Latest / Skin Anarchy / Dr Alexiades, MD PhD (boss level), Founder of Macrene Actives

Transcript

Dr Alexiades, MD PhD (boss level), Founder of Macrene Actives · Skin Anarchy

0:01
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0:31
SPEAKER_02: Hey guys, welcome back to Skincare Anarchy.
0:33
SPEAKER_02: I'm so excited that it's the new year, so happy new year.
0:36
SPEAKER_02: I just wanted to take a minute and um say a huge thank you to all of you who've been tuning in and just giving us support.
0:43
SPEAKER_02: Also, thank you so much to our sponsors and everybody who supports the podcast.
0:48
SPEAKER_02: It means the world to us.
0:49
SPEAKER_02: We are definitely working towards giving you even better content content in 2022, and it's just gonna be a really, really great year.
0:58
SPEAKER_02: So stay tuned for that and happy new year.
1:00
SPEAKER_02: And I hope you take a chance to look through the catalogs we've uploaded onto my Instagram page that are really kind of categorizing the skincare that has come across for the episode so far in 2021 also hair care products as well as subscribed in general.
1:16
SPEAKER_02: Um we've done our best to bring these some really great pegs.
1:20
SPEAKER_02: So check them out and stay tuned for a giveaway because we will be having one in 2022.
1:25
SPEAKER_02: And for now, I hope you love this amazing episode of Dr.
1:30
SPEAKER_02: Alexia's coming up.
1:31
SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much, guys, and happy, happy new year.
1:54
SPEAKER_02: She is definitely someone that I'm trying to learn from and talk to you about everything skin health.
2:00
SPEAKER_02: So without further ado, I want to introduce you guys to Dr.
2:04
SPEAKER_02: McCreen Alexiades.
2:06
SPEAKER_02: She is an MD PhD and also the CEO and founder of McCreen Actives.
2:12
SPEAKER_02: Uh Doc, you have so many, you know, credentials and you've done such great work and you have such a phenomenal career.
2:18
SPEAKER_02: So um I can't even list all of the uh things in her signature in the intro, but welcome, welcome to the show.
2:25
SPEAKER_02: I'm so excited you're here.
2:27
SPEAKER_01: Ekta, it's such a pleasure to be here and such an honor.
2:30
SPEAKER_01: You're doing great work with Skin Anarchy, and I'm just thrilled to be here with you.
2:35
SPEAKER_02: Oh, thank you so much.
2:36
SPEAKER_02: That means the world.
2:37
SPEAKER_02: And, you know, I'm really excited to learn from you.
2:40
SPEAKER_02: I know that um, you know, that that's my biggest thing with inviting on medical professionals, is just, you know, learning as much as I can about just skin health.
2:50
SPEAKER_02: So I want to get started.
2:51
SPEAKER_02: I want to talk to you about um your career and just how it all began.
2:55
SPEAKER_02: I know that um you got both your MD and your PhD.
2:58
SPEAKER_02: And, you know, how did you did you want to do that from the beginning?
3:01
SPEAKER_02: If you can walk us through that.
3:04
SPEAKER_01: Well, when I was a very little girl, I became an artist at a young age.
3:09
SPEAKER_01: I started doing portraits when I was apparently only three or four years old.
3:12
SPEAKER_01: My parents have portraits that I did in uh books that were lying around the house at that age.
3:17
SPEAKER_01: So I'd say when I was first born, I was an artist.
3:20
SPEAKER_01: But then at the same time, I had this fascination with nature and science.
3:25
SPEAKER_01: And I used to follow insects around in my backyard, and I put toothpicks in the dirt, following the ant's path to and from a crumb.
3:34
SPEAKER_01: And so from a young age, I realized they were releasing invisible signals.
3:38
SPEAKER_01: And it wasn't until close to 20 years later, I mean, when I was 16, I went to Harvard and I was in a class where, in fact, it had been discovered that ants do release these pheromones, if you will, these signals in the soil.
3:51
SPEAKER_01: So it's something that stayed with me for years was this dual duality of both being an artist and a scientist.
3:59
SPEAKER_01: Um, and so I started winning like science fairs when I was in grade school.
4:03
SPEAKER_01: Uh, I ended up skipping two years of school.
4:05
SPEAKER_01: So I ultimately, like I said, ended up at Harvard when I was at 16.
4:10
SPEAKER_01: But I started in lab at the age of 12 when um I read Rachel Carson's Silent Spring, and I was very disturbed by the pesticides that were being used on agricultural crops.
4:21
SPEAKER_01: So I got a position in a lab, in a university lab, and I was working, I know it sounds nuts, but I was 12 years old and I was trying to extract natural forms of birth control for insects from plants.
4:33
SPEAKER_01: I had this idea that plants that served as natural repellents or controllers of insects may have ingredients in there because I had read a paper by a Dr.
4:44
SPEAKER_01: Carol Williams that talked about what were what were called third generation pesticides.
4:49
SPEAKER_01: So I started learning about insect biology at that age.
4:52
SPEAKER_01: And ultimately, when I went to Harvard in my freshman year, the first job I scored was with that exact scientist, Carol Williams.
5:00
SPEAKER_01: And I worked in his lab on that exact concept, which was natural forms of pest control, but particularly this notion of using birth control for insects.
5:10
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
5:11
SPEAKER_01: And um worked on that and then transitioned into Lawrence Bogorad's lab at Harvard during my undergraduate, which was plant molecular biology.
5:20
SPEAKER_01: I did that for several years, and then um applied to the MD PhD program because I did want to be a doctor and I really enjoy taking care of people.
5:30
SPEAKER_01: Um, but in between did a Fulbright in bioengineering of agricultural crops in Europe.
5:35
SPEAKER_01: So I got a lot of plant biology, agricultural background there, again, working on non-GMO alternatives.
5:41
SPEAKER_01: And then finally went to med school at Harvard and did a PhD in developmental genetics.
5:48
SPEAKER_01: And it was at that time that I started focusing on mammalian biology, mammals, humans, etc.
5:54
SPEAKER_01: So when I ended up in dermatology, it was a natural course for me to end up in an aesthetic field, first of all, in medicine because of the artistic background, and then really working on pioneering this notion of clean beauty, which when I started 20 years ago, nobody wanted to listen to me.
6:12
SPEAKER_01: But I'm I'm proud to say that after launching the first luxury clean skincare brand 10 years ago, that finally the field has caught up.
6:19
SPEAKER_01: And I'm so proud to be part of this movement to protect the earth and its inhabitants.
6:27
SPEAKER_02: I love that, you know, I love that you've walked us through like the beginning of your journey through that because I think that the word clean beauty means so many different things these days to people, right?
6:39
SPEAKER_02: I mean, I think I I've heard like 15 different renditions from people about what clean beauty is.
6:44
SPEAKER_02: And I would love for you to kind of explain, you know, in a nutshell what what you think of when you think of clean beauty, you know, being a pioneer in this area.
6:53
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
6:54
SPEAKER_01: And I'd like to emphasize that I'm a practicing dermatologist who sees many patients a day.
7:00
SPEAKER_01: So I have the real life experience to know um day to day what we're doing in terms of skincare and whether or not it works.
7:08
SPEAKER_01: As opposed to somebody who just formulates in a lab but really doesn't see the outcomes.
7:12
SPEAKER_01: I see the outcomes on a daily basis, and I'm translating, you know, cosmetic procedures into active ingredients.
7:18
SPEAKER_01: And so when I started working on formulation, I was very, very concerned and troubled by the toxic ingredients in skincare.
7:27
SPEAKER_01: And that's when I started to define which ingredients were toxic and categorize them.
7:32
SPEAKER_01: So on my website, which is macreenactives.com, on the menu, there's clean beauty and defining clean beauty.
7:39
SPEAKER_01: You click on that and you will see my manuscript.
7:42
SPEAKER_01: And what I've done for the industry is I've categorized the what we call unclean ingredients according to what they do that's harmful.
7:51
SPEAKER_01: Either it's harmful to our health or it's harmful to the environment.
7:55
SPEAKER_01: And I've categorized them according to what they do.
7:58
SPEAKER_01: So, for example, it's very difficult to go on a list and try to search to see if an ingredient that's on the packaging is on that list.
8:06
SPEAKER_01: That's just very inefficient.
8:08
SPEAKER_01: So, what I've done is categorized ingredients so they form a class of ingredients that are either, for example, hormone disruptors, these are uh cosmetic ingredients that interrupt the natural course of hormones in our bodies and cause breast cancer, for example, or um, and then we have mutagens, we have ingredients that directly go to the DNA of your cell and mutate it and cause cancer that way.
8:36
SPEAKER_01: So I was trying to categorize all the ingredients and define classes of ingredients for the industry instead of just having a no-no list that just kind of goes on forever or that expands.
8:47
SPEAKER_01: This one actually orders them so that we can really then say that this class of ingredients is, you know, not clean.
8:56
SPEAKER_01: Then I taught what took it a step further.
8:58
SPEAKER_01: Manufacturing practices are packaging componentry.
9:02
SPEAKER_01: Manufacturing practices are important.
9:04
SPEAKER_01: We learned this with the sunscreen debacle.
9:07
SPEAKER_01: So it's not enough to have a formula that's devoid of toxic chemicals.
9:11
SPEAKER_01: You've got to ensure that your manufacturer isn't contaminating your production with toxic chemicals.
9:18
SPEAKER_01: And then packaging, I find that it's hypocritical for companies to claim to be clean and to be using plastic jars or plastic tubes, because the bisphenols are not just BPA.
9:33
SPEAKER_01: There are several bisphenols that come out of plastics and they are very toxic.
9:38
SPEAKER_01: So I package my products in glass, and I really am trying to push the industry to practice what they preach and really be true, not just give lip service, claim to be clean, but in fact have ingredients that are unclean and have plastic packaging, but rather walk the walk and talk the talk.
9:56
SPEAKER_02: And I think it's I think it's really interesting.
9:59
SPEAKER_02: I don't want to interrupt you, but I want to say this, and I think this is important for everyone to understand is how important what you just said is about the plastics.
10:07
SPEAKER_02: You know, I I have, you know, a lot of research in nanotoxicology.
10:13
SPEAKER_02: And I think that's something that the industry is not focusing on when it comes to uh packaging and and and especially plastics, is that not only is it, you know, we we know about BPA and we know about all these things, but it goes even beyond that, you know.
10:28
SPEAKER_02: And so I think that people need to understand exactly what it is you're you're saying here, which is, you know, you got to listen to the experts.
10:35
SPEAKER_02: It's not just about, hey, you know, I don't use, you know, I only use a little bit of plastic.
10:40
SPEAKER_02: No, the plastic you're using, it's it's it's problematic on many different levels that we are still on an you know, academia level trying to understand, you know, in terms of what's being emitted and what comes out due to heat or certain you know processing that occurs naturally, you know, in degradation and stuff.
10:59
SPEAKER_02: So I really love that you brought that up.
11:01
SPEAKER_01: And you hit on a couple of really key points that I would like your audience to understand.
11:06
SPEAKER_01: There was proof that water bottles had microplastics floating around in there.
11:12
SPEAKER_01: So when you're drinking the water, you're actually drinking some small particulate plastics in your body.
11:19
SPEAKER_01: So that's what where when you're talking about the nanoparticles, that's what we're talking about.
11:24
SPEAKER_01: So that's number one, absolutely true.
11:27
SPEAKER_01: We could be actually putting plastics on our skin if we have little nanoparticles.
11:32
SPEAKER_01: The other is that people are they the sad thing, and I do think this is sad, is that a lot of entities will value recycled packaging above clean packaging.
11:44
SPEAKER_01: So they'll say, well, it's recycled plastic, so I'm gonna give it the clean label.
11:48
SPEAKER_01: No, it doesn't matter recycle plastic.
11:51
SPEAKER_01: We need less, yes, of course, recycle plastic, not make more.
11:54
SPEAKER_01: I'm all for that.
11:56
SPEAKER_01: But let's shift away from that.
11:58
SPEAKER_02: Let's I completely agree with you.
12:01
SPEAKER_02: And honestly, my father, my I'm sorry, I keep interrupting you.
12:04
SPEAKER_02: Um, my father would actually love you because he's uh his uh work and the PhD's also an MD PhD in his work and the PhD is uh aspect has been always around this idea of this what we're talking about, plastics and what comes out.
12:18
SPEAKER_02: And you know, this is one of his projects that's been ongoing.
12:21
SPEAKER_02: And I remember being a teenager and my dad yelling at me, like, don't leave plastic bottles of water in your car, you know, like even though they're sitting in your car, they're emitting things and things are coming out, and you're gonna inhale that and you know, all this stuff.
12:34
SPEAKER_02: So it's like this problem is, you know, as PhDs and as scientists, we understand that, right?
12:40
SPEAKER_02: But it's like, how do you transfer this knowledge to the consumer?
12:43
SPEAKER_02: Because consumers are not understanding that it's not just about, hey, you know, this this product doesn't have plastic in it or it only has a little bit, it's about the idea of long-term effects.
12:53
SPEAKER_02: And that's you know, that's something that I think is is very, very important here.
12:58
SPEAKER_01: I agree.
12:59
SPEAKER_01: And I think that what I've noticed is that there are people like us that are actually doing the work because I'm a physician scientist, right?
13:06
SPEAKER_01: So I'm doing the hard work.
13:08
SPEAKER_01: And then unfortunately or unfortunately, it doesn't get to everybody unless somebody with like really strong marketing skills markets it really aggressively and puts a lot of money behind it.
13:19
SPEAKER_01: So what we've no, what I've noticed, and I have two kids who are in college now, they're both at Harvard, and my daughter's really smart, and she like sometimes will comment about a a brand that's sold at a mass marketplace, and she'll say, Oh yeah, mommy, that brand's really clean.
13:35
SPEAKER_01: And I will be like, Oh my lord, like my brain explodes because it's in plastic, it's got it's got parabens in it, it's got all kinds of things, and somehow they could they they signaled through some very you know clever messaging that they that they're they're clean when they really aren't.
13:51
SPEAKER_01: And I'm hopeful that at least the notion of clean is is is being caught up, is catching on first.
13:58
SPEAKER_01: And I just can only hope that the work that you, your dad, that I'm doing will trickle out into clever pack, you know, marketing so that people really understand what clean is.
14:10
SPEAKER_01: I mean, you can start by going to my website and reading the clean beauty manuscript, that's a start.
14:15
SPEAKER_01: But at the same time, you've got to be a very, very savvy consumer.
14:20
SPEAKER_01: You have to question and you can't just accept that something's clean because they're signaling it in somehow in their clever packaging or messaging.
14:30
SPEAKER_01: You've got to really double check and say, okay, is this in glass?
14:34
SPEAKER_01: Is the is the carton a uncoated carton with biodegradable inks like mine, which are vegan inks, or is it metal foil and laminate?
14:46
SPEAKER_01: Um, and is this in cellobrap, or does it have, as I have, I've sourced compostable wafer seals, you know, like I've gone the extra mile, and that's what you want to look for in in, and you also want to see a brand that's got a founder behind it who actually understands medicine and science, because too often we have founders that are really clever, lovely people, but they don't really understand the science of toxicity that's going on.
15:11
SPEAKER_01: And this is the number one most important thing in the world right now.
15:14
SPEAKER_01: We have climate change, we have toxic environmental exposures, cancer rates.
15:20
SPEAKER_01: And so it it all if I can make a difference in my little corner of the universe, which is the beauty sector, then my life will have been well spent.
15:29
SPEAKER_02: Yes, and I love that.
15:31
SPEAKER_02: I love that you said that.
15:32
SPEAKER_02: And you know, honestly, it's it's more about the idea that even if you don't know, like, you know, all for this for all the entrepreneurs out there, even if you don't know the answers and you're not an MD and you don't have a PhD and you don't have the science background, go find somebody who does, you know, and if you want to be an entrepreneur, that's fine.
15:49
SPEAKER_02: But make sure that you have somebody uh fact checking you, you know, and with the with the background that's gonna be able to go and and you know read, for example, you know, Dr.
15:59
SPEAKER_02: McCrean's, you know, uh papers and you know, like, you know, other scholars like her.
16:04
SPEAKER_02: Like we we need people who understand the science, you know, point blank, period.
16:08
SPEAKER_02: That's that's really what it comes down to.
16:10
SPEAKER_02: So I love that you said that.
16:11
SPEAKER_02: And I and I want to actually move on because I know that you have beautiful products and um, you know, it's not a huge range, and I love that.
16:17
SPEAKER_02: I I like that you have exactly like you know what you think we need.
16:21
SPEAKER_02: So um I want you to go through that with us and talk to us, you know, from your perspective.
16:26
SPEAKER_02: What do you think we need in a skincare routine?
16:28
SPEAKER_02: You know, what are some things that everyone should kind of look towards when we're trying to buy something for our skin, just daily use?
16:37
SPEAKER_01: These are great questions, Ecta.
16:39
SPEAKER_01: One of the one of the elements in really cleaning up the beauty industry is redaction to a very curated regimen, because there is waste when you layer, there's waste in packaging, there's waste in manufacturing.
16:55
SPEAKER_01: And yes, you're layering on potentially preservatives.
17:00
SPEAKER_01: So when we decide, when I I say myself as we, as in the scientific community, because I'm part of it, I do, I have done work, FDA trials, etc.
17:09
SPEAKER_01: Uh, when we decide what is the maximum allowable of a preservative, right?
17:15
SPEAKER_01: It is making the assumption that you're only using that one product.
17:19
unknown: Yeah.
17:19
SPEAKER_01: So if you're using layers of different brands or even one brand that doesn't adhere to my standards, which I actually am creating like a beauty seal called the Clean Beauty Authority to be able to be that person that founders can come to for that help.
17:36
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
17:37
SPEAKER_01: So I can look at their ingredient listing, I can look at their packaging, and I can help them get clean.
17:42
SPEAKER_01: But in the meantime, if they don't have the Clean Beauty Authority seal, you can be a you can assume that they probably do have some toxic preservatives in there.
17:49
SPEAKER_01: So if you're layering, you're already exceeding the maximum allowable preservative.
17:54
SPEAKER_01: So that is right there a good one of the many incentives to reduce the number of products you're using.
18:00
SPEAKER_01: But to have the best skin in the world, you want lots of active ingredients.
18:04
SPEAKER_01: So therefore, I put over 50 active ingredients in each product in my line.
18:09
SPEAKER_01: So my cream has over 55 active ingredients.
18:12
SPEAKER_01: So with one application, you're getting all your needs met.
18:16
SPEAKER_01: You're getting antioxidants, DNA repair, uh, peptides, microencapsulated hyaluronic acid, amino acids, plant polyphenols, barrier repair.
18:25
SPEAKER_01: You're getting everything you do need to have the best skin and to repair your rejuvenate your skin in one product.
18:32
SPEAKER_01: So theoretically, you only need one product.
18:34
SPEAKER_01: However, we do age, we have additional concerns.
18:37
SPEAKER_01: So as you develop other problems like sagging, not just wrinkles, but your skin is starting to actually lose its elasticity.
18:43
SPEAKER_01: That was what prompted me to make the serum with another 55 actives.
18:47
SPEAKER_01: So now if you use the cream and the serum together, you've got over 110 active ingredients.
18:53
SPEAKER_01: And when I say actives, my actives are mostly plant derived.
18:57
SPEAKER_01: So for each plant extract, if you do the analysis, which I have a lab and that's what I'm working on this year, it's actually hundreds or thousands of ingredients.
19:05
SPEAKER_01: So it's a way of getting hundreds or thousands of active ingredients on your skin in one or two steps.
19:12
SPEAKER_01: Then you can add to additional needs as needed.
19:15
SPEAKER_01: Lip.
19:15
SPEAKER_01: I wanted to replace lip filler, so I did microcapsulate hyaluronic acid, peptides, ceramides, and essential oils that are lip therapeutic for my lip product.
19:25
SPEAKER_01: My tinted moisturizer, people wanted a sunscreen, they wanted cover up.
19:28
SPEAKER_01: I gave it to them free of mica, free of talc, you know, essentially with like the 45 of the healthiest antioxidants that are actually antipollutant.
19:40
SPEAKER_01: Because as a dermatologist, when I would do appeal, I would notice that pollution would adhere to people's makeup.
19:45
SPEAKER_01: And it took, it was difficult to get off.
19:47
SPEAKER_01: So I reasoned that you need antipollutants in your tinted moisturizer.
19:52
SPEAKER_01: So I did that too.
19:52
SPEAKER_01: So it's like good enough to sleep in and it makes your skin permanently better because it has such phenomenal ingredients.
19:59
SPEAKER_01: But it fulfills a need.
20:00
SPEAKER_01: Some people don't need a tinted moisturizer, so they could just use my cream and my serum.
20:04
SPEAKER_01: My cleanser, you have to wash your face.
20:06
SPEAKER_01: So that's like a necessity.
20:07
SPEAKER_01: And mine is almost 100% plant-derived and organic with plant-derived surfactants, so that's safe for the environment.
20:14
SPEAKER_01: Antioxidants that are therapeutic, anti-blemish, vitamin B derivatives.
20:18
SPEAKER_01: So I really cleverly formulated each product in the line to meet all the needs of that organ and of that function.
20:27
SPEAKER_01: I love that.
20:28
SPEAKER_01: And that makes our lives so much easier because you don't need a day cream, a night cream, a this or that.
20:34
SPEAKER_01: You really just need one product, frankly.
20:36
SPEAKER_01: It's a one-step skincare solution that you can use twice a day.
20:39
SPEAKER_01: But as your needs may increase, you can add additional products for to really get to another level.
20:45
SPEAKER_01: But it really reduces the waste and it reduces the potential for any exposures.
20:51
SPEAKER_01: So that's really, you know, the logic behind getting rid of this notion of layering and focusing on maximizing active ingredients and minimizing the use of any sort of preservatives and exposures.
21:03
SPEAKER_02: That is so interesting that you have 50 of 50 active ingredients in one formulation.
21:08
SPEAKER_02: Now, how does that work?
21:09
SPEAKER_02: Because I'm sure that there's that must have been very difficult to formulate, right?
21:13
SPEAKER_02: So, how did how does that work in terms of like interaction between the ingredients or like, you know, any kind of chemical, you know, I guess hurdles to overcome in the formulation aspect?
21:25
SPEAKER_01: Well, I achieved a patent.
21:26
SPEAKER_01: I was granted a patent for my work.
21:28
SPEAKER_01: So a singular patent, just me.
21:31
SPEAKER_01: I did this all by myself.
21:32
SPEAKER_01: So what I did was I I I combined basically layers of liposomes.
21:37
SPEAKER_01: So I selected liposomes based on certain properties to target where the ingredients work in the skin, which layer it's and what the goals are for the uh liposomal delivery.
21:47
SPEAKER_01: And I basically was then able to combine all numerous active ingredients together.
21:54
SPEAKER_01: And the liposomes protect them from each other and from air.
21:57
SPEAKER_01: And I did antioxidant assays.
22:00
SPEAKER_01: Which demonstrated that my products were maintaining almost 100% antioxidant activity out to six months.
22:06
SPEAKER_01: And in HPLC analysis, which is an analysis that enables us to monitor the presence or absence of ingredients, that almost 100% of the active ingredients were still present after three years.
22:18
SPEAKER_01: So the liposomal encapsulation, I think, creates an anoxic environment that creates a great deal of stability.
22:25
SPEAKER_01: So you don't have interaction with each other or with the atmosphere.
22:30
SPEAKER_01: And that keeps the products stable for a very, very long time.
22:36
SPEAKER_01: Having said that, with my relaunch, I my products are essentially preservative free.
22:43
SPEAKER_01: And because of that, you know, I've I personally keep mine now in the fridge.
22:49
SPEAKER_01: Once I purchase them, it doesn't mean they have to be shipped in the fridge.
22:52
SPEAKER_01: It doesn't mean they have to be necessarily stored in the warehouse in refrigerated conditions.
22:56
SPEAKER_01: But once I get my jar and I uh open it and I start using it, I keep it in the fridge because as we know from our lab work, you know, that keeps those proteases and other enzymes that naturally exist from getting to work on your product.
23:10
SPEAKER_01: And so I treat it like a really high-end pharmaceutical agent in the way I treat my products.
23:18
SPEAKER_01: And I'm telling you, they work.
23:20
SPEAKER_01: Oh yeah.
23:21
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I'm that's not even a doubt in my mind.
23:24
SPEAKER_02: I mean, yeah, I'm just so fascinated by the science of this.
23:26
SPEAKER_02: I mean, you've really, you know, you've really hit something for me in terms of like my scientific curiosity about just drug delivery and stuff.
23:34
SPEAKER_02: So I'm over here like, you know, imagining like all the different ways you could apply what you just explained in terms of drug delivery.
23:41
SPEAKER_02: But that's really interesting.
23:42
SPEAKER_02: Um, I want to actually ask you, and this is a question that I know often comes up with uh in terms of clinical uh dermatology.
23:49
SPEAKER_02: A lot of my, you know, my guests and people I speak to that are strict clinicians, you know, they'll ask about, well, skincare, you know, is it really important?
23:59
SPEAKER_02: And, you know, does it really make a difference?
24:02
SPEAKER_02: Because does it penetrate the skin barrier and is it able to go across?
24:06
SPEAKER_02: So well, what's your you know, what's your take on that?
24:09
SPEAKER_02: Like, how do you how do you see skincare and and you know what it's really doing for um and what layers it's doing something for in our skin?
24:18
SPEAKER_01: Okay, so this is really the heart of this podcast and like where people should really perk up.
24:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
24:25
SPEAKER_01: Okay, so when I started in this industry, like ages and ages, decades ago, I've been working obviously for 40 years in the sciences.
24:33
SPEAKER_01: Um, there were like in the 1970s, only 500 ingredients in in inky, inky ingredients, which are like ingredient listing ingredients for skincare, and they were all chemicals, all chemicals.
24:43
SPEAKER_01: Now, the last I checked, it was 11,000 and counting last time I did my search.
24:50
SPEAKER_01: Wow.
24:50
SPEAKER_01: So what happened is we had a renaissance of active ingredients starting in the early 2000s.
24:56
SPEAKER_01: Wonderful.
24:57
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, look, and here's the thing before all that, it was not possible to get results.
25:03
SPEAKER_01: It just wasn't.
25:04
SPEAKER_01: These were chemicals.
25:04
SPEAKER_01: You were getting hydration, and that's it.
25:07
SPEAKER_01: But now, with McCreen Alexiatis' brain at the helm, you can translate cosmetic procedures.
25:13
SPEAKER_01: And this is my textbook.
25:14
SPEAKER_01: I wrote I the editor-in-chief of Alexiatis' Cosmetic Dermologic Surgery, which is a very large textbook.
25:21
SPEAKER_01: It's a Bible to the industry of all the cosmetic medical and surgical treatment options for every condition in skin in dermatology.
25:30
SPEAKER_01: So, and what's special about that book is that it's an algorithm.
25:33
SPEAKER_01: It tells you everything that we have that's proven to work for various things.
25:38
SPEAKER_01: And what I've done is with the first half of my career, I helped launch countless laser technologies, pharmaceuticals, uh, toxins for Botox, et cetera, uh, fillers.
25:50
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I do FDA trials as part of my world, is part of my job for the last two decades has been to run these trials.
25:58
SPEAKER_01: And prior to that was bench science.
26:01
SPEAKER_01: So I have built cosmetic dermatologic surgery alongside my colleagues.
26:06
SPEAKER_01: I've been one of the leaders in the industry.
26:08
SPEAKER_01: And now, ironically, I'm spending the second half of my career replacing those very cosmetic procedures with active ingredients because we can now.
26:16
SPEAKER_01: So, what I've done is I've identified for which ingredient will recapitulate the result that I get with a laser or an injectable.
26:26
SPEAKER_01: And so I've translated procedures into active ingredients and I've delivered them with my patent method into the skin.
26:34
SPEAKER_01: So I know they're getting into the skin, and I know from published reports, both basic science and clinical, because my ingredients have to pass muster, my muster.
26:44
SPEAKER_01: I've selected and I source my own ingredients for my products.
26:47
SPEAKER_01: So each ingredient is researched by me to have the basic science publications behind it, but that's not enough.
26:53
SPEAKER_01: It also has to have the clinical data to prove that it's actually working with the claims that you theoretically would expect from it.
27:00
SPEAKER_01: I'll give you an example, a peptide, right?
27:02
SPEAKER_01: In my laxity chapter in Alexiatis' cosmetic dermatologic surgery, I've literally pages and pages of every peptide that's on the market.
27:10
SPEAKER_01: I've mastered this topic.
27:12
SPEAKER_01: And I know which peptides have what published work behind them.
27:15
SPEAKER_01: And I selected for McCreen Actives the world's most proven peptides.
27:19
SPEAKER_01: So when you go to the store and you pick a product and it says it has a peptide, chances are it's not going to be the best.
27:27
SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's just probabilistically speaking, because there's just not enough data from that peptide.
27:32
SPEAKER_01: You don't know if it's really functioning the way you think it is.
27:35
SPEAKER_01: The ones I've selected are tried and true.
27:37
SPEAKER_01: We know they work.
27:38
SPEAKER_01: And that's why I get everyday emails from customers saying I used X, Y, and Z for years, and the results I'm getting with your product far exceed it.
27:47
SPEAKER_01: It's because I'm using the world's best ingredients.
27:49
SPEAKER_01: And that's key is knowing your ingredient, getting it from the source yourself.
27:54
SPEAKER_01: Like I source my own ingredients because when you go to a lab, they're just going to buy a cheap imitation.
28:00
SPEAKER_01: So the man, the founder of a brand has to be like me.
28:03
SPEAKER_01: I'm a physician scientist, I'm sourcing my own ingredients.
28:06
SPEAKER_01: And then it's the delivery because there's no question, if you don't understand the science and you don't source your ingredients properly, so that you know that that ingredient will actually deliver into the tissue, it's probably sitting on top of your skin and not getting in.
28:19
SPEAKER_01: And then the delivery method matters because I've reasoned out how each ingredient's going to be delivered.
28:25
SPEAKER_01: So I know it's getting in and it's actually having an effect.
28:28
SPEAKER_01: So there's a lot of there are a lot of pieces to this to make sure that you have a good outcome.
28:34
SPEAKER_01: And these translate into results that I believe are as good, if not better, than cosmetic procedures.
28:42
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
28:42
SPEAKER_02: Wow.
28:43
SPEAKER_02: I love that.
28:44
SPEAKER_02: I love that you um, you know, first of all, wow, you wrote a textbook.
28:49
SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, and so and second of all, wow, that you are able to say that you're, you know, you're finding actual, you know, I I I guess, yeah, supplements um in the non-invasive uh, you know, side of things.
29:01
SPEAKER_02: That's really, really amazing.
29:02
SPEAKER_02: And I hope everyone listening that you really uh paid attention to that because that's very important to acknowledge.
29:08
SPEAKER_02: I mean, this is this is exactly why I, you know, I argue with clinicians.
29:13
SPEAKER_02: And and it's not because I don't, you know, it's not that I don't respect their work.
29:18
SPEAKER_02: I just, you know, I've never understood why, you know, so many of them say no, absolutely no to skincare.
29:24
SPEAKER_02: Because I'm like, you don't know, you know, you have no idea.
29:27
SPEAKER_02: All you're used to are aesthetic procedures.
29:30
SPEAKER_02: All you're used to is putting a needle in someone's face or, you know, using, I don't know, retinol or tretinoin, or, you know, and that's not the end all be all of skin health.
29:40
SPEAKER_02: It just can't be, you know, there's no way.
29:43
SPEAKER_02: So I love that.
29:44
SPEAKER_02: I love that you explain that to us.
29:45
SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
29:46
SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, and and my next question really is it's more so about um, you know, when we approach the skin and we talk about, for example, anti-aging.
29:56
SPEAKER_02: I really don't like that word, you know, and I think that's pretty clear to everybody at this point on my podcast.
30:00
SPEAKER_02: I hate the word anti-aging because I don't think it really exists.
30:03
SPEAKER_02: I mean, it it's kind of an oxymoron.
30:06
SPEAKER_02: And I I want to talk to you about what healthy aging in terms of our skin really should look like, you know, on a on a cellular level or, you know, in any way that you want to define it.
30:16
SPEAKER_02: Like what is the concept of good, proper aging um when it comes to our skin?
30:23
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
30:23
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I agree with you.
30:24
SPEAKER_01: I think that people do get caught up in the vocabulary and justifiably so.
30:29
SPEAKER_01: Justifiably so.
30:30
SPEAKER_01: We aging is just the term we use for the passage of time.
30:34
SPEAKER_01: But the passage of time doesn't necessarily have to mean the accumulation of damage.
30:39
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
30:39
SPEAKER_01: And that's what we're talking about is and and so they've they've replaced like the changes of skin due to the accumulation of damage, they've just called it aging.
30:50
SPEAKER_01: And well, guess what?
30:51
SPEAKER_01: You can you can if you live in like an igloo and you never see the sun, your skin may never quote unquote age.
30:57
SPEAKER_01: So aging is really not the appropriate term, frankly, because it just connotes the passive time.
31:03
SPEAKER_01: So that's where my concepts come into play, because I'm not targeting like stopping the cells from moving forward temporally.
31:11
SPEAKER_01: I want them to continue to cycle.
31:13
SPEAKER_01: What I'm doing with Macrine actives is I'm targeting the damage that is gets accumulated as we chronologically age.
31:24
SPEAKER_01: Now, you may say, oh, well, some of that's intrinsic, some of that's extrinsic.
31:28
SPEAKER_01: That's a classic way of talking about it in dermatology.
31:31
SPEAKER_01: Intrinsic aging being our own machinery kind of screws up, and extrinsic aging being outside factors come in and screw up our machinery, okay, our cellular machinery.
31:42
SPEAKER_01: Um, so my point being, yes, but that's why when I put macrine actives together, I included some clever ingredients like DNA repair.
31:52
SPEAKER_01: Now, DNA repair works whether you have an intrinsic problem or an extrinsic problem.
31:57
SPEAKER_01: It actually gets at the core, at the crux of skin aging, which is to correct the damage to the DNA that is really the basis for all the changes that happen over time that we don't want.
32:09
SPEAKER_01: And so I agree with you, we need a new term for bringing the skin back to uh a healthy state.
32:18
SPEAKER_01: And this is what I tell my patients, and this is why being a mudfad, a memd PhD, like I am and your dad, is so different.
32:25
SPEAKER_01: We don't think like clinicians.
32:26
SPEAKER_01: And I actually don't really like the term that my product is clinical skincare, because it is so much more than that.
32:33
SPEAKER_01: Yes, it is clinical, but it's like it's like it's like revolutionary because what I'm trying to connote to my colleagues is that, and I tell this to my patients too.
32:45
SPEAKER_01: How can you replace Botox?
32:47
SPEAKER_01: I say to them, think about it.
32:48
SPEAKER_01: When you were 25, you moved your face and you didn't have wrinkles.
32:52
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
32:52
SPEAKER_01: I said to them, Why is that?
32:54
SPEAKER_01: You should see their faces.
32:55
SPEAKER_01: And these are colleagues, these are people in the scientific community.
32:59
SPEAKER_01: And they look at me and I'm like, because your skin was healthy and intact then.
33:04
SPEAKER_01: It hadn't accumulated the damage of time and movement and toxic damage and UV exposure and and and and.
33:12
SPEAKER_01: So I said, So my goal is not to freeze your muscles and stop you from moving.
33:17
SPEAKER_01: My goal is to get your skin back to the way it was when you were 20 or 25.
33:21
SPEAKER_01: Now, that is a point in time, and that's where the aging concept kind of comes in.
33:26
SPEAKER_01: But for me, it's really about getting your skin to its native state.
33:30
SPEAKER_01: And sometimes the native state is not even good enough, which is why peptides are important and microincalcate hyaluronic acid are important and amino acids, because for some people, their skin starts to accumulate damage even when they're teenagers.
33:42
SPEAKER_01: So I'm even getting you better than 25.
33:45
SPEAKER_01: So for me, it's like I need a new term.
33:48
SPEAKER_01: It's really about getting your skin back to native perfection and trying for that.
33:53
SPEAKER_01: And that's what I'm doing with Macrine Actives.
33:56
SPEAKER_02: I love that.
33:57
SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh.
33:58
SPEAKER_02: I would honestly like I wish I could just like literally like be around you all the time.
34:03
SPEAKER_02: Like I would be like your little lab helper.
34:05
SPEAKER_02: I swear to God.
34:06
SPEAKER_02: Like it's so cool.
34:07
SPEAKER_02: Like everything you're saying is so it just resonates with me so much because you know, it's like people like, especially in science, it's like, you know, you have to realize, like, you know, just for everyone listening, that, you know, you have to think of it in a different way.
34:22
SPEAKER_02: Like, you can't, you know, we're taught in medical school.
34:24
SPEAKER_02: Like I remember like the first day of like my clinical, you know, years in medical school, and they were like, non-invasive is the way to go.
34:32
SPEAKER_02: Everything non-invasive, don't ever be invasive.
34:34
SPEAKER_02: And it was like when I remember learning that from my attendings and and thinking, like, okay, okay, you know, and carrying that forward in my training.
34:42
SPEAKER_02: Like, if I can be least invasive, that's the best way, and that's the most ethical way to practice medicine.
34:49
SPEAKER_02: And now when I look around and I see everybody promoting Botox or injectables, or, you know, and I understand there's a place and a time and a reason and all that good stuff, but you don't need them, you know, like for some reason, I'm sorry if if I I can't sit here and say that, you know, the idea of injecting a toxin, which is literally, if you put it in high enough concentrations, going to paralyze things like your respiratory tract.
35:16
SPEAKER_02: You know, I can't get behind injecting that in people's faces, uh, you know, however many oftentimes people want to get Botox.
35:24
SPEAKER_02: You know, I just I hate that.
35:25
SPEAKER_02: And so it everything you're saying to me, it's it's just I'm so passionate about it.
35:29
SPEAKER_02: And I think that, you know, we need more people like you, you know.
35:33
SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
35:34
SPEAKER_01: No, and listen, I I'm my lab is finishing up here in the city.
35:38
SPEAKER_01: Yeah because my lab used to be in New Jersey.
35:39
SPEAKER_01: So if you ever want to do a fellowship, we'll have so much fun.
35:43
SPEAKER_01: Oh my god.
35:44
SPEAKER_01: Because I have the lab where I'm doing the skincare stuff in the lab where I'm making the extracts from plants and identifying new active ingredients, and then I have we have our research clinic where we're running the clinical trials.
35:54
SPEAKER_01: So it's just there's tons of opportunity.
35:57
SPEAKER_01: It's so much fun.
35:58
SPEAKER_02: Wow, that's so cool.
36:00
SPEAKER_02: Yes, I'm definitely gonna have to talk to you about that uh later on.
36:02
SPEAKER_01: But it's cross-fertilization, ECTA.
36:07
SPEAKER_01: So, like, yes, I have pioneered like the toxins and the fillers and the lasers, and but the purpose of that in my brain is now I'm translating that into active ingredients so that you don't have to do them.
36:21
SPEAKER_02: It's really well, it's like a step-by-step process, right, Dr.
36:24
SPEAKER_02: McCreen.
36:24
SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's like surgery.
36:26
SPEAKER_01: Now we went to lasers and injectables, and then from laser injectables, now I'm taking it to um skincare.
36:33
SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
36:33
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I love that.
36:34
SPEAKER_02: And you know, I think that that's exactly the kind of you know, the kind of scientific mind we need at the forefront of this industry.
36:41
SPEAKER_02: I mean, this has become a billion-dollar enterprise.
36:43
SPEAKER_02: Everybody and anybody in the world is coming out with skincare, but this is the difference, you know, right here what we're talking about between something you actually should be using in terms of, you know, if you want to improve your skin, you want to improve the health of your skin, versus if you just want a pretty product to put on your shelf, even though you know your products are gorgeous, don't get me wrong.
37:03
SPEAKER_02: But like, you know, it's like just you have to really think about as a consumer, what do I want?
37:08
SPEAKER_02: And where am I trying to go with this?
37:10
SPEAKER_02: And what what is skin health to me?
37:12
SPEAKER_02: And you know, this is a question I pose to everybody.
37:14
SPEAKER_02: I challenge all of you listening, you know, sit down and think about that.
37:18
SPEAKER_02: You know, what what do you want your skin to look like 10 years from now?
37:21
SPEAKER_02: And what are you willing to sacrifice for that?
37:24
SPEAKER_02: Because that's really what it comes down to.
37:26
SPEAKER_02: Every time you go to somebody who's and you know, like not an experienced injector or not an experienced person um in the field of dermatology, you're putting yourself in a position where your skin could potentially look so much worse, you know?
37:41
SPEAKER_02: So it's like you really have to weigh the pros and cons, and you have to really understand who are the leaders in this field.
37:46
SPEAKER_02: And you need to, you know, realize like it's better for me to invest in this rather than just go to person X, Y, and Z, you know, because I saw them on TikTok or I saw them on, you know, in Instagram reels or whatever.
37:58
SPEAKER_02: So, you know, that's my little rant.
37:59
SPEAKER_02: But um I actually want to I want to ask you one last question.
38:02
SPEAKER_02: And this is something that's very close to my heart for this podcast because there's a lot of people listening that want to go into the professions and the fields of the guests that I invite on.
38:10
SPEAKER_02: And I want you to give us some advice to all the young scientists listening, all the young clinicians uh listening, you know, any advice you have for them in terms of career or just you know, just discovering your passion in science, you know, any any words of wisdom you can offer.
38:26
SPEAKER_01: Yes, I think that you should that you your instinct, your gut is going to guide you.
38:32
SPEAKER_01: When making choices, make them naturally.
38:36
SPEAKER_01: I didn't realize until quite recently that I was first and foremost an artist and I ended up in this aesthetic field because I'm first and foremost an artist.
38:47
SPEAKER_01: Um it it I used to tell the story about my science background and my medicine background.
38:53
SPEAKER_01: And in fact, unconsciously, I walked through doors because I believe life is fractal.
39:00
SPEAKER_01: I don't believe that you close doors.
39:01
SPEAKER_01: I believe when you open to a new door, you have a myriad of new options and opportunities available to you.
39:08
SPEAKER_01: So I ended up in dermatology as opposed to some other fields after doing an MD PhD from Harvard and et cetera, and a Fulbright.
39:16
SPEAKER_01: And I could have easily gone into either plastics or nurse surgery.
39:20
SPEAKER_01: I ended up in dermatology, but it offered me new opportunities.
39:24
SPEAKER_01: But I stayed true to what I enjoyed.
39:27
SPEAKER_01: And therefore, for me, seeing patients, and I see sometimes 25, 35 patients a day, and each and every one of them has procedures and skin checks and biopsies, and it's it doesn't tire me out because I love it.
39:40
SPEAKER_01: And when you do something that you love, it relaxes you, it lowers your blood pressure.
39:45
SPEAKER_01: So, my advice to medical students and people coming to up the pike is listen to your body messages.
39:51
SPEAKER_01: If you feel stressed out when you're doing a particular procedure or you're in a field that makes you feel like anxious, that may not, that your body may be telling you something because you'll be the best at whatever you find is effortless for you.
40:06
SPEAKER_01: That you find it relaxing as you do it, you will be the best at that.
40:10
SPEAKER_01: Your body is telling you something.
40:12
SPEAKER_01: So don't fight Mother Nature, go with it.
40:14
SPEAKER_01: And it's going to help guide you to making the right decisions, whether it's lab work or whether it's in the clinical world.
40:21
SPEAKER_01: It will guide you properly so that you make decisions that really are not only give you joy and are healthy for you, but you will be better at it for your patients or your uh, you know, scientific endeavors.
40:35
SPEAKER_01: You'll be actually the best at it because for you, it is a natural um extension of your natural God-given talents and your ability to execute techniques.
40:46
SPEAKER_02: I love that.
40:47
SPEAKER_02: Wow, that's some excellent advice.
40:49
SPEAKER_02: And I really hope you guys are listening.
40:51
SPEAKER_02: And you know, it all actually almost brought me to tears because I completely agree with you, and I think that, you know, not enough people really do that.
40:57
SPEAKER_02: Um, I see so many people, you know, end up in medicine and they shouldn't be here.
41:01
SPEAKER_02: Let's be honest, they shouldn't be there because they don't have that passion, you know, like the kind of the enthusiasm and and and the drive that has come across in this interview with you, you know, just they don't have that.
41:12
SPEAKER_02: And it's like I always wonder it's like, how did you end up in a field where that is so centered around you really better know why you're here, you know what I mean?
41:21
SPEAKER_02: And then I just look at them and I'm like, I don't get it.
41:24
SPEAKER_02: So um, thank you.
41:26
SPEAKER_02: Thank you for offering that amazing, amazing advice and for all of your insights into skin health.
41:31
SPEAKER_02: This has been one of the best interviews that I've had the opportunity to conduct.
41:34
SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much.
41:36
SPEAKER_01: Ekta, I hope to see you and I'd give you a tour of the lab anytime.
41:39
SPEAKER_01: I'd love to, my door is always open to you.
41:41
SPEAKER_01: This has been such a pleasure.
41:43
SPEAKER_01: Thank you for doing this.
41:44
SPEAKER_01: Thank you for being a leader and a communicator.
41:48
SPEAKER_01: I think you're doing such a great service for everybody.
41:52
SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much, Dr.
41:53
SPEAKER_02: McCreen.
41:54
SPEAKER_02: And I hope you guys have had a great time.
41:56
SPEAKER_02: Leave us some feedback, some comments.
41:58
SPEAKER_02: If you've got any questions, uh, definitely leave them in the comment section.
42:01
SPEAKER_02: I will definitely pass them along to Dr.
42:03
SPEAKER_02: McCreen's team.
42:04
SPEAKER_02: And I can't wait.
42:05
SPEAKER_02: I I want to invite you back on if you ever have the time.
42:08
SPEAKER_02: So um, you know, we'll we'll definitely have a part two coming up at some point if we can.
42:13
SPEAKER_02: But thank you guys.
42:14
SPEAKER_02: Leave some comments.
42:16
SPEAKER_02: Hey guys, so I hope you love that episode.
42:19
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42:24
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43:02
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43:07
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43:18
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43:23
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