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How OSPF and Life Side Ohio Brought Gun Owners Into The Suicide Prevention Conversation · Voices For Suicide Prevention

• 0:04
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome everyone to Voices for Suicide Prevention, the podcast of the Ohio Suicide Prevention Foundation, where we like to say our conversations are real talk and real life.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_02: I'm Scott Light.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_02: So before we get to our guests for this episode, folks, this is exciting stuff because I get to introduce you to our new co-host, SoulSonist.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's an honor to be here.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_02: Well, tell, I mean, you've been on the pod before, but tell our audience about you.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so I have been on the podcast here in my own mental health journey.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_00: I'm actually an ambassador here at OSPF.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_00: I make mental health positive content for social media, which has been so fun over the years.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I have a media background.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_00: I'm very involved in the community, and it's just such an honor and full circle moment to be uh helping you co-host this podcast.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_02: Well, great to have you.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_02: Why don't we jump in and let our audience know what we're talking about?
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: Today we're talking about one of OSPF's most unique and impactful initiatives, Lifeside Ohio, a campaign designed largely by gun owners for gun owners.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_00: Mental health and suicide prevention are often difficult conversations in any community, but they can be especially sensitive where self-reliance, strength, and personal responsibility are deeply valued.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_02: Lifeside Ohio seeks to break down stereotypes, reduce stigmas, and create practical pathways to support through three key communities that we reach out to firearms retailers, veterans, and law enforcement.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_02: So, fire service, EMS, police, and other first responders.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_02: Today, we are joined by two people who have been deeply involved in this effort for years.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_02: Daniel Bennett is an educator, former teacher.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_02: He is OSPF's chief strategy officer, outdoorsman, hunter, you name it.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_02: He does it.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_02: What's up, D?
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_02: Hey, good morning.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_02: It's good to see you, bud.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_02: Joe King is here as well.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_02: He's an executive at Blackwing Shooting Center, charter supporter of Lifeside Ohio, and also a member of the Delaware County Suicide Prevention Coalition.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_02: Hey, Joe.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks for having me.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_02: Glad to be here.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_02: Good to see both of you.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, welcome, Joe and Daniel.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_00: All right, let's get started.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_00: Daniel, for listeners who might be hearing about Lifeside Ohio for the first time, give us an overview.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_00: What's the campaign and why was it created?
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_01: The campaign really is an opportunity for us to bring firearms owners into the conversation around suicide prevention.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_01: We know that in our state, about uh 60% of our suicides involve a firearm.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_01: We know that if an individual uses a firearm to attempt suicide, uh, in about 80% or more cases, that individual is going to end up uh losing their life.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: So we want to bring people into the conversation so that we can have honest discussions around how we can get help for our loved ones if they are struggling.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_01: We want to make sure that firearms owners know that resources exist.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_01: And we also want people to be really comfortable in this conversation because we know uh, as we've talked about, it's not always the easiest thing to talk about with suicide.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_01: And um, we know that in the firearms community there can be a lot of mistrust when it comes to services.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_01: We just want people to know that uh there are things out there if someone they they know or if themselves may be struggling that they can turn to.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_02: So, Daniel, what gap or gaps, plural, did you and OSPS see in traditional, we'll call it traditional suicide prevention messaging and especially geared toward um the firearms community?
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_01: Most of our traditional messaging is reaching out to providers.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of the the work that we're doing is getting training for clinicians or maybe it's engaging people in areas where it's kind of easy to connect with them, like schools.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_01: We do a lot of work in the school setting.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, we know that youth suicide is uh certainly something that impacts communities and we we really value that work, but it doesn't help us move the needle when it comes to adults.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_01: How how do we find ways to access adults that are that are struggling?
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_01: And we know that again, a lot of those adults, um maybe especially here in Ohio, they're firearms owners.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_01: So how can we have conversations with them in places where they're comfortable?
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_01: How can we reach out to them uh and bring this uh conversation uh into the spaces where they're already engaging?
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: Which kind of leads us into the phrase we often say about Lifeside is buy gun owners for gun owners.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: Why is that distinction so important?
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_01: I think that distinction is so important because it helps us to build trust.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, as a gun owner myself, I'm gonna be much more comfortable talking to other gun owners when it comes to this conversation.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_01: And I work in the mental health field.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_01: I know a lot of folks that um that I've hunted with over the years or that I've shot uh recreationally with or family members that own guns, that they're not gonna walk in and have a conversation with a mental health counselor because they just don't feel comfortable in that space.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_01: But if they have another gun owner reach out to them because they're worried about them or they've seen some concerns, um, that's when they'll start to engage.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_01: And then that's where we can build that connection and get them to uh a trusted clinician.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_02: It's funny you said walk in a door and have a conversation because boy, does that tee up my question to Joe.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_02: All right, Joe, let's let's go to the Wayback Machine.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_02: Uh five plus years ago, I walked into Blackwing.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_02: You and I had a conversation.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_02: What was your first impression on just kind of the pitch on Lifeside Ohio to you?
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_03: Do you remember that?
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_03: I do.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_03: And as charming as you were when you walked in there, I already had a no in my mind because I've been, you know, I've been approached with this subject before, and it's can you just put this card up?
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_03: Can we put these signs up?
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_03: And again, you know, they don't they don't work.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_03: You know, it it's not a conversation, it's it's a cold, let me hand you this.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_03: You know, that's always been my thought.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_03: We're a entertainment industry, you know, that I don't want to walk into the range and you know see a sign that says, Are you thinking about suicide?
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_03: Like, no, I'm I'm here to have fun, actually.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_03: So with that being said, yeah, our conversation was nothing like that.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_02: But you got what we wanted to do, like from the start.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_02: I just got I just had the sense that and and you wanted to jump in.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I remember the phrase like, hey, the the cornerstone of this is we're not gonna talk about two-way politics, we're gonna focus on this issue.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_03: And that's what got me to put my guard down and start listening.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_03: I I think.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_00: So was there any other part of the initiative that made you want to be part of it that made Blackwing Shooting Center say, yes, we're in?
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_03: You know, from some experiences I had before this conversation of people coming into Blackwing with the intention of considering to hurt themselves, you know, I we really didn't know what we could do.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_03: We, you know, what was not my comfort zone.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_03: Um and so there was always a need there, but you know, it we've always been left out of the conversation.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_03: So it just seemed like an open door that I could stick my foot in and maybe learn a few extra things, help educate the staff and help, you know, protect and and and and help our customers that may, you know, may come in with no one else to ask, but want to talk to us.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_03: And and believe it or not, it has happened more than you would probably think.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_02: So, Joe, in the beginning, when you had other conversations with with your other retail friends out there and retail partners, and you told them that, you know, we're getting involved in this.
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, was there any pushback or did you get uh, okay, why why are you guys doing that?
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, there was.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, there was it's the old slow to trust, right?
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_03: You know, okay, what did they sucker you into type of thing?
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_03: Well, hold on, listen, let's talk through this.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_03: This is this is the direction I see this going.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_03: This is how this could help us.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and and I was, you know, kind of teased, like, you know, customers are really hard to earn their trust to get them to come in.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_03: You know, the last thing we want them to do is to hurt themselves.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, we want to help our people.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_03: We want to keep our customers.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_03: And if that means a simple conversation about mental health, you know, count me in.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_00: Daniel, all right, back to you.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, we've built trust with firearm retailers like Blackwing.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_00: It's been one of the secret sauces with Lifeside Ohio.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_00: Can you talk a little bit about the trust evolution over the last decade statewide?
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_00: Because that has had to be a very big evolution.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_01: I think the biggest piece of that, Soul, is that we've done this on a grassroots basis.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_01: We've gone in and had individual conversations.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it would be easy enough for us to find the email addresses for 50 retailers across the state.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_01: But if I just send an email out to the retailers, I'm sure Joe could back this up.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_01: It's probably going straight into the trash bin.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_01: It's not going to get read.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, we've we've got a team of folks that we call our ambassadors.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_01: There's um four of them across the state, and then uh one who's actually come on our team recently, Jared uh Combs here at OSPF.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_01: Um, they're going in, they're having conversations with the retailers in person.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_01: They're going into um FOPs and Elks Clubs and um the American Legions, and they're talking to gun owners one-on-one.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_01: And that's really helped us build that trust because you can see, you know, I'm having a conversation with you, you can see what I'm talking about, you can see that I'm being honest uh in that space.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_01: And it I think it really helps us to open those doors.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_01: And once we get a retailer like Blackwing in an area of the state to start participating with us, it makes it really easy to go and talk to his neighboring shops, uh, and then we can kind of spread out from there.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_00: Like a domino effect.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, very much so.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_02: Both of you guys have have also been stars of some of our videos that we have online as well.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_02: And Joe, you said a couple of times, and I and I love it when you say this, that you know, retailers need to be part of this discussion, and and they really haven't been.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_02: So life side has has been that bridge, right?
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah, I I go back.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_03: I think about, you know, going to a pediatrician's visit with one of my kids and feeling the lecture of do I own a firearm coming from, you know, a doctor.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_03: It is a much different feel than having the same conversation, you know, with a like-minded gun owner who has their guard down and doesn't feel vulnerable and on the defense.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_03: So I think that's one of the keys to our secret sauce.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_03: I really do think so.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_03: And having the right people having the right conversation.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_00: Let's dive into the two pillars of community of outreach.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_00: Very important veterans and L E.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_00: So police, fire, and first responders.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_03: So I am neither L E or a veteran, but I do work with a lot of those heathens and I love them so much.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_03: Um and it's been fun having these conversations with my staff and co-workers and seeing some of their attitudes towards mental health and even suicide prevention change.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_03: Um, again, I really do think we're changing hearts and minds as we go through this.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_01: Just to add to that, Joe, a couple of our ambassadors are um veterans or former law enforcement.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_01: And I think they've helped us open some of those doors as well because there's, again, just like firearms owners have a shared language and culture, uh, law enforcement officers and veterans have a shared uh culture and and language that when we can put another veteran in front of you, you're much more comfortable in that conversation.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_02: You couldn't have said it better.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_02: I've I've watched that magic happen.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_02: That's an easy tee up because we can talk about veterans again, as Seul mentioned, another one of our huge outreach uh communities.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_02: Daniel, you know this, you you study these numbers.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_02: OSPF looks at these numbers unfortunately every single day.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_02: We lose veterans every single day to suicide.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_02: That really highlights, I think, the need right there to just staying engaged with them in suicide prevention conversations.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_02: How do we do that?
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_01: Well, and part of it is, as we said, having those conversations directly with them, getting other veterans in front of them.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_01: We do have some partnerships with groups like veteran service organizations across the counties.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_01: We work pretty heavily with uh the VA and with their office for their community engagement partnership coordinators.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_01: They've been a great resource to be able to get things like gunlocks into the community and have those conversations.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then we also try to do veteran-friendly events.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um, over the summer, we hosted a fishing event uh in five or six different counties.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_01: We hold a clay chute every year.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_01: So it's not that we're, you know, just uh having a mental health fair and handing out brochures around suicide prevention.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_01: We're actually going and doing things that that veterans like to do, that gun owners like to do, so that they can be engaged in.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_01: Then we kind of sneak that suicide prevention conversation in with uh with those activities.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_03: I can speak specifically to like my co-workers and peers um who are veterans and and with Blackwings, you know, participation in this, you can kind of see the feeling and the culture, even in our shop, change about how this stuff is talked about, and as opposed to rolling your eyes and and dismissing it, you can see people like getting a little more engaged with it.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_03: It is working.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_00: That's incredible.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_02: Let's talk misconceptions from a couple of different angles here with veterans and mental health.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_01: I I think as far as veterans specifically go, some of the misconceptions we see, one is that all veterans um are getting the care that they need or that they're accessing resources like the VA.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_01: We know that some of our veterans are using that service, and we know that some of them aren't.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_01: And we know that some of them don't have a comfort level with some of those resources.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_01: So I think that's a big misconception.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I think also another misconception we see with veterans is that they won't talk about their mental health.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_01: I think they have to be in kind of the right setting or they have to be with people they're comfortable with, but they will have those conversations, they will open up and they can be great ambassadors for one another to get that next level of help if if they do see someone struggling.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_00: Now, Joe, people also have misconceptions about retailers.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_00: Talk about how you've been debunking those myths.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_03: One of my favorite things about Lifeside Ohio that I've experienced is it has put me in a room having conversations with people that I otherwise would have never been able to talk to, right?
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_03: Clinicians, doctors, things like that.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_03: And I remember a couple years ago uh being invited to speak and you know, gave my normal spiel and things like that.
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_03: In fact, it was with Jared Combs before he worked with OSPF.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_03: And at the very end, when we were kind of QA and wrapping up, you know, one of the clinicians came up and said, Hey, your perspective is very interesting.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_03: I've never really heard from you guys directly.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_03: In fact, I just thought you were a bunch of death dealers.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't know that you had a conscience and you cared about these things.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_03: And again, you know, life side Ohio put me in in a conversation with this person, and we both understood each other, and that would have never happened in the past.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_03: Well, Joe, you mentioned getting out and speaking.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_02: You do a lot of that for us.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_02: Daniel, of course, you do as well.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_02: You guys actually testified um just a few feet away here from the OSPF office uh at the statehouse downtown.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_02: So this summer, Ohio implemented a new law known as the Keep Them Safe Act.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_02: Folks, I want you to think about this.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_02: This is a law involving guns that passed the Ohio legislature unanimously.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_02: Daniel, why don't we start with you?
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_02: What'd you tell state lawmakers about this?
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_01: I came at the conversation from a couple different perspectives.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um I spoke in part in my role here with OSPF.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_01: I spoke in part as the chair of the Summit County Suicide Prevention Coalition and how we thought potentially this law passing would impact our our ability to uh to affect suicides in in my county.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_01: But then I also spoke on it a little bit as a firearms owner myself.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_01: Uh and so I I mean I tried to be as honest uh as I could be to to talk about examples from when I was younger of where there were family members that may have been at risk for suicide that had way too easy an access to a firearm uh in my personal life.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_01: My grandfather used to just leave a loaded gun at the back door in case deer would walk through the yard.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_01: He was not a big fan of uh ODNR regulations and kind of just did what he wanted to on his own land.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I I know I had some family members that struggled with some uh some suicide ideation and things like that.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, that firearm was always there and available.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_01: So luckily we're one of the families that didn't have to go through that tragedy, but it was a possibility.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_01: So I tried to talk a little bit about that.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_01: And I again I talked a little bit about how the law might impact our ability to help people in my home county of Summit.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but I'm gonna be totally honest with you.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think my testimony moved the needle nearly as much as the retailers that showed up for us, uh, Joe included.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: Can you talk a little bit about your your testimony and what that was like in front of lawmakers?
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_03: Absolutely.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_03: And I did have some peers in Central Ohio that really chipped in on this too.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_03: So I don't want to discount that.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_03: Yep.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_03: My my perspective, our perspective was very simple.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_03: Um, we have been in the position of identifying somebody in crisis and we have helped them, but we weren't really sure what kind of realm we were stepping into.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_03: And so we saw the opportunity with this in layman's terms, this is a simply a good Samaritan act for a retailer, right?
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_03: So now I know that if somebody comes into the shop in crisis, I can help them and not jeopardize the 30-something families that work there.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_03: God forbid something happens later if we return the firearms and and they, you know, want to sue us and things.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_03: So we wanted to do the right thing.
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_03: And, you know, this is evidence of concrete work that got accomplished by all of us.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, this is you know, tangible evidence that what we're doing is moving needles, I feel like.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_02: So let's let's back up and broaden out.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_02: So, Joe, why don't you start?
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_02: Tell our listeners about the Keep Them Safe Act.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_03: What does it do?
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, so basically, again, I the best way to say it to me is it's a good Samaritan act for a retailer.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, if somebody comes in and for whatever reason, they don't even have to specify I would like to store my firearms at a retailer.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_03: We have the processes and procedures in place, um, the conversation already mapped out about how we can help you the best, what fit is best for you.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_03: And, you know, we've gift drafted this to any FFL gun dealer, you know, range who wants to participate.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_03: Um and again, you know, we know we're confident that one, we can help people, and two, we will continue to keep our jobs well after, God forbid, something terrible happened.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_00: So, Joe, when you've been talking to all these different retailers, what has been their perspective, like their concerns, their thoughts?
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_00: What is going on in their minds?
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_03: So, some of the concerns, and I remember feeling this too, um, is dabbling into that red flag territory, right?
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_03: Um, that concerns me.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_03: I I'm a big fan of my rights.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_03: Um and I've had that from some of my peers.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_03: Like, man, this looks a lot like you know, a red flag law or the start of one.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_03: And it's easy for me to explain, like, this is quite the opposite.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_03: You know, we're here to help you.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_03: Let's make sure you're good to go.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_03: And when you are, here's your stuff back because it's yours and it's your right to have it.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_03: So that was my biggest argument.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_03: Like, this is the opposite of that.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I'm not a big fan of anything mandatory.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but it again, it uh it gave us the opportunity to help people.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_02: Daniel, do you think it's one of those things almost like a little microcosm of life side itself and the way we started?
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_02: You talked about the organic nature of the whole campaign, the grassroots.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_02: I I kind of look at our outreach that has started uh from here, you know, we we've got pillar partners like uh Blackwing and others.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_02: But I do think once we get the word out to more retailers, they're they're gonna see the benefits of this that Joe's talked about.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_01: In a nutshell, what the law does is it just takes away that liability from the retailer when they return the firearm.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_01: As Joe said, it's totally voluntary.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_01: You can set up your own storage agreements, you can choose to charge, you can choose to offer it as a free service.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_01: There's a lot of flexibility there.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_01: And that has really resonated with the retailers we've talked to about this.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_01: We had a goal of setting up five retailers.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_01: We're gonna put them on the Life Side Ohio website on a map.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_01: We had a goal for five retailers this year.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_01: We're already closing in on 10, and that's with only like a month of outreach to those retailers.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_01: People have pretty overwhelmingly been comfortable saying, This sounds like a great idea.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_01: We want to we want to offer this to our customers.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_01: Largely the only concerns we've gotten have been how many people do you think are gonna want to use this service?
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_01: Do I have enough storage space?
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_01: It's been more that kind of conversation and less about uh, as Joe mentioned, is this a red flag law or is this something that's gonna take something away from me?
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_01: We had um you you talk about the this being a collaborative effort like we've done with Life Side.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_01: Joe is very modest, but he and Blackwing, if it weren't for them, they were the initiating party on this.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_01: They saw the need here and they stepped forward.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_01: It wasn't something that OSPF came up with.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, this came from Joe's side.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_01: And then we had partners like uh the NRA came in and spoke in favor of this bill.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_01: Um, Buckeye Firearms spoke in favor of this bill.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_01: And then we had some um county suicide prevention coalitions outside of my own.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_01: We had different uh agencies speak on this.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_01: We got a law created that allows these retailers to have a ton of flexibility but still be able to support their communities and reduce risk for suicide.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_00: Now, someone who is a firearm owner and kind of learning about all of this as we're talking about it, is there anything that you really want them to know?
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_01: I think the biggest thing I want them to know is just that the resource exists.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_01: It may be something that 90% of firearms owners or higher in Ohio never have to use.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_01: But if you do need a safe place to take your firearm, this is an option.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_01: And as Joe mentioned, it doesn't have to be because you're suicidal.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_01: It could be because you're moving or you're getting deployed, or maybe I'm selling my house and I'm having an open house and I just don't want my guns in there when strangers are walking through.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_01: It could be one of a hundred different reasons.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_00: I love it.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_01: But you can go and store there and just know the resources available if you need it.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_00: Like even having family for the holidays or a lot of kids over, like that is such a great resource to have.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_03: I think of this is also an opportunity to talk about safe storage.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, early in my life, I didn't have to worry about storing my firearms safely, but I have two kids running around now.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and I took that serious.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_03: I preached that to my fellow gun owners about, you know, keeping firearms out of the hands of people who should not be operating them.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_03: So um again, just you know, helps widen the breadth of safe storage, of responsible gun ownership.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_02: Let's talk about life side.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_02: I mentioned the Wayback Machine a couple minutes ago, but I'd love to get back.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_02: Both of your perspectives.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_02: When you look at the evolution of life side over these last five plus years, um, what are you most proud of?
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_03: I alluded to it earlier.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I think the thing that's the most interesting to me and the most impactful has been the conversations that I've got to have with folks otherwise I would have never had the opportunity to even be in the same room with.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I had my, you know, misconceptions about them, and I'm sure they had an idea of who I was and what I was about.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_03: And just a couple sentences each way, I mean, I it really created a bridge.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_03: I feel like I've I've made great relationships again with people otherwise I would have never had the opportunity to speak with.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_03: So I think I think those connections is what's helping build all this as well.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_03: And I think that's the big part of this.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_02: Let me mention one other thing too.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_02: Here's here's something that is indelible in my mind, and Joe, it involves you.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_02: When we kicked off Lifeside Ohio, we did three press conferences Columbus, Cincinnati, and Cleveland area.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_02: After the cameras were gone at our Columbus presser, you and several or several of our other retail partners, our OGs who are with us from the very beginning.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_02: I remember looking over kind of in the corner of the room, and you were having a deep and good conversation with the Franklin County coroner.
• 23:14
  unknown: Wow.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_02: And I would venture a guess that that was a unique conversation for her and also a unique conversation for you guys.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_03: Do you remember that?
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_03: I I do.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_03: In fact, I remember in the back of my head, like this lady probably thinks I make her job busy, you know, which, you know, a short conversation later, you know, she understood that, you know, oh wow, these guys are here doing the right things.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah, it was a very interesting moment for me as well.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_02: I'll never forget it.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_02: I'll never forget looking and seeing the four or five of you.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_02: I can't remember, but I mean, and you guys had like this 15, 20 minute conversation.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_02: Cameras were gone, and you guys stay stayed really engaged.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_02: So, man, kudos to you.
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_00: So, with all the success of the campaign, has there been anything that really stands out or has surprised you?
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_01: For me, the biggest thing that surprises me is that we got a law passed.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like I would have never guessed whenever I talk about the Keep Them Safe Act or Senate Bill 273.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_01: I always say at life side, we don't talk about bills, policies, and laws, but let me tell you about this bill policy law.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um But I I really feel like this one's the exception to the rule because it's not, like Joe said, it's not about um two-way politics at all.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's solely about giving people an additional option.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_01: So I am always shocked uh when I think about the fact that we were able to move the needle and get something passed, as Scott talked about earlier, something unilateral and passed with uh unanimous uh support.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_01: So that's really cool.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um when I went into this work in suicide prevention, our goal is always to save lives.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I know that there are people who have reached out to me and to some of our other partners because of life side that we've been able to get someone help.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_01: So much of the time in this work, we don't hear about those positives, we only hear about the horror stories.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_01: And so when someone reaches out and says, I heard about your campaign, my cousin, uncle, brother, whoever was struggling, and I was able to get him some help that that really makes all this worth it.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_00: Uh Joe, what about from a retailer point of view?
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_00: What surprised you the most?
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_03: So Lifeside Ohio kind of got me involved in the suicide prevention world.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_03: From there, I got involved in some of the local coalition work, which was interesting.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_03: Um the first thing I learned was coalition work does not pay.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_03: But uh, you know, with that being said, um, you know, our local coalition in Delaware County, we, you know, with some of the partners there, we we've gotten tens of thousands of dollars of funding for handgun lockboxes, of which we're handing out in classes if they're interested, of which we're handing out in the community if if they're interested.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_03: So you know, that is an offshoot of life side Ohio's success.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_03: And again, you know, responsible gun ownership, um, safe storage options for some people that otherwise wouldn't have been able to afford it.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_03: But those are the things that kind of surprise me when I take a step back and like, I can't believe I'm still doing all this and I, you know, I'm spending my time here.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_03: And I mean, we're moving the needle, um, not just sitting in meetings, wasting our time pretending.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_02: The things we talk about with this campaign and and again, the outreach, lives saved, we know that laws that get passed, it just it does.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_02: It makes the hair on the back of your neck stand up.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_02: It does.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_02: What is the next chapter, Daniel, you think, for Life Side Ohio?
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_01: I think for me, because Lifeside is such a collaborative effort, I think in part the firearms community kind of has to dictate that.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, what do they need?
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_01: So ideally for me, I'd love to see a couple retailers and all kind of five quadrants of the state, the the corners in central Ohio, where there's a safe storage option through Senate Bill 273.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_01: That would be great to be able to offer that to anybody across the state that needs it.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_01: But we didn't know when we started this work that that was even on the radar that you know we needed to find a way for retailers to be able to offer this and still be able to protect their employees and their business.
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_01: So I think I I kind of want to leave it up a little bit to the firearms uh community to see what what do we need to make suicide prevention work better for them.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_00: Well, as we're diving into our final questions here, this has been an incredible conversation.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_00: I've definitely also learned a lot.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_00: Um, if listeners only remember one thing from our whole conversation, what would you want it to be?
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_00: And I want to hear from both of you.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_00: Daniel, why don't you kick it off?
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_01: If they just remember one thing from today's conversation, it's that there's always a resource, there's always something available to get help.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_01: And if you don't know where to look, 988, you can call, text, chat, lifesideohio.org, ohio spf.org.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_01: There's always a resource here in Ohio.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_01: And if you're outside of Ohio, we will find that for you in your home state.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_01: 988's always available.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_03: I cannot top that.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_03: However, um, from a retailer's perspective, you know, the main thing to take away is if if you need to store your firearms for any reason, you know, find a reputable range and retailer that that does offer this.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_03: And remember, it is all voluntary.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_03: It is a private transaction between you and that business.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_03: And with that being said, if if you don't have that opportunity or you don't even need it, and you have this conversation with a fellow gun owner, be that person for them.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_03: If you're able to, help them out, store their firearms.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_03: Now give them back when they're ready.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_03: But um, we need to all help each other.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_03: And and again, even if you can do it without a retailer, be that person and do that right thing for your buddy, your family member, your friend.
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you're both doing it.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_02: Joe, Daniel, thanks as always.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_02: Great conversation here, as Sol just mentioned.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, I'll repeat the website that uh that uh Daniel just mentioned.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_02: If you want to learn more about Lifeside Ohio, again, come visit us, come join us, lifesideohio.org, and there you'll find plenty of resources, information, and ways to get involved.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for listening to Voices for Suicide Prevention.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_00: We'll see you next time.