Latest / The Occult Rejects / The Rare Element: Lucy Von on Occultism, Contact, and the Search for What’s Real

Transcript

The Rare Element: Lucy Von on Occultism, Contact, and the Search for What’s Real · The Occult Rejects

• 0:02
  Speaker 1: You see, something's going to happen.
• 0:06
  Speaker 2: What's going to happen?
• 0:15
  Speaker 3: What I.
• 0:24
  Speaker 4: Welcome back to the Occult Rejects. Today's guest is Lucy Vron,
• 0:30
  Speaker 4: host of The Rare Element, a podcast devoted to people, experiences,
• 0:34
  Speaker 4: and ideas that exist outside the boundaries of conventual explanation.
• 0:39
  Speaker 4: Through her conversations with occultists, ceremonial magicians, experiencers, artists, mystics,
• 0:45
  Speaker 4: and other unconventual figures, Lucy has created a space where
• 0:49
  Speaker 4: extraordinary claims are not automatically dismissed, but are also given
• 0:53
  Speaker 4: enough room to reveal their complexities, contradictions, and deeper meaning.
• 0:58
  Speaker 4: That makes today's conversation is especially interesting because Lucy is
• 1:01
  Speaker 4: not only someone who studies and participates in this world,
• 1:05
  Speaker 4: she is also someone who interviews the people attempting to
• 1:07
  Speaker 4: define it. She regularly sits down across individuals, describing magic, contact, transformation,
• 1:14
  Speaker 4: hidden traditions, and encounters with realities that may not fit
• 1:17
  Speaker 4: neatly into accepted categories.
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: So today I want to turn the interview around.
• 1:23
  Speaker 4: We are going to talk about Lucy's own background, the
• 1:26
  Speaker 4: experiences that brought her into the occult, the creation of
• 1:28
  Speaker 4: the Rare element and what she has learned from speaking
• 1:31
  Speaker 4: with people who claim to have crossed the boundary between
• 1:34
  Speaker 4: the ordinary and the unknown. But before we get into her,
• 1:37
  Speaker 4: let me introduce the other reject joining us.
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: What is going on, Brandon? How are you sup?
• 1:43
  Speaker 5: Nick?
• 1:43
  Speaker 6: I'm great? Here we go, ready for a fine conversation
• 1:48
  Speaker 6: with Lucy and shout out to all the other rejects
• 1:52
  Speaker 6: out there of the occult, the magical, n esoteric. You
• 1:56
  Speaker 6: know me.
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: This is Maggus in the media on the great occult rejects.
• 2:01
  Speaker 3: Cardinal Head is crushing life right now. Yeah, everyone, just
• 2:06
  Speaker 3: head on over to Magason the media subscribe. I can
• 2:08
  Speaker 3: share as we try to take down the great grand arcons,
• 2:11
  Speaker 3: the technocratic, feudalist elite. They're not elite because they don't
• 2:15
  Speaker 3: understand the divine within us all.
• 2:17
  Speaker 6: So bring back the sacred. Let's get into it.
• 2:20
  Speaker 4: Awesome, my man, I always love your love your spiels
• 2:24
  Speaker 4: gets everybody woking up and ready for the show. Thank
• 2:28
  Speaker 4: you very much, Brandon, always always enjoy when you join
• 2:31
  Speaker 4: join us and Lucy the guest. Please, Lucy, if there
• 2:34
  Speaker 4: was anything, well, I know there was a few things
• 2:36
  Speaker 4: I left out of there that you can promote and
• 2:37
  Speaker 4: talk about, but please don't promote whatever you like and
• 2:40
  Speaker 4: introduce yourself please.
• 2:43
  Speaker 5: All right, I'm Lucy Vaughan. I'm a magician and an entertainer.
• 2:51
  Speaker 5: So should I start off with how I got into
• 2:53
  Speaker 5: the occult?
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: Oh no?
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: No?
• 2:55
  Speaker 4: Well first off, besides that, no, just let everybody know
• 2:57
  Speaker 4: like where they can find your stuff if you want
• 2:59
  Speaker 4: to promote anything right now, your YouTube, your you know
• 3:01
  Speaker 4: all that stuff.
• 3:02
  Speaker 5: All right. You can find me on YouTube at officially
• 3:06
  Speaker 5: Lucy Vaughn. That's where I have just I have interviews
• 3:12
  Speaker 5: there and I also have like some stuff from my
• 3:16
  Speaker 5: when I started beginning, so on the Lucifer Stayan in
• 3:20
  Speaker 5: the Power of You. Then I also have the Rare
• 3:23
  Speaker 5: Element on YouTube as well aslong with my website that
• 3:27
  Speaker 5: has personal services, tarot card readings, and I also have
• 3:31
  Speaker 5: ebook right now, so if you sign up on my
• 3:33
  Speaker 5: website you can go ahead and get my free book
• 3:35
  Speaker 5: Original Sin and that has sigil magic in it and
• 3:39
  Speaker 5: some really cool stories and poems about my life.
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: Awesome. Nice, always love dot Lucy von dot com.
• 3:48
  Speaker 4: Awesome, Thank you so much, Lucy. I appreciate that. Oh yeah,
• 3:51
  Speaker 4: I always love me. Some sigil magic I might have.
• 3:53
  Speaker 5: To check that out, I'll send you.
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: Thank you, thank well.
• 3:57
  Speaker 4: Hopefully maybe we can even talk a little bit about
• 3:59
  Speaker 4: that today as well. But yeah, before we get into it,
• 4:02
  Speaker 4: it's always a question I ask everybody that's involved in
• 4:04
  Speaker 4: the occult, which is pretty much every guest on here,
• 4:08
  Speaker 4: what was it that I guess maybe got you into it?
• 4:10
  Speaker 4: How did you end up finding yourself I guess attracted
• 4:12
  Speaker 4: to this, to this stuff, this life.
• 4:16
  Speaker 5: Well, let's start off at the very beginning. I was
• 4:19
  Speaker 5: born in smack dab of the United States, Dodge City, Kansas,
• 4:23
  Speaker 5: and so I grew up in Bible Belt, USA. So
• 4:27
  Speaker 5: how I came about to be was my mom was
• 4:29
  Speaker 5: actually a Christian missionary. My dad was a Christian missionary
• 4:33
  Speaker 5: and a pastor. So I grew up in a very
• 4:36
  Speaker 5: religious home. Okay, my dad was not like an ordinary pastor.
• 4:41
  Speaker 5: He was very evangelistic. He did the praying in tongues
• 4:44
  Speaker 5: like hunshaman and I like literally would put all ove
• 4:47
  Speaker 5: oil on our heads when we were sick and pray
• 4:50
  Speaker 5: the sickness out of us. So I'm real deal. We
• 4:54
  Speaker 5: would have I been help with Sunday school, and then
• 4:56
  Speaker 5: we would go to the streets and minister to people.
• 5:00
  Speaker 5: Won't have them bring their have them give their life
• 5:02
  Speaker 5: to the Lord. So I was very heavily involved in
• 5:05
  Speaker 5: the church. At the same time, I also always seen
• 5:09
  Speaker 5: like the duality of it. And we grew up like
• 5:13
  Speaker 5: with the garden and like a little farm and all
• 5:15
  Speaker 5: this stuff. So I grew up a lot in nature.
• 5:16
  Speaker 5: We didn't really have TV and all that stuff. So
• 5:19
  Speaker 5: I always noticed, Like looking back now, I can tell
• 5:23
  Speaker 5: like I always had a guardian energy entity with me.
• 5:27
  Speaker 5: There was light. There's light being, I guess I would
• 5:30
  Speaker 5: call it. And I think the best way com pair
• 5:33
  Speaker 5: would be like the sun. And I think like that
• 5:36
  Speaker 5: kind of always gave me a connection to like the reality,
• 5:39
  Speaker 5: like true reality, like you know, nature, how beautiful it
• 5:42
  Speaker 5: is and how pure it is. And to me, religion
• 5:45
  Speaker 5: kind of it kind of didn't. It never sat right
• 5:49
  Speaker 5: with me completely on my soul. I think that even
• 5:51
  Speaker 5: at a very young innocent age, I just had so
• 5:54
  Speaker 5: many questions, Well, if God loves everybody, why do people
• 5:57
  Speaker 5: get punished, you know? And why do people get born
• 5:59
  Speaker 5: into bad lives? You know? So it was just I
• 6:02
  Speaker 5: always had these questions from a bad age because I
• 6:04
  Speaker 5: didn't ever believe that anybody was born a bad person.
• 6:08
  Speaker 5: I believe, you know, we're born innocent and pure and
• 6:10
  Speaker 5: we go through things in life that determine how we
• 6:13
  Speaker 5: end up. You know, we have the power to change that.
• 6:16
  Speaker 5: So I always, I always recognize that stuff at a
• 6:18
  Speaker 5: young age, but I never questioned it. You know, I
• 6:22
  Speaker 5: always prayed to God. I believed in Jesus, I do
• 6:25
  Speaker 5: all that. But I mean as I got older and
• 6:29
  Speaker 5: the human life set in, I mean, I think my
• 6:32
  Speaker 5: questions grew and grew and grew, and then my family
• 6:34
  Speaker 5: went through a divorce and that was really hard on
• 6:37
  Speaker 5: me at a young age, and I kind of had
• 6:39
  Speaker 5: to step up to the plate be a parent to
• 6:42
  Speaker 5: like my other I'm the oldest of seven, so I
• 6:44
  Speaker 5: kind of had to step up and just be a
• 6:45
  Speaker 5: parent at a young age. And then we moved out
• 6:48
  Speaker 5: here to California, and that was just like being thrown
• 6:51
  Speaker 5: into the land of oz, going from a town no
• 6:55
  Speaker 5: bigger than three hundred to a huge melting pot of
• 6:58
  Speaker 5: all kinds of peace, people and personalities and stuff. So
• 7:05
  Speaker 5: I remember when I was like in my teenage years,
• 7:08
  Speaker 5: I can was like the internet was still new, and
• 7:10
  Speaker 5: you know, I found the church to say website, and
• 7:12
  Speaker 5: I was like, this is so cool.
• 7:14
  Speaker 4: I love how they were definitely I love how they
• 7:16
  Speaker 4: were on the internet so early in the day, like
• 7:17
  Speaker 4: as soon as.
• 7:18
  Speaker 5: Oh yeah, And I remember the picture was where they
• 7:21
  Speaker 5: all had the animal heads on, right, and then they're
• 7:24
  Speaker 5: putting ant on the veins, like pointing the sword at you,
• 7:26
  Speaker 5: you know, and I'm like, to me, but how I
• 7:28
  Speaker 5: was raised like that was a complete opposite. I guess
• 7:30
  Speaker 5: there was that magnetism because I was like, this is
• 7:33
  Speaker 5: so cool, like people are actually doing this kind of stuff,
• 7:35
  Speaker 5: you know. And I think at that point in time,
• 7:38
  Speaker 5: I had already felt like I already had felt like
• 7:43
  Speaker 5: very outcasted at that time period anyways, because I think
• 7:46
  Speaker 5: that's part of the teenage years, you know, trying to
• 7:48
  Speaker 5: figure out who I am. And I was dealing with
• 7:50
  Speaker 5: a lot of health issues at the time, so I
• 7:52
  Speaker 5: just felt very lost. I felt like I was in
• 7:56
  Speaker 5: a battle against something that was like trying to consume
• 7:59
  Speaker 5: my life. So I think that was kind of a
• 8:03
  Speaker 5: reflection of all those things went on with me internally,
• 8:06
  Speaker 5: and I didn't I never brought it up to anybody
• 8:08
  Speaker 5: at that time because like that would have been bad.
• 8:12
  Speaker 5: So what's an idea, What I was going through at
• 8:16
  Speaker 5: that time. At that time, I was going in on
• 8:18
  Speaker 5: rehabs a lot for like eating disorder and self harm
• 8:21
  Speaker 5: and stuff. So I was going I had a rough.
• 8:23
  Speaker 5: I had a internally, I had a rough, Like I
• 8:25
  Speaker 5: was trying to shove my feelings so I could be
• 8:27
  Speaker 5: strong for everybody else and my family and my life,
• 8:30
  Speaker 5: and so I was dealing with a lot. So I mean,
• 8:35
  Speaker 5: to me, I think that kind of discovering that difference
• 8:38
  Speaker 5: in the world kind of opened up not even just
• 8:41
  Speaker 5: like the spiritual, but like art, like I can be different,
• 8:43
  Speaker 5: I can be something different than what's always been taught
• 8:46
  Speaker 5: to me, and maybe it's not working for me. So
• 8:48
  Speaker 5: I kind of just left that alone, but it always
• 8:51
  Speaker 5: kind of stuck in the back of my mind. So
• 8:53
  Speaker 5: once I got my twenties and I had moved on
• 8:55
  Speaker 5: my own, I went and bought the Satanic Bible, and
• 8:58
  Speaker 5: then I just started digging into it and I started
• 9:01
  Speaker 5: practicing the rituals in there, and I mean I did
• 9:03
  Speaker 5: get some results. And then I started like taking the
• 9:06
  Speaker 5: names apart in there that he recommended, like you know,
• 9:10
  Speaker 5: alis Ja, Crowley, all these guys, and then I kind
• 9:13
  Speaker 5: of started opening up the world and they occult for
• 9:15
  Speaker 5: me to like the Golden Dawn her meticism, all the
• 9:18
  Speaker 5: different layers that are out there, and so for I mean,
• 9:24
  Speaker 5: it's funny how these things happened in the magical world,
• 9:27
  Speaker 5: because I would have never thought that I would have
• 9:29
  Speaker 5: ended up meeting the bloodline from the Labay family and
• 9:33
  Speaker 5: actually working with them down the way. You know, it
• 9:35
  Speaker 5: wasn't anything that was like if you would have told
• 9:39
  Speaker 5: me that, I was like, you're crazy. But that time,
• 9:45
  Speaker 5: and I didn't even know he had a grandson or
• 9:47
  Speaker 5: any of this stuff till later on. So at that time,
• 9:52
  Speaker 5: I was also I had left a very bad marriage
• 9:55
  Speaker 5: and I had so I started dancing so I can
• 9:59
  Speaker 5: make so I could provide for and my daughter, and
• 10:02
  Speaker 5: I just started making all this money and then I
• 10:04
  Speaker 5: got into the Satanic witch and that kind of really,
• 10:08
  Speaker 5: I mean, I got into that world and I pretty
• 10:12
  Speaker 5: much got disowned by my family for standing on my
• 10:14
  Speaker 5: own two feet and trying to be a parent and
• 10:17
  Speaker 5: adult on my own, you know, with the tools that
• 10:19
  Speaker 5: I grew up with. So that kind of like helped
• 10:23
  Speaker 5: me accept like this is where I'm mad in life.
• 10:26
  Speaker 5: I can make the most of it. I can be
• 10:27
  Speaker 5: successful I can be independent, and so that really just
• 10:31
  Speaker 5: kind of led the way to me, led the way
• 10:34
  Speaker 5: for me to be empowered and to be like strong
• 10:36
  Speaker 5: and who I was, regardless of Whereverbaiales was staying in
• 10:40
  Speaker 5: religion and all that stuff. And it's funny because people
• 10:44
  Speaker 5: that were very religious in my life, all of a sudden,
• 10:46
  Speaker 5: they were like super religious because they knew what I
• 10:49
  Speaker 5: was doing in life. But they were the they were
• 10:52
  Speaker 5: like the most hateful, meanest people ever to And I'm like,
• 10:56
  Speaker 5: I'm not asking you for money. I'm not doing it.
• 10:58
  Speaker 5: I'm staying on my own two feet, you know. So
• 11:03
  Speaker 5: I kind of went through that, and then I kind
• 11:04
  Speaker 5: of went through some ups and downs in life and
• 11:07
  Speaker 5: ended up obviously in that world. You know, I ended
• 11:11
  Speaker 5: up getting in a lot of trouble, getting to some
• 11:14
  Speaker 5: d ys and stuff and going to jail for a
• 11:16
  Speaker 5: good good while. And then yeah, I ended up in
• 11:22
  Speaker 5: jail for a little while, and I was like, WHOA,
• 11:25
  Speaker 5: I think I got myself here, you know.
• 11:29
  Speaker 4: I will I will say I did have some eye opening, uh,
• 11:32
  Speaker 4: you know, whatever epiphanies in prison about myself.
• 11:35
  Speaker 5: I was just gonna get to that. Yeah, so I'm
• 11:38
  Speaker 5: sitting there and John, I'm like, fuck, you know, fuck.
• 11:42
  Speaker 5: I was like, I've traveled the world, I've done all
• 11:43
  Speaker 5: this cool and amazing stuff, like made so much money,
• 11:46
  Speaker 5: I've done all that. I've pretty much had a pretty
• 11:48
  Speaker 5: rock star lifestyle, you know, and then how the hell
• 11:51
  Speaker 5: did I get here? You know? And everyone's always told
• 11:53
  Speaker 5: me you're too smart for your own good. So I'm
• 11:56
  Speaker 5: just sitting there and that's how I got really into
• 11:58
  Speaker 5: like I think the divine the universe set me there
• 12:02
  Speaker 5: for a reason because it took away all of the
• 12:05
  Speaker 5: material things. That took wait, all the material things, all
• 12:07
  Speaker 5: the men, all the fun stuff, and I had to
• 12:09
  Speaker 5: sit there with myself. And that's really when I got
• 12:13
  Speaker 5: I think, like that's when I had a very spiritual
• 12:15
  Speaker 5: experience for myself. Was like the life I had been
• 12:18
  Speaker 5: living was not the left life that I was meant
• 12:21
  Speaker 5: to be living. You know. I hadn't really cracked open
• 12:25
  Speaker 5: to the spirit I am today. And that was like
• 12:29
  Speaker 5: the pivotal point in my life that helped make that happen.
• 12:34
  Speaker 5: And it's interesting though, because right before that happened, I
• 12:36
  Speaker 5: had started working with Lucifer, Lilith and all these very
• 12:40
  Speaker 5: strong currents, right and I just recently made the connection
• 12:44
  Speaker 5: with this other day. But I started working with these
• 12:47
  Speaker 5: different currents, Alio, all these different entities, and they come
• 12:52
  Speaker 5: in and their current just completely like rips apart everything
• 12:56
  Speaker 5: going on in your life in a rough not in
• 12:58
  Speaker 5: a soft, subtle way, but in a very chaotic way.
• 13:01
  Speaker 5: So that's exactly what had happened in my life. Everything
• 13:04
  Speaker 5: that I was living was completely like depressing my spirit
• 13:07
  Speaker 5: of my full potential, the people in my life, the
• 13:11
  Speaker 5: stories I was telling myself in my head, like I
• 13:13
  Speaker 5: kept getting in my own way. So I know that
• 13:16
  Speaker 5: all that had was coordinated with that, all that stuff
• 13:19
  Speaker 5: had to be broken apart and fall away so I
• 13:22
  Speaker 5: could have nothing but myself to rebuild something from. So
• 13:28
  Speaker 5: when I got out of jail, I pretty i had.
• 13:30
  Speaker 5: So I had signed an agreement to go to like
• 13:32
  Speaker 5: a program after that and go do what the courts wanted.
• 13:35
  Speaker 5: So I started off in a homeless, homeless shelter, and
• 13:38
  Speaker 5: then I worked my way up. So I got a
• 13:40
  Speaker 5: job and got my own little place again and rebuilt
• 13:42
  Speaker 5: my life from what I would say, materialistically, from nothing,
• 13:47
  Speaker 5: but I rebuilt it from the strength of my own
• 13:50
  Speaker 5: spirit in connection with the divine and magic. Like in jail,
• 13:55
  Speaker 5: I had nothing else but to rely on but my magic,
• 13:58
  Speaker 5: what I had learned, and it takes me back. I
• 14:05
  Speaker 5: don't know if you've ever read the book Man Search
• 14:07
  Speaker 5: for Meeting with Victor Frankel.
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 14:10
  Speaker 5: Yeah, So when I got out of jail, I read
• 14:14
  Speaker 5: that book and I was crying because he's talking about
• 14:18
  Speaker 5: when and this is the guy. He was in the
• 14:20
  Speaker 5: concentration camp, and he survived a concentrationed camp, and he
• 14:22
  Speaker 5: was a very famous doctor, and he wanted His goal
• 14:26
  Speaker 5: was to get out and write this book about what
• 14:28
  Speaker 5: he about what he learned in there. But come to
• 14:32
  Speaker 5: find out at the end of it, the whole his
• 14:36
  Speaker 5: whole experience was like the gold of the story. So
• 14:40
  Speaker 5: in there he says, any man that has a has
• 14:42
  Speaker 5: a y can go through anyhow. And and in that
• 14:47
  Speaker 5: book he's talking about how people, once they accepted defeat
• 14:51
  Speaker 5: in their head, they would slowly watch him like die.
• 14:56
  Speaker 5: But whoever had a reason, like this guy, Victor Francle,
• 14:59
  Speaker 5: he wanted to see his wife and all this stuff,
• 15:01
  Speaker 5: you know, So in his mind he was going to
• 15:02
  Speaker 5: see his wife, all these different positive things. So it
• 15:06
  Speaker 5: gave him the will to live and that's what he
• 15:07
  Speaker 5: also noticed people that gave themselves a reason to continue going.
• 15:11
  Speaker 5: They made it through that, you know. So and I
• 15:15
  Speaker 5: think that coordinated back to my time in there, because
• 15:18
  Speaker 5: that's like my goal was to get out and start
• 15:20
  Speaker 5: this brand, and it was because magic had always helped
• 15:27
  Speaker 5: me make it through things. And it wasn't just the magic.
• 15:30
  Speaker 5: It wasn't just magic because before that, I always noticed
• 15:32
  Speaker 5: the power of the mind, the resiliency of human nature
• 15:35
  Speaker 5: and belief can makes get us through so much. And
• 15:42
  Speaker 5: then even being in like the homeless shelter, being around
• 15:45
  Speaker 5: people that had nothing and seeing that, you know, having
• 15:49
  Speaker 5: laughter and being able to like find some positivity and
• 15:52
  Speaker 5: sometimes outlook helps you get through things in life. So
• 15:56
  Speaker 5: that's a big reason why I started the brand, was
• 15:58
  Speaker 5: because like I would be sitting there in like a
• 16:01
  Speaker 5: home shelter, and then I had my little government of
• 16:04
  Speaker 5: phone and I'd go sneak in the bathroom and I'd
• 16:06
  Speaker 5: record like some stuff that I put together and actually
• 16:09
  Speaker 5: I have it. It's on Spotify. It's Order of the
• 16:12
  Speaker 5: Black Flame Sun. So that's like my starting starting stuff.
• 16:16
  Speaker 5: You know. I did some stuff for like and it
• 16:20
  Speaker 5: wasn't really anything that picked up that I didn't really
• 16:22
  Speaker 5: pick up too fast. It was called Ordered the Black
• 16:25
  Speaker 5: Flame Sun, and it was around the archetypes of Lucifer,
• 16:30
  Speaker 5: the Santa Marte, and then I think it was the
• 16:35
  Speaker 5: power of You. So that's kind of what I made
• 16:39
  Speaker 5: it off of it, and really I really haven't really
• 16:41
  Speaker 5: done much with it since then, but I mean it
• 16:45
  Speaker 5: was these things that kind of put like that was
• 16:48
  Speaker 5: like my little gold in that time. It was like,
• 16:51
  Speaker 5: I know, this is gonna be something. I'm gonna keep
• 16:53
  Speaker 5: building this, this is what I want to do, and
• 16:56
  Speaker 5: all I would talk about was like the Ordered Black
• 16:59
  Speaker 5: Flame Son. And then it's funny because Sharon actually actually
• 17:04
  Speaker 5: so back to when I started working with Lucifer and
• 17:08
  Speaker 5: these different entities, that's when I got introduced to Stanton LaVey.
• 17:12
  Speaker 5: And Stanton Lavay was the grandson of Anton LaVey, So
• 17:18
  Speaker 5: I started I was going out to LA and working
• 17:21
  Speaker 5: with them on a few thinks, him and his wife
• 17:23
  Speaker 5: Sharon Levey. So he then he had passed away when
• 17:28
  Speaker 5: I like a little bit after I gotut of jail.
• 17:30
  Speaker 5: So we ended up doing the Witches Sabbath in LA
• 17:35
  Speaker 5: with Sharon Levey and Shane Bugby. I don't know. Are
• 17:37
  Speaker 5: if you're aware of who Shane Bugby.
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: Is, No, I'm not.
• 17:42
  Speaker 5: No, no, well he's an artist in the occult world
• 17:49
  Speaker 5: as well.
• 17:51
  Speaker 6: Just pause posive. So is this after.
• 17:54
  Speaker 3: You you're levy and doing all this stuff?
• 17:57
  Speaker 6: This is after you were out of out of jail.
• 18:00
  Speaker 5: Yeah?
• 18:01
  Speaker 6: Nice? And so did you know them before you went
• 18:02
  Speaker 6: to jail?
• 18:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and so okay, nice, I'm just we're just putting
• 18:06
  Speaker 3: the pieces together here.
• 18:08
  Speaker 5: So when I started, okay, so before I went to jail,
• 18:10
  Speaker 5: I started working with like Lucifer Lillith yea for Entities
• 18:15
  Speaker 5: and like, that's a.
• 18:16
  Speaker 6: Little dangerous there, a little dangerous.
• 18:20
  Speaker 5: I've never been one to run away from dangerous obviously. Yeah.
• 18:26
  Speaker 5: So you get the best lessons out of that and
• 18:31
  Speaker 5: it makes for a better story, Okay. So yeah, so
• 18:35
  Speaker 5: that's when I got into that world. That's when I
• 18:37
  Speaker 5: met Stanton Levey and his wife Sharon Lvay, and I
• 18:40
  Speaker 5: was like, this is so cool, Like I couldn't believe
• 18:42
  Speaker 5: that I got to meet them and work with them
• 18:44
  Speaker 5: on some things. So that was really neat. So yeah,
• 18:48
  Speaker 5: and then we did The Witches Sabbath when I got
• 18:50
  Speaker 5: out jail, and I mean, this whole world started opening
• 18:53
  Speaker 5: up to me, and I just kept going with doing
• 18:55
  Speaker 5: the YouTube videos. And I mean my first stuff was
• 18:58
  Speaker 5: pretty crummy, like it was. It was all right, I
• 19:01
  Speaker 5: was talking about nonsense. But I mean as I kept going,
• 19:05
  Speaker 5: people kept coming into my life. So I knew that
• 19:08
  Speaker 5: as people came into my life and things kept going,
• 19:10
  Speaker 5: and I know that was the direction I was meant
• 19:12
  Speaker 5: to go. You know, even though I would confront my
• 19:14
  Speaker 5: own doubts and stuff like that, like, things kept blossoming
• 19:18
  Speaker 5: and they still are today. I mean, I just did
• 19:20
  Speaker 5: the interview with Nicholas Shrek, and I mean I would
• 19:23
  Speaker 5: never of I don't think even I don't even think
• 19:26
  Speaker 5: I would have had the confidence to be able to
• 19:28
  Speaker 5: pull something off like that before. But in the working
• 19:32
  Speaker 5: in the world of magic and the occult has helped
• 19:34
  Speaker 5: me cultivate these things withinside of myself that have made
• 19:37
  Speaker 5: it possible for me to do a lot of things
• 19:39
  Speaker 5: that I do today. And I also just came out
• 19:43
  Speaker 5: with the original sim book, which is like a few
• 19:45
  Speaker 5: poems of my life story along with uh some sigil
• 19:50
  Speaker 5: work and some magical workings in there. And I haven't
• 19:55
  Speaker 5: even gone to the Ota yet.
• 19:57
  Speaker 6: Yeah, no, true, Nick, you might have asked a question.
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, go for it. I was going to ask
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: one too, and I already forgot.
• 20:02
  Speaker 6: So that's okay, I'll pick up on that.
• 20:05
  Speaker 3: So what do you My question then would be what
• 20:09
  Speaker 3: do you think about how you're invoking and doing these
• 20:13
  Speaker 3: things with it?
• 20:15
  Speaker 6: And correct me if I'm wrong? And very little.
• 20:20
  Speaker 3: Practice in like were you practicing meditation where you're doing
• 20:25
  Speaker 3: grounding work, were you're doing anything to help set you
• 20:28
  Speaker 3: into doing these invocations to these more darker aspects of
• 20:33
  Speaker 3: the human psyche? And then you know, meeting the Levey's
• 20:36
  Speaker 3: and doing the Satanic thing and then going to jail
• 20:39
  Speaker 3: and then coming out of that and going right back
• 20:41
  Speaker 3: into the LaVey in Satanism, Like where what part is
• 20:47
  Speaker 3: there a grounding aspect to this?
• 20:49
  Speaker 6: And do you see how like is there Just talk
• 20:51
  Speaker 6: to me about that. I just want to know what
• 20:53
  Speaker 6: you think.
• 20:54
  Speaker 5: No, that's a good question. So when I got into that,
• 20:58
  Speaker 5: I think I had a little at the prior to that,
• 21:01
  Speaker 5: I had a little bit more experience into the deeper
• 21:05
  Speaker 5: realms of magic. I don't really go into that because
• 21:08
  Speaker 5: it's private, of course, of course, so into the deeper realms,
• 21:12
  Speaker 5: So I had a little footing on that. And that's
• 21:16
  Speaker 5: why I say when I was in jail, a lot
• 21:18
  Speaker 5: of that came into play because it was all like,
• 21:22
  Speaker 5: none of this is all good or bad. Like all
• 21:24
  Speaker 5: everything in my life has always been something that's helped
• 21:28
  Speaker 5: me build into the next level, helped me involve. So
• 21:30
  Speaker 5: I don't think anything bad's ever helpened to me in
• 21:32
  Speaker 5: my life. It's all just been lessons because our refused
• 21:35
  Speaker 5: to let anything bad happen to me because I define
• 21:38
  Speaker 5: how it's going to turn out. I define the narrative.
• 21:40
  Speaker 6: So, yeah, you're not a victim.
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: I like that.
• 21:43
  Speaker 5: Yeah, So what's I always think, what's the goal to
• 21:47
  Speaker 5: be made out of this? How can I transmute this?
• 21:52
  Speaker 5: So when okay, so let's go back to the time era.
• 21:55
  Speaker 5: You're talking about my life. At that point in time,
• 21:57
  Speaker 5: I was, I was heavily in the adult industry. I
• 22:01
  Speaker 5: was a call girl, I was My life was pretty.
• 22:03
  Speaker 6: It was bad.
• 22:04
  Speaker 5: I hated it. I hated my life. I hated it.
• 22:07
  Speaker 5: But it may at that point in time it made
• 22:10
  Speaker 5: sense because I was making a lot of money. I
• 22:11
  Speaker 5: was providing for my daughter, I was taking care of
• 22:13
  Speaker 5: my family. I had a lot I was doing a lot,
• 22:16
  Speaker 5: you know, and I didn't know how to have boundaries.
• 22:19
  Speaker 5: I didn't know how to set up boundaries for myself.
• 22:21
  Speaker 5: I was just completely always open and giving and giving
• 22:24
  Speaker 5: and giving to the point that I was depleting who
• 22:26
  Speaker 5: I was, my energies. So I mean, especially in that world,
• 22:31
  Speaker 5: a lot of women end up on drugs. You know,
• 22:34
  Speaker 5: you have to shut off yourself and like you have
• 22:37
  Speaker 5: to show off yourself to be able to do that.
• 22:38
  Speaker 5: So it kind of work sometimes, but also it goes
• 22:42
  Speaker 5: back deeper, you know, the deep stuff. And that's what
• 22:44
  Speaker 5: I've learned by my journey. So at that period of time,
• 22:47
  Speaker 5: I was, I was alcoholic, I was on heroin, I
• 22:52
  Speaker 5: was my life was bad. So when I started working
• 22:56
  Speaker 5: with these entities that they came in with the brutal force,
• 23:00
  Speaker 5: but that had to happen, had to happen to shape myself.
• 23:04
  Speaker 5: And the more I talk with other people that have
• 23:06
  Speaker 5: worked with these different entities, they have similar stories where
• 23:11
  Speaker 5: they were going through some very hard stuff in their
• 23:13
  Speaker 5: life and these seeing these forces kind of come to you,
• 23:16
  Speaker 5: I think, and break shake things up and break things
• 23:21
  Speaker 5: apart that have to be broken up. And you know,
• 23:23
  Speaker 5: by opening up those things, I learned about. I had
• 23:26
  Speaker 5: had to dive into things that happen in childhood, all
• 23:29
  Speaker 5: these deep, these deep, deep things that I think when
• 23:32
  Speaker 5: you're a child, your psyche block things out to protect you,
• 23:36
  Speaker 5: and eventually that can be that it doesn't go anywhere,
• 23:40
  Speaker 5: just festers in, festers and festers, and eventually, I think
• 23:42
  Speaker 5: once you get into your twenties, late twenties and thirty
• 23:45
  Speaker 5: and your literally thirties, these things can evolve into addictions,
• 23:49
  Speaker 5: can evolve into like bad habits. So unless you're going
• 23:53
  Speaker 5: to go in there and take care of it, you're
• 23:54
  Speaker 5: going to kind of go through life always not really
• 23:57
  Speaker 5: be able to reach full potential. So answer your question,
• 24:01
  Speaker 5: I think, like my roots and deeper occult workings that
• 24:08
  Speaker 5: kind of laid the foundation, I think for these other
• 24:11
  Speaker 5: entities to come in as part of the magical journey
• 24:14
  Speaker 5: to teach me lessons so I could get to that
• 24:16
  Speaker 5: higher self that I'm out now. I mean, my journey
• 24:19
  Speaker 5: is not over right, but not today. So that was
• 24:23
  Speaker 5: what had to happen. And it's funny because I was
• 24:26
  Speaker 5: just talking with some people recently and we were making
• 24:30
  Speaker 5: the correlations between Lucifer and Starte and the feminine and
• 24:35
  Speaker 5: these other energies, right. And it's funny because, Okay, so
• 24:41
  Speaker 5: at that period of time when I was working with
• 24:42
  Speaker 5: those entities, I was very heavily in the drug scene
• 24:45
  Speaker 5: and all that stuff, and that went very well along
• 24:48
  Speaker 5: within the Satanic world. You know, that's a very heavy
• 24:51
  Speaker 5: Usually the Satanic world is heavily influenced with drugs and
• 24:55
  Speaker 5: alcohol and all that stuff and party. It's very very
• 24:58
  Speaker 5: cardinal and low nature, right, So I mean you have
• 25:02
  Speaker 5: to deal with your cardinal and laurwe nature though to
• 25:04
  Speaker 5: evolve to the higher levels of magic. So once I
• 25:09
  Speaker 5: got to jail, that was like where I had to
• 25:11
  Speaker 5: face myself. I was like I had to like face
• 25:17
  Speaker 5: myself and like slow down and really have to go within.
• 25:21
  Speaker 5: And that's really when I got into the twelve step
• 25:23
  Speaker 5: programs nice and that really kind of introduced opened me
• 25:29
  Speaker 5: back up to another's to more spiritual experiences. But I
• 25:33
  Speaker 5: mean everything that happened after like that, every that had
• 25:37
  Speaker 5: to happen for my life to get better, and I'm
• 25:40
  Speaker 5: grateful for those experiences today. So when I got out,
• 25:44
  Speaker 5: I mean, everybody in my life was new people. It
• 25:47
  Speaker 5: was all new people in my life, and I had
• 25:51
  Speaker 5: to go through so much to like refine the person
• 25:54
  Speaker 5: I am today and that people in my life that
• 25:56
  Speaker 5: believed in me, that had faith in me, that told me,
• 25:59
  Speaker 5: set me down when I was in the wrong and
• 26:01
  Speaker 5: corrected me, and kind of where the family and the
• 26:03
  Speaker 5: guidance that I never had, and like all that had happen,
• 26:07
  Speaker 5: all like the breakdown had to happen for that to
• 26:09
  Speaker 5: come through, you know.
• 26:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, Well, so how do you get from reading
• 26:14
  Speaker 3: Because you were said earlier that you were reading with
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: the Golden Dawn's work, So why do you think from
• 26:21
  Speaker 3: the Golden Dawn to the Satanic more dark aspects of
• 26:25
  Speaker 3: the occult. Why do you think that you moved more
• 26:28
  Speaker 3: away from Golden Dawn's stuff into the other stuff?
• 26:32
  Speaker 5: So in this reality we have duality, correct, we have
• 26:39
  Speaker 5: the black the white, we had the day in the night,
• 26:43
  Speaker 5: and they're connected by spirit, by God, university, the uniting
• 26:48
  Speaker 5: force in the world. So in order to evolve and
• 26:54
  Speaker 5: transcend in the light, we have to know our roots
• 26:58
  Speaker 5: in the dark, right, So that's where it comes to play.
• 27:03
  Speaker 5: Like I had to go through the darkness to be
• 27:08
  Speaker 5: able to get rid of the filth and the gunk
• 27:11
  Speaker 5: that was holding me down, so that way I could grow,
• 27:12
  Speaker 5: I would best way. I always come back to plants, right.
• 27:15
  Speaker 5: Plants are the easiest way to explain stuff sometimes. So
• 27:17
  Speaker 5: when you're growing a plant and it starts to have
• 27:20
  Speaker 5: dead leaves and all these things, you know it's going
• 27:23
  Speaker 5: to hinder its growth. You have to go and you
• 27:25
  Speaker 5: have to proven all these dead leaves off and take
• 27:26
  Speaker 5: all the gunk off and so and then once it
• 27:29
  Speaker 5: does it, it has energy to grow and flourish. And it's
• 27:31
  Speaker 5: the same thing with our spirit. We have all these
• 27:34
  Speaker 5: different aspects of our life that are just like dead,
• 27:37
  Speaker 5: dead waiste hanging off of us that can attract more debt,
• 27:41
  Speaker 5: dead waste and like parasites and all that stuff. It
• 27:44
  Speaker 5: begins to like affect our growth. So it's the same
• 27:47
  Speaker 5: way with our spirit. We have to like take all
• 27:50
  Speaker 5: that stuff off so our spirit can continue to grow
• 27:52
  Speaker 5: and flourish to like so we can evolve. Yeah, so
• 27:57
  Speaker 5: I think there's a uniting force there. I don't I
• 28:00
  Speaker 5: know sometimes there's this conflict with that things have to
• 28:03
  Speaker 5: be completely light or completely dark, but they both go
• 28:06
  Speaker 5: cohesively together. For our spirits to grow, a plant has
• 28:10
  Speaker 5: to have the day in the night to grow. It
• 28:12
  Speaker 5: has to have time of rest.
• 28:13
  Speaker 3: To have true true But can you tell me why
• 28:15
  Speaker 3: do you think it was more attractive to go straight
• 28:18
  Speaker 3: into the dark as deep as you went, Because it's
• 28:20
  Speaker 3: not like everyone goes that deep into the darkness, right
• 28:23
  Speaker 3: and then not like everybody has the ability to all
• 28:26
  Speaker 3: of a sudden stumble upon the LaVey family, who, interesting enough,
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: may or may not have contact with the CIA and
• 28:31
  Speaker 3: these different things. So it's like, and then even Shrek
• 28:34
  Speaker 3: himself came out of the end yourself, it seems like
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: Included came out of and was all like he disavowed
• 28:41
  Speaker 3: the Leavey and Satanism and went more towards Buddhism and
• 28:45
  Speaker 3: these different things interesting enough, So I just wonder about yourself,
• 28:49
  Speaker 3: what do you think was so attractive A buy that?
• 28:52
  Speaker 5: That's a good question to me. These things are so
• 28:56
  Speaker 5: normal in my life, but I don't realize how abnor
• 29:00
  Speaker 5: well they aren't tell that people bring them up.
• 29:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you think about that when I joined the OTO
• 29:05
  Speaker 4: sometimes too. When I joined the OTO, I had even
• 29:09
  Speaker 4: thought that at one point, like how the fuck did
• 29:11
  Speaker 4: I even end up in here?
• 29:13
  Speaker 6: Yeah?
• 29:14
  Speaker 4: You know, I mean, I know, maybe it's not the
• 29:16
  Speaker 4: same situation as a place that you went to, but
• 29:20
  Speaker 4: it's still weird enough and has a shitty enough name.
• 29:23
  Speaker 5: You know, that's pretty dark. I mean we all have stories, right,
• 29:30
  Speaker 5: we all have backgrounds. Some of us have darker backgrounds
• 29:34
  Speaker 5: than the rest. So not to get to too much
• 29:38
  Speaker 5: into the dark dark things in my life, but I
• 29:41
  Speaker 5: mean I've had two and when I was when I
• 29:46
  Speaker 5: was going through therapy and stuff like that, I had
• 29:48
  Speaker 5: to go to some really really deep dark points in
• 29:51
  Speaker 5: my life. And I mean, I don't know how I'm
• 29:55
  Speaker 5: still standing here today, Like I've died some times. And
• 29:59
  Speaker 5: I always joke with the people about this. I'm like
• 30:01
  Speaker 5: I was, so I'm so crazy, like the other side,
• 30:03
  Speaker 5: doesn't you want me? You know, like I have so
• 30:06
  Speaker 5: I figure out what I'm supposed to do. So I've
• 30:09
  Speaker 5: just come to accept I can't go nowhere until I
• 30:11
  Speaker 5: fulfill what I'm supposed to do here. So I mean,
• 30:17
  Speaker 5: that's a good question. I don't think I can really
• 30:19
  Speaker 5: give you too much of an answer because it's like
• 30:21
  Speaker 5: my journey is always unfolding and I keep discovering these
• 30:25
  Speaker 5: different things about myself. And I mean, I think I
• 30:31
  Speaker 5: have to know the good in order to combat the dark,
• 30:35
  Speaker 5: because the moment I let go of the light in
• 30:38
  Speaker 5: my life, the dark will consume me. And it takes
• 30:40
  Speaker 5: me back to this quote. It's a Native American quote
• 30:44
  Speaker 5: that said that says I can't remember completely, but I
• 30:46
  Speaker 5: love it because it says, you know, we always have two.
• 30:50
  Speaker 5: There's two wolves that are that were in war with
• 30:53
  Speaker 5: all the time when it is light and good and
• 30:56
  Speaker 5: prosperous and joy and abundance, and there's this other wolf
• 30:58
  Speaker 5: that's dark. It's a dark wolf, you know, and it's
• 31:01
  Speaker 5: depression and it's havoc and it's all these things and
• 31:04
  Speaker 5: we get to choose which one we feed. But and
• 31:08
  Speaker 5: then so that's what it is to me, like I
• 31:10
  Speaker 5: have to I'm always in that, always fighting those to
• 31:14
  Speaker 5: keep the balance within the two. And it takes me
• 31:18
  Speaker 5: back to kind of like what the thirty third degree
• 31:20
  Speaker 5: would be in freemasonry is, you know, with the two
• 31:23
  Speaker 5: eagles in the board, is you got to look to
• 31:26
  Speaker 5: the back and you have to look to the front
• 31:28
  Speaker 5: in order to keep going. Like sorry, And there's another
• 31:31
  Speaker 5: quote that comes in mind right now as Steve Jobs,
• 31:33
  Speaker 5: you know, is the way we build forward is by
• 31:35
  Speaker 5: looking back at the patterns that have shown itself in
• 31:38
  Speaker 5: the past. I mean, I might have got that wrong,
• 31:41
  Speaker 5: but it's very similar to that. So I mean, the
• 31:46
  Speaker 5: more deeper I have to dive into the darker aspects
• 31:49
  Speaker 5: of aspects of myself is like the greater I can
• 31:52
  Speaker 5: transcend in my in my journey of light to do
• 31:55
  Speaker 5: good for sure, And that's why I think, like, that's
• 32:00
  Speaker 5: why it's been such a big motivation for me to
• 32:04
  Speaker 5: My story is effective on its own right, but as
• 32:09
  Speaker 5: I meet other people that have similar stories, there's power
• 32:12
  Speaker 5: in people's stories in their journey. You can teach. I
• 32:16
  Speaker 5: can put together a program and teach something, right, but
• 32:19
  Speaker 5: the impact of people sharing their story and how they
• 32:21
  Speaker 5: got went from where they were to whether at has
• 32:24
  Speaker 5: much more power than anything, like than any lesson I
• 32:28
  Speaker 5: could probably teach. And there's a connection, there's a there's
• 32:31
  Speaker 5: a connection in the power that happens. So I might
• 32:35
  Speaker 5: be getting off topic, but I hope that kind of
• 32:36
  Speaker 5: answered your question.
• 32:37
  Speaker 6: Brandon, Yeah, something like that. Yeah, definitely a little off topic,
• 32:42
  Speaker 6: but you know, I hear you.
• 32:43
  Speaker 3: And it's hard to truly know why we're attracted to
• 32:48
  Speaker 3: certain things and why not. And that's why we're kind
• 32:50
  Speaker 3: of on this, uh, this journey of the great work.
• 32:53
  Speaker 3: You know, sometimes the hardest things to see are the
• 32:56
  Speaker 3: ones right in front of us, and so it is
• 32:59
  Speaker 3: a fascinating thing.
• 33:00
  Speaker 6: Nick, did you remember your question?
• 33:01
  Speaker 4: Yes, yeah, I remember, actually have like two or three
• 33:04
  Speaker 4: now hopefully I forget them. You mentioned uh AA before
• 33:10
  Speaker 4: what was I don't know if you specified AA.
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: You said twelve steps.
• 33:15
  Speaker 4: I guess maybe I went to AA because I've gone
• 33:17
  Speaker 4: to AA.
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: Myself as well.
• 33:19
  Speaker 4: Uh what was your thoughts on like your experience in
• 33:23
  Speaker 4: these twelve step programs.
• 33:29
  Speaker 5: It's so funny because I was younger. When I was
• 33:34
  Speaker 5: I totally was rebuked to twelve steps because I was like,
• 33:39
  Speaker 5: not that, I don't do the God thing. I'm saying this,
• 33:42
  Speaker 5: I don't do that. But it's funny because like when
• 33:46
  Speaker 5: I was sitting in jail, like there was a there
• 33:48
  Speaker 5: was well I got it was the NA Book, and
• 33:50
  Speaker 5: that's when I started just studying it and looking into it.
• 33:54
  Speaker 5: And then I started talking about this higher power stuff.
• 33:56
  Speaker 5: And now so I got a higher power stuff. And
• 34:00
  Speaker 5: I'm still like at that time, like I believe in
• 34:02
  Speaker 5: Satan and Lucifer and all this stuff. Right, so I'm like, well,
• 34:05
  Speaker 5: still of God. I'm just gonna where the god words
• 34:08
  Speaker 5: are at. I'm just going to put Lucifer like, you know,
• 34:11
  Speaker 5: that's my game. That's the cool I guess that's cool
• 34:14
  Speaker 5: rock and way to walk and roll, a way to
• 34:15
  Speaker 5: do it. So that's how I just that's how I
• 34:18
  Speaker 5: did it. So I'm like, well, if there's a higher
• 34:20
  Speaker 5: power out there, then let's see what this is going
• 34:24
  Speaker 5: to do, you know. So I just start working like
• 34:26
  Speaker 5: the steps on my own in there, and I start
• 34:30
  Speaker 5: hosting like okay, so like when you're in jail, like
• 34:35
  Speaker 5: usually you're like in little pods and you have about
• 34:38
  Speaker 5: people there, right, So I've started hosting like my own
• 34:42
  Speaker 5: little NA meetings in there, like lessons and studies and
• 34:47
  Speaker 5: stuff like that. And so I mean, I should have
• 34:53
  Speaker 5: went to prison for two years, but I'm sure you're
• 34:57
  Speaker 5: here's the room. But by the miracle of the universe
• 35:00
  Speaker 5: my higher power, I didn't. I got into a program
• 35:02
  Speaker 5: and was able to really work on myself and turn
• 35:05
  Speaker 5: my life around. So I think, like, and this is
• 35:09
  Speaker 5: why I compare spiritual connection to a higher power energy
• 35:16
  Speaker 5: is I think, as human beings were all given the
• 35:19
  Speaker 5: gift of creativity, and I think in the context of religion,
• 35:24
  Speaker 5: we are very creative beings, and we've created these systems
• 35:27
  Speaker 5: to understand the divine of the universe, you know, to
• 35:31
  Speaker 5: kind of make a digestible form for ourselves. But I
• 35:34
  Speaker 5: think they all hold truth to the same thing, to
• 35:39
  Speaker 5: very many similar things about the just the journey to
• 35:41
  Speaker 5: how you get there is different, right, coming from the
• 35:44
  Speaker 5: context of culture and all these different things. So, I mean,
• 35:47
  Speaker 5: I don't today, I don't subscribe to any type of religion,
• 35:51
  Speaker 5: but I know that my connection that I gained through
• 35:56
  Speaker 5: through life experience, that there's always been something else there
• 36:00
  Speaker 5: with me and whether that's my and I've seen my
• 36:06
  Speaker 5: life turn around. So I mean that's the best way
• 36:08
  Speaker 5: I could put it for outside of religious stuff.
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: Nice.
• 36:13
  Speaker 4: Nice, Yeah, I just wanted to know your thought on it.
• 36:16
  Speaker 4: I you know, not promoting really any of the places,
• 36:21
  Speaker 4: but from my experience with the Twelve Steps of AA,
• 36:26
  Speaker 4: I've always thought that if you did, like certain of
• 36:29
  Speaker 4: those certain steps, but especially especially the moral inventory when
• 36:32
  Speaker 4: you do the footstep, I actually thought of, like you
• 36:35
  Speaker 4: use that as a magician, you like could do shadow
• 36:39
  Speaker 4: work that way.
• 36:41
  Speaker 5: You know. There's the interesting history though that most people
• 36:43
  Speaker 5: don't know is that if you go back to the
• 36:46
  Speaker 5: lineage of how the AA programs got started. A lot
• 36:49
  Speaker 5: of the people that started that we were already involved
• 36:53
  Speaker 5: in the occult.
• 36:55
  Speaker 4: There were spiritualists. Not too many people like talking about
• 36:57
  Speaker 4: that on the AA, but they.
• 36:59
  Speaker 5: Were involved in the cult. And even as I've tried
• 37:01
  Speaker 5: down to my studies of different areas in the occult,
• 37:05
  Speaker 5: especially the older, much older traditions, I see the lineage
• 37:10
  Speaker 5: of how it played in there. Because so if you
• 37:13
  Speaker 5: work the twelve steps, it does have a very magical
• 37:15
  Speaker 5: vibe into it.
• 37:19
  Speaker 2: That's funny between them.
• 37:22
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I was going to ask you if you thought
• 37:23
  Speaker 4: that maybe there was any occult underlyings in that, because
• 37:28
  Speaker 4: I've heard from my experience just now looking back at
• 37:31
  Speaker 4: the stuff and even stuff from the Big Book, I
• 37:33
  Speaker 4: do think there's some interesting shit in there now, you know,
• 37:36
  Speaker 4: and an occult angle. But I've even heard people say
• 37:39
  Speaker 4: that they even think that possibly even Alistair Crowley was
• 37:43
  Speaker 4: involved writing the Big Book. So if you look really,
• 37:49
  Speaker 4: I've heard people say that I'm not trying to get
• 37:52
  Speaker 4: cited for that, but it did come out before he died,
• 37:55
  Speaker 4: and it is AA and he has I don't know,
• 37:58
  Speaker 4: I don't know where people go with it.
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: Oh and when I real quick too.
• 38:02
  Speaker 4: They used to use I don't know if you noticed
• 38:03
  Speaker 4: in the AA Big Book that circle with the triangle
• 38:06
  Speaker 4: in it. They even took that from the Catholic Church,
• 38:08
  Speaker 4: and we're told they had to take it out of
• 38:10
  Speaker 4: the book, so that I even find that interesting as well.
• 38:17
  Speaker 5: Well, it's funny because I work a lot with a
• 38:19
  Speaker 5: different Freemasons, and so I learned a lot about the
• 38:22
  Speaker 5: tradition and stuff like that. But in order to be
• 38:26
  Speaker 5: accepted as a Freemason, you have to have a belief
• 38:29
  Speaker 5: in a higher power. You don't have to have hot.
• 38:31
  Speaker 5: It doesn't matter what religion you come for what like.
• 38:34
  Speaker 5: You can be Eluciferian, but as long as you believe
• 38:36
  Speaker 5: in a higher power, then you can become that. Even
• 38:39
  Speaker 5: though they technically subscribe to the Bible or some type
• 38:43
  Speaker 5: of holy book. So even there you can see the
• 38:45
  Speaker 5: lineage tied back to the AA structure. You know, you
• 38:50
  Speaker 5: have to have belief, and some have a higher power,
• 38:51
  Speaker 5: even if its doorknob, even if.
• 38:54
  Speaker 4: It's that they say that a doorknob, or a chair,
• 38:59
  Speaker 4: if it's the chair you're sitting in.
• 39:00
  Speaker 5: Right now, And that comes back I think to the
• 39:03
  Speaker 5: power of belief. I think when you have a belief
• 39:07
  Speaker 5: in something greater than yourself, you're able to like empower
• 39:10
  Speaker 5: your spirit.
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: Even the whole thing.
• 39:14
  Speaker 4: If you look at the designing of the Steps, and
• 39:15
  Speaker 4: again I'm just looking at it because I do find
• 39:17
  Speaker 4: it very interesting when when you want to tie it
• 39:19
  Speaker 4: into you know, magic and it is talking about having
• 39:23
  Speaker 4: in a spiritual experience, It's like, I mean, that's the
• 39:25
  Speaker 4: whole goal of the Steps is to have a spiritual experience,
• 39:29
  Speaker 4: and then through prayer and meditation you're going to keep it,
• 39:32
  Speaker 4: you know, keep it going. It's like, how basic of
• 39:34
  Speaker 4: a magician is that that's even theagy right there kind of.
• 39:39
  Speaker 5: And it's it's if you look at it, it's shadow work.
• 39:42
  Speaker 5: You have to dive down into your past, into your
• 39:46
  Speaker 5: your twisted mentality and realize, like, Okay, it wasn't the
• 39:50
  Speaker 5: addiction that was the problem. There was a lot of
• 39:52
  Speaker 5: fucked up things going in my mindset and a lot
• 39:54
  Speaker 5: that there's a lot of probably experience I went through
• 39:57
  Speaker 5: that shift in my chain my thinking, and you have
• 40:00
  Speaker 5: to go unravel all that stuff. And it's not just
• 40:02
  Speaker 5: a one time thing like that's always it's a lifetime journey,
• 40:05
  Speaker 5: you know, like there's all going back, and it's like,
• 40:07
  Speaker 5: the best way I compare it is to like cleaning house.
• 40:09
  Speaker 5: You know, you clean your house, it's good for a
• 40:11
  Speaker 5: week or two, and then you got to go clean again.
• 40:12
  Speaker 5: It's the same thing with your with your mind, body,
• 40:14
  Speaker 5: and spirit. You always have to be taken care of it.
• 40:16
  Speaker 5: It's not ever a done deal. Yeah.
• 40:21
  Speaker 4: Interesting, Yeah, I just as somebody who's been in this stuff,
• 40:23
  Speaker 4: I wanted to know your opinion with this, your experience
• 40:27
  Speaker 4: with the Twelve Steps. It's pretty much the same as well,
• 40:30
  Speaker 4: your thought, I guess the same as mine, that there's
• 40:32
  Speaker 4: some might seems to be some sort of a cult
• 40:35
  Speaker 4: undertones in my opinion, yeah, or it's not. If not,
• 40:40
  Speaker 4: it's definitely. I think you could use it as a
• 40:42
  Speaker 4: magician some of those things and then some of the ideas.
• 40:45
  Speaker 5: Yeah, it's interesting how these magical journeys go together. But
• 40:51
  Speaker 5: to get back to Brandon's, uh, what you were talking
• 40:54
  Speaker 5: about earlier about how unfolding and working with Nicholas Shrek
• 40:57
  Speaker 5: and how even Zena LaVey came out and talked about,
• 41:00
  Speaker 5: you know, disowning the Satanic Church and all this stuff.
• 41:04
  Speaker 5: I mean, okay, so and going back to your question
• 41:07
  Speaker 5: before of kind of how my journey went with going
• 41:10
  Speaker 5: back into the satanic world when being a sober person. Right, Oh,
• 41:14
  Speaker 5: that was an experience because, uh, I went to and
• 41:19
  Speaker 5: I was still in a program, so I was still
• 41:21
  Speaker 5: on a tay leash, you know, like I had a
• 41:22
  Speaker 5: drug test and all this stuff. So I went to
• 41:25
  Speaker 5: I got the permission to go to the Witch's South
• 41:27
  Speaker 5: because I was like one of the main hosts there
• 41:29
  Speaker 5: helping hosts the event. And so I got there and
• 41:33
  Speaker 5: everybody's smoking weed and doing this stuff, you know, And
• 41:36
  Speaker 5: and I think that's really when the kind of additional
• 41:39
  Speaker 5: disillusionment started to happen.
• 41:42
  Speaker 6: Was like.
• 41:44
  Speaker 5: The same connection that I had with it before to
• 41:47
  Speaker 5: then was it wasn't the same nomore. I didn't fit
• 41:49
  Speaker 5: in with those people no more. It was like it
• 41:52
  Speaker 5: wasn't it wasn't my thing anymore. I didn't feel comfortable there,
• 41:54
  Speaker 5: it wasn't who I didn't resonate with who I was anymore.
• 41:57
  Speaker 5: But that had to happen. I kind of had to
• 41:58
  Speaker 5: come to that acceptance. And I mean, I think sometimes
• 42:04
  Speaker 5: people take it taken away with their stories of conspiracy
• 42:09
  Speaker 5: and stuff like that of the magical cult world. When
• 42:14
  Speaker 5: at the end of the day, it's always regular people
• 42:17
  Speaker 5: just trying to be better people through different types of
• 42:21
  Speaker 5: means and religion. Right, So I mean to have to
• 42:28
  Speaker 5: hear Nicholas and Zena come out about the things that
• 42:31
  Speaker 5: they do, I mean, it was just stuff I already
• 42:35
  Speaker 5: had known about.
• 42:39
  Speaker 6: For instance, I can't really go into two.
• 42:42
  Speaker 3: I was gonna say, you get dangle a carrot in
• 42:44
  Speaker 3: front of our nose like that, That's okay. Find that
• 42:48
  Speaker 3: The reason the reason I bring it up, and the
• 42:50
  Speaker 3: reason I brought it up is interesting enough, is because
• 42:52
  Speaker 3: of one of my main things that I'm continually trying
• 42:55
  Speaker 3: to help people understand is that whether you know it
• 42:59
  Speaker 3: or not, you are being influenced by everything around you
• 43:04
  Speaker 3: because of how our nervous systems, brain vision work. And
• 43:10
  Speaker 3: so even if there is some deep underlying conspiracy, or
• 43:14
  Speaker 3: if it is just even if it is just a
• 43:20
  Speaker 3: pentagram upside down, right, there is there are underlying psychic
• 43:27
  Speaker 3: structures in our mind.
• 43:29
  Speaker 6: That move with the rhythm of the moon and tide.
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 43:33
  Speaker 3: That's like a metaphor to the ideas that we're continually
• 43:36
  Speaker 3: being influenced whether we know it or not, and we
• 43:39
  Speaker 3: magnetize ourselves towards the people were around and people that
• 43:45
  Speaker 3: are on a lower magnet. I don't even like the
• 43:48
  Speaker 3: word frequency, but a lower frequency, a vibratory field adhering
• 43:53
  Speaker 3: towards their lower drives. They don't want others around them.
• 43:57
  Speaker 3: This is kind of like what you were experiencing when
• 43:58
  Speaker 3: you're disillusioned, when you went back not doing any of the.
• 44:00
  Speaker 6: Drugs and stuff.
• 44:01
  Speaker 3: It's like you go back there and now you realize
• 44:03
  Speaker 3: that it's like kind of like the term cesspool isn't correct,
• 44:07
  Speaker 3: but there's something with like I because I've been in
• 44:10
  Speaker 3: my own dark night of the soul, so don't don't
• 44:14
  Speaker 3: you know I'm not someone speaking up on high. But
• 44:16
  Speaker 3: it's like I started to realize once I started kind
• 44:19
  Speaker 3: of separating myself from some of the lower level drives,
• 44:23
  Speaker 3: that you start to realize like I'm being influenced at
• 44:26
  Speaker 3: all times, and only I can lift myself on high.
• 44:30
  Speaker 3: Only I can be the one to truly bring myself
• 44:34
  Speaker 3: out of the pits of despair and let the light
• 44:39
  Speaker 3: shine upon the darkness, so that I can take that
• 44:44
  Speaker 3: upside down pentagram symbolically and metaphorically and actually and flip
• 44:48
  Speaker 3: it right side up so that then the highest aspect
• 44:52
  Speaker 3: of things is Spirit, is God or whatever that is,
• 44:56
  Speaker 3: instead of having the lower drives be the highest aspect
• 44:59
  Speaker 3: of things.
• 45:00
  Speaker 6: And so I find it interesting that.
• 45:04
  Speaker 3: Satanism is the thing that the kids want to rebel
• 45:10
  Speaker 3: towards when you're still stuck within the same frameworks of
• 45:14
  Speaker 3: the Christian mythos because there is no if you step
• 45:18
  Speaker 3: outside of the Christian mythology, there is no such thing
• 45:20
  Speaker 3: as satan That is a dualistic understanding of a split
• 45:24
  Speaker 3: of God. And now you know, you start worshiping this
• 45:28
  Speaker 3: other power and it's like you're now putting that up
• 45:31
  Speaker 3: as God.
• 45:32
  Speaker 6: So are you rebelling against God? Or you rebelling against
• 45:34
  Speaker 6: your parents?
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: Not you?
• 45:35
  Speaker 3: But this is kind of my thinking towards how do
• 45:37
  Speaker 3: we get ourselves out of these things? And the symbols matter.
• 45:42
  Speaker 3: So that's my little like it's an interesting you know.
• 45:44
  Speaker 3: And so it's like all the stuff that is going
• 45:46
  Speaker 3: on in say like Leavey and Satanism. Who I think
• 45:50
  Speaker 3: Anton Levey was a CIA plant, even if he knows
• 45:55
  Speaker 3: it or not, due to his acquaintances with Thomas Aquino
• 45:58
  Speaker 3: um or queen is that his name?
• 46:01
  Speaker 1: Tom?
• 46:02
  Speaker 2: Michael?
• 46:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Michael Aquino, thank you? And that's see I was
• 46:07
  Speaker 3: talking about Aquinas earlier.
• 46:09
  Speaker 6: Were really.
• 46:12
  Speaker 3: So anyway, that's my ramble on that kind of thing
• 46:15
  Speaker 3: and how important it is to put ourselves around others
• 46:18
  Speaker 3: and why we like to get into and try to
• 46:20
  Speaker 3: commit a like.
• 46:21
  Speaker 6: Like what Nick's doing with old rejects.
• 46:22
  Speaker 3: It's like we're just trying to put against a bunch
• 46:25
  Speaker 3: of people together that can help bring conversation to the masses.
• 46:30
  Speaker 3: And it's not easy, right Nick, It's not easy to
• 46:33
  Speaker 3: put people together and have conversations, you know, and all
• 46:40
  Speaker 3: it takes is one or two people to bring the
• 46:42
  Speaker 3: whole conversation down.
• 46:43
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, no, I've definitely experienced that.
• 46:47
  Speaker 2: It'd be a shame.
• 46:47
  Speaker 4: It's like for you know, for a while, yeah, for
• 46:52
  Speaker 4: a while the podcast. I mean, even if if this
• 46:55
  Speaker 4: was at a different time, we might have had more
• 46:56
  Speaker 4: people here, but you know, for a while, probably like
• 47:00
  Speaker 4: eight to ten people on the whole thing. And it
• 47:03
  Speaker 4: is interesting how like one person could come in and
• 47:08
  Speaker 4: disrupt everybody and even kind of like brush people off
• 47:11
  Speaker 4: enough to where it's like they don't even come on
• 47:13
  Speaker 4: the show that often anymore until that person's gone. And
• 47:16
  Speaker 4: still even after that, it's like they're kind of like
• 47:18
  Speaker 4: shook by the experience and they're just like, wow, it
• 47:21
  Speaker 4: really wasn't what I thought it was, Like yeah, and
• 47:23
  Speaker 4: it's like either today sorry, like yeah, but so yeah,
• 47:28
  Speaker 4: like how you know one person could even I've seen
• 47:30
  Speaker 4: it on the show, how one person could even affect
• 47:32
  Speaker 4: the whole crew, and it's sucks something like oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 47:37
  Speaker 4: Just people sometimes that probably change or just going through
• 47:42
  Speaker 4: shit in life and start acting different, you know, so
• 47:44
  Speaker 4: getting a little maybe too radical, and it just affects
• 47:47
  Speaker 4: other people and I can't you know what happen, so
• 47:50
  Speaker 4: I gotta sorry.
• 47:55
  Speaker 5: Work. I've done interviews with a lot of males that
• 47:58
  Speaker 5: can kind of get that way.
• 48:00
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 48:00
  Speaker 3: It's not even males though, it's it's it's people. And
• 48:03
  Speaker 3: that's that's one of my main points is that when
• 48:05
  Speaker 3: people get together and if like my main thing about
• 48:08
  Speaker 3: what magic is for, I don't I think low magic
• 48:12
  Speaker 3: and trying to do to find your keys.
• 48:15
  Speaker 6: Or get money or get women or men or any
• 48:18
  Speaker 6: of these things.
• 48:19
  Speaker 3: I think it's kind of silly because if you're actually
• 48:22
  Speaker 3: doing the great work and becoming a mystic, then all
• 48:27
  Speaker 3: that other stuff just happens, you know what I mean,
• 48:31
  Speaker 3: And you will go through something like you've been through,
• 48:34
  Speaker 3: or Nick's been through, or I've been through, where the
• 48:37
  Speaker 3: deconstruction phase, the negrado, the black sun, these things will
• 48:43
  Speaker 3: destroy you because you had to have it happen, and
• 48:48
  Speaker 3: it will continue to destroy you until you learn your lesson.
• 48:52
  Speaker 3: And then once you learn that lesson, your life will
• 48:54
  Speaker 3: rebuild itself because of your your your nature is moved
• 49:00
  Speaker 3: towards your great work. And I think maybe that's something
• 49:03
  Speaker 3: you've even found in your own life. It sounds like
• 49:06
  Speaker 3: with like learning the lesson, even though it seems like
• 49:09
  Speaker 3: things have happened, and then now you can rebuild and
• 49:11
  Speaker 3: it seems like you're doing pretty well for yourself.
• 49:14
  Speaker 5: Oh, let me tell you, it's fun. It's so funny though. Okay,
• 49:17
  Speaker 5: So you know, and when you're reading a book, they
• 49:19
  Speaker 5: foreshadow stuff. Oh yeah, when the Path of Magic, I
• 49:23
  Speaker 5: always find that, like it seems like the next the
• 49:27
  Speaker 5: next evolution is always foreshadowed. Oya, right, so when it's
• 49:32
  Speaker 5: started doing the order of the black flames. So this
• 49:34
  Speaker 5: is stuff that I that I was. I it was
• 49:38
  Speaker 5: stuff that was I was I would say channeling the
• 49:40
  Speaker 5: best terms of when I was working with like the
• 49:43
  Speaker 5: Luciferian current, and that stuff, you know, with the darker aspects.
• 49:47
  Speaker 5: But and then I didn't really understand what the historical
• 49:52
  Speaker 5: reference was it to the Black Son. You know, I
• 49:54
  Speaker 5: would just say, so cool, I'm going to make a
• 49:57
  Speaker 5: whole religion. Now. This is awesome though. But then it's
• 50:01
  Speaker 5: funny because then things would come into my life and
• 50:03
  Speaker 5: I would learn what the Black Son was a still
• 50:05
  Speaker 5: nigger and all these different things. And looking back now,
• 50:08
  Speaker 5: I put together these pieces, you know, and then it's
• 50:11
  Speaker 5: funny today because I didn't really understand that Lucifer also
• 50:16
  Speaker 5: had the connection with like the feminine and then the
• 50:19
  Speaker 5: star Tee and all these different entities, you know, but
• 50:21
  Speaker 5: it's like they're like the opposite version of them. So
• 50:25
  Speaker 5: and it's funny because that when I I was working
• 50:29
  Speaker 5: with with with the Star Tape for a little while
• 50:33
  Speaker 5: in my sober life, and this is before I came
• 50:35
  Speaker 5: into contact with the Ota. But it's interesting how those
• 50:39
  Speaker 5: things evolve and transcend. So yeah, so I started working
• 50:44
  Speaker 5: with the Starte and then I came into contact with
• 50:46
  Speaker 5: the Ota, and then their patron goddess is a Starte,
• 50:50
  Speaker 5: and then the Canaanite and all this stuff. So it's
• 50:53
  Speaker 5: interesting how to see how the magical life unfolds.
• 50:57
  Speaker 6: Yeah, definitely.
• 50:59
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 51:00
  Speaker 2: How do you like how do you like the ota?
• 51:04
  Speaker 5: Okay, it's pretty cool, little cool people.
• 51:08
  Speaker 4: I remember, Oh my god, classic that Poke Runyan Clatia video.
• 51:14
  Speaker 2: I think he's so old. I thought that was great.
• 51:17
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I don't know much about them.
• 51:19
  Speaker 4: Yeah, a star tape.
• 51:23
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I didn't really know much about them either. One
• 51:26
  Speaker 5: of my girlfriends, she like, invited me to the Feast
• 51:31
  Speaker 5: of the Gods that they were having and it was
• 51:33
  Speaker 5: sounded really cool. So I went and I got introduced
• 51:35
  Speaker 5: to them, and I didn't know at that time. I
• 51:38
  Speaker 5: didn't really know who Poke Runyan was or any of
• 51:40
  Speaker 5: these guys, you know. And my friend she's like, you
• 51:42
  Speaker 5: have to do an interview with him. I was like, okay,
• 51:47
  Speaker 5: So I did the interview, you know, and and then
• 51:50
  Speaker 5: come to find out, I started getting all this feedback
• 51:52
  Speaker 5: on who on him, and then that's when I kind
• 51:55
  Speaker 5: of really figured out who he was and like that
• 51:57
  Speaker 5: the influence he had in the occult world. But you know,
• 52:00
  Speaker 5: my thing was always like the church saying rock and
• 52:02
  Speaker 5: roll stuff. So it's interesting though, because it goes back
• 52:06
  Speaker 5: into her meticism and the Tree of Life and all
• 52:09
  Speaker 5: these different things. I love discovering all these different layers
• 52:12
  Speaker 5: of magic, and and it always coordinates with what I'm
• 52:15
  Speaker 5: going through in life for the layer I'm at in life.
• 52:18
  Speaker 5: Like you were saying earlier, you know, we we attract
• 52:21
  Speaker 5: what at the level we're at. So that's really it's
• 52:25
  Speaker 5: been a fun journey working with them.
• 52:27
  Speaker 4: Nice. That's cool. Yeah, Uh did you have any have
• 52:35
  Speaker 4: anything else? Something totally forgot? Oh did you get into
• 52:40
  Speaker 4: Thelema at all Limic stuff?
• 52:43
  Speaker 5: I didn't get into Thalma?
• 52:45
  Speaker 2: Okay, nothing.
• 52:49
  Speaker 5: I mean out here in California we have a big
• 52:52
  Speaker 5: melting pot of the occult, all the occult groups in
• 52:54
  Speaker 5: La So I've always kind of been privy to like
• 52:58
  Speaker 5: information on the different groups and the people are the groups,
• 53:02
  Speaker 5: and I think it just was not anything that I
• 53:04
  Speaker 5: found that a tracked me.
• 53:06
  Speaker 6: You know.
• 53:06
  Speaker 5: I think once I got out of my I think
• 53:09
  Speaker 5: the Golden Dawn kind of introduced me into the light
• 53:12
  Speaker 5: side of magic and the duality play of that. So
• 53:15
  Speaker 5: I think once I started, and like you were saying,
• 53:17
  Speaker 5: that's when I really started saying that in order to
• 53:20
  Speaker 5: create change, I had to work on myself through through
• 53:23
  Speaker 5: magical ways. And then all this other stuff starts coming in,
• 53:26
  Speaker 5: and not only that, Like when you're working with the
• 53:29
  Speaker 5: with darker layers of magic, you can ask like, hey,
• 53:33
  Speaker 5: let's say a guy like they wanted they want to
• 53:35
  Speaker 5: attract a woman. Okay, they attract all that. Now they
• 53:38
  Speaker 5: start getting all these like crazy women, because that's that's
• 53:42
  Speaker 5: the level they're at, right. They haven't dealt with things internally.
• 53:45
  Speaker 5: They want a high value women, but they haven't dealt
• 53:47
  Speaker 5: with the things inside themselves to attract that type of woman.
• 53:50
  Speaker 5: But I think with like magic, like the Golden Down,
• 53:53
  Speaker 5: all stuff like it works on you. So when you're ready,
• 53:57
  Speaker 5: like those things come in and you're ready for the
• 54:00
  Speaker 5: those things, you're ready to be able to work with
• 54:02
  Speaker 5: those things. You're ready to be the person that you
• 54:04
  Speaker 5: need to be to have that high value partner or
• 54:07
  Speaker 5: to be able to go on YouTube and do shows
• 54:09
  Speaker 5: and all this stuff. Like you're at the level to
• 54:11
  Speaker 5: be able to do it. Yeah, you don't stand your
• 54:14
  Speaker 5: own way, Yeah.
• 54:15
  Speaker 6: Yeah for sure.
• 54:16
  Speaker 7: Yeah.
• 54:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 54:17
  Speaker 3: If I've learned anything through my I teach martial arts,
• 54:20
  Speaker 3: and if I've learned anything, it's even in simple drills.
• 54:24
  Speaker 6: Is most of the time we get in our own way.
• 54:26
  Speaker 3: The whole time, and it's because we don't actually know
• 54:29
  Speaker 3: what it's like to feel our own body, you know
• 54:32
  Speaker 3: what I mean. It's like one of the simple drills
• 54:34
  Speaker 3: is to be able to like they call it chisau
• 54:36
  Speaker 3: or they call it like push hands, and a lot
• 54:39
  Speaker 3: of it is like understanding how your body moves and
• 54:42
  Speaker 3: then you have a partner to get there, and then
• 54:43
  Speaker 3: all of a sudden you're moving together, and it's like
• 54:45
  Speaker 3: you can't get to the next step with a partner
• 54:48
  Speaker 3: in this allegory if you don't first understand how to
• 54:51
  Speaker 3: move with your own body.
• 54:54
  Speaker 6: You know what I mean.
• 54:55
  Speaker 3: And so it's an interesting thing, is like how can
• 54:57
  Speaker 3: I learn to be okay in this thing here that
• 55:02
  Speaker 3: I have that is actually deeply integrated to my own consciousness?
• 55:06
  Speaker 3: And I think magic has the ability to help that unfold.
• 55:09
  Speaker 3: And as as you said very eloquently, and I will
• 55:12
  Speaker 3: repeat it for everyone out there, is like, if you
• 55:14
  Speaker 3: ever want to attract something out in the world, you
• 55:17
  Speaker 3: you first have to be the person that you would
• 55:20
  Speaker 3: want to attract. You can't be your current self, especially
• 55:24
  Speaker 3: if you keep attracting ghouls and ghosts and goblins. It's
• 55:28
  Speaker 3: like if you want an angel you have to vibrate
• 55:31
  Speaker 3: yourself at the level of the angels.
• 55:33
  Speaker 6: It's the only way it works.
• 55:37
  Speaker 5: Very good, it's true.
• 55:40
  Speaker 4: So what do you what's your plans in the future?
• 55:42
  Speaker 4: You got any things? I know you mentioned that ebook too,
• 55:47
  Speaker 4: what's going on with that?
• 55:49
  Speaker 5: Yeah. So it's a little gift I'm giving out to
• 55:52
  Speaker 5: all my all the people that have been along with
• 55:54
  Speaker 5: me along the way, and the new people. Just to
• 55:57
  Speaker 5: Funlott some poems in there by life journeys, and then
• 56:02
  Speaker 5: some little rituals and sigils in there. Nothing is and
• 56:06
  Speaker 5: it's not it's not. I know most of us are
• 56:09
  Speaker 5: really complex into deep stuff in the magical world, but
• 56:12
  Speaker 5: this is more for life. It's very simplistic, very low key.
• 56:18
  Speaker 6: Nice.
• 56:19
  Speaker 3: We all start somewhere, right, Yeah, well.
• 56:26
  Speaker 5: Is there she'd like guys like to get into.
• 56:29
  Speaker 3: Well, how does it feel to live in l a
• 56:31
  Speaker 3: Cesspool City?
• 56:33
  Speaker 5: No, yeah, right now I'm working considering living out there.
• 56:39
  Speaker 5: I live on the outskirts.
• 56:41
  Speaker 6: Nice good.
• 56:42
  Speaker 5: La is pretty I mean, the magical community in LA
• 56:45
  Speaker 5: is pretty.
• 56:46
  Speaker 6: Big, for sure. It's huge.
• 56:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 56:51
  Speaker 5: But I heard this joke the other day. I hope
• 56:54
  Speaker 5: I should get it because kind of political, right, But
• 56:57
  Speaker 5: I was saying like as I ran that I ran,
• 57:00
  Speaker 5: I wanted to come Bambas in California, but then they
• 57:02
  Speaker 5: seem to state word and they said they couldn't do
• 57:04
  Speaker 5: any worse to us.
• 57:07
  Speaker 6: That's a great joke a l A. I was like,
• 57:10
  Speaker 6: oh my god, Yeah, it's crazy.
• 57:13
  Speaker 2: Just let the guy keep doing. Yeah, that's funny.
• 57:22
  Speaker 6: That's funny.
• 57:23
  Speaker 5: So for the future. Yeah, I've just did an interview
• 57:26
  Speaker 5: with Pithy and priests, so that's been coming out soon.
• 57:31
  Speaker 5: I mean, I'm doing I work. I work with a
• 57:34
  Speaker 5: lot of different people, so we'll see what unfolds.
• 57:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, did you talk about the paranormal with her?
• 57:42
  Speaker 5: Yeah, she has a really cool story her normal. Yeah.
• 57:48
  Speaker 5: I think it was really need working with her, And
• 57:50
  Speaker 5: it was a really cool opportunity to work with Nicholas
• 57:52
  Speaker 5: Shreck as well and hear his story and it was
• 57:55
  Speaker 5: kind of it's kind of confirmed stuff that I already
• 57:57
  Speaker 5: had known out the Church of Satan. But it's it's
• 58:02
  Speaker 5: always interesting to hear people different sides, because I think
• 58:05
  Speaker 5: you more you hear the repetitive things, you know that
• 58:07
  Speaker 5: you can kind of define what is the truth and
• 58:09
  Speaker 5: stuff like that when it comes from different sources, you.
• 58:12
  Speaker 4: Don't think you'll like, maybe I'm not crazy. Somebody else
• 58:14
  Speaker 4: look it too. Yeah, I'm not imagining.
• 58:20
  Speaker 5: Like how did you guys get started with your podcast?
• 58:24
  Speaker 4: I I was, I was into the occult for a minute,
• 58:28
  Speaker 4: and then I joined the OTO and then I left,
• 58:31
  Speaker 4: and uh, I don't know something just maybe oh you
• 58:35
  Speaker 4: know what basically the whole thing with COVID.
• 58:37
  Speaker 2: You know where you think I shut down. I think
• 58:39
  Speaker 2: I used the bailout.
• 58:40
  Speaker 4: Check to actually go buy podcasting equipment, and I was like,
• 58:42
  Speaker 4: fuck it, I'll sell podcasting.
• 58:43
  Speaker 2: What else am I going to do?
• 58:45
  Speaker 1: You know?
• 58:45
  Speaker 4: Like I was, I was out of work already because
• 58:47
  Speaker 4: I got hurt, so believe it or not, Like I mean,
• 58:50
  Speaker 4: COVID didn't make a difference, Like I wasn't working with
• 58:53
  Speaker 4: all those so yeah, so I ended up doing I
• 58:57
  Speaker 4: ended up using Yeah, I think it was the first first,
• 58:59
  Speaker 4: a second, a bell out checker, yeah, boor podcasting equipment,
• 59:03
  Speaker 4: And was like, fuck, I'm going to talk about the
• 59:05
  Speaker 4: occult uh or I wanted to kind of that in conspiracies.
• 59:09
  Speaker 4: Actually I was a lot more with conspiracies, but it
• 59:12
  Speaker 4: was the occult was in there, and uh, you know,
• 59:16
  Speaker 4: I started the occult rejects with somebody else as like
• 59:21
  Speaker 4: kind of a co host for about a year year
• 59:23
  Speaker 4: and a half, and then after he left, I kind
• 59:25
  Speaker 4: of changed it and started going less conspiracy or try
• 59:29
  Speaker 4: to And now the last two years it's really been
• 59:31
  Speaker 4: just all occult, which is I'm a lot happier with
• 59:34
  Speaker 4: now too. Yeah, yeah, because I like I even had
• 59:37
  Speaker 4: people on the show that were conspiracy theorists that unfortunately,
• 59:42
  Speaker 4: like they weren't even you know what's crazy, They weren't
• 59:43
  Speaker 4: even Christians, but they still thought everything is like Dixon demons.
• 59:47
  Speaker 2: You know, it's like an ongoing joke.
• 59:48
  Speaker 4: I always say, they think whenever it comes to magic,
• 59:51
  Speaker 4: that's all it is, is like, you know, something's demonic
• 59:53
  Speaker 4: or somebody's getting as raped. You know, it's like that's
• 59:56
  Speaker 4: all it boils down to. You know, everything's a fucking
• 59:58
  Speaker 4: phallic fallous. It's like, yo, who's dick actually looks like
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 4: an obelism? Yeah right, you know, it's like come on,
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 4: let's you know curve no just I mean, what the fuck?
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 5: No?
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 2: But whatever, But yeah, it's just you.
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 4: Know, so uh yeah, I kind of uh yeah, got
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 4: out of the It was rough having people on like
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 4: that with other occultists because we just couldn't even kind
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 4: of even really be ourselves or we had to worry
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 4: about this these you know. Eventually we had people on
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 4: the show calling us Nazis. I don't even know because
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 4: we had because we had Stephen Flowers on.
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because we had Stephen Flowers on, and I lost
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 2: like two people from the show because of that.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 6: It's his work is brilliant.
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 4: They're like, oh, you're a Nazi, and I was like, oh,
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 4: fuck yourself, really fuck you, Like, I'm not kissing Nazi balls.
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 2: I was like, you know, I didn't ask you to either.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 5: It's funny how there's the layers like that, you know,
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 5: because I went through that too, with the Nazi stuff
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 5: and all that stuff.
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 2: I actually had I come with them well the time too.
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 4: I always shot on the Nazis. I've covered Nazis and
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 4: like what the fuck?
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, you people go down the rabbit hole, and
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 5: unfortunately it's like not the rabbit holes you want to
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 5: go down. Sometimes.
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 3: Well then they don't understand correlation and causation. So it's
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 3: like you just because these things correlate doesn't mean they
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 3: cause each other, you know what I mean.
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 6: It's it's silly, well.
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 5: Especially like if you look like with the black Sun,
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 5: that's what I'm saying back to Nazi even though.
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 6: They try, Yeah, yeah.
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 5: Exactly symbol but it seeds that so people just I
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 5: think people like to have the big crazy story sticks
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 5: out to most people. Then the reality, the boring reality
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 5: kind of some sometimes behind stuff, you know, and that
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 5: going back to like the Satan Church of Satan stuff,
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 5: learning what I've learned about it. It's funny though, because
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 5: I think people create the beasts themselves. Yeah, the church
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 5: to say, it would have never been that big unless
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 5: there was something within people, and it's human tendency since
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 5: Adam and Eve humans human tendency to kind of kind
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 5: of check out what's the darkness, check out what the
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 5: opposite is? You know. So I think that's a big
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 5: I have made it as big as it was.
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, it's definitely it we have.
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 5: I think we have that tendency most of the time
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 5: curiosity that no.
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 4: I think that's built into its curiosity or it should.
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 2: All Yeah.
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, Brandon, did you have anything else? I think
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 4: unless there's anything else you want to talk about to
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 4: try to promote.
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 5: Yeah, we'll go. I would say, go follow me on YouTube.
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 5: I have two channels. There is official and then there's
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 5: the rare element, and then I also have gonna be
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 5: coming out with a couple more YouTube channels for Taro
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 5: strictly Tarot cards and one that's just gonna have clips
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 5: from different shows on there. So that's something we're gonna
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 5: be looking forward to. And I have more artists and
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 5: people in the co world that are going to be on,
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 5: so subscribe there. I'm on all social platforms, so go
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 5: follow us.
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 6: Nice.
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 4: Thank you very much, Lucie. I very much appreciate you
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 4: coming on. Sorry about earlier with the time mess up,
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 4: but made it happen anyway.
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 2: Awesome. And Brandon, please let everybody know what is up
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 2: with you man.
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 3: All the great things are up on this and Magus
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 3: in the media coming out tomorrow.
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 6: Everyone go check it out.
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 3: Alan Chapman, he's a big name in the same way
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 3: as he is also away in his own world and
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 3: that is a three and a half hour conversation where
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 3: we dive deep into his magia, his mysteries, his Holy
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 3: Guardian Angel workings.
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 6: As well as.
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 3: His Crowley and the Oto work that the Oto wasn't
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 3: very happy about. So it's a great talk, and we're
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 3: hopefully going to get him on The Rejects as well.
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 6: I'm also going to be.
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 3: Dropping Freighter Elitharia interview next week as in hopefully Ian
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 3: Edwards' interview next.
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 6: Week as well. So we got lots of stuff.
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 3: The Great Kai of a Rose, my love and Darling
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 3: is going to be back, and so her and I
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 3: are going to be putting out our weekly shows, going
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 3: to try to be dropping those a lot more since
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 3: she's back. We've had a busy last few weeks, and
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 3: so we're going to be covering all of the all
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 3: the crazy things in this world that are going on
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 3: through our brilliant philosophical, magical, mystical, and astrological perspectives. So yeah,
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 3: so it's gonna be great. Nick and I are going
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 3: to be doing some stuff. We don't know what it's
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 3: going to be great, we have ideas, but we're going
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 3: to be doing great things. So thank you Lucy for
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 3: a wonderful conversation, and I look forward to our next one.
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 4: Thank you, Thank you very much. Yes, and thank you again, Lucy.
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 4: I very much appreciate you coming on. Interesting story definitely
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 4: for sure, very powerful too. I mean I could totally
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 4: identify with a lot of stuff, the drugs in the jail,
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 4: so uh, you know, interesting stuff and great to see that,
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 4: you know, change, Yes, and thank you everybody in the chat.
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 4: That is what's up, what's going on, and I appreciate it,
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 4: and that's where we go live and until the next one,
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 4: everybody be well.
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 7: Later, close your words, look into the darkness, find the
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 7: lazy story.
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 1: Focus on they'll be called the eclipse. Don't feel thank you,
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 1: sure be good guy.
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 5: You got to turn every game. I don't want to
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 5: hear it.