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King or Consultant? A conversation with pastors Nathan and Rachel Derenski · The Wholehearted Enneagram Podcast

0:16
SPEAKER_01: Hi friends, welcome back to the Simply Wholehearted Podcast.
0:20
SPEAKER_01: Again, I hope you're enjoying our music from Enner the Worship Circle.
0:24
SPEAKER_01: It's called Heavenly Things, written by Carla Adolf and Ben Tasley.
0:29
SPEAKER_01: I hope you'll find out more at Inertheworship Circle.com.
0:33
SPEAKER_01: I am so excited about fall finally being here.
0:37
SPEAKER_01: Well, it's fall officially, but it feels like fall today, and I'm thrilled to be wearing a sweater, and it feels chilly and brisk, and it's nice to be able to linger outside a little bit longer, and the kids can play and imagine and take their adventures outside for a bit of time before we come back inside when the weather is too cold.
0:58
SPEAKER_01: But for now, I'm loving it, and I put out my harvest decor and fall leaves, and I need to pick up some pumpkins to put out on the front porch this weekend.
1:08
SPEAKER_01: So I'm thrilled about it, and hopefully you all are enjoying it in your neck of the woods and maybe even can enjoy some apple picking and apple cider and all the fun things of fall.
1:18
SPEAKER_01: So with fall finally here, it has me thinking about the end of last season, the end of summer, and what summer was like.
1:27
SPEAKER_01: For me, I tend to enter into summer with completely unrealistic expectations of sitting by the poolside with a drink in my hand, well, you know, ice water in hand and a good book in the other, and letting my kids frolic and play and just enjoy and relax the day away.
1:46
SPEAKER_01: Well, we all know that summer is really not like that for most of us.
1:50
SPEAKER_01: Maybe there were a few seasons of life where you did get to live that out, but now it looks a little bit different.
1:57
SPEAKER_01: So one of the things that I've learned to do is evaluate the last season as I enter a new one while it's fresh, while I can think ahead, and I can just take time to internally process what it was that I loved about it and what about that season I didn't like.
2:17
SPEAKER_01: Now you've heard me talk about the Super Summer Challenge before on this program, the intentional parenting tool that my mother-in-law created many years ago and has passed down through the generations.
2:29
SPEAKER_01: And I've created in turn a workshop called Simply Summer, and it's about using that tool and really evaluating our lifestyles and our goals and our vision for our family, and how do you incorporate that into the summer months?
2:45
SPEAKER_01: So in the fall, it's a great time when we've just finally like settled into our new routine and rhythm and we're kind of enjoying the new pace.
2:54
SPEAKER_01: It's to look back in the summer and go, okay, I really loved what we did this summer.
3:02
SPEAKER_01: And maybe there's some things that you go, I really don't want to do that again.
3:06
SPEAKER_01: It was too busy.
3:07
SPEAKER_01: We did too many camps.
3:09
SPEAKER_01: Maybe you didn't do enough camps.
3:11
SPEAKER_01: And what did you um who did you enjoy hanging out with?
3:15
SPEAKER_01: What places did you enjoy going to?
3:18
SPEAKER_01: And maybe you guys got a pool pass but then never ended up using it.
3:22
SPEAKER_01: Or maybe you wish you had gotten a pool pass because you really needed one.
3:26
SPEAKER_01: There's so many variables, and everybody's family and situation and kids and personalities look entirely different.
3:34
SPEAKER_01: So today's podcast has nothing to do with summer or the evaluation of summer, but I just wanted to pop in here as it's kind of the perfect time to take that evaluation and good hard look of what worked well.
3:49
SPEAKER_01: And I've created a easy printable uh to just kind of answer those questions.
3:54
SPEAKER_01: And for those of you who are looking to prepare a super summer challenge for your family next year and to create a Simply Summer, you might find this resource really helpful to evaluate fresh what's what worked and what didn't, and to have it ready come this spring when it's time to create your super summer challenge.
4:13
SPEAKER_01: So to find out more, of course, I put information in the show notes and a link where you can quickly access that free printable or on our website at simply wholehearted.com.
4:24
SPEAKER_01: Today's conversation is with Nathan and Rachel Drinsky.
4:28
SPEAKER_01: I'm really thrilled to be able to share this with you finally.
4:31
SPEAKER_01: We actually had this conversation a while back, just after they got home from their summer vacation.
4:36
SPEAKER_01: It was a fun, relaxed conversation about their adventure and their journey to the Kansas City area from Cincinnati, Ohio.
4:46
SPEAKER_01: They took the invitation given not just from friends and fellow pastors, David and Renata Perkins, but also from the Lord to step into something that was really uncomfortable and pretty scary for them.
5:00
SPEAKER_01: It was a huge risk that they took to leave everything familiar and what they knew well and what was going well to enter into the adventure of church planting an unknown city with lots of unknown people.
5:13
SPEAKER_01: But they have done a beautiful job stepping into leadership role.
5:17
SPEAKER_01: And I know that Nathan and Rachel both wear many different hats of leadership and are um doing such a phenomenal job, discipling and mentoring and creating systems and making sure all the correct spots are filled, but also leading our small group ministry, which I'm personally really involved with.
5:36
SPEAKER_01: So today we're going to talk about their adventure and their lifestyle of intentionality and obedience into the Lord.
5:43
SPEAKER_01: And we're also going to be talking about Nat's book that just came out this year, King Jesus Living with a King in a World of Consultants.
5:52
SPEAKER_01: I know you'll enjoy this conversation, and I look forward to hearing what you think about it.
6:03
SPEAKER_04: Exactly.
6:09
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
6:10
SPEAKER_01: Sounds about right.
6:13
SPEAKER_01: So you guys are vacationed up, ready to go, ready to dive back in.
6:16
SPEAKER_01: Probably your first vacation since you've landed here in Kansas City.
6:19
SPEAKER_05: Uh it's actually our first real vacation since before Isaac was born.
6:23
SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
6:24
SPEAKER_05: Wow, that's fun.
6:25
SPEAKER_00: Which when you're when yeah, before we had children, we vacationed all the time.
6:28
SPEAKER_00: I bet that was like our hobby.
6:30
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but absolutely it was.
6:32
SPEAKER_01: So this last vacation was awesome.
6:34
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, how many years have you guys been married?
6:37
SPEAKER_05: Nine years.
6:37
SPEAKER_05: So we just had our ninth anniversary, June 28th.
6:40
SPEAKER_01: Oh, congratulations.
6:42
SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
6:43
SPEAKER_01: Well, give us a little background on your journey to Kansas City because you've been here about a year.
6:48
SPEAKER_05: Yeah, just over.
6:48
SPEAKER_05: We moved um here a year ago in May, so just over a year now.
6:53
SPEAKER_05: Um Well, so we basically were very happy.
6:56
SPEAKER_05: We were born and raised in Cincinnati.
6:58
SPEAKER_05: We both grew up there, you know, University of Cincinnati alumni.
7:01
SPEAKER_05: I mean, we were Cincinnati through and through.
7:03
SPEAKER_01: Through and through, yeah, for sure.
7:04
SPEAKER_05: Um we were, you know, had a great job working at church, doing what we loved.
7:09
SPEAKER_05: And there was just the sense that there was nothing wrong, but there just it wasn't right at the same time.
7:16
SPEAKER_05: And it was just a lot of wrestling in that season um because we just kept going, okay, is it we're just supposed to, you know, buy a new house?
7:23
SPEAKER_05: Is it something, you know, a big change, but not a massive change.
7:27
SPEAKER_05: And we just couldn't put our thumb on it for the longest time.
7:31
SPEAKER_05: And we would just drive around in the car and just asking and just processing, asking those hard questions, you know, okay, what do we think it is?
7:41
SPEAKER_05: What what do we think the Holy Spirit's whispering to us to to do, or how how is he transitioning us?
7:48
SPEAKER_05: And we invariably would come to the question, okay, what would be the scariest thing God could ever ask us to do?
7:55
SPEAKER_05: And every single time it was go plan a church.
7:59
SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
8:00
SPEAKER_05: And we would be like, No, that's not how God has not called us to do that.
8:04
SPEAKER_03: No way.
8:04
SPEAKER_05: Um But we were like, once you start having that conversation, your mind just and your heart kind of stays there.
8:11
SPEAKER_05: And um, we would ask each other about names, what would we name a church, what where would we want to go, all those different things.
8:18
SPEAKER_05: And we always kept saying radiant church.
8:22
SPEAKER_01: Um that's what you would say.
8:24
SPEAKER_01: That's what we would name it, radiant church.
8:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
8:26
SPEAKER_01: That's ridiculous.
8:27
SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
8:27
SPEAKER_05: So we have um in a good way.
8:28
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, in a good way.
8:30
SPEAKER_05: We pioneered an internship in Cincinnati called um burn, and we founded it on Psalm 34.5 that those who look to the Lord are radiant, their faces are never put to shame.
8:39
SPEAKER_05: Wow.
8:39
SPEAKER_05: Um, so we have this stack full of what we call prophetic hoodies in our closet that says this says literally it says we are radiant.
8:47
SPEAKER_05: Um those who look to them are radiant.
8:49
SPEAKER_05: I mean, all of these random merchandise that say radiant, there's just plastered all over them.
8:55
SPEAKER_05: And then um in November, David called us and said, Hey guys, I'm planning a church.
9:02
SPEAKER_05: He kind of gave us his journey on coming to that decision, and he said, I would love for you guys to pray about coming with us.
9:10
SPEAKER_05: And I said, Well, what are you gonna call it?
9:13
SPEAKER_05: So he said I bought the URL in 2008 that he started telling me the whole story, and then I was like, Well, wait, what URL did you buy?
9:20
SPEAKER_05: What was the what was the actual URL?
9:21
SPEAKER_05: And he said, Radiant Church.
9:22
SPEAKER_05: And I remember the moment I just erupted in laughter.
9:26
SPEAKER_05: Yeah, because I was just in that moment just knew that oh my gosh, God, God's up to something here.
9:32
SPEAKER_05: And um, and David, he's so sweet and so unassuming.
9:35
SPEAKER_05: He's like, Wait, is that a bad name?
9:37
SPEAKER_05: Why are you laughing?
9:39
SPEAKER_05: So then I said, No, not at all.
9:40
SPEAKER_05: Here's our journey, our story in this.
9:44
SPEAKER_05: And then I remember this just hushed, like this pause on the phone.
9:48
SPEAKER_05: It was probably 10 seconds, it felt like an hour.
9:51
SPEAKER_05: And then I remember him saying, Wow, maybe God's up to something here.
9:58
SPEAKER_05: So we got off the phone, I walk inside, and um Rachel looks at me and is like, Who are you talking to?
10:04
SPEAKER_05: You know?
10:04
SPEAKER_05: Um I was like, It's David.
10:06
SPEAKER_05: And she's like, Oh, what did he say?
10:08
SPEAKER_05: What did he have to say?
10:09
SPEAKER_05: And I went, he's playing in a church in Kansas City.
10:14
SPEAKER_05: He wants us to come, and he's gonna name it Radiant Church.
10:19
SPEAKER_05: And she looks at me, I mean, this is the faith of my wife.
10:21
SPEAKER_05: This is so incredible.
10:22
SPEAKER_05: She looks at me and goes, We're going, aren't we?
10:24
SPEAKER_05: Wow.
10:25
SPEAKER_01: And I said, That's cool.
10:26
SPEAKER_05: I think so, but let's uh let's pray about it for at least a m for at least a day or two.
10:31
SPEAKER_01: Right, right, for sure.
10:33
SPEAKER_01: It's a big deal.
10:35
SPEAKER_05: So yeah, so very quickly we jumped in and um and from there we were just going full full board for Radiant.
10:42
SPEAKER_01: So Yeah, that's awesome.
10:43
SPEAKER_01: Because you guys left everything now.
10:45
SPEAKER_01: You have both experienced um you know as some big hardship in your life, um, losing parents, family.
10:53
SPEAKER_01: Um I I think I think it's worth mentioning because there's a seasoning that you both bring to the table um that you guys have experienced and walked through grief in a way that has brought you to the heart of God.
11:05
SPEAKER_01: Um and and just just can't you've experienced him and you've known him and you've seen his faithfulness.
11:11
SPEAKER_01: And so for you guys to leave what precious family you do have there and a family that's also your church family um and you know, security.
11:22
SPEAKER_01: Um and it's worth mentioning that your your wife is a nurse or a uh sorry, a nurse practitioner.
11:30
SPEAKER_01: I love my nurse practitioner, can I just say?
11:33
SPEAKER_01: Um, but you know, like great job and and life, and you guys you guys leave it all behind to come here.
11:40
SPEAKER_00: So how did that feel for you, Rachel?
11:43
SPEAKER_00: I just think that um my personality and just I think just how I was kind of created or just how I was raised is just to take life way too seriously.
11:53
SPEAKER_00: And it gets exhausting.
11:54
SPEAKER_00: And I think that the Lord just through this process um in early in life, um, when I was figuring out like what career path to take or what to do in my life, it was very like very clear.
12:07
SPEAKER_00: I was fortunate that way.
12:08
SPEAKER_00: The Lord was like, do this, go to nursing school, because then I want you to go to grad school.
12:12
SPEAKER_00: And I it was not even on my radar.
12:14
SPEAKER_00: And it was very clear.
12:15
SPEAKER_00: And then throughout the time of just me just again, taking life too seriously in achieve mode, achieve, achieve, achieve, achieve, you know, just how I'm naturally bent.
12:24
SPEAKER_00: That the Lord just kind of shared and and just whispered in my heart this desire of this doesn't have to be, I heard this quote once, like a minefield of like if I do this, then this, and then I have to do this.
12:35
SPEAKER_00: It can just be a dance that's just like open and and you have room to breathe and you can just relax and just let the Lord do his thing.
12:45
SPEAKER_00: And so I think my journey, just moving here and with like just obedience, that yes, it was just you know, hard, fast obedience, but it was more of like a dance, like it's okay, like we can breathe and you can, you know, change jobs that you've that's the only place you've ever worked, of course, you know, because that's my personality.
13:05
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
13:06
SPEAKER_00: And so, you know, we can just do those things.
13:08
SPEAKER_00: And I think that um that it taught me a lot of just listening to the Lord in like the clear and fast ways, but then listening to him just in that whisper of us riding around in the car, yeah, being like, something's not right, but everything's great circumstantially.
13:24
SPEAKER_00: Like, what is it?
13:25
SPEAKER_00: Your job's great, my job's great, our family's great.
13:27
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and just realizing that the Lord can just kind of knit your heart and transition you over in seasons of just obedience on this lovely little dance that can be kind of lighthearted and then get you somewhere totally new, like a new city with the city.
13:42
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's his kindness, right?
13:44
SPEAKER_01: Because I know that for us, we wrestled um with that feeling for quite a while.
13:49
SPEAKER_01: And we we even took it before the Lord because we thought, is this just discontentment?
13:52
SPEAKER_01: Are we just hitting like, you know, a midlife crisis and we're just used to having things change so much and that we're being discontent with what we have?
14:01
SPEAKER_01: And you know, I think I think that was really good for us to ask the question because uh every unsettling is not necessarily the move of God.
14:06
SPEAKER_01: It may be absolutely just re-establishing our heart's focus, but but in that we we discovered we we started asking that question.
14:14
SPEAKER_01: I think that was the important thing.
14:15
SPEAKER_01: Like, Lord, what is this you?
14:16
SPEAKER_01: Is this you stirring something in me?
14:18
SPEAKER_01: What am I missing?
14:20
SPEAKER_01: What is it that you would have for me next?
14:22
SPEAKER_01: Is there something I need to change?
14:23
SPEAKER_01: Right.
14:24
SPEAKER_01: Uh sometimes it's a need to repent too.
14:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
14:26
SPEAKER_01: Um, but but in that whole process, I love how I could see, because for me, a lot of times I thought it was me, like the Lord saying we're going to to move back to Colorado.
14:36
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
14:37
SPEAKER_01: And, you know, so I was sure and I was dead set on that for a long time.
14:41
SPEAKER_01: And then um in his kindness, at the whole time when I he made it clear no, you're not going back to Colorado.
14:48
SPEAKER_01: Um he also brought about Radiant Church and the timing of all of that, which was just his like I I felt like he was saying through that whole process of oh no, this is what I was getting you ready for is to be a part of this new church body and and you know just serve in a different capacity than we had or I had in a long time, and then us as a family and as a couple to be able to step into that was really, really great.
15:11
SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
15:12
SPEAKER_00: I love that.
15:12
SPEAKER_00: I love that you know, obedience is not just like as Christians, it's not just about you know avoiding sin or avoiding all of these things, but just embracing a life that really goes somewhere to establish, you know, making Jesus famous or building his kingdom on the earth, and it's not just a you know, um, a minefield, like I like to say.
15:32
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you know, it is a dance, and I love that.
15:34
SPEAKER_01: So that is awesome.
15:35
SPEAKER_01: So you like the Lord opened up some big doors for you guys to jump through because it wasn't, I mean, you said yes, yes, we would be here, but a lot of pieces had to play because it wasn't just you guys, it's a couple.
15:46
SPEAKER_01: You have two precious little kids sitting over here, which you might hear a little in the background, but that's okay.
15:51
SPEAKER_01: They're coming back from vacation.
15:53
SPEAKER_01: They're cranky.
15:55
SPEAKER_00: Um yeah, and so we did.
15:57
SPEAKER_00: And so I um just really everything as far as we just prayed um for selling our house in Cincinnati.
16:06
SPEAKER_00: We were like, Lord, here's what we would love to get for it.
16:09
SPEAKER_00: Can we get this for it?
16:10
SPEAKER_00: That would be awesome.
16:11
SPEAKER_00: And he's like, Yep.
16:12
SPEAKER_00: It was like the highest sales price of our any home in our neighborhood, which is you know, I get it, it's just monetary.
16:19
SPEAKER_00: But for us, it was like faith.
16:20
SPEAKER_00: It was just like, hey, we're gonna ask him this and see what happens.
16:23
SPEAKER_00: This is fun.
16:24
SPEAKER_00: Cause then it just started to get really fun.
16:25
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
16:26
SPEAKER_00: And so then I was like, okay, Lord, I need a job, and I don't even know if there's a shortage of NPs in Kansas City or not.
16:33
SPEAKER_00: And it turns out there was at the time.
16:36
SPEAKER_00: And so I submitted my application and someone called me back within like four minutes.
16:39
SPEAKER_00: Like it wasn't even five minutes.
16:42
SPEAKER_00: This lady you know, called me back from the HR where I work currently, and then the next day I got like eight other interviews, and they were all set up on the same day.
16:50
SPEAKER_00: I was like, yep.
16:50
SPEAKER_00: So I went for one day and did, you know, like ten interviews or something really ridiculous and exhausting, but it was awesome because in Cincinnati it wouldn't have been that way.
16:59
SPEAKER_00: And um, and then the job I took actually had two physicians that did their last year of training in the group I worked with in Cincinnati.
17:07
SPEAKER_00: Really?
17:08
SPEAKER_00: And so that's the job I took.
17:09
SPEAKER_00: I was in the interview and here comes one of them in, like, hey, I heard you were here, and I was like, Oh, wow.
17:14
SPEAKER_00: Wow Hey, Scott, how's it going?
17:16
SPEAKER_00: You know, and so it was just was really cool.
17:18
SPEAKER_00: Um, all those little things really count a lot.
17:22
SPEAKER_00: And um I think most people ask us, you know, has it been hard?
17:26
SPEAKER_00: Has it been hard?
17:27
SPEAKER_00: Are you lonely?
17:28
SPEAKER_00: All the things, and it's just not because there was instant community here with people such as yourselves and just other people that just it's just it was instant, and so it hasn't been hard.
17:39
SPEAKER_00: And we feel really fortunate about that.
17:41
SPEAKER_01: Kind of finding our people, yeah.
17:43
SPEAKER_01: I think a lot of like-minded, uh light-hearted, you know, yeah people who have gathered for the same vision, yes, um has has been a real blessing, I think, for everybody.
17:53
SPEAKER_01: Even people who've lived here for years like us, um, and we've found a smattering of that, but nothing like you know, sure a couple hundred people to join together with and and yeah, you know, partner together.
18:05
SPEAKER_04: We were here four years before we had it found it.
18:07
SPEAKER_04: So four years of homeless.
18:10
SPEAKER_04: I felt spiritually homeless for about four years, and it was not fun.
18:13
SPEAKER_04: So I'm thrilled after you are it makes a huge difference to have have your people.
18:17
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
18:19
SPEAKER_01: So in the midst of moving and starting a church and re-establishing, Nathan, you decide to write a book.
18:25
SPEAKER_01: You gotta give us some background on it.
18:28
SPEAKER_05: So I'm I'm an avid reader.
18:30
SPEAKER_00: I love reading and mostly books by dead people.
18:33
SPEAKER_00: Yes, yes, I'm reading.
18:35
SPEAKER_00: Those are mine, really good.
18:37
SPEAKER_05: Mostly, yes.
18:38
SPEAKER_05: Diversifying myself all the time.
18:41
SPEAKER_05: Mostly good.
18:42
SPEAKER_01: Um, it's good.
18:48
SPEAKER_01: There's so much wisdom though, but you know it's good if they hold their weight, you know.
18:52
SPEAKER_05: There is, yeah.
18:53
SPEAKER_01: Through many lifetimes.
18:54
SPEAKER_05: Uh yeah, truth is just timeless.
18:56
SPEAKER_05: Yes.
18:57
SPEAKER_05: So you can read a C.S.
18:58
SPEAKER_05: Lewis book and it's just as pertinent today as it was when he wrote it 40 years ago.
19:03
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
19:04
SPEAKER_05: So um so I'm an avid reader, I love reading, and I've always um had this innate desire to do something um kingdom-wise that would just kind of craft a legacy.
19:14
SPEAKER_05: And I the one reason I love books, even probably more so than um live teaching or anything like that, is that it's uh timeless.
19:24
SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
19:24
SPEAKER_05: I mean, the fact that I do read books written by these spiritual giants from, you know, Lewis to Tozer to Spurgeon to you know Bounds, you know, all of these great works of literature that were written some a hundred years ago and they're still available in print and you can still have them.
19:43
SPEAKER_05: And that's just that to me, that speaks to the longevity of legacy and that when you do something for the kingdom that ideally it would be something that reached past even your own lifespan.
19:53
SPEAKER_05: I saw a tweet, I think it was from uh Willie George of all people um the other day that what God is doing in your life or in your generation should go beyond your generation.
20:05
SPEAKER_05: And um it was just this beautiful reminder to me that you know I'll be able to hand this book to my kids or my grandkids and they're gonna know my heart on a a subject matter or even you know the reach of it that you know if it goes wherever whoever reads it and however it impacts, that'll go keep happening even beyond when I when I've left this earth and all of that.
20:28
SPEAKER_05: And the appeal of that I think was what really drew me into that writing process.
20:34
SPEAKER_05: Um so that's why I wanted to write a book.
20:37
SPEAKER_05: Um but then Rachel and I, we would just have these conversations just perpetually about this idea, whether it was a sermon I prepared that was somehow along these lines or um whatever it was, and we just kept having these conversations, and I just kept we just kept feeling like there was this is more than just a sermon.
20:55
SPEAKER_05: This is more than just a sermon series.
20:58
SPEAKER_05: Yeah, um that there's more to it.
21:00
SPEAKER_05: It's it's so robust that I think there is you can just build upon this.
21:04
SPEAKER_05: Um finally one day I was like, you know what?
21:08
SPEAKER_05: This has been on my heart long enough to where it's one of those things where I'm just gonna I'm gonna go for it and see what happens.
21:14
SPEAKER_05: Who knows where it will end up, who knows if it'll finish, who knows if it'll um be published, who knows if any of those things will happen.
21:22
SPEAKER_05: But for my part, I just need to be obedient to that.
21:25
SPEAKER_05: Again, the inkling of the Holy Spirit.
21:27
SPEAKER_05: And um just I just go for it.
21:29
SPEAKER_05: So that's that's why I started to write about it.
21:32
SPEAKER_01: That's okay.
21:33
SPEAKER_01: Okay, so we you ended up landing on King Jesus, living with a king in a world of consultants.
21:38
unknown: Yeah.
21:39
SPEAKER_01: I I I really love the title because I I get I think I get where you're going with this, but kind of share some of your heart and your vision behind uh going in this direction.
21:47
SPEAKER_05: Absolutely.
21:48
SPEAKER_05: Um so one of my favorite uh passages in the entire Bible is the uh the story that Jesus talks about, the the rich young rulers, that interaction that he has.
21:57
SPEAKER_05: And this young man who was rich, who was influenced.
22:00
SPEAKER_05: He was young.
22:01
SPEAKER_05: He comes to Jesus and says, Hey, what do I need to do to enter inherit internal life?
22:06
SPEAKER_05: And Jesus just tells him real quickly, Hey, do this, do this, do this.
22:08
SPEAKER_05: And he's like, I've done all of those.
22:10
SPEAKER_05: What else can I do?
22:10
SPEAKER_05: Jesus responds as he looks at him, he loves him, and he says, Sell everything you have and come follow me.
22:16
SPEAKER_05: And the rich man goes away sorrowful.
22:19
SPEAKER_05: And it's just that dynamic so just grabbed my heart in such a real way.
22:24
SPEAKER_05: Um Rachel actually would pick on me because I would talk about it so frequently.
22:28
SPEAKER_05: Um, here you go, here comes the rich young ruler story again.
22:33
SPEAKER_05: Um, but what happened was I just believe that as in reading that and and marinating on that story for so long, um, the reality came into play that why didn't he listen to Jesus?
22:45
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
22:45
SPEAKER_05: I mean, he came to Jesus as a you know a spiritual advisor essentially, but then he didn't take his advice.
22:54
SPEAKER_05: Why?
22:55
SPEAKER_05: It was because of the his lens and how he was viewing Jesus that he was viewing him just as a spiritual consultant versus a king.
23:04
SPEAKER_05: Because when you look at Peter, when you look at John, when you look at these uneducated, ordinary fishermen, when they saw Jesus and Jesus told them to do something, but they did it.
23:14
SPEAKER_05: Now they may have messed up royally doing it, right?
23:17
SPEAKER_05: But they did it.
23:18
SPEAKER_05: And then yet here is this rich, affluent, powerful man, and he doesn't do it.
23:24
SPEAKER_05: And the reality just kind of set in that it's because he was viewing Jesus as a consultant versus a king.
23:30
SPEAKER_05: And I think in our day and age in Western society, we are so used to having consultants and people give us suggestions all the time.
23:38
SPEAKER_05: We're not used to people giving us commands and a king decreeing things that we must do in our lives.
23:46
SPEAKER_05: Um so that's really where the topic was birthed out of, and that's really where we kind of settled on this concept.
23:52
SPEAKER_00: And I think I'm just kind of looking through a few things, but uh one of the things in here is I I totally agree with is just that we maintain only a token obedience to him as as long as it aligns with our desires or worldview.
24:05
SPEAKER_00: And we're all guilty of that because naturally we process information and we decide if we agree or not and if we're going to act on it or not.
24:14
SPEAKER_00: And um I think one of the verses like I love, where it's King David, where he just says, you know, I won't I let's hear, I won't give hold on, sorry.
24:25
SPEAKER_00: Where he says, um, I will not offer burnt offerings to the Lord my God that cost me nothing.
24:32
SPEAKER_00: And I think that there's something when you push yourself to obey in some area that actually costs you something, whether it's costs you praying through an attitude problem with a person or cost you something physically, um, obviously that can hurt sometimes.
24:50
SPEAKER_00: But I I want to give the Lord something that was costly to me because we've all gotten to a place where we gave something that was costly at one point and then we grow and then we realize it doesn't really cost me much anymore.
25:02
SPEAKER_00: I've adjusted in life, it's comfortable.
25:04
SPEAKER_00: And I think what's challenging is that we all challenge ourselves to say, okay, what's something that would cost me now?
25:11
SPEAKER_00: What's something that would hurt?
25:12
SPEAKER_00: Not hurt, not hurt in a horrible way, but hurt in enough that's saying, I'm going to give you something.
25:19
SPEAKER_00: And um, I I love that.
25:21
SPEAKER_00: I want to be per I want to pursue God that way.
25:24
SPEAKER_00: Do I always know?
25:25
SPEAKER_00: But I want to say, my attitude really stinks about this.
25:29
SPEAKER_00: I need to, I need to push past it.
25:32
SPEAKER_00: This is gonna cost me some heart work here that I'm gonna need to invest in you.
25:36
SPEAKER_00: We're on and on, even how much we give, you know, no one likes to talk about money stuff that way, but I'm not afraid to do that.
25:41
SPEAKER_00: That is true.
25:42
SPEAKER_00: But you know, you adjust and you're like, oh, I can give this.
25:44
SPEAKER_00: That's what I gave last year.
25:45
SPEAKER_00: We know we can do that.
25:46
SPEAKER_00: Okay, well, what else?
25:47
SPEAKER_00: Who else is hurting around me?
25:48
SPEAKER_00: You know, what else is going on that maybe we could sacrifice something?
25:52
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
25:52
SPEAKER_00: And I would rather live a life that's more beautiful in that sense than you know, I think we all would, but yeah, we then it's just encouraging ourselves to do that.
26:02
SPEAKER_01: I I really like how you know you liken it to consultants, and I was also thinking the term coaches because and this is not an octocoach, yeah, coaches at all, because I think they're invaluable, but I think kind of like you said, we pick and choose.
26:15
SPEAKER_01: Um, we might pick a a coach for our business, but we wouldn't dare pick a coach for our health.
26:20
SPEAKER_01: Right.
26:21
SPEAKER_01: Because no one better go there.
26:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
26:25
SPEAKER_01: Our finances, you know, or we all pick we all kind of pick and choose.
26:28
SPEAKER_01: Whereas Christ is like, no, I'm I'm here to tell you about everything.
26:33
SPEAKER_01: I'm here to be in the center of everything and direct everything you're doing and not just give you a good idea or a good suggestion or a little elbow, hey, you know, you should really, you know, check this out.
26:43
SPEAKER_01: It's it's like, no, actually, this is the way you need to go.
26:47
SPEAKER_01: This is how you should walk in it.
26:49
SPEAKER_01: Not just for his benefit, but also for ours, you know, along the way too.
26:54
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
26:54
SPEAKER_01: I think that's really good.
26:56
SPEAKER_01: I love it.
26:56
SPEAKER_05: Absolutely.
26:57
SPEAKER_05: I think one of the uh things that struck me is just that you know, essentially that obedience is the currency of the kingdom.
27:04
SPEAKER_05: So if we want to, you know, store up a currency or treasure in heaven, faith is obedience.
27:13
SPEAKER_05: Because if you're not obedient to what he's commanding you, you don't really have faith in what he's telling you.
27:18
SPEAKER_05: Um so just that link of I think all of us want to build that spiritual equity and the the processes that it's obedience.
27:27
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, even obedience in small things.
27:29
SPEAKER_00: And I think that there's no small task that God gives us.
27:33
SPEAKER_00: We just minimize that task in our mind, whether it's serving in some small area or quiet moments that no one sees with our kids or with our spouses or in relationship that just with him and him and us or between us, that it's no small, you know, there's no small assignments.
27:51
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
27:52
SPEAKER_00: And I have to remind myself of that.
27:54
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
27:55
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
27:56
SPEAKER_04: I think that's where it really matters too, because it's easy to put on a good face to I don't know, stand on a on the platform on Sunday morning and deliver a sermon or whatever that you spend all week or two or whatever working on.
28:06
SPEAKER_04: But then at home, you know, kids are having a meltdown or your husband, you know, you're having a little disagreement or who knows what it is.
28:13
SPEAKER_04: But it it's in those small things I think that exposes it really exposes the heart absolutely where we are.
28:19
SPEAKER_04: So we like to minimize those things, but sometimes that's where the I don't know, it's where you see the fruit.
28:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think where it can count the most.
28:26
SPEAKER_01: For sure.
28:27
SPEAKER_01: I love it.
28:28
SPEAKER_01: Well, as you um share more about this book and as you're thinking about well, as you probably wrote it and who you're thinking about it, because you did um youth ministry for a time and then associate pastor, and then here you're in an associate pastor capacity.
28:43
SPEAKER_01: So you've kind of you know, you covered the gamut here.
28:46
SPEAKER_01: So when you as you wrote the book, who came to mind as who you're writing it for in your audience and and all that sort of thing.
28:54
SPEAKER_05: In reality, I think the the key demographic is just the the the Christian who's not satisfied.
29:01
SPEAKER_05: Whether that's you know, you're sixteen, seventeen years old, whether that's you're in your twenties and you're grappling with larger decisions of who you you're gonna marry, what you're gonna do career-wise, where you're gonna live.
29:12
SPEAKER_05: Or even if you're, you know, 35, 45, and you're in the the minutiae of life and that you're trying to find the beauty of the ordinary because your life is not set, but it kinda is, and that you've you made all those major decisions.
29:29
SPEAKER_05: Who just wants to be a little bit more reckless in their obedience.
29:33
SPEAKER_05: And I think that's the beauty of following Jesus, is where we can offer that reckless obedience to him, but then our life all of a sudden it it becomes a little more flourishing.
29:43
SPEAKER_05: You get to see the beauty of the ordinary, you get to see that even when your kids, like you said, are going crazy and it's one of those mornings or days or weeks even, you can see the beauty of the fruit and the things that are happening in your life and that.
29:58
SPEAKER_05: Um so I would say just uh the person who just wants to live a little bit more obedient.
30:04
SPEAKER_01: That's great.
30:05
SPEAKER_01: Now for you guys, you have admitted that you did the scariest thing so far.
30:12
SPEAKER_01: The scariest thing you could do is go plant a church.
30:14
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
30:15
SPEAKER_01: So you guys are still pretty young.
30:18
SPEAKER_01: You've got plenty of life left.
30:19
SPEAKER_01: So what's the gonna be the new scary thing?
30:23
SPEAKER_00: Oh boy.
30:25
SPEAKER_05: Do you want to take that one?
30:26
SPEAKER_05: I have no idea.
30:27
SPEAKER_00: For me, it would be like having more than one other child.
30:30
SPEAKER_00: I think that's the next one.
30:33
SPEAKER_00: If we are completely outnumbered to a more degree, that would be very scary.
30:38
SPEAKER_00: Gotcha reason to make it.
30:41
SPEAKER_00: That's what it's amazing.
30:43
SPEAKER_00: That's my personal.
30:46
SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
30:46
SPEAKER_00: We'll have to see what else the Lord brings to mind.
30:49
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
30:50
SPEAKER_00: That's funny.
30:51
SPEAKER_01: He's been kind though and like settled in a little bit.
30:55
SPEAKER_00: Man on man defense here.
30:56
SPEAKER_00: So we'll see.
30:58
SPEAKER_00: And it's not really awesome.
30:59
SPEAKER_00: No, I think um, I think for anybody, I just want to live a life that where you feel fully alive.
31:06
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
31:06
SPEAKER_00: And we've all had seasons where we don't feel as alive, and then seasons where we do, and we think, oh, this is great.
31:12
SPEAKER_00: I feel alive.
31:13
SPEAKER_00: And so I think whatever circumstances come, as long as I can just focus on what's important and feel fully alive in him, then I think I'll be okay.
31:26
SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
31:28
SPEAKER_05: I think for me, it's just I want to look at my life and know that I'm being faithful.
31:32
SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
31:33
SPEAKER_05: I just wanna I wanna be that good steward that Jesus talks about, that with whatever talents he's chosen to give me, whether it's one, five, ten, like anywhere along the spectrum, I want to look at it and go, I've been faithful with what he's put in my hands to be faithful with.
31:48
SPEAKER_05: Um and really no more, no less.
31:50
SPEAKER_05: That's really what I want.
31:52
SPEAKER_05: Um and I think that's where you know you have the most fun too.
31:56
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's true.
31:57
SPEAKER_01: It is an adventure.
31:59
SPEAKER_01: That's for sure.
32:00
SPEAKER_01: It keeps us honest on our toes.
32:03
SPEAKER_01: Well, okay, so maybe someday we'll see some more books from you as you continue to read dead authors.
32:10
SPEAKER_00: Mostly dead authors.
32:11
SPEAKER_00: As long as he stays alive, I don't care.
32:14
SPEAKER_01: This is true.
32:18
SPEAKER_01: No, we got he's got a map.
32:24
SPEAKER_01: Um, but besides people, you know, coming and checking out Radiant Church in Kansas City, what are some other ways that people could connect with you?
32:32
SPEAKER_01: And they can find your book on Amazon.
32:33
SPEAKER_01: We'll make sure we put the book in the show notes and all the links there and all that sort of stuff.
32:38
SPEAKER_01: But I don't know.
32:39
SPEAKER_01: We're on Facebook, got a website.
32:42
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we're uh This was on the questions that you never got.
32:47
SPEAKER_01: I try to prepare people, but if you don't get my questions, no worries.
32:51
SPEAKER_05: Um, yeah, so the book's available everywhere BarnesandNoble.com, Amazon.com, any major distributor.
32:57
SPEAKER_05: Um and then we're on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, um at Nate Dorinsky at all of them.
33:04
SPEAKER_01: And then um easy to find no one had taken your name before you got to it, yeah.
33:08
SPEAKER_05: Dorinsky is a pretty unique name.
33:09
SPEAKER_05: I don't I usually don't have to struggle too hard to get a good uh get a good URL.
33:14
SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
33:15
SPEAKER_01: I love it.
33:16
SPEAKER_01: So did you enjoy the book writing process?
33:18
SPEAKER_05: I did.
33:19
SPEAKER_05: It was probably the most difficult thing I've done in my life, which I enjoy.
33:23
SPEAKER_05: I really am challenge-oriented.
33:26
SPEAKER_04: Yep.
33:26
SPEAKER_05: Um so I really enjoyed that part of it.
33:29
SPEAKER_05: I loved how hard it was.
33:31
SPEAKER_04: Did you enjoy writing previously, or is this just I know you're a reader, sometimes those go together, sometimes they do not.
33:37
SPEAKER_04: Your wife is shaking her head.
33:38
SPEAKER_05: She's shaking my head because I previously struggled with English uh substantially in college.
33:45
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, a lot of tutoring in college.
33:47
SPEAKER_00: That's okay.
33:47
SPEAKER_00: Taught them how to write really good run-on sentences.
33:50
SPEAKER_04: They were awesome run-on sentences.
33:52
SPEAKER_04: I like a good run-on sentence.
33:54
SPEAKER_00: Are you are you an editor, Rachel?
33:55
SPEAKER_05: Um, just a lot of sense.
33:59
SPEAKER_01: I know who to go.
34:00
SPEAKER_01: No, just a little bit.
34:01
SPEAKER_01: She's great.
34:02
SPEAKER_05: It was so awesome to have her read through things because she knows what's in my heart, but then she also is reading it with fresh eyes so that she can go, you're not articulating what you're intending it to say.
34:15
SPEAKER_05: Yes.
34:16
SPEAKER_05: So that was really fantastic.
34:16
SPEAKER_05: That was that is good.
34:18
SPEAKER_05: That was a crucial part for me.
34:19
SPEAKER_01: Did you use any apps or did you just get old Word and you typed or and all that sort of thing?
34:24
SPEAKER_05: Um, I used Word for a lot of it.
34:26
SPEAKER_05: Um I'm a huge fan of an app called Evernote.
34:29
SPEAKER_05: It's a free app.
34:30
SPEAKER_05: And it just um helps me stay organized.
34:32
SPEAKER_05: It's basically my file cabinet for everything in life.
34:35
SPEAKER_05: So I would essentially um if it was on Twitter or you know, anywhere if I found any kind of quote that I loved, I just kept a notebook essentially for um I just call it tweets to keep.
34:49
SPEAKER_05: And um, I just have it automatically, if I like a tweet, it automatically goes into that notebook for me.
34:54
SPEAKER_05: And then I can just search this in my world.
34:57
SPEAKER_05: Yeah, this is fantastic.
34:58
SPEAKER_05: So then I could just go through and search based on each chapter.
35:02
SPEAKER_05: If I was looking for a particular quote, I could find one there.
35:04
SPEAKER_05: Um I use that.
35:06
SPEAKER_05: I used um Kindle iBooks because if you highlight and mark up stuff, you can search it later.
35:12
SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
35:12
SPEAKER_05: So those were those are the big ones.
35:15
SPEAKER_01: Man, I need more C in my life.
35:20
SPEAKER_01: I could glean like two.
35:24
SPEAKER_01: We can't we can't be everything, right?
35:25
SPEAKER_04: We can't be as great as Jesus.
35:28
SPEAKER_04: I don't have much of that at all.
35:30
SPEAKER_04: Come to my home.
35:31
SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
35:31
SPEAKER_01: Well, then obviously it sounds like you got a good system placed.
35:34
SPEAKER_01: There might be more coming from you in the meantime.
35:36
SPEAKER_01: So, but in the meantime, we can also um I know you have a couple sermons up on the Radiant Church um podcast if people want to hear some more of your heart and the vision and get some good wisdom.
35:47
SPEAKER_01: That'd be a great place to start.
35:48
SPEAKER_01: We'll also put that in the show notes.
35:50
SPEAKER_01: But thank you guys for coming in and coming like post-vocation, jumping right in here and worries they said flip-flops.
36:02
SPEAKER_03: Exactly, uniform.
36:04
SPEAKER_01: And excuse me if there's two people.
36:17
SPEAKER_01: And to see over the last year of all that he has done with their faithfulness and their obedience.
36:23
SPEAKER_01: I hope you'll be sure and check out his new book.
36:25
SPEAKER_01: You can find it on Amazon and buy it today.
36:27
SPEAKER_01: It's called King Jesus, Living with the King in a World of Consultants, written by Nathan Drinsky.
36:34
SPEAKER_01: I'll be sure and put the links in the show notes so you can find out more about it for yourself.
36:40
SPEAKER_01: Also, remember about the summer evaluation.
36:43
SPEAKER_01: If that would be helpful to you while it's still fresh in your mind of how it went for your family, I hope that you will take the time to print that off and just answer a few questions and then keep it tucked in your notebook and day planner.
36:56
SPEAKER_01: So when spring comes around and you're thinking about all the summer plans and summer camps and trips that you need to take, you'll be able to help use that and remember, oh yeah, this worked or this didn't work.
37:08
SPEAKER_01: A couple other podcasts that I thought I would mention that are simply wholehearted podcasts that are similar to this one if you enjoy this conversation, which um actually happens to be all within the family in a way within the Radiant Church family.
37:25
SPEAKER_01: The first one is Dan and Amy Perkins, and that one is episode 10, and they share about their journey here to Kansas City and also Radiant Intensive, which is a program for young adults who want to come and learn how to do ministry and community while still living the normal college age or career life.
37:47
SPEAKER_01: Another one that I loved is probably still one of my favorites, and it's the conversation with Hal and Debbie Perkins.
37:53
SPEAKER_01: They are, um, and that one's episode 17.
37:56
SPEAKER_01: They are incredible people.
37:59
SPEAKER_01: Soft spoken, as you'll tell, the audio is a little bit, you'll have to turn it to the loudest um possible to hear Hal and Debbie speak as clearly as possible because you don't want to miss a word.
38:10
SPEAKER_01: And about um during that conversation, they give some just great insight and wisdom and parenting and um just ideas too as we navigate um the best and most important job we'll ever do as parents.
38:26
SPEAKER_01: Uh, they have a book as well, which we talk about in the podcast, and attach that episode.
38:30
SPEAKER_01: I have another free printable called Conversation Starters, and I just wrote out a few of the prompts that Hal and Debbie talked about that they used with their kids when they were trying to get to the heart of the matter and direct their kids to see really what it was that Jesus wanted to tell them ultimately, not just what mom and dad thought was a good idea or even to listen to their own voice, but what the Bible had to say about their life and their issues and their needs.
38:57
SPEAKER_01: So be sure and listen to episode 17 if you haven't already.
39:02
SPEAKER_01: Another book that I would like to recommend to you that I read this summer is called Rhythms of Rest.
39:09
SPEAKER_01: We're going to air an episode, a conversation with Shelly Miller, who's the author of Rhythms of Rest, Finding the Spirit of Sabbath in a busy world, right after Thanksgiving.
39:21
SPEAKER_01: We decided to do a conversation pertaining to the concept of rest and sabbath in one of the busiest times of year.
39:28
SPEAKER_01: Man, for us it's a real hustle.
39:31
SPEAKER_01: Um, we have family birthdays and tons of travel and trips and work parties and you know, end-of-the-year school stuff, and just so many things happening all in like one short amount of time.
39:42
SPEAKER_01: And I knew that her book really ministered to me just in this stage of life and how I could enter more into what the Lord is offering and the invitation of rest, even in the harried pace that we all tend to keep, at least I'm guilty of keeping for sure.
39:58
SPEAKER_01: So I knew that I needed to hear what she would have to say entering into the holiday season and how we can just take the invitation of abiding that the Lord gives to us.
40:07
SPEAKER_01: So I'm really looking forward to that.
40:09
SPEAKER_01: It was a wonderful conversation.
40:10
SPEAKER_01: I'm looking forward to sharing that with you at the end of November.
40:14
SPEAKER_01: But in the meantime, you can definitely get her book.
40:16
SPEAKER_01: It's available on Amazon and Kindle and Paperback.
40:19
SPEAKER_01: And again, it's written by Shelly Miller and it's Rhythms of Rest, Finding the Spirit of Sabbath in a busy world.
40:28
SPEAKER_01: Again, I so appreciate when you all send me an email or a message or just stop me in person to tell me what a blessing this podcast has been to you.
40:37
SPEAKER_01: Ashley and I are really enjoying the conversations that we get to have and just sharing these wholehearted um stories and lives that people are leading.
40:47
SPEAKER_01: And we hope that is an encouragement and a blessing to you.
40:50
SPEAKER_01: And if you have enjoyed it, would you do us a favor and would you leave a little rating on iTunes, the five-star rating, with just a comment of what it was that you liked or your favorite episode?
41:00
SPEAKER_01: This really helps other people as they're looking for new things to add to their playlist, their podcast playlist, what they might enjoy and listen to, and what to expect when they join in the conversation.
41:11
SPEAKER_01: So until next time, we hope that you find more ways to live simply, wholehearted, unplugged, purposeful, and intentional.