Latest / A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast / Talks to Daniel Rawnsley about his choice of Rose

Transcript

Talks to Daniel Rawnsley about his choice of Rose · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

• 0:23
  None. Hamster with a blunt.
• 0:34
  Pen knife for doing. Quicker, quicker.
• 0:39
  Quicker, quicker. Yeah, I've got a choice.
• 0:44
  Stay at home with my mum, my boyfriend, my job or Chuck it
• 0:48
  all in for danger and podcasting and hamsters with blunt pen
• 0:53
  knives. What do you think?
• 0:57
  I think. Do you want to come with me?
• 1:00
  Because if you do, I should warn you.
• 1:05
  Hello Daniel. Hello Joe.
• 1:08
  Oh, how simple we are with each other today after.
• 1:10
  Fighting it out on season six of Strictly come out of the Stuff.
• 1:13
  Oh. It's good to see you again.
• 1:15
  Run for your life. Oh, there was so many things.
• 1:19
  Well, I think that's a slight clue as to what we might be
• 1:22
  talking about today. Yes.
• 1:24
  What are we talking about today? What?
• 1:26
  Did you tell us? Well, we are going all the way
• 1:29
  back to 2005 where it all began. Not with a police box standing
• 1:36
  in a junkyard, but a shop girl going down to the basement and
• 1:41
  being menaced by living plastic come to life and grabbing the
• 1:48
  hand of a stranger and running for her life.
• 1:52
  I've got to be honest, though, that all of that sounds a bit of
• 1:54
  holographic. She's gone down to the basement.
• 1:57
  She's. I I won't go there.
• 2:00
  I won't go there. How has this never been covered
• 2:04
  on Hamster before Rose of all episodes?
• 2:08
  Yes, it's. And it's 19 years old today, so
• 2:13
  the same age Rose Tyler is. Happy birthday, Rose Tyler.
• 2:16
  Happy birthday, Doctor Who. I've got a number of questions I
• 2:23
  would like to ask you before we go into the episode.
• 2:26
  Is this your in to Doctor Who? So this was my in to Doctor Who
• 2:33
  officially my the when I officially started watching.
• 2:37
  I wasn't a stranger to Doctor Who before because I my my my
• 2:44
  mum actually introduced me to the Peter Cushing Doctor Who and
• 2:48
  the Dalek Invasion of Earth movie.
• 2:52
  So that was my first taste of the Daleks and.
• 2:56
  Did you love them? I did.
• 2:57
  I was scared. But I was, I love them.
• 3:01
  And then, yes, a few months later, my parents were getting
• 3:04
  really excited because Doctor Who was coming back.
• 3:07
  And so I was like, oh wow. And so they sat us down in front
• 3:11
  of the TV and I was expecting the Doctor to be this, you know,
• 3:16
  white haired Peter Cushing old man type.
• 3:19
  And imagine my surprise when he was this rude Northern bloke
• 3:23
  from Southford. You know, in a black leather
• 3:25
  jacket. Unthinkable in a leather jacket.
• 3:29
  Doctor Who? Are you mad?
• 3:32
  And I was like, that's the doctor.
• 3:35
  And so I was hooked. He was so cool, wasn't he?
• 3:39
  Well, it was just, yeah, he was just so blunt and rude to
• 3:42
  everyone. And I found that so refreshing.
• 3:45
  It was so refreshing. I was expecting him to be, you
• 3:47
  know, the very well behaved gentleman.
• 3:50
  And yeah, it was modern, it was fast, it was exciting.
• 3:56
  And and then, yeah, we got to the end of the world, the very
• 3:59
  next episode and we had Cassandra playing Toxic.
• 4:05
  And that's when I was hooked. I was like, I am never letting
• 4:08
  this go. I've got to say, like when I I I
• 4:14
  obviously was a fan of Classic Who and I've been there all
• 4:17
  through the wilderness years. I came in at the tail end in 89
• 4:22
  and saw a little bit of Battlefield and now that was
• 4:24
  about it in the last season. And then obviously there was
• 4:26
  nothing else but collected the videos and all that nonsense.
• 4:29
  Anyway, you remember that this leaks online?
• 4:32
  It did, yeah. Downloaded it because I'm a
• 4:36
  naughty boy. But it didn't work.
• 4:39
  Only the sound downloaded. So I thought, all right, well,
• 4:42
  this is only half naughty, so I'll listen to it and I'll
• 4:45
  listen to Rose and I I got to the end and I was like, that
• 4:48
  can't be it, surely? What was that?
• 4:52
  And I was so I was straight to Gallifrey base.
• 4:56
  This appalling spectacle was coming on and then I watched it.
• 5:00
  And actually, I still wasn't thrilled by.
• 5:04
  Rose, But I want to sort of tell you how I came to terms of that
• 5:08
  as we go through the episode. OK, but for me, it was the end
• 5:11
  of the world as well. But I watched the end of the
• 5:13
  world and I was like, it's like a Graham Williams story with a
• 5:16
  budget. This is absolute gold.
• 5:19
  Yeah, they broke the budget with that, didn't they?
• 5:21
  Yeah, I'm glad they did though. It's all there on the screen.
• 5:25
  So what was it like then, going through this first series, like
• 5:28
  by the end of it, where you're absolutely hooked?
• 5:30
  Oh yeah. And my parents got hooked too
• 5:32
  like they they were we we were in London actually when aliens
• 5:37
  of London and World War Three broadcast.
• 5:39
  So we we were actually in the location it was it was broad it
• 5:43
  was you know the story was happening and then you know you
• 5:46
  got to the end of that one and you had the next time trailer
• 5:48
  which which now I think always spoils everything but and you
• 5:53
  know the the Daleks were coming back and it was so chilling
• 5:57
  watching Dalek. You know, I was, I was still
• 5:59
  quite scared of the Daleks at the time.
• 6:02
  And then we got to what was it? Yeah, the empty child.
• 6:07
  And my dad actually literally got off the sofa and recorded
• 6:11
  the Next Time trailer on his Dictaphone for the for for the
• 6:15
  next episode. And then we get to the end and
• 6:20
  and he regenerates into David Tennant and and my parents ran
• 6:25
  for the hills. Oh, what?
• 6:27
  They didn't watch any more. We watched, we watched, I think,
• 6:30
  David Tennant's first couple of episodes, and as soon as he
• 6:33
  started shouting, they were like, Yep, done, can't do, can't
• 6:37
  deal with this guy. But I'm assuming you kept going.
• 6:40
  Oh. I kept going and luckily because
• 6:42
  I was, I had so cousins who watched it, so they'd come and
• 6:45
  watch it and yeah, and I kept going and I watched it all the
• 6:50
  way to university without without sort of missing a
• 6:55
  broadcast. And then, you know, real life
• 6:58
  kicks in. You've got to you.
• 7:00
  You have other things to be distracted by and beg.
• 7:03
  Your pardon? What other things?
• 7:05
  And Doctor Who? Studies.
• 7:11
  No, no, just our girls studies. I was.
• 7:15
  I went to film school so I was all about movies.
• 7:19
  So movies enter my life a lot and and so I had to catch up
• 7:23
  with the the. I remember for the 50th I had to
• 7:26
  do a very speedy catch up because it was you know it was
• 7:31
  here in November and I in October I had I had the DV DS
• 7:34
  and I was like oh I've got to watch all this now and yes so
• 7:39
  and I've I've kind of never really fallen out of love with
• 7:42
  with with Doctor Who and I think around the around the 50th I
• 7:46
  will I then got into the the classic series through the five
• 7:51
  Doctors and. Good calendar, it.
• 7:55
  And now you know, now it's all on, all on the iPlayer.
• 7:59
  And you know, I don't know where to start.
• 8:01
  So I I I kind of pretend I'm I'm Doctor Who.
• 8:04
  I put on the randomizer and it picks a story for me.
• 8:08
  And I just the. Story goes, you know.
• 8:10
  So have you still got a lot to watch of Classic Who?
• 8:15
  Yes. Oh, I'm.
• 8:16
  So. German, You bastard.
• 8:19
  It's it's mainly the per with Tom Baker Eras because I did
• 8:24
  watch those actually before the revival came back.
• 8:27
  I remember they were on rotation on UK gold in on TV, but I just
• 8:34
  don't remember anything. So I I would get, so it's now
• 8:37
  kind of a litmus test of have I seen this before.
• 8:40
  And then you get sort of two Store 2 episodes in you say, Oh
• 8:44
  yeah, I have seen this before and then there's another one.
• 8:45
  I have never seen this one. Before I'm so jealous.
• 8:49
  Like I know this stuff back to front and inside out to be able
• 8:52
  to watch this stuff new. Oh you lucky, lucky man.
• 8:57
  So. But is your love still with the
• 8:59
  new series? My love is still the new series,
• 9:02
  but I I love it all actually as I grew up and you know as I grew
• 9:07
  up watching movies and got more into Classic Cinema and 70s
• 9:12
  cinema and you just you've just learned to appreciate there's no
• 9:15
  for me there's no dated there's no, oh this is too old.
• 9:19
  It's all, it's all part. It's all a snapshot in time you
• 9:23
  know so so it's the same with the with with the with the
• 9:27
  classic series and the new series.
• 9:29
  I know we keep calling it that, but for me it's all it's all
• 9:32
  Doctor Who. I wish more people fall like
• 9:35
  you. You know, some people will just
• 9:37
  see dated televisions go, no, I'm out too slow.
• 9:40
  You know, too melodramatic. OK, we'll come back to the new
• 9:45
  series then. Do you have like a a favorite
• 9:49
  series of the new series? Well, is is it in that initial
• 9:55
  realm? The first four series, the 1st
• 9:59
  4. Russell T Davies.
• 10:01
  Yeah, definitely. That's my era.
• 10:03
  That's that's the. I'm so nostalgic for that.
• 10:06
  I grew up watching that. I rewatched them again and again
• 10:09
  and again. I keep coming back to them.
• 10:12
  And also I did when Series 5, Moffett's first season came out,
• 10:17
  I was, I was really on board with that.
• 10:20
  And then it's been sort of dips and valleys.
• 10:23
  I've never, I've never outright hated any any season really.
• 10:28
  Because you know when you as as all Doctor Who, well, a lot of
• 10:32
  Doctor Who fans do you you, you don't like it and then you go
• 10:36
  back and revisit it. Now, actually there is some good
• 10:39
  here, you know. Go with your gut Then what's
• 10:43
  your favorite episode of the new series?
• 10:46
  Go with your gut. We'll go with my gut, OK?
• 10:49
  Midnight. Oh, excellent.
• 10:51
  Excellent choice. I mean, mine's turned left and
• 10:54
  they're right. They're back.
• 10:55
  They're right. Yeah.
• 10:56
  Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
• 10:57
  Yeah, what a Time to Be Alive Series 4.
• 11:00
  And I was watching. Yeah, I I watched that one on my
• 11:02
  own. I think that's why it was such a
• 11:04
  sort of vivid memory of just me watching it on my own.
• 11:08
  It was, it was still daylight outside.
• 11:10
  And it was so it was so chilling and eerie.
• 11:15
  Oh, like I just Yeah. Obviously you've gone from this
• 11:19
  being a whole new thing and Christopher Reckerson being the
• 11:22
  Doctor, not one of the Doctors, the Doctor.
• 11:26
  And now you've experienced all the rest of the new series,
• 11:29
  quite a bit of the classic series.
• 11:31
  So now Christopher Reckerson is one of the Doctors.
• 11:35
  What do you feel about the Knife, Doctor now?
• 11:37
  He's my doctor. Actually he was my you, you
• 11:41
  never forget your first and and Christopher Eccleston, yeah, he
• 11:48
  he made such a big impression of me that I I think it's actually
• 11:51
  perfect in the sense that he he only had 13 episodes and it was
• 11:56
  a great run. And I I know he's come back for
• 11:59
  Big Finish, but I kind of never want him to come back to the
• 12:03
  show proper. I mean he himself has probably
• 12:06
  said that too but it's it's I just like that to be sort of
• 12:13
  crystallized in amber. Just he had those 13 episodes
• 12:17
  and they stand on fool by their merits but he, you know he was
• 12:22
  and you know I I don't go back to him very often just because I
• 12:25
  want to preserve that sort of that that first memory.
• 12:29
  So I do watch his, his, his, his series every now and again.
• 12:33
  But I like to savour it like a like a wine, you know?
• 12:37
  I would say about series one is they kind of rusty Davis had an
• 12:42
  approach he wanted to take, but he didn't really know how far he
• 12:45
  could go. And so there's stuff that
• 12:47
  they're doing, one that they never do again, and that's what
• 12:50
  makes it sort of exciting. There's a bit of edge to it, you
• 12:53
  know. There is, yes.
• 12:55
  Even in the episode we're going to talk about.
• 12:57
  Yeah, well, I mean, there's a lot of fluff.
• 12:59
  In there as well, but there is a bit of edge to it too.
• 13:02
  Well, OK, what about Billie Piper as Rose?
• 13:05
  Who's on? 1st.
• 13:06
  Companion. My first companion and to to to
• 13:10
  date. Still one of my favorite
• 13:12
  companions. OK.
• 13:14
  Series 2 didn't ruin her for you.
• 13:16
  No, I, I, I, I, I love her. And Tennant being a pair of
• 13:20
  smug, lovestruck Gitz. You know, because I know people
• 13:25
  like that. I've known people who
• 13:27
  ridiculously attractive, ridiculously charming, and
• 13:30
  they're also so in love with each other it's almost
• 13:33
  sickening. Oh, honestly, Danny, you don't
• 13:35
  have to say that about me. It's it's fine.
• 13:40
  No, I know what you mean. I know what.
• 13:41
  You mean, Yeah, you just want to go on along with the ride
• 13:43
  because they're so charming, they.
• 13:45
  And yeah, and of course that whole series, Series 2 is all
• 13:50
  designed to punish them at the end is they get so big for their
• 13:53
  boots and then by the end, they're.
• 13:57
  Separated. You know?
• 13:58
  I love how much of a shit bag she is in Series 2, because I
• 14:01
  know lots of people like that. And frankly, I'm a bit like that
• 14:04
  as well. Like, I'm a nice guy, but I can
• 14:06
  also. See, it ain't.
• 14:07
  So a total cuddle as well. So to see someone on the screen
• 14:11
  who's got that all of those levels, because I don't really
• 14:14
  know, do you know, like, oh, actually Amy Bold could be
• 14:18
  horrible as well. You know what?
• 14:20
  I mean, like the model companion Bill's lovely, but I don't
• 14:24
  really know many bills, you know, it's just sort of nice
• 14:28
  people. And while she's sort of fun, not
• 14:32
  as engaging, you know, when you're not really sure which
• 14:35
  which person are we getting this week?
• 14:37
  You know, the total, you know, the total cow bag or the really
• 14:41
  nice rose. But I think in one, in one,
• 14:45
  she's that pretty consistent. Like she can be selfish, but I
• 14:50
  feel like her and Eccleston, there's such a chemistry there,
• 14:54
  but they have. A unique chemistry together,
• 14:55
  yeah. There's a special sizzle between
• 14:58
  them where whereas with with Tenon it's a very different
• 15:01
  chemistry and it's still, I think it still works
• 15:03
  brilliantly, but it's it's a very different vibe, yeah, yeah.
• 15:06
  You know that that mattress that Joji and Mandy fall onto at the
• 15:10
  beginning of the Flux? I could imagine Tenant and oh
• 15:13
  not Tenant. Sorry, the 10th Doctor and Rose
• 15:16
  at it on that mattress. I can't see the 9th Doctor and
• 15:19
  Rose doing that though. No, no.
• 15:21
  Well, you just have to head over to Tumblr and oh.
• 15:24
  Really. Oh God, what horror?
• 15:27
  What sites have you seen? Daniel, tell us.
• 15:29
  I'm a bitch. Oh, it's probably not for for
• 15:33
  public consumption on this podcast.
• 15:35
  I saw a picture once of of the 10th Doctor and the Meta Crisis
• 15:39
  Doctor and that's all you need to know.
• 15:43
  I was like, oh God, it's the work of a diseased mind, this
• 15:46
  deviant art. I need to get out of here.
• 15:48
  Oh well, he's a bit just a bit of self love, you know?
• 15:52
  You feel quiet, yeah. And we are going to do a bit of
• 15:55
  self love now as we watch Rose but.
• 15:59
  That's what we're doing, OK? We'll wait till after the
• 16:04
  commentary for that. Very quickly on Rose itself,
• 16:09
  yes. Do you think this is a good
• 16:11
  episode of Doctor Who, and do you think this is a good
• 16:15
  introduction to a television series?
• 16:19
  Yes, actually, I think what when I revisited it, I was actually
• 16:23
  quite surprised by how sort of solid it still is.
• 16:27
  It still holds up. Not everywhere but it it still
• 16:31
  work does sets out to do a lot of things and there's a lot of
• 16:34
  things it sets out to do and I think it it's it ticks nearly
• 16:38
  all the boxes I think very nearly and so it's not a home
• 16:41
  run but it's it's it's it's a good sturdy piece of work I
• 16:47
  think not my favorite series opener but but it's the one.
• 16:51
  Tell us what is? Oh, sorry.
• 16:55
  I think just by pure, just by pure quality of in in this era,
• 17:01
  in the Russell T Davies era, it's the the Series 4 opener.
• 17:05
  Oh, yes. Partners in crime, just 'cause
• 17:08
  you go back to that and you think, yeah, he's he's worked so
• 17:10
  long on this script and they, yeah, he's they've got it so
• 17:14
  right and it just puts you in such a good mood for the rest of
• 17:17
  the series. What sort of country do you
• 17:19
  think this is, Daniel? Oh, it's a beautifully fabbed
• 17:22
  country. Oh, I love that one so much.
• 17:26
  I've always said. About Rosie's, it's.
• 17:28
  It is a very good introduction to the TV show, to the to Doctor
• 17:32
  Who I. It creates a mystery around the
• 17:35
  Doctor and it unpeels that mystery throughout the episode,
• 17:39
  really cleverly as a Doctor Who story.
• 17:43
  So like the whole sort of orbit on Invasion.
• 17:46
  It is a bit lacklustre because it happens.
• 17:48
  In that, yeah, a bit of an afterthought, isn't it?
• 17:51
  But oh, great, hang on, yeah, we're still that show as well.
• 17:53
  We need to hang this on at the end last 10 minutes.
• 17:56
  So you get that massive BLOB coming up.
• 17:58
  And I mean it's it's very exciting and it sort of shows
• 18:01
  the possibilities. But kind of done better in the
• 18:05
  Pearl era, I think. The Autonomy invasions.
• 18:08
  Oh yeah, with spearhead from space.
• 18:10
  Well, that ended with a a tentacle monster strangling,
• 18:14
  probably. Wasn't it?
• 18:15
  Oh, yeah, actually. Maybe I'll take it back.
• 18:18
  That was terrible. Not in common, actually.
• 18:20
  Yeah, yeah, very much. Well, let's press play and see
• 18:24
  where this episode takes us. Would you do me the great honour
• 18:28
  of counting us in? I.
• 18:29
  Shall OK on so on 54321 OK 5432 run.
• 18:43
  Well done. Oh, this title sequence.
• 18:47
  Oh, I love this title sequence. I I do like that that they
• 18:50
  judged it up for for series 4 where it gets the sort of
• 18:55
  electric guitar out. Oh.
• 18:56
  It's great and the piano's in there as well, isn't it?
• 18:59
  Piano. Yeah, yeah.
• 19:00
  My favorite bit is the yeah, just after Chris Eccleston's
• 19:04
  title. It goes, yeah, that bit.
• 19:10
  We're being very indulgent now, well.
• 19:15
  Yes. Well, you, you, you people out
• 19:17
  there, you've listened to enough of this podcast.
• 19:19
  You know how indulgent it gets. So shut up.
• 19:22
  Not you. Them.
• 19:23
  Well, question for you, Joe. Come on, what are the first two
• 19:26
  things we see in this episode? There's one on the screen right
• 19:29
  now. What's the planet Earth?
• 19:31
  What's the moon, technically? Yeah, it's the space.
• 19:34
  OK. And then we zoom in.
• 19:38
  And he's moving into a clock. A clock time.
• 19:41
  So he's facing time. Isn't that brilliant?
• 19:43
  That is actually very good. What's going on with the pink in
• 19:45
  that room, though? That pink is horrible, actually.
• 19:48
  And I think they even the production team complain about
• 19:51
  it. On the, the commentary, they're
• 19:52
  like oh, we went, we were glad we went and fixed that.
• 19:55
  Jackie Tyler's ever increasing flat.
• 19:58
  As you go through the seats as it gets bigger and bigger.
• 20:02
  He did some refurbs well. Her daughter was gone.
• 20:05
  Do you think Rusty Davies is very good at doing this sort of
• 20:08
  shorthand, introducing characters very quickly and
• 20:12
  establishing their relationships?
• 20:14
  This, this montage, I mean it's, I mean that's kind of sums up.
• 20:17
  The whole episode is like, this episode is fast.
• 20:21
  I mean it just moves at such a lick that when I was taking my
• 20:24
  notes, I was like, oh, I give up.
• 20:27
  I can't tell. I just, it was moving so fast, I
• 20:29
  couldn't keep up. So I was like, I'm going to take
• 20:31
  my notes at the end. And yeah, it sketches the broad
• 20:35
  sketches of of Rose's life. So we know we know everything.
• 20:39
  Well, we know the broad stroke. So she's she lives in a council
• 20:42
  estate. She gets up at 7:30, she takes
• 20:45
  the bus to work. She works in a department store,
• 20:48
  which boils her to tears. I've worked in a department
• 20:51
  store and I'll tell you why, it's very boring, but you'd
• 20:53
  never get away with wearing that hoodie, I'm telling you.
• 20:57
  It's quite a LAX dress code they have there.
• 21:00
  And do they have a basement in your department store?
• 21:04
  Oh, they did. It was miserable like this, all
• 21:06
  pipes and dripping water. We didn't have someone down
• 21:10
  there. What's the fella's name in this?
• 21:12
  Wilson. Wilson That's the lottery money.
• 21:17
  Oh, that lift, that that lift shot that they use again and
• 21:21
  again and again. And they get some good, good
• 21:23
  money out of that shot, didn't they?
• 21:26
  In the book. Have you read the book of this?
• 21:29
  Yeah, the target novelisation, yeah.
• 21:31
  It's Wilson out to be like some dreadful old perv, doesn't it?
• 21:35
  She's a, too. Scared to go down there and give
• 21:37
  him the. Money, in case he yeah, isn't.
• 21:39
  That they they it describes it as he he leaned a little too
• 21:43
  close and breathed a little too loudly.
• 21:47
  Oh, nasty. In fact, I think if I do a
• 21:49
  little bit of peering over your shoulder there I can see some
• 21:52
  new series adventures. I think I can see a couple of
• 21:54
  spines. Yes.
• 21:55
  I don't have the the target of Rose.
• 21:58
  I did. I lent it to someone and they
• 22:01
  never gave it back. So sorry about that, I'll put it
• 22:03
  in the post tomorrow. So this scene is this is pure
• 22:10
  Doctor Who. I mean they have another scene
• 22:11
  like this in Aliens of London where it all goes quiet and he
• 22:15
  just lets the atmosphere sort of reign over the.
• 22:19
  And yeah, it's just and this would be the kind of opening
• 22:22
  where, you know, the beautiful blonde goes down to the basement
• 22:26
  and then she gets brutally murdered and then the titles
• 22:28
  kick in and then we start with a whole nother story of Doctor
• 22:32
  Who. But of course it doesn't do
• 22:34
  that. I think this shows Buffy's
• 22:37
  influence on Doctor Who as well. And Russell says he loved Buffy
• 22:41
  and he wanted to bring a bit of that to the show.
• 22:44
  Yeah, this young blonde girl, very capable, but she's not some
• 22:48
  all conquering, you know, one Slayer to kill them all.
• 22:52
  She's just a regular girl with, you know, 5G CSES&APE
• 22:56
  certificate and that's but, oh, she's got to her name.
• 22:59
  That's right. Yes.
• 23:00
  Yeah, she's she's got no A levels and she regrets leaving
• 23:04
  school. And yeah, and she, I think she
• 23:08
  dumped Mickey for a Jimmy Stone. She she brings that up very
• 23:12
  briefly and then went back to him, yeah.
• 23:15
  I actually think this the movement of the Autons in this
• 23:18
  scene is really well done, the way it peers out of the light.
• 23:22
  And the stretching of the plastic.
• 23:24
  Yeah, like Keith Bowman comes into for a lot of Flack.
• 23:28
  And I think sometimes deservedly because because he, like
• 23:32
  everybody else, was figuring out, is there a slot for this
• 23:35
  sort of TV? Is there an audience for it?
• 23:37
  Where where do we pitch it? So sometimes they pitch it very
• 23:40
  young in these first couple of episodes, but when he gets it
• 23:44
  right, I think he really gets it right.
• 23:47
  Yeah, there's some good, some good composition work in this,
• 23:50
  actually, where they make good use of the background and it's
• 23:53
  very clever. Yeah, yeah, but.
• 23:54
  Of course, we will also point out the bits where it's really
• 23:57
  lame as well. You know, going back very
• 24:00
  quickly to how we economically captures the characters.
• 24:05
  I think he actually bests that in series 3, even more with.
• 24:09
  Smith and Johnson's phone call that.
• 24:11
  Series of calls. It's just so well done.
• 24:13
  Isn't it? Hi, Martha, hi.
• 24:16
  Hi, Annalise. Taking shopping, Big Boy.
• 24:21
  Offered that a few times. Oh, here he is.
• 24:25
  Here's the Doctor. Here he is, and I love that his
• 24:29
  first word is run. It's such a great sort of
• 24:32
  summation of his whole ethos and even the whole character of the
• 24:35
  Doctor. It's just and that's he hits the
• 24:38
  ground running and it's it's he barrels into into our lives.
• 24:42
  You know, basically. Never stops.
• 24:43
  He just runs throughout the entire series.
• 24:46
  Yeah, and this episode has a lot of running in it, actually.
• 24:48
  That's the other thing. It's got, it's got it.
• 24:50
  It's all go, go, go. And they always, they're always
• 24:53
  learning something new or they're walking to one place to
• 24:55
  another or they're running from one place to another.
• 24:58
  And it just never, never, never stops.
• 25:00
  Well, I think he's deeper than that, though, because he's
• 25:02
  running away from the consequences of the Time War,
• 25:05
  isn't he? Oh.
• 25:06
  Yes, he is, Yeah. Not just pretty face, you know,
• 25:09
  but actually in Boomtown, Margaret Slovene says to him,
• 25:14
  you always run because you can't stop and face the consequences.
• 25:18
  Yeah. So there's definitely something
• 25:20
  to that. And at a point at the end of the
• 25:22
  season where he can't run anymore and he's got to make a
• 25:25
  terrible choice, well, we're not there.
• 25:28
  We're not watching. We're not there.
• 25:29
  But eventually he has to stop running, is what I'm saying.
• 25:33
  Oh, do you remember this bit in the trailer?
• 25:35
  I'm the Doctor, by the way. What's your name?
• 25:37
  Rose, that's for you. Rose.
• 25:39
  Run for your life. And that always.
• 25:41
  That always makes me laugh. I can remember that with the BBC
• 25:44
  logo going around it on the trailers, I was like, I'll bring
• 25:47
  it on baby, I'm ready. Well, and he bought and.
• 25:50
  Yeah. And it's like, we're kind of
• 25:51
  like in Rose Rose's point of view because she's just
• 25:54
  bombarded with all this information, you know, he sonics
• 25:57
  the lift. Hey, what?
• 25:58
  You know what's going on? He's got a bomb straight out of
• 26:00
  24, you know, And then he just propels her out the door.
• 26:04
  OK, Don't tell anyone about this or we get them killed.
• 26:06
  Bye. And that's a really great point,
• 26:08
  because there's only been a handful of companions, Ian and
• 26:11
  Barbara, Tegan and a few others that have been just so shocked
• 26:17
  at entering into this world. Whereas I really hate it when
• 26:20
  people just. Walk in and go, oh, it's bigger
• 26:22
  on the. Inside than the help, yeah.
• 26:25
  I think Nisa does that, doesn't she?
• 26:26
  Yeah. Oh, I think Clara does a bit as
• 26:28
  well. And a few others.
• 26:33
  I mean, do you remember Donna? She walked in and she's like,
• 26:35
  what the hell? And she just runs out again
• 26:37
  straight away, like, well, what? Rose does the same thing.
• 26:39
  She does, yeah. And they do that walk around the
• 26:42
  TARDIS. But oh Jackie Tyler, as I live
• 26:46
  and breathe, I love her so much. Yes.
• 26:50
  Oh, Daniel. Skin like an old Bible.
• 26:53
  Oh. OK, oh, let's let's deal with
• 26:59
  the elephant in the room, shall we?
• 27:00
  No, Clark. Yes.
• 27:01
  No Clark, who has done some things that you can read about
• 27:04
  on the Internet, yes. And what about Mickey?
• 27:08
  Mickey Yeah. So the out of all the, the
• 27:12
  players here, all the characters, all the the actors,
• 27:14
  he's probably the one who's kind of maybe overdoing it a little
• 27:19
  bit on the. Uninformed, perhaps.
• 27:21
  Yeah, he he did. I think he did say that he
• 27:24
  didn't have any rehearsal time and he didn't actually have any
• 27:27
  sort of chance to meet the actors on set before they
• 27:30
  filmed. And he was on another shoot at
• 27:33
  the same time. So his head was not in the game
• 27:35
  basically. So yeah, so he he, he, although
• 27:40
  it does kind of work for this little shorthand they have
• 27:43
  between him and Rose where they have these little childish games
• 27:46
  that they play. You know, she trips him up as he
• 27:48
  walks out the door and then he takes the the plastic arm and
• 27:51
  strangles himself like you know, and he think that's the thing
• 27:55
  too, is he thinks he's cool, but he drives this, you know,
• 27:58
  clapped out, horrible yellow beetle.
• 28:00
  You know, I know so many people like that.
• 28:02
  Yeah. Luke Malloy, I'm talking about
• 28:04
  you, all right? He doesn't drive a Beetle, but
• 28:08
  yeah, it's an interesting car. I think he's fine when he's
• 28:12
  Mickey, it's when he's the Auton later is.
• 28:16
  I don't know what is going on you.
• 28:17
  Know Babe, babe, sweetheart, Sir.
• 28:22
  He does that little grin. Doesn't even go at one point.
• 28:26
  There you are to the dogs or. Something like that.
• 28:30
  Butcher. It's.
• 28:31
  Really. Really.
• 28:32
  Quite bad, but he, yeah, like you said, he admits it himself
• 28:35
  and he does try and improve. I think come alien to London
• 28:39
  World War Three, he's getting better.
• 28:40
  Come party. Otherwise he's even better.
• 28:42
  By the time we get to Doomsday. He's one of the best things,
• 28:44
  isn't it? Yeah, and I actually kind of.
• 28:47
  I do kind of like the I prefer the funny Mickey to the heroic
• 28:51
  Mickey, though, you know, is it? Because we're like the full guy.
• 28:55
  I think it's yeah also because once he because once he, well,
• 28:58
  he he he he's a hero in doomsday.
• 29:01
  But then you know when they bring him back for Journey's
• 29:03
  End, I mean he's got nowhere to go with the character.
• 29:05
  He's just he's fully formed And so he just does the tough guy
• 29:09
  act again and you think, oh that's a bit boring, you know.
• 29:11
  Yeah. Yeah, there's a really
• 29:13
  interesting line in Aliens of London about having, like, feces
• 29:17
  posted through his letterbox. And Oh yeah.
• 29:19
  Posting stuff through my letterbox pointing the finger.
• 29:22
  Yeah, it's all getting very real world at that point.
• 29:25
  Did you hear Jackie just said she got 2000 LB off the council
• 29:29
  because the fellow said she. Looked Greek.
• 29:30
  I know she is Greek, but it don't matter.
• 29:33
  I love. That line actually, because it's
• 29:35
  it's just an example of Russell's writing where it it's
• 29:38
  just a she answers her own question.
• 29:40
  She kind of she's like, she's talking to herself.
• 29:43
  So normally the punchline would go, you know, that that old man,
• 29:46
  you know, thought yeah, gave you £2000 off the candle because she
• 29:49
  thought she looked Greek. And then Rose would say, but she
• 29:53
  is Greek and she would say I know, but that's not the point.
• 29:55
  But she kind of jumps to the punchline herself, you know?
• 29:59
  It's like the pretty Christmas invasion where she's trying to
• 30:01
  figure out what the Doctor needs and she just don't let him get a
• 30:04
  word. Does she soup?
• 30:05
  Soup in a sandwich? Soup Cup of tea.
• 30:08
  Oh, that pink. I can't get over that electric
• 30:10
  pink. I don't think any girl in 2005
• 30:14
  had a bedroom like that unless they're about 3, you know.
• 30:19
  Did you see that back cloth there for the council estate
• 30:21
  where he was standing at the door very clearly in the studio?
• 30:24
  Oh no, it's really, really quite terrible.
• 30:30
  But, you know, I think the budget was a bit unkind at this
• 30:34
  point. Like they they were pouring some
• 30:37
  money into it. Certainly not the money it was
• 30:39
  getting, you know, come serious for.
• 30:42
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love him.
• 30:44
  I love him mooching around the flat where he kind of he's like,
• 30:46
  oh, you know, that would last. She's gay and she's an alien.
• 30:49
  Well, the use I can't tell you how big the use of the word gay
• 30:53
  was. And then when she uses it again
• 30:55
  in Aliens of London. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 30:58
  Because you just didn't have any of those sort of real world
• 31:00
  words. It was like a few in the McCoy
• 31:03
  era which were very tame. But at the time, everyone's
• 31:06
  going, Oh yeah, someone goes, you don't give a toss to you or
• 31:09
  something like that. We're like, Oh my God, yeah,
• 31:10
  well. Yeah, and that's the thing too.
• 31:13
  Is is, is, is. There's that's another hallmark
• 31:16
  of Russell's writing is that it's this very natural inclusion
• 31:20
  of of sexuality into the world of into the world, the science
• 31:24
  fiction world of Doctor Who where, you know, you've got
• 31:26
  Jackie throwing herself at that the Doctor in a in a dressing
• 31:31
  ground. You've got, you know Rose and
• 31:33
  Mickey in a relationship and yeah.
• 31:37
  And you have you know, yeah those those oh, you have that
• 31:40
  line. You know, oh give a man a
• 31:41
  plastic and. What's weird is I think like
• 31:45
  Rose, Mickey and Jackie, they're essentially soap characters.
• 31:48
  They're basically like characters from EastEnders, you
• 31:50
  know, sort of real world down to earth characters.
• 31:53
  I don't think we've had it in Doctor Whoever before.
• 31:57
  All the sort of. Normal people we meet, they're
• 31:59
  either the man from the Ministry or, you know, the guy from the
• 32:02
  club or someone from the army. Or, I don't know, in the third
• 32:06
  where it was always, you know, that woman who whose husband
• 32:09
  gets strangled by the troll doll.
• 32:11
  And it's just all it's just not relatable people, Whereas this
• 32:15
  is the first time we've done really relatable people.
• 32:18
  That's why I loved about this first series.
• 32:20
  I think, yeah, of course. We've all been.
• 32:22
  I mean, we haven't all exactly been like Rose, but we've all
• 32:24
  been Rose at one point in our lives where it's just this kind
• 32:28
  of sense of dull disappointment that things didn't just just
• 32:31
  didn't turn out the way you thought they would.
• 32:33
  Why? Are you looking at me right now?
• 32:34
  I know you know I work in a shop, all right.
• 32:38
  But it's the kind of this untapped potential that she has,
• 32:41
  and the Doctor is the one who kind of brings that out in her.
• 32:45
  And I think that's it. In a lot of Russell's work,
• 32:48
  actually, is you have these people who could have been
• 32:50
  something brilliant, and they're just destroyed by, usually by a
• 32:54
  cruel system run by an even crueler bunch of people.
• 32:58
  That moment in It's a Sin where the fella gets out of the car
• 33:03
  and dances because he's supposed to be a big, you know, big star,
• 33:07
  but he's dying of HIVI mean it's heartbreaking.
• 33:11
  Yeah, and he says. You know, I just.
• 33:12
  I just want to be happy, Yeah. This tracking shot out of the
• 33:17
  building through the garage. Again, it's just not the sort of
• 33:21
  surroundings we normally see in Doctor Who.
• 33:24
  Yeah. And it really works because it's
• 33:25
  a good chance for for for Eccleston and Piper to sort of
• 33:29
  you really bounce off each other and you get so much, you get so
• 33:34
  much sort of dialogue in there and actually a lot of, a lot of
• 33:37
  sort of a lot of character stuff for Rose because, you know she's
• 33:40
  she's assertive because she she, you know, she pulled the Doctor
• 33:42
  into the flash like you inside right now.
• 33:46
  And she's curious because she's like, oh, you can't just walk
• 33:49
  away, you know, you've got to tell me what's going on.
• 33:52
  And you know, when he, he, he's also a bit eager.
• 33:54
  You know she did. She she kind of pokes fun at his
• 33:57
  ego too, because he's like, you know, she said she says yeah, so
• 34:02
  you're saying the world revolves around you and he's like, oh,
• 34:04
  sort of, Yeah. He's like, you're full of it,
• 34:07
  Sort of. Yeah, yeah.
• 34:09
  And I love the fact. That we get those first sort of
• 34:11
  hints of him being utterly condemning of humanity, that's
• 34:15
  who this Doctor is where he goes, you know, Oh, you look,
• 34:17
  you'll just eat and sleep, eat chips and all the all the time.
• 34:21
  There's a whole war going on around you that you don't know
• 34:24
  about. I mean, he gets more savage
• 34:26
  before the end of the episode. Oh, this bit.
• 34:29
  I just love when he's like go home Rose Tyler, and then you've
• 34:32
  got the first instance of. Chancellor Flavia, right, But I
• 34:40
  love that bit too, because he he gives that whole extraordinary
• 34:43
  speech about the the turn of the earth.
• 34:46
  I'll go and do it, get you got the subtitles up.
• 34:49
  Oh, God. OK.
• 34:54
  Do you know, like we were saying about the earth revolving?
• 34:57
  It's like when you were a kid and they tell you everything.
• 35:00
  They tell you everything's spinning and you can't quite
• 35:03
  believe it because everything looks like it's standing still.
• 35:06
  But I can feel it. The turn of the earth, the
• 35:09
  ground beneath our feet is standing, is spinning at 1000
• 35:12
  miles an hour, and the planet is hurling around the sun at 67,000
• 35:16
  miles an hour. And I can feel it.
• 35:18
  We're falling through space, you and me, clinging to the skin of
• 35:22
  this tiny little world. And if we let go, that's who I
• 35:27
  am. Oh God, I've got goosebumps.
• 35:31
  But he he does this because because because he does that
• 35:34
  speech and then he gives this loon, you know funny little bye
• 35:36
  bye wave with the plastic arm and then he turns around and his
• 35:40
  face is completely blank. And so it's kind of it's, you
• 35:44
  know all this talk about oh it's a price war or making jokes of
• 35:47
  the plastic arm. It's all a facade.
• 35:49
  It's all a front. You know, he's a he's a complete
• 35:52
  alien who's not of this world. And what I just loved about this
• 35:57
  first series was how slowly he introduces the idea of the war
• 36:03
  and Gallifrey and the Daleks. It doesn't blow his load in the
• 36:07
  first episode, like so many people was.
• 36:09
  It's just peppered in. And so you get all of this
• 36:13
  domestic and it becomes this epic storyline and ask Doctor
• 36:17
  Who. It's the ambition and it's the
• 36:20
  intimate side by side. But this is just done on such a
• 36:24
  scale and so evocatively. Oh, it's gorgeous.
• 36:29
  Yeah, there's that kind of that mythic side to him already.
• 36:32
  You know, right from the off, he's already this, yeah, he's
• 36:35
  steeped in legend, you know? This is exactly what we would
• 36:37
  do. Look, go straight to Google or
• 36:40
  whatever she's. Looking on and go right the
• 36:41
  Doctor blue box. What's going on here?
• 36:44
  He is my woman. Why did he say don't look at my
• 36:48
  emails? Yeah, he deserved to lose his
• 36:51
  girlfriend, quite frankly. Yeah, I mean, what?
• 36:54
  He's got there going on with his emails.
• 36:56
  They could either be some ladies of the night or no.
• 37:00
  It's that Trisha Delaney he's been.
• 37:02
  Yeah, that's what I was thinking.
• 37:05
  That's also the. Photoshop.
• 37:08
  That's also the most dated part of this episode, is Rose
• 37:10
  actually has to go over to Mickey's flat to use the
• 37:13
  Internet because now I think nowadays she just look it up on
• 37:17
  her phone. On your phone, you know, in
• 37:20
  fact, watching how phones have developed over new Who is, is.
• 37:24
  Quite. That's funny, Carl.
• 37:26
  Daniel. Yeah, that's the other thing is
• 37:29
  they they did fix Mickey's beetle.
• 37:31
  I think in the parting of the ways he has a black one, that's
• 37:34
  much better. But like, what is going on with
• 37:37
  Mickey here? What a prick.
• 37:38
  He's sitting there behind his wheel, giving evil looks for
• 37:41
  anyone who looks his way, even though he's the intruder on this
• 37:44
  street. And then he's looked sort of
• 37:46
  madly overprotective of Rose as well.
• 37:49
  Like at this point I don't know if he's a very nice bloke.
• 37:52
  But he's a coward, too, because she's the one who goes up to the
• 37:55
  door and and he's like, gets all macho and he's like ready to
• 37:58
  roll his window down. But he stays in the car.
• 38:01
  He doesn't come out, you know? Yeah.
• 38:04
  Wimp. No murders, Don't worry.
• 38:06
  It's Mark Benson. Oh, isn't he lovely?
• 38:10
  Yeah, yeah. I can't believe he gets his face
• 38:12
  blown off. In front of his wife and kids I.
• 38:14
  Know they just come back, you know, in the Rose Tyler
• 38:16
  Dimension Cannon. Big finish.
• 38:18
  Yeah. He's very good in this.
• 38:20
  Yeah. Well, that's the thing too.
• 38:22
  Is is is Clive could so easily be written as the kind of mouth
• 38:26
  breathing, you know, hyper obsessed Doctor Who fan from the
• 38:30
  classic series. Because that's what he's kind of
• 38:31
  meant to be. You could read him as that, but.
• 38:34
  But, but, but he's really just really lovely bloke, you know,
• 38:38
  and he live, he's got a family and it's it's a very sort of
• 38:41
  stable, functional family life he's got.
• 38:44
  And you just get the sense that this sort of doctor obsession is
• 38:46
  just this little hobby he keeps in his shed, you know?
• 38:49
  Very sinister shed though, isn't it?
• 38:52
  Like you ever seen Shallow Grave that's got Christopher Axton in
• 38:55
  it? Yes, Yeah, well, the woman's
• 38:57
  there, like drilling away at the walls and all the lights coming
• 39:00
  through. It looks a bit like that.
• 39:02
  Yeah, it's very atmospheric actually, yeah.
• 39:05
  And as well, like you said, this really, really sells.
• 39:08
  The Doctor is this mythic figure that somebody's pieced together
• 39:12
  all of his appearances over time.
• 39:14
  And it's so, yeah, it's only from Rose's point of view, she
• 39:17
  finds out through Clive. And so we find out through her
• 39:20
  about the Doctor's past. And you know, there's no sort of
• 39:24
  voice over at the beginning like in the TV movie where it's my
• 39:29
  modes of Gallifrey and Master. This is how you do it, isn't
• 39:32
  you? Eke it out slowly.
• 39:35
  Yeah. Well, just a.
• 39:36
  Massive info dump. Although which do you think is
• 39:39
  the worst? Photoshop.
• 39:40
  The Titanic. Oh no, the Titanic they get away
• 39:44
  with because they can make it sort of look bit blurry and old
• 39:49
  because that, yeah, he's been he.
• 39:50
  That's the only time you'll see Chris Eccleston in in Victorian
• 39:53
  clothing because they have a sort of they had a special photo
• 39:56
  shoot where he was, you know, looking very dapper, but he
• 39:58
  never wears that, you know, it's just for a photo.
• 40:01
  How Big Finish have not told these stories yet is baffling to
• 40:04
  me. Oh, he'd be up for it, would he?
• 40:07
  Crack a toe, I wonder, because. He's doing them all and there's
• 40:09
  the ready made missing stories, but now they're doing their own
• 40:13
  thing. Oh.
• 40:14
  Now what do you think about this wheelie bin?
• 40:16
  The burping bin. I love the burping bin.
• 40:21
  Me too. I I do think a lot of older
• 40:25
  Doctor Who fans don't like this, but I do think you need to
• 40:28
  remember the kids and the kids will laugh at this stuff.
• 40:32
  Yeah. How old were you when you
• 40:33
  watched this? 12.
• 40:35
  OK. So you're a little bit older
• 40:36
  there. A little bit older than that, so
• 40:39
  just kind of getting into my teenage years, but but actually
• 40:44
  you mentioned the kids. Well, I'll bring it up again at
• 40:46
  the end, but there's I, there's a specific moment at the end
• 40:50
  where I'm thinking imagine being a kid and watching that and
• 40:53
  hearing that line for the first time.
• 40:56
  We'll we'll get to it. But yeah.
• 40:58
  And you think, I'll imagine, yeah, because you know, you'll
• 41:00
  come to a Doctor Who fan in as an old Doctor Who fan, you know
• 41:03
  all about this show, but as a new uninitiated, you know, new
• 41:07
  viewer kid especially, you know? So I remember there was a late
• 41:12
  night sort of TV critique show, very stuffy, Old people were
• 41:16
  sitting around in a circle and they watched all of the
• 41:19
  television, you know, pics of the week it was on like 11:00 in
• 41:22
  the evening. Anyway, before Doctor Who came
• 41:25
  on, they got a preview of this and this was the scene they
• 41:27
  showed and they lamented the special effects and well, I
• 41:33
  think this woman's career died of death after this, she said.
• 41:36
  There's just no audience for this.
• 41:38
  No parents and children are going to sit down and watch TV
• 41:41
  together while Rusty Davis took those words and shove them down
• 41:45
  her. Throat They were wrong, weren't
• 41:49
  they? I think a lot of people didn't
• 41:50
  think this was going to work. In fact, they were even ready to
• 41:52
  shunt this off to Sunday night if this didn't grab an audience.
• 41:57
  I mean, even if it had just been this 13 episode run, I think
• 42:01
  that would have been so special though.
• 42:03
  You have this one piece of modern Doctor Who and they never
• 42:05
  made it again. They never made another one, but
• 42:07
  you still have those 13 episodes.
• 42:09
  Some people ought to pretend that that was the case,
• 42:11
  actually, that everything that came up well, your parents
• 42:14
  especially. Oh yeah, that.
• 42:20
  Now I'm not sure about Rosie's powers of perception now when
• 42:24
  she gets. OK.
• 42:25
  Yes, yes. Well, I try and kind of
• 42:28
  rationalise that by saying, well, you know, she's still got
• 42:31
  the Doctor on her mind, she thinks Clive's a bit weird, so
• 42:34
  she's kind of all up in her own head.
• 42:37
  But you could, as AI think as a director you could sort of
• 42:40
  convey that with a close up, just a close up on her face and
• 42:43
  keep nicking out of frame or something.
• 42:45
  He. Literally looks like a
• 42:46
  mannequin. If you turned up on this call
• 42:49
  tonight looking like a mannequin, I'll be like, Daniel,
• 42:51
  are you OK? Like you're looking a bit
• 42:54
  plasticky, sort of like pizza. Look at him there.
• 42:58
  Just grinning like a lunatic. She must have noticed his
• 43:02
  erratic driving, too. I've got to wonder if she just
• 43:06
  was showing no interest in it whatsoever.
• 43:09
  So she's barely looking. At him.
• 43:11
  Yeah, yeah. And it's funny too, because
• 43:13
  then, you know, she, they have that dinner at the pizza
• 43:15
  restaurant, He's just staring at her and she's lamenting about,
• 43:18
  you know, her future and her prospects.
• 43:20
  And it all looks very, very dreary.
• 43:23
  And he's not reacting. And she suddenly goes, what do
• 43:26
  you think in that very sort of kind of slightly, you know, mean
• 43:30
  way, you know? That's how I talk to Mark all
• 43:32
  the time. You know, I'll give my opinion
• 43:35
  first. What do you think?
• 43:36
  Oh, OK. And then he goes, so where did
• 43:39
  you meet this doctor? And she's like, oh, I'm sorry,
• 43:41
  was I talking about me for a second?
• 43:44
  Yeah. Oh, I did like the way he came
• 43:46
  in though. Here with the champagne.
• 43:49
  And I like the Boeing when the, when the.
• 43:52
  Champagne cork hits him in the face.
• 43:54
  Yeah, and you know, he gets his head pulled off.
• 43:57
  I mean, it's about pulling no punches.
• 44:00
  Like, obviously this is early CGI and so, and I'll forgive
• 44:04
  that because I think it's Doctor Who absolutely championed in the
• 44:08
  technology that was available at the time.
• 44:10
  But I love the way his hand becomes that board and he starts
• 44:13
  smashing the place up. Yeah, there we go.
• 44:18
  Well, and also the they they they have that couple in the
• 44:22
  background and it's not the woman who screams, it's the man
• 44:25
  he goes. Yeah, I've been there.
• 44:27
  And you had the line earlier about if she's interested in the
• 44:30
  Doctor and she's a she. She's a she.
• 44:32
  We're trying to break every convention that we can.
• 44:35
  Yeah. Look at that.
• 44:36
  That looks great with him Headless smashing up the play.
• 44:39
  It's never sort of happens when I'm in a restaurant, you know?
• 44:43
  Oh, you've never had to send your food back?
• 44:44
  I've. Never had a a headless mannequin
• 44:48
  smash up the place? It would make the night very
• 44:50
  exciting. What do you think about the
• 44:53
  TARDIS reveal now? How it's.
• 44:54
  Done. Oh, it's brilliant, actually.
• 44:56
  They originally wanted to do it in one sort of continuous shot,
• 44:59
  but obviously they didn't have the sort of the the budget for
• 45:02
  that. And I think they finally did it
• 45:04
  in Was it Day of the Doctor? No Snowmen.
• 45:07
  Yeah, the Snowmen. Although you can see where the
• 45:09
  cut is now, yeah, I can see where they do the join.
• 45:14
  But yeah, yeah yeah it's I love it because she she she she backs
• 45:18
  right out and the the music Murray Golden who gets so
• 45:21
  excited like and she goes oh she does that walk around the TARDIS
• 45:25
  which you know Ruby Sunday did in the Church of Ruby Rd.
• 45:29
  So they still do it, now you know?
• 45:31
  It's so wonderful that we get the close up on her face but
• 45:34
  don't see anything that she's seeing.
• 45:36
  And then I love high shots of the TARDIS like that when.
• 45:39
  She sort of walking around it going.
• 45:41
  Hang on, how is this possible? And you have all those circles
• 45:44
  in within circles, so it kind of draws your eye to the middle of
• 45:48
  the the console. So I love this.
• 45:51
  You know this coral, the coral one.
• 45:53
  A shot over a shoulder which pulls out to see the whole of
• 45:56
  the console room, which when I first saw it, this was just the
• 45:59
  most exciting set. And you recognise that bit of
• 46:02
  music they've got going on on, whereas as as as it pans out to
• 46:06
  see the whole console room, you know it's the the theme for
• 46:09
  Doomsday. Of course it is.
• 46:13
  It's in a minor key and he just he just sampled that for the
• 46:17
  Series 2 finale. And he just looks so cold
• 46:21
  standing there at the TARDIS. Like, if anybody was a bit
• 46:24
  unsure about Eggleston, anyone's unsure about the leather jacket,
• 46:28
  you know, and how sort of casual he looks.
• 46:30
  He just looks like the Doctor there, doesn't he?
• 46:32
  And he, yeah, he's, he's, it's that sort of, yeah, that
• 46:35
  complete detachment. And he's got the, the, the, I
• 46:38
  think the leather jacket gives him this, this sort of very dark
• 46:41
  silhouette which when you, when you see him actually against the
• 46:44
  nesting consciousness later, it really cuts the sort of it's a
• 46:48
  shadowy, A shadowy silhouette, you know, really very evocative,
• 46:52
  yeah. Our fault, Yeah, I like the fact
• 46:55
  that she she sobs. Sarah as well, like you would, I
• 46:58
  think if you're world, you know turned upside down like this and
• 47:01
  you walked into a spaceship that was bigger inside than out,
• 47:04
  you'd have a moment. And but she's also thinking of
• 47:07
  Wiki, too. That's The thing is her her
• 47:09
  thoughts go in this completely human direction where he thinks,
• 47:12
  oh, you know, culture shock happens to the best of us.
• 47:14
  And she's like, no, I've got to go and tell Mickey's mother that
• 47:18
  he's dead and you didn't even think about that.
• 47:21
  He's just ahead now, isn't he? Plugged into the console,
• 47:24
  although she does. And that's one of her strengths,
• 47:26
  isn't it? Is that she does keep reminding
• 47:28
  him of the human implications. I love it in the end of the
• 47:31
  world where she goes. What?
• 47:33
  Your machine gets into my head and changes my brain.
• 47:35
  Yeah, and you didn't even ask. Yeah, she refuses to be taken
• 47:38
  for granted. You know, and and yeah, that's
• 47:41
  that's the that's the thing about, about Eccleston's doctor
• 47:46
  actually he he's very standoffish and I think we get
• 47:49
  the the stupid apes line in a minute.
• 47:52
  Trouble is, is with Rose, right? Because we're introducing a
• 47:55
  whole new generation of kids to these ideas.
• 47:57
  Yeah, so you can get away with having a culture shock moment
• 48:01
  here, seeing the aliens in the end of the world and having to
• 48:04
  come out of the room and sort of fan ourself down.
• 48:06
  But then from like Series 3 onwards, we know the drill.
• 48:11
  So we can't So so suddenly everyone doesn't feel that real
• 48:15
  because they all just accept everything like that because we
• 48:17
  know it all already. So once by the time you get to.
• 48:19
  Clara and she's on the rings of. Akaten and she's going, oh,
• 48:22
  isn't this jolly, all these aliens.
• 48:24
  You know. I'll be like, no, what the fuck
• 48:26
  is that? You know, like that would be me.
• 48:29
  Is it going to eat me? I don't.
• 48:35
  Know. Oh, now he's a bit of a prick
• 48:36
  here. Yeah.
• 48:38
  You like? If I did think about, if I did,
• 48:41
  forget about some kid called Mickey's because I'm trying to
• 48:43
  save the life. Of every stupid.
• 48:45
  Ape blunder him about on top of this planet, all right.
• 48:49
  Big Finish. He's available all right, if
• 48:51
  Eccleston has ever had enough. Of this lame ass ending anti
• 48:56
  plastic. I love it too.
• 48:58
  There's like, because you're thinking, oh, it's going to be
• 49:00
  some Doctor Who sort of techno Babble and it's just anti
• 49:03
  plastic. And she thinks, oh, that's so
• 49:05
  lame and he's like anti plastic. He's very.
• 49:07
  Excited. I love this joke about the
• 49:10
  wheel. I know it's so stupid, but it
• 49:12
  works. It's just like because it leads
• 49:15
  up to his catch phrase, doesn't it?
• 49:16
  Completely invisible. I mean, every Doctor Who found,
• 49:21
  I swear, has been to that wheel and had that picture.
• 49:24
  What? He looks so cute as well.
• 49:27
  Do you think he can play comedy well?
• 49:29
  Yeah, so that was I was going to.
• 49:31
  I was going to get into that, actually, because that was what
• 49:33
  really made me love Eccleston is that he was very, yeah, you can,
• 49:38
  he says in interviews. He was very sort of, he'd never
• 49:40
  done comedy before. He wanted to try it and you can
• 49:43
  kind of see, yeah, he's sort of feeling his way around it, but
• 49:47
  it kind of works for his doctor because it's almost like he's,
• 49:50
  he's sort of learning to laugh again.
• 49:52
  And he sort of discovered this shiny new thing called humor.
• 49:56
  And you think, oh, well, you know, so, so when he does a
• 49:58
  joke, he kind of then gives a little smile like, oh, that that
• 50:01
  was good, wasn't it? You know that bit where he does
• 50:03
  the armless joke and you know he, he grins.
• 50:07
  And then Rose hits him with it and he's like, how?
• 50:10
  Yeah, I like the idea of it. He's sort of damaged from the
• 50:13
  time where he's been serious for a long time.
• 50:15
  Yeah. And now he's met this wonderful
• 50:18
  girl who's, yeah, taught him to embrace life again.
• 50:21
  Yeah. And so he's a bit awkward.
• 50:23
  But by the time you get to the empty child, he's so funny.
• 50:27
  Well, that bit too, when he's he's he, you know, She asked
• 50:30
  what the TARDIS is and he's like, it's a telephone box, it's
• 50:33
  a disguise. And he looks so earnest when he
• 50:35
  says that, you know. Oh, apparently this location was
• 50:39
  really expensive. It looks so cheap compared to
• 50:42
  what everything else. That come later now doesn't it?
• 50:45
  What the? The base, you mean?
• 50:46
  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Which they reused I think.
• 50:50
  Is it New Earth? Did they use it?
• 50:52
  New Earth. And you think funny like they
• 50:55
  they got some nesting architecture.
• 50:59
  Yeah. Oh look, it's The BLOB now.
• 51:01
  I love a bee movie, so this blobby creature, I don't really
• 51:05
  have a problem with that. Well, I think it's also because
• 51:07
  they if you showed a sort of great tentacle eyed monster like
• 51:11
  like they did in Spearhead from space, I think people would
• 51:14
  think oh what is this, you know, so they kind of are very they,
• 51:18
  they're still sort of tiptoeing around the bug eyed monsters,
• 51:21
  you know, as as Sydney Newman would sort of say.
• 51:23
  It, you know, let's, I mean, where are we At 32 minutes in?
• 51:26
  We've established Rose and her life and her family.
• 51:29
  We've established the Doctor and his time craft and all of that
• 51:34
  and that he fights monsters and there's still time in the last
• 51:38
  1015 minutes for an alien invasion.
• 51:43
  I mean economy don't come into it.
• 51:45
  I know, yeah. Yeah.
• 51:46
  And and I I you we mentioned the target target novel but it's so
• 51:52
  much more violent in that I so much more spectacular.
• 51:56
  It's like as if he this is how you would do it now.
• 51:59
  You know, with the London Eye actually collapsing into the
• 52:01
  town, it's gorgeous and people getting their heads chopped off
• 52:04
  and oh, that's just brilliant. If you listen to the the reading
• 52:08
  of that, oh man, they go to town on the reading of it and I like
• 52:12
  that, that the breast implants explode on somebody.
• 52:16
  It's like all the all the famous movie stars.
• 52:18
  They have a yeah, they have a Well, that's the breast implants
• 52:21
  joke that she makes, isn't it? You see that sort of sort of
• 52:25
  twisted face there coming out of that BLOB?
• 52:28
  Yeah, that's sort of what I look like in the morning when I wake
• 52:30
  up, I sort of look at him here. It's very unpleasant.
• 52:36
  Well, that's the other thing. That when he talks to the
• 52:38
  nesting consciousness, he does this little, this pun, You know,
• 52:41
  he's like you. You infiltrated this planet by
• 52:43
  means a warp shunt to technology.
• 52:45
  So might I suggest, with the greatest of respect, that you
• 52:47
  shunt off and then he does this little smile, you know?
• 52:51
  Roses that kind of God, Get that microphone off him quick.
• 52:56
  Well. Actually, and the the climax too
• 52:58
  was a lot more complicated because originally there was
• 53:01
  going to be another plastic Mickey who and that's how the
• 53:04
  Doctor gets rumbled for the disinfect the not the
• 53:08
  disinfectant, the the anti plastic.
• 53:10
  Because, Rose says to Mickey, oh don't worry, he's got this anti
• 53:13
  plastic as insurance. And so then Mickey the plastic,
• 53:17
  Mickey tells the nesting consciousness and that's why
• 53:19
  they grabbed the Doctor, you know?
• 53:21
  That is in the book, isn't it? Is in the book.
• 53:23
  He added that back in. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 53:25
  But like you said, if he had that budget, they they would
• 53:28
  have gone wild with this. Like what he's going to do now
• 53:31
  of his Mickey Mouse money. He's going to go crazy with that
• 53:37
  MY1 complaint about the last 10 minutes, aside from the fact
• 53:42
  that it's the briefest invasion on record is we just.
• 53:45
  Keep cutting back to these very awkward scenes of Christopher
• 53:49
  Edgerton being held down by autumns going.
• 53:52
  Against the blue screen. I swear we do it like five times
• 53:56
  and you're going. Rose, Will you rescue him
• 53:58
  already? I did actually.
• 54:00
  That's the other thing that was missing.
• 54:01
  Maybe if if that, if if this episode does have a flaw, is
• 54:04
  that so? It ticks all the boxes, I said.
• 54:07
  And maybe the one box that it doesn't take is is hard in the
• 54:10
  sense of like proper emotion. You have to wait till the end of
• 54:14
  the world for that kind of upswell of emotion at the end
• 54:17
  when he, you know he he talks about the time war and
• 54:20
  everything is lost And and here I mean, I I did still get a sort
• 54:26
  of little moment where he has that look and with Rose just
• 54:31
  kind of this silent look like I need your help and that actually
• 54:34
  does work, I think. But you just needed a few more
• 54:37
  moments like that, I think. What also works is that they
• 54:40
  weren't sure how far they could go with the violence, which is
• 54:43
  why you don't actually see the Autons shooting anybody.
• 54:45
  They shoot and people are on the floor, but you never actually
• 54:48
  see someone get shot like you cut away from Clive.
• 54:50
  He doesn't, You don't see him getting.
• 54:52
  It's not like trying to say, yeah, you see everything, but I
• 54:56
  think that's more effective because it means your
• 54:58
  imagination does the work. Yeah, well, and actually that
• 55:01
  you have, you have some shots of people like diving onto the the
• 55:04
  sort of metal chairs and tables and that is actually quite real
• 55:08
  and you think, oh God. That's in front of his wife and
• 55:10
  kids and it cuts to her screaming.
• 55:12
  That's really horrible. Yeah, yeah.
• 55:14
  And then you have the, the, the child dummies kind of walking
• 55:17
  around as well, which is really kind of quite twisted, you know,
• 55:20
  and. I love jacket, like, looking
• 55:22
  around like, oh, how ridiculous. What's going on?
• 55:24
  Yeah. And then she realizes, Oh my
• 55:27
  God. And she throws her her shopping
• 55:29
  bag on the escalator and it's like a wide throw like.
• 55:33
  The amount of times I've picked up my phone and gone, I'm in 10.
• 55:39
  She was buying a new coffee table as they break her coffee
• 55:41
  table, don't they? That's right.
• 55:44
  I do love the shots of them coming, the Altos coming out the
• 55:47
  mall though, and they're the sort of Armageddon St. that
• 55:51
  they've done. But the bus on its side and the
• 55:54
  flames? The flames.
• 55:55
  The brides smashing their way out.
• 55:57
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 55:58
  Oh, the brides are great. Are they?
• 56:00
  Yeah, look at that. I mean, it's quite busy.
• 56:03
  It is a bit busy. I think it's a bit chaotic and
• 56:05
  that's probably, yeah, maybe another sort of bit where the
• 56:08
  direction falls down a little bit.
• 56:10
  But it's the sort of thing that Graham Harper would get
• 56:12
  absolutely right, you know. Yeah, yeah.
• 56:15
  You know, when he did an assignment bursting into that
• 56:17
  house in Rise of the Assignment, that sort of thing, you know?
• 56:20
  Yeah, yeah. But yeah, he's he's an old hand
• 56:23
  at this sort of thing come. On Rose.
• 56:27
  Oh yes. I've got no job, no future.
• 56:31
  What she had. Oh yes, under sevens gymnastics
• 56:34
  she got the bronze. It's a lovely, lovely detail
• 56:37
  actually. What do you think about the
• 56:39
  music in this one? Well, I, as we mentioned, I love
• 56:43
  Murray Gold's Westminster Bridge theme where it's constantly
• 56:47
  humming along almost every scene.
• 56:50
  And there's that bit when they're walking through the
• 56:52
  council estate and it's going kind of every goosing things
• 56:56
  along. So when So he can't really get
• 56:57
  bored because then his his music comes in and sort of, you know,
• 57:01
  gooses things along again, you know?
• 57:03
  People will kill me for saying this, but I think he's got more
• 57:06
  in common at this point with Kev McCulloch because because he
• 57:10
  brings momentum and pace. Whether you like the music or
• 57:13
  not, there's movement to it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 57:16
  But then of course, Murray Gold can also create the shepherd's
• 57:19
  point and things like that, you know, which is a genuinely
• 57:21
  beautiful piece of. Music.
• 57:22
  No, it is. It is.
• 57:24
  And you know, I mean, I do understand the people who he who
• 57:27
  who say he's, you know, Mr. May I put this trumpet in your rear?
• 57:32
  This is how you're going to feel now, but it's it's great.
• 57:37
  He's a great musician. No, he is, He is.
• 57:39
  And he did, sort of. You know, he did keep
• 57:42
  experimenting as he went along, even though you feel like, oh,
• 57:45
  he's been doing it for years. He must be getting a bit tired,
• 57:48
  but he's still, every now and then he comes out with something
• 57:50
  completely new, you know? So I have I I think he's
• 57:53
  probably going to have new stuff for the the, the new series, you
• 57:57
  know? I can't help it.
• 57:58
  Whenever I'm in London now, I'm sort.
• 58:04
  Of it's so energetic and I love it when they ever they.
• 58:07
  I think they bring it back a couple of times in in in Series
• 58:10
  2 as well and you're like. Oh, yes.
• 58:12
  You know. It's great.
• 58:15
  Oh, see, now that there's a long shot there, they're waiting for
• 58:17
  the explosions to go off, but it takes about four seconds of
• 58:21
  just, so it's just nothing. The tard is materializing in the
• 58:24
  distance and then nothing. Well, they use these shots again
• 58:27
  for the age of steel. Actually, when the Battersea
• 58:31
  Power Station blows up, it's the same shots, they just reuse
• 58:34
  them. And get their money out of this
• 58:35
  stuff. And of course, they feel new
• 58:37
  stuff for love of monsters, don't they?
• 58:41
  They did, yes. Oh, so you so you know,
• 58:43
  somewhere out there, Elton Pope is getting his shopping.
• 58:46
  And I love, I remember loving the way he runs with his
• 58:48
  shopping bags. It's like, Oh my God.
• 58:52
  I think the first time in series one, the first time I genuinely
• 58:58
  was in love with the show, was her on that rooftop going.
• 59:03
  And I'm the only. Person on planet Earth who
• 59:05
  knows? I was like, oh man, I love this
• 59:11
  so much. Decision time.
• 59:17
  Oh yes, now this is very well done.
• 59:22
  Just say that, he soiled himself, Mickey.
• 59:26
  They suggest it suggests it, yeah.
• 59:29
  Someone says you're stinking or something you're.
• 59:31
  Stinking. Yeah, yeah.
• 59:33
  Yeah, that's a bit weird. I love too.
• 59:35
  She's she's you know, she's still such a cow bag.
• 59:37
  She, you know, her mother calls her oh, Rose, Rose don't get out
• 59:40
  of the house and she just laughs and hangs up, you know.
• 59:45
  Well, they had this this this subplot that they deleted that
• 59:49
  Mickey was meant to be unfaithful to Rose.
• 59:51
  So that's why you have the don't look at My emails line and why
• 59:55
  he kind of abandons her to go down the pub, you know.
• 59:57
  And so there's a bit of the skeleton of that left there, but
• 1:00:01
  again it over complicates it, So they just they took it out.
• 1:00:04
  Maybe they like, they like no clock.
• 1:00:06
  So they were like, let's just not do that.
• 1:00:12
  Yeah. So the way he's talking is like,
• 1:00:14
  he's a bit perfecting, isn't he? Yeah, he's very, very cowardly.
• 1:00:18
  And so that's why I think it's so effective in World War 3,
• 1:00:22
  where he, you know, the Doctor puts his faith in him and, you
• 1:00:25
  know, enables him to be better. So she makes the Don a noble
• 1:00:29
  choice here, doesn't she? No, I'm not coming with you, you
• 1:00:32
  know. He needs me.
• 1:00:32
  My mum needs me. Yes, yes.
• 1:00:35
  And he looks kind of. I mean, he's his face is blank
• 1:00:38
  again, but again, he looked that you.
• 1:00:39
  As he closes the door, you can just sense he's a bit
• 1:00:42
  disappointed. They have tried to rough up
• 1:00:45
  Cardiff a little bit there but that is clearly Cardiff.
• 1:00:48
  There's no St. in London in that.
• 1:00:50
  Case. It looks like that.
• 1:00:53
  Oh well, we're coming up to the line then.
• 1:00:54
  So again, imagine if you're a kid so younger than I was.
• 1:00:58
  So I'll say a nine year old kid, an 8 year old kid watching this,
• 1:01:02
  and you have no indication what the TARDIS is except that it
• 1:01:06
  moves around. So it moves from the powerless
• 1:01:08
  state or from from the pizza restaurant to the London
• 1:01:11
  embankment and then it gets them out of the nesting layer.
• 1:01:14
  And then he says, oh, it can go anywhere in the universe.
• 1:01:16
  And she still says no. And then he pops back and he
• 1:01:19
  says, oh, by the way, did I mention it also travels in time
• 1:01:23
  and you're just your your nine year old world would just be
• 1:01:26
  like. Do you know?
• 1:01:28
  Because because I'm a classic Who fan.
• 1:01:32
  Because I know this stuff inside out, the impacts of that line.
• 1:01:35
  Until you've just said that there, I've never considered it
• 1:01:38
  like what a new generation of kids would think here in that
• 1:01:42
  line. And of course, that's why she
• 1:01:43
  runs in then, because I Oh my God, yes, I'm there.
• 1:01:48
  Yeah. Well, it's it's, I don't know if
• 1:01:50
  I was I I don't. I think I knew that it was a
• 1:01:53
  time travel show already. So I don't know if it hit, but I
• 1:01:56
  just imagining. Yeah, a younger generation than
• 1:01:58
  me. Well that's a terrible slow MO
• 1:02:00
  though. Oh God.
• 1:02:03
  Well, you know, primitive technology and all that.
• 1:02:06
  They'll get better at this sort of stuff.
• 1:02:08
  Oh, but. Look, here's the end of the
• 1:02:09
  world. Oh, next time, who the hell are
• 1:02:12
  you? Oh, that's nice.
• 1:02:14
  Thanks. She calls Cassandra Bitchy
• 1:02:18
  trampoline. Oh, I love it.
• 1:02:20
  Quick word with Michael Jackson. Oh, it's.
• 1:02:24
  Just the best. Well, that again, yeah, that was
• 1:02:27
  the moment where I was like, oh, I can't let go of this because
• 1:02:29
  you know, it it toxic kicks in and oh, it's just brilliant.
• 1:02:34
  Can I ask you, is is Doctor Who like your favorite television
• 1:02:40
  show or is it amongst your favorite television shows?
• 1:02:45
  It's my it's my favorite television show.
• 1:02:48
  Oh, you. Geek.
• 1:02:51
  Oh, yeah. I I, there was a period where I
• 1:02:52
  was watching all kinds of other, you know, very well reviewed
• 1:02:56
  prestigious shows. And then, yeah.
• 1:02:59
  And then the couple of times where I've almost given up,
• 1:03:01
  well, not almost given up on dog two, but sort of felt like,
• 1:03:04
  well, maybe it's time to put away childish things.
• 1:03:07
  And then I and then I'm like, no, I actually, I need the show.
• 1:03:09
  And then I go back and I. Was like, why is it that draws
• 1:03:12
  you back then? Or what is it that sort of
• 1:03:15
  raises it above the others? What is it?
• 1:03:17
  The raises above. I think it's something that you
• 1:03:19
  can lose yourself in completely actually whereas other shows
• 1:03:23
  will remind you of the real world and actually Doctor Who
• 1:03:26
  itself is is has very much a lot a lot to say about the real
• 1:03:30
  world you know in in the messages it tries to convey to
• 1:03:33
  to the audience but and the writers that write for it but
• 1:03:37
  but it is something that you can completely yeah lose yourself in
• 1:03:41
  and and it's so vast that you can approach it from any angle
• 1:03:46
  whatsoever and there's always a a chance that that angle hasn't
• 1:03:50
  been covered yet. So it's almost kind of an
• 1:03:52
  endlessly creative engine, you know, both for the writers and
• 1:03:58
  the the the people who work on it and the people who love it,
• 1:04:02
  the people who follow it, the fans, you know, the the viewers
• 1:04:05
  as well. Such a gorgeous statement.
• 1:04:08
  I'm not even going to be sarcastic.
• 1:04:11
  Well, look, you know how this thing works.
• 1:04:14
  We do tell me. We do have to think up our three
• 1:04:18
  fabulous reasons to recommend Rose.
• 1:04:21
  Now it's not going to be hard because there's 500 you start
• 1:04:25
  and then bounce over to me and then back and forth again.
• 1:04:28
  OK, well, I'll get the obvious one out of the way.
• 1:04:31
  Billie Piper as Rose because you know, a pop star starring in
• 1:04:37
  Doctor Who. Whatever will they think of
• 1:04:40
  next, you know? And she just, her talent is
• 1:04:43
  obvious from the off, you know. As soon as she goes down into
• 1:04:46
  that basement, she sells it. And and Rose herself is such a
• 1:04:51
  sort of layered character. There's so much in there.
• 1:04:55
  You know she we've, we mentioned, you know, that the
• 1:04:57
  the characters can be a bit selfish and she, you know, she
• 1:05:00
  can be really selfish sometimes, you know, and but also she she's
• 1:05:05
  she's gutsy she asked questions. She's curious.
• 1:05:08
  She's kind of the perfect kind of companion to get into Doctor
• 1:05:13
  Who if you're coming into the series with this episode, I
• 1:05:17
  think, yeah. I've only got one question for
• 1:05:20
  you on the back of that. Go on then.
• 1:05:22
  Why do you want to play that song so loud?
• 1:05:24
  Because we want. To it loves that song.
• 1:05:29
  It well, it must be something deep inside I.
• 1:05:33
  Beg your pardon, It frequently is, but not right now.
• 1:05:39
  Where were we? Oh yeah, my first one.
• 1:05:41
  I would like to compliment Rusty Davis.
• 1:05:44
  I mean, I always like to compliment him, but this
• 1:05:46
  especially for this script and how it introduces the elements
• 1:05:50
  of Doctor Who for a brand new audience in a simple but very
• 1:05:53
  effective way. It tells you everything you need
• 1:05:56
  to know to kick to get going with the series, but holds back
• 1:06:00
  loads of big surprises for laser as well.
• 1:06:04
  Yeah, lays the seeds. So those sides, those those
• 1:06:07
  surprises pay off. I think it's a very skillful bit
• 1:06:10
  of writing, which when I listen to that audio version, I was
• 1:06:14
  being a bit mean about, if I'm honest.
• 1:06:16
  So yeah, it's a, it's a. Really great script.
• 1:06:20
  I think it does kind of fail as a Doctor Who story because it's
• 1:06:23
  so throw. Away maybe.
• 1:06:25
  A bit anemic, Yeah. Bit sort of.
• 1:06:27
  But it was to show you it can be exciting and horrific and sort
• 1:06:31
  of quirky, these dummies coming to life as well.
• 1:06:33
  So I kind of get that too. Hey, it works right.
• 1:06:37
  Well, it does, yes. And actually just to jump off
• 1:06:40
  that, the the fact that yeah, he because he the way he weaves all
• 1:06:46
  those that that arc into into the Bad Wolf arc into series one
• 1:06:52
  and the dynamic with Rose's family that we keep coming back
• 1:06:55
  to. And it all builds off.
• 1:06:56
  And it's so sort of beautifully intertwined.
• 1:06:59
  I think that when this isn't, this isn't an issue that some
• 1:07:03
  people have, whether it's writing that I've personally
• 1:07:05
  never had, is that when he ends his finales with a Deus Ex
• 1:07:09
  machina, but he literally does that in series one.
• 1:07:12
  It's literally a, you know, a goddess from the machine as she
• 1:07:16
  absorbs the Time vortex and, you know, comes out of the TARDIS
• 1:07:19
  and wipes all those Daleks away. And it's just so bold and and
• 1:07:24
  sort of daring that I kind of after that I gave him a free
• 1:07:28
  pass for all his finales. Daniel, you should never listen
• 1:07:32
  to their complaints of Fraser Gregory.
• 1:07:33
  I mean, the man's mad. I.
• 1:07:36
  Don't know who you're talking. About who does you know?
• 1:07:40
  What's your second one? Or was that your second one?
• 1:07:42
  No, sorry. Oh, my second one.
• 1:07:45
  Well, Chris Eccleston as the Doctor, he's my doctor again.
• 1:07:49
  I don't go back to him as often as I probably should, but that's
• 1:07:53
  because I have such sort of affection for that first viewing
• 1:07:59
  experience of of all those 13 episodes of him.
• 1:08:03
  And I think he can play comedy. He's really funny and it's it's
• 1:08:09
  just amazing that he's, he he thought he'd never, he'd never
• 1:08:13
  done comedy before because it seems to be a very natural fit
• 1:08:17
  for him, you know? And yeah, that's that's all I
• 1:08:23
  have to say about that. I'm going to be bold enough to
• 1:08:26
  say, because I'm usually quite mean about him, but actually
• 1:08:30
  watching this in preparation for this, and then again with you, I
• 1:08:32
  actually think Keith Bowman gets the right moments.
• 1:08:36
  So that's the reveal of the TARDIS, the the reveal of the
• 1:08:39
  Doctor, the tracking shot coming out of the building through the
• 1:08:44
  garages, the TARDIS landing on the Embankment.
• 1:08:49
  You know all of that. I think there are weak moments
• 1:08:52
  in this, but I think he gets all the important moments bang on
• 1:08:56
  and he deserves the credit for that.
• 1:08:58
  So Keith Bowick is my second. Keith Bowick, OK Oh my third.
• 1:09:04
  Oh, something we didn't mention and this is another hallmark of
• 1:09:08
  Russell T Davies writing. But I'll say it's, I'll say it's
• 1:09:12
  part of the production team. So it counts as a separate thing
• 1:09:15
  is the all the introduce, the introduction of the, the mass
• 1:09:18
  media. So all those news reports that
• 1:09:22
  start off with Rose and there are then sort of carry as a sort
• 1:09:27
  of a spine for the whole Russell T Davies era where you have
• 1:09:31
  those news broadcasts and those PC screens and those mobile
• 1:09:35
  phones and all that technology and images that are very and,
• 1:09:39
  you know, encroaching on in 20 in our 21st century lives.
• 1:09:43
  And he uses it as a storytelling device for exposition to to make
• 1:09:48
  the world feel bigger too. Because again, you know, if if I
• 1:09:51
  think if you watch was it aliens of London and World War Three,
• 1:09:54
  it's basically set in three rooms.
• 1:09:57
  And he makes it feel so much larger because you have all
• 1:09:59
  those news reports around the world, you know have Trinity,
• 1:10:02
  Wells and and then it goes all the way to, you know, the the,
• 1:10:06
  the, the finales with with the stolen earth, for example, where
• 1:10:10
  literally the whole Earth is towed back home and even that
• 1:10:15
  appears on the the screens. What is that?
• 1:10:19
  Yes, we've just had the news in they have released.
• 1:10:23
  The cold the. Cold.
• 1:10:28
  So, so all that you know and all those big alien invasions and
• 1:10:33
  those London landmarks of, you know, Big Ben are getting
• 1:10:36
  destroyed, Downing St., getting destroyed, the Sikorak
• 1:10:39
  spaceship, the rock, the Ragnos webstar, all that is all the
• 1:10:43
  essence of that is in the first sort of 6 minutes of of rows of
• 1:10:46
  the of this episode. Yeah, so that's nice.
• 1:10:50
  Oh, just oh, I've got to do another one.
• 1:10:52
  You've got to do another one. Well, of course it can only.
• 1:10:54
  Be. The superstar of series one and
• 1:10:57
  two, Camille Kajuri as Jackie Tyler.
• 1:11:01
  Because I remember watching this going, oh, she's so annoying.
• 1:11:05
  And then calm against of London, I was totally won over and calm
• 1:11:09
  doomsday. She was the best thing in the
• 1:11:12
  show, so he did amazing work with that character and as Toby
• 1:11:16
  Haydock says. It is like a character that
• 1:11:18
  doesn't belong in Doctor Who dropped in the middle.
• 1:11:21
  Of Doctor Who. And that's what works about that
• 1:11:23
  mad culture clash of finally, we've got a character that says
• 1:11:27
  things like, are you going to tell me my daughter's going to
• 1:11:30
  be all right? Can you promise me that?
• 1:11:32
  And things like that, you know? Or the end of that where she
• 1:11:35
  waiting there 10 seconds and just.
• 1:11:37
  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So moving the end of part of the
• 1:11:42
  ways which comes along with the truck, you know or she.
• 1:11:46
  Gives me a favour, never mind why.
• 1:11:51
  She's just wonderful and she does have some funny lines in
• 1:11:56
  this, you know, she sort of punches all the seriousness.
• 1:11:58
  She deserves compensation. Exactly.
• 1:12:02
  I'm in 10. She's just glorious.
• 1:12:06
  Yeah. And and also, I've met Camille
• 1:12:09
  Kajuri at a phantom convention and she was a total bitch to
• 1:12:14
  everyone. Too.
• 1:12:15
  And I just love it when Doctor Who celebrities are horrible in
• 1:12:20
  convention. It just makes me love them just
• 1:12:23
  that little bit more, Someone said, would you have this
• 1:12:26
  picture with us? Will you take?
• 1:12:27
  And she went, no, I'm not supposed to do that.
• 1:12:29
  Sorry. And she walked out of the room
• 1:12:32
  and these poor old people look like they're going to cry.
• 1:12:34
  And I was like, oh, how amusing. See, This is why I've never set
• 1:12:38
  foot inside a convention. No, I'm sort of over it now, if
• 1:12:42
  I'm honest. If you hear these anecdotes
• 1:12:44
  once, you've heard them 50 times, you know should.
• 1:12:46
  Never meet your heroes. No, there is something to that.
• 1:12:49
  You know, there is something to that.
• 1:12:51
  There's a couple of met. If I met Chris Eccleston, I
• 1:12:54
  probably wouldn't want to. I mean, he's a brilliant actor,
• 1:12:57
  but you know. He's he's he's kind of
• 1:13:01
  dangerous, doesn't he? You need to get.
• 1:13:04
  Him on a good when. Disaster comes.
• 1:13:05
  He's there, He brings us home in his way, and he has one constant
• 1:13:09
  companion. We'll stop there.
• 1:13:12
  Yeah, it's also the attitude that's his constant companion.
• 1:13:17
  Well, wasn't that marvellous? A great way to start Doctor Who.
• 1:13:21
  I feel like we've gone back to 2005 all over again.
• 1:13:25
  Just a gorgeous exploration of you discovering the show, I
• 1:13:30
  suppose that leads me to ask you the question, Daniel, if you are
• 1:13:34
  prepared, where are we going next?
• 1:13:37
  Well, you tell me, Joe Ford, backwards or forwards anytime.
• 1:13:43
  Where do you want to go? You're you do as many quotes as
• 1:13:47
  may as great. Seriously, I I backwards.
• 1:13:52
  Backwards. OK.
• 1:13:54
  OK. So we are going back then to
• 1:13:59
  1964? Oh.
• 1:14:02
  God, what? Have we already had a
• 1:14:03
  conversation? Go on, tell me.
• 1:14:04
  Yeah. All right.
• 1:14:06
  So where we we discover that size does matter and talk about
• 1:14:13
  all things big and small in Planet of Giants.
• 1:14:18
  Oh, fabulous. Yes.
• 1:14:22
  Did you know that one? Well I had fun with it actually.
• 1:14:28
  It's it's a strange way to kick off the second season.
• 1:14:31
  I I think now we would probably look back and think yeah start
• 1:14:35
  off what? Start it off with Dalek,
• 1:14:36
  Invasion of Earth. But but there's it's it's I I
• 1:14:42
  can't you know the the the the the science fiction cliche of
• 1:14:46
  being shrunk down to minuscule size.
• 1:14:49
  It has its, you know, it has its moments and it does, it does
• 1:14:53
  play well, you know. I love the bit where they're.
• 1:14:56
  What? They're down the plug hole and
• 1:14:58
  they're up above and they're like, can you hear me?
• 1:15:02
  What's that bit? That weird, That nosy telephone
• 1:15:06
  operator who's like, well, I don't know what's going on
• 1:15:10
  there, but it's. Sounded very strange on the
• 1:15:11
  phone. Oh, wonderful.
• 1:15:14
  What a great choice. Well, completely different from
• 1:15:18
  this as well. Yes, well, we're going Well,
• 1:15:21
  well, almost. Back to the beginning, where
• 1:15:23
  William Hartner was the doctor and he had a granddaughter and
• 1:15:26
  two annoying school teachers. I would say we'd have we should
• 1:15:32
  go through the star based after that and go all the way back to
• 1:15:34
  the beginning again of a whole new era.
• 1:15:37
  Because that's isn't that called series one.
• 1:15:38
  Oh no, that's the new Shootie 1. Yes, some people called it the
• 1:15:43
  new new series. That's it.
• 1:15:45
  You know what, right? I'm going to let's put it on
• 1:15:46
  record now. Would you be down to do that
• 1:15:48
  one? The first Shooty Gatwa or sorry,
• 1:15:51
  the 2nd Shooty Gatwa episode, The first episode of the new
• 1:15:53
  series. Oh, do we know what it's called?
• 1:15:58
  I don't know, but what? We can talk about it, right?
• 1:16:02
  Maybe easy to talk about. Bring it on.
• 1:16:04
  OK. That's an oral contract.
• 1:16:06
  It does just. Leave me to say thank you very
• 1:16:10
  much for your time. You bring gorgeous insight.
• 1:16:14
  I've had a great time. Thanks so much for having me on
• 1:16:17
  again. Let's let's go get shrunk down
• 1:16:19
  to the size of an inch. And you know, size doesn't
• 1:16:23
  matter if you've got the Magic Fingers.