Latest / Deep Transformation / The Healing Power of Creating Art

Transcript

The Healing Power of Creating Art · Deep Transformation

0:00
Welcome
0:00
to
0:00
part
0:01
one
0:01
of
0:01
our
0:01
conversation
0:02
with
0:02
Dr.
0:03
Sally
0:03
Adams
0:04
Jones.
0:05
We've
0:05
grown
0:05
used
0:06
to
0:06
amazing
0:07
conversations
0:07
on
0:08
our
0:08
Deep
0:08
Transformation
0:09
podcast,
0:09
but
0:10
this
0:10
is
0:10
very
0:10
special.
0:11
Let's
0:11
dig
0:11
in.
0:12
It
0:12
goes
0:12
from
0:13
strength
0:13
to
0:14
strength.
0:18
Welcome
0:19
to
0:19
Deep
0:20
Transformation.
0:21
Self,
0:22
Society,
0:22
Spirit,
0:24
life
0:24
enhancing,
0:25
paradigm
0:26
rattling
0:26
conversations
0:27
with
0:27
cutting
0:28
edge
0:28
thinkers,
0:29
contemplatives
0:30
and
0:30
activists.
0:32
With
0:32
Dr.
0:32
Roger
0:32
Walsh
0:33
and
0:33
John
0:33
Dupuy
0:35
join
0:35
us
0:35
in
0:36
the
0:36
evolutionary
0:36
fast
0:37
lane
0:37
as
0:38
we
0:38
take
0:38
a
0:38
deep
0:38
dive
0:39
into
0:40
transformational
0:41
practice.
0:43
Peak
0:43
experience,
0:45
profound
0:45
understanding,
0:47
powerful
0:48
contribution.
0:52
I'm
0:53
Roger
0:53
Walsh
0:53
and
0:54
our
0:54
co
0:54
host
0:54
is
0:54
John
0:55
Dupuis.
0:56
And
0:56
with
0:56
us
0:57
today
0:57
is
0:57
someone
0:58
whose
0:58
work
0:59
has
0:59
made
0:59
an
0:59
enormous
1:00
difference
1:00
to
1:02
people
1:04
suffering
1:04
from
1:04
poverty,
1:05
multiple
1:06
kinds
1:06
of
1:06
deprivation,
1:07
refugees.
1:08
This
1:09
is
1:09
Dr.
1:09
Sally
1:10
Adnam
1:10
Jones.
1:10
Sally
1:11
was
1:11
born
1:12
and
1:12
raised
1:12
in
1:13
South
1:13
Africa,
1:14
but
1:14
got
1:14
a
1:15
PhD
1:15
in
1:16
Transformation
1:17
through
1:17
Art
1:18
at
1:19
the
1:19
University
1:19
of
1:19
Victoria
1:20
in
1:20
Canada
1:21
where
1:21
she
1:21
actually
1:22
went
1:22
back
1:22
to
1:23
Africa
1:23
and
1:23
worked
1:23
with
1:24
the
1:24
poorest
1:25
of
1:25
the
1:25
poor
1:26
to
1:26
attempt
1:27
to
1:27
provide
1:28
healing
1:28
throughout.
1:30
And
1:30
she
1:30
has
1:31
written
1:31
this
1:32
or
1:32
edited
1:33
this
1:33
wonderful
1:34
book,
1:35
Art
1:36
Making
1:36
with
1:36
Refugees
1:37
and
1:37
Survivors.
1:38
Creative
1:39
and
1:39
Transformative
1:40
Responses
1:41
to
1:41
Trauma
1:42
After
1:42
Natural
1:42
Disasters,
1:43
war
1:44
and
1:45
Other
1:45
Crises.
1:46
Sally's
1:47
a
1:47
student
1:47
of
1:48
integral
1:48
studies.
1:49
She
1:49
is
1:49
an
1:50
expert
1:50
or
1:51
very
1:51
familiar
1:51
with
1:51
developmental
1:53
ideas.
1:54
So
1:54
she
1:54
brings
1:55
a
1:55
lot
1:55
of
1:55
perspectives
1:56
to
1:57
our
1:57
discussion
1:58
today.
1:59
Sally,
1:59
so
2:00
your
2:00
biography
2:01
is
2:01
really
2:02
striking.
2:02
Perhaps
2:03
you
2:03
could
2:03
tell
2:04
us
2:04
a
2:04
little
2:04
about
2:04
how
2:05
you
2:05
came
2:05
to
2:06
this
2:06
work.
2:07
Thank
2:07
you,
2:07
Roger.
2:08
I
2:09
feel
2:09
very
2:10
privileged
2:10
to
2:10
have
2:10
been
2:11
born
2:11
and
2:11
raised
2:12
in
2:12
Africa.
2:13
I
2:13
lived
2:14
there
2:14
for
2:14
30
2:14
years
2:15
before
2:15
immigrating
2:16
to
2:16
Canada.
2:17
So
2:17
it's
2:17
very
2:18
dear
2:18
to
2:18
my
2:18
heart.
2:19
It's
2:19
a
2:20
very
2:20
complex
2:21
country
2:23
and
2:23
because
2:24
it
2:24
has
2:25
a
2:25
lot
2:25
of
2:26
poverty
2:27
and
2:27
a
2:28
lot
2:28
of
2:28
racial
2:29
issues
2:30
and
2:30
a
2:30
lot
2:31
of
2:31
gender
2:32
inequality,
2:33
every
2:33
single
2:34
kind
2:34
of
2:34
trauma
2:35
exists
2:36
there
2:36
as
2:37
an
2:37
intersection.
2:38
And
2:40
one
2:40
of
2:40
the
2:41
reasons
2:41
I
2:41
left
2:41
is
2:42
because
2:42
I
2:42
was
2:43
so
2:43
deeply
2:44
moved
2:45
by
2:46
the
2:46
situation
2:46
and
2:47
I
2:47
felt
2:47
very
2:47
overwhelmed
2:48
as
2:48
a
2:48
young
2:49
person.
2:50
I
2:50
did
2:51
not
2:51
know
2:51
how
2:52
to
2:52
begin
2:52
to
2:52
help.
2:54
So
2:54
my
2:54
journey
2:55
took
2:55
me
2:56
to
2:56
other
2:56
countries,
2:57
including
2:58
Canada.
2:59
And
3:00
what
3:00
I
3:00
find
3:00
amazing
3:01
is
3:02
the
3:02
people
3:03
that
3:03
are
3:03
being
3:03
brought
3:04
in
3:04
contact
3:04
with
3:06
the
3:06
teachers
3:07
were
3:08
exactly
3:08
the
3:09
people
3:09
that
3:09
I
3:09
needed
3:10
to
3:10
meet.
3:12
And
3:13
I've
3:13
been
3:13
a
3:14
lifelong
3:14
student
3:15
of
3:16
how
3:17
to
3:17
evolve
3:17
our
3:18
consciousness
3:19
out
3:19
of
3:19
suffering.
3:20
And
3:20
that
3:21
includes
3:22
education,
3:23
psychology,
3:25
spirituality.
3:27
So
3:28
my
3:28
travels
3:28
brought
3:28
me
3:29
in
3:29
contact
3:29
with
3:30
some,
3:30
I
3:30
would
3:31
say
3:31
world
3:32
class
3:33
teachers.
3:35
I
3:35
was
3:35
then
3:35
able
3:36
to
3:36
come
3:36
up
3:37
with
3:38
some
3:38
pioneering
3:39
work
3:41
when
3:41
I
3:41
integrated
3:42
all
3:42
this
3:42
information
3:44
and
3:44
go
3:44
back
3:45
to
3:45
Africa
3:45
to
3:46
try
3:46
and
3:46
apply
3:46
that.
3:47
I
3:48
had
3:48
to
3:48
find
3:49
human
3:50
developmental
3:51
maps
3:51
like
3:52
spiral
3:52
dynamics.
3:53
I
3:53
had
3:53
to
3:54
find
3:56
world
3:56
leaders
3:57
in
3:58
therapeutic
3:58
creative
3:59
practice.
4:00
I
4:00
had
4:00
to
4:00
find
4:02
spiritual
4:02
teachers
4:03
on
4:03
how
4:03
to
4:04
live
4:04
in
4:04
the
4:04
present
4:04
moment
4:05
and
4:06
how
4:06
to
4:06
let
4:06
go
4:07
of
4:07
our
4:07
suffering.
4:08
So
4:09
I
4:09
brought
4:09
all
4:09
these
4:09
ideas
4:10
together
4:10
and
4:11
came
4:11
up
4:11
with
4:11
a
4:11
model
4:12
which
4:12
was
4:12
my
4:13
PhD
4:14
in
4:15
how
4:15
to
4:15
help
4:16
people
4:17
in
4:18
the
4:18
most
4:18
dire
4:19
circumstances
4:21
who
4:21
had
4:23
been
4:24
dispossessed
4:25
of
4:25
just
4:26
about
4:26
everything.
4:27
Their
4:27
health
4:29
because
4:29
of
4:29
the
4:29
HIV
4:30
pandemic,
4:31
their
4:31
land
4:32
because
4:32
of
4:32
apartheid,
4:34
their
4:34
vote
4:35
because
4:35
of
4:35
apartheid,
4:36
and
4:36
their
4:36
voice
4:38
and
4:38
their
4:39
economic
4:40
abilities
4:41
to
4:41
produce
4:43
the
4:44
intersection
4:45
of
4:45
suffering
4:45
is
4:46
unimaginable.
4:47
And
4:47
now
4:47
there's
4:48
a
4:48
lot
4:48
of
4:48
hotspots
4:48
around
4:49
the
4:49
world
4:49
with
4:49
similar
4:50
circumstances
4:51
like
4:51
Gaza,
4:53
Ukraine.
4:55
I
4:55
felt
4:55
my
4:56
work
4:56
had
4:56
to
4:57
be
4:57
applicable
4:58
in
4:59
situations
4:59
where
5:00
there
5:00
was
5:00
no
5:00
economic
5:01
infrastructure
5:02
because
5:02
we
5:03
have
5:03
to
5:03
start
5:03
from
5:03
the
5:04
ground
5:04
up
5:04
with
5:04
people
5:05
where
5:05
the.
5:06
Where
5:06
they
5:06
are,
5:07
with
5:07
a
5:08
technology
5:08
that
5:09
can
5:09
apply
5:09
in
5:10
any
5:10
situation.
5:11
So
5:11
my
5:12
book
5:12
on
5:13
art
5:14
making
5:14
with
5:14
refugees,
5:17
it's
5:17
bigger
5:17
than
5:18
just
5:18
making
5:18
pretty
5:19
pictures.
5:20
It's
5:20
about
5:21
how
5:21
to
5:21
access
5:22
our
5:23
creativity
5:25
when
5:26
we've
5:26
been
5:26
dispossessed
5:27
and
5:27
dislocated,
5:29
when
5:29
we
5:29
feel
5:29
like
5:30
we've
5:30
got
5:30
no
5:31
agency
5:32
left.
5:33
How
5:33
do
5:33
we
5:33
resurrect
5:34
ourselves?
5:35
How
5:36
do
5:36
we
5:36
start
5:36
to
5:36
build
5:37
the
5:37
world
5:38
that
5:38
we
5:38
need,
5:40
which
5:41
has
5:42
a
5:42
domino
5:43
effect
5:43
in
5:44
our
5:44
self
5:44
esteem,
5:45
in
5:46
our
5:46
voice,
5:47
and
5:48
in
5:48
our
5:48
ability
5:49
to
5:50
imagine
5:51
the
5:51
next
5:52
world
5:52
that
5:53
we
5:53
need.
5:53
Little
5:54
did
5:54
I
5:54
know
5:54
this
5:55
is
5:55
now
5:55
becoming
5:56
a
5:56
global
5:56
application
5:57
as
5:58
we
5:58
face
6:00
a
6:00
poly
6:00
crisis.
6:01
This
6:01
book
6:02
that
6:02
I
6:02
wrote,
6:03
I
6:03
knew
6:03
was
6:04
ahead
6:04
of
6:04
its
6:04
time
6:06
and
6:06
it
6:06
was
6:07
located
6:07
specifically
6:08
in
6:08
Africa,
6:10
specifically
6:11
with
6:11
a
6:12
community
6:12
of
6:12
people
6:13
suffering
6:14
from
6:14
HIV
6:15
and
6:16
poverty
6:17
and
6:17
discrimination.
6:19
And
6:19
now
6:20
I
6:20
realize
6:20
that
6:20
this
6:20
is
6:21
applicable
6:22
across
6:22
the
6:22
world.
6:22
We
6:23
need
6:23
this
6:23
work
6:23
more
6:24
than
6:24
ever.
6:25
Not
6:25
only
6:25
with
6:25
people
6:26
who've
6:26
suffered
6:26
trauma,
6:27
but
6:27
for
6:27
everybody.
6:29
My
6:29
work
6:30
has
6:30
now
6:30
progressed
6:31
to
6:31
trying
6:31
to
6:31
motivate
6:32
everybody
6:34
to
6:34
access
6:35
their
6:35
creativity
6:36
and
6:36
start
6:36
building
6:37
the
6:37
world
6:37
we
6:38
need
6:38
instead
6:38
of
6:38
sitting
6:39
around
6:39
talking
6:39
about
6:40
it.
6:44
Beautiful.
6:45
And
6:45
you
6:45
have
6:46
certainly
6:47
worked
6:47
with
6:47
a
6:47
lot
6:48
of
6:48
groups.
6:48
So
6:49
after
6:49
you
6:51
went
6:51
back
6:52
to
6:52
Africa
6:52
and
6:53
did
6:53
your.
6:54
I
6:54
call
6:55
it
6:55
therapeutic
6:55
art
6:56
because
6:56
it
6:57
feels
6:57
like
6:57
it's
6:57
a
6:57
deep,
6:58
deep
6:58
therapy
6:59
you
6:59
were
6:59
offering.
7:00
And
7:00
I
7:00
know
7:00
there
7:00
are
7:01
technical
7:01
terms,
7:01
but
7:02
what
7:02
then?
7:03
What.
7:03
What
7:03
were
7:04
you
7:04
led
7:04
to
7:04
after
7:04
that?
7:06
Yeah,
7:06
so
7:06
the
7:07
origins
7:07
of
7:07
the
7:07
work
7:08
is
7:09
you
7:09
can
7:09
go
7:09
to
7:09
any
7:10
hotspot,
7:10
sit
7:11
under
7:11
a
7:11
tree,
7:12
use
7:13
the
7:13
materials
7:14
at
7:14
hand
7:15
and
7:16
build
7:16
a
7:17
community
7:17
of
7:18
people
7:18
using
7:19
their
7:19
hands.
7:19
And
7:20
I
7:20
really
7:20
believe
7:22
in
7:22
our
7:22
evolutionary
7:23
development
7:24
is
7:24
a
7:24
connection
7:25
between
7:26
the
7:26
thumb
7:26
and
7:27
the
7:27
brain.
7:29
So
7:30
you
7:30
start
7:30
using
7:30
your
7:31
hands
7:32
as
7:33
a
7:33
way
7:33
to
7:34
access
7:35
pre
7:35
verbal
7:37
pain.
7:39
The
7:39
verbal
7:40
comes
7:40
later.
7:42
So
7:42
when
7:42
you've
7:43
been
7:43
through
7:43
a
7:43
massive
7:44
disaster
7:45
and
7:46
our
7:46
world
7:46
is
7:46
heading
7:47
that
7:47
way.
7:47
So
7:47
I
7:48
feel
7:48
like
7:48
this
7:49
work
7:49
is
7:50
going
7:50
to
7:50
be
7:50
used
7:51
more
7:51
and
7:51
more.
7:51
You
7:52
can't
7:52
find
7:53
the
7:53
words
7:53
to
7:53
describe
7:54
what
7:54
you've
7:55
been
7:55
through.
7:55
That's
7:56
the
7:56
main
7:57
metrics
7:58
of
7:58
a
7:59
deep
7:59
trauma
7:59
is
8:00
you
8:00
lose
8:00
your
8:00
words.
8:02
In
8:02
fact,
8:03
there
8:03
are
8:04
no
8:04
words
8:04
to
8:04
describe
8:06
what
8:06
you
8:06
endured.
8:08
So
8:08
we
8:08
have
8:08
to
8:09
start
8:09
healing
8:11
first
8:11
of
8:11
all,
8:11
by
8:11
building
8:12
a
8:12
safe
8:13
circle
8:14
of
8:15
shared
8:15
endeavor
8:16
using
8:17
hands.
8:18
And
8:19
this
8:19
is
8:19
gender
8:20
specific.
8:20
It's
8:20
interesting.
8:21
Men
8:21
love
8:21
to
8:22
do
8:22
that
8:22
with
8:22
work.
8:23
They
8:23
love
8:23
to
8:24
grow
8:24
things
8:24
or
8:25
fix
8:26
something
8:27
or
8:28
build
8:28
something
8:29
together.
8:30
And
8:30
women
8:30
will
8:31
love
8:31
to
8:31
cook
8:32
something
8:33
or
8:33
create
8:33
something
8:34
with
8:35
more
8:35
feminine
8:36
materials.
8:36
And
8:37
I'm
8:37
talking
8:37
about
8:37
traditional
8:38
communities.
8:38
You
8:38
have
8:38
to
8:39
be
8:39
really
8:39
respectful
8:40
of
8:40
gender.
8:41
So
8:42
they
8:42
can
8:42
sew
8:42
a
8:43
tapestry
8:44
or
8:44
peel
8:44
vegetables.
8:46
So
8:47
you
8:47
bring
8:47
the
8:47
community
8:48
together,
8:48
first
8:49
of
8:49
all,
8:49
using
8:49
their
8:50
hands.
8:50
There's
8:50
no
8:51
words.
8:51
You
8:51
can
8:52
just
8:52
sit
8:52
and
8:52
chat.
8:52
And
8:54
slowly
8:55
belonging
8:56
is
8:57
created
8:57
and
8:58
safety
8:59
through
8:59
shared
8:59
endeavor
9:01
work.
9:02
And
9:03
I'm
9:03
noticing
9:03
this
9:04
more
9:04
and
9:04
more
9:04
that
9:04
people
9:05
find
9:05
meaning
9:05
in
9:06
work
9:06
and
9:06
love.
9:08
So
9:08
you
9:08
build
9:08
the
9:08
work,
9:09
you
9:09
build
9:09
the
9:09
community
9:10
that
9:10
that
9:10
is
9:11
meaning
9:12
this.
9:12
I.
9:13
I
9:13
really
9:14
believe
9:14
that
9:14
we've
9:15
lost
9:15
contact
9:16
when
9:16
we
9:16
start
9:16
creating
9:17
fancy
9:17
narratives.
9:18
That's
9:19
a
9:19
very
9:19
sophisticated
9:20
late
9:20
stage.
9:22
Meaning
9:22
is
9:22
built
9:23
through
9:23
work
9:23
and
9:24
love.
9:26
And
9:27
so
9:27
once
9:27
you've
9:27
got
9:28
the
9:28
community
9:30
harnessed
9:31
in
9:32
a
9:32
shared
9:32
endeavor,
9:33
they
9:33
can
9:34
beautify
9:35
their
9:35
location
9:36
somehow,
9:36
whether
9:37
it's
9:37
a
9:37
tapestry,
9:38
whether
9:38
it's
9:38
a
9:39
mosaic
9:39
on
9:39
a
9:40
wall,
9:40
whether
9:40
it's
9:40
a
9:40
new
9:41
concrete
9:41
slab,
9:42
whatever
9:43
it
9:43
is.
9:44
And
9:44
certain
9:45
materials
9:46
are
9:46
traditionally
9:46
gender
9:47
appropriate.
9:48
In
9:48
communities
9:48
like
9:49
that
9:49
have
9:49
to
9:50
be
9:50
respectful.
9:52
They
9:52
feel
9:52
pride.
9:54
So
9:54
that's
9:54
a
9:55
whole
9:55
new
9:56
level
9:56
of
9:56
transformation
9:57
as
9:57
well.
9:59
Look
9:59
at
9:59
that.
9:59
We
10:00
did
10:01
that.
10:02
That
10:03
is
10:03
amazing.
10:03
I
10:04
can
10:04
impact
10:06
my
10:06
environment.
10:07
I
10:07
actually
10:08
have
10:08
that
10:08
agency,
10:09
even
10:09
though
10:10
I
10:10
thought
10:10
I
10:10
was
10:10
stripped
10:11
of
10:11
all
10:11
my
10:11
agency.
10:13
That's
10:13
the
10:13
beginning.
10:13
That's
10:14
one
10:14
of
10:14
the
10:14
first
10:14
steps,
10:15
the
10:15
second
10:15
step.
10:16
After
10:16
you
10:16
build
10:16
work,
10:17
you
10:17
build
10:17
community,
10:18
you
10:18
build
10:19
pride.
10:20
And
10:20
then
10:21
you
10:21
build
10:22
a
10:22
belief
10:23
in
10:23
your
10:24
own
10:24
creativity
10:25
to
10:25
change
10:26
your
10:26
world.
10:28
So
10:28
it's
10:28
a
10:28
very
10:28
embodied,
10:30
very
10:30
practical
10:33
method
10:34
that
10:34
I've
10:34
pioneered.
10:37
And
10:37
after
10:38
that,
10:38
you
10:38
can
10:39
start
10:39
finding
10:40
your
10:40
voice.
10:41
Because
10:41
when
10:41
you
10:41
bring
10:42
the
10:42
community
10:42
together,
10:44
you
10:44
start
10:44
to
10:44
articulate
10:45
your
10:46
experience,
10:47
you
10:48
find
10:48
the
10:48
linear
10:49
connection
10:49
of
10:49
your
10:50
shared
10:51
story.
10:52
That's
10:52
when
10:53
the
10:53
voice
10:53
is
10:53
liberated.
10:56
So
10:56
in
10:56
the
10:56
work
10:56
I've
10:56
done,
10:57
for
10:57
example,
10:57
with
10:58
African
10:58
women
10:59
in
11:00
villages
11:01
that
11:01
have
11:02
suffered
11:02
deeply,
11:04
we
11:04
built
11:05
a
11:05
project
11:05
and
11:06
it
11:06
happened
11:06
to
11:07
be
11:07
a
11:07
tapestry.
11:09
Each
11:10
person
11:10
did
11:10
their
11:10
own
11:11
little
11:11
square,
11:12
and
11:12
slowly
11:13
they
11:13
sewed
11:14
all
11:14
the
11:14
squares
11:15
together.
11:16
That's
11:16
a
11:16
psychological
11:18
expansion
11:20
to
11:20
believing
11:21
we
11:21
all
11:22
in
11:22
this
11:22
together.
11:23
Then
11:24
you
11:24
have
11:24
a
11:24
beautiful
11:25
tapestry
11:26
on
11:26
the
11:26
wall
11:26
that
11:26
you
11:27
can
11:27
look
11:27
at.
11:27
You've
11:28
externalized
11:30
your
11:30
private
11:31
interior
11:33
into
11:33
something
11:34
beautiful
11:34
that
11:35
you
11:35
can
11:35
be
11:35
proud
11:36
of.
11:37
And
11:37
then
11:37
you
11:37
take
11:38
that
11:38
tapestry
11:39
from
11:39
village
11:39
to
11:40
village
11:40
and
11:41
the
11:41
whole
11:41
community
11:42
goes,
11:42
wow,
11:43
that's
11:44
my
11:44
story,
11:45
too.
11:45
And
11:45
we
11:46
can
11:46
start
11:46
talking
11:46
about
11:47
the
11:47
deepest
11:47
shame,
11:48
for
11:48
example,
11:49
of
11:49
suffering
11:49
from
11:50
hiv.
11:52
You
11:52
find
11:52
your
11:53
story,
11:53
you
11:53
find
11:54
your
11:54
pride,
11:54
you
11:55
find
11:55
you
11:55
belong.
11:57
You
11:57
find
11:57
beauty,
11:59
and
11:59
you
12:00
find
12:00
your
12:00
voice.
12:02
That's
12:03
when
12:03
you
12:03
start
12:04
being
12:04
an
12:04
activist
12:06
and
12:06
change
12:07
your
12:07
community,
12:08
and
12:09
it
12:09
starts
12:09
healing
12:09
you.
12:10
Right?
12:10
When
12:10
you
12:11
find
12:11
that
12:11
voice,
12:11
when
12:11
this
12:12
creativity
12:12
is
12:13
coming
12:13
through
12:13
you,
12:14
it's.
12:15
It's
12:15
sacred,
12:16
it's
12:16
special.
12:16
I
12:17
mean,
12:17
I
12:17
know
12:17
what
12:17
language
12:17
you
12:18
want
12:18
to
12:18
use,
12:18
but
12:18
there's
12:19
something
12:19
very
12:20
special,
12:20
and
12:20
I
12:21
wanted
12:21
to
12:21
ask
12:21
you
12:21
too,
12:22
is
12:22
how
12:23
did
12:23
you
12:23
get
12:23
into.
12:24
How
12:24
do
12:24
these
12:24
people
12:25
open
12:25
up
12:25
their
12:25
hearts
12:26
and
12:26
minds
12:26
to
12:26
you?
12:26
You
12:27
just
12:27
walk
12:27
in
12:27
the
12:27
village
12:27
and
12:27
say,
12:28
hey,
12:28
let's
12:28
make
12:28
a
12:28
tapestry.
12:29
How
12:29
did.
12:29
How
12:30
did
12:30
they
12:30
become
12:30
to
12:30
trust
12:31
you?
12:31
Because
12:31
it
12:32
entails
12:33
a
12:33
lot
12:33
of
12:33
trust
12:34
to
12:34
do
12:34
the
12:34
kind
12:34
of
12:35
work
12:35
that
12:35
you've
12:35
been
12:35
doing
12:35
in
12:36
these
12:36
poor
12:36
communities.
12:38
Yeah,
12:38
I've
12:38
worked
12:39
with
12:39
several
12:39
Indigenous
12:40
communities
12:40
in
12:41
this
12:41
way,
12:41
including
12:41
in
12:42
Canada
12:42
with
12:43
carving
12:43
totem
12:44
poles,
12:44
which.
12:45
So
12:45
you
12:45
have
12:45
to
12:46
find
12:46
the
12:46
indigenous
12:48
method,
12:48
the
12:49
preferred
12:49
method
12:50
of
12:50
that
12:50
gender.
12:51
Wood
12:52
is
12:52
not
12:52
for
12:52
women.
12:53
Wood
12:53
is
12:53
for
12:54
men.
12:54
Tools,
12:55
traditionally,
12:57
I'm
12:57
not
12:57
saying
12:57
in
12:58
other
12:58
communities,
12:58
we
12:59
feel
12:59
free
12:59
to
12:59
use
12:59
any
13:00
materials,
13:00
but
13:00
if
13:00
you
13:01
go
13:01
into
13:01
an
13:01
indigenous
13:02
community,
13:04
you
13:04
have
13:04
to
13:04
go
13:04
in
13:05
empty,
13:07
literally.
13:08
First
13:08
of
13:09
all,
13:09
you
13:09
have
13:09
to
13:09
get
13:09
ethical
13:10
permission
13:11
to
13:11
be
13:11
there
13:11
from
13:12
the
13:12
elders
13:13
of
13:13
the
13:13
community,
13:13
and
13:14
you
13:14
have
13:14
to
13:14
establish
13:15
a
13:15
relationship.
13:16
You
13:17
have
13:17
to
13:17
verify
13:18
that
13:18
you're
13:18
not
13:18
going
13:18
to
13:18
be
13:19
there
13:19
to
13:19
exploit
13:19
them
13:20
in
13:20
any
13:20
way.
13:22
So
13:23
I
13:24
spent
13:24
the
13:24
first
13:24
month
13:25
in
13:25
this
13:25
village
13:26
just
13:27
being
13:27
with
13:27
the
13:28
community,
13:28
doing
13:28
what
13:29
they
13:29
do,
13:30
which
13:30
at
13:31
that
13:31
time
13:31
was
13:31
mostly
13:32
attend
13:32
funerals
13:33
because
13:33
a
13:33
third
13:34
of
13:34
the
13:34
village
13:34
was
13:35
dying
13:35
from
13:35
hiv.
13:36
And
13:37
now
13:37
that
13:37
PEPFAR
13:38
is
13:38
withdrawing
13:38
its
13:39
aid,
13:40
they're
13:41
going
13:41
to
13:41
be
13:41
millions,
13:43
millions
13:44
of
13:44
Africans
13:45
dying
13:46
from
13:46
HIV
13:47
anyway.
13:48
So
13:48
this
13:48
work
13:49
can
13:49
only
13:49
be
13:50
more
13:50
and
13:50
more
13:50
applicable.
13:52
I
13:52
spent
13:52
the
13:52
first
13:53
month
13:53
just
13:53
being
13:53
with
13:54
the
13:54
community,
13:54
peeling
13:55
vegetables,
13:57
singing
13:57
songs,
13:58
because
13:58
it's
13:59
a
13:59
very
13:59
oral,
14:00
vocal,
14:01
chanting,
14:02
rhythmical
14:03
community,
14:04
and
14:05
finding
14:05
out
14:05
what
14:06
their
14:07
needs
14:07
were
14:08
and
14:08
then
14:08
applying
14:09
my
14:09
work
14:09
to
14:10
their
14:10
specific
14:11
needs.
14:13
And
14:13
in
14:13
that
14:14
community,
14:14
there
14:14
were
14:15
people
14:15
doing
14:16
this
14:16
work.
14:17
There's
14:17
a
14:17
beautiful
14:17
woman,
14:18
Dr.
14:18
Carol
14:19
Hoffmeyer,
14:20
who
14:20
was
14:20
there,
14:20
a
14:21
medical
14:21
doctor,
14:21
who
14:23
valued
14:23
art
14:24
as
14:24
a
14:25
therapy.
14:26
So
14:26
she
14:26
and
14:26
I
14:27
teamed
14:27
up
14:27
and
14:28
we
14:28
harnessed
14:29
what
14:29
was
14:29
there.
14:31
So
14:32
while
14:32
we
14:33
were
14:33
doing
14:33
creative
14:34
endeavor,
14:36
she
14:36
was
14:37
able
14:37
to
14:37
do
14:37
HIV
14:38
education.
14:41
So
14:41
the
14:41
voices
14:42
started
14:42
opening
14:43
up.
14:43
You
14:43
begin
14:44
to
14:44
drop
14:44
in
14:45
educational,
14:46
supportive,
14:46
community
14:48
issues.
14:51
When
14:51
you
14:51
have
14:52
hiv,
14:54
the
14:54
problem
14:54
you.
14:55
You're
14:55
trying
14:55
to
14:55
overcome
14:56
is
14:56
shame.
14:58
People
14:58
are
14:59
silenced.
15:00
They
15:00
can't
15:01
own
15:01
it.
15:01
It's
15:02
still
15:02
very
15:03
stigmatized.
15:04
So
15:05
once
15:05
you
15:05
build
15:05
that
15:06
trust,
15:06
you
15:06
can
15:06
start
15:07
to
15:07
understand
15:09
that
15:10
you're
15:10
in
15:10
a
15:10
shared
15:11
situation.
15:11
You
15:12
start
15:12
to
15:12
speak
15:13
about
15:13
it,
15:13
you
15:13
start
15:13
to
15:14
get
15:14
outside
15:14
help,
15:15
you
15:15
start
15:16
going
15:16
for
15:16
testing,
15:17
you
15:17
start
15:17
getting
15:18
antiretroviral
15:19
drugs,
15:21
and
15:21
the
15:22
community
15:22
can
15:22
start
15:22
healing.
15:25
It
15:25
starts
15:26
from
15:26
the
15:26
ground
15:26
up.
15:27
This
15:27
work.
15:28
It's
15:28
applicable
15:29
in
15:29
any
15:30
disaster,
15:31
whether
15:31
it's
15:32
genocide,
15:33
pandemic,
15:34
tsunami,
15:35
earthquake,
15:37
refugee
15:38
camps.
15:39
And
15:39
the
15:39
book
15:39
that
15:39
I
15:40
wrote
15:41
drew
15:42
on
15:42
leaders
15:43
in
15:43
those
15:43
various
15:44
situations
15:45
filled
15:46
with
15:46
trauma,
15:47
already
15:48
doing
15:48
this
15:48
work.
15:49
Because
15:50
there
15:50
was
15:50
no
15:51
degree
15:51
in
15:51
this
15:51
work.
15:52
There's
15:53
you.
15:54
Only
15:54
now
15:54
can
15:55
you
15:55
go
15:55
and
15:55
get
15:55
an
15:55
art
15:56
therapy
15:56
degree.
15:56
When
15:56
I
15:57
was
15:57
starting
15:57
this,
15:57
there
15:58
was
15:58
no
15:58
such
15:58
thing.
15:58
Art
15:59
therapy
15:59
degrees
16:00
are
16:00
brand
16:00
new.
16:01
But
16:01
there
16:01
were
16:02
people
16:02
in
16:02
other
16:03
parts
16:03
of
16:03
the
16:03
world
16:04
and
16:04
I
16:04
found
16:04
them,
16:04
I
16:05
sought
16:05
them
16:05
out
16:05
who
16:06
were
16:06
doing
16:06
this
16:06
work
16:07
in
16:07
refugee
16:07
camps,
16:08
specifically
16:09
in
16:09
Jordan
16:10
and
16:10
Syria
16:11
and
16:12
the
16:13
Calais
16:13
jungle
16:14
in
16:14
France,
16:15
places
16:15
where
16:16
they
16:17
had
16:17
been
16:17
drawn
16:17
to
16:18
this
16:18
work.
16:18
There
16:18
was
16:18
no
16:19
degree
16:19
you
16:19
could
16:19
get,
16:20
but
16:20
they
16:20
were
16:20
doing
16:21
this
16:21
work.
16:21
And
16:22
I
16:22
collated
16:23
chapters
16:24
in
16:24
the
16:24
book
16:25
that
16:25
they
16:25
could
16:25
tell
16:26
their
16:26
stories
16:26
of
16:26
how
16:27
they
16:27
had
16:27
also
16:27
found
16:28
this
16:28
to
16:28
be
16:28
helpful.
16:29
So
16:30
this
16:30
book
16:30
is
16:30
a
16:31
brand
16:31
new,
16:31
pioneering
16:32
endeavor
16:33
to
16:33
help
16:34
fundraisers,
16:36
to
16:36
help
16:37
project
16:37
facilitators,
16:38
to
16:38
help
16:39
public
16:39
health
16:40
officials,
16:41
to
16:41
help
16:42
educators,
16:42
to
16:43
help
16:43
therapists
16:45
really
16:45
understand
16:46
that
16:46
the
16:46
basis
16:47
of
16:47
self
16:47
esteem
16:48
is
16:49
agency,
16:51
and
16:51
that
16:51
how
16:51
you
16:51
find
16:52
agency
16:52
is
16:53
by
16:53
finding
16:54
your
16:54
hands
16:55
and
16:56
your
16:56
heart
16:56
and
16:57
your
16:57
voice.
16:59
That's
16:59
the
16:59
background.
17:00
I
17:00
don't
17:00
go
17:00
into
17:00
communities
17:01
and
17:01
tell
17:01
them
17:01
any
17:02
of
17:02
this.
17:02
We
17:02
just
17:02
start
17:03
a
17:03
project,
17:04
we
17:04
talk
17:04
about
17:05
it
17:05
afterwards.
17:06
It's
17:06
too
17:06
much
17:07
academia
17:09
in
17:09
the
17:09
beginning.
17:10
But
17:11
in
17:11
retrospect,
17:12
they
17:12
can
17:12
see
17:12
their
17:13
healing
17:13
journey
17:14
and
17:14
its
17:14
specific
17:15
steps
17:16
that
17:16
you
17:16
lead
17:16
them
17:16
through
17:17
slowly.
17:18
And
17:18
art
17:18
and
17:18
creativity
17:19
is
17:19
just
17:19
a
17:20
very
17:20
deep,
17:20
deep
17:21
part
17:21
of
17:21
being
17:21
a
17:22
human
17:22
being,
17:22
isn't
17:23
it?
17:23
I
17:23
mean,
17:23
you
17:23
go
17:23
back
17:24
to
17:24
the
17:24
earliest
17:26
remains
17:27
and
17:27
artistry
17:28
of
17:28
our
17:28
distant
17:29
ancestors,
17:30
even
17:30
the
17:30
Neanderthal.
17:32
They
17:32
made
17:32
things
17:33
with
17:33
their
17:33
hands,
17:33
they
17:34
drew
17:34
on
17:34
the.
17:35
The
17:35
walls
17:35
of.
17:36
They
17:36
probably
17:36
did
17:36
a
17:36
lot
17:36
more
17:36
stuff,
17:37
but
17:37
that's
17:37
what
17:37
survived.
17:38
So
17:38
I
17:38
don't
17:39
think
17:39
there's
17:39
probably
17:40
ever
17:40
been
17:40
a
17:41
isolated
17:42
tribe
17:42
or
17:43
a
17:43
group
17:43
of
17:43
human
17:43
beings
17:44
that
17:44
didn't
17:46
do
17:47
art,
17:47
didn't
17:48
do
17:48
creativity,
17:49
didn't
17:49
try
17:49
to
17:49
take
17:49
their
17:49
inner
17:50
juice,
17:50
their
17:51
inner
17:51
stuff,
17:51
and
17:52
put
17:52
it
17:52
out
17:52
in
17:52
a
17:52
way
17:53
that
17:53
could
17:53
be
17:53
experienced
17:54
by
17:54
themselves
17:54
and
17:55
by
17:55
others.
17:56
That's
17:56
exactly
17:57
right,
17:57
John.
17:57
And
17:58
you
17:58
put
17:58
your
17:58
finger
17:59
on
18:00
why
18:00
I
18:01
had
18:01
to
18:01
go
18:02
further
18:02
into
18:03
this
18:03
work,
18:04
became
18:05
fascinated
18:05
with
18:06
creativity.
18:07
Then
18:07
I
18:08
asked
18:08
Myself,
18:08
the
18:09
question
18:09
you've
18:09
asked,
18:10
where
18:10
did
18:10
that
18:10
go?
18:11
We
18:11
used
18:11
to
18:12
do
18:12
this
18:12
all
18:12
the
18:12
time
18:14
as
18:14
communities.
18:15
35,000
18:16
years
18:16
ago,
18:17
we
18:17
were
18:17
painting
18:17
on
18:18
caves.
18:20
So
18:21
now
18:21
my
18:22
work's
18:22
expanded
18:23
into
18:23
what
18:23
I
18:23
call
18:24
the
18:24
phenomenology
18:25
of
18:25
creativity
18:27
and
18:28
without
18:28
overwhelming
18:29
people.
18:29
That
18:29
means
18:30
you
18:30
have
18:30
to
18:30
understand
18:31
what
18:31
happened
18:32
in
18:32
the
18:32
pre
18:32
modern
18:32
era,
18:33
because
18:34
we
18:34
were
18:34
all
18:34
creative
18:35
in
18:35
the
18:35
pre
18:35
modern
18:36
era.
18:37
What
18:37
happened
18:38
in
18:38
the
18:38
modern
18:39
era,
18:40
which
18:40
was
18:40
to
18:41
start
18:42
moving
18:42
into
18:43
our
18:43
left
18:43
brain
18:45
and
18:45
moving
18:45
out
18:46
of
18:46
our
18:46
right
18:46
brain.
18:48
And
18:48
there's
18:48
a
18:48
whole
18:49
bunch
18:49
of
18:49
reasons
18:49
for
18:49
that.
18:49
I
18:50
write
18:50
about
18:50
that.
18:50
I
18:50
don't
18:51
want
18:51
to
18:51
bore
18:51
people
18:51
with
18:51
that.
18:52
But
18:54
in
18:54
other
18:54
words,
18:54
there's
18:55
another
18:55
way
18:55
to
18:55
look
18:55
at
18:55
that.
18:56
We
18:56
became
18:56
yang
18:57
and
18:58
we
18:58
forgot
18:59
how
18:59
to
18:59
be
18:59
yin,
19:01
left
19:01
and
19:01
right
19:01
brain
19:02
in
19:02
the
19:02
body
19:03
in
19:04
this
19:04
era.
19:06
My
19:06
suggestion
19:07
is
19:07
that
19:07
we
19:07
have
19:08
to
19:09
look
19:09
at
19:10
the
19:10
personal
19:10
and
19:10
the
19:11
collective
19:13
oppression
19:15
of
19:15
our
19:16
creativity,
19:17
which
19:17
is
19:17
to
19:17
discount
19:18
the
19:18
right
19:18
brain,
19:20
anything
19:20
creative,
19:21
and
19:22
resurrect
19:22
that
19:23
into
19:23
a
19:23
polarity
19:26
and
19:26
use
19:26
integrate
19:27
our
19:27
left
19:27
and
19:28
right
19:28
brain
19:28
again.
19:30
That's
19:30
the
19:30
second
19:31
part
19:31
of
19:31
my
19:32
academic
19:33
journey,
19:33
is
19:33
how
19:33
to
19:33
articulate
19:34
creativity
19:36
through
19:37
an
19:37
integration
19:38
of
19:38
our
19:38
left
19:38
and
19:39
right
19:39
brain.
19:39
So
19:40
I
19:40
used
19:40
to
19:40
teach
19:41
at
19:41
the
19:41
university
19:42
and
19:42
I've
19:42
taught
19:42
in
19:43
indigenous
19:43
communities
19:44
and
19:44
I've
19:45
taught
19:45
in
19:45
classrooms
19:46
and
19:46
studios.
19:48
And
19:48
I
19:48
found
19:49
that
19:51
there
19:51
were
19:52
several
19:52
ways
19:53
of
19:53
thinking
19:53
when
19:54
students
19:54
arrived.
19:55
Some
19:55
were
19:56
divergent
19:57
thinkers,
19:59
in
19:59
other
19:59
words,
19:59
give
20:00
them
20:00
one
20:00
problem
20:00
and
20:01
there's
20:01
a
20:01
million
20:02
answers.
20:04
And
20:04
some
20:04
were
20:05
convergent
20:05
thinkers,
20:06
which
20:06
is
20:07
give
20:07
them
20:08
all
20:08
these
20:08
data
20:09
points
20:09
and
20:10
they'll
20:10
try
20:10
and
20:10
make
20:11
one
20:11
answer.
20:12
Ian
20:13
McGilchrist's
20:14
work,
20:14
which
20:14
I
20:14
rely
20:15
on
20:15
as
20:16
the
20:16
medical
20:18
basis
20:18
for
20:18
my
20:19
theory,
20:21
is
20:21
that
20:21
left
20:21
brain
20:22
thinkers
20:24
are
20:24
convergent
20:25
and
20:26
right
20:26
brain
20:26
thinkers
20:27
are
20:28
divergent.
20:29
So
20:29
when
20:29
I'm
20:30
faced
20:30
with
20:30
a
20:30
classroom
20:31
full
20:31
of
20:31
students,
20:32
I
20:33
have
20:33
to,
20:34
as
20:35
I
20:35
always
20:35
do,
20:37
try
20:38
and
20:38
find
20:38
out
20:38
what
20:38
their
20:39
needs
20:39
are.
20:40
And
20:42
it
20:42
became
20:43
obvious
20:43
to
20:44
me
20:44
eventually
20:45
that
20:46
this
20:46
was
20:46
gendered.
20:48
I'd
20:48
go,
20:49
wow,
20:49
look
20:49
at
20:49
this.
20:49
This
20:50
is
20:50
so
20:50
interesting.
20:51
The
20:51
men
20:53
tend
20:54
to
20:54
be
20:54
convergent
20:56
and
20:56
the
20:56
women
20:57
tend
20:58
to
20:58
be
20:58
divergent.
20:59
And
20:59
this
20:59
is
20:59
not
21:00
stereotypical.
21:00
There's
21:01
many
21:01
women
21:01
who
21:02
are
21:02
left
21:03
brained
21:03
and
21:04
many
21:05
men
21:05
who
21:05
are
21:05
right
21:06
brained.
21:08
What
21:08
happens
21:09
in
21:09
a
21:09
classroom
21:11
is
21:12
that
21:12
they
21:12
are
21:13
stereotyped,
21:14
that
21:14
the
21:15
women
21:15
are
21:15
not
21:15
supposed
21:16
to
21:16
be
21:17
left
21:17
brained
21:18
and
21:19
the
21:19
men
21:20
are
21:20
not
21:20
supposed
21:21
to
21:21
be
21:21
right
21:22
brained.
21:22
In
21:22
fact,
21:23
they're
21:23
ostracized.
21:24
Men
21:25
in
21:25
my
21:25
classrooms
21:26
who
21:26
were
21:26
deeply
21:26
aesthetic
21:28
were
21:28
taunted
21:30
outside
21:31
the
21:31
classroom.
21:31
They
21:32
would
21:32
come
21:32
in
21:32
there
21:32
filled
21:32
with
21:33
shame,
21:33
knowing
21:34
I'm
21:34
deeply
21:34
aesthetic.
21:35
I
21:35
have
21:35
all
21:36
these
21:36
talents,
21:36
but
21:36
it's
21:37
not
21:37
masculine.
21:38
And
21:39
women
21:39
would
21:39
come
21:39
in
21:40
there
21:40
saying,
21:42
I
21:42
have
21:42
a
21:42
deep
21:42
aesthetic,
21:43
but
21:43
I'm
21:43
not
21:43
supposed
21:44
to
21:44
have
21:44
any
21:44
agency
21:45
and
21:45
execute
21:46
and
21:47
manifest
21:47
that
21:48
creativity
21:48
in
21:49
the
21:49
world
21:49
that's
21:49
masculine.
21:53
So
21:53
this
21:53
arose
21:54
naturally
21:54
in
21:55
my
21:55
classrooms
21:56
and
21:56
I
21:56
would
21:56
have
21:56
to
21:56
begin
21:57
to
21:57
work
21:58
with
21:58
de
21:59
genderizing
22:00
creativity.
22:02
What
22:03
that
22:03
actually
22:03
meant
22:04
is
22:04
metabolizing
22:05
in
22:05
your
22:05
other
22:05
side
22:06
of
22:06
the
22:06
brain.
22:07
So
22:07
we're
22:07
conditioned
22:08
as
22:08
men
22:09
to
22:09
be
22:09
very
22:09
left
22:10
brained,
22:11
as
22:11
women
22:11
to
22:11
be
22:12
right
22:12
brained.
22:12
And
22:13
so
22:13
my
22:13
task
22:14
in
22:14
any
22:14
creative
22:15
situation
22:17
is
22:17
how
22:18
do
22:18
we
22:18
get
22:18
out
22:18
of
22:18
that
22:19
programming,
22:20
how
22:20
do
22:21
we
22:21
get
22:21
women
22:21
to
22:22
be
22:22
more
22:22
left
22:23
brained
22:23
and
22:23
balance
22:24
that
22:24
and
22:24
how
22:24
do
22:25
we
22:25
get
22:25
men
22:25
to
22:25
be
22:26
more
22:26
right
22:26
brained?
22:27
And
22:27
I
22:27
know
22:27
you,
22:28
John,
22:28
you're
22:28
exploring
22:29
that
22:29
beautifully.
22:29
And
22:30
that
22:31
means
22:31
we
22:31
have
22:31
to
22:32
overcome
22:33
some
22:33
stigma.
22:35
I
22:35
didn't
22:36
want
22:36
to
22:36
genderize
22:37
my
22:37
classroom.
22:38
It
22:38
became
22:38
evident
22:39
to
22:39
me
22:39
my
22:39
students
22:40
were
22:40
arriving
22:40
with
22:41
all
22:41
this
22:41
history,
22:42
oh
22:42
my
22:42
goodness,
22:43
I
22:43
have
22:43
to
22:44
hide
22:44
my
22:44
femininity
22:45
as
22:45
a
22:46
man,
22:46
or
22:47
oh
22:47
my
22:47
goodness,
22:47
I
22:47
have
22:48
to
22:48
hide
22:48
my
22:49
masculinity
22:49
as
22:50
a
22:50
woman.
22:50
That
22:50
is
22:51
destructive
22:51
to
22:52
creativity
22:52
in
22:52
general.
22:53
That
22:54
was
22:54
my
22:54
first
22:54
step
22:55
into
22:55
this
22:55
phenomenology
22:56
of
22:56
creativity.
22:58
And
22:58
now
22:58
it's
22:59
moved
22:59
into
22:59
integral
23:00
daoism,
23:03
which
23:03
is
23:03
to
23:03
understand
23:04
that
23:04
the
23:04
nature
23:05
of
23:05
emergence
23:07
itself
23:07
is
23:08
to
23:08
become
23:10
aware
23:11
of
23:11
your
23:11
polarity
23:14
and
23:14
integrate
23:15
it.
23:15
And
23:16
the
23:16
more
23:16
you
23:16
do
23:16
that,
23:17
the
23:17
more
23:17
creative
23:18
you
23:18
become.
23:19
Can
23:20
you
23:20
give
23:20
an
23:20
example
23:20
of
23:21
that,
23:21
Sally,
23:21
what
23:22
that
23:22
would
23:22
look
23:22
like?
23:24
Yeah.
23:25
So
23:25
given
23:26
any
23:26
creative
23:27
project,
23:28
most
23:28
people
23:29
show
23:29
up
23:30
either
23:30
with
23:30
an
23:30
ability
23:31
to
23:31
imagine
23:32
or
23:32
intuit
23:34
and
23:35
they're
23:35
weak
23:35
on
23:36
execution.
23:38
Or
23:38
somebody
23:39
will
23:39
show
23:39
up
23:39
with
23:40
a
23:40
very
23:40
engineering
23:41
understanding
23:42
of
23:42
the
23:42
data,
23:44
but
23:44
they
23:44
can't
23:44
imagine
23:45
or
23:45
envision.
23:46
I'm
23:47
stereotyping,
23:47
but
23:48
these
23:48
are
23:48
the
23:48
people
23:48
that
23:48
show
23:49
up
23:49
in
23:49
my
23:49
classrooms.
23:51
My
23:51
facilitation
23:52
means
23:53
we
23:53
have
23:53
to
23:53
expand
23:54
into
23:54
the
23:54
opposite.
23:55
Please.
23:57
Progress
23:58
means
23:59
engineers
23:59
have
24:00
to
24:00
become
24:00
more
24:00
aesthetic
24:01
and
24:02
estheticians
24:02
need
24:03
to
24:03
become
24:03
more
24:04
data
24:04
and
24:04
math
24:04
driven.
24:05
So
24:05
math
24:05
and
24:06
art,
24:06
let's
24:06
just
24:07
say,
24:07
let's
24:07
reduce
24:08
it
24:08
to
24:09
that.
24:10
How
24:10
do
24:10
we
24:10
imagine
24:12
and
24:12
then
24:12
execute?
24:13
Because
24:14
you
24:14
can
24:15
do
24:15
all
24:15
the
24:15
imagining
24:16
you
24:16
want,
24:16
but
24:16
your
24:16
project
24:17
will
24:17
fail
24:17
with
24:17
no
24:18
execution.
24:18
You,
24:19
you
24:19
can't
24:19
manifest.
24:20
Right?
24:20
You
24:21
can
24:21
have
24:21
all
24:22
the
24:22
structural
24:23
agentic
24:24
abilities
24:25
you
24:25
want,
24:25
but
24:26
with
24:26
no
24:26
vision
24:26
and
24:27
imagination.
24:27
You're
24:27
just
24:28
going
24:28
to
24:28
reiterate
24:28
the
24:29
old.
24:31
You
24:31
need
24:31
both
24:33
masculine
24:34
and
24:34
feminine,
24:35
left
24:35
and
24:35
right
24:35
brain,
24:36
whatever
24:36
you
24:36
want
24:36
to
24:36
call
24:37
it,
24:37
at
24:37
whatever
24:37
scale.
24:39
We
24:39
can
24:39
use
24:39
the
24:39
archetype
24:40
yin
24:40
and
24:40
yang,
24:41
which
24:41
is
24:41
what
24:41
I
24:42
do
24:42
because
24:42
it
24:42
takes
24:42
it
24:43
out
24:43
of
24:43
male
24:43
and
24:43
female.
24:44
Let
24:44
me,
24:44
let
24:45
me
24:45
add
24:45
here,
24:45
I'm
24:45
A.
24:46
You
24:46
know,
24:46
I'm
24:46
a
24:46
creative
24:47
and
24:47
also
24:47
a
24:47
musician,
24:48
a
24:48
guitar
24:48
player,
24:48
songwriter,
24:49
singer,
24:50
and
24:50
you
24:51
can.
24:51
You
24:51
know,
24:51
you
24:51
have
24:52
to
24:52
study
24:52
for
24:52
years
24:52
to
24:53
get
24:53
the
24:53
technique
24:53
right
24:53
on
24:54
the
24:54
guitar.
24:54
Right.
24:55
But
24:57
if
24:57
you
24:57
don't
24:57
have
24:57
the
24:58
inspiration,
24:59
it's
25:00
just.
25:01
It's
25:01
dead.
25:02
It
25:02
doesn't
25:02
move
25:02
you.
25:03
It
25:03
doesn't
25:03
move
25:03
anybody
25:04
else.
25:05
But
25:05
it's
25:06
some.
25:06
And
25:06
I
25:06
still
25:07
haven't
25:07
figured
25:07
it
25:07
out
25:07
quite,
25:08
but
25:08
at
25:08
some
25:08
point,
25:08
the
25:09
muse
25:09
kicks
25:10
in
25:10
and
25:11
you
25:11
feel
25:12
like
25:12
there's
25:12
something
25:12
bigger
25:13
than
25:13
yourself
25:14
that's
25:14
taking
25:14
over,
25:15
and
25:15
it
25:15
just.
25:16
You
25:16
know,
25:16
and
25:16
it
25:16
may
25:16
take
25:16
years
25:17
of
25:17
struggling
25:17
to
25:18
get
25:18
there,
25:18
but.
25:19
But
25:19
something.
25:20
Something
25:20
really
25:20
happens.
25:21
And
25:21
I've
25:22
also
25:22
suffered
25:22
with
25:22
depression
25:23
and.
25:24
And
25:24
the
25:24
weight
25:24
of
25:25
the
25:25
world
25:25
and
25:25
dark
25:26
nights
25:26
of
25:26
the
25:26
soul
25:27
and
25:27
this
25:27
sort
25:27
of
25:27
stuff.
25:28
It
25:28
seems
25:28
that
25:29
at
25:29
that
25:29
point,
25:30
the
25:30
trauma,
25:31
the
25:31
darkness
25:32
actually
25:32
becomes
25:32
fuel
25:33
for
25:33
the
25:33
creative
25:34
fire,
25:34
and
25:35
it
25:35
gets
25:35
transformed
25:36
into
25:36
something
25:36
that
25:36
can
25:36
be
25:37
beautiful
25:37
and
25:37
transformative
25:38
and
25:38
healing
25:39
at
25:39
the
25:39
same
25:39
time.
25:41
Yeah.
25:41
So
25:42
I'm
25:42
listening
25:42
to
25:42
your
25:42
language,
25:43
John,
25:43
and
25:43
you've
25:44
used
25:44
the
25:44
language
25:45
of
25:46
discipline
25:47
and
25:48
inspiration,
25:49
the
25:49
masculine
25:49
and
25:50
the
25:50
feminine.
25:51
So
25:51
for
25:52
any
25:53
successful
25:54
creative
25:55
endeavor,
25:56
we
25:56
need
25:56
both.
25:56
We
25:57
need
25:57
to
25:57
do
25:57
the
25:57
10,000
25:58
hours,
25:59
and
25:59
then
26:00
we
26:00
need
26:00
to
26:00
surrender
26:03
and
26:04
get
26:04
into
26:04
the
26:04
feminine,
26:05
which
26:05
is
26:05
to
26:06
actually
26:07
move
26:07
beyond
26:07
the
26:08
identity
26:08
and
26:09
allow
26:09
the
26:10
inspiration
26:10
to
26:11
emerge
26:11
through
26:12
the
26:12
human
26:12
body.
26:13
It's
26:14
stunning.
26:14
We
26:15
go
26:15
into
26:15
altered
26:16
states.
26:16
That
26:16
is
26:16
the
26:17
mystical
26:17
union
26:18
of
26:18
yin
26:18
and
26:19
yang
26:19
in
26:19
the
26:20
human
26:20
body.
26:20
And
26:21
it
26:21
is
26:21
creative.
26:23
So
26:24
at
26:24
the
26:24
lower
26:25
chakras,
26:27
masculine
26:28
and
26:28
feminine
26:28
come
26:29
together
26:29
as
26:29
procreative.
26:32
At
26:33
the
26:33
higher
26:33
levels
26:34
of
26:34
yin
26:34
and
26:34
Yang,
26:35
masculine
26:36
and
26:36
feminine
26:37
come
26:37
together
26:37
as
26:38
creative.
26:40
So
26:40
it's
26:40
a
26:40
different
26:41
scale
26:41
of
26:42
the
26:42
same
26:42
libidinal
26:43
energy.
26:45
So
26:46
a
26:46
lot
26:46
of
26:46
people
26:46
just
26:46
get
26:47
stuck
26:47
in
26:47
the
26:47
lower
26:48
chakras.
26:48
And
26:49
I've
26:49
noticed,
26:49
like
26:49
dating
26:50
language,
26:50
the
26:51
Yin
26:51
and
26:51
the
26:51
Yang
26:51
in
26:52
the
26:52
dating
26:52
pool
26:53
is
26:53
about
26:53
how
26:54
to.
26:55
How
26:55
to
26:56
specialize
26:57
in
26:57
one
26:57
way
26:58
or
26:58
the
26:58
other,
26:59
which
26:59
is
26:59
necessary
27:00
for
27:01
the
27:01
third
27:02
thing
27:02
to
27:02
be
27:02
made
27:03
the
27:03
baby.
27:05
At
27:05
the
27:05
higher
27:06
levels
27:06
of
27:07
creativity.
27:08
And
27:08
then
27:08
mysticism,
27:10
the
27:10
marriage
27:11
becomes
27:12
internal.
27:13
Yin
27:14
and
27:14
Yang
27:14
come
27:15
together
27:15
and
27:15
make
27:16
the
27:16
third
27:16
thing.
27:18
And
27:18
eventually
27:19
man
27:19
and
27:19
God
27:20
come
27:20
together
27:20
and
27:21
make
27:21
the
27:21
emergent
27:23
inspiration,
27:24
the
27:24
mystical
27:25
union.
27:26
So
27:26
I
27:26
look
27:26
at
27:26
these
27:27
three
27:27
scales
27:28
of
27:28
yin
27:28
and
27:28
Yang,
27:30
procreativity,
27:31
creativity,
27:33
and
27:33
actual
27:34
oneness.
27:34
With
27:35
emergence,
27:36
you
27:36
become
27:36
an
27:37
instrument
27:37
for
27:38
the
27:38
divine
27:38
through
27:39
yin
27:39
and
27:39
Yang.
27:40
Yeah,
27:41
so
27:41
that's
27:42
the
27:42
integral
27:42
Taoism.
27:43
This
27:43
work
27:43
has
27:43
just
27:44
progressed
27:44
from
27:44
just.
27:44
And
27:45
it
27:45
feels
27:45
very
27:46
mysterious.
27:47
And
27:47
even
27:47
when
27:47
you
27:48
experience
27:48
it,
27:48
you
27:49
can't
27:49
explain
27:49
it.
27:50
You
27:50
know,
27:50
it
27:50
seemed
27:50
like
27:50
that
27:51
song
27:51
wanted
27:51
to
27:51
write
27:52
itself.
27:52
It
27:52
was
27:52
very
27:52
easy
27:53
you
27:53
know,
27:53
I
27:53
went
27:54
through
27:54
all.
27:54
I
27:54
wrote
27:54
a
27:55
song
27:55
about
27:55
Ukraine.
27:56
It's
27:56
on
27:56
YouTube
27:57
if
27:57
anybody
27:57
wants
27:57
to
27:58
watch
27:58
it.
27:58
John
27:58
Dupuy
27:59
with
27:59
the
27:59
exclamation
27:59
mark.
28:00
And
28:00
it's
28:01
hard
28:01
to
28:01
write
28:02
topical
28:02
songs
28:03
that
28:03
just
28:03
don't
28:03
sound
28:04
like
28:04
propaganda
28:05
or
28:05
cheesy
28:06
or
28:06
something.
28:06
So
28:07
I
28:07
really
28:07
was
28:08
feeling
28:08
really,
28:09
really.
28:09
I
28:09
had
28:09
friends
28:10
over
28:10
there
28:10
and
28:10
I
28:11
was
28:11
just.
28:11
The
28:11
injustice
28:12
of
28:12
it
28:12
all
28:12
really
28:13
hit
28:13
me.
28:13
So
28:14
I
28:14
just
28:15
picked
28:15
up
28:15
my
28:15
guitar
28:16
and
28:17
I
28:17
got
28:17
the
28:17
chorus
28:18
which
28:18
is
28:19
repeating
28:19
Ukraine,
28:21
Ukraine.
28:21
You
28:22
know,
28:22
just
28:22
all
28:22
this
28:24
admiration
28:24
and
28:25
sadness
28:25
and.
28:26
And
28:27
all
28:27
the
28:27
feelings
28:27
I
28:27
have
28:27
about
28:28
Ukraine.
28:29
And
28:29
then,
28:29
then
28:29
the
28:30
verses
28:30
just
28:30
came
28:31
out.
28:32
And
28:32
then
28:32
I
28:33
ran
28:33
into
28:33
this.
28:33
Well,
28:34
a
28:34
daughter
28:34
of
28:34
a
28:34
friend
28:34
of
28:35
mine,
28:35
she
28:35
was
28:35
14
28:35
years
28:36
old
28:36
at
28:37
the
28:37
time,
28:37
Ukrainian.
28:38
And
28:38
she
28:38
put
28:38
the
28:38
videos
28:39
to
28:39
the
28:39
song
28:39
together.
28:40
And
28:40
the
28:40
videos
28:41
are
28:41
just
28:42
perfect.
28:43
I
28:43
mean,
28:44
if
28:44
you
28:44
have
28:44
half
28:45
a
28:45
heart,
28:45
you
28:45
can't
28:46
see
28:46
this
28:46
without
28:47
feeling
28:48
emotion
28:49
and
28:49
tears
28:49
come
28:49
into
28:50
your
28:50
eyes
28:50
and
28:50
it's
28:50
just
28:50
like.
28:51
And.
28:52
And
28:52
one
28:52
time
28:52
they
28:53
asked
28:53
Bob
28:53
Dylan,
28:53
how
28:53
did
28:54
you
28:54
write
28:54
all
28:54
those
28:54
songs
28:55
way
28:55
back
28:55
when?
28:56
And
28:56
he
28:56
says,
28:56
I
28:56
don't
28:56
know,
28:57
I
28:57
have
28:57
no
28:57
idea.
28:58
You
28:58
know,
28:58
it's
28:59
just
28:59
this
29:00
thing
29:00
that
29:00
happens
29:00
and
29:01
it
29:01
gets
29:01
us
29:01
out
29:01
of
29:01
ourselves
29:02
and
29:02
connects
29:02
us
29:02
with
29:03
something
29:03
beyond
29:04
just
29:05
our
29:05
normal
29:05
day
29:06
to
29:06
day
29:06
ego,
29:06
self
29:07
and
29:07
the
29:08
realm
29:08
of
29:08
mystery,
29:09
magic,
29:09
spirituality,
29:11
all
29:11
of
29:11
that
29:11
combined.
29:12
So
29:14
I
29:14
love
29:14
that,
29:14
John,
29:15
that
29:15
the
29:15
ultimate
29:16
understanding
29:17
then
29:17
is
29:18
about
29:18
the
29:18
mystery.
29:19
It's.
29:21
It's
29:21
an
29:21
embodied
29:23
channel
29:24
to
29:24
the
29:24
divine.
29:25
And
29:25
there
29:25
are
29:26
a
29:26
second
29:27
level
29:27
of
29:27
no
29:27
words.
29:29
So
29:29
you
29:29
start
29:29
out
29:29
with
29:30
no
29:30
words
29:31
and
29:31
you
29:31
find
29:31
the
29:32
words
29:32
to
29:32
do
29:32
the
29:33
creative
29:33
expression.
29:34
And
29:34
then
29:34
the
29:34
conclusion
29:35
you
29:35
come
29:35
to,
29:36
there's
29:36
no
29:36
words.
29:37
There's
29:37
a
29:37
mystery
29:37
here.
29:38
And
29:38
I'm
29:38
going
29:39
to
29:39
facilitate
29:40
that
29:40
and
29:41
practice
29:41
that
29:42
as
29:42
much
29:42
as
29:42
possible.
29:43
So
29:43
that's
29:43
my
29:43
life
29:43
journey,
29:44
like
29:44
you're
29:44
saying
29:44
there,
29:45
John,
29:46
is
29:46
how
29:46
to.
29:46
How
29:47
to
29:47
articulate
29:47
this
29:48
for
29:48
other
29:48
people.
29:50
Beautiful.
29:51
Really,
29:51
really,
29:52
really
29:52
important
29:52
work.
29:53
Yes.
29:53
Yeah.
29:54
How
29:54
do
29:54
we
29:55
understand
29:56
emergence,
29:57
which
29:57
is
29:58
actually
29:59
duality
30:00
is
30:01
yin
30:01
and
30:01
yang
30:02
at
30:02
the
30:02
biggest
30:02
frame?
30:04
I
30:04
won't
30:04
go
30:04
into
30:04
that
30:05
now,
30:05
but
30:06
if
30:06
you
30:06
want
30:06
to
30:07
discuss
30:07
that
30:07
at
30:07
the
30:08
human,
30:09
that's
30:09
the
30:09
macro.
30:10
If
30:10
you
30:11
want
30:11
to
30:11
look
30:11
at
30:11
the
30:11
meso
30:12
level,
30:13
which
30:13
is
30:13
the
30:13
human,
30:14
it's
30:14
the
30:14
same
30:14
cosmic
30:15
principles.
30:17
How
30:17
does
30:17
duality
30:18
show
30:18
up
30:18
in
30:18
the
30:19
human
30:19
body
30:19
and
30:19
its
30:20
polarity?
30:22
And
30:22
it
30:22
shows
30:23
up
30:23
at
30:23
different
30:24
scales.
30:24
Mysticism,
30:26
creativity
30:27
and
30:27
co.
30:27
Creativity
30:28
and
30:29
procreativity.
30:31
So
30:31
that's
30:31
the
30:31
biosphere
30:33
evolving
30:34
into
30:34
the
30:34
neurosphere.
30:37
And
30:38
the
30:38
physiosphere
30:39
has
30:39
those
30:40
polarities
30:40
too,
30:41
with
30:41
positive
30:41
and
30:42
negative
30:42
and
30:43
north
30:43
and
30:43
south
30:44
poles
30:44
and
30:44
mag
30:45
Anyway,
30:46
yin
30:47
and
30:47
yang,
30:48
I
30:49
suggest,
30:50
is
30:50
a
30:50
cosmic
30:51
principle
30:52
that
30:53
is
30:53
embodied
30:53
at
30:54
the
30:54
physiospherical
30:55
level,
30:56
the
30:56
biospherical
30:57
level,
30:57
and
30:58
now
30:58
the
30:58
neurospherical
30:59
level.
31:02
So
31:02
that's
31:02
my
31:03
job,
31:03
is
31:03
to
31:03
track
31:04
that
31:04
and
31:05
we
31:05
call
31:05
that
31:06
creativity
31:06
at
31:07
the
31:07
human
31:07
level,
31:08
but
31:08
it's
31:08
actually
31:08
emergence
31:09
working
31:09
through
31:10
the
31:10
human
31:10
body.
31:13
That's
31:13
an
31:13
intriguing
31:14
reframe
31:15
of
31:15
creativity,
31:16
emergence
31:17
operating
31:17
through
31:18
the
31:18
human.
31:19
That's
31:19
brilliant.
31:20
Yeah,
31:20
I
31:20
love
31:20
that.
31:21
That's
31:21
a
31:21
new
31:21
one
31:21
which
31:21
I'll
31:22
have
31:22
to
31:22
have
31:23
to
31:23
think
31:23
about.
31:23
Is
31:23
there
31:24
more
31:24
you'd
31:24
like
31:24
to
31:24
say
31:25
to
31:26
help
31:26
me
31:26
and
31:27
all
31:27
those
31:27
listening?
31:28
Yeah.
31:29
So
31:29
this
31:29
is
31:29
when
31:30
I
31:30
started
31:30
dipping
31:30
into
31:31
process
31:32
philosophy.
31:33
So
31:34
I
31:34
find
31:34
language
31:35
there,
31:37
the
31:37
language
31:37
of
31:38
wholar
31:39
kism,
31:40
where
31:41
everything
31:41
we
31:42
see
31:42
is
31:42
parts
31:43
and
31:43
wholes
31:44
and
31:44
there's
31:44
a
31:44
dance
31:45
between
31:45
them.
31:46
And
31:47
how
31:47
do
31:47
we
31:48
make
31:48
sense
31:48
of
31:48
that?
31:50
So
31:50
Kussler
31:51
was
31:51
the
31:52
person
31:52
who
31:52
articulated
31:53
emergence.
31:55
And
31:55
Alfred
31:56
North
31:56
Whitehead
31:57
spoke
31:58
about
31:58
reality
31:59
just
31:59
being
31:59
a
32:00
relentless
32:01
movement
32:01
into
32:02
novelty.
32:03
That's
32:03
all
32:04
that
32:04
life
32:04
is.
32:06
And
32:07
I'm
32:08
now
32:08
taking
32:08
that
32:09
into
32:09
polarity
32:10
principles.
32:11
How
32:11
does
32:11
that
32:12
work?
32:12
Because
32:12
we
32:13
actually
32:13
embody
32:14
that.
32:14
We're
32:14
not
32:14
separate
32:15
from
32:15
principles
32:16
of
32:16
emergence.
32:18
We're
32:19
a
32:19
fractal
32:19
of
32:19
that.
32:21
So
32:21
how
32:21
do
32:21
we
32:22
potentiate
32:23
through
32:24
our
32:24
body?
32:25
And
32:25
it's
32:26
my
32:26
suggestion
32:27
that
32:27
we
32:27
do
32:27
that
32:27
through
32:28
understanding
32:28
polarity
32:29
principles,
32:30
including
32:31
just
32:31
in
32:31
the
32:31
classroom,
32:32
understanding
32:32
left
32:33
and
32:33
right
32:33
hemisphere
32:34
in
32:35
the
32:35
bedroom,
32:35
it's.
32:36
It's
32:36
male
32:37
and
32:37
female.
32:38
Wherever
32:39
you
32:39
go,
32:39
there's
32:39
a
32:40
polarity
32:40
principle
32:41
that
32:41
produces
32:41
a
32:42
third
32:42
thing.
32:44
So
32:45
I
32:45
have
32:45
a
32:46
long
32:46
history
32:46
in
32:47
tantric
32:47
thinking.
32:48
I'm
32:48
a
32:48
yoga
32:49
teacher.
32:49
I
32:49
have
32:50
a
32:50
master's
32:50
in
32:51
yoga
32:51
education
32:52
from
32:52
the
32:52
Hindu
32:53
University
32:53
of
32:53
America
32:54
as
32:54
well.
32:55
So
32:55
it
32:55
was
32:55
understanding
32:56
tantric
32:57
principles,
32:57
principles
32:59
long
32:59
before
32:59
I
33:00
started
33:00
noticing
33:02
in
33:02
my
33:02
classroom
33:03
teaching
33:03
creativity.
33:04
These
33:04
are
33:04
tantric
33:05
principles.
33:07
It's
33:07
left
33:07
and
33:07
right
33:08
brain,
33:08
it's
33:09
understanding
33:10
the
33:10
gendered
33:10
qualities
33:11
that
33:11
we
33:11
can
33:12
bring
33:12
to
33:12
the
33:12
table
33:13
of
33:14
execution
33:15
and
33:15
receptivity.
33:16
And
33:16
eventually
33:17
when
33:17
we
33:18
get
33:18
to
33:18
the
33:18
mystical
33:19
level,
33:19
we
33:20
have
33:20
to
33:20
do
33:20
that
33:21
internally.
33:24
So
33:25
at
33:25
that
33:25
point
33:26
we
33:26
become
33:28
whole,
33:29
hierarchical.
33:30
The
33:30
parts
33:31
of
33:31
us
33:31
have
33:32
come
33:32
together
33:32
into
33:33
a
33:33
new
33:33
whole.
33:35
So
33:35
where
33:35
are
33:36
those
33:36
parts
33:36
in
33:36
the
33:37
body?
33:37
That's
33:37
where
33:37
I
33:38
track,
33:38
attract
33:39
the
33:39
different
33:40
scales.
33:40
You
33:40
know,
33:41
it's
33:42
polarity
33:42
exists
33:43
everywhere
33:44
in
33:44
the
33:44
body,
33:45
it
33:45
exists
33:46
in
33:46
the
33:46
genitalia,
33:47
it
33:48
exists
33:48
in
33:48
the
33:49
chromosomes,
33:49
it
33:50
exists
33:50
in
33:50
the
33:50
hormones,
33:51
it
33:51
exists.
33:52
It
33:52
exists
33:52
in
33:52
the
33:53
breathing,
33:54
it
33:54
exists
33:55
in
33:56
the
33:56
brain,
33:57
it
33:57
exists
33:58
in
33:58
the
33:58
autonomic
33:59
nervous
33:59
system
34:00
as
34:01
parasympathetic
34:02
and
34:02
sympathetic.
34:04
So
34:04
without
34:05
going
34:06
into
34:06
too
34:06
much
34:06
detail
34:07
and
34:07
overwhelming
34:08
people,
34:09
my
34:10
book
34:10
Integral
34:11
Daoism,
34:12
that's
34:12
coming
34:12
up
34:13
this
34:13
year
34:14
looks
34:14
at
34:15
the
34:15
four
34:15
quadrants
34:16
of
34:16
Daoism
34:18
in
34:18
the
34:18
human
34:18
body.
34:20
So
34:21
in
34:21
other
34:21
words,
34:21
it
34:21
looks
34:22
at
34:22
the
34:22
biology,
34:23
the
34:23
psychology,
34:25
the
34:25
cultural
34:26
sociology
34:26
and
34:27
the
34:27
politics
34:29
and
34:30
institutionalized
34:31
education
34:32
systems,
34:32
blah,
34:32
blah,
34:33
of
34:33
yin
34:34
and
34:34
yang.
34:35
It
34:35
shows
34:35
up
34:36
everywhere.
34:36
And
34:37
now
34:37
all
34:37
I
34:37
can
34:37
do
34:38
is
34:38
see
34:38
it
34:39
everywhere,
34:39
of
34:39
course,
34:40
because
34:40
I've
34:40
been
34:40
immersed
34:41
in
34:41
this
34:41
for
34:41
a
34:41
year.
34:42
So
34:42
I
34:43
look
34:43
at
34:43
yin
34:44
and
34:44
yang
34:44
in
34:44
the
34:44
brain,
34:45
I
34:45
look
34:46
at
34:46
yin
34:46
and
34:46
Yang
34:46
in
34:47
the
34:47
psychology,
34:48
I
34:48
look
34:48
at
34:48
yin
34:49
and
34:49
Yang
34:49
in
34:49
our
34:49
stories
34:50
from
34:50
culture,
34:51
and
34:51
I
34:51
look
34:51
at
34:52
yin
34:52
and
34:52
yang
34:52
and
34:52
our
34:53
politics.
34:54
And
34:54
interestingly,
34:55
it's
34:55
incredibly
34:56
relevant
34:57
to
34:57
our
34:57
politics
34:58
today.
34:58
So
34:59
let's
34:59
move
34:59
into
35:00
left
35:00
and
35:00
right
35:01
politics.
35:02
Before
35:02
we
35:03
do.
35:03
Sally,
35:03
can
35:03
we.
35:04
Can
35:04
I
35:04
just
35:04
clarify
35:05
how
35:05
you're
35:06
using
35:06
the
35:06
term
35:06
polarity
35:07
Sounds
35:07
like
35:07
you're
35:07
using
35:08
in
35:08
a
35:08
slightly
35:08
different
35:09
way.
35:09
So
35:09
maybe
35:09
you
35:10
could
35:10
just
35:10
explain
35:11
how
35:11
you're
35:11
using
35:11
the
35:12
term
35:12
polarities.
35:14
Yeah.
35:14
So
35:14
polarities
35:15
would
35:15
be
35:15
a
35:15
dance
35:16
between
35:17
contrasting
35:19
parts.
35:21
So
35:22
it's
35:22
an
35:22
erotic
35:23
energy
35:25
between
35:26
any
35:27
contrasting
35:28
poles.
35:30
So
35:30
that's
35:31
polarity.
35:31
So
35:31
in
35:32
the
35:32
physiosphere,
35:35
that's
35:35
between
35:35
negative
35:36
and
35:36
positive
35:38
or
35:39
poles
35:40
of
35:40
a
35:40
magnet
35:41
in
35:41
the
35:41
geosphere,
35:42
its
35:43
north
35:43
and
35:43
south
35:43
pole,
35:45
which
35:45
creates
35:46
summer
35:47
and
35:47
winter,
35:50
which
35:50
creates
35:51
circadian
35:52
rhythms
35:52
in
35:53
the
35:53
human
35:53
sleep
35:54
and
35:54
awakeness,
35:55
which
35:56
creates
35:57
melatonin
35:58
and
35:58
serotonin.
36:00
Every
36:01
level
36:02
of
36:02
existence
36:04
has
36:04
polarity.
36:05
I
36:05
know
36:06
I'm
36:06
making
36:06
a
36:06
profound,
36:07
outrageous
36:08
statement,
36:09
but
36:09
I'll
36:09
stand
36:10
by
36:10
it.
36:12
And
36:12
they're
36:13
interlinked
36:14
in
36:14
this
36:14
hilarchy
36:15
that
36:15
we
36:15
call
36:16
existence.
36:17
They're
36:18
dependent
36:18
on
36:19
each
36:19
other
36:20
in.
36:20
In
36:20
the
36:20
martial
36:21
arts,
36:21
we
36:21
learned
36:22
that
36:22
there's.
36:23
There's
36:23
the
36:23
hard
36:24
techniques
36:25
and
36:26
then
36:26
there's
36:26
the
36:26
blending
36:27
techniques.
36:28
And
36:29
when
36:29
it
36:29
really
36:29
becomes.
36:31
The
36:31
thing
36:32
is
36:32
when
36:32
you
36:32
bring
36:33
those
36:33
two
36:33
things
36:33
together
36:34
and
36:34
just
36:34
spontaneously
36:35
move
36:35
through
36:35
the
36:36
heart
36:36
and
36:36
soft.
36:37
And
36:37
it's.
36:39
It's
36:39
a
36:39
very
36:39
mystical,
36:40
profound
36:41
experience
36:41
when
36:41
we
36:42
are
36:42
able
36:42
to
36:43
do
36:43
that.
36:43
And
36:43
they've
36:43
been
36:44
doing
36:44
this
36:44
for
36:44
thousands
36:45
of
36:45
years.
36:47
Yeah.
36:48
Share
36:48
a
36:49
brief
36:49
story
36:49
then
36:49
with
36:50
your
36:50
listeners
36:50
about
36:51
an
36:51
initiation
36:52
I
36:52
received
36:52
in
36:52
China
36:53
from
36:53
a
36:53
Taoist
36:54
master.
36:56
I
36:56
can
36:56
explain
36:57
the
36:57
people
36:58
I've
36:58
come
36:58
across,
37:00
but
37:01
it's
37:01
all
37:01
meant
37:01
to
37:02
be
37:02
for
37:02
me
37:02
to
37:03
come
37:03
to
37:03
this
37:03
book.
37:04
So
37:04
I
37:05
went
37:05
to
37:05
visit
37:05
my
37:05
sister
37:06
who
37:06
was
37:06
working
37:06
in
37:07
Beijing,
37:08
and
37:08
she
37:08
said,
37:09
come,
37:09
let's
37:09
go
37:09
look
37:09
in
37:10
the
37:10
park.
37:10
You've
37:11
never
37:11
seen
37:11
meditative
37:12
practices
37:14
like
37:14
you
37:15
see
37:15
in
37:15
a
37:15
Chinese
37:16
park.
37:17
So
37:17
we
37:18
went
37:18
down
37:18
and
37:18
sat
37:18
in
37:18
the
37:19
green
37:19
space,
37:19
highly
37:20
dense
37:21
neighborhood
37:21
of
37:22
toll
37:23
apartment
37:24
buildings.
37:24
And
37:24
in
37:25
China,
37:25
it's
37:25
beautiful.
37:26
There's
37:26
always
37:26
a
37:26
green
37:26
space
37:27
and
37:27
the
37:27
public
37:27
Always
37:28
come
37:28
down
37:28
from
37:29
their
37:29
units
37:29
and
37:29
they
37:30
meditate
37:31
in
37:31
the
37:31
park.
37:32
I
37:33
sat
37:33
there
37:34
speechless.
37:35
There
37:36
were
37:36
all
37:37
varieties
37:37
of
37:38
meditative
37:38
practice,
37:39
from
37:40
huge
37:41
paintbrushes
37:42
painting
37:42
water
37:42
on
37:43
the
37:43
sidewalk
37:43
that
37:44
would
37:44
evaporate
37:45
as
37:45
a
37:45
meditation
37:46
of
37:46
impermanence.
37:47
You
37:47
create
37:48
a
37:48
picture,
37:49
it
37:49
evaporates
37:50
to
37:51
ballroom
37:52
dancing
37:53
between
37:53
couples
37:54
just
37:55
practicing
37:56
random
37:56
strangers
37:57
how
37:57
to
37:58
play
37:58
with
37:58
yin
37:58
and
37:58
yang.
38:00
There
38:00
were
38:00
qigong
38:01
masters,
38:02
there
38:02
were
38:02
tai
38:03
chi
38:03
masters.
38:04
There
38:05
were
38:05
people
38:07
literally
38:07
just
38:08
swirling
38:09
long
38:09
colored
38:10
ribbons
38:11
in
38:11
the
38:12
air
38:12
to
38:12
see
38:13
the
38:13
interplay
38:14
of
38:14
movement
38:16
that
38:16
they
38:16
could
38:16
create.
38:18
I.
38:20
I
38:20
fell
38:21
in
38:21
love
38:21
with
38:21
China
38:22
in
38:23
that
38:23
moment.
38:23
And
38:24
that's
38:24
why
38:24
my
38:24
book
38:25
is
38:25
called
38:25
Integral
38:26
Taoism
38:27
and
38:27
not
38:27
Integral
38:28
Tantra.
38:31
So
38:32
I
38:32
was
38:32
sitting,
38:32
minding
38:33
my
38:33
own
38:33
business
38:33
on
38:34
the
38:34
bench
38:35
in
38:36
absolute
38:37
awe,
38:38
when
38:38
a
38:39
community
38:39
of
38:39
people
38:40
right
38:40
next
38:40
to
38:40
me,
38:42
the
38:42
leader
38:42
who
38:43
was
38:43
doing
38:43
a
38:43
practice,
38:44
called
38:45
me.
38:45
He.
38:46
He
38:46
turned
38:46
around
38:47
and
38:47
pointed
38:48
to
38:48
me
38:48
and
38:48
said,
38:49
you
38:49
come
38:50
here.
38:51
And
38:51
I
38:52
said,
38:52
no,
38:53
there's
38:54
a
38:54
group
38:54
of
38:54
Chinese
38:55
people
38:55
around
38:56
him,
38:56
and
38:56
he's
38:56
demonstrating
38:57
a
38:57
martial
38:58
art.
38:59
And
39:00
again
39:00
he
39:00
said,
39:00
you
39:02
come
39:02
here.
39:03
My
39:04
sister
39:04
pushed
39:05
me
39:05
forward
39:06
and
39:06
took
39:06
my
39:07
camera
39:07
and
39:07
my
39:07
purse
39:08
and
39:08
pushed
39:09
me.
39:09
And
39:09
I.
39:11
I
39:11
was
39:11
the
39:11
only
39:11
blonde
39:12
person
39:12
in
39:12
the
39:12
whole
39:13
of
39:13
Beijing
39:13
in
39:13
that
39:13
moment.
39:14
And
39:14
I,
39:14
like,
39:16
I'm
39:16
a
39:17
foreigner.
39:17
I
39:17
don't
39:17
belong
39:18
here.
39:19
So
39:19
he
39:19
said,
39:19
you
39:20
come
39:21
here.
39:22
He
39:22
made
39:23
me
39:23
stand
39:23
on
39:23
a
39:24
pair
39:24
of
39:24
bricks,
39:25
and
39:26
he
39:26
stood
39:26
on
39:26
another
39:27
pair
39:27
of
39:27
bricks,
39:28
and
39:28
he
39:29
said,
39:29
get
39:29
on
39:29
the
39:30
bricks.
39:31
So
39:31
I
39:31
stood
39:31
on
39:32
the
39:32
bricks,
39:33
and
39:33
he
39:34
without.
39:34
He
39:35
spoke
39:35
Mandarin,
39:35
I
39:36
spoke
39:36
English.
39:36
There
39:36
was
39:36
no
39:37
communal
39:38
language,
39:38
but
39:39
we
39:39
understood.
39:39
He
39:40
said
39:40
to
39:40
me,
39:40
the
39:40
rules
39:41
are
39:41
contact
39:42
between
39:42
the
39:42
wrist
39:42
and
39:43
the
39:43
elbow
39:43
only,
39:45
and
39:45
we're
39:46
going
39:46
to
39:46
fight,
39:47
and
39:48
the
39:48
only
39:48
rule
39:49
is
39:49
you
39:49
look
39:49
me
39:49
in
39:50
the
39:50
eye.
39:52
So
39:52
I'm
39:52
standing
39:53
on
39:53
the
39:53
bricks.
39:54
We
39:54
make
39:55
forearm
39:55
contact
39:57
and
39:57
we
39:57
engage,
39:59
and
40:00
off
40:00
we
40:00
go.
40:01
And
40:01
his
40:02
job
40:02
is
40:02
to
40:02
push
40:02
me
40:03
off
40:03
my
40:03
brakes,
40:03
and
40:04
my
40:04
job
40:04
is
40:04
to
40:05
push
40:05
him
40:05
off
40:05
his
40:05
brakes.
40:10
We
40:10
engage,
40:12
and
40:12
he
40:12
pushes
40:13
me
40:14
over,
40:14
and
40:15
I
40:15
push
40:15
him
40:15
over.
40:16
And
40:17
we're
40:17
doing
40:17
this
40:18
dance,
40:21
and
40:21
it's
40:21
a
40:22
polarity
40:22
dance
40:23
of
40:24
every
40:25
force
40:26
has
40:26
an
40:26
opposite
40:27
and
40:27
equal
40:28
force.
40:31
Neither
40:31
of
40:32
us
40:32
could
40:33
get
40:33
the
40:33
other
40:33
one
40:33
off
40:34
their
40:34
bricks
40:36
because
40:36
we
40:36
were
40:36
completely
40:38
integrated
40:39
in
40:40
our
40:40
strength
40:41
and
40:41
our
40:41
surrender.
40:44
I
40:44
have
40:44
never
40:44
received
40:45
a
40:45
lesson
40:45
from
40:46
a
40:46
master
40:47
quicker
40:48
than
40:48
in
40:49
that
40:49
20
40:49
minutes
40:50
of
40:50
engagement
40:50
with
40:51
a
40:51
Chinese
40:51
master.
40:52
With
40:52
no
40:52
language,
40:53
common
40:53
language,
40:54
I
40:55
got
40:57
rooted
40:57
in
40:57
my
40:57
body
40:58
that
40:58
my
40:59
masculine
40:59
and
40:59
feminine
41:00
have
41:00
to
41:00
come
41:00
together.
41:01
I
41:01
have
41:01
to
41:01
surrender
41:03
and
41:03
I
41:03
have
41:04
to
41:04
impact,
41:05
and
41:05
I
41:06
have
41:06
to
41:06
be
41:06
grounded,
41:07
and
41:07
I
41:08
need
41:08
to
41:08
be
41:08
elevated,
41:10
I
41:10
need
41:10
to
41:10
be
41:10
aggressive
41:11
and
41:11
I
41:12
need
41:12
to
41:12
be
41:12
tender.
41:13
Anyway,
41:14
I
41:14
won't
41:14
go
41:15
into
41:15
it,
41:15
but
41:16
that
41:17
moment
41:18
was
41:18
the
41:18
birthing
41:19
moment
41:19
of
41:19
my
41:19
book
41:20
Integral
41:20
Taoism.
41:21
It
41:22
was
41:22
a
41:23
teaching
41:24
with
41:24
no
41:24
language
41:26
by
41:26
a
41:26
stranger,
41:27
a
41:27
man
41:27
I've
41:28
never
41:28
met,
41:28
who
41:29
singled
41:29
me
41:29
out
41:29
from
41:30
across
41:30
a
41:30
park
41:31
for
41:31
this
41:31
lesson.
41:34
And
41:34
now
41:34
I
41:35
write
41:35
about
41:35
it,
41:35
and
41:36
I've
41:36
articulated
41:37
what
41:37
polarity
41:38
is
41:38
at
41:39
every
41:39
scale.
41:41
And
41:41
it's
41:41
yin
41:42
and
41:42
yang
41:43
working
41:43
together
41:44
to
41:44
create
41:44
the
41:45
third
41:45
thing.
41:46
That's
41:47
a
41:47
great
41:47
story.
41:49
One
41:49
of
41:49
the,
41:50
the
41:50
reasons.
41:51
Well,
41:51
I.
41:52
We
41:53
do
41:53
a
41:53
group
41:53
together.
41:54
It's
41:54
called
41:55
Integral
41:55
Psychotherapy
41:56
Group.
41:56
And
41:56
we
41:57
get
41:57
there
41:57
and
41:58
we
41:58
share
41:58
and
41:59
it's
41:59
all
41:59
videoed
42:00
and,
42:00
you
42:00
know,
42:01
we
42:01
talk
42:01
about.
42:01
Or
42:02
somebody
42:02
presents.
42:03
You
42:03
were
42:03
talking,
42:04
and
42:04
it
42:04
was,
42:04
I
42:05
don't
42:05
know,
42:05
a
42:05
couple
42:05
of
42:05
months
42:05
ago,
42:06
or
42:06
we
42:06
were
42:06
talking,
42:07
the
42:07
group
42:07
was
42:08
talking.
42:08
And
42:09
you
42:09
mentioned
42:09
that
42:10
you
42:10
were
42:10
Canadian.
42:11
You
42:11
know,
42:12
and
42:12
that's
42:14
right
42:14
when
42:16
Donald
42:16
Trump
42:16
had
42:16
started
42:17
trying
42:18
to
42:18
say
42:18
that
42:19
he
42:20
would
42:20
take
42:20
Canada
42:21
as
42:21
a
42:21
51st
42:22
state,
42:22
you
42:23
know,
42:23
bullying,
42:24
threatening,
42:25
threatening
42:26
military
42:26
power,
42:27
playing
42:27
with
42:28
tariffs
42:29
as
42:29
a
42:29
way
42:29
of
42:30
blackmailing.
42:31
Anyway,
42:32
it
42:33
hit
42:33
me
42:33
really
42:33
hard
42:34
because
42:34
I
42:34
do
42:34
love
42:35
my
42:35
country
42:35
and
42:35
my
42:36
country
42:36
does
42:37
bad
42:37
things.
42:38
I
42:38
really
42:38
feel
42:39
it.
42:39
We
42:39
do
42:39
good
42:39
things.
42:40
I
42:40
really
42:40
feel
42:40
that,
42:41
too.
42:42
So
42:43
it
42:43
was
42:43
just
42:44
so
42:44
out
42:44
of
42:45
the
42:45
blue.
42:46
I
42:46
mean,
42:46
you
42:46
know,
42:46
it's
42:47
like
42:47
Canada,
42:47
you
42:47
know,
42:48
I
42:48
mean,
42:48
the.
42:49
The
42:49
meme
42:49
about
42:50
Canada,
42:50
they're
42:50
like
42:51
us.
42:51
They're
42:51
just
42:51
nicer.
42:52
Right.
42:52
And
42:53
you've
42:53
been
42:53
there
42:53
with
42:54
us
42:54
through
42:55
wars
42:55
and
42:56
all
42:56
this
42:56
stuff,
42:57
and
42:58
for
42:58
him
42:58
to
42:59
do
42:59
that
42:59
is
42:59
just
42:59
unconscionable.
43:01
And
43:02
I.
43:03
It
43:03
was
43:03
really
43:03
getting
43:04
to
43:04
you,
43:04
too,
43:04
at
43:04
that
43:04
moment.
43:05
And
43:05
I
43:05
don't
43:05
know
43:05
how
43:06
it
43:06
is,
43:06
but
43:06
it
43:06
wasn't
43:07
just
43:07
one
43:07
of
43:07
Trump's
43:08
mental
43:08
blurbs.
43:09
I
43:09
mean,
43:09
he's
43:09
doubled
43:10
down
43:10
on
43:10
it,
43:11
and
43:11
he's
43:11
still
43:12
doing
43:12
it.
43:12
And
43:12
just
43:12
a
43:12
couple
43:13
of
43:13
days
43:13
ago,
43:13
or
43:13
a
43:13
few
43:14
days
43:14
ago,
43:14
King
43:15
Charles
43:15
came,
43:16
you
43:16
know,
43:16
and
43:16
Canada's
43:17
a
43:17
constitutional
43:17
monarchy,
43:18
like
43:18
you
43:18
were.
43:18
We
43:19
were
43:19
talking
43:19
about
43:19
earlier
43:19
how
43:20
the.
43:20
You
43:20
have
43:20
the
43:20
traditional
43:21
roots
43:21
that
43:22
plants
43:22
you
43:23
in.
43:23
And
43:24
he.
43:24
He
43:25
stood
43:25
up
43:25
for
43:25
Canada
43:26
as
43:26
a
43:26
separate
43:27
individual
43:28
entity.
43:29
And
43:29
what
43:29
makes
43:30
a
43:30
country,
43:30
the
43:30
people
43:31
make
43:31
a
43:31
country.
43:32
It's
43:32
not
43:32
the
43:33
borders.
43:33
It's
43:33
what
43:33
people
43:34
feel
43:34
about
43:34
themselves.
43:35
Like,
43:36
Putin
43:36
said
43:37
that
43:37
Ukraine
43:37
was
43:37
not
43:37
really
43:38
a
43:38
country.
43:38
Well,
43:38
they
43:39
weren't.
43:39
They
43:39
sure
43:39
are
43:40
now.
43:40
You
43:41
know,
43:41
they've
43:42
come
43:42
together.
43:42
And
43:43
Canada
43:43
is,
43:44
my
43:44
understanding,
43:44
has.
43:45
I
43:45
mean,
43:45
he's.
43:46
He's
43:46
successfully
43:47
divided
43:48
America,
43:49
and
43:49
that's
43:50
the
43:50
way
43:50
he's
43:51
assumed
43:51
power.
43:52
But
43:52
he,
43:53
in
43:53
my
43:53
impression
43:54
from
43:54
looking
43:55
from
43:55
the
43:55
outside
43:56
in
43:56
into
43:57
Canada,
43:57
he's
43:57
united
43:58
your
43:58
country.
43:58
So
43:58
what
43:59
is
43:59
it?
44:00
You
44:00
know,
44:00
what
44:00
does
44:00
it
44:01
Feel
44:01
like
44:01
from
44:02
your
44:02
end,
44:02
and
44:02
you're.
44:03
You're
44:03
a
44:03
psychotherapist
44:04
and
44:04
obviously
44:05
a
44:05
very
44:05
intelligent,
44:05
sensitive
44:06
woman.
44:08
What's
44:08
going
44:08
on
44:09
with
44:09
that?
44:11
Yeah,
44:11
it's
44:12
interesting,
44:12
John,
44:13
because
44:13
our
44:13
Prime
44:14
Minister,
44:15
Mr.
44:15
Mark
44:15
Carney,
44:16
just
44:16
this
44:16
week
44:17
said
44:18
Canada's
44:19
Athens
44:19
and
44:20
America
44:20
is
44:21
Rome,
44:22
the
44:23
Romans.
44:23
So
44:24
I've
44:24
been
44:24
thinking
44:24
about
44:25
that.
44:25
I
44:25
think
44:25
it's
44:25
a
44:25
very
44:26
interesting
44:26
analogy
44:27
he
44:27
used
44:28
because
44:28
we're
44:28
both
44:29
pro
44:29
democracy,
44:31
so
44:32
I've
44:33
been
44:33
toying
44:33
with
44:34
that.
44:34
But
44:34
it
44:34
also
44:34
fits
44:35
into
44:35
the
44:35
yin
44:36
and
44:36
the
44:36
yang.
44:38
So
44:38
I
44:38
see
44:38
this
44:39
polarization,
44:41
as
44:41
opposed
44:42
to
44:42
polarity,
44:44
between
44:44
the
44:45
right
44:45
and
44:45
the
44:45
left.
44:47
The
44:47
right
44:48
is,
44:49
in
44:50
my
44:50
view,
44:52
holding
44:52
on
44:52
to
44:52
the
44:53
past
44:53
and
44:53
seeing
44:54
great
44:54
value
44:55
in
44:55
tradition.
44:56
And
44:57
the
44:57
left
44:57
is
44:58
trying
44:58
to
44:58
move
44:59
into
44:59
the
44:59
forward
45:00
and
45:00
wanting
45:01
to
45:01
embrace
45:01
change.
45:02
So
45:03
there's
45:03
a
45:05
emphasis
45:06
on
45:06
meritocracy,
45:07
individualism,
45:09
accountability,
45:10
old
45:11
structures,
45:13
hard
45:13
work.
45:13
There's
45:14
an
45:14
atomization,
45:16
as
45:17
opposed
45:17
to
45:17
a
45:17
collectivism
45:19
on
45:19
the
45:19
left.
45:21
So
45:21
there's
45:21
the
45:22
parts
45:22
and
45:22
whole
45:23
dance
45:23
going
45:23
on
45:24
here,
45:24
too,
45:25
between
45:27
what
45:27
I
45:27
would
45:27
call
45:28
the
45:28
shadow
45:29
of
45:29
yin,
45:30
which
45:30
is
45:30
hyper
45:31
collectivism,
45:33
the
45:34
healthy
45:34
social
45:34
democracy,
45:35
that
45:36
can
45:36
also
45:36
move
45:36
towards
45:37
Marxism,
45:38
and
45:38
communism,
45:39
which
45:39
is
45:40
hyper
45:40
collectivity
45:42
in
45:42
other
45:43
countries.
45:43
In
45:44
South
45:44
Africa,
45:44
for
45:44
example,
45:45
it's
45:45
moving
45:46
towards
45:46
shadow
45:47
feminine.
45:48
And
45:49
other
45:49
countries
45:50
where
45:50
that
45:51
when
45:51
extreme,
45:52
moves
45:52
towards
45:53
fascism,
45:54
which
45:54
is
45:54
hyper
45:55
masculine.
45:57
So
45:57
there's
45:58
the
45:58
nanny
45:58
state
46:00
versus
46:01
and
46:01
which
46:02
is
46:02
the
46:02
left
46:02
versus
46:03
the
46:03
right,
46:04
which
46:04
is
46:04
about
46:05
hyper
46:05
individualism.
46:07
It's
46:07
modernism
46:08
versus
46:08
postmodernism,
46:10
which
46:10
is
46:11
going
46:11
to
46:11
toxic
46:12
extremes
46:13
right
46:13
now.
46:14
So
46:14
polarization,
46:15
as
46:15
opposed
46:16
to
46:16
a
46:16
polarity
46:17
dance
46:17
that
46:17
we
46:18
need
46:18
to
46:18
come
46:19
into
46:19
play
46:20
that
46:20
both
46:21
are
46:21
valid,
46:22
both
46:22
have
46:23
absolute
46:24
value
46:24
sets.
46:26
And
46:27
Canada
46:27
is
46:28
moving
46:28
into
46:29
the
46:30
left,
46:31
more
46:31
liberal
46:32
social
46:32
democracy.
46:34
And
46:34
in
46:35
our
46:35
country,
46:36
the
46:36
conservatives
46:37
are
46:37
afraid
46:38
we'll
46:38
move
46:38
into
46:38
communism,
46:39
Marxism.
46:41
And
46:41
in
46:42
your
46:42
country,
46:42
you're
46:43
moving
46:43
more
46:43
towards
46:45
the
46:45
patriarchal
46:46
meritocracy,
46:48
the
46:48
anti
46:49
dei.
46:51
So
46:53
with
46:53
that
46:53
said,
46:53
we've
46:54
got
46:54
a
46:54
yin
46:54
and
46:54
yang
46:55
polarization.
46:57
Trump
46:58
looks
46:58
at
46:58
Canada
46:59
and
46:59
says,
47:00
you
47:00
are
47:01
my
47:01
worst
47:01
nightmare.
47:02
You're
47:03
dei,
47:05
South
47:05
Africa's
47:06
even
47:06
more
47:07
extreme
47:07
dei.
47:08
He's
47:09
got
47:09
that
47:09
in
47:09
his
47:10
mind.
47:11
We
47:11
should
47:11
just
47:12
say
47:12
diversity,
47:12
equity,
47:13
inclusion.
47:13
Probably
47:14
everyone
47:14
knows.
47:15
But
47:15
just
47:15
so
47:16
we
47:16
make
47:16
it
47:16
clear.
47:17
So
47:18
how
47:18
do
47:18
we
47:18
bring
47:18
these
47:19
back
47:19
into
47:19
healthy
47:20
balance?
47:21
Stay
47:22
tuned
47:22
to
47:22
part
47:22
two
47:22
of
47:23
our
47:23
conversation
47:24
where
47:24
we
47:24
get
47:24
into
47:25
the
47:25
current
47:25
situation
47:26
with
47:26
Trump
47:27
in
47:27
Canada
47:27
and
47:28
beyond
47:28
with
47:28
Sally's
47:29
brilliant
47:29
integral
47:30
Taoist
47:31
perspective.
47:32
Thank
47:32
you
47:33
very
47:33
much
47:33
for
47:33
being
47:34
a
47:34
part
47:34
of
47:34
this
47:34
conversation.
47:35
We
47:35
hope
47:36
that.
47:36
That
47:36
you
47:36
were
47:36
moved,
47:37
as
47:37
we
47:37
are
47:37
moved,
47:38
being
47:38
part
47:38
of
47:38
it
47:39
ourselves.
47:39
We'd
47:40
also
47:40
like
47:40
to
47:40
say
47:41
that
47:41
this
47:41
is
47:41
being
47:42
funded
47:42
by
47:42
Roger
47:43
and
47:43
myself.
47:43
It
47:43
comes
47:44
out
47:44
of
47:44
our
47:44
pockets.
47:44
So
47:45
if
47:45
you
47:45
would
47:45
like
47:45
to
47:45
help
47:46
us
47:46
to.
47:47
Mainly
47:47
to
47:47
get
47:48
this
47:48
podcast
47:48
out
47:48
to
47:49
more
47:49
people,
47:49
because
47:49
the
47:50
bigger
47:50
audience
47:50
have,
47:50
which
47:51
is
47:51
steadily
47:51
growing,
47:52
but
47:52
the
47:52
more
47:52
people
47:52
we
47:53
can
47:53
reach
47:53
and
47:53
the
47:53
more
47:53
marketing
47:54
we
47:54
can
47:54
do,
47:55
the
47:55
more
47:55
positive
47:56
effect
47:56
we
47:56
can
47:56
have
47:56
on
47:57
the
47:57
world.
47:57
So
47:57
we've
47:58
done
47:58
that
47:58
a
47:58
couple
47:58
of
47:58
ways.
47:58
But
47:59
we'd
47:59
like
47:59
you
47:59
to
47:59
buy
48:00
us
48:00
a
48:00
cup
48:00
of
48:00
coffee.
48:01
Very
48:01
simple.
48:02
And
48:02
I
48:02
do
48:02
that
48:02
with
48:02
podcasts
48:03
that
48:03
I
48:04
support,
48:04
and
48:05
I
48:05
find
48:05
it's
48:05
very
48:06
satisfying.
48:06
So
48:07
thank
48:07
you
48:07
for
48:07
your
48:07
help,
48:08
thank
48:08
you
48:08
for
48:08
your
48:08
presence,
48:09
and
48:09
thank
48:09
you
48:09
for
48:10
all
48:10
you
48:10
are
48:10
and
48:11
all
48:11
you
48:11
do.
48:11
We
48:11
love
48:12
you.
48:27
Sam.