Latest / 360 with Katie Woolf / Minister for Territory Families Kate Worden has defended the implementation of recommendations from the Royal Commission into Protection and Detention of Children in the NT

Transcript

Minister for Territory Families Kate Worden has defended the implementation of recommendations from the Royal Commission into Protection and Detention of Children in the NT · 360 with Katie Woolf

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Well, we know the treatment of youth in detention centers
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: was thrust back into the spotlight again last night in
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: a report by Four Corners. It was heavily focused on
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: Western Australia, where youth were allegedly locked up in solitary
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: confinement for extended periods and were often well subjected to
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: hogtime according to that report. We also know though, that
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: don Dale featured in the report labeled the country's most
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: notorious prison. The ABC claims that there were four hundred
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: complaints about the facility relating to solitary confinement, racism and
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: excessive use of force. Now, we did put in a
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: request to speak to the Children's Commissioner as well as
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: the National Children's Commissioner.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: No luck, unfortunately.
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: We do, however, have the Minister for Territory Families, Kate Warden,
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: on the line. Good morning to your minister.
• 0:50
  Speaker 3: Good morning Katie, Kate.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: You appeared on that report on Four Corners last night.
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: As we all know, there were two hundred and twenty
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: seven recommendations from the Royal Commission.
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: From your perspective, what has changed, yes, Katie, so.
• 1:05
  Speaker 3: I was the only State or Territory minister who would
• 1:08
  Speaker 3: agree to sit down with four corners, as you saw
• 1:10
  Speaker 3: last night, and what you saw was a very small
• 1:13
  Speaker 3: snippet of an hour long interview, so you know, that's
• 1:16
  Speaker 3: of guess that's the way those things often play out.
• 1:20
  Speaker 3: But of the two hundred and eighteen recommendations that we
• 1:23
  Speaker 3: had from the Royal Commission, we've addressed one hundred and
• 1:25
  Speaker 3: seventy four of them and there are forty four that
• 1:28
  Speaker 3: we do always acknowledge that them remain outstanding. But the
• 1:31
  Speaker 3: majority of those all relate to the opening of the
• 1:34
  Speaker 3: new Youth Justice facility up here and the upgrades in
• 1:37
  Speaker 3: Alice Springs. We need to do those take those actions
• 1:43
  Speaker 3: as well, you know, but that will come with the
• 1:46
  Speaker 3: new center. We just can't do that those without them.
• 1:48
  Speaker 3: So there's lots of things have changed. The biggest change
• 1:51
  Speaker 3: was taking those young people out of adult corrections. You
• 1:55
  Speaker 3: saw the old footage last night where they were handled
• 1:58
  Speaker 3: by correction officers back in two thousand and sixteen, and
• 2:02
  Speaker 3: that no longer happens. We've got trained youth Justice officers
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  Speaker 3: working with them day in and day out. We've got
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  Speaker 3: Danilla Dilba working in there with the young people are
• 2:13
  Speaker 3: going to school every day. We've got training for them.
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  Speaker 3: You know, there's a whole range of different things that
• 2:18
  Speaker 3: are unfortunately being done in an environment that's not ideal.
• 2:22
  Speaker 3: But things have changed greatly.
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: Minister March was said through that interview about recommendations, you know,
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: being implemented, but it was revealed that some have been
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: considered and closed rather than actually implemented. One of which
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: was the use of body worn cameras. Why has that
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: recommendation been ruled out and not actually used?
• 2:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, Katie. We're very upfront about that, and all
• 2:47
  Speaker 3: of our reports have gone up online so it's easy
• 2:50
  Speaker 3: to see and track where we were with those recommendations.
• 2:53
  Speaker 3: I should say up online, so if anybody ever wants
• 2:56
  Speaker 3: to log on there, on there. But what there is
• 2:58
  Speaker 3: a decision. So we got the recommendations and they're exactly that.
• 3:01
  Speaker 3: The word tells you what they are. They were recommendations.
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  Speaker 3: Then government goes through a process of considering with any report,
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  Speaker 3: not just this raw commission, about what's possible and what's not.
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  Speaker 3: And with those that body worn cameras, there was it
• 3:16
  Speaker 3: wasn't supported in the way that it was put to
• 3:18
  Speaker 3: government because it was viewed as being quite counter to
• 3:23
  Speaker 3: building those relationships with staff and young people. Body worn
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  Speaker 3: cameras are quite a significant piece of equipment. As you'd understand,
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  Speaker 3: it would be sitting over you transform youth officers to
• 3:34
  Speaker 3: just look more probably more like police when they're sitting there.
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  Speaker 3: And I go into there, I've been and there a
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  Speaker 3: number of times, and you can see that relationship between
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  Speaker 3: Youth Justice officers and the young people is very different
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  Speaker 3: to that. You know, most of them have got trauma,
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  Speaker 3: a trauma filled background, and we want to address that.
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  Speaker 3: And it's not where there's so many cameras through that facility,
• 3:55
  Speaker 3: and you saw last night you saw footage that had
• 3:57
  Speaker 3: been taken in the facility with those cameras, So it's
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: not like that footage isn't able to be taken in
• 4:03
  Speaker 3: those spaces.
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  Speaker 1: Do you reckon, though, that it would actually be of
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  Speaker 1: benefit to the correct well to the sorry not corrections,
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  Speaker 1: to the Youth Justice or the youth officers, so that
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  Speaker 1: you know that they're not in a situation where they
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  Speaker 1: are accused of doing the wrong thing, and it would
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  Speaker 1: protect them and protect the kids to some degree.
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  Speaker 3: So I think you'll find, Katie, that the Youth of
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  Speaker 3: Justice officers and a number of them, and I do
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  Speaker 3: want to give them a shout out today because obviously
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  Speaker 3: the way in which it was pitched last night in
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  Speaker 3: four Corners, it's very very difficult, different to the job
• 4:36
  Speaker 3: that they do, a very difficult job every single day.
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  Speaker 3: So I want to just say to them today, we
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  Speaker 3: value the work that you do because they've been trained
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  Speaker 3: in a very different way they are dealing with trauma.
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  Speaker 3: They know that they're trained about handling very challenging young
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  Speaker 3: people in a very tricky circumstance and looking for early
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  Speaker 3: signs of incidents that might emerge and interventions. You know,
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  Speaker 3: if those things do happen, they train very very differently,
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  Speaker 3: and if you you know in there, they don't. That's
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  Speaker 3: not the way they deal with young people day in
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  Speaker 3: and day out. And I see that not just here
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  Speaker 3: up in Dondale, but I see that in Alice Springs
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  Speaker 3: as well in our system down there. So it's a
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  Speaker 3: long way from where it was six years ago. Katie
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  Speaker 3: and I think it's really important that every young person
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  Speaker 3: that's in there gets treated individually, and that's the way
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  Speaker 3: we take it. It's more of a case management approach
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  Speaker 3: than it is you know, young people in schools and
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  Speaker 3: those sorts of things, it would be inappropriate to have
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  Speaker 3: those offices with body worn cameras on.
• 5:32
  Speaker 2: Minister.
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  Speaker 1: There is vision though in that four Corners report last night,
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  Speaker 1: as you've touched on of a child coming out of
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  Speaker 1: their cell then being forced to the ground.
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  Speaker 2: And you know and held with force. Is that lock?
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  Speaker 2: At what point or when is that appropriate?
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  Speaker 1: My understanding is that it was due to a self
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: harm or threat of self harm.
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  Speaker 3: So I think that young person, those details come out, Katie,
• 6:00
  Speaker 3: that young person was around self harm. But in terms
• 6:04
  Speaker 3: of the behavior, you know, every use justice officer esteemed inappropriate,
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  Speaker 3: then it gets dealt with accordingly. And it is my
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  Speaker 3: understanding that there was an investigation into that matter and
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  Speaker 3: the outcome of that was provided to the Children's Commissioner,
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  Speaker 3: but we didn't receive any response back post that. So
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  Speaker 3: she was aware of the you know, the response that
• 6:25
  Speaker 3: we had provided in that specific case, and that was
• 6:28
  Speaker 3: managed as an operational man matter, and I am very
• 6:33
  Speaker 3: satisfied that it was done appropriately.
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: Now there were four hundred complaints is what the ABC
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: had revealed last night about the facility in the last year,
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: relating to solitary confinement, racism and excessive force. How have
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: those complaints been dealt with and how many of those
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: allegations have actually been upheld.
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  Speaker 3: So Katie, that's the matter for the Children's Commissioner. So
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  Speaker 3: those complaints were received by her. We've got to remember
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  Speaker 3: that this is a very very complicated and complex system,
• 7:02
  Speaker 3: and she would it's her role to investigate those complaints
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  Speaker 3: and follow them up. So that's a matter for you
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  Speaker 3: to ask her. But we respond and we have a
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  Speaker 3: working relationship with the Children's Commissioner as defined by the Act.
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  Speaker 3: If anything happens, we make sure that she's well and
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  Speaker 3: truly aware of those incidences, and she has the capability,
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  Speaker 3: and she demonstrates that she goes into the facility herself
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  Speaker 3: quite regularly. She's one of our most regular visitors in there,
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  Speaker 3: and that's what that relationship's about. So it's appropriate that
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  Speaker 3: people if they do have a complaint, but very very
• 7:34
  Speaker 3: challenging young people and very very challenging the work that
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  Speaker 3: we do with the families for those young people as well,
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  Speaker 3: and those complaints are part of the normal system and
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  Speaker 3: she would address though.
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  Speaker 1: I guess what I'm trying to get to is, if
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  Speaker 1: there is four hundred complaints made, presumably any of those
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: that are really serious or that need changes made immediately,
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  Speaker 1: you as the minister would be aware of, or the
• 8:01
  Speaker 1: government would be aware of. How many of those have
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  Speaker 1: you how many of those have gotten to the point
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  Speaker 1: reached the point where you as the minister have been
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  Speaker 1: made aware of them and there's needed to be immediate action.
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  Speaker 3: Over my time, Katie, I think I've probably had directly
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: to me perhaps one that's come to my attention.
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  Speaker 2: So of those four hundred complaints, only one, yes.
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  Speaker 3: So the Children's Commissioner would work very closely with all
• 8:27
  Speaker 3: of us. She has all of our numbers, and she
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  Speaker 3: knows that she can ring our offices. She works very
• 8:32
  Speaker 3: incredibly closely with the CEO Ken Davies on any of
• 8:36
  Speaker 3: these matters, and we invariably if something occurs in the center,
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  Speaker 3: we would flag that with her directly. She would be
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  Speaker 3: one of the very first phone calls that we get
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  Speaker 3: and so that we make if anything would happen. But
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  Speaker 3: in my time over the last couple of years, I
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  Speaker 3: would have from memory on the spot, I would say
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  Speaker 3: perhaps one that I've been aware of. All the rest
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  Speaker 3: would be done transaction between the Children's Commissioner's Office and
• 9:02
  Speaker 3: the CEO. Of course, Katie, some of those would not
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  Speaker 3: be upheld. You know, we live in a very complex
• 9:08
  Speaker 3: and work in a very complex environment where there may
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  Speaker 3: be complaints that are not upheld. But that is a
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  Speaker 3: question for the Children's Commissioner because she has access to
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  Speaker 3: those details.
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  Speaker 2: Minister.
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  Speaker 1: Right now, we have got a situation where families and
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: activists are calling for don Dale to close and feel
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: that the government is failing these youth. You then have
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: a community that is absolutely broken and fed up with
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: youth crime. I know the National Children's Commissioner was on
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  Speaker 1: the ABC earlier this morning saying that kids are stealing
• 9:41
  Speaker 1: to get food. Meanwhile, last week there were eleven year
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: old kids allegedly stealing cars, ramming marked police cars and
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: putting the community in danger. How do you meet the
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  Speaker 1: expectations of the community here and how do.
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  Speaker 2: You do that?
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  Speaker 3: Very good question, Katie, And it is a balancing act
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  Speaker 3: because I believe very strongly that we need to make
• 10:05
  Speaker 3: sure that whilst young people are looked after and given
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: every opportunity to have you know, a good, a better
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  Speaker 3: path in life, it's also very very important that we
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: have community safety, you know, at the front of our
• 10:19
  Speaker 3: minds and as a Minister. I've taken that approach ever
• 10:22
  Speaker 3: since for the over the last couple of years. So
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: it's you know, it is a very tricky balancing act
• 10:27
  Speaker 3: you as you've just outlined, keeping young people safe at
• 10:31
  Speaker 3: the same time and as you say, in some instances, Katie,
• 10:34
  Speaker 3: we do know that young people have stolen, have broken
• 10:37
  Speaker 3: into places for food. But in other instances they're doing
• 10:41
  Speaker 3: these things and acting them out for attention because that
• 10:44
  Speaker 3: you know, they don't get that real positive affirmation in
• 10:46
  Speaker 3: their life elsewhere. We know there's plenty of research around
• 10:49
  Speaker 3: young people and how they'll form together in groups, you know,
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: in order for that association to make themselves feel get
• 10:57
  Speaker 3: a sense of belonging. We know all of that. We've
• 11:00
  Speaker 3: we work off evidence in our area of work particularly,
• 11:04
  Speaker 3: and that's why we do take if they young people
• 11:07
  Speaker 3: aren't successful through diversion and do take those steps which
• 11:11
  Speaker 3: make the community unsafe. We make sure that if they
• 11:13
  Speaker 3: do end up in detention, that we continue to provide
• 11:16
  Speaker 3: them an alternate opportunity. And we do see young people
• 11:20
  Speaker 3: quite regularly coming out of use detention and going into jobs,
• 11:23
  Speaker 3: for example, going into the Back on Track program, working
• 11:26
  Speaker 3: with our providers in remote and we've got some really
• 11:29
  Speaker 3: great success stories on those young people. We just don't
• 11:32
  Speaker 3: shout from the rooftops about them all the time. Well,
• 11:35
  Speaker 3: and because we want to give them some privacy to
• 11:37
  Speaker 3: work their way through. Over sixty percent of young people
• 11:40
  Speaker 3: that go through diversion actually never reoffend, Katie. So there's
• 11:44
  Speaker 3: a huge system with a lot of young people. And
• 11:46
  Speaker 3: we had over five hundred young people go through diversion
• 11:50
  Speaker 3: just this year alone. So it's a tricky it's a treaty.
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: It's really tricky act.
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: It's so hard at the moment, and honestly, I honestly
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: the community is quite broken in a lot of ways
• 12:02
  Speaker 1: when it comes to these issues that we've got with crime.
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: And I know that there's not an easy fix.
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: But I think that for a lot of people listening
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: this morning, they're going to be feeling pretty frustrated. You
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: know that we still have these issues obviously within don Dale.
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: We know that the construction of the new facility is
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: you know, it is happening.
• 12:21
  Speaker 3: Can I just interrupt you there? What was highlighted last
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: night is not the run of the mill at our
• 12:27
  Speaker 3: youth Justice center. I need to be very very clear
• 12:31
  Speaker 3: about that. I had an hour long interview with them.
• 12:33
  Speaker 3: They showed perhaps what two minutes of me speaking, They
• 12:37
  Speaker 3: were not going to highlight any of the great stuff
• 12:39
  Speaker 3: that was going that is going on. We have reformed
• 12:42
  Speaker 3: the system. It is not what it was in twenty sixteen.
• 12:45
  Speaker 3: So I think in some ways what was running last
• 12:48
  Speaker 3: night was quite disingenuous. And I want you know, we
• 12:51
  Speaker 3: don't have this ongoing. We have to just work at
• 12:54
  Speaker 3: many levels. We have to work at the early intervention level.
• 12:57
  Speaker 3: We have to work on young people when they start,
• 13:00
  Speaker 3: you know, escalating, and then if they do escalate, we
• 13:02
  Speaker 3: need to make sure the community is safe. That's our job.
• 13:05
  Speaker 3: We do it day in and day out. We are
• 13:07
  Speaker 3: closing don Dale. We've got a brand new facility here,
• 13:09
  Speaker 3: We've got a thirty five million dollar upgrade in our springs.
• 13:12
  Speaker 3: It's just complicated, Katie, and we are We're not taking
• 13:16
  Speaker 3: our foot off the pedal. You know.
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: They still minister and to the victims that have suffered
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: as a result and continue to suffer as a result
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: of youth crime, what do you say to them this morning?
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: Because I know that a lot of them are going
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: to be listening and they're feeling broken. They are so
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: over it and they just want some change.
• 13:36
  Speaker 3: So Katie, you know, my heart absolutely goes out to
• 13:39
  Speaker 3: any individual, family or business that had has been this.
• 13:44
  Speaker 3: You know, has been a victim of crime. I don't
• 13:47
  Speaker 3: know about you, but I've been a victim of crime
• 13:48
  Speaker 3: myself some years ago under a previous government. This is
• 13:51
  Speaker 3: not this is not a new thing, but we are
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: working at every level. We're working with an increasing number
• 13:57
  Speaker 3: of families. We are working in a context where we've
• 14:01
  Speaker 3: got a number of young people that were born under
• 14:04
  Speaker 3: the baby Bonus era. This is all a whole range
• 14:07
  Speaker 3: of culmination of things that are going on, but we
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: are working with hundreds of families and kids, and we
• 14:13
  Speaker 3: continue to strive to do better every single day.
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: Minister, we are going to have to leave it there.
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: I appreciate your time this morning. Thank you very much
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: for coming on the.
• 14:21
  Speaker 3: Show anytime, Katie, thanks for having me.
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: Thank you