Latest / Taking Initiative / Meet Ohio's Secretary of State Candidates: Allison Russo (Democratic Party)
Transcript
- Laura Lucarelli: Welcome to Taking Initiative, a podcast presented by Ohio Ballot Protection. I'm joining you again today with my co-host, Pat Blackmon. Patricia Blackmon: Hello Laura. Laura Lucarelli: and we're also joined today by special guest Allison Russo, one of the candidates running for Ohio's Secretary of State. Welcome, Allison. Allison Russo: Thank you, thank you for having me. Laura Lucarelli: we get started asking you questions, I just want a quick reminder of why we're here. So as everybody knows, or hopefully knows, in May, Ohioans will be voting in the primaries for candidates for Secretary of State. We've talked quite a bit about how our Secretary of State impacts citizen initiative directly. We've invited all the candidates for Secretary of State to be interviewed on our podcast. And we want to make sure the candidates and the audience knows we are not going to be endorsing any candidate. Instead, we're asking the same questions and giving you an opportunity to get to know them and make a decision for yourself. Pat, you summarize for us what the Secretary of State does? Patricia Blackmon: I am so fascinated with being able to do this in front of a candidate who is running for Secretary of State. So please forgive me if I make mistakes. The Secretary of State is a constitutional officer, runs for office every four years, has two primary goals to deal with elections and to also deal with individual corporations and filings. Today we're going to focus on the election part of it. And I'm just going to cite three areas that the Secretary of State is primarily responsible for. And the first one is of all the 88 counties that have and they all do in the state of Ohio a board of elections. the Secretary of State manages and oversees those groups. In addition, the Secretary of State sits on the five-member Ohio Ballot Board, which is very important, and also manages different aspects of elections all over the state in every election. So just a little bit of history, because I'm a history buff. The Secretary of State was first introduced into Ohio when Ohio became a state in 1803. In 1851, they made it an office and individuals could be appointed to Secretary of State for two years. Then in 1992, it became term limited. So you run for four years, you can only sit for two consecutive terms. And that's pretty much the history and a little bit of the definition of the Secretary of State. Laura Lucarelli: Well now it's your turn, Allison. We want to get to know you. First, just tell us a little bit about yourself and why you're running. Allison Russo: Yeah, yeah. Well, some people may know me because I currently serve in the state legislature. I have been a member of the Ohio House of Representatives since 2019. I was elected in 2018. During my time in the legislature, sat on a number of really important committees to the topic that we are discussing today, including general government, where we hear many of the election laws that impact what the Secretary of does in our boards of elections. Constitutional resolutions, ⁓ anytime legislature actually sends something directly to the ballot because there two pathways these initiatives can go. ⁓ I've on those committees. I also served as the Ohio House Minority Leader, so the top Democrat ⁓ in Ohio House during some very interesting times as it relates to ballot initiatives. initiatives, specifically when the majority in the legislature tried to push forward raising the threshold citizen-led ballot initiatives, the passage threshold to 60 percent, ⁓ I opposed and we were successful in holding that off for several months ⁓ it finally went to the ballot and was defeated, as well as a number of the statewide issues, citizen-led initiatives have come forward, including the Reproductive Rights Amendment and 2024 redistricting that included a citizen led commission ⁓ to replace Ohio Redistricting Commission. I also have on the Ohio Redistricting Commission ⁓ from 2022 2023. So ⁓ I have a of aspects ⁓ of how this the Secretary of State, actually interacts with the legislature, which is quite a bit. A lot of people don't realize that no other statewide office other than the governor interacts as closely with the state legislature because it is the state legislature that establishes the laws and the rules that dictate how we conduct our elections. The secretary of state carries those out but also specifically as it relates to ballot initiatives is quite a bit of an interaction ⁓ the legislature often including appointment of members to the ballot board which I have done as the House Minority Leader so very familiar with the proceedings of the ballot board as well. So I'm running for Secretary State because I think First of all, we need a Secretary of State who is an advocate for voters and who understands that the job is to put the politics aside and to really do what is best for voters and to follow the Constitution and follow the law in the execution of fair, free, and secure elections. Patricia Blackmon: thought maybe we would delve right into ⁓ whole concept of citizen initiatives and where it comes from. And so one of the things I'm specifically concerned about is your role. And I think you gave us a little bit of that in terms of defending direct democracy. Allison Russo: Well first of all, I am a strong believer ⁓ in right to direct democracy. serving in a legislature that is often out of touch with where voters are on some very important issues ⁓ has helped me clearly understand that this right that Ohioans have had and it's, you know, a right given to them in our Ohio Constitution ⁓ to direct democracy incredibly important because it is the final check of citizens on government, whether it be the legislature or the governor, on government. when government does not respond to what the citizens want. And so we've seen this to play recently, certainly with the reproductive rights amendment ⁓ cannabis and legalizing adult use cannabis ⁓ with, know, making attempts to do redistricting reform. We see people out right now collecting signatures for the equality issue, marriage equality and equality. ⁓ So is a very important right. As a legislator and specifically as the House Minority you know, I have watched as citizens are stepping up and using this right more often, a legislature majority in the legislature, you know, try to roll back some of that right by raising that threshold to 60 % for passage. And of course, they couldn't do that because the voters said no, also other things like raising, trying raise signature requirements that you have to gather. ⁓ as it relates to the Secretary of State's office, ⁓ these statewide offices that have very important roles to play in this process, the of State, the Attorney General, ⁓ and the powers in these roles to put their on the scale for these ⁓ ballot initiatives if don't agree with them. ⁓ And I'm sure talk about this, the Secretary of State has a tremendous amount of power because of the role on the ballot board ⁓ in terms of the looks like in terms of you know how we certify those signatures, ⁓ finance specifically as it relates to ballot issues as well as you know how people ⁓ or don't access the ballot so all of those things are important and it's why these statewide offices ⁓ matter direct Laura Lucarelli: Hypothetical question, how would you handle an initiative presented to the board, to the Ohio ballot board, that you oppose? Allison Russo: ⁓ answer is simple. It shouldn't matter what my personal opinion is ⁓ an My job is to essentially be the referee. And so there are requirements that these initiatives have to meet in order to go before voters. And so that is my job as the Secretary of State. ⁓ they collect an adequate number of signatures that are certified and legal yes or no? ⁓ When it comes the ballot board, is this single subject? it multiple issues? ⁓ And being fair in determination. as the chair of the ballot board. And I you know, one of the most important pieces that we've learned is what the language ⁓ that voters about this issue when they go into the voting booth? ⁓ Is it Is it accurate? ⁓ Is it And so that ⁓ what I consider be my job as the Secretary of State. You know, ⁓ it should not what my opinion is. ⁓ on the issue and I'll use a very current example right now. There are citizens at the moment who are collecting signatures to fully repeal our property taxes and put that before voters. I have huge concerns with that approach. I understand people's frustration with property taxes. I believe we need to reform how we do it. ⁓ repealing them entirely without some sort of replacement for the revenue for our school districts, our local governments, etc. I think, you know, could be very detrimental. So personally, I probably will not be voting for this issue if it comes before us because I think there are other approaches here. That said, as the Secretary of State, that shouldn't matter. If these individuals who are collecting these signatures get enough and they're legal, if they come before the ballot board ⁓ they provide a description that is accurate and unbiased, that is my job as the Secretary of State. And I feel very strongly, and this goes back to me ⁓ fully in the right to direct democracy. It's not my decision about whether or not that should pass. It is the citizens of Ohio and the voters of Ohio who should have the final say in that Patricia Blackmon: One the issues that you raised, and I've ⁓ a lot of research on this, we use ⁓ the single subject language too often. It's a single issue. And I wonder if you have any concerns about how that's being interpreted and what are multiple issues and what's the system that's set up to handle this? Allison Russo: Well, I mean, listen, there are certainly ways this can be manipulated to make it more difficult for citizens to be able to collect those signatures. I mean, we see this right now playing out with the Equality ⁓ Ballot Initiative, the board, and it was the Secretary of State, LaRose, who was the tie breaking vote on this, decided that was not one subject, it was two subjects. So now these of citizens who are going out and collecting these signatures have to do it on two different petitions. And they're doing it at the same time, but that still adds another layer of burden. They have to meet those signature requirements twice because it's been divided into two subjects. I think certainly there are issues that come before the ballot board that reasonable people can disagree if this is a single subject or multiple subjects. And you know the trick here and I think Pat you will appreciate this the trick here some of the guidance around this to the ballot board, you know has been litigated is based on court decisions not necessarily Ohio revised code or what's in the Constitution? So then you know, it's interpretation legal interpretation in terms of you know, what what is the guidance for the ballot board? and it's similar to you know some of the issues we face as legislators as well because we have a single subject requirement for legislation also that often gets ignored or strictly adhered to depending on you know who's making the final call and if they support that or not. For me ⁓ as the next Secretary of State is to follow as closely the legal guidance and on this as much as possible, but again, not to use the interpretation to put the thumb on the scale for issues that you may not personally agree with. What we don't want to do is overburden ⁓ citizens who are trying to directly petition Thank Patricia Blackmon: it's not that you as the Secretary of State can change the issues, but you could say that it's multiple issues and cause that much stress. And so I'm curious about what could you see from those cases, especially the Ohio Supreme Court's decision ⁓ on is a single issue so that you don't get confused and say, it's not a single issue anymore, it's multiple issues. Allison Russo: Here's of the challenge we at the moment too, is we have a different Supreme Court at the moment. ⁓ And, you know, I think that there is, there are scenarios where a ballot board can make a decision about whether or not something is single subject or not. ⁓ It will most certainly get litigated often, ⁓ will ultimately determined by the Ohio Supreme Supreme Court. Unfortunately, I feel we are in a moment right now in Ohio where our Ohio Supreme Court is much more politicized than it has been in the past. because of for a variety of reasons. And so, you know, I'm not sure that some of the case law that has previously existed here will necessarily stand depending on, you know, who is litigating this and what the topic is. So I ultimately, think that it comes down to, a plain language reading of the guidance here, which is, you know, are we dealing with one topic, one subject? So for example, the equality issue, I think that that was one topic and one subject. I think it was only determined to be two because it makes it more difficult. And there were some games being played there to make it more difficult to carry through with the signature collection piece. And so, you know, that is the standard I think that is appropriate is, you know, what is the plain language reading and interpretation of these issues that come forward. Laura Lucarelli: ⁓ We mentioned a little bit about signature gathering requirements and how too long ago there was conversation about making it more difficult. Just curious ⁓ your thoughts on signature gathering. Is it fair as it is? there anything that you, if it were in your control, might change? Allison Russo: Yeah, well, certainly since I have been in the legislature, there have been a number of conversations and potential efforts to increase that signature threshold and certain groups that have been pushing for that to make it more difficult, ⁓ it be a statute ⁓ initiatives, a constitutional change, or even a citizen led referendum, which we haven't talked about the referendum as But that is where you can directly ⁓ repeal that has passed by the General Assembly within 90 days the governor signing something into law. Listen, I think that the signature requirements that we have right now for all of those efforts ⁓ are... difficult enough. ⁓ have a large number of initiatives, citizen-led initiatives that start and never actually make it to completion or referendum ⁓ that start and never actually make it to completion because threshold is so high. So anyone who tries to make the argument, you know, we have too many of these, the evidence simply does not support that. I mean, you know, just in the last year and a half, we've had efforts to try to repeal Senate Bill 1, which was an attack on higher education that was passed by the legislature, effort to repeal changes ⁓ the cannabis marijuana ⁓ that failed, you know, a few weeks ago. ⁓ Those just the referendum thresholds, which are slightly lower than constitutional amendments. But it just goes to show, you know, this is incredibly difficult. A lot of these efforts are grassroots efforts. There's not a lot of money behind these signature collection efforts. You all of the different hurdles that have been put in place, you know, for people who are those signatures and what they have to do to collect those signatures. It is high enough and I think any changes that make it difficult, I am opposed to because again, you know, so few actually make it all the way through to come before voters. ⁓ Laura Lucarelli: We actually had a chance to talk to Dr. Mandy Fehlbaum who the SB1 referendum. Fascinating story. They worked so hard and didn't make it. Allison Russo: Yeah, truly a grassroots effort. truly it was remarkable how many they were to collect in that compressed time frame because again, you know we have a statewide office in this case. It's the Attorney General ⁓ that can delay even the start of that signature process. So they had a very compressed window and you know got very close but just couldn't quite make it to the requirements. Patricia Blackmon: You ⁓ given a lot good information with respect to ⁓ single issues ⁓ and you should looking for. And I'm curious as to what do you think about what happens with the final language that goes on the ballot? Do you have some thoughts about that? Because ⁓ one thing we want stress is that we're trying to educate the public. as to what this system looks like and what it has gone through. And so your interpretation of what the final ballot language should look like and what standard you would use would be helpful, Allison Russo: Yeah. ⁓ No, I have very strong opinions about this. there is language that is actually approved before you even begin collecting signatures that has to be presented on that It's usually a quick summary that language, right? ⁓ That is approved. That's approved by the attorney general. ⁓ And then once you collect those signatures, ⁓ and you meet the requirements, it then comes before the ballot board and there is language that voters see when they go into the voting booth. To me, it has always perplexed me that we don't... at least default back to the language that was used originally and already approved, right, by the attorney general. Why? That is not the default language that we go back to, but that has not been the case. what we have seen is, you know, under this secretary of state, changes to that language, making it longer, making it not even sound like the same thing that was originally collected. That's certainly what happened in 2024. So I think, you know, Laura Lucarelli: Approved! Allison Russo: It's important for me, first of all, to be consistent with that original language that was approved. But number two, you know, we're talking about people who are coming into a voting booth. And what we have learned is if you make things, number one, too difficult to read, because you want to make sure that the average person can understand in plain language what they are voting on. But number two, if it is too long, you actually end up creating things like longer lines to vote because people are standing there, you know, trying to read and figure it out if they haven't done their research beforehand. And we can't assume that everyone does the research on these issues beforehand, depending on what the issue is. consistent, plain language. easy to understand, relatively short that you can read in a quick period of time. And then I think most importantly, it to be unbiased and accurate. ⁓ And, know, we're ⁓ talking human beings on a ballot board, so there's going to be some bias in it. But as unbiased as possible, I think is the appropriate approach to take here. And the other thing that I will just say, is, you know, under, when Jennifer Brunner was Secretary of during ballot board meetings when ballot language was being discussed they actually actively edited in the proceeding so that it was transparent as to any of the changes that were going to be made in the discussions about how to craft the ballot language ⁓ they did in a public space that added transparency to the process. And I would like to see that restored with me as Secretary of State. You know, let's do that in front of the public, not behind closed doors that the public doesn't get to see until the last minute right before the ballot board or sometimes as was the case in 2024 with the redistricting language. Literally, they came back from a break and introduced it at the last minute. was actually sitting, I was at that ballot board when that happened. So opening up the transparency of how these decisions are made I think is incredibly important. Laura Lucarelli: ⁓ It like you definitely have ideas, different ways of maybe running the Secretary of State office and different goals than maybe ⁓ the Secretary of State. Can you walk us through what your goals would be, what changes you might see enacting? Allison Russo: Most importantly for me ⁓ in all the of the Secretary of State is to add trust transparency back to that office. ⁓ And, ⁓ you know, are lot of decisions that the Secretary of State makes, sometimes tie-breaking decisions, you know, when there's disagreement, for example, ⁓ at a board of about certifying a candidate or an issue or whatever the case may be, often it does come to the Secretary of to be that tie-breaking vote. Being transparent and why that decision made, being consistent ⁓ why that decision was made. ⁓ just one piece of this because to me the biggest threat to our elections right now is this ⁓ that is being fomented through disinformation. ⁓ part of we combat that is we add transparency to all of the processes. Whether it's how we run our elections, how decisions are made, how we operate on the ballot board, that is incredible. The thing that I would like to see and ⁓ focus and resources dedicated towards ⁓ is voter and voter engagement and outreach. ⁓ And that is to require not just resources dedicated to those efforts, ⁓ you know, how do make voting information and using technology, how do we make that convenient and accessible to all voters. But it's also about building coalitions outside of the Secretary of State's office with our schools, with our universities, with our faith communities, with nonprofit groups who work in this space to better engage Ohioans so that they Number one, have a seat at the table through their voter registration, but number two, actually have a voice at the table as well through their vote. And so we've got a lot of work to do in this space. And that is the work that really, really excites me here. And then I think third and most important is what we're talking about today is to give citizens a fair shot when they come forward with these initiatives or referendums and to stop putting our thumb on the scale because we agree don't ⁓ an issue. To me, direct democracy is about voters having the final say. Patricia Blackmon: I think that's a really good point because I want to stress that ⁓ this is a part of the Constitution that started ⁓ in during one of the ⁓ magnificent, constitutional conventions that had. And so we need to mindful that. And since we've... Allison Russo: Yes. And FDR, Roosevelt came and actually spoke at that. And he coming off of a period of time where we had major corruption in our federal government. ⁓ Patricia Blackmon: Teddy Rotten's Bell. Yes. Allison Russo: ⁓ know, government, mainly Congress, that was not working for the people. And so he came and spoke about why direct democracy was so important, because it is check. When you've got a legislature that is corrupt, that is non-responsive, ⁓ it is the check that citizens have. And not every state has this right. Ohio is unique in that, you know, we're one of a handful of states that has this right. ⁓ And it's so precious and so important and it's why I am dedicated as a legislator currently but also as the Secretary of State to ensuring that ⁓ uphold that right. Patricia Blackmon: I maybe you could delve into what you would use for purging voters from the voter roll. Allison Russo: Hmm. ⁓ ⁓ of all, let me be very clear that maintaining accurate voting rolls ⁓ is important. It's absolutely important. So we want to make sure, you know, when people move out of state, they're no longer eligible when people pass away, that we are maintaining accurate voting rules. So some amount ⁓ ⁓ know, I don't want to call it purging, but ensuring that you've got clean and accurate voting rules should happen and has happened ⁓ for Now, ⁓ In the past, what we have used something the ERIC system, ⁓ and was a multi-state coalition of secretaries of states and states coming together to basically be able to bounce your data off so that if someone, for example, moved to Pennsylvania ⁓ and there was that they had newly registered in Pennsylvania, you would know, okay, let's remove them ⁓ from Ohio's voting ⁓ Secretary of State actually took us out of that system as well as many other Republican Secretaries of states because of political attacks. on ERIC, so there there were Republicans who suddenly said, you this ⁓ a partisan data set. It's not. There was no evidence of this. And so the Secretary of State, our best tool for maintaining accurate data ⁓ he took us out essentially. So now see efforts and actually state law that recently passed that dictates that now in order to maintain these voter rolls, number one, you have to match them with things like the data set, something called the SAVE data set, which is a federal data set that, you know, supposedly indicates if someone is a citizen or not. The problem is... that we know there are a lot of errors in both of those data sets and they are not always up to date. And so you get people erroneously flagged to be quote unquote, know, purged or checked or whatever because of an error that is not actually theirs. And we have had this secretary of state and the previous secretary of state, John Husted before him, who would remove people from voting rolls simply because they did not participate in a certain number of elections. And I think that that is wrong. Someone should not be penalized and lose their voter registration just because they weren't inspired by a candidate for a couple of election cycles. Now, unfortunately, that is also dictated in state law. So the Secretary of State has to do that. But for me, a Secretary of State, again, I have to follow what is in state law. That's just the reality of the relationship between the Secretary of State as an executive position and the legislature. However, I feel very strongly I should not be going beyond the plain language of the law to do things even more that may erroneously take people and remove them from the voter rolls and I should ensure that any process that state law requires me to do that we are doing it in a way that accurately identifies folks who legitimately should be removed from the voter rolls because they've moved, they passed away, they're not eligible to vote, know, whatever the case may be. Laura Lucarelli: What are your thoughts on the Secretary of State right now being a partisan role? ⁓ People are running as Democrats, libertarians, but to your point, you have to ⁓ adjudicate for everybody in the state. So just curious your thoughts on that. Allison Russo: Yeah, well, I actually feel very strongly this shouldn't be a partisan office. And I say that, you know, when I'm talking to voters about this as well, because again, it shouldn't matter. ⁓ If you agree with a candidate or not, if you agree with an issue or not as Secretary of State, that should have absolutely no bearing on how you carry out the duties as Secretary of State. So to me, this should be a nonpartisan office. It is a partisan office, but I think that anyone who serves in this role should act in as nonpartisan of a way as possible. My commitment is as Secretary of State, I will not be endorsing ⁓ I will not be putting yard signs in my yard, you know, on issues or candidates because, ⁓ know, my job is to be a referee, not a player on the field. ⁓ you know, if you want to trust a Secretary of State to carry out fair and free and and unbiased elections, I think you have to make that commitment as someone who holds this office. Patricia Blackmon: How have you ⁓ prepared yourself for role? this is a lot different than being ⁓ in the legislature. Allison Russo: That's right. Well, feel very strongly that this is a role that requires experience ⁓ the experience that I have gained over the last eight years ⁓ working on a number of these issues around election integrity, working on things like the Ohio Redistricting Commission ⁓ constitutional resolutions, ⁓ with our elections officials as this legislation has come forward and understanding what their needs are, what their concerns are, and some of the things that they are facing, the resource constraints that they are facing, knowing how to navigate the levers power within the legislature because again, often the Secretary of State has to come before this legislature and advocate for or against things. Understanding the state budget process, because the Secretary of State is reliant on the state budget process to both fund our elections and the Secretary of State operations. That is incredibly important. You know, I think in this moment in time when I feel very strongly that our democracy is under threat, and we are seeing that every day whether it's coming from the state legislature, it's coming from the president himself, that we need a secretary of state who can go in on day one with that experience and to be able to hit the ground running because there is too much at stake, our are too important, voting is too important, and ⁓ ability people to have government that is accountable and transparent to them is just too important. Patricia Blackmon: Thank you so much. We really appreciate you today. Allison Russo: Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I appreciate both of you. It's been a great conversation.