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Elon Musk Talks About The Presidential Candidate, Dean Phillips with Bill Ackman, Jason Calacanis. · Elon Musk Thinking

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Elon. I don't think you've met Dean yet, Elon Musk meet entrepreneur Dean
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Phillips, also a presidential candidate now running. I think at about twenty six
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percent in New Hampshire. Elon. Dean is under the age of eighty,
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he's run. He ran Belvidere Vodka. I think we might have popped a
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bottle of Belvedere Laca back in the day. And he also, you know,
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ran the delicious Silenty gelato company. So he's an entrepreneur, he's under
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eighty, and he's a moderate, and you know he has the backing of
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Bill and myself now I think in this election. So maybe your thoughts today
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just on twenty twenty four DII and Mark picking Day, everything well at Friscal.
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I agree with the puzsanive attribute that you listed. I think there's definitely
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something if you said full of those things. And I agree with what Blackin
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said about the I you know this, we really want to in order for
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records be the land of opportunity, we have to be arit based society.
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The moment we let go of being a merit based society, we are no
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longer the land of opportunity, and that is very important to appreciate. So
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out of King of this country is nothing. Actually it just ended up with
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a ties student debt. And you know, I've had some success, so
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you know, I think and and and this is this, This is true
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of many people. And I think there's there's perhaps of sometimes I misunderstanding or
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lack of appreciation that uh, when kids are born into comfort, there that
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lack of adversity uh is actually a liability for them. It is not the
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case that a lack of adversity makes them motivated. It tends to decrease motivation.
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So the reason they had the sort of loads and peasants in most societies
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and still you know some cases still have it was in order to preserve the
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power of the the kids who were not as capable as their parents. So
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and you know, and they wanted to have in America a place where you
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could prosper and succeed based upon your merits, based upon your skills and hard
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work. That's that was extremely important. So I just want to emphasize it
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is not the case that want its prosperity is a path to success. I
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think it is very often not a path to success. You have to say,
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how many second and third generations of those who were very success well are
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themselves successful. They are the exception at the normal. Yeah, I think
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we've seen that first and in uh yeah, in our circles and just the
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people who tend to in entrepreneurship drive results are the ones who come from a
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lot of adversity and my gosh, Silicon Valley gets you know, a pretty
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gets criticized a whole lot. But just watching who has run to the positions
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of power, in many cases immigrants, kids of immigrants, and people who
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started with nothing. I think moving on to this election, Dean, I
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was wondering if you could give us an idea of what it's like to be
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running in the Democratic Party and what you're seeing, you know, in the
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streets of New Hampshire, what you're you're getting from the electorate in terms of
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their choice and a lot of us who are lifelong Democrats actually you want most
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people don't know this, I think has been a speak for himself. But
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sure a lifelong Democrat, yeah, so made for I mean as fared to
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be a lifelong independent, but for practical purposes I have I have for most
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of my life been a Democrat. Now I do believe that one should consider
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both parties, and so I sort of favorite in patis thought that that you
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shouldn't just vote for a candidate because of a political party. I think you
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should vote for a candidate on the merits of the candidate and be open at
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least occasionally to voting for the candidate of the other party. But but yes,
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it's the life of never Democrat can mean, it can mean that you
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will vote for a Democrat no matter what, and that is certainly not the
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case. Remain Yeah, you're but but I have objectively, you know,
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voted for Democrats the vast majority of my life. Yes, And so you
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know, Dean, when when you look at the feedback you're getting on the
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choices people, I think overwhelmingly in America or not interested in a rematch of
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that's another statement. And maybe yeah, and we're in fact looking for maybe
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moderates, not lunatics on either side of the fringe, and maybe some normalcy
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and competency in the White House. But you've had a heck of a time
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getting on the ballots. So maybe you could talk a little bit about the
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ballot issue being blocked by the Democratic Party, which we thought was hopefully going
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to be incredibly democratic, and then just why you're breaking ranks and now the
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most hated man in the Democratic Party for criticizing Biden running at his advance.
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So you know, there's actually there's an interesting analogy here because in my business
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life, my father, my partner Steve Gill, Josh hawkshul or others.
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You know, we provided antidotes to duopolies. When it was vodka, it
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was absolute and stolic Chnaia, and we introduced Belvedere. When it was ice
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cream it was Ben and Jerry's and Hagenda's. We introduced to Lenti. And
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it is the analogy of politics. We have Democrats and Republicans. And the
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truth is it's great to be an independent in America until you run for office,
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because the system is designed to prevent the success of independence, free thinkers,
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people who might have some views on the left, some on the right.
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In fact, it was George Washington that warned us in his farewell address
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so long ago that he believed that the great risks of this country would be
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in the development of factions, which is exactly exactly what we're facing right now.
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So that is the system in which I now operate that I wish to
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disrupt in the same way I did to the other categories, and to the
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extent that you everybody listening, which is to join me. Doesn't matter if
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you're a Democrat, a Republican, a libertarian, independent. By the way,
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more independence in America than far more in fact now than Democrats and Republicans.
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That's ultimately my mission, because the truth is both parties are participating in
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the erosion of democracy right now. On January sixth, I will say that
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it was an effort to prevent the counting of ballots. I was there in
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the chamber that day. I felt it. You all watched on TV.
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It was horrific. Democrats now in the state of Florida, in the state
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of North Carolina have literally decided that Joe Biden won the primary. There need
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not be a competition, and they will submit his name and all the delegates
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to the convention in Chicago next year without even an election. Democrats have no
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chance to vote. The state of New Hampshire, where I am right now,
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you guys, it's even more appalling. The Democratic National Committee decided to
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take one hundred and three year old extraordinary practice of democracy transfer. It to
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South Carolina, and that means that any candidate on the ballot here, including
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me, is not going to get any delegates, no matter how well we
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do. In fact, it's so atrocious that the Democratic National Committee sent a
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letter to the New Hampshire Democrats last week saying that this is a meaningless effort,
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it is not an election and they should stand down, which got a
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response from this State of New Hampshire. Listen to this. The State of
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New Hampshire sent a cease and assist to the Democratic National Committee just days ago
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for the quote unlawful suppression of voters. Now, I don't think most people
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listening probably even are aware of this, but these are the truths, and
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I'm on a Yeah. It's insane and it's wrong. It is just as
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significant of an erosion of democracy as the effort to now one was violent in
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a mob and a riot, of course, and it was horrifying, But
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the behind the scenes effort to essentially disenfranchise Americans is just as dangerous. And
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I'm going to make that case to you guys. I'm a proud Democrat.
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I'm trying to, at least in a last ditch effort to restore the principles
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of democracy through the Democratic Party. That's why I'm running. And the coronation
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of a candidate, in this case Joe Biden, who is unelectable. Every
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single poll is approval numbers, intuition. We all know why the coronation of
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a candidate is exactly the opposite, is antithetical to what this country was founded
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on. So what I'm seeing you guys, is actually joyful. I've been
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campaigning around the country and it is the most beautiful, patriotic, inspiring and
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reinvigoring and reinvigorating experience you could possibly imagine. If you, guys, your
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families want to come along for a couple of days, I'm telling you,
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anybody listening, come along. If you want to restore your faith in this
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country, join me and talking to Trump supporters to far left liberals to libertarians.
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It is a beautiful, remarkable experience and entertainment which I considered the evening
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cable opinioned news talkers would have us believe that we're so much more divided than
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we really are. And I'm pretty appalled when I hear people say shame on
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you for even appearing right now with those three guys on Twitter or on Ax,
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I'm sorry forgive me, Elon, don't hold me accountable for that.
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Sorry, I'm sure I bet you do it once and more. Whatever you
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understand, It's just I was trying. I was trying to brood in the
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platform beyond the original premise of short text messages like that. So that's my
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whole case is this, guys. I love conversation. I can never do
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my long test exactly, So that's all. You know, Guys, what
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I love about this is we need debate. We need deliberation. You know,
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in business, I was taught, I was taught. I was that
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if two people always agree, you only need one of them. We need
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to celebrate difference. I just want to close with this, Jason. You
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know, we going back to what you start and what Elon said as well.
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You know, two things can be true at once. We should be
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a meritocracy, but we should also ensure that everybody can participate in that meritocracy.
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And I think we can all agree on that, and that's to me,
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the grand solution for our country is to do just that. There has
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been injustice, we can correct it, and we can correct it for everybody
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so that everybody participates. What a beautiful outcome. I got to tell you,
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guys, Joe Biden and Donald Trump are not going to be the guys
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that can even dream about that, let alone execute it. They aren't prepared
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for AI. They don't understand what is forthcoming, what we can do,
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and how we can do it. And that's why I'm running. And I
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got to tell you it's the most extraordinary and fun experience of my life.
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And I hope people can come out and join me because it is, uh,
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it's reinvigorating. So Bill Ackman, I'm curious you're a position on just
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what's happening in the Democratic Party. Obviously, I think you've been a donor
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and obviously you get courted by them. What is your best thinking handicapping of
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what the Democratic Party is doing by not having debates and putting up a candidate
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that is so unpopular and that is you know, I think you've said this,
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you know has no chance of winning. And then what do you think
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of this Democratic Party machine blocking the debates and blocking the balance. I think
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it's an embarrassment to our country and I and I'm ashamed. And you know,
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I know some very high quality people that have good relationships with tender Reschumer,
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who I've enormous respect for as a good man, and I can't imagine
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his being sort of part of it. I think the original premise was,
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well, quote unquote, the only person who can be Donald Trump is President
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Biden. So we got to stick by President Biden. And I think that
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was the original logic behind putting up Biden the candidate, because they didn't see
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anyone a logical person they felt that could be competitive with Trump. Now that
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as Biden falls further and further behind the polls, as his health and cognitive
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health, you know, sort of obviously deteriorates, I think there's got to
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be great concern. But all of that being said, I think it's a
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bit like we go back to the Emperor's new clothes, you know, well
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the childhood book. No one wants to say the Emperor has no clothes.
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And I give Dean a lot of credit for saying that, because again,
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if you step out of line. Unfortunately most people in Washington, being a
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politician is a career, it's a source of income, it's their business,
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and they can't risk not getting re elected. Right, So if you challenge
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the king, your toast and there goes your career, right, It always
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comes to back to incentives. In my view, drive all human, babe.
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You look at the incentives of the people. Most of the people large
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in the Congress. I mean, Dean has the benefit of he's a super
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talented entrepreneur. He can go right back to that anytime he wants. He's
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made some money, so he's say if he doesn't need the job, and
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therefore he's unfortunately one of the few people, or always say fortunately he's one
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of the few people who can step into this race. But I think everyone
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else is. You know, if the machines against them, there's no chance
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of reelection. You know, in the Congress, you've got to get reelection.
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Every coompany bills, right, you guys. I got to say,
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you know one thing, another truth is that Congress is populated almost exclusively with
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people that have been brought up in the political world. All they know is
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a spirit of competition winning the next election. And that's why incumbency is part
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of the It's almost biblical in politics. The incumbent is always recordinated. Forget
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the data, forget the national mood, forget winning. It is just baked
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in. So the absence of entrepreneurial spirit, and looking at this from a
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different perspective is staggering. And then to Bill's other point, you know,
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I have been successful, and that means nobody can buy me, nobody can
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influence me. I will always make the right decision, but I won't make
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that decision until I hear from all perspectives on any issue. And as the
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only member of Congress, you guys, five hundred and thirty five people,
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I'm the only one that takes no pack money of any kind that means corporate
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or union or anything else, no special interest money. I don't take any
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lobbyist money. I don't take or give money to fellow members of Congress because
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that's basically just money laundering. And I don't have a leadership pack, which
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is basically just a politician's slush fund, the only one out of five hundred
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and thirty five people. And people wonder why policies tend to favor only the
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wealthy and well connected. Well, you got the farm industry that brings three
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hundred million dollars a year to Washington in the form of lobbying and in the
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form of campaign contributions, literally enriching the campaigns of the very people who are
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on the committees of jurisdiction for their industries. All it is is legalized corruption,
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you guys. So I understand why people who support Donald Trump are angry
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and they're fed up and they're nauseated, because you know what, I've been
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on the inside now for five years and I am too. So I appreciate
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those words from Bill and he's spot up. I want to bring up a
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topic that's, you know, being discussed on x every day, videos being
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shared, and it feels like it's a top it might be the top topic
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of this election, which is the border. Kelan, you have to you're
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an immigrant who came to this country again with nothing. I think you seem
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to have done okay for yourself so far. Keep working, I mean so
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false, so good. You know, yes, okay at one day and
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you can make it too one day. It's America. I would say most
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most of the eland's games are paper games. That's question. Yeah, but
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what do you think as an entrepreneur ended immigrant elon a reasonable immigration strategy because
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we have two groups that you know, on one side there seems to be
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absolutely no border control. On the other side, Hey shut down the border.
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What would be a reasonable approach that you ask somebody who's an immigrant and
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who needs to get talented immigrants to work at space X, to work at
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your companies, what would you do if they said hate Elan? You decide,
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well, pray first last that I should send a very pro immigrant,
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obviously being one myself. And you can just look at the you know,
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old aces that have come to America and built incredible things to say like,
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wow, it would be foolish if that if we had prevented them from coming,
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or if they chose not to come because they've added so much value to
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the team. I mean, you can think of I think the right way
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to think about countries like a pro sports team. It's like, okay,
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you want to get the ace players on your team, or and you suddenly
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don't want to force them to fight against you on the other team. That's
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crazy. And if you add, if you you add some ace players to
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the team, that's going to help you win the championship and it helps the
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whole team. So I'm very much a favor of a greatly expanded UH legal
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immigration system because right now it is trying to get us a green card or
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citizenship. Is UH a byzantine, kafka esque laborious uh and just flat out
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wrong. It doesn't make it's it's an insane obstacle course to become a parent
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resident and then a citizen, and and and and it's to a very small
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number of people. So when you really need to first of all fix that,
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and then secondly, we cannot have not really an open border, but
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a border where the federal company is facilitating the transfer of vast numbers of people
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into the country. And even when say Texas tries to take action to enforce
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the law, the federal government is trying to stop them from doing so there's
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like literally a federal laws lawsuit to stop Texas from actually enforcing the legal immigration
18:30
laws. And it's important to bear in mind that the United States is only
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four to five percent of the world population, so it's very easy for the
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varied states to get swamped by illegal immigration, just absolutely swamped. And you
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know, if if you're somewhere else and you say, like, okay,
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well they're going to give free money, housing, and medical care to illegal
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immigrants, and you know, and that exceeds the standard of living in half
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the world, why doesn't half the world just move here. That's certainly that
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you know, as as Bill said a moment ago, instead of dry behavior.
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Obviously, it'd be strange if they didn't. And so and what we're
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seeing as that word is getting out so that it's getting it's going viral.
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Basically, legal immigration through the southern border is going viral. This is not
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a Mexico thing. Almost none of the people coming across are Mexican. Yeah,
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and you saw it first, says And just so people know this is
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being positioned Bill as some sort of a partisan issue. There was just a
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pull that came out this month. Seventy five percent of the country, seventy
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five percent of Americans view what's happening at the border as a crisis or very
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serious. So I guess Bill, I'll hand it to you. You heard
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you all sort of Yeah. I just want to like that people do not
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just look at the graphs of the rate of growth of illegal immigration. It
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is going exponential. Is it is going like it's going you know, to
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use a rocket ship analogy, it is a rocketship of growth of legal immigration
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because because of social media, everyone on Earth knows this and they all know
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and it is now an industry from speaks for getting as Oni Lemit are all
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absolutely so it's it's exactly the amount of press on it has now given it
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a tipping point back when I'm curious, Bill, what your thoughts are on
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this and what's reasonable? I mean, you have countries Australian, zeal And,
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Canada, the Nordics say, well, are based on a points system,
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right, and they have specific number targets which we don't have in this
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country. And then Dan will go to you because I know you have a
20:38
reasonable position on this, so Bell and Nindian. So I totally agree with
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Elon and this. And my wife's company recruits, you know, scientists all
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over the world and she generally gets them because they need a very very high
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standard for you know, their their backgrounds. But it's still a huge process.
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But the notion that you know, like one of my colleagues at work,
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uh, it was married to a woman from South America. You know,
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she's you know, got two degrees, super capable, smart, you
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know, makes a lot of money, and she still hasn't gotten her green
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card, okay, and she's married, legitimate everything else. It's a huge
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pain in the ass. And I think that speaks to it but I'd love
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to take my time and turn over Dean. Actually, you know, this
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is one of many I thought very thoughtful perspectives he had on a kind of
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a critical issue, and I just agree. I think a very high percentage
21:25
of the country is we need a solution. But Demons Jill, lay out
21:30
what you're I appreciate it. I well, let's start with the basics.
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You know, unless you are a descendant of enslaved people or indigenous Americans,
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all of us have an immigrant background. My fore mothers and forefathers escaped programs
21:42
in Eastern Europe in the late nineteenth century. All of each of the four
21:47
of us have stories of immigration. It's the most beautiful part of America.
21:49
It's what made us the most remarkable country on Earth. I think we can
21:53
all agree on that our system is not just broken, it is so dysfunctional
21:59
and so poorly managed. Even with the laws we have in place and back
22:03
to management, we've not had a legitimate executive as president in a long long
22:07
time. The amount of time it takes Bill I spoke to your associate who's
22:12
facing that problem. You won't believe this, but every single member of Congress
22:17
will tell you the same thing. We are the de facto customer service departments
22:21
for every federal agency because they are not managed by managers, they're managed by
22:25
politicians. They do not understand customer service. They have no reward system for
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customer service. It takes people months, sometimes years to get an IRS check
22:33
back to get their green card process. So even the law that's in place
22:38
right now, if the laws in place right now, they're not even being
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well executed, which is the job of the executive. So my proposition is
22:45
this, we should lower the barriers to entry to legal immigration. We should
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be welcoming, inviting, attracting, hospitable to people. Yeah, with ideas
22:55
and capital and want to be part of this extraordinary experience here and just like
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you that reference to a ball team or something, elon, Yeah, we
23:03
should attract the stars, but we also need the support team, the people
23:06
taking care of the field and preparing food and helping coach, and the bat
23:11
boys and the bat girls and the whole that's the whole duty of America,
23:14
right, So we all agree on that. So here's my proposition. Yeah,
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no, actually should class It's not just like attract the elitest. I
23:19
mean, I think that's the reason that if I think anyone who is like
23:23
honest, hard working, I mean i'd be fair of like if like if
23:30
they're going to have if they have high integrity, are going to work hard
23:33
and contribute to to to the economy and producers and services like that's that's that's
23:40
going to be a plus. But that we're losing a lot of that talent,
23:42
like yeah, well there's to Canada too, and people are getting educated
23:48
here, then we actually lose that talent. And and I and if I
23:51
could, if I could just continue with my proposition, because I think we
23:53
should lower the barriers to legal immigration and literally raise the barriers to illegal immigration.
23:59
It's not rocket science. And I'm a Democrat who's telling you the truth.
24:02
I've been to the southern border twice. I have seen the atrocity.
24:04
It is inexcusable. How much of this dene is because Trump said we have
24:11
to build the wall. And there Democrats are saying, I just don't want
24:15
to give Trump a win, and just that you know what, he got
24:18
something right, We have to close the southern border. Is that what happens
24:22
in meetings amongst Democrats is that they're just scared of you know this optics of
24:26
giving Trump a win on bit or you know, or is it something else.
24:30
It's very confounding the American the seventy five percent, or looking at this
24:34
saying fix it. It's a crisis. It's a big problem. Yeah,
24:38
why you guys, just I'll tell you, jakel what The first meeting I
24:42
was invited by Donald Trump to the White House was in twenty nineteen, and
24:45
it was about the border wall. And it was an experience right out of
24:51
Saturday Night Live. We had about an hour together about eight of US,
24:52
four Democrats, four Republicans, and I listened to him make his proposition because
24:59
if you remember, he he shut down the government because he didn't get the
25:02
funding for his border wall. And during this discussion in the White House situation
25:06
room, he remarked and was he was flabbergasted that Congress wouldn't go along with
25:11
just building a few hundred miles of border wall. And I actually, I
25:15
actually interrupted and I said, mister President, a few hundred miles this is
25:18
proposed as a you know, from the Pacific to the Atlantic, you know,
25:23
see the Signing Sea, kind of medieval wall. And he says,
25:27
no, it's just a few hundred and I could tell. His team immediately
25:30
interrupted him because they didn't want the truth to be known because it had been
25:33
a political proposition. We're going to build a wall now, and that's how
25:37
things work, you guys, And that's there. But there you go.
25:44
Well it's a red herring exactly. And you guys, and this is this
25:47
is the binary nature of this day and age, particularly in Washington. It's
25:51
such a joke. You're either for or against. It's either good or bad.
25:55
In this case, his proposition was a tiny portion. Yes, we
25:57
need some barriers, of course we do to prevent entry. But what he
26:02
didn't talk about is the fact that our ports of entry are so archaic,
26:07
the infrastructure so poorly designed for basically the mid twentieth century, not for human
26:11
beings and for commerce. When I was down there, I saw human beings
26:15
in cages. I saw a line of a mile long of semi trailer trucks
26:19
waiting and baking in the heat because it's so slow and arduous to get across
26:22
the border. And probably a half mile long line of people who come across
26:30
that border every day to work, to shop, to go to school.
26:33
And this is the United States of America. In the twenty first century.
26:36
It is appalling. So yes, we can at border security. We will
26:40
have border security, by the way, not just at the southern border,
26:42
but at the northern border. We are not long away, my friends,
26:45
months or maybe years from huge migration waves due to famine, due to war,
26:52
due to lack of clean water, and we should be prepared. It's
26:55
not inhumane. What we're doing now is the most inhumane. So here's my
26:59
proposition. It's the asylum policy that it is the source of this whole problem,
27:06
and it is so fixable. Elan you know this. We listen to
27:10
what the United States is doing right now. We are forcing these people who
27:15
wish to become Americans, first to save about ten thousand dollars per person,
27:19
and then to make this arduous journey across the ultimate through the Rio Grand where
27:25
people literally drown. They pay the Mexican cartels ten thousand dollars to be escorted
27:30
across, enriching them by the way, which is just nonsensical. They're processed
27:33
by border patrol agents then literally dumped in the streets of El Paso with not
27:37
a penny in their pocket, don't speak the language and cannot work. And
27:42
now become the responsibility of cities that have no money. The federal government,
27:47
including the Biden administration, not giving any support to help them. So here's
27:49
what we do. It's so simple. Change the law so that asylum cases
27:55
are actually filed in the country of origin. So let's say you're coming from
27:59
El Salvador in the Northern Triangle countries, you would file your case at an
28:03
consulate or an embassy. I believe we should build dormitories nearby, very inexpensive
28:07
to keep people safe while their applications are being processed. If they're at under
28:11
risk. When we adjudicate it locally, first, we have people there that
28:15
actually will know if it's a legitimate case. If they're approved, we escort
28:19
them to the United States. And best of all, they have ten thousand
28:23
dollars per person to start their lives here, to become owners of this economy.
28:27
They can open a restaurant, they can put a down payment on a
28:30
place to live, and we don't have to use our existing social services to
28:34
get them started. They want to work, and that's the easiest way to
28:38
fix this, And in the meantime, we're doing it completely the opposite,
28:42
and that would stem the wave, and that would stem the wave, and
28:45
we could as solve vote. But I'll tell you why it doesn't happen.
28:48
They'll wrap up with this. There's no political courage because every single person in
28:53
Washington wants to get re elected in their next election, and they know that
28:57
doing the right thing will undermine their chances because of this country that has so
29:03
separated and become so binary. And that's the answer. And it's almost as
29:08
if we're steering based on what's in the review mirror. You look at the
29:15
reason people are upset about immigration is that we had all of these jobs leaving
29:21
touring free trade, and now we are at the lowest unemployment of all of
29:26
our collective lifetimes, the four of us at least. I don't know how
29:29
old people in the audience are. We've still got almost two jobs for each
29:32
unemployed American that the unemployment rate is under four or five percent. Right now,
29:37
I want to talk about the hardest topic for a politician to talk about,
29:40
which is spending the national debt. Now we've added about twelve trillion dollars
29:45
between the last two presidents. I think it was eight. Bill Lackman,
29:48
maybe I could have you just sort of teat this up for us here,
29:52
and how concerned you are about our national debt? If you are eight billion?
29:56
I think under Trump obviously COVID you know, it was a bit of
30:00
a wildcard there, and then Biden's gone buck wild as well. I think
30:03
you put four or five maybe he's that five or six trillion on top of
30:06
that. How big of an issue is the national debt? And what's the
30:12
you know, if Bill Ackman was president, if you gave the plan to
30:17
Dean or where the advisory committee to say, how do we get to sing
30:18
under control? What would be your plan to kind of land this plan safely?
30:23
And here I think I'm going to for a Dean, I'll give you
30:26
a kind of quick view on it. I think the biggest problem that we
30:27
have now is that we have a Congress that sort of figures out want to
30:33
cost them nothing politically or otherwise to support a bill to give money to someone,
30:38
and in fact, if anything, it helps them get reelected. And
30:41
so the people politicians are spending the country's collective future. And that's what when
30:47
you're borrowing money that gets paid back in the future, you're borrowing from the
30:49
next generation, giving it to distant generation, and we don't have kind of
30:53
a culture of fiscal discipline in Washington, and unfortunately, you know, it's
31:00
we've lost people. You know, the numbers are so large, people just
31:03
sort of ignore them. In terms of thirty four trillion of debt, you
31:07
know, I think the way to look at this is, you know,
31:08
it's a bit like you can't look at debt on as stendable one basis,
31:11
you have to compare it to the quote unquote value of the country. And
31:14
the value of the country is very very high. Right. The government owns,
31:18
you know, the right to tax its citizens and tax its corporation,
31:23
so it basically owns you know, call it thirty five percent of SpaceX.
31:29
It owns thirty five percent of you know, federal government. Ever, every
31:32
person's sort of income, and they have the right to adjust that dial.
31:36
Right, So that's a very valuable asset. And plus we have enormous real
31:40
estate assets and other assets globally, et cetera. So it's an enormously valuable
31:42
country. But the trend is very very negative, and we've been you know,
31:47
it's a bit like you've been, you know, living in a world
31:48
where your cost of money was very close to zero. You accumulate a ton
31:52
of debt in that world, and now the world gets repriced at a much
31:56
higher interest rate, and all of a sudden, we're spending on interest pretty
31:59
soon, and we're spending on national defense, and that's a grave threat to
32:02
the country. And there is a moment at which the bond market, you
32:07
know, you know, we get into a bit of a death sparl.
32:08
So I think this very f prospect. I asked Ian precisely this question at
32:14
on Friday, and i'd look for the group to hear his answer. Yeah,
32:17
thank you, Bill, and everything he just said is spot on.
32:20
We have thirty three trillion dollars in debt just a couple of years ago,
32:23
mid twenty one. I think the interest on that debt was about one and
32:28
a half percent roughly. Now it's a little over three. So about one
32:30
hundred and fifty basis point change in just a couple of years. That's going
32:36
to turn out to be about if it stays, and by the way,
32:37
it might even go up, it's going to be about a four hundred billion
32:42
dollar incremental change to our debt service responsibility. And as Bill just said,
32:47
we will not just be approaching our defense budget. We are then officially spending
32:52
more on the past than we are investing in the future. There is no
32:57
money left to spend at a discretionary level in the United States. And while
33:01
our country first of all, I am pro growth, and I ultimately want
33:06
to develop policies to grow our way out of this mess, it's not going
33:09
to be easy. We have to be become more efficient as well, and
33:14
if we do so, we can actually make it happen. But in the
33:16
meantime, what no one talks about. We can accommodate a little bit more
33:20
debt. I think so, but nobody is talking about that. Debt service
33:22
to go from four hundred billion a year to about eight hundred billion a year
33:27
is a huge change and a troublesome burden for all of us. And when
33:32
I become president, I have a few propositions. First, I'm going to
33:35
have a bipartisan cabinet, not comprised of politicians, but of the best and
33:39
brightest operators and managers in America. I don't care about politics. I care
33:44
about principles, experience, and capacity to lead. I'm going to have a
33:47
youth cabinet as well. That's another story. I will employ zero based budgeting
33:52
because I've never encountered an organization, institution for profit or non that budgets in
33:58
the manner that we do by people who can't even read a P and L
34:00
or a balance sheet. We have a Pentagon budget that is approaching a trillion
34:05
dollars and they cannot passing on it. So I will engage one of the
34:09
big international consulting firms to conduct a top down assessment of every federal agency,
34:15
every program, every expenditure, and make an independent proposition to me and to
34:22
the Congress about how we can improve efficiency and delivery of service. If we
34:27
are not generating ROI on our core mission, we should eliminate it. And
34:30
if there's a private enterprise that can do so better, we will outsource it.
34:36
We have got to operate more efficiently, and then you all know,
34:39
you guys are successful men in America. We can only match reductions and expenditures
34:45
with increases in revenue if we hope to get our way out of this mess.
34:50
In addition to pro growth policies. But I don't blame people right now
34:53
for not wanting to share more because they don't believe in their government, They
34:58
don't have faith in our executive leadership and we have to do better. But
35:01
as you know, gentlemen, I propose a massive change to our healthcare system.
35:07
Not the provision of care that has to be private. But we're spending
35:09
twice as much than any nation in the world per capita. Our outcomes are
35:14
mid pack. We're the only nation in the world that has pharmaceutical pricing like
35:16
we have. We could reduce healthcare expenditures in our country and generate better outcomes
35:23
by also reducing the consumption of our GDP from about eighteen percent to about ten
35:29
percent. These are ways we can actually save money and generate better outcomes.
35:32
And yeah, I think the zero based budgeting technique something which is public now.
35:39
I think Elon you did Elon when you took over Twitter, or maybe
35:44
you could speak to the power of zero based budgeting and maybe Elon explained to
35:47
the audience what that is and why it's important. Yeah, it's pretty simple.
35:52
You really just start with nothing and build up from there, as opposed
35:58
to starting with what exists subtracting, so you know, unless something is obviously
36:04
useful and contributing to in the in the the case of Twitter X, making
36:08
the product better or running running the Silver operations. Uh, then than that
36:14
role shouldn't exist. And and then obviously to create an intesta structure where the
36:20
rate of innovation and improvement of the product is what gives people ahead and and
36:25
not have the the process for investment be obtuse or backwards. So and and
36:36
we're we've gotten more done in a year with twenty percent of the personnel than
36:40
Twitter had with hypercent personnel over five years. So you can even see in
36:46
the evolution of spaces. I mean, we unfortunately try to hold the spaces
36:52
and it just broke when we you know, just when we had the Rons
36:57
of Sciences spaces and I was I'm trying to have spaces be you know,
37:00
as non pot as them as possible. And so I'm glad that Dean Phillips
37:05
is doing this. Then you're doing it. The point is not to promote
37:09
one ideology over another, or one political group or another, but to provide
37:14
a forum where the public can listen to candidates from a wide range of view
37:20
points and make their decision regarding their vote. And I'm just against anything that
37:28
utterminds the democratic process and certainly getting candidates especially popular, you know, o
37:34
key candidates that are quite liable removed from ballots is taking that decision away from
37:39
the public, which is fundamentally anti democratic. That's insane. So and you
37:47
know, some political party shouldn't think that they know better than the public.
37:52
And I think I also took about these, you know, the lawfare.
37:57
We're using the judicial system to get Canada to all ballots. Also good let
38:02
the public make make their own decision, that's the whole. That is literally
38:07
what democracy needs. So well, yeah, it's pretty crazy. I will
38:13
say I'm disappointed being a former journalist has been a while now in twenty years,
38:16
but that the press is not covering Dean, the fact that you're being
38:21
blocked from certain ballots. I did a search on Google this this morning and
38:24
trying to find good money covering the issue. And you know, I was
38:30
talking to the best Day. I'll have him remain nameless right now, but
38:34
he basically, you know, dispected me, like, how can you block
38:39
somebody from even being on the ballot. And I'm not talking about Trump and
38:43
the in direction you know cases, I'm talking specifically about you, a Democrat,
38:50
being blocked from being on the ballot, and the press won't cover it,
38:52
but they will cover them the Trump you know, over and over again.
38:59
Soas what's going on in your press machine? Good Bill, Yeah,
39:02
if I could just jump in because I wanted to make a point on this
39:06
sort of bigger question, which I think is a really important one. So
39:07
one of the on the downside case, here's what we have to worry about.
39:12
The debt accumulations happened during one of the strongest economies we've had in you
39:15
know, generations, right, and now you're set up with an enormous amount
39:20
of debt, a huge deficit going into what could potentially be a recession.
39:23
Right. That's when now your revenues are declining, your debt is compounding,
39:28
and that's a really, really bad outcome. That's why the next president,
39:30
it's critically important that the next president of the country is a talented, successful
39:35
business leader because fundamentally, the United States is a massive business. Now it
39:39
suffers from We've seen this on a much smaller scale in everything from railroads to
39:45
restaurants to various other businesses. But a poorly run business, as you know,
39:51
tons of duplicative costs, an uninspired team, doesn't use technology effectively,
39:55
the incentives are misdesigned, and there's really no, no culture of excellence,
40:01
and fortunately that describes a lot of our government. But I've also learned that
40:07
just putting in one new person to a dysfunctional company, you can do an
40:10
incredible turnaround because that person attracts really amazing talent if you find the right one,
40:15
and then you know, you make a tremendous progress. And the appeal
40:19
to me of Dean is he's a legitimately successful business person. He gets it.
40:23
He's smart and is capable, and he spent three terms, uh and
40:28
being you know, been re elected in the Congress, understands how the government
40:31
works. You have a combination of business talent and understanding. You know,
40:36
cost control, designing incentives, you know leadership, you know, charismatic leadership,
40:42
which is necessary to achieve these goals. And also you know, how
40:45
does the system work? How do you break the quote unquote politics, how
40:49
do you fix the culture? You know, he has those elements and that's
40:52
what's made him a very you know, pealing candidate. To me, I
40:55
just want to make sure people understand what Bill's talking about in a crystal clear
41:00
fashion. There is a website for the Saint Louis fed It's called Fred and
41:05
you could just look up gross federal debt as a percentage of gross domestic product,
41:08
our debt to what we make. For the majority of our lifetimes,
41:13
it has been between a thirty and sixty percent, in other words, our
41:17
debt to what we produce every year. The last time it broke one hundred
41:22
percent, and you know right now, I think we're at about one hundred
41:24
and twenty or so was at the end of World War Two. That was
41:29
the spike. It took us in that spike, gosh, from nineteen forty
41:34
six when the war ended, forty five, forty six, all the way
41:37
to you know, the seventies, in order to work off two and a
41:40
half decades to work off that debt. We are now, to Bill's point,
41:45
in a vibrant economy at one hundred and twenty percent. This is and
41:50
the most acute issue you can think of. It's incredibly hard for politicians to
41:54
take this on. And the reason it's my number one, you know,
42:00
I understand we have culture wars going on right now. Trump is triggering people,
42:04
Biden has got cognitive issues, the border a bubble. Else if their
42:07
balance sheet is broken, this holding can come apart. And the idea that
42:13
people can get stimmy checks or unemployment. This could be kindaclismic. Yes,
42:17
absolutely. And by the way, Steve Balmer has an organization called the USA
42:22
Facts and encourage people to take a look. They present the US federal budget
42:27
in a way that anybody in business can better understand. It's really great work.
42:30
I'm not sure Joe Biden can read a P and L a balance sheet.
42:35
Donald Trump, you know, Donald Trump, through his bankruptcies, clearly
42:38
can't either. And I do think it's time that we start recognizing that these
42:43
are times where we should be reducing debt because when we face another recession or
42:47
crisis, it reduces the capacity to respond to provide the stimulus necessary to get
42:54
us out of it. I think we're all in agreement on this. It's
42:57
nonsensical. We cannot spend two trillion dollars annually more than we generate in revenue.
43:02
And as one of you guys said earlier, you know, the incentives
43:06
in Congress are so perverse. Nobody is rewarded for reducing costs or generating more
43:14
revenue. I've never had someone come to my office and say, please spend
43:16
less on my program or please raise my taxes. So we can generate more
43:21
revenue. I mean, come on, it doesn't happen for obvious reasons,
43:22
and there's no courage. The obvious question is I know to fix it.
43:27
Okay, now you're president, tell us give us the first one hundred days.
43:30
You understand the system, that you understand the broken incentives. So here
43:32
we go. I'm glad for the question. Executive leadership. The best,
43:36
the most extraordinary bipartisan cabinet in American history. We maybe we'll have a third
43:42
of them on this spaces right now, by the way, guys, and
43:45
then we go into zero based budgeting, a comprehensive assessment, attracting the best
43:51
and brightest. By the way, I can't do it alone. No individual
43:53
can do this alone. Has to attract extraordinary Americans. That's how we start.
43:58
At the executive level. I'm the second most bipartisan member of Congress,
44:01
Bill you know this. That means I work beautifully with people on both sides
44:06
of the aisle. And I will work with the Republican Party to better manage
44:12
our government. It is a focus of THEIRS. I will work with the
44:14
Republican Party on national defense and security. I will work with my fellow Democrats
44:19
on some of the issues of raising the foundation, healthcare, housing, education,
44:23
cost of food and fuel. We can actually combine the core principles of
44:28
both parties right now and do better. All of us have negotiated. You
44:32
can't take everything off the table. And by the way, you got to
44:36
put people on the plane at the takeoff if you want them there at the
44:39
landing. And I have to tell you this might surprise people listening, but
44:44
I've received an extraordinary number of thoughtful, friendly texts and calls for my Republican
44:50
colleagues in Congress saluting my effort in running for president against an established incumbent against
44:55
one's party. I cannot wait to get to work. They can't wait to
45:00
get to work. The system is suffocating and stifling the very progress we need
45:06
to make. And that's what happens when you have people in Congress in the
45:09
White House who have been there for literally fifty years, guys. So that's
45:13
how we start fixing it. Bill. But my call to action right now
45:15
for everybody listening, in fact, is to start considering. If you're a
45:20
person who's been successful, you're looking for your next endeavor. I mean it.
45:23
The elections coming up in November inauguration day is January twentieth of twenty twenty
45:29
five. We are going to need an extraordinary number of great executives, great
45:34
managers, idators, innovators, and to fundamentally change the operations of a government
45:40
that is increasingly broken because of an exodus of the very people of confidence who
45:46
have left in the last number of years. And Jason, I was going
45:50
to answer your question really quickly about being left off ballots and it's not being
45:52
reported in the news. Look at I'm staggered, you guys. One reason
45:58
I'm thrilled to do this spaces with you is to call attention to the truth
46:01
that is not being reported. It is dangerous, it is despicable. But
46:06
you ask why, because the Democratic and Republican parties are private institutions. They're
46:13
not public. They don't work for us, They're working against us. And
46:16
I'm really sick of and I'm a competitor. I want to create competition from
46:21
both the inside and the outside. I'm a proud Democrat, you guys,
46:23
but I'm a disruptor and there is a day coming where we need to ensure
46:28
that there is competition for these two parties because in the future it is only
46:31
going to get worse when you have the wrong people in the wrong positions working
46:37
against us. And by the way, you want to learn more about me,
46:39
go to my website. Oh, Jason, he's got it down dot
46:45
com. You got it were happier. I just want to say, it's
46:49
great to have everybody come on and have this important discussion. You know,
46:54
this is I think the year that the two party system really do get challenged.
47:00
I think it's it's thanks to places like x and Twitter where people can
47:06
speak freely. It's thanks to podcasts and alternative media channels. And the public
47:12
is sick of these two parties and the choices. You know, say what
47:14
you will about. You may like them be not RFK, you may like
47:19
him not. But man, we are starting to see a lot more choices,
47:22
and if we don't like the choices we have, we have to fight
47:27
h to get more choices on the ballot and data. I'm really excited that
47:30
you left, you know, being an entrepreneur and running businesses to go be
47:37
of service. We know, Jason, I'm still hey, you know what,
47:39
I'm an entrepreneur still. In fact, it's the most it's the most
47:43
important entrepreneurial mission. Of my entire life. And so to you, j
47:46
Cal, to you, Bill, to you, Elon, thank you,
47:50
and I need your help, I need your advocacy, and everybody listening,
47:52
I love you all. Let's get to it and let's shock this country in
47:55
November with the most massive change for the better we've ever ever dreamt about.
48:01
Well, thank you, thank you for coming on nex spaces, and I
48:05
think people will be break glad to hear from you directly and be surprised about
48:09
some of the negative tactics that have been used against you, which are obviously
48:14
inappropriate and underminded democratic process. And I mean to be honest, I actually
48:20
had not heard of you. Well, I sort of make we heard your
48:22
name, but I didn't know you were appalling. So I literally at that
48:27
in the last few days and just I mean again, I'm seeing such obvious
48:31
facts that there it's a miarrocable that one should even have to state them.
48:37
But the public should have the right to pick the candidates that the public once.
48:40
That's the whole essence of democracy, and you know, we should be
48:45
against anything that underlines that, whether it's a public and democrat or otherwise.
48:50
You're here. I guess if I can I'm not the campaign manager, but
48:54
I guess my suggestion would be the following. Uh, you know, Dean's
48:57
put five million dollars of his own money into his camp, Pa, I'm
49:00
contributing a million towards his pack, and I just you know, you're contributing
49:05
ten dollars, one hundred dollars or otherwise. You like what you heard,
49:07
Money actually matters. It cost a lot of money in litigation and otherwise for
49:10
him to get on ballots, and that's before kind of getting the word out.
49:14
This is one of the most capable people I've ever met. I believe.
49:17
I'm incredibly excited that he's running from president of the United States. I
49:21
think the country is really fortunate. It's taking a lot of personal risk and
49:23
attacks and all the other things things I get used to over time. But
49:29
if you like what you hear, find a way to help the guy Dean.
49:31
How can people help other than money? Hey, thank you. Treasure
49:35
is really important, but your time, your advocacy, and your invitation.
49:38
I'm going to be crisscrossing the country. I've got lots of days on the
49:43
calendar shown up in a lot of states. If you send an email to
49:45
me at Dean at Dean twenty four dot com. Believe it or not,
49:50
I actually see it, as does my team. If you want to help
49:52
us out, you want to host a gathering to introduce me, you want
49:55
to write postcards, you want to do some door knocking, tell your friends,
49:59
tell your family to vote in primaries. If I could just make one
50:01
final call to action, guys, the reason we've handed over the keys to
50:06
the furthest Right and the furthest Left is because the parties don't want you to
50:09
vote in primary elections. They want to coordinate a candidate and then force that
50:15
choice upon you. So please register to vote in your primaries, and then
50:19
let me know if you want me to come to your town and do a
50:22
rally, do a fundraiser, do a meet and greet, and help us
50:25
out. You guys, it's all up to us, the powers in everyone's
50:29
hands. Still, let's keep it that way. And exactly what Elon said.
50:32
The minute they start taking names off ballots, suppressing you, refusing to
50:37
debate, we are in big trouble. But it's not too late. So
50:39
thanks Bill, thanks for the shout out, and to all you guys,
50:43
I think the world of view. And one more thing. If I may
50:45
be rude to interrupt one second, Dean, one of the other things.
50:49
For people to support you, they have to believe there's a credible path for
50:52
you to be president. I think you make a very well you made a
50:53
very credible case which convinced me. Once you go ahead and just chhare people
50:57
shortly. Thanks Bill. So here it is guys. You know I'm an
50:59
under and I love it, and that's why we're going to succeed. We're
51:01
scrappy, we're efficient, We're using twenty first century technologies to do better.
51:07
It starts in New Hampshire. January twenty third, just about eight days from
51:12
now, is the first primary election in the country. And if we surprise
51:15
that night, it's game on. And if any of you listening have friends
51:21
here, have family, want to spread the words somehow in New Hampshire to
51:23
get people to come out and vote in the primary for me, mark my
51:27
words, that will be the igniter for the whole campaign. Either way,
51:30
I will be continuing, and my mission is to get to this summer June
51:34
July, before the convention in Chicago, to a point where the country knows
51:37
me. I got a lot of work to do to introduce myself. When
51:40
they do, I almost I can almost guarantee that the polls will continue to
51:46
show Joe Biden losing to both Donald Trump and probably any other competitor, and
51:52
also will show me probably beating Donald Trump and other competitors. And when that
51:57
happens, Democrats will have a very choice. Do we coordinate an unelectable candidate
52:02
or do we get behind someone who can't just win but can actually achieve reasonable,
52:07
common sense solutions and actually get this country to be excited and joyful and
52:13
optimistic. Again. That's my mission. Bill and all of you listening would
52:16
love to have you join the Dean team because we can do it. We
52:21
absolutely can do it, and I'm not going to give up. And today's
52:23
a great day. Thank you all very much. Thanks so much Elon Bell
52:29
for joining us, and Dean, we thank you for running and your public
52:34
service and commitment to helping solve America's problems in a reasonable fashion. We wish
52:38
you the best. Everybody. Go to Dean twenty four dot com if you
52:40
want to give a donation if you have the means to do so. If
52:44
not, yeah, just tell your friends, maybe tweet about it, X
52:47
about it, post about it on X. I'm catching up. In fact,
52:51
i'm catching up to Elon. I've got forty thousand followers on X and
52:54
you're only at one hundred and sixty nine million Elon. So I'm catching up
52:58
fast, catching up fast. Yeah, closing, closing fast. Thanks everybody.
53:02
That's good, all right, Thank you, Thanks for cheers. Like
53:07
and subscribe if you haven't yet, and I will see you in tomorrow's episode.
53:09
Thank you so much for watching.