Latest / Coffee People Podcast / Roast! - Hollis Swan, Declination Roasting Company

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Roast! - Hollis Swan, Declination Roasting Company · Coffee People Podcast

0:00
Hey, good morning everyone. Welcome to season 4 episode. 8
0:14
of the roast West Coast coffee podcast.
0:17
I'm Ryan Walt. And this is the show where I
0:19
bring you stories of coffee professionals entrepreneurship
0:22
and coffee education. Today, I'm joined by Hollis
0:25
Swan, he's the founder and Lead roaster of declination Roasting
0:28
Company in Soldotna, Alaska. Aska.
0:30
He's also the founder of declination Studios and an
0:33
artist and an art teacher and a welder and a coffee roaster
0:37
Builder. And a fisherman, he does a lot
0:40
of things Hollis is further north and west than any guests
0:44
I've spoken to yet someday, I hope to make the 36 Hundred Mile
0:48
Drive that includes multiple country, border crossings to
0:51
explore the Kenai Peninsula. But for the purposes of this
0:55
podcast, I want to point out that I reached out to Hollis
0:57
after stumbling on his Instagram account.
1:00
I had no idea at the time that he was connected to Southern
1:03
California in any way, nor that we were linked by only one
1:07
degree of separation more on. That will be forthcoming during
1:11
our recording session, which was a few weeks ago, I kept finding
1:14
myself being very aware of how amazing it was.
1:17
That two strangers could get together for a cup of coffee
1:20
over a video chat and it would feel completely normal.
1:23
The technology of our time in the speed at which we've all
1:25
adapted to it is truly amazing right now.
1:29
You and I are even connecting through this podcast albeit in
1:32
an abstract sort of way. To help strengthen that
1:36
connection. I'll try to paint you a little
1:37
bit of a picture in a moment. I'll be in the kitchen pouring
1:40
myself, a cup of coffee, from a stainless steel French Press.
1:44
It'll feel a truly lovely, handmade ceramic vessel of
1:47
glazed Browns and purples without a handle.
1:49
Hollis, kindly ship the cup down to me.
1:51
After we chatted along with a few coffees to try, then I'll
1:55
sit on the front porch steps, looking out at the bank parking
1:57
lot. Over the fence, a beast of a
1:59
brown, Labrador, pointer mix named Mick sitting like a human
2:03
on the step. Next to me, I'm out.
2:05
Obligated to tell you to head to roast westcoast.com.
2:08
If you want to see that cup or subscribe to the Rose to West
2:11
Coast coffee newsletter, it's free.
2:13
But you can also pay for a monthly subscription or just buy
2:16
us a cup of coffee there. If you've been appreciating this
2:19
content, thanks for all your support.
2:22
It's what drives this show further and further into being a
2:24
real professional program which I think is the goal.
2:28
It is the Pinocchio story of podcasts.
2:31
Right now, make sure you've got a full cup of coffee to enjoy
2:35
because it is time for this week's roast West Coast coffee
2:38
podcast interview with Hollis Swan founder and Lead Roaster at
2:42
declination Roasting Company. I appreciate you taking some
2:59
time to hang out with me today. Welcome to the roast West Coast
3:03
coffee podcast, if you wouldn't mind for the tape here, if you
3:07
could state your name, would you think your job title is and
3:11
maybe what your favorite outdoor activity is?
3:15
My name is Paula Swan. I am the owner and Lead roaster
3:19
for a declination Roasting Company up in Soldotna, Alaska,
3:23
and Man, favorite outdoor activity.
3:26
Just being outside. Doesn't really matter what I'm
3:28
doing. Just, as long as I'm moving and
3:31
I'm sorry. I have to do this stereotypical
3:34
horrible thing, I'm in California.
3:36
I'm freezing. It's like 70 degrees today 68, I
3:40
did check your weather, and it's a little bit colder there today,
3:43
but I wanted to say a kind Gave me motivation to say.
3:47
I'm tonight I'm gonna make some hot coffee or hot chocolate and
3:51
just kind of reimagine what my growing up was like in the, in
3:55
the North Woods of Wisconsin do it.
3:57
I think it warmed up to around 1520 today, so that's a nice.
4:01
Not, yeah, super nice. I got a text this morning from
4:06
home. It was negative 19 at my mom's
4:08
this morning and I just, I do not miss that at all.
4:11
Yep. That's that's been our winner -
4:14
10 - 14, Not fun, but it is it is what it is and it's I love
4:21
the winter. I think the key is mentally
4:25
having things to do being willing to go outside and
4:28
there's a difference in being prepared to, you know, as I got
4:30
older and started investing in real equipment, like a nice code
4:34
and nice boots and all those things and it made it a lot
4:37
easier. I want to learn a little bit
4:39
about you before we get too far off the rails.
4:42
And in particular you you have a company that That reason, I
4:45
reached out to declination Coffee Roasters Coffee Company.
4:49
Before that, did you have kind of an experience with coffee
4:52
that made? You think this is something I'm
4:53
interested in learning more about or interested in pursuing?
4:57
Yeah, absolutely. I actually spent about 12 years
5:01
living down in San Diego. So, I grew up here in Alaska,
5:05
took off running like any 18 year old that grows up here and
5:09
bounce around a little bit, but found a home in San Diego and
5:13
Man, I was there a couple of years and going to school going
5:16
to art school and working for UPS couldn't make quite enough
5:22
money. So just applied for a round and
5:24
random coffee. Roasting job and got hired.
5:28
Got put to work instantly, not so much.
5:31
I love coffee was just more of an interest.
5:34
And during that first year, I was just a production roaster.
5:37
Didn't learn a whole lot. Just pushing buttons going
5:40
through the motions. But during that time, Time
5:43
frame. Somebody found out, I knew how
5:46
to weld in that company. So I started building things and
5:50
we put together a new civets roaster and from there the word
5:54
kind of got out and I got hired on by Renegade Roasters building
6:00
and Manufacturing Roasters and then we would go out and do
6:02
maintenance and that's really where my coffee education came
6:06
from. And I just wanted to be on the
6:09
record. I did not know that you had any
6:11
San Diego connection. When I reached out to you not,
6:14
when I was scrolling through your Instagram, I saw a photo of
6:19
a renegade roaster that you had worked on that's in Hawaii.
6:23
Now and I had interviewed the, the team at Renegade last season
6:27
maybe two seasons ago and I had seen pictures of that roaster
6:32
before I knew what that was. So that's just a weird
6:35
coincidence that we reached all the way.
6:38
A to Alaska and we ended up with someone who's connected here to
6:41
San Diego. We think this world is is so big
6:45
but man, it's so small. Yeah, that is very true.
6:49
A lot of Industries coffee and beer and there's a lot of
6:53
overlap, but you you always know someone who knows someone
6:56
somehow and I find that to be true.
6:59
Every time I do, another one of these interviews so you are at
7:03
Renegade working and you're obviously not there.
7:06
Now, what made you decide? Side to head back to Alaska.
7:10
There was some in between leaving, Renegade and coming to
7:14
Alaska. I got an opportunity to move
7:17
overseas over to Europe, and See what that was like.
7:22
So I took that opportunity and left Renegade not very easily.
7:28
That was a that was a fun job enjoyed what I was doing.
7:31
But again couldn't pass that up. I'll learn quickly I needed to
7:36
come back and finish school so I actually I went back to San
7:39
Diego and went back to school and then got a job working in
7:44
the art Department in North County, San Diego college.
7:49
So did that for eight years They're so.
7:52
And then one day, I woke up and decided I need to move home
7:58
life, priority changes needed to be around family moved, back
8:02
home. Got a fishing job.
8:04
Did that for a little while, saving money to buy a roaster
8:09
called my old boss. Boyd and said, hey boy, can I
8:12
buy one of your Roasters? And he's like absolutely not.
8:15
You can just make your own. I don't have time to bility
8:18
hers. So Started working on a 15 kilo
8:22
Renegade. It's still in the works.
8:25
It was taken a while bouncing from San Diego to Alaska, back
8:29
and forth. And during that timeframe a
8:33
roaster that I actually built while I was there came up on
8:35
Market, so I grab that. And right now I'm roasting on a
8:40
5 kilo, still building that 15. It'll get done eventually.
8:45
So that's where where we sit right now which is actually like
8:49
The Sibling Rose Or to The Roaster.
8:52
You saw in Hawaii. I visited that roaster last year
8:56
and then it was really cool seeing the exact replica of my
9:01
roaster. Somewhere else, brought back a
9:04
lot of good memories. So did you?
9:07
You said you were fishing? Did you go back to Alaska?
9:10
I did it to be close to family and I've been through this once
9:13
as well, where my wife and I moved to be closer to family and
9:18
we still be struggle with that. Now, we're very far away from
9:20
our both of our families, but we didn't really have a plan for
9:23
what we were going to do once we got there.
9:25
Did you go back with the priority being Family Family?
9:29
First with a plan? Or did you go back and say, I'm
9:31
just going to see where the world takes me all of the above.
9:36
Family's always first to me, always has been.
9:39
But I also know you have to take care of yourself.
9:42
So starting a Roasting Company was always on my mind how to do
9:47
it. I had no clue.
9:49
Fishing was the easy way for me to still be outside, do
9:54
something that I knew, I loved to do, and save a little bit of
9:56
money to buy a roaster. And I'm going to play it a
9:59
little bit of ignorance when we say a fishing job.
10:02
Are we talking about? Like, the ships we see on?
10:05
Like the Discovery Channel, television shows.
10:08
Are we talking about guiding what?
10:10
What is the level there? Yes.
10:12
So I was actually commercial fishing.
10:14
I spent a summer setting. So basically you throw a line
10:18
out from the shore. Go out and check it and pull the
10:21
fish in and then sell that did that for a year and then got
10:25
hired on a fishing tender, which is basically one of those big
10:29
boats that take all the fish and take it back to the Cannery.
10:32
So did that for a while? It's a big jump from the art
10:35
Department. Aunt.
10:36
Yes, it is. So once again, I got hired on
10:41
that boat because I had a skill of welding.
10:45
I got hired on for Renegade, because of that skill of
10:49
Welding, which I learned in art school.
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So it's this big full circle. I don't think in the brochure
10:56
for art school and I went to design school it says like, hey,
10:59
learn to weld and you'll end up working on a fishing boat and
11:02
eventually being an entrepreneur.
11:04
So while you're doing that, you're thinking, About a coffee
11:07
roaster. It's there in the back of your
11:09
mind what was that Tipping Point?
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That you said, okay, I'm ready to start moving forward on this
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and was it always the idea of opening your own roaster or was
11:18
there another plan in place at any point?
11:21
Pretty much just the idea of doing what you want to do
11:24
watching. So many people, fumble through
11:26
life, having these careers where it's just to make money, that's
11:31
never been me. That's why I was, that's why I
11:35
got into the Arts. In the first place, if it's not
11:38
moving you and there's not purpose there, then I'm kind of
11:41
like why do it. So it was really, really easy to
11:45
save up that money and get help from family to be able to start
11:49
this and move in that direction. And you're located in.
11:54
You mentioned Soldotna, Alaska. I did look up how to pronounce
11:57
that because I want to make sure I had it right.
12:01
It's a relatively small community of about 5,000 people
12:04
give or take. I think yeah 56 were next to
12:08
another town with six seven thousand our whole Peninsula.
12:14
I think we're maybe around 70 thousand give or take so yeah
12:18
there's not a lot of people here.
12:20
Summertime can triple AAAA number.
12:24
We have one of the biggest king salmon Fisheries sockeye salmon
12:30
that come through the Kenai River.
12:31
So, very big tourist spot was there, a coffee Community, their
12:38
prior, are you joining a community or are you kind of on
12:40
the Forefront of a new community?
12:43
We have coffee kiosk on every corner.
12:46
It's pretty amazing. But as far as Roasters in our
12:49
town, there was maybe one. Maybe two, but Loki.
12:55
We have some bigger Roasters up in Anchorage, roasting
12:58
Community. I kind of feel as small coffee
13:01
Community is huge in alaskans love their coffee.
13:06
They like their coffee and they like their ice cream.
13:09
And they're Greer horse. Any are there any Regional
13:12
coffee Trends or coffee favorites?
13:15
That might not be familiar. We might not be familiar with
13:18
down south people, like it dark here, that heavy heavy roast.
13:23
So makes my job a little easy, I go in a little different
13:27
direction from my philosophy of how I roast and how I taste
13:32
sometimes, good for business, lot of Education, which I love
13:36
retraining reteaching. Just putting a different product
13:40
in front. People and say, Hey, you can
13:43
still like what you like, but try this too, and see where it
13:46
goes. Just so everyone.
13:49
Anyone listening can kind of Envision.
13:51
This is it just a Roasterie or is there a storefront type Cafe?
13:56
What is, what's the setup that you guys have going on right
13:59
now? It's just a Roastery.
14:01
I am only open for hours a week and I hesitate on those four
14:06
hours a week. I love my warehouse space.
14:10
That doesn't mean people. Are here while I'm gone when I'm
14:12
here. People are always coming and
14:14
going some days. I want it to be a full retail
14:19
store sometimes I don't. So we've got so many other
14:23
things happening. How are you getting the coffee
14:26
out to the people? Then I have small markets around
14:29
town that I sell to. We do online service, you can
14:33
come and pick it up here. So that's that for hours a week
14:36
that we kind of be like. Okay, I'm going to be here come
14:38
and grab your coffee. We just launched a home delivery
14:43
service. So I actually will deliver once
14:46
a month by bike all around our community slowly expanding to
14:51
the other communities. So basically like a Milkman
14:54
Service, drop it off on your doorstep and then it gets warm
14:58
outside too. Are you also are you doing that
15:00
biking through the winter as well with like a Fat Tire Bike?
15:03
Absolutely. And I have a Fat Tire Bike and
15:06
then I've got a little cart that I pull behind me.
15:08
So once again, weather is just An excuse.
15:12
If it snows too much, we just slow down a little bit.
15:16
Oh man, you're making me feel terrible.
15:17
I used to do that. I used to ride my bike with my
15:20
car to pick up my groceries and now I feel like I'm too lazy to
15:24
do it because it's too cold. I'm going to have to get the
15:26
card out again this week. The outdoors are very, very
15:31
clearly important to you just looking at your branding and
15:35
your Social Media stuff. There's as many pictures of the
15:38
outdoors as there are of coffee things.
15:41
How do you kind of use coffee in the outdoors together?
15:44
Obviously, you just mentioned the biking and dropping off.
15:46
That's one way you do it. But is there kind of a mission
15:49
statement that you're using for the brand?
15:51
Is your kind of your personal North Star, absolutely.
15:54
So coffee in a sense isn't to me, is it just about the taste?
16:01
There's so many other things it's about experience, it's
16:04
about doing other things. It's kind of like a starting
16:07
point and I go back to with what drives Ives me and outdoor
16:12
drives me. So, we are this, this starting
16:17
point to get people to go out and have fun and find what it is
16:22
that drives them, it's easy outside.
16:25
So, that's, that's kind of where we come from.
16:29
And what we do, which goes back to the name.
16:32
Declination, that was something where as I was starting the
16:36
company like, okay, we know it's going to be about the outdoors.
16:41
But declination. So the definition of
16:44
declination, is the angle difference between magnet
16:47
magnetic north and True North. So for instance, say you're
16:52
outside and you're holding a compass.
16:54
If you just set that up to North, you also have to set the
16:58
declination angle wherever you are in the world or you will
17:02
wander the wrong direction, it varies in a varies from year to
17:06
year. So, again, it's we wanted to be
17:09
that starting point for people, and when we're getting ready to
17:14
go outside, we're usually sitting around staring at a map.
17:18
With a cup of coffee in her hand, used to have a beer in our
17:21
hand and that was our starting point.
17:24
So it's like, okay, how can we be other people starting point.
17:27
So we really take that in and what I'm doing market.
17:31
So I also do different events, get coffee out that way started.
17:36
This trend where people will, Come in and ask trail
17:39
conditions. And a lot of tourists, like,
17:42
where should I go? Be like, well, grew up here.
17:44
If I can't figure out a good place right now, I can ask a
17:48
friend and be like, yeah, trail conditions over here great and
17:51
we roll little bit like that. That's really interesting.
17:54
I was going to ask about the name, declination, this might
17:57
just be maybe a romantic side of me, but I'm also imagining that
18:01
as your wherever you are and you're looking, you'll you've
18:05
got your, your compass set up towards True North.
18:08
And then also magnetic north, it's also kind of giving you
18:11
like these latitude, not latitude longitude, but it's
18:13
giving you these lines these directions where You could think
18:17
you're going towards one thing, but you have, you could have an
18:20
entirely different destination in the end, which is kind of
18:24
your story altogether, right? Absolutely.
18:26
There's nothing wrong with that. Yeah.
18:29
If you're looking at a map and a compass, there's definitely a
18:31
right ending point around any quicker.
18:34
But in life maybe not so much based where you are.
18:38
I'm wondering about kind of the benefits and challenges you
18:41
faced being so far, north along the coast and especially over
18:45
the last year. A year and a half during covid.
18:47
I know the news here is constantly where I am is always
18:52
about supply chain Logistics. I would imagine you're already
18:55
dealing with supply chain Logistics, not necessarily being
18:58
further south along the coast and a major port Anchorage, is a
19:02
major port, but it's still difficult to get up there for
19:04
people, right? And that might be ignorant on my
19:06
part. I apologize if so.
19:07
But I'm wondering just what that last year and a half has been
19:10
like and how you adapt that into your business Logistics being up
19:15
here. Here is basically time.
19:19
So in a sense, it just takes longer for things to get up
19:24
here. It is a little more expensive.
19:27
You kind of just have to wait and deal with that once again.
19:31
I think people kind of move a little bit too fast, we forget
19:35
this thing called patients being up here.
19:37
It's like, okay, we have to wait a little bit.
19:39
We don't really have a choice. I don't personally have a
19:43
problem with that. I kind of like that.
19:45
Covid was almost a benefit for the company in we had to really
19:52
stop and say what do we want redirection and say, okay I
19:59
can't be in front of people. So let's start more of the
20:02
online. Let's start more of this
20:04
delivery service. Let's do all of these things
20:06
that I really wanted to do. But wasn't able to do while
20:10
getting creative, it opened up that space to get creative. - so
20:16
as we progress now it's can we stay with that creativeness
20:22
rather than falling back into an or more into whatever is
20:27
comfortable? So just keep pushing those
20:30
boundaries always kind of being on our toes.
20:34
Once again I think that that uneasiness can be a good thing
20:39
if you just sit with it. There's an interesting parallel
20:43
in that coffee is for many, a kind of break in the morning, or
20:50
a restart to the day absent. It sounds like you've been going
20:55
through that as well. And I'm actually doing quite a
20:58
bit of reflecting, maybe more so than a normal interview as I'm
21:00
talking to you, where I think about my coffee every morning,
21:04
the whole process of it. Whether it's the grinding or the
21:08
heating of the water or the, you know, the Brewing process.
21:12
Us the idea for me. What in the reason I'm I love it
21:15
so much. Was that?
21:16
Meditative kind of like here's this 15 minutes that is mine
21:21
that I don't know anyone else but I I'm realizing only right
21:26
this second that I've sort of gotten away from that with this
21:29
roast West Coast effort because I'm kind of constantly working
21:34
during that 15 minutes. Now whether it's trying a new
21:36
coffee or thinking about the show and maybe I need to make a
21:39
more concerted effort to take back.
21:41
At 15 minutes in the morning, it's that routine.
21:45
Yeah, I mean, as a roaster it's my job to put the best cup of
21:49
coffee in front of you and you don't have to worry about that,
21:53
but then it's, it's your job as a consumer to create that
21:58
experience. When I wake up in the morning,
22:01
that first 15 minutes of my morning is all about.
22:04
Well first my dog. He gets fed and then I like my
22:08
coffee and I just sit and that's it.
22:11
That's that's the best 15 minutes of my day.
22:13
It's great. I wanted to ask you a little bit
22:17
about kind of your philosophy and when it comes to sourcing
22:20
and roasting roasting, scuse me and kind of by extension leading
22:24
your business. You just mention something about
22:27
how it's your job as a roaster, to put the best coffee in front
22:31
of you. How are you going about
22:33
sourcing, your products, and what is kind of your, your ethos
22:37
behind that behind that effort? Because there are certainly a
22:41
lot of places, you can coffee, beans in the world.
22:43
And there are a lot of Reasons to buy for one place or another,
22:46
what are yours? Yes, and this is one of the
22:50
benefits of getting into this industry, 20 years ago, where
22:57
you create these connections, and these friendships with
22:59
people. And I want to say that I only
23:03
buy coffee from small farms and I go visit them and see what
23:07
they're doing. That's a very very romantic.
23:11
But in reality, I live way up in Alaska and it's expensive to get
23:14
to those places. So how do you do both
23:18
eventually? Yes, I will travel.
23:20
I will go to these places and and see them.
23:23
But for now, I work with smaller Brokers.
23:26
I work with people that I trust and know who I like, and let
23:32
them do the due, diligence to go after those things that I see
23:37
and that I want. And they, they know me.
23:40
So they can get eyes and they can get touch and feel.
23:44
And when the time is right, for me to get there and then I'll go
23:46
do that. Here, I do things a little bit
23:49
differently with the green coffee in.
23:52
I'm constantly getting different coffees in, and I do that on
23:56
purpose. I treat it like produce.
23:59
It's part of that training or education rather than here's
24:04
coffee, just drink it. It's like man every bag that I
24:08
get is different. Every time it enters my
24:12
facility, I take it through a protocol of roasting all these
24:16
samples and letting it Choose how it's going to be roasted,
24:19
rather than a medium, or a light or a heavier roast.
24:24
So I switch it up. We see, you can get a bag from
24:30
the same Farm year after year, after year, and it is constantly
24:33
changing. So, we treated that way, How is
24:38
your Roastery been received in the region?
24:42
The idea that you're presenting, maybe an elevated craft coffee.
24:47
You said, alaskans are in general passionate about coffee
24:50
and there's coffee carts kind of all over coffee kiosks.
24:53
Rather being a craft coffee roaster and I use that word
24:58
craft not necessarily to say better.
25:01
Although I do believe that tool for a lot of extents, but but
25:05
more of that, you are actually the person who is handling the
25:07
beans. Just mentioned you're roasting
25:09
them and sampling them. It's like a it's a craft crafted
25:13
product that you're creating and giving out what does that
25:15
response been like for you and how have people adapted to this
25:18
new idea of coffee that you're presenting?
25:21
It's been very positive and our our community has always been
25:27
behind the craft beer scene so they understand it and they can
25:30
see it and once you wrap your brain around that it's like okay
25:34
this is just an extension of that.
25:38
Retraining a pallet and doing doing those things.
25:42
So very very positive. I push the education side so we
25:46
do classes kind of shut that down with code as well.
25:49
So that was a disappointment where I was just getting
25:52
rolling. Like, okay, well we'll do it
25:54
again. So now we're bringing in some
25:56
more private group tastings and again, and not so much.
26:00
As a cupping education classes, more like sensory development.
26:05
More. Okay.
26:08
Let's everybody has a totally different palette from.
26:13
Yes I can taste. All these really cool flavors
26:15
that you say are in the coffee too.
26:17
Yeah, I'm not getting any of that.
26:19
So how do you find that? That middle ground?
26:22
We just take step a step backwards and let's let's go to
26:27
the fundamentals. Can you can you taste this?
26:29
Yes. No.
26:31
Kind of in that direction. Sure.
26:33
And I think that's one of the reasons I try not to review
26:36
coffees as a Big, or at least not publicly because everyone
26:40
does have a different palette and the person that I was five
26:43
years ago, tasting, a coffee is a totally different person than
26:47
I am today with a little bit more practice.
26:49
And so, there's something to be said for producing products that
26:54
people like, and that can be difficult when you're talking
26:56
about an entire Community, I'm wondering.
27:00
What do you have planned for the future of of?
27:04
Not just declination, but it seems like you have other
27:06
projects It's in the worse. There's kind of a says, Brewing
27:10
on your website and coming soon, which I feel like is a tease and
27:13
then I saw a declination Studios Instagram, pop-up, what are what
27:18
other projects do you have in relation to coffee that you're
27:21
working on? I feel like I'm always moving
27:24
and shaking. I'm never quite and one place.
27:29
I'm almost ready to relaunch the brand new website.
27:32
So that was an old site that I haven't been able to touch in a
27:37
long time. I'm so all of those Brewing
27:40
guides and coming soon, things will change.
27:45
As far as the studio goes. I've taken the whole back in my
27:51
warehouse and turned it into a ceramic studio, and we are going
27:55
to get ready to launch a ceramic subscription program, so you
27:59
basically can show up and you can get a mug and a bag of
28:03
coffee, and it all goes back to that experience.
28:07
Take your coffee home. If you want me to show you how
28:10
to make it, how I make it, you can change that up.
28:14
But it's all part of that big big picture that combined with
28:20
more teaching if I'm doing Ceramics.
28:23
I might as well start teaching art again and we'll work with
28:25
kids and teaching teach some kids ceramic programs have a
28:29
couple in the works right now. So again back to really trying
28:36
to get people to that first step into doing whatever, they love,
28:40
whatever their purpose is be. It coffee be at our Be it
28:44
outside anything. It doesn't really matter to me.
28:47
So that's our next Direction. With the Ceramics efforts, I
28:52
have to know what is your favorite style of vessel to
28:57
drink out of? I think, for a long time,
28:59
especially for people on the go, there's this push for
29:02
double-wall steel, which is great for keeping things hot.
29:05
But isn't necessarily my personal favorite for drinking
29:07
out of how do you feel that the ceramic mugs versus a glass or
29:12
versus something else? Do you think?
29:14
I think that impacts flavor and and if so you know where do what
29:17
is your favorite and why absolutely impacts flavor and
29:22
the best way to test that is make coffee and put it all
29:26
three. Drink them all at the same time.
29:28
My favorite method is a small ceramic cup.
29:32
It goes back to coffee and tasting has a flavor point when
29:38
it's really hot. And when it's cold, it's the
29:41
life of the coffee and if you You are tasting out of a smaller
29:45
cup. You get that full spectrum of
29:48
that life. And if you make a pot of coffee,
29:50
you drink it, once you go back and you can start it all over.
29:54
So, with a, with one pot of coffee, you can live that coffee
29:58
life about 34 times with a smaller cup that excites me.
30:03
Sometimes it tastes bad dark or hot It.
30:07
Go in different directions obvious idea of drinking on the
30:11
go I kind of pause that I like Ceramics because they're here.
30:18
They're right now. They don't leave my shop, they
30:21
don't leave my house. They go, where they stay in
30:25
those places. So I'm usually not really
30:28
drinking coffee when I'm driving.
30:31
If I go Outdoors - I'll make it there so I'll bring all my
30:35
equipment and make it wherever I'm at and take that.
30:37
Pause that's interesting because then you're making a choice that
30:41
it's worth the extra weight to carry which is something I think
30:45
about as a hiker to do it on site because of the experience
30:49
That you'll get out of it as opposed to giving up the way to
30:53
make for the convenience to maybe have a lesser experienced.
30:58
Oh yeah, I'll cut weight on all other Corners when I'm
31:00
backpacking, but don't touch my coffee equipment.
31:05
What are you taking on a backpacking?
31:07
What are you? What are you doing out of?
31:09
I just do a pour-over. So I've got a silicone pop-up
31:13
pour over. I've tried all sorts of methods
31:17
and this is the easiest way for clean.
31:20
The easiest way to just get it done.
31:24
I have a little pocket rocket stove and paper filters and
31:29
those paper filters. Go right back in a little
31:31
ziplock bag when I take them, take them back with those
31:34
grinds. What about are?
31:36
You grinding on site as well? Or you pre grinding?
31:39
Yeah, I usually bring a hand grinder.
31:42
I've got a little classic REO, hand grinder.
31:44
So I will that's about the heaviest thing that I have and
31:48
it comes with me all the time. I'm everyone's well, I will pre
31:53
grind and I suffer, but it is what it is.
31:58
Depends on where I'm going. Depends on what I'm doing.
32:02
If I'm going fast, if I have the time, what what that experience
32:07
is for me? Sure how I commend you on the
32:10
effort. I have to know how much work
32:12
does fits actually do, Fitz's your dog.
32:15
I believe it's is my dog. Fits has the most important job
32:19
here. Come to the shop with me and his
32:24
patience level isn't like mine. So we'll get 45 minutes in and
32:28
then he will remind me that we need to go home that we need to
32:31
go outside. We need said, so he's this, hey,
32:36
it's not all about work. He is hilarious.
32:39
I wish you would work a little bit more.
32:42
We actually just hooked him up and when I did the first couple
32:46
deliveries, I let him pull me on my bike.
32:48
So he's my turn. Go on my bike.
32:53
That's always good. A shop, dog is always something.
32:56
Well, welcome, we are fostering a big lab pointer, something mix
33:03
and I don't know how he did it. I was in this podcast Studio,
33:07
which is in my closet and he somehow opened the door and
33:11
jammed his head in during an interview yesterday and he's
33:14
just like, hey, like it's been a half-hour.
33:16
Like, let's go, we need to do something.
33:18
So the last I shouldn't say that that not the last question, but
33:23
I'm wondering if there's anything I didn't cover today.
33:25
I didn't ask you about DC are that you'd like people to know
33:29
Pretty much just go out and do what you love.
33:32
That's, it's everything's really basic drink.
33:36
Good coffee. Try different coffees.
33:40
So we get stuck in this like, oh, they're the best.
33:44
I'm like, well, what about these guys over here?
33:46
What about these guys over here? I drink other people's coffees
33:49
all the time. They are there people doing
33:52
things with coffee that I never will same?
33:55
As I will do things with coffees.
33:57
Nobody else will? I think that's fabulous.
33:59
So just keep tasting. Are you currently shipping
34:02
coffee outside of your region? Yeah, we do all online sales.
34:08
So anything that's coming through, put up on my website
34:11
and you can order directly out of here.
34:14
You can also do a subscription out of our, our place, as well.
34:18
Very cool. And I'll make sure that I'm
34:19
linking to all of those things in the podcast and in the show
34:22
notes. And on the newsletter the last
34:25
question I do ask everyone is that when you are out and about
34:28
and you're trying someone else's coffee, what what is it that
34:31
you're drinking or what is it that you're ordering for
34:33
yourself? I'm looking more for.
34:39
Or for a fruit Berry style coffee.
34:43
Something different. I used to people ask me what's
34:47
your favorite coffee? And I would always say oh an
34:49
Ethiopian, oh and African, I'm slowly changing.
34:54
So it's more that that's what my brain wants to say.
34:58
But what's happening is if I'm drinking a coffee that I can't
35:02
quite figure out. That's my favorite cup of
35:05
coffee. If I can't get those notes down.
35:09
Down or there's something in there that are like, wow, it may
35:12
not necessarily be something I really like, it's just a complex
35:17
flavor that I can't name. That's my favorite, I suppose,
35:21
it's the learning. It's a curiosity of it.
35:24
My finding that a lot of Sumatra ins lately, a lot of Kenyans.
35:28
Yeah, it's just fun. Whatever.
35:30
Puts a smile on my face. That's what I'm drinking.
35:32
Well, I can certainly appreciate that.
35:34
I know that the coffee that I that is my favorite is the See
35:39
that's in my mug right now. Usually, that's the most
35:44
important coffee that I'm gonna have, I really appreciate you
35:48
taking time to be here on the show.
35:50
I think it's exciting that coffee can connect people,
35:53
across great distances, it's one of the things I love about
35:57
coffee, not just for me to me in, on the south part of the
36:01
West Coast to you in the north. But to us around the world
36:04
talking about coffee and I just really appreciate you being
36:06
here. Yeah.
36:08
Well thank You for the opportunity.
36:10
I was really excited when you when you sent that email
36:23
I thought it was really interesting that Hollis is skill
36:26
as a welder is what really tipped him over the edge into a
36:29
life of coffee. What if he had?
36:31
Never learned how to do that in art school?
36:34
Where would he be right now, we will obviously never know.
36:37
But it is a great reminder, that there are so many throwaway
36:40
moments that occur throughout the day in our life and any one
36:44
of them could be the pivot moment that we look back on as a
36:46
turning point or at least a part of a combination of events that
36:50
lead to something so much more than you expected.
36:53
For example, 20, plus years ago, I got a seasonal job at Old Navy
36:57
in the mall one day when I was taking a nap behind a rack of
37:01
Means I was walking up by this beautiful woman who later.
37:04
Became my wife, what are the odds?
37:07
Eight years ago? I hosted a bicycle ride for
37:09
Charity. My now friend and coffee Sensei,
37:12
Chris O'Brien, who, you know, as one of the coffee smarter
37:15
experts on this show, was the very first person to show up,
37:19
what are the odds of that? And just two years ago, the
37:23
world shut down due to a scary unknown unseeable, virus, and
37:27
the job that I thought I'd be going to Everyday disappeared
37:30
for some reason. And I thought I should fill my
37:32
time, making this podcast, which led us to the conversation, you
37:36
just heard with Hollis way up there in Alaska.
37:39
What are the odds? As I read listen to this show
37:43
and was editing out the occasion, alums or awkward gaps
37:45
when the internet was being less than Stellar.
37:48
I stopped near the end when Hollis talked about his favorite
37:50
coffee being the one, he couldn't figure out the one that
37:53
challenged him coffee is one of, if not the most complex
37:58
beverages on Earth there are more than 800 flavor and
38:02
aromatic compounds found in coffee.
38:04
It's one of the reasons the flavor wheel is so valuable
38:06
during the tasting process for comparison.
38:09
Wine has only about 200 identifiable compounds that
38:13
complexity is one of the reasons.
38:15
It's so difficult to become an accredited Q greater I mentioned
38:19
earlier that Hollow sent me some coffee in the care, package was
38:22
a Kenya and Ethiopia in one bed, just labeled blind tasting.
38:27
I sampled those beans as a pour-over and as a French press
38:30
and at various ratios of water to grounds.
38:33
And while I'm not an expert taster, I came back to Hollis
38:36
with the flavor note of Raisin. Being the most dominant from the
38:39
bag of beans labeled blind tasting and he said I nailed it
38:43
on the head which made me feel pretty damn good looking back on
38:47
it. I really Had the challenge of it
38:49
too. Even though the coffee from
38:51
Kenya was my favorite based on Flavor alone.
38:54
I had a lot more fun, tasting, the unlabeled sample when it
38:57
comes to Coffee. I encourage you to lean into the
38:59
challenge of drinking with a little bit more, intention to
39:02
see if there is something more there than you might think.
39:06
There is a lot more I could talk about today related to the
39:08
interview including coffee setups outdoors, and why dogs
39:12
are the best animal to have a cup of coffee with.
39:14
But it is how coffee connects us that resonates and how I want to
39:17
close out the show today. I spent more than a few
39:20
morning's this week as I imagined so many have watching
39:23
and reading about the Russian invasion of Ukraine.
39:25
I've been inspired by the Ukrainian people appalled and
39:29
angered by the violent greedy Invasion and the loss of life in
39:32
yet another war that seems pretty unjust.
39:35
Gotten pretty good at killing each other.
39:38
After 2 years, in a deadly pandemic.
39:40
You'd think we'd be over that impulse by.
39:41
Now, there are enough things in the world that we can fight
39:45
against together, instead of each other, this show stands
39:49
with Ukraine, which obviously it does.
39:52
And I do as an emotion, but I don't know what that means.
39:55
In terms of action yet this morning.
39:57
After reading the news, I ordered a stainless steel
39:59
spatula from Walmart, which felt pretty messed up, and it left me
40:04
feeling pretty helpless. but also we needed a new spatula and
40:08
they had one I don't know, the best way to support the people
40:12
of Ukraine from afar, other than to keep the focus on what they
40:15
are going through right now and possibly sending Aid in the form
40:18
of a donation. To one of the incredible
40:20
humanitarian groups that are there on the ground NPR, put
40:24
together a list of organizations, to potentially
40:26
support, which I'll link to in the show notes and on the
40:30
website. And if you find yourself
40:32
appreciating this show or appreciating your coffee
40:35
experiences more because of it and you decide to sign up for a
40:38
paid subscription, To the roast West Coast coffee newsletter
40:43
this week, I'll donate 100% of the proceeds to one of those
40:45
eight groups if you know of other ways to support the people
40:49
of Ukraine or Aid groups that you think do great work.
40:52
Feel free to shoot me a message on Instagram at roast West
40:55
Coast. That's all for today's show.
40:58
Thank you to our industry Partners.
40:59
Cafe litter moisture, Coffee Company, coffee cycle, roasting
41:02
leap coffee, zoom bar, coffee and tea, Maria coffee
41:06
steady-state, coffee roasting Camp, Coffee Company.
41:09
Cape, Horn coffee, importers and first light whiskey.
41:13
If you're looking for a job in Coffee Cafe, litter just posted
41:16
Barista and Shop management opportunities for their newest
41:20
location, in Encinitas California, and I've started a
41:23
coffee jobs. Thread on the website roast
41:25
westcoast.com, you can find the tab at the top.
41:29
As a, reminder, I'll see you all at zoom bar, coffee, and tea and
41:32
Cardiff next week, Friday, March 11th, right across from the
41:35
Patagonia store. I'll have the microphone setup
41:38
and if you stop by I'll Hopefully get a chance to chat
41:41
with you about why you love coffee.
41:42
Why you love this show or why you don't, I'll be there from
41:46
9:00 to 11:00 a.m. thank you to everyone for subscribing and
41:50
listening series simran Khalsa, the executive director of lofty
41:54
coffee is back for the next coffee smarter episode.
41:57
We catch up and dig into flavor development during the roasting
42:00
process. This episode of the roast West
42:03
Coast coffee podcast is was has been written produced and
42:08
recorded by me Ryan Walt. I hope this episode is found you
42:12
happy healthy and with at least enough sanity and coffee to make
42:16
it through another day. And please always tip your
42:19
Baristas and be sure to drink good coffee.
42:46
I like beer. It makes me a jolly.
42:51
Good fellow welcomed. I like beer the podcast where we
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discuss great beers and the Tory's that go with them.
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I'm your host Jeff and I am your host.
42:59
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a beer Mecca, within a beer Mecca, where it's 72 degrees all
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