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51 – A man’s guide to menopause · The Dr Louise Newson Podcast

0:00
Today my podcast is really for partners as well As for women
0:03
who are experiencing symptoms. So I've got Joe Warner with me
0:07
whose new book is called Burning Up, Frozen Out.
0:11
And it's really about how you can help if your partner is
0:14
experiencing symptoms, how you can be their advocate, how you
0:18
can help them, how you can support them, and how you can
0:21
take them to the doctor to receive the treatment that they
0:23
usually want as well. So this is really exciting.
0:29
I'm meeting you for the first time, Joe, and I'm holding your
0:32
book. It feels like this is a long
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time coming. And for those of you listening,
0:36
it's called Burning Up, Frozen out.
0:39
And it's got a woman and a man sleeping back-to-back in her
0:44
bed. So you reached out to me.
0:47
How long ago was it now? I think we probably spoke about
0:51
this time last year. Yeah, it goes to show how long
0:53
the whole book research. And publishing it.
0:55
Takes an awful long time and I wanted to write this book
0:59
basically because I went out and tried to find it and it didn't
1:02
exist. And you know that spirit of if
1:05
it doesn't exist, go out there and create it That's what I did.
1:07
I took the bull by the horns. And you were one of the first
1:09
people I wanted to speak to because I've been following you
1:11
on Instagram for a while and it's always that, you know,
1:13
you've got a couple of big names you want to interview for a, for
1:16
a book like this. And you were very generous with
1:19
your time. And I think, I'm not quite sure
1:21
you realise just how important that interview was for me
1:24
because I've done lots of interviews.
1:26
I'm a journalist for 20 years. I've spoken to an awful lot of
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people from all different walks of life.
1:30
But I'd never really been at a project like this where I knew
1:34
nothing. I'd covered men's health and
1:37
fitness for a long time and men had become sort of very simple
1:40
creatures in, in my mind, I, you know, if you want to build
1:42
muscle or burn fat, it's basically about lifting weights
1:44
or what, what you eat. But then I discovered hormones
1:48
and specifically female hormones.
1:50
And it was quite terrifying until we had that conversation.
1:54
And I think something you said to me, and I've actually put it
1:56
in the book where I, I quote you, where you talk about how
1:59
perimenopause took you by surprise.
2:02
And it almost just took the weight of the world off my
2:04
shoulders. Like if you.
2:05
Yeah, absolutely. Because I knew nothing.
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And I felt, I think, like a lot of men, a bit of sort of guilt
2:11
and shame that I didn't know this and I should know it.
2:13
And it makes it quite difficult to reach out if you're reaching
2:17
out from a position of vulnerability or you're
2:19
admitting that you don't know something.
2:21
So having that conversation with you is like, Oh my God, if you
2:24
don't know, then I've got absolutely no chance of knowing.
2:27
And it sort of set me free a little bit to go off and go, OK,
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I can completely go with an open mind.
2:32
And there's no such thing as a stupid question and I'm going to
2:35
get things wrong, but I'm going to ask amazing people sensible
2:38
questions and then trying to steal their expertise into
2:41
advice that will work for the average man.
2:43
It's really important because I spoke to someone this morning
2:46
actually, and she was saying she's in her 30s and she said so
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many of my friends, Louise, are really scared perimenopause,
2:52
they think it's going to happen soon.
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I said, well, it probably is. And they said but they're really
2:55
scared. And that's a real shame
2:57
actually, because people are scared of uncertainty or they're
3:00
scared of what they don't know. And, and it's, it's always been
3:04
so simplistic actually, where people think menopause is very
3:08
binary. It's either you have a period or
3:11
you don't have periods as a women.
3:12
And that's really about it. Or it's about flashes or sweats.
3:15
And up until sort of 12 years ago, really, that's all I
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thought really when if someone came to see me as a patient who
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hadn't had a period for a couple of years or in the 50s, they're
3:26
having symptoms, it's very easy. I'd give them hormones, you know
3:29
what I mean? And it was only when I sat in
3:31
someone's clinic and I said to them, look, how do you know
3:35
someone's perimenopausal? And he went, oh, it's, it's
3:37
really obvious to me. You can just tell.
3:39
I was like, oh really? And about that time was when I
3:41
started to experience symptoms. And you know, I said to you and
3:44
we spoke, it was about 6 months of having really awful symptoms
3:48
actually, like close to giving up my job and really hating my
3:52
husband. But we're talking about it
3:53
recently actually, because he was saying how hard it was for
3:58
him at the time. And, you know, we're really
4:00
solid. We're very lucky because I've
4:02
known him since I was 18. So it would take a lot for
4:05
anything to happen really in a big way to our relationship.
4:08
But I had this demon in my head, like giving me permission to be
4:12
as rude, as rude as I could to him.
4:14
And it didn't matter. He's there thinking, well, who's
4:17
this person and, and how does he talk about it?
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And so Fast forward six months, obviously I worked out what was
4:25
going on. I got on hormones.
4:26
We know some is a lot better, but I still have got this thing
4:30
that as you've, he'd known more information rather than just
4:34
trying to keep out of my way, which is what he was doing or
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sleep like this where we were just back to each other.
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And when I had night sweats, I was creeping out of the bed
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thinking I can't wake him up. And I put a towel on the sheets
4:46
so it didn't have to sit the bed.
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And he was concerned in the morning because I often said, I
4:50
think I've got lymphoma type of cancer.
4:52
Like I didn't think about night sweats, hormones.
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Like why? I don't know.
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But if he had had, his brain wasn't gone to mush like mine.
5:02
So if he knew, you know, then what he knows now, he could have
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calmly said to me, you know, that night sweat you're getting,
5:09
You're 45. Do you think maybe it could be
5:12
your hormones? You know, I've read something
5:14
then that conversation would have, you know, And that's where
5:17
the importance of your book and all the work is really, isn't
5:20
it? Absolutely.
5:21
And that's something we we touch upon very early on in the book
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is that it might be happening to your your partner, but you're
5:26
the lookout, you're the scout. You're the one that's going to
5:29
notice these changes perhaps before she does.
5:31
Either because I, you know, I spoke to so many women for this
5:34
book and some of them said I was just in denial.
5:36
Yes. Or I didn't know, or I thought
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it wouldn't happen to me. Yeah.
5:40
Yeah. There can be tons of different
5:41
reasons. But it comes on also quite, it
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varies some, but it comes on like a ton of bricks or like,
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you know, people tell me they fall off a Cliff.
5:49
Other times it's gradual. But even last week there was an
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article in the paper saying that mental health is a crisis for
5:56
middle-aged women. Suicide rates are high.
5:58
So if you read it and then it said because they've got a stiff
6:01
upper lip and they're bringing up children and they've got
6:04
elderly parents and they're the samura generation, if they talk
6:06
about it, then it'd be better. Nothing about hormones.
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And I'm just thinking that's not helpful actually for women at
6:13
all, because then they're less likely to talk about it because
6:16
it shows their vulnerability. And it puts the blame back on
6:18
the woman for not being able to juggle all these things that I
6:22
just see this all the time. And again, lots of my
6:24
conversations were around. There's a chapter in the book
6:27
how to deal with the doctor and not necessarily what the man
6:31
should say or take over an appointment, but how you can
6:33
prepare your partner for an appointment.
6:35
And we've got a little fun game called Brush Off Bingo.
6:38
You know, if you hear your doctor say your GP say any of
6:40
these things, might be time for a second opinion because.
6:43
That's really interesting. So many women report the same
6:46
thing. Did you hear that a lot?
6:47
Yeah, yeah, exactly. And you know, we antidepressants
6:50
was was the first solution. Hormones weren't even mentioned
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yet. You're just a bit tired.
6:55
You're juggling too much. Have you tried drinking less
6:57
coffee, drinking less wine? These are the things we've we've
7:00
put in the book is if you hear it's.
7:01
Crazy. It's 2026 and people are saying.
7:03
We had a patient recently whose doctor said to them, perhaps you
7:06
should pray more and eat more fruit.
7:11
I mean, it's so I'm not often speechless, but I was so many
7:15
times in the course of researching this book because
7:17
first I think I was shocked and then I was angry and then it's
7:22
almost just like this simming rage and it's not happening to
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me so but I'm so far removed from it so I can only imagine
7:28
what it feels like that's. Why I get angry every single
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day? Absolutely.
7:31
See how? Completely justifiably so,
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because women are suffering often in silence.
7:36
And I think to come back to, to what you were saying, one of the
7:40
reasons I wanted to write this book is somebody said to me,
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there's an there's a silent army of support here and there's
7:46
husbands and and there's colleagues and, you know,
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there's men here that can step up and help.
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And I think it's really important as well.
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And we address this in the book, not to see, you know, it's her
7:57
problem or it's your fault. This is a hormonal biological
8:01
issue. Absolutely.
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And I think that's crucially important.
8:04
And many years ago, I did some work for West Midlands Fire
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Brigade, and this was about 10, 910 years ago.
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So no one was really talking about menopause then.
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And I was really just talking to them about what it is, what it
8:16
means. And, and I remember speaking to
8:19
people in the occupational health and they were saying a
8:22
lot of men in their 40s, early 50s were having a lot of time
8:25
off work with sickness. And when they unpicked it and
8:29
really spoke to these men, they were really struggling at home.
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And that was, you know, affecting the work as well.
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So then talking to them about hormones, what it means, the
8:38
effects, they're like, Oh my goodness, so it's not my fault
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then That's why she's gone off me.
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That's why she went and hold my hand.
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That's why we can't have sex. That's why she's miserable.
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That's why she's put on my, I thought it was something I was
8:49
doing. And so suddenly it not to be a
8:52
blame thing. But the problem is, and it's
8:56
still a problem that infuriates me every day, is that it's seen
8:58
as a natural transition process without any treatment.
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Or if the treatment is given, it's like you say, normally
9:05
antidepressants, whereas it's a hormonal problem with health
9:09
risks, with symptoms that should be addressed with hormones and
9:14
if it was addressed a lot quicker then people wouldn't be
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suffering. Absolutely.
9:18
And yeah, speaking to to countless couples who at various
9:22
stages of the perimenopausal journey, some at the beginning
9:24
and, and terrified and some whose relationship had broken
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down and, and that's so, so common.
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There's quite a lot going on in middle life in midlife for men
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and women that is similar in terms of, you know, young kids,
9:36
elderly parents, work stress. And obviously a lot of women are
9:38
working now, which might not be in the case a generation ago.
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And I don't want anyone to think that I'm equating what men go
9:45
through in midlife as women. I'm absolutely not.
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But men do suffer some changes in midlife with testosterone
9:51
going down. It's not the same.
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I want to make that crystal clear.
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But I think it is important to acknowledge, you know, I'm very
9:56
interested in the role of hormones in men and women.
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And you know, 30% of men will have low testosterone.
10:02
A lot of mental health is related to low testosterone.
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I've mentioned for my husband uses testosterone and I think
10:07
people still think it's quite like a bit of a failure thing
10:11
having hormones. And I think ego tied up with it,
10:14
especially with men. It's it's your job is to be able
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to perform on demand and that's what you.
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Do, but even even for women, I think because it's so difficult
10:22
to get from the doctors, you know, I, it's 25 years ago, it
10:26
used to be a sort of more of an opt out treatment.
10:29
You would automatically have it really.
10:31
And we know that HRT prescribing was more than double of what it
10:34
is now. Whereas now it's almost like
10:37
you've got to plead for it. You've got to really beg and
10:40
I've been trying for the last six weeks to get my HRT from my
10:44
NHSGP and I can't get it at the minute and you know that.
10:49
Whereas if I was on an antidepressant, I don't know,
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I've not been on an antidepressant.
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If I was, I'm sure they'd give it to me very quickly, and that
10:56
doesn't seem right, no. It's it's that complete mismatch
10:59
between what could really make a tangible difference.
11:02
Yeah, relatively quickly. Absolutely.
11:04
Versus going on, you know, a lifetime potentially of
11:07
antidepressants that aren't going to address the hormonal
11:09
issue. And what I've when when men
11:13
speak to me about this and they're often confused and
11:15
they're hurt and sometimes they're angry as well.
11:18
What I found massively useful is trying to make the case that
11:23
perimenopause might be happening to your partner, but you're
11:26
going through changes. And the sooner you can realize
11:28
that you're on a team here and it's not a case of trying to fix
11:31
each other or because so many men will default to that fix,
11:35
right? We need there's a problem.
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You're a problem, it's a problem, how do we fix it?
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And you can't fix perimenopause. And then sometimes men will try
11:43
and fix it and get rebuffed, you know, because it's the wrong
11:46
time, it's the wrong approach, it's the wrong language.
11:49
And then they'll put their head in their sand.
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And that's where you see couples at this sort of crossroads of
11:54
can we communicate again and address this as a team and get
11:57
back on the same wavelength? Because I think that's what the
11:59
hormone disruption does. You're both kind of wanting the
12:02
same thing, but you can't quite connect to each.
12:05
Other I think it's really hard because I mean, from personal
12:08
experience also experiences seeing thousands of women, you
12:11
feel very vulnerable, really vulnerable, very exposed and
12:15
your brain doesn't work properly.
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Like it really could be quite difficult to understand even
12:20
short sentences of two syllables or whatever.
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So but I think also for a lot of men, obviously it's a
12:26
generalisation, but it's through black and white.
12:28
It's a hormonal problem. Have some hormones and fix it,
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which is true. But for women who've been told
12:33
all these things about hormones, their mum didn't maybe have them
12:36
or maybe it's a failure or my doctor saying they're too
12:39
dangerous did it. And then they catastrophize and
12:41
then they overthink. And then the man's just like,
12:43
well, let me, let me help you a bit more.
12:46
But it's how do you approach that person without falling out
12:49
with them? How do you not become the person
12:52
that's sort of ganging up against them really?
12:55
But I do think partners have a really important role to be an
12:59
advocate for that person and the knowledge bank for that person.
13:03
Because even just Googling or reading a book or listening to a
13:08
podcast can be very hard when you've got hormonal changes to
13:11
to, you know, absorb all that knowledge and make sense of it
13:14
all. And there's so much even on my
13:16
social media, I'm just popping up on adverts and supplements.
13:20
And you don't know who to believe.
13:21
You don't know who to trust. So having that information as a
13:24
partner, ideally before you need it, then you can calmly say,
13:30
look, I just think I know you so well.
13:32
I think some of your symptoms could be related to your
13:35
hormones. I think that was the starting
13:37
point for not even writing the book, but the pitch for, for
13:41
trying to get a book deal for off the ground was I don't
13:45
believe most men are silent because of a lack of empathy.
13:49
I just don't believe if you, if you marry someone, you're with
13:51
someone, you love them and you care them and you want them to
13:53
thrive. So if it's not a lack of
13:56
empathy, what is it? And it's a lack of knowledge.
13:59
It's a lack of language and it's a lack of confidence.
14:01
If you don't have the knowledge or the language to express that
14:04
knowledge or the confidence to say in the 1st place, it's easy
14:08
to put your head in the sand. And I think partners can play, I
14:13
mean, an absolutely fundamental role because as you say, if
14:15
you're if you're not able to think clearly, you know, you
14:18
don't feel that yourself, you feel like a stranger.
14:20
You can't make rational decisions, you can't take on
14:22
board the information, you can't assess what the GP is telling
14:26
you are your viable options. And this is where someone not to
14:28
take over, but to accompany, to make notes to, to read
14:33
resources, to start distilling all of that information into
14:37
some options, some plans, and really stressed in the book,
14:40
like we're not saying this is the right way to approach it.
14:42
What we're doing is giving you hopefully an amazing array of
14:46
options and you can pick and choose what works for you and
14:48
your partner in your life because we're all at different
14:51
stages. If you've ever felt confused,
14:55
dismissed, or just left to figure out your hormone health
14:58
on your own, that's exactly why I created my free Balance app.
15:03
It's designed to educate women about their hormones at every
15:07
stage of life. You can track your symptoms and
15:10
periods if you have them, read evidence based articles and
15:14
connect with a community of women who are asking similar
15:17
questions that you might be asking.
15:20
I see everyday how powerful knowledge is.
15:23
When you understand what's happening in your body, you can
15:25
make informed choices about your health and your treatment, and
15:29
you can advocate for yourself when you speak to healthcare
15:32
professionals. If you want clear, trustworthy
15:35
information without the noise or the misinformation, then
15:39
download My Balance app today. It's there to educate, support
15:44
and help you take back control of your hormone health.
15:48
But we're all so different and our relationships are very
15:51
different. And what we want out of our
15:52
relationships are very different as well.
15:54
And you know, the book is not judgmental, which is really
15:58
important, but it's also really heavily referenced.
16:02
I mean, I must congratulate you with how heavily referenced it
16:05
is, because that does make a difference.
16:07
I think it's really important. I was conscious at the start of
16:09
this of wiser man writing about the menopause because you've got
16:13
to be aware of these things and everyone large, largely, most
16:16
people have been incredibly supportive of that.
16:18
But I think to to back it up, you have to, you have to earn
16:22
that. And I think doing the research
16:23
and it was fascinating for me discovering so much.
16:26
Like I said, I was a health and fitness journalist for 20 years.
16:28
I still am, but dealing with men, it was very, very simple.
16:31
And then you factor in, in hormones and you, I, I mean, I
16:35
just, you wouldn't wish it on your worst enemy.
16:37
Some of the symptoms, I know everyone gets different
16:39
symptoms, but it's, it was absolutely horrific.
16:42
And I think the more, the more research I read, the more it
16:45
helped me form some sort of action plan for the book of what
16:49
would be most useful for men. And it's, it is not taking it
16:52
personally, it's not trying to fix it.
16:55
You know, quite often it's listening.
16:56
You just need to listen and, and, and there's a big, big
16:58
section on just how to actively listen because it's where so
17:02
many couples can fall apart. Is, is just that breakdown in
17:05
communication. It's very hard to get back.
17:07
You think you've been with somebody 1520 years, you're
17:09
always going to be able to talk. But it starts as a crack and
17:11
turns into a chasm. Sometimes and it's really
17:14
important and even thinking back to the bedroom scene, so many
17:19
women I speak to are not having any intimacy with their partner
17:23
and they're not having sex. And, you know, a lot of doctors
17:26
even find it very uncomfortable talking about sex.
17:29
And clearly I, I don't because it's I, I've lost count the
17:33
number of women who say to me, I can't believe you're asking me
17:36
about this. This is really nice to have this
17:37
conversation. I didn't know so many other
17:40
women felt the same as me. And you know, a lot of people
17:43
say it's not that I don't love him.
17:44
I just don't have any feelings. Like I'm numb from the waist
17:48
downwards. You know, George Clooney could
17:50
walk in the room and I still wouldn't want to have sex.
17:53
It's just, and they're really sad about it, but they always
17:57
feel that it's, it's something that they should not talk about.
18:01
Somehow. Men can talk about sex a lot.
18:04
They can't really talk about lack of sex to their friends.
18:07
But women, if they want sex, it's almost a dirty thing.
18:10
And it's, it's hungover from the Victorian times, I'm sure.
18:14
But actually, why can't women be allowed to have sex and a good
18:18
orgasm and everything else? But who do they talk to?
18:22
And that's really do. And then the men, often this is
18:25
a generalization again, if they can't have a good sexual
18:30
relationship with their partner, then they feel it's their.
18:33
Fault. And that's exactly what I was
18:35
just about to say. It's, it's very difficult.
18:37
I think, again, we're always talking generalizations here
18:39
where we're talking about, about men and women, but I think it
18:42
this is where a lot of men feel like it is their fault.
18:45
She's not attracted to me. Why doesn't she doesn't want to
18:47
hold hands when, you know, I can't remember the last time any
18:50
sort of intimate act happened. And I think it's probably just
18:54
human nature. I think it's both men and women
18:56
will feel rejected. There's a lot of shame.
18:59
There's a lot of and I think men, men are probably great
19:02
talking about sex when they're getting a lot of it.
19:04
Well, that's right, but they don't know.
19:05
As the public says. You know what lads?
19:06
I haven't had sex for two years. Like how are you going to bring
19:09
that? Up it's really, really difficult
19:11
and I think we do cover sex and intimacy in the books.
19:14
It's obviously such an important part of our relationship and and
19:16
middle age and you know, the belief in the sex acts I've got
19:19
to sex gets better if you're communicating, but it's it's
19:21
about that that again, that mismatch.
19:23
I think for for some men and you know, it literally a gust of
19:27
wind and they can be in the mood.
19:28
Whereas when the expert I I spoke to in the book was, you
19:31
know, women, some women want that sizzle.
19:33
Even, you know, they might obviously before HRT, nothing at
19:37
all. But even then, once they are
19:38
beginning to get back on track. It's so unfortunate if you've
19:41
not had a sexual relationship for couple of years.
19:44
Sometimes it's a lot longer. I've got a couple who hadn't had
19:47
sex with 15 years and she had recurrent urinary tract
19:50
infections, individual cystitis. Every time she had sexual she
19:54
had urinary tract infections. Then she had awful vaginal
19:57
dryness, soreness, irritation, joint pain, you know the works.
20:01
And it took about probably 2 years to get the right balance
20:04
of hormones for her. And then it took about another 3
20:08
or 4 years for them to have a sexual relationship, but it was
20:11
a very gradual thing. They just learnt to know each
20:14
other again and then explore each other's bodies in a just a
20:18
nice tactile sort of teenager type way without the pressure of
20:22
sex. And you know, I he always used
20:25
to come or he still does, to the consultation.
20:27
So we could talk quite openly about different ways of just re
20:32
connecting actually. And they found it very lovely to
20:36
have somebody independent, non judgmental who could just talk
20:40
about things. And now they are so gloriously
20:43
happy together. But it's been a combination of
20:46
the hormones, their relationship, relearning and the
20:49
trust and everything. Together, And I think that's
20:52
where so many men kind of either get defensive or put the
20:56
barriers up is there's a problem and they don't like it so why
21:00
can't we fix it quickly? But you know, especially with
21:03
intimacy and sex, it's going to take a long time and the longer
21:06
it's been, the longer it's going to take.
21:07
And it's that fixation on it doesn't have to be penetrative
21:10
sex. There's other ways that you can,
21:11
you can connect, which we which we cover.
21:14
But I think relationship, you know, generally it's one of the
21:17
most common things. The men I spoke to were
21:19
frustrated about. You don't have to fix it.
21:20
It it's not your fault. You can then start listening
21:24
without judgement, without solutions.
21:26
And, and sometimes you, you won't need to say anything, but
21:29
it just shows your partner that she's being heard and that there
21:32
is someone there. Because I think sometimes you
21:34
have to re establish that you're in it together because if
21:37
there's been some miscommunication or some
21:39
problems, you can kind of, you know, a busy household, your
21:43
ship's passing in the night. All you talk about is logistics
21:46
of who's picking up when and who needs to go to which lesson.
21:49
You've got to dedicate some time for yourself.
21:51
And I think that's where we're talking, even if it's just at a
21:53
car drive where you're side by side or a walk once a week,
21:57
going out and getting lunch. Anything like that you can put
21:59
in the diary that you prioritize.
22:01
It's just so important in in making you realise that you are
22:04
there for one one another and you want to make each other
22:07
happier and healthier. Yeah.
22:08
It's really important. But I do also feel really sad
22:12
that, you know, you were saying about being angry.
22:14
And I do spend a lot of my time angry, but I also feel sad
22:16
because I feel the medical establishment is really failing
22:20
women. Well, even when we think about
22:23
libido and sex and the role of testosterone in women, hardly
22:28
any women are prescribed testosterone.
22:30
And we know that it can improve sexual desire, it can improve
22:34
sexual experiences, it can improve libido, orgasm and so
22:38
forth. Yeah, women have to really often
22:41
plead for it. I don't know what your
22:42
experience was in the book when you talk to women about
22:44
testosterone. It's, we didn't cover a huge
22:47
amount. We do talk about testosterone in
22:49
there, but obviously when we, when we talk about HRT, we, we,
22:52
we talk mainly about oestrogen. But it's interesting because on
22:55
the way here on the tube, I couldn't help but notice all the
22:58
testosterone testing for men on, on on bank station is just
23:01
covered, covered in them. And it's, I think, you know, it
23:05
was very difficult for men to admit they might need
23:07
testosterone. I think that's going now.
23:09
My general vibe is that a lot of men are talking about TRT.
23:14
You're obviously seeing, you know, a lot of guys in their 40s
23:17
and 50s in pretty good shape. So that has suddenly become
23:21
acceptable, for lack of a better phrase.
23:23
But yes, with women, it's obviously a completely different
23:25
story. And it's almost like that that
23:27
is such an important conversation.
23:29
But where do you focus the battle?
23:31
Because it's HRT is a is a whole concept for for for GPS giving
23:36
it to women is is still so far from normal.
23:39
Yeah, it's it's man. How is it how are we still at
23:42
this stage where it's so long since the studies have been
23:45
debunked? And but the I'm interested in
23:49
your thoughts on where where that comes from.
23:51
Is it, is it so ingrained in, in society, in the medical
23:53
profession, that it's going to take another 20 years before we
23:57
we finally see it's? Interesting.
23:59
I think what is changing is women are understanding it more
24:02
than often the healthcare professionals.
24:04
And yeah, there's studies, even the 1940s showing that women's
24:08
well-being, their mental health improve on testosterone.
24:12
One of the big things that I think needs to be unlearned
24:17
really I suppose is about what testosterone is, because a lot
24:21
of doctors and healthcare professionals think testosterone
24:25
is the same as the testosterone that people inject with and
24:30
abuse in, in, in various, you know, gyms or whatever.
24:34
The antibiotic steroids that are synthetic testosterones.
24:38
So they're not the same chemical structure as testosterone.
24:40
There's hundreds of them available in the market, you
24:43
know, wherever. And they are not the same.
24:46
When they do have risks like the synthetic estrogens, the
24:49
synthetic progestogens, they're completely different chemicals.
24:53
So a lot of doctors who don't prescribe are worried that
24:55
they're putting their patients at risk.
24:57
I would never prescribe A synthetic testosterone.
25:00
I prescribe the body identical gel or the cream.
25:04
It's the same structure replacing like for like.
25:07
And I think until people understand that, it's really
25:09
basic, really basic. It's like saying to you, you
25:12
need more protein. Do you want to have chicken as
25:16
in roast chicken or you're gonna have chicken flavour crisps,
25:18
which one's got protein? It won't take you long.
25:21
Your five year old will be able to say probably the chicken,
25:23
roast chicken, and that's the same with the testosterone.
25:26
So I think we have to really just debunk all the myths and
25:29
say also all we're doing is restoring testosterone to a
25:33
physiological response. And some women need might need
25:36
slightly less or some women might say low.
25:39
We hardly ever see side effects with testosterone.
25:43
You know, I've taken testosterone myself for 10 years
25:46
and I would not be married probably.
25:48
I wouldn't be able to look after my children and I wouldn't be
25:50
working without testosterone. You know, Mokira professor's
25:53
been on my podcast a couple of times and he clearly says, and I
25:57
agree with him that that testosterone is the most
25:59
important hormone of marker of health.
26:02
So we know it reduces instance of type 2 diabetes,
26:05
cardiovascular disease, dementia.
26:07
So denying women a biologically active hormone in my mind is
26:11
scandalous, actually. And it it's got to change like
26:16
so many generations of doctors. But I think it's got to come
26:19
from the the women and the men, you know, understanding it.
26:23
Really, I don't think you can we can again, generalizing.
26:26
We can't rely on the medical profession to lead that charge.
26:28
And I think what I was very keen to get across in the book is, is
26:32
how the male partner can support during interactions with doctors
26:36
by these are the. Questions that they are
26:38
important. And, and going into your
26:40
appointment with, with a checklist of, or, or even some
26:44
bullet point questions, what do you want out of this?
26:45
What are my options? Because I think if you go and
26:48
say, I don't know what's going on, you're wasting your 10
26:50
minutes, You're probably going to get, you know, sympathies
26:53
with GPS. They've got an awful lot of
26:54
people to see and, and limited time and resource.
26:57
And that's why I think being proactive can be so helpful.
27:00
You know, asking about treatment, what about
27:03
testosterone? And you might not get it on the
27:04
first go. You're not going to get it on
27:06
the first go, But you've started that conversation and it shows
27:08
that you're informed and then you can go away and do your own
27:11
research. But I think it is very much a
27:12
case of you, you know, at some point the, the buck has to stop
27:16
with us. We have to do it ourselves
27:18
because we can't rely on anyone to, to, to safeguard us or
27:20
corral us into the right treatment approach.
27:23
You've got to, you've got to do the research.
27:25
And I say to any, any bloke I speak to about the book, you
27:29
know you can't, you can't fix anyone, but you can educate
27:32
yourself. This is where it has to start
27:34
from. Absolutely.
27:35
I mean, a lot of my work is educated people, so they make
27:37
choices that are right for them. And you know, taking home means
27:40
is a choice, exercising is a choice, but we've got to
27:43
understand the reasons that we're doing it and then we make
27:45
the choice based on education. So this book is wonderful.
27:50
I'm going to end by asking you 3 reasons why people should buy
27:55
and read the book. Well, it's interesting because
27:58
my answers for women are going to be different.
28:00
For men, right? Why don't you do 2 each then?
28:02
I'll let you do that. 2 for women and two for men.
28:04
I think the first thing the book is written for men, It's, it's,
28:08
it's a man's guide to the menopause.
28:09
But I really do believe that women would benefit from reading
28:11
it because, you know, you just mentioned the lifestyle.
28:13
We go into a lot around lifting weights, eating more protein,
28:18
how to minimize sleep and stress.
28:19
We also talk about HRT options as well.
28:21
So I've written it in a way that hopefully makes it helpful for
28:24
both men and women. So I think the first thing would
28:27
be, if you're a woman listening to this, get your partner to
28:30
listen to this podcast. I think is the most important
28:32
thing because I've had a lot of feedback from menopause
28:37
advocates who say they do seminars, but men just don't
28:39
come. They don't come if a woman's
28:40
presenting it. And I think hopefully a bloke
28:43
talking about it might make it a little bit more accessible.
28:46
We've also got a free download that women, I'd love you to
28:49
download that and pass it on to your partner or get them to do
28:51
it. It's 1 chapter from the book
28:52
that's all about men and midlife and I think that's going to help
28:55
set the scene. And for men, obviously listen to
28:58
this and download the free chapter because it's a really
29:00
good starting point. I think learning how to listen
29:04
is, is the most important thing and not jumping into fix it
29:07
mode, but listening, finding out what's going on, realising that
29:10
you've got far more in common than you probably think.
29:14
And the final thing for men, I mean, I can't just say by the
29:17
book, obviously, can I? Even though that's that's what I
29:19
want to say. I think just be patient.
29:22
I think small gestures count much more than big gestures.
29:26
Being present, being steady, being calm beings, being a rock
29:30
for your partner while they go through this.
29:32
And you're probably dealing with your own midlife stuff as well.
29:35
But it it's realizing you're in a team and if you can be steady,
29:38
that's going to give someone else something they can anchor
29:39
onto. My advice to any man listening
29:41
to this, if it feels tough right now, there is a way through, you
29:44
can do it, but it all starts with a little bit of education
29:48
and a whole lot of love and you will get there.
29:50
Yeah, thank you. Thank you so much for coming.
29:52
It's been great and well done. Again, thank you.
29:57
I've got something really exciting to share with you.
29:59
Every Thursday, I'm going to be releasing an extra episode for
30:03
those of you that sign up. It's an opportunity that I can
30:06
have more guests share more information, dig deeper into the
30:11
research that I can share with you.
30:13
And when you subscribe, this money is going to be used to
30:16
help with research, much needed research that's away from
30:20
pharmaceutical companies. So information is down in their
30:24
show notes. So have a look and subscribe and
30:27
enjoy.