Latest / The World of Phil Hendrie / Episode #3966 The New Phil Hendrie Show Radio Archive June 2002

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Episode #3966 The New Phil Hendrie Show Radio Archive June 2002 · The World of Phil Hendrie

0:00
Speaker 1: Hey, how are you guys?
0:00
Speaker 2: It's Phil Hendry here for another Radio Archive Hour. And
0:03
Speaker 2: this is one from the year 2002. Dean Wheeler is
0:06
Speaker 2: a marriage counselor. He comes on our program and appears
0:09
Speaker 2: to forgive a woman named Terry Barton. She was a
0:11
Speaker 2: forestry service employee who set a fire, he claims, after
0:14
Speaker 2: she got a very sad breakup letter from her husband.
0:17
Speaker 2: So she was upset. She was pissed off, whatever. She
0:20
Speaker 2: set fire to the forest. And he thinks, hey, you know,
0:23
Speaker 2: people are more important than forests. And it gets into
0:25
Speaker 2: a whole discussion about what would you rather do, see
0:27
Speaker 2: a baby die, you know, Anyway, that was a pretty
0:31
Speaker 2: good hour. Also, we have a Vernon Dozier flashback. And
0:36
Speaker 2: I don't know what it's about, but it sounds funny, too.
0:38
Speaker 2: Here is Dean Wheeler and forest fires.
0:42
Speaker 3: Terry Barton is a forestry technician accused of starting the
0:46
Speaker 3: Hayman fire in Colorado. She's apparently, allegedly, set fire to
0:51
Speaker 3: a letter that was sent to her by her husband.
0:54
Speaker 3: dropped it into a ring that is supposed to contain campfires,
0:58
Speaker 3: but apparently it's spread. She lied, allegedly, to investigators and
1:03
Speaker 3: said that she didn't have any part in starting any fire,
1:06
Speaker 3: and now she's been arrested and charged with the Hayman Fire,
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Speaker 3: one of several that are raging out of control in Colorado.
1:13
Speaker 3: Joining us on our Newsmaker line is Dean Whaler, who
1:16
Speaker 3: is a marriage family counselor, to comment on the motivations
1:20
Speaker 3: of somebody like this, someone so hurt, someone so devastated
1:25
Speaker 3: by something she read in a letter or perhaps something
1:27
Speaker 3: somebody said to her that she would uh... i don't
1:32
Speaker 3: know bbp criminally negligible or negligent i should say dean
1:37
Speaker 3: how are you.
1:38
Speaker 4: I'm real good phil thank you for having me so
1:41
Speaker 4: not saying.
1:41
Speaker 3: That she started the fire on on purpose it is
1:44
Speaker 3: alleged that she was criminally negligent uh... after reading this
1:47
Speaker 3: letter but goes to the mind of somebody when they
1:49
Speaker 3: received a kind of a shock like this.
1:52
Speaker 4: Well, I feel for Terry. I think what she read
1:54
Speaker 4: in that letter was so devastating, and I think what
1:58
Speaker 4: she read in that letter was probably so insulting that
2:01
Speaker 4: she needed an act. And again, this is just my opinion,
2:05
Speaker 4: but she needed to do something that would express the
2:10
Speaker 4: pain and the devastation that she felt emotionally. Because one
2:14
Speaker 4: of the things you want to do, Phil, and I
2:16
Speaker 4: think it's important, is to sweep the past away. And
2:18
Speaker 4: I think Terry must have been horribly hurt by what
2:21
Speaker 4: she read.
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Speaker 1: Can you imagine what was in that letter? Can you
2:25
Speaker 1: give us any idea?
2:26
Speaker 4: Well, I'm sure it had something to do with her weight.
2:30
Speaker 4: Men can be terribly cruel, suggesting diets. But for her
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Speaker 4: to set fire to an entire area like that, he
2:37
Speaker 4: must have been brutally cruel. It probably was highly personal,
2:41
Speaker 4: talking perhaps about her ability as a sex partner or
2:44
Speaker 4: that he couldn't stand the smell of her or things
2:48
Speaker 4: that are so devastating and of course she wants to.
2:50
Speaker 3: Act out yeah but she set fire to what amounted
2:55
Speaker 3: to 103,000 acres destroying a lot of resource well.
2:59
Speaker 4: It's a horrible thing to lose a resource but I'm
3:01
Speaker 4: trying to get you to see something else Phil I'm
3:03
Speaker 4: trying to get your listeners to see something else we
3:06
Speaker 4: are talking about the value of a human life and
3:09
Speaker 4: we so often forget how important our feelings are we
3:13
Speaker 4: value people's feelings Phil And I'll tell you, all the
3:17
Speaker 4: forests in the world are not worth the torment and
3:19
Speaker 4: heartache of one woman, one fat woman.
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Speaker 1: But lives were threatened by this fire. You're not justifying,
3:28
Speaker 1: you know.
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Speaker 4: Well, no one died. No animal life. If you say
3:32
Speaker 4: that no human beings died in this fire, I'm trying to...
3:35
Speaker 4: I'm a marriage counselor. I'm not a forestry technician or
3:39
Speaker 4: a forest ranger, but I do know people. And I
3:43
Speaker 4: guess you're suggesting that what she did was... worse than
3:46
Speaker 4: what happened to her.
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Speaker 3: I'm saying setting fire the way she did, even if
3:52
Speaker 3: it was by mistake, she lied about it, that is
3:55
Speaker 3: the allegation anyway, is a very serious thing that could
3:59
Speaker 3: have killed people, and for all we know, may still,
4:03
Speaker 3: because this fire still rages.
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Speaker 4: Well, Phil, I'm not one of these tree-huggers that believes
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Speaker 4: forests are the end-all, be-all, when one woman's feelings... She
4:12
Speaker 4: gets a letter from an ex-husband telling her her toilet
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Speaker 4: habits are despicable. He comments on her complexion. He makes
4:18
Speaker 4: fun of her teeth. This could be devastating.
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Speaker 1: Well, you don't know that that was in the letter.
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Speaker 4: But I can well imagine that he probably commented on
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Speaker 4: her toilet habits. What would make a woman so angry
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Speaker 4: she'd want to set fire to 103,000 acres? I think
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Speaker 4: we have to look at that. And I think we
4:35
Speaker 4: have to have compassion for that person. And let's stop
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Speaker 4: talking so much. about the loss of natural resources when
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Speaker 4: trees are not human beings. And trees are.
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Speaker 1: Thousands of acres, Mr.
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Speaker 3: Wheeler, thousands of acres of natural resource was lost by
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Speaker 3: a woman's careless.
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Speaker 1: And idiotic behavior.
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Speaker 4: All right, Phil, before you get all of that, I
4:58
Speaker 4: want to ask you a question. It's going to let
5:01
Speaker 4: me know where you're coming from. Okay? And this is
5:05
Speaker 4: a question. It's what we call a moral question. compass,
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Speaker 4: and I do this in my practice, and I want
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Speaker 4: your listeners out there to ask this question themselves, too.
5:15
Speaker 4: If it would save one baby's life, would you set
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Speaker 4: fire to all the trees in the world?
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Speaker 1: I don't think that's fair.
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Speaker 4: Answer the question fairly. Just go with me, Phil. If
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Speaker 4: it would save one innocent baby's life, would you set
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Speaker 4: fire to all the trees in the world?
5:34
Speaker 1: If it would save one innocent kids and one one innocent.
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Speaker 4: Baby a brand new baby a baby with all that
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Speaker 4: life would you set fire to all the trees in
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Speaker 4: the world.
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Speaker 3: Yes i would i mean i i no no i
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Speaker 3: wouldn't no i wouldn't well which is it no i
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Speaker 3: would not i would not i would not burn all
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Speaker 3: the trees you let the kid die i would let
5:56
Speaker 3: that child die i would yeah.
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Speaker 4: I would not well mr henry i think there is
5:59
Speaker 4: a job for you uh at an abortion clinic manning
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Speaker 4: a vacuum Because that's about as heartless a thing as
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Speaker 4: I've ever heard.
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Speaker 1: I cannot see burning every tree in the world to
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Speaker 1: save one baby. I'm sorry.
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Speaker 4: Well, like I said, there's a job for you at
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Speaker 4: an abortion clinic, manning any one of the many vacuums
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Speaker 4: they have there.
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Speaker 3: So in other words, is this a pro-life discussion we're
6:21
Speaker 3: having here?
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Speaker 4: No, we're talking about a woman and her feelings and
6:24
Speaker 4: her humanity. And you fail to see that.
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Speaker 1: All right, our number is 1-800-449-8686. You're not a doctor, correct?
6:32
Speaker 4: No, Phil, I have my master's in marriage counseling. All right.
6:36
Speaker 3: Dean Wheeler is with us. He's a marriage counselor from
6:39
Speaker 3: Northern California. Our number is 1-800-449-8686. So, in other words,
6:44
Speaker 3: this woman is allowed to set fire to all of
6:46
Speaker 3: these trees just so long as we understand her feelings.
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Speaker 4: Is that it? Phil, you just got done saying that
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Speaker 4: you would kill a baby rather than burn down all
6:57
Speaker 4: the trees in the world. Didn't you say that?
6:59
Speaker 1: This is not going to be about me, okay?
7:00
Speaker 4: Well, didn't you just say that?
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Speaker 1: Yes, I did.
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Speaker 4: Well, you've just committed media suicide, because what you're saying
7:04
Speaker 4: is you would rather see a baby stabbed through with
7:08
Speaker 4: a carving knife than to see some trees burned down
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Speaker 4: that could grow again.
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Speaker 1: I didn't say that I want to see a baby
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Speaker 1: stabbed through with a carving knife.
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Speaker 4: Well, does that change your opinion? You see, what we
7:18
Speaker 4: need to do is embrace Terry's pain. Terry Barton is
7:22
Speaker 4: a woman who got a letter from a husband... telling
7:26
Speaker 4: her that her bathroom habits were despicable and her breath
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Speaker 4: was lousy. And that can only humiliate a woman who
7:35
Speaker 4: her entire life is spent trying to be attractive for men.
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Speaker 1: So therefore she goes out and burns down an entire forest.
7:43
Speaker 4: So therefore we focus on her pain and we stop
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Speaker 4: the endless caterwauling and crying and rubbing our eyes like
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Speaker 4: infants about a forest. The trees are going to grow back.
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Speaker 4: What about Terry and her pain? And again, Mr. Henry,
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Speaker 4: you committed media suicide by saying you would let a
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Speaker 4: baby die rather than all the trees in the world.
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Speaker 3: I do not want to see all the trees in
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Speaker 3: the world burning down. All the trees in the world
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Speaker 3: burning down would mean that the people in the world
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Speaker 3: would be affected, the oxygen level.
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Speaker 1: In the world would be affected.
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Speaker 4: Well, that's your hypothesizing, like a lot of tree huggers
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Speaker 4: and like a lot of pro-choicers. But I'm talking, so
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Speaker 4: in other words, you'd want to see a baby gutted
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Speaker 4: and cooked.
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Speaker 1: And I didn't say anything about a baby gutted and cooked.
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Speaker 4: Well, would that change your opinion? What if the baby
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Speaker 4: was gutted and cooked? Then would you see that?
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Speaker 1: You know what? That is an imbecilic thing to say
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Speaker 1: to me.
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Speaker 4: Well, does it change your opinion?
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Speaker 1: I'm not going to go there with you. I refuse
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Speaker 1: to go there with you.
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Speaker 4: So, again, you see how difficult it is. You'd rather
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Speaker 4: see a baby gutted and cooked rather than burned.
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Speaker 1: I didn't say that, did I?
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Speaker 4: You said you'd rather see one die.
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Speaker 1: You gave me the initial choice.
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Speaker 3: You said, would you rather see a baby die or
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Speaker 3: see all the trees in the world burned down? And
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Speaker 3: I said, okay, I'd rather see the baby die than
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Speaker 3: see all the trees burned down.
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Speaker 1: I didn't say gutted and cooked.
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Speaker 4: Well, Phil, again, what we're talking about here is a
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Speaker 4: moral choice, and Terry Barton, that forestry technician, is a
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Speaker 4: lady who was so deeply offended by what was in
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Speaker 4: that letter. Women have a very difficult time with criticism.
9:24
Speaker 4: They can't handle criticism. And so they do extreme things.
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Speaker 4: In this case, she set fire to a forest. But
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Speaker 4: I've seen women. I had an ex-girlfriend who carved up
9:34
Speaker 4: all of my furniture. She went into my kitchen. She
9:37
Speaker 4: took out a set of steak knives that were German-made
9:40
Speaker 4: that I had just purchased. And she set about cutting
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Speaker 4: and slicing into all of my furniture, which was all handcrafted.
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Speaker 5: Why?
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Speaker 4: Because I broke up with her. So you can see.
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Speaker 4: And remember what Shakespeare said, hell hath no fury.
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Speaker 5: 1-800-449-8686.
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Speaker 1: Here is Rocky. Go ahead, Rocky.
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Speaker 4: Yes, Mr.
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Speaker 5: Wheeler, it's not only women who do dramatic things. Men
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Speaker 5: have killed their entire families. to keep their wives from
10:12
Speaker 5: leaving them, but I'm more concerned.
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Speaker 4: About your equating.
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Speaker 5: The death of a baby with the loss of all
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Speaker 5: the forests in the world. We have to realize that
10:21
Speaker 5: we're interdependent with other species.
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Speaker 4: We can't just give up the environment. What is your
10:27
Speaker 4: answer to that question, Rocky? Would you see a baby
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Speaker 4: die to save the forests, or would you save that
10:32
Speaker 4: baby from the forests?
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Speaker 5: I don't think the baby's life would be worth living
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Speaker 5: without the forest on the earth.
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Speaker 4: It's living in a vacuum, and it's.
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Speaker 5: Not the same as aborting a baby. It is not
10:44
Speaker 5: the same as aborting a baby.
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Speaker 4: You'd also be manning a vacuum at an abortion clinic.
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Speaker 5: No, no.
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Speaker 1: You are totally off-base with that. That is really sick.
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Speaker 6: No, that is not the same thing.
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Speaker 4: No, both of you would man a vacuum at an
10:55
Speaker 4: abortion clinic because the child to you is dispensable. And
11:01
Speaker 4: the fact that you would take an ice pick and
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Speaker 4: stick it into the brain of a child to save
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Speaker 4: a cougar and a bush, to me, is absolutely reprehensible.
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Speaker 5: I would never do that.
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Speaker 6: You just said that you would.
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Speaker 5: No, I would never take an ice pick and stick
11:15
Speaker 5: it in a baby's neck.
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Speaker 4: No, wait, no. You said for the forest and the world.
11:19
Speaker 5: You would destroy the earth. You would destroy the earth
11:23
Speaker 5: so that one child could have maybe a miserable life.
11:26
Speaker 5: I think that humans... Just putting humans over, you know,
11:31
Speaker 5: everything is just ridiculous.
11:33
Speaker 4: Trees grow back.
11:34
Speaker 5: You're totally ridiculous.
11:35
Speaker 4: I'm ridiculous? You were the one who said you'd throw
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Speaker 4: a child under the wheels of a truck.
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Speaker 1: No, no, I didn't. You're lying. She did not.
11:43
Speaker 6: You're making that up.
11:43
Speaker 1: Now, that is a lie, and you know that.
11:45
Speaker 5: I did not say that.
11:46
Speaker 4: You're totally making it up. I want to know what
11:48
Speaker 4: the difference is. You both said you would sacrifice a
11:51
Speaker 4: child for forests. No, I said you said.
11:55
Speaker 4: You said you would gladly throw a child.
11:57
Speaker 5: But if you burned down all the forests in the world,
11:59
Speaker 5: if it would save one child's life, well, I don't
12:02
Speaker 5: know how you make that connection between that and stabbing
12:05
Speaker 5: a baby with an ice cube.
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Speaker 3: And Rocky and I both said that we didn't think
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Speaker 3: of the forests burning down.
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Speaker 1: We wanted to save the forests because what would the
12:12
Speaker 1: life of a child.
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Speaker 4: And you chose the vacuum at an abortion clinic. All right.
12:16
Speaker 4: Thank you.
12:16
Speaker 5: No.
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Speaker 1: No, we did not.
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Speaker 4: Yes, you did.
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Speaker 5: Aborting a child does not save the forest. You're so
12:22
Speaker 5: equivalent there. You're making something up that doesn't even relate
12:26
Speaker 5: to me.
12:26
Speaker 4: You said that you would gladly shove a child's hand
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Speaker 4: into a garbage disposal.
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Speaker 1: No, we did not. All right, Rocky, thank you.
12:33
Speaker 5: You know, this guy is totally off.
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Speaker 4: I'm trying to show you the pain that Terry Barton
12:39
Speaker 4: is feeling.
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Speaker 1: Hold on. All right. Thank you, Rocky. 1-800-449-8686. Betty, go ahead.
12:44
Speaker 5: Hey, you know something, Mr.
12:45
Speaker 7: Wheeler?
12:46
Speaker 1: Yes, ma'am.
12:46
Speaker 7: I'd like to see your hand stuck in this.
12:49
Speaker 5: Good.
12:49
Speaker 4: Garbage disposal.
12:50
Speaker 5: I'd like to see somebody gut you.
12:52
Speaker 4: Oh, so you kill children too? Let me tell you something.
12:56
Speaker 5: Let me tell you something right now. You are a jerk.
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Speaker 7: And anybody that stands up for that woman for setting
13:02
Speaker 7: the state of.
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Speaker 5: Colorado on fire. I'm about 25 miles from this fire.
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Speaker 7: I've got six children that are going to be evacuated
13:11
Speaker 7: and lose their homes.
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Speaker 6: And you're sitting there.
13:14
Speaker 7: Accusing everybody of saying something stupid when you're.
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Speaker 5: The one that's saying that we would do things like that.
13:20
Speaker 4: Betty?
13:20
Speaker 8: I'd like to see you carved up, mister.
13:23
Speaker 4: Betty, I'd like you to answer my question.
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Speaker 5: And how do you know what was in the letter?
13:27
Speaker 5: If you didn't write it, you sick son of a bitch.
13:29
Speaker 4: Betty, you're very emotional. I want you to answer my question, Betty. Betty?
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Speaker 7: Because I wouldn't talk to such a son of a
13:35
Speaker 7: bitch like you. I'll tell you, but I won't listen
13:38
Speaker 7: to you.
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Speaker 4: So goodbye. Her husband called her fat. And you know
13:41
Speaker 4: what that does to you, Betty, when people call you fat?
13:43
Speaker 1: Betty?
13:44
Speaker 4: Betty? All right, she's gone. You know something?
13:47
Speaker 5: I am.
13:47
Speaker 1: All right, we can dump that last little piece there.
13:50
Speaker 1: My goodness, she's very... Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hostile. 1-800-449-8686. 1-800-449-8686.
13:57
Speaker 1: We're with Dean Wheeler.
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Speaker 3: He's a marriage counselor who believes that we're ignoring Terry
14:02
Speaker 3: Barton's feelings, the forest technician who is alleged to have
14:06
Speaker 3: started the fire. What's a few burned trees against a
14:09
Speaker 3: woman's feelings?
14:10
Speaker 8: The Phil Henry Show is back.
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Speaker 5: 1-800-449-8686.
14:15
Speaker 1: Dean Wheeler is with us. He is a marriage counselor.
14:18
Speaker 1: You're a therapist, correct, Mr.
14:19
Speaker 8: Wheeler?
14:19
Speaker 4: I deal in marriage and child counseling, yes, Mr. Henry.
14:23
Speaker 3: And you believe that Terry Barton, the forestry technician who
14:26
Speaker 3: was accused of setting these fires, her feelings are being ignored.
14:30
Speaker 4: Mr. Henry, all I'm saying is that Terry read in
14:33
Speaker 4: that letter something that was very hurtful to her, and
14:36
Speaker 4: she acted out. And I would think that a woman
14:40
Speaker 4: wiping away the horror of heartache by burning down some
14:42
Speaker 4: forest isn't going to be made into a federal case.
14:45
Speaker 4: And all we're asking is that they let her go
14:47
Speaker 4: before they make fools of themselves.
14:49
Speaker 1: Who lets her go?
14:50
Speaker 4: The federal authorities.
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Speaker 3: I mean, and then this question about what's more valuable,
14:56
Speaker 3: the child of a life or all the forests in
14:57
Speaker 3: the world.
14:58
Speaker 4: And you chose aborting a child.
15:01
Speaker 1: I didn't say aborting.
15:02
Speaker 3: You simply asked me about the life of a child,
15:04
Speaker 3: and I said the forests are more important.
15:07
Speaker 4: Yes, that's what you said. And you're entitled to that choice, Phil.
15:11
Speaker 4: But now we see what we've got here, a bunch
15:13
Speaker 4: of tree huggers versus the life of one woman.
15:15
Speaker 1: All right, 1-800-449-8686.
15:17
Speaker 4: Susan, go ahead.
15:20
Speaker 7: Pardon me?
15:21
Speaker 1: Susan, go ahead.
15:22
Speaker 4: You're on the air.
15:22
Speaker 1: And I understand you were evacuated, but you're back home now.
15:25
Speaker 7: Yes, we are.
15:25
Speaker 1: You're in the Denver area, right? Susan, this is Dean.
15:29
Speaker 4: I'm so happy to hear that your family's all right.
15:32
Speaker 7: Okay, yeah, we are. But we're still on red alert
15:34
Speaker 7: as to the evacuated. But we moved back in yesterday,
15:37
Speaker 7: and then, of course, the winds have shifted toward Denver.
15:40
Speaker 4: But, Susan, you understand that if it was going to
15:42
Speaker 4: save the life of a baby, you wouldn't mind your
15:44
Speaker 4: home being burned down, would you? I don't.
15:46
Speaker 7: I don't understand. I thought the issue here was basically
15:50
Speaker 7: a person starting a forest fire. Am I incorrect?
15:53
Speaker 4: No, the issue really is why.
15:55
Speaker 7: What is the topic of this talk?
15:57
Speaker 4: Well, the topic is what are the feelings of this
15:59
Speaker 4: young lady that made her start this fire? Okay, first
16:02
Speaker 4: of all, if you.
16:03
Speaker 5: May I finish, please?
16:05
Speaker 7: May I finish, please? May I please finish?
16:07
Speaker 4: This is a woman with a broken heart.
16:08
Speaker 7: Okay, let me finish my sentence.
16:10
Speaker 4: Certainly, Susan.
16:11
Speaker 7: The latest information is, and this is not a fact,
16:15
Speaker 7: probably the letter had nothing to do with it, if
16:17
Speaker 7: there even was a letter.
16:19
Speaker 8: That she started.
16:20
Speaker 7: Wait, let me finish my sentence.
16:22
Speaker 4: You're interrupting me again. No, that's all right.
16:23
Speaker 7: That she probably started the forest fire to put it
16:27
Speaker 7: out so that she could be a hero. That is
16:29
Speaker 7: what you're hearing. I'm not finished.
16:31
Speaker 4: That's a terrible call for help.
16:33
Speaker 7: You are interrupting me again. May I have the courtesy
16:35
Speaker 7: of finishing, please?
16:36
Speaker 4: Go right ahead, Susan.
16:37
Speaker 7: And then I will let you talk.
16:38
Speaker 4: Go right ahead. I completely apologize. I'm sorry.
16:41
Speaker 7: You're right.
16:42
Speaker 4: And you do have the right to say what you
16:43
Speaker 4: want to say.
16:44
Speaker 7: I'm trying to if you would.
16:45
Speaker 4: Well, go ahead. I just want you to know that
16:47
Speaker 4: I would like to say something, too, when you're done.
16:49
Speaker 4: You're doing it again.
16:50
Speaker 7: You are doing it again.
16:51
Speaker 1: Dean, Mr. Wheeler, would you please be quiet?
16:53
Speaker 4: I'm certainly going to be quiet. I just want to
16:55
Speaker 4: know that I will be able to talk right when
16:58
Speaker 4: she's done.
16:58
Speaker 7: Where do you find these people?
16:59
Speaker 1: Would you please just go ahead?
17:01
Speaker 7: Anyway, the point that I'm trying to make is your
17:04
Speaker 7: information is probably.
17:05
Speaker 4: But you didn't answer my question.
17:07
Speaker 1: What question do you want me to answer?
17:08
Speaker 4: Will I get to talk, too?
17:09
Speaker 1: Yes, you'll get to talk. This lady has the floor.
17:13
Speaker 7: When I get finished, I will answer the question. As
17:15
Speaker 7: long as it is the issue of.
17:17
Speaker 4: Have you ever had your heart broken? You're not telling
17:19
Speaker 4: me anything about yourself. You're not telling me anything.
17:23
Speaker 7: What is the issue of this talk show?
17:25
Speaker 4: The issue is.
17:26
Speaker 6: The issue of this talk.
17:27
Speaker 7: Show is a lady starting a forest fire.
17:29
Speaker 4: Are you underwater?
17:31
Speaker 7: Okay, I'm on a cell phone.
17:32
Speaker 4: You're on a cell phone, all right.
17:33
Speaker 7: But it has nothing to do... I'm in Denver. And
17:37
Speaker 7: it has nothing to do with her feeling that that's
17:41
Speaker 7: totally irrelevant.
17:42
Speaker 5: Awesome.
17:43
Speaker 7: Her feelings don't matter. What this trained employee did, who
17:47
Speaker 7: was trained not to do this, deliberately went and started
17:51
Speaker 7: this fire. And do you know what? If those trees
17:54
Speaker 7: burn down, what it's doing to our water system here
17:56
Speaker 7: in Denver, do you have any idea the people that
17:58
Speaker 7: it's going to affect?
18:01
Speaker 4: Well, I think you're making a very good point.
18:04
Speaker 7: I am making a good point. I'm here. I've been
18:06
Speaker 7: to the meetings. I've been with the firefighters.
18:08
Speaker 4: I understand. Okay? And if you say people.
18:12
Speaker 7: Have not died yet, we don't know that. This is
18:15
Speaker 7: out of control. We do not know that there will
18:17
Speaker 7: not be life lost. We don't know that.
18:20
Speaker 1: Very good, Susan. And she's living it.
18:22
Speaker 7: And you want to know what else?
18:23
Speaker 4: People's livelihoods, their homes are gone. are gone.
18:29
Speaker 7: Yeah, but a little pink baby. I have not finished.
18:32
Speaker 7: We're not talking about babies.
18:33
Speaker 4: A plump pink baby would be safe.
18:36
Speaker 7: Do you always interrupt and not listen like this? Is
18:39
Speaker 7: this your nature and you're supposed to be a marriage counselor?
18:42
Speaker 7: How would you listen to your clients? They never get
18:45
Speaker 7: to speak.
18:47
Speaker 4: Amazing.
18:48
Speaker 7: May I finish?
18:49
Speaker 4: Well, how do you live with yourself with the blood
18:50
Speaker 4: of a newborn in your hands? May I finish?
18:52
Speaker 7: Now, also, what I was saying was the fact that.
18:55
Speaker 4: We have to break, Susan.
18:57
Speaker 5: Okay.
18:57
Speaker 1: All right, hold on, Susan. Will you let me do that?
19:01
Speaker 4: What?
19:01
Speaker 1: Will you let me say we're breaking, not you?
19:03
Speaker 4: All right.
19:06
Speaker 1: We have to break, Susan.
19:07
Speaker 4: I put her on hold.
19:09
Speaker 1: Thank you.
19:11
Speaker 4: The Phil Hendry Show is back. 1-800-449-8686.
19:15
Speaker 3: Dean Wheeler is with us, marriage counselor, talking about the
19:18
Speaker 3: forest fires in Colorado. The Hayman Fire is alleged to
19:21
Speaker 3: have been started by a forest technician named Terry Barton.
19:25
Speaker 3: Did she start the fire because she got a dear
19:27
Speaker 3: Jill letter? Did she start the fire because she was
19:29
Speaker 3: looking for attention? We're here with Dean Wheeler to talk
19:32
Speaker 3: about the psychological implications. And you've been saying that her
19:35
Speaker 3: feelings are more important than the trees, which, of course,
19:38
Speaker 3: is something I've got a difficult time getting past.
19:39
Speaker 4: So if I could just quote a great song by
19:44
Speaker 4: a songwriter by the name of Bruce Coburn. And the
19:47
Speaker 4: song's lyrics go as follows. If a tree falls in
19:51
Speaker 4: a forest, does anyone hear it? Well, the answer, I think,
19:56
Speaker 4: if we were all here with Mr. Coburn, we would
19:58
Speaker 4: say the answer is no. No one really hears it
19:59
Speaker 4: and no one cares. But, Phil, I put it to
20:02
Speaker 4: you now. If a baby were to be gored with
20:06
Speaker 4: a barbecue skewer, you would hear it. You would hear it.
20:12
Speaker 4: You see what I'm saying, Phil?
20:14
Speaker 1: If a baby were gored with a barbecue... What you're
20:16
Speaker 1: saying to me?
20:17
Speaker 4: Yes. You would hear the suffering of a child much
20:19
Speaker 4: more than you would hear a tree falling. A baby, Phil,
20:24
Speaker 4: going through the windshield of a car. That's loud. But
20:29
Speaker 4: a tree falling in the woods is not.
20:34
Speaker 1: If no one hears it.
20:35
Speaker 4: If no one hears it. 1-800-449-8686.
20:37
Speaker 5: John, go ahead.
20:38
Speaker 1: You're on the Phil Henry Show.
20:41
Speaker 8: I'm amazed that, first, Susan and your family are very fortunate.
20:46
Speaker 1: To make it out of a fire like that. Absolutely.
20:49
Speaker 8: It's incomprehensible to me, first, for this man to even
20:53
Speaker 8: consider saying that, comparing the death of a child and
20:59
Speaker 8: you being an abortionist, Because this woman's feelings were hurt,
21:04
Speaker 8: and it was necessary for her to start a fire
21:07
Speaker 8: for whatever reason, attention or something. There's no comparison. Everyone
21:13
Speaker 8: on this planet gets their feelings hurt daily or from
21:16
Speaker 8: time to time. So does that mean we should all
21:18
Speaker 8: strike out and go start fires, bomb things, burn things,
21:23
Speaker 8: hurt people?
21:24
Speaker 4: Understanding. We need understanding.
21:27
Speaker 8: Understanding and actions are two different things. Feelings are not
21:31
Speaker 8: a tangible asset. No one's hurt physically by a feeling.
21:35
Speaker 8: It's an emotional thing.
21:37
Speaker 4: Wait a minute.
21:37
Speaker 8: I have to deal with feelings every day.
21:39
Speaker 4: Terry probably got a letter from her husband that told
21:42
Speaker 4: her she was a fat cow.
21:44
Speaker 8: You can tell me that doesn't hurt. And this merits
21:47
Speaker 8: a conflagration of that size and endangering that many lives?
21:52
Speaker 4: Let's move over to that. Let's move over to that
21:54
Speaker 4: idea then. All right, so her feelings were hurt.
21:56
Speaker 8: Are you comparing me to an abortionist?
21:58
Speaker 4: Well, I'm going to ask you the question.
22:00
Speaker 8: Go ahead.
22:02
Speaker 4: What's more important?
22:04
Speaker 8: Someone's feelings or someone's life?
22:06
Speaker 4: No, no, no.
22:07
Speaker 8: That's really the question. And the answer to that is
22:10
Speaker 8: what we need to do is what's right. Yes, people's
22:14
Speaker 8: feelings get hurt from time to time. And if this
22:17
Speaker 8: is the kind of advice that you give people, I mean,
22:19
Speaker 8: you're a tawdry, tawdry marriage counselor at best.
22:23
Speaker 1: That's a good word, John.
22:24
Speaker 4: Oh, that's a good word, John. I see you, Phil,
22:27
Speaker 4: doing what we call in psychology... You're interjecting. You're identifying
22:32
Speaker 4: with him.
22:32
Speaker 1: You don't have to psychoanalyze me. I agreed with the man.
22:35
Speaker 4: It's a good word. You know what?
22:36
Speaker 8: I don't even really care what his opinion is. I
22:38
Speaker 8: just know that I would not do or light a
22:40
Speaker 8: fire because my feelings were hurt and endanger that many lives.
22:44
Speaker 8: And that's my dead-out opinion and belief. And I'm entitled
22:48
Speaker 8: to that.
22:48
Speaker 4: You're entitled to your opinion, but would you throw a
22:50
Speaker 4: baby off a bridge or set fire to all the
22:52
Speaker 4: trees in the world?
22:53
Speaker 8: Because my feelings were hurt?
22:55
Speaker 4: No. Would you throw a baby? No, I would not.
22:56
Speaker 8: Because my feelings were hurt? No, I wouldn't. I don't
22:59
Speaker 8: care if you call me fat or I have bad breath.
23:01
Speaker 8: It has nothing to do with the absolute danger and
23:06
Speaker 8: damage that this person has created.
23:07
Speaker 4: Well, you're not answering my question, though.
23:09
Speaker 8: No, I'm not going to because it's not even applicable
23:13
Speaker 8: to what would happen here.
23:13
Speaker 3: I notice it's gone from a baby dying to a
23:16
Speaker 3: baby being gored with a barbecue skewer.
23:17
Speaker 5: It's a baby.
23:18
Speaker 6: The woman is not a baby.
23:19
Speaker 4: But she's not a baby. She's a human.
23:22
Speaker 8: She's a baby, and she's actually looking after a forest.
23:25
Speaker 8: She's a pretty old and intelligent baby, I would think.
23:28
Speaker 4: Well, John, but we're all babies. So she's not a child.
23:31
Speaker 8: And if you want to talk tree-huggers, and now we're
23:34
Speaker 8: talking about let's get in touch with our inner child
23:36
Speaker 8: and have a group hug. It's absolutely amazing that you
23:39
Speaker 8: could come out with a statement like that. I know
23:41
Speaker 8: this is a talk show, but you know what? That's
23:44
Speaker 8: one of the most magnificently ignorant comments I've heard in
23:47
Speaker 8: such a long time, and that's why I had to
23:49
Speaker 8: call in here.
23:49
Speaker 4: Well, John, I can tell you're angry.
23:51
Speaker 8: Oh, I'm furious that you would even come out with
23:55
Speaker 8: a comment like that. And how did you even make
23:57
Speaker 8: a reference to other people as being an abortionist? How
24:00
Speaker 8: did you tie that into a woman's feelings being hurt
24:03
Speaker 8: because she was called fat or whatever?
24:06
Speaker 4: I asked Mr. Henry... what was more valuable, the life
24:09
Speaker 4: of a child or all the forest burning? And he said,
24:12
Speaker 4: what was more valuable were the forests. And I said, Mr. Henry,
24:15
Speaker 4: there's a job for him at an abortion clinic manning
24:17
Speaker 4: a vacuum.
24:18
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think that that's a... That's what he
24:19
Speaker 1: chooses to do.
24:19
Speaker 4: He can do that.
24:20
Speaker 1: No, I don't choose to do that.
24:21
Speaker 8: But let's get back to the real issue.
24:22
Speaker 4: We're all babies in the eyes of God.
24:27
Speaker 8: I mean, Susan and her family was in definite danger.
24:30
Speaker 1: Without a doubt. They made it out.
24:31
Speaker 4: And you know what?
24:32
Speaker 7: You're right.
24:33
Speaker 4: I'm going to put you down. I'm agreeing with you there.
24:35
Speaker 4: All right, I'm going to put you down in the category.
24:37
Speaker 8: But there are no babies. This has nothing to do
24:39
Speaker 8: with a baby. A woman was no baby.
24:40
Speaker 4: But I'm putting you down in the category.
24:42
Speaker 8: You made a conscious choice to light that fire.
24:43
Speaker 4: That's right. But I'm putting you down in the category
24:45
Speaker 4: of putting a barbecue skewer right through a kid.
24:47
Speaker 3: Will you knock that off, okay? Nobody said anything about
24:49
Speaker 3: a barbecue skewer through a kid.
24:51
Speaker 1: No one did.
24:52
Speaker 8: Thank you.
24:52
Speaker 4: I didn't. Both of you guys did not tell me.
24:54
Speaker 7: No one did.
24:54
Speaker 4: That's what both of you guys want to do.
24:56
Speaker 8: Only this tawdry, self-proclaimed marriage counselor. All right, John, thanks.
25:02
Speaker 8: It's not even a realistic comparison.
25:04
Speaker 1: I appreciate your comment.
25:05
Speaker 8: It's a grown adult that needs to get back to reality.
25:09
Speaker 4: We all have an inner baby. And the inner baby
25:11
Speaker 4: needs to be.
25:11
Speaker 8: Okay, well, apparently hers is way out of hand and
25:14
Speaker 8: just pretty good with matches, isn't she?
25:15
Speaker 4: Well, I would say that we all need a big
25:18
Speaker 4: nipple from time to time. And she didn't have one.
25:22
Speaker 4: So she set fire to half the state of Colorado.
25:24
Speaker 8: Okay, I'm feeling bad right now. What do you think
25:26
Speaker 8: I should do?
25:27
Speaker 4: You feel bad about what?
25:29
Speaker 8: This is what I'm saying here. Somebody over there told
25:31
Speaker 8: me I was fat. What should I do about it?
25:33
Speaker 8: Light fires? That's basically what you're telling me. I should
25:37
Speaker 8: go be an abortionist? Is that what you're telling me? Yes. Oh,
25:42
Speaker 8: that's a good idea, isn't it?
25:43
Speaker 1: Go out and be an abortionist?
25:45
Speaker 8: All right, John, thanks.
25:48
Speaker 1: Thanks very much for your call.
25:50
Speaker 4: The both of you laughing at me is masking your hostility.
25:53
Speaker 1: Oh, blow it out your ass.
25:55
Speaker 4: How dare you?
25:58
Speaker 1: 1-800-449-8686. So let's see. I'm feeling bad. I feel pretty
26:03
Speaker 1: bad right now. I think I'll go get a job
26:05
Speaker 1: at an abortion clinic. That'll cheer me up. How come
26:09
Speaker 1: nobody's laughing? I thought it was pretty funny.
26:11
Speaker 3: You don't like all the tree huggers and a woman's
26:13
Speaker 3: life is more valuable than all the trees in Colorado, huh?
26:16
Speaker 4: I really believe that, Phil. And there's so... What is this?
26:20
Speaker 1: This is John Denver music.
26:22
Speaker 4: Please don't do that. You've done that on purpose, didn't you?
26:25
Speaker 1: Yeah, I did do it on purpose.
26:27
Speaker 3: He kind of represents a sensibility that I personally like.
26:30
Speaker 4: Oh, do you think he was hip or something? I
26:31
Speaker 4: thought he was kind of lame. I much preferred the
26:34
Speaker 4: music of Traffic, The Who, and.
26:36
Speaker 1: Well, good for you. Sometimes I like to hear John Denver.
26:39
Speaker 4: Oh, Matt, come on. Uh, hey, Phil. Um, do you
26:45
Speaker 4: want to go get naked in a sweat lodge?
26:47
Speaker 3: From yesterday's show, by the way, I did the voice
26:49
Speaker 3: of Dean Wheeler in the last bit.
26:51
Speaker 1: In fact, I do all the voices of all the
26:52
Speaker 1: characters on my show. In fact, last hour, I did
26:54
Speaker 1: the voice of, who was the character? I forget. I
26:57
Speaker 1: don't remember one day to the next what I do. Oh,
26:59
Speaker 1: Bobby Dooley. Yeah, that was me and Steve.
27:01
Speaker 4: I do it all.
27:03
Speaker 3: Now, from yesterday's show, Vernon Dozier was jealous of Tiger Woods,
27:06
Speaker 3: and he didn't like the fact that his son thought
27:09
Speaker 3: Tiger Woods was pretty good.
27:10
Speaker 1: Phil Hendry Show.
27:11
Speaker 5: Comedy Gold.
27:12
Speaker 6: Well, this guy has absolutely no clue about what's important
27:17
Speaker 6: in life. I mean, what day is it? It's Father's Day, right?
27:20
Speaker 4: You got it. You got it.
27:21
Speaker 6: Okay, so why is it that you're celebrating Father's Day?
27:24
Speaker 6: Because you have a son.
27:26
Speaker 4: You got it. Right? And he has a father.
27:29
Speaker 5: Right.
27:30
Speaker 6: So your son, who should be one of the most
27:34
Speaker 6: important things to you, comes to you and talks to
27:36
Speaker 6: you about something that is important to him.
27:38
Speaker 4: And you smack him. There's where you made a mistake.
27:42
Speaker 4: He has to talk to me about what's important to
27:44
Speaker 4: me because it's Father's Day. No, no. Wait a minute,
27:47
Speaker 4: wait a minute.
27:48
Speaker 6: You're a father, right?
27:49
Speaker 4: Is it called Son's Day or is it called Father's Day?
27:51
Speaker 5: No, this is.
27:53
Speaker 4: There you go.
27:54
Speaker 8: It's Father's Day.
27:55
Speaker 4: Right.
27:56
Speaker 6: And as a father, you have a son who should
27:59
Speaker 6: be the most important thing to you.
28:00
Speaker 4: My son is sorry.
28:01
Speaker 8: And this person who's the.
28:02
Speaker 6: Most important thing to you comes and talks to you
28:05
Speaker 6: about something that's important to him, and you smack him.
28:08
Speaker 6: And you don't think that's deranged?
28:10
Speaker 4: And what about what's important to me, okay? I went out.
28:13
Speaker 1: Right.
28:14
Speaker 6: And your son should be important to you, and it
28:16
Speaker 6: apparently isn't because you're more worried about this golf score
28:20
Speaker 6: of 88. Now, let me ask you this question on
28:22
Speaker 6: this golf score. How many mulligans did you take to
28:25
Speaker 6: get 88?
28:26
Speaker 4: You're allowed one aside.
28:28
Speaker 1: No, you're not.
28:29
Speaker 4: What?
28:30
Speaker 1: No, you're not.
28:32
Speaker 4: You are allowed one mulligan aside.
28:33
Speaker 6: Okay, now, if you're keeping one mulligan aside, how many
28:37
Speaker 6: penalty shots did you count? You know, did you play
28:40
Speaker 6: a do count or a don't count game?
28:42
Speaker 4: I played a do count game. I have a handicap
28:45
Speaker 4: of 30.
28:45
Speaker 1: Which means you shot a 118.
28:47
Speaker 4: No, it doesn't. It means I shot a net 88.
28:50
Speaker 6: Let me ask you this question. Did you ever think
28:53
Speaker 6: to say, you know what? Tiger Woods had a great
28:55
Speaker 6: game today, and guess what, son?
28:57
Speaker 5: So did I.
28:58
Speaker 6: In fact, I shot an 88 at whatever country club
29:01
Speaker 6: it was.
29:01
Speaker 4: Why do I?
29:02
Speaker 6: And why don't you go golfing with me next time,
29:04
Speaker 6: and I'll show you how to play?
29:05
Speaker 4: I want to have him golf with me, but he
29:07
Speaker 4: hacks it up. Well, how do you think he's.
29:09
Speaker 6: Going to want to golf with you if you smack
29:11
Speaker 6: him every time he talks about golf?
29:12
Speaker 4: I have had him out on the course with me,
29:14
Speaker 4: and he embarrasses me. He hacks it to pieces. He
29:16
Speaker 4: can't drive for crap.
29:18
Speaker 1: He's five years old. How far do you think he's
29:21
Speaker 1: going to drive the ball?
29:22
Speaker 4: Well, then you guys are telling me to take him out.
29:24
Speaker 4: Is that right?
29:26
Speaker 1: Phil, the man said take the boy. You can sit
29:28
Speaker 1: him in the cart with you.
29:29
Speaker 4: They don't allow spectators.
29:30
Speaker 1: Oh, bull crap.
29:32
Speaker 3: On a freaking middle of the week, they'll let you
29:34
Speaker 3: have your son sit with you in your cart.
29:36
Speaker 4: And you can... Oh, and you've golfed at Riviera how
29:38
Speaker 4: many times, Mr. Henry?
29:40
Speaker 1: I've never golfed there.
29:41
Speaker 5: Ah, hi.
29:41
Speaker 4: Okay, thank you. Thank you.
29:43
Speaker 1: You know what?
29:44
Speaker 4: I'm saying.
29:44
Speaker 1: Thank you.
29:44
Speaker 4: Thank you.
29:45
Speaker 5: No.
29:45
Speaker 4: Thank you.
29:49
Speaker 6: You ought to let him talk to you because with
29:51
Speaker 6: the attitude you've got, you're lucky he even.
29:54
Speaker 8: Talks to you.
29:55
Speaker 4: Hey, on Father's Day, you're supposed to. I don't care
29:59
Speaker 4: what day it is.
29:59
Speaker 1: Why don't you like Tiger Woods?
30:02
Speaker 4: He bothers me, okay?
30:03
Speaker 1: Why?
30:04
Speaker 6: This has nothing to do with Tiger Woods. This is
30:06
Speaker 6: about a dad who has a son, and that son
30:10
Speaker 6: has something that was important or on his.
30:12
Speaker 4: Mind, and his father was more interested.
30:15
Speaker 6: In hearing about something he did himself. than about something
30:18
Speaker 6: to help his son or talk to his son or
30:20
Speaker 6: build a communication with his son. And if that's the
30:22
Speaker 6: kind of dad you are, you don't deserve to be
30:24
Speaker 6: a dad. You're lucky that this kid even talks to you.
30:27
Speaker 4: What about what was important was on my mind.
30:30
Speaker 1: What?
30:30
Speaker 4: What about what was important on my mind?
30:33
Speaker 6: You're a dad, right?
30:35
Speaker 4: Yeah.
30:36
Speaker 6: And that means making sacrifices. And one of the sacrifices
30:38
Speaker 6: you make is the things that.
30:40
Speaker 4: Kids are more important in life than you. My wife
30:44
Speaker 4: said that Father's Day is a day.
30:47
Speaker 1: The day that what?
30:48
Speaker 4: What happened to you? Did you get anything?
30:50
Speaker 1: Yeah, my kids made breakfast for me. They served it
30:53
Speaker 1: in bed.
30:54
Speaker 5: Oh.
30:55
Speaker 4: Okay, so now you're rubbing that in, huh?
30:56
Speaker 1: I'm not rubbing anything in, man, but my kids served
30:59
Speaker 1: me breakfast in bed.
31:00
Speaker 4: I didn't get diddly squat.
31:03
Speaker 1: Did you get a present?
31:05
Speaker 4: I got a cheap tie. Are you a father, Bob? Yeah,
31:10
Speaker 4: I am.
31:11
Speaker 6: I have three kids.
31:12
Speaker 4: What'd you get?
31:13
Speaker 6: I didn't get squat, and I didn't care. But you
31:16
Speaker 6: know what I did get? I got a chance to
31:19
Speaker 6: go to church with one of my kids. I got
31:21
Speaker 6: a phone call from one of my other kids, my
31:23
Speaker 6: daughter who lives in Florida. And that was it.
31:27
Speaker 4: All right.
31:28
Speaker 6: I'm happy about that because I can communicate with my kids.
31:31
Speaker 6: But I'll tell you, when your kids come and talk
31:33
Speaker 6: to you about something that's important and you smack them,
31:36
Speaker 6: they're never going to talk to you again, and I
31:38
Speaker 6: don't blame them.
31:38
Speaker 4: No, he'll talk to me about me and... I got
31:42
Speaker 4: to stop.
31:43
Speaker 6: Well, that sounds like a short conversation. Because you sound
31:47
Speaker 6: so shallow, there ain't a whole lot to talk.
31:49
Speaker 4: About, buddy.
31:50
Speaker 1: All right, listen.
31:51
Speaker 4: Okay.
31:52
Speaker 1: Hold on. Thank you, Bob. I got to move on.
31:53
Speaker 5: 1-800-449.
31:53
Speaker 3: Oh, he gets to throw his hand grenade and run.
31:56
Speaker 1: Phil Henry Show. Comedy gold.
31:59
Speaker 4: Yeah.
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Speaker 2: World famous Phil Henry Show. Executive produced by Phil Henry