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“Person, woman, man, camera… podcast.” · Pod Save America

• 0:20
  Speaker 1: Welcome to Pod Save America. I'm Dan Pfeiffer.
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: I am not Jon Favreau. I am Tommy Vitor subbing
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: in today because Dan, we got some news.
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: We're going to break this news right here and now.
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: I got permission. So I got permission to tell what's
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: going on, which is that John called me at about
• 0:35
  Speaker 2: 1030 last night and said, hey, I think Emily's water broke.
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: We're headed to the hospital. Can I drop Leo off
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: at your house? And I resisted the urge to say,
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: you think?
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: I was just going to say, yes.
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: They're at the hospital now. There's no baby yet, but
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: I can report to our listeners that Leo is snuggling
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: with Hannah comfortably. And that I have taken an epidural
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: in solidarity. So that's where we're at.
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: Well, it will be perfectly fitting for the long history
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: of the Thursday podcast if the Favreau baby arrives immediately
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: after the recording of this podcast. Yeah, that's right.
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: Big break of news right after you guys record.
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: That's right. I would also note that I haven't taken
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: assiduous records over the four years that the four of
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: us have been doing podcasts, but I'm pretty sure this
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: is the first time you and I have ever done
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: a podcast, just the two of us.
• 1:30
  Speaker 2: Oh, Dan, that's so weird. And this is exciting. I've
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: always wanted to just talk to you.
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. I mean, I've just been trying to
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: get the other half of Fenway Strategies for four years now,
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: and I finally got there.
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: Well, I'm just trying to get an invite onto Campaign
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: Experts React because I've been smashing that subscribe button.
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: You are on the list and you have to pass
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: a expert's mental acuity test to get on it. So
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: we'll see how you do.
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: Got it. Got it.
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: All right. On today's pod, we're going to talk about
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: President Trump's new tone and the revival of the daily
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: COVID briefings, the latest twists and turns on Congress's efforts
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: to pass another COVID relief bill, and Joe Biden's very
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: bold plan to help caregivers and parents. But first, Tommy,
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: every week in the housekeeping section, my favorite part is
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: when John dramatically reads the Pod Save the World promos.
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: But since we have you here today, I'll let you
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: do it yourself.
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: I don't even remember what I sent over. What usually
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: happens with these is I send something stupid and then
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: Jordan and Michael Martinez chill it out a little bit.
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: But Ben and I had a great show. We had
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: Matt Dusson, who is a national security advisor to Bernie Sanders,
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: incredibly smart guy who's trying to think of all the
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: ways to push for a more progressive foreign policy. And
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: then we also talked about the ways that everything Mike Pompeo,
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: the Secretary of State, touches turns to shit. So check
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: that one out. We got to do a Mike Pompeo
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: in a poop emoji. podcast cover art, which speaks to
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: just how childish we are. But I also think it's
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: worth letting everybody know how bad Mike is at his
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: job before he runs for president, since he went to
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: Iowa last week, Dan, on the State Department dime.
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: I mean, sure. That makes complete sense. There's nothing else
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: happening in the world. He probably has time to work
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: in Iowa.
• 3:06
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: Good point.
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: This is hard to believe, but Sunday will be 100
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: days out from Election Day. And between now and then,
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: we'll be up against structural problems that will make or
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: break the election. On top of this pandemic, we're facing
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: rampant voter suppression and disinformation, and in an election where
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: we'll need every last vote, we can't afford to lose
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: a single one. That's why this Sunday, Vote Save America
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: is kicking off a week of action, a fight back,
• 3:30
  Speaker 1: and make sure that every last vote is counted on
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: election day. Check out votesaveamerica.com slash every last vote for
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: all the details. We'll have a tool for you to
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: request mail ballots, opportunities for you to call voters about
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: voting by mail and volunteer as a poll worker on
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: election day, and We're launching a brand new fund with
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: our friends at PowerPack to support aggressive on-the-ground efforts to
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: mobilize marginalized communities that are frequently the targets of aggressive
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: voter disenfranchisement efforts. Our week of action starts on Sunday.
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: Once again, check everything out at votesaveamerica.com slash everylastvote. This week,
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: as his polling numbers sank further into the proverbial political toilet,
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: President Trump restarted his daily coronavirus briefings, which he suspended
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: in the spring and after suggesting that Americans drink bleach
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: to protect themselves. Before we get to the briefings, Trump
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: did an interview with Fox News where he had a
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: few things to say about that mental acuity test he's
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: so proudly taken. Let's take a listen.
• 4:25
  Speaker 4: If you're in the office of the presidency, we have
• 4:28
  Speaker 4: to be sure. So they were saying all these different things.
• 4:31
  Speaker 4: It was going all over. Whichever stuck, none of it stuck, fortunately.
• 4:34
  Speaker 4: But one of the reasons it didn't is that I
• 4:36
  Speaker 4: took a test. I said to the doctor, it was Dr.
• 4:39
  Speaker 4: Ronnie Jackson, I said, is there some kind of a test?
• 4:42
  Speaker 4: an acuity test. And he said there actually is, and
• 4:45
  Speaker 4: he named it, whatever it might be. And it was
• 4:48
  Speaker 4: 30 or 35 questions. The first questions are very easy.
• 4:51
  Speaker 4: The last questions are much more difficult. Like a memory question,
• 4:55
  Speaker 4: it's like you'll go person, woman, man, camera, TV. So
• 5:05
  Speaker 4: they say, could you repeat that? So I said, yeah.
• 5:09
  Speaker 4: So it's person, woman, Man, camera, TV. Okay, that's very good.
• 5:16
  Speaker 4: If you get it in order, you get extra points. Okay,
• 5:19
  Speaker 4: now he's asking you other questions, other questions, and then
• 5:24
  Speaker 4: 10 minutes, 15, 20 minutes later, he'll say, remember the
• 5:27
  Speaker 4: first question? Not the first, but the 10th question? Give
• 5:31
  Speaker 4: us that again. Can you do that again? And you go, person, woman, man, camera, TV.
• 5:39
  Speaker 4: If you get it in order, you get extra points.
• 5:42
  Speaker 4: They said, nobody gets it in order. It's actually not
• 5:44
  Speaker 4: that easy. But for me, it was easy. And that's
• 5:48
  Speaker 4: not an easy question. In other words, they ask it
• 5:50
  Speaker 4: to you. They give you five names, and you have
• 5:52
  Speaker 4: to repeat them. And that's OK. If you repeat them
• 5:55
  Speaker 4: out of order, it's OK. But, you know, it's not
• 5:58
  Speaker 4: as good. But then when you go back about 20,
• 6:01
  Speaker 4: 25 minutes later, and they say, go back to that question.
• 6:03
  Speaker 4: They don't tell you this. Go back to that question
• 6:06
  Speaker 4: and repeat them. Can you do it? And you go, person, woman, man.
• 6:13
  Speaker 4: camera TV. They say, that's amazing.
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: How did you do that?
• 6:18
  Speaker 4: I do it because I have like a good memory
• 6:21
  Speaker 4: because I'm cognitively there.
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: Okay, Tommy. So after listening to Donald Trump explain this test,
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: are you ready to finally admit that he is the
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: very staple genius he claims to be?
• 6:35
  Speaker 2: He is, you know, look, he was right all along.
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: We're wrong. I mean, this moment kind of encapsulates, I think,
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: everything about Trump that is terrifying to hilarious, and demoralizing
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: all at once. He is basically bragging about passing the
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: NFL concussion test without ever getting on the field. He
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: somehow thinks that sounding like a CNC is the way
• 6:57
  Speaker 2: to make an argument that Joe Biden is in cognitive decline.
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: For all of us, it is just self-evident that he's
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: a blithering idiot, but somehow 40% of the country is
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: going to love it Because Fox News trots out the
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: Geraldo Rivera of TV doctors to tell us he's a genius.
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: It's just one of those moments where his stupidity is
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: laid bare for the world to see and half of
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: the country still won't. And it makes you apoplectic that
• 7:24
  Speaker 2: this man is in charge. But whatever. Here we are.
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: I mean, I feel like his pride in passing this
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: test was undermined by the fact that he could not
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: remember the name of the test.
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: That's right.
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: I mean, you're right. It's a real window into just
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: Donald Trump's mind, which is he is clearly incredibly proud of,
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: quote unquote, passing this test. It's perhaps the only test
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: he's ever passed. And he is unable to even acknowledge
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: or accept the idea that this is not the Mensa
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: entrance exam. This is not the application for a Rhodes Scholarship.
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: It is essentially the test they give people to see
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: if they have dementia or potentially Alzheimer's. That's what it is.
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: And that's the test he's passed. And he treats it
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: as if it's a way to demonstrate that he has
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: the ability to be president, not just to remember five
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: things in a row. And thinking that this exam is
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: worthy of being president of the United States is sort
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: of like passing a field sobriety test and thinking it
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: qualifies you to be the number one draft pick in
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: the NFL. It's just an absurd sense of how he
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: glorifies the basic minimum success. And I would also note
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: that He sort of explained that this was Dr. Ronnie
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: Jackson who gave it to him. And Dr. Ronnie Jackson
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: left the White House years ago to then run a
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: horribly offensive and deeply disappointing campaign for Congress. So this
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: isn't even a recent mental acuity test.
• 8:59
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: I mean, he didn't get into Mensa. He basically, it's
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: like that commercial where you can get into an art
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: school if you draw a turtle with a pirate hat
• 9:06
  Speaker 2: on it. I mean, it's like, he just doesn't seem
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: to understand that. Even discussing this once is a self-own.
• 9:13
  Speaker 2: The way you prove that you are all cognitively there
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: is you don't talk about your cognitive tests. You just
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: kind of move on.
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: The only rule of being cognitively fit is not having
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: to defend whether you're cognitively fit.
• 9:26
  Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah.
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: I think that's right.
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: Okay. So far, Trump has held two briefings. And while
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: he's no longer telling Americans to chug disinfectant, Here's what
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: he did say this past week. He lied about the
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: US coronavirus mortality rate and spread misinformation about the ability
• 9:41
  Speaker 1: of children to transmit the coronavirus, as well as offering
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: well wishes to the woman accused of helping Jeffrey Epstein
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: in the sexual trafficking of minors. But despite that, the
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: news media was quite excited about a, quote, change in
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: tone that they're seeing from the president. Our friends at
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: The Daily Show did a little compilation that we'd like
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: to play for you.
• 10:00
  Speaker 3: President Trump is dramatically changing his tone and strategy. Tonight,
• 10:03
  Speaker 3: the president took the podium alone, bringing in a shift
• 10:07
  Speaker 3: in tone.
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: Striking a much more serious and measured tone.
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: Perhaps a bit more reserved version of President Trump.
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: A different tone coming from the president today.
• 10:16
  Speaker 5: For the first time, presented a rather sober view of
• 10:19
  Speaker 5: this pandemic.
• 10:20
  Speaker 6: The president at times was calm.
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: Offering a more sobering analysis. The president actually sang in
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: a very somber way.
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: He was solo.
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: It was shorter. He had a really different tone.
• 10:31
  Speaker 3: What stands out to me here is the change in tone.
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: Well, Tommy, before we get to what I'm sure will
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: be a very spirited discussion of the tone, I wanted
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: to ask you about the return of the briefings themselves
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: and what do you think this says about whether Trump
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: is acknowledging either the change in virus since he got
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: rid of these briefings, or at least the change in
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: his political standing.
• 10:55
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: So Dan, just one quick note, just for my worldos
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: out there. We also learned this week that Trump asked
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: his ambassador to the UK to lobby British officials to
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: get the British open at his golf course and then
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: denied it at one of these briefings. So we're just
• 11:08
  Speaker 2: full on lies, propaganda, corruption. It's all happening at once.
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: But back to the briefings itself. So his advisors aren't good.
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: They are not good at politics, but they're able to
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: turn on a television. So they know that the coronavirus
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: news is all consuming. They reportedly showed Trump a bunch
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: of polling that proved that his numbers around the handling
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: of the pandemic are catastrophically bad. I do think that's
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: probably why you've seen some course corrections in terms of
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: him wearing a mask publicly. Like, look, it's significant, right?
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: Like normally he doesn't learn or change in any way.
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: But in this case, I just think it would be
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: political suicide to keep doing what you're doing. And it
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: always speaks to the tension in the White House, which
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: is how much do you have the president talk about
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: the news of the day and what's happening versus what
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: you want your message to be? I think they're learning
• 11:56
  Speaker 2: that in a pandemic, you just don't have a choice.
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: But Dan, you tweeted, Trump always thinks that more Trump
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: is the answer to the problem when he's really the problem.
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: I think that's a perfect encapsulation. I don't know if
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: resuming the briefing will help them. I think they probably
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: have to give it a shot, I would argue, for
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: doing it. But the problem is that he has screwed
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: up his trust on this issue so badly that two-thirds
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: of the country doesn't believe what he says. And he
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: refuses to let Fauci or Dr. Birx or any of
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: the professionals do the briefings because that hurts his ego.
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: So we might have a new tone for a couple
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: of days. We'll get to that later. I'm sure we'll
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: see the same old Trump. And actions will speak louder
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: than words here, I think, when it comes to what
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: Congress and the administration actually puts forward to help people.
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: I think that You raise a really important point. And
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: by that, I mean you quoted my tweet. But like
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: I said, we'll get to tone. But these briefings are
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: stylistically different than the previous briefings, which is the previous
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: briefings included Trump usually at the top. And then there
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: was like this cavalcade of cabinet secretaries leaned really heavy,
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: particularly early on, on the quote unquote medical experts in Dr.
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: Fauci and Birx. And these briefings are Trump and only Trump.
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: And I am skeptical that the problem politically or substantively
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: or stylistically with the previous briefings was too much expertise, right?
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, me too.
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: It is the TV critic, The New York Times, who
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: wrote a book about how TV informs Trump's relationship, which
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: is a great book, whose title I have totally forgotten
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: right now. But he wrote an article about this where
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: he compared what's happening with these briefings to season two
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: of The Apprentice. And we have sort of convinced ourselves
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: because Donald Trump became president that The Apprentice was this
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: incredibly successful show over a long period of time that
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: led to Donald Trump being president. But that's not actually
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: the case. The first season was a huge success. And
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: then Trump sort of attributed all of the success to himself,
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: went on a huge media tour, made himself a bigger
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: part of the show, and the ratings cratered in the
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: second season. And eventually, it was then rebooted as the
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: even more ridiculous celebrity apprentice where he was, uh, getting
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: like D-list celebrities to, to compete for jobs. Like, uh,
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: I think little John most famously was on there.
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: Um, yeah, I think meatloaf, a couple, you know, Busey.
• 14:16
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: Busey.
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: Uh, Gary or Jake, I don't know which, um, but like,
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: that is sort of what, like he thinks as you know,
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: is in that tweet, Trump always thinks that more Trump
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: is the solution to the problem. And when it's probably
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: the opposite, like if, If we were in a world
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: with a normal president, right? How do you think a
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: normal– let's take Barack Obama as a random selection of
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: a normal president. But how do you think we would
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: have handled the briefings from an Obama perspective?
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: I mean, think about like a foreign trip, right? When
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: we would go abroad, when we go to a G20,
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: when we go to a NATO summit, you have this
• 14:54
  Speaker 2: captive audience of a press corps. You have all these experts, right?
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: who are there with you to staff you in the
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: various meetings about discrete issues. What you do in those
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: cases is you have your expert on China or the
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: economy brief for you because the president should have better
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: things to do than spend an hour every single day
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: at the podium. At some point, you need to take
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: questions from the press. You need to give speeches. But
• 15:20
  Speaker 2: in terms of the White House briefing component, I would
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: just have these experts out there every day providing factual
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: information trying to create a cadence where people felt like
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: they trusted information from the White House again. At the
• 15:34
  Speaker 2: same time, I would want the president doing events with
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: first responders. I would want him visiting with doctors. I
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: would want him welcoming into the Oval Office people who
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: have fully recovered from COVID to show that there's sort
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: of a light at the end of this tunnel. There's
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: a million different ways you can have him out on
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: these issues that isn't taking a grab bag of questions
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: from the press, half of which are going to be
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: about things you don't want to talk to. So like tactically,
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: maybe it's the only thing they can do, but it's
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: still not the best way to approach it, I don't think.
• 16:11
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: The most strategic way of thinking about this from Trump,
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: and like you said, neither he nor his team are
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: particularly strategic in any way, shape, or form, but is
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: the best chance– for Trump to get reelected is to
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: get the virus under control. The best way for the
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: virus to get under control is for Americans to change behavior.
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: You would need to put someone who was trusted by
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: Americans to give them advice. You would pretty much do
• 16:39
  Speaker 1: this briefing with Dr. Fauci every single day. It would
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: probably be covered live on television every single day because Dr.
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: Fauci is trusted by a rolling majority of Americans. He
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: has bipartisan trust. And if he was telling people to
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: wear masks, to socially distance, to stay out of bars,
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: to not gather people outside of your household indoors, that
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: would have the potential to change behavior. And therefore, Trump
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: would sort of lie back. It's often true that the
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: best thing that Trump could do to improve his political
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: position would be to just shut up because he has
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: become so polarizing. And as you point out, so distrusted
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: on coronavirus that he has the opposite effect, right? He
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: is incapable of telling people good information clearly. And when
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: he speaks, it often drives people in the wrong direction,
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: both it takes, you know, his base, which are the
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: people that have been weaponized against this and moves them
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: in the wrong direction. And in a pandemic where we
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: are only sort of as strong as our weakest link,
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: you need everyone in there. But They're incapable of that.
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: That has been always how Trump has responded to these
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: things is just more Trump.
• 17:45
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: Now, we spent a lot of time dunking on the media.
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: And as that Daily Show clip showed, a lot of
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: them sort of fell hook, line, and sinker for the
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: idea that Trump has a new tone and is newly
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: engaged in the coronavirus. That is the spin that Trump
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: team has been giving to the press that, yeah, sure,
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: maybe he had downplayed it before and was against masks.
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: as the Washington Post reporter over the weekend, bored with
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: the coronavirus, but now he's engaged and he has this
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: new tone. And so first I want to ask, why
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: do you think so many members in the media sort
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: of have fallen for this trick? Or is it a trick?
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: Is it a new tone of sorts?
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: I mean, right. Suggesting Trump had a new tone at
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: the briefing can get you murdered via quote tweets, so
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: I will tread lightly here. But there is a charitable
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: version of that description, which is basically Trump didn't go
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: out and do an hour and a half long briefing
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: that it was ranting and raving and included like five
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: minute diatribes about how the military ran out of bullets
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: until he came along, right? Like that was the version
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: of this we were seeing in April. He didn't say
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: inject some bleach into your body. He said the obvious,
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: which is that, you know, COVID will probably get worse
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: before it gets better. And while that is the lowest
• 19:05
  Speaker 2: bar humanly possible, when people say like how he's talking
• 19:10
  Speaker 2: about COVID has changed. I think that's what they're, they're
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: talking about. It was shorter. It was sort of subdued. Um,
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: but those descriptions are all, all relative to a 30
• 19:20
  Speaker 2: minute snapshot in time. And I doubt it will stay
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: that way. I think the problem for Trump is it's
• 19:25
  Speaker 2: too little, too late telling everyone to wear masks three
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: to four months ago might've meaningfully slowed the spread of
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: the virus. It might've saved a lot of lives. If
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: he had tweeted, uh, be safe, care for your neighbors,
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: you know, like take care of your children instead of
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: liberate Michigan, right? We might've prevented this response from becoming partisan.
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: So he's, again, like you said, like not doing the
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: obvious easy thing, which is just have Fauci do the
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: briefings but he's not as embarrassingly terrible as he was
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: at one point so I think that the delta between
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: those two gets shorthanded as new tone it's just we've
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: seen these little snapshots in day or two moments of
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: what seems like contrition from him, but they never, ever,
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: ever stick. And I think that's what drives people crazy.
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: I think if we're going to be fair to the media,
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: which you know we always strive to do here at
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: Pod Save America, is I think for the overwhelming majority
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: of the media, if you ignore some tweets and some
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: brief clips on cable, the idea that Trump has a
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: new tone and a new level of engagement is treated
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: with a pretty heavy degree of skepticism, right? It's like
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: dripping out of these stories. Because people, he's done this
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: a thousand times. There are only so many times people
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: are going to fall for it. The fact that some
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: people in the media still go to it, I think,
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: speaks to a couple of different things. One is, it's
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: the larger both sides narrative that the media loves, which
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: is you would rather be balanced than accurate. And any
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: opportunity you have to say something positive about Trump sort
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: of helps get you your both sides quota for the month.
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: And so people leap to that. And I think second is.
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: The media, like the rest of us, we have family
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: members at risk of COVID. We know people who have
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: gotten sick or died from COVID. If you're in the media,
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: you're deeply worried about your financial situation because of the
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: hit the coronavirus-related recession has had on advertising and everything.
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: And so I think there is sometimes this thirst for
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: a normal president. We need him. We actually need Trump
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: to succeed here as a country. And so you can
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: see some yearning in the media for it. I think
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: what is like, is his tone different? I think that's
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: sort of the, it's a cheap way that the media
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: sort of does it. And it's like defaulting to optics, which,
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: you know, we obviously scream about all the time, but
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: I think what is different, at least in two briefings
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: is that he didn't take the bait, right? He took
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: these questions, reporters asked him, you know, about things other than, um,
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: And then the coronavirus, and instead of launching into a diatribe,
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: he got a question about Chicago Mayor Lori Lightfoot's response
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: to his proposal to use federal troops to invade Chicago.
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: And he answered it in an incredibly stupid and pretty
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: offensive way, but not his usual stupid and offensive way.
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: And so he is getting credit for that. Whether that
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: will stick for several days, I do not know. And
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: then I think the other mistake the media makes is
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: sort of treating this briefing as something that happens in
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: a vacuum. Because that's not how people consume it, right? Like, yes,
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: there must be some– like, it's hard for me to
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: imagine there's some audience of people who watch that 30-minute
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: briefing and they consume no other Trump content for the
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: rest of the day. And as he's being praised for
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: his new tone and new level of engagement or, quote, unquote,
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: turning the corner on mass or whatever, he's sending out
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: a bunch of crazy tweets this morning about Obama and
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: Biden and Liz Cheney and a bunch of other things.
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: And so, you know, let's see where this goes in
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: a few days. But it doesn't– like, I don't think
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: this is the moment where Trump became president.
• 22:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, your point about this happening in a
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: vacuum is the most important one. I mean, of course,
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: if you read a tweet that says new tone from Trump,
• 23:08
  Speaker 2: you are going to spiral off in a rage if
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: you juxtapose that with images of random, unidentified DHS stormtroopers
• 23:17
  Speaker 2: beating the shit out of moms who are protesting in Portland, right?
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: Tear gassing the mayor of Portland.
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: Tear gassing the mayor of Portland. And to your other point,
• 23:26
  Speaker 2: like reporters are human beings. They're doing their best. They're
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: scared to death in this moment too. Ashley Parker writes
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: for the Washington Post. She's been on the show a
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: couple of times. Fantastic reporter, wonderful human being. Tweeted on
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: the 22nd that she took a COVID test last Monday
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: and it has now been 10 days and she still
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: doesn't have her results. So they are living with the
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: consequences of this totally fumbled policy response as much as
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: we are. They're frustrated too. Everybody's just trying to do
• 23:51
  Speaker 2: their jobs. And in some ways, Your job is to reflect, okay,
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: if the Tuesday briefing was totally different than the Monday briefing,
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: you have to tell people that, but you have to
• 24:00
  Speaker 2: sweep it into the broader context of how badly this
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: whole thing has been bungled.
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: It's sort of the hard part of media today, which
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: is if you were to read just written stories in
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: the Times and the Post about this, you would get
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: the full context. If you're consuming news in a three-minute
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: immediate reaction on– CNN or MSNBC or Fox or whatever else,
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: or just reading a tweet, you're not going to get
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: that full context. And it's, were you surprised that he
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: took a moment during this briefing to offer well wishes
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: to Ghislaine Maxwell?
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: I mean, that is, look, and again, here's another moment
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: where I can very easily understand why people would fly
• 24:41
  Speaker 2: off into a rage about the new tone suggestion. I mean,
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: Ghislaine Maxwell is charged with sex trafficking of children. She
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: conspired with Jeffrey Epstein to sexually abuse minors. She participated
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: in the abuse of girls as young as 14. You
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: don't wish her well. You hope that she rots in
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: a fucking prison cell and that she survives to testify
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: against all the other people who are complicit in this, right?
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: That statement would be a defining moment for the presidency
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: of basically any other human being who has served in
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: that role But for Trump, it's just the latest in
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: a string of bizarre moments that define the entire presidency,
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: I guess.
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean, he does have this natural tendency because
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: he views everything through himself. And so when people are
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: accused of racism, he tends to defend them because he
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: thinks any accusation of racism is an accusation against Trump,
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: which- It's a bit of a self-conscious own there. Yep.
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: But it's the same thing with– which is why he's
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: always defended whether it's Harvey Weinstein or Bill O'Reilly or
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: anyone else. Anytime someone is accused of sexual assault or
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: sexual harassment or crimes, he has a– like he feels
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: a connection to people involved in crimes. And so– at
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: least white people involved in crimes. And so that's why
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: he left here. It does like– you just have to
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: say that if you are– Working on your story about
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: the new tone and he offers well wishes to Glenn Maxwell,
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: you probably should delete your story and start over with
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: a story about President Trump using the White House podium
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: to offer well wishes to Glenn Maxwell. But such is
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: the world we live in.
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. Well wishes to pedophile would normally be the
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: lead of most White House speeches.
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: That would be on the front page of a paper
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: if Barack Obama had done that. Yes, I believe that.
• 26:32
  Speaker 2: You'd think. That and a tan suit, sure.
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. All right, Tommy, while we're on the
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: topic of tone, there was a separate incident in the
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: house this week that we should talk about. On Monday,
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: Florida Representative Ted Yoho accosted Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on the
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: steps of the Capitol, calling her disgusting and crazy. After
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: AOC called him rude and he walked away, he was
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: heard by a reporter calling her a quote, fucking bitch.
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: Yoho later offered a pretty insufficient apology where he used
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: his wife and daughters to defend himself from charges of
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: sexism and said he couldn't apologize for his passion or
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: for loving my God, my family, and my country. AOC
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: spoke about what happened and how Yoho responded on the
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: House floor on Thursday. It's worth listening to the whole thing,
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: but here's a short clip.
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: But what I do have issue with is using women,
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: our wives, and daughters as shields and excuses for poor behavior.
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: Mr.
• 27:34
  Speaker 3: Yoho mentioned that he has a wife and two daughters.
• 27:38
  Speaker 3: I am two years younger than Mr. Yoho's youngest daughter.
• 27:45
  Speaker 3: I am someone's daughter, too. My father, thankfully, is not
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: alive to see how Mr. Yoho treated his daughter. My
• 27:59
  Speaker 3: mother got to see Mr. Yoho's disrespect on the floor
• 28:05
  Speaker 3: of this house towards me on television. And I am
• 28:09
  Speaker 3: here because I have to show my parents that I
• 28:12
  Speaker 3: am their daughter and that they did not raise me
• 28:16
  Speaker 3: to accept abuse from men.
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: Tommy, what's your reaction to that?
• 28:21
  Speaker 2: I mean, first of all, you know, Ted Yoho calling
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: her a fucking bitch in front of a reporter and
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: then saying, I cannot apologize for my passion or for
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: loving my God. It is such a disgraceful, cynical, cowardly,
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: pathetic excuse for an apology. I couldn't believe it. I mean, look,
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: misogyny is not new. It is not new in Congress.
• 28:44
  Speaker 2: It is not new in Washington, D.C. Misogyny is not
• 28:47
  Speaker 2: a Republican problem. It is an American problem. That said,
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: I mean, the kind of treatment and dehumanization that AOC
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: and a lot of the younger members of Congress, women
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: of color mostly, have endured is disgraceful. I mean, A
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: Republican super PAC ran an ad that starts by burning
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: a photo of AOC's face to reveal a pile of
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: human skulls in Cambodia. Right. Trump told the squad to
• 29:13
  Speaker 2: go back to where they came from, I guess, forgetting
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: that they are American citizens. Rudy Giuliani this week tweeted
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: a photo that was taken four years before Ilhan Omar
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: was born. and claimed that it was a picture of
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: her at an Al-Qaeda training camp. Before that, Susan Rice
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: was the preferred Fox News target. This doesn't happen by accident.
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: They are targeted because of their gender, their race, and
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: the goal is to dehumanize them. And that makes people
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: like Ted Yoho feel okay, threatening them, calling them names,
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: delegitimizing them. And so like Trump didn't create this problem,
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: but when you have a man in the Oval Office
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: bragging about sexual assault, it certainly makes them all think
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: they can get away with these kinds of comments with impunity.
• 29:57
  Speaker 2: So Good for her for calling this shit out. I
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: highly recommend everyone watch the full nine-minute speech. It was powerful.
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: I think she delivered it without any notes. I mean,
• 30:08
  Speaker 2: it was just like searing, personal. Hopefully, it leads to
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: some introspection from Yoho and some of these others who
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: like to hide behind the fact that they're fathers and
• 30:19
  Speaker 2: husbands and all this nonsense, but treat others with such disrespect.
• 30:22
  Speaker 2: But it was incredibly impressive. Yeah.
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: I mean, AOC is one of the most powerful, eloquent
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: messengers and people in all of American life. And I
• 30:32
  Speaker 1: thought she responded to that in an incredibly powerful way.
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: And you're right that this is part of a larger
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: pattern of the dehumanization of people of color and women
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: of color in particular that comes directly from the Oval Office.
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: Ted Yoho, who seems appropriately named, by the way, has
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: been horrible long before Donald Trump was in office. But
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: Trump's behavior and his rhetoric sets a standard, not just
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: for the Republican Party, for the American people. And it's
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: important for people to stand up and push back against it.
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: And AOC did it in as powerful a way as possible.
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: And I would encourage people to share the speech, clips
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: of the speech with people in their network, because I
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: think it is helpful to hear the way how she
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: responded to it as so many Americans deal with this.
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, agreed.
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: Okay, so we've known for a long time that the
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: initial coronavirus stimulus bill wouldn't be enough to get us
• 31:26
  Speaker 1: through this crisis. That is why back in May, the
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: House Democrats passed the HEROES Act, a $ 3 trillion piece
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: of legislation that extended the $ 600 unemployment expansion, provided billions
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: of dollars for state and local governments, and ramped up
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: public health infrastructure, including testing. Since then, the Republicans have
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: done basically squat. Mitch McConnell has even argued against doing
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: anything at all. But on Thursday morning, Republicans got a
• 31:48
  Speaker 1: new tone. We finally got some movement from them. According
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: to the Washington Post, the emerging GOP bill is expected
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: to include a fresh round of $ 1, 200 stimulus checks, a
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: limited extension of enhanced unemployment insurance benefits, and $ 70 billion
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: for elementary and secondary schools, money for coronavirus testing and tracing,
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: and of course, every Republican's favorite provision, legal liability protections
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: for businesses. Yeah, it's right. I think I would add
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: one note to this is that Half the money for
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: schools in the bill is conditioned upon schools physically reopening
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: in the fall, and there is no new money for
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: states and localities. Tommy, I have to ask, do you
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: think this seems sufficient, especially given the fact that we
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: got news this morning that weekly unemployment claims were higher
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: than expected and went up for the first time since
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: the early days of the pandemic?
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: No, and they are not fooling anyone with this bullshit.
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: I mean, you can't bungle the pandemic response and then
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: say to workers, look, I know you're out of work
• 32:47
  Speaker 2: because we couldn't get our shit together and it's not
• 32:50
  Speaker 2: even safe to leave your house, but we're going to
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: gut the unemployment benefits we gave you earlier and then
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: pass a bunch of liability waivers that allow your bosses
• 32:57
  Speaker 2: to force you to go back to work and get sick.
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: That is not going to fly, right? Republicans have embraced
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: this false choice that we either reopen the economy or
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: we deal with the pandemic. People understand that they are
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: linked and they're just going to call them out on
• 33:09
  Speaker 2: this bullshit. I think Democrats, like I've never seen the
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: Democratic Party better positioned politically to pick a fight. Republicans
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: want to cut the enhanced unemployment benefit to $ 400 a month.
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: Democrats should fight like hell to keep it at $ 600
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: a week. And we should fight like hell to prevent
• 33:28
  Speaker 2: these liability waivers for businesses. I mean, the New Yorker's
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: Jane Mayer, who's a fantastic reporter, had a really important
• 33:34
  Speaker 2: piece this week about how the Trump administration is already
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: using the pandemic to just gut worker protections, gut OSHA,
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: and help out big corporate donors. We can't let that happen.
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: So My message to Democrats, pick a fight, right? Georgia
• 33:48
  Speaker 2: Senator Kelly Loeffler, who is best known for dumping millions
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: of dollars of stock after getting a pandemic briefing, is
• 33:54
  Speaker 2: on TV saying she sees no need to extend federal
• 33:57
  Speaker 2: unemployment insurance. This as 3.1 million Georgians, the state she represents,
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: have filed for unemployment since March. Kelly Loeffler is worth
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: $ 800 million. Her private plane costs $ 25 million. Let's make
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: Kelly the face of this thing. And by the way, Dan,
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: The moratorium on evictions that is protecting 12 million tenants
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: from getting kicked out of their homes is about to
• 34:20
  Speaker 2: expire as they're trying to gut these benefits. It is insane.
• 34:25
  Speaker 2: It is completely insane to me that they're trying to
• 34:27
  Speaker 2: do this.
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: So you make the case that Democrats should fight hard.
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: I think there is this question for Democrats, I'd be
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: curious to get your take on, which is they obviously
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: have a lot of leverage. And we'll talk in a
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: second about what that leverage is. But there is a
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: risk that if they... push in one direction or they
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: make a certain set of demands that nothing gets done.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: How much does that concern you?
• 34:52
  Speaker 2: It concerns me, but allow me to be Mitch McConnell
• 34:56
  Speaker 2: for a minute.
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: I will not allow that on this pod. You are
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: not going to be Mitch McConnell here.
• 35:02
  Speaker 2: I'm just a turtle in the shell. Oh, look at me.
• 35:05
  Speaker 2: I think Democrats have all the leverage. I think 75%
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: of the country is opposed to cutting the extra unemployment insurance.
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: Trump owns the economy politically. He owns the pandemic response.
• 35:17
  Speaker 2: I don't want us to do nothing, but I think
• 35:19
  Speaker 2: doing something half-assed won't solve the problem and it will
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: reduce people's faith in the government's ability to care. So
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: I think a failed response hurts Mitch McConnell, who's up
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: for reelection and terrified about his Senate majority slipping away.
• 35:34
  Speaker 2: I think that look, brinksmanship is scary and it sucks.
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: I would do it here because I think there's a
• 35:42
  Speaker 2: middle ground solution that we might get to that will
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: both cost a ton of money, make future action harder,
• 35:50
  Speaker 2: but not actually help people. And I kind of think
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: that that might be the worst possible scenario.
• 35:56
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: I mean, it is interesting, which is, this is always
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: the battle for Democrats. It's between our sense of responsibility
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: to doing the right thing. Because we know that we
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: are negotiating with plutocratic nihilists who are, to steal a
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: phrase from a Christopher Nolan movie, are people who just
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: want to see the world burn. That is how the
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: modern Republican Party is. And if you care if the
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: world burns, you enter into these negotiations somewhat. And McConnell
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: has exploited that in many ways over many years. The
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: thing that is interesting about this is that, as we've
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: talked about on this podcast many times, there's a strong
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: correlation between the strength of the economy on Election Day
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: and the re-election prospects of incumbents. And in this election,
• 36:41
  Speaker 1: the Republican president and the Republican Senate are the incumbents.
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: And so it would seem to be in their interest
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: more than anyone else to juice the economy. So it's
• 36:53
  Speaker 1: like you would think if they were truly– thinking about
• 36:56
  Speaker 1: doing the right thing and sort of get out of
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: the right way and conservative news bubble, the Democrats would
• 37:01
  Speaker 1: be like, we want $ 1, 200 payments. McConnell should be like.
• 37:05
  Speaker 2: You know what?
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: We'll give you $ 5, 000 payments. Whatever you can to put
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: more money in the hands of the people who need
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: it would actually help the Republicans. So we're in this
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: weird world where Democrats are trying to do the right thing.
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: And in doing the right thing, at least on the
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: economic parts of these bills, we are helping, theoretically helping,
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: potentially making get easier for Donald Trump to get reelected
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: and Mitch McConnell to hold the Senate, which, as you
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: point out, should give us a ton of leverage. You
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: brought up the UI expiration, which expires at the end
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: of this month for the expanded UI. And all the
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: timing from the congressional tea leaf readers suggests that there's
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: no way this bill is getting done before expanded UI expires.
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: And many, many, many American families are just hanging on
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: barely because of that expanded UI. The Republicans have expressed
• 37:54
  Speaker 1: reservations and in some cases outright opposition to some sort
• 37:56
  Speaker 1: of bridge, like an extension to get us between now
• 37:59
  Speaker 1: and when this new bill comes. How important do you
• 38:02
  Speaker 1: think that is and why in God's name would they
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: oppose such a thing?
• 38:06
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I mean, I think they cling to
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: this false notion that has been around for decades, that
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: the Republican Party is somehow the fiscally responsible side of
• 38:18
  Speaker 2: the aisle when we have all watched them pass tax
• 38:20
  Speaker 2: cuts for their rich friends and that have exploded the deficit?
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: I mean, look, I don't know. It's a good question
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: on the extension. I am terrified of a scenario where
• 38:31
  Speaker 2: a week, two weeks, three weeks tick by and people
• 38:35
  Speaker 2: have no money and they're starting to get evicted and
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: things are going very badly for my, for families. But I'm,
• 38:40
  Speaker 2: I'm also very worried about a scenario where Republican leaders
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: are cut a deal that ends the cap on the
• 38:49
  Speaker 2: deduction of state and local taxes because there's a very
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: vocal group of mostly upper income individuals who are progressive
• 38:58
  Speaker 2: as well lobbying for that. And then you have poultry
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: workers who are forced to go back to work in
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: unsafe conditions and have to pay for their own PPE
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: and hand sanitizer. And I'm just really worried about Those
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: people and the neediest groups who are probably not getting
• 39:17
  Speaker 2: heard or their unions have been gutted over decades. They
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: don't have lobbyists fighting for them. And so that's why
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: I just think I want Democrats to fight for a
• 39:26
  Speaker 2: maximalist position when it comes to the exploitation. unemployment benefit
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: and to ensure that we're not putting low-wage workers in
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: a position where their bosses can say, you have to
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: go back to work even though it's not safe. And
• 39:40
  Speaker 2: if people die, you can't sue me. I think you're
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: sort of seeing a version of that playing out with
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: teachers as well, who are being, in some instances, forced
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: or getting... hearing demands that they go back to work
• 39:51
  Speaker 2: when nothing has been done to ensure safe working conditions.
• 39:53
  Speaker 2: And I just think it's immoral.
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: I mean, this is the real challenge for Democrats. And
• 39:57
  Speaker 1: we've been through this a gazillion times in the Obama
• 39:59
  Speaker 1: years since we've been negotiating with congressional Republicans is there's
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: going to be debate around an extension. And the Republican
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: opposition to the extension is a negotiating tactic right now, right?
• 40:10
  Speaker 1: Which is they feel like if you do that, it
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: turns the clock off, right?
• 40:13
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: Democratic position is keep it as it is at 600.
• 40:16
  Speaker 1: Republican position is no extension. So they'll come back and say,
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: we'll extend it for two weeks or three weeks, but
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: at a $ 300 level, right? So we'll split the difference.
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: But what the problem with that is, is it sets
• 40:28
  Speaker 1: the new ceiling for when you negotiate it in the
• 40:30
  Speaker 1: bigger bill. I think this is a very important juncture
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: for Democrats to push very hard to not allow them,
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: the Republicans, to notch their first win in this fight
• 40:39
  Speaker 1: over the extension. Another thing I just want to say
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: about schools, which I think is important, which is the Republicans,
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: as you point out, have gone from sort of framing
• 40:47
  Speaker 1: around that they're the, you know, liberate Michigan, keep the
• 40:49
  Speaker 1: economy open to their big new wedge issue is schools
• 40:54
  Speaker 1: and opening of schools. And Trump at that briefing that
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: was filled with new tones and well wishes, you know,
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: talked about how there, he said, kids don't transmit the disease.
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: That is not true. That's actually a dangerous piece of information.
• 41:05
  Speaker 1: I think it's important that we correct because I mean,
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: no one knows because obviously this has only been around
• 41:11
  Speaker 1: for a few months, but there is a large new
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: study from South Korea that shows that children younger than
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: 10 transmit to others much less than adults do. But
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: the risk is not zero. And those between the ages
• 41:22
  Speaker 1: of 10 and 19 can spread the virus at least
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: as well as adults do. So what that says is
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: that it's very complicated and there is great risk in
• 41:29
  Speaker 1: opening schools because, as you may know, there are a
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: lot of people older than the age of 10 who
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: go to school. And so they're giving it to teachers
• 41:36
  Speaker 1: and they're bringing it home to parents and grandparents and
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: other people with comorbidities. And that's another reason, another thing
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: Democrats are going to fight really hard for, which is
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: These schools need money to prepare, but it cannot be
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: contingent upon risking the health of your students, teachers, employees,
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: and parents just to get that money.
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: Right. I mean, Dan, I saw a stat that said
• 41:54
  Speaker 2: 30% of teachers in the United States are over the
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: age of 50, which puts them at considerable risk from COVID-19.
• 42:01
  Speaker 2: How do we keep them safe? How do you force
• 42:03
  Speaker 2: someone at risk to go back to school? I'm not
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: a parent, but I certainly understand how profoundly... Parents need
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: their kids back in school so they can go to
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: work and they can make money. But it's incumbent on
• 42:16
  Speaker 2: the government to make those jobs safe. This isn't the military.
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: You didn't sign up to go to the fucking Marines.
• 42:21
  Speaker 2: You're a teacher. Keep them safe. And then just on
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: this last point on this unemployment insurance debate, Republicans are
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: saying publicly that they want to gut the extra unemployment benefit,
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: the $ 600 a week, because they think it's deterring people
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: from going back to work. But that is the whole point.
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: We want people home. We want people social distancing. The
• 42:42
  Speaker 2: outbreak is worse now than it was the last time
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: we passed a bill. Why would we increase incentives for
• 42:49
  Speaker 2: people to reopen or resume work in ways that are
• 42:53
  Speaker 2: not safe? And so this is an incredibly difficult negotiation.
• 42:56
  Speaker 2: It's a hard problem. Democrats need to find a way
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: to wrestle the mic away from new tone Trump so
• 43:01
  Speaker 2: that we can spell out that alternative governing strategy. Because
• 43:04
  Speaker 2: I think if people are able to hear the Democratic
• 43:07
  Speaker 2: side of this debate, It will make sense to them.
• 43:10
  Speaker 2: They intuitively know that we have to deal with the
• 43:13
  Speaker 2: virus and then we can get to the economic part
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: of the problem. But they have to be heard first.
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: That's right. Public opinion is incredibly on the side of
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: Democrats here, whether it involves the expanded UI, the additional spending,
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: the funding for state and local, the funding for schools,
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: opening schools safely. It's all on the Democratic side.
• 43:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 43:39
  Speaker 6: Before you read this ad copy, picture yourself in a
• 43:42
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• 44:42
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  Speaker 2: That's YouTube.com slash Crooked Media. Elijah, I'm amazed we read
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• 45:47
  Speaker 1: Okay, before we wrap up here, I want to take
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: a moment to talk about the latest from our Democratic nominee,
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: Joe Biden. Earlier this week, Joe Biden rolled out the
• 45:57
  Speaker 1: third part of his four-part Build Back Better plan. This
• 46:01
  Speaker 1: plan involves a $ 775 billion plan for providing help to
• 46:05
  Speaker 1: caregivers and parents. Here are just a few of the
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: things the plan calls for. Universal pre-K for three and four-year-olds,
• 46:11
  Speaker 1: credits to help people afford care for kids and the elderly,
• 46:14
  Speaker 1: funding for the construction of new facilities, and eliminating wait
• 46:17
  Speaker 1: lists that people are on for accessing home and community
• 46:21
  Speaker 1: care through Medicaid. He would pay for this plan by
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: rolling back tax breaks for real estate investors and boosting
• 46:25
  Speaker 1: tax compliance among the very rich. This is yet another
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: example of how Joe Biden is running as the most
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: progressive nominee in presidential history. I want to get just
• 46:38
  Speaker 1: your reaction, not just at this point in particular, but
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: to Biden's decision to offer such big progressive plans at
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: a time in which he is leading in the polls
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: by a large margin.
• 46:47
  Speaker 2: I think this is smart. I mean, look, it's a
• 46:51
  Speaker 2: policy that I think would be welcomed by most Americans
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: in a normal moment. I think it's particularly savvy and
• 46:58
  Speaker 2: timely at a moment where people are struggling more than usual.
• 47:02
  Speaker 2: to find pre-K for their kids, to find ways to
• 47:07
  Speaker 2: care for the elderly. Clearly, a lot of the facilities
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: and ways we were doing things before were not safe.
• 47:14
  Speaker 2: I also think it was pretty fun that their pay
• 47:17
  Speaker 2: for is going after real estate investors with incomes over
• 47:21
  Speaker 2: 400K and tax compliance for rich tax cheats. This is
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: basically a pay for That will be paid for by
• 47:27
  Speaker 2: Trumps and Kushners, right? It's like directly targeted. So this
• 47:31
  Speaker 2: is smart. It's a good idea. The challenge is always,
• 47:34
  Speaker 2: how do you get this covered? And on the 2008 campaign, Dan,
• 47:38
  Speaker 2: what we would have done was set up a round
• 47:42
  Speaker 2: table with Barack Obama and some kids and some seniors
• 47:46
  Speaker 2: in Philadelphia to get that targeted local media market and
• 47:49
  Speaker 2: sort of buttress it by a lot of local interviews
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: and one-on-ones after the fact. Hopefully that model is replicable
• 47:57
  Speaker 2: on a local scale via Zoom or via the limited
• 48:00
  Speaker 2: campaign travel you're able to do. But I think when
• 48:03
  Speaker 2: you talk about what people actually want from government, it
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: is this stuff. They don't care if Fauci's briefing or
• 48:09
  Speaker 2: Birx's briefing or Trump's talking about hydroxychloroquine or whatever the
• 48:14
  Speaker 2: fuck it's called. I don't even remember anymore. They want
• 48:16
  Speaker 2: to know, how is my tax dollar going to help
• 48:18
  Speaker 2: me get my kid to pre-K or help me take
• 48:21
  Speaker 2: care of my elderly mom? And this is a smart plan.
• 48:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Obviously, Democrats have talked about caregiving before. People have
• 48:32
  Speaker 1: had universal pre-K plans. It was in Obama's State of
• 48:35
  Speaker 1: the Union at some point. Kirsten Gillibrand had a bill
• 48:37
  Speaker 1: in the Senate for a very long time. Hillary Clinton
• 48:40
  Speaker 1: talked about it. But as Ai-jen Poo, who's the co-founder
• 48:44
  Speaker 1: and executive director of the National Domestic Workers Alliance, put it,
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: This is the first time a presidential campaign has made
• 48:49
  Speaker 1: investments in the care economy a core strategy in their
• 48:52
  Speaker 1: economic agenda, not a side issue, not an add-on or
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: a special interest. And I think that is a reflection
• 48:58
  Speaker 1: of the way in which the pandemic has changed the debate.
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: It has– like this problem about America woefully and embarrassingly
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: underfunding childcare and caregiving for the elderly has been around
• 49:10
  Speaker 1: long before this. But Like so much else, the pandemic
• 49:13
  Speaker 1: has shined a light and exacerbated huge problems in our economy.
• 49:16
  Speaker 1: And so it's obviously good politics. I don't think there's
• 49:19
  Speaker 1: a political downside to doing this. And obviously, you know,
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: the way he's paying for it is quite smart and,
• 49:25
  Speaker 1: you know, actually quite legitimate. But it's also the right
• 49:28
  Speaker 1: way to think about fixing the economy, you know, if
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: and when Joe Biden becomes president. Because particularly, you know,
• 49:35
  Speaker 1: if you're operating the assumption that coronavirus is still going
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: to be around, when Joe Biden takes office, dealing with
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: the situation where closed schools, closed daycare centers, the lack
• 49:47
  Speaker 1: of other childcare or eldercare or where nursing homes are great,
• 49:51
  Speaker 1: potential risk centers, all of that is an impediment to
• 49:54
  Speaker 1: economic activity. People cannot go back to work if they
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: cannot get childcare for their children. And so making it
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: a part of your economic strategy is a substantive right
• 50:02
  Speaker 1: thing to do. And doing the substantive right thing on
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: the economy is always the best politics for all the
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: reasons we just talked about. about how the economy drives
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: political sentiment so strongly. I was meant to ask Favreau
• 50:15
  Speaker 1: this question last week when we talked about the climate
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: part of his Build Back Better plan, but we never
• 50:21
  Speaker 1: got around to it. And I was intending to ask
• 50:22
  Speaker 1: him again this week, but since he's not here, I
• 50:24
  Speaker 1: will ask you. What do you think about the Build
• 50:27
  Speaker 1: Back Better message or title or slogan, I guess?
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: BBB?
• 50:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah, BBB.
• 50:32
  Speaker 2: I don't know. It's catchy.
• 50:34
  Speaker 4: It works.
• 50:34
  Speaker 2: I don't know. It's memorable, right?
• 50:36
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: The joke on most political campaigns I've observed or worked
• 50:41
  Speaker 2: on is that they had so many slogans that it's
• 50:44
  Speaker 2: almost a trivia question to see if you can remember
• 50:46
  Speaker 2: them all. That was a particular criticism of the 2004
• 50:50
  Speaker 2: presidential campaign, some of the other primary challengers to Barack Obama.
• 50:54
  Speaker 2: I think Build Back Better- Are you referring to Bill Richardson? No,
• 50:59
  Speaker 2: I'm referring to some others. It speaks to the moment. Look,
• 51:02
  Speaker 2: I don't know. Are any of these things valuable? Who knows?
• 51:05
  Speaker 2: You can slap it on a bumper sticker. You can
• 51:06
  Speaker 2: put it on a bus. You can easily make the
• 51:08
  Speaker 2: candidate say it. I mean, my bar on these things is,
• 51:15
  Speaker 2: does it sound incredibly forced when you have to insert
• 51:18
  Speaker 2: it into a set of remarks about the policy topper
• 51:20
  Speaker 2: of the day? In this case, I don't think it does.
• 51:23
  Speaker 2: So I say roll with it.
• 51:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean, we have been engaged over the many,
• 51:28
  Speaker 1: many years in a gazillion discussions about slogans and how
• 51:33
  Speaker 1: you title things. And I've been part of some of
• 51:36
  Speaker 1: the worst titling things ever, like when we made the
• 51:38
  Speaker 1: theme of the 2011 State of the Union, Win the Future,
• 51:42
  Speaker 1: which none of us realized. And there are a lot
• 51:44
  Speaker 1: of relatively smart people. None of us realized that abbreviated
• 51:45
  Speaker 1: to WTF. So they're always terrible. And the New Deal
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: is only a cool name in hindsight, right? At the time,
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: it probably sounded cheesy.
• 51:56
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 51:57
  Speaker 1: And I do think like I give credit to the
• 51:59
  Speaker 1: Biden people because one, I generally like alliteration, but just
• 52:02
  Speaker 1: build back better. Joe Biden, what's your plan? I want
• 52:04
  Speaker 1: to build back what we've lost and I want to
• 52:07
  Speaker 1: do it better than before. So it's just like, sometimes
• 52:09
  Speaker 1: it's like, just say the thing, like you don't get
• 52:11
  Speaker 1: extra points for rhetorical flourish. And so, and so I
• 52:14
  Speaker 1: think it's great.
• 52:15
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: It'd be look, Kerry in 04 had a stronger America
• 52:18
  Speaker 2: begins at home, a safer, stronger, more secure America, the
• 52:21
  Speaker 2: real deal, the courage to do what's right for America.
• 52:24
  Speaker 2: I think like when, Let America be America again. I
• 52:27
  Speaker 2: think we're ripping off Langston Hughes at some point. I mean,
• 52:30
  Speaker 2: you can overthink these things. You can spend hours with
• 52:33
  Speaker 2: whiteboards and name storms and blah, blah, blah, blah. If
• 52:36
  Speaker 2: people don't remember it, if the candidate doesn't want to
• 52:38
  Speaker 2: use it, if it feels corny, it's not going to work.
• 52:40
  Speaker 2: So Build Back Better, I like it. Roll with it, Joe.
• 52:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's right. The other thing I wanted
• 52:45
  Speaker 1: to say was you raised the issue of how you
• 52:49
  Speaker 1: communicate this in the pandemic. This got coverage. I think
• 52:53
  Speaker 1: he even received some television coverage and I read some
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: stories on it in the research document that Jordan and
• 53:00
  Speaker 1: Michael sent us for this. But the way to think
• 53:04
  Speaker 1: about this, I think, always is in campaigns when you're
• 53:07
  Speaker 1: rolling out policy is you want to get as much
• 53:09
  Speaker 1: coverage as you can in the moment just because you
• 53:11
  Speaker 1: want more people to know more things. But the way
• 53:14
  Speaker 1: to think about it is you are layering in a
• 53:17
  Speaker 1: platform and a story that you're going to tell in
• 53:19
  Speaker 1: paid messaging later on. So this will be You can
• 53:23
  Speaker 1: see mail pieces, you can see digital advertising, you can
• 53:25
  Speaker 1: even see TV advertising that contrasts Joe Biden's Build Back
• 53:29
  Speaker 1: Better plan, all the planks of it, with everything else.
• 53:33
  Speaker 1: You can see advertising with testimonials from parents or caregivers
• 53:40
  Speaker 1: or seniors about why Joe Biden is going to address
• 53:41
  Speaker 1: their problem. And so it's not just like, did you
• 53:44
  Speaker 1: get to do a roundtable in Philly today? It's how
• 53:47
  Speaker 1: you use this data point to make your larger argument
• 53:50
  Speaker 1: going forward.
• 53:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 53:52
  Speaker 2: I mean, look, I think the coronavirus has laid bare
• 53:55
  Speaker 2: that a lot of the social safety net in America
• 53:59
  Speaker 2: was not prepared for this moment, was not strong enough
• 54:01
  Speaker 2: to begin with. And so that we need to fix
• 54:04
  Speaker 2: that in the long term. I also think the Biden
• 54:06
  Speaker 2: campaign probably listened to an internalized criticism that some of
• 54:12
  Speaker 2: his early messaging that sounded like, hey, we're just going
• 54:15
  Speaker 2: to go back to the Obama era and everything is
• 54:16
  Speaker 2: going to be OK. did not resonate for a lot
• 54:19
  Speaker 2: of people who felt left behind even during the Obama economy.
• 54:22
  Speaker 2: So I do think Build Back Better speaks to that
• 54:26
  Speaker 2: tension and to the moment of the coronavirus.
• 54:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. Tommy.
• 54:32
  Speaker 2: Dan.
• 54:32
  Speaker 1: Thank you for filling in for Jon Favreau at the
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: last minute because of unexpected events. And we are obviously
• 54:43
  Speaker 1: thinking about and John and Emily, and wishing them all
• 54:46
  Speaker 1: the best right now. And we'll talk to everyone next week.
• 54:51
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 54:51
  Speaker 2: I mean, look, Dan, I just want to tell everyone,
• 54:53
  Speaker 2: I'm in the office for the first time because I
• 54:56
  Speaker 2: had to escape two barking dogs. And I'm sitting next
• 54:59
  Speaker 2: to the Dan-o-rama, which we don't get to use, but
• 55:01
  Speaker 2: it includes this creepy hand with your face on it.
• 55:05
  Speaker 2: So I just wanted you to see that I'm thinking
• 55:08
  Speaker 2: of you. We're thinking of John and Emily. The weird
• 55:10
  Speaker 2: thing about someone going into labor in 2020 is you
• 55:12
  Speaker 2: can literally text them as they're in bed. So everybody
• 55:15
  Speaker 2: seems fine so far, but yeah, excited for them. Excited
• 55:18
  Speaker 2: for baby Favreau. Thanks for having me on Thursday.
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: All right. Bye everyone.
• 55:22
  Speaker 4: Bye.
• 55:29
  Speaker 5: Pod Save America is a Crooked Media production. The executive
• 55:32
  Speaker 5: producer is Michael Martinez. Our assistant producer is Jordan Waller.
• 55:36
  Speaker 5: It's mixed and edited by Andrew Chadwick. Kyle Seglin is
• 55:39
  Speaker 5: our sound engineer. Thanks to Tanya Sominator, Katie Long, Roman Papadimitriou,
• 55:43
  Speaker 5: Caroline Reston, and Elisa Gutierrez for production support, and to
• 55:46
  Speaker 5: our digital team, Elijah Cohn, Narmel Cohnian, Yale Freed, and
• 55:50
  Speaker 5: Milo Kim, who film and upload these episodes as videos
• 55:53
  Speaker 5: every week.