Latest / UNCHAINEDTV'S Truth Files with Jane Velez-Mitchell / Why Music Icon Moby Is Praising Chicken Rescue Defendant Zoe Rosenberg

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Why Music Icon Moby Is Praising Chicken Rescue Defendant Zoe Rosenberg · UNCHAINEDTV'S Truth Files with Jane Velez-Mitchell

0:03
You are watching a moment in history.
0:06
The defense case has begun in the trial
0:09
of Zoe Rosenberg, what's being called the Chicken
0:13
Rescue Trial, and it's going to be really
0:18
historic as Zoe says it was worth it
0:23
all to rescue these four innocent beings that
0:28
she rescued from a slaughter truck way back
0:32
in 2023.
0:34
This is the moment that everybody's been waiting
0:37
for since June 2023.
0:39
You're seeing her commit the alleged crime for
0:43
which she is charged, rescuing four chickens from
0:46
a slaughter truck in Sonoma County, California.
0:50
She could do five years in prison and
0:54
we are going to hear from a very
0:56
special guest in just a moment who will
0:59
bring us an entirely new perspective in this
1:02
case.
1:03
But first, let's go straight out to the
1:06
courthouse where our reporter Matthew Zirbel is standing
1:11
by as supporters of Zoe Rosenberg gather to
1:15
enter the courtroom in just a couple of
1:18
minutes.
1:18
So without further ado, we are going to
1:22
go straight out to Matthew Zirbel.
1:24
Matthew, just give us a sense of what's
1:28
happening there, the intensity, the emotion.
1:32
Yeah Jane, well we've got a lot of
1:33
people gathered and this is still early.
1:36
We're expecting I think a good number of
1:38
people more to gather as we get a
1:42
little bit closer to the start of court
1:43
which is in about a half an hour
1:45
now.
1:46
So we're all very excited to hear Carla
1:49
and Rocky's testimony today.
1:52
Carla, especially being able to testify as an
1:54
expert witness, will be able to say just
1:56
a little bit unfortunately, but a fair bit
2:00
of what she was experiencing, what her conclusions
2:03
were about the chickens that she rescued.
2:06
And so the trial is about to really
2:08
shift from what happened to why it all
2:11
happened.
2:12
And there's a picture of Carla.
2:14
She was the one who took in the
2:17
chickens after Zoe Rosenberg rescued them.
2:20
Can you flesh that out a little bit?
2:23
Yeah, unfortunately I don't know the full timeline
2:25
of events afterwards.
2:27
So I'll be learning in court along with
2:30
the jury, but I believe so.
2:33
I believe she took in the chickens, did
2:35
the initial caregiving, sent her report over to
2:39
Dr. Rosenberg.
2:40
Thank you so much.
2:42
We'll be back to you in a second.
2:44
Now our very special guest.
2:46
This is Tracy Glover and she runs a
2:49
Sweet Peeps Chicken Sanctuary in Alabama.
2:54
Tracy, who are you with?
2:56
You've been following this case.
2:58
What are your thoughts and feelings about it?
3:00
Hi, yeah, thanks so much for having me.
3:03
This is Jasmine and Jasmine is the same
3:07
kind of chicken that Zoe rescued, a Cornish
3:10
cross.
3:12
She also was rescued from a factory farm
3:14
about six years ago.
3:17
And when I watch the footage of the
3:21
rescue, all I can think is about my
3:26
chickens.
3:27
So I currently have 24 right now and
3:31
every single one of them, I mean, they're
3:34
sentient beings.
3:36
So, you know, to see them crammed into
3:39
that crate, I just can't imagine that they're
3:42
not having like wings broken or bones broken.
3:46
I mean, they're living beings.
3:48
They're not things.
3:50
And it just, I can't even quite put
3:52
into words how much it hurts my heart
3:54
to think about somebody like Jasmine being treated
3:57
like that.
3:59
Jasmine and every other chicken here is an
4:03
individual.
4:04
They are intelligent, they are sensitive, they have
4:07
emotions.
4:09
They're not different in any relevant way from
4:13
our dogs and our cats.
4:14
I also have dogs and cats and, you
4:17
know, they're all individuals.
4:19
But the bond I have with the chickens
4:22
is the same.
4:24
And I just, you know, if we wouldn't
4:27
do it to dogs and cats, then I
4:29
don't, you know, we shouldn't be doing it
4:31
to chickens.
4:32
So many people have talked about this case
4:35
as really highlighting a cultural divide.
4:40
When the officer in the prosecution's case testified,
4:44
he referred to the chickens as products and
4:48
said, I wouldn't interact with these products because
4:51
of contamination risk.
4:54
What is your reaction to that?
4:58
Essentially, I mean, let's face it, to give
5:00
him a little leeway, everybody who buys chickens
5:04
in the store when they're dead refers to
5:06
them as products essentially.
5:08
Right.
5:08
I mean, it's just such a fiction.
5:12
It's such a, it's so counter to reality.
5:16
Um, you know, I mean, again, like, yeah,
5:19
when people buy animal products in the store
5:23
and they are already, you know, they've already
5:27
been slaughtered and cut up and they don't
5:30
resemble the living being that they were.
5:33
But like, especially you're talking about these animals
5:35
at the slaughterhouse, they're obviously not things, they're
5:39
living beings.
5:40
Like, I mean, I think it, though, it
5:43
reflects so, um, accurately the way that they're
5:47
treated.
5:48
Like if they were things, it would be
5:50
okay to treat them like in the industry
5:54
does.
5:55
But, um, it's just such a lie.
5:57
It's, it's such a, I mean, I think
5:59
it's, it's like the lie that we have
6:01
to tell in order to be able to
6:03
do to them what we do.
6:04
But, you know, you, you just, it's just
6:07
not reality.
6:08
Um, it's like we can, you know, when
6:09
you see the animals themselves and especially, I
6:13
mean, I wish everybody had a chance to
6:15
get to know them as individuals.
6:17
Um, because it's, it just puts the lie
6:20
to that whole, um, story that we've been
6:24
told, you know, I think our whole lives
6:26
in this society that chickens and the other
6:28
animals that we eat are, um, fundamentally somehow
6:32
different from other living beings like dogs and
6:35
cats.
6:36
Um, and, uh, I mean, I don't know,
6:39
just to hear them talk about his products
6:41
is it's, it's just, it's just insanity.
6:44
It's like, it's, it's, it's, it's insane.
6:46
It's so disconnected from the reality.
6:49
Like this is obviously not a product.
6:51
Jasmine is not a product.
6:53
Jasmine is a living being, um, who feels
6:57
pain and, and on the other side, like
6:59
feels joy.
7:00
Like, you know, the animals at sanctuary, the
7:02
animals here, they're such a joyful, happy, sweet,
7:05
little people.
7:06
They feel safe here.
7:08
And that's the other thing is like, just
7:09
thinking about, you know, my, my whole goal,
7:11
my whole mission here is to keep these
7:13
animals safe and to make them feel safe.
7:16
Um, and to see all those animals in
7:19
the video, um, uh, with the you just
7:23
know that those animals are terrified and they're
7:27
babies.
7:28
Um, you know, I mean, I see here
7:30
all the time, if there's, you know, a
7:32
Hawk or something and one of the chickens
7:35
will spot the Hawk and, you know, you
7:36
can see the fear on their faces and
7:38
they run for cover or, you know, if,
7:40
if a strange person even comes onto the
7:42
property, they don't know if they can trust
7:44
them or not.
7:45
And you could just see it in their
7:46
faces.
7:47
They look to me like, is this person
7:48
okay?
7:49
Is this situation okay?
7:51
Um, and I mean, again, these are babies
7:53
or, you know, what, six, maybe eight weeks
7:55
old.
7:56
They're just these innocent, fragile, I mean, fragile
7:59
and to cram them in there like that.
8:02
Um, I mean, if they, again, if they
8:04
were products, if they were inanimate objects, that
8:07
would be fine, but they're not, they're living
8:08
beings.
8:09
Um, and they're trying, you know, I can't
8:11
even imagine the trauma of that baby right
8:14
there, the fear, um, just, just the misery
8:17
of, of their whole existence.
8:19
And every chicken that was shoved back there,
8:23
they're dead, right?
8:24
Right.
8:25
Right.
8:25
4,000 chickens, approximately according to the defense
8:29
in every truck.
8:31
And one of the reasons I just want
8:33
to state why this is an historic trial
8:35
is that it really goes to the heart
8:37
of animal agriculture companies aside, chickens are the
8:42
most killed by far.
8:44
This is figures from 2022, more than 75
8:47
billion chickens.
8:48
If you were to remove chickens from the
8:50
food chain, the number of animals kill would
8:53
drop by 95% approximately.
8:56
Now, let me say this, uh, Purdue is
8:59
invited on any time.
9:01
They say they have high animal welfare standards,
9:04
no cages or crates.
9:06
Well, okay.
9:08
But obviously that's not true during transportation because
9:11
they were transported in crates in the truck.
9:15
Um, so we invite them on any time
9:19
to discuss that.
9:20
And, um, also they have an entire website
9:24
devoted to their record on animal welfare, corporate
9:27
.purduefarms.com forward slash responsibility forward slash animal
9:31
care.
9:31
They say they're a leader in animal welfare,
9:34
dedicated to the highest standards of animal care
9:37
and give their bird space to roam to
9:39
the outdoors.
9:40
And basically say DXC is an extremist group
9:44
with the ultimate goal of ending animal agriculture.
9:47
So before we move on and go back
9:49
to court, what is your reaction?
9:52
And again, we invite them on any time
9:54
and, and that those trucks are industry standards.
9:57
They're not unique to this company or any
10:00
company, but right.
10:03
Just in the transportation, what would you say?
10:06
Yeah.
10:06
I mean, like one thing too, that in,
10:08
um, in that list of, you know, humane,
10:11
uh, conditions, um, and it says the ability
10:15
to express their natural behaviors.
10:17
I don't even know how they could make
10:20
that claim.
10:21
Um, I mean, there's obviously nothing natural about
10:25
that truck, but also, you know, I don't
10:27
know where they're coming from.
10:28
Um, but for sure in that moment, they're
10:32
still alive.
10:33
And, um, that's just, uh, uh, I mean,
10:38
I don't know how a living being, like
10:40
how you could think that they wouldn't be
10:42
injured, um, treating them like that.
10:45
Um, yeah.
10:47
I mean, I just think it's, it's, uh,
10:49
it's a lot of propaganda on that.
10:52
I'm, you know, it seems to me, this
10:55
is a crate.
10:56
Yeah.
10:56
That's a crate.
10:57
And this is not natural.
10:59
There's nothing natural about being packed in like,
11:02
like this.
11:03
Um, uh, it's just, um, yeah, I mean,
11:06
it's, it's got to be, I'm sure that
11:09
there are, if there, if there are 4
11:10
,000 birds on that truck and Zoe rescued
11:13
four, I mean, I bet, I can't imagine
11:16
how many more had have injuries or other,
11:19
um, you know, health issues besides just again,
11:22
like the, the real, you know, these are
11:23
emotional, sensitive beings.
11:25
Like imagine if we did that to dogs
11:27
or cats, just how, how, how terrified they
11:30
would be.
11:31
Um, so, I mean, I don't know.
11:33
I think, uh, like you say, though, I
11:36
mean, there's so much that is considered standard
11:39
industry practice that is, that's legal that leads
11:42
to tremendous suffering.
11:43
That's tremendously cruel and we can't share it
11:47
with who they really are.
11:48
Um, and so we have to about who
11:50
they are.
11:51
I mean, like Jasmine, again, she was rescued
11:53
from a factory farm over six years ago.
11:56
Um, uh, you know, the typical age that
11:59
these birds are sent to slaughter is six
12:01
to eight weeks old.
12:02
The birds in that crate in the video,
12:04
they're six to eight weeks old max.
12:06
They look older because they've been so genetically
12:09
manipulated to grow so big that they appear
12:12
to be almost like adults, but they're babies.
12:13
I promised they were peeping.
12:15
They were peeping like chicks peep.
12:18
Um, and, um, they can have, uh, you
12:22
know, like their lives, obviously like you said,
12:24
the rest of them, the rest of them
12:26
have all been sent to slaughter.
12:27
Whereas the four that Zoe rescued right there,
12:29
they're getting to live the lives that they
12:33
deserve to have.
12:35
Um, I mean, Jasmine for one, again, this
12:37
is like one bird, every single one.
12:39
I see how she's nuzzling under your arm.
12:41
She would stay.
12:42
I mean, sometimes like, again, if there's like
12:44
a good treat or something, she might, you
12:46
know, decide she wants to go somewhere, but
12:47
otherwise she'll just sit in my arms.
12:50
Like when I go out into the yard,
12:51
they all come over to me.
12:53
They all want attention.
12:54
They all want to have their little like
12:56
heads rubbed and their cheeks rubbed.
12:58
And they're just, they like to snuggle.
13:02
I mean, they're so, and they, you know,
13:04
and again, they all have these individual personalities.
13:06
They're so much smarter than people know.
13:08
Um, you know, I did this film for
13:10
you or with you.
13:12
Um, and one of the chickens in that
13:13
film, sunshine is we featured.
13:15
And, um, she's one of the chickens who
13:17
sleeps in the house at night.
13:18
And like every night at bedtime, she comes,
13:21
she goes outside during the day to be
13:23
with her sisters.
13:23
But every night at like dinnertime, she comes
13:26
to the door and she waits for me,
13:27
like on the dot, like she doesn't wear
13:29
a watch, but she knows what time it
13:30
is.
13:30
And then I opened the door.
13:32
I have to open like four doors.
13:33
She just knows the whole way through the
13:36
yard and then through the porch and then
13:37
through the house.
13:38
And she makes her way to her own
13:39
little kennel.
13:40
Uh, I mean, they're, they're so much smarter
13:44
than, than people know.
13:46
Um, and I think, you know, we have
13:48
this like misconception that if they, if, if,
13:51
uh, if they're, if they're stupid enough, then
13:53
like they're suffering, then they can't suffer or
13:55
something.
13:55
And that just doesn't make any sense.
13:57
Like, like babies, babies can suffer.
14:00
I mean, we know, you know, it's like,
14:01
it doesn't make sense.
14:02
And it's not true.
14:02
Like, even if they were not smart, it
14:06
wouldn't be okay to treat them the way
14:07
that we treat them just as in the
14:09
same way that it's not okay to treat,
14:11
uh, you know, somebody with like a mental
14:13
disability or a baby or, uh, you know,
14:16
a senior, um, you know, you had mentioned
14:19
dogs and what's interesting is, of course, there
14:22
is as it, there should be an uproar
14:25
about what some other societies and not very
14:29
many, and there's animal rights movements in all
14:32
those societies, but look what is done to
14:36
these dogs going to market for food and
14:39
Americans are outraged, screaming at the top of
14:43
their lungs as they should be.
14:44
Right.
14:45
But you make the point that chickens are
14:47
not that different.
14:49
We really want to draw the line at
14:51
chickens.
14:51
Final comment.
14:53
I think I would, you know, reiterate what
14:55
you said that, um, if you want, if
14:57
we want to reduce the greatest amount of
15:00
suffering as fast as possible, like just stop
15:03
eating chickens, a lot of people, you know,
15:05
they, as they're, as they see the, um,
15:08
environmental implications and everything of eating meat, you
15:10
know, they often want to, we'll start with
15:12
the larger animals and that they end up
15:14
eating more of the smaller animals, which means
15:16
more animals dying and more suffering.
15:18
Um, I think just, you know, to, to,
15:20
to reiterate they're, they're sensitive, emotional beings with
15:25
like rich inner lives and they don't want
15:27
to suffer and they want to live.
15:29
And so just, um, give up eating chickens
15:32
and you can do so much good.
15:34
You can reduce so much suffering in the
15:36
world.
15:36
And before you go, can you just, just
15:38
bring Jasmine a little closer to the camera
15:41
so we can see her beautiful face.
15:43
Yeah.
15:44
Thank you Jasmine for being our very special
15:47
guests.
15:47
We have an exclusive with Jasmine, the chicken
15:50
at the Sweet Peeps Animal Sanctuary in Alabama.
15:55
Thank you so very much.
15:58
Appreciate you.
16:01
Appreciate you.
16:02
All right.
16:02
We're going to go out now to, back
16:05
to Matthew.
16:06
Okay.
16:07
We've got 15 minutes till the start of
16:09
the defense case.
16:11
Um, just give us a sense of the
16:14
importance and the drama of this moment.
16:18
Yeah.
16:19
This is going to be the turning point
16:21
where we get to talk about how the
16:23
chickens were treated.
16:25
What's like the situation that they found themselves
16:28
in was immediately after the rescue.
16:31
And so this is really where we get
16:34
to talk about all the things we've been
16:37
trying to get in.
16:38
And it's very fortunate that we've been able
16:40
to get in Zoe's, all of this is
16:42
on the basis of Zoe's ability to say,
16:44
I had a necessity defense.
16:47
Now she's not allowed to argue in court
16:49
that the necessity defense actually applies here.
16:52
The judge has ruled that it does not,
16:54
unfortunately, but she does get to argue because
16:56
she's being charged with conspiracy that her belief
16:59
in necessity meant that she was not planning
17:01
to do anything illegal.
17:03
And that was because of her good faith
17:05
belief that it was legal to rescue chickens
17:08
when they're being abused.
17:11
And for good faith belief that the chickens
17:13
at the slaughter house were being abused.
17:16
And so that's informed by the jury, the
17:19
actual conditions of the chickens, which Carla will
17:22
be able to testify to.
17:24
And that's why all of that is able
17:25
to be discussed in court.
17:27
And it'll be really interesting to see how
17:30
much of it gets to get thrown to
17:32
the jury and what the jury will make
17:34
of it.
17:35
Wow.
17:36
Okay.
17:36
This is very exciting.
17:38
I want to bring in first our legal
17:41
analyst, Justine Block.
17:43
Now, one of the things that happened, of
17:45
course, when the prosecution ends its case in
17:49
chief, there is this opportunity before the defense
17:51
starts for the defense to say, they didn't
17:55
make their case, throw it all out.
17:57
That's what the defense tried to do.
17:59
The judge did not throw the case out,
18:01
but he did make a ruling eliminating one
18:05
of the aggravating factors.
18:07
Can you tell us about that?
18:08
Because that is a victory for the defense.
18:11
Sure, Jane.
18:12
What happened after the prosecution rested their case
18:15
is that the defense asked for a directed
18:18
verdict, basically saying that, would the judge acquit
18:23
the defendant because the prosecution failed to present
18:27
legally sufficient evidence to prove their case?
18:30
So as you mentioned, the judge did not
18:33
acquit on the three charges that the defense
18:38
brought up and had made arguments to ask
18:40
for those charges to be dropped.
18:41
It's very unusual, very rare that that would
18:43
happen.
18:45
So those charges, there's total of four charges.
18:48
So those are still proceeding.
18:51
However, there was a success, as you mentioned,
18:53
on an aggravating factor.
18:55
There were two aggravating factors and both of
18:59
them relate to the felony conspiracy charge.
19:03
And those are factors that are considered in
19:06
sentencing.
19:06
If Zoe is found guilty and convicted on
19:11
felony conspiracy and those aggravating factors that the
19:15
prosecution put in their complaint are one that
19:19
the crime indicates planning, sophistication, or professionalism, the
19:23
judge did not dismiss that factor.
19:25
And the second factor is inducement or leadership
19:29
of co-conspirators.
19:31
So the judge agreed with the defense that
19:34
the prosecution didn't present enough evidence in their
19:37
case to support that aggravating factor.
19:40
However, he did leave a little room for
19:45
the prosecution to bring it up again after
19:48
the defense rests and for the judge to
19:51
reconsider whether that aggravating factor would apply depending
19:54
on the testimony presented by the witnesses.
19:59
If Zoe testifies, it would be on her
20:02
testimony and potential rebuttal witnesses as to that
20:05
aggravating factor.
20:07
A very good summary.
20:09
So it was a victory for the defense,
20:11
but it could come back.
20:14
The judge could reconsider.
20:16
And basically the aggravating factor is she's a
20:19
leader and she inspired others to commit crimes.
20:22
And the judge said, no, there's not enough
20:24
evidence to show that she was in any
20:26
kind of leadership position.
20:27
But after she testifies, after the defense case,
20:32
they could come back and rebuttal.
20:34
And I get the feeling because the prosecution
20:37
only called, correct me if I'm wrong, three
20:39
witnesses, a cop and two employees, that they're
20:42
planning on some big monster rebuttal case.
20:46
We'll see if that happens.
20:48
Certainly they're trying to think outside the box
20:51
because other defendants in similar cases have been
20:56
acquitted.
20:56
Notably Alexandra Paul, the former Baywatch actress who
21:00
also rescued a chicken.
21:01
She was acquitted in another county.
21:03
So they're changing the game up a little
21:05
bit.
21:05
So let me get to some really exciting
21:08
news.
21:09
Our reporter, Michelle Celestino with Unchained TV ran
21:12
into Moby, the music icon over the weekend.
21:16
And she asked him about this case and
21:20
what he thought about it.
21:22
And I've got his soundbite coming up here
21:25
in a second.
21:26
And where is it?
21:29
Just so you know, we have many, many
21:31
soundbites that we accumulate here for, here it
21:34
is.
21:35
Let's listen to Moby.
21:37
And essentially Moby is calling Zoe Rosenberg a
21:40
hero.
21:41
This is news.
21:43
So the fact that the Chronicle and Yahoo
21:45
News are covering it and calling it a
21:48
chicken rescue trial, I think that's great.
21:50
I mean, yeah, so it's people want to
21:54
do the right things, but I feel like
21:55
everyone's just so overwhelmed.
21:56
He made a movie last summer and Zoe
21:58
was in the movie.
22:00
What I would say to Zoe, because I've
22:03
never been in that situation, so I can't
22:05
be so presumptuous as to say I understand
22:07
it.
22:08
But when you look at history, the number
22:12
of people who've been where she is, the
22:14
people who've been arrested and persecuted for their
22:18
ethical beliefs, she's certainly in good historical company.
22:23
She's in company with Cesar Chavez and Martin
22:26
Luther King Jr. and on and on and
22:29
on with the suffragettes.
22:32
So many people have been arrested for doing
22:35
the right thing.
22:36
So I don't know if there's any comfort
22:37
in that, but she's certainly on the right
22:40
side of history.
22:41
And thank you to our reporter, Michelle Celestino,
22:45
for getting that interview.
22:47
Tiffany Brunelli, former law enforcement investigator turned Direct
22:51
Action Everywhere member.
22:53
What's your reaction to what Moby had to
22:56
say?
22:59
Oh, she's definitely on the right side of
23:01
history.
23:02
Just to put her up there with Martin
23:05
Luther King and the others he mentioned.
23:07
Yes, I agree.
23:08
She's on the right side of history.
23:10
And I just keep thinking about the quote
23:13
or what the responding officer said that when
23:18
he was asked by the prosecution, you know,
23:22
did you check the condition of these animals?
23:24
The prosecution even used the word animals.
23:27
I still can't get around why the responding
23:31
officer said, called the chickens products.
23:36
I just, I can't imagine if he responded
23:38
to a call of child abuse or even
23:41
like a fighting dog ring, would he say
23:43
products?
23:44
Did the prosecution prep him on that?
23:47
Did he come up with that himself?
23:49
It's just so distancing from the whole scenario.
23:54
Like why would I check the products?
23:57
It's hard for me to get my mind
23:59
around that.
24:01
Well, also what stood out to me is
24:04
that he had indicated that he didn't investigate
24:10
the products, the animals, the sentient beings, because
24:14
he was not aware of any issues surrounding
24:18
them, which according to the defense he had
24:21
in a previous hearing, like a preliminary hearing
24:24
stated that he was aware of a controversy.
24:28
But my point is you have to be
24:30
living under a rock.
24:31
It's not like this is happening in New
24:34
York city where there's five boroughs and 8
24:36
million people.
24:37
This area is relatively small and everybody who
24:42
lives there knows about direct action everywhere and
24:45
the gazillion protests and open rescues and all
24:51
sorts of events that have been happening in
24:53
Northern California for years now.
24:56
I'll just point to one here, a massive
25:00
open rescue where the police showed up in
25:03
force again in Northern California in this general
25:08
region.
25:09
How could you not know about the claims
25:14
of direct action everywhere that they have tried
25:18
to submit to law enforcement for decades, not
25:21
decades, excuse me, for many years, let's say
25:25
a half a decade, saying essentially that there
25:31
is ongoing animal cruelty at all these factory
25:35
farms.
25:36
Essentially, and correct me if I'm wrong, but
25:41
what direct action everywhere is saying is the
25:44
institution of factory farming itself is inherently cruel.
25:47
Industrialized animal agriculture that kills 140,000 chickens
25:53
every minute on this planet is inherently cruel.
25:57
The systems are inherently cruel.
26:01
I find it very hard to believe that
26:04
any law enforcement officer could be living in
26:08
that part of California and not be aware
26:11
that there is a controversy over the treatment
26:13
of animals in these industrialized facilities, whether it
26:19
be the factory farm or the slaughterhouse.
26:22
I'm going to go back to you, Tiffany,
26:24
because you are a member of direct action
26:26
everywhere and you're a former law enforcement investigator.
26:29
Yes, Jane, I think that was all a
26:31
great point.
26:33
I remember I was up there for Wayne's
26:35
sentencing hearing and rally when Zoe and Rocky
26:40
and others were arrested.
26:42
They must have had at least 10 officers
26:46
just swarm us just to do those simple
26:50
arrests during a rally.
26:52
I don't know if they were planning on,
26:55
we were going to get violent, but they
26:57
know it's not a violent group.
26:59
How big can this police department be, Petaluma
27:02
Police Department?
27:04
These are sheriffs here that we're looking at.
27:09
By the way, the young man with the
27:12
rose and the light green jacket, that is
27:18
Rocky Chow.
27:19
He's going to be one of the first
27:20
witnesses.
27:22
Then the other first witness is going to
27:24
be Carla Cabral, who is a well-known
27:28
animal activist in her own right.
27:31
Yes, she has been arrested in a recent
27:34
goat rescue.
27:35
She is on the witness stand probably two
27:38
minutes away from taking the stand right now
27:42
as the first witness in the defense, the
27:45
one who received the four chickens, we are
27:48
told.
27:49
Obviously, I can't predict what's going to be
27:51
said on the stand, but this is what's
27:53
been reported.
27:54
These are the four chickens who are living
27:56
their best life now after having been rescued.
27:59
This is the healthy version of them.
28:02
Of course, the version that they're going to
28:05
be talking about is the version of what
28:07
happened to them minutes after this rescue.
28:11
Carla Cabral is going to testify.
28:14
The allegations are that they had scratches, they
28:17
had bruises, they were traumatized, and they also
28:20
had bacteria.
28:22
We could hear from Carla Cabral as a
28:28
defense witness.
28:29
Additionally, another witness is going to be Zoe
28:36
Rosenberg's own mother.
28:38
Zoe Rosenberg's own mother, the defendant's mother, is
28:41
a veterinarian.
28:43
She also is going to testify.
28:47
As we bring this together, this all could
28:53
happen before Zoe takes the stand.
28:56
Just to recap and review, we're going to
29:00
have Carla Cabral, we're going to have Rocky,
29:04
we're going to have Dr. Rosenberg, Zoe's mother,
29:08
and we may also have this woman.
29:13
Let me get to her image, Raven Deerbrook.
29:18
She is a famed undercover investigator who is
29:21
most notable for having gone into a pig
29:25
slaughterhouse and been one of the only people
29:28
on the planet to videotape the pig gas
29:31
chambers, uncovering to the world that these pigs
29:35
scream and writhe to death as they are
29:38
slowly suffocated.
29:39
Very different from the, oh, they just fall
29:42
asleep peacefully storyline that the public has been
29:46
given.
29:47
These are hardcore, although nonviolent in the extreme,
29:52
extreme in their nonviolence, animal cruelty investigators.
29:56
This woman literally risked her life.
29:59
I interviewed her after that and she said
30:00
she was just literally moments away.
30:03
If she had not grabbed on one thing
30:05
and pulled herself out, would have died in
30:07
the gas chamber.
30:08
It's fair to say that whatever you have
30:12
to say about these folks, however you feel
30:14
about them, they are courageous.
30:17
Zoe Rosenberg is actually, in her own words,
30:22
potentially risking her life as she has a
30:25
lifelong from birth type one diabetes and a
30:30
health problem that she was born with that
30:33
requires her to have medication and all sorts
30:37
of equipment that she was told, or she
30:39
said that law enforcement told her that they
30:41
can't always provide behind bars.
30:44
Let's listen to something else that Zoe had
30:49
to say about the prosecution's case.
30:53
Remember it was one law enforcement officer and
30:55
two people who work for the company.
31:00
And one was a woman.
31:02
Let's listen to this.
31:03
She testified that I caused about $28,000
31:06
in losses on June 13th and about $75
31:09
,000 in losses on the following Saturday in
31:13
overtime that they had to pay employees during
31:16
cross-examination.
31:17
She was asked about footage that was taken
31:19
on the of birds flailing who clearly were
31:22
not stunned properly.
31:23
And she was a bit dodgy with those
31:24
questions.
31:25
She also admitted that birds sometimes eat condemned
31:29
chickens out of the dumpster, which is very
31:31
concerning because wild birds can be getting sick
31:34
from those chickens.
31:35
In fact, a lot of the birds who
31:37
are thrown in the dumpster are thrown in
31:39
the dumpster because they are infected with concerning
31:41
bacteria.
31:42
So a couple of things, I'm going to
31:45
go back to Tracy in a second to
31:47
talk to her about this idea of the
31:49
other birds, wildlife eating the condemned birds.
31:53
But when it comes to money, Justine Block,
31:57
you're our attorney.
31:59
So they're saying it cost, I think she
32:03
said $28,000 the night of, and then
32:07
more from lost overtime for a total of
32:10
almost $100,000.
32:12
What are your thoughts on that?
32:15
I mean, how important is the money?
32:19
I always say, follow the money.
32:23
What's going on there with that witness's testimony
32:26
for the prosecution is I'm gathering that the
32:30
prosecution's trying to prove their elements of the
32:34
crime of trespass Remember, there's two counts of
32:38
trespass.
32:39
And one of the trespass counts has to
32:42
do with committing the trespass by entering lands
32:47
for the purpose of injuring property or property
32:49
rights with the intention of interfering or obstructing
32:54
or injuring the lawful business.
32:56
And that's just part, I'm quoting part of
32:59
the charge, because that's what the prosecution's trying
33:03
to show is this action by Zoe on
33:10
the property of removing the chickens interfered with
33:13
their business.
33:14
And so they are saying they suffered damages,
33:17
financial damages.
33:19
But from what I gathered on the expos
33:23
about the back and forth, it's hard to
33:25
say without hearing it myself, but it seems
33:28
very weak in terms of the intent.
33:31
So I'm looking forward to hearing what the
33:33
defense witnesses say about about this about the
33:38
situation and more about Zoe's intent because it
33:41
she specifically what she wasn't going there to
33:44
interfere with their business, she was going to
33:46
rescue the chickens and keep them from from
33:50
being they were sick.
33:52
So she you can see in the video
33:54
where she's pulling out the chickens, she's sorting
33:57
through to identify which ones are sick.
34:00
And the defense's position, as I understand, has
34:04
been to say, well, these chickens probably wouldn't
34:07
have been slaughtered for food consumption.
34:12
Anyway, if they're sick chickens, they are removed
34:15
from the line, they may not even be
34:17
stunned.
34:18
And and they're suffering.
34:20
If they're not stunned, they're hanging upside down
34:23
and not and just stunned and flailing their
34:25
arms or their wings are flailing.
34:28
And so the argument and position, as I
34:32
understand, is what the defense is trying to
34:34
say is that these animals may not even
34:36
been sold for food.
34:38
So how is that even interfering with their
34:40
business if they're just discarding these animals, the
34:42
sick birds into piles, they're not entering the
34:46
food chain is one and then this particular
34:48
witness that testified about the financial damages, she
34:51
couldn't say that that particular truck that Zoe's
34:55
at with the 4000 chickens didn't go through
34:59
the slaughterhouse that day.
35:02
So then they may not have this particular
35:04
truck may not have caused them and what
35:06
Zoe's did in that video may not have
35:09
directly caused them any financial losses.
35:11
So they couldn't really tie that truck.
35:13
So the witness that they had didn't really
35:15
seem to deliver what the prosecution was wanting.
35:19
So I thought the defense was able to
35:21
poke a lot of holes in it.
35:23
And to leave enough for a reasonable doubt.
35:25
All the defense has to show is reasonable
35:27
doubt.
35:29
And and so I thought that was good
35:31
for the defense.
35:31
And we'll see more about how they present
35:34
this today.
35:35
You raise a really important point.
35:38
All it takes is one juror and I
35:40
want to go back to Tracy Glover who
35:42
runs the Sweet Peeps Animal Sanctuary in Alabama.
35:47
Are you still there?
35:48
Is that Jasmine or is that somebody else?
35:51
I had somebody else for a minute Satya
35:53
but Satya was more interested in seeing what
35:57
kind of treats she could find but Jasmine
35:59
so Jasmine popped back up in my lap.
36:02
I didn't want to keep playing the chickens
36:04
upside down over and over but I mean
36:08
as you see again I think in a
36:11
way this is a defense of the company
36:13
itself.
36:14
These are standard procedures.
36:17
Industrialized animal agriculture is killing 75 excuse me
36:24
now it's really 80 or even 82 or
36:27
90 however you count it land animals alone
36:31
billion billion every year.
36:34
Is there any way to this is what
36:38
DXC says there's no nice way to kill
36:40
an animal who doesn't want to die.
36:43
Is there any nice way to kill 80
36:46
or 90 billion animals every year or which
36:50
amounts to approximately 140,000 chickens a minute
36:54
on this planet all the companies included.
36:57
This is I think the essence of the
37:00
case.
37:01
All systems that we're seeing here are not
37:06
unique to any one company.
37:09
Right I mean I think that's what makes
37:12
the case so hard I think all around
37:15
is that the company is trying to defend
37:19
these standard practices that are inherently causing tremendous
37:24
suffering like even if everything goes right they're
37:29
causing you know not just the death of
37:33
these animals who want to live like all
37:36
of us do but there's just inherent suffering
37:41
in the process and then you have these
37:43
other instances like things like you know chickens
37:46
being boiled alive or not being properly stunned
37:49
before they're slaughtered and even though that's like
37:52
not supposed to happen it's to your point
37:54
about when you're killing this many animals and
37:58
like you know and it's all about the
37:59
bottom line right so the faster you can
38:01
kill the more animals the more profit and
38:05
that's what it's all about and the and
38:08
the faster you you do and you know
38:09
the more animals you kill the more animals
38:13
will fall through whatever minimal care standards are
38:17
set up and even those minimal care standards
38:19
ensure suffering but it's also a guarantee when
38:23
the lines are running that fast that animals
38:26
will not even get the the bare minimum
38:29
protections and so things like being boiled alive
38:33
will are happening even if it's a fraction
38:36
of that total number it's millions it's probably
38:40
hundreds of millions of animals who are suffering
38:43
like they're not just being killed they are
38:45
being tortured before they're killed and they are
38:48
not products they're not widgets they're sweet individual
38:52
beings like jasmine like even right now like
38:56
little jasmine was like she kind of wants
38:57
to get she was thinking about getting up
38:59
my off my lap and i'm gonna let
39:00
her if she wants to because i don't
39:02
want her to for a moment to suffer
39:05
um you know just just uh she's an
39:09
individual being and her individual needs need to
39:11
be considered um that's just like the foundation
39:14
of a compassionate society of like a base
39:17
a society that that reveres kindness at all
39:20
and the industry is the antithesis of a
39:25
good society of a society where we care
39:28
for the vulnerable and the innocent where kindness
39:32
and compassion are revered and that's the you
39:35
know what's so um just just twisted about
39:39
this case is like here's this brave young
39:42
girl who is moved to this to take
39:47
that you know to risk her own liberty
39:49
and safety to um protect these innocent beings
39:54
she's moved by kindness and compassion and we
39:58
are contemplating jailing her and i have to
40:02
believe that most people would be on her
40:05
side but then it's like you look at
40:07
like you know what are the repercussions of
40:09
acquitting her and like what does that say
40:11
about the industry and you you can't escape
40:13
the the larger questions about whether or not
40:17
this industry should exist and i think you
40:20
know if we believe in kindness if we
40:22
believe in compassion and if we think suffering
40:25
is wrong then this industry should not exist
40:30
i mean first of all i want to
40:33
say that you're talking about the industry in
40:35
general the figures that we're talking about are
40:37
the industry in general 140 000 chickens killed
40:41
every minute globally there's 8.2 billion humans
40:45
at least on this planet and um unfortunately
40:49
meat consumption continues to rise and that's why
40:52
this trial is such an important trial historically
40:55
because chickens are again the number one animal
40:58
killed and uh you know the last question
41:03
i have to ask you is why is
41:04
it that and do you see people change
41:07
their attitude toward chickens when they come to
41:10
your sanctuary because it seems that particularly chickens
41:14
i mean i've had people say to me
41:15
i don't eat meat i just eat chicken
41:17
uh they they just have a special quality
41:21
there's there's a wall yeah people who've woken
41:24
up about pigs and cows just aren't waking
41:28
up about chickens yeah yeah i don't know
41:31
what that is but i have to admit
41:33
that i mean i think before i started
41:35
caring for chickens i was vegan um i
41:38
had been for like 15 years before i
41:40
took in my first rescues but i still
41:42
think that i felt more of a connection
41:45
with the larger mammals you know i don't
41:48
know if it's like that they have these
41:50
big eyes or if there's some like can
41:52
you know some more instinctive connection because they're
41:55
mammals and chickens are are birds i don't
41:59
know what that is but you know i
42:01
also think sometimes too it's that thing of
42:03
especially like you know the the chickens that
42:04
we raise for meat um cornish crosses they're
42:08
all these big white birds the ones we
42:09
lay we we raise for eggs are mostly
42:11
these small white birds but they all just
42:14
look indistinct it's hard especially to you know
42:17
you hear the numbers and it just they
42:19
just become like an undifferentiated mass when people
42:23
come here and i put jasmine or fanny
42:26
or jojo eloise into somebody's arms and they
42:29
meet them people are stunned like people i
42:33
don't have a lot of visitors here because
42:34
it's a small sanctuary it's my home and
42:36
more than anything i want to make sure
42:38
that the animals here are safe and feel
42:40
comfortable and aren't stressed out but whenever anybody
42:42
does come and they get to hold one
42:44
of these chickens especially and again because they're
42:47
all individuals right some don't want to be
42:48
held so i i basically you know i
42:51
asked like do you want to be held
42:52
and there are some like jasmine who who
42:55
loves to be held by she had made
42:56
anybody you know she just wants to be
42:58
snuggled all the time and people come and
43:00
they meet them and they go like oh
43:02
my god i had no idea is this
43:03
what chickens are like i'll never eat another
43:05
chicken again and they don't um and um
43:08
so i think it has has a lot
43:10
to do with like we don't know who
43:11
they are even to you know i mean
43:13
it's not very common anymore that people like
43:15
grow up on farms but even the people
43:16
i know who've grown up on farms have
43:18
had the you know they've had chickens as
43:21
a product to be exploited and so they
43:23
haven't treated them they haven't you know it
43:26
hasn't been like the norm to treat them
43:27
with the gentleness and kindness that you need
43:31
to treat them with for them to earn
43:32
your trust or to earn their trust and
43:35
so i you know i think people will
43:37
come and they'll say like oh every farm
43:38
i've ever been at the chickens run away
43:40
from you they don't run from you like
43:41
no of course they don't run from me
43:43
they run to me because they know i'm
43:44
safe so i just i don't know i
43:46
think people don't know them um and they're
43:50
presented as this amorphous mass they don't you
43:53
know they don't see them as individuals um
43:56
but they are that's what you're providing for
44:00
us is an opportunity to see them as
44:03
individuals it was great to meet jasmine so
44:05
great to talk to you i hope you
44:07
come back as this trial progresses apparently it's
44:09
going to go through the end of the
44:10
month uh final thoughts from our attorney jazz
44:15
justine block and then we'll go over to
44:18
tiffany i just want to address about the
44:22
the terminology as far as referring to the
44:27
birds as products remember the um about the
44:30
officer referring to the chickens as products terminology
44:34
is so important and we've talked about this
44:36
on other live panels is that um not
44:40
only was officer referring to them as products
44:44
another witness talked about the facilities as processing
44:48
facilities instead of a slaughterhouse she didn't even
44:51
want to say the word slaughterhouse the defense
44:53
had to really press her to even say
44:56
the word slaughterhouse so or that the chickens
45:00
are slaughtered that it's instead of processing facility
45:03
so these terms are really important and now
45:05
that um the defense is going to present
45:08
their case the jury's going to hear the
45:10
other side of um the side that we're
45:13
seeing we were seeing with meeting jasmine today
45:16
that the individual lives that they're not that
45:20
chickens aren't just products they are lives and
45:22
that the the law is behind i do
45:24
want to make a second point is that
45:26
if the law is considering chickens and other
45:33
farm animals as property and that's what the
45:37
law is reflecting that's what we're up against
45:40
and you see it all coming to a
45:42
head in this trial are the jurors gonna
45:44
see the chickens as food or as individuals
45:50
that that shouldn't suffer and be harmed in
45:55
this industry and that and that they'll see
45:58
the whole other side of the chickens as
46:00
individuals so look forward to seeing how this
46:04
plays out all right thank you excellent points
46:07
uh we're also very appreciative to have an
46:10
attorney by the way i found out that
46:12
um the owner of the sanctuary the chicken
46:15
sanctuary is also an attorney so you're not
46:17
going to get away from us that quickly
46:20
tracy we need our attorneys all right tiffany
46:23
tiffany your final thoughts for today and i
46:26
just want to thank tracy and jasmine i've
46:28
i have never really until the last couple
46:31
of years when i've gone to sanctuaries i've
46:33
never been around chickens i didn't know how
46:35
sweet they are and that you can actually
46:37
hold them and that they actually know people
46:41
by sight or sound i had i had
46:43
no idea just sitting here watching her with
46:46
jasmine she's such a good chicken mama it
46:49
just reminded me of when i try and
46:50
hold my dog and he wants to get
46:52
down or you just forget and then you
46:56
keep hearing these words products and and it's
47:00
just i want to thank her for being
47:01
on with jasmine and i'm excited to see
47:04
the defense's case and see what they can
47:06
get through to the jury i think it's
47:08
going to be a very exciting week i
47:11
agree i think ultimately we have to get
47:14
back to the consumers none of this would
47:17
be happening if consumers weren't lining up to
47:21
eat chicken and um you know i realize
47:25
that compassion is curiosity having the curiosity the
47:30
courage to be curious about how that food
47:33
that you like ends up on your plate
47:35
and i drive like everybody else down my
47:38
local miracle mile and people are lined up
47:41
around the chicken especially and we all know
47:44
that there are now ad campaigns that are
47:47
so cynical featuring a cartoon cow saying eat
47:51
more chicken um this is well i think
47:55
it's sad honestly i think whoever came up
47:58
with that campaign probably thinks they're very clever
48:00
but i would say i feel sorry for
48:04
them um and here's somebody saying prayers for
48:07
zoe rosenberg um somebody said tracy is my
48:11
friend thank you for doing this it's debbie's
48:13
birthday by the way happy birthday debbie happy
48:16
birthday debbie and guys keep coming back guys
48:20
and gals uh we are mimicking what they
48:24
do on core tv what they do on
48:26
all the major networks covering trials as i
48:29
used to do on major networks including core
48:32
tv and cnn headline news hln but we
48:35
don't have the reach we rely on the
48:38
people watching to share share share share hit
48:41
that share button and go down there and
48:43
share to as many groups as possible because
48:46
there's a woman who is actually facing half
48:50
a decade behind bars and because she suffers
48:53
from lifelong illnesses it could potentially she says
48:57
be fatal she's willing to do that i
48:59
think we at at the very least can
49:01
be willing to hit that share button over
49:03
and over and over again we're going to
49:04
see you next time we still don't know
49:07
whether this crazy case where the days change
49:10
i've covered many criminal charges i've trials i've
49:13
never seen one work when we're going to
49:15
start tomorrow is always up in the air
49:17
but we know we're going to be back
49:18
thursday possibly tomorrow but we're told thursday for
49:23
sure so please just watch on unshamed tv
49:28
as well as uh on facebook for when
49:32
it's coming up next unshamed tv is a
49:35
501c3 non-profit news network for the sustainable
49:40
plant-based lifestyle you can get it on
49:42
your phone you can watch it online unshamed
49:44
.tv it's absolutely free mostly volunteer run including
49:51
myself a volunteer and we need your support
49:54
so download unshamed tv it's right there on
49:57
your phone it's on your tv it's on
49:59
my tv behind me and there are two
50:02
thousand more than two thousand videos about all
50:06
aspects of this movement and lifestyle see you
50:09
next time