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Cop to Corporate: When Being Trapped In Your Job Is ALL You Know · Murders to Music: Crime Scene to Music Scene (Streamline Events and Entertainment)

• 0:24
  Speaker 1: Well, what is going on?
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: Everybody?
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: It's Aaron with the Murders to Music podcast.
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much for coming back for another week, man.
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: I tell you what this podcast is getting a ton of traction.
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: I'm getting a ton of response and emails and text messages.
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much for coming back.
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: If you like it, be sure you followed, subscribed and share it with some friends.
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: So tonight we're going to talk about the cop-to-corporate transition.
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: And when you know one thing your entire life, oftentimes we believe that we can't do anything else or our skill sets are so unique to whatever our job is that they can't be applicable to anything else in the world.
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: And I know that when I was going through the process, I kept thinking to myself man, I just wish there was somebody out there who could analyze my skill sets and tell me how they fit into that corporate world.
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: And there probably are.
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: You guys are much smarter than I am.
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: There's probably somebody out there.
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: If not, I just gave you your next job to make a million bucks, but that is what I was hoping for.
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: That person never came along in my life and I moved on without them.
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: But I want to talk about the cop to corporate transition, the good, the bad, the ugly, the life on the other side, and what is it really like?
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: Is it better, is it worse?
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: That's what we're going to talk about tonight, but before I do, I want to tell you just a quick funny story.
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: That just happened two minutes ago, so before I turned the microphone and the camera on and for those of you who don't know, this is also on YouTube.
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: You can go to YouTube and you can watch many of my episodes right there on YouTube, where you get some video with it.
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: Anyway.
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: So I'm looking at myself in the camera before I get started and I'm like man, the left side of my body is all out of whack.
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: It's lower than the right, maybe my left ass cheek is smaller than my right ass cheek and I got to get some adjustments made or like an addition or, you know, augmentation or whatever the hell it is.
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: I don't even know.
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: But I'm like sitting.
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: So I'm trying to adjust my seat and make everything right and, no matter how I look, my head is crooked and my head's crooked on my shoulders and I'm like is that what everybody sees when they see me as a crooked head?
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: I mean, I'm like Humpty Dumpty with this crooked head on the wall and I don't even get it.
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: And then I realized my camera was angled and it wasn't me at all.
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: All I had to do was straighten out my camera, make it level, and all of a sudden I'm back in business.
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: Sometimes the answer is right in front of us, literally, and we don't see it.
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: Let's talk a little bit about cop to corporate.
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: So let's start like we do on many of the shows, and if you think that your skills are not applicable to the real world, in whatever it is that you do, you're so deep into your niche, please stick around and watch this video to the end.
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: I think that it will be pretty clear that you can transition out.
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: You can make a change.
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: So let's talk about it.
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: So let's talk about it.
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: My journey of getting out of law enforcement started long ago.
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: It started about six years ago eight years ago now, because I've been out two.
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: So about eight years ago I realized I hated going to work.
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: I felt like.
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: So I felt like I hated going to work.
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: Every time I would have to get ready to go to work, every time the phone would ring.
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: It was frustrating to me.
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: The pressure at work was getting higher for various reasons, people were leaving.
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: We were understaffed and every time somebody left, no matter what position they were at the top or the bottom, it created a ripple effect amongst our organization.
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: And, as you know, if you've been in the world at all and had a pulse and paying attention, society has changed over the last decade and it hasn't gotten better, at least not in the Portland Oregon area metropolitan area.
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: I found myself, you know, at work in the car on the crime scene running cases, whatever it may be.
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: I felt myself filling with hate and anger and rage and it just pissed me off every time that my phone rang and it was another call out that my phone rang and it was another call out Every time I had to go to work and talk to my supervisors.
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: It became a very toxic and caustic situation.
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: So this started about six years ago, eight years ago now, and it just progressively got worse up until that end.
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: You know and there's a few things that I want to talk about on this podcast I want to go through and highlight some of the things that I think contributed to that Now, that's to say, if these things weren't there, would I still be in law enforcement.
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: I mean, that's God's plan, not mine.
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: I know he's got me where he wants me right now.
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: I don't know what tomorrow looks like.
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: If you'd have asked me eight years ago, would I ever leave law enforcement?
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: No, I would sit back and whine about it and make a ton of excuses why I couldn't leave, and bitch and moan to anybody that would listen.
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: And heaven forbid you ask me, hey, how was work?
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: Because I would give you an earful.
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: I felt like there was a period for about eight years seven, eight years that I had nothing positive to say, even if I went out and arrested a murderer or a child molester.
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: It wasn't a positive experience.
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: There was no dopamine release, there was no happiness at all in my world, but yet I continued to do it.
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: And every time somebody would ask, the answers would just get worse than the time before.
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: Talking about telling a cop story or, you know, tell me something cool that happened.
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: You didn't want to hear my cool stories because I would shock your conscience and I would make some shit up about a broken baby or something that I knew would absolutely disgust you, because I didn't want to have that conversation with you.
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: It wasn't something that I was interested in pursuing or doing, so I would shock your conscience, you would be disgusted and you would walk away.
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: And that's how I handled those situations for many, many years.
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: I found myself praying for a new job six, seven, eight years ago.
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: God, please give me a job that has similar benefits, time off with my family, similar pay, and just allow me to be a happier human being, because inside there was no happiness whatsoever.
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: If I was happy, I was faking it.
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: If I seemed happy, if I was smiling, it doesn't matter if it was a birthday, a holiday, a Tuesday.
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: If I was smiling, it was fake, because in my heart it was so dark and angry and negative and, like I've said before, I was out of balance and I was looking for a fight.
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: Everywhere I went, I was looking for confrontation.
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: It was a relief from the pain that I was feeling.
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: So I was praying this prayer.
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: You know, dear God, give me this opportunity to come up.
• 8:01
  Speaker 1: And as we go through life and I've said this, this before there's exit signs on this highway of life, and I kept passing them and there was nothing huge, you know, but it's just as simple as an indeed ad.
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: Come up on your Instagram feed or whatever you know, apply here, put your resume in, let people call you.
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: I'm like, nah, I don't have any skills outside of solving murders and cop stuff.
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: There's nowhere that can use me and that's the way that I felt.
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: So I was short-tempered, I had no patience and, like I said, I dreaded the phone ringing when call outs would come.
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: I would still give them my all, but in reality I hated it.
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: I hated going in and managing people and just doing that stuff.
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: Then, about five years ago now, we had a supervisor change and we got a supervisor who I don't believe has ever worked a identity theft case, much less ran a murder investigation a murder investigation His job was.
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: His career path has kept him in a supervisory role or some other positions that canine, et cetera.
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: That would keep him out of a hands-on investigative role, which I'm okay.
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: I love teaching and training.
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: That is one of the places that I love doing.
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: I thrive there.
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: It's a lot of fun for me.
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: I love teaching, especially old.
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: That is one of the places that I love doing.
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: I thrive there.
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: It's a lot of fun for me.
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: I love teaching, especially old dogs new tricks.
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: It's a lot of fun.
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: So I was excited for that opportunity for the supervisor.
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: I didn't know him, I had never really worked with him before, and he came into the unit and it wasn't long in the unit that we got really busy.
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: And he came into the unit and it wasn't long in the unit that we got really busy.
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: And some people handle pressure under fire with grace.
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: Some people have an absolute panic attack and just start making decisions to make decisions, and I think that one of the things on this show is I'm going to be candid and open because I think it's important and that's the way I'm going to be candid and open because I think it's important and that's the way I'm going to be.
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: In my opinion, this guy didn't know shit about solving murders and he didn't know about the systems or the people or his strengths or his weaknesses in his team.
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: So therefore he couldn't effectively manage.
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: But instead of being smart enough to sit back and allow the veterans who have done it before many, many times show him the ropes, he wanted to get involved and he wanted to supervise because he could supervise.
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: Maybe you've had one of those supervisors that doesn't know shit about your job but all of a sudden wants to come in and tell you how to do it.
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: Well, if you're working the, you know, and no offense to McDonald's workers, but if you're working the burger line at McDonald's, okay, maybe I flip my patty this way versus that way.
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: A child abuse, the two worst crimes that are even fathomable to our imaginations and you want to come in and, all of a start, start putting your little fingers into places that they don't belong.
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: That's a good way, in my world, to get them smacked.
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: Now, as I'm talking, I'm getting passionate about this because this is important to me.
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: This is something that you don't screw with.
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: My investigation.
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: You don't come in, you don't tell me what I'm doing wrong.
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: If you don't know if I'm doing something wrong, tell me about it, but if I don't, if you don't know what you're talking about, I really don't care what your opinion is.
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: There's a time to think and a time to act, and when I'm too busy thinking, I don't need your input, because I need to think so I can make other people act.
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: If I'm running a crew of 25 or 30 cops to investigate a murder or a homicide, I don't need you chipping in my ear stuff that doesn't make any sense and doesn't matter.
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: Instead, sit back and be a freaking sponge.
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: That's the way I felt, and I guess I didn't mind telling him this, because there was more than one time I'm in his office yelling and screaming and swearing at him.
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: I was out of line and he doing the same to me.
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: He had the audacity to tell me that my intensity level was an 11 and I needed to dial it back to about a three or a four.
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: Well, you know what?
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: I've already dialed my intensity level back before I came into your office.
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: If it's an 11 now, you should have saw what it was 15 minutes ago when I was in the other room and you weren't around.
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: That is stuff that I couldn't handle, and it didn't happen once, it happened multiple times.
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: All right, now that's calmed down a little bit.
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: So it was a problem At that time.
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: We didn't just get one of those supervisors.
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: We had two supervisors switch out the other supervisor while a nice guy again wants to supervise, to supervise, wants to be in the middle of everything that he knows nothing about.
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: And both of these people have learned caveat.
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: They're not the same person today as they were before.
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: This is what it was like yesterday, back in the day.
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: So they wanted to supervise, just to supervise.
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: And the second one I wouldn't say worse, but was different was a shit stirrer, was a pot stirrer.
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: He'd come in, stir the pot and like, wouldn't even lick the spoon, he'd just leave and everybody looks around wondering what the hell just happened.
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: So those are the supervisors.
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: Add that on top of my already negative opinion about being there and you can see how the deck of cards is starting to stack up, only to soon crumble a few years later.
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: In my opinion, our unit was going to crap at the same time, because we have supervisors that don't know what they're doing.
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: One example if you have a homicide, I think if it was your spouse or your child who was killed yeah, you the one listening to this if it was your spouse or your child that was killed, you would want somebody on that investigation that has experience, has been there, has done that and knows the ropes, knows the ins and outs, knows the law, has been a detective more than a week, for example.
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: Because when you come from patrol, you don't do a ton of investigations or at least major crimes.
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: You do some dope cases, you do some identity theft, you might do an armed robbery, but then you turn it all over detectives.
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: Who finishes it for the patrol officers?
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: Because we have different roles and responsibilities.
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: So now we're back to your loved one getting murdered or getting abused sexually for a child or physical abuse.
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: You would want somebody with experience.
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: These supervisors would come in and there's a lead and a co-lead.
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: In a homicide investigation, the lead is responsible for the decisions in the case.
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: The co-lead assists the lead in their role and can also make decisions in the lead person's absence lead investigator's absence.
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: The idea is that if one person is not there, the other person can pick it up.
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: So also in our department we had long-term and short-term detectives.
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: A long-term detective is there for their career, the rest of their career.
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: A short-term detective is somebody who's in there temporarily for four years and they get to learn about investigations and see if it's something they like and are cut out for.
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: It's a training ground, if you will.
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: I was a long-term detective, so these supervisors would come in and put a short-term detective in a lead role.
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: Well, what that does is when the short-term detective leaves three or four years later or decides next month, this isn't for them.
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: They are holding all the keys to the castle on this investigation and they take that knowledge with them.
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: So that leaves holes and opportunities for defense attorneys to jump in and tear things apart.
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: It gives opportunities for the case to fail or not be successful in court.
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: We don't get paid to fail.
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: We don't get paid to fail in a street fight alongside in court.
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: We don't get paid to fail.
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: We don't get paid to fail in a street fight alongside the road.
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: We don't get paid to fail in the courtroom.
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: And we don't get paid to fail solving your case.
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: We get paid to win.
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: That is the mentality.
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: But yet you have these supervisors that haven't investigated an identity theft.
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: They probably have, but they don't seem like it.
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: So they definitely haven't done a major crime.
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: So they come in and they want to start putting the four year detective in the lead position, putting a long-term detective in a co-lead position.
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: The lead detectives literally have been back there one week and they're leading a homicide.
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: They don't, they can't even spell homicide, much less lead one.
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: They've never been involved, yet they're getting handed the reins.
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: I was watching my unit go to crap, a unit that I had bled for, that I had lost sleep over, destroyed my family at times been on the brink of divorce, driven a wedge between me and my family and my kids, and I'm watching it go to absolute crap because of the leadership and I use that word very lightly of our unit.
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: It's too high stress.
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: We're all dealing with too many cases and we never get to finish anything.
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: What I mean by that is I may have seven to 10 homicides that are open and active.
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: Then the phone rings and I'm working one of them and I'm working it hot and we are getting somewhere and we're ready to go out and catch somebody, and then the phone rings, ring, ring and we answer it.
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: There's another homicide, there's another major case, what we were working on today gets put on the back burner and we may not touch that for six months.
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: Now, if you stack that up eight or 10 times the stress of knowing that you have all these open major cases but you can't work them because of mismanagement, because of low numbers, nobody wants to be a cop.
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: Now we've got us into the BLM movement and the defund, the police movement, and all cops are bastards.
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: How does that?
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: How does that compile the stress level that we're feeling in the office?
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: There are times in the office that I'm standing up across the cubicle looking at another detective senior to me in police world, 50 something yearold man, and he's got tears in his eyes, crying because of the stress that he's under in the office.
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: When we look around the room, there's no joy or happiness.
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: Dear God, give me another job that will get me out of here Similar benefits, similar pay, time with the family, lower stress.
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: Hold on, I can't quit because I got too much to do.
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: I've got six cases, eight cases, 10 cases, a bunch of 30 felony child abuse cases.
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: Everybody needs me.
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: I'm the go-to.
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: I can't do anything.
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: I'm too busy, I'm too important to leave, so therefore I just stay there and allow my stress and blood pressure to build.
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: Every day that we went to work was somebody else's worst day.
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: Then I this goes on for years, years.
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: Remember the last five months of my job, five days off, uh, about average of approximately 300 hours overtime every two weeks.
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: Um, I was sleeping at the police department or falling asleep on the way home driving across the bridge.
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: That was the straw that broke the camel's back.
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: So then I go to the doctor.
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: Doctor tells me PTSD.
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: I say no.
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: She says yes.
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: I say no.
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: We argue, she wins.
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: I take a couple weeks off, I go to some therapy, I take a few more weeks off and, before you know it, I don't return to work for 14 months until I close out my desk and pick up all my crap.
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: Well, it was about two weeks after that diagnosis that I am at church.
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: My son is in the hospital.
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: He has got an intestinal blockage.
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: I have another episode on here about my son.
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: You can listen to him.
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: His name is Justice.
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: This is Fight for Life.
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: He is in the hospital with an intestinal blockage.
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: I am at church.
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: It's two weeks after.
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: I'm at the height of my stress.
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: I know in my mind that I'm probably never going back to work as a police officer.
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: Yet I am not ready to be done.
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: I'm coming downstairs after the service and I hear a voice behind me that I don't really recognize at first, but all I hear is hey, aaron, how's work going?
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: And in my mind I'm like I am not in the mood to have a tell me a cop story or how's things going?
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: I don't want small talk about work.
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: I want nothing to do with thinking about it.
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: I've lost my career.
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: I know nothing else.
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: I have no identity.
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: I might as well not even be carrying a gun or a badge I am useless.
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: But I turned around and it was a.
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: It was a guy that I an acquaintance of mine and uh, been going to church with him for years.
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: He knew I rode a motorcycle.
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: He would often talk to me about that.
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: This is the first time he'd ever really asked me about work and he knew nothing about my situation.
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: So I said hey, uh, chris, I said how's it going?
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: He's like it's good.
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: How's work going?
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: I said do you really want to know?
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: He's like yeah, I said dude, it's going shitty, man, it's terrible.
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: He's like well, how come?
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: So I go through the whole thing.
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: I vomit on him.
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: I'm pretty blunt, pretty open, and I vomit on him about all of the stuff that I've been going through and the depression and the nightmares and the suicide stuff, and my life sucks and my son's in the hospital, really really sick, circling the drain, and I can't handle the stress anymore.
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: And you know the hospital, really really sick, circling the drain, and I can't handle the stress anymore.
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: And you know I'm ready to be done.
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: And he says what do you do for work at the department.
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: So I told him, I said I'm a detective, I do homicide, child abuse, I manage cases, I interview suspects, interview witnesses.
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: I put the pieces of the puzzle together.
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: I'll show up on a scene where there's a dead body, there's no other evidence, and I manage the teams that put that case together and then I present that case in court for a successful prosecution.
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: I said I do a ton of interviewing, a ton of case management stuff.
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: He's like hmm, you ever thought about sales?
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: And I'm like no, I said I haven't.
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: I said salesmen are greasy.
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: The last thing I want to do is be a used car salesman.
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: And he's like hold on, aaron, hold on, hold on.
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: He's like what if sales looked like entertaining, networking, taking people to dinner, maybe, taking people on motorcycle rides up into Canada, taking them fishing, golfing, just building a relationship and the product you have they're going to need eventually.
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: So if you build that relationship and you provide value to them, then when they're ready to buy they choose to buy from the ones they trust and they know is going to have their back.
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: And I'm like well, I said you know I could break down walls.
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: I said if I can go into an interview room and talk to a child molester or a murderer about the crimes they just committed and within a very short amount of time they break down the walls, they forget they're talking to a cop and they start confessing everything.
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: And then, when I take them to trial and are successful, they thank me, they shake my hand, they joke with me and we part as friends.
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: I said if I can do that in an interview room, I can probably build a relationship on a motorcycle trip.
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: And I didn't know what this guy did and I'm like well, he's like well, why don't you come to my office on Wednesday?
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: And I just want to show you what it is that I do.
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: So he gave me the address and I go there on the Wednesday.
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: And when I got there he met me.
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: He said, aaron, there's three things I want to do.
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: I want to show you who we are and what we do.
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: He said I want you to understand our product sets and what it is that this company does.
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: Two, I want to show you some of our products in person so you can understand hands-on what these things look like and how they function.
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: And three, if this doesn't seem like something you're interested in, I want to help you write a cover letter, a resume, and I want to put you in touch with corporate contacts, because what you have in the police world is applicable in the real world.
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: You just can't see it because you're too deep into it.
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: He said I want to help you get out of where you're at.
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: Those words, even as I'm talking them back right now, um, were very divine and God sent.
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: All those prayers that I was praying for many years were being answered by a guy who was almost a complete stranger, by a happenstance of hey Aaron, how's work going?
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: And I think because of my weakness not weakness, but my vulnerability in just to say I don't give a crap about, I'm going to tell you.
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: You want to know how it's going.
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: I'm fricking, floundering, I'm dying here and I think that honesty resonated.
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: So we walked around.
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: This is a company called Braley Gray.
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: Braley Gray is a commercial plumbing factory rep just below the factories and they're the product knowledge experts.
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: They give training, education, support to everything from architect and design engineering firms, contractors, distributors, service contractors and users.
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: If there is one of their products on the line card and there's about 20 different factories that Brayley Gray supported about 70 different product groups, any of those products from.
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: Every time you go into a public restroom and you push down that flush handle on the urinal or on the toilet, you know that little lever, it sticks out.
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: Sometimes you probably kick it with your feet.
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: Lever it sticks out, Sometimes you probably kick it with your feet, that one that is called a flushometer, probably by a company called Sloan S-L-O-A-N.
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: Next time you're in there, take a look at the top when you see the Sloan.
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: Realize that if you have any Sloan problems I'm your guy.
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: Come talk to me, I'll help you fix them.
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: Anyway.
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: So Sloan is one of their factories.
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: So we took a walk back into this large warehouse.
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: A bunch of cast iron, a bunch of stuff.
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: I had no idea what it was and he shows me some of the products.
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: He shows me a roof drain, for example.
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: If you've ever noticed, that thing looks like a cow tongue sticking out of the side of a building.
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: That is the overflow drain for a roof drain, meaning that if you ever see water pouring out of that, it means that, one, it's probably raining, but two, it means that the main drain on the roof of that building is clogged.
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: That is the emergency overflow and that's a visual indicator that you have a lot of water on the roof.
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: So what does that mean?
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: That means that a roof is not structurally, doesn't have enough structural integrity to hold all of that water, and that is a dangerous environment.
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: I would not go in the building.
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: I might've just saved your life.
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: See, I'm saving lives today and I'm not even a cop anymore.
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: So anyway, he showed me that, showed me a couple other products and I'm like you know what?
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: I've never thought about plumbing being something that I was interested in.
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: But I mean, why not?
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: These things are kind of cool, high filtration systems to get, like, all the yuckies out of water in a hospital to help save lives in that environment, and I'm like that's pretty cool stuff.
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: So I left that was in oh March probably.
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: Then he invited me on that day.
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: He invited me out to lunch.
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: So we went out to lunch with another guy who's been in the business.
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: I always joke with him, but you know a hundred years he's been in the business, 45, 46 years.
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: We went out to lunch and I was too wound tight to realize that was an interview.
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: I was enjoying my Thai food and getting asked a lot of questions about what I do and how I do it and what I like about law enforcement, what I don't like, and I was wound pretty, pretty tight, because I was still a cop, I was still going 150 miles an hour and I didn't realize I was in an interview, so I left.
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: I got asked if I played golf.
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: I told him no and he's like well.
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: I got asked if I played golf, I told him no and he's like well, you should.
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: So I left and probably three, four months later, um, I got asked if I would go to a training event that they were holding and I just go in as an observer, but it would give me some insight into the Sloan world, that fleshometer world I spoke about.
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: So I agreed and I went and I met some folks and I'm like you know what I can do?
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: This?
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: There's a 60 year old guy up there teaching other adults about this product group.
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: I mean, I teach all the time.
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: I could totally do this.
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: So my wheels start turning and a few later I get a job offer and I can't take the job offer at the time because I'm still employed as a police officer.
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: So I tell them you know I can't accept the job, but I'm obviously by this time on my way out of law enforcement, so I can see that the end is kind of near from my employment with where I was working.
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: So they're like all right, you know, well, let's put the date out into the future.
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: So we put the date out into the future and the next date came and I said look guys, I'm still not in a position to accept employment outside.
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: So they're like all right, well, let's push the date out again.
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: So they pushed the date out again.
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: By this time it's been months and months since I went to my first lunch, which apparently was an interview, that I still didn't realize.
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: So, um, then that next date came and went and like, all right, let's push it out again.
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: So they pushed it out another time for me Now we're talking into October of that year.
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: Uh, so this whole thing started in March.
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: Now we're into October, november, and I got told you know that October came and uh, I called them and said you know, you guys are going to have to move on without me because I am still not in a position.
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: One, I can't take it because I'm employed.
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: Two, I can't take it because mentally I'm not right, I'm not sound and if I jump right back into another position or another job, then it is going to likely kill me.
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: My stress level is going to be up.
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: I am still not mentally stable enough to reintegrate into the world.
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: And he's like well, aaron, I really appreciate your time through this whole process, but we do need to fill the position.
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: We've been waiting a long time and you know not terrible news there may be another position in the future and we'll keep you in mind in the future and we'll keep you in mind.
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: I'm like okay, I get it.
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: So that job was done, it was over and I missed my opportunity.
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: But I missed it for the right reasons, so I was okay.
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: Two days later I get an email and it's a modified job offer, different title, and it asked me for a start date just after the first of the year.
• 32:45
  Speaker 1: Well, the first.
• 32:45
  Speaker 1: I'm like okay, I should be done with my career then.
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: So I call him up.
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: I'm like what's going on?
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: He's like we really want you, we're willing to wait, can you do it around the first of the year?
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: And I'm like well, I think I'll be done and can accept the position then done with my current employment.
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: So the first of the year came and I uh had to call him up and I'm like, look, this is on their timeline, not mine, and I'm still not done.
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: So I said but I have a proposal.
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: What if you don't pay me?
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: Proposal?
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: What if you don't pay me?
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: What if I just come and hang out and intern and see what happens, learn who the people are, learn what your product is?
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: I said, let's do that for a while.
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: You guys don't pay me, you get some level of free work from me, whatever it is, whatever the little bits I can do.
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: Now this is a language I don't even know.
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: I don't know commercial plumbing.
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: I can't even spell plumbing.
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: The first time I spelled it I forgot to put the B in there.
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: So but they're like you know what.
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: That's not a bad idea.
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: So I started in an internship.
• 33:46
  Speaker 1: That was in January.
• 33:46
  Speaker 1: I started going every day, 40 hours a week, and just learning and observing and absorbing this new world Multipliers.
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: I didn't know what a multiplier was, and maybe you don't either.
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: It's part of the math of figuring out a price of an item, whether it's list or net, and you know what is a roof drain, what's a floor drain, what's a cow tongue.
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: What's this?
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: What's that?
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: All this stuff I didn't know.
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: It's literally like speaking a new language.
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: It's like being dropped into the middle of China and you don't know anything about China, other than some Americanized Chinese food, panda Express.
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: You don't know anything about China, but you're dropped into the middle of the country and you're expected to talk the talk, walk the walk and navigate your way around the streets.
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: That was super hard.
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: Now I was coming from a place where I was an expert.
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: Remember, back a few months ago, I was doing cop stuff and I was on top of my game and I was an expert and everybody came to me.
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: Now I'm in a world where I don't know anything, literally nothing.
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: So I had to learn, and I had, and it was sucked.
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: It sucked learning.
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: It still sucks learning because I don't want to ask for help.
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: I'm 45 years old.
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: 44 years old, I'm starting a new career.
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: I'm pissed off that I don't have any kind of medical retirement from law enforcement, because there is no medical retirement for law enforcement or firefighters in the state of Oregon.
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: I'm upset about that.
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: I've worked a 20 something year career and I'm having to start over at ground zero with something that I don't know anything about with a group of people that I don't know.
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: I'm not an expert.
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: I don't even have a key for the front door.
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: That was a really, really hard place to be, yet humbling.
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: So I interned until April.
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: Then in April April 5th I went to the police department and I was done.
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: I turned in my letter of resignation, I cleaned up my desk, I said goodbye to all my peers.
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: If you were in that room that day that I said goodbye, I want you to know that was one of the hardest things that I've ever done.
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: I want you to know that was one of the hardest things that I've ever done and I love and thank you guys for listening to me and hearing what know that I would not allow anybody to touch my stuff or help me because I was too good for help.
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: But the day that I left, everybody had to pick up my slack and it was you people sitting in that room that made it absolutely possible for me to survive this.
• 36:31
  Speaker 1: I trusted you guys for me to survive this.
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: I trusted you guys.
• 36:33
  Speaker 1: Hearing the disclosures that I made and what came of that was super hard and I thank you guys for that, and I know some of you are listening to this right now, so thank you, but I left.
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: I left the office that day and I haven't been back and I went to my new job the one I was interning for and started the following day on their payroll.
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: So now I'm a factory rep.
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: I've been there, you know, just over a year, 14 months, I don't know 15 months, 18 months.
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: I'm not good at math.
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: I went to a small school in Alaska.
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: We can drink, we could have.
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: Since then.
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: I am now in a position where, uh, I'm starting to make a difference.
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: I'm starting to understand what's going on around me.
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: I understand the pieces of the puzzle.
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: When I got started there, there were some things that caused some issues for me, and it still cause issues.
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: I have memory problems, something that occurred during this whole transition or the PTSD.
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: I have memory problems.
• 38:02
  Speaker 1: I can't remember my best friend's names.
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: I would have to look at the phone chart on my desk to figure out who the person in the cubicle sitting next to me was that I've worked with for 15 or 10 years.
• 38:15
  Speaker 1: Whatever it is I.
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: I have anxiety issues.
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: I have struggles with, uh, some of the personnel there because of my stress, because I'm high strung, some of the personnel there because of my stress.
• 38:36
  Speaker 1: Because I'm high strung, I was having a tough time.
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: I didn't want to sound like an idiot.
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: You know, I'm with these people who have been doing this forever and they get what they're talking about.
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: And I'm smart enough to realize unlike my sergeant a while back, I'm smart enough to realize that when I'm in a situation I don't know anything about, I just sit down, shut up and I'm a sponge.
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: I don't try to pretend that I know what I'm doing, but there were times in this new role where I had to engage and I would forget people's names, I would forget things, I would forget numbers, and my stress level was high and I felt stupid.
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: And I had never felt stupid, you know, not never or rarely because I was in a world that I knew really well and now, this world, I'm a fish out of water.
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: Luckily, that guy that I went to lunch with not the one from church but the other one, mr Been in the business, 100 years that man is a saint.
• 39:31
  Speaker 1: He has been around forever, he knows everybody.
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: He's a great teacher, a great mentor.
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: He showed me the ropes from day one and allowed me to come alongside of him, took me under his wing and has got me moving up in the right direction, which is really, really good, and there's definitely opportunities for the future with this company.
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: My roles and responsibilities are the factory rep role, which I explained earlier.
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: I cover the state of Alaska, which is my home state, and, as a result, when I go up there, I run into everybody that I know, and Alaska is like one giant small city.
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: If you go anywhere, you're going to run into people you know or went to school with or whatever.
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: So I'm the perfect person for that position.
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: I cover the state of Oregon, I cover Southwest Washington.
• 40:18
  Speaker 1: I'm making friends, making contacts, and the nice thing about these people that I'm meeting is they want to be alive, they want to be in their world, they want to be doing what they're doing.
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: They like it.
• 40:27
  Speaker 1: Some of them are grumpy jerks, but most of them like it, and it's such a different experience for me from what I had before.
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: You know, I think that God has me where he wants me in this position.
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: I'm getting to teach, I'm getting to train, I'm getting to educate, I'm getting to barbecue.
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: I'm getting to take people fishing.
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: I'm getting to take people on vacations.
• 40:56
  Speaker 1: I'm getting to take them to see baseball games in Mesa, arizona.
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: I get to travel with my wife.
• 41:02
  Speaker 1: She gets to go with me on some of these things Some of it, you know.
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: The company is very, very gracious and helpful to me and my family.
• 41:11
  Speaker 1: I'm learning new things every single day.
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: I'm building new relationships I have new opportunities are coming.
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: I got a phone call.
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: Remember that Sloan I was talking about?
• 41:21
  Speaker 1: Well, the number one in the company it's a family company.
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: Number one in the company heard my name at a sales meeting, reached out to me directly, bypassed everybody in my management team and came to me indirectly and gave me a personal invite to bring my wife out to Arizona to meet him and go to a baseball game with him at Sloan Park, which is in Mesa, arizona.
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: When I told my supervisor that one of the principals of the company says he's never even met him yet, that guy's calling me and I think that God has me right where he wants me right now.
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: I was at the top of my game.
• 42:00
  Speaker 1: I just solved the cold case murder.
• 42:03
  Speaker 1: I've solved lots of other murders.
• 42:05
  Speaker 1: I've got a Dateline episode.
• 42:07
  Speaker 1: I've got a Snapped episode.
• 42:08
  Speaker 1: Bbc flew over from Europe to film a miniseries on one of my murders.
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: I've been on TV a lot.
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: If there was something cool and sexy going on, I was waist deep in the middle of it.
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: If they had high profile interviews that needed to be done, I was doing them.
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: I would come in and interview for other detectives that you know.
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: I don't even know their case, but they would call me and interview them for them because that's somewhere where I was a strong skill set of mine.
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: But all of that built pride and it wasn't until I was out of there that I realized just how prideful I was, and pride kills that.
• 42:50
  Speaker 1: I realized just how prideful I was, and pride kills Pride.
• 42:55
  Speaker 1: When you think you are too good, you are the best, the world won't revolve without you, it's a dangerous, dangerous place to be and that's where I was.
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: The first thing I would do is tell people I don't know on Dateline or brag or whatever.
• 43:11
  Speaker 1: That is not a good quality and it's not until I've been removed and can look back in hindsight and realize just what a douchebag I was at times.
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: I'm blessed to be here.
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: If you found yourself, I hope that you are still in this with me at 43 minutes and 17 seconds later, if you find yourself any of the parallels, remember.
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: I want this to be educational, informative and valuable for you.
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: If you are, if you can relate to the parallels, you feel like you're on top of your game.
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: You can't do anything else.
• 43:49
  Speaker 1: This is all you know.
• 43:51
  Speaker 1: There's no life on the other side.
• 43:52
  Speaker 1: I'm stuck.
• 43:53
  Speaker 1: This is all you know.
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: There's no life on the other side.
• 43:55
  Speaker 1: I'm stuck, I'm buried, I'll die here.
• 43:56
  Speaker 1: All of that is a narrative of lies that you're telling yourself.
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: We often will take a certain situation or a set of circumstances.
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: We will form a narrative that makes sense to us, that justifies our actions, abilities and involvement, and tell ourselves that lie.
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: That is Satan lying.
• 44:17
  Speaker 1: You are not stuck where you are.
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: You can get out.
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: You have there's life on the other side.
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: There's hope on the other side.
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: I am a living example of a guy who was the top of his freaking game.
• 44:29
  Speaker 1: That sounded prideful.
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: I'm not.
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: That's where I was.
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: It's the truth.
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: And I went back to ground zero knowing nothing.
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: And now I'm starting to build myself and others around me are starting to pick me up and help support me into this new role, and this new role is right where I'm supposed to be.
• 44:48
  Speaker 1: I'll leave you with this kind of a funny idea.
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: So back around Christmas, prior to me getting hired, so I had met him, I had went on that little training exercise and they'd offer me some jobs but I couldn't take them.
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: And it's Christmas time, I get invited to the company Christmas party and I'm sitting there at the company Christmas party.
• 45:12
  Speaker 1: A lot of people I don't know.
• 45:14
  Speaker 1: I've never met most of these people.
• 45:16
  Speaker 1: I've interviewed with the principals on well, two of the three principals on Zoom, but I'm definitely again a fish out of water amongst a bunch of strangers and their wives.
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: And one of the things that we did is or they did and I was witness to was they had a slideshow and this slideshow they're like all right, guys, everybody, and everybody's happy and excited and having a drink, and they're like let's get around and and and take a look at our pictures from the year and let's have our picture contest.
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: And they start putting pictures up of bathrooms, of toilets, of plumbing errors and flushometers that have been plumbed wrong and just travesties of shit and clogged toilets and everything else, and they're all happy and excited and giddy about clogged toilets.
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: And I looked at my wife and I'm like, what the hell am I doing?
• 46:10
  Speaker 1: Like my world is dead, people and murders and things that matter life and death.
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: And these guys were getting excited about a clogged toilet.
• 46:19
  Speaker 1: I'm like, oh my God, oh my God, I'm in.
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: Uh, am I good?
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: Am I doing the right thing?
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: And um, we left.
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: We had a good night and we left.
• 46:28
  Speaker 1: And now, 18 months later, when I go into the bathroom and I'm like, oh, this is a pretty cool toilet, and I take out my phone, you know, in the man's restroom, first of all I get weird looks and people think I'm crazy.
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: But I start taking pictures of all these toilets or these plumbing catastrophes or cool things, and I'm like, oh my God, I'm one of them, I am totally one of them.
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: So now how the tides have changed, they can change for you too.
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: Thank you, guys, so much for listening.
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: I really hope you got something out of this or at least enjoyed hearing my story how I went from cop to corporate and now I'm in a new role, a new life, and enjoying every minute of it.
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: I have my family back and I have my life back.
• 47:15
  Speaker 1: Thank you, guys, so much for sticking around.
• 47:19
  Speaker 1: Catch us next week on the Murders to Music podcast released every Saturday morning at 7 am.
• 47:25
  Speaker 1: Be sure to like, subscribe, follow, send me messages.
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: There's a chat feature on a lot of your platforms.
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: Feel free to send me a message.
• 47:33
  Speaker 1: Let me know you're listening.
• 47:34
  Speaker 1: If you know me, reach out.
• 47:36
  Speaker 1: If there's something you want to hear about, if you're involved in one of my stories or my life and you've been there and you witnessed it with me, reach out.
• 47:43
  Speaker 1: Let's have you on the show.
• 47:44
  Speaker 1: Let's talk about it.
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: Give me some ideas.
• 47:46
  Speaker 1: Love you guys so much.
• 47:48
  Speaker 1: Murderous Music Podcast released every Saturday morning at 7 am.
• 47:52
  Speaker 1: Like, subscribe, follow, share with a friend.
• 47:54
  Speaker 1: There's your call to action.
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much.
• 47:57
  Speaker 1: Peace out, guys and girls.