Latest / GowayPro Travel Tales / Through Their Eyes: Family, Safari & South Africa

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Through Their Eyes: Family, Safari & South Africa · GowayPro Travel Tales

• 0:00
  Hey there everyone, I'm Don, Professor Goay and welcome to the GoayPro Travel Tale Podcast.
• 0:06
  Travel far and travel often.
• 0:17
  Hello everyone, welcome to the Go Way Pro Travel Tales podcast.
• 0:20
  We're continuing on a bit of a theme of Africa.
• 0:23
  uh If you've been listening in, would have heard from Yael and we were discussing Botswana, Zimbabwe and...
• 0:32
  South Africa, I think, yes, yes, and a bit of Namibia as well.
• 0:35
  um We've had conversations about the beaches of Africa and everything else Africa.
• 0:40
  We're gonna continue in that vein, but a little bit different angle, which is gonna focus in on Africa, but also uh touch on generational travel.
• 0:51
  With me is Bromman.
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  Now, Bromman looks after our African apartment here, so that's one reason we're talking Africa as well.
• 0:57
  But more importantly, oh, sorry, and we have down here, if you can see on camera, we have Rosie.
• 1:01
  uh
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  and one of the many go away dogs we have in the building now.
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  So, hi Rosie.
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  So, we're going to focus on Africa because obviously Bronwyn looks after that area.
• 1:12
  Two, her mother is originally from South Africa, Claire.
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  Three, your main motivation, well not main motivation, one of the motivations to going to South Africa was the sea to sea marathon.
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  you ran that.
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  Okay, how did you do?
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  I finished the goal and I had a good time.
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  So yeah, it went really well.
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  So I was hoping to do it in six hours.
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  It was an ultra marathon and I did it.
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  Yeah, fifty-six kilometers.
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  And uh I did it in five hours and fifty nine minutes.
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  It's a really big area.
• 1:54
  Well no, yeah, but I know you run a lot obviously.
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  Have you done a normal marathon?
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  before.
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  I've done a normal marathon.
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  You had to do a normal marathon.
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  It's a little bit of a lottery and yeah, this is my probably first and only option.
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  And when you say lottery, was it a literal lottery to get in or you just put your name down?
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  Brenam down.
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  They it was predominantly South Africans and African runners.
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  And then they had a small section for this international, so I think it's like only five percent of international runners.
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  So I don't know if everyone who applies gets a spot, but technically I've got one.
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  And I saw some photos and you can see some photos out there on our Instagram accounts and the scenery.
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  I drove some of that when I was down there last year, but it looked like a very pretty run as well.
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  That's why I ran it.
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  World's most beautiful marathon.
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  except for this.
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  Yeah.
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  Okay, fine.
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  Okay, so that was one of the main motivators.
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  The second one is ah your mum, as I say, she's from South Africa originally.
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  So what came first?
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  I'm going to run the marathon, mum come with me and family come with me or family, let's go to South Africa and I will run the marathon on top of that.
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  So I think so so we traveled as a family, my family of four, so my husband, my two kids, and my mum.
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  And I think with a lot of multi-gen travel like this, it starts you almost need an anchor.
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  Like there's sort of a it starts with something you want to see or do.
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  So for us it was this race.
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  I had always wanted to run this race and I started training for it and um I applied and I got my spot.
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  So I knew what date.
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  It was I think April eleventh.
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  So we then built a trip around that date.
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  So which actually helped.
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  I know for
• 3:30
  A lot of the bookings I've seen in our team, often it's, you know, a milestone birthday, maybe it's a grandparent's seventieth birthday, maybe it's a trip's uh kids graduation
• 3:40
  present.
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  So sometimes there's like a bit of an anchor for what the date is, which helps build the itinerary.
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  But I booked the race and then I said, Kids and to my husband we're going and uh mom we'd love you to join as well.
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  So
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  Okay, so how often does your mum get back?
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  She had not been back in quite a while, so it not that often.
• 4:00
  Right.
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  So a bit of a background here for those who may not know Bronwyn by visual or her voice Bronwyn is Bronwyn Hodge.
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  So you have done you and your family, not your current family, your mum and dad and your brother have done a ton of travel for obvious reasons because you've been with go away
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  from literally inception.
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  Yeah.
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  So before we get into your multi-gen, your mum and dad, I would assume took you and your brother lots of places.
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  So you've done a lot of your personal travel as multi-gen travel.
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  Is that right?
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  yeah, that would be correct.
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  So my family we traveled growing up but um didn't have grandparents join, so it wouldn't have to be necess necessarily a multi gen.
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  Fair enough, yep.
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  Um so just usually typically my parents and my brother and I.
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  And with my mom being South African, we would go uh back to South Africa to visit her sister and her mother, um, just for a visit but not necessarily traveling around together.
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  Uh we did Botswana as a family trip when I was about fourteen and that was one of our most iconic vacations we've ever done.
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  Yeah.
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  Yeah.
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  It was incredible.
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  Because of what?
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  Because it was one those special moments or because it was Botswana or a combination of everything.
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  well it's funny 'cause you just spoke about Botswana.
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  it was really special.
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  We went with another family, so I don't know what we call that in travel trends.
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  It wasn't I guess it's kind of multi-gen in that way.
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  but two families traveling together.
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  It was not luxury.
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  We were camping.
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  We were sleeping in a proper canvas tent that was mobile and moved you know, y usually each night and I don't know, it was just really magical.
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  There's something very magical that happens when you're out in I was about fourteen and the other kids with us was about so fourteen to seventeen was the range.
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  So you mentioned from the terminology of multi-gen, it's sort of kids, parents and more likely grandparents.
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  So your grandparents, because your dad's Australian, so you, no I don't know this actually, I've known you for a while, your grandparents on your mum's and dad's side, are
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  they, were they, are they in Australia and South Africa?
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  So uh most of my grandparents passed actually, like when was much younger.
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  So on my dad's side, um I didn't r remember meeting them.
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  but my grandmother who was in Cape Town, I did meet.
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  Okay.
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  So she passed when I was a teen.
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  So I didn't really get that experience.
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  but I think multi gen can mean lots of different things, whether it's you know, parents traveling with their kids and a grandparent.
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  Sometimes we see bookings where like an aunt or an uncle's joining as well, or family friends traveling together, but I think
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  To me my understanding is just a range of ages travelling on one one trip.
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  Yeah, that's how I see it too because I travel a lot independently as a kid and love it.
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  That's why I'm working in the industry I am.
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  And as you know, I've taken my family on lots of trips over their youthful years.
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  My kids are now in their 20s.
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  How old are your kids?
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  So one's about to turn eight, but so on the trip she was seven and six.
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  Close in age.
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  Yeah.
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  Now we took our kids traveling that same age as well so to me yes, maybe technically multi-gen is three generations to the point of grandparents parents kids But I was thought
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  I know it's family trouble as well But I always thought taking kids particularly younger age to exotic destinations any destination can be considered exotic but I always found
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  that as a multi-gen trip to your point before that doesn't necessarily have to be The grandparents could be uncle's yeah.
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  Yeah, do you agree with that?
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  I think we're seeing a trend especially for these kind of iconic bucket list trips where some other people are joining in, you know, whether it's it's family friends, groups of
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  two families travelling together, that's definitely something we're seeing.
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  So
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  Talking Africa, and again your area of courage is like the continent also, a lot people that realise it with Morocco is obviously Western Africa, Egypt is Africa.
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  How many multi-gen bookings do you see coming through, or extended family bookings, whatever terminology you want to use?
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  Is Africa a popular sought after destination for multi-gen travel?
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  I think so.
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  Um it's hard to sometimes get those statistics.
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  Uh you don't always necessarily know when I look at a booking who who's who in the booking.
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  Um, but I I definitely think it is, especially, you know, if you're going on Safari and you're doing a private safari vehicle, you know, that sh cost shared amongst a group of
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  four or just two.
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  You know, obviously the savings are better if it's a bigger group.
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  So I definitely am seeing more like the bookings having more passengers on them.
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  Okay.
• 8:25
  is from a family point of view, because obviously when you approached your family about I'm going to the marathon, let's go there, um is cost?
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  for the average person an issue like is Africa going to be from a cost point of view a roadblock for multigen?
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  Because again, even though you said before if you're in a vehicle for six people, if it's a family, generally mum and dad, or maybe the grandparents if you're really lucky are
• 8:51
  paying for it so it's not necessarily a split cost per se.
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  I'm rambling a here, but is Africa affordable for a family?
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  So I I think a trend we're seeing sort of economically is that boomer age group paying for the trip for um the younger like the the children and the grandchildren.
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  We've seen that with I've I've heard that amongst my team of you know, grandmas or grandparents are treating the trip for the the family.
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  I think that generation is uh there is a great wealth transfer that is going to happen and I think people want to enjoy their
• 9:27
  They're you know 70 plus and they want to enjoy that money and see their their family travel together.
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  so we have seen that.
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  I think the barrier, you know, if if grandparents aren't paying for it, I think the barrier sometimes can be the flight because it is a long flight.
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  Yeah.
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  You know, and if you if you're the parents having to buy four tickets for the kids, yeah, those those flights, you know, we've all seen airfares go up and fuels go up.
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  So um the flight we were on, which is a pretty
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  popular one is the Newark to Cape Town direct flight which is about fifteen hours.
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  With who?
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  Newark with United.
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  Yeah.
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  they fly into Cape Town and out of Joburg.
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  So that makes a great itinerary.
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  You can start in Cape Town, finish in Johannesburg, um and fly out.
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  So that that can be the tricky one.
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  So looking for a seat sale
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  Choice.
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  Um, you know, out of the US market, people tend to quite enjoy flying with United or Delta, especially people who have any frequent flyers with them.
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  Yeah, yeah.
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  So the price can be tricky with the flights, and that there's no denying that, but I will say South Africa is incredible value for money.
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  Yes.
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  When you are there, like dining out as a family for in the city of Toronto can be very expensive, but the food and value for what you get in South Africa was unbelievable.
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  Like
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  the quality of the wine, the quality of the food.
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  So I found it very affordable to eat and drink when we were there.
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  Um I think the quality of the hotels and the lodges is really good for what you pay for.
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  So a bit tricky to get there on price, but I think the value is phenomenal um on the land arrangement.
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  that because we were that you were hit there just recently this April 26 we're sitting in I would say
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  April, May, actually 25, yeah I concur, was airfares, because we had a family of five, you had a family of four, and we had our friends meet us from Australia as well, so it was a
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  multi-gen.
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  And yeah, we both found that the airfares were, not a roadblock we went, but yeah, that's, did you say, one of the big price factors.
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  So booking ahead obviously helps in reducing your price points always.
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  Yeah, so looking ahead, um, you know, there's lots of great promotions in South Africa as well.
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  Like you depending on the seasonality of when you go, lots of lodges offer like a stay three pay two promotions.
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  So there's lots of ways to look at it creatively.
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  and then I'll of course when planning your budget, you also want to make sure you say
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  North America, I've had tipping in general, but I've found in my travel experience, particularly with your guides, and in Africa, they're even more integral to your trip, on
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  safari in particular.
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  So I've never found a reason not to tip a guide, uh a safari guide in particular.
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  Just to add to that, the like cur the South African ran, the currency in South Africa against the US or the Canadian dollar, like our dollar is quite strong.
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  So it does go a long way, once you're there.
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  And other thing too that people can consider is a lot of people will know that Africa and Gatway spells are beautiful, high-end, stunning lodges all over, from Morocco, Egypt, well
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  not just per se but accommodation choices, East, South Africa, stunning, but there's also very, very much more affordable, I would say basic but less fancy options if budget
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  becomes a concern or...
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  I think it's nice.
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  So what I love about South Africa as a destination for families, or not even for families, but for couples is it's very dynamic destination.
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  So you've got Cape Town, the beautiful scenery, like running on the water.
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  I ran for a long time there, and it's all Cape Town.
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  Saw a lot of Cape Town, but you know, the table mountain, the VA waterfront is gorgeous.
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  Then you can go out into the wine region and it's just lush nature, beautiful wine setting, very relaxing.
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  And then you can head out on safari, um and be in a game lodge.
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  So you get this really mixed experience.
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  And you can kind of play around with your budget accordingly.
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  Like if you're in Cape Town and you're doing you're out every day, out in the VA waterfront, out for dinner, out doing table mountain, out at the Cape Peninsula, maybe
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  you're gonna save some money by doing more of a moderate hotel there.
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  You know, you're out and busy.
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  Um, and then maybe you splurge for your safari experience.
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  a lot of the like more moderately priced lodges and product that we have in South Africa is still amazing quality.
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  Like none of the not we don't sell anything that is budget.
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  you know, below three star and the the service you get in South Africa is amazing.
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  Yeah, I think sometimes the service is what makes a trip, like the hospitality, the people, the quality of the food and wine I cannot stress that enough.
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  Um so you're gonna have a great experience whether you're at luxury or more moderate and that yeah.
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  The the service is always gonna be there.
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  And the other thing that I found over years and years of traveling and selling in Latin America when we talked to Galapagos, a lot of people would come to us and say, the boat,
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  the boat, I want XYZ boat, which is fine.
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  But we'd explain to them that you're going to spend probably 80 % of your time off the boat.
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  So don't get caught up on that or spending extra dollars for that when you could use that savings by using a sort of different type of more affordable boat, get exactly the same
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  experiences, right?
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  And then have that extra money to maybe go to the Amazon or something else like that.
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  a fair statement for Africa as well.
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  If you want it, can afford a go-five-star the whole way, course.
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  But as you say, save some money, use the moderates and save that money can be used elsewhere for extended safaris or bungee jumping off the falls or whatever it may be.
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  But do you agree with me on this?
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  Because we both stayed at Karula, which is a beautiful lodge in uh Greater Kruger.
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  Well let me ask this question first, I'm not sure if you're right Henry, did you sort of go in, do your safari then out type thing over two or three days?
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  Did you have a day to enjoy the lodge?
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  So it's a great question.
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  So we stayed two nights at the Capama Karula property which is a gorgeous five star lodge.
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  Um they've got beautiful, very expansive rooms, very much a foodie destination.
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  Like um we had some tasting menus that were amazing.
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  They all
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  they accommodated accordingly.
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  So we did two next there.
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  Um and so they were it was packed, like we were busy every day.
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  I'm someone there was actually another family staying at Krula there and they were out on Safari every
• 15:58
  Yeah.
• 15:59
  You know, we're good to sleep in the next morning and just enjoy the pool, enjoy a quiet breakfast, and relax.
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  And that worked for us.
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  This other family was they were out enjoying themselves.
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  Um, so it just it's family-dependent for me.
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  I'm not somebody who needs to just take I saw wildlife after wildlife.
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  Um, the experience of the lodge itself and relaxing a bit as well is is enjoyable.
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  Um, the Safari experience with young children, so my kids were six and seven, and a uh 70 plus uh grandma.
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  On board, it's it's tiring.
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  The day starts quite early, so you're sort of up at five, they bring you coffee and and some snacks, and then you're you're out to get an early morning safari drive.
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  Then you come back to the lodge and relax, and then there's usually sort of a late afternoon-evening drive.
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  But for what you know, for having an early morning and a late drive, there's not actually that much time for sleeping for kids that might need 11-12 hours of sleep.
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  Um so it was a little bit tiring, and you just kind of need to know that, and we
• 16:57
  We had some naps and we relaxed during the day.
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  So it it's busy and I think traveling with in a multi gen group you just need to be mindful of is this pace okay?
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  And so for our last morning I said, let's just have a sleep in and this works for us and and slow down the pace.
• 17:11
  Yeah, that's why was getting out too because even my kids when we did it last year, they were all in their 20s and they liked to sleep in as well.
• 17:18
  And it wasn't so much that you want to do things, it was just the pace is, it's not, you're not pushed, but you you're in Africa, you want to see as much as you can.
• 17:27
  My, in reflection on that, and it has nothing to do necessarily with Karula being a beautiful phoesic, because we found the same type of vibe at Elephant Sands, I think, I
• 17:39
  remember its name.
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  which is a more moderate lodge around the waterhole.
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  We purposely took a day off doing safaris.
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  One, just to, because we've been busy.
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  But two, one, enjoy the lodge.
• 17:52
  But two, because it was around the waterhole, just sit there all day and watch the animals come and go.
• 17:55
  So, and I've said this, I think in a few of our podcasts before, I think, and you can, you're deeper into Africa than I am.
• 18:03
  If someone has a time of course of budget, maybe plan a day in of nothing at a chosen lodge just to either enjoy the lodges' amenities like Corula, which wasn't around the
• 18:13
  water hole, or whatever lodge you choose just to decompress a bit and just soak up Africa.
• 18:19
  Would you concur with that?
• 18:21
  The sitting around and seeing the animals come to you is called an armchair safari.
• 18:26
  Um but I think what's great is like I mentioned the hospitality.
• 18:30
  So the guides are amazing.
• 18:31
  They all receive like incredible training.
• 18:34
  the guide that we had was one of the highest certified guides.
• 18:39
  Justice.
• 18:40
  you're a justice?
• 18:42
  In Cap Cafama Cruula, yeah.
• 18:43
  Yeah, I had to
• 18:44
  guy called...
• 18:45
  So he Justice was one of the guides who received one of the highest certifications, including some I'm gonna not get this right, but it was some sort of astrology
• 18:52
  certification.
• 18:53
  So he was able to tell us about the stars at night, in addition to all the the other wildlife um knowledge.
• 18:58
  But I think what's what the point I'm getting at is you can speak with your Safari guide and the lodge and say, I'm not sure I want to do a a long one.
• 19:05
  I think we might want to take the day off, or you know what, we we actually just wanna go out late morning.
• 19:09
  I know we might not see as much, but we'd rather have a little sleep and go in a bit later.
• 19:12
  They are there to accommodate an ag
• 19:15
  Just if you're on a private safari.
• 19:16
  So that's a private safari.
• 19:18
  On a private safari.
• 19:19
  Yeah.
• 19:20
  which works really well for multi-gen.
• 19:21
  Of course, if you're uh joining other people on the safari, the time's a little more more set.
• 19:26
  For me, I think people sometimes have this experience when going on safari, like I said, it's this checklist, like, I need to see the big five, but I also want to see this, and
• 19:34
  they have this in mind about what they're gonna see.
• 19:36
  And it was really refreshing to see safari through the eyes of my young children.
• 19:40
  They were of course blown away, like you come out of the
• 19:44
  Hood Street Airport and you're on your way and you see a giraffe, you know, five minutes after leaving for like that.
• 19:56
  small insects to see a tortoise on the road, to ask questions about the animal poop on the road.
• 20:02
  They were you know, they they did a little bushwalk with one of the guides and they um got this clay sort of footprint of a they found like a leopard footprint and they made a clay
• 20:12
  sort of thing um with the guide an infinite
• 20:15
  a lying one which I didn't make it, I bought it in Victoria Falls when I was a passenger, when I was in my early 20s.
• 20:22
  I know it's a really good memory.
• 20:24
  So it's not you think you're you're there for the wow factor, though the the first time you see a lion, the first time you see an elephant, and they're incredible, don't get me
• 20:33
  wrong, but it's not necessarily this checklist and the the big big things that's it's the whole experience, the whole part of being in the bush.
• 20:40
  The little deer, I forget what they're called, um on the property.
• 20:44
  Yeah.
• 20:47
  Yeah.
• 20:47
  Not a palala, but a different
• 20:49
  They were kind of around Yeah, just cruising around cruising around.
• 20:51
  Um the the birds, like we saw some incredible birds with beautiful like blue colors and so it's the whole experience and I think that seeing it through a child's eyes can be really
• 21:01
  refreshing because they are taking the whole thing in.
• 21:04
  Yeah, I agree that because one of the things that when I got back from the trip last year, and this was our trip of a lifetime, you because our boys are older, becoming men and
• 21:13
  heading off in their own life, we wanted to have that sort of last hurrah.
• 21:18
  And we'd been planning this for like eight years, and finally circumstances allowed us to happen.
• 21:24
  So through the eyes of your kids, eight and six, six and seven, um
• 21:30
  would be even more sort of wondrous for you as parents, but even for me with my young men, I love watching them.
• 21:38
  And you're 100 % right, they were caught up in like the lion and that type of thing, but there was other stuff they just, they found fascinating, was cultural stuff they were
• 21:46
  interested in, and I just, like I had as much.
• 22:03
  anchor of what the truth is, whether it's yeah good like I like I said before with my my race.
• 22:08
  Um yeah, no I totally agree with you and Yeah.
• 22:11
  Let me ask you about Corula.
• 22:13
  This is just something I really stood out from being in the industry and service levels being important to go away because in turn it goes to your clients out there.
• 22:21
  We want to make sure they have the best time.
• 22:24
  What I found amazing is we arrived at Corula, same thing, in from the airport, mid-afternoon or lunchtime-ish and checked in and all that stuff.
• 22:33
  Then we went out on a safari that night, but that afternoon was a bit of have a look around or not.
• 22:38
  We sat down.
• 22:40
  They had a lunch for us.
• 22:41
  We did a safari, back, had dinner.
• 22:43
  The next morning as we walked in, were in group seven because my friend joined us, they knew all our names.
• 22:49
  Like, they only just met us for two meals.
• 22:53
  We didn't really interact with them, but they picked up on it.
• 22:56
  And my wife, Janna, she ordered a special tea.
• 22:58
  And the next morning, they, would you like this tea?
• 23:00
  Did you hear that type of like, was that really personalized?
• 23:03
  Super personalized, super friendly.
• 23:06
  after we did Kapama, we went to Sabi Sabi Bush Lodge, which um is like a an incredible experience, a little bit different.
• 23:12
  Um and in both properties, the level of attention to my children.
• 23:17
  Yeah.
• 23:18
  Um, you know, kids I find sometimes dining it with my kids in in Toronto, like they're noisy and they're clanking their plates.
• 23:24
  People are not fussed by this.
• 23:26
  When you're in a destination that you can
• 23:29
  overlax as a parent.
• 23:31
  You know, kids can't sit in a
• 23:35
  Krula has like a lot of t yeah, and a lot of tastings and that we had like a seven course tasting meal one night.
• 23:40
  It was incredible.
• 23:41
  Um my kids are not sitting at the table for that length of time and so they would be kind of moving around and you know, one of the staff members would was I I think at one point
• 23:51
  playing a board game with them while we were finishing dinner.
• 23:54
  And then the photos I have maybe I can show a couple.
• 23:57
  Yeah, um, you know, as they were leaving there were so many hugs.
• 24:00
  Um
• 24:01
  You know, my son kinda pretended he was a guide one day.
• 24:04
  He had this kind of green outfit and kind of matched the guide.
• 24:07
  So I had a photo of him with them.
• 24:09
  We did a beautiful um Karula put on this gorgeous sundowners experience or sundowner where you they take you to a spot and they set up like an under a nice picture.
• 24:18
  Maybe you had the same one.
• 24:19
  Well, not a sundowner, we had one of the guys, my friend's son.
• 24:35
  Furniture.
• 24:36
  We had a couch in the middle of the bush and they set up a little beautiful bar and we watched the sun go down and we had this really special moment, which is a great thing to
• 24:44
  do for a birthday.
• 24:45
  Somebody's got an anniversary.
• 24:47
  If you have like a VIP client and you want to do a special touch, that's always a great thing to ask for.
• 24:52
  Um so we had this beautiful sundowner.
• 24:55
  And again, like my kids are not going to sit on a couch and have a glass of wine, obviously.
• 24:59
  Uh I think they always have like little juice for them.
• 25:01
  They're running around, and I have this video of my
• 25:04
  kids with the guide and he was just swinging them and then they were taking slow-mo videos of themselves jumping in the air and they were just goofing around and the ability for the
• 25:13
  guide to kind of take off his like guiding hat about pointing out things and just play with my children.
• 25:20
  And you know, they're just so k so kid oriented.
• 25:23
  So that was wonderful.
• 25:25
  that that feeling of warmth that you get when people are delighted to be around your children as a mom is great.
• 25:31
  And we have highlighted acrylics, we both spent time there, but these experiences generally will happen almost in any lodge or tent camp that you choose.
• 25:40
  not just these particular places.
• 25:41
  if I can talk about Sabi Sabi Bush Lodge, this is also a really popular product for families.
• 25:45
  They actually have a dedicated, it's called Elefun Children's Center.
• 25:50
  And um so we checked into that lodge after Karula and it open I think it's open pretty much gen through it the whole day.
• 25:58
  Um so when you come back from Safari and usually they have a little bit of downtime in the sort of like mid morning, you have your breakfast or whatever, my kids just went to the
• 26:06
  Elefun Center.
• 26:06
  Just like kids club, essentially.
• 26:09
  And they had stop on site, they were playing games, they had like a jungle gym, there was other kids there, they were painting.
• 26:17
  So we kinda dropped them off for a few hours and had like some great relaxing time.
• 26:21
  Um there was one day where my mom and my daughter were not they wanted to rest and not go in the afternoon safari, so my husband and my son and I went and my mom and my daughter,
• 26:31
  she was at the elephant, I think my mom was relaxing, so it allowed people to do a bit of their own thing.
• 26:35
  m
• 26:36
  farm.
• 26:36
  Hopefully she does as well.
• 26:37
  She might have been.
• 26:39
  Um and they again, like the staff there were amazing.
• 26:43
  So they just felt so well looked after.
• 26:45
  Yeah, again, from our personal experiences of traveling and just in general, I've found everywhere in the world I've gone that the local service and local peoples have always
• 26:56
  been warm and welcoming.
• 26:57
  It's got to do with Africa or the Middle East.
• 26:59
  It's just generally, as a foreigner, I've never ever experienced anything other than being welcomed and literally and metaphorically being hugged from the local people.
• 27:10
  We um we stayed in Stellenbosch, the wine region.
• 27:14
  we actually did the wine portion, then Cape Town, then Cougar, and that just worked with with the timing of the race.
• 27:20
  I didn't want to have too much wine before the race, so we kind of spaced that out.
• 27:23
  Um and I wasn't sure how my children were going to enjoy the the wine region.
• 27:27
  Um there's so many wineries and beautiful product out just like forty minutes outside Cape Town.
• 27:35
  so we stayed at the Lansrak.
• 27:36
  Which is just an absolutely gorgeous product.
• 27:38
  And it has this kind of old world charm, um, just luxury, just so lovely.
• 27:43
  And I was sort of a bit unsure what my kids would enjoy of it, and a phenomenal.
• 27:48
  Again, it came down to that service.
• 27:50
  The people were so friendly, they were very welcome.
• 27:53
  There was one our very first night, my kids were very loud in the restaurant, and there was only one other table there.
• 27:58
  And I was like, guys, shh, you're being really loud.
• 28:01
  And this table um looked over us and said, Don't worry, don't tell your kids to be quiet, it's fine.
• 28:05
  And I was thinking, where are you?
• 28:06
  you know, a really nice setting here.
• 28:21
  Not actually like a jungle gym, but like a big rock and like a wine bridge.
• 28:25
  And like kind of in the in the setting.
• 28:26
  And they just played on that for probably two hours.
• 28:29
  Right.
• 28:29
  Um so it really I you know, to think about going, you know, to the wine region with children, like, boy, they have fun.
• 28:36
  They definitely had a good time.
• 28:37
  So again
• 28:48
  had you done a big trip with your kids, so six and seven at the time, so had you done a big family trip prior to that when they were younger?
• 28:56
  We've not done sort of an international flight of that length, uh we had done a trip to Belize.
• 29:02
  Have you gone back to Oz or Cape Town or South Africa with the kids after they were...
• 29:08
  took my daughter to Australia when I was on Mat League when she was a little baby.
• 29:11
  Right.
• 29:11
  Uh so a bit different.
• 29:13
  Okay.
• 29:14
  and the only other trip we had done was a trip to Belize, which is a lot short of a flight.
• 29:17
  I remember you talking about it.
• 29:18
  Yeah, yeah.
• 29:19
  But was a great experience.
• 29:20
  Um so this was our first We did.
• 29:23
  You did.
• 29:24
  Yeah.
• 29:24
  Yeah.
• 29:25
  We've another podcast.
• 29:26
  Yeah, another podcast.
• 29:27
  and they were littler for that one, so I got good advice for that.
• 29:29
  Um but this is our biggest trip that we've done.
• 29:32
  Um
• 29:33
  Okay, so when you sort of say, I'm going to speak to your husband, I'm going to do the race, mum, do want to come along with us?
• 29:38
  And you present it to the kids.
• 29:39
  What was their reaction?
• 29:40
  Did they know what Africa was, what it was going to be?
• 29:45
  they immediately think lions and giraffes?
• 29:48
  Like, was there an initial reaction to when they actually landed and experienced it?
• 29:51
  a great question.
• 29:52
  So obviously was doing most of the planning, but I did want to involve them because I think it's super important to get your kids involved in the planning stage.
• 30:00
  The excitement you had before a trip Um My husband kinda let me it worked out better that I took the reins on that.
• 30:07
  Um my mom also helped plan a few things as well.
• 30:10
  But professionals, you and your mom.
• 30:12
  Yes.
• 30:12
  Yeah, I think you know what you're doing.
• 30:15
  Yeah, I hope I do.
• 30:18
  and you know, we we got a map out.
• 30:20
  Of course a lot of kids think, I'm going to Africa.
• 30:22
  They would tell their friends I'm going to Africa.
• 30:23
  I said, We're going to South Africa.
• 30:25
  Africa's the continent.
• 30:26
  So we're going to South Africa in the continent of Africa.
• 30:28
  Um, we had to kind of pull a map out.
• 30:31
  I remember getting a book on just like a kid's sort of wildlife kind of book and we talked about some of the animals they might see.
• 30:37
  So we were having some of those conversations in advance.
• 30:39
  Um s pretty much most of it was planned.
• 30:43
  In advance, uh I did talk to them.
• 30:45
  When I showed them pictures of Cape Town, I said, Here's what Cape Town looks like.
• 30:48
  They spotted the Ferris wheel, which is at the VNA waterfront on one of those sort of classic photos, and they I wanna go in the Ferris together.
• 30:54
  Different eyes, different things.
• 30:55
  Wasn't on top of my list.
• 30:56
  So then when we got to the waterfront, we then saw and we of course had to go up and it was actually quite nice.
• 31:01
  Um so they got to choose some fun things like that.
• 31:04
  When we were in Stellenbosch, we learned there was this
• 31:17
  of on the spot book that.
• 31:19
  So there was a little bit of fluidity to the trip based on what the kids were interested in.
• 31:25
  Did you build in, consider or do things like Robben Isle, things a bit more historically focused?
• 31:32
  And if you did, did you take the kids or do you have the kids stay with mum?
• 31:35
  You and yeah when you have I got some feedback from my team about whether Robin Island would be appropriate for them and I felt they were a bit young.
• 31:42
  So I'd love to do that with them on another trip.
• 31:45
  So sorry to interrupt, so was that as a parent, regards to destination, like I know it wasn't a concern for me, it was a thought that if you take kids when they're younger...
• 31:55
  that will they remember it?
• 31:57
  Was that ever a conversation between you and your husband about is it worth taking them?
• 32:01
  That's a horrible choice of words, you know what mean?
• 32:04
  But if we take them all this way for this big experience at this age, will they remember any of it?
• 32:08
  Like I've got history on this.
• 32:11
  I want to hear what you think and have since then.
• 32:14
  I you know, it's definitely that concern is a parent, the investment financially and the time and everything for them to remember.
• 32:21
  You know, I I don't know if they will remember, you know, exactly our itinerary, but I think it's the experiences that you know that they remember that just builds their
• 32:30
  characters and exposes them to different cultures, exposes them to to new things.
• 32:35
  Like you can't you can't sort of evaluate what that is, but I know that they got a lot out of it.
• 32:42
  We're in the process of making a photo book so that we can like talk about it.
• 32:45
  We we still pull up photos and look at things we did so they remember.
• 32:50
  I don't know, it's hard to say.
• 32:51
  I I do think for me personally, I don't have a lot of memories before the age of six.
• 32:55
  Sort of I I think around six, seven is when kids do really remember things.
• 32:58
  I also wanted to say while I'm thinking of it, I don't know if I would recommend Safari product for kids much younger than six.
• 33:04
  Right.
• 33:05
  I would say that's about the age where they are sort of required to be um
• 33:10
  Around six or seven, depending on the product, to be able to go on the safari and very kid dependent.
• 33:15
  So some kids are super wriggly and just sitting in a vehicle for a few hours wouldn't work for them.
• 33:21
  Exactly.
• 33:22
  So you gotta you gotta know your kids.
• 33:23
  Um I think I'm happy I took them at this age.
• 33:26
  I think they got a lot out of it.
• 33:28
  Uh I probably wouldn't have taken them much younger.
• 33:31
  So I want to continue on this line because I think it's important for agents if they're to take their families or they're passing this on to their particular clients.
• 33:41
  I found, and I remember this, we'd done a whole lot of travel when the kids were much younger.
• 33:45
  So they travelled around about that age.
• 33:47
  The youngest one was about six or seven.
• 33:48
  We did Ecuador and things like that.
• 33:50
  I remember when they were sort of more in their teens, we did some travel.
• 33:52
  We went to Peru and Jarnam alive.
• 33:55
  She was frustrated at times when they were there because they weren't paying attention to maybe some of the historical.
• 34:16
  I've now as they matured, I now see reflections of those trips in them.
• 34:22
  I see comments coming from them which I can trace back to those trips.
• 34:26
  Now you traveled extensively as a young person through your parents.
• 34:30
  Surely, and I know you and I know your brother, I hear that as well through your, I guess general philosophies on life.
• 34:40
  to me, I'm talking me and my kids, I think you agree that, you've already said it,
• 34:45
  in time it will shape who they are.
• 34:47
  Will they remember that day and that particular lion spotted?
• 34:50
  Maybe, maybe not.
• 34:51
  But it will form who they are as they get older.
• 34:54
  going back to your word of investment, I think it's a worthwhile investment to expose your younger children, particularly to the fact that these people in Africa were giving them
• 35:03
  hugs and playing with them and swinging them.
• 35:05
  Yeah.
• 35:05
  I that's so cool of to say that you can see that now when your kids at an older age and
• 35:10
  It's hard to tangibly say what that is.
• 35:12
  I also think, you know, aside from the cultural experience and the wildlife and all of that, traveling with children ha forces them to be adaptable, to be flexible, that this
• 35:21
  day's gonna look a little different.
• 35:23
  That um w maybe we're doing an activity today that grandma wants to do but you didn't really want to do, but tomorrow's your activity, so you've got to be patient.
• 35:32
  wait your turn.
• 35:33
  Like just these things that are not necessarily skills just great human characteristics.
• 35:39
  no, I agree because exactly that you have to, like any travel with people, be it a family or you're on a group trip, you have to adapt to other people's likes and dislikes and
• 35:50
  quirks, some good, some are bad.
• 35:52
  Yeah, so teachers, kids, like to me, I'm you agree that just by them seeing what the rest of the world is and does and what a lot of people don't have.
• 36:04
  I remember we've got photos of it too of, we were in Ecuador, the kids were,
• 36:08
  visit a local community and I've got a photo of my boy talking to this little Ecuadorian girl, not talking, exchanging and sign language and stuff like that.
• 36:18
  But around the village was very very basic and our kids got to see this is again it's not
• 36:26
  think.
• 36:32
  now for what they have and they're very empathetic to other people here and around the world I think that's all.
• 36:39
  Amazing.
• 36:39
  Good job, John.
• 36:40
  Thank you.
• 36:40
  Was that part of your, as a parent, is that part of your motivation going forward now to have your kids travel more with or with their, obviously when they're younger with you,
• 36:51
  encourage that sort of lifestyle?
• 36:52
  Because it's in your family naturally.
• 36:54
  Is it something you want to pass on for some of reasons we just discussed?
• 36:57
  Absolutely.
• 36:57
  We we came back from this trip and thought where are we gonna go next year?
• 37:00
  Also how are we gonna top that?
• 37:02
  And you know, maybe next year is
• 37:12
  important I also want to highlight like my kids' time with grandma was also so special like to have that memory.
• 37:20
  absolutely loved it, you know, so those are just like uh core memories that you have and you know she's they're not gonna be able to travel with grandma forever so
• 37:30
  a question, not sure if I ever asked this myself.
• 37:33
  Where was grandpa?
• 37:35
  What they call?
• 37:38
  Did they call him?
• 37:39
  that's his name and he wanted he didn't want a grandparent name.
• 37:41
  He unfortunately wasn't able to go.
• 37:43
  He had another trip uh about a month earlier and so it it just didn't work out that he was able to join.
• 37:50
  But you know, the itinerary was fast paced.
• 37:51
  You know, I was worried about my kids, you know, is this gonna be too fast paced for them?
• 37:55
  But also you have to keep in mind Yeah.
• 37:57
  For grandparents that a busy day where you're out for dinner and then you're up early the next morning and then you're doing a sightseeing.
• 38:03
  It's taxing on on uh
• 38:05
  So what do your kids call your mom?
• 38:07
  For some reason they called her Maggie.
• 38:09
  Thank you.
• 38:10
  They it was a name they gave her when they were toddlers and then they just named her Meg.
• 38:15
  Yeah, that's Because we had dinner with some friends the other night and they've got grandkids now and they're much younger, like, you know, they're ones and twos and stuff.
• 38:27
  I just asked my friend Derek, I said, what are you all, what's your grandparent like?
• 38:32
  And it's grumpy.
• 38:34
  Apparently, my wife, Janna, said something as a joke about Graham, Derek being grumpy and one of the grandkids heard it and...
• 38:43
  That was it.
• 38:44
  So now it's grumpy.
• 38:46
  I'm not sure if he's 100 % pleased with it.
• 38:48
  He loves his grandkids, but I'm not sure if he's happy with the name.
• 38:52
  We've discussed obviously family dynamics, as in younger kids, know, teen kids and whatnot.
• 38:58
  I can tell you when you get there, because you would have forgotten, as I forgot as a teenager, being a teen as a parent, they're a pain in the bum.
• 39:06
  and it's a different challenge.
• 39:07
  Actually, we have a very good podcast I spoke to my wife about.
• 39:11
  It so much multi-generational, it was just traveling with family and how kids can be at times a challenge.
• 39:16
  You've already mentioned that as well.
• 39:18
  And actually, throughout conversation with my wife and I, found that there were no roadblocks, there no don't do it.
• 39:23
  It was all positive for lot of the reasons we discussed as well.
• 39:26
  They challenging at times.
• 39:28
  um So, in your recollection of your trip,
• 39:36
  You mentioned the staff looking after your kids at times and kids clubs being available.
• 39:40
  If someone comes to one of our destination specialists with a family, be it four or five or even extended, you know, 15 people, and they have younger kids, or even teens, that
• 39:50
  matter, young teens.
• 39:52
  Is there, are there lodges, tented camps, hotels, etc.
• 39:58
  that would cater specifically for what we would recommend for multi-generational trips in South Africa in particular and Africa in general.
• 40:07
  It's broad question.
• 40:09
  every family is different.
• 40:11
  So I think obviously the more details a travel agent can share with a destination specialist about what that family is and their dynamics, do they all do they want to be in
• 40:21
  a two-bedroom kind of product if if grandparents are there so they're close by, does everyone need their own room?
• 40:26
  Right.
• 40:27
  Are there, you know, what what is the rooming configuration?
• 40:30
  I think that then gives us some information about what type of product.
• 40:35
  there's even more like kind of apartment style options.
• 40:37
  For instance, in Cape Town.
• 40:39
  um The VNA waterfront is where we send so many first-time travelers to Cape Town, but it is a busy area.
• 40:44
  Maybe they want to be somewhere a little quieter, depending on the group.
• 40:47
  So very, very dependent, hence why we do Tailor Made, and that's what our destination specialists are there for to guide that and they have that level of expertise.
• 40:55
  I think some great tips for multi-gen travel is pre-arranging as much as possible makes a smooth trip.
• 41:04
  So if you're five, six people on a Saturday night in Cape Town, it's a good idea to book a dinner reservation.
• 41:08
  You can probably do that only a couple days in advance.
• 41:11
  You don't need to do it months in advance.
• 41:13
  the destination specialist can we've actually got a restaurant guide, so we can recommend some.
• 41:16
  Um or just as a travel agent, you can go on to I don't know if it's open table or with the equivalent of an online app and just book some.
• 41:23
  So it's always nice to have some restaurants prearranged.
• 41:26
  I think you want to know what you're doing every single day.
• 41:28
  You do not want a multi gen group waking up on, you know, on day three and go, so what are we doing today?
• 41:33
  Yeah, yeah.
• 41:34
  Um you need a plan.
• 41:35
  So it really helped.
• 41:36
  Like every day we were like this is when our transfers come in to pick us up, this is when the tour guides come in to get us.
• 41:41
  We always knew what time it was.
• 41:44
  some families may then be beneficial to like have like a later start if they need a bit more time in the morning.
• 41:49
  So there's a lot of flexibility there.
• 41:51
  Private touring is great for family to go.
• 41:54
  Um we did the most amazing trip uh down to the peninsula where we went to Boulders Beach, saw the penguins.
• 42:00
  We had this beautiful private picnic set up.
• 42:02
  nice.
• 42:03
  Um it was incredible.
• 42:04
  So any kind of special touches, private experiences, always recommend.
• 42:11
  I think I deviated from what your question was, but
• 42:13
  Well, yeah, no, that's into it.
• 42:16
  let me get back to the specifics of the question.
• 42:18
  This is because South Africa, like Cape Town, Stalembauchet, et cetera, like they are unique, they're different, but they are cities with hotels and, you know, the sort of the
• 42:28
  models, what you mentioned, you know, do you want three in a room, family rooms, apartments, whatever.
• 42:33
  Probably more of interest to our travel professionals out there is when it comes to your safari experiences, and again from five star down to more moderate um experiences, not
• 42:44
  every lodge or private gate reserve will be suited for a family.
• 42:53
  again, it's letting us know when you're making the booking and we would recommend obviously lodges.
• 42:58
  So let's say you have a group of 10.
• 43:00
  um
• 43:02
  Where do you direct people?
• 43:03
  Like obviously budget will be a drug.
• 43:06
  Availability is a big driving factor.
• 43:08
  uh I know sometimes my team will say, I know what region they want to Sabi Sabi.
• 43:12
  You know, this is the region, so now I'm gonna start looking at availability.
• 43:15
  Availability is a huge one.
• 43:17
  People want to add on Victoria Falls.
• 43:19
  Victoria Falls is so hard to get availability.
• 43:21
  Highly recommend you do it.
• 43:22
  So booking early, getting that commitment from the client early so we can um get things up put on hold is always a big one.
• 43:30
  But but sometimes the client and the agent.
• 43:52
  Mobility could be an important one.
• 43:53
  So certain lodges might not be suitable with those steps.
• 43:56
  Um and maybe if they are traveling with young children, maybe that's also a factor.
• 44:02
  You know, just a bit of on the interest, some people want to have like a tented camp experience.
• 44:06
  The tented lodge versus you mentioned you want it to all be around the watering hole and have that kind of experience.
• 44:11
  So just the more details you can get from the clients, what getting painting the picture.
• 44:17
  Um, you know, Sabi Sabi has a communal dining experience, so you actually eat with your guide at dinner every night.
• 44:25
  With the guide, yeah.
• 44:26
  And so everyone kinda eats dinner at the same time, sort of
• 44:28
  Boma style with buffet and and like that's a cool experience is that if people want to say, like, I do really want to have my meals as with my guide, maybe you want to like a
• 44:36
  more of a private experience and really interact with and feel very exclusive and quiet family time.
• 44:42
  So it's so it's so dependent on the family.
• 44:45
  I actually think kind of do you want to be social or not social is almost an interesting one.
• 44:49
  Yeah.
• 44:51
  My husband and I when we travel, we're like, we want social.
• 44:54
  We want to when we get to a product
• 44:55
  Thank you.
• 44:56
  When we get to lodges, we're like, we want chat to people.
• 44:58
  We wanna go to a bar and chat.
• 44:59
  Some lodges we've been to in our past are like it's very private and exclusive and everyone kinda disappears.
• 45:04
  So so many things to consider.
• 45:07
  I don't know nearly as much as my team knows when it comes to product and all those nuanced details.
• 45:12
  So that's why you collect that information from your client, share it with the destination specialists and they can recommend.
• 45:17
  Yeah, I think it's important too because what we found on our experience and like doctors are the worst patients, travel professionals are sometimes the worst travelers, and I went
• 45:26
  to this trip, you know, we planned it, again, I did, I sort of it all and I trusted Moira, who at the time was looking after Africa, she knew, or knows it intimately, she said do
• 45:38
  this, do this, and we went, okay, fine, trust you.
• 45:41
  But we sort of knew what, we knew what we were doing, but we didn't, like a lot of people will dive into every detail.
• 45:47
  That's just a way of a person will travel.
• 45:50
  Book this and I'll learn when they get there or other people won't know anything before they get there.
• 45:54
  But we found, like, Corolla is stunning and the dining is amazing but it's on the, well, it's all the property, but we've been to the sea.
• 46:02
  It's in the private restaurant.
• 46:04
  It probably reserved in the restaurant.
• 46:06
  We went to, I think, at Elfenstans.
• 46:09
  Again, much more moderate lodge around the waterhole.
• 46:12
  So your dining was the Boma literally at the waterhole.
• 46:16
  And people asked me what was the most memorable thing, like everything was.
• 46:21
  As you said, how do you beat this on the next trip?
• 46:24
  But to me, I guess the special thing, and it wasn't being the five-star lodge, Elf and Sands, is not that.
• 46:30
  It was this dining and our villa.
• 46:36
  basically it was right by the waterhole, so we heard lions at night mooring.
• 46:40
  You'd get up at two o'clock in morning, there'd be elephants around the waterhole, and when you dined, there were generally lots of elephants in this area.
• 46:48
  And that was what was really special, that proximity to the wildlife when you're not on safari, when you're just eating or sitting in the bar having a drink.
• 46:57
  So I think back to your point of...
• 47:00
  you out there telling our destination specialist everything you know about the family or getting all the information from the family because that then would direct what type of
• 47:08
  lodge, where the lodge is located, if it's around the water hole, um and what facilities it may or may not have.
• 47:15
  Because um in Kapama, they've got four lodges.
• 47:19
  There's Karula, which is the posh one.
• 47:22
  We've got River.
• 47:24
  Yeah, I've forgotten as well.
• 47:25
  But one is geared towards families.
• 47:27
  It's much more bigger.
• 47:28
  footprint and it has kids clubs and the whole thing as well.
• 47:32
  Super yeah, just so di dependent.
• 47:34
  We do trainings with these lodges weekly in essence.
• 47:39
  Um because the products are so specific and so no one can ever remember everything, but the matching that client to the right product and I think having mixed experiences, like
• 47:50
  for you to be able to say we had this Capama Crula experience and then having the you know the um the elephant sands one um I think having that mixed experience makes a really
• 48:01
  interesting trip.
• 48:02
  Um so putting together different products.
• 48:04
  I think that's a really important point, be it multi-gen or just a standard two three people FIT.
• 48:10
  I think for anywhere, particularly for Africa, mix up the types of, particularly on safari, the types of accommodation and safari options because there's walking, flying
• 48:20
  safaris up in East Africa.
• 48:21
  Can you do flying safaris in South?
• 48:24
  uh not in the same way that you do in East Africa.
• 48:27
  Yeah.
• 48:28
  And I think also like there's other reasons
• 48:38
  That's
• 48:41
  Now because
• 48:55
  So diverse.
• 48:57
  Broan says our DS's destination specialists are trained in all departments if not weekly like a lot oh just as we're sitting here recording we have uh ten of our Latin supplies
• 49:09
  next door training our staff as well so our destination specialists are trained as Bruce would like to say trained to death because you know they need to know the ins and outs of
• 49:19
  when you come to us with a
• 49:21
  where to place that person in this instance in a safari lodge or an experience in South Africa.
• 49:27
  Absolutely.
• 49:27
  There's sort of one last sort of thought I would lean on that I just remembered.
• 49:30
  I so I put this trip together myself very, you know, while working and very busy and f you know, obviously I know the region, but you know, travel agents travel professionals make
• 49:40
  the worst travelers.
• 49:41
  On more than one occasion I said I need a travel agent because I arrived in Hood Spreed airport and my tri transfer wasn't there and I checked
• 49:49
  my notes and saw that I had provided the wrong arrival time.
• 49:52
  really?
• 49:53
  And I was like, wow, I really needed somebody to have checked that I had my D I just I had a typo.
• 49:57
  And I said I was arriving at two, but we arrived at twelve, something like that.
• 50:01
  I actually found another example when a uh touring company had come to pick us up and they were calling to say we're outside, we're ready to pick you up.
• 50:10
  And then they didn't get through to me and later I realized I actually sent my wrong phone number.
• 50:14
  I had a typo.
• 50:15
  So these are the kinds of details that people are busy and they think
• 50:19
  You know, just having the a like the work that agents do in those extra set of eyes and ensuring every detail is correct and that our team on the ground does as well, is
• 50:30
  phenomenal.
• 50:31
  There are so many logistics in a trip to South Africa and just having a travel agent put that all together and do it for someone versus somebody kinda hacking it together
• 50:39
  themselves.
• 50:40
  Yeah.
• 50:40
  I cannot stress that enough.
• 50:42
  Yeah.
• 50:42
  Um how important it is.
• 50:43
  that's you guys out there.
• 50:45
  This is why we rely on you.
• 50:46
  work with us to make your client's the best it can be.
• 50:50
  So before we wrap up, so you said it as you were chatting earlier, like how do you beat this trip?
• 50:56
  I concur with our trip to Africa, like if we do another big family trip, how do you beat that?
• 51:01
  That kids will have to suck it up and if we offer them another trip, they'll take what they get.
• 51:05
  But again, my guys are young men now heading off in their own directions.
• 51:08
  Your kids are much younger than mine.
• 51:10
  What is the next sort of big trip?
• 51:12
  I know you mentioned doing the RV around maybe BC, but...
• 51:15
  oh
• 51:17
  on the radar for family trip, when they're a bit.
• 51:19
  My husband has not been to Asia, the continent.
• 51:22
  really?
• 51:22
  So I said it's time we go, so I think our next trip will be in Asia.
• 51:26
  Obviously most uh trip travel agents know like Japan and Thailand are probably the two most popular places for families.
• 51:32
  So many good reasons to go.
• 51:34
  Um so one of those destinations is maybe on my radar or maybe possibly China.
• 51:38
  Um which is definitely an up and coming destination for us um in in terms of volume.
• 51:43
  So uh somewhere in Asia is next for us.
• 51:47
  cross plug we've just done a China module in the Academy so if you want to learn about China before Brahman does you can check out the Academy.
• 51:54
  Okay that was really good again it's hard not to have a good time in South Africa it's hard not to a good time with your family I'm glad you were happy to share that with us
• 52:05
  congratulations on the ultra marathon.
• 52:06
  Thank you.
• 52:07
  was just the marathon.
• 52:08
  Anything else you'd like to say about travel professionals before we take a
• 52:12
  was gonna go home tonight and get a clip of something uh that my children loved about the trip.
• 52:17
  So I'm gonna do that and you can hear from them what they thought was incredible about the trip.
• 52:22
  And so hopefully you can play that afterwards.
• 52:24
  we're talking about through their eyes, so we actually hear it through their words, Kara Brolin and her two kids.
• 52:31
  So on that note, thank you, Bronwyn, really appreciate it.
• 52:33
  And Rosie, you're have me on that down there behind the chair now.
• 52:37
  And as always, thank you to you out there for carving out an hour of your time.
• 52:40
  We know you're busy and we appreciate you listening in.
• 52:43
  And until next time.
• 52:45
  you