Latest / In These Times with Rabbi Ammi Hirsch / Jonathan Greenblatt

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Jonathan Greenblatt · In These Times with Rabbi Ammi Hirsch

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I am Rabbi Ammi Hirsch of the Stephen Wise Free Synagogue in New York, and
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you're listening to In These Times.
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Three years ago, ADL CEO Jonathan Greenblatt joined me on this podcast
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and offered one of the most memorable descriptions of contemporary
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antisemitism I've ever heard.
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He said that the hatred coming from the far right is like a
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hurricane, sudden violent and deadly.
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While the antisemitism of the far left is like climate change slowly raising
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the temperature until the environment becomes inhospitable for Jewish life.
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That was before October 7th.
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Since then, the weather has only gotten worse and the climate changed
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faster than anyone could have imagined.
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I asked Jonathan to join me again last week to exAmmine the forces
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reshaping American Jewish life and to help us understand what it will take
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to keep this country safe for Jews.
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Jonathan Greenblatt, welcome back to In These Times.
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Thank you, Ammi.
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It's a pleasure to be here.
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You know, I've told you many times, I, uh, so admire your work and your character.
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Like Jim may.
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Just ask you before we get into all of these questions of, uh,
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antisemitism, uh, just how are you doing?
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How, how are you holding up?
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How are you doing?
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It's a nice question.
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I mean, look, I, I will say right off the bat for your
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listeners, the feeling is mutual.
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Like, I think,
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you know, for a thousand, 2000, 3000 years, in many ways, the synagogue, the
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temple, or the shoul has been our kind of organizing construct as a community.
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I think so often we have leaders at the pulpit who, you know,
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they follow, they read Torah and they help us make sense of it.
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What I appreciate about you is you help us make sense of Torah in light of the world,
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and that has led you to take some bold positions and demonstrate courage on me.
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And I think courage seems to be in short supply these days, so I
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appreciate you and your character and so that's a way for me to get to, I
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think this moment is a difficult one.
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You know, I think we as Jewish people sometimes I feel like we're frogs
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in the boiling water and we lose sight of the fact that what we are
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experiencing right now is not normal.
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And yet we've seen kind of some of the worst behaviors be normalized.
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So on a day-to-day basis, I'm perfectly fine.
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And in fact I have never been more energized.
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I have never been more, uh, animated.
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I have never been more committed to the work.
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And yet at the same time I would acknowledge this is very difficult stuff.
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I mean, we are facing cross currents, the likes of which we read about in
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history books, and now it's here and now.
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And so I don't think, I mean, I think we need to keep in
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perspective that this is not normal.
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And you know, I'm reminded of it all the time, Ammi, because of my job, I talked,
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you know, you have your congregates, I have my constituents, if you will.
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They're all part of our community.
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They're all part of like Klal Yisrael.
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And I hear from people who say to me, this happened to my child on a college campus.
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This happened to my elderly mother at the grocery store.
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This happened to me at the office.
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And you know, I, it, it, my heart breaks every time.
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I hear those stories every single time.
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They never get any easier.
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Never
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you say, uh, you, you, you're as energized as ever.
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Maybe even more because the challenges are more significant and good
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people always rise to the challenge.
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You just round the clock out of a sense of responsibility and a care
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and concern for the Jewish community.
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Uh, and I think it's important for the Jewish community to know that
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whether or not, you know, they agree with every particular decision that
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we make as, uh, heads of institutions, the most important point and what's
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especially noticeable in you is just, first of all, your capacity to work
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your energy and everything about you is about concern for the Jewish community.
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And it's something I deeply respect because for me, it's not simply the
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Jewish community, it's the people of Israel, the Jewish people.
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And that's what.
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That's what I'm doing.
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And you're doing, and you're doing it in a magnificent way,
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and I'm just very grateful to you.
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Well, it's very, it's very kind.
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I appreciate that.
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I don't know that I deserve it, but I appreciate it.
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What, what I'll say is that, like, you know, in the, a DL was founded in 1913,
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we were founded in a time of Jewish vulnerability, of Jewish weakness.
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When Leo Frank was lynched, that was in an environment where Jews were
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routinely discriminated against.
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They couldn't get healthcare at many institutions.
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They couldn't, or medical treatment broadly.
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They couldn't work in many professions.
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They couldn't live in many places.
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They couldn't attend, many universities couldn't get accepted at many kind
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of social kind of organizations.
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And in that environment, a DL was founded.
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So we were founded with this mission statement to fight
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antisemitism in all forms of hate.
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And it's, it's driven us, it again, it's been this animating kind of purpose
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for overall a hundred years, but, but.
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The reason why we have this purpose, the why our core purpose has never changed.
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Our core purpose is really, really simple.
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It is to protect the Jewish people.
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And so I don't care whether you're secular or observe it.
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I don't care whether you vote Republican or Democrat.
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I don't care whether you keep kosher or you don't know what that even means.
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I don't care if you live in, you know, the Upper East Side or like lower
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Patagonia or the Middle East or wherever.
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My job, our job at a DL is, is unswerving.
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By the time I wake up in the morning, the time I put my head on the pillow at night,
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the only thing that's driving me is that core purpose protect the Jewish people.
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That's it.
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And that's, uh, noticeable.
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One more question before we actually get to what's going on in the country.
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And you're, you're our expert.
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Um, I find it personally, I find it much more difficult now.
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I've been, uh, in synagogue life for 21 years and I've been in
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Jewish life for over 35 years.
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Just find it much more difficult now to oversee, to govern, to lead a Jewish
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institution that defines itself as broad based as, you know, consensual
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because the American population is so polarized and that's polarizing
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the Jewish community as well.
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And of course, you know, on a, on a broad perspective, what is more
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consensus in the Jewish community than combating antisemitism?
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Right?
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So do you, do you find it more difficult now than say, 10 years ago?
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Uh, when, when you started, and do you agree that it's harder now to oversee
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a broad-based Jewish organization?
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Look,
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I mean, I think.
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We could spend all the time talking about this.
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So, and I really respect what you do and what congregational, rabbis and
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clergy broadly have to do because it has never been more difficult.
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So let's acknowledge that number one, like our world is now
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mediated through phones, right?
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So the way that your congregation gets their information, it's
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no longer through the evening news or even the New York Times.
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It's through the algorithms that are individually and, and
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singularly generated for them.
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So again, a mother and a father, and the three children living in the same house,
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if five different streams of information.
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So the lack of a shared narrative is very difficult, really difficult.
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And again, these, these kind of systems, they segment us and they
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micro-target us, and by their very nature, they are dividing us.
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Number two, let's recognize that we live in a time.
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Where there is a broad sense, again, I would say enabled by and
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facilitated by social media where, uh, systems seem to be failing.
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Distrust in cynicism has never been higher.
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Distrust of the media, distrust of the government, distrust of the congress,
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distrust of the law enforcement, distrust of the military, distrust
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of medicine, distrust of science, distrust of, uh, institutions generally.
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So in a moment where systems are failing and where people aren't seeing the
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outcomes that they expect or would hope for, that creates a kinda space that
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populists exploit and populists thrive on.
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Scapegoating.
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They thrive in saying it's, the system is failing, but it's so, it's not your fault,
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it's their fault they did this to you.
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And so I think a lot of that manifests in what I'll call soft ways.
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As you see, like the world get, or like America get parsed into red
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versus blue, you know, it's them.
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It's them.
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And that's kind of soft.
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And as much as it's not personalized, but then it gets personalized, right?
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And it's the Jew who did that, or so andSo specifically who did
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that, which is really dangerous.
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And unfortunately this, this disease has infected so many
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aspects of public life, including like our, our, our sacred spaces.
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By the way, I hear this from ministers and reverends in different churches, right?
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I don't think it's unique to us, but again, we as Jews were the
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people of debate and descent.
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Our tradition encourages not just critical thinking, but a kind of
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like arguing impassioned argument, which works until in the environment
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we're talking about things become so explosive and that's never been harder.
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I mean, if you don't have a shared narrative and systems are failing.
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People are scapegoating.
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It puts a real target on the backs of individuals like you who're
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trying to hold it all together.
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Now here's what I think is so interesting.
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Ammi is like, I don't think as Jews we should expect, or we even need
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unanimity, but we need unity, right?
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Like consensus.
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I don't have a consensus with my wife on things.
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We disagree all the time.
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We don't need consensus, but we need that community.
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So how do we again, encourage unity, build community in an environment where
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all the forces are pulling us apart?
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That is not easy.
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I'm exposed to it differently than you are.
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I mean, I'm kind of downstream to it, like dealing with, uh, what it generates,
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the, the, the gon that it creates.
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You're kind of upstream trying to hold that community together
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before it fragments further.
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And that's, that's a tough assignment.
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What it is, it's um, I feel it's getting.
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Tougher as, uh, the environment in, in America itself becomes more intense.
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Mm-hmm.
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And it's, it's like people see their intellectual opponents or even their
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political opponents, uh, not, not so much as opponents anymore, but as enemies.
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You know that, that yeah.
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In your very existence as you know it.
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And, and, and if I might say something about that, one thing that I have
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seen happen in the Jewish community, which I find so painful and so
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poisonous, is when we, instead of like, look, I have a general rule.
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Okay?
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Let's say two rules.
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Number one, I will work with, engage, with dialogue with anyone.
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I don't, I don't, I don't parse, again, by politics, if you will.
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My only red line is if you dehumanize others, then I'm not gonna humanize
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you or dignify you with my time.
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So if you dehumanize gay people.
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I have no, I have no space for you if you dehumanize black people,
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I have no, no patience for you if you dehumanize Zionists, no
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patience, no, not gonna talk to you.
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But everyone else I think is in play.
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Everyone else I think is in play.
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So that's important for me as a standard.
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But the other standard is when I disagree with in the lines of
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like, again, what our community is.
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I believe you call people in before you call them out, but we've seen so many
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Jewish leaders, I've seen it, I've been, I've experienced it firsthand where
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they disagree with something we've done.
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And so they prefer to flame me on Facebook rather than picking up
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the phone and calling and saying, Hey, what was going on there?
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Like, why did you do that?
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Or there certain groups whose names they won't mention, they fundraise
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against us and, and, and make up crazy claims about things we're
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doing are saying they're not true.
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So I think again, we need unity, if not unanimity.
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And we ha as a people, all of us.
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From the people in the pews to those at the pulpits, to those at positions like
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mine, have to find ways to continually try to bring us together and resist.
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'cause like when, when, when the broader world engages in these polemics, right?
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I think it's also very destructive, but we as a Jewish people, we are so
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small and our, our place is so fragile, we cannot afford these divisions.
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I just think the stakes are so much higher and, uh, the margin
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for error is so much smaller.
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So I, I hope I, I I, I, I pray that we get this right.
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You know, I'm glad you mentioned, uh, our minority status because something
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fundamental has changed in America.
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I think, uh, with respect to what Jews assumed, uh, life is like in
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the United States, in the way that American society would relate to
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Jews in a kind of exceptional way, in the context of, uh, ancient as well
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as, uh, contemporary Jewish history.
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And, you know, I, I think that it's just.
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Much harder now for American Jews to really understand that
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we always were a minority.
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Mm-hmm.
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We are a small minority.
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This is one of the things that October 7th, I think brought
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out vividly for every one of us.
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There are at least a thousand of them online and in all other places.
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Yeah.
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And you know, I think there was something sobering about the last couple of years,
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especially since October 7th, that emphasized to American Jews, again,
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despite all of the many accomplishments and the sincere acceptance on the part
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of the United States and our reciprocal approach towards American society.
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At the end of the day, we're a small minority.
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A hundred percent.
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I mean, look, let's put the, let's put me not Israel aside.
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Let's put the state of Israel aside for the Jewish people since the
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enslavement and expulsion by the Romans.
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Uh, I believe that this country.
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United States of America has been indisputably the best
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home for us in our diaspora.
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In our exile.
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We have never lived with the freedoms and the privileges, and Amer never
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lived in a country with the kind of corrective capacity that this one had.
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Correct?
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Like I was saying at the top, I mean, when ADL was founded, Jews couldn't
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get medical treatment in many places.
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Now we can wherever we want.
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Now, Jewish doctors are some of the most respected in the profession.
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We couldn't work in many professions.
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Right now.
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Law firms originally founded by Jews or banks, we founded by Jews are incredibly
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successful tech companies founded by Jews.
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Incredibly successful.
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We couldn't attend many universities either we were kept out entirely,
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or quotas kept them out.
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Now, Jews are the tops of their class, of all these institutions
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and so on and so forth.
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America has been so good to so many people, including the Jewish people.
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But we are foolish to think that anything lasts forever unless
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we're willing to fight for it.
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I think many of us who've grown up in this place, um, have
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become so accustomed to it.
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We forget that indeed we are a very small minority.
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Roughly 40% of Americans have never even met a Jewish person army.
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So if you live, like in New York City, if you live in Manhattan, one of the five
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boroughs or Long Island or Westchester County, you can't imagine that.
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But the reality is almost half of all people in the United States
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of America never met a Jew.
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And the reality is, despite our concentration in this place,
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we're less than two and a half percent of the overall population.
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So the data tells us, if you just look at the data, and ADL is a very data-driven,
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you know, uh, evidence-based organization.
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The data tells us that we punch above our way and we can't
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afford to take this for granted.
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So aid, you know, that old lotto commercial gotta be in it to win it, like.
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I mean, I actually think America is a contact sport and
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we're coming up on a 250th.
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America is a contact sport and every Jewish person, man, woman, or child, uh,
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young, old, gay, straight, right, left, observant, secular, however you choose
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to identify, you gotta be on the field.
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There's no, you know, watching from the bleachers and assuming
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everything's gonna work out.
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And if your team loses, they'll come back next tomorrow or next week or next season.
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Like we as the Jewish people need to recognize that again, our position
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is strong, and yet it's also simultaneously precarious, fragile.
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We better be willing to roll up our sleeves and get on
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the field and play the game.
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Yeah.
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Last time, uh, we spoke, which was, uh, I think, uh, two or three
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years ago, uh, you had this great, uh, analogy that you said, uh.
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Right wing antisemitism is like a hurricane and left wing
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antisemitism is like climate change.
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They're both dangerous, but one kind of blasts in on you and one creeps up on you.
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Um, so we've, it's pretty stormy out there, both from the right and from the
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left now since we spoke a few years ago.
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Yeah.
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Help us understand what's going
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on in the right.
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So there, there are a bunch of sort of macro trends, right?
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I think one of the macro trends that's shaping public discourse
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today is what I'll characterize as sort of anti-elitism, okay?
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It's a kind of populism that manifests that, that predicates on identifying
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who's to blame and who's to blame.
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Are the elites and Jews historically and present in present context are
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seen, often seen as the elites.
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Now sometimes we're, you know, seen as the impoverished masses and we're
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bad because we're criminals or we're.
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Poor or whatever.
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We're seen that way unfairly, but we're also sometimes seen as the elites.
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And so I think there is a kind of populism that has swept the country,
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and it's specifically with respect to the right, the, like, the extreme right,
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the antisemitism has always been there.
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And the antisemitism of the far right, it's rooted in like uniquely American
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strains of bigotry, like nativism or isolationism or white supremacy.
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Now, these may show up in other contexts, but there's a, there's
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an, there's a kind of an almost, again, unique American strain of,
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uh, bigotry rooted in these things.
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So those are like cords of a rope that are wound together, and that
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rope is American antisemitism.
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Again, there's a nativism, there's an isolationism and there's a
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kind of white supremacy in that.
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I think it's been there for a long time and I think the 2016 election.
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Really kind of took, you know, allowed that to come into the
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mainstream, allowed that to emerge from the shadows right here and now.
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And so from everything from Charlottesville to Pittsburgh, the year
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later, 2018, to Powerway in 2019 to the people Ram age Ram pages through the
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capitol with these, you know, six, six MWE sweatshirts, 6 million wasn't enough
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to, uh, Nick Fuentes and Tucker Carlson.
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I mean, Tucker Carlson has been bad for years.
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We've been calling him out at a DL for years.
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But now that he's like, again, in this podcast enabled world where there
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are no more guardrails, he can show up as his true self platforming Nick
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Fuentes, and even before Nick Fuentes, he's been having Holocaust deniers.
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He's been having anti-Israel voices, he's been having despicable pseudo
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historians on his show for a long, long time again, who seemed to be
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focused on one group of people on me.
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They see all the problems centered on one group of people,
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and those seem to only be Jews.
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So the right wing, far right antisemitism
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has exploded.
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Why?
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But why tell, tell us.
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Is it, I mean, you mentioned, uh, technology and you know,
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a native social media has
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exacerbated
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and you think that's the primary reason, as you say, it was always there.
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I, well, I think, you know, Tucker Carlson didn't start out speaking like this.
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He actually started out sounding like a pretty reasonable conservative.
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He was
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much more tame when he was on Fox.
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But, but without the editorial constraints, without the ombudsman,
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without the concern from Fox Legal Department about the liability
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he might create by saying slanders or libelous things, he
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shifts over to his podcast on X.
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Where anything goes, there are no more constraints because if you are not
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liable on X or social media broadly.
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Engage in libel.
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Okay.
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So there's an exemption, a lot of social media companies to skirt the
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same laws that the same conventions that normalize discourse on broadcast
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or print or other forms of media, social media is, has an exemption.
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So I think what's happened is, number 1 20 16, kind of like, uh, lifted up the
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rock and all these parties flooded out.
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I think they have been swimming in the sea of populism that's been raging.
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Um, conspiracist and populism, I didn't mention that before, but the Copi is real.
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Um, the Jeffrey Epstein stuff plays into it.
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You know, a lot of the MAGA folks believe it.
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There's a kind of conspiracism that creates a toxic stew where people
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actually think the rothchilds or Jewish space lasers or whatnot are,
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you know, again, shaping their world.
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Um, they're not.
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And so embedded, aided, and embedded by social media, populism, conspiracy
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system have kind of been mainstreamed in ways that are new and novel.
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And now some of the loudest voices who engage in this kind
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of anti-elitism, they look for someone to blame, and it's the Jew.
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So I, I see this a lot.
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We see this all the time.
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What's scary is it's become a potent mix at the, if he,
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you know, in the ballot box.
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So here's the good news.
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On the right, we are seeing, even as people like Candace Owens and
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Tucker Carlson, and Ian Carroll and Alex Jones engage in this, and Nick
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Fuentes, engage in this toxicity.
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You have seen very responsible voices on the right push back from
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Ted Cruz to Lindsey Graham, to um, you know, a zillion other people
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step up and say, no, no, no, no, no.
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Not in my party.
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Mike Johnson, speaker of the House just did a big interview.
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The other day where he literally said, we have got to deal with this antisemitism.
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So I think folks on the right, see, this is happening.
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It's like a battle for the soul of the Republican party.
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And will it yield to these forces of populism, conspiracists and toxicity,
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or will again, it revert back to like the kind of principled conservatism,
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the kind of movement it's arisen that's characterized this part of our
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political discourse from Goldwater and Buckley to Reagan to today.
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Um, so I, I think Tucker Carlson has the, has antecedents like the John Birch
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Society and the KKK and Father Kauflin.
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And there were people again, like Buckley and Reagan who said, and by the
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way, George W. Bush who said, no way.
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And I hope that those forces win this battle right now, and that voices
24:47
like Ted Cruz and others prevail.
24:51
We need them to Now, by the way, I should say.
24:53
ADL is a 501(c)(3).
24:56
We don't do partisan politics.
24:58
I don't get to tell people who to vote for.
25:01
My job is to call balls and strikes whether or not the, the person you
25:05
know at the batter's box is wearing a red jersey or a Blue Jersey.
25:07
Same strike zone.
25:09
But I admire the fact and appreciate that folks on the right are working through
25:12
this literally right now as we speak.
25:15
We have not yet seen that happen on the left in the same way,
25:18
I hope and pray that it will
25:20
before we get to the left.
25:22
And we've of course have a, had a very consequential, uh, election here in New
25:25
York City that is part of that phenomenon.
25:29
Um, just on, on the right for a moment.
25:32
Um, so there is this kind of ferocious ideological battle that has been joined.
25:38
And on the one hand it's, it's uplifting to see that the conventional
25:44
right realizes that this is something different that needs
25:48
to be contended within confront.
25:51
Are you optimistic about that?
25:53
We hear, we hear surveys that, uh, many of the younger, uh, conservatives are now
26:01
pulling away from a, uh, affinity towards, uh, Jews and toward, and a support
26:09
for Israel, uh, as, as happened in the left already, and that we've seen that.
26:15
So are you, are, do you Who's gonna win this, uh, struggle in the, in
26:19
the right, in the Republican party?
26:22
You can't
26:22
do this job if you're not optimistic.
26:24
You know, like optimism is not a strategy.
26:27
To be clear, I hope is not like a play.
26:29
But like, look, you gotta be in, you gotta be on the field.
26:32
There's a contact sport.
26:34
Now that being said, I think there are so many good people on the right who want
26:39
to prevail over these forces of darkness.
26:41
'cause they realize it will not just claim the Jews, it will claim their soul.
26:46
It will overtake their movement.
26:48
It will poison it.
26:49
And there is a long list.
26:52
There's a lot of debris of ideological movements that have been poisoned by and
26:56
ultimately undermined by the antisemitism.
26:59
Like it's a corrosive force that may create some early momentum
27:03
for, again, for some like populist bigots, but eventually it consumes
27:07
everything and everyone around it.
27:09
Um, but I, I, I worry, I mean, I think if you saw, there was a thing
27:12
a few weeks ago about when J.D. Vance said Ole Miss, and he got asked a
27:16
question about the state of Israel.
27:18
I didn't like how the vice president answered the question, but was more
27:20
salient, was young man who asked it, Ammi and the whooping and the
27:26
cheering that happened as he asked this crazy question about Israel
27:30
persecuting Christians or whatever.
27:32
It was, it was terrifying.
27:33
Again, not just what he said, but the response that you, this was an ole miss.
27:38
This is not a, this is not like the Harvard Yard.
27:40
Okay.
27:41
This is not like the Middle East Studies Department of Columbia University.
27:44
This was Ole Miss.
27:47
So I thought that was alarming.
27:49
Again, you've seen this manosphere, which we've written a lot about at ADL,
27:53
our centron extremism has studied it.
27:56
That is a place of appeal to young, typically white
28:00
Christian, disaffected males.
28:03
And again, the scapegoating that's happening, they're blAmming the Jews
28:06
or Israel or AIPAC, is very worrisome.
28:09
Um, all that being said, what gives me hope, like I would encourage
28:13
all of your listeners to go read an op-ed that was in the Wall Street
28:16
Journal a few weeks ago by Ralph Reed.
28:19
Ralph Reed, who some of your audience may know.
28:22
He was credited as one of the early kind of evangelical leaders
28:26
who brought politics into the mix.
28:30
He worked with, uh, Jerry Falwell, he worked with Pat Robertson.
28:34
He brought Christian kind of theology into our political discourse.
28:39
Not in a way we say we need to be a Christian nation, but we said we have
28:42
values and that would may guide some of our opinions and whatever our policies.
28:47
So again, he's not a Christian nationalist, but he is someone
28:50
who's values driven, inspired by his faith, by the way, just like me.
28:54
So what, what, uh, Ralph did though in this, in this piece is he wrote a
28:58
meaningful, meaningful, uh, per and pushback on the Tucker Carlson wing of
29:06
the kind of conservative movement and talked about the central relationship
29:11
between Jews and the Jewish people, the Jewish state to modern Christian,
29:15
not just theology, but practice and to our shared Judeo-Christian values.
29:20
It's very important, and I think there are a lot of young evangelicals.
29:25
Who share his disposition.
29:26
And what we need to do in the Jewish community is make sure
29:29
we're speaking to all of them.
29:30
I think for a long time we, the Jewish community, and again, this is a
29:33
community that overwhelmingly has voted for the Democratic party for years,
29:36
not telling how people how to vote, but I think reform and conservative
29:40
segments of our community, um, have not always been comfortable with their
29:45
evangelical cousins, if you will.
29:48
Worried about, again, what their theology suggests about our fate.
29:53
Um, worried about what did they have today of ulterior motives.
29:57
But I think in this moment, again, a post ten seven moment, I'm
30:00
a, today is October the eighth.
30:04
It's October the eighth.
30:06
We are living in an October the eighth world.
30:08
And October the eighth shook us to our foundations.
30:11
And October the eighth has forced us to confront things which maybe we didn't
30:14
want to, maybe we didn't understand.
30:17
And in October, the eighth world, I think we need to recognize and
30:21
embrace those who want to embrace us.
30:23
Not by sacrificing our principles, but by extending to them the same grace
30:28
that we have shown other communities.
30:30
And I think that's something for us as communal leaders, that's
30:33
for us as spiritual figures.
30:34
It's for us as Jewish people who believe in cva.
30:37
And this is for us as Jewish people who believe in our own kind of identities.
30:42
And so I think we as a Jewish people need to recognize and need to appreciate
30:49
our evangelical, I said cousins, but I'll reframe it here as brothers and
30:54
sisters because I think we share so much.
30:59
We have much more in common than the things that keep us apart.
31:11
So talk to us about the left now, which you equated, uh, or
31:16
compared, uh, to climate change.
31:19
And I think maybe the dam is bursting on that.
31:23
We're seeing greater effects on the climate every day.
31:27
Yeah.
31:27
In the left-wing parties than very alarming Democratic party.
31:31
And now, uh, with the mayoral election in, in New York City, what do you say?
31:36
What, well, first of all, what are your general
31:37
observations?
31:39
So, so that the audience knows your reference?
31:42
What I've said for a long time is antisemitism shows up on
31:45
both sides of the spectrum.
31:46
Neither side is like exempt from intolerance, and on the right it was
31:49
more like violent category five storms that blow your house up and kill everyone
31:54
inside, like Pittsburgh or Poway.
31:57
So many other incidents.
31:59
But whereas on the left it showed a more like climate change, slowly and
32:02
steady temperature rising and some might deny it and some might dismiss it.
32:07
And then finally you try to adjust and it's too late.
32:09
It reaches a temperature level way up here.
32:12
And what happens when the temperature level's up here,
32:15
where things have so unraveled?
32:16
Category five storms in the other direct.
32:19
That's actually where we are right now.
32:21
So we have hurricanes on one side and tornadoes on the other.
32:24
You have the same destructive force.
32:26
Now again, it's certainly fair to say we haven't had a mass casualty event
32:29
in America, like, like the Tree of Life massacre, which was done by a white
32:34
supremacist, angry about immigration by someone on the quote unquote left.
32:39
That on the other hand, we have people on the far left justifying like a biblical
32:46
catastrophe or cataclysm like October the seventh, literally justifying it,
32:50
literally describing, uh, some of the perpetrators who were caught and captured
32:54
as hostages, which are so profane.
32:57
I hesitate to even say it out loud.
32:59
It's just so disgraceful and immoral.
33:04
But the reality is there are segments of the far left, which should be
33:07
consumed by this anti-Zionist ideology.
33:09
And we've talked on your show before and I'm pretty out there saying anti-Zionism
33:13
is anti-Semitism because it is.
33:17
I also think the sky is blue.
33:19
You know, I also think that the world is not flat.
33:22
I mean, anti-Zionism is simply the latest way that anti-Jewish hate is normalized
33:29
and legitimized with a pseudo-scientific or pseudo political veneer.
33:34
But if you look at the tropes and if you, if you listen to the words and you
33:41
see them for who they are, like the, the, the rabid anti-Zionist is just an
33:46
antisemite by any other name, by the way.
33:47
Even if they come from our Jewish community, we need
33:49
to recognize that as well.
33:50
If you dehumanize people, like again, you de-legitimize their
33:54
very existence and you demonize them, like, I'm sorry, that's hate.
33:59
No matter how you dress it up, it's hate.
34:01
All that being said, I think we have a real challenge on our hands because the
34:06
truth is, is that like what happened in our mayor race here in New York
34:10
City, like Mayor Elect ManAmmi won apparently with 30% of the Jewish vote.
34:17
There are a number of people who heard what he said and still believed in him.
34:22
By the way,
34:24
Donald Trump won in 2016 with 30% of the Jewish vote, and a number of
34:31
people heard him and believed him.
34:33
So let's recognize that the, I mean, I hear this from some of,
34:37
uh, the supporters of the mayor.
34:39
They say, well, what about 30% of the people who voted for him?
34:41
Again, 30% of people voted for Trump.
34:43
That doesn't mean the stuff that President Trump did as a candidate in 2016.
34:46
You know, again, like credentialing white supremacists for his
34:50
campaign events was okay.
34:52
And I don't think just 'cause 30% of Jews voted for Ammi, that somehow
34:56
means that his breezy anti-Zionism and his, like drawing equivalence between
35:01
what happened at Park East Synagogue, uh, with these, with these rabid
35:06
demonstrators, cursing and threatening Jewish people walking into a synagogue.
35:11
And he drew equivalence between them like.
35:14
It doesn't square with me.
35:15
Just
35:16
for the audience.
35:16
He issued a statement.
35:18
He issued the synagogue too, criticizing the synagogue for hosting what he
35:22
called illegal under international law.
35:26
Not American law, by the way.
35:27
And, uh, and well, whether it's international law too.
35:31
Yeah.
35:31
I mean, it's, it's a total contrive.
35:33
It's ridiculous.
35:34
So there was an incident at Park East Synagogue Park.
35:36
Synagogue is a large historic shul in, uh, Manhattan.
35:41
And there was a, uh, an event being held in the synagogue, uh, like on a
35:46
Wednesday evening by a group called Nefesh B'Nefesh, which helps Americans
35:50
who wanna make Alah immigrate to Israel.
35:53
Uh, it was hosting them for an event to talk about process.
35:56
And such.
35:56
Nefesh B'Nefesh is a pretty vanilla organization without
36:00
a political point of view.
36:02
It helps immigrants.
36:03
That's what it does.
36:04
And nonetheless, uh, these anti, I'm not gonna call them pro-Palestinian,
36:08
they're not pro-Palestinian.
36:10
Like I, like, I'm sorry.
36:12
Even calling them anti-Israel understates.
36:14
What they are, these are like pro Hamas pro-terror voices who organized around the
36:19
synagogue right in front of the entrance.
36:22
And these people walking in middle aged elderly people.
36:26
They cursed at them, they swore at them, they threatened them.
36:30
It was horrific, right up close to these people.
36:35
And then the following day, after many people in public life had condemned
36:39
what had happened because it was, it was just indisputably vulgar.
36:45
Um, and Violative violative, uh, the mayor spokesperson called it out and yet
36:51
somehow managed to suggest that there was some equivalence between the people who
36:54
were protesting the people walking into the synagogue for an event that, that,
36:58
that spokesperson, erroneously claimed was somehow in violation of international law.
37:05
This is a fiction, this is a lie.
37:07
This, this is not a shred of truth to that.
37:10
Again, you can have strong feelings about, uh, Israel's conduct toward
37:14
Palestinians, the way that the war has been prosecuted about settlements in
37:19
Judea and Samaria and so on and so forth.
37:21
But the idea that Jewish people going to live in the Jewish state
37:24
is a violation of international law.
37:27
It is grotesque, but this is what's becoming normative
37:30
with this kind of language.
37:31
It then gets pulled back.
37:32
Then she, or the city hall or the, the transition retracted
37:37
and clarified doesn't matter.
37:39
It's already out there.
37:40
This is part of the game.
37:41
This is part of the double game that they play, and I really don't have any patience
37:45
for the gaslighting of our community.
37:46
You don't get to say that you're against antisemitism and then make
37:50
specious fictional claims about putting New York in quote unquote
37:55
compliance with international law.
37:59
Not a thing.
38:00
By suggesting somehow you're gonna implement BBS, not a thing.
38:04
So I find that very problematic.
38:06
Now, on the other hand, let's acknowledge.
38:09
30% of American Jews voted for candidate Trump, and we've gotta acknowledge
38:14
that they have a point of view.
38:16
And 30% of the New York Jews apparently voted for Mayor-Elect
38:20
Mamdani acknowledged, they have a point of view and he is our mayor.
38:23
And like that or not, we have to deal with that.
38:27
So I think it's our job at ADL as an institution.
38:31
We don't get to choose who the American people, elected president.
38:33
We don't get to choose who New York City elects as its mayor.
38:36
It's our job to find ways to work with those individuals where we
38:39
can in service of the needs of our community that doesn't preclude us
38:43
from calling them out when we must.
38:46
That doesn't preclude us from kind of using all the means at our disposal.
38:50
Try to make sure that our community is kept safe.
38:52
But if there are areas of of common interest, if there are areas of
38:56
opportunity for collaboration, we're gonna try to pursue
38:59
those in a principled manner.
39:02
In the spirit of we want this city.
39:05
We want this country to be the best place possible for its Jewish citizens.
39:09
And by the way, for all people, irrespective of how you
39:12
prayer, where you're from or any other degree of diversity.
39:16
So it's not easy, Ammi, but we've gotta walk this line between calling out the
39:22
egregious and ugly, you know, slander.
39:26
Even as we try to find ways to work together where we can't.
39:29
Jonathan, um, you, you, within days, I think you announced, I think
39:37
you called it the Momani monitor.
39:39
Yes.
39:40
Right?
39:40
Yeah.
39:41
And, um,
39:44
can you explain, some people were critical of that.
39:47
I don't know if they were critical because it was right after the elections
39:52
and maybe there's a grace period there that, that might have been appropriate
39:55
or they were critical of the idea.
39:57
I, I, I heard that some people.
39:59
So well, why are we opening a Mom Donny monitor and not a far right monitor or
40:04
a Trump monitor or so on and so forth.
40:06
So here's an opportunity to
40:08
explain all of that.
40:09
Again, the a DL doesn't, we don't play politics.
40:12
We don't pick favorites, nor do we elect individuals like it's
40:15
our job to call balls and strikes.
40:18
As I mentioned a few minutes ago, with respect to candidate Trump and
40:21
then President Trump, he may have been critical during the campaign
40:24
and critical when he is in office.
40:25
We also find ways to work together.
40:26
That's what we have to do.
40:28
But we have never held back in criticizing.
40:30
And so for example, in the last, whatever it's been nine months since President
40:34
Trump was inaugurated, we've, I mean, look from Matt Gaetz to Joe Kent, to Paul and
40:42
Gracia to others who have been nominated.
40:47
And those nominations either withdrawn or proceeded when they,
40:50
when he has had people up for roles that we found problematic.
40:53
We've called it out.
40:55
He's pursued policies that we've agreed with, we've celebrated, and these
40:58
pursued policies we've disagreed with.
40:59
We've called that out like this is what we do.
41:01
So we are tracking Trump every single day.
41:05
With respect to candidate Mamdani, what makes him a little bit
41:08
different than candidate Trump was.
41:11
Candidate Trump came in kind of as a, uh, you know, it was
41:16
unclear what his core values were.
41:20
Man's been very clear and he kind of, like I said, casually, talks
41:23
about being an anti-Zionist.
41:25
That is an anti-Semitic position, period.
41:29
anti-Zionism is not, again, dignity and equality for all people.
41:34
anti-Zionism is denial of rights for Jewish people's.
41:39
What it is, unless you hold that view consistently for all people, if the
41:44
only group that you single out into whom you would deny self-determination
41:49
is Jews, uh, it's called anti-Semitic.
41:53
anti-Jewish and it's wrong.
41:55
And so he came to this role.
41:56
With that in mind, over the last few months of the campaign, we saw
41:59
him intensify saying things like he would cut ties with the Teknion.
42:05
Again, Cornell Tech is the center of innovation in this city.
42:09
They do breakthrough research, they do extraordinary innovation.
42:13
And his basis to cut ties was not the quality of their output or
42:19
the success of their scholarship.
42:21
It's because it was a Jewish institution.
42:22
That's it.
42:24
That's it.
42:25
Um, or insisting.
42:26
He would bring BDS to city Hall, a discriminatory practice that would
42:30
discriminate against Jewish people and Israeli people that is against
42:34
the law to discriminate against people based on their ethnicity or
42:37
nationality and so on and so forth.
42:40
So as his language intensified, and he came in as a person with a clear ideology,
42:46
and by the way, he's shown he is pragmatic on other issues like affordability,
42:50
issues he's shown can be pragmatic.
42:52
We worried a great deal because on this he's basically shown no flexibility
42:56
and shown no willingness to learn.
42:58
When you can't call out globalize the ada, when you are unable to
43:03
reckon with some of the most basic stuff, that's a little bit of a tell.
43:07
So indeed, the day after the election, we announced the I'm Donny Monitor
43:11
and our intent is to do two things.
43:13
It's to, number one, um, allow New Yorkers who experience antisemitism to tell us.
43:21
Now, by the way, Americans across the country, Jewish people, when
43:25
they experience antisemitism, they tell us they've been doing
43:28
that , Ammi, for almost 50 years.
43:31
We've been collecting reports for almost 50 years and systematically tracking it.
43:37
All we're doing here is narrowing in a hyperlocal and New York City.
43:42
Why?
43:43
Because we are worried that a new mayor again who espouses anti Zionism.
43:48
Creates a permission structure for people to engage in antisemitism.
43:52
So we wanna make sure New Yorkers, Jewish New Yorkers know report your
43:55
incidents to us because we are worried in the city with the most Jews of any
44:00
in the world, in the city, in America, where the most antisemitism happens.
44:04
It could go up like that.
44:06
We wanna make sure people know to report.
44:08
And then secondly, we're gonna track the personnel and the the
44:13
appointments that the mayor makes, the policies that he introduces
44:17
and the programs that he rolls out.
44:20
By the way, we do that right now with respect to other elected officials.
44:25
The only thing different is we've kind of labeled it as this Mamdani Monitor to make
44:30
sure that the mayor and his aides and the city knows that we're gonna have a hot,
44:35
bright, white light on this from day one.
44:38
So this does not mean that we are biased against him.
44:43
It simply means we feel it is necessary.
44:47
To pay ultra close attention to what might happen.
44:52
Why?
44:53
Because of what he has already said and why, because of what he is already done.
44:58
So look, at the end of the day, as everything we do, Ammi, this will be
45:02
data driven, it will be fact focused, it will be grounded in evidence.
45:08
So if he appoints good people to different positions, that's what's
45:12
gonna show up in the monitor.
45:13
If incidents don't go up, that's gonna show up in the monitor.
45:16
If he introduces good policy, that's what's gonna show up in the monitor.
45:19
On the other hand, if he does things that are controversial or he proposes people
45:24
with a track record of anti-Semitism, or he suggests policies that again, would
45:28
discriminate against or marginalized Jewish people, that's gonna show up.
45:31
So it's interesting that there've been so much noise around this.
45:34
As far as I'm concerned, we're just doing our job now.
45:37
Some people think we personalized it to him, but again, he is the mayor
45:43
and he's espousing an ideology.
45:46
Creates a permission structure, we're concerned about it.
45:50
If we're wrong, then that will be exposed.
45:53
If we've missed the mark, then that's gonna be exposed.
45:56
But it's odd that people are concerned that we are going to report what happens.
46:02
As far as I'm concerned,
46:04
that means we're doing urgent.
46:05
Mm-hmm.
46:06
Would you advise, uh, New York Jews and through New York Jews, American Jews,
46:11
but in particular here in the city, would your advice to them in terms of, uh,
46:16
protecting themselves from, uh, acts of Jew hatred be different today or when
46:23
Momani is sworn in on January 1st than, say, three months ago or six months ago?
46:30
Do you have advice?
46:31
I I have people all the time who come in here and express worries
46:35
for themselves, their kids.
46:37
Do you have any different kind of advice than you would've given a while ago?
46:41
I mean, I think number one, one of the, in, in an October the eighth world.
46:46
We are reminded that we must be wary.
46:49
We just can't take any of this for granted.
46:52
That none of this was ordained by, you know, Hashem as if
46:56
it would be here forever.
46:58
Right.
46:59
Um, the fact of the matter is the first temple, the second temple fell,
47:03
and this temple of, if you will, this modern temple could fall as well.
47:07
We don't get our act together.
47:09
Do everything we can to preserve it.
47:11
This modern tempo being the exceptionalism of the United States
47:16
in terms of all of its citizens and in particular the Jewish community.
47:19
Correct.
47:20
So I don't mean a physical structure.
47:22
I mean, yeah.
47:23
This, this kind of, this remarkable construct that has been, that
47:29
has developed and taken shape and like been bolted in over
47:33
the last 200, almost 50 years.
47:36
We see how we can wobble and we see how we can fall if we don't hold it up.
47:40
Um, there's a broader conversation about democracy, but I'm specifically
47:43
speaking here in a very Jewish context.
47:45
About the sanctity of our place in this society.
47:49
Um, so I think number one, I think one of the lessons we must be wary.
47:55
I think number two, I think we've gotta be engaged.
47:57
I, I said it before, I'll say it again.
47:59
Turns out that democracy is a contact sport and none of us, I think can
48:04
afford to watch it on the sidelines.
48:06
Just assume it's gonna work out.
48:08
You gotta roll up your sleeves and get into it.
48:10
Whether that means volunteering or donating or voting or, or, or, or
48:16
blogging or, um, change in careers or getting involved in some other way.
48:22
I mean, there's an infinite number of possibilities, but you've got to be in it.
48:28
Like we can't afford to be spectators in our own story.
48:33
But your advice doesn't include to change your behavior on the
48:37
streets or as you approach Jewish institutions or anything like that.
48:41
You're not.
48:42
Well, look, we already have
48:43
learned.
48:44
We need to, again, part of being wary is not in some abstract
48:47
way, but in an immediate way.
48:49
Be wary of your surroundings.
48:50
Be wary of your spaces.
48:52
Be wary whether you're on the subway or walking down the street
48:55
and, um, that carries forward.
48:58
We can't afford not to be in a world where antisemitic incidents have
49:01
reached epic epidemic levels, but by the way, those are our subways.
49:08
Those are our streets.
49:10
These are our spaces.
49:11
So I am not willing to surrender not a millimeter to the bigots and to
49:18
the bullies and to the anti Zionists, however they choose to sort of identify.
49:23
So yeah, we gotta be wary and yeah, we gotta be in it.
49:26
But I say absolutely no to to surrendering or to submitting that
49:32
somehow we should like, okay, so you should wear your kipa out.
49:35
You might wanna wear a baseball cap over your kipa if you want to be smart.
49:38
But if you wear your kipa, you should wear it proudly.
49:42
That's what I believe.
49:44
I really believe that, like you see this blue square.
49:46
I know when I wear this blue square, and by the way, I've taken off my yellow
49:50
hostage pin because they shut down Hostage FAmmily Forum, thank God or Hashem.
49:57
Um, and I, nearly all the hostage have come home.
50:00
There's only two left.
50:01
And again, I'm following the lead of the hostage, uh, forum.
50:06
That being said, I know wearing the blue square, which is from Robert
50:10
Kraft's, a Blue Square Alliance, people see that and they either think
50:13
I'm Jewish or I'm aligned with Jews.
50:16
I wear this every day, if you will, loudly and proudly.
50:21
Um, because I will not again, be intimidated by or modify my
50:25
behavior in order to placate the bullies and the bigots.
50:28
You can forget it.
50:29
They can all jump in the lake.
50:31
Um, now again, you gotta be smart.
50:33
I'm not saying you should be stupid about it and careless, but I think we can.
50:39
Afford to give in and to let them win.
50:42
You mentioned, uh, the Jews who are anti-Zionists.
50:46
How, how big in your view is that phenomenon?
50:49
People voted for Mamdani.
50:50
You could say 30%.
50:51
That strikes me as high too.
50:53
But what do I know?
50:54
I, I don't
50:55
know that that's true.
50:55
I don't think we have good data, but I've heard estimates it's between 20 to 30%.
51:00
Yeah.
51:00
Okay.
51:00
20% sounds more reasonable to me, but it could be 30%.
51:05
It doesn't really matter.
51:06
It's still a, uh, minority.
51:09
And it's exactly the opposite of what a conventional Democrat in this city
51:14
would've received, which is two thirds.
51:17
But how, how big do you think this anti, this anti-Zionist Jewish phenomenon is?
51:23
After all, people vote for mayor for a whole host of reasons.
51:26
Uh, I've had people in my congregations who identify as liberal Zionists, and they
51:29
told me they voted for Momani because of all the other, uh, factors about New York.
51:34
So how big, how big do you think.
51:37
anti-Zionist Jewish population is how big a problem do you think it is for us?
51:45
So I think two things can be true at the same time.
51:48
So I think small population, big problem.
51:51
So let's say it is 20 ish percent or something like that.
51:53
I've seen data that suggests that 90% of American Jews have an attachment, positive
51:59
attachment to the state of Israel.
52:01
One could say that makes them Zionists.
52:04
I would say that people who observe, who identify as Jewish
52:07
are all Zionists because Zion is central and a return to E's Israel
52:12
is central to our, to our faith.
52:15
Like it's so fundamental.
52:16
It's why I don't need to tell you Omni of all people, we know that
52:19
it's not just this political entity that started 70 some odd years ago.
52:25
Like again, we have a, we have a covenantal commitment to that land
52:29
that is present in all aspects of worship and ritual that characterize
52:34
Judaism and the Jewish people.
52:35
So that being said.
52:38
Let's say it's a small population again.
52:40
Maybe it's 10%, maybe it's 20%.
52:43
So it's small, but it's a big problem because it is worrisome to me when you
52:48
have a segment of your community who's so detached from our core values and who has
52:52
imbibe the language of those who hate us.
52:56
And again, I understand those who want to see, um, a more humane and dignified,
53:03
uh, piece, a process that provides dignity and equality to Palestinians.
53:07
I want that too.
53:09
I want to see a process in the Middle East that allows Jewish, Jewish Israelis
53:14
and Palestinian Arabs, however they choose to identify, to live side by side
53:20
and in, in, if you will, places of their own so that they're able to enjoy and
53:27
realize their national aspirations without being in conflict with one another.
53:31
That's what I want.
53:32
I want a world where they can again.
53:36
Exercise their full humanity with in safe, secure spaces without, again, impinging
53:43
upon, let alone attacking the other side.
53:47
The anti Zionist doesn't believe that, and I think many Jewish people who want
53:50
dignity for Palestinians don't realize they're repeating the rhetoric of the
53:54
enemy when they say ridiculous things like Israel's an ethno national project.
54:00
Like it couldn't be farther from the truth.
54:02
So when I say it's a big problem, I think we need to own, we need to be accountable,
54:06
that we have to do a better job.
54:08
We as Jewish leaders, um, to make sure that our institutions and the systems
54:13
that support them and that the, the, the values, the invisible scaffolding
54:17
that holds up those systems and those institutions fully encompasses the
54:23
complexity of the times we're living in.
54:26
I worry sometimes when we flatten things, it oversimplifies.
54:30
Again, I appreciate that our tradition, that our faith
54:34
teaches us to love thy neighbor.
54:37
It it requires us to find the dignity again in those Palestinians, even
54:43
those who say and do horrible things, they still are mothers and fathers.
54:49
They are still sons and daughters.
54:51
So we've gotta find that again.
54:53
The anti-Zionist though, who flattens, uh, the Israeli Jews and who negates
55:00
what it means to be Jewish, is doing themselves a tremendous disservice.
55:04
So I think we need to ask ourselves, how can we, as a Jewish people, again,
55:09
in leadership roles, reflect upon and kind of discover new ways to connect
55:17
with a younger generation who feel so detached from their, from the, the
55:22
Zionist identity and from the heritage which has held our people together.
55:28
2000 years of exile.
55:29
I think we've got a lot of work to do.
55:31
I really
55:31
do.
55:31
And my last question to you, uh, Jonathan, is, uh, we're going into the 250th
55:36
celebration here in the United States.
55:38
You think the country has changed in fundamental ways in the
55:42
last, uh, two or three decades?
55:44
And are you optimistic about the future of the country?
55:47
I mean, I don't know that there's another country in the history of humanity
55:51
with the corrective capacity that this one has, this country has endured.
55:55
And we're not like a civilization like ancient Rome or ancient Persia
56:01
or ancient, uh, such and such.
56:03
This is a democratic republic, a representative democracy that's
56:08
shown a constitutional capability of correcting for, its, its inherent flaws
56:15
that's shown a corrective capability to overcome, you know, economic
56:20
depression, social upheaval, civil war.
56:24
We forget the fact that the bloodiest conflict in the history.
56:27
Of this republic was when Americans fought Americans and, and, you know, fAmmilies
56:33
were torn apart, shooting each other in the street and on the, in the fields.
56:38
Um, global catastrophe.
56:41
So much we, we have come through so much and there was so much promise ahead of us.
56:46
I mean, you know, there's this whole emerging idea on the left of abundance,
56:51
which has been here for a long time.
56:53
But you look at the promise of technologies like generative AI and
56:57
the promise of technologies like, you know, bio innovation and the promise of
57:02
technologies like that are controlling for and adjusting for climate.
57:07
And you look at the developments in, um, science and medicine that have
57:12
contributed to such advancements in like, again, human health and broad prosperity.
57:19
So the country has changed a lot in the last 30 years.
57:23
30 years ago was November, 1995.
57:26
My God, post Oslo, you know, in the middle of, uh, bill Clinton's
57:31
term, we had a balanced budget.
57:34
Globalization.
57:36
Globalization was upon us in a positive way.
57:39
Um, we are at the earliest dawn of the internet.
57:43
Like there was a lot of, to be hopeful then.
57:44
But again, now we're at the early dawn of ai.
57:47
Now globalization is already upon us again, now we've
57:50
achieved so much progress.
57:52
Like I have no doubt if any country can get through this time.
57:55
It's this one.
57:57
And if any people can contribute to that renaissance, it's Jewish Americans.
58:04
So I am hopeful and I see tremendous horizons ahead of us.
58:10
But again, we gotta get on the field.
58:13
We gotta, each of us has a role to play.
58:16
We gotta find our role.
58:17
We gotta lean in like never before.
58:19
You want the next 250 years to be as fruitful, as productive,
58:23
as, uh, as the previous 200.
58:26
Jonathan Greenblatt, one of the great leaders of the American
58:28
Jewish community at the very heart of the crisis of our times.
58:33
Thank you for spending this time with us and, uh, thank you for all that
58:37
you do and all that you will do in protection of American society as
58:41
well as the American Jewish community.
58:43
Thank you for your kind of intellect, your wisdom.
58:47
Like I said, your courage, which uplifts all of us on me, and I think
58:51
all of us, your congregants and the community is grateful for that.
58:54
So thank you.
59:02
I have known and admired Jonathan Greenblatt since he became the
59:05
Chief Executive Officer of the Anti-Defamation League 12 years ago.
59:10
He is utterly devoted to the Jewish community and to American society.
59:15
Jonathan is tireless.
59:17
He possesses enormous energy and works round the clock on our behalf.
59:22
The American Jewish community owes him our gratitude.
59:26
I want to pick up on two points he raised.
59:29
First.
59:31
It's been my experience as well that it is much harder now to lead a
59:35
broad-based Jewish organization than when Jonathan was first appointed.
59:41
It was never easy to lead a community of Jews.
59:45
Even Moses had many setbacks who made you judge and ruler over us is
59:49
a question he heard several times.
59:52
But today, in contrast to even a decade ago, the Jewish community is much more
59:58
polarized, as is American society, and the stakes for us are much higher.
1:00:05
Antisemitism has exploded, and Jews are more fearful and more anxious
1:00:10
than at any time since before World War ii, during these historic years.
1:00:16
It is critical for our community to have the best and the
1:00:19
brightest representing us.
1:00:22
Jonathan is one of those leaders.
1:00:25
Second regarding our discussion about the connection between
1:00:29
anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism in the context of the election of
1:00:33
New York City Mayor Elect Momani.
1:00:37
The safety of American Jews is dependent not only on the number of security
1:00:41
personnel guarding Jewish buildings, it is first and foremost connected to the
1:00:46
general environment, an atmosphere of tolerance, coexistence, and comradery.
1:00:53
You could put 50 police officers outside of New York City
1:00:56
synagogue or a Jewish school.
1:00:59
If the overall atmosphere is hostile to Jews, it will threaten
1:01:04
Jewish safety everywhere.
1:01:07
And history has proven that what starts with the Jews never ends with the Jews.
1:01:13
The city itself will become much nastier, much more violent.
1:01:18
And that is the main threat from the ideologically driven anti-Zionism
1:01:23
of Zoran Momani spreading in both American political parties.
1:01:30
The history of the Zionist movement since the late 19th century establishes that
1:01:34
wherever anti-Zionism is normalized, especially by high government
1:01:39
officials, hostility to Jews increases.
1:01:43
We've seen that in the past two years in the ivory towers of elite
1:01:48
academic institutions and on the streets of New York City and across
1:01:52
the United States, and it's not only Jonathan Greenblatt, who insists that
1:01:58
anti-Zionism is often antisemitism.
1:02:01
Martin Luther King said, when people criticize Zionists, they mean Jews.
1:02:06
You're talking antisemitism.
1:02:09
The vast majority of American Jews support Israel and consider her a central
1:02:14
component of their own Jewish identity.
1:02:18
The effort to delegitimize Zionism is an effort to delegitimize Judaism.
1:02:24
It is an effort by non-Jews to define Judaism for Jews to separate
1:02:30
what they call good Judaism and bad Judaism, good Jews and bad Jews,
1:02:36
or as Congresswoman Omar said, pro genocide and anti genocide Jews.
1:02:43
We cannot let them do that.
1:02:45
They would not be so bold with any other minority group.
1:02:50
Jews get to define Judaism.
1:02:53
Others get to decide whether they accept us as we see ourselves.
1:03:00
This ideological anti-Zionism is not a critique of Israeli policy, not a
1:03:04
debate about borders, but opposition to the very idea of a Jewish state
1:03:10
and a commitment to see it dismantled.
1:03:13
Along with its 10 million people, seven and a half million of whom are Jewish.
1:03:18
We need to strip anti-Zionism of its veneer virtue and remind Americans that
1:03:24
anti-Zionism is intolerant and illiberal a betrayal of the American way of life.
1:03:33
We will get through these times together.
1:03:37
Challenging times often bring out the best in people.
1:03:41
We should work hard to instill a deep passionate Jewish
1:03:45
identity in our children.
1:03:48
If we do they and we will be fine, and we must form alliances
1:03:54
with our non-Jewish friends.
1:03:56
Jews are still a small minority.
1:03:58
We cannot succeed alone.
1:04:01
There are tens of millions who stand with us.
1:04:04
We need them now more than ever, until next time.
1:04:09
This is in these times.