Latest / Deep Transformation / Opening to the Absolute: The Mystery That Liberates with A. H. Almaas (Part 2)

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Opening to the Absolute: The Mystery That Liberates with A. H. Almaas (Part 2) · Deep Transformation

• 0:00
  Part
• 0:00
  two
• 0:00
  of
• 0:01
  our
• 0:01
  dialogue
• 0:01
  with
• 0:01
  Hamid
• 0:02
  Ali
• 0:02
  is
• 0:02
  a
• 0:03
  really
• 0:03
  deep
• 0:03
  dive
• 0:04
  into
• 0:04
  the
• 0:04
  fundamental
• 0:05
  nature
• 0:05
  of
• 0:05
  reality.
• 0:06
  And
• 0:07
  yet,
• 0:07
  as
• 0:07
  he
• 0:07
  points
• 0:08
  out,
• 0:08
  once
• 0:08
  we
• 0:09
  touch
• 0:09
  this
• 0:09
  reality,
• 0:10
  life
• 0:10
  becomes
• 0:11
  clear
• 0:11
  and
• 0:12
  simple
• 0:12
  in
• 0:13
  a
• 0:13
  remarkable
• 0:13
  way.
• 0:18
  Welcome
• 0:19
  to
• 0:19
  deep
• 0:19
  transformation.
• 0:21
  Self,
• 0:21
  society,
• 0:22
  spirit,
• 0:23
  life
• 0:23
  enhancing,
• 0:24
  paradigm
• 0:25
  rattling
• 0:26
  conversations
• 0:27
  with
• 0:27
  cutting
• 0:27
  edge
• 0:28
  thinkers,
• 0:28
  contemplatives
• 0:30
  and
• 0:30
  activists.
• 0:31
  With
• 0:31
  Dr.
• 0:32
  Roger
• 0:32
  Walsh
• 0:33
  and
• 0:33
  John
• 0:33
  Dupuy
• 0:34
  join
• 0:35
  us
• 0:35
  in
• 0:35
  the
• 0:35
  evolutionary
• 0:36
  fast
• 0:36
  lane
• 0:37
  as
• 0:37
  we
• 0:37
  take
• 0:38
  a
• 0:38
  deep
• 0:38
  dive
• 0:38
  into
• 0:40
  transformational
• 0:41
  practice.
• 0:42
  Peak
• 0:43
  experience,
• 0:44
  profound
• 0:45
  understanding,
• 0:47
  powerful
• 0:48
  contribution.
• 0:52
  In
• 0:52
  luminous
• 0:53
  Night's
• 0:53
  Journey,
• 0:54
  you
• 0:54
  talk
• 0:55
  about,
• 0:55
  in
• 0:55
  the
• 0:56
  earlier
• 0:56
  parts
• 0:56
  of
• 0:56
  the
• 0:56
  book,
• 0:56
  you
• 0:57
  talk
• 0:57
  about
• 0:57
  the
• 0:57
  soul,
• 0:58
  our
• 0:58
  essence,
• 0:59
  which
• 0:59
  includes
• 0:59
  personal
• 1:00
  essence,
• 1:01
  pearl
• 1:01
  of
• 1:01
  great
• 1:01
  price,
• 1:02
  as
• 1:02
  being
• 1:03
  an
• 1:03
  extension
• 1:04
  of
• 1:05
  being.
• 1:06
  Yeah.
• 1:06
  And
• 1:07
  the
• 1:07
  difference
• 1:07
  between
• 1:08
  absolute
• 1:08
  and
• 1:08
  being
• 1:09
  I'm
• 1:09
  not
• 1:09
  really
• 1:10
  quite
• 1:10
  sure
• 1:10
  of.
• 1:11
  And
• 1:12
  when
• 1:12
  I
• 1:12
  would
• 1:12
  be
• 1:12
  reading
• 1:13
  being,
• 1:14
  I
• 1:14
  would
• 1:14
  substitute
• 1:15
  the
• 1:15
  word
• 1:15
  God
• 1:16
  a
• 1:16
  lot
• 1:16
  for
• 1:17
  being.
• 1:17
  And
• 1:17
  that
• 1:17
  seemed
• 1:18
  to
• 1:18
  make
• 1:18
  sense
• 1:18
  to
• 1:19
  me.
• 1:19
  So
• 1:19
  how
• 1:20
  would
• 1:20
  you,
• 1:20
  how
• 1:20
  would
• 1:20
  you
• 1:20
  distinguish
• 1:21
  being?
• 1:22
  Or
• 1:23
  then
• 1:23
  later
• 1:23
  on
• 1:23
  in
• 1:23
  the
• 1:23
  book
• 1:24
  you
• 1:24
  talk.
• 1:24
  It's
• 1:24
  all
• 1:24
  co.
• 1:25
  Co
• 1:25
  emergent,
• 1:26
  all
• 1:26
  these
• 1:26
  things,
• 1:27
  you
• 1:27
  know,
• 1:27
  they're
• 1:27
  not
• 1:28
  separate
• 1:28
  things,
• 1:28
  they're
• 1:29
  all
• 1:29
  part
• 1:30
  of
• 1:30
  the
• 1:30
  same
• 1:31
  picture.
• 1:32
  Yeah.
• 1:34
  So
• 1:35
  being
• 1:35
  is
• 1:35
  what
• 1:36
  I
• 1:36
  call
• 1:36
  presence.
• 1:38
  Being
• 1:39
  mean
• 1:39
  the,
• 1:39
  the
• 1:40
  beingness,
• 1:41
  the
• 1:41
  existence,
• 1:42
  the
• 1:43
  ontology
• 1:45
  of
• 1:45
  whatever
• 1:47
  is
• 1:47
  manifest,
• 1:48
  whatever
• 1:48
  we're
• 1:48
  experiencing.
• 1:50
  Like
• 1:50
  if
• 1:50
  you
• 1:51
  feel
• 1:51
  the
• 1:51
  beingness
• 1:52
  of
• 1:52
  your
• 1:52
  body,
• 1:53
  the
• 1:53
  beingness
• 1:53
  of
• 1:53
  your
• 1:54
  soul,
• 1:55
  that's
• 1:55
  being.
• 1:56
  But
• 1:57
  absolute
• 1:58
  takes
• 1:58
  us
• 1:58
  to
• 1:59
  beyond
• 2:00
  being,
• 2:00
  to
• 2:01
  non
• 2:01
  being,
• 2:02
  to
• 2:02
  what
• 2:02
  they
• 2:03
  call
• 2:03
  emptiness,
• 2:03
  which
• 2:04
  is
• 2:04
  lack
• 2:04
  of
• 2:04
  healing.
• 2:05
  Non
• 2:05
  being
• 2:06
  mean
• 2:06
  none
• 2:07
  being.
• 2:08
  It's
• 2:08
  the
• 2:08
  funny
• 2:09
  thing,
• 2:09
  because
• 2:09
  non
• 2:10
  being
• 2:11
  in
• 2:12
  some
• 2:12
  sense
• 2:12
  is
• 2:12
  a
• 2:12
  negation
• 2:13
  of
• 2:13
  being.
• 2:14
  However,
• 2:15
  in
• 2:15
  the
• 2:15
  Buddhist
• 2:16
  tradition,
• 2:16
  they're
• 2:17
  wet,
• 2:17
  they're
• 2:17
  married,
• 2:17
  they're
• 2:18
  inseparable,
• 2:20
  you
• 2:21
  see,
• 2:21
  so
• 2:22
  there
• 2:22
  are
• 2:22
  two
• 2:22
  sides
• 2:23
  of
• 2:23
  the
• 2:23
  same
• 2:23
  thing.
• 2:25
  So
• 2:25
  everything
• 2:26
  is
• 2:26
  both
• 2:26
  being
• 2:27
  and
• 2:27
  non
• 2:27
  being.
• 2:28
  So
• 2:29
  there
• 2:29
  is
• 2:29
  a
• 2:29
  fullness
• 2:30
  on
• 2:30
  one
• 2:30
  side
• 2:31
  and
• 2:32
  like
• 2:32
  if
• 2:32
  you
• 2:32
  feel
• 2:32
  it
• 2:33
  from
• 2:33
  a
• 2:33
  certain
• 2:34
  vantage
• 2:35
  point,
• 2:35
  there's
• 2:35
  a
• 2:36
  fullness.
• 2:36
  If
• 2:36
  you
• 2:37
  feel
• 2:37
  it
• 2:37
  from
• 2:37
  another
• 2:38
  vantage
• 2:38
  point,
• 2:38
  it's
• 2:39
  completely
• 2:39
  nothing.
• 2:40
  It's
• 2:40
  a
• 2:40
  mysterious
• 2:41
  that
• 2:41
  way.
• 2:42
  And
• 2:43
  the
• 2:43
  mind
• 2:43
  cannot
• 2:44
  conceive
• 2:44
  of
• 2:45
  it,
• 2:45
  you
• 2:45
  know,
• 2:45
  you
• 2:46
  have
• 2:46
  to
• 2:46
  have
• 2:46
  it.
• 2:47
  Direct
• 2:47
  experience.
• 2:48
  Direct
• 2:48
  experience
• 2:49
  is
• 2:49
  very
• 2:49
  obvious,
• 2:50
  very
• 2:50
  clear,
• 2:50
  distinct.
• 2:52
  No.
• 2:54
  Yeah.
• 2:55
  To
• 2:55
  quote
• 2:55
  you
• 2:55
  amid,
• 2:56
  you
• 2:56
  say
• 2:56
  experientially,
• 2:57
  it
• 2:57
  is
• 2:58
  simplicity
• 2:58
  itself,
• 2:59
  clarity,
• 3:00
  lightness
• 3:00
  and
• 3:01
  freedom.
• 3:01
  Conceptually,
• 3:02
  it's
• 3:03
  paradoxical.
• 3:05
  Yeah,
• 3:07
  it
• 3:07
  did.
• 3:07
  Yeah.
• 3:09
  All
• 3:09
  the
• 3:10
  paradox,
• 3:11
  all
• 3:11
  the
• 3:11
  paradoxes
• 3:12
  come
• 3:12
  from,
• 3:12
  you
• 3:13
  know.
• 3:13
  Yeah.
• 3:14
  And
• 3:14
  I
• 3:15
  mean
• 3:15
  you,
• 3:15
  you're
• 3:15
  talking
• 3:16
  about
• 3:16
  the,
• 3:17
  the
• 3:17
  inseparability
• 3:18
  of
• 3:19
  being
• 3:19
  and
• 3:19
  non
• 3:20
  being.
• 3:20
  But
• 3:20
  you,
• 3:21
  you
• 3:21
  point
• 3:21
  to
• 3:22
  something
• 3:22
  even
• 3:23
  deeper,
• 3:24
  that
• 3:24
  at
• 3:24
  a
• 3:25
  certain
• 3:25
  profound
• 3:26
  depth
• 3:27
  of
• 3:27
  experience,
• 3:29
  one
• 3:29
  is
• 3:29
  required
• 3:30
  to
• 3:31
  let
• 3:31
  go
• 3:32
  of
• 3:33
  any
• 3:33
  belief
• 3:34
  in
• 3:34
  or
• 3:34
  experience
• 3:35
  of
• 3:36
  being
• 3:37
  and
• 3:37
  one's
• 3:38
  own
• 3:38
  being.
• 3:39
  Yeah,
• 3:39
  to
• 3:40
  get
• 3:40
  to
• 3:40
  experience
• 3:41
  non
• 3:41
  being,
• 3:42
  meaning
• 3:43
  the
• 3:43
  dissolving
• 3:44
  of
• 3:46
  being
• 3:46
  of
• 3:46
  any
• 3:47
  kind,
• 3:47
  whether
• 3:47
  it's
• 3:48
  one's
• 3:48
  being
• 3:49
  or
• 3:49
  universal
• 3:50
  being,
• 3:50
  all
• 3:50
  of
• 3:51
  them.
• 3:52
  So
• 3:53
  it
• 3:53
  is
• 3:53
  letting
• 3:53
  go
• 3:55
  of
• 3:55
  the
• 3:55
  individual
• 3:56
  soul
• 3:57
  and
• 3:57
  letting
• 3:58
  go
• 3:58
  of
• 3:59
  Sati
• 3:59
  Chanda.
• 4:01
  Both.
• 4:03
  The
• 4:04
  Vedantas
• 4:04
  wouldn't
• 4:05
  be
• 4:05
  happy
• 4:05
  to.
• 4:05
  Hear
• 4:05
  that
• 4:06
  that
• 4:06
  doesn't
• 4:07
  be
• 4:07
  eliminated.
• 4:12
  Hamid,
• 4:12
  in
• 4:13
  this
• 4:13
  text,
• 4:14
  you
• 4:14
  talk
• 4:14
  about
• 4:14
  having
• 4:15
  this
• 4:15
  experience,
• 4:17
  but
• 4:17
  then
• 4:17
  it
• 4:17
  was
• 4:18
  difficult,
• 4:20
  challenging
• 4:20
  to
• 4:21
  go
• 4:21
  from
• 4:21
  the
• 4:22
  absolute
• 4:22
  back
• 4:23
  into
• 4:23
  being
• 4:24
  Hamid
• 4:25
  and
• 4:25
  having
• 4:25
  a
• 4:25
  life
• 4:26
  and
• 4:26
  having
• 4:26
  a
• 4:26
  wife
• 4:27
  and
• 4:27
  having
• 4:27
  a
• 4:28
  house
• 4:28
  and
• 4:28
  food
• 4:28
  and
• 4:29
  trees
• 4:29
  and
• 4:29
  bugs
• 4:30
  and
• 4:30
  birds
• 4:31
  and
• 4:31
  all
• 4:31
  this
• 4:31
  stuff.
• 4:32
  And
• 4:32
  it
• 4:32
  seems
• 4:33
  like
• 4:33
  a
• 4:33
  major
• 4:34
  theme
• 4:34
  of
• 4:34
  this
• 4:35
  is
• 4:35
  that
• 4:36
  it
• 4:36
  can.
• 4:37
  There
• 4:37
  can
• 4:37
  be
• 4:37
  a
• 4:37
  reproach
• 4:38
  mind.
• 4:38
  It
• 4:38
  can
• 4:39
  be
• 4:39
  brought
• 4:39
  together
• 4:40
  and
• 4:41
  you
• 4:41
  can
• 4:41
  have
• 4:43
  a
• 4:43
  life
• 4:44
  at
• 4:45
  the
• 4:45
  same
• 4:45
  time,
• 4:45
  not
• 4:45
  being
• 4:46
  meshed
• 4:46
  in
• 4:46
  it.
• 4:48
  And
• 4:48
  that's
• 4:49
  the
• 4:49
  idea
• 4:49
  of
• 4:50
  freedom,
• 4:51
  that
• 4:51
  to
• 4:52
  have
• 4:52
  a
• 4:52
  life
• 4:52
  that
• 4:52
  you're
• 4:52
  not
• 4:53
  enmeshed
• 4:53
  in
• 4:53
  it.
• 4:54
  You
• 4:54
  know,
• 4:55
  a
• 4:55
  big
• 4:56
  principle.
• 4:56
  And
• 4:57
  this
• 4:57
  path
• 4:58
  is
• 4:58
  what
• 4:58
  I
• 4:59
  call
• 4:59
  being
• 4:59
  in
• 4:59
  the
• 4:59
  world
• 5:00
  and
• 5:00
  not
• 5:00
  being
• 5:00
  of
• 5:01
  it.
• 5:02
  Yes.
• 5:03
  If
• 5:04
  you
• 5:04
  are
• 5:04
  the
• 5:04
  absolute,
• 5:05
  any
• 5:07
  dimension,
• 5:08
  being,
• 5:08
  you're
• 5:08
  not
• 5:08
  of
• 5:09
  this
• 5:09
  world,
• 5:09
  because
• 5:09
  this
• 5:10
  world
• 5:10
  is
• 5:10
  physical
• 5:10
  and
• 5:11
  material
• 5:11
  and
• 5:12
  emotional,
• 5:12
  all
• 5:13
  of
• 5:13
  that.
• 5:13
  You're
• 5:13
  not
• 5:14
  your
• 5:14
  nature,
• 5:15
  not
• 5:15
  any
• 5:15
  of
• 5:15
  that.
• 5:16
  You're
• 5:16
  not
• 5:17
  of
• 5:17
  this
• 5:17
  world,
• 5:17
  but
• 5:18
  you're
• 5:18
  in
• 5:18
  it.
• 5:19
  So
• 5:20
  in
• 5:20
  the
• 5:20
  sense
• 5:21
  you're
• 5:21
  living
• 5:22
  life,
• 5:22
  a
• 5:22
  personal
• 5:23
  life,
• 5:23
  I
• 5:24
  mean,
• 5:26
  all
• 5:26
  the
• 5:26
  gurus
• 5:27
  who
• 5:27
  talk
• 5:27
  about
• 5:28
  there
• 5:28
  is
• 5:28
  no
• 5:29
  universe,
• 5:29
  they're
• 5:29
  still
• 5:30
  talking
• 5:30
  to
• 5:30
  people,
• 5:32
  you
• 5:32
  know,
• 5:32
  Remember
• 5:33
  NASA,
• 5:33
  Gaddada
• 5:33
  Maharaj?
• 5:36
  Yeah,
• 5:36
  I
• 5:36
  like
• 5:37
  him
• 5:37
  because
• 5:37
  he
• 5:37
  has
• 5:37
  many
• 5:38
  paradoxes.
• 5:39
  He'll
• 5:39
  be
• 5:40
  talking
• 5:40
  to
• 5:40
  a
• 5:40
  person
• 5:42
  and
• 5:42
  he's
• 5:43
  telling
• 5:43
  them
• 5:43
  that
• 5:44
  there's
• 5:44
  no
• 5:45
  individual
• 5:45
  and
• 5:46
  it's
• 5:46
  all
• 5:46
  in.
• 5:47
  There's
• 5:47
  only
• 5:48
  consciousness.
• 5:48
  But
• 5:49
  then
• 5:49
  he
• 5:49
  gets
• 5:49
  angry
• 5:50
  at
• 5:50
  them
• 5:50
  for
• 5:50
  not
• 5:51
  get.
• 5:51
  For
• 5:51
  not
• 5:52
  getting
• 5:52
  what
• 5:52
  he
• 5:52
  says.
• 5:53
  So
• 5:54
  obviously
• 5:54
  he's
• 5:54
  talking
• 5:54
  to
• 5:55
  somebody
• 5:57
  and
• 5:57
  he's
• 5:58
  contradicting
• 5:59
  himself
• 5:59
  in
• 5:59
  the
• 5:59
  moment.
• 6:00
  He's
• 6:00
  saying
• 6:01
  by
• 6:01
  being
• 6:01
  angry
• 6:02
  at
• 6:02
  them
• 6:02
  while
• 6:03
  you
• 6:03
  be
• 6:03
  angry
• 6:04
  at
• 6:04
  somebody
• 6:04
  if
• 6:04
  you
• 6:04
  believe
• 6:05
  they're
• 6:05
  only
• 6:05
  in
• 6:05
  your
• 6:06
  mind.
• 6:10
  Yeah,
• 6:11
  my
• 6:11
  mind
• 6:11
  could
• 6:11
  do
• 6:11
  that,
• 6:12
  by
• 6:12
  the
• 6:12
  way.
• 6:12
  Yeah.
• 6:16
  Ah,
• 6:16
  let's
• 6:17
  see.
• 6:17
  So
• 6:18
  many
• 6:18
  directions
• 6:18
  to
• 6:18
  go.
• 6:19
  John,
• 6:19
  I
• 6:19
  have
• 6:20
  a
• 6:20
  line,
• 6:20
  but
• 6:20
  is
• 6:21
  there
• 6:21
  some
• 6:21
  more
• 6:21
  you
• 6:21
  want
• 6:21
  to
• 6:22
  say?
• 6:22
  Yeah,
• 6:22
  I
• 6:22
  have
• 6:22
  a
• 6:23
  bunch
• 6:23
  of
• 6:23
  stuff
• 6:23
  too,
• 6:23
  but
• 6:23
  I
• 6:24
  want
• 6:24
  to.
• 6:24
  I
• 6:24
  don't
• 6:24
  want
• 6:24
  to
• 6:24
  go
• 6:25
  galloping
• 6:25
  off
• 6:25
  into
• 6:26
  God
• 6:26
  knows
• 6:26
  what.
• 6:27
  So
• 6:27
  I'm
• 6:27
  kind
• 6:27
  of
• 6:28
  pulling
• 6:28
  back.
• 6:29
  I
• 6:29
  had
• 6:29
  a
• 6:30
  couple
• 6:30
  of
• 6:30
  ending
• 6:31
  questions
• 6:31
  for
• 6:31
  you,
• 6:32
  but
• 6:32
  let
• 6:33
  me
• 6:33
  bring
• 6:33
  up
• 6:33
  this.
• 6:34
  This
• 6:34
  one
• 6:34
  thing
• 6:34
  you
• 6:35
  talked
• 6:35
  about,
• 6:36
  the
• 6:37
  ego.
• 6:37
  And
• 6:37
  now
• 6:38
  when
• 6:38
  you
• 6:39
  experience
• 6:39
  things,
• 6:40
  you
• 6:40
  experience
• 6:40
  things
• 6:42
  kinesthetically,
• 6:43
  you
• 6:43
  Feel
• 6:43
  it
• 6:43
  in
• 6:44
  your
• 6:44
  body.
• 6:45
  You
• 6:45
  see
• 6:45
  it
• 6:46
  as
• 6:46
  diamond
• 6:47
  multifaceted.
• 6:48
  And
• 6:49
  obviously
• 6:49
  you
• 6:49
  get
• 6:50
  it
• 6:50
  intellectually
• 6:50
  too.
• 6:52
  And
• 6:52
  after
• 6:53
  you
• 6:53
  studied
• 6:54
  and
• 6:54
  taught
• 6:54
  physics
• 6:54
  at
• 6:55
  Berkeley,
• 6:56
  you
• 6:56
  studied
• 6:57
  Reichan
• 6:57
  therapy.
• 6:58
  You
• 6:59
  think
• 6:59
  that
• 6:59
  was
• 6:59
  partly
• 7:00
  responsible
• 7:00
  for
• 7:01
  your
• 7:01
  Are
• 7:02
  helping
• 7:02
  you
• 7:02
  to
• 7:02
  be
• 7:02
  able
• 7:03
  to
• 7:03
  have
• 7:03
  such
• 7:04
  embodied.
• 7:06
  I
• 7:06
  think
• 7:06
  so.
• 7:06
  I
• 7:06
  think
• 7:07
  revelations
• 7:08
  that
• 7:08
  made
• 7:09
  me
• 7:10
  appreciate
• 7:11
  the
• 7:11
  body
• 7:11
  being
• 7:12
  open,
• 7:13
  free
• 7:14
  of
• 7:14
  tension,
• 7:15
  free
• 7:16
  of
• 7:16
  patterning,
• 7:17
  you
• 7:17
  know,
• 7:17
  historical
• 7:18
  patterning
• 7:19
  and
• 7:19
  open.
• 7:19
  And.
• 7:20
  And
• 7:20
  that
• 7:21
  really
• 7:21
  is
• 7:24
  my
• 7:24
  way
• 7:24
  of
• 7:24
  teaching
• 7:25
  is
• 7:25
  always
• 7:26
  experiencing
• 7:26
  presence
• 7:27
  through.
• 7:28
  In
• 7:28
  the
• 7:28
  body.
• 7:29
  You
• 7:29
  know,
• 7:30
  similar
• 7:31
  to
• 7:31
  the
• 7:31
  martial
• 7:31
  arts,
• 7:32
  where
• 7:32
  the
• 7:32
  body
• 7:32
  is
• 7:32
  important.
• 7:34
  So
• 7:34
  feeling
• 7:35
  the
• 7:35
  body
• 7:35
  is
• 7:36
  opening
• 7:36
  the
• 7:37
  body.
• 7:37
  Because
• 7:37
  really,
• 7:38
  especially
• 7:39
  if
• 7:39
  we
• 7:39
  want
• 7:39
  to
• 7:39
  learn
• 7:40
  about
• 7:40
  the
• 7:40
  soul,
• 7:40
  the
• 7:40
  soul
• 7:41
  is
• 7:41
  what's
• 7:41
  in
• 7:42
  the
• 7:42
  body.
• 7:43
  It's
• 7:43
  so
• 7:44
  enmeshed
• 7:44
  in
• 7:44
  the
• 7:44
  body,
• 7:45
  so
• 7:45
  separate
• 7:46
  from
• 7:46
  the
• 7:46
  body.
• 7:46
  It's
• 7:47
  what
• 7:47
  animates
• 7:47
  it.
• 7:48
  How
• 7:48
  can
• 7:49
  you
• 7:49
  recognize
• 7:50
  the
• 7:50
  soul
• 7:50
  of
• 7:51
  the
• 7:51
  body
• 7:51
  is
• 7:51
  not
• 7:52
  open?
• 7:54
  So
• 7:54
  I
• 7:54
  think
• 7:55
  learning
• 7:55
  of
• 7:55
  writing,
• 7:56
  therapy
• 7:57
  and
• 7:57
  biology
• 7:57
  and
• 7:58
  doing
• 7:59
  years
• 7:59
  of
• 8:00
  breath
• 8:00
  work
• 8:01
  and
• 8:01
  freeing
• 8:01
  the
• 8:02
  body
• 8:02
  and
• 8:02
  relaxing
• 8:03
  and
• 8:03
  opening
• 8:03
  it.
• 8:04
  And
• 8:04
  I
• 8:04
  think
• 8:05
  the
• 8:05
  one
• 8:05
  reason
• 8:06
  why
• 8:06
  I
• 8:06
  got
• 8:07
  to
• 8:07
  understand
• 8:08
  what
• 8:08
  the
• 8:08
  soul
• 8:08
  is
• 8:10
  experienced
• 8:11
  because
• 8:11
  it
• 8:11
  is
• 8:11
  really
• 8:13
  an
• 8:13
  inside
• 8:14
  of
• 8:14
  the
• 8:14
  body.
• 8:16
  And
• 8:16
  by
• 8:16
  freeing
• 8:17
  the
• 8:17
  body,
• 8:17
  as
• 8:17
  you
• 8:18
  said,
• 8:18
  Hamid,
• 8:19
  what
• 8:19
  are
• 8:20
  exactly
• 8:20
  you
• 8:20
  talking
• 8:21
  about?
• 8:21
  Releasing
• 8:22
  muscle
• 8:23
  tensions?
• 8:25
  What
• 8:25
  are
• 8:25
  you
• 8:25
  pointing
• 8:26
  to
• 8:26
  here?
• 8:27
  Well,
• 8:27
  if
• 8:27
  you
• 8:27
  read
• 8:28
  Reich,
• 8:28
  Wilhelm
• 8:29
  Reich,
• 8:30
  I
• 8:31
  mean,
• 8:31
  he
• 8:31
  takes
• 8:32
  Freud
• 8:33
  work
• 8:34
  about
• 8:35
  defenses
• 8:36
  and
• 8:36
  contraction
• 8:37
  and
• 8:37
  all
• 8:38
  of
• 8:38
  that,
• 8:38
  and
• 8:38
  he
• 8:38
  said
• 8:39
  all
• 8:39
  those
• 8:40
  appear
• 8:40
  in
• 8:40
  the
• 8:41
  body.
• 8:42
  There
• 8:43
  is
• 8:43
  no
• 8:44
  defense
• 8:45
  or
• 8:45
  resistance
• 8:46
  that
• 8:46
  doesn't
• 8:46
  have
• 8:47
  a
• 8:47
  counterpart
• 8:48
  in
• 8:48
  the
• 8:48
  body.
• 8:49
  And
• 8:49
  the
• 8:49
  body
• 8:50
  appears
• 8:50
  as
• 8:51
  contraction.
• 8:52
  Patterns
• 8:53
  of
• 8:53
  contraction,
• 8:54
  pattern
• 8:54
  of
• 8:55
  tension
• 8:55
  and
• 8:56
  opaqueness.
• 8:57
  So
• 8:57
  freeing
• 8:57
  the
• 8:58
  body
• 8:58
  is
• 8:58
  freeing
• 8:59
  it
• 8:59
  from
• 8:59
  those
• 8:59
  contraction,
• 9:00
  from
• 9:00
  those
• 9:00
  opaqueness,
• 9:01
  from
• 9:01
  the.
• 9:02
  From
• 9:02
  this
• 9:02
  tension.
• 9:04
  Because
• 9:05
  those
• 9:06
  tensions
• 9:06
  are
• 9:06
  not
• 9:07
  just
• 9:07
  physical
• 9:07
  tension
• 9:08
  because
• 9:08
  of
• 9:08
  accident,
• 9:09
  whatever.
• 9:09
  They
• 9:10
  really
• 9:10
  correspond
• 9:11
  to
• 9:11
  mental
• 9:13
  attitude
• 9:13
  and
• 9:14
  mental
• 9:14
  beliefs
• 9:14
  and
• 9:15
  stuff.
• 9:15
  Like
• 9:15
  they
• 9:15
  all
• 9:15
  go
• 9:16
  together.
• 9:16
  So
• 9:17
  right.
• 9:17
  In
• 9:17
  therapy
• 9:18
  by
• 9:18
  doing
• 9:19
  the
• 9:19
  work,
• 9:19
  the
• 9:19
  breathing
• 9:20
  work,
• 9:20
  whatever.
• 9:21
  What.
• 9:21
  It's
• 9:22
  not
• 9:22
  that
• 9:22
  the
• 9:22
  body
• 9:23
  just
• 9:23
  relaxes.
• 9:24
  Body
• 9:24
  relaxes
• 9:25
  by
• 9:25
  releasing
• 9:26
  emotional
• 9:27
  content.
• 9:30
  Yeah.
• 9:30
  And
• 9:31
  there's
• 9:31
  a
• 9:31
  principle
• 9:32
  called
• 9:32
  the
• 9:32
  psychophysical
• 9:33
  principle,
• 9:33
  that
• 9:34
  every
• 9:34
  psychological
• 9:35
  state
• 9:35
  has
• 9:35
  a
• 9:35
  somatic
• 9:36
  expression
• 9:37
  of
• 9:37
  some
• 9:37
  kind.
• 9:37
  It
• 9:38
  seems
• 9:38
  like
• 9:38
  one
• 9:38
  can
• 9:39
  harshly,
• 9:40
  I
• 9:40
  don't
• 9:40
  think
• 9:40
  completely
• 9:41
  release
• 9:42
  these
• 9:43
  psychological
• 9:44
  conflicts,
• 9:45
  defenses,
• 9:45
  et
• 9:45
  cetera,
• 9:46
  by
• 9:46
  somatic
• 9:47
  work.
• 9:48
  And
• 9:48
  it
• 9:49
  sounds
• 9:49
  like
• 9:49
  that's
• 9:49
  what
• 9:49
  you're
• 9:50
  pointing
• 9:50
  to.
• 9:50
  That
• 9:51
  really
• 9:51
  facilitates
• 9:52
  the
• 9:52
  psychological.
• 9:53
  Yeah,
• 9:54
  it's
• 9:54
  very
• 9:54
  helpful
• 9:55
  that
• 9:55
  way,
• 9:55
  actually,
• 9:55
  for
• 9:56
  many
• 9:56
  people,
• 9:57
  if
• 9:57
  you
• 9:58
  don't,
• 9:58
  you
• 9:58
  know,
• 9:58
  work
• 9:59
  in
• 9:59
  their
• 9:59
  body
• 9:59
  and
• 10:00
  to
• 10:00
  help
• 10:00
  liberate
• 10:01
  it.
• 10:01
  Difficult
• 10:02
  for
• 10:02
  them
• 10:02
  to
• 10:02
  experience
• 10:03
  presence
• 10:04
  or
• 10:04
  pure
• 10:04
  consciousness,
• 10:06
  because
• 10:06
  the
• 10:06
  tension
• 10:07
  makes
• 10:07
  it
• 10:07
  difficult
• 10:08
  to.
• 10:09
  You
• 10:09
  need
• 10:09
  to
• 10:10
  be
• 10:10
  relaxed,
• 10:10
  you
• 10:10
  need
• 10:11
  to
• 10:11
  be
• 10:11
  at
• 10:11
  ease.
• 10:11
  And
• 10:12
  the
• 10:12
  body
• 10:12
  need
• 10:12
  to
• 10:13
  be
• 10:13
  open.
• 10:14
  That's
• 10:14
  a
• 10:14
  valuable
• 10:15
  addition,
• 10:16
  Hamid,
• 10:16
  because
• 10:17
  there's
• 10:17
  not
• 10:17
  a
• 10:17
  lot
• 10:18
  of
• 10:18
  emphasis
• 10:19
  on
• 10:19
  that
• 10:19
  in
• 10:20
  at
• 10:20
  least
• 10:20
  some
• 10:20
  traditions.
• 10:21
  Of
• 10:21
  course,
• 10:21
  Hatha
• 10:22
  yoga
• 10:22
  would
• 10:22
  be
• 10:22
  the
• 10:23
  example
• 10:23
  of
• 10:24
  excellence
• 10:25
  of
• 10:26
  that,
• 10:27
  but
• 10:27
  it's
• 10:27
  not
• 10:28
  often
• 10:28
  emphasized.
• 10:29
  I
• 10:29
  haven't
• 10:29
  heard
• 10:29
  it
• 10:29
  stated
• 10:30
  so
• 10:30
  clearly
• 10:31
  sometime.
• 10:33
  Yeah,
• 10:33
  I
• 10:33
  mean,
• 10:34
  I
• 10:34
  think
• 10:34
  that's
• 10:34
  why
• 10:34
  many
• 10:35
  of
• 10:35
  the
• 10:36
  Indian
• 10:36
  tradition,
• 10:37
  they
• 10:37
  always
• 10:38
  practice
• 10:38
  yoga.
• 10:40
  You
• 10:40
  know,
• 10:40
  it's
• 10:40
  an
• 10:41
  important
• 10:41
  part
• 10:41
  of
• 10:41
  the
• 10:42
  thing
• 10:42
  to
• 10:42
  practice
• 10:43
  yoga
• 10:43
  too.
• 10:43
  So
• 10:43
  the
• 10:44
  body
• 10:44
  become
• 10:44
  more
• 10:45
  supple
• 10:46
  of
• 10:47
  tension.
• 10:48
  But
• 10:48
  you
• 10:48
  see,
• 10:48
  it
• 10:48
  is
• 10:49
  possible
• 10:49
  to
• 10:49
  experience,
• 10:50
  you
• 10:50
  know,
• 10:51
  transcendent
• 10:52
  state
• 10:52
  while
• 10:53
  the
• 10:53
  body
• 10:53
  is
• 10:53
  tense,
• 10:55
  still
• 10:55
  tension.
• 10:56
  The
• 10:56
  body
• 10:56
  is
• 10:57
  not
• 10:57
  liberated,
• 10:57
  But.
• 10:58
  But
• 10:58
  that
• 10:59
  becomes
• 10:59
  a
• 10:59
  dissociated
• 11:00
  state,
• 11:01
  the
• 11:01
  transcendent
• 11:02
  state
• 11:02
  that
• 11:02
  doesn't
• 11:03
  include
• 11:03
  the
• 11:03
  body.
• 11:05
  So
• 11:05
  you
• 11:05
  can
• 11:05
  experience
• 11:06
  it,
• 11:06
  can.
• 11:07
  It
• 11:07
  can
• 11:07
  be
• 11:07
  in
• 11:08
  a
• 11:08
  state
• 11:08
  of
• 11:08
  consciousness,
• 11:09
  free,
• 11:09
  whatever.
• 11:11
  But
• 11:11
  that
• 11:11
  doesn't
• 11:11
  inhabit
• 11:12
  the
• 11:12
  body,
• 11:13
  doesn't
• 11:13
  come
• 11:14
  through
• 11:14
  the
• 11:14
  body.
• 11:17
  Okay,
• 11:18
  so
• 11:18
  still
• 11:19
  limited
• 11:19
  by
• 11:19
  the
• 11:20
  somatic
• 11:22
  complexes,
• 11:23
  tensions,
• 11:24
  character
• 11:24
  armors.
• 11:25
  Yeah,
• 11:26
  they
• 11:26
  don't
• 11:27
  just
• 11:27
  go
• 11:27
  away
• 11:27
  because
• 11:28
  we
• 11:28
  are
• 11:28
  in
• 11:29
  a,
• 11:29
  you
• 11:30
  know,
• 11:30
  transcendent
• 11:31
  state.
• 11:33
  Just
• 11:33
  like
• 11:33
  ego's
• 11:34
  content
• 11:34
  doesn't
• 11:35
  go
• 11:35
  away
• 11:35
  by
• 11:36
  experiencing,
• 11:36
  you
• 11:37
  know,
• 11:37
  liberation.
• 11:38
  Know,
• 11:39
  awakening.
• 11:40
  Experience.
• 11:40
  State
• 11:40
  of
• 11:41
  awakening
• 11:42
  doesn't
• 11:42
  mean
• 11:42
  the
• 11:42
  ego
• 11:43
  is
• 11:43
  completely
• 11:43
  gone.
• 11:44
  But
• 11:44
  then
• 11:44
  you
• 11:45
  have
• 11:45
  to
• 11:45
  do
• 11:45
  the
• 11:45
  work
• 11:45
  of.
• 11:45
  Of
• 11:46
  clarification
• 11:46
  and
• 11:47
  purifying.
• 11:48
  Right,
• 11:48
  we
• 11:48
  talked
• 11:48
  about
• 11:49
  that
• 11:49
  before.
• 11:49
  So
• 11:50
  that
• 11:50
  you
• 11:51
  can
• 11:51
  actually
• 11:51
  become
• 11:51
  the
• 11:52
  vehicle
• 11:52
  or
• 11:52
  instrument
• 11:53
  of
• 11:54
  being
• 11:54
  of
• 11:54
  the
• 11:55
  absolute.
• 11:56
  So
• 11:57
  there's
• 11:57
  a
• 11:57
  lot
• 11:57
  of
• 11:57
  work.
• 11:58
  Well,
• 11:58
  not
• 11:58
  just
• 11:59
  the
• 11:59
  spath.
• 12:00
  I
• 12:00
  work
• 12:00
  with
• 12:01
  my
• 12:02
  work,
• 12:02
  which
• 12:03
  is
• 12:03
  that
• 12:03
  the
• 12:04
  working
• 12:05
  through
• 12:06
  one
• 12:07
  psychology
• 12:08
  and
• 12:08
  psychological
• 12:09
  history
• 12:10
  is
• 12:11
  one
• 12:11
  side
• 12:12
  of
• 12:12
  the
• 12:12
  inner
• 12:12
  work,
• 12:13
  the
• 12:13
  other
• 12:13
  side
• 12:14
  the
• 12:14
  discovery
• 12:17
  of
• 12:17
  our
• 12:18
  true
• 12:18
  nature
• 12:19
  and
• 12:20
  various
• 12:21
  possibilities.
• 12:22
  So
• 12:23
  they
• 12:23
  go
• 12:24
  hand
• 12:24
  in
• 12:24
  hand.
• 12:25
  The
• 12:25
  two
• 12:25
  go
• 12:26
  together.
• 12:27
  You
• 12:27
  know,
• 12:27
  I
• 12:27
  don't
• 12:28
  just
• 12:28
  talk
• 12:28
  about
• 12:29
  awakening
• 12:29
  to
• 12:29
  true
• 12:30
  nature.
• 12:31
  I
• 12:31
  do
• 12:31
  that
• 12:31
  at
• 12:32
  an
• 12:32
  important
• 12:34
  central
• 12:34
  part
• 12:35
  of
• 12:35
  the
• 12:35
  teaching.
• 12:36
  However,
• 12:37
  liberation
• 12:38
  from
• 12:38
  the
• 12:38
  conditioning
• 12:39
  of
• 12:39
  the
• 12:39
  past,
• 12:40
  from
• 12:40
  the
• 12:40
  patterning
• 12:41
  previous
• 12:42
  experience
• 12:43
  is.
• 12:44
  Is
• 12:44
  really
• 12:44
  important.
• 12:46
  Otherwise
• 12:47
  we
• 12:47
  cannot
• 12:48
  have
• 12:49
  to
• 12:49
  be
• 12:50
  in
• 12:50
  the
• 12:50
  world
• 12:50
  and
• 12:50
  not.
• 12:51
  We
• 12:51
  can't
• 12:51
  be
• 12:51
  in
• 12:52
  the
• 12:52
  world
• 12:52
  in
• 12:52
  a.
• 12:52
  In
• 12:53
  a
• 12:53
  free
• 12:53
  way.
• 12:54
  We
• 12:54
  can
• 12:54
  be
• 12:54
  not
• 12:55
  of
• 12:55
  it,
• 12:55
  but
• 12:55
  we
• 12:56
  can't
• 12:56
  be
• 12:56
  in
• 12:56
  the
• 12:56
  world
• 12:57
  in
• 12:57
  a
• 12:57
  full
• 12:58
  human
• 12:58
  way.
• 13:00
  Is,
• 13:00
  Is
• 13:00
  the.
• 13:01
  At
• 13:01
  one
• 13:01
  point
• 13:01
  you
• 13:02
  talk
• 13:02
  about
• 13:02
  the
• 13:02
  ego,
• 13:03
  memories
• 13:04
  and
• 13:05
  culture,
• 13:05
  anything
• 13:06
  that
• 13:06
  makes
• 13:06
  up
• 13:06
  the
• 13:07
  personal
• 13:08
  as
• 13:08
  being
• 13:08
  kind
• 13:08
  of
• 13:09
  a
• 13:09
  liquid,
• 13:09
  leaden,
• 13:11
  heavy
• 13:13
  thing.
• 13:14
  And
• 13:15
  it
• 13:15
  kind
• 13:15
  of
• 13:16
  changes
• 13:16
  into
• 13:18
  a
• 13:18
  pearl,
• 13:18
  you
• 13:18
  know,
• 13:19
  a
• 13:19
  luminescent
• 13:19
  pearl,
• 13:20
  which
• 13:20
  is
• 13:20
  a
• 13:20
  personal
• 13:20
  essence,
• 13:21
  I
• 13:21
  suppose.
• 13:22
  And
• 13:22
  my
• 13:23
  question
• 13:24
  is
• 13:25
  the
• 13:25
  ego,
• 13:27
  not
• 13:27
  the
• 13:27
  enemy,
• 13:27
  but
• 13:28
  a
• 13:28
  necessary
• 13:28
  stage
• 13:29
  in
• 13:30
  order
• 13:30
  to
• 13:32
  experience
• 13:32
  and.
• 13:33
  And
• 13:33
  to
• 13:33
  wake
• 13:33
  up.
• 13:34
  Can
• 13:34
  we
• 13:34
  skip
• 13:35
  ego
• 13:35
  and
• 13:35
  go
• 13:35
  directly
• 13:36
  to
• 13:36
  absolute?
• 13:38
  Yeah,
• 13:39
  that's
• 13:39
  true
• 13:39
  ego.
• 13:40
  I
• 13:40
  mean
• 13:40
  everybody,
• 13:41
  everybody
• 13:42
  grows
• 13:42
  up
• 13:42
  with
• 13:42
  an
• 13:42
  ego.
• 13:43
  So
• 13:43
  it's
• 13:44
  natural
• 13:44
  to
• 13:45
  have
• 13:45
  an
• 13:45
  ego.
• 13:45
  So
• 13:46
  you
• 13:46
  wonder
• 13:46
  if
• 13:46
  it's
• 13:46
  natural,
• 13:47
  why
• 13:47
  there
• 13:49
  it
• 13:49
  can't
• 13:49
  be
• 13:50
  mistake
• 13:50
  if
• 13:50
  it's
• 13:51
  natural
• 13:51
  for
• 13:51
  everybody.
• 13:53
  So
• 13:53
  it
• 13:53
  says.
• 13:54
  So
• 13:54
  that's
• 13:54
  why
• 13:55
  I
• 13:55
  see
• 13:55
  it
• 13:55
  as
• 13:55
  a
• 13:56
  step,
• 13:56
  as
• 13:57
  one
• 13:57
  stage,
• 13:57
  a
• 13:58
  development
• 13:58
  of
• 13:58
  the
• 13:58
  soul
• 13:59
  which
• 13:59
  prepares
• 14:00
  the
• 14:01
  life
• 14:02
  for
• 14:03
  more
• 14:04
  of
• 14:04
  an
• 14:05
  essential
• 14:05
  kind
• 14:06
  of
• 14:06
  individuation.
• 14:07
  I
• 14:08
  call
• 14:08
  the
• 14:08
  pearl.
• 14:09
  The
• 14:09
  leaden
• 14:10
  thing
• 14:10
  is
• 14:11
  more.
• 14:11
  The
• 14:12
  lead
• 14:12
  is
• 14:12
  one
• 14:13
  way
• 14:13
  of
• 14:13
  experiencing
• 14:14
  inner
• 14:15
  defensiveness.
• 14:16
  But
• 14:16
  it
• 14:16
  is
• 14:17
  a
• 14:17
  state
• 14:17
  of
• 14:17
  inertia.
• 14:19
  The
• 14:19
  inertia
• 14:19
  for
• 14:20
  the
• 14:20
  ego.
• 14:20
  How
• 14:21
  the
• 14:21
  ego
• 14:21
  doesn't
• 14:22
  change
• 14:22
  when
• 14:22
  the
• 14:22
  people
• 14:22
  say
• 14:23
  I
• 14:23
  work
• 14:23
  in
• 14:23
  it,
• 14:23
  but
• 14:23
  it
• 14:24
  doesn't
• 14:24
  change.
• 14:25
  That's
• 14:25
  because
• 14:25
  there's
• 14:25
  inertia.
• 14:26
  You
• 14:26
  have
• 14:26
  to
• 14:26
  get
• 14:27
  to
• 14:27
  the
• 14:27
  inertia
• 14:27
  part.
• 14:28
  When
• 14:28
  you
• 14:29
  feel
• 14:29
  inertia,
• 14:29
  it
• 14:29
  feels
• 14:30
  like
• 14:30
  lead
• 14:31
  doesn't
• 14:31
  move,
• 14:31
  doesn't
• 14:32
  flow.
• 14:34
  There's
• 14:34
  so
• 14:34
  much
• 14:34
  in
• 14:35
  this
• 14:35
  chapter
• 14:35
  on
• 14:35
  true
• 14:36
  nature.
• 14:36
  I
• 14:36
  mean
• 14:36
  this,
• 14:37
  this
• 14:37
  was,
• 14:39
  this
• 14:39
  was
• 14:39
  a
• 14:39
  mind,
• 14:40
  a
• 14:41
  mind
• 14:41
  blower
• 14:41
  in
• 14:42
  the
• 14:42
  best
• 14:42
  sense.
• 14:43
  We
• 14:43
  haven't
• 14:43
  talked
• 14:44
  about
• 14:44
  a
• 14:44
  couple
• 14:44
  of
• 14:44
  things
• 14:45
  that
• 14:45
  you
• 14:45
  emphasize.
• 14:46
  One
• 14:46
  is
• 14:47
  the
• 14:47
  whole
• 14:47
  relationship
• 14:48
  to
• 14:48
  space
• 14:48
  and
• 14:49
  time
• 14:50
  of
• 14:50
  true
• 14:50
  nature.
• 14:51
  And
• 14:51
  so
• 14:52
  that
• 14:52
  seems
• 14:52
  important.
• 14:53
  And
• 14:53
  then
• 14:53
  how
• 14:53
  one
• 14:54
  points
• 14:54
  to
• 14:54
  true
• 14:54
  nature.
• 14:56
  So
• 14:57
  that
• 14:57
  chapter
• 14:57
  about
• 14:58
  true
• 14:58
  nature
• 14:58
  I'm
• 14:59
  introducing
• 14:59
  through
• 15:00
  nature
• 15:01
  in
• 15:01
  some
• 15:01
  ways
• 15:02
  main
• 15:02
  feature,
• 15:03
  but
• 15:03
  in
• 15:04
  general
• 15:05
  an
• 15:05
  introduction
• 15:06
  to
• 15:06
  what
• 15:07
  comes.
• 15:07
  The
• 15:07
  chapters
• 15:08
  come
• 15:08
  after
• 15:08
  it
• 15:09
  where
• 15:09
  I
• 15:09
  go
• 15:10
  through
• 15:11
  different
• 15:11
  dimensions
• 15:12
  of
• 15:13
  that
• 15:14
  true
• 15:14
  nature.
• 15:14
  And
• 15:15
  more
• 15:15
  detail.
• 15:15
  Like
• 15:16
  I
• 15:16
  go
• 15:16
  there's
• 15:16
  a
• 15:17
  chapter
• 15:18
  on
• 15:18
  the
• 15:18
  absolute,
• 15:18
  for
• 15:19
  instance,
• 15:20
  detail
• 15:21
  in
• 15:21
  the
• 15:21
  fifth
• 15:21
  dimension.
• 15:23
  But
• 15:23
  he
• 15:23
  true
• 15:24
  nature
• 15:24
  is
• 15:24
  more
• 15:24
  general
• 15:25
  and
• 15:26
  brings
• 15:26
  out
• 15:27
  many
• 15:27
  features
• 15:28
  of
• 15:29
  what
• 15:29
  we
• 15:29
  call
• 15:30
  true
• 15:30
  nature.
• 15:31
  What
• 15:31
  I
• 15:31
  call
• 15:31
  true
• 15:32
  nature.
• 15:32
  Buddha
• 15:33
  is
• 15:33
  called
• 15:33
  Buddha
• 15:34
  nature.
• 15:34
  You
• 15:35
  know,
• 15:35
  the
• 15:35
  Indian
• 15:36
  will
• 15:36
  call
• 15:36
  it
• 15:36
  the,
• 15:37
  you
• 15:38
  know,
• 15:38
  the
• 15:38
  ultimate
• 15:39
  self
• 15:40
  and
• 15:40
  the
• 15:41
  Suvs
• 15:41
  will
• 15:42
  call
• 15:42
  the
• 15:42
  divine
• 15:42
  essence.
• 15:44
  And
• 15:44
  one
• 15:45
  of
• 15:45
  the
• 15:45
  things
• 15:45
  you
• 15:45
  emphasize
• 15:46
  is
• 15:47
  that
• 15:47
  true
• 15:47
  nature
• 15:48
  as
• 15:48
  the
• 15:49
  absolute
• 15:50
  ground
• 15:50
  of
• 15:51
  all
• 15:51
  phenomena
• 15:51
  in
• 15:51
  the
• 15:52
  universe
• 15:52
  is
• 15:54
  beyond
• 15:54
  space
• 15:55
  and
• 15:55
  time,
• 15:55
  that
• 15:56
  it
• 15:56
  creates
• 15:57
  space,
• 15:57
  time.
• 15:58
  And
• 15:58
  so
• 15:58
  it
• 15:59
  introduces
• 15:59
  these
• 16:00
  extraordinary
• 16:01
  paradoxes
• 16:02
  of
• 16:02
  experiencing
• 16:03
  it
• 16:03
  as
• 16:03
  infinite
• 16:04
  and
• 16:04
  eternal.
• 16:05
  And
• 16:05
  yet
• 16:06
  it's
• 16:07
  not,
• 16:09
  it's
• 16:09
  not
• 16:09
  quite.
• 16:11
  Yeah,
• 16:12
  infinite,
• 16:13
  eternal.
• 16:15
  That's
• 16:15
  how
• 16:15
  we
• 16:16
  can
• 16:16
  experience
• 16:16
  it
• 16:17
  from
• 16:17
  outside
• 16:17
  it.
• 16:19
  And
• 16:19
  when
• 16:20
  we
• 16:21
  see
• 16:21
  that
• 16:23
  vastness
• 16:24
  of
• 16:24
  it.
• 16:24
  And
• 16:25
  like
• 16:25
  an
• 16:25
  experience
• 16:26
  of
• 16:26
  the
• 16:26
  absolute
• 16:27
  or
• 16:27
  any
• 16:28
  of
• 16:28
  those
• 16:28
  dimensions
• 16:29
  is
• 16:29
  vast
• 16:29
  and
• 16:29
  it
• 16:29
  has
• 16:30
  no
• 16:30
  end
• 16:30
  to
• 16:30
  it.
• 16:31
  So
• 16:32
  that
• 16:32
  sums
• 16:32
  infinite.
• 16:34
  It
• 16:34
  feels
• 16:35
  infinite
• 16:35
  in
• 16:36
  terms
• 16:36
  seeing
• 16:37
  it
• 16:37
  feel
• 16:37
  like
• 16:37
  you
• 16:37
  can't
• 16:38
  see
• 16:38
  the
• 16:38
  end
• 16:38
  of
• 16:38
  it
• 16:39
  and
• 16:40
  feels
• 16:40
  infinite.
• 16:41
  So
• 16:41
  we
• 16:41
  say
• 16:41
  it's
• 16:42
  infinite
• 16:43
  since
• 16:43
  it
• 16:43
  is
• 16:44
  the
• 16:45
  non.
• 16:45
  The
• 16:46
  absolute
• 16:46
  part
• 16:47
  of
• 16:47
  it
• 16:47
  is
• 16:47
  the
• 16:48
  non.
• 16:48
  Being
• 16:48
  source
• 16:49
  of
• 16:49
  all
• 16:49
  being.
• 16:51
  Being
• 16:51
  appears
• 16:52
  in
• 16:52
  space
• 16:52
  and
• 16:52
  time,
• 16:54
  you
• 16:54
  know,
• 16:55
  so
• 16:55
  it
• 16:56
  manifests
• 16:57
  space
• 16:57
  and
• 16:58
  time.
• 16:58
  Because
• 16:59
  true
• 16:59
  nature,
• 16:59
  you
• 17:00
  cannot
• 17:00
  say
• 17:00
  it
• 17:01
  is
• 17:01
  space
• 17:01
  or
• 17:02
  time.
• 17:02
  It's
• 17:03
  not
• 17:03
  the
• 17:03
  time
• 17:04
  that
• 17:04
  passes,
• 17:04
  because
• 17:06
  no
• 17:06
  time
• 17:06
  passes
• 17:07
  in
• 17:07
  true
• 17:07
  nature
• 17:08
  itself.
• 17:08
  If
• 17:08
  time
• 17:09
  and
• 17:09
  space
• 17:09
  emerge
• 17:10
  from
• 17:11
  true
• 17:11
  nature.
• 17:11
  Yes.
• 17:12
  It's
• 17:12
  not
• 17:12
  held
• 17:12
  in
• 17:13
  time.
• 17:13
  Yes.
• 17:14
  But
• 17:14
  you
• 17:14
  see,
• 17:15
  saying
• 17:15
  that
• 17:15
  space
• 17:16
  and
• 17:16
  time
• 17:16
  emerge
• 17:17
  from
• 17:17
  true
• 17:17
  nature
• 17:18
  is
• 17:19
  really
• 17:20
  a
• 17:20
  very
• 17:21
  profound
• 17:22
  thing.
• 17:23
  Because
• 17:24
  even
• 17:24
  though
• 17:25
  on
• 17:25
  the
• 17:25
  spiritual
• 17:26
  level
• 17:27
  it
• 17:27
  says
• 17:28
  space
• 17:28
  and
• 17:28
  time
• 17:28
  are
• 17:29
  not
• 17:29
  fundamental,
• 17:31
  it
• 17:31
  says
• 17:32
  the
• 17:32
  physical
• 17:32
  level.
• 17:32
  And
• 17:33
  they
• 17:33
  are
• 17:33
  fundamental,
• 17:34
  you
• 17:34
  know,
• 17:35
  because
• 17:35
  they
• 17:35
  emerge
• 17:36
  from
• 17:37
  true
• 17:37
  nature.
• 17:38
  True
• 17:39
  nature
• 17:39
  creates
• 17:40
  space
• 17:40
  and
• 17:41
  time.
• 17:42
  Because
• 17:42
  there
• 17:43
  are
• 17:43
  many
• 17:43
  theories
• 17:44
  now,
• 17:44
  and
• 17:45
  quantum
• 17:45
  theory,
• 17:46
  whatever,
• 17:46
  they're
• 17:46
  trying
• 17:47
  to
• 17:47
  sort
• 17:47
  of
• 17:48
  make
• 17:48
  space
• 17:49
  and
• 17:49
  time
• 17:49
  not
• 17:50
  real
• 17:50
  out,
• 17:50
  created,
• 17:51
  but
• 17:51
  create
• 17:51
  from
• 17:52
  what?
• 17:52
  Not
• 17:52
  physically.
• 17:53
  They
• 17:54
  think
• 17:54
  of
• 17:54
  it
• 17:54
  as
• 17:54
  a
• 17:55
  quantum
• 17:56
  phenomena.
• 17:56
  Creates
• 17:57
  time
• 17:57
  and
• 17:57
  space.
• 17:58
  But
• 17:59
  that
• 17:59
  is,
• 18:00
  you
• 18:00
  know,
• 18:00
  from
• 18:00
  the
• 18:00
  perspective
• 18:01
  of
• 18:01
  spirituality,
• 18:02
  that
• 18:03
  not
• 18:03
  true.
• 18:03
  The
• 18:04
  space,
• 18:04
  the
• 18:04
  way
• 18:05
  we
• 18:05
  experience
• 18:05
  it,
• 18:05
  is
• 18:06
  created
• 18:06
  by
• 18:06
  true
• 18:07
  nature.
• 18:08
  So
• 18:08
  is
• 18:08
  time.
• 18:08
  And
• 18:09
  the
• 18:09
  time
• 18:09
  that
• 18:09
  passes,
• 18:11
  even
• 18:11
  when
• 18:11
  we
• 18:11
  experience
• 18:12
  timelessness,
• 18:14
  if
• 18:14
  we
• 18:14
  live
• 18:15
  in
• 18:15
  timelessness
• 18:15
  all
• 18:16
  the
• 18:16
  time.
• 18:16
  Right.
• 18:17
  Some
• 18:17
  can
• 18:18
  live
• 18:18
  in
• 18:18
  timelessness,
• 18:19
  meaning
• 18:19
  no
• 18:20
  time.
• 18:20
  The
• 18:21
  body
• 18:21
  ages
• 18:21
  anyway.
• 18:24
  And
• 18:24
  that
• 18:24
  is
• 18:25
  with
• 18:25
  the
• 18:25
  meaning
• 18:25
  of
• 18:26
  the
• 18:26
  passage
• 18:26
  of
• 18:27
  time.
• 18:27
  So
• 18:27
  the
• 18:27
  passage
• 18:28
  of
• 18:28
  time
• 18:29
  never
• 18:29
  ceases,
• 18:31
  even
• 18:31
  though
• 18:31
  we
• 18:31
  can
• 18:32
  live
• 18:32
  in
• 18:32
  timelessness.
• 18:35
  That's
• 18:36
  a
• 18:36
  paradox,
• 18:37
  you
• 18:37
  see.
• 18:38
  Yes.
• 18:39
  Because
• 18:40
  true
• 18:40
  nature
• 18:40
  is
• 18:41
  timeless.
• 18:42
  However,
• 18:42
  it
• 18:43
  also
• 18:44
  manifests
• 18:45
  time
• 18:45
  and
• 18:46
  space
• 18:46
  for
• 18:47
  life
• 18:48
  to
• 18:48
  happen,
• 18:49
  because
• 18:49
  life
• 18:50
  as
• 18:50
  people
• 18:50
  know
• 18:51
  it,
• 18:51
  it's
• 18:51
  in
• 18:52
  time
• 18:52
  and
• 18:52
  space
• 18:53
  and
• 18:53
  everything.
• 18:53
  I
• 18:54
  mean
• 18:54
  the
• 18:54
  whole
• 18:55
  universe,
• 18:55
  I
• 18:55
  mean
• 18:56
  the
• 18:56
  world
• 18:56
  of
• 18:56
  science
• 18:57
  and
• 18:57
  materiality
• 18:58
  is
• 18:58
  in
• 18:58
  space
• 18:59
  and
• 18:59
  time.
• 19:03
  And
• 19:03
  you
• 19:04
  your
• 19:04
  point
• 19:05
  that
• 19:05
  if
• 19:05
  one
• 19:06
  doesn't
• 19:06
  have
• 19:06
  a
• 19:06
  spiritual
• 19:07
  perspective,
• 19:07
  then
• 19:08
  space,
• 19:08
  time
• 19:09
  can
• 19:09
  seem
• 19:10
  absolute,
• 19:10
  as
• 19:10
  they
• 19:11
  did
• 19:11
  for
• 19:11
  Newton.
• 19:13
  It
• 19:14
  also
• 19:14
  could
• 19:14
  be
• 19:14
  very
• 19:15
  bleak.
• 19:15
  Yeah.
• 19:16
  Newton
• 19:16
  thought
• 19:16
  they
• 19:17
  were
• 19:17
  absolute,
• 19:18
  that
• 19:18
  God
• 19:18
  created
• 19:19
  space
• 19:19
  and
• 19:19
  time.
• 19:20
  And
• 19:21
  I
• 19:21
  think
• 19:21
  in
• 19:21
  some
• 19:21
  sense
• 19:22
  he
• 19:22
  was
• 19:22
  correct.
• 19:22
  If
• 19:23
  we
• 19:23
  take
• 19:23
  true
• 19:24
  nature
• 19:24
  to
• 19:24
  be
• 19:24
  God.
• 19:26
  However,
• 19:26
  at
• 19:26
  the
• 19:26
  present
• 19:27
  time,
• 19:27
  they're
• 19:28
  trying
• 19:28
  to
• 19:28
  make
• 19:28
  space
• 19:29
  and
• 19:29
  time
• 19:29
  a
• 19:30
  byproduct
• 19:30
  of
• 19:31
  other
• 19:32
  physical
• 19:32
  phenomena.
• 19:35
  Well,
• 19:37
  well.
• 19:38
  And
• 19:38
  in
• 19:39
  practical
• 19:39
  terms,
• 19:40
  I
• 19:40
  mean,
• 19:40
  I
• 19:40
  want
• 19:40
  to
• 19:41
  quote
• 19:41
  something.
• 19:41
  You
• 19:41
  say
• 19:42
  that
• 19:42
  true
• 19:43
  nature
• 19:43
  is
• 19:43
  beyond
• 19:44
  time
• 19:44
  and
• 19:44
  space.
• 19:45
  It
• 19:45
  can't
• 19:46
  be
• 19:46
  measured
• 19:47
  by
• 19:47
  either,
• 19:47
  because
• 19:48
  they're
• 19:49
  right.
• 19:50
  But
• 19:50
  what
• 19:50
  one
• 19:51
  can
• 19:51
  experience
• 19:52
  is,
• 19:52
  I
• 19:52
  quote,
• 19:53
  ineffable
• 19:54
  freedom.
• 19:56
  Yes.
• 19:58
  Well,
• 19:58
  to
• 19:58
  be
• 19:59
  true
• 19:59
  nature,
• 19:59
  the
• 20:00
  realization
• 20:00
  of
• 20:01
  oath
• 20:01
  to
• 20:01
  be,
• 20:01
  to
• 20:02
  recognize
• 20:02
  we
• 20:02
  are.
• 20:02
  That
• 20:03
  true
• 20:03
  nature
• 20:03
  is
• 20:04
  pure
• 20:04
  freedom.
• 20:04
  Because
• 20:05
  true
• 20:05
  nature
• 20:05
  is
• 20:05
  free
• 20:07
  essence
• 20:08
  of
• 20:08
  freedom.
• 20:10
  There's
• 20:10
  nothing
• 20:10
  that
• 20:11
  constrain
• 20:11
  it.
• 20:13
  And
• 20:13
  sometime
• 20:13
  in
• 20:14
  our
• 20:14
  conversations,
• 20:15
  probably
• 20:15
  in
• 20:16
  a
• 20:16
  later
• 20:16
  dialogue,
• 20:17
  we
• 20:17
  must
• 20:17
  have
• 20:18
  a
• 20:18
  conversation
• 20:19
  about
• 20:19
  the
• 20:19
  varieties
• 20:20
  of
• 20:20
  freedom.
• 20:20
  Because
• 20:21
  there's
• 20:21
  an
• 20:21
  evolution
• 20:22
  in
• 20:22
  your
• 20:22
  work,
• 20:23
  different
• 20:23
  kinds
• 20:24
  of
• 20:24
  freedom,
• 20:24
  which
• 20:25
  is
• 20:25
  very
• 20:25
  profound.
• 20:27
  But
• 20:27
  maybe
• 20:27
  we
• 20:27
  can
• 20:27
  extend
• 20:28
  this
• 20:28
  conversation
• 20:29
  about
• 20:29
  true
• 20:30
  nature
• 20:30
  being
• 20:30
  beyond
• 20:31
  space
• 20:31
  and
• 20:31
  time
• 20:32
  to
• 20:32
  the
• 20:32
  recognition
• 20:33
  that
• 20:33
  you
• 20:33
  emphasize
• 20:34
  that
• 20:34
  true
• 20:35
  nature
• 20:36
  is
• 20:36
  beyond
• 20:37
  all
• 20:37
  characterization,
• 20:38
  that
• 20:39
  we
• 20:39
  can
• 20:40
  point
• 20:40
  to
• 20:40
  it
• 20:40
  in
• 20:40
  various
• 20:41
  ways,
• 20:43
  it
• 20:43
  is
• 20:44
  radically
• 20:45
  unqualifiable.
• 20:46
  And
• 20:46
  I
• 20:47
  guess
• 20:47
  I
• 20:47
  hadn't
• 20:47
  thought
• 20:48
  of
• 20:48
  the
• 20:48
  connection
• 20:48
  here,
• 20:48
  but
• 20:49
  this
• 20:49
  way
• 20:50
  you're
• 20:51
  pointing
• 20:51
  to
• 20:52
  what
• 20:52
  Nagarjuna,
• 20:53
  the
• 20:53
  central
• 20:53
  philosopher
• 20:54
  of
• 20:54
  Mahayana
• 20:55
  Buddhism
• 20:56
  pointed
• 20:56
  to,
• 20:56
  that
• 20:56
  you
• 20:57
  can't
• 20:57
  say
• 20:57
  anything
• 20:58
  is,
• 20:58
  is
• 20:58
  or
• 20:59
  isn't,
• 20:59
  or
• 21:00
  Both
• 21:00
  is
• 21:01
  and
• 21:01
  etc.
• 21:02
  Etc.
• 21:03
  Maybe
• 21:03
  you
• 21:03
  could
• 21:04
  speak
• 21:04
  to
• 21:04
  that.
• 21:05
  Well,
• 21:06
  even
• 21:07
  when
• 21:07
  we
• 21:07
  talk
• 21:07
  about
• 21:08
  the
• 21:08
  absolute,
• 21:09
  we
• 21:09
  are
• 21:09
  really
• 21:11
  elaborating.
• 21:12
  And
• 21:12
  an
• 21:13
  experience
• 21:15
  and
• 21:15
  true
• 21:15
  nature
• 21:16
  can
• 21:16
  be
• 21:16
  even
• 21:16
  more
• 21:17
  mysterious
• 21:17
  than
• 21:17
  that,
• 21:19
  than
• 21:19
  what
• 21:19
  we
• 21:19
  call
• 21:19
  absolute
• 21:20
  in
• 21:20
  the
• 21:21
  sense
• 21:21
  at
• 21:22
  some
• 21:22
  point
• 21:22
  it
• 21:22
  becomes
• 21:24
  we,
• 21:24
  we
• 21:24
  have
• 21:25
  to
• 21:25
  go
• 21:25
  to
• 21:25
  another
• 21:27
  third,
• 21:27
  the
• 21:27
  fourth
• 21:28
  turning
• 21:28
  of
• 21:28
  the
• 21:29
  teaching,
• 21:29
  because
• 21:30
  absolutism
• 21:30
  of
• 21:31
  the
• 21:31
  end
• 21:31
  of
• 21:31
  the
• 21:31
  second
• 21:32
  turning,
• 21:33
  where
• 21:33
  you
• 21:34
  cannot
• 21:34
  say
• 21:34
  anything
• 21:35
  about
• 21:35
  true
• 21:35
  nature
• 21:36
  because
• 21:36
  whatever
• 21:37
  you
• 21:37
  say
• 21:38
  could
• 21:38
  be
• 21:39
  true,
• 21:39
  could
• 21:39
  be
• 21:39
  not
• 21:40
  true.
• 21:40
  You
• 21:40
  cannot
• 21:41
  determine
• 21:42
  it.
• 21:43
  And
• 21:43
  the
• 21:43
  determination
• 21:45
  that
• 21:46
  happened
• 21:46
  when
• 21:46
  you
• 21:46
  say
• 21:47
  this
• 21:47
  is
• 21:47
  true
• 21:48
  doesn't
• 21:48
  mean
• 21:49
  it's
• 21:49
  wrong,
• 21:50
  but
• 21:50
  it
• 21:51
  means
• 21:51
  there,
• 21:51
  there
• 21:52
  is
• 21:52
  a
• 21:52
  way
• 21:53
  of
• 21:53
  explaining
• 21:53
  true
• 21:53
  nature
• 21:54
  where
• 21:54
  that
• 21:54
  is,
• 21:55
  you
• 21:55
  cannot
• 21:55
  say
• 21:56
  that
• 21:56
  about
• 21:56
  it.
• 21:58
  And
• 21:58
  Ken
• 21:59
  Wilbur
• 21:59
  had
• 21:59
  a
• 22:00
  nice
• 22:00
  three
• 22:01
  part
• 22:02
  pointer
• 22:03
  to
• 22:03
  the
• 22:04
  way
• 22:04
  one
• 22:05
  can
• 22:05
  point
• 22:05
  to
• 22:05
  true
• 22:06
  nature.
• 22:06
  Saying
• 22:07
  one
• 22:07
  can
• 22:08
  use
• 22:08
  analogy.
• 22:09
  It's
• 22:09
  not
• 22:09
  this,
• 22:10
  but
• 22:10
  it's
• 22:10
  kind
• 22:10
  of
• 22:10
  like
• 22:11
  this
• 22:12
  or
• 22:13
  this
• 22:13
  via
• 22:13
  positiva
• 22:14
  or
• 22:15
  the
• 22:15
  negative.
• 22:16
  It's
• 22:16
  saying
• 22:17
  it's
• 22:17
  not
• 22:17
  this,
• 22:17
  it's
• 22:18
  not
• 22:18
  that
• 22:18
  netty.
• 22:19
  Nettie
• 22:19
  of
• 22:19
  the.
• 22:19
  Of
• 22:19
  the
• 22:20
  right
• 22:21
  or
• 22:22
  injunctive
• 22:23
  way.
• 22:23
  It's
• 22:24
  a,
• 22:24
  you
• 22:24
  know,
• 22:25
  to
• 22:25
  do
• 22:25
  this,
• 22:25
  practice
• 22:26
  yourself
• 22:27
  and
• 22:27
  experience
• 22:27
  it
• 22:28
  to
• 22:28
  yourself
• 22:28
  directly.
• 22:29
  It
• 22:29
  seems
• 22:30
  like
• 22:30
  that's
• 22:30
  a
• 22:30
  nice.
• 22:31
  He
• 22:31
  puts
• 22:31
  together
• 22:32
  those
• 22:32
  three.
• 22:32
  That's
• 22:33
  the
• 22:33
  only
• 22:33
  way
• 22:33
  to
• 22:33
  really
• 22:34
  know.
• 22:34
  Through
• 22:34
  experience.
• 22:36
  Yeah,
• 22:36
  I
• 22:36
  mean
• 22:37
  all
• 22:37
  spiritual
• 22:38
  teaching
• 22:38
  do
• 22:39
  that.
• 22:39
  And
• 22:39
  they're
• 22:39
  trying
• 22:40
  to
• 22:40
  get
• 22:40
  you
• 22:40
  to
• 22:41
  have
• 22:41
  the
• 22:41
  experience
• 22:43
  of
• 22:43
  true
• 22:43
  nature,
• 22:44
  which
• 22:44
  means
• 22:44
  experience
• 22:45
  of
• 22:45
  your
• 22:46
  freedom,
• 22:47
  basically
• 22:47
  your
• 22:48
  liberation
• 22:49
  and
• 22:50
  fulfillment
• 22:51
  and
• 22:51
  happiness
• 22:51
  and
• 22:51
  all
• 22:52
  of
• 22:52
  that.
• 22:53
  And
• 22:53
  it
• 22:53
  seems
• 22:53
  to
• 22:53
  me
• 22:54
  that
• 22:55
  in
• 22:55
  this
• 22:56
  inner
• 22:56
  work,
• 22:57
  not
• 22:57
  only
• 22:58
  is
• 22:59
  the
• 22:59
  only
• 22:59
  way
• 23:00
  one
• 23:00
  can
• 23:00
  really
• 23:01
  know
• 23:03
  these
• 23:03
  profound
• 23:04
  experiences,
• 23:04
  and
• 23:05
  particularly
• 23:05
  true
• 23:05
  nature,
• 23:06
  is
• 23:06
  through
• 23:06
  direct
• 23:07
  experience,
• 23:07
  but
• 23:07
  the
• 23:08
  depth
• 23:08
  of
• 23:09
  one's
• 23:09
  experience
• 23:09
  sets
• 23:10
  the
• 23:10
  limits
• 23:11
  on
• 23:11
  one's
• 23:11
  intellectual
• 23:12
  understanding
• 23:13
  also.
• 23:14
  Yeah,
• 23:14
  that's
• 23:14
  a
• 23:15
  good
• 23:15
  way
• 23:15
  of
• 23:15
  saying
• 23:16
  it.
• 23:16
  Yes.
• 23:18
  Because
• 23:20
  whatever
• 23:21
  we
• 23:21
  experience,
• 23:21
  the
• 23:22
  mind
• 23:22
  will
• 23:22
  conceptualize
• 23:23
  at
• 23:23
  some
• 23:24
  points.
• 23:24
  You
• 23:24
  know,
• 23:26
  each
• 23:26
  teaching
• 23:26
  does
• 23:27
  that
• 23:27
  they
• 23:27
  have
• 23:27
  a
• 23:27
  view
• 23:28
  for
• 23:28
  realization,
• 23:29
  like
• 23:29
  instruction.
• 23:30
  The
• 23:30
  view.
• 23:32
  The
• 23:32
  view.
• 23:33
  But
• 23:33
  what
• 23:33
  is
• 23:33
  the
• 23:34
  view
• 23:34
  is
• 23:34
  just
• 23:35
  a
• 23:35
  conceptual
• 23:37
  perspective
• 23:37
  about
• 23:38
  what
• 23:38
  the
• 23:39
  experience
• 23:39
  is,
• 23:40
  you
• 23:41
  see.
• 23:42
  But
• 23:42
  if
• 23:42
  we
• 23:43
  don't
• 23:43
  know
• 23:43
  it,
• 23:44
  our
• 23:45
  mind
• 23:45
  can't
• 23:46
  conceive
• 23:46
  of
• 23:46
  it.
• 23:47
  Many,
• 23:48
  many
• 23:48
  of
• 23:48
  the
• 23:48
  dimensions
• 23:49
  through
• 23:49
  nature
• 23:49
  are
• 23:50
  inconceivable
• 23:51
  because
• 23:51
  many
• 23:52
  of
• 23:52
  them
• 23:52
  are
• 23:52
  either
• 23:53
  paradoxical
• 23:54
  or
• 23:54
  unexpected
• 23:55
  or
• 23:56
  unimagined,
• 23:57
  unimaginable
• 23:59
  in
• 23:59
  terms
• 23:59
  of
• 23:59
  the
• 24:00
  subtlety
• 24:00
  and
• 24:01
  the
• 24:01
  difference
• 24:02
  and
• 24:04
  beauty,
• 24:05
  accuracy.
• 24:05
  All
• 24:06
  these
• 24:06
  things
• 24:06
  are
• 24:07
  actually
• 24:08
  cannot
• 24:08
  be
• 24:08
  conceived
• 24:09
  by
• 24:09
  the
• 24:09
  mind.
• 24:10
  So
• 24:12
  if
• 24:12
  we
• 24:13
  don't
• 24:13
  experience
• 24:13
  them,
• 24:13
  the
• 24:14
  mind
• 24:14
  doesn't
• 24:15
  know.
• 24:15
  But
• 24:16
  when
• 24:16
  we
• 24:16
  experience
• 24:17
  those
• 24:18
  people
• 24:18
  who
• 24:18
  have
• 24:18
  a
• 24:19
  good
• 24:19
  mind,
• 24:20
  they
• 24:20
  have
• 24:20
  quite
• 24:21
  a
• 24:21
  good
• 24:21
  time
• 24:21
  because
• 24:21
  they
• 24:22
  can.
• 24:22
  Their
• 24:23
  knowledge
• 24:23
  has.
• 24:23
  Explodes
• 24:24
  sort
• 24:25
  of.
• 24:26
  Yeah,
• 24:26
  you
• 24:26
  reach
• 24:26
  the
• 24:27
  limit
• 24:27
  and
• 24:27
  like
• 24:28
  you
• 24:29
  can't
• 24:29
  go
• 24:29
  beyond
• 24:29
  it.
• 24:30
  Yeah.
• 24:31
  In
• 24:31
  terms
• 24:31
  of
• 24:31
  knowing
• 24:32
  it
• 24:32
  through
• 24:32
  the
• 24:32
  mind.
• 24:33
  But
• 24:33
  if
• 24:33
  you
• 24:34
  experience
• 24:34
  it,
• 24:34
  that
• 24:35
  opens
• 24:35
  the
• 24:36
  mind
• 24:36
  further,
• 24:37
  you
• 24:37
  see.
• 24:39
  Yeah.
• 24:39
  If
• 24:39
  you
• 24:39
  experience
• 24:40
  through
• 24:40
  nature,
• 24:41
  it
• 24:41
  silences
• 24:42
  the
• 24:42
  mind
• 24:43
  through
• 24:44
  during
• 24:44
  the
• 24:44
  experience.
• 24:45
  But
• 24:45
  then
• 24:47
  the
• 24:47
  mind
• 24:47
  comes
• 24:48
  back,
• 24:48
  it
• 24:48
  has
• 24:49
  new
• 24:49
  content,
• 24:50
  new
• 24:50
  data
• 24:51
  that
• 24:51
  hasn't
• 24:52
  had
• 24:52
  before.
• 24:53
  It
• 24:53
  can
• 24:53
  think
• 24:54
  with
• 24:55
  and
• 24:56
  it
• 24:56
  can
• 24:56
  do
• 24:57
  it
• 24:57
  in
• 24:57
  a
• 24:57
  way
• 24:57
  that
• 24:58
  obstruct
• 24:58
  this
• 24:59
  experience
• 24:59
  if
• 24:59
  it
• 25:00
  holds
• 25:00
  on
• 25:00
  to
• 25:01
  the
• 25:01
  thought.
• 25:01
  Or
• 25:02
  it
• 25:02
  could
• 25:02
  do
• 25:02
  it
• 25:02
  in
• 25:03
  a
• 25:03
  way
• 25:04
  that
• 25:04
  opens
• 25:04
  up
• 25:04
  experience
• 25:05
  further.
• 25:06
  Yeah,
• 25:06
  and,
• 25:07
  and
• 25:07
  a
• 25:07
  lot
• 25:07
  of
• 25:07
  the
• 25:08
  book
• 25:08
  that,
• 25:08
  that
• 25:08
  I
• 25:09
  kind
• 25:09
  of
• 25:09
  got
• 25:09
  off
• 25:09
  the
• 25:09
  path,
• 25:10
  what
• 25:10
  we
• 25:10
  were
• 25:10
  doing
• 25:10
  before.
• 25:10
  I'll
• 25:11
  go
• 25:11
  back
• 25:11
  to
• 25:11
  the
• 25:11
  text
• 25:12
  if
• 25:12
  you'd
• 25:12
  like
• 25:12
  me
• 25:12
  to.
• 25:13
  But
• 25:13
  it,
• 25:13
  you,
• 25:14
  you
• 25:14
  talk
• 25:14
  about,
• 25:15
  you
• 25:15
  know,
• 25:15
  the
• 25:15
  integration
• 25:16
  you
• 25:16
  had,
• 25:16
  all
• 25:16
  these
• 25:16
  revelations,
• 25:17
  I
• 25:17
  mean,
• 25:17
  these
• 25:18
  experiences
• 25:19
  absolute
• 25:19
  of
• 25:19
  being
• 25:20
  a
• 25:20
  presence
• 25:20
  of
• 25:21
  reality,
• 25:21
  of
• 25:22
  the
• 25:22
  soul
• 25:22
  and
• 25:23
  essence
• 25:24
  and
• 25:24
  all
• 25:25
  of
• 25:25
  this
• 25:25
  stuff.
• 25:25
  And
• 25:25
  then
• 25:26
  at
• 25:26
  one
• 25:26
  point
• 25:27
  you
• 25:27
  felt
• 25:27
  like,
• 25:28
  how
• 25:28
  can
• 25:28
  I
• 25:28
  go
• 25:29
  back,
• 25:29
  you
• 25:29
  know,
• 25:29
  how
• 25:30
  can
• 25:30
  I
• 25:30
  go
• 25:30
  back
• 25:30
  into
• 25:30
  the
• 25:31
  world
• 25:31
  and
• 25:32
  be,
• 25:33
  as
• 25:33
  you
• 25:33
  said,
• 25:33
  be
• 25:34
  part
• 25:34
  of
• 25:34
  it,
• 25:34
  but
• 25:34
  not
• 25:35
  of
• 25:35
  it.
• 25:36
  And
• 25:36
  I
• 25:37
  wanted
• 25:37
  to
• 25:37
  ask
• 25:38
  you,
• 25:38
  this
• 25:38
  is
• 25:39
  personal.
• 25:39
  There's
• 25:40
  a
• 25:40
  lot
• 25:40
  of
• 25:40
  really
• 25:41
  what
• 25:41
  I
• 25:41
  would
• 25:41
  say
• 25:41
  bad
• 25:42
  things
• 25:42
  going
• 25:42
  on
• 25:42
  in
• 25:43
  our
• 25:43
  country
• 25:43
  right
• 25:43
  now,
• 25:43
  like
• 25:44
  our
• 25:44
  constitutional
• 25:45
  democracy
• 25:45
  is
• 25:45
  being
• 25:46
  destroyed.
• 25:47
  And
• 25:47
  I
• 25:47
  wonder,
• 25:49
  you
• 25:49
  know,
• 25:49
  how
• 25:49
  do
• 25:50
  we
• 25:50
  act
• 25:50
  on
• 25:50
  that?
• 25:50
  And
• 25:50
  I've
• 25:50
  got
• 25:51
  the
• 25:51
  intuition
• 25:51
  that
• 25:51
  I
• 25:52
  should
• 25:52
  resist,
• 25:52
  but
• 25:53
  I
• 25:53
  don't
• 25:53
  know
• 25:53
  what
• 25:53
  that
• 25:53
  resistance
• 25:54
  should
• 25:54
  look
• 25:54
  like.
• 25:55
  I
• 25:55
  don't
• 25:55
  want
• 25:55
  to
• 25:55
  be
• 25:55
  part
• 25:55
  of
• 25:55
  the
• 25:56
  problem,
• 25:56
  you
• 25:57
  know,
• 25:57
  I
• 25:57
  want
• 25:57
  to
• 25:57
  be
• 25:57
  part
• 25:58
  of
• 25:58
  the
• 25:58
  solution.
• 25:58
  So
• 25:59
  if
• 25:59
  you
• 25:59
  have
• 25:59
  any
• 25:59
  insights
• 26:00
  on.
• 26:00
  That,
• 26:00
  I
• 26:00
  would
• 26:00
  be
• 26:01
  deep
• 26:01
  these
• 26:01
  days.
• 26:02
  How
• 26:02
  to
• 26:02
  tell
• 26:02
  what's
• 26:03
  the
• 26:03
  position
• 26:03
  to
• 26:04
  take.
• 26:04
  Right.
• 26:05
  Yeah.
• 26:05
  I
• 26:05
  don't,
• 26:05
  I
• 26:06
  don't
• 26:06
  know
• 26:06
  if
• 26:06
  I'm
• 26:06
  just
• 26:06
  angry
• 26:07
  and
• 26:07
  shout
• 26:07
  and
• 26:07
  scream.
• 26:07
  Is
• 26:08
  that
• 26:08
  just
• 26:08
  going
• 26:08
  to
• 26:08
  harden
• 26:08
  the
• 26:09
  other
• 26:09
  side?
• 26:09
  I'm
• 26:10
  not
• 26:10
  sure.
• 26:11
  It's.
• 26:11
  It's
• 26:11
  a
• 26:11
  co
• 26:11
  on
• 26:12
  for
• 26:12
  me.
• 26:12
  Resist.
• 26:13
  But
• 26:13
  what
• 26:14
  is
• 26:14
  resistance?
• 26:14
  How
• 26:15
  do
• 26:15
  you
• 26:15
  do
• 26:15
  that?
• 26:18
  Yeah,
• 26:18
  I
• 26:19
  think
• 26:20
  the
• 26:20
  way
• 26:20
  I
• 26:21
  really
• 26:21
  take
• 26:21
  it
• 26:22
  is
• 26:22
  that
• 26:23
  important
• 26:24
  thing
• 26:24
  is
• 26:25
  that
• 26:25
  I
• 26:25
  am
• 26:25
  myself,
• 26:27
  that
• 26:27
  I
• 26:27
  am
• 26:28
  free
• 26:28
  and
• 26:29
  recognize
• 26:29
  that
• 26:30
  I
• 26:30
  am
• 26:31
  not
• 26:31
  only
• 26:31
  free,
• 26:32
  but
• 26:33
  inured
• 26:34
  from
• 26:35
  the
• 26:35
  influence
• 26:35
  of
• 26:35
  all
• 26:36
  these
• 26:36
  things,
• 26:37
  all
• 26:37
  these
• 26:37
  things
• 26:38
  happening
• 26:38
  around
• 26:38
  me.
• 26:39
  I
• 26:39
  mean,
• 26:39
  it's
• 26:40
  much
• 26:40
  worse,
• 26:41
  much
• 26:42
  more
• 26:42
  chaos,
• 26:43
  much
• 26:43
  more
• 26:43
  suffering
• 26:44
  and
• 26:44
  fear
• 26:45
  and
• 26:45
  anger
• 26:45
  than
• 26:46
  it
• 26:46
  used
• 26:46
  to
• 26:46
  be
• 26:46
  20
• 26:47
  years
• 26:47
  ago.
• 26:48
  Yes,
• 26:48
  right.
• 26:49
  However,
• 26:50
  there
• 26:50
  was
• 26:50
  always
• 26:51
  anger,
• 26:51
  fear,
• 26:52
  whatever.
• 26:52
  There's
• 26:52
  nothing
• 26:53
  new,
• 26:53
  it's
• 26:54
  just
• 26:54
  more
• 26:54
  intense.
• 26:56
  Right.
• 26:57
  And
• 26:58
  just
• 26:58
  like
• 26:58
  20
• 26:59
  years
• 26:59
  ago,
• 27:00
  we
• 27:00
  still
• 27:00
  needed
• 27:01
  to
• 27:01
  be
• 27:01
  ourself,
• 27:02
  to
• 27:02
  be
• 27:02
  free
• 27:03
  from
• 27:03
  all
• 27:03
  the
• 27:03
  anger
• 27:04
  and
• 27:04
  fear
• 27:04
  and
• 27:05
  all
• 27:05
  these
• 27:05
  things.
• 27:06
  Now
• 27:06
  the
• 27:06
  need
• 27:06
  is
• 27:07
  even
• 27:07
  stronger.
• 27:09
  We
• 27:09
  need
• 27:10
  to
• 27:10
  be
• 27:10
  grounded
• 27:10
  in
• 27:11
  what
• 27:11
  we
• 27:11
  are,
• 27:13
  so
• 27:13
  that
• 27:13
  the
• 27:14
  fear,
• 27:14
  I
• 27:15
  mean,
• 27:15
  I
• 27:15
  feel
• 27:15
  the
• 27:16
  sadness
• 27:16
  and
• 27:17
  the
• 27:17
  fear
• 27:17
  of
• 27:17
  the
• 27:18
  world.
• 27:18
  I
• 27:18
  am
• 27:18
  aware
• 27:19
  of
• 27:19
  it,
• 27:20
  but
• 27:20
  what
• 27:21
  I
• 27:21
  am
• 27:21
  is
• 27:22
  not
• 27:22
  touched
• 27:22
  by
• 27:23
  it.
• 27:23
  You
• 27:23
  know,
• 27:23
  I'm
• 27:24
  aware
• 27:24
  of
• 27:24
  it,
• 27:24
  feel
• 27:25
  it,
• 27:25
  sympathize
• 27:26
  with
• 27:26
  it,
• 27:27
  but
• 27:27
  I
• 27:27
  am
• 27:29
  not
• 27:29
  touched
• 27:30
  by
• 27:30
  it
• 27:30
  because
• 27:30
  I
• 27:30
  am
• 27:31
  something
• 27:31
  that
• 27:31
  is
• 27:32
  indestructible,
• 27:33
  you
• 27:34
  know,
• 27:34
  that
• 27:35
  its
• 27:35
  purity
• 27:36
  cannot
• 27:36
  be
• 27:36
  marred.
• 27:37
  And
• 27:38
  from
• 27:38
  that,
• 27:39
  depending
• 27:39
  on
• 27:40
  the
• 27:40
  situation,
• 27:41
  what
• 27:41
  expression
• 27:42
  comes
• 27:43
  wouldn't
• 27:43
  be
• 27:44
  a
• 27:44
  natural
• 27:44
  obvious
• 27:45
  thing.
• 27:45
  That
• 27:45
  happens
• 27:46
  and
• 27:46
  depends
• 27:47
  on
• 27:47
  the
• 27:47
  situation.
• 27:47
  It
• 27:48
  depends
• 27:48
  on
• 27:49
  what
• 27:49
  is
• 27:49
  your
• 27:50
  place
• 27:51
  in
• 27:51
  life,
• 27:52
  you
• 27:52
  know,
• 27:52
  what
• 27:53
  kind
• 27:53
  of
• 27:53
  job
• 27:53
  you
• 27:53
  have,
• 27:54
  what
• 27:54
  kind
• 27:54
  of
• 27:54
  position,
• 27:55
  what
• 27:55
  kind
• 27:56
  of
• 27:56
  reputation.
• 27:57
  All
• 27:57
  of
• 27:57
  these
• 27:58
  can
• 27:58
  determine
• 27:59
  what
• 28:00
  action
• 28:00
  will
• 28:01
  arise
• 28:01
  from
• 28:01
  you.
• 28:04
  But
• 28:04
  it
• 28:05
  has
• 28:05
  to
• 28:05
  be
• 28:05
  informed
• 28:06
  by
• 28:06
  the
• 28:06
  truth
• 28:06
  of
• 28:06
  our
• 28:07
  inner
• 28:07
  nature.
• 28:08
  Otherwise
• 28:08
  you're
• 28:08
  lost.
• 28:10
  Many
• 28:10
  people
• 28:11
  these
• 28:11
  days
• 28:11
  are
• 28:11
  actually
• 28:12
  completely
• 28:12
  lost.
• 28:12
  They
• 28:13
  don't
• 28:13
  know
• 28:13
  what
• 28:13
  is
• 28:13
  true,
• 28:14
  up
• 28:15
  and
• 28:15
  down
• 28:15
  and
• 28:15
  you
• 28:16
  know,
• 28:16
  they're
• 28:16
  reacting
• 28:17
  one
• 28:17
  way
• 28:17
  or
• 28:17
  another.
• 28:18
  It's
• 28:19
  sad,
• 28:19
  you
• 28:20
  know,
• 28:20
  but
• 28:20
  you
• 28:20
  know,
• 28:21
  if
• 28:21
  we
• 28:21
  grounded
• 28:22
  in
• 28:22
  our
• 28:22
  true
• 28:23
  nature,
• 28:23
  at
• 28:23
  least
• 28:24
  we
• 28:25
  are
• 28:25
  aware
• 28:25
  of
• 28:25
  all
• 28:26
  these
• 28:26
  things,
• 28:26
  but
• 28:26
  we're
• 28:27
  not
• 28:27
  embroiled
• 28:28
  in
• 28:28
  them.
• 28:28
  And
• 28:28
  amid
• 28:29
  you
• 28:30
  mentioned
• 28:30
  that
• 28:31
  this,
• 28:32
  your
• 28:33
  inner
• 28:33
  work
• 28:34
  allows
• 28:34
  you
• 28:35
  to.
• 28:36
  To
• 28:36
  be
• 28:36
  aware,
• 28:36
  but
• 28:37
  not
• 28:37
  to
• 28:37
  be
• 28:38
  thrown
• 28:38
  about
• 28:39
  by
• 28:40
  the
• 28:40
  events
• 28:41
  of
• 28:41
  the
• 28:41
  world.
• 28:41
  And
• 28:42
  that's
• 28:42
  often
• 28:43
  misunderstood
• 28:44
  as
• 28:44
  not
• 28:45
  caring.
• 28:46
  But
• 28:46
  I
• 28:47
  think
• 28:47
  you're
• 28:47
  pointing
• 28:48
  out
• 28:48
  that
• 28:49
  and
• 28:49
  a
• 28:49
  number
• 28:50
  of
• 28:50
  traditions
• 28:50
  do
• 28:51
  that.
• 28:51
  That
• 28:51
  kind
• 28:52
  of
• 28:52
  profound
• 28:52
  equanimity
• 28:53
  allows
• 28:54
  a
• 28:54
  deeper
• 28:54
  caring
• 28:55
  to
• 28:55
  emerge
• 28:56
  and
• 28:56
  more
• 28:56
  skillful
• 28:57
  responses.
• 28:58
  Yeah,
• 28:58
  I
• 28:58
  mean,
• 28:59
  because
• 28:59
  part.
• 29:00
  True
• 29:00
  nature
• 29:00
  manifests
• 29:01
  also
• 29:03
  as
• 29:03
  compassion,
• 29:04
  as
• 29:04
  love,
• 29:05
  as
• 29:05
  sensitivity,
• 29:07
  as
• 29:07
  generosity,
• 29:08
  as
• 29:08
  tolerance.
• 29:09
  All
• 29:10
  of
• 29:10
  these
• 29:10
  things,
• 29:10
  these
• 29:11
  are
• 29:11
  manifestations.
• 29:12
  So
• 29:12
  our
• 29:13
  interaction
• 29:13
  with
• 29:14
  the
• 29:14
  world
• 29:14
  will
• 29:15
  embody
• 29:15
  all
• 29:16
  these
• 29:16
  things,
• 29:17
  all
• 29:17
  these
• 29:17
  true
• 29:18
  values.
• 29:19
  People
• 29:20
  talk
• 29:20
  about
• 29:20
  values
• 29:21
  these
• 29:21
  days
• 29:21
  and
• 29:22
  I
• 29:22
  hear
• 29:22
  politics
• 29:23
  say,
• 29:23
  well,
• 29:24
  I
• 29:24
  changed
• 29:24
  from
• 29:24
  one
• 29:25
  thing,
• 29:25
  I
• 29:25
  changed
• 29:25
  my
• 29:25
  values.
• 29:26
  I
• 29:26
  said,
• 29:26
  what?
• 29:27
  How
• 29:27
  do
• 29:27
  you
• 29:28
  change
• 29:28
  your
• 29:28
  values?
• 29:29
  Values
• 29:29
  are
• 29:29
  values.
• 29:30
  You
• 29:30
  don't
• 29:30
  change
• 29:30
  your
• 29:31
  values,
• 29:31
  you
• 29:31
  change
• 29:31
  your
• 29:32
  beliefs
• 29:32
  or
• 29:32
  positions,
• 29:33
  but
• 29:33
  about
• 29:33
  things,
• 29:34
  about
• 29:35
  issues.
• 29:35
  But
• 29:36
  if
• 29:36
  you
• 29:36
  change
• 29:36
  your
• 29:37
  values
• 29:37
  mean
• 29:37
  you
• 29:37
  don't
• 29:38
  have
• 29:38
  values.
• 29:39
  That's
• 29:39
  simple
• 29:39
  as
• 29:39
  that
• 29:42
  so.
• 29:42
  But
• 29:42
  the
• 29:42
  values
• 29:43
  of
• 29:43
  true
• 29:44
  nature
• 29:44
  are
• 29:44
  fundamental
• 29:45
  and
• 29:45
  eternal.
• 29:46
  Yes.
• 29:47
  You
• 29:47
  know.
• 29:48
  Yeah.
• 29:49
  So
• 29:49
  our
• 29:49
  job
• 29:49
  is
• 29:49
  to
• 29:50
  manifest
• 29:50
  those,
• 29:51
  work
• 29:51
  on
• 29:51
  ourselves
• 29:52
  and
• 29:52
  manifest
• 29:52
  those.
• 29:53
  Those
• 29:54
  essential
• 29:54
  values.
• 29:55
  Yeah.
• 29:55
  How
• 29:56
  do
• 29:56
  you
• 29:56
  manifest
• 29:56
  those
• 29:57
  eternal
• 29:57
  values
• 29:58
  and
• 29:58
  not
• 29:59
  just
• 29:59
  now,
• 30:00
  all
• 30:00
  the
• 30:00
  time?
• 30:02
  Even
• 30:02
  things
• 30:02
  get
• 30:03
  easy
• 30:03
  and
• 30:03
  obvious
• 30:04
  and
• 30:04
  clear.
• 30:04
  We
• 30:04
  still
• 30:05
  need
• 30:05
  to
• 30:05
  manifest
• 30:06
  those.
• 30:07
  Amen.
• 30:08
  Yeah.
• 30:08
  Good.
• 30:09
  Did
• 30:09
  you
• 30:09
  have
• 30:09
  something?
• 30:10
  Well,
• 30:10
  there
• 30:10
  was
• 30:11
  an
• 30:11
  association
• 30:11
  I
• 30:12
  had
• 30:12
  which
• 30:12
  was
• 30:13
  that
• 30:13
  I
• 30:13
  find
• 30:14
  it
• 30:14
  very
• 30:14
  helpful,
• 30:14
  Hamid,
• 30:15
  that
• 30:15
  you
• 30:15
  emphasize
• 30:16
  the
• 30:17
  many
• 30:18
  essential
• 30:18
  qualities
• 30:19
  that
• 30:20
  true
• 30:20
  nature
• 30:20
  can
• 30:20
  take.
• 30:21
  All
• 30:21
  these
• 30:22
  many
• 30:22
  cases
• 30:23
  described
• 30:23
  as
• 30:23
  classic
• 30:24
  virtues,
• 30:24
  that
• 30:24
  they're
• 30:25
  all
• 30:25
  expressions
• 30:25
  of
• 30:25
  true
• 30:26
  nature.
• 30:27
  And
• 30:27
  I
• 30:27
  find
• 30:27
  that
• 30:27
  very
• 30:28
  helpful
• 30:28
  compared
• 30:29
  to
• 30:29
  so
• 30:30
  many
• 30:30
  traditions
• 30:30
  which
• 30:31
  say
• 30:31
  true
• 30:31
  nature
• 30:32
  is
• 30:32
  this.
• 30:32
  It's
• 30:33
  consciousness
• 30:34
  or
• 30:34
  it's
• 30:34
  being
• 30:34
  or
• 30:35
  it's
• 30:35
  some.
• 30:35
  It's
• 30:36
  one
• 30:36
  thing.
• 30:37
  And
• 30:37
  there's
• 30:38
  not.
• 30:38
  Doesn't
• 30:39
  seem,
• 30:39
  at
• 30:39
  least
• 30:39
  as
• 30:40
  in
• 30:40
  my
• 30:40
  reading,
• 30:41
  that
• 30:41
  there's
• 30:42
  the
• 30:43
  emphasis
• 30:43
  on
• 30:44
  the.
• 30:44
  The
• 30:44
  manifold
• 30:45
  virtues
• 30:46
  that
• 30:46
  are
• 30:47
  all
• 30:47
  expressions
• 30:48
  of
• 30:48
  true
• 30:48
  nature.
• 30:48
  Yeah.
• 30:49
  I
• 30:49
  mean,
• 30:50
  the
• 30:50
  quality
• 30:50
  is
• 30:52
  some
• 30:53
  teaching.
• 30:53
  Talk
• 30:53
  about,
• 30:54
  like
• 30:54
  the
• 30:54
  Platona
• 30:55
  and
• 30:55
  Plato,
• 30:56
  Platonic
• 30:56
  idea
• 30:57
  and
• 30:57
  Neoplatonic
• 30:58
  traditions
• 30:59
  also
• 31:00
  had
• 31:00
  that.
• 31:01
  So
• 31:01
  our
• 31:01
  Western
• 31:02
  tradition
• 31:02
  had
• 31:02
  that
• 31:03
  in
• 31:03
  its
• 31:03
  roots,
• 31:04
  that
• 31:04
  there
• 31:05
  are
• 31:05
  many
• 31:05
  qualities
• 31:06
  of
• 31:06
  our
• 31:06
  true
• 31:07
  nature
• 31:07
  or
• 31:07
  being.
• 31:09
  Some
• 31:09
  of
• 31:09
  the
• 31:09
  Eastern
• 31:10
  traditions
• 31:11
  have
• 31:11
  that
• 31:11
  to
• 31:11
  some
• 31:12
  degree.
• 31:13
  This
• 31:13
  teaching
• 31:14
  seemed
• 31:14
  to,
• 31:14
  for
• 31:14
  some
• 31:15
  reason,
• 31:15
  had
• 31:15
  that
• 31:16
  as
• 31:16
  an
• 31:16
  important
• 31:17
  part
• 31:17
  of
• 31:17
  the
• 31:18
  teaching.
• 31:18
  The
• 31:18
  qualities.
• 31:19
  But
• 31:20
  the
• 31:20
  qualities
• 31:20
  you
• 31:20
  see
• 31:21
  are
• 31:21
  significant
• 31:22
  partly
• 31:23
  because
• 31:23
  one
• 31:24
  principle,
• 31:24
  the
• 31:25
  source
• 31:25
  of
• 31:25
  this
• 31:26
  teaching,
• 31:27
  is
• 31:27
  to
• 31:27
  be
• 31:27
  in
• 31:27
  the
• 31:28
  world
• 31:29
  and
• 31:29
  not
• 31:29
  of
• 31:29
  it.
• 31:30
  How
• 31:31
  can
• 31:31
  you
• 31:31
  be
• 31:31
  in
• 31:31
  the
• 31:31
  world
• 31:32
  without
• 31:32
  those
• 31:32
  qualities?
• 31:34
  You
• 31:34
  do
• 31:34
  need
• 31:34
  courage,
• 31:35
  you
• 31:35
  need
• 31:35
  steadfastness,
• 31:37
  you
• 31:37
  need
• 31:37
  clarity,
• 31:38
  you
• 31:38
  need
• 31:38
  intelligence,
• 31:39
  you
• 31:39
  need
• 31:40
  compassion,
• 31:40
  sensitivity,
• 31:41
  all
• 31:42
  of
• 31:42
  that
• 31:42
  to
• 31:43
  live
• 31:43
  in
• 31:43
  this
• 31:43
  world.
• 31:44
  And
• 31:45
  that's
• 31:46
  when
• 31:46
  the
• 31:46
  qualities
• 31:46
  really
• 31:47
  become
• 31:48
  very
• 31:49
  useful
• 31:49
  thing.
• 31:50
  And
• 31:51
  both
• 31:51
  guidance
• 31:52
  and
• 31:52
  capacity
• 31:53
  to
• 31:54
  live
• 31:54
  in
• 31:54
  the
• 31:54
  world
• 31:55
  in
• 31:55
  a
• 31:56
  genuine
• 31:56
  and
• 31:56
  also
• 31:57
  as
• 31:57
  effective
• 31:58
  a
• 31:58
  way
• 31:58
  as
• 31:58
  possible.
• 32:00
  And
• 32:02
  a
• 32:02
  path
• 32:02
  to
• 32:03
  liberation
• 32:04
  without
• 32:05
  these
• 32:05
  essential
• 32:05
  values
• 32:06
  would
• 32:06
  be.
• 32:08
  Would
• 32:08
  be
• 32:09
  pretty
• 32:09
  grim.
• 32:09
  I
• 32:10
  mean,
• 32:10
  it
• 32:10
  would
• 32:10
  be
• 32:11
  not
• 32:12
  empty
• 32:12
  in
• 32:12
  a
• 32:12
  good
• 32:12
  way,
• 32:13
  but
• 32:13
  it
• 32:13
  would
• 32:13
  be
• 32:14
  valueless.
• 32:14
  I
• 32:15
  guess
• 32:15
  that
• 32:15
  doesn't
• 32:16
  help
• 32:16
  us
• 32:16
  to
• 32:17
  live
• 32:18
  in
• 32:18
  a
• 32:18
  better
• 32:18
  way.
• 32:21
  Yeah,
• 32:21
  I
• 32:21
  mean,
• 32:21
  many
• 32:22
  teachings
• 32:22
  don't,
• 32:23
  especially
• 32:23
  the
• 32:23
  Easter
• 32:24
  one.
• 32:24
  They
• 32:24
  don't
• 32:25
  talk
• 32:25
  about
• 32:25
  living
• 32:26
  life
• 32:26
  because
• 32:27
  they're
• 32:27
  mostly
• 32:27
  monks
• 32:28
  and,
• 32:28
  you
• 32:28
  know,
• 32:29
  living
• 32:29
  in
• 32:29
  monasteries.
• 32:30
  That's
• 32:30
  how
• 32:31
  Buddhism
• 32:31
  started.
• 32:32
  Buddha
• 32:32
  was
• 32:33
  a
• 32:33
  monk,
• 32:33
  and
• 32:33
  he
• 32:34
  was.
• 32:34
  Wanted
• 32:35
  his
• 32:35
  people
• 32:35
  to
• 32:35
  be
• 32:36
  monks
• 32:36
  with
• 32:36
  him,
• 32:37
  not
• 32:37
  live
• 32:38
  in
• 32:38
  the
• 32:38
  world.
• 32:39
  And
• 32:40
  they
• 32:40
  didn't
• 32:40
  cook
• 32:40
  their
• 32:41
  food
• 32:41
  or
• 32:41
  work.
• 32:42
  They
• 32:42
  begged
• 32:42
  for
• 32:43
  food.
• 32:45
  But
• 32:45
  that's
• 32:45
  not
• 32:46
  living
• 32:46
  in
• 32:46
  the
• 32:46
  world.
• 32:47
  That
• 32:47
  is
• 32:47
  just,
• 32:48
  you
• 32:48
  know,
• 32:49
  being
• 32:49
  in
• 32:49
  the
• 32:50
  world
• 32:50
  just
• 32:50
  to
• 32:51
  go
• 32:51
  into
• 32:51
  true
• 32:51
  nature,
• 32:53
  you
• 32:53
  see.
• 32:54
  And
• 32:54
  while
• 32:54
  this
• 32:55
  teaching
• 32:55
  says,
• 32:55
  yes,
• 32:56
  we
• 32:56
  want
• 32:56
  true
• 32:56
  nature,
• 32:57
  that's
• 32:57
  part
• 32:57
  of
• 32:58
  it.
• 32:58
  We're
• 32:58
  not
• 32:59
  part
• 32:59
  of
• 32:59
  the
• 32:59
  world.
• 33:00
  But
• 33:00
  how
• 33:01
  we
• 33:01
  are
• 33:01
  in
• 33:01
  the
• 33:01
  world,
• 33:02
  that
• 33:03
  true
• 33:03
  nature
• 33:04
  expresses
• 33:04
  itself
• 33:05
  in
• 33:05
  the
• 33:06
  everyday
• 33:06
  life.
• 33:07
  And
• 33:07
  that
• 33:08
  takes
• 33:08
  us
• 33:08
  to
• 33:08
  the.
• 33:09
  You
• 33:09
  know,
• 33:10
  Zen
• 33:10
  takes
• 33:10
  that
• 33:11
  into
• 33:11
  the
• 33:11
  last
• 33:12
  one
• 33:12
  of
• 33:12
  the
• 33:13
  pictures
• 33:13
  being
• 33:14
  the
• 33:14
  marketplace,
• 33:15
  you
• 33:15
  know,
• 33:16
  hands
• 33:16
  open.
• 33:17
  Yeah.
• 33:18
  In
• 33:19
  the
• 33:19
  marketplace.
• 33:20
  But
• 33:20
  you,
• 33:20
  like.
• 33:20
  You
• 33:21
  appear
• 33:21
  like
• 33:21
  an
• 33:22
  ordinary
• 33:22
  human
• 33:22
  being
• 33:23
  with
• 33:23
  other
• 33:23
  human
• 33:24
  being,
• 33:24
  you
• 33:24
  know.
• 33:27
  Yes.
• 33:27
  There's
• 33:28
  a
• 33:28
  beautiful
• 33:28
  commentary
• 33:29
  on
• 33:29
  that
• 33:30
  last
• 33:30
  picture.
• 33:30
  Maybe
• 33:31
  we
• 33:31
  just
• 33:31
  should
• 33:31
  just
• 33:31
  say
• 33:32
  that
• 33:32
  the
• 33:32
  10
• 33:32
  oxfording
• 33:33
  pictures
• 33:34
  are
• 33:34
  a
• 33:34
  pictorial
• 33:35
  representation
• 33:36
  of
• 33:36
  the
• 33:36
  spiritual
• 33:37
  path
• 33:37
  as
• 33:38
  described
• 33:38
  and
• 33:38
  practiced
• 33:39
  in
• 33:39
  Zen.
• 33:39
  In
• 33:40
  the
• 33:40
  last
• 33:40
  picture
• 33:41
  that
• 33:41
  you're
• 33:41
  talking
• 33:42
  about,
• 33:42
  amid
• 33:42
  is
• 33:42
  this.
• 33:43
  This
• 33:44
  bumpkin
• 33:45
  kind
• 33:45
  of
• 33:45
  wandering
• 33:45
  into
• 33:46
  the
• 33:46
  marketplace
• 33:46
  with
• 33:47
  a
• 33:47
  good.
• 33:50
  And
• 33:50
  the
• 33:50
  commentary
• 33:51
  says
• 33:51
  even
• 33:52
  the
• 33:52
  wisest
• 33:53
  cannot
• 33:53
  find
• 33:54
  them,
• 33:55
  which
• 33:55
  I
• 33:55
  think
• 33:55
  is
• 33:55
  a
• 33:56
  great
• 33:56
  description.
• 33:56
  It's
• 33:57
  like,
• 33:58
  so
• 33:58
  apparently
• 33:59
  ordinary.
• 34:00
  Yeah.
• 34:01
  And
• 34:01
  that
• 34:01
  is
• 34:02
  actually
• 34:02
  the
• 34:02
  nature
• 34:03
  of
• 34:03
  realization.
• 34:04
  At
• 34:04
  some
• 34:04
  point,
• 34:05
  you
• 34:05
  feel
• 34:05
  ordinary.
• 34:06
  I
• 34:06
  mean,
• 34:06
  after
• 34:06
  all
• 34:07
  the
• 34:07
  vast,
• 34:08
  amazing,
• 34:09
  beautiful,
• 34:10
  mind
• 34:10
  shattering
• 34:11
  thing,
• 34:13
  life
• 34:14
  become
• 34:14
  ordinary
• 34:15
  and
• 34:15
  simple
• 34:16
  at
• 34:16
  some
• 34:16
  point.
• 34:18
  Yeah.
• 34:18
  And
• 34:19
  hopefully
• 34:19
  we
• 34:20
  will
• 34:20
  get
• 34:20
  to
• 34:20
  the
• 34:21
  fourth
• 34:21
  turning.
• 34:22
  But
• 34:22
  you.
• 34:23
  You
• 34:23
  emphasize
• 34:24
  there
• 34:24
  that
• 34:24
  the
• 34:25
  most
• 34:25
  ordinary
• 34:26
  experiences
• 34:27
  can
• 34:27
  be
• 34:28
  recognized
• 34:28
  as.
• 34:29
  As
• 34:29
  profound
• 34:29
  as
• 34:30
  some
• 34:30
  of
• 34:31
  the
• 34:31
  most
• 34:31
  remarkable
• 34:32
  experiences
• 34:32
  we've
• 34:33
  been
• 34:33
  talking
• 34:33
  about
• 34:33
  today.
• 34:34
  So.
• 34:34
  Yeah.
• 34:35
  Yeah.
• 34:35
  The
• 34:35
  idea
• 34:36
  is
• 34:36
  to
• 34:36
  be
• 34:36
  free.
• 34:37
  You
• 34:37
  know,
• 34:38
  there's
• 34:38
  freedom,
• 34:39
  no
• 34:39
  limitation
• 34:40
  on
• 34:40
  oneself,
• 34:41
  and
• 34:42
  inwardly
• 34:43
  free.
• 34:44
  You
• 34:44
  might.
• 34:45
  Outwardly,
• 34:45
  you
• 34:45
  might
• 34:46
  not
• 34:46
  be
• 34:46
  free,
• 34:46
  but
• 34:46
  inwardly
• 34:47
  free.
• 34:48
  Yeah,
• 34:49
  yeah.
• 34:50
  Beautiful.
• 34:50
  You're
• 34:51
  reminding
• 34:51
  me
• 34:52
  of
• 34:52
  that
• 34:52
  exquisite
• 34:53
  quote
• 34:53
  from
• 34:53
  Viktor
• 34:54
  Frankl,
• 34:54
  the
• 34:55
  psychiatrist
• 34:56
  who
• 34:56
  was
• 34:56
  imprisoned
• 34:57
  in
• 34:57
  the
• 34:58
  Nazi
• 34:58
  system
• 34:59
  and
• 34:59
  said,
• 34:59
  everything
• 35:00
  can
• 35:00
  be
• 35:00
  taken
• 35:01
  away
• 35:01
  from.
• 35:02
  From
• 35:02
  a
• 35:02
  person
• 35:02
  except
• 35:03
  the
• 35:03
  last
• 35:03
  freedom,
• 35:04
  the
• 35:04
  freedom
• 35:04
  to
• 35:04
  choose
• 35:05
  their
• 35:05
  attitude
• 35:05
  in
• 35:06
  any
• 35:06
  situation.
• 35:07
  Yeah,
• 35:07
  yeah.
• 35:08
  Right.
• 35:09
  Yeah.
• 35:11
  John,
• 35:11
  you
• 35:12
  had
• 35:12
  a
• 35:12
  question
• 35:13
  you
• 35:13
  wanted
• 35:13
  to.
• 35:13
  Yeah,
• 35:14
  this
• 35:14
  is
• 35:14
  like
• 35:15
  the.
• 35:15
  The
• 35:15
  cherry
• 35:16
  on
• 35:16
  top
• 35:16
  of
• 35:16
  this
• 35:18
  absolute
• 35:19
  Sunday
• 35:19
  we've
• 35:20
  been
• 35:20
  digesting
• 35:21
  here.
• 35:21
  Thank
• 35:22
  you
• 35:22
  so
• 35:22
  much
• 35:22
  for.
• 35:22
  It's
• 35:22
  been
• 35:23
  extremely
• 35:23
  profound.
• 35:24
  So
• 35:24
  this
• 35:25
  question
• 35:25
  arose
• 35:25
  for
• 35:26
  me
• 35:26
  when
• 35:26
  studying
• 35:26
  your
• 35:26
  works,
• 35:27
  and
• 35:27
  I
• 35:27
  have
• 35:27
  been
• 35:27
  immersing
• 35:28
  myself
• 35:28
  in
• 35:28
  it
• 35:29
  also.
• 35:29
  Your
• 35:30
  words
• 35:30
  are.
• 35:30
  They're
• 35:31
  transmitting.
• 35:31
  It's
• 35:31
  not
• 35:31
  just
• 35:32
  intellectual
• 35:32
  ideas.
• 35:32
  There's
• 35:33
  something
• 35:33
  that
• 35:33
  really
• 35:34
  comes
• 35:34
  through
• 35:34
  and
• 35:35
  helps
• 35:35
  us
• 35:35
  understand
• 35:36
  these
• 35:36
  almost
• 35:36
  impossible
• 35:37
  things
• 35:37
  that.
• 35:38
  That
• 35:38
  you
• 35:38
  describe.
• 35:39
  But
• 35:39
  what
• 35:39
  is
• 35:39
  it,
• 35:40
  Hamid,
• 35:40
  that
• 35:40
  motivates
• 35:41
  you
• 35:41
  these
• 35:42
  days
• 35:42
  at
• 35:42
  this
• 35:42
  point
• 35:43
  in
• 35:43
  your
• 35:43
  life?
• 35:44
  Why
• 35:44
  are
• 35:44
  you
• 35:44
  talking
• 35:45
  to
• 35:45
  us?
• 35:45
  Why
• 35:45
  do
• 35:46
  you
• 35:46
  still,
• 35:46
  you
• 35:46
  know,
• 35:46
  teach?
• 35:47
  And
• 35:47
  what.
• 35:47
  What
• 35:47
  is
• 35:48
  the
• 35:48
  motivation?
• 35:48
  Why
• 35:49
  don't
• 35:49
  you
• 35:49
  just
• 35:49
  hang
• 35:50
  out
• 35:50
  and
• 35:50
  be,
• 35:50
  you
• 35:51
  know,
• 35:51
  be
• 35:52
  true
• 35:52
  nature?
• 35:54
  I
• 35:54
  am.
• 35:57
  Okay?
• 35:58
  I'm
• 35:59
  hanging
• 35:59
  out,
• 35:59
  being.
• 36:01
  Well,
• 36:02
  I
• 36:02
  mean,
• 36:03
  living
• 36:03
  this
• 36:03
  life.
• 36:04
  What
• 36:04
  does
• 36:04
  it
• 36:04
  mean,
• 36:04
  hanging
• 36:05
  out?
• 36:05
  I'm
• 36:05
  not.
• 36:06
  I'm
• 36:06
  not
• 36:06
  in
• 36:06
  a
• 36:06
  monastery,
• 36:08
  you
• 36:08
  know,
• 36:08
  I'm
• 36:09
  still
• 36:09
  living
• 36:09
  in
• 36:09
  life.
• 36:11
  Although
• 36:11
  I'm
• 36:12
  not
• 36:14
  an.
• 36:14
  An
• 36:15
  ego
• 36:15
  individual.
• 36:17
  Like
• 36:18
  I.
• 36:19
  The
• 36:19
  way
• 36:19
  I
• 36:20
  experience
• 36:20
  myself
• 36:20
  is
• 36:21
  not
• 36:21
  something.
• 36:21
  That's
• 36:22
  how
• 36:22
  most
• 36:22
  people
• 36:23
  describe
• 36:23
  their
• 36:23
  experience,
• 36:25
  but,
• 36:25
  you
• 36:25
  know,
• 36:27
  still
• 36:27
  engage.
• 36:28
  There's
• 36:29
  engagement
• 36:29
  with
• 36:30
  life
• 36:30
  and
• 36:30
  the
• 36:31
  enjoyment.
• 36:32
  There's
• 36:32
  enjoyment
• 36:33
  of
• 36:33
  our
• 36:33
  conversation.
• 36:35
  And
• 36:35
  also
• 36:36
  it
• 36:36
  is
• 36:37
  something
• 36:37
  that
• 36:38
  happens
• 36:38
  at
• 36:38
  some
• 36:38
  point
• 36:39
  in
• 36:39
  the
• 36:39
  path,
• 36:40
  which
• 36:40
  is
• 36:42
  the
• 36:42
  expression
• 36:43
  of
• 36:43
  compassion,
• 36:44
  love,
• 36:45
  generosity,
• 36:46
  giving.
• 36:47
  Wanting
• 36:48
  others
• 36:48
  to
• 36:48
  benefit
• 36:49
  is
• 36:49
  not
• 36:50
  a
• 36:50
  motivation.
• 36:51
  It's
• 36:51
  a
• 36:51
  natural
• 36:52
  expression.
• 36:56
  It
• 36:56
  just
• 36:56
  happens,
• 36:58
  you
• 36:58
  know,
• 36:58
  that
• 36:59
  is
• 36:59
  what
• 36:59
  happens.
• 37:00
  So
• 37:01
  I
• 37:01
  don't
• 37:01
  need
• 37:02
  motivation.
• 37:04
  There's
• 37:04
  nobody
• 37:05
  there
• 37:05
  to
• 37:05
  be
• 37:05
  motivated,
• 37:06
  let's
• 37:06
  put
• 37:06
  it
• 37:07
  that
• 37:07
  way.
• 37:10
  Expression,
• 37:11
  outflow
• 37:12
  of
• 37:13
  life.
• 37:14
  Beautiful.
• 37:15
  Well,
• 37:16
  I
• 37:16
  mean,
• 37:17
  being
• 37:18
  true
• 37:18
  nature
• 37:18
  is
• 37:19
  expressing
• 37:19
  itself
• 37:20
  through
• 37:20
  you
• 37:20
  in
• 37:22
  exquisite
• 37:22
  and
• 37:22
  delightful
• 37:23
  and
• 37:23
  enjoyable
• 37:24
  and
• 37:25
  very
• 37:25
  helpful
• 37:26
  ways.
• 37:26
  And
• 37:27
  thank
• 37:27
  you
• 37:27
  so
• 37:27
  much
• 37:28
  for
• 37:28
  giving
• 37:29
  everyone
• 37:29
  who's
• 37:29
  listening
• 37:30
  this
• 37:30
  profound
• 37:31
  transmission
• 37:32
  and.
• 37:32
  And
• 37:33
  your
• 37:33
  being
• 37:33
  so
• 37:34
  deep
• 37:34
  appreciated.
• 37:35
  Yeah,
• 37:35
  Very,
• 37:36
  very
• 37:36
  grateful,
• 37:36
  Hamid.
• 37:37
  Thank
• 37:37
  you.
• 37:38
  I'm
• 37:38
  also
• 37:39
  grateful
• 37:39
  to
• 37:39
  the
• 37:40
  two
• 37:40
  of
• 37:40
  you
• 37:41
  because
• 37:42
  you
• 37:42
  are
• 37:43
  giving
• 37:43
  many
• 37:44
  people
• 37:44
  the
• 37:44
  opportunity
• 37:46
  to
• 37:46
  have
• 37:46
  a
• 37:46
  window
• 37:47
  into
• 37:48
  this
• 37:48
  universe
• 37:49
  that
• 37:49
  is
• 37:50
  potential
• 37:50
  for
• 37:51
  all
• 37:51
  human
• 37:51
  beings,
• 37:53
  while
• 37:53
  most
• 37:53
  human
• 37:54
  beings
• 37:54
  don't
• 37:54
  know
• 37:54
  about
• 37:55
  it.
• 37:55
  Yeah.
• 37:56
  So
• 37:57
  giving
• 37:57
  people
• 37:58
  a
• 37:59
  window
• 37:59
  to
• 37:59
  look.
• 38:00
  Oh,
• 38:00
  yeah.
• 38:01
  It's
• 38:01
  possible
• 38:02
  there
• 38:02
  is
• 38:02
  such
• 38:03
  thing
• 38:03
  that,
• 38:04
  you
• 38:04
  know,
• 38:05
  hopefully.
• 38:06
  I
• 38:06
  mean,
• 38:07
  it's.
• 38:07
  It's
• 38:08
  good
• 38:08
  for
• 38:08
  them
• 38:08
  to
• 38:09
  know
• 38:09
  that.
• 38:09
  But
• 38:10
  also
• 38:11
  it's
• 38:11
  a
• 38:11
  way
• 38:11
  for
• 38:12
  true
• 38:12
  nature
• 38:12
  to
• 38:13
  appear.
• 38:15
  Yes,
• 38:15
  yes,
• 38:17
  yes.
• 38:18
  And
• 38:18
  we
• 38:18
  feel
• 38:19
  very
• 38:19
  extremely
• 38:20
  grateful
• 38:21
  to
• 38:21
  be
• 38:21
  part
• 38:22
  of
• 38:22
  it
• 38:22
  and
• 38:22
  to
• 38:22
  be
• 38:23
  able
• 38:23
  to
• 38:23
  play
• 38:23
  a
• 38:24
  small
• 38:24
  role
• 38:24
  in
• 38:25
  getting
• 38:25
  these
• 38:25
  profound
• 38:26
  realizations
• 38:27
  your.
• 38:28
  And
• 38:29
  your
• 38:29
  being
• 38:29
  out
• 38:30
  to.
• 38:30
  To
• 38:30
  the
• 38:30
  world.
• 38:31
  So
• 38:31
  thank
• 38:32
  you
• 38:32
  so
• 38:32
  much.
• 38:33
  Yeah.
• 38:34
  And
• 38:34
  I'm
• 38:34
  reading
• 38:35
  this
• 38:35
  stuff
• 38:35
  and
• 38:35
  immersing
• 38:36
  myself
• 38:36
  in
• 38:36
  it,
• 38:36
  and
• 38:36
  I
• 38:36
  go,
• 38:37
  then
• 38:37
  I
• 38:37
  get
• 38:37
  to
• 38:38
  talk
• 38:38
  to
• 38:38
  him
• 38:38
  in
• 38:38
  person
• 38:40
  next
• 38:40
  week.
• 38:40
  You
• 38:40
  know,
• 38:41
  it's
• 38:41
  like.
• 38:41
  Yeah.
• 38:41
  So
• 38:41
  I'm
• 38:42
  glad
• 38:42
  you
• 38:42
  got
• 38:42
  into
• 38:43
  that
• 38:43
  book,
• 38:44
  John,
• 38:44
  because
• 38:45
  it's
• 38:45
  a
• 38:45
  book
• 38:45
  I
• 38:46
  really
• 38:47
  noticed,
• 38:48
  and
• 38:49
  not
• 38:49
  many
• 38:50
  people
• 38:50
  read
• 38:50
  it,
• 38:51
  and
• 38:51
  I
• 38:52
  imagine
• 38:52
  not
• 38:53
  many
• 38:53
  people
• 38:53
  read
• 38:53
  it
• 38:54
  because
• 38:54
  it's
• 38:55
  hard
• 38:55
  to
• 38:55
  sort
• 38:55
  of
• 38:55
  read
• 38:56
  in
• 38:56
  some
• 38:56
  sense,
• 38:57
  although
• 38:57
  it's
• 38:58
  biography
• 38:59
  is
• 38:59
  biographical.
• 39:00
  Should
• 39:00
  be
• 39:01
  easier
• 39:01
  than
• 39:01
  the
• 39:01
  other
• 39:02
  books
• 39:02
  because
• 39:02
  it's
• 39:03
  a
• 39:03
  direct
• 39:03
  experience,
• 39:04
  but
• 39:05
  it's
• 39:05
  a
• 39:05
  kind
• 39:05
  of
• 39:06
  experience
• 39:06
  that
• 39:07
  many
• 39:07
  people
• 39:07
  don't
• 39:08
  have.
• 39:09
  So
• 39:09
  it
• 39:10
  might
• 39:10
  not
• 39:10
  be
• 39:11
  able
• 39:11
  to
• 39:11
  relate
• 39:11
  to
• 39:11
  it,
• 39:12
  but
• 39:12
  as
• 39:12
  I
• 39:13
  said,
• 39:13
  it
• 39:14
  is
• 39:14
  intended
• 39:15
  as
• 39:15
  a
• 39:16
  confusion
• 39:17
  to
• 39:17
  spiritual
• 39:18
  literature
• 39:18
  about
• 39:18
  an
• 39:19
  area
• 39:19
  of
• 39:19
  spirituality
• 39:21
  that
• 39:21
  is
• 39:21
  not
• 39:21
  discussed,
• 39:22
  which
• 39:22
  is
• 39:23
  how
• 39:23
  the
• 39:23
  soul
• 39:24
  connects
• 39:24
  with
• 39:24
  the
• 39:25
  absolute.
• 39:28
  And
• 39:28
  there's
• 39:28
  so
• 39:29
  much
• 39:29
  in
• 39:29
  that
• 39:29
  book
• 39:29
  that
• 39:30
  perhaps
• 39:30
  we
• 39:30
  could
• 39:31
  even
• 39:31
  do
• 39:32
  a
• 39:32
  conversation
• 39:33
  around
• 39:33
  it.
• 39:33
  I
• 39:33
  know
• 39:34
  John
• 39:34
  would
• 39:35
  jump
• 39:35
  at
• 39:35
  the
• 39:35
  opportunity.
• 39:36
  Yeah.
• 39:37
  I
• 39:37
  barely
• 39:37
  got
• 39:37
  beyond
• 39:37
  the
• 39:38
  introduction
• 39:38
  today.
• 39:38
  I
• 39:39
  mean,
• 39:39
  I
• 39:39
  got
• 39:39
  the
• 39:39
  first
• 39:39
  25
• 39:40
  pages,
• 39:40
  maybe,
• 39:41
  but
• 39:41
  we
• 39:41
  could.
• 39:41
  Yeah,
• 39:42
  we
• 39:42
  could
• 39:42
  explore
• 39:42
  that.
• 39:43
  You
• 39:43
  will
• 39:43
  see
• 39:44
  in
• 39:44
  it
• 39:44
  by
• 39:44
  the
• 39:44
  second
• 39:45
  half
• 39:46
  what's
• 39:46
  it
• 39:46
  like
• 39:46
  to
• 39:46
  be
• 39:47
  the
• 39:47
  absolute
• 39:47
  living
• 39:48
  in
• 39:48
  this
• 39:48
  world.
• 39:49
  That's
• 39:49
  right.
• 39:49
  It's
• 39:50
  really,
• 39:50
  really,
• 39:50
  really
• 39:52
  good
• 39:52
  to
• 39:52
  see.
• 39:53
  Yeah.
• 39:54
  Yeah.
• 39:54
  That's
• 39:54
  the
• 39:54
  major
• 39:54
  thrust.
• 39:55
  Yeah.
• 39:56
  Magical
• 39:56
  in
• 39:57
  some
• 39:57
  sense,
• 39:57
  you
• 39:57
  know,
• 39:57
  but
• 39:58
  it
• 39:58
  is
• 39:58
  interesting.
• 39:59
  Yeah.
• 40:01
  There's
• 40:01
  the
• 40:01
  understatement
• 40:02
  of
• 40:02
  the
• 40:02
  day.
• 40:04
  Well,
• 40:05
  good
• 40:05
  being
• 40:05
  with
• 40:05
  the
• 40:06
  two
• 40:06
  of
• 40:06
  you.
• 40:06
  Till
• 40:06
  next
• 40:07
  time.
• 40:08
  I
• 40:08
  think
• 40:08
  next
• 40:08
  time
• 40:09
  will
• 40:09
  be
• 40:09
  in
• 40:09
  two
• 40:09
  weeks
• 40:10
  or
• 40:10
  something.
• 40:10
  Not
• 40:11
  far.
• 40:12
  Yeah.
• 40:13
  Yes.
• 40:14
  Thanks
• 40:14
  so
• 40:15
  much.
• 40:15
  Thank
• 40:16
  you,
• 40:16
  Hamid.
• 40:18
  Have
• 40:18
  a
• 40:18
  good
• 40:18
  day.
• 40:19
  Thank
• 40:20
  you
• 40:20
  very
• 40:20
  much
• 40:20
  for
• 40:21
  being
• 40:21
  a
• 40:21
  part
• 40:21
  of
• 40:21
  this
• 40:22
  conversation.
• 40:22
  We
• 40:23
  hope
• 40:23
  that
• 40:23
  you
• 40:23
  were
• 40:23
  moved,
• 40:24
  as
• 40:24
  we
• 40:24
  are
• 40:25
  moved,
• 40:25
  being
• 40:25
  part
• 40:25
  of
• 40:26
  it
• 40:26
  ourselves.
• 40:27
  We'd
• 40:27
  also
• 40:27
  like
• 40:27
  to
• 40:28
  say
• 40:28
  that
• 40:28
  this
• 40:28
  is
• 40:28
  being
• 40:29
  funded
• 40:30
  by
• 40:30
  Roger
• 40:30
  and
• 40:30
  myself.
• 40:30
  It
• 40:31
  comes
• 40:31
  out
• 40:31
  of
• 40:31
  our
• 40:31
  pockets.
• 40:32
  So
• 40:32
  if
• 40:32
  you
• 40:32
  would
• 40:32
  like
• 40:32
  to
• 40:33
  help
• 40:33
  us
• 40:33
  to.
• 40:34
  Mainly
• 40:34
  to
• 40:35
  get
• 40:35
  this
• 40:35
  podcast
• 40:35
  out
• 40:36
  to
• 40:36
  more
• 40:36
  people,
• 40:36
  because
• 40:37
  the
• 40:37
  bigger
• 40:37
  audience
• 40:37
  have,
• 40:38
  which
• 40:38
  is
• 40:38
  steadily
• 40:38
  growing,
• 40:39
  but
• 40:39
  the
• 40:39
  more
• 40:39
  people
• 40:40
  we
• 40:40
  can
• 40:40
  reach
• 40:40
  and
• 40:40
  the
• 40:40
  more
• 40:41
  marketing
• 40:41
  we
• 40:41
  can
• 40:41
  do,
• 40:42
  the
• 40:42
  more
• 40:42
  positive
• 40:43
  effect
• 40:43
  we
• 40:43
  can
• 40:43
  have
• 40:44
  on
• 40:44
  the
• 40:44
  world.
• 40:44
  So
• 40:45
  we've
• 40:45
  done
• 40:45
  a
• 40:45
  couple
• 40:45
  of
• 40:45
  ways,
• 40:46
  but
• 40:46
  we'd
• 40:46
  like
• 40:46
  you
• 40:46
  to
• 40:47
  buy
• 40:47
  us
• 40:47
  a
• 40:47
  cup
• 40:47
  of
• 40:48
  coffee.
• 40:48
  Very
• 40:48
  simple.
• 40:49
  And
• 40:49
  I
• 40:49
  do
• 40:49
  that
• 40:49
  with
• 40:49
  podcasts
• 40:50
  that
• 40:51
  I
• 40:51
  support,
• 40:52
  and
• 40:52
  I
• 40:52
  find
• 40:52
  it's
• 40:53
  very
• 40:53
  satisfying.
• 40:54
  So
• 40:54
  thank
• 40:54
  you
• 40:54
  for
• 40:54
  your
• 40:55
  help.
• 40:55
  Thank
• 40:55
  you
• 40:55
  for
• 40:55
  your
• 40:56
  presence,
• 40:56
  and
• 40:56
  thank
• 40:56
  you
• 40:57
  for
• 40:57
  all
• 40:57
  you
• 40:57
  are
• 40:58
  and
• 40:58
  all
• 40:58
  you
• 40:58
  do.
• 40:58
  We
• 40:59
  love
• 40:59
  you.
• 41:21
  Sam.