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Red Flags in ABA · ABA Business Leaders

• speaker-0: companies coming in and specializing or trying to specialize in ABA, I think is a benefit to us all. I think there are a lot of areas where we're just not, you know, maybe hitting the mark. So I think that having expertise come in from other ⁓ areas, other fields, I think is a benefit, in my opinion. There are a lot of areas where it doesn't need to be an ABA specific standard, right? So I think that like standards are standards for a reason. I don't necessarily think asked to be a BCBA coming into this space. think if you are coming into this space for the right reasons, you have your why, right? speaker-1: Having your Y is so important. speaker-0: Welcome to ABA Business Leaders brought to you by 3PiSquared, where we discuss topics on how to create and grow an ethical and sustainable ABA practice. speaker-1: Whether you're starting, scaling, or thinking about selling your business, we're here to share insights, stories, and strategies to help you on the journey. speaker-0: We owned a successful ABA practice for over 10 years. speaker-1: And now we help other ABA business owners do the same without all the chaos. speaker-0: Stick around, you're in the right place. speaker-1: Hello everyone, welcome to our podcast. Welcome to ABA Business Leaders presented by 3Pi Squared. I'm April and this is Stephen. And today we're gonna talk about red flags, but in a different way than we've talked about them before. We have talked about red flags for certain things, but today we're gonna talk about red flags in ABA service providers. So I think those of you out in the ABA space, speaker-0: How you doing? speaker-1: ABA business owner space would agree that there's, it's become a really great market, right? For like an opportunity for others outside. speaker-0: So you're talking about like consultants or things like this is that speaker-1: Yeah. so ⁓ people, people, people coming in, people wanting to take your money. It's like, okay, well how do we know who to trust and what questions should we ask? And what are we looking for? Maybe you have a, you know, a dual, a dual ⁓ degree, right? In business, right? Or maybe you're, you're, you know, business savvy and you grew up in a family of entrepreneurs and business owners and you really have good handle on it. But I know that there are a lot of clinicians out there who who don't, right? They just want to be able to provide ABA and do it in the way that they want to within their company. And they're like learning all the business stuff as they go. speaker-0: Can I say something? You might get into this anyway, but just something to be aware of, like business associate agreements are super important. So if any of these consultants, mentors, coaches, whatever, ⁓ are going to have access or potential access to your client information, it is important that you have a business associate agreement in place with them. ⁓ And I would also recommend in one of our handbooks in the HIPAA policy is that we have a business associate agreement questionnaire. You can probably do a Google search and ask, like do a Google search for business associate questionnaire. Just ask them some questions like who's their security officer? When's the last time they've had HIPAA training? Things like this, like, because if they're answering like, don't know, to a lot of these questions. You may want to look somewhere else simply because they may not have your best interest in place. And then one other thing, ⁓ super important, I've gotten pushback from attorneys that said, I don't need a business associate agreement. We have customer, ⁓ what is it? Client, ⁓ And that's not true. The HHS is very clear on this that even attorneys need a business associate agreement in place. speaker-1: confidential. speaker-0: Just wanted to say that you may get into it, I just wanted to cover that. speaker-1: Great great advice for sure. So red flag number one. So no input or development from clinicians So if a company well, so does a company have to be clinician owned to give great value to clinician ⁓ What are some advantages to working with a clinician versus someone who's not a clinician so just in general, right? speaker-0: Yeah, I'm not a clinician. I think I add a lot of value. I don't know that it necessarily needs to be a clinician owned while I think that there is a benefit to that, but it depends on what area you need support in. So I don't think that you need to have like a financial advisor that is a BCBA. I don't think that's necessary. I certainly wouldn't look for a BCBA as an attorney either. don't think that that is necessary. ⁓ Like I don't think that my accountant needs to be a BCBA, right? So there are many areas that I don't necessarily think that you need a BCBA, but if you're starting out on a BAA practice, ⁓ I guess this is to the newer business owners and your ⁓ Maybe you feel like there's areas ⁓ that you need support in as far as clinical, then yeah, absolutely get a mentor that has that extra experience that can guide you through the clinical side of things. But I think that the vast majority of the people that you're going to need help from or eventually delegate ⁓ don't need to be a BCBA or a clinician. speaker-1: Yeah, I agree. I also feel like in some areas it's very helpful if someone's a clinician. I mean, you've worked closely with clinicians. Yes. And you are very much a part of building our company. So you learned a lot just from that about like the clinical piece. And I think if you're in, you know, something like ⁓ marketing, I don't think it's necessary. You don't have to have a BCBA. But I do think that when you're writing copy and you're like marketing, doing all the things that marketers do, I feel like it's very helpful to have a B-Spa, at least to understand and maybe even to be an RBT, know, like having some understanding of like the ethics and just the culture of what we do. But yeah, I mean, I don't think you have to, but I do think in a lot of cases it does, it does like help, but yeah, like an attorney and some of those positions that kind of almost wouldn't make sense. Now, what is nice though, if those non-clinician owned businesses that provide services to ABA businesses understand what ABA is. That's really nice. ⁓ It's not a deal breaker necessarily, but it's very nice. And I think that we are... meeting new people every day in the space who are clinicians, but they have a good understanding of ABA and what it is that we do in our field. ⁓ And it's nice not to have that 45 minute intro of, okay, let me try to explain what ABA is and how you we can incorporate and how we can help. speaker-0: Yeah, I mean, I think again, it depends, right? So let's say you need to build a website. I'm not so sure that ⁓ that needs to be like, you're going to get a developer, right? For something like that. Same with ⁓ an attorney. I'm not certain that they need to have ABA experience while it can be helpful. ⁓ The problem is, ⁓ it's kind of very similar to HIPAA. You need something to be HIPAA compliant. It's going to... drastically increase the price, right, of the service. So with an attorney, you're looking for someone with ABA experience that is going to drastically increase the price. could, yeah. Because of, it does. speaker-1: And just to be clear, I'm agreeing with you that you can work with non-clinical. But then there are some that are really nice to work with, like our BCBA. speaker-0: No, I-I-I-I- So like with an attorney, you're probably like what I recommend because it's going to be very rare to find ⁓ an attorney that's going to have ABA experience that's hard to find. So normally when you're looking for like an employment attorney, I do recommend that you try to find someone that has some kind of home healthcare experience simply because they'll kind of understand a little bit of how it works. Because a lot of employment attorneys in some states, just for... They're saying, oh, okay, this is a nine to five office job, right? And they just don't understand the nuances and the rules that you need to follow. So in that situation, like margin keepers, I don't know if this is to be an ad, but margin keepers, they understand ABA, right? That's super helpful when you're in that space. Megan was an RBT. She's got like a... certification in OBM. she understands this and I do believe that that is a benefit when it comes to a biller. Not only does she have a lot of experience in ABA billing, but she understands ABA. think that that does matter. Our marketing person, he does understand ABA. We've talked about this, but one of my biggest pet peeves with the 15 marketing people that we've tried over the years is they would say, ⁓ ⁓ like they would use it, ABAs. You're looking for ABAs. No, I'm looking for ABA companies. I'm looking for ABA practices, right? Just things like that, that someone in this space wouldn't set, right? ⁓ It's going to really cause issues when you're trying to market your stuff. So yes, I do think that having some ⁓ experience in the field will be a benefit. ⁓ It's not, ⁓ like you said, it's not a deal breaker in some cases. speaker-1: Red flag number two. a lot of people come into this space, some to start the ABA company, some to provide services to the ABA company, ⁓ because they don't understand it. They don't understand like the overhead in ABA and they just see dollar signs. They see reimbursement rates and they see dollar signs. And so they assume that ABA business owners have a lot of cash. Yeah. Or, know, as Some people come into it as an ABA business and are thinking that it's going to be a big moneymaker for them, right? So how much is too much to pay for these services? Would you rather pay a company 3K to run HR or hire your own HR person for 5K a month? Or, you know, how should you prioritize doing it yourself within your own company versus hiring contractors? speaker-0: Yeah, I mean, like when I, it's gonna depend, right? And so I can't give you a really good answer on this, maybe, maybe I can, I'll try my best. But it's going to depend on the gaps that you have within your expertise and the people that are supporting you, right? So like in our case, I had some policy understanding because of my background. speaker-1: process engineering. So you can pretty much turn anything into a process if you understood what it was that needed to be done. speaker-0: And so like reading that legalese stuff while I'm not an attorney wasn't that complicated for me and I could manage that kind of stuff, right? Like I learned how to build a website, right? So like maybe I didn't need a developer right off the bat, right? And so what normally happens in these situations? I guess the best thing, example I could provide is ⁓ it's very similar to the insurances that you purchase. So maybe at the start, you only need the simple insurances, right? Professional liability, workers' comp, general liability, stuff like this, right? ⁓ But as you grow, you're going to have more risk. And so then you're gonna be like, maybe I should get an umbrella policy, maybe I should get cyber insurance, you should probably get cyber insurance, sorry, Maybe I should get, there's different types of insurance that will protect different areas of your company. And so, and then maybe you're wanting to go with a different insurance provider because it covers more areas or there's more, they will cover more expenses, right? And so you're going to get different insurances at different levels. And when you're just out by yourself, maybe you're just getting cheap insurance, right, to cover the basics, but as you grow, you you got 3 million in revenue, then you're going to add different insurances. And I think that and consultants is very similar. Can you get away with simple HIPAA security stuff at the start? Probably, right? But then when you have a larger team, 20, 30 employees, you may want to have some on-call support that can set up your devices that can keep up with all the latest issues that are going on in HIPAA because you have more risk, right? Does that make sense? Same with an HR person, right? I don't know that I would spend 5K on an HR person when I have two employees, right? I would be going with Legal Shield, right? And that would be, but if I have 50 employees and it's like, man, Legal Shield isn't covering me enough, I need that ongoing support. I don't wanna handle this anymore. Then yeah, I think an HR person ⁓ may be the right step. But to say, this is an acceptable price. I don't know that I could give you an acceptable price, right? Because it depends on the area that you're in. You're probably going to find a cheaper HR person in Alabama than you would in San Francisco. speaker-1: It really boils down to that delegating piece that we talk about too, Yeah. Also understanding your budget, understanding how much money you have coming in and how much you can afford to go out. But just because someone's offering something like at a super high rate, like doesn't necessarily mean that it's a great service or a great thing. speaker-0: No, I mean, I think you would look at the reviews, right? You would ask to see, hey, can I talk to some of your customers out there? Right? I think that when you're spending this amount of money on something, you want to make sure that it's you're going to get what you're asking for. So that's important to know that you're working with trusted people. ⁓ I don't know. I mean, it's going to depend on. Also the personality of the person, Like ⁓ I'll often get the question, what question should I ask to an attorney or an accountant? And for me, it's not so much what question should I ask, it's like just ask them something, right? And see what their response is. And if you get the feeling that you're wasting their time. Right? They're not really answering your questions or it feels like you're an inconvenience that you're even asking a question. It's probably not the right person for you. speaker-1: Great, red slide number three. So what about a service that they're providing services for multiple different industries and they're just getting into ABA? Maybe they already work with OT or speech or a clinical psychologist or maybe home health care in general and they're just getting into ABA. ⁓ Should a company only focus on ABA to be good? What good questions can you ask to make sure that the company really understands ABA and isn't just putting it into a basket with like PT, OT, speech kind of things. speaker-0: Yeah, I mean the biggest one that I could I guess the one that that comes to mind more often and this is billing. All right, so we when we were trying to do our billing course, we interviewed a bunch of ADA billers, right? And then we started talking about ADA billing and it was quite obvious that they did not understand ADA billing. They couldn't even Provide us like what are the codes right? So these are questions that I would certainly be asking and again like They have to it's gonna depend right because again an attorney is gonna be different than a biller. I would not Just say hey Yeah, you did OT billing great. I'm sure ABA is just as good. You're just as good at ABA That that's different where an attorney maybe it's not that big of a deal and then you know back and forth on marketing, we've had so many marketing people that are experts and amazing and they've done so much amazing marketing. And then it just doesn't work out because they just don't know this space. So I think I wish that I could give a better answer to them, but it's going to depend, right? It just depends. And I think when you're hiring someone like a biller, for example, they better give you some really discounted rates. ⁓ ⁓ not knowing the space and They certainly shouldn't lock you into a long-term contract if they have zero experience in ABA That would be I don't know does that speaker-1: Yeah, mean, ABA is very specific and ⁓ there's a lot of those strange quirks ⁓ that are very specific to ABA. so ⁓ it doesn't mean that a provider coming into this space doesn't know like you shouldn't necessarily, it doesn't necessarily mean you shouldn't work with them. Like if they're willing to learn, if they're putting the work in and they're, know, as you're talking to them, it's obvious that they are understanding a bit about ABA and how things work. But yeah, like you said, like I wouldn't come in with a newbie into the field, coming into the field and, know, sign long-term contracts or pay them a lot of money. Then it kind of comes down to the personality too. If it's a smaller business and you strike up a working relationship and they see it as an opportunity to learn from you about how ABA could work with whatever. service that they're helping you with and help, but also know that that's probably going to take more of your time than say if you just hired somebody who was already in the field and understood the fields. speaker-0: Yeah, again, I think it's gonna, it does depend a little bit, right? speaker-1: definitely something to be on the lookout for because ABA is very specific. speaker-0: And it is really nice and this is something again that I do recommend and when we vet people we do try to look for people that have experience in ABA ⁓ but ⁓ like okay you say especially if they claim they're an expert in ABA or they have many ABA customers then I want to talk to some of those ABA customers right I want to be able to ask them specific questions I think that that's important because if they claim they have a whole bunch of ABA customers and it turns out they've got one that may not really, I guess, you speaker-1: then you have other issues, perhaps trust issues with what can you believe. Yes. You know, so yeah. speaker-0: Like I'll just say like maybe a speech clinician with tons of like a lot of experience. Maybe they could come in and help you. You know, in some cases, ⁓ because we have had marketing people that have come in, we have one that we still work with. And he does provide a lot of insight and it does help almost that he doesn't have that AVA experience because ⁓ you know, speaker-1: And have a fresh perspective on some of the things that we feel like are ⁓ that's just an avi problem and he's like actually This is something you're gonna see across the board when you're dealing with this issue or whatever, right? And so it kind of helps but if he we've worked with him for Years now we have that relationship and we're able to hop on a call and we'll talk through an issue and no problem, right? ⁓ But out of the dozens that we've talked to we've had to yes that we've had we have like our person now is BCBA we have the you know the guy that we just explained so you know nothing's black and white right it's just really our conversation today is just to help get everyone thinking right and just start with thinking and what questions should I ask what should I be looking for what I need to you know I call it your spidey senses right like when your spidey senses start going off we trust your spidey speaker-0: And like, I would also reach out to Score. I think that that's a great option where you can get like a business mentor and like, again, very similar to insurance. Maybe they get you, you know, 60 % of the way, right? And then you have to specialize at some point, but it may also provide you an out of the box view of this. may You may find out that you have some blinders that you didn't even know were blinders because you're stuck in the ABA world, right? And so maybe your outreach to two parents is too clinical and you need a little different marketing, right? And so they may suggest something that you weren't thinking about, right? So I don't want to say that it has to be ABA all the time. I think getting different opinions from many people is always a good thing, ⁓ right? speaker-1: For sure. All right, slide number four, no referrals or no referrals from businesses that look like you. So referrals are crucial. Like they are super important and knowing how a company will treat you. Yes. So also though, if you ask for someone to like for referrals, like to be able to reach out to other people using their services and they send you to like multi-state organizations or, you know, but you're like a small shop then. maybe that's not a good match or vice versa. You just have to kind of see who has the referrals, what they say, what types of businesses they are ⁓ to look for. So would you rather go with an ABA specific startup with no reviews or an established business with reviews, but from other fields like home healthcare? speaker-0: That's a difficult question to ask. I would have to interview them. I would just have to be able to see how they respond. if like, because, you know, we've talked about this about hiring too, right? Should I hire an RVT or should I hire just someone with no experience? And the vast majority of the time, I would pick ⁓ someone with no experience. where they had a willingness to learn and they were genuine and honest, right? So if this person comes in and says, hey, I don't have any experience, but I do this thing and I have done this thing, let's work together. And they were able to give me a contract that was like, you know, beneficial to both of us, then yeah, sure, let's try it and see, right? But yeah, it may not be the right fit, but you would want to be able to eject, right, without... being stuck with some long term, you you have to sign for a year. That's not cool. ⁓ So yeah, yeah, I guess it's going to depend. speaker-1: Red flag number five, they sell hard and have unbreakable unbreakable contracts. You just already, you know, said that feeling different depending on the market, right? Depending on, you know, they may have contracts with no opting out or you have to pay high fees if you opt out, things like that. So how long is too long to be locked into a contract? Do you always ask for opt outs or are you willing to commit to one year or more to save money? speaker-0: I mean, like, so I'm thinking about our ADA business leader membership. That is a year. It's a 12 month membership. I think that for something like building your business, like we follow you through getting your in network contracts, right? And so I think that that has to take a year, right? To go through all of that. So I'm like, I'm fine with selling that as a year or 12 month membership, right? Like, and so we do not offer a one month membership. ⁓ So there are certain things that you're probably going to have to pay for a year, right? Many of the subscriptions that we have, you know, for our ⁓ websites and stuff like this, you're, you can get maybe a monthly fee, ⁓ but it's going to cost a lot more. So if I know I'm going to use it, I might as well get the year fee. I would say that some practice managements are probably going to be like this. ⁓ So again, I wish that I could give you a better answer, but it's going to depend, right? And I think if they are gonna lock you into a year, it's what do I do if I don't like this? Do I get a refund, right? Like for practice management, especially if I'm paying $1,000 a month or maybe even more, and I don't like the way this works, do I have to continue paying you? ⁓ to and then also have to pay somebody else. But then you also think about like, and I know that this isn't really a contractor or anything, but a lease on a building. I mean, you're stuck, right? Like you're probably gonna have to sign a two year lease. speaker-1: for businesses, the minimum is like three and even still sometimes it's hard to get a three year lease and at least that's how it was in Northern Virginia. speaker-0: And then with attorneys, a lot of them require a retainer, right? And so that's just the way it is. And ⁓ then HIPAA consultants, mean, a lot of them do require ⁓ a year kind of contract that you can go, but some do month to month. So I guess, again, it's going to depend on how much value they have. But if they do come with high, really good ratings, you've heard from others that this is really good in the ABA space. then I'm not opposed to signing a year or two contract. speaker-1: I feel like it's definitely worth asking, what if I what if I'm not happy with this? mean, some things are just like the business, the members, the business leaders membership. then like, I'm also thinking things like marketing or things like, ⁓ I can't think of it. But like, if you need more than a month to really show, get anywhere, right. And so you might the person contracting with you. I know we've done this with some people that we've worked for, with contractors that we brought in to help Three Pi Squared Two. It's like, okay, ⁓ we need some kind of time commitment to know that we can work with each other to work through the issues. And we also need to know that if this isn't working for either, then we do have an exit plan, right? With minimal, you know, minimal. money or minimal like hardship or whatever, right? So it is, it is like more conversation. speaker-0: Yeah, I guess it also depends like how big of promises they're asking for too, right? or I'm sorry, how like, what are the promises that they're they're saying? Are these like, crazy lofty promises? That that's just something speaker-1: In my experience, though, I feel like other than like things like memberships and practice management software, stuff like that, they just kind of make sense. It's typical to have like contracts like year long contracts, like, or like phone services and things. mean, some stuff that that's just how that industry is. But I do feel like other especially small companies who are trying to get into the ABA field as service providers and wanting to help ABA providers then like The willingness to work together I think is a big deal and that's what we are finding now most small companies who are coming into this earth to this To this area right to this on this field Most are willing to work together and I see feeling that also shows their understanding of ABA as a culture and like sir, you know, like what we do right is to write Okay, so those are five red flags that we went through but I do have a few more questions for you and ⁓ So, are there specific questions in general that you should ask? I know we went through some questions through these flags, but are there certain questions that we didn't cover today that you want to make sure that we can talk about when they are interviewing service providers? speaker-0: Yeah, like I said, especially when you're dealing with PHI, the vendor or the person you're working with should provide you a business associate agreement. Because again, if they're not providing you a business associate agreement, then that to me is a red flag. Because if you're dealing with like a security officer, it doesn't give you a business associate agreement, there's a problem. Right? If you're working with a biller and they don't give you a business associate agreement, then what are they doing? Right? They should have a template to provide you. You should not have to provide them a template. So, and then like I said, there are certain questions around that that I would be asking, right? Like who is your security officer? What do you do in case of a breach? You know, things like that I think are really important. And then on the attorney side of things, I do like to ask questions around, do you have any experience with ABI? And if they answer, which more than likely is going to be no, I don't even know what ABA is, then we're asking questions around, especially if you're working in home, obviously. But do you have any in-home healthcare ⁓ experience, respite care, early intervention, know, things like that ⁓ is probably, even if they have like education, like school experience, that could be helpful. At least they're going to understand a little bit about you, which can be helpful. But again, you may not Um, may not be able to find that, I would like another situation with an attorney, especially like this happens all the time and it's really difficult. Um, is like, do I need a PLLC, uh, to be an ABA provider in the state or do I need an LLC? Uh, or do I need something else? Right? Like I went through this, I don't know, four or five months ago in Texas, and I went to the. the Texas government, again, I try emailing back and forth, but do they need a PLLC? Because it kind of looks like they do. And they're like, I don't know, right? And so like this is, it's wild that the government can't tell you if you need a certain business structure. And then the same with California. Some people are claiming that you cannot have an LLC as a BCBA. yet the BCBA is not licensed in California, so therefore you should be able to. And I'm getting a variety of opinions from ABA business owners and attorneys and accountants in this space. So having someone with that experience ⁓ can be beneficial, right? So I don't know, what questions can you ask? ⁓ speaker-1: think you covered it. mean, think too, like just when you're asking these questions, you already said it is like, how do they respond? Like, how was their tone when they were responding? You know, are they, they seem to be willing to discuss these things and work with you or not? And depending on what the services that you're contracting or purchasing or whatever, will depend on like what level of that that you need, right? speaker-0: I would also say trust your gut. I think that there's more value in that than a lot of people where, as an engineer, ⁓ my thing is information data, what do the numbers say? And I would assume that a lot of BCDAs are probably that way too. All the reviews are good. All these people said they were good. So therefore they're good. That may not necessarily be true. And, there are probably some people out there, I can't imagine any, but that probably wouldn't want to work with me, right? I think I'm awesome, but they may be like, yeah, we just don't mesh, right? Like this just isn't the person I need somebody ⁓ else that can do this, right? So there are many people out there that are doing amazing work in this space. And it's really important that you find the person that you can work with, right? And again, that you get what you need. I think that that... is the probably the most important thing is if they are not providing a value to you, then you should not be using them, right? No matter what the reviews are, ⁓ like if they're not giving you what you expect or giving you what was agreed upon, then we need to stop. speaker-1: Yeah, I agree because you part of you want to enjoy work, right? And you know opening and building and know an ABA business building anything is hard, right? And challenging and so like the more people that you can surround yourself with that you enjoy and you get along with doesn't necessarily mean that you're gonna like you would be friends with them outside of work but on a working relationship you you you get along with each other then that just makes your life a little bit nicer. Okay, so now for 3Pi Squared, we also work with other ⁓ services, right? We contract with other professionals ⁓ as we work together, as we help provide information. ⁓ For you guys listening, you know, if there's something that we don't know, we're reaching out to find who does know it. And so we go through similar processes to this. As we are looking at who do we want to back or who do we want to bring in to our teams or, you know, to, you know, have affiliates with or whatever. Right. Like, so I don't know if, if they're from that angle, if they're, if there are any pieces that you wanted to, to mention or talk about. speaker-0: Yeah, I mean, yeah, so like we do try our best to vet the people that we work with and what, know, again, a benefit that we provide is that we have a lot of customers. So we have 1200 ABA, it's probably more than that. It's probably getting closer to 1300 at this point, ABA companies that we work with. So in this space, we... when we are working with other ABA, I don't know, vendors, I guess. A lot of the time is we, one of their customers is more than likely one of our customers, right? So we can get that feedback and get some real time testimonials without having to do too much. And we, speaker-1: Yeah, ⁓ speaker-0: We, you know, our customers are always recommending services for us to try or, you know, companies for us to try. that's, that's, that's what we do in this space, right? Is to help find some trusted companies that you can partner with. So, you know, again, Matt, Megan, Cam and JJ is another awesome. person in this space, So yeah, margin keepers, right? Like so they're like, you know, and so some of these happen to be our sponsors, but we still do the same thing for our sponsors. We want to make sure that we are affiliated with and we're recommending services that are good service. speaker-1: Right, people that we would use if we were And so that we use as being consulted for ABA businesses. Yeah. All right. Well, hopefully this conversation was helpful for you guys. Hopefully, at least like, like I said, like that kind of the idea behind this is to get you thinking as you know, there are more and more of these conversations online and yeah, just to just kind of help get you thinking what questions to ask, what you know, what you're looking for and you know, and just trusting yourself and Reaching out, collaborating, right? Reaching out to other BCBA business owners and getting their opinions on things. you know, the more that we all work together, you know, more we these things, better, right? speaker-0: I think for the most part, these companies coming in and specializing or trying to specialize in ABA, I think is a benefit to us all. think that there are a lot of areas where we're just not ⁓ maybe hitting the mark. And so I think that having expertise come in from other ⁓ areas, other fields, I think is a benefit. I think it would be great for some ISO guys to come in and try to get into the space where, these are standards that these standards are already built, right? There are healthcare standards in ISO. I think that someone like that could be a benefit to this field simply because it doesn't have to, in my opinion, there are a lot of areas where it doesn't need to be an ABA specific standard, right? So I think that like, standards are standards for a reason. And I think that they can, they can be done in that way. And I think, you know, Jennifer Fitzpatrick is a great resource, right? In that case where she came from the, like the hospital system and she's, I mean, she wrote it, she wrote the book on session notes, right? I think that she has a lot of value to add to this space. So I don't necessarily think it has to be a BCBA coming into this space. I think if you, are coming into this space for the right reasons. You have your why, right? I think you. speaker-1: Having your Y is so important. And it's so funny because what I was going to say just now as we ended is, so if those of you listening, what you know, want to branch out and start working more with ABA companies, reach out to us. But then I was like, who's going to be listening to this podcast unless they're already an ABA person? So if you know of any Y, hey, send them our way. We love to collaborate and, you know, brainstorm ideas. So I think that's enough for today. ⁓ everyone for joining and can't wait to see what we have to talk about next time. speaker-0: Oh, and hey, if you're listening to this and you haven't left a review on our podcast, I'd really appreciate it if you leave a review. Yeah, that'd be. speaker-1: That would be awesome. That would be That would be helpful. Thank you. All right. Have a great one, everyone. Bye. Thanks for joining us on ABA Business Leaders. speaker-0: We provide mentorship, courses, handbooks, billing support, credentialing, HIPAA support, web design, and more. Everything you need to build an ethical and sustainable ABA practice. speaker-1: You can find all of our resources at 3pi2.com. speaker-0: Don't forget to subscribe and share this podcast with other ABA business owners. speaker-1: We'll see you next time and remember you don't have to build your practice alone.