:00
  Is a commercial dispute ever a good reason for a retailer to remove a product that shoppers actually still want to buy?
• 25:07
  This is a really complex one.
• 25:09
  And I actually dug deeper on this story because I was quite interested.
• 25:12
  I mean, I understand and respect the fact that Kroger is trying to protect its consumers and make sure that things are affordable.
• 25:20
  Okay, but where is the line?
• 25:23
  Right.
• 25:23
  Absolutely.
• 25:24
  Because it's also a massive risk for Kroger because if we're Red Bull drinkers, we're not necessarily going to switch.
• 25:30
  We're just going to go buy Red Bill somewhere else.
• 25:32
  We're not going to go to a Kroger store.
• 25:34
  It is an iconic brand.
• 25:36
  Exactly.
• 25:36
  And so when you're especially the energy drink category, like when you are loyal to an energy drink, I feel like you are loyal to an energy drink.
• 25:42
  Right.
• 25:43
  So that's a massive risk to say, okay, don't come to a Kroger store to buy Red Bull.
• 25:47
  Go somewhere else.
• 25:48
  Does that then take those consumers to another store altogether because they want to do everything all at once.
• 25:54
  So it's a gamble here where I do respect focusing on price and making things affordable.
• 26:00
  But at the same time, if people are loyal to the brand.
• 26:04
  Yeah.
• 26:04
  Are they going to continue shopping at your stores?
• 26:06
  So this could be a huge opportunity for other energy drink brands at Kroger.
• 26:10
  Right?
• 26:10
  Yeah.
• 26:10
  Yeah.
• 26:10
  Because shelf space is open.
• 26:13
  What can happen pulling in their shop and marketing budget right now?
• 26:16
  Right.
• 26:17
  Yeah.
• 26:17
  Let's look at the planogram and figure out what we do here.
• 26:20
  Right.
• 26:20
  But I don't know if it makes sense from a control perspective to really kind of pull a brand fully like that.
• 26:29
  It's a big risk.
• 26:30
  What about the statement it makes?
• 26:32
  I mean, I think it makes a statement that they're trying to protect their consumers, but at the Same time, they're also not necessarily willing to negotiate price.
• 26:41
  So to me it's more of let's have a joint conversation about it versus like this is my hard stance and then we're taking it away because then it puts kind of Kroger in the like it's our, our way
• 26:52
  or no way kind of situation.
• 26:54
  Yeah, and I, I completely agree with that.
• 26:57
  It's, it's funny.
• 27:00
  I've been on a bit of a journey of this story.
• 27:01
  Oh, okay.
• 27:02
  Because when I first thought about it, I must say I just rolled my eyes.
• 27:06
  Like, here we go, another public delisting to make a point story.
• 27:10
  We've seen this before.
• 27:13
  As a rule of thumb, I don't love it when this happens because there is a signal that it gives to the market that says we're not in a collaborative place right now.
• 27:23
  100% and we both can't.
• 27:25
  Like when I say we both brands and retailers can't win without each other.
• 27:29
  We need to play nice in the sandbox in order for everybody to win, especially in the commerce world we live in today.
• 27:35
  So like I said, I respect the price sensitivity for consumers, but at the same time, like, let's collaborate together to figure out what the best approach is forward.
• 27:44
  Because brands are also struggling right now from a profitability perspective and a growth perspective.
• 27:48
  And so everybody's trying to find their.
• 27:51
  Way a bit, which is exactly where I started.
• 27:55
  And then the more I thought about it, I'm wondering if we've reached that line in the sand.
• 28:00
  I think for a couple of reasons.
• 28:02
  Let me tell you for why.
• 28:03
  Let's be really clear.
• 28:04
  You and I, unless you, there's anything you haven't told me, are not privy to the negotiations that are going.
• 28:09
  No, I am not.
• 28:10
  So, so we, we are, we are linking the dots as other people have been from what we've read.
• 28:14
  Correct?
• 28:15
  Exactly.
• 28:16
  But I think there's a number of things.
• 28:18
  Firstly, there is a.
• 28:20
  The backdrop is that many.
• 28:22
  And again, I'm not calling specifically out Red bull, but many CPGs have gone for a period where they have grown through price rather than volume.
• 28:32
  There has been a number of years of inflation.
• 28:36
  And you know what?
• 28:38
  At this very show, a grocery shop.
• 28:39
  Last year, during my keynote presentation, I made the point that we needed as an industry to move to volume based growth, not value based growth because there is a huge risk for branded CPGs that the Gap, the price
• 28:55
  gap to private label and to limited line form stores becomes too great.
• 29:01
  100% totally agree.
• 29:03
  And then secondly, Kroger does Have to get sharper on price.
• 29:09
  What Greg Foran is saying is not incorrect.
• 29:13
  He knows it.
• 29:13
  He announced back in May that the company was working on trying to cut housing prices.
• 29:18
  There was research from Numerator that showed over the Last year around 12 billion billion of spend on CPG products has left Kroger and has gone to Amazon, Walmart and Costco.
• 29:33
  So I think that line in the sand has been drawn.
• 29:36
  I think Kroger, Kroger is the, is the grocer with the scale to fight back on price and I'm quite pleased to see foreign and the team doing that, as tough as it's going to be.
• 29:49
  The other thing I would say though is what is the innovation that you're coming to the table with?
• 29:54
  Or what is the new experience or different way of shopping that can then differentiate you in a way where you can make those statements or make those plays and not take a hit to profitability or your collaboration with
• 30:08
  brands?
• 30:08
  And I know Kroger just launched an agent and so they are really kind of getting into the agentic space, but that's what I would think about, like what is that next level innovation that's going to help them move
• 30:19
  forward if these decisions keep coming through?
• 30:21
  You can't just do the hard negotiation on its own.
• 30:24
  Completely agree.
• 30:25
  Okay, come on, let's go on to our final discussion area and this time we're going to do something different, if that's okay.
• 30:30
  So it's Grocery Shop this week.
• 30:32
  It runs from Tuesday 22nd today through to Thursday 24th of September here in Vegas, which is.
• 30:41
  Well, there is a beautiful Las Vegas skyline out to us.
• 30:44
  I was.
• 30:45
  It looks great for YouTube list viewers.
• 30:47
  I was going to try and get it in but the camera wouldn't really pick that up.
• 30:51
  So.
• 30:52
  Too sunny.
• 30:52
  So you've got the backdrop if you're watching, of the beautiful Mandalay Bay look.
• 30:56
  This Grocery Shop is the leading global event for grocery tech and innovation.
• 31:01
  The Grocery Shop team are expecting to welcome about 4,000 attendees this week.
• 31:07
  And well over a thousand of those will be retailers and CPGs, which is.
• 31:12
  And I think they're up on the ear, which is fantastic for this show.
• 31:18
  This is much more than a trade show.
• 31:19
  There will be well over 150 speakers.
• 31:23
  There are 30 plus content sessions, there's a CEO keynote stage and an editorially led agenda.
• 31:30
  So with all that in mind, Lauren, what do you think the big talking points of Grocery Show 2026 should be and what questions are you looking for answers to?
• 31:42
  Well, I think I know one of the talking points is going to be AI, but I think it should be actionable AI.
• 31:49
  Right.
• 31:50
  I feel like last year it was like, AI is here, it's happening, we're trying to figure it out.
• 31:54
  And this year it's like, okay, what are you actually doing about it?
• 31:56
  What's working?
• 31:57
  What's changing?
• 31:58
  The other thing I would love to see, and I did see a couple sessions, is around organizational structure and operating model.
• 32:04
  Okay.
• 32:04
  Because that's something that you've done a lot of work on, isn't it?
• 32:06
  Yes, it is something I'm super passionate about.
• 32:07
  And I think to our point about collaboration and needing brands and retailers to work together, that does require change inside organizations.
• 32:15
  How are you set up for success?
• 32:17
  Who are people reporting to?
• 32:18
  What are the incentives?
• 32:20
  What are the specific roles that are needed in this world of commerce?
• 32:23
  So I really hope that is the case.
• 32:25
  And then my third one would be getting back to the consumer.
• 32:28
  Okay.
• 32:29
  Really anchoring on what is the consumer experience?
• 32:32
  What does the consumer want?
• 32:33
  How is the consumer consumer shopping and trying to anchor on that versus all the other noise that's happening out there.
• 32:39
  Yeah.
• 32:40
  And I think the changing consumer affordability.
• 32:43
  Yes.
• 32:43
  We've just spoken about.
• 32:45
  So where do you think the grocery industry is on kind of the agentic game at the moment?
• 32:49
  I know that's this is.
• 32:50
  This is kind of your specialty.
• 32:52
  If you are looking at, you know, from starting gun to pure autonomy.
• 32:58
  Where is this industry right now?
• 33:00
  Now?
• 33:00
  So I look at it as a spectrum.
• 33:02
  I don't think we are in the world of fully autonomous shopping to our point before.
• 33:07
  I don't think there's trust there from a consumer perspective.
• 33:10
  And I think we're pretty far away from that.
• 33:13
  But I think we are very much in the AI assisted discovery space.
• 33:18
  So consumers are using LLMs to discover products to figure out where to buy.
• 33:23
  That is where we are today.
• 33:25
  And I think the retailers that understand that are taking steps forward to be able to compete in that space.
• 33:31
  Whether it's creating agents, making their content machine readable on the pdp, setting specific standards for brands to do that.
• 33:39
  I think those are the steps that I'm seeing people take now.
• 33:43
  And this is a big change.
• 33:44
  Right.
• 33:45
  It's the biggest change we've seen in the industry since E Commerce.
• 33:50
  Yeah.
• 33:50
  Right.
• 33:50
  So I think it's going to take some time to change, but I am seeing positive movement forward.
• 33:55
  And I'm with you.
• 33:56
  This has got to be the show where we talk about what people are doing more.
• 34:00
  And we started to see that in the spring shop talk that that was starting to be what people are doing versus the concept and the principles.
• 34:07
  But they were like, we're testing.
• 34:09
  And I'm like, well, what are the results?
• 34:10
  I want to see the results.
• 34:11
  So when you think about the agent e commerce activities that you've seen from grocery retailers or brands, is there any who are the standouts that you say people should look out, pay too much attention to spend some time
• 34:23
  on their sites with their agents to get a feel of the art of the possible?
• 34:27
  Well, I think from an agent perspective, there's two retailers that are winning and I think it's the ones that we know the most.
• 34:33
  Right.
• 34:33
  Amazon with Alexa for shopping and Walmart with Sparky.
• 34:36
  They have probably the most advanced agents right now.
• 34:40
  So I look to them to understand how our consumers use utilizing it, what data are they sharing, how is that experience?
• 34:47
  But I've seen a lot of retailers like Kroger for example, is very much focused on machine readable content on their site.
• 34:54
  Same with Target.
• 34:55
  So retailers are having these conversations with brands, but everyone's in the early stages of it.
• 35:01
  Right.
• 35:01
  Like I haven't seen anyone go fully all in or kind of develop something that's like an Alexa for shopping because it does take time and infrastructure to be able to get there.
• 35:11
  It does.
• 35:11
  And we covered the launch of Clementine so instacart agent last week.
• 35:16
  But I think it's really interesting that you called out Amazon and Walmart because one of the big trends for me right now is how is the rest of the industry, particularly here in the US this is a global
• 35:26
  show with a US focus.
• 35:28
  How is the rest of the market responding and how can you keep up with the investments, particularly in agentia, but also in rapid delivery?
• 35:37
  Well, so that's where I say retailers need to focus on loyalty.
• 35:40
  Okay.
• 35:40
  Actually think loyalty is still such a differentiating factor.
• 35:44
  Back to our point about consumers aren't ready to go fully autonomous because they don't have that level of trust.
• 35:49
  There's so much data that showcases that consumers are doing the discovery on LLMs but doing the purchase on the retailer of their choice.
• 35:58
  Yeah.
• 35:59
  So if you have a loyalty program, then double down on that because your consumers are still purchasing in the places that they normally do.
• 36:06
  But the other thing to think about is if you have a great loyalty program, you want people to discover you need to talk about it.
• 36:12
  Because if you don't talk about it, how is an agent going to say, oh, this is a great loyalty program or you get a lot of Benefits if you sign up for this, this or this.
• 36:19
  Most sites don't actually talk about it on the PDP or on their website where a machine can actually take that information and recommend it to a consumer.
• 36:29
  So there's a little tweak to the loyalty piece.
• 36:31
  But I still think loyalty is a very, very strong differentiator for retailers.
• 36:35
  Yeah, I think.
• 36:36
  Absolutely.
• 36:37
  Couldn't agree more.
• 36:38
  Could not agree more.
• 36:39
  Okay.
• 36:40
  In which case, Lauren, before you go, this has been great, but we're going to do, we're going to do grocer talk, grab and go.
• 36:46
  So come on.
• 36:46
  In the spirit of doing things differently this week, I want to hear your pick of one story from somewhere else in the world of global retail that we haven't covered.
• 36:55
  But I also want you to pick a content session here at grocery shop that you think is going to be a must see.
• 37:03
  Two rules for that, Econ, be a session at your end.
• 37:07
  My session.
• 37:07
  And it can't be a session that I'm in.
• 37:09
  Understood.
• 37:09
  Let's do that.
• 37:09
  I did not pick either of those sessions.
• 37:11
  So where are we going to start?
• 37:13
  Do you want to start with a story or a content story?
• 37:16
  Okay.
• 37:16
  Yeah, let's do it.
• 37:17
  Okay, so my story is from retail dive and it's called Dueling Amazon Target October sales events return.
• 37:24
  Okay, so Amazon just announced their prime day.
• 37:28
  So Prime Day is October 6th to the 7th.
• 37:30
  It's the same as Target circle days.
• 37:31
  And then Walmart is also having their day on October 5th.
• 37:36
  So for brands that are preparing for these deal days, they have the triple threat.
• 37:40
  Now it's Amazon, Target and Walmart all competing one week.
• 37:45
  So thinking about what are the products that you're selling differently on each of those different retailers, how should you think about this also being a halo effect potentially to other retailers?
• 37:55
  Even if it's not on Amazon, Target or Walmart, how will this affect a Kroger or even any other retailer in the space?
• 38:01
  Because people are looking for deals and what is the opportunity the retailers have to take advantage of that?
• 38:07
  And then from a consumer perspective, what's the behavior that's going to be happening?
• 38:11
  Right.
• 38:11
  Are they.
• 38:12
  I'd love to see the numbers afterwards to see if people are actually targeting that now that there's two prime days.
• 38:17
  Yeah.
• 38:17
  Interesting, interesting.
• 38:19
  Okay, look, the story that caught my eye was from the Retail Tech Innovation Hub website and it reported that Marks and Spencer's in the UK is working with an organization called Too Good to go in 350 of its
• 38:34
  stores now following a successful trial.
• 38:36
  And we Love stories that go from trial to rollout.
• 38:39
  So Too Good to Go is an app.
• 38:41
  It gives shoppers the chance to buy surprises bags of surplus bakery products to prevent them going to waste.
• 38:49
  I love that the bags contain three or four products such as pastries, breads or cookies.
• 38:55
  They have a minimum retail value of 10 pounds UK pounds 20 pence.
• 39:03
  Customer shoppers can order it through the Too Good to Go app.
• 39:06
  They pay £3.80 for the product and then you don't know what it's going to be but you go and click the in store an hour before the shop closes.
• 39:15
  I think it's great.
• 39:15
  It fits in with a lot of the M and S sustainability reducing food waste initiatives.
• 39:21
  It's a nice play.
• 39:22
  It's obviously working.
• 39:23
  They're scaling it.
• 39:25
  So I was pleased.
• 39:26
  That was my pick of the week.
• 39:27
  So there's actually a lot of food waste in the US and one of my good friends actually works for a non profit who's trying to change the legislation because most institutions can't give away that food because there's a
• 39:38
  liability to does it go bad?
• 39:40
  Is someone going to get sick?
• 39:41
  And so I absolutely love this story because I think it'll be really helpful in improving food waste everywhere.
• 39:48
  Fantastic.
• 39:49
  I agree.
• 39:49
  Okay, session picks.
• 39:51
  Ooh, I'm excited.
• 39:52
  Go on.
• 39:54
  You've delved into the agenda.
• 39:56
  What have you gonna come up with?
• 39:57
  Okay, the session I'm super excited about is the one today, Tuesday 3:40 to 4:20.
• 40:02
  It's called boosting Discovery and Conversion across Digital Channels.
• 40:07
  Good friend Gregor Murray from DCG is moderating.
• 40:10
  Shout out to Gregor.
• 40:11
  Shout out to Gregor.
• 40:12
  And it will be Arthur from Danone, Andrew from Mondelez and Sarah from Bobby.
• 40:17
  So really great panelists and I think it'll be a great session.
• 40:21
  Nice, nice.
• 40:21
  I couldn't agree more.
• 40:23
  Okay, what's your pick?
• 40:24
  I'm also going for oneness.
• 40:25
  This afternoon I am going for a session which is called Centering products and assortment around around key dietary preferences.
• 40:34
  Oh, I saw that one.
• 40:35
  That's interesting.
• 40:36
  So why so number one, GLP1s.
• 40:39
  It's one of my big trends at the moment.
• 40:42
  Chobani is speaking.
• 40:43
  They are a key tailwind cpg.
• 40:46
  So hearing what they're going to say is really interesting.
• 40:48
  2 John Conlin, SVP of merchandising for food and beverage at Target is speaking.
• 40:53
  Let's go back to our first second story today.
• 40:57
  Big one, how are they driving their merchandising?
• 41:00
  So that's my thing.
• 41:01
  And number three, it's been moderated by Chad Lusk from the NM Consumer and Retail Group.
• 41:08
  Chad is one of the best.
• 41:10
  I've noticed there's actually fewer consultants on the program this year, so really good to see Chad there.
• 41:16
  He's got a really interesting boy.
• 41:17
  He will lead a really interesting conversation.
• 41:19
  So that's 4:30 till 5:10 today on the pop stage.
• 41:23
  Ooh, exciting.
• 41:25
  Well, today's podcast was produced with the help and support of Ellisield and is brought to you exclusively as part of the omnitalk Podcast Network.
• 41:34
  Omnitalk exists to highlight the trends, technologies and innovations shaping retail and Grossertalk now does this specifically for the global grocery and CPG industry.
• 41:45
  So thanks as always for listening in.
• 41:48
  Please remember to like and leave us a review wherever you happen to listen to your podcasts or on YouTube.
• 41:54
  And you can follow us today by Simply going to YouTube.com forward/omnitalkretail, which is also where you can find all our interviews this week from Vegas.
• 42:05
  Lauren, if people want to get in touch with you this week or beyond, what's the best way for them to do that?
• 42:10
  Well, they can come to my session.
• 42:13
  It is on Wednesday.
• 42:14
  I won't plug my own session, but here, please find me.
• 42:16
  Say hello.
• 42:16
  If not, connect with me on LinkedIn.
• 42:18
  Always happy to chat and meet new people.
• 42:20
  Fantastic.
• 42:20
  So until next week, on behalf of all of us at Grocer Talk and Omnitalk Retail, thanks for tuning in.