Latest / Queer Voices / August 12th - The Dianas talk History and bring in the COWGAYS!

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August 12th - The Dianas talk History and bring in the COWGAYS! · Queer Voices

• 0:03
  Brett: You are listening to Queer Voices, a radio show on KPFT Houston and a podcast that has been around for over five decades.
• 0:12
  Brett: I am Brett Cullum.
• 0:13
  Brett: On this one, Lee Ingalls talks with Tanner Williams, who is the current president of the Diana Foundation.
• 0:20
  Brett: The Diannas are the nation's oldest queer social group in the United States, and they have raised millions for their causes over the years.
• 0:28
  Brett: And this year, the Dianas will have a special guest at Angela's country dinner in November, the Cal Gay.
• 0:35
  Brett: Hey, we know that group.
• 0:38
  Brett: So after together, we have our interview with the queer super group from Nashville, the Cal Gay.
• 0:44
  Brett: Please remember that KPFT is a listener of the radio station.
• 0:48
  Brett: You will notice in the next hour that there are no commercials.
• 0:51
  Brett: We rely on the kindness of strangers to contribute.
• 0:54
  Brett: And you can donate at KPFT.org.
• 0:58
  Brett: All donations go straight to KPFT's operations at Queer Voices as an all-volunteer staff.
• 1:05
  Brett: I produce the show.
• 1:06
  Brett: Lee Ingalls is a frequent contributor, and Brian Lavinka and Deborah Monkey Fell are executive producers.
• 1:13
  Brett: Queer Voices starts now.
• 1:18
  Lee: Welcome everyone.
• 1:19
  Lee: My name is R.
• 1:20
  Lee: Lee Ingalls, and today we're going to talk about the Diana Foundation.
• 1:23
  Lee: The foundation was founded in Houston in 1953 and is widely recognized as one of the oldest continuously active LGBTQ plus social and philanthropic organizations.
• 1:36
  Lee: And that's in the United States, which in itself says a lot.
• 1:40
  Lee: It begins a private gathering of friends but developed into a formal nonprofit organization that at this point has raised more than$2.1 million for charitable and community causes over its existence.
• 1:52
  Lee: The foundation currently is in its 74th year, known as Diana 74.
• 1:57
  Lee: And today we welcome Tanner Williams, the president of the Diana Foundation, to Queer Voices.
• 2:02
  Lee: Welcome.
• 2:03
  Lee: Thank you for joining us.
• 2:04
  Lee: Thanks for having me.
• 2:05
  Lee: Yeah, yeah.
• 2:06
  Lee: Quite an organization to be recognized as the longest LGBTQ organization in the United States.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, it is incredible that it's here in the city of Houston.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_05: You would think it would be like New York or San Francisco, but I think this is something that is everyone in Houston should be really proud of.
• 2:24
  Lee: Yeah, I know I absolutely agree.
• 2:26
  Lee: Absolutely agree.
• 2:27
  Lee: And you know, history is my thing.
• 2:28
  Lee: So capturing our history is important to me, and I know it's important to others as well.
• 2:33
  Lee: So tell me a little bit about the beginning, how the uh the organization actually began.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_05: Well, this is probably a lesson for everyone who's listening about be careful when you host a house party because you never know what it's going to turn into.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_05: Uh so if you go all the way back to March of 1953, it was when the 25th Academy Awards was first broadcast on television.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_05: A group of local florists, a couple other shop clerks, some models from the Sakowitz department store, they got together to watch this uh televised event.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_05: The whole country was uh a buzz that finally folks were going to be able to, you know, see some of these uh Hollywood gyms received their statues.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_05: During the broadcast, unfortunately the the new television set that David Moncrief, who was hosting the party at the time, lost reception.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_05: And so the group continued along with the party, you know, kind of having uh their own kind of humorous jokes uh throughout the evening.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_05: But then uh they decided to get the party back together again the following year in 1954.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_05: And before the broadcast began, uh they started out with a cheeky, roasty award uh for one of the guests for their mischievous behavior uh during that year, and that was really the kickoff to the first Diana award that was ever given.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_05: Ever s since that party in 1954, the group continued to grow.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_05: And in the pretty much like the late 50s, early sixties, imagine that you go over to someone's house to watch the Academy Awards, and there's probably like you know seven to ten televisions out in the backyard, just extension cords running everywhere.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_05: And but before the the festivities begin, uh there's some tongue-in-cheek Rossi awards given to friends, the Diana Awards, and then folks, you know, were able to partake in watching the Academy Awards.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_05: Uh and eventually as the the more of the socialness aspect of the organization began to come together, this was probably in the late 70s.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_05: The organization pulled away from actually having its Diana Awards on the same night as the Academy Awards.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_05: At that time, the Academy Awards were being broadcast on a Thursday night.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_05: Uh so the Dianas moved their Diana Awards bigger festivity, the the roast component of this to a Saturday evening.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_05: Still black tie, elegant.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, but this is where really the talent and creativity of all of its members really got the shine.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_05: Folks started coming up with their own big uh stage productions.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_05: At one time they had a whole orchestra that would rehearse all year, uh, record all the singers.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_05: So when the singers were singing on stage, they were singing over their own voices who were you have over 200 volunteers making costumes, etc.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_05: And then as you got through the 80s, the 90s, these were large uh stage productions, uh which were really fantastic.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_05: And during this time, the organization began to make money, uh, received its nonprofit status, and was able to use the fun uh and energy of the Diana Awards to really become philanthropic and respond to needs in the community.
• 5:46
  Lee: Yeah, yeah, and I did see that in the history as well.
• 5:48
  Lee: In fact, I'm showing that in 1976 is when the Diana Foundation was formally established, uh, and you were awarded your nonprofit tax exempt status at that point.
• 5:59
  Lee: And I do see some of the people that were key to the organization back in the early days, Tom Osborne, Ava.
• 6:06
  Lee: Yes, and and one of the my source documents was uh a book was produced of the Diana's.
• 6:11
  Lee: Uh it's a it's a fairly substantial book, uh, and it was part of Bob Britt's collection.
• 6:15
  Lee: So when he passed away, you know, he had quite a large extension of books itself.
• 6:19
  Lee: Some of those books, like this one, I thought was too important to just let go somewhere.
• 6:24
  Lee: Uh it should be held.
• 6:25
  Lee: So Brett and I took it.
• 6:27
  Lee: Um so I went through it as well and saw some of the photos of those early years.
• 6:30
  Lee: It was just remarkable.
• 6:31
  Lee: It's a remarkable performance that they gave.
• 6:34
  Lee: And and the one of the notes that I made was that the uh awards were more like a roast rather than just an award presentation.
• 6:41
  Lee: I know Bob was on that team of writing them for a while.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, there was always this illustrious uh writing committee uh that formed after 1954.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_05: So there was like this one community that was coming up with the again, keeping an eye on all the uh behaviors going around with within the friend group or within the community, because really the Diana Awards uh as it really hit kind of like a a peak in the 80s, uh especially around gay pulp culture.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_05: It was, you know, everyone was in the community was uh I guess uh open to winning one of the awards.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_05: You mentioned Tom Osborne.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_05: Tom Osborne, if you look at our go to our history tab at our uh the Diana Foundation.gay, you can see the flip book that you're referring to.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_05: Tom Osborne, he was uh traveling the countries, uh I guess a figure skater who performed in all these groups, but he was actually the first official drag queen to perform at the Diana Awards.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_05: And of course you were talking about the book itself, the the 65 Years of History book, but really as the Dianas were f completing their 60th anniversary, uh they there was uh OutSmart magazine did a a two magazine spread of the history of the Dianas.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_05: And it was really through that research uh that folks really discovered that the Diana Foundation is the oldest continuously active gay organization in the United States.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_05: And that's through Brandon Wolf, who was the author of that writer for OutSmart and really the key author of the the history book, uh was able to really substantiate that in his historical biography.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, interesting.
• 8:19
  Lee: And one question that I had was is there a difference between joining the organization back in those days and and how the process of joining today?
• 8:28
  Lee: Or has it always been the same?
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_05: Well, I mean, the organization has gone through some bylaw changes.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_05: Now, I would say in the early the early fact of being part of the organization is really like in the 1950s and the 60s, right?
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_05: There was no really avenue to be out and gay.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_05: And there weren't like the HRCs and the other groups were advocacy or many of the other uh social organizations and opportunities that we have in Houston today.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_05: So the Dianas were a key aspect to find community and find friendships.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_05: It was really when it became a lot more formalized, uh, you know, and structure.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_05: Obviously, house parties were growing to outpacing really the size of homes at that time.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_05: So they were having to go to different venues and more folks were wanting to be involved with the uh planning and the operations.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_05: So as groups do, as they continue to become a more sophisticated, so did the uh the rules of engagement or I guess the rules to to belong.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_05: At the time, and again, I referenced the peak in the the 80s, there was a time where the Dianas were have always been capped at about 100 full members, but there used to be a waiting list of like 200 plus of people wanting to join the organization.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_05: Still today, even though we we've gone through some bylaw changes, even as recent about two years ago, uh, we still have a constitutional cap of 100 full voting members.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_05: However, we have expanded to uh honor some of our more distinguished members uh based on their their service to the organization and their seniority in terms of recognizing more of an emeritus status, and also understanding that making sure that the like dues dollars are not prohibitive for someone to engage in the organization that we have created an associate membership, uh, which is a non-voting position.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_05: However, it it does allow someone to have more of a discounted rate to come in and get to know Diana members, find community, and see if this is uh an organization they really want to be a part of.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_05: So we have expanded these opportunities for people to get engaged.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_05: I would say from experience, and you know, I've been a member going on almost 15 years.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_05: It's been more of the same process where if someone wishes to join, uh they find a member, a voting member sponsor, it goes before the membership, an application.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_05: Usually folks are just looking for a funny biography, like who is this person?
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_05: Do they have a sense of humor?
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_05: Uh what do they want to bring to the table and get involved?
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_05: So that's usually what it takes to for people to come into the family and begin to have a great time.
• 11:08
  Lee: Yeah, yeah, no, good.
• 11:09
  Lee: And thank you for that.
• 11:09
  Lee: And just to clarify, one piece of that, the uh survivable aspect of any organization is to bring in younger uh people, and nothing against older people, I'm one of the older people, but to keep it alive, you do need to bring in younger people so to to backfill.
• 11:23
  Lee: And so the associate program then is more targeted toward them, so toward that group then?
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_05: Obviously, the associate, yeah.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, especially if we're we're thinking about our associate members, there's there's no age uh specifications on any of our whether it's an associate level or a full level.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_05: It's it's really making sure like sometimes when you're gonna join, let's just be frank, if you're gonna join any organization and you kind of maybe just some folks are okay with jumping in the deep end and having a great time.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_05: Other folks might want to just put their toe in the water and kind of ease themselves in to see what is this organization really about.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_05: And that's okay.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, you can pick your flavor, pick your speed.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_05: I am really proud of what the Diana Foundation has really, what the group has really done over the past two years.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_05: Our membership has more than doubled uh over the past two years in terms of really bringing in a, I would say, being more representative of the LGBTQ plus community.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_05: We have um, you know, transgendered members, we have more uh uh women members.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_05: There was a time where you know we were stereotyped a little bit as that we're uh you know a white gay men's organization.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_05: And I'm very proud to say that's absolutely not true.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_05: We are a a vibrant organization and our our age ranges of membership, it it's we've got young professionals too, again, some of our folks that have one of our members, Ms.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_05: Sharon Loris, she's celebrating 55 years as a member.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_05: Oh my goodness.
• 12:50
  Lee: Wow, that's incredible.
• 12:50
  Lee: Yeah, and I'm glad to hear that.
• 12:52
  Lee: Uh, because you're right.
• 12:52
  Lee: I think that was at one time the the brand of the organization.
• 12:56
  Lee: I'm glad to see that that has changed.
• 12:57
  Lee: There's two things that you mentioned that I really don't want to uh glaze over without hitting them a little bit harder.
• 13:02
  Lee: And one is in the early years, in the 1950s, the scenes or the places where we would gather weren't what they what we know today.
• 13:11
  Lee: They there weren't the gay bars that of my generation and the social uh media sites that we have today largely people met at someone's home, and that's where the gatherings took place and you you had to be invited.
• 13:23
  Lee: So I think that that was common for that time, and that definitely changed over time.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_05: I would I would even say during that time, it's this is also when the the Diana organization was really balanced between men and women in the 50s, early 60s.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_05: Because if there was just a large gathering of men at a home, still that nosy neighbor would sometimes pick up the phone and call the police and saying, Hey, there's a bunch of men at this house.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_05: I don't know what they're doing.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_05: So men and women were supporting each other to you know still have some cover, even though people were in the privacy of someone's home.
• 13:54
  Lee: Yeah, yeah.
• 13:55
  Lee: No, and I had the good fortune talking to people that were young during those time periods and the stories they shared were very, very interesting.
• 14:01
  Lee: The other one is that so, and I do want to talk about the 80s, but before we do that, I uh so I did talk to a few members that of our community that were older, and my sense of the community before uh the AIDS crisis was that you didn't really see a lot of organizations to support our community very well.
• 14:21
  Lee: But AIDS kind of made that, it changed all that.
• 14:23
  Lee: And a lot of the organizations uh either stepped up and helped, or there was a lot of them that were created during that time period that still exist today.
• 14:30
  Lee: And reading through your history, I see your involvement in that was equally as important.
• 14:36
  Lee: Do you want to speak to that a little bit?
• 14:38
  Lee: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_05: I think I think you make a good point.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, organizations usually start for a whole host of reasons.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, the Diana has started again as as a as a creative house party, and then luckily some people caught on that there's some sense of humor, and we can this is fun, let's keep repeating this.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_05: Unfortunately, like in the the the the 80s uh with the the AIDS uh epidemic, the the Diana's responded in a f a few different ways.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_05: First, uh having one of our our leaders actually trying to join on on more more of a public task force, and that was kind of a scary thing for that leader at the time for having their picture published in a newspaper and being more out, uh especially because their employer and other folks would see that.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_05: At the time of the early on with the with the AIDS crisis, I mean, usually it was the organization was just writing checks to pay people's health care so people can uh remain on their health care and have some services.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_05: Eventually, uh the Diana Foundation also helped organize the first AIDS walk in in Houston.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_05: Um, and we were actually the part of the seed money that actually started AIDS Foundation Houston, which is today Allies and Hope.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_05: So we were at the forefront, and this is at a time where really the the Diana Awards, I go back to this, like at the Tower Theater, was making a whole lot of money, and folks were like, Well, we've got to be able to do something with it.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_05: One of our first president, Charles Hebert, you know, he had a vision actually.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_05: Uh his vision in the late 70s, early 80s, he was thinking like, we need to have a community health organization that provides free health care for our community.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_05: That was his vision at the time.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_05: Unfortunately, he uh was murdered in 1987.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_05: But that dream, that vision, that that conversation that was happening in the community, others picked up on that, and others were having those same conversations.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_05: And I'm I'm glad to say that we do have services like Legacy and other organizations within the the Houston community, which the Dianas have been uh key supporters, you know, throughout their histories as well.
• 16:38
  Lee: Yeah, yeah.
• 16:39
  Lee: No, and I see that and very impressive.
• 16:41
  Lee: Again, it was a difficult time in our community history, and organizations such as the Diana has definitely stepped up.
• 16:46
  Lee: And so I want to make sure that we talked about that as well.
• 16:49
  Lee: And then moving on into the 90s, then uh you were given some really impressive recognition.
• 16:53
  Lee: The first lady, Barbara Bush.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_05: Barbara Bush in 1990.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_05: She actually did write a letter to the organization thanking us for our work uh um around HIV AIDS and being an established organization in the community.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_05: Um, I would say that even as the organization even looked out, we began really honoring more people at that time in the general Houston community, one of those with like a Diana Award for Community Achievement.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_05: And one of those we we reached out to, like Carolyn Farbe, who is you know a big philanthropist in the city of Houston, but really recognizing her for her work uh to really raise money for HIV AIDS as well.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_05: Because you know, she really tried to bring home to the River Oaks crowd that it's okay to write checks and and support HIV AIDS services.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_05: So we were really trying to build those relationships with others in our broader community.
• 17:48
  Lee: Yeah, yeah, and that's very impressive.
• 17:49
  Lee: And I'm also showing that in early uh 1990, so I guess 1992 was the year, uh the first year for the Miss Angela's country dinner.
• 17:58
  Lee: Well, actually, yes.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_05: In a in a way, our our first president, Charles Hebert, he was kind of like the, I would say, the the center of all gay things social in Houston.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_05: I would say he was pretty much like everyone ran through their mailbox.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_05: They ran their mailboxes anyways, too, because back then you got a mailed invitation and you wanted to be on people's mailing list.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_05: It wasn't like you got a text or a Facebook invite or anything, it was old school uh, you know, stamp and paper.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_05: And Charles's list, you know, for his parties, you know, people really wanted to make sure that they were on his list.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_05: And in 1969, he started an event called the Dog Days of Summer.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_05: And this is where individuals came up with their own funny country dishes and some other things.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_05: Uh this party continued on.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_05: Then after his passing in 87, the the organization, the Dianas, picked up his event and you know, carried it forward as one of our major fall fundraising events.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_05: And it's called Miss Angela's Country Dinner because when Charles would present at the Diana Awards, his stage persona was Miss Angela Linsbury after Angela Lansbury.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_05: That's how we wrote it in as Miss Angela's uh country dinner.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_05: So uh we brought back the name Miss Angela last year uh because our it was just really the Diana Country Dinner Weekend or Country Dinner.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_05: But then you know the committee thought we need to you know highlight our past, but also Miss Angela is kind of uh more of a uh a cooler name for the event.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 19:30
  Lee: Yeah, yeah, kind of uh honoring the the history.
• 19:32
  Lee: I I totally get it.
• 19:33
  Lee: And yeah, and so this year um the dinner's gonna be held November 8th.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_05: Is that correct?
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, it'll be Sunday, November 8th.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_05: We're gonna be back at Lott Hall in Herman Park.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_05: And many people ask, where's Lot Hall in Herman Park?
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_05: Well, it's right across from the zoo.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_05: It was it's the 1930s, the old historic golf club right there in Herman Park.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_05: And we're gonna have well be barbecue, it'll be open bar, uh, there'll be dancing.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_05: It's a great time.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_05: It's from noon to four.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_05: Tickets are on sale now on our website, and it's incredible because one thing about the Diana is whether it's from some of our award shows or other things, we like to be like to be bringing in some really new, amazing talent and showcasing some LGBTQ plus artists in the country.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_05: And this year uh we're bringing in these uh queer trio from Nashville, this talented group, they're all talented in their own rights, but uh we're bringing the cow gays.
• 20:25
  Lee: Yeah, and we love the cow gays.
• 20:27
  Lee: We uh did a segment on them, as you know.
• 20:29
  Lee: Yeah, so thrilled to see that and can't wait to see them in person.
• 20:32
  Lee: Brett and I will be there.
• 20:34
  Lee: So tell us what we should wear.
• 20:36
  Lee: We don't mind standing out, we just don't stand out for the wrong reasons.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_05: Well, the great thing is if you if you people purchase the VIP ticket, you get to do your meet and greet and get your photo with the cow gays.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_05: But I say, you know, it is Sunday fun day, it is Sunday brunch uh attire.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_05: Uh bring on your cowboy boots, bring on your sequins, bring on your fringe, come out and have a good time.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_05: I'm sure the weather will be cool a little cooler than it is today.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_05: So you can uh you know break out maybe a little sweater weather if we're a little lucky, but come enjoy, you know, embrace your countriness and and come out.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_05: All right.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_05: Okay, so I need to go shopping.
• 21:11
  Lee: So wanted to mention that.
• 21:12
  Lee: We'll talk about a little bit more about that at the end, but I also want to talk about a difficult period in the foundation's history.
• 21:18
  Lee: I know in the late 90s it was a difficult period.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_05: So actually, I mean, look, I mean, organizations, especially if you've been an organization that's been around like a few decades, uh, every nonprofit organizations, they go through ups and downs because it's all about your members, it's all about your leaders and what's going on.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_05: It was just a a perfect storm of things that were happening uh with the Diana's, especially in the in the early 90s.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_05: One, we lost we honestly lost so many beautiful, amazing people uh to HIV AIDS.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_05: Our volunteer base, many of our member base.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_05: At the the other time is is that so many other organizations were just blowing up and coming up on the scene at the time.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_05: Time.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_05: And folks were having to make a decision of, you know, do I continue to do money and time and energy and, you know, kind of a fun social organization that does some philanthropy?
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_05: Or do I want to jump on this new thing that's over here that's fighting for legislative change and rights and other things?
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_05: And folks, luckily we had the opportunity that there are more organizations and more things to choose from and more advocacy.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_05: And folks began to kind of, you know, take on other parts in our community.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_05: And that's okay.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_05: It's just at the time the Dianas were just going through, you know, a struggle.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_05: Fortunately, there were some you know well-dedicated members like Michael Kemper, for example, at the time, Bill Populin, Earl Krieger, um, all past presidents of the organization, that really you know took a step back and tried to reimagine what the Diana Awards, uh, what that program looked like while trying to maintain some of the historical traditions, but trying to give it a new feel because we weren't gonna fill uh sell out the Tower Theater and we weren't gonna sell out the Wortham Theater that we did a few years, you know, in the late 1989, 1990.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_05: We weren't gonna sell a thousand seeds.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_05: So, how do you scale back and still put on some fun productions that honor the past, but really start pointing the organization to a different future?
• 23:20
  Lee: Yeah, yeah.
• 23:21
  Lee: And so I did look at the changes that you made and it it made sense uh for the time uh and allowed the organization to continue on.
• 23:27
  Lee: So one of the things that I noted was uh something that you called the continuing identity, three uh definitions fellowship, humor, and philanthropy.
• 23:38
  Lee: Uh so had those always been the three?
• 23:40
  Lee: Have those always been through it might have been there, but maybe not articulated.
• 23:44
  Lee: Was it in the uh early 2000s that you actually articulated it that way or or explained that to me?
• 23:49
  Lee: Because I thought they were they were profound.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_05: I don't think they were actually articulated in the first uh 60 years of the the organization of history, that was the heart and and spirit of the group.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_05: I know after as we went into the 61st year and especially into the 62nd year, uh we really started to put some more things down on paper and to lay out what are our true traditions of the organization.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_05: How do we talk more with our own members about our history?
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_05: When we got into year 62, we had a manuscript now of that history book.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_05: It wasn't published, but we had a manuscript.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_05: We finally had some real, you know, key history that was written down that we could point to and solidify around our story and and you know that we were you know standing on the shoulders of individuals.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_05: Some of the members didn't understand or didn't know because that research was new to folks.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_05: So taking some time to tell our story internally was important.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_05: How do we continue to tell our story externally and share the story of the Diana Foundation with the world?
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_05: That was the big premise of after I left the presidency my first time around.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_05: I really helped spearhead at getting the the the book published because I understand it's a it's a huge instrument to share out and allow a lot of pretty much all the artifacts and the other information to you know be digitized and allow people to use it for research purposes.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_05: And actually, when I was in Washington, DC, just a few weeks ago, stopping by the Library of Congress, there there's the the Diana Foundation, 65 Years of History right there that someone can take a look at.
• 25:27
  Lee: That's amazing.
• 25:28
  Lee: I can tell you it's a fascinating read.
• 25:30
  Lee: So if if you get a chance to read it, please do.
• 25:32
  Lee: Fascinating.
• 25:33
  Lee: And you're right, the the history that's there is just uh something that would normally have faded away and just not been told.
• 25:40
  Lee: So I'm so glad to see that it was captured and put in book form that we can all then enjoy.
• 25:45
  Lee: Uh so one of the other events then you celebrated the 70th year in uh 2023, your platinum jubilee.
• 25:53
  Lee: Yes.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_05: So we had the the 70th uh Jubilee.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_05: Uh Bianca Del Rio was the the big headliner for the 70th award show.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, she she she was great.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_05: Um we just celebrated our 73rd uh award show just a few months ago, back in March, and we brought in again some creative uh entertainer, Tony and Nikiki from Queens, New York.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_05: They came in and brought the house down.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_05: It was great.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_05: And actually we began the pivot uh where we actually introduced not just our classic Diana Roast Awards, but we actually launched our Diana Community Awards, which is now an evening balance of recognizing some true trailblazers and dedicated folks that are doing some important work in our community.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_05: Then at the same time having the ability to also continue to look at ourselves and laugh at ourselves a little bit and not take ourselves so seriously.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_05: So that is a new balance to the program.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_05: And now we're gearing up for the 74th anniversary, which will be on March 27th, be at the hall at Iron Works.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_05: So we're looking forward to putting together an incredible show where we'll again do that balance between the Diana Awards and our community awards.
• 27:01
  Lee: Looking forward to that as well.
• 27:02
  Lee: What are the changes you see going forward, or what are you implementing now for future growth?
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_05: When I came back to the board of directors two years ago, the conversation that we started having around the table is that we know that because you know, next year, as we out, because we conclude Diana 74, right?
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_05: We like nice big shiny numbers, right?
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_05: So Diana 75 is going to be a huge milestone anniversary year.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_05: We talked about this even at our Board of Governors and Committee retreat.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_05: But the the idea is not just to get to like Diana 75.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_05: Our conversation is how is the Diana Foundation around at Diana 100 and beyond?
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_05: And what does the Diana Foundation look like uh for future generations?
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_05: Because right now, yeah, as we point back to certain periods of our history, right?
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_05: Some people talk about, well, this this was the heyday or this was the heyday.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_05: And these were great, exciting times.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_05: And a lot of us look around the room, we're like, well, this is our heyday, damn it.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, we're here right now.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_05: We get to have fun too, but but we're also here because others came before us, right?
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_05: And so how are we really thinking about uh putting a stronger, I guess, foundation around the foundation itself?
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_05: And in doing so, again, looking at diversifying our membership and building some uh deeper relationships with some uh other members in our our community.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_05: Also looking to uh in terms of when we look at our philanthropic growth, the Diana Foundation is an all-money in, all money out model.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_05: That is, all the money we raise is all the money that we give out, and that has served okay as a model, but I think this is a we need to start learning from the seasons that we experience.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_05: But we're not in a vacuum.
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_05: So when things are good around the country, well, wink wink, when things are better around the country, uh, you know, the community feels less attacked and people feel less attacked, and there's a lot less pressure, right?
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_05: And then the pendulum swings where we have to respond.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_05: There's needs in our community that arise where we need to be able to have some cash to be able to respond to resources that are being cut or new issues that arise.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_05: This is why we're now launching a campaign to establish a new endowment fund so we can really begin to cement our legacy in giving.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_05: So, on top of like our all money in, all money out model, how are we also making investments that each year a large amount of dollars just from interest will be able to help go and again help supplement in our our amount of giving.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_05: So, can we double our dollars of giving as we move forward?
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_05: So, looking at some of these ways that that when we think of Diana 100, when people are around, I right now we're having some very creative conversations about kicking off an announcement and building one.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_05: I can't wait to the folks to be having conversations, you know, 26 years from now, all arguing around the table, how are we going to spend all this money?
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_05: I think that'll be an exciting thing for the group.
• 29:56
  Lee: Yes, yes, I hope that to be the case as well.
• 29:58
  Lee: So two things about you then personally.
• 30:01
  Lee: So you said that you came back to the board about two years ago.
• 30:04
  Lee: So what prompted you to to do that?
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_05: Well, I was the president uh the first time around, around 2014 to 2017.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_05: Membership got up to a full 100.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_05: We started our uh Diana Archive at the University of Houston.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_05: We were out doing a bunch of other fun, exciting things.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, but uh at the same time, my career, I was moved to Austin and I was no longer 100% in the within the Houston community.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_05: Right after COVID, I was able to return to Houston, move back, getting more back involved on a more permanent basis with the Dianas.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_05: Never quit.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_05: I'm still a member, but more on the sidelines.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_05: And there was just a need for someone to take the reins, and the membership trusted me and gave me a gave me a shot.
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_05: And since then we've we've been uh moving along pretty strong.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_05: I'm really excited that right now we have about 32 members that are part of six different planning committees.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_05: We just hosted our first Wednesday happy hour uh this week.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_05: Uh relaunched the program now in partnership with OutSmart Magazine.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_05: Uh we had folks from the Garden Theater doing some performances from their upcoming production of Xanadu.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_05: Now we're traveling the program throughout different bars throughout the city.
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_05: You know, shout out to the great folks over at Pearl Bar that hosted us.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_05: But it was great.
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_05: It was a packed room.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_05: So continue to bring some excitement.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_05: Being back on the board is fantastic.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_05: But at the same time, we're having more of a concentration of how are we building our bench and if we're really going to get to that Diana 100 and beyond, right?
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_05: It's also the organization we're taking a big look at our leadership development and how we get folks engaged in ensuring that this organization is well planned and we are well executed on those plans.
• 31:48
  Lee: I could say personally, I I haven't followed completely your uh time with Diana's, but I have been impressed by by what you've done.
• 31:55
  Lee: Um I'm glad to see you're back, and I know the uh organization itself uh is very glad that you stepped back into the leadership role.
• 32:02
  Lee: So you talked about 26 years from now, the people are just sitting in the room and doing their tasks, and looking back, what do you want them to say about your time as president of the organization?
• 32:13
  Lee: What would you like to them to to recognize you for?
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_05: Shoot, I'm just trying to add up how old I would be if I'm still around.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_05: I just hope that folks would look back at whether it's me or anyone else in a leadership role that we we we took some big we took some chances and we made some things happen, you know, for for good things.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_05: We took some good chances and we made some good strides.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_05: And we looked at opportunities to you know to make some transitions for the better.
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, if if if that's if that's anything, we kept it going.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_05: And I say this to anyone who's comes into the organization, it it's what we want to make of it.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_05: Uh it's what we put into the organization, is what we'll get out of it.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, you know, personally, uh, you know, if folks want to just go on the fun spectrum and just have a bunch of fun, do that.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_05: If folks want to join the group and do do more fundraising philanthropy, there's room for that.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_05: If you want to do both, there's room for that.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_05: It's what every Diana wants, what do they want their Diana experience to be?
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_05: And if anything, if I'm here to help cultivate that and somehow that helps build a culture, then maybe folks can look back and say, you know, thanks, thanks for making sure that there's space for all of us to be a part of it.
• 33:22
  Lee: Yeah, yeah.
• 33:23
  Lee: No, I totally agree.
• 33:24
  Lee: And I'm I'm so glad to hear you say that.
• 33:26
  Lee: Yeah, so going back to it then, the Miss Angela's country dinner, November 8th, 12 to 4.
• 33:32
  Lee: And where can people go to get tickets?
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_05: So you want to visit thedianafoundation.gay.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_05: That's the thediana foundation.gay.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_05: And there's lots of different ways you can go to the events calendar.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_05: You can click on one of the pretty images there and get tickets.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_05: I would suggest that people get tickets early.
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_05: This event sold out last year.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_05: I'm confident that it's gonna sell out quick this time around.
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_05: There's already been an uptick in VIP and premium tickets.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_05: And yes, Lee, thank you.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_05: We have your tickets.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, we saw those come in.
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_05: So uh that VIP ticket does get the meet and greet option.
• 34:12
  SPEAKER_05: But again, it's a it's we've got some incredible live auction items uh because proceeds are gonna help support Montrose Grace Place, uh, which they're doing a lot of incredible work around homeless gay youth, and they're getting ready to launch a new initiative.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_05: There, they have their press conference coming up around their their new uh home that they're gonna be opening, and also around uh out for education supporting uh the Diana Foundation Adoubt Scholarship in partnership with Out for Education.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_05: So we're excited to be supporting youth scholarships.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_05: So it'll be a fun day.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_05: Again, amazing barbecue, four hours of open bar, and and we're done by four o'clock, which that means it's you have plenty of time to get ready and then still go out for Sunday Fun Day.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, yes.
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_05: Do something else later in the afternoon.
• 34:58
  Lee: Yes.
• 34:59
  Lee: Well, I appreciate you joining us today.
• 35:01
  Lee: Always good to talk to you.
• 35:02
  Lee: Um, yes, definitely reach out.
• 35:04
  Lee: I hope to see all of you on November 8th.
• 35:06
  Lee: Thank you.
• 35:07
  Lee: No, thank you so much.
• 35:15
  Deborah: This radio program, Lear Voices, has existed since the 1970s on KPFT.
• 35:25
  Deborah: We have this little crew of folks working every week to produce what's no longer unique because we're almost mainstream now, but we're still an important voice that might not otherwise get heard because it's not on that many places.
• 35:43
  Deborah: So KPFT is very important to give voices to those who might not otherwise have voices.
• 35:52
  Deborah: So as Glenn always says, you participate by listening, but you should also participate by supporting the station.
• 36:01
  Deborah: So please go to kpft.org and make your donation right away.
• 36:10
  Lee: This is Lee Ingalls and Brent Cullum.
• 36:13
  Lee: And today we're talking about a group which has gone viral lately, which is the Cow Gays.
• 36:18
  Lee: They are a country trio made up of three queer solo artists who came together to reclaim country music for the LGBTQIA plus community with songs like Wish I Wasn't Gay and Good Ho Down.
• 36:31
  Brett: Brooke Eaton, Chris Halsman, and Adam Mack are knocking down barriers one barn door at a time.
• 36:36
  Brett: Now, I'm gonna I'm gonna come clean.
• 36:38
  Brett: Lee discovered these guys first on social media, and I quickly became a fan after he told me about it.
• 36:43
  Brett: And the cow gays are actually with us here today.
• 36:46
  Brett: So welcome Adam Brooke, Chris, to our little get together, our hoe down.
• 36:52
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks for our little hoe.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_02: It is yes.
• 36:59
  Lee: Well, now first thing is where did you get the name and what are the cow gays?
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_08: Yeah, well, it actually started out as our group text.
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_08: So our group text is the three of us, our two managers and my wife, and we're all gay.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_08: So uh we were like, oh, we'll be the cow, can't be the cow boys, can't be the cowgirls, but we all are cow gays.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_13: Yes.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_08: So that was the name of our group chat.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_08: And then once we realized that uh, whoa, we might need to start a band, we just took that name straight from the group chat and we said, We are the cow gays.
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_02: Made it out of the group chat.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 37:36
  Brett: Love it, love it.
• 37:38
  Brett: No, you all I from what I understand, each of you had solo careers before this.
• 37:43
  Brett: So, how did you decide that you wanted to come together like as a trio to do this?
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, well, honestly, it started after some margaritas in Mexico.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_04: We were down there a couple years ago celebrating Brooke's birthday as well as New Year's, ringing in the New Year's with a group of 12 of like close friends.
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_04: We were already kind of best friends.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_04: And after some margaritas and a day out on uh catamaran, we found ourselves singing an old country uh song, When Will I Beloved, in the hallway of the Airbnb.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, then we started harmonizing.
• 38:18
  SPEAKER_04: It sounded really good, and our friends kind of congregated, and then we were like jokingly like, wait, did we just start a family band?
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_02: Are we a family band?
• 38:27
  SPEAKER_02: Wait, why did that sound so good?
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_02: And then literally, that is kind of what sparked it all.
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_02: We got back home and then we were like, okay, but for real, maybe we should write some songs.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_02: And it was it was really when we started writing songs together that we realized this was a lot bigger than just singing in a stairwell in Mexico.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_08: And we actually realized, like, oh, this isn't a joke.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, this is for real.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_08: That is like this is gotta be for real because these songs are good.
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, seriously.
• 38:57
  SPEAKER_08: Yeah, but what is cool too is that we all still do have our solo projects.
• 39:02
  SPEAKER_08: Um Chris is dropping his album this year.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_08: Um and um Adam has an extended album that he's also putting out, and then I have music coming out as well.
• 39:14
  SPEAKER_08: So we're all doing all the things.
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, we're very tired.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_08: We work a lot, but it it makes it also fun to get to do it with your best friends.
• 39:24
  Brett: Wow, wow, that's right.
• 39:26
  Brett: Let me ask you guys where where are you based out of?
• 39:28
  Brett: Where's home?
• 39:29
  Brett: Nashville, Tennessee.
• 39:30
  Brett: Okay, so Nash Vegas.
• 39:32
  Brett: All right.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, we're originally from Adam's from Kentucky originally, Brooke's from Florida, and I'm from Kansas originally, but we've all been in town 12 plus years.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_04: Oh wow.
• 39:44
  Lee: Wow.
• 39:45
  Lee: Yeah, so um I what is your mission and what do you hope to get from Cal Gay's?
• 39:51
  SPEAKER_02: Mission.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I think really when we set out to do this, we really just wanted to write country songs that we had wished we had heard growing up.
• 40:05
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I think that a lot of queer people grew up, especially queer people in the South, grew up listening to country music, especially like 90s country music and the nostalgia that comes with 90s country.
• 40:19
  SPEAKER_02: And then somewhere along the way, the genre didn't feel safe for queer people anymore.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_02: And a lot of people migrated away from it.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_02: And what we found in our solo careers, and specifically with the Cowgays, is that there's such a large audience of people who love and adore country music, but never had their stories told in country music before.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_02: And that's kind of really what our mission is is to kind of rewrite our own stories into country music.
• 40:52
  SPEAKER_02: And good for you.
• 40:52
  Lee: And that's one of the things I liked when I first saw your uh your first video.
• 40:56
  Lee: I think I saw the um keep a hoe down first, but then um I saw um.
• 41:02
  Lee: Wish I wasn't gay.
• 41:04
  Lee: Yes, wish I wasn't gay second, and that one's on my gym playlist, and I always play that Mac um just to keep me motivated.
• 41:10
  Lee: Uh, but the imagery that's in there and the fact that we're you know we're reclaiming our space in areas that we have been led to believe we don't belong, I think is important.
• 41:20
  Lee: So thank you for doing that.
• 41:22
  Lee: Uh you hit two bullets with that one or two items with that one.
• 41:26
  Brett: Well, and you know what's funny is I was actually a country DJ in the nineties on a radio station.
• 41:32
  Brett: Oh yes, so I am very familiar with nineties uh country pop.
• 41:38
  Brett: And I remember like they would not it was nobody talked about being gay.
• 41:43
  Brett: I mean Ty Herndon kept it a secret.
• 41:45
  Brett: Totally.
• 41:46
  Brett: Uh Reba McIntyre did a song about AIDS and didn't even say the word AIDS.
• 41:50
  Brett: I mean and she changed it to a woman and a man, and I mean it was just it was very kind of taboo.
• 41:57
  Brett: So I mean I'm really glad to see you kind of taking back that 90s country pop.
• 42:03
  Brett: But is that I mean, what do you like about that specific part of the time?
• 42:06
  Brett: I mean, I know that that was huge for country, but are you leaning more?
• 42:11
  Brett: Do you just like a pop influence of it?
• 42:12
  Brett: Or I used to joke it was always the Eagles.
• 42:16
  SPEAKER_08: Yeah, I mean, for us, the storytelling, the harmonies, um, it's just, you know, it's the first music we really heard.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_08: You know what I mean?
• 42:25
  SPEAKER_08: We were little, little, little when, you know, Shania and Garth and the Chicks and Trisha Yearwood and you know, so many of our influences were blaring on our radios.
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_08: And so we all grew up.
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_08: I mean, I don't know about y'all, but for me, we only listen to country music in our in our house and the Spice Girls, but that's a whole different story.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_02: Um so yeah, you know, we And we love we're we're a sucker for a fiddle and um a fiddle and a steel guitar, honestly.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um so aesthetically, like sonically, we wanted it to sound like the music we grew up on.
• 43:05
  SPEAKER_02: And then aesthetically, we we just love to lean into how campy the 90s were, like all the bold patterns and denim and just how like kind of queer it already was.
• 43:19
  SPEAKER_02: Like if you look back at 90s cut like country fashion and even before then, like 60s and 70s, uh country and western fashion, it was all bold and over the top and rhinestoned down.
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_02: It was gay as hell.
• 43:34
  SPEAKER_02: So we're just kind of like reclaiming that and amping it up.
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_02: We are.
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_04: And also, yeah, 90s, especially for country music, was so campy.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_04: And so, you know.
• 43:47
  SPEAKER_04: Pearl had to die.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_02: Like really the stories, like we love a story song, a song that tells a story with a little like tongue in cheek, kind of silly playfulness.
• 43:57
  SPEAKER_02: That's kind of the sweet spot for the Cowgays.
• 44:01
  Brett: Well, how do you feel in the industry?
• 44:02
  Brett: Were you ever advised not?
• 44:04
  Brett: Did it come out?
• 44:05
  Brett: I mean I know in the 90s they were really told not to be.
• 44:09
  SPEAKER_08: Oh yeah.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_08: Um I was dying in 2014.
• 44:14
  SPEAKER_08: Um and I met my wife, my now wife, um, on my very first day of radio tour, she was actually my radio rep.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_08: So, you know, uh so scandalous.
• 44:26
  SPEAKER_08: Um and when the industry found out about us, they were like, if you want to keep your career in country music, you have to zip it about your relationship.
• 44:35
  SPEAKER_08: And so we did that for five years, and it was so hard because you know, I think that as a queer person, you grow up your whole life not understanding love because you're dating someone of the opposite sex and it's just not making sense.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_08: Um, and then you know, I meet this like wonderful person and just am so in love and I'm not allowed to speak about it, and I'm writing love songs about her, but I'm not allowed to say that they're about her.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_08: And then, you know, conjuring music is all about the songwriting, and they want to know who the song is about.
• 45:04
  SPEAKER_08: Right.
• 45:05
  SPEAKER_08: And I have to lie and act like I have some boyfriend or some like, you know, man on the side or something, and it just felt so incongruent with who I was as a human being.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_08: I felt like I, you know, when I was on the road, I had to be one person, and then when I got home, I got to decompress and actually be myself.
• 45:22
  SPEAKER_08: And um I ended up getting like really I had a lot of like mental health issues um because I was you know trying to be two people um at one time, and it was just it was it was not it, y'all.
• 45:35
  SPEAKER_08: It was not it.
• 45:37
  SPEAKER_02: So don't recommend it.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_08: Exactly.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_08: So uh we ended up coming out in 2021 and then right after that got engaged and now um and get married, and now my wife and I have uh a 19-month-old son, and you know, things really opened up, I think, after the pandemic.
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_08: I think that kind of all the BS that used to be the music industry were like, oh, like we're all still alive, maybe we should just like live our lives.
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think it was I think because we were already out, but I think just like when I hear your story um and the timing of it all and it could be in 2021.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_02: Um I think even for Chris and I post pandemic, it kind of gave all of us in separate ways.
• 46:23
  SPEAKER_02: This is kind of like um we were kind of like over trying to hide a door.
• 46:31
  SPEAKER_02: Like even Chris and I were writing songs that were gender-neutral pronouns and not trying to write like he, him, love songs and shit.
• 46:39
  SPEAKER_02: And like post-pandemic, we kind of also hit a wall of like what is all this for?
• 46:45
  SPEAKER_02: Like, yeah, literally, we just almost the whole world almost ended, and here we are pretending to be something that we're not we're not doing that anymore.
• 46:53
  SPEAKER_02: And I think all of us in separate ways experienced that, and it kind of probably led us to sitting right here together being a band called the freaking cow gays.
• 47:02
  SPEAKER_08: Yeah.
• 47:04
  SPEAKER_08: No more TV secrets.
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's been a whirlwind of uh of a few months.
• 47:12
  SPEAKER_02: Two songs.
• 47:12
  SPEAKER_02: Is there an album coming in?
• 47:14
  SPEAKER_02: One comes out tonight.
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_02: Another song comes out tonight at midnight.
• 47:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_02: It's okay.
• 47:23
  SPEAKER_02: It's like a um to me it's like our most personal song.
• 47:27
  SPEAKER_02: Like it's wrapped in an eight nineties, so it doesn't feel like a like oh this is a sad, hard string, cutting song.
• 47:37
  SPEAKER_02: But it really is like uh all of our stories and kind of like a uh you belong type of thing.
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_02: Perfect for prodigy.
• 47:46
  Brett: Yeah.
• 47:48
  Brett: Well, I sure hope that the country world is shifting.
• 47:51
  Brett: I mean, I I really we've been big fans of like horrible pack and seeing him kind of take the country stuff in.
• 47:58
  Brett: And Shania even gave him a little bit of a lift off or something, you know.
• 48:02
  Brett: Totally.
• 48:04
  SPEAKER_02: So hopefully we can get Shania to come out with the cow goes and we've actually been our manifestation has been the chicks because they just announced a tour, and so we're like, what better than a queer trio to join the ultimate trio of all time and go on tour together?
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_02: That's our that's our current manifestation, so help us out, put that out into the universe.
• 48:28
  Brett: Alright, we totally will.
• 48:30
  Brett: I'll circulate it to other people.
• 48:33
  Brett: I think I still have some connection with that.
• 48:37
  SPEAKER_08: Highway to heaven, baby.
• 48:40
  Brett: Exactly.
• 48:42
  Lee: Well, do you have anything else that you want to ask about the other songs you believe so far?
• 48:47
  Lee: Do you have a favorite?
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, well, I think we can all agree that our favorite is yet to come.
• 48:55
  SPEAKER_02: Not too far off, but the the the next single after the one tonight, I think is kind of unanimously our favorite.
• 49:05
  SPEAKER_02: Um but I will say good hoewn was the first song that we wrote where we realized this is the sound, this is the direction we want to go in, this is the the brand, the world of the cowgays.
• 49:19
  SPEAKER_02: Good hoe down.
• 49:20
  SPEAKER_02: Just when we wrote that, it kind of felt like we all looked at each other and like this is it, this is the thing that we've been searching for.
• 49:27
  SPEAKER_02: So that one holds a special place in my heart.
• 49:30
  SPEAKER_08: Totally, totally.
• 49:31
  SPEAKER_08: But what I love so much about our music thus far is that everything has really had a place.
• 49:36
  SPEAKER_08: You know, like everything has told a different part of our story, and you know, it we wouldn't be the cowgays without each of the songs.
• 49:44
  SPEAKER_02: Totally.
• 49:45
  SPEAKER_08: So I love all the different sides of our personality that you get to see with each of them.
• 49:50
  Lee: Yeah, yeah, and I will say from a personal perspective, I find it very uh comfortable and familiar, but at the same time, it has a layer of newness that uh we haven't seen before.
• 49:59
  Lee: So that's exciting.
• 50:01
  Lee: Thank you.
• 50:01
  SPEAKER_02: That's such a great compliment.
• 50:03
  SPEAKER_02: That's that's all we want.
• 50:06
  Brett: Yeah, I know it's amazing.
• 50:07
  Brett: I I really just keep drinking the plays in this trail for sure.
• 50:12
  Brett: Thank you so much.
• 50:13
  Brett: Thank you for the visiting with us.
• 50:16
  Brett: We will get the word out as much as we possibly can because of course, of course.
• 50:24
  Lee: Take care.
• 50:25
  SPEAKER_12: Bye showers in gay.
• 50:35
  SPEAKER_12: I don't wish in gay Clap your hands for Jesus, hallelujah, praise the Lord Haddon with Showers in gay No more Used to lay in bed and I'd cry myself to sleep.
• 51:10
  SPEAKER_11: That damned old devil had a hold on me.
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_11: Till the day I found this all the lie.
• 51:18
  SPEAKER_11: Wish I was too gay.
• 51:20
  SPEAKER_12: Wish I was too gay.
• 51:22
  SPEAKER_12: I don't wish I was too gay no more.
• 51:27
  SPEAKER_12: Don't get to Jesus I don't wish I was too gay no more.
• 51:35
  SPEAKER_10: Preacher used to tell me I was dead straight to hell.
• 51:39
  SPEAKER_10: Something that I tried but couldn't stand.
• 51:43
  SPEAKER_11: Head the walk too far till I found my spell.
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_12: Only the extent I'd say, Star Wars gay, I don't Star Wars no more cheese, I don't do that, we found to gain both with the women's tie.
• 52:29
  SPEAKER_12: Till I found the both tree friends is a friend.
• 53:29
  SPEAKER_12: Praise the Lord, I don't wish that was too gay no more.
• 54:03
  SPEAKER_10: Climbing up trees, skinning our knees, running through the neighborhood spring close.
• 54:09
  SPEAKER_07: So if everybody else started falling in love, I started feeling left out.
• 54:14
  SPEAKER_07: Worried my world would fall apart.
• 54:18
  SPEAKER_12: Everybody ever found out Till I found out it's like uh beat back up, don't let you gotta be but don't let it break up, we I never be wide.
• 54:59
  SPEAKER_11: Now it's a dog in a house celebrate.
• 55:05
  SPEAKER_12: Don't be ball back, don't we?
• 57:46
  SPEAKER_00: This has been Queer Voices, heard on KPFT Houston, and as a podcast, available from several podcasting sources.
• 57:56
  SPEAKER_00: Check our web page, queervoices.org, for more information.
• 58:02
  Ghost of Glenn: Some of the material in this program has been edited to improve clarity and runtime.
• 58:05
  Ghost of Glenn: This program does not endorse any political views or animal species.
• 58:08
  Ghost of Glenn: Views, opinions, and endorsements are those of the participants and the organizations they represent.
• 58:12
  Ghost of Glenn: In case of death, please discontinue use and discard remaining products.
• 58:15
  SPEAKER_00: For Queer Voices, I'm Glenn Holt.