Latest / The Cine-Files / 476 STAND BY ME (1986) Part 2 - The Season of Rob Reiner

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476 STAND BY ME (1986) Part 2 - The Season of Rob Reiner · The Cine-Files

• 0:01
  [SPEAKER_10]: It's like God gave you something, man.
• 0:03
  [SPEAKER_10]: All those stories that you can make up.
• 0:06
  [SPEAKER_10]: And he said, this is what we got for you.
• 0:07
  [SPEAKER_10]: You can try not to lose it.
• 0:09
  [SPEAKER_10]: Kids lose everything unless there's someone that'll look out for them.
• 0:12
  [SPEAKER_10]: And if your parents are too fucked up to do it, then maybe I should.
• 0:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: Hello and welcome once again to the cinephiles where we are continuing our season of Rob Reiner and continuing our exploration of standby me.
• 0:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: My name is Steve Morris, I'm a filmmaker and directing instructor in Los Angeles, California.
• 0:36
  [SPEAKER_12]: Hello, everyone.
• 0:36
  [SPEAKER_12]: My name is John Roca, I'm a writer producer host and voiceover artist here in San Diego, California.
• 0:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: And of course, we could not make the cinephiles without our incredible supporters on Patreon.
• 0:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: You've already heard some of their fantastic questions.
• 0:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're going to be more of their questions in part two.
• 0:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we thank them very much as well as our supporters on Apple podcast, where you can get at free versions of the show.
• 0:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Listen to our cinephiles shorts and, of course, on Patreon, join our advisory board where we are having a big meeting.
• 1:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: As we record this tomorrow,
• 1:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: because John and I don't know what our next movie is and the advisory board's gonna help us pick it.
• 1:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: So that's what can happen if you join the cinephiles advisory board at patreon.com slash the cinephiles.
• 1:14
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, absolutely.
• 1:15
  [SPEAKER_12]: Another way you can support us too is if you listen to the podcast with the ads, if you hear a good service or product that you wanna try out,
• 1:23
  [SPEAKER_12]: definitely use our code when you try them out and sign up there because you're going to big discount and you'll also let those companies know that they should keep coming back and supporting us here on the cine files you're going to hear ads from quints better help the piece core Mars men and true diagnostic and coming up hims will be on back supporting us as well.
• 1:43
  [SPEAKER_12]: So a lot of brands are coming aboard the cine files so please do us a massive favor
• 1:48
  [SPEAKER_12]: and support them and try out their products and services as an indication that you like them sponsoring us here on the cinephiles.
• 1:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Steve, that's very long-winded.
• 1:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's get into part two.
• 1:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I think we should jump right in and where we start and again, it's the soundtrack that great 50 soundtrack that's driving the show.
• 2:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we go right into one of my favorite songs that I sang based on in an Occupella group when I worked at the Lair Summer Camp and that is Book of Love.
• 2:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, good song.
• 2:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: I love that.
• 2:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Great.
• 2:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Great song.
• 2:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we see the guys in the gang are making cobra scars on shoulders with razor blades.
• 2:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: And this is the classic old Hollywood technique where you have a little blood pack behind the razor blade and the person
• 2:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: doing it squeezes the little blood pack that makes it look like there's blood as they're cutting onto the shoulders and in this case I don't think it works very well at all.
• 2:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it looks really clear that there's nobody being cut here.
• 2:52
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, very clear, I agree with you as well.
• 2:54
  [SPEAKER_12]: But you know, it's 1986.
• 2:55
  [SPEAKER_12]: I mean, how much of this and they really perfect in terms of the visual nature of it all.
• 2:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: But yes, agreed.
• 3:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I would have this is this is where if I was the editor, I would be like, you know what, it was a nice idea of cut it.
• 3:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's not quite working.
• 3:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: We don't need it.
• 3:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: And after some, you know, back and forth about hooking up with women and Protestant girls versus Catholic girls, we hear on the radio, a story about the missing kid Ray Brower.
• 3:19
  [SPEAKER_14]: some expanded their efforts to include mutton, Durham, and the outlying areas.
• 3:23
  [SPEAKER_08]: That's what we're going to do.
• 3:24
  [SPEAKER_08]: We're going to be educated.
• 3:25
  [SPEAKER_08]: Kids gone, they're never going to find them.
• 3:27
  [SPEAKER_08]: Not where they're looking.
• 3:28
  [SPEAKER_08]: Hey, I was right, Charlie.
• 3:30
  [SPEAKER_08]: They never going to find them.
• 3:32
  [SPEAKER_12]: We Charlie just can't shut up.
• 3:33
  [SPEAKER_12]: Can't shut up.
• 3:34
  [SPEAKER_12]: There's always that one person in the group.
• 3:36
  [SPEAKER_12]: Just got to talk about everything.
• 3:37
  [SPEAKER_12]: Got to open their mouths and talk and have it opinion.
• 3:39
  [SPEAKER_12]: And can't keep a secret for anything.
• 3:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's true.
• 3:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, when you tell me a secret, I take it to my grave like that one you mentioned about the, yeah, exactly.
• 3:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I'm, I'm on camera too much to have any secrets for God's sake.
• 3:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, yeah, and they start arguing about whether or not you're going to, whether or not they're ever going to find him and finally ace goes, would you to just shut the fuck up?
• 4:05
  [SPEAKER_19]: He's one of you ass was at $2,000 I kid you both.
• 4:08
  [SPEAKER_19]: Jesus.
• 4:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, this is terrible.
• 4:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: What a horrible guy.
• 4:14
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, but I think this is also really smartly done, right?
• 4:17
  [SPEAKER_12]: Like you, if you're not going to, because Ace is not in the movie that off that much, right?
• 4:21
  [SPEAKER_12]: I think it's probably even less than a lecter's time that he's in the movie.
• 4:25
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yet he is a presence every time you see and he is unsettling and chilling every time you see him.
• 4:31
  [SPEAKER_12]: So it's about economy of effort, right?
• 4:34
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's like you take advantage of a little amount of time you have, but you put your best foot forward.
• 4:39
  [SPEAKER_12]: So these scenes are just there to make it very clear how dangerous Ace is to lead us all the way to that confrontation with the Gordi
• 4:54
  [SPEAKER_12]: work and effective to put you in that mindset, you know.
• 4:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great point and I think one of the mistakes that lots of movies make is they're so concerned about building up how awesome their hero is.
• 5:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, they forget it's actually more important to build up a scary villain.
• 5:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: And you like you mentioned a perfect one which is, you know, Hannibal Lecter.
• 5:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 5:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: terrifying.
• 5:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, how much time do we spend learning about Darth Vader?
• 5:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: How much time do we spend building up hunts and die hard?
• 5:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like that's it.
• 5:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so Ace's genuinely scary.
• 5:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: So when Gordy stands up to him at the end, it's genuinely heroic and when Chris stands up to him.
• 5:30
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yes, and you as a director, I'm sure you know this, Steve.
• 5:34
  [SPEAKER_12]: If you cast the right actor, you don't need to put them in the majority of the movie, as the villain.
• 5:41
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's about just get in and get out.
• 5:43
  [SPEAKER_12]: And if the actor delivers it well, the audience is going to be left with that feeling and that the feeling that that presence that evil presence is hanging over the entire film.
• 5:53
  [SPEAKER_14]: From the racks and stacks, it's the best on wax.
• 5:56
  [SPEAKER_14]: If the court adds with lollipop.
• 5:58
  [SPEAKER_12]: I love lollipop.
• 6:04
  [SPEAKER_10]: La la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la la
• 6:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: Repeating the line that the adult says, you know?
• 6:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's what does it mean to be a man?
• 6:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's what does it mean to be a grown-up and enjoying that cigarette after a nice supper is one of those things?
• 6:42
  [SPEAKER_12]: Do you think kids have this nowadays because like everything is available to kids?
• 6:47
  [SPEAKER_12]: I just wonder if they have the same approach to anything, you know, because it's all just so there for them.
• 6:54
  [SPEAKER_12]: That's why I think a lot of the reasons why you see these studies recently about how,
• 6:59
  [SPEAKER_12]: a lot of the younger generation don't want to see nudity or sex scenes in their movies, because it's already available within a click.
• 7:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: So I wonder if the fact that they can get cigarettes alcohol, I'm sorry to say this drugs, at a moment's notice, I wonder if there's anything that is like this taboo thing that they have to do to kind of
• 7:18
  [SPEAKER_12]: imitate being adult or or yeah like cosplay about being an adult because that's what this is smoking the cigarette is like I'm becoming an adult.
• 7:26
  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm understanding what an adult is.
• 7:28
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's not different than putting on your dad shoes when your five years old, you know?
• 7:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, totally.
• 7:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I think it's something, it made me think like, like, I've said many times that I sought out every kung-fu movie I could find so I could watch the fight scenes.
• 7:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: So the fight scenes were drawing me to the kung-fu movie, whether the movie was good or bad.
• 7:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: The same honestly could be said for me from the ages of 11 until 17, if there was gonna be some nudity in it, I wanted to see the movie.
• 7:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
• 7:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's not the case anymore.
• 7:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you know, we talk about all these other reasons why people aren't going to comedies and why people aren't going to films and like, you know, the ubiquity of pornography is actually probably of something that needs to be factored in, you know, 100%.
• 8:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: I will just speak from my experience with my kit.
• 8:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: My kid is not imitating the way that I say things or do so.
• 8:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, he probably is on some levels, but the words that come out of his mouth are all from memes.
• 8:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're all from quotes and things like that.
• 8:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: And frequently, I have no idea what he's saying because I don't know the mean.
• 8:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then he looks at me like, which obviously, I already, I never was cool.
• 8:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was never, at any time in my life, really hip on what was hip, how with my son is just like, he's like, Dad, how can you not know the blank mean?
• 8:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like, I don't spend my day looking at memes.
• 8:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I don't, I'm sorry.
• 8:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 8:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it's funny, too, because now this next moment, I mean, this next scene is amazing scene.
• 8:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because it's, you know, we just had this moment where there, you know, as you said, cost playing their fathers on some levels.
• 8:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now, Gordi says, Just think of where, definitely.
• 9:03
  [SPEAKER_10]: No man seriously.
• 9:05
  [SPEAKER_10]: My word.
• 9:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: which by the way, just the, the courage to ask that question shows the real confidence in the relationship, you know?
• 9:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, agreed.
• 9:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he trusts him, that he trusts him, right?
• 9:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
• 9:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
• 9:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Chris's response is like a universe of wisdom in one line, I think.
• 9:26
  [SPEAKER_10]: You're up at so wide, everybody's worth.
• 9:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, if you're gonna take, there's so many things to take from this movie, but for me, at least everybody's weird is a big one, we're all crazy.
• 9:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: We all don't know what we're doing, we're all feel lost sometime.
• 9:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's only from the outside that everybody looks like they've got it figured out none of us do.
• 9:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: No, no, it's so true.
• 9:45
  [SPEAKER_10]: You ready for school?
• 9:48
  [SPEAKER_10]: You're doing it hard.
• 9:49
  [SPEAKER_10]: You know what that means?
• 9:53
  [SPEAKER_10]: The next year we'll be split up.
• 9:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: What's so interesting about this is, I think Gordi asking if I'm weird, that's been in his heart for a long time.
• 10:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: He wanted to ask this question.
• 10:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's thought about it a lot.
• 10:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think this thing that Chris says about, hey, next year we're going to be split up.
• 10:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's something Gordi's never considered, right?
• 10:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: But Chris has been thinking about this for a long time.
• 10:13
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, it's very similar to Superbette, and I wouldn't be surprised if the guys took this idea from this movie to add that to the Michael Sarah.
• 10:25
  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh god, what's his name?
• 10:27
  [SPEAKER_12]: Jonah Hill.
• 10:28
  [SPEAKER_12]: Relationship in the film because that is the prevalent.
• 10:31
  [SPEAKER_12]: argument throughout the whole movie is we're about to split up next year when we leave high school, right?
• 10:36
  [SPEAKER_12]: That's high school.
• 10:37
  [SPEAKER_12]: This is junior high.
• 10:38
  [SPEAKER_12]: There's different, but like the bones of that are in super bad from what we're seeing here, you know, and you can even argue, Maclovin is Teddy, you can even argue that if you want to go that far.
• 10:46
  [SPEAKER_12]: But like this is the kind of thing where you look at and go, okay, yeah, this is the thing that really happens.
• 10:50
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's very universal.
• 10:51
  [SPEAKER_12]: As he tells us later in the film, the friends you have at that point,
• 10:56
  [SPEAKER_12]: some, you drift apart sometimes, but they'll never have friends like you had friends at 12 years old.
• 11:00
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so these moments are about change.
• 11:02
  [SPEAKER_12]: This is almost like a ritual of adulthood.
• 11:08
  [SPEAKER_12]: Like a half step towards adulthood is separating from friends to move into the next stage of your life.
• 11:15
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I'm not everyone's going to go with you.
• 11:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: I never had the wisdom to see this coming ever and and there was so many times where I had the here's the gang and for me, you know, I think I'm very loyal and like to me like the gang was going to be forever and that wasn't true in elementary school that gang went away and the high school gang kind of stood on but most of them went away a few I stayed contact with right and then we know we had the massive gang
• 11:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the only person I knew who said, hey, this isn't going to last, enjoy what we can was Jeff Johnson when we when you remember when vocal and Ross and Sarah made a this literally two people who are listening out there when you hear stories about this crazy group of friends that once existed in the era of Camelot Mike Vogel, Mike Ross and our friends Sarah Calporthway, they made a documentary about our friendship.
• 12:10
  [SPEAKER_12]: We're the interviewed all of us and that's when Jeff said, hey, enjoy this while because this isn't going to last right because it was right at the cat, it caught us right at the cusp of all of us like trying to establish ourselves in LA trying to establish ourselves.
• 12:27
  [SPEAKER_12]: as adults.
• 12:29
  [SPEAKER_12]: And some of us were older, some of us were younger.
• 12:31
  [SPEAKER_12]: It was like a seven-year age gap.
• 12:34
  [SPEAKER_12]: But it was all right around that time where we were all trying to stop ourselves.
• 12:37
  [SPEAKER_12]: And eventually, people are going to get married.
• 12:39
  [SPEAKER_12]: People are going to have kids, so that Jeff was 100% right on that.
• 12:43
  [SPEAKER_10]: We're talking about what would that happen?
• 12:45
  [SPEAKER_10]: It's not going to be like grandma's school.
• 12:47
  [SPEAKER_10]: That's why we're taking your college courses and we're getting the very low will be in the shop courses with the rest of the retards and making
• 12:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: I really do think Chris has been thinking about this and thinking about this for a long time.
• 13:01
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's such a brilliant element of this character because, you know, he comes from a tough household, clearly.
• 13:10
  [SPEAKER_12]: His brother allowed him to get beat up with his face, put in the asphalt.
• 13:14
  [SPEAKER_12]: He brings a gun to the surface, which doesn't know it's loaded.
• 13:19
  [SPEAKER_12]: But Chris is a sensitive soul.
• 13:21
  [SPEAKER_12]: And sometimes people, as you said, just a few seconds ago, Steve, you judged by what you see, there's more going on.
• 13:29
  [SPEAKER_12]: And Chris, these moments are what make you believe that he did become a lawyer, that he did break out of the situation, because he's not a dummy.
• 13:39
  [SPEAKER_12]: He's a guy who has an empathy for the world.
• 13:42
  [SPEAKER_12]: And no matter what situation he was born into, he was born this way.
• 13:47
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so these exchanges, and later when him and Gordi really have the exchange about if I was your father, I would treat you better, these are these things that he's a lot emotionally smarter than you might anticipate.
• 14:00
  [SPEAKER_12]: And moments like this kind of begin plant the seed of what we're going to see later.
• 14:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was gonna say this later, but I honestly think I think Chris is such a hero.
• 14:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think he is, I honestly think that Chris Chambers might be the closest to Captain America in any realistic movie I can think of.
• 14:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Sure.
• 14:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Is just so deeply committed to justice, to doing what is right, to caring about his friends, to self-sacrifice.
• 14:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's just not, which is why he dies,
• 14:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know what I mean?
• 14:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: But he's not going to see a conflict and not try to step into the middle of it and do the right thing.
• 14:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 14:41
  [SPEAKER_10]: You're going to meet a lot of new guys.
• 14:43
  [SPEAKER_10]: Smart guys.
• 14:45
  [SPEAKER_10]: A little pussy just with you, man.
• 14:46
  [SPEAKER_10]: No, man.
• 14:48
  [SPEAKER_10]: Don't say that.
• 14:48
  [SPEAKER_10]: Don't even think that.
• 14:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: What was he supposed to get it?
• 14:58
  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, then you're an asshole.
• 15:03
  [SPEAKER_12]: I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I
• 15:17
  [SPEAKER_12]: And he's like, if you're not going to be staying here anymore, either going to go to that college or you're going to get your own apartment and then just make a life at Charlottesville, but you're not staying with because I'm not going to help you not go to Florida state and pursue this dream of being an actor, you know, he had to kick me in the ass.
• 15:34
  [SPEAKER_12]: Those are the friends you cherish on so many levels.
• 15:37
  [SPEAKER_12]: You may not like what they're saying at the time that they say to you, but you will really appreciate it later in life, you know?
• 15:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's so funny, because I swear to God, the next note I have in my notes here is Goodwill hunting.
• 15:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I had the exact same thought about this situation.
• 15:52
  [SPEAKER_10]: I feel the same way that you did, and he says,
• 16:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then, you know, it's funny.
• 16:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know how we talked about when we did when Harry Metzalley, how so much of that movie was based on the conversations between Billy and Andy and Nora and Rob about relationships and all the stuff.
• 16:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, all the little interstitial, what I would call the interstitial kid moments, ours, Rob and the writers and Andy and all those people talking about what they talked about when they were kids, what did they, what were the things that obsessed them and this is one of them.
• 16:33
  [SPEAKER_06]: You think my name has to beat up Superman?
• 16:35
  [SPEAKER_06]: What are you?
• 16:35
  [SPEAKER_06]: What?
• 16:36
  [SPEAKER_06]: Why not?
• 16:37
  [SPEAKER_06]: I saw the other day you was carrying five dolphins in one hand.
• 16:41
  [SPEAKER_09]: Boy, you don't know nothing.
• 16:43
  [SPEAKER_09]: My name is a cartoon.
• 16:45
  [SPEAKER_09]: Superman is a real guy.
• 16:46
  [SPEAKER_09]: The way a cartoon could be a real guy.
• 16:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's so much in the logic of that that I'm like, wait, hold on.
• 16:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: What are we saying?
• 16:55
  [SPEAKER_12]: We're still doing.
• 16:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're still having those debates now.
• 16:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Probably.
• 16:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: These are great conversations that we could do, Citafal Shoredon, who could fight who all year if we wanted to.
• 17:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's true.
• 17:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now we're back to Chris and Gordy.
• 17:08
  [SPEAKER_10]: You could be a real writer, somebody, Gordy.
• 17:11
  [SPEAKER_10]: Fuck the writing.
• 17:12
  [SPEAKER_10]: I don't want to be a writer.
• 17:14
  [SPEAKER_10]: It's stupid.
• 17:14
  [SPEAKER_10]: It's a stupid waste of time that you're dad talking.
• 17:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's funny, you know, when we were in a few good men, there were data issues.
• 17:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: We talked a lot about the data issues.
• 17:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
• 17:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the fact is this movie in terms of Rob Riner's relationship with his father is critical.
• 17:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 17:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is a lot of Rob Riner's pain coming out of me.
• 17:35
  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, historically, that's the way the film industry is because it's been so male-dominated.
• 17:39
  [SPEAKER_12]: Father issues are prevalent throughout so many movies for decades.
• 17:43
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I wonder sometimes if women had started the film industry and had been the prevalent voices of making films and it had been a majority-women field, I wonder if the same thing would have been true.
• 17:55
  [SPEAKER_12]: Would we have seen mother daughter
• 17:58
  [SPEAKER_12]: issue, would you seen mother issues?
• 18:00
  [SPEAKER_12]: Because we rarely get those films like postcards from the edge, there's only a few of those that really kind of form other daughter issues, Augusto Sage County, which is your Magnolia's, you know?
• 18:10
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, so like that's the prevalent nature of a lot of films, and it's because it's a predominantly male-dominated
• 18:17
  [SPEAKER_12]: feel for so many years, you know.
• 18:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, this is, you know, I know people get pissed off of us when we talk about, but this is why we talk about representation matters and the thing is there's there's all these stories.
• 18:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's not that they're not stories there.
• 18:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
• 18:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's not it's they're just as many stories and they're just as rich as the story is it is all the daddy issue movies we've talked about.
• 18:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Of course, you know, and daddy issues with
• 18:45
  [SPEAKER_10]: I don't know how your dad feels about you.
• 18:47
  [SPEAKER_10]: He doesn't give a shit about you.
• 18:48
  [SPEAKER_10]: Danny was the one he cared about.
• 18:50
  [SPEAKER_10]: And don't try to tell me different.
• 18:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: Which, first of all, that's top man.
• 18:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Those are tough words.
• 18:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 18:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Your dad doesn't give a shit about you.
• 18:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: He only cared about your brother.
• 19:00
  [SPEAKER_12]: Feel like Chris has been holding onto this for a bit.
• 19:03
  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh yeah.
• 19:03
  [SPEAKER_12]: And now with the idea that Gordi is like that,
• 19:07
  [SPEAKER_12]: Gordy's father has shamed him so hard that now he doesn't even want to be a writer, which I think Chris is secretly always loved about Gordy, is an artistic or creative nature.
• 19:15
  [SPEAKER_12]: To have his, but to hear that his father, he, the, he, the words coming out of Gordy, this father would tell him, I think this pisses Chris off.
• 19:23
  [SPEAKER_12]: to motivate him to say this stuff to him and pull all the balls down.
• 19:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you know, we all have moments with our friends where, you know, the elephant is in the room.
• 19:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: We all know what's going on and nobody's voicing it and Chris has the courage to voice it.
• 19:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 19:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then this next line.
• 19:39
  [SPEAKER_10]: You're just a kid, Booty.
• 19:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, when a kid, another kid tells you you're just a kid.
• 19:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I just, like, as a person who always is a kid who wasn't the oldest, felt older than everybody, I get where Chris is coming from.
• 19:54
  [SPEAKER_10]: Oh, gee, thanks, Dad.
• 19:56
  [SPEAKER_10]: She's the hell I was your dad.
• 19:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: Man, I mean, Chris Chambers.
• 20:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's sincere.
• 20:02
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, of course it is.
• 20:03
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
• 20:04
  [SPEAKER_12]: He loves Gordy.
• 20:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
• 20:06
  [SPEAKER_12]: Not in the romantic sense, but in the sense of a human being, loving another human being, and he wants what's best for him, and he hates that he's seen what Gordy's father has done to him and beat him down.
• 20:18
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so he's pushing back on him as hard as he can to get Gordy to stand back up and embrace who he really is.
• 20:25
  [SPEAKER_12]: And him saying that I wish I was your dad,
• 20:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's that kind of thing that's like, whoa, it's not just that Chris sees Gordy in a way that Gordy's father can't and won't.
• 20:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: But he actually does know what's best recording on some level, Gordy would be terrible if Gordy didn't pursue writing.
• 20:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: That would be awful.
• 20:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: He needs Chris to tell him that.
• 20:45
  [SPEAKER_10]: Like God gave you something, man.
• 20:47
  [SPEAKER_10]: All those stories that you can make up.
• 20:49
  [SPEAKER_10]: And he said, this is what we got for it.
• 20:50
  [SPEAKER_10]: You can try not to lose it.
• 20:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a whole philosophy of life right there.
• 20:54
  [SPEAKER_10]: kids lose everything unless there's someone that'll look out for them.
• 20:58
  [SPEAKER_10]: And if your parents are too fucked up to do it, then maybe I should.
• 21:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Chris frames himself as an adult, even though he's a kid.
• 21:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: Really powerful.
• 21:06
  [SPEAKER_12]: Now, let's compare this, and this is a currenting me in the moment right now, to the scene we just saw with Ace.
• 21:14
  [SPEAKER_12]: Ace is berating the guys, controlling the guys, insulting the guys, threatening their lives for a few thousand dollars, and this is how he implements control.
• 21:26
  [SPEAKER_12]: Why?
• 21:27
  [SPEAKER_12]: Because he's insecure, he's ignorant, he's angry, and he's dumb.
• 21:33
  [SPEAKER_12]: And this is how he rules.
• 21:35
  [SPEAKER_12]: Now he may be smart in knowing how to rule these guys, but he's not smart-ailed in the real world.
• 21:41
  [SPEAKER_12]: Chris, as the leader of this gang, is caring and empathetic and delivering tough love and wants what's best for them, saves Teddy.
• 21:51
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, I messes with Vroom, but that'll come later, who do something good.
• 21:54
  [SPEAKER_12]: But with Gordon in this moment, it's really critical.
• 21:56
  [SPEAKER_12]: He is stepping up.
• 21:57
  [SPEAKER_12]: and using his responsibility as the leader of this gang to get through the accordion to be himself.
• 22:03
  [SPEAKER_12]: He isn't trying to be rate-gordies trying to uplift accordion.
• 22:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: Why?
• 22:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: Chris Chris is intelligent.
• 22:07
  [SPEAKER_12]: Chris is empathetic.
• 22:08
  [SPEAKER_12]: He is caring.
• 22:10
  [SPEAKER_12]: That matters.
• 22:11
  [SPEAKER_12]: And that's the difference in who is a good leader and it was a shit leader.
• 22:15
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I think that's, I think the movie on purpose is constructed to show you the difference dream, A's leading is gang and Chris leading again, you know?
• 22:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Great, great points.
• 22:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think for the, yeah, I totally agree.
• 22:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think for A's, the gang exists to serve his ego.
• 22:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
• 22:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Chris exists to serve his friends.
• 22:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, yes.
• 22:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that is negative, this ego stroke.
• 22:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's a, it's a complete, fundamentally different world view.
• 22:42
  [SPEAKER_09]: Yep.
• 22:43
  [SPEAKER_09]: Come on, you guys, let's get moving.
• 22:45
  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, by the time we get there, the kid won't even be dead anymore.
• 22:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we go into another, another banger of a classic, which is Buddy Holly's every day.
• 22:53
  [SPEAKER_19]: Every day, it's a getting closer.
• 22:56
  [SPEAKER_12]: Great remake by James Taylor.
• 22:58
  [SPEAKER_12]: If you've never heard the great remake, I have heard James.
• 23:00
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, that's great.
• 23:01
  [SPEAKER_12]: And that's why I'm here, Alba.
• 23:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Wow, bro, bro, James Taylor, bro.
• 23:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's one of the most lovely voices in the world and I had I always thought of him as this incredibly together guy and so I looked into his autobiography and heard heard like, oh my god, he's doing heroin I also only only then did I find out like the whole he got discovered by making a phone call into someone who got him into Abby road where he met the Beatles.
• 23:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's crazy is like yeah.
• 23:30
  [SPEAKER_12]: And stayed friends with them.
• 23:31
  [SPEAKER_12]: But would you Harrison for the rest of his life?
• 23:33
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, there's nobody I've seen more on stage than James Taylor.
• 23:37
  [SPEAKER_12]: I've seen him I think eight times in college.
• 23:39
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I don't go to concerts.
• 23:40
  [SPEAKER_12]: That tells you how much I love that.
• 23:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: I've seen him once and it was fantastic.
• 23:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: It was, right?
• 23:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, it's so good.
• 23:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: And his backup singer, sir, amazing.
• 23:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's just a great experience.
• 23:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now we've reached probably among the most famous scenes in the movie, which we were at, The Tressel.
• 23:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Um, and this is shot in Reading, California.
• 24:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's genuinely a hundred feet above the water.
• 24:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: This threshold, it was very scary.
• 24:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the camera goes up and up revealing just how high up they are, how big this bridge is.
• 24:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the first question they ask is a very important one.
• 24:16
  [SPEAKER_09]: Any of you guys know next story is doing it.
• 24:19
  [SPEAKER_09]: We could go down to the root 136 bridge.
• 24:21
  [SPEAKER_09]: What are you crazy?
• 24:23
  [SPEAKER_09]: That's five miles down the river.
• 24:24
  [SPEAKER_09]: You walk five miles down the river.
• 24:26
  [SPEAKER_09]: You gotta walk five miles back.
• 24:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Teddy is determined to go.
• 24:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, of course.
• 24:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Vurn doesn't want to.
• 24:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think Gordie is wavering.
• 24:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: But the moment that Chris decides to go, that's it.
• 24:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they start to go.
• 24:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Gordie reaches down and feels the tracks.
• 24:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: Which seems like a smart thing to do.
• 24:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't seem like it's very effective.
• 24:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: beautiful shot from the side as they walk.
• 24:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: By the way, there was a a trestle in Stephen King's neighborhood growing up and it was a very important right of passage for kids to cross it.
• 24:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is one of the first sequences that Rob Reiner really storyboarded out.
• 25:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: They needed to know exactly what the shots were to construct this whole thing.
• 25:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Um, when you're looking at the really far wide shots, those are stunt doubles on the actual trestle when we're in close ups, they're just, they're not on the trestle at all, you know, they're just walking somewhere else.
• 25:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then they also need to do the same trick we talk about before, which is extremely long lenses like a, I think it's a, hmm, forget what it is.
• 25:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's a 600 millimeter lens that gives you the sense when the train comes that is much closer than it is.
• 25:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's all those techniques that are being used.
• 25:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Chris and Teddy are pulling ahead, Gordy is behind, um, and in it, a vurn is crawling across the bridge.
• 25:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: And there's actually a deleted scene that explains this, which is in the deleted scenes, Teddy is kind of goofing, unsurprisingly, as he's going across the bridge, starts walking backwards, doesn't realize there's a slap missing, falls through the bridge.
• 26:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: and Chris saves his life.
• 26:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it is seen that that makes vurn start crawling across the bridge.
• 26:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm not sure why they cut it.
• 26:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: I have some theories of maybe why they cut it, but I, it might just be like something we talked about when we did jaws, which is the excitement and the drama of that might have taken away some of the excitement from the actual train coming.
• 26:23
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, it makes sense.
• 26:24
  [SPEAKER_12]: I could see it that way for sure.
• 26:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then as vurn crawls, the comb falls out of his pocket.
• 26:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Chris, we're still, and I think they do a really good job slowly setting this up and having the tension build as they're slowly moving across the rail again, Gordy reaches down the field the rail and then he looks back and now we see the smoke and he stands up at slowmo and yells.
• 26:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Teddy and Chris run, Gordie gets vurn up and they run.
• 26:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is a rear projection process shot, which is really kind of, you can pretty much tell.
• 27:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: And vurn and Gordie are running and crying.
• 27:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the train is coming and Teddy and Chris are make it there and their screaming for them to go.
• 27:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: The train is getting closer.
• 27:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're running, we're screaming.
• 27:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now we are in that 600 millimeter lens.
• 27:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: So the train is looks like it's right on top of them.
• 27:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: It actually hasn't even come on the trussle yet.
• 27:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: That is how far away from them it is.
• 27:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Wow, it's super far away, and here's the thing.
• 27:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Rob Reiner needed them to be really, really scared by super scared and emotional and they did take after take.
• 27:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the kids were just running, you know, and they were trying to act scared, but they just couldn't get there.
• 27:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: So Rob Reiner, who we have been discussing through the whole season of Rob Reiner as the sweetest, nicest, most supportive director in the world
• 27:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: He says, and he's going, like, I don't want to actually scare them about the train.
• 27:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want them to feel physically safe, but I want them emotionally upset, so he comes up to them and he says, listen, listen, you kids and he yells at them and says, these guys are been pulling this dolly for this dolly shot all day because you kids can't do this job right.
• 28:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like they are exhausted, the only reason we're still doing this shot is because you
• 28:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they said they were genuinely scared.
• 28:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: And in the last thing he says to them, he says, and you don't have to worry about the train coming after you, because if you have one more bad take, I'm gonna come after you.
• 28:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
• 28:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
• 28:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: For Rob Reiner.
• 28:39
  [SPEAKER_12]: That is, that is big.
• 28:40
  [SPEAKER_12]: And listen, don't get a twisted.
• 28:42
  [SPEAKER_12]: We've seen, you know, Rob in films where he plays, I guess somebody who can be a little, yeah.
• 28:48
  [SPEAKER_12]: you know, hard.
• 28:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah.
• 28:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they immediately start crying as soon as they start crying, Rob says roll camera.
• 28:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: They do the take.
• 28:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: It is fantastic.
• 28:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the thing that they said right after the take, um, uh, J. O'Connell and will we run up to Rob Reiner super happy.
• 29:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 29:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they say to him, did you see what I did?
• 29:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was really crying back there.
• 29:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I was really crying.
• 29:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was really crying.
• 29:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was
• 29:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Rob said, you know what he said is he said, if he's any good as a director, it's because he wasn't actor.
• 29:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
• 29:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, and what he says is, you know, it's like having a coach who has actually played the game.
• 29:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like if you asked a player to make a 20 foot jump shot, you should be able to make a 20 foot jump shot.
• 29:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 29:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: And this is, I think I said before, this is the acting moment for Will Wheaton where he understood what an actor's director was, what it meant to be an actor, what that was really about.
• 29:44
  [SPEAKER_12]: Hey man, uh, Jerry, when they're running, the screaming and the crying, all of it.
• 29:49
  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm just like, oh, caught up in what they're doing.
• 29:52
  [SPEAKER_12]: Actually, it struck me how believable it was when I was watching it for our show.
• 29:56
  [SPEAKER_12]: So yeah, whatever Rob did, it was affected.
• 29:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: So they just, of course, in time, make it off the tracks, fall down the hill, and dust, and then we hear, hey, at least now we know when the next train was due.
• 30:10
  [SPEAKER_12]: By the way, I want, you know, Steve, I used to do a lot of conversations on our show about symbolism, symbolism, symbolism, symbolism.
• 30:18
  [SPEAKER_12]: I don't always, I don't do it as often as I have past, but I will say this, then having a conversation about,
• 30:26
  [SPEAKER_12]: You taking shop classes, we're gonna be breaking up.
• 30:29
  [SPEAKER_12]: The train here clearly symbolizes impending adulthood, impending change, right?
• 30:35
  [SPEAKER_12]: Coming through separating the four of them, you know?
• 30:39
  [SPEAKER_12]: So I think that's why the train scene happens here.
• 30:44
  [SPEAKER_12]: because it's almost meant to underline this idea that things are about to change and the train of change is coming.
• 30:52
  [SPEAKER_12]: And you can get out of the way, but it's still gonna come through, you know.
• 30:56
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so I think that's what symbolic in this moment.
• 31:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that totally works.
• 31:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I will give my own symbolism, make sure one, which is because to me, it's sort of man plans, God laughs.
• 31:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: Any attempt you have to think you can control the universe, you can't.
• 31:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Things are always going to come that is the unexpected is always coming and will always mess things up, you know?
• 31:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah.
• 31:21
  [SPEAKER_12]: And again, as I said, the beginning of our discussion, burn was right.
• 31:25
  [SPEAKER_12]: They should have gone around.
• 31:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's true.
• 31:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, okay, so of course crossing over on that that was dangerous and stupid and they shouldn't have done it.
• 31:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, but I also know in every one of my road trips, every one of my journeys, there is some fucking stupid thing where you where things could have gone really south and of course those of what make those journeys memorable too, you know, yeah, but only because you're
• 31:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now we cut to them at the campfire just as you said talking about how they almost died and making jokes about it, then we see Vern to say that marshmallow and they're like vurn you got to turn it over and you got to sell it like it and it drops into the fire and man.
• 32:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think to see marshmallows and in particular trying to make it some more is like the perfect example of reality never matching up to the fantasy you have.
• 32:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: I had so many marshmallows catch on fire and some more things where it slid off the thing and it never works out like it's supposed to.
• 32:26
  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm with you.
• 32:27
  [SPEAKER_12]: That's why I'm a terrible chef and you're a great chef.
• 32:32
  [SPEAKER_12]: I would always lose the marshmallows.
• 32:35
  [SPEAKER_12]: You took that lesson in your head.
• 32:37
  [SPEAKER_12]: I can be better at it.
• 32:38
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I took the lesson.
• 32:39
  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm never going to be good at this.
• 32:40
  [SPEAKER_12]: So I do the bare minimum.
• 32:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think you give me a lot of credit because I don't think I ever got better at the making some more thing.
• 32:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I did get better at other cooking things.
• 32:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's exactly.
• 32:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was using a George Foreman girl.
• 32:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: No, I'm Joe.
• 32:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: But for a man just to get the marshmallow back and then it's later.
• 32:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: And as they said, they're smoking their Winston's after supper.
• 33:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: By the way, this is all this stuff.
• 33:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: All this nighttime stuff is all indoors on a set.
• 33:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, and the reason it's all indoors on a set is because child actor laws, you can only work them so many times.
• 33:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it's much easier to deal with that in the daytime.
• 33:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: So these are all day shoots, which is why we're shooting it indoors.
• 33:17
  [SPEAKER_03]: That makes sense.
• 33:18
  [SPEAKER_10]: Hey Gordon, what does it tell us the story?
• 33:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: The nature of that question tells us that this is something that's happened many times.
• 33:26
  [SPEAKER_07]: Goody telling them a story.
• 33:30
  [SPEAKER_07]: No one here in the horror stories.
• 33:31
  [SPEAKER_07]: I'm not up for that man.
• 33:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's just a very subtle reminder that this is Stephen King, you know?
• 33:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 33:37
  [SPEAKER_12]: Good point, yes, yeah.
• 33:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think this whole scene is Stephen King, but yes, we'll get to this.
• 33:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, 100% I agree, yeah.
• 33:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Gordy says, and this is obvious that he's been thinking about this story for a while, because he has it ready.
• 33:49
  [SPEAKER_10]: Well, the one I've been thinking about to kind of different, it's about this patent contest.
• 33:54
  [SPEAKER_10]: The main guy's stories is that kid that nobody likes named David Hogan.
• 33:58
  [SPEAKER_07]: And again, we have people chiming in.
• 34:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's such dynamics of groups and when I'm telling stories, there's always someone type it in, you know, like that.
• 34:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now we're going into, I think this arguably is the most famous sequence in the movie.
• 34:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it's funny, I don't love the sequence and everybody loves it and I'm not saying anything negative, I don't have any negative say about it, but it is not
• 34:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, and maybe because I was the fat kid and so I don't, you know, the fat kid maybe because and you know what else maybe because I'm not a revenge guy, you know, you know, those two things kind of conspire to give me very powerful and I love this.
• 34:43
  [SPEAKER_10]: Well, kiddies are age, but he's fat, real fat.
• 34:47
  [SPEAKER_10]: He weighs close to one, but, you know, it's not as fault.
• 34:50
  [SPEAKER_10]: It's as glams.
• 34:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: And again, Verne pipes in with something about his cousin?
• 34:54
  [SPEAKER_10]: Well, all the kids, instead of calling him David, they call him Lardas, Lardas Hogan.
• 35:00
  [SPEAKER_10]: Even as little brother and sister calling him Lardas, but one day it's 90, the greatest revenge idea.
• 35:09
  [SPEAKER_10]: A kid ever had.
• 35:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a good, you can almost read the paragraph
• 35:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now we cut to, and I remember seeing the movie for the first time, and it's so unexpected that we're going to go into the story.
• 35:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we have the announcer who's bringing up all the contestants in the pioneering contents.
• 35:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: We see the principal.
• 35:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: We see the whole town is gathered and including the, like the loyal order of the Antelope with their, with their antlers.
• 35:37
  [SPEAKER_14]: A new cover to the fight, but what do we expect great things from in the future?
• 35:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Young Master David Hogan.
• 35:48
  [SPEAKER_08]: You've got a big appetite, Lord Ish.
• 35:51
  [SPEAKER_08]: Don't even think about winning this.
• 35:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: And this gentleman who takes this contest extremely serious is a character named Bill Travis.
• 36:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: John, can you tell us about the actor who plays him?
• 36:02
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, this is played by Dick Durak, who sadly passed away in 2009.
• 36:06
  [SPEAKER_12]: But he was in over 80 films and over 700 television episodes.
• 36:12
  [SPEAKER_12]: That's incredible.
• 36:13
  [SPEAKER_12]: He played swap thing.
• 36:15
  [SPEAKER_12]: in the DC Comics film in 1982 and the return of Swamp Thing in 1989 and even played it in the series, the Swamp Thing TV series.
• 36:25
  [SPEAKER_12]: He's six foot six tall and he was in a number of Clint Eastwood films like The Enforcer in any of which way you can.
• 36:31
  [SPEAKER_12]: But Steve, you and I might really know him.
• 36:35
  [SPEAKER_12]: for playing fries creature in two episodes of the incredible Hulk.
• 36:39
  [SPEAKER_12]: Who is fries creature?
• 36:41
  [SPEAKER_12]: He was the other Hulk that Hulk fought with the skinny with the messed up hair and the rarer.
• 36:47
  [SPEAKER_12]: That is Dick Durak and make up as the other Hulk, the anti-Hulk show I say, that he fought for two episodes in the show.
• 36:55
  [SPEAKER_12]: And when I found that out, I was like, oh my god, because that look has stayed with me since I was a kid.
• 37:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: That creature has freaked me out since I was a kid.
• 37:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: I love that piece of information.
• 37:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's funny.
• 37:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: There are a whole bunch of TV shows that I adored when I was a kid, but I know better than to ever try to rewatch again.
• 37:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: Dukes of hazard being probably at the top of that list.
• 37:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: I loved it.
• 37:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: I thought it was the coolest show in the world.
• 37:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Don't ever go back.
• 37:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: My feeling is I think incredible whole, because it was kind of serious.
• 37:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: I've never watched it since I was a kid.
• 37:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I bet parts of it hold up.
• 37:28
  [SPEAKER_12]: I have watched episodes as recently as last year, and I was blown away in how much of it still holds up the right.
• 37:36
  [SPEAKER_12]: And there are versions of it that have been up-res, so it looks kind of HD, whatever the term may be, but it looks HD.
• 37:41
  [SPEAKER_12]: And you're able to appreciate it even more so of what they do.
• 37:44
  [SPEAKER_12]: And Bill Bixby's performance is still damn good.
• 37:47
  [SPEAKER_12]: And some of the storylines you like feel the ache and the pain of him in almost every episode of what he's dealing with.
• 37:54
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's amazing that it still holds up.
• 37:57
  [SPEAKER_12]: is the theme song on your TV theme song mixed tape 100%.
• 38:02
  [SPEAKER_12]: Both the opening and the ending, because the opening is the ending event.
• 38:06
  [SPEAKER_12]: And then Tantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantantant
• 38:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think we're going to do something some kind of a short or something on Patreon exclusive to go through this mix tape and discuss because I think it'll be I think it'll be totally fun.
• 38:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: I would have so much fun doing that with you.
• 38:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he is the many times champion.
• 38:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think this is his claim to fame is that he is the guy who can win the piloting contest.
• 38:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
• 38:40
  [SPEAKER_14]: Boy are you fat.
• 38:43
  [SPEAKER_14]: Don't pay any attention to those fools, Lardaz, David.
• 38:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then as Lardaz, so I started to call him Lardaz.
• 38:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha
• 39:12
  [SPEAKER_13]: Hey, water, drown out, water, water, go!
• 39:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now, I am not clear about the rules exactly of this piety and contest, but they've seen pretty thin.
• 39:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 39:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: They don't have to finish the pie.
• 39:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: They just need to certain amounts and whenever they say done, they give them another pie.
• 39:29
  [SPEAKER_12]: The old man with the flag checks to make sure you've eaten the pie.
• 39:33
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's not even than one of those,
• 39:35
  [SPEAKER_12]: What I used to do when I was in CrossFit, you see you've got a judge at every station.
• 39:38
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yes, you've done all the number, acquired number of reps, rather, correctly.
• 39:44
  [SPEAKER_12]: And then you can move on to the next thing.
• 39:45
  [SPEAKER_12]: That's essentially what's happening.
• 39:46
  [SPEAKER_12]: But yeah, they're not eating the cross.
• 39:48
  [SPEAKER_12]: They're just eating the middle and going on to the next thing, which I didn't know that would part of a fighting.
• 39:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: No, again, I will say I do not think this or they're following any clearly defined rules here.
• 39:59
  [SPEAKER_10]: You understand that, was that Lara's wasn't really interested in what he did.
• 40:04
  [SPEAKER_10]: what he wanted was revenge.
• 40:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then we go a flashback within this to right before the contest where we see him pull out a giant bottle of castroil and start chugging it.
• 40:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: Castroil was never a thing I had to do and it's mostly, I don't think kids have to do it anymore at all but it sounds horrible.
• 40:23
  [SPEAKER_12]: I have never saw it in the cartoons.
• 40:26
  [SPEAKER_12]: I have never liked it was a real thing.
• 40:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh no, it's a real thing.
• 40:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is how they got you to clean out your system.
• 40:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: So you like, you know, before you go to a colonoscopy, it's that was this version of that.
• 40:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
• 40:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
• 40:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he chugs that down and then opens up a rug, which this actor really had to do, drop the rug and his mouth and eat that.
• 40:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: So nasty, super nasty, we go back and again, Logan is continuing to go through pie after pie.
• 40:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: The big competitor to the X-Champ, he's getting really worried about this.
• 41:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is looking like a real problem.
• 41:04
  [SPEAKER_04]: Fiving into his fifth pie, Lord has began to imagine that he was a feeding point.
• 41:09
  [SPEAKER_04]: He pretended he was eating cowflops and rack guts and blueberries saw.
• 41:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: By the way, the pies were donated by a local bakery in the town in Oregon, and every year that town has a standby mean festival where there is, of course, a pie eating contest.
• 41:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
• 41:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: Have you ever done a pie eating contest?
• 41:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I have not.
• 41:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I have never done an actual real eating contest.
• 41:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: You have things like it camp, or it's like who could eat the most tacos, but I have not actually done any serious competitive eating.
• 41:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, put 26 eggs in your mouth or whatever.
• 41:38
  [SPEAKER_12]: What was before?
• 41:40
  [SPEAKER_12]: I have not had Luke.
• 41:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: It was 50 eggs.
• 41:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm almost positive to me.
• 41:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: 50 eggs.
• 41:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 41:46
  [SPEAKER_12]: I did two or three eating contests.
• 41:50
  [SPEAKER_12]: I was terrible at them because although I, well, you know, was a fat kid growing up, it's not because I was eating a shit ton of stuff.
• 41:58
  [SPEAKER_12]: I just would eat bad stuff.
• 42:01
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so when I tried to do those, but I was like, I was blown away in the first few,
• 42:06
  [SPEAKER_12]: first round rather you know I never got out of the first round because I was amazed at how many people and you know what you know who ate the most the fucking skinny kids which was even more of a mine fuck when you were sitting there go like how come I can't eat as much as the skinny kid can put away you know so it's crazy as a fat person
• 42:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:23
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great proportion.
• 42:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: I do not eat that much more or even any more than most people.
• 42:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I just get fatter with the same food and so like And the idea that I mean it is so documented.
• 42:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: I bet I bet if you look at a competitive eating I'm sure there are some big fat guys that are great at competitive eating but that is not the determining factor on who can win a competitive eating contest look at Joanne A
• 43:07
  [SPEAKER_12]: or Joe Chestnut, whatever his name is, Joe Chestnut, the hot dog eating guy, he is skinny as fuck, and he eats like 75 hot dogs, and he is dipping the bread in water.
• 43:17
  [SPEAKER_12]: That's how he's doing it and shoving it like 70 DM hot dogs.
• 43:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's insane.
• 43:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's insane.
• 43:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: The guy who invented that whose name I think is Koyashi, and Japanese guy, tiny, tiny, yeah, anyway.
• 43:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Back to Lardass.
• 43:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'll just call him Lardass.
• 43:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's the thing in the movie.
• 43:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: I feel bad about it, but I'm going to keep calling him that.
• 43:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: I love the sounds of his stomach as the castor oil and raw egg starts to work.
• 43:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's magic.
• 43:43
  [SPEAKER_16]: And before Bill Travis knew it, he was covered with five pies with a few blueberries.
• 43:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now, this is clearly a vomit hose, you know, like they're not making any, there is no, I think I actually think it probably works better because they didn't really try to do realistic vomiting, if they did realistic vomiting, it would make a sick, but because it's so ridiculous, I don't think it makes too many people sick in the audience.
• 44:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Also, because the child is telling the story.
• 44:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it makes it a little less, yeah.
• 44:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: By the way, in case you're interested, the vomit is a mix of blueberry pie filling and large curd cottage cheese.
• 44:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we hear the narration is great and the visual is just over the top and ridiculous.
• 44:26
  [SPEAKER_16]: Girlfriend's Barth on Boyfriend's kids Barth on a parent, a fat lady, Barth in her purse.
• 44:32
  [SPEAKER_16]: The daughter leads with Barth on each other and the women's auxiliary Barth all over the benevolent order of analogs.
• 44:39
  [SPEAKER_16]: And Marta's just sat back and enjoyed what he created.
• 44:44
  [SPEAKER_16]: A complete and total Barth for Ramma.
• 44:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: which you can again see the paragraph and that that is the last line in the short story as Gordy will write it when he writes this thing down.
• 44:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: If he hasn't already.
• 44:57
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
• 44:58
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I wonder if this was like a throwaway story that King had written just early in life and threw it into this story or if it was created for the film, I don't know, but it's really well done.
• 45:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: I wish I knew the answer to that.
• 45:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's a great, that's a great question.
• 45:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because certainly I'm sure Stephen King is perfectly willing to recycle old material that never found a home.
• 45:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we're back at the campfire and the kids absolutely cheer.
• 45:25
  [SPEAKER_10]: And then that was the best, just the best.
• 45:28
  [SPEAKER_14]: That would happen.
• 45:30
  [SPEAKER_10]: What do you mean?
• 45:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: as a writer, as a person who tells stories, what is about to happen in this scene?
• 45:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, it's exactly the way it is.
• 45:39
  [SPEAKER_12]: This is absolutely Stephen King and Rob Reiner taking his comic critics.
• 45:44
  [SPEAKER_12]: 100% this whole section of the scene is that.
• 45:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I want to point out what's so important is they all cheered when the story ended.
• 45:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Of course, they didn't, they didn't dislike anything about the story.
• 45:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: They love the story, and now they are post-hawk, finding ways to find fault with it, and it's just the worst.
• 46:05
  [SPEAKER_09]: What do you mean what happened?
• 46:06
  [SPEAKER_09]: That's me, isn't it?
• 46:08
  [SPEAKER_09]: How can that be the end?
• 46:09
  [SPEAKER_09]: What kind of an ending is that?
• 46:10
  [SPEAKER_09]: What happened to Lara?
• 46:13
  [SPEAKER_10]: I don't know.
• 46:14
  [SPEAKER_10]: Maybe what home and celebrated with a couple of cheeseburgers.
• 46:18
  [SPEAKER_11]: Jesus.
• 46:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: That sucks.
• 46:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like, that wasn't the ending.
• 46:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: He gave you the ending and you cheered.
• 46:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and at this moment, talk about talk about reveal a little bit too much.
• 46:32
  [SPEAKER_11]: Don't you make it to that, so that Lawrence goes home.
• 46:34
  [SPEAKER_11]: and he shoots his father, and he runs away, and he joins the Texas Rangers.
• 46:39
  [SPEAKER_11]: How about that?
• 46:40
  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh, that's a completely different story, Teddy.
• 46:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: A completely different story.
• 46:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: Then, again, this is exactly the kind of total non-sequitor note or comment you get from people when you give them your story that they loved.
• 46:56
  [SPEAKER_06]: But there's one thing I didn't understand.
• 46:58
  [SPEAKER_06]: Did Lardas have to pay to get in the contest?
• 47:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is a YouTube comment that I'd come to life.
• 47:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh my god, yes, exactly.
• 47:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is what it is.
• 47:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like nobody bumped on this.
• 47:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: Nobody had a problem with this.
• 47:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then what can happen in what happens on the YouTube comment is someone goes, oh yeah, and then 30 people are saying it.
• 47:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
• 47:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now someone has to, and this is on like a trailer.
• 47:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now the studio has to have a meeting whether they have to add a scene where the Lord has paid to get in the contest to explain the way this thing that nobody bought was bothered by.
• 47:31
  [SPEAKER_18]: and talked into the night.
• 47:33
  [SPEAKER_18]: A kind of talk that seemed important until you discover girls.
• 47:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then this is just what we're talking about before with the Mickey Mouse and Superman thing, which is where they're talking about, you know, the stuff.
• 47:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 47:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I want to separate them out.
• 47:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: So we make a joke about the $64,000 question being fixed.
• 47:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: I love the line.
• 47:49
  [SPEAKER_08]: Why you're trying to really cool show?
• 47:52
  [SPEAKER_08]: Did you ever notice that they never get anywhere?
• 47:55
  [SPEAKER_08]: I don't know.
• 47:55
  [SPEAKER_08]: Just keep why you're training.
• 47:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: But the throughline of this is a discussion that I do feel that we have to comment on.
• 48:02
  [SPEAKER_10]: All right.
• 48:03
  [SPEAKER_10]: All right.
• 48:03
  [SPEAKER_10]: Mickey's a mouse, Donald's a duck, who does a dog?
• 48:08
  [SPEAKER_10]: What's goofy?
• 48:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they have some serious conversation, which ends with them trying to figure out like, why is goofy wearing clothes and why is he doing this?
• 48:17
  [SPEAKER_06]: God, that's weird.
• 48:19
  [SPEAKER_06]: What the hell is goofy?
• 48:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: I believe they're asking the wrong question.
• 48:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, okay.
• 48:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think the question is what's Pluto?
• 48:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because they live in a world where ducks and mice have houses and cars and where clothes.
• 48:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's nothing unusual about goofy being a dog wearing a clothes.
• 48:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's what everyone in this world is.
• 48:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, Pluto is a dog who has been stripped of his clothes and is being treated as a slave.
• 48:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: That is what I think is going on.
• 48:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: If dogs are sentient, then Pluto can have a job.
• 48:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, goofy can have a job, then what's going on with Pluto?
• 48:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: That to me is the big question.
• 48:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
• 48:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 48:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's what I'm saying.
• 48:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's just a dog who enjoys being in service of Mickey Mouse.
• 49:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, sure.
• 49:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: So he's, he's happier that way.
• 49:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Is that what you're saying?
• 49:03
  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm saying, well, I don't think I would call him this way.
• 49:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: That's sure, but I think he's, yes, I think he's, I mean, you don't catch Pluto going, I don't like living this life or anything like that, you know, you never catch him push.
• 49:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, are there two, are there two species of dogs?
• 49:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: One that can talk and drive and do all sorts of things and another species of dog, which can't.
• 49:25
  [SPEAKER_12]: I just recently watched the dinosaurs.
• 49:27
  [SPEAKER_12]: on Netflix, the new one with no, yeah, evolution buddy.
• 49:31
  [SPEAKER_12]: That's evolution.
• 49:32
  [SPEAKER_12]: I think there are two parts of them.
• 49:34
  [SPEAKER_12]: I think, but that the question is, does Goofy look down on Pluto?
• 49:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know that's evolved.
• 49:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's why I go.
• 49:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's the Pluto issue that's really the book of the weird one to me, not the Goofy one.
• 49:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the thing is, it's not just that our characters are having a great time in the scene.
• 49:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is an important coming of age time for our actors as well in their bonding.
• 49:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: And
• 49:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Things are happening in both good ways, and maybe we would say not so good ways for instance River Phoenix lost his virginity while shooting standby me.
• 50:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Cory Feldman had his first beer while shooting standby me and both River Phoenix and Cory Feldman started smoking weed on the set of standby me.
• 50:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ooh.
• 50:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 50:16
  [SPEAKER_12]: Who gave them weed?
• 50:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: Who gave these kids weed on the set of stands?
• 50:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I mean, you heard the stories about Drew Barrymore getting drugs like sticks.
• 50:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: you know, you're working with adults, you're working on and honestly, this is not an accusation.
• 50:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: I have no evidence of this.
• 50:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: I am, but the most likely candidates would be key for Southern and John Cusack.
• 50:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Very possible.
• 50:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: Very, you know.
• 50:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because we know they, I know they were out partying together, right, which leads us to another question from advisory board member Jeff Cook who says, is this a movie about young boomers in the 50s or is it actually a gen X?
• 50:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: We were abandoned and raised ourselves movies made in the 80s.
• 51:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Generationally, is it closer to American graffiti or the breakfast club?
• 51:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: I
• 51:08
  [SPEAKER_12]: I think both of the first parts of this question apply, which is why the film still resonates and it was just celebrated in theaters over the weekend as we're recording our second part, the 40th anniversary of the release of it, because it is universal and can be transported to any generation.
• 51:28
  [SPEAKER_12]: So I think both those things are accurate which Jeff is laying out.
• 51:30
  [SPEAKER_12]: I think it's both of them.
• 51:32
  [SPEAKER_12]: The second part is, what did you say the second part?
• 51:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Is it closer to American graffiti or the breakfast club?
• 51:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Breakfast club, 100%.
• 51:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: To me, it's more closer to breakfast club.
• 51:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think emotionally, it's definitely more closer to the breakfast.
• 51:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I mean, honestly, I like American graffiti.
• 51:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a likable movie.
• 51:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: Sure.
• 51:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: but it doesn't move me.
• 51:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, a breakfast club has me in tears and so does this, you know, they're they're they're very very different.
• 51:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I think the point I agree with you and I think the point the chef is making is really interesting, which is that what makes it a great film is that it's both.
• 52:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, it uses the world of the 50s and the boomer generation to speak to our generation gen eggs and to every generation because it's universal, you know, and then we hear the coyotes.
• 52:17
  [SPEAKER_11]: Oh my God, it's a proud kid.
• 52:20
  [SPEAKER_11]: Let's go sidewalk in the woods.
• 52:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Which by the way, and you might, I don't know if you ever heard them here.
• 52:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's a coyote den right below my house.
• 52:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I think coyotes all the time.
• 52:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: I see coyotes walking up and down my streets.
• 52:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like there's coyotes, there are a lot of coyotes around here.
• 52:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: Coyotes, when a big group of coyotes get together and make noise, it is the weirdest sense.
• 52:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: It sounds like people killing babies.
• 52:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: It is like the most disturbing bizarre sound you've ever heard.
• 52:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 52:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's natures specials.
• 52:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they're all the kids are freaking out and, you know, are they ghosts?
• 52:48
  [SPEAKER_10]: Maybe we should stand guard.
• 52:51
  [SPEAKER_10]: Yeah.
• 52:51
  [SPEAKER_10]: It's a good idea.
• 52:52
  [SPEAKER_10]: I'll take the first one.
• 52:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they just wrote down great, Teddy with a gun.
• 52:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: And if I was nervous about gun safety, when we first brought it out, now I'm terrified.
• 53:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because Teddy has his finger on the trigger and we know the gun is loaded, and he is playing games like Teddy does.
• 53:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: And next, if I wasn't already freaked out by Teddy with a gun, next we have Vurn with the gun.
• 53:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: totally terrifying.
• 53:23
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, scared to get.
• 53:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, turning spinning at every direction with his finger on that trigger and what's happening by the way is Rob Reiner is running around off camera, making little noises and trying to scare him.
• 53:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: Next we have Chris with the gun goes down to the fire, looks down at Gordy, who's asleep and wimpers in his dream.
• 53:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then we cut to the funeral.
• 53:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Um, it's very, very blown out in Chloe, it's overexposed.
• 53:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: And what they probably did, this is a, you know, because this is a shot on film that what I believe that they did is something called flashing the negative, if I told you what this is before, please.
• 53:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is I learned memorizing this in film school because we're shooting on film.
• 54:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: So obviously, you're going to set an exposure based on how much light you have and that's going to determine, you know, the how much bright, how bright the image and the thing is, well, what you can do is you can flash your negative before you film.
• 54:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: So you just hit it with a tiny bit of light.
• 54:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: And what that does is it brings everything up essentially one stop, or you can do a half flash to and things like that.
• 54:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: So what it does is it essentially all there is no black in the whole piece of film, right, because the entire negative has been exposed just a little bit, which kind of lifts everything up and gives you that sort of blown out sort of ghosted quality my pre exposing the negative a little bit.
• 54:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: I believe that's what they did here.
• 54:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're watching the body being lowered into the ground.
• 54:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's very upsetting.
• 54:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the camera pushes in on Gordy and dad turns to him.
• 54:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, should have been you, Gordon.
• 54:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: You think this is the first time he's had this dream?
• 54:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: No, hell no.
• 54:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: Nope, yeah, he has had this dream a lot.
• 55:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: It wakes up with a start.
• 55:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Chris is there.
• 55:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the first thing Gordy says is, I didn't quite finish feeling.
• 55:12
  [SPEAKER_07]: Of course.
• 55:15
  [SPEAKER_07]: I really miss him.
• 55:17
  [SPEAKER_07]: I know.
• 55:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: and he goes up to stand guard again.
• 55:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Gordy goes up to sit next to him.
• 55:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is seen in the movie.
• 55:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we're one of two at least, but it's just like, and what's so great about these young actors is you can feel how much they're already in it.
• 55:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: And again, we're gonna cover most of this in one shot, which means they really have to do it.
• 55:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: They both have to be there 100% every take, you know?
• 55:44
  [SPEAKER_10]: Maybe he could go into college courses with me.
• 55:47
  [SPEAKER_10]: that'll be the day.
• 55:49
  [SPEAKER_10]: Why not your smart enough?
• 55:51
  [SPEAKER_10]: Oh, I love you.
• 55:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because Chris has thought about this too, you know?
• 55:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because, and the thing is, he doesn't say, no, I'm not smart enough, right?
• 56:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: He doesn't disagree with Gordon.
• 56:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: He knows he's smart enough.
• 56:03
  [SPEAKER_10]: Yeah.
• 56:04
  [SPEAKER_10]: Just the way the people think of my family in this town.
• 56:07
  [SPEAKER_10]: Just the way they think of me.
• 56:08
  [SPEAKER_10]: Just one of those world-life champions kids.
• 56:11
  [SPEAKER_10]: That's not true.
• 56:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: But Gordon knows this is true, by the way.
• 56:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, of course.
• 56:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
• 56:16
  [SPEAKER_10]: No one even asked me if I took the milk money at that time.
• 56:20
  [SPEAKER_10]: Did you take it?
• 56:22
  [SPEAKER_10]: Then I took it.
• 56:23
  [SPEAKER_10]: You knew I took it.
• 56:26
  [SPEAKER_10]: Telling you I took it.
• 56:28
  [SPEAKER_10]: Everyone know I took it.
• 56:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: By the way, this comes from Stephen King, which is he was at school, the milk money disappeared and King didn't do it, but he was exactly in the same position as the kid who got blamed was.
• 56:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the didn't blame Stephen King, they went right to the kid who was known as being the bad kid and blamed him.
• 56:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: with no evidence whatsoever and Stephen King always remembered this and that found its way into Chris Chambers.
• 56:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
• 56:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: Then he says an interesting thing.
• 56:59
  [SPEAKER_10]: He says maybe I was sorry and I try to give it back.
• 57:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's interesting that he says maybe because he is hesitant to reveal the second part of this story that nobody knows, you know.
• 57:13
  [SPEAKER_10]: And maybe I took it to all the assignments and told him
• 57:21
  [SPEAKER_10]: Maybe the next week, all of these assignments at the Spray News Surround, which came to school.
• 57:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: So let's just be clear about what Chris is saying happened.
• 57:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he stole the money.
• 57:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, totally dead.
• 57:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Felt terrible about it because Chris is a really good guy.
• 57:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: He went to a teacher to an adult, admitted his crime, handed the money back in.
• 57:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: That teacher told no one, allowed him to continue to have detention and be in trouble at the whole school.
• 57:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: and kept the money to buy something for herself.
• 57:52
  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, this is why I think the film is so powerful in its approach to
• 58:01
  [SPEAKER_12]: adult mistreating children, throughout the movie, because we get so caught up in this stupid fantasy, and I'm going to say this strongly, of the 1950s and the Rockwell paintings, that never existed.
• 58:16
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's a fantasy, okay?
• 58:18
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's a fantasy.
• 58:19
  [SPEAKER_12]: Adults have always fucked over kids.
• 58:23
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's always been that way.
• 58:24
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's a horrible truth.
• 58:26
  [SPEAKER_12]: You don't want to accept it, and I'm not saying
• 58:31
  [SPEAKER_12]: And it's a sad truth of life, and this entire movie is a commentary on how adults have screwed over the kids.
• 58:39
  [SPEAKER_12]: Gordy's dad, Teddy's dad, I don't know if Varns parents are more a matter of indifference, and with Chris, and what happens to the teacher with him.
• 58:49
  [SPEAKER_12]: You know, even Lardass, his story is about how all of these adults are oblivious to how they are affecting this campaign to a health to the point that he takes this extreme act in order to have a momentary hour of satisfaction from his vengeance.
• 59:08
  [SPEAKER_12]: What all these people have done to him without being aware of it, you know.
• 59:11
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so this is what this, I think this is such an important part of the film is to understand it, you know.
• 59:17
  [SPEAKER_12]: The harsh truth of reality is that adults will let you down as a kid.
• 59:21
  [SPEAKER_12]: And one of our biggest betrayals in life usually come from adults.
• 59:25
  [SPEAKER_12]: One of our biggest rituals of manhood or adulthood, regardless of gender, is realizing that adults will screw you over.
• 59:32
  [SPEAKER_12]: Adults will fuck you over.
• 59:33
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yes, they'll also help you.
• 59:34
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yes, they'll uplift you.
• 59:35
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yes, they'll support you.
• 59:37
  [SPEAKER_12]: But you will come across that parent or that adults working in whatever job that will screw you over for their own benefit.
• 59:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think it's important that that's a very prevalent part of the movie, you know, I'll tell you what I take from it and I remember I can remember where I was standing on the streets of Berkeley when I realized this thing and it sounds stupid, but I was in my early 20s and I was under the impression that people grew up.
• 1:00:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but yeah, I mean, like yes, we mature and some people grow up and yes, you maybe don't make some of the mistakes, but adults do just as many stupid, irresponsible, cruel, terrible things as kids and sometimes they're just as petty, they're just as shallow, they're, you know, it's the same people and what we see throughout this whole movie.
• 1:00:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: is adults who didn't, you know, like, you know, the pettiness of Gordi's fucking dad and horribleness of him.
• 1:00:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's like, no, the idea that you're maturing, you would do those kinds of things is awful.
• 1:00:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
• 1:00:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Chris has worked out what's gonna happen.
• 1:00:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: He talks about what would happen if he told the truth.
• 1:00:48
  [SPEAKER_10]: Me, Chris Chambers, kid brother to eyeball Chambers.
• 1:00:51
  [SPEAKER_10]: Do you think that anyone would have believed it?
• 1:00:54
  [SPEAKER_10]: And do you think that that bitch would have dare tried something like that if it'd been one of those douche bags on the view of dare taking the money?
• 1:01:01
  [SPEAKER_10]: Oh, wait, I don't know.
• 1:01:04
  [SPEAKER_10]: What would be me?
• 1:01:06
  [SPEAKER_10]: How was this stupid one for you trying to give it back?
• 1:01:11
  [SPEAKER_17]: Just everything up.
• 1:01:14
  [SPEAKER_17]: I never thought.
• 1:01:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: and then Chris bursts into tears.
• 1:01:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I mean, it's an amazing, amazingly honest and powerful moment.
• 1:01:28
  [SPEAKER_17]: Fuck, give me a way.
• 1:01:34
  [SPEAKER_17]: Just a mission.
• 1:01:35
  [SPEAKER_17]: I like it to go someplace.
• 1:01:37
  [SPEAKER_17]: Nobody knows me.
• 1:01:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's incredible.
• 1:01:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely incredible.
• 1:01:45
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's so funny to an Roman funny laugh, but like funny in terms of looking at the construction of the film.
• 1:01:52
  [SPEAKER_12]: Chris is the one who wants to not be seen.
• 1:01:56
  [SPEAKER_12]: Gordy is the one who is desperate to be seen.
• 1:01:59
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's so interesting.
• 1:02:00
  [SPEAKER_12]: And by seeing, I mean, accepted for who he is, right?
• 1:02:03
  [SPEAKER_12]: That's what he really wants.
• 1:02:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: His father's hatred of him destroys him because he wants his father to be proud of who he is.
• 1:02:10
  [SPEAKER_12]: He wants to not be a writer so that he can get his father's love.
• 1:02:15
  [SPEAKER_12]: Right, and Chris on the other side, Chris is someone who doesn't want to be seen, doesn't want to do, he wants to disappear somewhere, so that he can essentially build his life from scratch and not be judged by other people from where he came from.
• 1:02:27
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so it's a fascinating approach that both of them have in this film.
• 1:02:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say, I'm going to say something that sounds like the opposite of what you're saying, although I think we we pretty much agree on the point, which is the way I would put it.
• 1:02:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think Gordi wants to be something else.
• 1:02:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: He wants to be someone that his father can love.
• 1:02:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: Chris actually wants to be himself.
• 1:02:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: He wishes he could be seen as who he is.
• 1:02:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, like it's it's anyway, it's just a different slightly different way of saying I think it's the same thing here.
• 1:02:58
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, you're saying the exact same thing.
• 1:02:59
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, because he wants to be seen from because he wants to be taken for who he is and not me judged by where he came from in his last name.
• 1:03:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:03:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I manage to say crisis lines without bursting in the tears.
• 1:03:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not sure that I'm gonna manage to say the behind the scenes part.
• 1:03:18
  [UNKNOWN]: Okay.
• 1:03:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: River Phoenix wasn't getting there.
• 1:03:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: He wasn't quite emotionally getting to the place.
• 1:03:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he knew he wasn't getting there and Rob knew he wasn't getting there.
• 1:03:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: And essentially, what he went over and did was classic Stanislav's game methods, sense memory stuff.
• 1:03:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: He said, you know, River, there's probably a time where a grown-up has disappointed you.
• 1:03:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 1:03:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Think about a time where a grown-up is disappointed you.
• 1:03:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: And this is what's going to make me cry, telling this part of the story, partially because of the loss of raw briner.
• 1:03:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: But River Phoenix got there.
• 1:03:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: And when you get there and I'm sure you've been there as an actor, you can't just shrug off the emotions right after, right, you know, because what good acting is isn't faking emotions, what good acting is is experiencing the real emotions, right?
• 1:04:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: and Rob took him and held him in his arms and told him he loved him.
• 1:04:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: Damn.
• 1:04:21
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, there's a lot of the reality of what these actors bring to these characters that have come from their own lives.
• 1:04:27
  [SPEAKER_12]: You were mentioning it earlier about Will Wheaton in our previous part.
• 1:04:32
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I think I mentioned the thing about Jerry O'Connell, how he felt.
• 1:04:36
  [SPEAKER_12]: how, you know, he'd felt he'd mess stuff up.
• 1:04:38
  [SPEAKER_12]: He was kind of told by his family that he'd got all stuff up.
• 1:04:41
  [SPEAKER_12]: So this is one of the reasons why this film is so powerful is because these kids were young enough that they could bring their own experiences into what they were doing.
• 1:04:51
  [SPEAKER_12]: And it resonated very powerfully with us from a realistic place.
• 1:04:55
  [SPEAKER_12]: And Rob was the perfect director.
• 1:04:58
  [SPEAKER_12]: You know, as you just pointed out, you know, that he was able to get the kids to where they needed to be at.
• 1:05:03
  [SPEAKER_12]: And the kids trusted him.
• 1:05:04
  [SPEAKER_12]: to get them there, you know, and I think that's another huge reason why the film works as well as it does.
• 1:05:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think the reason that gets to me so much, there's so much hate and cruelty in our world right now.
• 1:05:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: So many people, you know, just feels like everywhere we're beset by enemies and that we're all enemies, we're becoming enemies and all of
• 1:05:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: and the way he did things on the set was all about love.
• 1:05:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yep.
• 1:05:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yep.
• 1:05:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
• 1:05:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's funny.
• 1:05:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: The next longing in my notes is Chris embarrassed by bursting into tears in front of his friend says, I'm guessing just a pussy, huh?
• 1:05:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, that's how I feel right now too.
• 1:05:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: No, I don't though, it's not actually how it is.
• 1:05:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's morning, beautiful shot.
• 1:06:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Gordy is sitting reading comic books on the train track.
• 1:06:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: I love that he packed so a few comic books in his backpack.
• 1:06:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's what I would have done.
• 1:06:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: I would have packed some comics too.
• 1:06:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, and this beautiful dough comes up to it and and they look at each other.
• 1:06:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if you've ever had this moment with wildlife, you're not a woodsie guy.
• 1:06:16
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's not not.
• 1:06:17
  [SPEAKER_12]: No.
• 1:06:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I have.
• 1:06:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: I've had this moment where I've been like really near a wild animal and then we just kind of looked at each other.
• 1:06:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I have with the coyotes, honestly, I couldn't go on walks all the time.
• 1:06:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: It said, I said, coyote, you will just start walking along with me and I'm like, okay.
• 1:06:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not looking, you know, I'm not really nervous around you and he's just looking at me for a while and I look at him and then he goes away.
• 1:06:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Stephen King, when he wrote this moment in the book, he spent a lot of time writing this moment because he felt there should be something transcendent in the story.
• 1:06:47
  [SPEAKER_18]: To freight woke up the other guys and it was on the tip of my tongue to tell them about the deer, but I didn't.
• 1:06:54
  [SPEAKER_18]: That was the one thing I kept to myself.
• 1:06:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: I've never spoken or written up it until just now.
• 1:07:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a very common Stephen King technique of putting the actual moment of the writing.
• 1:07:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: in the story itself, it feels like the author is talking to us directly.
• 1:07:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like the author becomes your friend in that moment, sharing a secret.
• 1:07:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: So we're trying to create a serene and pastoral and tranquil moment of beauty in nature.
• 1:07:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: That ain't how it was on the set.
• 1:07:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because they're trying to get this deer to walk in and look in the right directions and so they're using air horns and blasting loud noises and yelling and clapping, just trying to get this deer's head to turn the way they wanted to turn and they do of course finally get it.
• 1:07:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's beautiful moment of the film.
• 1:07:41
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
• 1:07:41
  [SPEAKER_12]: Let me ask you something, Steve.
• 1:07:43
  [SPEAKER_12]: Before we leave the deer moment, what do you think that symbolizes?
• 1:07:49
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's so funny because to me, I don't think you put it in as a director unless there's a reason for it, you know?
• 1:07:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: What, well, what's funny is that it's Stephen King felt there needed to be a moment of transcendence.
• 1:08:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's how he described why it's in the book.
• 1:08:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't know, you know, you're much more of a symbol person than I am.
• 1:08:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: But to me, like to me, it's not, I don't care about what the meaning is as much as what it means for the character, how it feels.
• 1:08:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
• 1:08:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, that's kind of where my brain is.
• 1:08:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: And for me, like I said, I've had this moment of like,
• 1:08:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: you're alone in nature, and there's some magical thing, and you are the only one to experience, who will ever experience that particular moment.
• 1:08:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: And just sitting in that, like, that's how it feels to me.
• 1:08:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't necessarily put a symbol on it.
• 1:08:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: What about you?
• 1:08:35
  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, yeah, I think, you know, because there's a great scene in the queen.
• 1:08:38
  [SPEAKER_12]: Remember, when Helen Mary is the stag, right?
• 1:08:42
  [SPEAKER_12]: That it's
• 1:08:45
  [SPEAKER_12]: It always seems to occur in a movie when there's about to be a change or a person embracing a little more power and their voice, right?
• 1:08:53
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I think there's a way to look at it as like this innocent creature amongst the danger of the forest or whatever, right?
• 1:09:00
  [SPEAKER_12]: And it's almost can symbolize them as kids.
• 1:09:02
  [SPEAKER_12]: in the dangerous world, you know what I'm saying?
• 1:09:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: You can see that.
• 1:09:06
  [SPEAKER_12]: But the fact that only Gordi sees the deer, I think is a symbol of the fact that he is going to change evolve as a person.
• 1:09:16
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so that's why I think it makes sense.
• 1:09:19
  [SPEAKER_12]: He's the sensitive soul in the jungle.
• 1:09:21
  [SPEAKER_12]: you know, or in the forest, whatever.
• 1:09:24
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so I think that's the symbolism of it.
• 1:09:26
  [SPEAKER_12]: When I look at it, of course, it could be any number of things.
• 1:09:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's the next morning in the walking and they're walking along the tracks past the the big water tank, which is, by the way, Rob Riner's favorite shot in the film.
• 1:09:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, nice.
• 1:09:38
  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, our stomach's rumbling.
• 1:09:39
  [SPEAKER_18]: We pressed on toward the royal river.
• 1:09:42
  [SPEAKER_18]: The reality of Ray Brower was growing and kept us moving despite the heat.
• 1:09:48
  [SPEAKER_18]: for me, the idea of seeing that kid's dead body was starting to become an obsession.
• 1:09:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they stopped, we look out at the river, and they realized that the tracks are not going exactly where they wanna go, and they're deciding whether they're gonna cut across the fields and of course, and you're right, man, vurn is always right, vurn is risking that.
• 1:10:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they rush off and finally, vurn has to go along because it's not gonna get left alone.
• 1:10:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we're now with the guys.
• 1:10:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's no funny how we just check in with Asis gang every few scenes.
• 1:10:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're fishing and again, the subject of the Brower Kid comes out.
• 1:10:26
  [SPEAKER_07]: You know, they're Brower Kid.
• 1:10:27
  [SPEAKER_07]: We're bad.
• 1:10:29
  [SPEAKER_18]: I like to tell you something about them, but you've got a square name on this good name and you can tell nobody.
• 1:10:34
  [SPEAKER_18]: Billy and Charlie had managed to keep their enormous secret for about 36 hours, a personal record for both of them.
• 1:10:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: So Asis convincing them to now go look for the body.
• 1:10:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
• 1:10:43
  [SPEAKER_19]: OK.
• 1:10:47
  [SPEAKER_19]: I'm going to stay mine, get in the fucking car.
• 1:10:51
  [SPEAKER_19]: Now, let's go.
• 1:10:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think Ace is here to protect democracy, not practice it.
• 1:10:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, actually, he's not even there to protect democracy.
• 1:11:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: No.
• 1:11:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, one of the interesting things that we haven't talked about this movie?
• 1:11:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay.
• 1:11:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Isn't our rated movie?
• 1:11:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
• 1:11:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, there's so many F-bombs in this movie.
• 1:11:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:11:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it's a kid's coming of age movie.
• 1:11:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: It is, there had to be arguments like, why are you doing a kid's movie that the kids can't go to see?
• 1:11:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, and yet it's obviously was very successful.
• 1:11:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, well, the choice to leave the tracks wasn't necessarily the best choice, John, because now the mud is getting deeper and deeper.
• 1:11:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, you always get to this point on your long journey where it really gets hard.
• 1:11:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: and that's where they are now.
• 1:11:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: They come up on this bog, which by the way, this is a built for the movie.
• 1:11:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: This isn't, you know, this is all, this actually is all perfectly fine and clean.
• 1:11:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: It is not some disgusting bog.
• 1:11:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: Although, because of shooting scheduling, they built it, but then they didn't shoot in it right away, and it sat for several days, getting a little nastier as they got closer to shooting it.
• 1:12:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: But it was built for the thing, and they're trying to decide if they how deep it is, and Chris sticks in it goes, it's not that deep.
• 1:12:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: They all start walking forward, and they should have put that stick a little further because suddenly the bottom drops out and they all go Told me to just talk to the tracks
• 1:12:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: that and immediately, and this is what you do when you're a kid, Teddy Dunks vurn and now everybody's wrestling and Chris is wrestling and and Gordy, the nerdy one is trying to quietly slink away and get out of the way so he doesn't get involved, Chris scenes him and they go after Gordy.
• 1:12:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they need it.
• 1:12:42
  [SPEAKER_12]: They need this small, right?
• 1:12:44
  [SPEAKER_12]: Cause it's a lot of serious stuff has happened over the last few minutes.
• 1:12:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now they're all wrestling and they're all laughing and everything seems great because this is what kids do and then Gordi says There's something on your neck And freak out and oh my god when they take their shirts off and they're all over their backs and all that I mean that pulling them I mean it is awful yeah 100% off oh
• 1:13:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: And as I said, I think I said it before, I have had leeches on me once.
• 1:13:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was in a river in Israel, but they were not this big.
• 1:13:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: They were little tiny leeches.
• 1:13:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: They were not giant suckers.
• 1:13:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then, man, they're pulling the leeches off each other.
• 1:13:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then the moment, we're gourdy.
• 1:13:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: senses, because you know what leeches do is they have a, um, uh, they secrete, uh, enzyme that numbs your skin.
• 1:13:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: So you don't feel it when they bite you.
• 1:13:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that's what, so that's what makes them so you could be in there and have a whole bunch on you and not know it.
• 1:13:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't know there.
• 1:13:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then there's the moment where Gordy senses something is a miss.
• 1:13:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: very carefully pulls out the waistband of his underwear to look down and from his reaction, we all know what's going on.
• 1:14:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: And by the way, this exact thing in this position happened to Stephen King.
• 1:14:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Whoa, so I've heard.
• 1:14:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think Gordie has a perfectly justified freak out.
• 1:14:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:14:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: Fanting in for a guy.
• 1:14:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
• 1:14:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: I agree.
• 1:14:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I love that the first thing he says is, Oh, shit.
• 1:14:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Chris.
• 1:14:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, is that because Chris is the guy, and finally he, look, everyone's watching me looking just down and he grabs it and pulling out that bloody leash because you know where that blood's coming from.
• 1:14:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: It is, it is a moment.
• 1:14:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he faints dead away.
• 1:14:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yep.
• 1:14:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they freak out because since, you know, you see a guy faint at this very, very scary.
• 1:14:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: They check that he's breathing and now they're getting dressed.
• 1:14:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we have a really interesting shot because
• 1:14:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: and the guys are out of focus in the background.
• 1:14:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they're kind of talking about him.
• 1:14:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's still a little out of it.
• 1:14:59
  [SPEAKER_10]: She's probably the champ.
• 1:15:00
  [SPEAKER_10]: Kind of leeching it from his balls, he fainted.
• 1:15:02
  [SPEAKER_10]: What are you?
• 1:15:02
  [SPEAKER_10]: It's mother.
• 1:15:03
  [SPEAKER_10]: It's shit, it's shit, it's shit, it's hate, hate, hate.
• 1:15:06
  [SPEAKER_10]: I think Chris is right, let's go back.
• 1:15:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now the argument is getting bigger and bigger.
• 1:15:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: But we're back to the shot with Gordy in the foreground and he finally yells it.
• 1:15:16
  [SPEAKER_10]: Right, he's gonna happen.
• 1:15:17
  [SPEAKER_10]: Check it out.
• 1:15:18
  [SPEAKER_10]: Stop it.
• 1:15:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he gets up real strong and says, I'm not going back.
• 1:15:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think it's important that he says, I'm not going back.
• 1:15:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: He doesn't say we're not going back.
• 1:15:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's totally up to them.
• 1:15:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: They go back or not go back.
• 1:15:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: He is deciding for him what he has to do.
• 1:15:34
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, and I also think it's important that Vurn stands up to Teddy.
• 1:15:38
  [SPEAKER_12]: I think with this great point, yeah.
• 1:15:40
  [SPEAKER_12]: It went's too because that's what ends up causing Gordy to finally look over and say something.
• 1:15:45
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I like it's Vurn gets that rare moment to stand up to Teddy, who's actually been bullying him.
• 1:15:50
  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, they've all kind of been bullying him throughout the whole movie, but he finally is had enough.
• 1:15:54
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I love that he jumps on Dabbat Teddy because Teddy is all bluster.
• 1:15:58
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so that's what eventually sparks
• 1:16:01
  [SPEAKER_12]: Gordy to say something but like I think we're Gordy the whole time is doing and we've seen this Steve in many films like when you have a near-death experience and essentially that's what qualifies in the situation for near-death experience along with the train is that you come out a different person and he is more than ever determined to go to this body because the body symbolizes to him
• 1:16:25
  [SPEAKER_12]: It independence from his dad, I think, in a lot of ways.
• 1:16:27
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's like to him, he's going to do what he's going to do, and he's kind of tired of, you know, after Chris has talked to him after he's really come to terms all the stuff.
• 1:16:35
  [SPEAKER_12]: I think this is him kind of finally grabbing his voice and leading the game.
• 1:16:40
  [SPEAKER_12]: Right, it was Chris who had led the gang.
• 1:16:42
  [SPEAKER_12]: Now he's saying, we're going, whether you come with me or not, I'm going.
• 1:16:46
  [SPEAKER_12]: And it's what motivates the gang to fall behind him.
• 1:16:48
  [SPEAKER_12]: So in a way, he's kind of taking the lead from Chris in this moment because now he is clear in purpose.
• 1:16:55
  [SPEAKER_12]: I think it's great.
• 1:16:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's a super important moment and I think it becomes, I mean, you know, you're talking about symbolism for, right?
• 1:17:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: This dead body is a symbol.
• 1:17:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: It is a symbol of all sorts of things for these guys and I think the thing that you put your finger on is it's like just Gordie's not going to quit at this point, you know, he has to see this thing through.
• 1:17:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: 99.9% to the top of Everest and stop three feet away from the top.
• 1:17:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: You didn't get to the top.
• 1:17:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, like there's something about seeing the thing to, and of course, notice respect to someone who didn't get to the top of Everest and it's a very hard thing to do.
• 1:17:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't mean to say that.
• 1:17:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I am saying like, he set this as a goal and now he's got to go through with it.
• 1:17:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know,
• 1:17:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he just starts going, you know, and that's the other thing, too.
• 1:17:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's not a discussion.
• 1:17:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's going.
• 1:17:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so they go with him.
• 1:17:55
  [SPEAKER_18]: At the time, I didn't know why I needed to see that body so badly.
• 1:17:59
  [SPEAKER_18]: Even if no one had followed me, I would have gone on alone.
• 1:18:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now we have a hard cut to yackety yet from the coasters and we're out driving in the car, but the gang is split into two cars and they start racing.
• 1:18:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:18:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ace on the wrong side of the road and they're neck and neck and suddenly we see a truck in the distance coming towards Ace.
• 1:18:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so I forget who's driving the other car, but he thinks he's he thinks he can win, you know, finally going to beat Ace except that Ace is not going to check it out.
• 1:18:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is, by the way, they're tribute to rebel without a cause.
• 1:18:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: This must be nice.
• 1:18:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: And man, Ace is not only Zase God damn crazy, and not only is just, you know, he makes it a habit of just knocking down mailboxes in the neighborhood and probably all sorts of other things.
• 1:18:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he could have gotten all of him killed.
• 1:18:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yep, doing this.
• 1:18:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: It is absolutely nuts what happens.
• 1:18:54
  [SPEAKER_12]: He's sociopath for sure.
• 1:18:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, he's not getting on the way so the trucks were to avoid him.
• 1:18:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: The logs go everywhere and of course, Ace wins.
• 1:19:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: the little wind you cock knacker.
• 1:19:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're walking on the tracks again.
• 1:19:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: The woods are very windy.
• 1:19:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: It was very important to Rob Reiner that this be windy.
• 1:19:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: So they've got every wind machine they could get in the state of Oregon to make this happen and then they even have lines on specific branches of trees and PAs and other crew members behind the trees who could wiggle the lines to make specific branches move its specific times in specific ways.
• 1:19:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're walking
• 1:19:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: If you look, there is one particular tree branch that seems to be moving a lot more almost with a mind of its own.
• 1:19:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: As I said, we have crew members on the tree branches, and these are, you know, complicated shots and we have dolly moves and stuff like that.
• 1:19:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: And at one point, one of the crew members forgot to pull on the line for their tree to move the tree branch.
• 1:19:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: Lung's yelled to this crew member, who's name was Carol?
• 1:20:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Carol, yank, your bush.
• 1:20:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh my god, whoa.
• 1:20:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, needless to say, that stopped shooting for a fair amount of time.
• 1:20:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the next time they did the take, Carol made sure to yank her bush real well.
• 1:20:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And you could, I bet if you watch these shots right before we get to the body, you'll find where Carol's tree was.
• 1:20:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: Um, and then Furnspot's the body.
• 1:20:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Of course, Furnspot's the body.
• 1:20:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:20:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Burnspot's been right the whole time.
• 1:20:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: The Burnspot's the body.
• 1:20:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: In defense of vurn.
• 1:20:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, we should have a whole vurn fan club.
• 1:20:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Justice for vurn.
• 1:20:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: Justice for vurn.
• 1:20:42
  [SPEAKER_18]: The train had not graved rower out of his kids just like it had not the life out of his body.
• 1:20:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we looked down at this body covered in brush.
• 1:20:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think they handle it exactly right.
• 1:20:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: I agree in terms of what that body looks like.
• 1:20:55
  [SPEAKER_12]: The, oh, yes, 100%, right.
• 1:20:58
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's just even the first time you see him, it's just the legs sticking out.
• 1:21:02
  [SPEAKER_12]: And then they come up on the body and these.
• 1:21:04
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
• 1:21:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I think there's a reference here too, that's really amazing for the four of them.
• 1:21:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: I totally agree.
• 1:21:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: Particularly when they reveal his face and you have them kind of looking in the face of a, and I remember when I first saw a dead body, it is a, it's weird.
• 1:21:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's weird thing.
• 1:21:20
  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, it is.
• 1:21:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Very much so.
• 1:21:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: The kid wasn't sick.
• 1:21:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: The kid wasn't sleeping.
• 1:21:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: The kid was dead.
• 1:21:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they sit there.
• 1:21:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're right.
• 1:21:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a very reverent moment.
• 1:21:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, and this brings us to another question from one of our patrons from Jennifer Lewis who says, did Ray Brower kill himself?
• 1:21:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: This thought just hit me last week.
• 1:21:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: I always thought it was weird that young boy would go out picking berries.
• 1:21:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's not like a train can sneak up on you and accidentally hit you.
• 1:21:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: Was it, it was suicide, wasn't it?
• 1:21:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know what suicides rates were like for basically preteen boys in the 50s or the 80s.
• 1:21:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: But all four of the main cast were certainly traumatized in various ways and wouldn't be surprising
• 1:22:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: I never thought about it either.
• 1:22:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: I do always thought of the story of he got hit by a train while picking berries, like it seems, because Jennifer's right, trains don't generally sneak up on you.
• 1:22:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, right, but I don't have any, to me, because to me, this is where I think the body is symbolic.
• 1:22:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't need to know anything about Ray Brower, you know, he is very much the maguffin, a symbol, but not, but whether or not he commits who said it never occurred to me.
• 1:22:31
  [SPEAKER_12]: Right, it's the body that's important not how the body became the body.
• 1:22:35
  [SPEAKER_12]: But certainly you can make a case, possibly that he did kill himself, maybe just like Daddy wanted to get just had a terrible family or upbringing or father or mother and just wanted out of the situation and went as far away as possible and got hit.
• 1:22:50
  [SPEAKER_12]: I know the, or threw himself from the train.
• 1:22:52
  [SPEAKER_12]: I know the story is what that he got hit while he was picking the berries.
• 1:22:59
  [SPEAKER_12]: But I grew with you Steve, how the fuck do you get hit by picking berries?
• 1:23:01
  [SPEAKER_12]: Like it's kind of weird to do that.
• 1:23:03
  [SPEAKER_12]: So, yeah, you're not here at the horn.
• 1:23:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: You don't see the sound or hear the sound.
• 1:23:07
  [SPEAKER_12]: There's no way that would have happened.
• 1:23:08
  [SPEAKER_12]: So, very possible we could have killed them.
• 1:23:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, you know.
• 1:23:12
  [SPEAKER_12]: Or was playing around like playing chicken like Teddy did earlier in the film and just got caught and died.
• 1:23:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so, they start talking about building the structure.
• 1:23:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: And as they're doing this, Gordy sits down and they all kind of look over it in.
• 1:23:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: So this scene, this happens all the time, by the way, you're writing a screenplay and there's one scene you just can't crack and you write it and you write it and you go, it's like it doesn't quite work and you try different approach and you try different approach and you just can't get the scene to work.
• 1:23:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: And this scene with Gordon and Chris was the scene that they could never get to work.
• 1:23:49
  [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, wow.
• 1:23:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: They just, they, they had different versions of it.
• 1:23:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: They were herst one version.
• 1:23:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they're like, okay, I think this was what it is.
• 1:23:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Rob just had this suspicion that they hadn't gotten there yet.
• 1:24:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:24:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it's literally the night before they're going to shoot the scene.
• 1:24:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Rob sits down to try one more pass that we're writing it.
• 1:24:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the thing is what he realizes and and I think I've had this experience so many times where you can be working on a thing and working on a thing and working on a thing and not actually understand what it is you're trying to do and why it's hard.
• 1:24:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: And of course the reason that this scene was hard for him to write and figure out was because this was seen about Rob and his father.
• 1:24:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, that's what we're really getting to is that and you think about ours thinking we talked about this week did sort of his biography is that, you know, Rob grew up and are you believe the funniest household in there?
• 1:24:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:24:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: With, you know, Carl Reiner there and Mel Brooks and Sid Seas are stopping ball at the time at Dick Fantyke stopping by and Norman Lear was there and all these funny people are there.
• 1:24:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: And funny is the currency that of the Reiner household and call Reiner did not think his son was funny.
• 1:25:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's like, I mean, you remember the story from the Albert Brooks documentary, which is what brings over his best friend.
• 1:25:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're like junior high or something, and Albert Brooks just starts doing bits in front of Carl Reiner and Sid Seaser and Mel Brooks, and they think he is the funniest person in the world.
• 1:25:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mel Brooks goes on the tonight show to say he just met the funniest person in America at into 12-year-old kid named Albert Brooks and Carl Reiner doesn't think his son is funny.
• 1:25:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, and then it gets to he says he wants to be an actor and And Rob can feel that his father is being fake supportive, you know, you know, and I don't know if you've had that experience with your dad or your dad No, we believe in you and I kind of did I definitely sort of like
• 1:25:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Of course, son, you can go ahead and do whatever you want, you know, like we will support you, but not enthusiastic.
• 1:25:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: And when Norman Lear wants to hire him for all in the family, Carl is shocked and says to Norman Lear, but he's not funny.
• 1:26:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, and that's what he's doing with him.
• 1:26:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, as he sits down to write this scene and what he says was basically he sobbed the whole time.
• 1:26:12
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, no, for me and my dad, he was worried that I wouldn't be able to pay bills.
• 1:26:18
  [SPEAKER_12]: That was his concern.
• 1:26:19
  [SPEAKER_12]: It was never not supporting me.
• 1:26:21
  [SPEAKER_12]: But, um,
• 1:26:23
  [SPEAKER_12]: He just was worried about it.
• 1:26:24
  [SPEAKER_12]: And it wasn't till he came to see me in Hamlet at Florida State University that everything changed.
• 1:26:30
  [SPEAKER_12]: Like as soon as he wouldn't come see my place, my mother was the only one who came to see my place.
• 1:26:36
  [SPEAKER_12]: My dad didn't want to encourage this because he didn't want me to go down this path that would have led to poverty in his mind.
• 1:26:41
  [SPEAKER_12]: And look, it wasn't wrong.
• 1:26:42
  [SPEAKER_12]: There were certainly times when I could have done a lot of money.
• 1:26:45
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I had to borrow money to pay rent for them a couple of times.
• 1:26:47
  [SPEAKER_12]: But like the, but when he came to see me, because we had always had a very difficult time in the 90s, my dad.
• 1:26:54
  [SPEAKER_12]: It was very headstrong, surprisingly.
• 1:26:56
  [SPEAKER_12]: I have no to a lot of people, but I was very strong about trying to do this thing.
• 1:26:59
  [SPEAKER_12]: And he didn't like that I joined the military.
• 1:27:01
  [SPEAKER_12]: So there were a lot of things that we battle with with the 90s.
• 1:27:03
  [SPEAKER_12]: But when I, when he saw me in Hamlet, play King Claudius,
• 1:27:08
  [SPEAKER_12]: The look on his face afterwards, everything changed.
• 1:27:12
  [SPEAKER_12]: My father completely believed in me from that point on to the point where he started watching inside the actor studio.
• 1:27:18
  [SPEAKER_12]: And he would call me after every one of those episodes.
• 1:27:21
  [SPEAKER_12]: It'd be like, have you tried to do this?
• 1:27:22
  [SPEAKER_12]: Have you tried to do this?
• 1:27:23
  [SPEAKER_12]: You should watch this episode because then so he became one of my biggest supporters.
• 1:27:28
  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, so ironically, because he had been one of the people who didn't want me to pursue it for a very long time.
• 1:27:34
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so it was a, it was a, it was a great thing to see that happen in my, it really filled a hole that I'd had for years about that.
• 1:27:41
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I remember we cried there at Florida State in the lobby when he said, oh, because he was crying.
• 1:27:46
  [SPEAKER_12]: He goes, he was so big.
• 1:27:48
  [SPEAKER_12]: Worked your presence.
• 1:27:49
  [SPEAKER_12]: I had no idea.
• 1:27:50
  [SPEAKER_12]: You could do these things, right?
• 1:27:51
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I wonder if,
• 1:27:53
  [SPEAKER_12]: Carl had that moment with Rob.
• 1:27:55
  [SPEAKER_12]: I wonder if it was like, and they had that coming together.
• 1:27:58
  [SPEAKER_12]: So it means the world.
• 1:27:59
  [SPEAKER_12]: You know, it means the world.
• 1:28:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: He did, and it was through, honestly, it was largely through this movie.
• 1:28:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, wow.
• 1:28:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, I mean, I think he realized he was funny because he's successful on all in the family.
• 1:28:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it, you know, it started a good closer, but it was really because this is, it's not that I'm saying that spinal tap is not a real movie.
• 1:28:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's not that I'm saying that the sure thing is not a real movie.
• 1:28:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: But in terms of heart, in terms of emotion, this is so far beyond those two things.
• 1:28:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: I love both those movies, it's not a criticism.
• 1:28:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I don't think Colriner could go see this film and not see that this is a real director.
• 1:28:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: I agree.
• 1:28:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Gordi is just in his moment and he says, what did you have to die?
• 1:28:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Teddy and Vurn, they're not, they don't get it, you know what I mean?
• 1:28:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's just like, it's not with Dorty, but Chris gets it.
• 1:28:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: He, he, he, one hundred percent understands what's happening and says, Why don't you guys just go over there and look for some branches, okay?
• 1:28:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
• 1:28:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Teddy even figures out that this is what happens, you know?
• 1:29:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: If Teddy knows you're having an emotional moment, not the most sensitive of guys.
• 1:29:06
  [SPEAKER_07]: Anyway, I have to die.
• 1:29:09
  [SPEAKER_10]: I don't know, I don't know, I shouldn't be, don't say that, don't say that, man.
• 1:29:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's it, and that's, those words have been in Gordys' heart since Denny, the day, Denny died.
• 1:29:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
• 1:29:30
  [SPEAKER_12]: There's a realism in that, right?
• 1:29:33
  [SPEAKER_12]: What do they call that survivor guilt?
• 1:29:35
  [SPEAKER_12]: And imagine he carries that survivor guilt because his father reiterates that he sees how his mother and father are completely changed and how they treat him or not treat him but how they function in their lives.
• 1:29:46
  [SPEAKER_12]: And he thinks that they wanted him to die instead of.
• 1:29:51
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so it's a powerful thing, the grass but such a young age, you know.
• 1:29:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think Wil Wheaton is the world's greatest actor.
• 1:30:02
  [SPEAKER_12]: No, I would hear that.
• 1:30:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: I would hear that.
• 1:30:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think there are things that he's fine in.
• 1:30:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that, but I think in this moment, oh yeah, it is one hundred percent that the pain of what he's expressed and you can feel
• 1:30:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: I bet you've had this moment, I've had this moment where the emotions just tore the words out of you.
• 1:30:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Words you, maybe you didn't even want a voice, you didn't want to say them out loud, and then they just flew out.
• 1:30:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and that's what it feels like is happening with Gory right now.
• 1:30:34
  [SPEAKER_10]: I'm so good, my dad's, and I'm so good, but does he know you?
• 1:30:39
  [SPEAKER_10]: Hey, it's me, it does not hate you.
• 1:30:42
  [SPEAKER_10]: And no, he just doesn't know you.
• 1:30:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: We just had a short where I mentioned this thought, but I'm going to mention it here too, because I was really important as I thought about these lines of, he hates you, he just doesn't know you.
• 1:30:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think there's so many times where hate is thrown in the direction of ignorance.
• 1:31:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And,
• 1:31:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: The fact is, if you hate something that you don't know, then you don't really hate that thing.
• 1:31:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: And if someone hates you who doesn't know you, they don't hate you.
• 1:31:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: What they hate is the image of you that lives in their head, in their mind, they hate their own creation.
• 1:31:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: It isn't, you know, like this is, and it's hard to take in.
• 1:31:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Gordi's dad doesn't hate him.
• 1:31:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: Gordi's dad doesn't know him.
• 1:31:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: He hates something else.
• 1:31:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: What is in Gordi is not hateable?
• 1:31:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: He should not think that.
• 1:31:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because he's going like, I'm a bad person because my dad hates you.
• 1:31:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, no, your dad doesn't know you.
• 1:31:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: The the the the qualities that your dad hates if he hates Gordi have nothing to do with Gordi, you know?
• 1:31:43
  [SPEAKER_12]: Right.
• 1:31:44
  [SPEAKER_12]: Well,
• 1:31:45
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, I mean, it's a very complex thing when you look at it because I do think it's father does not like him and doing think his father rejects him.
• 1:31:53
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, and we see that right in at the, at the dinner, from from what the movie gives us, right, from what the movie because that's the only thing we can go on.
• 1:32:00
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
• 1:32:00
  [SPEAKER_12]: But the movie gives us is clearly his father does not like Gordy, because Gordy is not like his brother.
• 1:32:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: Gordy's not sports obsessed, Gordy's not these are things that the father cannot visibly take pride in.
• 1:32:12
  [SPEAKER_12]: He's a writer.
• 1:32:13
  [SPEAKER_12]: He's sensitive.
• 1:32:14
  [SPEAKER_12]: He's empathetic, possibly.
• 1:32:16
  [SPEAKER_12]: He's just different.
• 1:32:18
  [SPEAKER_12]: And when you it's the macho versus the intellectual, that's what you see clashing here.
• 1:32:23
  [SPEAKER_12]: But I think Chris is right.
• 1:32:24
  [SPEAKER_12]: His father doesn't it because his father hasn't tried to know him.
• 1:32:27
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yep.
• 1:32:28
  [SPEAKER_12]: And that's an issue there too that that needs to be addressed.
• 1:32:31
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I'd love to find out if there's a wait.
• 1:32:35
  [SPEAKER_12]: I don't want to be the three guys going, what happens after standby me?
• 1:32:38
  [SPEAKER_12]: I don't want
• 1:32:41
  [SPEAKER_12]: But it'd be interesting to see down the road what happens with Gordon and his dad because we see Gordon at the end of the movie in Richard Dreyfaz, who's very tender and playful with his kids, you know, and so like is that a thing that Gordon takes the lesson from how his father tutored him, maybe had some resolution.
• 1:32:57
  [SPEAKER_12]: and takes that into his relationship with his kids.
• 1:32:59
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's curious to find out.
• 1:33:01
  [SPEAKER_12]: But yeah, in this moment, Chris is right.
• 1:33:03
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I love Chris sending the guys away.
• 1:33:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: Because Chris, again, understands Gordy, loves Gordy.
• 1:33:08
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so he knows this is the only way Gordy's going to be really open and vulnerable about his pain.
• 1:33:12
  [SPEAKER_12]: And Gordy, I think, also feels guilty that he didn't like he said, I didn't cry at his funeral.
• 1:33:16
  [SPEAKER_12]: He's a brother's funeral.
• 1:33:18
  [SPEAKER_12]: And that's been something that's knowing at him.
• 1:33:19
  [SPEAKER_12]: Why?
• 1:33:20
  [SPEAKER_12]: Why didn't I cry?
• 1:33:20
  [SPEAKER_12]: Why didn't this happen?
• 1:33:22
  [SPEAKER_12]: And now, finally, the damn breaks a little.
• 1:33:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's funny, you know, like the desire to know what happens next after the end of the story is a sign of the good story.
• 1:33:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, so like I think the fact that we're speculating about where this might go is a really good thing, but right now it's just, it's just the full breakdown.
• 1:33:45
  [SPEAKER_15]: He goes,
• 1:33:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Chris, again, being just a hero, knows enough to just put his arm around his friend.
• 1:34:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Instead.
• 1:34:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:34:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: So great.
• 1:34:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is to me, this is the model for male friendship.
• 1:34:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know what I mean?
• 1:34:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Friendship in general, like this moment.
• 1:34:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
• 1:34:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: Being with your friend in his moment of pain.
• 1:34:15
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yes.
• 1:34:15
  [SPEAKER_12]: And creating space for their vulnerability and not like trying to shoot down their feelings.
• 1:34:22
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
• 1:34:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yep, not rushing into fix it, not rushing in to make it go away.
• 1:34:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Nothing like that.
• 1:34:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Just being there.
• 1:34:30
  [SPEAKER_10]: And then he says,
• 1:34:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: brings us to another question from Jeff Cook, what other movie captures the failure of Father's more insightfully, from absent to traumatized and abusive, to passively dismissive to intoxicated?
• 1:34:53
  [SPEAKER_12]: I mean, field of dreams is a conversation to have, because we don't see the Father and how he treats Kevin Costner in the movie, but we hear from Kevin Costner's points of view.
• 1:35:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I think it's a much more rounded point of view because he's older, Gordon's younger.
• 1:35:10
  [SPEAKER_12]: But Constra and saying, well, I did this, and here's the mistakes I made, but here's how he made me feel.
• 1:35:16
  [SPEAKER_12]: So in the end, the pain he feels is from the loss of the connection with his father.
• 1:35:23
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so that when he comes back at the end, it's repairing that wound or that injury.
• 1:35:29
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so I think that's a great exploration of fatherhood and sons as well.
• 1:35:34
  [SPEAKER_12]: What do you guys do?
• 1:35:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, you're never going to get me to say anything bad about the father and stuff in the field of dreams.
• 1:35:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think in terms of the, because that's what the whole through line of the movie for young boys on a coming of age to become men and their father, the shadows of their fathers are everywhere in this film.
• 1:35:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, not not so much with Verna.
• 1:35:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think we know, you know, so much out of the mother.
• 1:35:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: But for the other guys that's just ever present, the only other movie to me that is similar is the breakfast club.
• 1:36:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because the breakfast club is a movie where it's the same.
• 1:36:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: It is it is a coming of age for these people.
• 1:36:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're going to have conflicts.
• 1:36:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're each going to have their moments of breakdown, their moments that are important, their catharsis.
• 1:36:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: and the specter of the parents just hovers over that entire film.
• 1:36:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's the only one that I can think of that even compares to Stan.
• 1:36:25
  [SPEAKER_12]: One of my favorites that, you know, I've told you about this one before, the Billy Crystal Allen King, when Memories of the Year.
• 1:36:31
  [SPEAKER_12]: That's such a great little 80s gem where you see both Billy Crystal Allen King.
• 1:36:39
  [SPEAKER_12]: talk about what happened in the past as they're dealing with their anger towards each other as father and son.
• 1:36:46
  [SPEAKER_12]: Now in the movie, the present day, the movie as the father has been diagnosed with this tumor.
• 1:36:52
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so it is exceptionally funny yet the moments of serious arguments are
• 1:37:07
  [SPEAKER_12]: where he says, that I never lay a hand on you, no, at least you would have touched me, but at least you would have touched him.
• 1:37:12
  [SPEAKER_12]: Like it's such an interesting, and this is Billy, full on drama, going out with Alan King, who's great in drama.
• 1:37:18
  [SPEAKER_12]: And it's just a fantastic film and exploring that relationship of fathers and sons and from a passionate place and angry place and a pain to place.
• 1:37:28
  [SPEAKER_12]: And then where they come to by the end because, as you just said so well, Steve, they got to know each other.
• 1:37:34
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, again, they found out who they are currently in their space.
• 1:37:38
  [SPEAKER_12]: He understood why his father did what he did, and his father understood, gets to know his son who is the doctor.
• 1:37:46
  [SPEAKER_12]: And it's amazing.
• 1:37:47
  [SPEAKER_12]: So by the end, when what happens happens, you're just, you know, really moved by it.
• 1:37:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, yeah.
• 1:37:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, and I'm really moved by the scene, and then the scene just gets shattered.
• 1:38:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: because right as we're in this moment with these two kids that's so heartfelt, we hear.
• 1:38:07
  [SPEAKER_20]: What the fuck do you know about this?
• 1:38:10
  [SPEAKER_20]: some bitch, my little brother.
• 1:38:12
  [SPEAKER_12]: Great timing, great timing, right?
• 1:38:15
  [SPEAKER_12]: We're just feeling so good about everything.
• 1:38:17
  [SPEAKER_12]: We've opened the door up to this pain and here comes a massive obstacle that we might have even forgotten about.
• 1:38:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: As we were watching this scene, I think so.
• 1:38:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think I was so 100% involved in this scene.
• 1:38:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: I had forgotten about them.
• 1:38:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now they show up.
• 1:38:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: And of course, they immediately figure out that Vurn is, you know, who told?
• 1:38:34
  [SPEAKER_10]: You get away, man.
• 1:38:37
  [SPEAKER_10]: We've found, and we got dips.
• 1:38:40
  [SPEAKER_20]: better start running eyeball.
• 1:38:42
  [SPEAKER_20]: They got tears.
• 1:38:43
  [SPEAKER_10]: We earned your man.
• 1:38:44
  [SPEAKER_10]: You guys came in the car.
• 1:38:45
  [SPEAKER_10]: They're not fair.
• 1:38:46
  [SPEAKER_10]: He's ours.
• 1:38:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they're standing up to these older kids.
• 1:38:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:38:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:38:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it's sort, you know what it is?
• 1:38:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's sort of like they've gone through a right of passage and feel more adult than they did two days ago.
• 1:38:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
• 1:39:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:39:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they found the body.
• 1:39:02
  [SPEAKER_11]: It's four of their sideball.
• 1:39:04
  [SPEAKER_11]: Just make your move.
• 1:39:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, we will.
• 1:39:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Don't you worry.
• 1:39:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then
• 1:39:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I mean, honestly, them going their four of them going to fight against two much older kids.
• 1:39:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know the how much of a chance they had anyway.
• 1:39:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: Right, right, right, especially with the word A snaps his fingers and vern runs away.
• 1:39:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: By the way, Gordie just kind of disappears.
• 1:39:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like I was watching it like you really, he's kind of there drifting backwards.
• 1:39:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then he just, he basically ghosts out of the scene.
• 1:39:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, according to Jerry O'Connell,
• 1:39:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: They were genuinely scared of key for Sutherland.
• 1:39:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's not like we did with some method acting shit going on there.
• 1:39:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: They were really terrified.
• 1:39:47
  [SPEAKER_20]: You guys have two choices.
• 1:39:50
  [SPEAKER_20]: You either leave quietly, we take the body.
• 1:39:53
  [SPEAKER_20]: We stay, we need to shit out of you.
• 1:39:56
  [SPEAKER_20]: We take the body.
• 1:39:58
  [SPEAKER_12]: But I think this is important.
• 1:39:59
  [SPEAKER_12]: Can I add this?
• 1:39:59
  [SPEAKER_12]: I think this is important.
• 1:40:01
  [SPEAKER_12]: Like, vurn, the polling way makes all the sense of it.
• 1:40:03
  [SPEAKER_12]: And then vurn, pulling the whole, no, it wasn't me because he's scared when it really was him.
• 1:40:08
  [SPEAKER_12]: Makes sense.
• 1:40:09
  [SPEAKER_12]: Teddy pulling back does make sense to me.
• 1:40:11
  [SPEAKER_12]: For two reasons, one, Teddy's bluster about confrontation and challenging himself, and I can handle all this stuff.
• 1:40:18
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's all nonsense.
• 1:40:19
  [SPEAKER_12]: because it's all meant to build himself up that he could.
• 1:40:22
  [SPEAKER_12]: And here is the moment where he can and he can't.
• 1:40:25
  [SPEAKER_12]: Because the people who can really step up don't talk about it all the time.
• 1:40:29
  [SPEAKER_12]: They just know they can.
• 1:40:30
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so I think that's why Teddy, but I also think narratively for the film, it makes sense for Gordon and Chris to take center stage here and push the other two guys back.
• 1:40:40
  [SPEAKER_12]: Because they're the main people we've been watching through the whole movie in their storyline and their friendship and now it's going to be up against the main villain, which is ace, you know.
• 1:40:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I mean, frankly, without the gun, Teddy doesn't stand a chance.
• 1:40:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: These four boys don't stand a chance.
• 1:40:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
• 1:40:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: I believe he is showing the better part of Valor.
• 1:41:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:41:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:41:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Um, uh, but that's not what Chris is doing.
• 1:41:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: Chris is standing his ground.
• 1:41:07
  [SPEAKER_20]: OK, chambers, you little faggot.
• 1:41:09
  [SPEAKER_20]: This is your last chance.
• 1:41:12
  [SPEAKER_20]: What do you say, kid?
• 1:41:14
  [SPEAKER_10]: Why don't you go home and fuck your mother some more?
• 1:41:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing
• 1:41:44
  [SPEAKER_10]: you're not taking your mind as crazy, you're not taking it.
• 1:41:48
  [SPEAKER_10]: She's got a nightmare.
• 1:41:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, this is really genuinely scary.
• 1:41:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:41:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Ace advances, goes, puts that knife right up to his throat.
• 1:42:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Before we get to the next moment, what was Ace gonna do?
• 1:42:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And does Ace even know what he was gonna do in this moment?
• 1:42:07
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, I think Ace is a psychopath.
• 1:42:15
  [SPEAKER_12]: Two cars, how he was willing to just, you know, risked the lives of the two of the guys in the car with him, I think he'd have no problem, possibly stabbing Chris or just holding Chris at bay while the other guy's got the body and moved it out, right?
• 1:42:33
  [SPEAKER_12]: But it's about power for him.
• 1:42:35
  [SPEAKER_12]: So I think it's more, you would have relished the fear in Chris, if you could have gotten him to that place by having the knife at his throat, and then the other guys do the work.
• 1:42:46
  [SPEAKER_12]: There's no way ace was gonna touch that body.
• 1:42:48
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's the other guys.
• 1:42:49
  [SPEAKER_12]: So I think this was a power move all around.
• 1:42:52
  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm gonna intimidate Chris and I'm gonna get my guys to move the body or we're gonna get the hell out of here.
• 1:42:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: do you think there is any moment where he was intending to kill Chris Chambers?
• 1:43:01
  [SPEAKER_12]: Chris?
• 1:43:02
  [SPEAKER_12]: A kill?
• 1:43:03
  [SPEAKER_12]: No.
• 1:43:03
  [SPEAKER_12]: But I think Chris tried to stop him.
• 1:43:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: He was going to stab him.
• 1:43:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's what I think too.
• 1:43:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think I don't really ever think that Chris's life is in jeopardy like he's going to log in and slid his throat.
• 1:43:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: But is he going to hurt Chris?
• 1:43:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: Is he going to intimidate Chris?
• 1:43:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Is he going to, and I also think Ace's smart enough to know the kinds of wounds he could give Chris that aren't going to show, right?
• 1:43:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that aren't going to involve the police.
• 1:43:29
  [SPEAKER_12]: Right, because they're like, he'd have to kill all the kids, right?
• 1:43:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he's like, yeah.
• 1:43:34
  [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
• 1:43:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now, Chris, I don't think Chris doesn't know whether or not he's getting nervous, right?
• 1:43:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Chris knows he could die.
• 1:43:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's what he's thinking at this moment.
• 1:43:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then, I, again, like a perfect plant in payoff, I've forgotten the gun.
• 1:43:50
  [SPEAKER_10]: You're going to have to kill me, Ace.
• 1:43:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, problem.
• 1:43:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: And there is Gordon.
• 1:43:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: And this is the most important change from the book.
• 1:44:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, because in the book,
• 1:44:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's Chris Chambers that has the gun.
• 1:44:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Chris Chambers is the hero because that's what Stephen King saw.
• 1:44:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: Stephen King saw this story about this hero, Chris Chambers.
• 1:44:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the character of Gordy La Chance was the observer who was there to write down the heroic adventure of Chris Chambers, who cast his coming of age moment and it was Rob Reiner's decision.
• 1:44:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: to change it, to have Gordi be the one with the gun, and he was absolutely terrified.
• 1:44:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because this is a major change in the book.
• 1:44:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: This isn't, this isn't, you know, with, you know, in room 237, where they changed the car from yellow to red, or something like that, this is a key, key plot point.
• 1:44:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so he was really scared, and I'm going to hold off on telling you Stephen King's reaction to this change, and to we get a little bit later.
• 1:44:57
  [SPEAKER_12]: and not taking it, nobody's taking it.
• 1:45:01
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, no, I also think Rob did this because, you know, Rob sees himself in Gordy.
• 1:45:07
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I think as a filmmaker sometimes, your main character is you.
• 1:45:11
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so giving him the hero moment, makes sense for Rob.
• 1:45:15
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I would understand being terrified, but his instinct was correct because it completely works.
• 1:45:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well,
• 1:45:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the thing is, I agree with your points a hundred percent.
• 1:45:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: I also think Chris Chambers doesn't need a hero moment.
• 1:45:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Right, right, this Chambers has been a hero the whole time.
• 1:45:31
  [SPEAKER_12]: You're a great point, it's already, yeah, he's already proved that many times over.
• 1:45:34
  [SPEAKER_12]: You're correct on that.
• 1:45:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Gordy is the kid who doesn't stand, you know, his father doesn't see him.
• 1:45:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: He doesn't, is insecure about his writing.
• 1:45:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: He thinks people think he's weird.
• 1:45:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: He needs a hero moment.
• 1:45:46
  [SPEAKER_20]: Yeah, you know.
• 1:45:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: He needs that.
• 1:45:48
  [SPEAKER_20]: Come on, kid, just give me the gun before you take your foot off.
• 1:45:53
  [SPEAKER_20]: And then got the sack to shoot a wood chuck.
• 1:45:57
  [SPEAKER_17]: Don't know, bass.
• 1:46:00
  [SPEAKER_17]: I'll kill you, I swear, God.
• 1:46:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Wood Gordy pulled that trigger?
• 1:46:04
  [SPEAKER_12]: 100%.
• 1:46:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: I think so too.
• 1:46:06
  [SPEAKER_12]: I think in that moment.
• 1:46:08
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yep.
• 1:46:08
  [SPEAKER_12]: He was determined.
• 1:46:10
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
• 1:46:10
  [SPEAKER_12]: No one's going to take something else from me.
• 1:46:14
  [SPEAKER_12]: You took my brother was taken.
• 1:46:15
  [SPEAKER_12]: You're not taking Chris.
• 1:46:17
  [SPEAKER_12]: If you're not in this pain of this place of loss, that he is at, he is not going to suffer the loss of someone else who's close to him.
• 1:46:23
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 1:46:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, and the journey to the, the body became a very serious thing for Gordy.
• 1:46:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:46:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: He said, it shouldn't be a good time.
• 1:46:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's the one who kept saying the rules.
• 1:46:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: He said, I have to get it.
• 1:46:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is, I mean, this is classic heroes journey.
• 1:46:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: He had to go through the horrible thing and stand up to the demon in order to become an adult.
• 1:46:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's what happens.
• 1:46:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm on the chance, give me the gun.
• 1:46:47
  [SPEAKER_20]: It must have at least some of your brothers' good sense.
• 1:46:50
  [SPEAKER_07]: Important, hold back the hammer and says, suck my life, that what you cheap dime store would.
• 1:47:01
  [SPEAKER_12]: Such a great writer's insult.
• 1:47:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: In 1959, 12-year-olds, you know?
• 1:47:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, cheap, dime star, huh?
• 1:47:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Ace, you know, kind of still thinks that he can take this with a little bit of attitude goes, well, you can't do shoot us all.
• 1:47:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then chillingly, I think, will wait and says, no, it's just you.
• 1:47:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that is the moment because you can see his ace just start to with her a little bit.
• 1:47:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's so funny because we just did him in a few good men where you see the little start, the little cracks when he's on the witness stand and here it's the same thing of like, oh, I might not be in charge here.
• 1:47:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to get you for this.
• 1:47:46
  [SPEAKER_09]: Maybe you will, maybe you won't.
• 1:47:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Um, you know, we were talking before about speculating about what's going to happen next in the story after the movies over, I'm very curious what happens with Ace.
• 1:48:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because it's not over, you know, yeah, I think the gang turns on him.
• 1:48:06
  [SPEAKER_12]: Once the leader has cracks, once the Russian is caught, you're not a strong anymore.
• 1:48:11
  [SPEAKER_12]: Once the Russian is caught, you're not a strong anymore.
• 1:48:13
  [SPEAKER_10]: I love the moment after.
• 1:48:21
  [SPEAKER_10]: It's been used to one in four counties.
• 1:48:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ugh, it's so good.
• 1:48:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the other kids come out and they're looking down at the body.
• 1:48:28
  [SPEAKER_10]: We're going to take them.
• 1:48:31
  [SPEAKER_10]: No.
• 1:48:34
  [SPEAKER_10]: But we came all this way.
• 1:48:37
  [SPEAKER_10]: We were supposed to be used.
• 1:48:41
  [SPEAKER_10]: Not this way, too.
• 1:48:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: I just love the calm leadership.
• 1:48:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, yeah, this decision has been made, you know?
• 1:48:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then we have just, you know, the beautiful golden hour shot and this is, you know, this is the kind of movie where you know you're heading towards the end.
• 1:48:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know what I mean?
• 1:48:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like we can feel that wrapping up.
• 1:49:01
  [SPEAKER_18]: We headed home and although many thoughts raised through our minds, we barely spoke.
• 1:49:11
  [SPEAKER_18]: We walked through the night and made it back to Castle Rock a little past five o'clock on Sunday
• 1:49:19
  [SPEAKER_18]: We don't even gone two days, but somehow the town seemed different.
• 1:49:24
  [SPEAKER_18]: Smaller.
• 1:49:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I've had these moments.
• 1:49:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Coming home after the long journey, where you know you've changed, you know?
• 1:49:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
• 1:49:34
  [SPEAKER_12]: I remember coming back to Virginia after I'd been in LA for like five years, and I was like, wait, why does this feel so small?
• 1:49:42
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, you're just kind of, once your world has expanded, which is what a lot of people
• 1:49:47
  [SPEAKER_12]: fear when people leave these small towns that they're going to leave them small towns behind.
• 1:49:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then now we're gonna have the goodbye.
• 1:49:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, so, so, varn walks off, they're trying to figure out something some moment for him to have like a final varn moment and they finally came to, he's walking across the street, bends over, found a penny.
• 1:50:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then Teddy says his goodbye, he heads off singing the theme song to Paladin.
• 1:50:15
  [SPEAKER_18]: As time went on, we saw less and less of Teddy and her, until eventually they became just two more phases in the halls.
• 1:50:23
  [SPEAKER_18]: It happened sometimes.
• 1:50:25
  [SPEAKER_18]: Friends come in and out of your life, like bus boys and a restaurant.
• 1:50:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's some nice Stephen King writing and boy sure it's true.
• 1:50:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yep.
• 1:50:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, we were talking before about not always recognizing the special times when you're in the middle of them.
• 1:50:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:50:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it's just like, oh.
• 1:50:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: From those years to those years, I was really close to those three people.
• 1:50:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
• 1:50:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't see those people at barely anymore.
• 1:50:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:50:49
  [SPEAKER_12]: I can't tell you the names of a lot of my friends in my 20s.
• 1:50:54
  [SPEAKER_12]: I can't, and there was one friend that I hung out all the time for two years.
• 1:50:58
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I think his name is Robbie.
• 1:50:59
  [SPEAKER_12]: I can't even remember a minute.
• 1:51:01
  [SPEAKER_12]: You know, but yeah, it happens, absolutely happens.
• 1:51:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: What's sad is Robby's listening to this episode.
• 1:51:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, I hope so.
• 1:51:07
  [SPEAKER_12]: Thank you, Robby.
• 1:51:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, thank you for your subscription.
• 1:51:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we hear what happened to Verne and what happened to Teddy, Verne's married and, you know, running a forklift and Teddy, you know, couldn't get in the army doing odd jobs, some time and jail.
• 1:51:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:51:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Um, and then it's time for our last goodbye.
• 1:51:26
  [SPEAKER_10]: I'm never going to get out of this town.
• 1:51:28
  [SPEAKER_10]: I'm like,
• 1:51:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: some skin.
• 1:51:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I like that we know that they give each other the skin, but we're it's off camera because we're up in those close-ups just watching them look at each other and Chris is walking away and now we hear what happened to him.
• 1:51:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Chris did get out.
• 1:51:50
  [SPEAKER_18]: He enrolled in the college courses with me and although it was hard he gutted it out like he always did.
• 1:51:56
  [SPEAKER_18]: He went on to college and eventually became a lawyer.
• 1:51:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm so happy that we have that little bit of story about what happens after the movie.
• 1:52:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: Sure.
• 1:52:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: That Chris and Gordy stayed together and Chris didn't just take the shop classes.
• 1:52:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: He actually took the college classes.
• 1:52:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: That he wanted to take and he did reinvent himself.
• 1:52:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: He did get out of town.
• 1:52:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm so glad we hear about that.
• 1:52:19
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, like great friends change you.
• 1:52:21
  [SPEAKER_12]: Great friends change, great friends motivate you inspire you.
• 1:52:24
  [SPEAKER_18]: Last week, he entered a fast food restaurant.
• 1:52:27
  [SPEAKER_18]: just ahead of him, two men got into an argument.
• 1:52:30
  [SPEAKER_18]: One of them pulled a knife.
• 1:52:32
  [SPEAKER_18]: Chris, who would always made the best piece tried to break it up.
• 1:52:36
  [SPEAKER_18]: He was stabbed in the throat.
• 1:52:38
  [SPEAKER_18]: he died almost instantly.
• 1:52:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: And at that moment that we hear those words, we see Chris Chambers and River Phoenix dissolve fade off into nothingness.
• 1:52:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I know Rob has a very hard time watching this moment of the movie, the other kids that are in it have a very hard, I mean, it's hard to watch, knowing what happens to River Phoenix.
• 1:53:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's like the John Lennon of this crew.
• 1:53:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh, yeah, you know, because they just had, you know, as we're just by serendipity or kismit, we're doing standby me at the time when they've re-released in the theaters for a 40th anniversary.
• 1:53:16
  [SPEAKER_12]: It was not our plan.
• 1:53:17
  [SPEAKER_12]: We had planned standby me earlier this year.
• 1:53:20
  [SPEAKER_12]: We had no idea it was coming out for a 40th, but, you know, Riverfine, oh, sorry, Wil Wheaton and Corey and Jerry have taken photos.
• 1:53:30
  [SPEAKER_12]: There's a photo, they just went right by the sign of where the town, where it was shot.
• 1:53:34
  [SPEAKER_12]: So it's like, but river is missing.
• 1:53:36
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so it's like the Beatles, you know, whenever before George passed on, whenever the three of them get together that anthology series, it was always empty, because John's not there.
• 1:53:45
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I think the same thing here, you know.
• 1:53:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then, again, it's really surprising cut because I feel like we forgot in this guy, even though we've been hearing his voice, but we're suddenly looking at green text on a screen, and we see the last line of voice over, typed there, although I hadn't seen him in more than 10 years.
• 1:54:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know I'll miss him forever.
• 1:54:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we see Richard Dryfiss is sitting at the computer and is obviously a son and his son's friends come in.
• 1:54:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're wearing towels.
• 1:54:11
  [SPEAKER_05]: Dad, can we go now?
• 1:54:19
  [SPEAKER_20]: Okay, I'll be right there.
• 1:54:21
  [SPEAKER_05]: So that I have a hour ago.
• 1:54:23
  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I might get out to where.
• 1:54:25
  [SPEAKER_05]: He gets like that one's right.
• 1:54:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: But my kid could say that about me.
• 1:54:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Writing or editing, that I get very weird, have no sense of time.
• 1:54:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then he writes, I never had any friends later on.
• 1:54:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like the ones I had when I was 12.
• 1:54:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Jesus, does anyone?
• 1:54:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: Just a great line.
• 1:54:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:54:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: And my response is, no, you don't ever have kids friends like you have when you're 12.
• 1:54:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because you're never like you are when you're 12 again.
• 1:54:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, yeah, it's different.
• 1:54:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: But for the meaning of a friendship at 12 is just different.
• 1:55:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: You and I are great friends.
• 1:55:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we've been friends really long time.
• 1:55:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we're not friends like we would have been when we were 12.
• 1:55:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's just no, right.
• 1:55:07
  [SPEAKER_12]: Exactly.
• 1:55:08
  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm still friends with one friend I was friends with me when I was 12.
• 1:55:12
  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm still friends with them on Facebook.
• 1:55:14
  [SPEAKER_12]: Right, so we communicate every once in a while, but yeah, but there are other friends, I had a friend named Nathan, a friend named Mike Gunn, who, or friends of me through, when I was 12, I never talked to them, you know, in decades.
• 1:55:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm talking in decades.
• 1:55:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I'm not, I'm actually saying something different, which is what I'm saying is that, like, so my two oldest friends David Seal again, Matt Rosen, both of them, support us on Patreon and could be my future episode.
• 1:55:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: We are super, super close friends, but we're not friends like we were when we were 12.
• 1:55:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I see what you're saying.
• 1:55:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's that the way you exist in the world is short print when you're 12.
• 1:55:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Everything is still new.
• 1:55:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:55:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're discovering everything together.
• 1:55:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're growing and changing through Apple Lake.
• 1:55:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're grownups.
• 1:55:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: We can talk about, you know, our insurance and our health and y'all, you know, like rent and movies and what's this new pain?
• 1:56:04
  [SPEAKER_12]: What's this new pain I got?
• 1:56:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I love what's so good, and I'm so glad that Richard Dreyfus is the one who got cast in the movie because his moment of looking at the last words that he wrote and smiling is the most writerly moment you can have.
• 1:56:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're totally alone.
• 1:56:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: You don't know if anybody else is going to like this thing that you just wrote, but you like it.
• 1:56:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're happy having written those words that and they didn't exist before.
• 1:56:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's the moment that Richard Dreyfus is
• 1:56:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: turns off the computer as we hear the sounds of Stan by me raising up in the background and we're looked through the window and we watch those kids fighting with towels and dad comes out and they get in the Jeep and they drive away.
• 1:56:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: By the way, Stan by we went to number one in the in the charts when this movie came out 25 years after it's initial release.
• 1:57:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Benny King saw.
• 1:57:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, great.
• 1:57:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: So by the way, in the book, all of the friends die.
• 1:57:10
  [UNKNOWN]: Oh, wow.
• 1:57:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because that's actually what happened to Stephen King's closest friends.
• 1:57:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: All of them had died by the time that he was writing the body.
• 1:57:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
• 1:57:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: By the way, you know, and obviously this whole process was a huge coming of an age experience for Rob.
• 1:57:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is where he feels like he became a director.
• 1:57:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: And
• 1:57:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: It also was a whole bunch of his friends supporting him to make this movie that made this possible, which I think is kind of neat.
• 1:57:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're in post production, and there was a plan to have Michael Jackson recording new version of standby me for the end credits and finally Rob Nickstit because he was like, no, it would take you out of the movie, it would take you out of the time of the movie in the world of the movie, no Michael Jackson.
• 1:57:53
  [SPEAKER_17]: Oh, just had a bad day.
• 1:57:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, I agree.
• 1:57:57
  [SPEAKER_12]: I think it would maybe take an end out.
• 1:57:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I mentioned that Rob Reiner was very nervous about how Stephen King would feel about the changes and they invited him to a screening.
• 1:58:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: He brought him, I think it was at a hotel and Rob couldn't even watch the movie with Stephen King who you've been freaked out.
• 1:58:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Stephen King, after Rob Reiner was murdered, wrote a beautiful, beautiful article in The New York Times, and I highly recommend it.
• 1:58:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I wanted to read part of it here, and I've done my best to edit this doubt as short as I can, not easy editing a great writer like Stephen King, but it is a long section, but I want to read the whole thing.
• 1:58:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: because this is how what his experience when Rob Reiner had him screen, what was it then called the body.
• 1:58:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was surprised by how deeply affected I was by its 89 minutes.
• 1:58:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: I've written a lot of fiction, but the body remains the only nakedly autobiographical story I've ever done.
• 1:58:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: Those kids were my friends.
• 1:59:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: We never walked down a railroad track to see a dead body, but we got up to other stuff.
• 1:59:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: The story was about my reality as I had lived it on the dirt roads of southern Maine.
• 1:59:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: There really was a junkyard dog, although his name wasn't chopper.
• 1:59:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: There really was a kid who went swimming and came out covered with leeches in surprising areas, but it wasn't Gordy La Chance.
• 1:59:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: It was me.
• 1:59:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: What I'm saying is that in Rob's hands, it all rang true.
• 1:59:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: The funny parts were really funny, including the Barferama and the dramatic parts hit me where I lived.
• 1:59:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: When the movie was over, I thank Rob and surprised the hell out of myself by giving him a hug.
• 1:59:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not ordinarily a hugging man, and I don't think that he was used to getting them.
• 1:59:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: He stiffened, muttered something about being glad I liked it and we both stepped away.
• 1:59:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: I apparently wasn't done feeling my feelings.
• 1:59:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: I went into the nearest men's bathroom and sat in the stall until I could get myself under control.
• 1:59:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Nostalgia can be dangerous when it's up close.
• 1:59:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't exactly know what I mean by that, but it feels true.
• 1:59:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: When I watch Chris Chambers say to the Weeping Gordi LaChance, you're going to be a great writer someday.
• 2:00:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: The Weeping Boy was me.
• 2:00:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: It was Rob Reiner who put it on the screen.
• 2:00:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's amazing.
• 2:00:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's beautiful.
• 2:00:10
  [SPEAKER_12]: From one artist to another.
• 2:00:12
  [SPEAKER_12]: One great artist to another, recognizing his brilliance and Rob's nervousness is respecting Steven's brilliance.
• 2:00:20
  [SPEAKER_12]: So yeah.
• 2:00:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I mean, I think part of why I think, well, speak for me, but I bet you feel this way too, is that part of why we love movies is that sometimes they're magic.
• 2:00:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes they can tap into something, just images together can make something feel real and I can't imagine the experience.
• 2:00:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: For Stephen King of seeing the most autobiographical thing he has written.
• 2:00:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: put up on screen and changed in a way that made it more real for him.
• 2:00:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that saw him in a way that he didn't see himself.
• 2:00:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's what's so powerful to me about that story.
• 2:01:00
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, that's a great point.
• 2:01:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 2:01:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Way back at the beginning, I said that they had, you know, this originally was with embassy pictures and the embassy was bought by Columbia and Columbia dumps the movie because they didn't want anything to do with it and then normally there's sweeps and pace for the movie and now they need to get a distributor.
• 2:01:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And nobody wants to distribute this movie.
• 2:01:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: After all, the body, they bring it over to Paramount to Universal Warner's Disney, everybody passes.
• 2:01:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: Finally, they go back to Columbia, who said they didn't want it.
• 2:01:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Norman Lear, it sounds like just pressures this guy.
• 2:01:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: His name is Guy Malkowain at Columbia to watch the film.
• 2:01:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's home sick.
• 2:01:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he's like, all right, I'll put it on with and he's watching it with his daughters.
• 2:01:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: and his daughters love the movie.
• 2:01:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that is why it ends up going back to Columbia, the studio, the dump them in the first place is the one that ends up distributing the movie.
• 2:01:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: It was nominated for one Oscar, which is for best, uh, uh, a screenplay, best adapted screenplay.
• 2:02:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: It went up against a children of lesser God, color of money, crimes of the heart, and a room with the view, which won for best screenplay.
• 2:02:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: It did not get nominated for anything else.
• 2:02:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's everything that I have on standby me.
• 2:02:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, John, do you have final thoughts on the show?
• 2:02:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And on the season of Rob Riner that we're ending today?
• 2:02:22
  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh, wow, the heaviness of that.
• 2:02:25
  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay, so this is all exemplary news.
• 2:02:27
  [SPEAKER_12]: So here's what I'll say.
• 2:02:28
  [SPEAKER_12]: First, I'm very glad we did this movie to finish off our season of Rob Riner because this could arguably be his most moving effective and touching movie.
• 2:02:41
  [SPEAKER_12]: You know, and at a tight 86 minutes.
• 2:02:44
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's an incredible film.
• 2:02:45
  [SPEAKER_12]: We did Princess Brie, which is also one of my favorites, but there's something about standby me that speaks to us on a very deeply human level.
• 2:02:54
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I'm glad I got to experience it again and watch it again.
• 2:02:57
  [SPEAKER_12]: It'd been years since I'd seen it.
• 2:02:59
  [SPEAKER_12]: and to explore more of what's going on with these characters and the story that's being laid out here and the journeys they're going on and the ways that me as a human being is John Roka connected to elements of all four of these guys as they were going on these journeys.
• 2:03:14
  [SPEAKER_12]: I've been all four of these guys at different stages of my life.
• 2:03:17
  [SPEAKER_12]: So there's something really powerful in that watching it for me overall.
• 2:03:22
  [SPEAKER_12]: But at the end,
• 2:03:23
  [SPEAKER_12]: It's that moment with Chris and Gordi sitting on the log that this film was all about.
• 2:03:27
  [SPEAKER_12]: That moment, and I think Steve you said it so well, but idea that we need to create this place where men can express their feelings, have the grace to express their feelings with other men, and be accepted for that, and find connection in that, find power in that, find strength in that.
• 2:03:45
  [SPEAKER_12]: So to end this shaming of men having to go on these journeys, these emotional journeys, and actually wanting to be there for them as we all go through it, because I think that would help our entire gender out in so many ways.
• 2:03:58
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so I think there's something really powerful in that.
• 2:04:01
  [SPEAKER_12]: with this story.
• 2:04:02
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I just love the universal aspects of it all.
• 2:04:05
  [SPEAKER_12]: And it was great to revisit Rob Reiner's greatness throughout this entire season of Rob Reiner.
• 2:04:09
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I come away from this.
• 2:04:10
  [SPEAKER_12]: I don't know if anybody listening this or you still feel, you still feel this way.
• 2:04:14
  [SPEAKER_12]: But I came I come away from this entire season, months of discussion of Rob Reiner's movie with work, rather, with a even
• 2:04:24
  [SPEAKER_12]: bigger appreciation for what he was able to do in films that I've just always kind of said yeah those are great those are great but to go bone deep on them the way we did in this last few months makes me
• 2:04:37
  [SPEAKER_12]: grasp the greatness of them even more in a way that sits me back on my ass and on my heels and makes me appreciate him as a filmmaker and revere him in ways that I had revered him before.
• 2:04:50
  [SPEAKER_12]: And so I think this has been an incredible journey.
• 2:04:52
  [SPEAKER_12]: And I hope all of our fans who listen to us have enjoyed us walking down this path and felt that we've done these movie justice, which is all we can ask.
• 2:05:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: I have a whole bunch of scattershot thoughts that maybe will fall into a certain kind of structure.
• 2:05:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
• 2:05:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm thinking about this film, and I'm thinking about some of the questions we got asked, some of the ones from Jeff Cook and some of the other ones where...
• 2:05:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: The question was one version of what other movies do this?
• 2:05:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: What other movies are like this?
• 2:05:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: And you and I both struggled to really find a whole bunch of other movies.
• 2:05:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, if we were if we were to do in diehard or something, we could come up with all sorts of other movies that are like diehard.
• 2:05:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 2:05:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 2:05:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 2:05:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, not as good, but like it.
• 2:05:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Whereas with this, it's like what other movie does this?
• 2:05:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I suddenly thinking about Rob Riner films in general.
• 2:05:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 2:05:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Going, you know what?
• 2:05:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: The great movies they are within genres, but they're also kind of stand alone.
• 2:05:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, Spinal Tap invents a genre.
• 2:05:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, like it is at the beginning of this idea of the mockumentary.
• 2:05:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: The sure thing is a great romantic comedy.
• 2:05:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: This might be the archetypal coming of age film.
• 2:06:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, the princess bride, there are lots of fantasy movies.
• 2:06:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's lots of comedy movies.
• 2:06:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Is there any other movie at all that's like the princess bride in tone, in structure, in its sense of adventure, in its sweetness, in its romance, I don't really think there is.
• 2:06:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: When here in Metzallie is the archetypal modern romantic comedy.
• 2:06:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Misery is unlike any other horror movie, and it's complete stillness, and it's quiet.
• 2:06:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's very, very different.
• 2:06:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, we started the, we started the season of Reiner with Rob Reiner doesn't get enough as much respect.
• 2:06:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's not listed one of these great filmmakers and I think that the warmth of Rob Reiner, they're humanness of it that we see that it's so filling this movie, maybe more than any other film, just the deep deep love.
• 2:06:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: is as central to filmmaking and Rob Reiner as the mob and the streets of New York are for Martin Scorsese, as wonder is for Stephen Spielberg.
• 2:07:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, as looking into the underbelly of things is for Stanley Kubrick, each one of these filmmakers has their Americana for Frank Appra.
• 2:07:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think the love of humans, the simplicity of character,
• 2:07:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: is so central to Rob Reiner and I think it's not exemplified anywhere more maybe than in standby me.
• 2:07:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: There's a bother.
• 2:07:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: So that's what we think of standby me.
• 2:07:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: We hope you've enjoyed this breakdown.
• 2:07:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: We hope you've enjoyed the season of Rob Reiner.
• 2:07:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: We've certainly had a fantastic time going through this film and we of course would love you to subscribe to the cinephiles if you haven't already.
• 2:07:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: You can do it at Apple iTunes that doesn't even make it anymore.
• 2:07:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: You can do it on Apple Podcasts or Spotify or YouTube or any other podcast platform.
• 2:07:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: If you want to leave your reviews, they're greatly appreciated, comments are always appreciated.
• 2:07:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: And if you want to reach me, you can do it at SR Morris on Twitter, John, how would they reach you?
• 2:08:01
  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, you can always reach me at the Roca says on all social media and please head on over to my YouTube channel, youtube.com slash john roca says what we do reviews have conversations explore all things going on in the world of entertainment film, we're trying to get to 50,000 subscribers.
• 2:08:16
  [SPEAKER_12]: So I would love it if you all would do that and you know, we're in March, we're about we're in April, rather, and we're about to go into a second part of the of the year.
• 2:08:31
  [SPEAKER_12]: episodes with your friends sharing our episode you're gifting subscriptions you know maybe there's someone like stay by me baby there's someone but who's friendship you love and respect who's opinion love and respect then you guys connect over movies maybe gifting them a subscription to the cinephiles for the year as a thank you or as a way of showing some love for your friend so they can appreciate what we do and you guys can have something new to share in conversations about our conversation so just a little something
• 2:09:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: uh... and i think that is it for this week we'll back next week with a movie that i don't even know what it is because we are deciding that in a few hours at our next advisory board meeting will be picking the next movie and you could join the advisory board by going to patreon dot com slash the cinephiles so that's it for this week we'll be back next time with another great film right here on the cinephiles