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Your Job Search Strategy for 2026 · Work It Like A Mum

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Hey, I'm Elizabeth Willis, and I'm obsessed with helping as many women as possible achieve their boldest dreams after kids and helping you to navigate this messy and magical season of life.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_01: I'm a working mum with over 17 years of equipment experience, and I'm the founder of the Investing in Women Job Board and Community.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_01: In this show, I'm honoured to be chatting with remarkable women, redefining our working world across all areas of business.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_01: They'll share their secrets on how they've achieved extraordinary success after children, their boundaries and balance, the challenges they faced, and how they've overcome them to find their own versions of success.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: Shy away from the real talk?
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_01: No way! Money, struggles, growth, loss, boundaries and balance.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_01: We cover it all.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_01: Think of this as coffee with your mates mixed with an inspiring TED talk, sprinkled with the career advice you wish you'd really had at school.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_01: So grab a cup of coffee or a glass of wine, make sure you're cozy, and get ready to get inspired and chase your boldest dreams or just survive Mondays.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_01: This is the Work It Like a Mum podcast.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_01: Investing in Women is a job board and recruitment agency helping you find your dream part-time or flexible job with the UK's most family-friendly and forward-thinking employers.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: Their site can help you find a professional and rewarding job that works for you.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_01: They're proud to partner with UK's most family-friendly employers across a range of professional industries.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_01: Ready to find your perfect job?
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_01: Search their website at investinginwomen.co.uk to find your next part-time or flexible job opportunity.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_01: Now back to the show.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_01: Hello and welcome to day two of Smash.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um, hope you can all hear us all okay.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_01: Please let us know if it sounds all alright.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much to everybody that is joining today and hasn't joined yesterday.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_01: Smash is a two-day event um helping you get ready to smash your 2026.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe you didn't quite achieve what you set out to achieve in 2025, but this is the year that you can change that.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_01: And this is the event to help you uh change it.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_01: We've had some brilliant sessions already, all about um how to get clarity on what you want, how to build confidence.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_01: I ran um a session yesterday on CVs and LinkedIn.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_01: We've got another one later on interviews, but today um at this morning, we have the brilliant uh Laurie McPherson, who was fantastic at our last event, our return ready event.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_01: And she is going to be talking all about job search strategy for 2026 because it's changed.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_01: It's a really competitive job market.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think there's any point any of us sugarcoating that.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um I know a lot of you will have experienced that, and I think AI is changing the game as well for a lot of people, and you know, positively, negatively, but I think we're all coming up more and more with AI recruitment as well.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_01: And so Laurie is at the forefront of that.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_01: She's um worked in the career space for a long years and years and years now.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um long time, very experienced, and she um she's brilliant at helping her clients get the jobs that they want and love.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_01: So we're really lucky to have her because I know she's extremely busy.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um she's gonna talk us through what's working now and how people can really make an impact with their job search in 2026.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_00: Awesome.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much for having me, Leslie.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's brilliant to be here.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um we keep, oh, there's a few people watching, we'll keep a B eye on the questions, will we?
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_01: Have you noticed it's changed?
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_01: Because how when did you start in?
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_01: Because you've been like me, you worked in careers a long time.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so 10 10 years, right?
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: So um I started working for yeah, 11 this year.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_00: I started working in employability sort of 11 years 11 years ago in July, so 10 and a half years, and it's changed massively.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_00: Of course, you know, the the the whole COVID period when everything was closed, but there were a lot of people still employed, and then the the shakeup that businesses had to make after that, and then now uh it was a really good period, as you'll know, just after when I think we're thinking, yeah, let's get everybody and let's woo, we yay, like you know, the boom if you like.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_00: And there was a lot of let's be honest, covet funding and all that was propping that up a little bit, and now we're in this place where yeah, it's hard, you know, um, and it's it it's different, and AI is being used, and I want to kind of talk into that a little bit today because I think when it's not going well for you, it's easy to sort of blame the AI, blame the algorithm, all of these things, and actually, and I'm gonna be really honest today, and I'm gonna ask for everyone's permission to do that.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I know we need on the reason, yeah.
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_00: The reason I want to be honest, Liz, is because I hate the thought of busy women working all day, you know, not spending the time they want with their kids and partners, and then sitting on a Saturday or Sunday churning out application, application for roles that they were not ever going to get anyway, because they're not the right job for their next move.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_00: They're possibly what they want and they're possibly a longer term plan, but they're not applying for jobs that they're gonna get, or they're not showing the employer why they're the person who fits.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_00: And if they don't do that, it won't land.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_00: Because what I need everyone to hear today, and as I say, I'm asking for your permission to be dead honest.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_00: If you are going, if you're applying for a job that you haven't done before in any sort of capacity, you're up against someone who has right now, and that is unusual.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_00: And we spoke about this the last time.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_00: I was thinking about this last night.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, you said if you were a marketer at a certain level and you'd marketed selling in the construction industry, and you saw a job in the beauty industry, you could go for it and get it because it was marketing, right?
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you know that, but right now, and I say this to my clients all the time, you're up against someone who's already working for a beauty brand, and you're probably up against 10 of them.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_00: So they'll hire them because they they know that they get it, and that's not a message anybody wants to hear on a sort of dark, we've been talking about dark is on a dark Thursday in January.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: I know that, but the reality is if you need a job quickly for financial reasons, which is absolutely you know, so far so normal, you're most likely to get a job that looks and sounds like one that you've done before right now, because the number of applicants for every job is just you'll you know, you'll see it in other site.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_00: It's hundreds.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_01: My friend, she said she applied, she saw a remote job, which we all know is are the most popular jobs.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_01: She applied for it, she saw it open that day, it was on LinkedIn, she applied for it by the end of the day.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: She'd seen they'd had over 400 applications, and then they closed the role, presumably, yeah, because they were inundated and they needed to sift through those 400.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_01: Attempt, yeah, and that's the thing.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's you know, my friend is a is at in talent and a big retailer, and he said he had a thousand applicants not that long ago.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: One of my clients came and said she did it, she'd gone for a CEO job, so you know, not you know, really high level, she's done amazing work, 437 applicants.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: So, how do you sift and how do you stand out in that you don't is the honest answer?
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, only apply if you fit everything.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they used to say that the job description is a shopping list, right now it's not.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_00: They'll not only get someone who's done the things, they'll get someone who's done the things in the sector for a very similar company and can evidence it.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: And this is the crucial bit.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_00: You have to in this market, they won't go for things like I could learn it or I'm a quick learner or I'm a good team player.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_00: These are these are too basic, these are you know, 2022 phraseology, and if you're still using them, no shame, but take them out of your CV from now on forth and aim at the level that you want to be at.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_00: Talk, they need your epit, they need evidence, right?
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_00: They can't hire you without that, and they also need evidence of achievements, and you also need to be thinking about building your network so that if you do want to move over slightly, for example, you want to do marketing, you've always done it in the construction sector, you're not bothers generally, and and I get that, or even you'd like a move out.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_00: How can you bridge that gap, say, between construction and beauty?
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm giving them with a big gap.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_00: How can you start to get some exposure to the beauty sector now so that you've got a bit of a network over here who can say, Oh, that person, I've met them, they're really great.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_00: They spoke about they've done it for this, and I know they haven't got beauty experience, but they've got XYZ marketing.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_00: You need to evidence your impact and you need a network to move if you want to do something at all different.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_00: Just cold apply-in among you know 437 others is highly unlikely to work right now.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_01: So most people even if you have the relevant skills, there's someone here that's seen the children's one and a half thousand applications.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_00: Like, how can they pick you, right?
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: They can't.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_00: So let's be really sensible here.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_00: They're not using AI out of badness.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_00: Liz will tell you, you don't you don't use AI as a quick sift out of badness, you use it because you physically can't get through all these applications.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_00: So if you don't hit all of the evidence and you don't evidence it, they can't hire you.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_00: It's really, really unpersonal, it's unemotional.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_00: It's that simple right now.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're not that person, don't apply for that job.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we see it all the time, Liz in the Flex Working Groups.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_00: I've applied for X hundred jobs, stop.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_00: Something's not working, you know, churning through applications.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_00: If you're clicking the one-click apply button now, stop.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_00: It's lazy and it shows that you've not put any effort into why you want this job at this time with this company.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_00: You need to be personalizing every time.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_00: I know this is an effort, and I know this isn't the best, you know, you see your life, but it is what's working right now.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_00: So take the time to personalize.
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_00: And I would say when we say job search strategy, you know, let's be honest, most folk are hanging out on the job boards, they're spending all the day on there, and actually, you'd be much better spent getting out the house, going to some local networking, talking to some people, using LinkedIn to network, using recruiters to help you, again, all in the right ways, rather than spending an old stat, and it was an old stat that I saw that said something like 11% of people get their job from the boards, everybody else gets it from their network, recruiters and LinkedIn.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_00: But you think about the time and effort you spend, that's flipped.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's mostly spent on the job boards.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_00: So if your job search strategy, such as it is in 2026, is just I'll wait till jobs pop up in job boards, that's not a strategy for 2026.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_00: It worked 10 years ago.
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_00: I I was a retail manager, I used to put my CV on in the morning and buy my coffee at lunch or lunchtime.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_00: Definitely, I'd have calls to get, you know, to come in someone to take me and move me to another company.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_00: That doesn't happen anymore.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: They are inundated with qualified, experienced, skilled people.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_00: So you need to do a harder work harder to show them why you and part of that is why you want this role, and part of that is often what specific evidence you've got that you've done.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_00: If they're asking for you to have increased, you know, views to a website, for example, you need to show them.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_00: I've done that from this to that before.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_00: You need to give them evidence, you need to tell them, show them, not tell them how you've done it.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_00: Use your cover letter to give them really specific examples, like short, sharp, star examples, and use your CV to give them numbers.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_00: 99%, I've it you're agreeing with me, Liz.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_00: 99% of the CVs that we see do not have any numbers on them.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_00: So therefore, how can the person know what level you've worked at?
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_00: People say things like handle budgets.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_00: And I always, you know, is it was it a fiver, was it a tenner, was it five million pounds?
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know unless you tell me.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_00: I I did a CV for a lovely client the other day, and she's been top level in the kind of production media TV sector.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um her CV read as if she'd been making the tea.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_00: It was like worked on this production as if as what?
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_00: Like you led it, you know.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: We need to stop underselling ourselves.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_00: 99% of the women's CVs that I see, and I mostly work with women, are underselling them.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_00: I know when we speak, I know what they've done because they tell me, but that's not actually represented on paper.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_00: So the biggest thing I hear is I don't know why I'm not getting to interview, I've got a good CV, and what they mean is I've got a great work history.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_00: Actually, they're not showing that.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_00: So can I tell from your CV the level that you are at?
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yes or no?
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_00: And if that's a no, go away and add in some numbers, some tangibles.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_00: And everybody comes at you at this point and says, I can't, my industry's different, it doesn't work like that.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_00: Every single person I've worked with, I've been able to help them to add some numbers of some description, customers, you know, viewing figures, um, numbers in your team, um spend, budget, you know, from this to this.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_00: They need some of this to give you a job.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_00: You look, you think about it, you're looking at all of these 400 odd applications, and somebody's actually taking the time to say, boom, boom, boom, here's how I fit exactly that that's who you're gonna pull out as well.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_01: And this is the impact that I made.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's this is the impact.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_01: And then as a hiring manager or as a recruiter, you're thinking, Oh, brilliant, if they did this in this and they positively impacted this business, great, then they're gonna hopefully positively impact mine as well.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_00: And do it again, do it again.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I think a lot of it, and I know people don't also say this to me as I'm like, you've got to link a lot of it back to profit.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, every private sector business has to be linked back, even if you're not in a revenue-generating role, every job impacts pop profit, should positively impact profit, and how has your jobs positively impacted the profit of your previous employer?
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_01: And that again makes you so much more attractive.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you know how how you roll, and some people will say lots of sectors have an element of compliance, right?
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_00: So, energy, I do a lot of work with women in the energy sector, um, finance, you know, anything financial, you've got a regulator, right?
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_00: So people will say, Oh, yeah, but like it's not a big deal that I did something to make us compliant.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_00: We have to be compliant, Lori.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_00: Like, that's so far so normal.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_00: But actually, like, what would it have, what would it, what was the cost if you're not compliant?
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, what was the cost?
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, well, we'd have got charged five million pounds by off gem.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, you know, so tell me that then.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_00: This, you know, this allowed us to, this meant that, this led to us remaining compliant.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_00: Is it net promoter score?
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_00: Is it profit?
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_00: Is it as you say, it let's be really honest, in a private business, there's usually links to saving money, making money, making time, even if your job isn't that, what did that let the company go on and do?
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_00: And if it's compliance, which would have cost them five million pounds, you know, which allowed us to retain the contract.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_00: Again, people say, Yeah, but we didn't do anything special, we just kept working.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but if you'd lost them, it's a massive, massive problem.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_00: You helped to stop that happening.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_00: How much was that worth?
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_00: And if you can't, if you're worried about confidentiality, you can use uh from you know this percent to that percent or something like that, you know.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_00: Don't you not asking people to break their NDA here, but what we are doing is saying, show me the level that you work at, or else I can't see it, I can't know it.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_01: It's oh it's and I think as well, a lot of people say they forget, and I get that if they so therefore, if you are working somewhere at the moment while you still can, make sure you're collecting that evidence as well because you've got it, and then you you know, because you do forget and you won't remember and yeah, so make sure you, if you're working, you're actually following up as well on the projects you're doing.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_01: Because I know that in projects sometimes people are just working maybe at the beginning of the project, so they can't see what happens that the results are there for make sure you're liaising with the colleagues, your colleagues to see actually what was the impact of this project.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um so that's something a little tip if you are still working um as well.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_01: So, yeah, so we've obviously touched on CV.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I know um I'd love to know we got I get questions on this a lot.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_01: What are you what is your views on skills-based CVs, Laurie?
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_00: I don't like them, and I don't like them because you know, Les, you're a recruiter, you can write, first of all, like forgive me, I always think about now.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_00: It's something that my friends will say to me a lot when I make a glib comment.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we always say, I'll be the judge of that, right?
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: When someone says I'm a people person, they're just a bit like how do you evidence that?
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_00: Like you don't, you know, people put these lists of skills.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_00: How do I know?
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_00: You could say anything, right?
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_00: What I need, you know, as a recruiter is do you look at I have these skills, or do you look at where did they work and what was the title?
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, I just scrolled past it.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: Of course you do.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: So recruiters are not, they're not that they need to know your skills, but they need to know where you con those skills, how you hosed them, what you did, what your impact was.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_00: So skills-based CVs, you're always, I'm sorry, I'm gonna say it, you're always trying to hide something, right?
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_00: Whether it's a career gap or hopping about or something, that I just think there's better ways of doing it.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_00: I personally don't like them.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_00: And if someone sends me one, I immediately scroll past all the skills hoopla and get to where did you actually work?
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_00: What was your actual title and what did you actually do, and what impact did you have?
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_00: Because yeah, I I I understand why returners and people with long gaps would use them, but the truth is you your recruiter's still gonna go through and go, you've lovely, but you've still had a five-year gap.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_00: So I don't like them.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_00: I think there are better ways of displaying gaps, evidence, breaks, moves.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_00: I yeah, I don't like them.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I scroll, I honestly scroll past them just to get to like.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_00: You can't go to your client and say, This person is great with people.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they're like, So who cares?
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_00: Where did they work?
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_00: What was their title?
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_00: They want to know actual detail, you know, so yeah.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, lovely.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so we've done a little bit of CVs.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_01: Um and we've had some questions on networking because I am a huge fan of networking, and I know so many people that have got their job through networking, made actually really big career pivots as well through a network that they I know they definitely wouldn't have done through a cold application.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_01: So, what are your tips then for starting with networking?
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, if you want to maybe make a pivot or if you're wanting to return to work after you maybe you've had a bit of a career break.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_01: How do people get started with networking?
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_01: Where should they go?
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_01: How do they find groups?
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, how do they get started?
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and there's quite a lot of questions on this in the chat as well.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_00: So first thing, ask, like ask on LinkedIn, put out a post that said, you know, and again, if you're starting from three followers, you know, you might need to do a bit of work to get folks to see it.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_00: But ask on LinkedIn, where do other people go?
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_00: And I know it sounds like I'm not I'm not being glib, Google like local networks in your physical area or your interest area.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_00: So, for example, women in social housing, if you work in social housing, has a so if you Googled, you know, networking for housing pros, that would probably pop up.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, if you've got specific areas, you know, absolutely um like let's have a think about those.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_00: But do a Google search, ask on LinkedIn, ask other people where they go.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_00: LinkedIn networking, like lots of other things, is a case of trial and error.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_00: Some work really, really well.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_00: I do a lot of women-only networking, I just find that really works for my business because I mainly work with women, but there are all there are tons like those women in Wibif, women in banking and finance, women in social housing, there's women in insolvency, they're all kind of works.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_01: Have you heard of risky women for women in risky women?
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_00: There's all these, they all have so ask Google, and I know as I'm not saying Google it, you know, I'm not being glib, but there are lots of local.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_00: I'm a committee member up here in Scottish Women in Business.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_00: There are groups, and I've just spoken to yesterday someone who started a thing called circle networking.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_00: Some are better for business owners, some are better.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_00: Have an ask in a Google.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_00: And if it's specific industries, pop them in the chat and we'll see if we can between us think of something.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_00: But um also if you're saying how do you network?
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_00: That's physical, go into a networking or virtual, and which is also great.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_00: And it's the thing I like about I love face-to-face, but virtual's quick.
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_00: I don't have to, I was just blocking in my 12 to 2 networking for March.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_00: You've got to take off 11 to 3 to get there to have a bit of a blather to get home.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_00: It's it takes a chunkier day.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_00: So virtual's a quick hour back to work, done it.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um, in terms of you also the other way is obviously use LinkedIn to network, you know, search, use the search bar, don't be scared to do this.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_00: You'll you'll feel like a strange weirdo.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_00: It's fine, it's a networking platform.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: Use the search bar to search for, you know, let's use that beauty industry, beauty industry um and Glasgow, and you'll see screeds and screeds and screeds of people.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_00: If you click the people tab on the side will come up, you can connect with them.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_00: You're not asking anything of them right now, you're not saying give me a job, you're seeing what they're talking about and seeing what things they go to, who do they link to, who are their contacts.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_00: Start to do a bit of like LinkedIn's an amazing platform for a bit of sleuthing.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_00: Like, where are they?
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_00: Where are Now, where do they used to work for?
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_00: That search bar is your friend.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't have to be limited to people you've physically met.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_00: We've only got so much time in the day, you know.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_00: But you can absolutely search by connections, you can use the filters.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_00: Say, for talking sake, you said you know you wanted to work in charity sector for talking's sake.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_00: You could then filter again using the keywords by you know which part of the charity sector.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_00: It's all there to play for.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_00: You have to fiddle with it because it's an American site, first of all, and it throws up some Americanism.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_00: Some things don't translate particularly well.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_00: Some, you know, some days I do it live on calls, and I'm like, yeah, that's not what we wanted.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_00: We need to try another term, but it's absolutely worth it.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_00: Look at what and and you know, look at where they go um and what they do, and just like we all know someone who's really well connected.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_00: Ask about yeah.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_01: I think as well with networking, it takes time, you know what I mean?
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_01: You're not gonna go LinkedIn on your day for day one and suddenly, you know, get your ideal network there and then, and it's really helpful.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_01: I think with anything, it's that consistency piece.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_01: And at the first, it's probably giving a little bit more than you get as well.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_00: No, 100%.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's it takes so long, and it's it's such a I stood up the other day and looked around the room, and I've worked with lots of them, and they've worked with me, and that's after like I've been doing that for six years in that network.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I'm trusted, they come to me.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_00: That it doesn't happen over a couple of sessions, but it's so I always say networking's always worth it.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_00: Let's do you know what it's like, it's wet, it's cold, it's last week it was really slippy and icy, and you think, I'll not, I'll say in my pajamas, but actually, like it's always worth just getting out of the house, even if it's just to say, I'm looking to speak to people in such an industry.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_00: Do you know anyone?
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_00: And they probably will say no instantly, and then they go home and speak to someone three days later and go, Oh, actually, so even if you don't get anything straight away, it knowing that you've planted some seeds, you've had some conversations, you just need to keep doing that so that you stay top of mind, you know.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um when you're looking for a new role, this should be as much of a part of what you're doing as clicking on the job boards.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and even if you're not looking for a new role, I think there's that phrase, isn't it?
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_01: Dig you well before your Thursday.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_01: And this is your network, they do say your network is your network networking.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, keep networking.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_01: And um also within your organization, I always find it's so much easier to make a career pivot internally because they've got to know you, they've got to trust you.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_01: I know people that have made massive career pivots.
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_01: This is the good thing, actually, about a large corporate.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_01: We spoke yesterday about how often it's the smaller businesses that are more flexible, but the large corporates are a bit sometimes more inflexible, but better benefits.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_01: But one of the benefits of a large corporate is you can really pivot and work in lots of different roles because you've built up that no-like trust factor um within the business.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_01: And they're much more likely to employ internally the next one.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_00: They'll kind of let you they'll let you loosen stuff a little bit, won't they?
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_00: Because they know you and trust you, they know you won't break it, and you know they know you know the culture, what they're trying to achieve, etc.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_00: So, so yeah, um, I think there's much more of a chance of if you can say, I'm actually interested in this, you know, for for down the line.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_00: Can I shadow?
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_00: Can I can I look at some events that are happening over on that side?
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_01: Can I turn up at, you know, look at the internet is a good way just to try it both both sides.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_00: And one thing I did when I was in um, so I was a retail manager, I worked for a massive company, and we just on the internet, they asked for like we're re we're relaunching our values.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_00: Would you like to be a values champ?
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I stuck my hand up, it was brilliant because I'm in a tiny Scottish, like it's a massive company across the UK.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_00: And I got to go to head office and meet like you know, the head of HR and the head of experience, and again, I'm still talking to them on LinkedIn now, years later, made some amazing friends and got exposure to, you know, I just I just it's literally just sticking your hand up for stuff and saying, So I became a values champ, went to the big relaunch event, was one of the team on the you know, everybody knows who you are.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_00: You've got a bit of a profile because you you've you've put your hand up, and that was that was brilliant for me.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_00: It really, really opened doors in the company and and helped me to, you know, and then these are the people who then help you later on when you need to do some moving and pivoting.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so um, we've obviously covered LinkedIn.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um we've got some questions that we can come on to in a moment and some networking.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_01: I think we've covered this, but obviously, we going back to applications.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_01: If there is anything, if you're trying to apply cold, is there anything you can do, do you think, to make your application stand out?
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_01: We've covered a lot of it, but is there anything we've missed?
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, lots of things.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_00: Like you only need to go back 10, 15 years-ish, again, depending on how long you've been in certain jobs.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_00: Don't go back to decades ago, it's no longer relevant, everything's moving so quickly.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_00: Use your profile summary, not to tell them what you want, which poke often do.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_00: I'm now looking for a job that you know that's not in this market, use it to tell them how you help them.
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_00: So it's here's your problem.
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_00: I understand your problem, and I've already done this in another role.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_00: Use some of their language.
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_00: If they're specifically asking for you to have handled complex projects, tell them that you have, you know.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously, of course, it's true.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_00: A top tip if your last title wasn't the title of the job you're going for, but it's not a massive reachy stretch that you're, you know, making it up.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not calling myself a recruitment manager because I'm not, but you know, if if your last title was accounting director and they want you to be business development, put as in your first line, you know, business development, so that they can see that you understand what the role is and that you are their person.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_00: You basically want AI as being used.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_00: We know that, and people get all in a panic about I have to stuff with keywords and do this.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_00: I've seen all sorts of nonsense.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_00: If you write in white at the bottom and the AI, it's just it's nonsense.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_00: Like, why would it do that?
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's not, you know, it's a machine, it's not, it doesn't have um, it's not daft, but also it doesn't have any nuance, so you have to tell it.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_00: So imagine you're reading this without knowing what that involves or that leads to.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_00: You have to kind of tell it.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_00: So if it asks for specific things, you have to tell them that you have that or are that, and as quickly as possible, because you know you get so many CVs, you can't read to the you know, I get clients get really angry.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_00: I did tell them I had 20 years' experience.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_00: Aye, if they read down to the bottom of your four-page CV, they can see that they don't have time for that.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_00: So, what you need to do is tell them in the top line, you know, business.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_00: If they're asking for 20 years plus of business development, you say business development professional with over 20 years experience in blah blah blah in the first line.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_00: It's about speed.
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_00: Imagine I'm reading this at you know, you listen to your messages at double time, they are reading your CV at double time.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_00: So give them what they need really quickly at the top of the page.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_00: If it's if it's going on to three and they're not reading that, they've already checked out because they've got to go on to the next one.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_00: So give them what they need quickly on an application and on a CV.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_00: And if it's an application, they want specific examples.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_00: When I worked there, I did this, I had to do this, I did this, and here was the result.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_00: It's short stars, S T A R, it's your competencies, you're going to use again interview.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_00: Give them those short examples on your application so that they know because folk tend to, it's like I always have, you know, it's good communication.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_00: I know this is a basic one, right?
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I always use good, like it's nothingy, really, when you think about it.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_00: How do you do it?
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone does it.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_00: It's just, you know, how do you differentiate against, and I've said this to folk before, if they ask basic questions like good team, you know, how do you ever you don't, you know, I've worked in teams, so has everyone else, really.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_00: Let's think about it differently.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_00: What I want you to do is think about it as the employer.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_00: How do I evidence that?
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's it's it's influence someone that you didn't have influence over.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_00: It's you know, it's the size of the team or the fact that the team were in different time zones or something complex, give them some evidence.
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_00: That's what most applications, if I'm honest, are missing.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_00: They're mostly very nice, and they're mostly, but they're probably, if we're really honest, and I wrote a week post about this yesterday, I think, if you've still got you know good team player, hard working, and can work on my own as well as part of a team, those phrases you put in your CV after uni, and you're 52, it's time to take a good hard look at it and actually show your level.
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_00: It's time to speak to the level you want to go to because most people are still not taught, and this is not not to shame anyone, we're not taught how to write a CV.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_00: We just the common wisdom is just to kind of add jobs on, actually strip it back.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_00: What does this employer need to know?
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_00: A good tip from me is read the job description and imagine filtering it through one of those wordal things, you know, that gives you big words.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_00: If it comes, you know, like imagine they use the word strategic, strategic, strategic, strategic all the way through it.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_00: My top line would say something about me being strategic or handling the strategy.
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, does that yeah?
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because that's what they care about.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's not being a town crier telling them everything you want to know about everything you've ever done.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_00: Let me tell you everything about everything I've ever done.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_00: They don't care.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's being a tailor, tailoring to what they need and want right now that's going to solve their biggest problem because it's tough for businesses right now, they're often really struggling.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_00: The COVID loans are needing to get paid back, you know.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_00: The cost of um employing has massively has rocketed.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_00: There's so many new policies and procedures on the favour of the employee.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_00: I know, I'll be honest, employees are nervous.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_00: Employers are really nervous now, and there's some CIPD research done about that.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they're the most nervous they've been in 10 years, and that includes the COVID years.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_00: Something like 12% reduction in actual jobs being created, and that's um from Office of National Statistics.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_00: That was one that I wrote an article for iPaper came out in Jan.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_00: That's what they said.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_00: There's less jobs, it costs them more to hire you.
• 33:01
  SPEAKER_00: They're up against it if anything goes wrong and you need time off.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's expensive.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_00: They don't want to make a mistake.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_00: So what they're looking for is safety, they want to know, and what tends to happen, I've seen this a lot, is you get you might even get to the final stage, and then they hire the person with sexual experience because it's just safer.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_00: So you've got to make clear make it clear.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_01: You've got to then make yourself out to be that safe, better.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_01: Make yourself safe, yeah.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_00: Not safe pair of hands, like I'll blend into the background because then they can't see you, but safe in terms of this person's not gonna go anywhere.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_00: No, and it's not about stay there forever, it's like this person feels safe for the next six months.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, possibly longer though, actually.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_00: Well, exactly.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they've got to they've got to feel that you're safe anyway.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_00: Recruiters, it's obviously recruiters is they've got to know you're not gonna move in the first six months because that's how they end living, you know, usually.
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_00: So they've got to they've got to feel like you're not gonna hop, you're not gonna jump, you're not gonna run away, you're safe to hire.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_00: So looking at your LinkedIn and CV, like, are you safe?
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I had some folks sit, especially folks who are maybe out at work for a while and are thinking I might just start a bit of a business or do some freelance.
• 34:12
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, are you do you want a job or do you want free like are you gonna leave me to go and do your own business or are you gonna leave me as a client to go and get a job?
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_00: Sitting in the messy middle supports no one, you have to pick a pick a horse and sit behind it in this and and be a little bit brave and say, This is what I'm gonna do, do it for six months, you know, and and and work at it.
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because yeah, it's about making you look really safe that you're not gonna move, you know.
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_00: For recruiters, they need to do at least six months, employers will want you to stay there for two to five years.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, employee recruiters will lose their money, it's as simple as that if you hop about.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_00: So nobody wants that after doing all the work.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_00: So so they've got to look what about job hoppers?
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_01: Because we and I I say and I feel awful saying this, but I've always been a perm recruiter, so we were being completely honest.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_01: That has always made me quite nervous seeing job hoppers because you're like, like Laurie said, if they leave, you lose the money that you worked really hard for.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_01: And some people have fallen into contracting, um, maybe through no fault through, maybe they now want to go perm.
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_01: How do they and it's I always think how do they then yeah, then move or demonstrate that they are safe on that, you know, they are a perm, say that.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's so hard, and it happened to a really good friend of mine, right?
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_00: So she'd done like nine pet temp roles one after the other, in a sector that rewards that and and asks for that because you don't have the money to pay you longer term, so like project this, project that.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_00: So she started looking, and we were chatting in the main chat, and we've got a group, you know, in a group chat, and then about she had like nine interviews or something like that.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_00: And then I was like, I could see the sort of desperation creeping in.
• 35:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I met I sent her a private message and I went, Hi, would you like some help with that?
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_00: And she was like, Oh my god, yes.
• 35:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I keep coming up against, are you just gonna leave?
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_00: And she's like, I would not have left any of them, bar in maybe one or you know, I would have stayed in all of them had the opportunity been there.
• 36:03
  SPEAKER_00: But I work in a sector where they don't have like charity-esque, they don't have the money to keep you, so you have to keep moving.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_00: And and I said, that's their I says, so rather than sitting sweating in the interview, waiting for them to ask that question at the end, I'm gonna say to you, just bluntly see it at the beginning.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_00: You'll see from my CV, I've had a lot of short-term contracts.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_00: You know, these were funded placements for a certain amount of time in which I made impact.
• 36:28
  SPEAKER_00: This role is permanent.
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_00: I am absolutely, you know, looking now for a permanent role, having really honed exactly what I want, where my skills are through doing these roles.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_00: Don't otherwise you sit, you're on the back foot that sits sweating, as opposed to taking the bill by the horns and saying, having had lots of you know, short-term contract roles, I'm absolutely ready to take a permanent role.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_00: I learned some brilliant things, work for some brilliant organizations in these roles, and and and it was they were only short-term funded.
• 36:55
  SPEAKER_00: I'm ready to, and then stop talking, you know, don't over-explain, like, I couldn't help it, or any of those kind of negative, minimizy things that women sometimes do.
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's really hard is the answer because you, you know, you're right, she didn't choose to do nine random jobs one after the other, but she got into that massive cycle of I can't now get out of pets of short term.
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_00: She's out now.
• 37:16
  SPEAKER_00: We she's she's in a perm route and it's it's lovely, and she's like, I'm going to stay here forever.
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, good.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_00: You know, yeah, it's it's not it's not viewed particularly well.
• 37:26
  SPEAKER_00: I think people sometimes stress it too much.
• 37:28
  SPEAKER_00: You know, sometimes we do hop.
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_00: Some jobs aren't affect that that's fine, but it's it's when it's a constant pattern.
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_01: When it becomes the pattern, isn't it?
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_01: And it's a pattern.
• 37:36
  SPEAKER_00: They do start to go for a few years.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_00: Is it you?
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_00: You know, let's be real, they do start to wonder, is it you?
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_00: You know, if it's always the problem someone else's problem, usually you're the problem.
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so they you have to kind of front that up.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_00: You really, you know, having completed a number of short terms, I'm now absolutely in a place to look for perm.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um, Nikki's asked about the networking search, that was on LinkedIn, yeah.
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and also she recommended Google.
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and ChatGPT as well, you could probably type into ChatGPT.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then Joanne has asked, would you remove career break sections on the CBF?
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_00: No, I'd leave them in, but I'd be really like you're not apologizing for having a career break, Joanne, usually to look after a child or an elderly person.
• 38:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I always say this if you don't look after them, someone else has to, right?
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_00: And you have to pay them, so it's fine.
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_00: What I wouldn't do, right, ever, because it's deeply naff, is do the I was a plaster putter on or maker of smoothies, answerer of the doorbell, you know, a referee of have you seen that really, really naf advice, like all these mummy tasks.
• 38:37
  SPEAKER_00: Corporate employers do not care that you've, you know, had to negotiate between two, three-year-olds fighting over a toy.
• 39:47
  SPEAKER_00: They really don't, and it makes you look like not like you're in their world.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_00: So leave it in, but something like planned career break or career break, that's it.
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_00: Don't over-explain it.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_00: If you've gone and done loads of community work, qualifications, PTA, sometimes, unless it's minimized and you put it in, but just career break and is fine, you know.
• 40:09
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe explain it a little bit in the cover letter if it was long, just to tell them that you know, especially if it's health, you you you know, you don't want to give them a reason not, you don't want to give them a reason not to hire you.
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_00: So have it in there.
• 40:22
  SPEAKER_00: If it's and again, see if it's six months, Liz, do you do you you don't get stressed about it?
• 40:28
  SPEAKER_00: Or notice if it's six months, you know, it after six months a year again.
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of people are off work, not even like for caring, it might be that they're just looking for a job.
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, exactly.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_00: So I wouldn't stress about it.
• 40:41
  SPEAKER_00: People do know that after COVID, that was quite a you know, it has changed things a bit, but don't, you know, I I wouldn't write loads of like I wouldn't explain yourself or write, definitely don't write any of those sort of nafs.
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_00: Sorry, it's one of my pet peeves, and you see it in all the groups all the time.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_00: Like, why don't you add in that you're a chief negotiator?
• 40:59
  SPEAKER_00: Like, please don't.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um and I'll say this to someone that's quite on, I'll say this this is a really honest thing.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_01: I've I've got children now, but I struggled with infertility, and I think if someone had said that to me in a CV while I was struggling to have children, I'd have found it really like abrasive.
• 41:16
  SPEAKER_01: You don't know who is reading that and what they are going through.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_01: So therefore I think if you're gonna put it in, also gray break, gray break.
• 41:25
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm creating and I'm child-free.
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_00: Also, avoid full-time mum.
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_00: It it sounds like someone who's doing it and Karen isn't a full-time mum, and it's a really, really it's really jarring.
• 41:35
  SPEAKER_00: If you're if you the person sitting there has had to leave their kid to sit and read your CV, are they not a full-time mum?
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_00: Just saying.
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, no full-time mums, no naff, mummy stuff, just cray break.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, okay.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think I think we've covered all the questions.
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_01: This has been brilliant.
• 41:53
  SPEAKER_00: Well, there's one about LinkedIn D advice to connect rather than follow, and what do you say?
• 41:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, always connect, uh, because if you follow the you can see them.
• 42:02
  SPEAKER_00: If you connect, they can also see your content.
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_00: Now I know what you're thinking.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_00: What content?
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_00: But if you are looking, you know, it would be wise to be posting a bit of an introduction, what you're looking for, always positive, no negativity, no how awful is this job market.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_00: You'll get a ton of likes, you get tons of validation.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_00: What you will never ever get, Liz, back me up on this one is a job.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_01: I had someone lesser, and she's had a had a really bad experience in her last role and wrote quite a post about how bad her employer was.
• 42:38
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, you need to take it off because as an employer, a few potential ring alarm bells.
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_01: She got loads of likes, all that validation.
• 42:47
  SPEAKER_00: All that validation, amazing.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_00: You feel great that you can get hired off it because there is that question, was it them?
• 42:53
  SPEAKER_00: Is it is it you?
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and and I'm being really honest today, and someone has said thanks for that.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_00: Because you know, there's wishing it's great, you know.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_01: We need it.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_00: We can all wish, we can all wish.
• 43:03
  SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, if if they connect with you, they can see your lovely content as well, which is coming, right?
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_00: And um, what to say, just a quick message saying, Um, you know, interested in moving into your sector if you are interested in seeing what's going on over there, um, or or don't send a message if it stresses you out, just connect.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_00: And and some people won't because they want a message, fine, you know, let them, but connect and just watch what's happening.
• 43:28
  SPEAKER_00: Once you see the kind of pattern of what people are talking about, join in, jump in and don't ever be scared to put to comment on someone's post on LinkedIn.
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_00: You they'll love you for doing it as long as it's kind because it's it gives their post more traction.
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_00: Someone posts comments on my post.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_00: I'm absolutely buzzing.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_00: So never feel scared to say, Oh, we've done that as well over at our place, or that sounds fab, that that event sounded great.
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_00: When might they run another one?
• 43:51
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, you know, they'll they'll start to chat me and go, Oh, they've got a mailing list, here's a link.
• 43:55
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that's how you build relationships on LinkedIn.
• 43:57
  SPEAKER_00: It's not all about creeping into people's DMs.
• 43:59
  SPEAKER_00: Nikki asked about that top line as well.
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just looking, um, short intro.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, how long should it be?
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_00: Again, sorry, Nikki, I'm not a politician, but it does depend.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_00: It depends on how much they're asking.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_00: If they've got a short list of what the bit that says essential information um essential criteria, you will be, you will have, answer that basically as much as you can in the top paragraph or just below in the achievements or skills section.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_00: I don't mean a skills-based CV with great big long screeds, but just short, you know, e-commerce, i.e.
• 44:28
  SPEAKER_00: Spotify and WooCommerce, for example, up at the top is my answer.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_00: And it, you know, it depends how long it is, depending on the level of seniority.
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_00: That the higher you go, the more they want, and that look has to get a bit longer.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_00: So, top paragraph, that's the personal summary.
• 44:43
  SPEAKER_00: Used to be I want what you were looking for, now it's how I help you fill your problem.
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um remove the section completely.
• 44:51
  SPEAKER_00: No, Gemma's asked that about skills.
• 44:53
  SPEAKER_00: Leave skills in, Gemma.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_00: What I mean is screeds of skills-based CV rather than actually get into the important bits.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_00: If you're writing skills like um, say for talking sake, it's an HR role, and you can say you've got experience of you know, um, complex union negotiations and two-pay transfer, absolutely, if that, but what I would say is if that's what the employer you're going to is asking for.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_00: If it's not, take it out because they don't care.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_00: What they want to know is that you fit what they need.
• 45:23
  SPEAKER_00: So it's much more specific to the role you're going for rather than what you want to tell them, if that makes sense.
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, I'm gonna um Liz, what are your thoughts on Helen's one?
• 45:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah, we've got two minutes as well.
• 45:37
  SPEAKER_01: So maybe uh Helen's the last.
• 45:39
  SPEAKER_01: Um should we do Helen as the last one?
• 45:42
  SPEAKER_01: And then there was one on Cover Letter as well.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe we'll just squeeze in the last two.
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_01: Would you recommend reaching out directly to the person recruiting after before you've sent off your application if you know who it is that is hiring?
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_01: Oh well, I think if you know who it is.
• 45:55
  SPEAKER_01: Is then if you know them, then yeah, and afterwards, definitely, because I do think not every nobody ever sends a thank you, and the people that do always stand out, and I think that's great.
• 46:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_00: If you know if you've got an in, absolutely always use it and don't feel embarrassed.
• 46:12
  SPEAKER_00: Men call it leverage in their network, women feel like, Oh, I'm using that person.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_00: You're not, you're asking for help at a stage when you need it, you can give back when it's time.
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_00: And covering letters, all they recruiters hate them, don't they, or don't really read them because they're on the other.
• 46:25
  SPEAKER_01: I like a cover left.
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_01: I noticed that so I was gonna say, if I was recorder, because you said about recruiting the talent acquisition team, I only shared the CV.
• 46:33
  SPEAKER_01: I get that.
• 46:34
  SPEAKER_01: I get in large corporates, it's slightly more impersonal.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_01: But I do think in these smaller businesses that are more founder-led, when it's the direct hiring manager or even the founder that is reviewing the applications, those cover letters go so far.
• 46:49
  SPEAKER_00: So far.
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_00: Sarah, my answer to that, and it's always I always write this because I've I've got a cover letter product, right?
• 46:54
  SPEAKER_00: So it's a bit cheeky.
• 46:55
  SPEAKER_00: When someone says, Should I write a cover letter?
• 46:56
  SPEAKER_00: I always say, only if you want the job.
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 46:59
  SPEAKER_00: Because it's how you tell them how that you want this job and why, and why you're a great fit, and you give them some examples.
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_00: It's more space.
• 47:06
  SPEAKER_00: You haven't got room in your CV, so a cover letter is the place to do that.
• 47:09
  SPEAKER_00: They might not read it, we have to be okay with that, but they might, and it might tip you the balance in your favour.
• 47:14
  SPEAKER_00: I'd do it if I needed a job right now.
• 47:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you've not learned anything to lose, have you?
• 47:18
  SPEAKER_01: Laurie, this has been incredible.
• 47:20
  SPEAKER_01: We've had so many questions.
• 47:21
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I know that people have found it really, really valuable.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_01: Um, as if I I've always learned something in our chats.
• 47:28
  SPEAKER_01: So thank you so much.
• 47:29
  SPEAKER_01: How can people connect with you, work with you, um, you know, find out more about what you offer because I know that you are brilliant.
• 47:38
  SPEAKER_00: So I am always on LinkedIn as Lori McPherson and also I'm on Instagram and I've got a website under Laurie McPherson as well, if anyone wants a bit of one-to-one help.
• 47:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I know you're doing one-to-ones.
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_01: I know you've helped so many women get jobs, um, which has been brilliant.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_01: I'm assuming a few men as well.
• 47:57
  SPEAKER_01: But um, yeah.
• 47:58
  SPEAKER_01: A few men.
• 47:59
  SPEAKER_00: An odd husband, as I always say, but yeah, usually filter through the women.
• 48:02
  SPEAKER_01: Brilliant.
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_01: Well, thank you so much, Laurie.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_01: You've been amazing.
• 48:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um, thank you so much to everyone that has watched, that has commented.
• 48:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we've got another session at half past ten with our recruitment manager Adele, who helps prepare our candidates for their interviews.
• 48:16
  SPEAKER_01: So she's going to be giving some interview tips.
• 48:18
  SPEAKER_01: So thank you so much, Laurie, again and see you all soon.
• 48:24
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for listening to another episode of the Work It Like a Mum podcast.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_01: If you enjoyed this episode, please rate, review, and subscribe.
• 48:33
  SPEAKER_01: And don't forget to share the link with a friend.
• 48:36
  SPEAKER_01: If you're on LinkedIn, please send me a connection request at Elizabeth Willet and let me know your thoughts on this week's episode.
• 48:42
  SPEAKER_01: You can also follow my recruitment site, Investing in Women, on LinkedIn, Facebook, and Instagram.
• 48:48
  SPEAKER_01: Until next time, keep on chasing your biggest dreams.