Latest / The Immutable Word / EP029 Why Charlie Kirk's Death Moved a Nation: Faith, Free Speech, and an Open Door

Transcript

EP029 Why Charlie Kirk's Death Moved a Nation: Faith, Free Speech, and an Open Door · The Immutable Word

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It is not my job to overthrow a government that took away my Second Amendment rights.
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It is not my job to spit in the face of a bad boss because I don't like him
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and he doesn't pay me enough.
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It is God who will right every wrong.
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That's what that passage is telling me. And that is exactly why Charlie Kirk was humble.
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That's why he tried to show the
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utmost respect, because he was actually honoring the God who saved him.
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Music.
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And he wanted to present truth in a clear and humble way that would reach people.
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And that, I believe, is why so many people are moved by his assassination and
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all the events that surround him.
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Welcome back to The Immutable Word. Robert and I are back in the studio,
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garage, cave, whatever you want to call it.
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These last couple of weeks have
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been pretty hectic. We're in the month of September, and I know, Robert,
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you've been doing a lot of school—well, you teach at the college,
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so you create a lot of the school content and the curriculums and also do Bible studies.
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Plus we have the podcast, plus you have the prison ministry,
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plus you've got probably several other things that don't come to mind.
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So this is a topic that we wanted to talk about for the last couple of weeks.
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Being in September, I'm sure everybody who's listening knows about the assassination of Charlie Kirk.
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And we just wanted to talk about that because it really made a profound impact on both believers,
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Christians, non-believers, and the reaction is certainly worth talking about
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and maybe some of the meaning.
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So I think there's a couple different directions that we can go.
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But my initial thoughts on this is, if I were to simplify this as best I can,
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is people might be asking, like, why did they kill Charlie Kirk?
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And it was simply due to his words.
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Nothing more, nothing less. It's not something he did. He
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was very respectful in his discourse I
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know that he was a Christian He had a
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testimony of believing on Christ And also proclaimed Jesus Christ Which is a
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blessing But he just died for his words And it's a profound impact And I think
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it created a pause among people Especially young people The impact that it's had.
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That's probably a pretty scary moment in our recent history, wouldn't you say? Yeah.
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At the end of the day, what happens is, you know, as far as being killed,
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you know, because of his words, he wasn't.
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A power mogul you know he wasn't uh
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he wasn't in congress he wasn't a
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political figure even though he talked about politics he
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moved politics he exemplified the fact that you know you can make a difference
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with your words and your ideas and of course his his whole thrust in in the
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aim of his organization turning point usa was to create a place where you can
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dialogue you can talk You can discuss,
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you can debate and agree or disagree like gentlemen or like a human being without,
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you know, resorting to violence, ironically.
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Right. And so the Bible talks a lot about that kind of stuff.
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You know, it talks about words being like arrows and so forth and so on.
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And it's funny because I think it represents a power that you can articulate
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and argue well and defend.
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And that's one thing if you listen to Charlie Kirk is he knew how to engage
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in debate. He knew how to challenge the worldview of a lot of these students.
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And his whole aim at the end of the day was, and when he first started as Turning
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Point, at least, you know, Turning Point USA, at least was from my understanding
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is he wanted to reach the younger people.
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He wanted to reach college age kids, you know, high school kids,
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college age kids, because of what they were being indoctrinated in the college campuses, right?
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He wanted to counter that and challenge the ideas that these kids are being indoctrinated.
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And, you know, he said some things that obviously rubbed certain people wrong.
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So the way that I looked at the whole, you know, my, my kind of summarization of it was.
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You openly assassinated somebody because of their freedom of speech,
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because of they exercising their liberty of conscience and their freedom of speech.
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That's what they did, which is a violation of our Constitution.
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Essentially, it brought us back
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over almost 250 years right prior to the ratification of our Constitution.
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We lived under a time called the Articles of Confederation. And during that
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time, you know, we're Baptists.
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You and I, we're Bible-believing Baptists.
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And it was our Baptist forefathers that died, persecuted, were driven out of
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some of these territories, the states at that time, because of their religious belief.
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Yeah. I mean, here on American soil before it was the United States.
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Almost, I think it was, I can't remember the time frame, but it was over 100
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years from the time of the Articles of the Confederacy.
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Well, if you take 1620, let's just say landing at Plymouth Rock, right?
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And our Constitution was ratified 1782?
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I can't remember the date. So 89. Check my history.
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But so you're talking about 1620 to 1789, let's just say, that's 169 years that
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our Baptist brethren were persecuted for religious conviction because of their
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religious— Simply what they thought.
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—their conscientious opinion. That's really at the end of the day.
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So what happened to Charlie Kirk—,
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I think the paradigm shift is the fact that, you know, you go to,
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now people have been assassinated. Okay.
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Some of it has been politically motivated. You know, presidents have been assassinated,
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Martin Luther King, John F.K.
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You know, we think about these, these great assassinations that have happened,
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but here's a man that was literally trying to engage college age students on a college campus.
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And all he was doing was debating. He was, like you said, he was giving them the mic.
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He was giving people, like he wasn't trying to oppress speech.
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He wasn't trying to oppress anybody.
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What kind of a person that's trying to oppress speech gives his enemy the mic
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and gives them an open forum to discuss their ideas and explain why they believe what they believe?
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And both present their arguments in a respectful manner.
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Right. And, well, just to go back a little bit before we move on,
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but I knew of Charlie Kirk.
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I've seen, you know, the clips that just often pop up from time to time.
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You often see him in a college campus having those discussions.
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And I think it's interesting now looking back, because I'm starting to see like,
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you know, wow, he was bold.
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It took a lot of boldness to go on a campus of all places where they're teaching
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these young generations to be intolerant,
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even though they say they preach tolerance and, you know, hate.
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And when I think about that, just defining what hate is, hate is suppressing the truth.
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And anyways, he was just there, the truth is objective, and he was just talking
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about the truth and representing the truth, and that's all he was doing, and he died for it. But,
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Yeah, I mean, we talked about going back a couple hundred years where they were
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persecuted just for what they believed
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and what they've said or what they preached. Right. It was illegal.
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It was illegal. What he was doing would have been illegal 250 years ago. Yeah.
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So, people don't understand that in this country.
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People were arrested here. Right, they were arrested. They were fined.
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I mean, they were fined for not having a license to preach. Matter of fact,
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Baptists were not allowed to marry.
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They could not marry because they had to get a license to marry.
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And the only way you can get a license to marry, like say, for example,
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when you're in Massachusetts, you had to confess as a Protestant.
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You had to be part of a state church. Yeah, you had to be part of a state church, state-run church.
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And you had to profess, you confess as a Protestant and then pay for a license.
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And of course, that's a violation of Scripture. You know, Jesus Christ,
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you know, they brought him a coin one time and they said, you know,
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hey, should we pay our taxes to Caesar?
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And of course, the Jews didn't want to pay taxes to Caesar.
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So they were trying to trap him because they wanted to make him an enemy of the state.
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And obviously, Jesus Christ brilliantly responded and said, bring me a coin.
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And he said, whose image and superscription is on the coin? They go, oh, Caesar.
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He goes, okay, render therefore to Caesar whatever Caesar's and render to God what's God's.
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So what he does, what he just did when he said that is Jesus Christ drew a line
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in the sand and said, there is, there are two things at play here.
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There's the state, there's Caesar, and there's what you owe God.
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Which is your conscience, your conscientious liberty to worship God as you please
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or respond or interact with your God as you please.
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The state cannot dictate what's God's, and God was going to leave the state to the state.
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So that's where we get the idea of separation church and state,
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meaning that the state cannot dictate to the person how he should exercise his conscience.
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So Jesus Christ laid that out as a fundamental, this is what our Baptist brethren read.
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They read those passages and they understood the state should have no part in it.
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So all they were doing was exercising their free speech, you know,
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and eventually the formation of our First Amendment was because of a Baptist preacher.
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Yeah, we wouldn't have one if it wasn't for John Leland.
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Yeah, John Leland. He was a major part. Exactly. He was talking to James Madison.
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James Madison was trying to get his votes. They needed Virginia's support in
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order to ratify it, and it was because of John Leland ensuring,
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like, hey, we won't support it unless we have— Without a First Amendment,
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without a free speech amendment.
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And this is what happened, just really quickly, persecution in America,
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Obadiah Holmes, you know Obadiah, right?
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So he was whipped for holding a prayer meeting.
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He, in court, he was told— He was whipped because he either had a choice.
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He could either pay the fine for preaching illegally in Massachusetts or receive punishment.
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And he received the punishment. And he says, I'm not going to pay a tax for
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it. He was whipped there in Boston Commons.
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And people walk there every single day, probably not even realizing what happened there to this guy.
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In court, he was told, you have denied infant baptism. You deserve to die. Yep. Oh, yeah.
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Many of our Baptist brethren, the Anabaptists, especially like in Switzerland
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and areas like that, in Geneva and places where in Europe,
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they were drowned because they refused to accept infant baptism. They were drowned.
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They were killed because they did not accept a baby being baptized.
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Think about that. This is the kind of conscientious objection that our Baptist
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forefathers lived with for hundreds of years under religious domination and state church.
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So the fundamental—I mean, we're talking about Charlie Kirk here.
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But the idea here is that what Charlie Kirk was doing was exercising the rights
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that our Baptist forefathers were able to bring to this country.
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That's all he was doing. And he was killed because of this. He was killed because of that.
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So, so that, but I was going to say this about Charlie Kirk.
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So when he first started, obviously it was very political because he wanted
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to win back the hearts and minds of, of young people for their country.
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He wanted them to love what this country stood for. Okay.
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And the longer his, you know, I would call it a ministry now,
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considering what he did and his influence, but the longer that he engaged in
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these meetings on campuses,
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you started seeing his faith come out stronger and stronger and stronger.
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What you heard was Charlie Kirk often support and advocate for his religious
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belief, his belief that Jesus Christ was Lord, that you needed to be a Christian.
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The most important decision a
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person had to make in this life was to trust Jesus Christ as their Savior.
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So, you know, he was very bold. Now, does he believe everything,
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you know, you and I believe theologically?
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No, but that doesn't matter. He was saved. My understanding is he got saved,
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I think, when he was in fifth grade. He made a profession of faith.
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And he was pretty clear about it. Yeah, he has a clear testimony, a salvation testimony.
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He was pretty clear about it. So, you know, at the outset, you know,
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in this conversation, you and I started talking about this.
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You know one we wanted to kind of like just
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talk about who charlie kirk was and at least from what we
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understand that you know we weren't friends with charlie kirk we weren't
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you know associated with him anyway but he
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influenced this country significantly because
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people you know he obviously influenced them
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more after his death than his life
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right and the bible talked about except a corner wheat die
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it's gonna it's gonna die alone but if
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it dies it'll bear much fruit and you
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could see this over you know over the
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events over the last week and a half after his assassination yeah you can kind
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of see a bit of a light and you know we've we've been talking about critical
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thinking we've been talking about going over the policies and right in logic
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and and this is something that drove him that's how he actually had a lot of
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these conversations because it was.
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Frank Turek. Turek, that trained him. There you go. He's an apologist.
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Yeah, Dr. Frank Turek, you know, is an apologist.
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You know, he's got, you know, the, what is the name of his ministry?
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Frank Turek's. He wrote the book, you know, I Don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist. Yeah.
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And then Cross-Examined is their ministry.
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And interesting enough, several years ago, Charlie Kirk actually was so impressed by Frank Turek.
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Because he watched his debates. He saw him going to colleges and interacting
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with students. he actually reached out to Frank Turek's organization and said,
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hey, I really need to get in touch with Frank Turek.
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And he ended up talking to Frank Turek and basically said, you know,
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for all essential purposes, I want you to mentor me in apologetics.
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And more and more, that relationship that developed between him and Frank Turek
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brought out the apologetic nature of Charlie Kirk.
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That's why you started hearing him more and more on these college campuses advocate
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for the Lord Jesus Christ, advocate for the Christian worldview.
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And he did it very well. If there's one thing that Charlie Kirk was really good
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at was assimilating a lot of knowledge and being able to use it effectively in dialogue.
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He was able to do that very, very effectively.
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So that's an interesting backstory where a lot of his influence came from.
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And that's why he was able to articulate himself so well in these conversations.
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And again, good discourse.
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But I'm hoping, or what I'm seeing, I think what we're seeing is we're seeing
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a movement after this event where maybe some of this generation is waking up
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where like, hey, I got to critically think through this too.
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I think it's important to understand what liberty of conscience is and what
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he stood for, Charlie stood for, and maybe also opens up an opportunity for
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the gospel to get out there, which I think— Yeah,
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I think what's really inspired people is the fact that a man had such strong
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convictions and he was not afraid to stand in the open public forum and debate
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those ideas and still stick to his convictions.
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And I think that's what's inspired people because he didn't raise a sword.
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He didn't bring a gun to the debate.
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He didn't, he wasn't condescending.
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He was, he was, he had a ton of humility.
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Matter of fact, before he would set up, you know, these events at the college
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campuses, he would tell, especially a lot of these people that show up to support him.
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He said, now, look, when somebody on the other side, like a liberal or a Marxist
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or transgender, if somebody on the other side wants to debate us,
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we do not want to treat them the way they would treat us.
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We want to treat them with respect and humility and we want to give them an
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open form an open door to discuss We don't want to pressure them.
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We don't want them to feel uncomfortable.
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That's what he that's what he would do He would prep those people because he
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honestly was interested.
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He didn't care if you disagreed with him, right?
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All he wanted to do. Let's let's talk about this.
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Let's discuss this. Let's dialogue about this
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and so that's it that's all he did
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and and what's it's a this is what i i think
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is amazing you got the psychos out there right
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you've got the people that are responding and rejoicing over
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his death and these people i just think are just demon
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possessed and there's definitely psychologically something wrong with maybe
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so or i think it's in the conditioning of our education systems well yeah when
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when you teach when you teach for decades that you're a product a byproduct
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of a biological accident, there is no God,
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there is no creator, there is no purpose for life, you're basically an animal
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and you're living in this environment where, you know, only the fittest survived,
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then yeah, you're going to create a bunch of animals.
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And the morals, good and bad, they go out the window. There is no such thing.
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So that's why people are...
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It's disturbing. Yeah. Well, this culture, it's like, you know,
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we listen to Brother Knox, James Knox down in Florida, and he had talked about
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it. This is Romans chapter one.
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Yeah. And he's talking about the end of the chapter where literally people were
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rejoicing over this wicked.
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It's not just the fact that people will conduct this wickedness, but they rejoice in it.
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They have pleasure in them that do them. They have pleasure in them that do
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them. Yeah. And then, you know, what's interesting is in Revelation 11,
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you have two prophets who spend 42 months, three and a half years,
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last half of the tribulation.
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And you know what they're doing? They're preaching.
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Now, of course, they're bringing down fire and holding, you know,
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rain and doing these things. They're a little bit more direct in their approach. Yeah.
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And then, of course, that tribulation dispensation, it's a very important,
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you know, time that God's obviously trying to cleanse Israel.
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But what's interesting is that after they're killed, after the three and a half
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years they're killed, and it says their bodies lay in the streets for three days.
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And the Bible says that people rejoiced and gave gifts to each other because
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they had tormented them.
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They're rejoicing over the beheading of two of God's witnesses.
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And I often thought when I read those years ago, those passages,
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I'm thinking, man, what would it take a society to get to that place?
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Throw out God. Right? Yeah. And, you know, here's another thing.
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At the end of the tribulation, or in the tribulation you have Jesus Christ comes
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back, he sets up the millennial kingdom.
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So he rules and reigns for a thousand years, right? The Bible says in Revelation chapter 20,
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at the end of the chapter, or towards the middle of the chapter,
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at the end of the thousand years of reign, where Jesus Christ is king and ruler,
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he has created a perfect environment, he has created a perfect government,
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he has created a perfect religion, and he is a perfect ruler. Okay.
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So there's no more poverty. There's no more disease.
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There's no more, you know, as far as, you know, the way, the things that we
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suffered today, no more war.
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So there's peace for a thousand years. And yet at the end of that thousand years,
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the devil is able to get the number of the sand of the sea of people to rise
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up and try to fight against the holy city and against Jesus Christ.
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You know what that shows you?
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The Bible says in Jeremiah chapter 17, verse 9, it says that the heart,
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our heart, the heart of man is above all.
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It's more wicked above anything. There's nothing more wicked than our heart.
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That shows us that the heart of man is so deprived and vile and wicked that
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it will always choose to go against and rebel against God.
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So there's no surprise with it, right?
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No. But I say shock for you and me is that for the last 30, 40 years,
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we didn't see this kind of level of, you know, vindictiveness and vile behavior so openly.
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Yeah. Well, what it is to me, like over the years.
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So I remember from the 90s, you know, we started to see things like we thought,
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wow, the 90s is wicked generation and going into where we are today.
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But then it was just, I thought Romans, Brother Knox going through that,
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I thought he articulated it as, and I think in the best way possible,
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that's just what led up why we're here.
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I tend to, you know, I hear on the news about like, well, all this left-wing
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rhetoric is resulting in this political violence that's happening.
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And, okay, maybe some of that is true I think that probably contributes to it,
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But it comes down to, if you take God out of our education systems And start
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with our young people from the 60s all the way up.
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We're just a bunch of animals. This isn't really wrong to do what happened.
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I wouldn't even go back before that. When you see the roots of this type of
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culture kind of growing and thriving was towards the end of the 19th century,
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1880s into 1901 and so forth and so on.
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What you started seeing was, like, for example, in the late 1800s.
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A kind of evolution. You know, Darwin came in. Yeah, Darwin.
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Karl Marx came in. A lot of those perverted Bible versions started coming out.
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German rationalism, yeah.
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The first major revision that corrected, you know, trying to attack the King
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James Bible is the Revised Standard Version in 1881.
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Then you had 1901, you had the American Standard Version.
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And from there, you see a change. You see a change in the culture.
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You see a change in the music.
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You see a change in the philosophy across the world.
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So those were the seeds. What you did is you started introducing that maybe
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there was no God that created us, and maybe Genesis isn't as literal.
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Now, it took—I mean, we're in 2025, so you're talking about over 160 years.
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You get to a point now where we're starting to see the fruit of that, right?
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Where it led to. And I've often, and I taught, when I taught Romans,
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the book of Romans, for example, when you started seeing when the Bible says
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God gave them over to a reprobate mind and he gave them over to do those things are not convenient.
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And what does it say? They did not like to retain God. Right.
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They did not retain. In their knowledge.
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In their knowledge, right. And they
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who hold the truth, hold the Bible in wickedness. And so here's the thing.
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When you see that, that they gave over, that's not, oh, judgment is impending. Oh, judgment is coming.
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No, that's judgment of God. When you start seeing that behavior in society,
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that is, I have judged this culture.
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I have judged this society. That's what it is.
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There's an old missionary, Japanese missionary. He was a missionary to Japan in the 50s.
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And I can't remember the name of the book now, but he wrote,
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he said this word. He says, the duty and obligation of every Christian is to
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identify the spirit of that age, find out what the spirit of that age is, and go against it.
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He says that is the duty of every Christian in every generation.
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And this generation, it's narcissism, it is self-love, it is a hatred of the truth, right?
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It is confusion. Ornication with this, covetousness, maliciousness, and the murder. Right.
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There you are. This is where we're at now.
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And you look at those things, you know, haters of God, backbiters,
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you know, haters of their parents, murderers of their own parents.
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You know, Timothy talks about that too.
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But here's the thing, you know, you know what Jesus Christ said?
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He said during his ministry, he says, you know, what's the end time going to
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be like? He said, oh, it's real simple. It's going to be like the days of Lot.
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And it's going to be like the days of Noah. And God's, his commentary on that
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in Genesis 6, he said, he saw the imagination and the wickedness of man's heart.
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He saw their imagination that it was so vile and so contempt that God said,
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I've got to destroy it and start all over again.
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So he had to find a genetically pure line, which was Noah's line, right?
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Because of the Bible says that he was pure in his generations,
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meaning he had a pure genetic code because you had a bunch of angels that were
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cohabitating with human women and producing wickedness and giants and all this other stuff.
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But here's the thing, Jesus Christ says, that's what the end of the world's
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going to be like. He's just going to be like that.
26:32
So it was enough for God to say, I've got to destroy the whole thing.
26:35
That tells you something. We say we haven't seen it in our lifetime,
26:39
but history repeats itself.
26:41
We're seeing Genesis chapter 6 starting to arrive, the transhumanism,
26:48
the transgenderism, the- All that's already here.
26:51
The multiculturalism. It's established now, I think.
26:54
And then coming to this point, like verse 32 is the way it was put,
26:59
it's like, here's the steps or the progression from verse 21 in Romans 121 all
27:04
the way to verse 32 in Romans 1,
27:09
yeah, Romans 1, and having pleasure and doing this.
27:13
So, it sets a precedence, right? It's sort of a line that's been crossed.
27:18
I think that's why it's a shock for a lot of people.
27:19
It was for me because we haven't seen that.
27:22
We've seen all the way up until this point until we see somebody that's openly
27:26
being assassinated for words they say that happens,
27:31
And then a generation of people that literally celebrate and rejoice in the
27:39
cold-blooded, merciless killing of an innocent man. And calling for more. Yeah.
27:46
And, you know, I was just perusing some articles today, just kind of looking
27:49
at, you know, what people, what the reactions are.
27:52
We're going through the reactions right now, right? So, we're just talking about the world's reaction.
27:57
And, I mean, we're talking about,
28:01
Of course, a lot of this stuff is on college campuses. You see a lot of professors,
28:06
teachers, college students.
28:08
I've preached on these campuses. I know exactly. So that's where you know where
28:12
the stuff is being nurtured and perpetrated.
28:17
It starts there because it's where young people are. But yeah,
28:20
they're openly celebrating it. They don't see anything wrong with it.
28:25
And then we're seeing the professors and college students all justifying it
28:30
and just Just news article after news article all over the country.
28:34
That's, you know, that's what's disturbing to me. Well, you know,
28:37
in the 90s, okay, like in the mid-90s to late 90s, early 2000s,
28:41
the professors that were teaching in college were your Marxists back in the 60s.
28:47
Yeah. Okay? So they introduced cultural Marxism.
28:51
They introduced political Marxism, religious Marxism.
28:55
And here's the thing. There was a Romanian pastor that was imprisoned when the
29:02
Soviet Union came into power.
29:04
I'm trying to remember his name now. It's going to bug me now if I don't remember
29:08
it. He wrote a book called Marx and Satanism. Marx and Satan.
29:13
And what he revealed was that Karl Marx was not trying to create a political
29:19
philosophy or political theory that was antagonistic to capitalism.
29:24
That's not what he was doing. Was it Wurmbrand? Wurmbrand, Richard Wurmbrand.
29:28
So Richard Wurmbrand, he wrote a book. It's called Marx and Satan.
29:32
You can find it. I found it on Kindle. I was able to find it.
29:36
And I started reading it. And man, what Richard Wurmbrand revealed was that in Russia,
29:43
they have thousands and thousands of pages of writings from Karl Marx.
29:50
But they're all suppressed. Yeah.
29:53
You only can find Das Kapital and some of his political theory stuff,
29:57
but you can't find his other stuff.
29:59
What you come to find out is that Karl Marx was raised, I think,
30:03
as a Methodist or a Protestant, and he was going to actually training to be
30:07
a priest or go into the ministry as a pastor or a preacher.
30:13
And something happened. This is what Richard Warren Brand said.
30:16
Something happened when he was 18.
30:18
We're not sure what it was. 19, 18. and all of a sudden something changed.
30:23
His whole demeanor changed. All of a sudden he started writing poetry as if
30:29
he wanted to kill the God of the Bible.
30:32
He no longer was interested in God. He wanted to create a society that was so against God.
30:39
He wanted to undo everything God had established in the Word of God.
30:44
Now, why would that, how do you confuse that with
30:47
a political theory how do you can't but nobody
30:50
talks about this because nobody knows this
30:53
history because all they see carl marx as oh you know marxism it's just a political
30:58
theory it's against these you know these capitalists these evil it's for the
31:02
people but really what the driving factor was like he had to rip god but his
31:07
out of the system but the root of it was not political it was religious.
31:13
Karl Marx hated God. That was the main driver of his entire theory and movement.
31:20
But it was hidden. That's wild.
31:22
And so this is what Richard Wurmbrand revealed this stuff.
31:25
Matter of fact, the way he would dress, you would always see him dressed in
31:28
all black and he'd have that big, giant, scruffy beard and all that stuff.
31:32
There was actually a group of Satanists that dressed exactly like that.
31:37
And he was actually influenced by that group. And Richard Wurmbrand talked about
31:41
it. That's why he dressed the way he dressed.
31:43
I'm telling you, it's very revealing. If you don't have the book, get that book.
31:47
It's just called Marks and Satan, and it will open your eyes. But here's my point.
31:53
What, what, you know, we talked about, you know, the. We're talking to the college campuses.
31:57
Well, in the, in the college campuses, but you were, you were saying about like
32:00
the left wing policies and like this. Yeah, the rhetoric. The rhetoric and things like that. Yeah.
32:05
But obviously that's not the root. The root of it is Satan.
32:09
The Bible says in 2 Corinthians chapter four, verse four, he is the God of this world.
32:15
He runs the political ideologies. There is a spiritual war that's going on when
32:21
it comes to kingdoms on this earth.
32:24
Daniel saw some of that. Whenever the angel came to him, he said,
32:28
hey, you know, the angel told him, Michael's been hindered by the prince of Persia.
32:33
The prince of Persia, the king of, not the king of Persia, but whoever was the
32:37
spiritual prince of Persia.
32:38
So there's a spiritual warfare going on, and it's the same thing that's happening today.
32:42
So when we hear political ideology and we hear this rhetoric,
32:47
these college kids have been brainwashed into believing in Marxism,
32:51
cultural Marxism, Darwinism, social Darwinism, you know, all this stuff.
32:56
What they basically bought into is a satanic lie.
32:59
And that is what's motivating their character, their psychology.
33:04
You know, their spiritual wickedness is what it boils down to.
33:08
And so that's why, you know, but this is all spiritual. It's all happening for a reason.
33:13
And here's the irony. The Christian isn't called to take up arms against these people.
33:18
The only, the weapon that we have is the word of God and our logic and our dialogue
33:25
and our ability to argue and debate ideas. That is what the Christian is left with.
33:31
That is our, because we're trying to fight for a spiritual kingdom.
33:34
It's a spiritual warfare.
33:36
Right. It's not a physical kingdom we're trying to obtain, right? Right.
33:39
So, but anyway, here's the thing, just as a little bit of a pivot,
33:43
right? We talked about who Charlie Kirk is, what he represented,
33:47
and then, of course, there was the funeral service, right?
33:50
And the funeral service, I mean, you're talking about 100,000 people in the
33:53
stadium, 20,000 in a nearby stadium, and 100 million streams.
34:00
100 million streams. It's ridiculous how many people. Now, here's the truth
34:05
of it. You had Catholics there.
34:08
You had Seventh-day Adventists there. You probably had Mormons there. You had Hindus there.
34:14
You had people that were secular philosophers and things like that that got
34:20
up. And they were all associated.
34:22
You know, you had one big giant, one world ecumenical religion there. Okay?
34:27
But I want to say this as a disclosure.
34:31
When I listened to the speeches and the things that were said,
34:37
90% of what was said was gospel truth.
34:42
That means God used the devil, in some cases, to preach the gospel.
34:46
And over, I don't know how many, I mean, probably over a million people heard
34:52
the gospel as a result of that funeral service.
34:55
Right. Okay? That's the positive thing. That's what I want to say.
34:58
Here's the thing, like, God works in that way. Yes.
35:00
God will work in that way. If you look in the Bible, you look in the Old Testament,
35:03
how he used evil nations to do his bidding.
35:06
In this case, he's using this as a platform to get his word out maybe just one
35:10
last time in this significant way.
35:15
Right. And the bottom line is this.
35:17
The truth got out in one form or another.
35:22
People were convicted. I mean, if there was one thing through the whole,
35:26
the assassination of Charlie Kirk and all the events that followed after the funeral service,
35:32
I have seen literally testimony after testimony after testimony after testimony
35:38
of people that said, you know what?
35:40
I haven't been in church in 27 years. What does that remind you of?
35:44
Because when September 11th happened, 2001, I was 17 years old.
35:49
People started flooding churches.
35:50
People started praying. Right. People started becoming religious.
35:52
It opened up a window of time where people were sensitive to God's word,
35:58
God's truth. Right. And it was an opportunity.
36:01
And what happened was, and it makes me think in Revelation chapter 3,
36:07
I believe, where he's talking about the Philadelphian church.
36:10
He says in verse 7, Revelation 3, 7. And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia,
36:15
write these things, saith he that is holy, he that is true, he that hath the
36:18
key of David, he that openeth and no man shutteth, and shutteth and no man openeth.
36:23
And he says, he goes, I know thy works, behold, I have set before thee an open
36:29
door, and no man can shut it.
36:32
For thou hast a little strength, and hast kept my word, and hast not denied
36:37
my name. So there's a door that was opened during the Philadelphia Church period,
36:42
which is actually the time of the formation of the United States and the Constitution.
36:46
That's the church period that we're talking about.
36:49
But he said, God said, I opened up a door. What are you going to do with that?
36:53
And I believe that's exactly what happened with Charlie Kirk's funeral is a door was opened.
36:58
Millions of people heard the gospel. okay now
37:02
unfortunately what's probably going
37:05
to happen is the devil's going to swoop in with all his cults
37:08
and all his heretics and false religions and
37:10
false beliefs and swoop those people up into false doctrine unfortunately that's
37:16
probably going to be the case my thing that bothers me is that we have a bunch
37:21
of independent bible believing baptist brethren who have the truth truth,
37:27
who have the right doctrine,
37:28
who have the right, you know, education and the right information to feed these
37:34
people and help them grow.
37:35
And they will not step on a college campus.
37:40
They will not go on a street corner. They will not pass out a track out in the open.
37:44
They will not witness out beside the four doors of their church or their house.
37:49
And they will let these people who could have been discipled,
37:53
who are looking for the truth, who are now under honest conviction that will
37:58
allow them to get sucked up by these false religions and false cults.
38:02
And so, so the, the, the one side that, you know, I wanted to point out as far
38:08
as the funeral and all the events is the fact that there was an open door and
38:12
people are responding in ways that,
38:15
like I was saying before, testimony after testimony.
38:18
I grew up an atheist. I just bought a Bible.
38:21
Yeah. You know, me and my kids have never been to church. We just went to church on Sunday.
38:25
Like you're hearing that over and over and over again,
38:29
meaning that people are responding because they know there's something more
38:34
to this life than just stinking education and entertainment and the goals that they live by.
38:42
They realize there's something more. Because here's a man that literally wasn't
38:46
afraid to go out into the open and lay down his life for the truth.
38:49
He was simply a testimony, and he's just, there's people that are not conditioned
38:54
or have not been in that environment, see this man that was assassinated who
38:58
boldly proclaimed Jesus Christ, and they're like, why do they have so much peace about it?
39:03
Why are they, they're not responding or reacting in a way that they would have
39:08
reacted with no hope without God.
39:10
And that in itself is a testimony, and it is drawing people in that curiosity.
39:14
It says in Ephesians 4 that Gentiles walk in the vanity of their own mind, their mind.
39:20
The emptiness, there's nothing, there's no purpose, there's no meaning to life.
39:24
And yet, what this shows you, the whole, you know, everything that's happened
39:29
with Charlie Kirk, who he was, and the way people have responded and been so
39:33
inspired by his life, it shows you the power of a man's conviction.
39:37
Yeah. If you have real conviction and you are really motivated by the truth
39:42
and you stand on that truth, look at the impact you can make.
39:47
And you died for that truth. And you died for it. And people see that.
39:51
Nobody's going to point the finger at Charlie Kirk and, oh, he was a fake Christian.
39:54
He didn't really believe what he believed. Really?
39:58
He's got over 13 years, 12, 13 years of Turning Point USA and being on college
40:02
campuses and debating openly and saying things with conviction,
40:07
openly telling people what, and even the testimony you see over and over again
40:12
on YouTube, they say, what do you want to be known for when you die?
40:15
And he says, the courage of my faith. I want people to see that I had a courageous
40:22
faith that I can live and die by That's what he said He wanted people he wanted
40:27
jesus christ to be magnified.
40:29
And uh, and and so that's the one thing to me is the amazing response Okay,
40:34
now here comes the negative side.
40:36
All right. This is robert and leash brace yourself Well, you know,
40:40
we already kind of indicated I know that some of our brethren the way that that
40:44
their one their lack of response to it. It's very frustrating.
40:49
The lack of response or the response that they have is just,
40:51
it's just critical instead of looking at the opportunity that we have.
40:55
And there's a brother that responded, and I love this brother to death.
40:58
I've read his books. I love this brother.
41:00
I agree with him 99.9% of everything that he teaches and preaches.
41:06
Yeah. But he wrote an article and just all he did, he didn't say one positive
41:10
thing about the funeral.
41:12
All he did was list all the Catholics that were involved and said,
41:14
welcome to the One world religion he basically criticized the
41:18
entire thing and he it's almost like he was trying
41:21
to shame bible believers into you
41:25
know buying into this whole charlie kirk phenomenon and and this isn't about
41:30
idolizing charlie kirk it's not about lifting him on a pedestal it's about honoring
41:35
a man that actually stood for his faith that had had like if if if if listen if,
41:42
Charlie Kirk had more courage and more boldness and more honor,
41:48
and he had more action for the Lord Jesus Christ than a hundred pastors I know
41:54
in 10 years would produce.
41:57
And yet they'll criticize him because, you know, he doesn't believe exactly how we believe.
42:03
Oh, you know, he's not of our religious stripe. So they're going to try to take
42:07
the position of superiority and they'll point the finger and say,
42:10
well, if you get into that and you're moved by that and you're convicted by
42:14
that lifestyle and the whole turning point thing and that ministry,
42:18
then, well, you know, you're just getting wrapped up in a one world ecumenical
42:21
religion. Yeah, that's a false dichotomy.
42:24
And what's sad about that is that there's Christians who probably were convicted by Charlie Kirk.
42:32
There was Christians who started thinking, man, maybe
42:35
I should do more for Jesus christ and here's
42:38
the worst part not only that not only the convictions of
42:41
christians that see a man who stood up for his faith but people
42:45
that maybe were teetering on the fence of what is this christianity and maybe
42:49
even look into it and see people like that say things like that right creating
42:54
that division and it pushes them away yeah or yeah or it causes them to say
42:58
you know what i don't want to have any part of that that's the consequence right
43:01
so but my my the thing that,
43:05
frustrates me, is rather than just let the open door remain open and take advantage of it.
43:12
They would rather criticize, strain at a gnat, swallow a camel,
43:16
rather than rejoice in the fact that the gospel is preached.
43:19
There's this in Philippians, let me read this first real quick,
43:21
because I wanted to read this.
43:23
In Philippians, this verse has been just like resonating in my mind all week long.
43:28
But Paul, he's in prison, okay, when he's writing to the Philippians that,
43:34
you know, the church at Philippi.
43:36
And he says this, he goes, but I, he goes, I would that you should understand brethren.
43:40
This is in verse 12, Philippians 1, 12, that the things which happen unto me
43:44
have fallen out rather unto the furtherance of the gospel. He said the things,
43:48
I'm in prison. I've been persecuted.
43:51
I've been arrested. I've been ridiculed, right?
43:54
He goes, verse 13, so that my bonds in Christ are manifest in all the palace,
44:00
and in all other places, everybody knows who I am.
44:03
Because, oh, here's that preacher that's been preaching this resurrected God, right?
44:08
And he says, and many of the brethren in the Lord waxing confident by my bonds.
44:15
He says a bunch of brethren are now waxing confident.
44:19
They have boldness because look, there's that man that's had a conviction about
44:23
this Jesus Christ that rose from the dead and he's willing to go to jail over it.
44:28
It produced confidence in these believers. Now he says, and are much more bold
44:33
to speak the word without fear because of his persecution, right? Watch.
44:41
Some indeed preach Christ, even of envy and strife.
44:45
He says, some people, they don't preach Christ for the right reason.
44:49
And then he says, and some also of goodwill. He goes, some do preach it,
44:53
Christ for the right reason. And he says, the one preach Christ of contention,
44:58
they're just trying to argue and make a mess and make a fuss of things, not sincerely.
45:04
So, oh, well, you know, those people aren't right. Some people may not be of the same stripe.
45:08
They may have the wrong motivation for preaching Christ. And he says,
45:12
he goes, supposing to add affliction to my bonds.
45:15
He says, so some people were preaching just to try to make life worse for Paul.
45:19
They were literally making his bond and his imprisonment worse. Verse 17.
45:25
But he says, but the other of love, knowing that I'm set for the defense of
45:29
the gospel, knowing what I stand for.
45:32
He says, so there's two sides to this preaching of Christ. The one that are
45:36
trying to cause problems and they're not preaching of a sincere heart.
45:40
They're not genuine, right?
45:42
They're faking it for all intents purposes. And then he says,
45:46
you have this other side that's preaching Christ and they're doing it out of
45:49
love and they're doing out of boldness.
45:52
And this is what he says, verse 18. What then?
45:56
Notwithstanding every way, whether in pretense, that means they're faking it,
46:02
they're doing it for the wrong reason, or in truth.
46:06
This is his conclusion. Christ is preached.
46:09
And therein do I rejoice, yea, and will rejoice.
46:15
Paul's basically saying, I don't care if you preach Christ out of pretense or
46:20
you preach him in truth as long as Christ is preached.
46:23
That's what Paul said. Isn't that interesting? People, our Baptist brethren
46:27
go, oh, look at that cardinal that's getting up and speaking at his funeral.
46:32
That cardinal didn't preach Catholicism.
46:35
These Catholics, some of these, Marco Rubio, which, you know,
46:39
I don't really care for him too much politically, but he got up there and he
46:43
preached the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ.
46:46
Hello. Isn't that something? Whether they preach in pretense or they preach
46:51
in truth, nevertheless, Christ is preached.
46:55
At the end of the day, you know, regardless of who was there,
46:58
the Catholics, the Mormons, whoever it was, it doesn't matter.
47:02
The truth was preached. I believe that we're going to get to heaven,
47:07
and we're going to see Catholics in heaven that trusted Christ as their Savior,
47:13
even though they grew up in an abomination of a religion.
47:18
I really honestly do, because at the very least, you get some gospel.
47:25
Yeah. You get some truth there.
47:27
And here's the one thing about this too, just thinking about it,
47:31
that this is probably going to be the only time that we're going to see.
47:35
Maybe even the last time where this type of platform, we had this type of platform
47:41
where the gospel is preached.
47:43
I don't think we're going to see it again. I don't know if we will or not.
47:47
What if this were the last hurrah right before the rapture?
47:51
That's what I'm saying. Like, I don't think personally, it's just my opinion
47:54
that we're going to see something at this level ever again.
47:58
Yeah, because when you see from the global perspective, you know,
48:01
Israel, you know, Emmanuel Macron, he just recognized Palestine as an independent state.
48:09
He's the first world leader to do that in the European world, in the Western world.
48:14
And, of course, there's a lot of speculation around Macron, whether or not he
48:18
might be the Antichrist or tied to the Antichrist.
48:20
And I'll tell you, there's a pretty good case for some of those things.
48:22
Is he half-two and half-Palestinians? I think there's some—I don't know,
48:29
but I do know that some of the things I've heard about him, it's very convincing.
48:34
Let's put it that way.
48:35
Interesting. But here's the thing. Another podcast. But here's the thing.
48:38
The point is, is there's a lot of things happening in the world today.
48:43
Not even i think it was right after the it
48:46
was monday or tuesday that trump right
48:49
after the funeral service went to the un and announced there's
48:53
going to be a new program where they're going to start introducing ai to
48:56
the global scale part of the global
48:59
world and and you know and i don't
49:02
know whether ai is going to be the platform that they
49:05
set up that's going to be part of the mark of the beast or bringing the image
49:08
of the beast to life but i tell you what there's some
49:11
there's some stuff about that and we probably need to do a podcast on ai
49:14
but here's the thing and all that
49:17
stuff is happening at breakneck speed this world
49:20
is not going to be the same five years from now and this
49:23
might be the only open door of this magnitude that christians have to go and
49:29
reach people because you know what there's a chance that if you go and pass
49:33
a track out and it's somebody that's been under conviction about this whole
49:37
charlie kirk thing and now you're offering them something that they'd been looking for.
49:42
And they're willing to talk to you where, guess what, three weeks ago,
49:46
they would have never talked to you.
49:47
Yeah, they would have never thought about it. Nope. And I could tell you right
49:50
now a personal testimony.
49:52
I have somebody that works for me who is not only from Israel,
49:57
who's a Jew, who's an atheist.
49:59
Yeah. Probably some of the hardest people. Oh, yeah. To ever reach.
50:04
And, you know, at work, you have to be balanced because you're on work time.
50:08
And so you can't go and use that still the time to try to further the gospel.
50:14
But there are times when they ask where you have an opportunity to open up.
50:19
And, you know, I think this was after the, it might've been around the Charlie
50:23
Kirk assassination. He was traveling or maybe it was before or after, I can't remember.
50:28
But he was walking to a Waffle House on a Sunday, Sunday afternoon.
50:34
And he knows I go to church and we talked about it briefly.
50:36
But he was in a Waffle House and getting breakfast, I guess he was traveling,
50:40
and he saw a family walk-in that was dressed up in suits, and he was just saying,
50:44
he was just like really happy and just, I don't know who they were.
50:48
Yeah, who they were, yeah. Right.
50:49
But what it did was, whoever they were, put a stone in his shoe because he started
50:55
wondering, like, why are they so happy?
50:56
Yeah, amen. But why are they, I don't, you know, what is with this thing that
51:00
they do or the church they go to? And he asked me because he's like,
51:03
hey, I know you go to church regularly and I want to maybe not hear,
51:08
but I'd like to sit down with you and talk to you about it more. Yeah.
51:11
Open door, man. This guy's a Jew from Israel that's an atheist,
51:15
self-proclaimed atheist.
51:17
And he asked me that. Yeah, because that worldview is morally bankrupt.
51:22
Yeah. And, but the point is, is when, when somebody, again,
51:28
it kind of emphasizes the whole conviction that was demonstrated and exhibited
51:32
by Charlie Kirk is that people will see that and go, man, what is it that that guy has that I don't?
51:39
Right. Right. What, what is it? There's something that they have that I cannot feel.
51:43
Yep. They don't, it's hope, right? But they want to figure out what,
51:46
they're at least curious. Yeah.
51:48
I was telling in the prison Sunday, I was given a testimony and I think I was given a personal time.
51:55
I can't remember, but it was, it might've been, I honestly, I don't remember
51:58
where I was giving this testimony, but I was talking to somebody and I was telling
52:00
them about when I was in, you know, the air force and I got away from God when
52:04
I first went in, I was 18 years old.
52:06
I'd only been saved for about maybe three years at that point.
52:09
So I was a baby, you know, baby Christian, didn't know very much,
52:12
wasn't really grounded as well as I could have been because I got saved in a charismatic church.
52:17
So I was kind of, you know, grew up in false doctrine. And anyway.
52:21
I go in the military and of course I backslid, got away from God,
52:25
started doing, you know, partying, hanging out with people, getting involved
52:29
in the world as a Christian.
52:31
And I was under a lot of conviction about that. And that's probably another story for some time.
52:35
There's some interesting stories that happened. But here's the thing.
52:37
And I ended up getting, it was like two years into it.
52:41
We had a watch night service at our church there in California where I was stationed at.
52:45
And I remember I got under conviction about it. And I was like,
52:47
man, I just, and our, you know, our dad was starting to carry the cross and
52:52
he was preaching on the street and he was doing all this stuff.
52:55
And I, and I wanted to do something like that. I was, cause I used to preach
52:58
on the street before that point.
53:00
Oh, when you say carrying the cross, he would actually.
53:04
He would carry a cross down the highway.
53:07
Six foot cross. or a seven-foot cross and carry it. Just to be a testimony, a witness.
53:11
Just to get people to stop and say, what in the world is that dude doing?
53:14
Yeah, when people see somebody carrying a cross, right, where their minds go to. Yep.
53:17
And people would ask, you know, would actually stop. Again, it's like,
53:20
why would a guy do that? It doesn't make any sense. Yeah, but anyways,
53:23
I didn't want to throw you off.
53:24
So I got under conviction and I made a commitment that night at watch night service.
53:29
I stood up before the church and I made a vow. And I said, you know what?
53:32
I'm going to rededicate my life to the Lord.
53:34
I'm going to start going. And I said I wanted to build a cross and start doing something publicly.
53:39
And there was a family in that church, really close friends of mine that came
53:42
up, and they had used to street preach on a regular basis. And they said,
53:46
look, we used to preach on the street.
53:48
And we ended up starting a street preaching ministry out of the church.
53:51
Well, anyway, I got under conviction. I go back to work.
53:55
So that morning, so it was, it was like watch night service the following work
54:00
day, you know, we would, we would all sit at a big giant table and we drink
54:05
coffee right before our day.
54:07
And then we would get into work vans and basically kind of work on the base.
54:11
Well, anyway, and these are all guys that I hung out with.
54:15
These are all guys that I partied with. These are all guys I went to the club with.
54:19
And I basically had to tell them, I said, Hey, I have something to say to everybody.
54:23
And I'm telling these, and there's about 10 or 12 guys sitting there and they
54:27
all lived in the dorm with me.
54:28
I was not married. I was single, you know, so I'm, so I'm, you think about it,
54:32
I'm 19, 20 years old at this point.
54:34
And I basically tell them, I said, I'm a Christian and I've been backslidden
54:38
for the past year and a half.
54:40
I've been going against my Lord and Savior. I should have been a better testimony to you guys.
54:44
I was saved when I was, you know, 16 years old. And I basically went through
54:48
the whole thing, started telling them about my testimony and that I was going
54:52
to rededicate my life and I was going to start going to church.
54:55
I didn't even have a vehicle. Matter of fact, the church bus picked me up at
54:58
my dorm on the base to take me to church.
55:02
But I remember I was thinking, man, that's it. These guys are going to think
55:06
I'm the biggest hypocrite. And I was, of course, ashamed because of my behavior.
55:10
But man, I felt like this huge weight was lifted on my shoulder.
55:13
And here's the thing, talking about open doors.
55:15
As soon as I got finished, you know, they, everybody kind of split up and we're doing our way.
55:20
This guy, Leo Antoninecchi, you know, I don't know if he'd ever listened to
55:25
this, but Leo was like, you know, this big, you know, tall, lanky Italian guy from New York.
55:32
And he came up to me and he was pretty, you know, you know, he was kind of one
55:35
of those guys that was like very brash and open and would easily embarrass you.
55:39
You know what I'm saying? Just one of those types of personalities.
55:43
And he came up to me. He goes, hey, Gamis, I want to talk to you.
55:45
And he came up to me and he's like, I've been thinking about this God thing, man.
55:49
And all of a sudden he wanted to know more about it. I invited him to church.
55:53
I mean, he never went or anything like that, but it was interesting that,
55:57
that created an open door because he saw a man who had enough conviction and
56:03
had enough boldness to stand up for his faith, even in a very embarrassing atmosphere.
56:09
And God used that. Now, that's just a small example of what Charlie Kirk produced But the point is,
56:17
is when you stand up for your faith And you have the boldness and the filling
56:22
of the Holy Spirit to stand up for Christ.
56:26
People are going to respond to that, whether they hate it or they love it,
56:31
whether in pretense or in truth, nevertheless, Christ is preached.
56:36
So, you know, we're talking about the response of our brethren,
56:40
especially our Baptist brethren that are real critical about all the events
56:43
around Charlie Kirk. Look, would I join his church? No.
56:46
Would I side theologically with him? No. That's not what I'm talking about.
56:50
What i'm talking about is how many of us are going to take up the mantle because
56:54
there is an open door And step through that door and try to reach people With
56:59
the truth Why aren't we trying to reach them with the real truth?
57:04
Instead of sitting back as a keyboard warrior and writing articles Blasting
57:10
ecumenical religion and movement and all that stuff.
57:12
Look That goes without saying Of course i'm not going to side with a catholic
57:16
It's just like these pro-life rallies.
57:18
We go and street preach there and there's a bunch of Catholics that promote pro-life.
57:23
I agree with them on that. I have no problem with it.
57:27
And I don't go to those pro-life rallies so that we can hold hands with a bunch
57:31
of Catholics because we're trying to save the unborn. That's not what we do.
57:36
You know what we do? We actually go out there and preach the gospel.
57:39
You piggyback off of that to preach the gospel. It's an open door to reach people
57:44
because people are sensitive about the abortion issue.
57:46
And you may have a bunch of pro-life people that have never heard a clear testimony of salvation.
57:53
Here's another example. We talked about this, but we have missionaries that
57:56
go into closed countries that are, they're communist countries,
58:00
they're not going to allow missionaries coming to freely preach the gospel.
58:04
And so they have to go under the auspices of being able to start a...
58:08
Any kind of ministry that would help them, right?
58:11
We don't want to name anybody because they are working, but maybe it might be
58:16
a business. It might be an orphanage. An orphanage, that's what I was getting at.
58:20
It might be a school, they may be a school teacher. And they're helping with that.
58:23
They help with training kids, teaching language, but maybe through that.
58:27
But that's an open door again. That is an open, does that mean that they're
58:31
compromising with the communist government? No.
58:33
Absolutely not. They're using that as a vehicle to be able to preach the gospel.
58:39
That's it. You know, when Joseph was in prison, the Bible says that when Joseph
58:46
first got Because everywhere he went, he was always a blessing to people.
58:52
It was just a natural byproduct of being around Joseph.
58:57
And it's actually because he's a picture of a Jew and he's a picture of Jesus Christ.
59:00
But here it's interesting. The Bible says that he had favor with the prison
59:06
keeper. That's what the Bible says.
59:08
So obviously, Joseph had won the favor and the goodwill of the prison keepers.
59:15
That gave him liberty and open doors that maybe he otherwise wouldn't have had.
59:21
What if he had a bad attitude?
59:23
You know what? I guess before we close, I do want to read a passage.
59:29
But anyway, I just want to point out that what we're trying to say is that,
59:33
man, take advantage of the open door.
59:35
Yeah. I mean, there's only a small window. I remember, again,
59:39
going back to September 11th, that there was just a period of time where people
59:44
were pretty sensitive and they just eventually fell back to the usual way of things, right?
59:51
So to kind of close it up a little bit, this is a passage of scripture,
59:58
and this has always brought me under conviction because here as Christians,
1:00:01
we tend to get really frustrated with things that are wrong.
1:00:05
We have righteous indignation, right?
1:00:08
It makes us mad that here's an innocent man was murdered in front of his kids,
1:00:13
his family, people that loved and honored him and respected him.
1:00:17
And he didn't deserve to die in that respect, right?
1:00:21
Nobody should have taken his life because of his conviction and religious belief in his ministry.
1:00:27
Nobody should have taken his life for that. And so we get upset about it.
1:00:31
And so, and it's the same vein, the same principle where we might get upset
1:00:36
because we work for an unjust boss or we live under an unjust ruler.
1:00:43
We're talking about being in a communist country, right?
1:00:45
This is what the Bible says in 1 Peter 2, starting in verse 13.
1:00:50
And this is a tough passage, but it gives us the underlying root of why we should
1:00:59
always leave certain things in God's hands and take advantage of the open doors we have.
1:01:05
Here's what it says. The Bible says, submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake.
1:01:11
Somebody once asked me, I'm very pro-Second Amendment.
1:01:15
Matter of fact, I don't believe you need to have any kind of gun permit to carry.
1:01:19
I believe the only permit we have is the Second Amendment, right?
1:01:23
And every man should have the right to protect his own life and the life of
1:01:27
his family and protect ourselves, the citizenry, from an unjust and tyrannical
1:01:33
government. I believe that.
1:01:35
But here's the question. What if they repealed the Second Amendment and it was
1:01:39
no longer legal to have a gun in the United States?
1:01:44
How many Christians would be up in arms and just be, man, just,
1:01:48
I hate America and, you know, rebel against America. We're going to take up
1:01:52
arms. And take up arms, right?
1:01:54
And they'd break the law. The problem is you'd be violating scripture according to Romans 13.
1:01:58
Here's what he says. This is what the Bible says. Submit yourselves to every
1:02:02
ordinance of man for the Lord's sake.
1:02:05
Okay? This is Peter writing this.
1:02:08
Under Nero. Wasn't he the guy that drew his sword and, you know,
1:02:14
cut off the earth? Yeah. Yeah. Impetuous is that guy.
1:02:17
But he says this, whether it be to the king as supreme.
1:02:21
Or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers,
1:02:26
and for the praise of him that do well.
1:02:28
For so is the will of God, watch, that with well-doing, that means good behavior,
1:02:35
ye may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men,
1:02:39
by your behavior, by your submission to every ordinance of man.
1:02:45
Then it says this, as free.
1:02:48
We are spiritually free. We may not be physically free, but we're spiritually.
1:02:54
He says, as free and not using your liberty for a cloak of maliciousness,
1:02:59
but as the servants of God. Watch this.
1:03:02
Honor all men, love the brotherhood, fear God, honor the king.
1:03:07
Now, he's under a half mad Roman emperor who burned half of Rome down and blamed it on the Jews.
1:03:14
This man crucified Jews and lit them on fire to light the roadways into Rome.
1:03:22
And he says, honor the king.
1:03:24
Now watch what he says. Verse 18, servants be subject to your masters with all
1:03:30
fear, not only to the good and gentle, but also to the forward, the wicked.
1:03:38
So he just said, be servant, be subject to your masters, not just to the good
1:03:42
ones, but also to the evil ones. Watch this.
1:03:46
For this is thankworthy if a man for conscience toward God, ah,
1:03:50
there's conscience again, liberty of conscience, endure grief, suffering wrongfully.
1:03:57
He says it is thankful in everything.
1:04:00
Give thanks, right? Bible tells us that in 1 Thessalonians 5.
1:04:03
For this is thankworthy if a man for conscience toward God endured grief, suffering wrongfully.
1:04:09
That means you're suffering because you are exercising a free will and conscience towards God.
1:04:16
He says, for what glory is it if when you be buffeted for your faults,
1:04:21
you shall take it patiently? If you're the one at fault, if you're punished
1:04:26
because you're wrong. He goes, what is that?
1:04:28
What glory is that? But if when you do well, when you do the right thing and
1:04:34
suffer for it, you take it patiently, this is acceptable with God.
1:04:40
So he's essentially saying, look, when you suffer for well-doing,
1:04:45
God's pleased with that.
1:04:46
When you suffer under an evil master for conscience sake, God loves that.
1:04:54
That's acceptable to God. Now watch. Why?
1:04:58
That's the question. Why is that even permissible? Why would we behave that way?
1:05:04
Why would we allow our liberties to be taken advantage of and undermined?
1:05:10
Why would we submit to an evil ruler or an evil, wicked boss?
1:05:15
How many Christians say, you know what? I don't like my boss.
1:05:18
I'm going to go find another job, right?
1:05:21
But here's what the Bible says in verse 21, watch, for even here unto were you
1:05:27
called, because Christ also suffered for us,
1:05:34
leaving us an example that you should follow in his steps.
1:05:37
Watch, who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth,
1:05:43
who when he was reviled, reviled not again.
1:05:47
When he suffered, he threatened not. but committed himself to him that judgeth righteously.
1:05:57
When Jesus Christ stood before Pilate, when they whipped him and they beat him
1:06:02
and they tore his flesh and they put that crown of thorns on his head and mocked
1:06:07
him and ridiculed and ripped his beard out and spat on him, the Bible says he opened not his mouth.
1:06:13
Why? Because he judged God righteous. He knew, I'm suffering for conscious sake.
1:06:20
I'm suffering because I love him.
1:06:23
Then he says this, he committed
1:06:27
himself to him that judges righteously who his own self bear our sins in his
1:06:34
body on the tree that we being dead and being dead to sins should live unto
1:06:41
righteousness by whose stripes you were healed.
1:06:45
For you were as sheep going astray, but are now returned under the shepherd
1:06:49
and bishop of your souls.
1:06:51
This is a powerful passage because this is basically telling you that as a Christian,
1:06:55
you need to rejoice and be thankful for the things that you suffer for conscience
1:07:01
sake towards God, because he's the ultimate judge.
1:07:05
He's the one that will make all things right when everything is said and done.
1:07:09
It is not my job to overthrow a government that took away my Second Amendment rights.
1:07:14
It is not my job to spit in the face of a bad boss because I don't like him
1:07:19
and he doesn't pay me enough.
1:07:20
It is God who will right every wrong.
1:07:23
That's what that passage is telling me. And that is exactly why Charlie Kirk was humble.
1:07:31
That's why he tried to show the utmost respect because he was actually honoring the God who saved him.
1:07:38
And he wanted to present truth in a clear and, you know, a humble way that would reach people.
1:07:45
And that, I believe, is why so many people are moved by his assassination and
1:07:51
all the events that surround it.
1:07:53
His funeral service, that he stood up for what he believed. He presented himself as a man.
1:08:00
You know, I heard the testimony of his best friend, who's also,
1:08:04
I think he's the COO of Turning Point. He was his partner.
1:08:08
And he said this, he said, and even the people that work at Turning Point,
1:08:12
some of the other people that have podcasts and stuff like that,
1:08:15
they said that when the rest of the crew would go and hang out and maybe they'd
1:08:20
go out for drinks or they'd go out for whatever, they said, number one,
1:08:24
Charlie would never drink.
1:08:25
He made a vow never to drink, just like President Trump.
1:08:28
But he said, number two, Charlie Kirk would never go out and hang out with his
1:08:33
people. He would always go straight home to erica and his kids and spend time
1:08:38
with his family He always prioritized his family.
1:08:41
He loved his wife and he loved his kids And you know what?
1:08:45
I always I always thought that was interesting because here's the thing The
1:08:48
people at turning point usa loved charlie kirk The leadership he built on we you know,
1:08:53
we talked about the management stuff He exemplified all of that and he didn't
1:08:57
have to hang out and be friends and go drinking with them He still prioritizes
1:09:03
family and people love a man with conviction.
1:09:07
That's why people are reacting this way because he was actually We know that
1:09:13
the bible says, you know, there's not a just man upon the earth You know,
1:09:16
there's no good man But in the sense of righteousness before god However,
1:09:21
charlie kirk was a good man in the sense of being a good honest human being
1:09:26
and being a good father and a good husband,
1:09:29
and he stood up for what he believed.
1:09:31
He was not afraid to challenge people. He was not afraid to debate them.
1:09:35
He was not afraid to try to reach the youth and people responded to that.
1:09:40
So my question to us Bible believers, who's gonna go out there and pass out a tract?
1:09:47
Who's gonna witness to their neighbor they haven't talked to in a year?
1:09:51
Who's gonna go out there on a street corner or go to a college campus and preach
1:09:56
the truth in light of all that?
1:09:58
You know, he demonstrated that
1:10:00
he loved the Lord Jesus Christ by doing what he did as bold as he was.
1:10:06
And I think as Christians, rather than being critical, we can take that as an example.
1:10:11
Absolutely. To do the same. And it convicts me.
1:10:15
None of us are ever going to agree 100% on everything. No. And we're not compromising.
1:10:20
And we're not compromising the truth, exactly. But that should never prevent
1:10:24
us from walking through that open door God's given us. That's right.
1:10:27
And taking advantage of it.
1:10:29
Well said. I can't, you know, I can't follow that up other than,
1:10:33
you know, the weapons of our warfare are not carnal.
1:10:38
We do have a spiritual battle that we need to fight, and that's what we need
1:10:41
to focus on. That's right. You know, as Christians.
1:10:44
Learn how to debate.
1:10:47
Learn how to argue for what you believe in. Learn how to defend and contend
1:10:51
for the faith. That's what we ought to do.
1:10:54
I think that's a good note to end it on, I think. Yep.
1:10:57
All right. I would say I'd leave like just one last thing, you know,
1:11:01
obviously keeping the Kirk family and friends and.
1:11:06
That group in prayer and that God uses this as an opportunity of just one last
1:11:12
big push or at least this platform to get the truth out there.
1:11:16
Because this window is going to close really quickly.
1:11:18
I think that's what Brother Knox said. Take advantage of it.
1:11:20
I would say keep his family in prayer, right? Here's what I would also say.
1:11:25
Because Erica Kirk has some big shoes to fill and she has some big responsibilities.
1:11:32
My understanding is that she grew up in a Catholic family. However,
1:11:36
there might have been a conversion.
1:11:38
I haven't heard a clear testimony conversion, but my understanding is that she
1:11:43
doesn't consider herself a Catholic, at least from what I heard.
1:11:49
That's what Charlie's best friend said, because he was an ex-Catholic and became a Christian.
1:11:56
But I do know she grew up that way. So, but this is what I would pray is number
1:12:00
one is that she has trusted the Lord Jesus Christ as her savior.
1:12:05
She has put her faith and trust in the finished work and that she can't buy
1:12:09
her way to heaven by, for example, forgiving Tyler Robinson for assassinating her husband.
1:12:15
That's not going to get her into heaven, right? Right. What's going to get her
1:12:18
into heaven is the blood of Jesus Christ.
1:12:20
I like how Frank Turek said during the funeral service, he says it was not the
1:12:23
sacrifice of Charlie Kirk for his savior that gives him an open door to heaven.
1:12:29
It was the sacrifice of his savior for Charlie Kirk.
1:12:32
And so that's what I would pray for is pray for the leadership of Turning Point
1:12:37
that they don't go into some ecumenical mess.
1:12:39
That they keep a lot of the principles and everything that Charlie Kirk stood for.
1:12:44
His legacy. And they create more boldness in the youth to stand up for their
1:12:50
faith in the Lord Jesus Christ. Pray for her leadership.
1:12:53
Pray for the direction of that company.
1:12:55
That's all we can do. But in the meantime, those of us at the grassroots level,
1:13:00
we need to hit the streets. We need to pass out tracks.
1:13:04
We need to be a better and bolder witness for the Lord Jesus Christ.
1:13:08
Amen to that Alright man, I think this was a good one Appreciate it And until
1:13:15
next time Thank you to the listeners too Any questions, you know where to find us Our email address.
1:13:21
Theimmutableword.gmail.com And we're still working on our website But theimmutableword.com
1:13:28
The perpetual project The perpetual project So hopefully we'll put that to an end But anyways,
1:13:34
appreciate it Thanks for everybody and we'll see everyone next time.