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How Schizophrenia Works · Stuff You Should Know

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Speaker 1: Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray.
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Speaker 1: It's ready. Are you welcome to Stuff you should know
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Speaker 1: from house Stuff Works dot Com. Hey, and welcome to
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Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. With me is always Charles W.
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Speaker 1: Chucker's Chuck Chuck Tran Chuck Luck. Right, How are you good?
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Speaker 1: I'm great. I'm going to see Bob Dylan tonight. People
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Speaker 1: are gonna be like, I mean times, is Bob Dylan
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Speaker 1: playing Atlanta? Have you ever seen David Bowie? It's good?
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Speaker 1: I have not. Um, Yes, you are, Chuck. I know
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Speaker 1: you're very excited. I am. I've seen him a few times,
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Speaker 1: but it's always good. Really yeah? Too short? Though he
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Speaker 1: buzz us through like fifteen songs. He's out of there?
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Speaker 1: Is he short? Oh? Well he's also short? But yea
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Speaker 1: is he really? I was just kidding. No, he's short.
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Speaker 1: I guess those um Bell bottomed long pants that he
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Speaker 1: wore in the sixties on his album Like Bell made
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Speaker 1: him look kind of tall. Um. Alright, So enough about
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Speaker 1: Bob Dylan for the second time. Not a big Dylan
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Speaker 1: fan myself. Um, let's talk about schizophrenia instead. OK. So
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Speaker 1: I was looking for an intro for this, and I
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Speaker 1: mean there's plenty of stuff, but it's all like pretty
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Speaker 1: you know, research heavy. Astra Zeneca was marketing serre quil
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Speaker 1: off label and just settled. Um, let's see what else
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Speaker 1: Jared Lofner is being medicated against as well. The guy
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Speaker 1: who shot Gabrielle Gifford's okay, really yes, he's he's been
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Speaker 1: diagnosed as schizophrenic. Um. Finally uh and then um, there
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Speaker 1: was a homeless man in Los Angeles who was beaten
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Speaker 1: to death by the police yesterday or today. Um, and
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Speaker 1: all of this is kind of I realized like there
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Speaker 1: wasn't any one thing that I was like, well, here's
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Speaker 1: the intro. But I realized like all of it together
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Speaker 1: gives a pretty good overview of you know, schizophrenia as
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Speaker 1: it stands right now, which is it's misunderstood, it's heavily prescribed, underfunded,
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Speaker 1: and um yeah, and there's a lot of people out
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Speaker 1: there who aren't necessarily getting help who need it. Yeah.
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Speaker 1: In fact, I got a stat if you want to
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Speaker 1: go ahead and go there. You got a bunch of
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Speaker 1: stats you said for this, right, I do. Um, if
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Speaker 1: you want to talk about people getting help and and
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Speaker 1: or needing help and not getting it. Uh, six percent
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Speaker 1: of six schizophrenics are homeless. Yeah, six percent are in
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Speaker 1: jail or prison, ten percent in nursing homes with a
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Speaker 1: family member, or independently living supervise housing. So and and
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Speaker 1: it makes sense, Chuck to that. These makes sense because
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Speaker 1: first of all, you have all of this crazy stuff
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Speaker 1: going on to you. That's your reality. So you're having
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Speaker 1: trouble dealing with reality as it stands. Um. It's Secondly,
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Speaker 1: a lot of times schizophrenia comes on um during times
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Speaker 1: when you learn how to hold down a job or
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Speaker 1: take care of yourself or do whatever. So you might
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Speaker 1: never learn how to do this because you're dealing with
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Speaker 1: your schizophrenia. Here's the shocking one. At any given moment,
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Speaker 1: there are more people with untreated severe psychiatric illnesses living
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Speaker 1: on the streets than there are receiving care. They outweigh
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Speaker 1: that people that are actually getting help. That's that is
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Speaker 1: shocking but not surprising. Somehow agreed. Wow, So you said,
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Speaker 1: what was that last one? Severe psychiatric illnesses. That's an
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Speaker 1: umbrella term. Obviously schizophrenia falls in under that for sure,
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Speaker 1: But prior to the beginning of the twentieth century, it
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Speaker 1: was pretty much thought of as generalized illness, like the
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Speaker 1: mental illness was mental illness, and maybe there is a symptom.
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Speaker 1: Your symptoms were different, but really you're men to the
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Speaker 1: ill which was a huge step up from the spirit
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Speaker 1: possession that had you know, it had previously been ascribed
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Speaker 1: to or millions of years. Yeah, um, so it was.
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Speaker 1: It's a fairly recently classified mental illness. It wasn't until
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Speaker 1: eight that um a German psychiatrist named Emil Crapelin classified
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Speaker 1: schizophrenia as a mental illness and uh he missed classified
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Speaker 1: it as a form of dementia early and early type
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Speaker 1: of dementia. And then in nineteen eleven a Swiss psychiatrist
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Speaker 1: named Yugen Bleuler came up with the name schizophrenia. That's right, Josh,
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Speaker 1: And he uh got that word from the Greek words
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Speaker 1: for split in mind, which contribute somewhat to the misconception
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Speaker 1: that it is a split personality disorder. But what he
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Speaker 1: meant was there's a disconnect with reality, right, the mind
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Speaker 1: splits from reality, which today we still that's how you
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Speaker 1: still perceive um schizophrenia, but rather than split, we use
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Speaker 1: the word break. There's a psychotic break. Yeah, and we
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Speaker 1: should go ahead and just uh, since that is a
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Speaker 1: common misconception. It is entirely different than split personality disorder,
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Speaker 1: which they call disassociative identity disorder. Now, and if you
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Speaker 1: know the movie the show The United States of Terra,
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Speaker 1: have you seen that? No, I know what you're talking
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Speaker 1: about though with Toni Collette, she is has split personality
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Speaker 1: disorder on that show. And that's the one that you
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Speaker 1: always seen in the movies where you have multiple personalities
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Speaker 1: and they don't know about each other and one dominates
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Speaker 1: the other. And uh, and then what all about Eve
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Speaker 1: was about? I never saw that Sybil civil Yeah for sure,
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Speaker 1: but it's not schizophrenia. They have nothing to do with
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Speaker 1: each other other than they're both types of mental illness.
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Speaker 1: And um, Hollywood is fascinated by them, that's right. Um
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Speaker 1: So yeah, well, and that's that's a pretty good example,
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Speaker 1: like of medicines is starting to get ahold of what
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Speaker 1: schizophrenia is, what mental illnesses you know in general, and
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Speaker 1: then the public at large still just being completely under
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Speaker 1: educated about it. Um, so let's educate people about it. Yeah.
6:10
Speaker 1: I want to say too that this is like a
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Speaker 1: lot of conditions, um and disorders that developed later in life.
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Speaker 1: To me, that's this one of the scariest things that
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Speaker 1: can happen. Like your cruising along at eight years old
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Speaker 1: and you think, like you know, I'm all good, and
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Speaker 1: you can develop schizophrenia like a boom in a matter
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Speaker 1: of weeks. Sometimes. Yeah, it can either come on gradually
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Speaker 1: or very suddenly in an acute manner. Um And like
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Speaker 1: you said, later in life. With men, schizophrenia usually develops
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Speaker 1: um in the late teens or early twenties is when
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Speaker 1: it starts um. Or in women it's the mid twenties
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Speaker 1: or the early thirties. So yeah, by the time, by
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Speaker 1: the time I was thirty, I certainly didn't think I
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Speaker 1: was going to become mentally ill. No, you thought, I
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Speaker 1: know my demons, you can write them down in a list.
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Speaker 1: I can quit them anytime I want. And that's what
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Speaker 1: they are, their self imposed demons, right this this is
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Speaker 1: it wasn't something that was beyond my control that happened
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Speaker 1: to my mind. And yeah, that's how schizophrenia hit you.
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Speaker 1: Hit you later in life, and it can happen all
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Speaker 1: at once or gradually. And this is not to scare
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Speaker 1: the crap out of you. If you're in your teens
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Speaker 1: or twenties, because there's only about a one percent chance schizophrenia.
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Speaker 1: It depends if if you're part of the general population,
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Speaker 1: there's a one percent chance. But as we'll see that,
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Speaker 1: there are risk factors that increase your chances of having schizophrenia.
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Speaker 1: And no, we're not trying to scare you, but I
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Speaker 1: guess kind of the newest forms of treatment or newest
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Speaker 1: thoughts about treating schizophrenia is to make people aware of it,
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Speaker 1: uh so that they will be able to recognize it
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Speaker 1: early on. And apparently early treatment leads to a better
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Speaker 1: success rate. I think we'll talk about that to the board.
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Speaker 1: But chuck, um, there's two kinds of symptoms of schizophrenia,
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Speaker 1: and they're positive and negative. And it's not like positive
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Speaker 1: symptom means you hallucinate bunnies, where negative symptom means you
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Speaker 1: hallucinate like a hell demon. Instead, positive symptom is like
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Speaker 1: an exaggeration of normal behavior. So like I see you,
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Speaker 1: I hear things, but I don't see you with horns,
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Speaker 1: and I don't hear Kermit here talking to me, right um,
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Speaker 1: So a positive symptom is an exaggerated behavior. Negative symptom
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Speaker 1: is the absence of normal behavior, like you lack affect
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Speaker 1: or the ability to experience any emotion. Um, or you
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Speaker 1: you basically are just generally apathetic, right and so it
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Speaker 1: so those are that's positive symptoms and negative symptoms. Yes,
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Speaker 1: and uh, certain negative symptoms are cognitive that deal a
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Speaker 1: lot with a tension span and memory, um, lack of
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Speaker 1: memory an ability to like plan anything or organize anything. Right.
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Speaker 1: And then another form of negative I should say, is
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Speaker 1: called avolition. Um, it's basically I think Crappler, the guy
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Speaker 1: who first classified schizophrenia, call it the annihilation of the will,
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Speaker 1: where you're just so withdrawn you can't. You no longer
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Speaker 1: engage in gold directed behavior, from brushing your teeth to
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Speaker 1: paying your bills to doing anything. You're totally withdrawn. So
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Speaker 1: that's that's that's not the form of schizophrenia you usually
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Speaker 1: hear about, but apparently it's fairly common. So get diagnosed. Uh, Josh,
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Speaker 1: you have to um exhibit a certain number of these
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Speaker 1: symptoms over at least six months without stopping. Right, yeah. Um,
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Speaker 1: if you have uh, is it schizophrenic form is like
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Speaker 1: a shorter it's schizophrenia, but it lasts less than six months. Yeah,
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Speaker 1: that's schizophrenic form. Good point. But if you according to
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Speaker 1: the d s M, and we should say like this
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Speaker 1: is you know, it's based on clinical observations or whatever,
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Speaker 1: but this is the d s M saying six months.
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Speaker 1: It may be you may have schizophrenia and you just
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Speaker 1: haven't reached the six months you know period yet, but
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Speaker 1: you're still schizophrenic. But to be diagnosed by a psychiatrist
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Speaker 1: or psychologist who's a member of the a p A,
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Speaker 1: you have to have X number of symptoms for six
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Speaker 1: months or more. Yeah, and they have to do that
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Speaker 1: because it's like the same as the cops when they
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Speaker 1: say you can't follow missing person's report unless they've been
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Speaker 1: gone for twenty four hours. And it's not like that,
10:31
Speaker 1: but it's sort of like that. Now there's like a law,
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Speaker 1: I think in Michigan called Kaylee's Law or something that
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Speaker 1: they're introducing where if you're a parent and you don't
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Speaker 1: report your kid missing after twenty four hours is a felony.
10:43
Speaker 1: What kind of parent wouldn't do that? The parent that
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Speaker 1: Casey Anthony made the kid go away allegedly not in general, Uh,
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Speaker 1: schizophrenia apparently, as how to pronounced, can take a few forms. Uh.
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Speaker 1: One you've probably heard about most is paranoid schizophrenia, which
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Speaker 1: is when you have the full on delusions and hallucinations.
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Speaker 1: And uh, then there's disorganized that is disorganized thinking. Uh,
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Speaker 1: your behavior is probably incoherent. It's also called hypophrenic. Really
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Speaker 1: and you you probably don't exhibit a lot of emotion. Yeah. Well,
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Speaker 1: usually like there's a negative symptom coupled with um disorganized behavior,
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Speaker 1: so it's almost like two separate things. I think you
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Speaker 1: can be hypophrenic without being negative. There's catatonic um that
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Speaker 1: means you move around and talk excessively. Um. Yeah, that
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Speaker 1: was a surprise to me. I always thought, you know,
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Speaker 1: catatonic state where you're just like that too. But it
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Speaker 1: also says they may become still an uncommunicative so he
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Speaker 1: can be one or the other. Yeah, but I guess
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Speaker 1: it has to do with motion or movement or lack
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Speaker 1: of it's catatonic. Undifferentiated means that it's just sort of
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Speaker 1: the umbrella term for when you have a mix of
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Speaker 1: symptoms and they don't want to classify you as one
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Speaker 1: specific kind. And then residual is if you have a
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Speaker 1: history UM of schizophrenia but you have a long extended
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Speaker 1: period of time with no negative I'm sorry, with negative
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Speaker 1: but no positive symptoms, they'll classify as residual, which you know,
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Speaker 1: I guess that's better than paranoid schizophrenia in a way.
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Speaker 1: I don't think any form of schizophrenia is right. It
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Speaker 1: would that would be it would be horrible. This is
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Speaker 1: a horrible disease. That's like the curb your enthusiasm. When
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Speaker 1: Larry asked if someone had good Hodgkins from the Party
12:38
Speaker 1: of Five episode is what he was referencing. When Charlie
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Speaker 1: got sick, he had quote unquote good Hodgkins and they
12:42
Speaker 1: were like that, they were so offended. There's no good Hodgens.
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Speaker 1: He's like, yeah, but one's better than the other, right,
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Speaker 1: And they were just like, you're such a jerk. They
12:51
Speaker 1: never seen anything like that. Yeah, pretty much. Uh. And
12:54
Speaker 1: then we mentioned schizophrenic form, which is an abbreviated version
12:58
Speaker 1: of schizophrenia, and then in this one has to be
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Speaker 1: just horrible schizo effective disorder. It's any kind of schizophrenia
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Speaker 1: couple with the mood disorder like depression. All right, that's awful.
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Speaker 1: So um, we should probably say there's delusions and there's
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Speaker 1: hallucinations Uh, mixed in together often with schizophrenic symptoms, and
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Speaker 1: they're often confused. But a delusion is a false belief
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Speaker 1: and and hallucination is a false sensation like Hey, I'm
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Speaker 1: Jesus Christ. That would be a delusion. Or hey, there's
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Speaker 1: Jesus Christ on top of that subway car. That would
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Speaker 1: be a hallucination. Yeah, and you can extend that to
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Speaker 1: anything to be Jesus or a subway car. Um. But
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Speaker 1: the there's just studying hallucinations and delusions are really really
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Speaker 1: interesting in my opinion. Um. The most common hallucination is
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Speaker 1: auditory among schizophrenics, and the most common auditories hallucination is
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Speaker 1: our voices. Yeah, they hear voices that can come from
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Speaker 1: anywhere from this kermit the frog could start talking to me,
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Speaker 1: or it could come from thin air, or it could
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Speaker 1: come from the electrical outlet in the wall. Um and Uh.
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Speaker 1: The voices say. Usually it's like one word, a couple
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Speaker 1: of words. There's an implication of word. Sometimes it's indistinct mumbling. Um.
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Speaker 1: On occasion, very rare occasions, will the voice like ramble
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Speaker 1: on coherently where the patient understands like long sentences. But
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Speaker 1: um that they also maybe commenting on what the person
14:44
Speaker 1: is doing is very um common. Usually it's um not
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Speaker 1: a voice that they recognize, although that can happen as well.
14:52
Speaker 1: Yeah right, Uh. And then sometimes there's more than one voice,
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Speaker 1: and even more disconcerting, lee the voices will argue about
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Speaker 1: the patient. Yeah, which that's wow. Well those I mean,
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Speaker 1: there's a guy on Martha that I see that, and
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Speaker 1: a lot of people that you see that are walking
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Speaker 1: down the streets screaming out out loud. They there's probably
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Speaker 1: a pretty good chance that they might be paranoid to
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Speaker 1: get sprintic, and they are yelling at the voice in
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Speaker 1: their head. That reminds me the stand up it I
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Speaker 1: saw when I was a kid in the eighties. Uh,
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Speaker 1: this guy was like this. This comedian said he was
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Speaker 1: walking down the street and he walked past this guy
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Speaker 1: was talking to himself and it's just mumbling, sounded so angry,
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Speaker 1: and the comedian goes and I thought, man, that guy
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Speaker 1: is really crazy. He's talking to himself. And then I thought, wait,
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Speaker 1: who am I talking to? Yeah it's a good point. Yeah,
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Speaker 1: I talked to myself all day long. I have arguments
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Speaker 1: in my head. But of course it's not the same thing. No, Um, no,
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Speaker 1: you don't have two voices arguing over what you're doing
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Speaker 1: at that moment and what's best for you or whether
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Speaker 1: you should hurt somebody or hurt yourself. Not making light
15:58
Speaker 1: of that. Uh. And the reason that a percentage of
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Speaker 1: frightening percentage of schizophrenics kill themselves as a lot of
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Speaker 1: times because the voice in their head may command them
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Speaker 1: to do so. Right there there. There's such a thing
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Speaker 1: as um commanding hallucinations, which is sometimes they could be
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Speaker 1: suggestive like, um, maybe we should go outside for a while,
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Speaker 1: or they could be like go outside, you know, And
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Speaker 1: it's not always scary, like they just point out. Sometimes
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Speaker 1: it's uh, hey you need to shave again, and you'll
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Speaker 1: go shave again. Yeah. It can be innocuous, but it
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Speaker 1: can it can lead to violence, or it can urge violence.
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Speaker 1: Apparently the vast majority of people who suffer uh, dangerous
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Speaker 1: command hallucinations are able to suppress them. But it's a
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Speaker 1: struggle and you know this is going on in this
16:48
Speaker 1: person's head. Yeah, and rarely, and I wondered about this
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Speaker 1: too before I got to that point in the article
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Speaker 1: that you sent me. Rarely, do you hear like, really
16:57
Speaker 1: great things like you're doing great today and you should
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Speaker 1: go and smell it. You know, it's interesting that it
17:04
Speaker 1: usually takes a dark turn and they don't know why. No,
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Speaker 1: they don't. Um. There's also uh hallucinations of touch, haptic hallucinations,
17:15
Speaker 1: which sound pretty awful. Um, things are crawling on you,
17:18
Speaker 1: things are inside of you trying to get out. Your
17:21
Speaker 1: bowels are shriveling. Um, you're being jolted by electricity is
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Speaker 1: a very common one. And then delusions obviously or any
17:30
Speaker 1: like any false belief. There's some that like you are
17:34
Speaker 1: Jesus Christ. That's a delusion, right. Um. But there's there
17:38
Speaker 1: was one subcategory that caught my attention that I wasn't
17:42
Speaker 1: aware of. It's called delusion of reference. Yeah, tell me
17:45
Speaker 1: about that. Well. It's basically like every single thing that
17:48
Speaker 1: goes on in life is full of meaning. Right. So,
17:52
Speaker 1: like in this Brown University sheet I sent you, there's
17:55
Speaker 1: a like a waiter leaving a crama on the table.
18:00
Speaker 1: That's purposeful. It's an insult to the patient, like the
18:03
Speaker 1: the busboy or the waiter did that on purpose as
18:06
Speaker 1: an insult or. Um. The street lights coming on all
18:10
Speaker 1: of a sudden is a signal for everybody to swarm
18:13
Speaker 1: on you and finally take you away or kill you
18:15
Speaker 1: or whatever. Like everything in life has meaning and it's
18:19
Speaker 1: making you. It's it's fueling this paranoia. Your mind is
18:22
Speaker 1: turning against you. It's pretty awful. Have we said it's awful? Yeah, okay, yes,
18:27
Speaker 1: it is quite awful. Um, but people live with this. Yeah.
18:32
Speaker 1: I mean we painted a dark picture because it is
18:34
Speaker 1: a dark disorder. But the majority of people in fact
18:38
Speaker 1: stet time. Uh, after ten years, if you want to know,
18:43
Speaker 1: after ten years of diagnosis with schizophrenia completely recover are
18:51
Speaker 1: much improved and relatively independent and are improved but require
18:56
Speaker 1: a pretty extensive support network. So that's seventy percent of
19:01
Speaker 1: people after diagnosis after a decade are are dealing with
19:05
Speaker 1: it fairly. Well, Um, that's it's very hopeful. That's not bad.
19:10
Speaker 1: Are unimproved in ten percent unfortunately are dead, probably by suicide. Yeah, well,
19:15
Speaker 1: ten percent at least of um schizophrenics commits suicide, which
19:20
Speaker 1: is incredibly high because in the general population of the
19:25
Speaker 1: United States, point zero one percent of people commit suicide
19:31
Speaker 1: to point zero one percent. Yeah, and that's people who
19:33
Speaker 1: are successful. They think it could be attempts could be
19:36
Speaker 1: as high as people that try to kill themselves just uh.
19:40
Speaker 1: I mean imagine sometimes the voices say to do it,
19:42
Speaker 1: and sometimes it's just a fine piece. Yeah, I was
19:46
Speaker 1: wondering what the breakdown between those two is. Um. And
19:52
Speaker 1: then violence is often attendant with schizophrenics, at least in
19:57
Speaker 1: the public mind, right D dangerous. Apparently studies have shown
20:02
Speaker 1: I remember reading about this when we talked about latent inhibition,
20:06
Speaker 1: UM that if you are typically violent when these uh,
20:12
Speaker 1: when the symptoms set and you're like early twenties or whatever, um,
20:17
Speaker 1: you're going to possibly be a violence schizophrenic. If you're
20:20
Speaker 1: not a very violent person, you're it's just not part
20:23
Speaker 1: of your personality before the symptoms set in, then you're
20:27
Speaker 1: not going to be a violence schizophrenic unless you abuse
20:31
Speaker 1: drugs or alcohol, which apparently vastly increases the chances that
20:36
Speaker 1: you may be a violent schizophrenic. Yeah. And even then,
20:38
Speaker 1: I think the violence is generally either self inflicted or
20:41
Speaker 1: it takes place inside the home, like against your family,
20:45
Speaker 1: which is not good. But the point is, if you're
20:47
Speaker 1: walking down the street and sadly you see the homeless
20:50
Speaker 1: man screaming out loud, you don't necessarily need to be
20:54
Speaker 1: afraid that he's about to, you know, attack you in
20:58
Speaker 1: a violent manner. That's probably not gonna happen. Chuck. Let's
21:02
Speaker 1: say you do want to talk to that schizophrenic homeless
21:04
Speaker 1: man over there, but you don't want to make things
21:07
Speaker 1: worse for him, right, but you don't want to ignore
21:10
Speaker 1: him's another human being. Um. The National Institutes of Mental
21:15
Speaker 1: Health have UM suggestions I guess for talking to schizophrenics
21:21
Speaker 1: and specifically with their families who have to deal with
21:24
Speaker 1: delusions and hallucinations all the time, specifically delusions. UM. Apparently
21:30
Speaker 1: you don't you don't contest what they're saying. Yeah, you
21:34
Speaker 1: don't want to say you're not Jesus Christ. What are
21:37
Speaker 1: you talking about? Yeah, you don't say no, you say, Um,
21:42
Speaker 1: I respect your right to believe different things, and I
21:45
Speaker 1: hope you'll respect my right to believe different things. But
21:47
Speaker 1: I I, you know, politely disagree. And what you also
21:51
Speaker 1: don't want to do is agree and say I know, honey,
21:53
Speaker 1: you are Jesus Christ. Right, You're okay, you're Jesus and
21:56
Speaker 1: it's fine. Yes, A lot of people probably take that
21:59
Speaker 1: tack in the family, you know, Well, yeah, first, I mean,
22:02
Speaker 1: at the very least because it's just easier after a while,
22:04
Speaker 1: it's like yes, yes, or you get so frustrated you're
22:08
Speaker 1: like no, you're not and you want to shake the
22:09
Speaker 1: person um. But yeah, apparently, And I wonder how hard
22:15
Speaker 1: it is to say, well, I I respectfully disagree with you. Yeah,
22:19
Speaker 1: I bet it's hard, you know. And if it if
22:21
Speaker 1: it does go over as well as as it seems
22:23
Speaker 1: like it that it suggested it should, you know, all right, Josh,
22:28
Speaker 1: I think this was really interesting. The recovery in the
22:30
Speaker 1: Third World part. Yeah, Apparently, the World Health Organization did
22:35
Speaker 1: a study in the nineteen sixties and uh I found
22:39
Speaker 1: that the recovery rate for schizophrenia and developing nations is
22:43
Speaker 1: higher by a full third than it is in the
22:46
Speaker 1: industrialized world. And then they did a follow up study
22:49
Speaker 1: even to correct possible selection biases, and they confirmed the
22:54
Speaker 1: original finding. And I thought that was really interesting. And
22:57
Speaker 1: they there's a lot of hypotheses, but one of them
23:00
Speaker 1: is that a there might not be a stigma like
23:04
Speaker 1: in the industrialized world, and they're just more readily accepted.
23:08
Speaker 1: And the other is that they might be able to
23:10
Speaker 1: have a job that they can do successfully and here
23:15
Speaker 1: in the West farming or digging, you know, digging the
23:17
Speaker 1: trench for the farm or whatever. Here in the West,
23:20
Speaker 1: we're very competitive. Yeah, it's hard to get a job
23:23
Speaker 1: that schizophrenic can maybe successfully complete. And I mean the
23:27
Speaker 1: rest of us are paranoid enough as it is about
23:29
Speaker 1: losing our jobs. If you are clinically paranoid schizophrenic, then
23:33
Speaker 1: it's probably going to be very difficult to keep your job, true,
23:36
Speaker 1: or do it in a way that will help you
23:39
Speaker 1: keep your job. That's very true. But Josh, there have
23:41
Speaker 1: been some successful stories of people that are afflicted with schizophrenia. Well,
23:47
Speaker 1: some some more successful and some. Sid Barrett was successful,
23:52
Speaker 1: but I don't know if you call him a success story.
23:54
Speaker 1: Ended up in a mental institution for the rest of
23:56
Speaker 1: his life. Sid Barrett founding member of Pink Floyd Schizophrenic
24:00
Speaker 1: and they believe that massive amounts of drugs that he
24:03
Speaker 1: used made it worse, way worse. John he is he
24:06
Speaker 1: is the crazy Diamond. Yeah, shine on you, Crazy Diamond.
24:10
Speaker 1: I love that song. That's a good one. All four
24:12
Speaker 1: parts of it, right, and they're like part I think
24:15
Speaker 1: up the part four is it? Yeah? Yeah, John Nash, Yeah,
24:19
Speaker 1: from the movie A Beautiful Mind. The Ron Howard film
24:22
Speaker 1: with Russell Crowe as John Nash, the Nobel Winner figure
24:27
Speaker 1: out that cable companies would do better if they cooperated
24:31
Speaker 1: with one another. That's right, And that movie did a
24:33
Speaker 1: lot for putting this on the map in a compassionate way,
24:35
Speaker 1: you know. And Jack carollact, did you know that one?
24:39
Speaker 1: That was debatable? Okay, he was in the Navy and
24:41
Speaker 1: they discharged him honorably after I think like a little
24:45
Speaker 1: less than a year and and the report they said
24:48
Speaker 1: he had schizoid tendencies. But um, other people have said
24:53
Speaker 1: that he faked that stuff to get out of the navy. Uh,
24:56
Speaker 1: and just wanted to not take orders and drink him
25:00
Speaker 1: off to death, which is what he did. And Pop
25:02
Speaker 1: Benny's do you know how he died? No, he woke
25:06
Speaker 1: up and was just like coughing blood and bleeding from
25:10
Speaker 1: his mouth and basically was like, I gotta get the hospital.
25:13
Speaker 1: Took him to the hospital and he was his liver
25:17
Speaker 1: was so shot that his blood wooden clot and they
25:20
Speaker 1: just were giving him transfusion one after the other and
25:24
Speaker 1: he just basically bled to death Holy cow from drinking
25:27
Speaker 1: holy cow. And he was drinking at the time. He
25:31
Speaker 1: was drinking whiskey and like whiskey and malt liquor. When
25:35
Speaker 1: he started, blood started coming out of his mouth. I
25:39
Speaker 1: wonder how that taste? Would you shake us through that?
25:42
Speaker 1: And I don't think he mixed him. I think he
25:43
Speaker 1: was like whiskey with a beer back in it, garnish
25:46
Speaker 1: with a drop of blood. So, kids, there's a lesson
25:50
Speaker 1: for you there here. There's one more person who is
25:53
Speaker 1: indisputably schizophrenic or was His name is Wesley Willis? Is
25:58
Speaker 1: that he is a musician who had such songs as well. Really,
26:03
Speaker 1: the only title I can say is rock and roll McDonald's.
26:06
Speaker 1: I don't I've never heard of him. You you have
26:10
Speaker 1: had to have heard of Wesley Willis. Okay, let me
26:14
Speaker 1: play you a little Wesley Willis. Right here. McDonald's is
26:22
Speaker 1: a place to rock. It is a restaurant where the
26:26
Speaker 1: bi fool. It is a good place to listen to
26:29
Speaker 1: the music. People flock here to get down to the rock.
26:32
Speaker 1: Musing rock, Gay, Romado, Rocky rom mcda, Rogay, Roam mcdonaldos,
26:44
Speaker 1: rock rumdo so chuck. That's Wesley will Okay, okay, and
26:49
Speaker 1: um he was very much schizophrenic. Um he wrote about
26:53
Speaker 1: it a lot. He talked about it in a lot
26:54
Speaker 1: of his songs and um, he said he'd just be
26:57
Speaker 1: going along, having a nice time riding the bush. I
27:00
Speaker 1: believe he lived in Chicago and then all of a sudden,
27:03
Speaker 1: his um, his hell demons would take him on one
27:08
Speaker 1: of his torture hell rides, which meant he was going
27:12
Speaker 1: on a little bit of an exacerbation of his schizophrenia symptoms.
27:16
Speaker 1: But he's a great, great guy, great music, very prolific.
27:20
Speaker 1: And uh, if you liked that, you should go watch
27:24
Speaker 1: Daddy rock and Roll as a documentary. But yeah, it's
27:27
Speaker 1: really good. I'll check that out. Yeah, Lionel Aldridge is
27:31
Speaker 1: a last name on our list. And he was a
27:33
Speaker 1: Green Bay packer and he was homeless unfortunately after he
27:36
Speaker 1: was diagnosed for a while and then later was able
27:39
Speaker 1: to climb out from that wreckage and go around and
27:44
Speaker 1: talk about mental illness, and he was he was playing
27:47
Speaker 1: in the sixties, the seventies. I think it was late
27:52
Speaker 1: sixties or seventies. So think about it, man, that's a
27:54
Speaker 1: big deal to go around and talk publicly about mental
27:57
Speaker 1: illness at that time, and it still is now. But
28:01
Speaker 1: I mean, like back then, that's hats off to him. Yeah,
28:03
Speaker 1: he was the guy that I included in the presentation
28:06
Speaker 1: that you did by yourself that you're like, he was
28:08
Speaker 1: this guy. All right, I understand now, Yeah, it's all
28:12
Speaker 1: coming together. So chuck, um, what causes this? Well, uh,
28:19
Speaker 1: it seems like there are environmental factors and there are
28:22
Speaker 1: genetic factors. Um. They have isolated what they believe are
28:25
Speaker 1: some genes the d I, s C one, the disbanden,
28:31
Speaker 1: the neuragoulin, and the G seven two genes, and they
28:36
Speaker 1: think there might be up to a dozen more genes
28:38
Speaker 1: that could impact this. Okay, So the basis of that
28:43
Speaker 1: is that they can't just look at your genes and
28:45
Speaker 1: say you're you're going to be schizophrenic. Right. It's possible
28:50
Speaker 1: that it's because we just haven't isolated all the genes
28:52
Speaker 1: and don't know the right combination yet. Or it's possible
28:56
Speaker 1: that it's from other causes, one of which one of
28:59
Speaker 1: the yours that's out there right now, is that it's
29:02
Speaker 1: the result of an in utero exposure to either a
29:06
Speaker 1: flu or the dread toxoplasmus. Remember toxoplasmuss that hijacks rats brains,
29:12
Speaker 1: that's found in cat urine that's why if you have
29:15
Speaker 1: a cat and you're pregnant, you don't be clean enough
29:17
Speaker 1: that litter box, right, um. And they think that one
29:19
Speaker 1: of the reasons, I guess, one of the evident pieces
29:22
Speaker 1: of evidence that supports this is called the birth month effect,
29:25
Speaker 1: and the birth month effect is, UM, if you were
29:28
Speaker 1: born in winter months or early spring months, you are
29:31
Speaker 1: at a higher risk for becoming schizophrenic later in life.
29:35
Speaker 1: And they think that those are flu months. UM. And
29:39
Speaker 1: another aspect of it is apparently the brains of schizophrenics
29:42
Speaker 1: show inflamed white blood cells, which is a sign of
29:44
Speaker 1: an infection. And they think that possibly all of us
29:47
Speaker 1: are carrying around a retrovirus encoded in our genes that
29:51
Speaker 1: lies dormant like ms that under the right circumstances like
29:55
Speaker 1: early exposure between infection UM can trigger its release where
30:00
Speaker 1: trigger it's activation, and it takes eighteen to twenty to
30:04
Speaker 1: thirty years to come on. Now you see why people
30:07
Speaker 1: that are pregnant are worried a lot. It's amazing that,
30:12
Speaker 1: like we've gotten anywhere. Yeah, so what else? Uh? Well,
30:18
Speaker 1: they did do have some new findings. I got this today,
30:21
Speaker 1: um from the internets. They have a new South Wales
30:26
Speaker 1: study from Thomas Wikert. He has identified the brain mechanism
30:31
Speaker 1: that derails decision making and people. So basically the part
30:34
Speaker 1: of the brain is called the ventral stratium I'm sorry,
30:37
Speaker 1: stray Adam, and it lights up you know, they put
30:40
Speaker 1: people neam all right, lights up when in response to
30:42
Speaker 1: rewards and healthy people and it's linked to your decision making,
30:46
Speaker 1: but completely unresponsive among schizophrenics. So they don't uh, they
30:52
Speaker 1: don't know the difference between expected and unexpected rewards, and
30:56
Speaker 1: so they don't have the opportunity to make a good
30:58
Speaker 1: decision to again with and that you know, it's a
31:02
Speaker 1: it's a nice finding. It doesn't get us any closer.
31:05
Speaker 1: Well maybe it does, you never know. They say, with
31:08
Speaker 1: proper funding that they predicted they could have a cure
31:12
Speaker 1: for this. Well yeah, but they don't get proper funding.
31:16
Speaker 1: But they're UM. They're looking into stem cells, right, they're
31:20
Speaker 1: looking into UM figuring out if it is an infection
31:25
Speaker 1: and if so liked adding that UM. And we've also
31:29
Speaker 1: long had antipsychotics. One of the things, strangely enough, that
31:33
Speaker 1: helped develop anti psychotics or better antipsychotics UM is PCP.
31:40
Speaker 1: Apparently researchers figured out that UM phenel cyclading UM or
31:45
Speaker 1: fencyclading PCP, the drug angel dust Um, produced such similar
31:52
Speaker 1: symptoms to schizophrenia that they started investigating and found that
31:56
Speaker 1: it had to do with UM the neurotransmitter glutamate, right right, right, Yes,
32:04
Speaker 1: well it has to do with both. But the emphasis
32:06
Speaker 1: before on anti psychotics was strictly dopamine and all it
32:10
Speaker 1: all it did was keep dopamine in the synapse is
32:13
Speaker 1: longer by blocking its reuptake by receptors. That's what antipsychotics do.
32:18
Speaker 1: And then in the eighties, after the PCP stuff UM,
32:21
Speaker 1: they figured out that there was glutamate was involved and
32:25
Speaker 1: they came up with a typical antipsychotics, and these focus
32:29
Speaker 1: somewhat on dopamine but more on things like glutamate and
32:33
Speaker 1: its reuptake, and uh, these things have produced better results
32:38
Speaker 1: with fewer side effects, so um, they're they're figuring out
32:41
Speaker 1: how to treat it. The problem is that there's all
32:44
Speaker 1: sorts of side effects even even with a typical UM antipsychotics,
32:49
Speaker 1: like weight gain, drowsiness, servishness, nervousness, muscle spasms. Yeah ALLUM.
32:54
Speaker 1: Bulging eyes apparently is one UM, and I guess most
32:59
Speaker 1: of the stuff can be treated by lowering the dosage,
33:01
Speaker 1: but they're they're bothersome enough that a lot of people
33:03
Speaker 1: just go off their meds and you know that doesn't
33:07
Speaker 1: help ect. Electroc convulsive therapy is another thing that they
33:10
Speaker 1: still do. It's not something irrelic from the fifties. It's
33:14
Speaker 1: changed a lot and how they do it, and they're
33:16
Speaker 1: not sure still how it exactly works. They stopped using
33:19
Speaker 1: car batteries, but about a hundred thousand Americans each year
33:25
Speaker 1: still receive e c T. So that is an option.
33:29
Speaker 1: And obviously the group therapy and family therapy help just
33:32
Speaker 1: the dealing with it aspect of the family. Yes, so
33:36
Speaker 1: we encourage you to seek helped as soon as possible. Yeah,
33:38
Speaker 1: And apparently families can help in very little ways. They're
33:41
Speaker 1: encouraged to UM set small goals. Apparently, if especially if
33:47
Speaker 1: you UM have lost your drive or your will as
33:50
Speaker 1: a result of your schizophrenia, or you're disorganized, it can
33:54
Speaker 1: just be compounded by all the you know, like when
33:57
Speaker 1: your life is disorganized, it seems to completely unwieldy, Like
34:01
Speaker 1: where do I start right now? If if that's a
34:03
Speaker 1: symptom of your schizophrenia, it's it's just that much worse.
34:07
Speaker 1: So if you can help a schizophrenic get back on
34:09
Speaker 1: track by setting small goals and building up their confidence again,
34:13
Speaker 1: apparently that has a measurable effect in their recovery UM
34:19
Speaker 1: and then the like the one of the leading edges
34:22
Speaker 1: of UM schizophrenia treatment right now is based on the
34:27
Speaker 1: this thing called the prodrome, which is the period between
34:33
Speaker 1: the onset of symptoms where you think maybe I am
34:37
Speaker 1: Jesus Christ and the time when that seems like your reality.
34:41
Speaker 1: So it's this point where you're starting to have the ideas,
34:44
Speaker 1: but they still seem bizarre or weird or why am
34:47
Speaker 1: I having these ideas? So if you apparently seek out
34:51
Speaker 1: treatment for schizophrenia when you start to have these ideas
34:56
Speaker 1: UM in the prodrome, the success rate of treatment is
35:03
Speaker 1: through the roof. Like Yes, this British doctor in the
35:06
Speaker 1: late eighties set up shop in these two towns outside
35:08
Speaker 1: of London and he's set to work finding every potential
35:14
Speaker 1: early case of schizophrenia he could, and he started treating
35:18
Speaker 1: people with therapy and low doses of anti psychotics, and
35:21
Speaker 1: in four years those two towns had a tenth of
35:25
Speaker 1: the prevalence of schizophrenia of the rest of the country. Yeah,
35:29
Speaker 1: so apparently like this pro drome research, there's like clinics
35:32
Speaker 1: that are opening up and like entire like departments in
35:35
Speaker 1: universities are dedicated to this prodrome period where you can
35:39
Speaker 1: be like, come, come back, come, this is reality. Yeah,
35:43
Speaker 1: and they're successful or they have been so far. Well, Josh,
35:46
Speaker 1: I got one more stat If you live in a
35:48
Speaker 1: city of three million people, then over twenty one thousand
35:53
Speaker 1: people in your city are suffering from schizophrenia. So well,
35:57
Speaker 1: keep that in mind. Yes, don't make fun of people.
36:00
Speaker 1: Don't obviously get scared or violent and in a reactive way.
36:06
Speaker 1: I don't know that I'm gonna say, like you should
36:08
Speaker 1: go over and talk to them, like you might want
36:10
Speaker 1: to just be compassionate and uh and hopefully they're getting help,
36:14
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. Go to schizophrenia dot com.
36:16
Speaker 1: You can find all kinds of good information. And if
36:19
Speaker 1: you hadn't already checked out Wesley Willis, check him out.
36:21
Speaker 1: He was a great guy. Check out The Daddy or
36:23
Speaker 1: Rock and Roll and um. Also, I would say, in
36:26
Speaker 1: addition to how schizophrenia works, UM required reading for this
36:30
Speaker 1: one is an article called Which Way Madness Lies? By
36:34
Speaker 1: Rachel lviv. It was in the December two issue of
36:38
Speaker 1: Harper's And I have a link, I'll I'll tweet it.
36:41
Speaker 1: I'll tweet the link out with that. That sounds great.
36:43
Speaker 1: If you want more about schizophrenia, Um, there's plenty of it.
36:46
Speaker 1: There's an article and then some on the site. Just
36:49
Speaker 1: type schizophrenia which again means split mind right into the
36:54
Speaker 1: search bar at how stuff works dot com and that
36:56
Speaker 1: brings up what check listener? Now, yes, Josh specific correction?
37:05
Speaker 1: Oh wow, I forgot about those. Yeah, well, well we'll
37:07
Speaker 1: correct ourselves on Facebook and stuff. But they mounted up,
37:11
Speaker 1: so sure we want We'll go for it. How wildfires work? Oh? Man,
37:17
Speaker 1: I don't have this guy's name. A couple of people
37:19
Speaker 1: sitting this in. Uh, the flash point of paper is
37:22
Speaker 1: not fahrenheit for fifty one, I said books. The flash
37:26
Speaker 1: point of books is not fahrenheit for fifty one. It
37:29
Speaker 1: is fahrenheit eight fifty one celsius for fifty and Ray
37:33
Speaker 1: Bradbury apparently changed the title because fahrenheit for fifty one
37:38
Speaker 1: sounds a lot better than celsius for fifty Apparently, what
37:41
Speaker 1: was one no celsius for fifty is the flash point
37:46
Speaker 1: or Fahrenheit eight as good as I think, Yeah, okay,
37:53
Speaker 1: but I assume that as well. Man, I wish I
37:55
Speaker 1: had his name. You know who you are. And it
37:57
Speaker 1: was a very nice correction. Those are the ones we
37:58
Speaker 1: like to read. Uh. Then we got a correction on
38:01
Speaker 1: who was the first murderer, apparently, David says, and even
38:06
Speaker 1: sent in a copy of one by Charles Mann. What
38:10
Speaker 1: where what he's an email? No, not a not a
38:15
Speaker 1: He sent a scan cop the page in four, he says.
38:21
Speaker 1: Charles Mann says, although Billington was in fact hanged, at
38:25
Speaker 1: least two other Europeans were executed before him. One was
38:28
Speaker 1: convicted for the much more interesting offense of killing his
38:31
Speaker 1: pregnant wife and eating her. So how about that, he said,
38:35
Speaker 1: I was on page fifty five of Yeah, there it is.
38:41
Speaker 1: That is crazy, okay, But still Billington is very noteworthy.
38:45
Speaker 1: Figure obviously sees a whole chapter on him. And then
38:48
Speaker 1: we got some uh. Oh. First of all, some people
38:51
Speaker 1: wrote in about wildfires in Georgia, when I said, oh, Georgia,
38:54
Speaker 1: and that wildfires South Georgia does and there's actually one
38:57
Speaker 1: going on right now in the Okay, Finoki. So I
39:01
Speaker 1: misspoke for sure, because I was just talking about the
39:04
Speaker 1: North Georgia Mountains, which are very lush and green, but
39:07
Speaker 1: Southworgia can get quite dry and there are wildfires in Georgia.
39:12
Speaker 1: I did not know that that's true. And then finally
39:15
Speaker 1: we got an email from an actual Hindu named Kush
39:20
Speaker 1: k U s h and Kush says, you guys missed
39:23
Speaker 1: a few things. Hinduism, typically, I'm sorry, technically only has
39:27
Speaker 1: one god, not a pantheon. It's complicated to explain, especially
39:31
Speaker 1: in the non Hindus, but the general idea is there
39:33
Speaker 1: is one universal soul or god that encompasses everything, called
39:37
Speaker 1: the brah Brahman, not the bro Ham, and every living
39:44
Speaker 1: thing has a part of that in us called the Atoman.
39:48
Speaker 1: The different gods are just different forms of the one Brahman. Also,
39:51
Speaker 1: you didn't properly explain the laws of karma. The law
39:54
Speaker 1: of karma has three parts in Hinduism. One, the performer
39:57
Speaker 1: of an action will get the result to the result,
40:00
Speaker 1: but the action will come right at the right time.
40:02
Speaker 1: And three good actions bring good results, bad actions bring
40:05
Speaker 1: bad results. And fourth, the gods are technically subject to karma.
40:10
Speaker 1: If you also expand the definition of karma to include
40:13
Speaker 1: the law of karma. But he says it was a
40:16
Speaker 1: good podcast overall. You guys really hit it on the
40:18
Speaker 1: head except for these few points. He did not hit
40:20
Speaker 1: it on the head for that. No, I'll just for
40:22
Speaker 1: that one part. And finally he pointed out and a
40:25
Speaker 1: few other people pointed out that I was wrong in
40:27
Speaker 1: correcting you with Jainism, and yeah, it's jain is m.
40:32
Speaker 1: But I'm gonna play you something right now. Okay, okay,
40:39
Speaker 1: that was from dictionary dot com. Well, then that voice
40:43
Speaker 1: is obviously wrong. Maybe so this is from Miriam Webster.
40:48
Speaker 1: If it's the same voice, it doesn't count. Twice did
40:52
Speaker 1: you hear that that's a different voice. Did that one
40:54
Speaker 1: come through Matt? Okay? And then finally, this is Google
40:59
Speaker 1: definitions And this is my favorite of all. Actually I
41:02
Speaker 1: don't like where wow, So I don't know because I
41:07
Speaker 1: had like three other people said three other robots, no,
41:12
Speaker 1: three other real people said no, it's Jaine is Um.
41:14
Speaker 1: And then I went on YouTube and people said Jaine
41:16
Speaker 1: is Um. So I don't know. Well, I like that
41:19
Speaker 1: it's both we're both right or we're both wrong. Yeah, yeah,
41:23
Speaker 1: it's genis Um, well, we love corrections so much that
41:27
Speaker 1: I managed to forget that we or are corrected a lot,
41:30
Speaker 1: or we used to read them. I never forget that
41:32
Speaker 1: we're corrected. Um, but let's do this again soon. Go
41:37
Speaker 1: through all three and fifty episodes, find everything you can
41:42
Speaker 1: that's wrong with them, and then let us know. Okay, okay.
41:46
Speaker 1: Or you can just correct the most recent ones whatever
41:48
Speaker 1: we got wrong in this one, which I'm sure is substantial. Um.
41:52
Speaker 1: You can go on Facebook if you want, You can
41:54
Speaker 1: tweet to us s y s K podcast, or you
41:57
Speaker 1: can send us a plain, old, fushioned email at stuff
42:00
Speaker 1: Podcast at how stuff works dot com. Be sure to
42:08
Speaker 1: check out our new video podcast, Stuff from the Future.
42:11
Speaker 1: Join how Stuff Work staff as we explore the most
42:13
Speaker 1: promising and perplexing possibilities of tomorrow, brought to you by
42:19
Speaker 1: the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. It's ready, are you