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The War on Fat: The Seven Countries Study · Stuff You Should Know

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Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, it's Josh and Chuck your friends, and we
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Speaker 1: out soon coming this fall. Welcome to Stuff you Should Know,
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Speaker 1: a production of My Heart Radios How Stuff Works. Hey,
1:02
Speaker 1: and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark, and there's
1:05
Speaker 1: Charles W. Chuck Bryant over there, and Jerry's here somewhere,
1:08
Speaker 1: and this makes it stuff you should know, the Heart
1:13
Speaker 1: Healthy Edition. Yeah, I've been wanting to do for a
1:16
Speaker 1: very long time, Chuck. Yeah, and this was one that
1:19
Speaker 1: was put together by our buddy Dave Ruse. But back
1:23
Speaker 1: in February, and I lost it and thankfully you said, hey,
1:27
Speaker 1: by the way, you know, we got that seven countries
1:29
Speaker 1: thing just sitting there gathering dust. Ye, I said, Chuck,
1:32
Speaker 1: don't lose it here. I lost it and then I
1:35
Speaker 1: found it. I was lost, but now I'm found. And
1:40
Speaker 1: fat is good for your body the end, I know.
1:44
Speaker 1: But that's a that's such like a revolutionary statement these days,
1:48
Speaker 1: radical even basically to say fat is good for your
1:52
Speaker 1: body the end, especially our we I'll not even our age,
1:55
Speaker 1: but anyone in America and the eighties and nineties, somebody
1:59
Speaker 1: in our court. You mean, yeah, I do too. So um.
2:06
Speaker 1: The reason why it's kind of radical to say that
2:09
Speaker 1: fat is good for you is because, yeah, everybody, our age, Chuck,
2:11
Speaker 1: knows that fat is horrible for you. And even if
2:15
Speaker 1: you kind of know that fat's not as bad as
2:17
Speaker 1: we used to think, you probably still don't realize how
2:20
Speaker 1: much better it is for you than it actually is.
2:22
Speaker 1: There still some part of you that demonizes it. And
2:25
Speaker 1: during the eighties and the nineties you couldn't get fat
2:30
Speaker 1: if you shook it out of a pig, like it
2:32
Speaker 1: was nowhere to be found. In the United States, we
2:35
Speaker 1: had low fat everything. Remember we had uh like potato
2:40
Speaker 1: chips where they took out the fat and replaced it
2:43
Speaker 1: with a like a diarrhea creating agent. Right, what were
2:48
Speaker 1: those called the did this? But I think they were
2:51
Speaker 1: like like um las ola. Weren't they called ola chips?
2:57
Speaker 1: They should have been called oiv as. So yeah, like
3:02
Speaker 1: we're doing all sorts of things. And one of the
3:03
Speaker 1: worst things we did too, even worse than adding olean
3:07
Speaker 1: or replacing fat with olean, was a takeout fat and
3:10
Speaker 1: replace it with high fruit toast corn syrup. Because one
3:13
Speaker 1: of the things that fat does is give food flavor,
3:16
Speaker 1: and we take fat out of food, you still wanted
3:18
Speaker 1: to have flavor, and if you're a food processor, one cheap,
3:21
Speaker 1: easy way to put flavor back into it is to
3:24
Speaker 1: put high fruit toast corn syrup into it. And so
3:27
Speaker 1: they think that like all of this war on fat
3:31
Speaker 1: that took place in the eighties and nineties is actually
3:33
Speaker 1: at least partially, if not fully responsible for the outbreak
3:38
Speaker 1: of chronic diseases that we're seeing now, including obesity and
3:43
Speaker 1: um diabetes that is just epidemic right now in the
3:47
Speaker 1: United States. Yeah, it was so ingrained in us that
3:52
Speaker 1: even after doing this podcast episode and knowing what we
3:55
Speaker 1: now know, it's still like you say things like, you know, boy,
4:00
Speaker 1: that steak you just feel like like clogging up your
4:03
Speaker 1: arteries as you know that fat just gets wedged in there.
4:05
Speaker 1: You just get these mental images of fat just like
4:10
Speaker 1: breaking off of food and sticking to your blood vessels. Right, Yeah,
4:14
Speaker 1: like this is really unhealthier, this is super indulgent or
4:17
Speaker 1: something like that, And that just may not necessarily be
4:20
Speaker 1: the case, but yeah, we had a number done on us, basically,
4:24
Speaker 1: and we're still crawling out from under it. And what's
4:27
Speaker 1: the most magnificently amazing thing is that basically all of this,
4:32
Speaker 1: the war on fat, the low fat trend, the possibly
4:36
Speaker 1: the diabetes, and the obesity that resulted from taking out
4:41
Speaker 1: faster and placing it with sugar, all of this stuff
4:44
Speaker 1: came from one study that was conducted back starting back
4:50
Speaker 1: in the fifties that some people are like, the study
4:53
Speaker 1: isn't even legitimate methodologically, yeah, so that is the seven
4:58
Speaker 1: country study. And uh. The creator of the seven country
5:03
Speaker 1: study was someone named Dr Ansel keys Um who was
5:07
Speaker 1: married and published and this is I'm not gonna We'll
5:12
Speaker 1: just let this speak for itself. They published a number
5:15
Speaker 1: of high volume selling books about the Mediterranean diet. That
5:20
Speaker 1: these cookbooks and um sometimes like the very first one
5:26
Speaker 1: was only what like two years after they started doing
5:29
Speaker 1: this study. So they have been accused of cherry picking
5:33
Speaker 1: their data and promoting correlation as causation and uh. As
5:40
Speaker 1: a result of all this, the United States very famously
5:43
Speaker 1: came out with the food Pyramid that we was drilled
5:46
Speaker 1: into our heads in school and said fat is cholesterol
5:50
Speaker 1: and that is heart disease and eating fatty things will
5:55
Speaker 1: kill you. Yes, like ipso fact. Though, the problem is
5:59
Speaker 1: is that it was all based those recommendations. That food
6:02
Speaker 1: pyramid was all based on the study and not any
6:05
Speaker 1: kind of like clinical data. It was just basically a
6:08
Speaker 1: study that was set up and designed to support a hypothesis,
6:14
Speaker 1: not really test a hypothesis so much as support this
6:17
Speaker 1: hypothesis by Dr Antel keys that saturated fats uh rose
6:24
Speaker 1: cholesterol levels in your blood and that increased cholesterol levels
6:27
Speaker 1: in your blood would kill you through heart disease. And
6:32
Speaker 1: so doctor keys Is been very much demonized over the
6:36
Speaker 1: years as people have figured out like, no, fats aren't
6:39
Speaker 1: bad for you and actually you need them. But there's
6:42
Speaker 1: also been like an effort to reform him too. And
6:45
Speaker 1: in his defense, he wasn't just some some psycho narcissist doctor.
6:51
Speaker 1: From what I could tell, he is. Um. He invented
6:54
Speaker 1: k rations. K rations are called that after him keys Um. Yeah,
6:58
Speaker 1: that that like kept a law of g I S alive.
7:01
Speaker 1: And World War two, Um, he was a major part
7:04
Speaker 1: of the Minnesota's starvation experiment where volunteers conscious just objectors
7:10
Speaker 1: and World War two volunteered to be starved um so
7:13
Speaker 1: that the scientists could figure out how to refeed people
7:16
Speaker 1: without killing them, which became very useful when we liberated
7:21
Speaker 1: the pow cants in Germany and some of the occupied areas.
7:25
Speaker 1: So he was like a good I don't okay, I
7:28
Speaker 1: don't know enough about him to say he was a
7:29
Speaker 1: good person, but I don't think he was like an
7:31
Speaker 1: evil person by any stretch of the imagination. And also
7:35
Speaker 1: the reason that he started conducting the study in the
7:37
Speaker 1: first place was because there was an epidemic of middle
7:40
Speaker 1: aged men, in particular in America who were just dying
7:44
Speaker 1: left and right of heart disease, and he wanted to
7:46
Speaker 1: figure out what the problem was. He also started the
7:49
Speaker 1: K pop phenomenon, so catchy and great. I don't know
7:56
Speaker 1: any K pop I know the kids love it, though
7:59
Speaker 1: they do, they're not for it. That one B twos
8:01
Speaker 1: band or something like that. I can't I can't remember
8:03
Speaker 1: their name, no idea, but if they're called the B
8:06
Speaker 1: fifty twos, then they should be sued because that's been taken.
8:10
Speaker 1: So Dr Ansel Keys as an American from Minnesota, a
8:13
Speaker 1: physiologist and in the forties when you know, uh, the
8:19
Speaker 1: Don Drapers, although that was a little later, but the
8:21
Speaker 1: Don Drapers of the world were falling over dead from
8:24
Speaker 1: smoking cigarettes all the time and eating steak for lunch
8:27
Speaker 1: and martinis for lunch. He said, you know what, I'm
8:29
Speaker 1: gonna figure this out and see what's going on, and
8:33
Speaker 1: I'm gonna identify some risk factors why men in this
8:37
Speaker 1: country are developing heart disease and men around the world.
8:40
Speaker 1: Is what it ended up being. But it started in
8:42
Speaker 1: Minnesota where he did a little pilot study. And while
8:46
Speaker 1: he was doing that, he got a message from a
8:48
Speaker 1: colleague in Italy who said, in southern Italy we got
8:53
Speaker 1: to no heart to disease. Everybody's a healthy And he said, really,
8:58
Speaker 1: and and he also said, southern Italy is really nice.
9:00
Speaker 1: You should come visit. And so he went there in
9:03
Speaker 1: the nineteen fifties and a bet, I mean, Southern Italy
9:05
Speaker 1: is still great, but a bet in the early nineteen
9:07
Speaker 1: fifties it was just idyllic. And he went down there
9:11
Speaker 1: and he started these informal studies comparing business business executives
9:17
Speaker 1: with the working class men of southern Italy, measuring serum
9:22
Speaker 1: cholesterol levels, talking about what you're eating, getting the data
9:26
Speaker 1: on heart disease and heart attacks there from the hospitals,
9:30
Speaker 1: and he started to form this hypothesis that you know what, dudes,
9:34
Speaker 1: middle aged dudes that have higher serum cholesterol levels are
9:39
Speaker 1: more likely to die or at least suffer from a
9:41
Speaker 1: heart attack. Yes, yes, And that was like the beginning.
9:45
Speaker 1: That was yeah, And that was his hypothesis. And it's
9:47
Speaker 1: pretty sound hypothesis, especially based on some of the data
9:51
Speaker 1: that he'd seen, because he around this time after his
9:55
Speaker 1: he was intrigued by his friend in southern Italy and
9:57
Speaker 1: his trip to southern Italy um, which, by the way,
10:00
Speaker 1: he fell in love with Southern Italy so much he
10:02
Speaker 1: shot shop there and I believe lived out his life
10:05
Speaker 1: till age one oh one. Yeah. Um, And that proves it.
10:11
Speaker 1: It basically does, because I believe he did adhere pretty
10:14
Speaker 1: strictly to the Mediterranean diet he espoused. He was no hypocrite,
10:18
Speaker 1: but um he uh. He started poking around and getting
10:23
Speaker 1: his hands on whatever data he could four things like
10:26
Speaker 1: fat intake in the diet and incidences of heart disease
10:31
Speaker 1: and heart attacks wherever he could get it in the world.
10:33
Speaker 1: And he compiled um data from twenty two different countries
10:39
Speaker 1: and he said, wow, this is really kind of all
10:41
Speaker 1: over the place. I'll just select six of these countries
10:44
Speaker 1: that really proved my point. And he created what's known
10:46
Speaker 1: as the six country graph, which a lot of people
10:49
Speaker 1: confused with the seven country Study, but it pre pre
10:52
Speaker 1: dated the seven country study. But it was this thing
10:54
Speaker 1: that was kind of like the transition period between first
10:57
Speaker 1: forming this hypothesis and begin the seven country study. The
11:01
Speaker 1: six country graph was kind of like the connective tissue
11:05
Speaker 1: between the two and it also told him where to
11:08
Speaker 1: look to really find the biggest disparities that might support
11:13
Speaker 1: or um undermine his hypothesis. And so we got to
11:16
Speaker 1: work looking around and contacting people around the world and said, hey,
11:20
Speaker 1: I have zero funding to offer you. I know that
11:24
Speaker 1: World War two just ended and everybody is basically trying
11:27
Speaker 1: to rebuild their economy and their nation in Europe is
11:30
Speaker 1: kind of war torn and shattered, and um, Japan has
11:33
Speaker 1: had bombs dropped on it. But do you want to
11:36
Speaker 1: start studying whether eating steak is bad for you and
11:40
Speaker 1: going to kill you? And actually, astoundingly some country said yes, yeah.
11:44
Speaker 1: So the countries ended up being Italy, Spain, South Africa, Japan, Finland,
11:51
Speaker 1: the US. And I guess was that Greece was the
11:54
Speaker 1: last one. Did that count Okay, Greece increase counts? Well,
11:57
Speaker 1: I mean I knew, yeah, I know, grease increases the word. So, um,
12:04
Speaker 1: it was time in the in the mid nineteen fifties.
12:07
Speaker 1: He had the interested countries and the interested parties, so
12:10
Speaker 1: in he developed these select populations and you kind of
12:15
Speaker 1: teased it earlier calling us cohorts. These populations of men
12:18
Speaker 1: they referred to as cohorts in the study so when
12:21
Speaker 1: you hear say cohort, it's not like one guy, it's
12:24
Speaker 1: a population of guys. Right. So the seven countries they
12:29
Speaker 1: would monitor for twenty five years and ideally lead to
12:33
Speaker 1: what risk factors would lead to heart disease. And that
12:38
Speaker 1: was his goal was, I'm going to find out what
12:40
Speaker 1: these risk factors are, provide some evidence, and then say
12:46
Speaker 1: here's what you should be eating. Basically, Yes, so that
12:50
Speaker 1: I mean, that's that's exactly what he did. Like you said,
12:53
Speaker 1: within two years of starting this um study, which was
12:57
Speaker 1: supposed to last and actually did twenty five and some
13:00
Speaker 1: of the people who were the original participants were studied
13:04
Speaker 1: for more than forty forty years. But um, within two
13:08
Speaker 1: years he uh, he turned around and published that cookbook.
13:13
Speaker 1: That's how certain he was of his hypothesis being correct. Yeah,
13:17
Speaker 1: and I don't you know, we don't want to poop
13:19
Speaker 1: of the Mediterranean diet. I think the idea, I'm sure
13:22
Speaker 1: the Mediterranean diet is it can be quite healthy. The idea, though,
13:26
Speaker 1: is is he shouldn't just be like, I'm gonna eat
13:28
Speaker 1: low fat, because that's what happened in America. Everyone didn't say, hey,
13:32
Speaker 1: we'll just eat Mediterranean. They said, we'll just eat junk
13:36
Speaker 1: food full of sugar and hyproc dose corn syrup but
13:39
Speaker 1: doesn't have fat. And and that was the other thing too,
13:41
Speaker 1: is he is very frequently unfairly accused of demonizing fat.
13:46
Speaker 1: He didn't do that. He said, you need to be
13:48
Speaker 1: eating olive oil by the gallonful, just injected daily. Basically
13:52
Speaker 1: he didn't say that. It's kind of paraphrasing, but he um.
13:57
Speaker 1: He didn't leave out things like, um, you know, fats
14:01
Speaker 1: from fish or from all of well, it was saturated
14:04
Speaker 1: fat and particularly that he was convinced was the culprit
14:08
Speaker 1: for heart disease and deaths from heart disease. Right, and uh,
14:13
Speaker 1: eat a lot of grains, eat a lot of pasta,
14:15
Speaker 1: eat a lot of fruit, eat a lot of bread,
14:18
Speaker 1: a lot of vegetables. Sure vegetables are good for you. Yeah,
14:22
Speaker 1: that's true, right. Yeah. And also I think one of
14:24
Speaker 1: the other things that was so radical about the Mediterranean diet,
14:27
Speaker 1: like even now you're like, oh, that sounds kind of exotic.
14:31
Speaker 1: This is the fifties that this guy first introduced the
14:34
Speaker 1: Mediterranean diet. But one of the other things that was
14:36
Speaker 1: radical about it, and I should say, um, I didn't
14:39
Speaker 1: I didn't give credit to his wife, Margaret, who co
14:41
Speaker 1: wrote the first book with him, at least the first one,
14:43
Speaker 1: if not more. Um, they wrote it together. But the
14:48
Speaker 1: the the thing that was radical about it was that
14:52
Speaker 1: he said, Hey, those fruits and vegetables and all that
14:55
Speaker 1: make those the main like make the meat your side dish, like,
14:58
Speaker 1: flip it over. You're gonna like live a lot longer
15:01
Speaker 1: than you are just by eating a big steak and
15:04
Speaker 1: some cream spinach on the side. Hey, I got no
15:08
Speaker 1: problem with the man. There is definitely a case to
15:10
Speaker 1: be made about eating what you like and living shorter.
15:15
Speaker 1: It's tough to argue with in some cases. Hey, what
15:17
Speaker 1: do we do when we occasionally on the road, We'll
15:20
Speaker 1: go to a steakhouse together? We split a cream spinach
15:23
Speaker 1: every time. Sure, I mean, how can you go to
15:25
Speaker 1: a steakhouse and not eat cream spinach? It's the best
15:29
Speaker 1: It makes you strong, right, Yeah, my forearm is just
15:33
Speaker 1: a freakishly bulging. Should we take a break, Yes, all right,
15:37
Speaker 1: go work out those four arms and we'll talk about
15:39
Speaker 1: the cohorts right after this. If you want to know,
15:51
Speaker 1: then you're in luck. Just chuck. Okay, So we're gonna
16:03
Speaker 1: say it again cohorts cohorts. It's a study population that
16:09
Speaker 1: bears some sort of similarity to one another, sort of.
16:12
Speaker 1: There were sixteen in the seven countries study, and all
16:15
Speaker 1: sixteen cohorts total twelve thousand, seven hundred and sixty three participants.
16:20
Speaker 1: So it's a pretty good study. Sixteen different groups of
16:22
Speaker 1: people more than twelve thousand total in seven different countries.
16:28
Speaker 1: It's fairly impressive and ambitious study for the time. For sure,
16:31
Speaker 1: it was. And I think there were at least two
16:35
Speaker 1: in every country except for the U S which had
16:37
Speaker 1: one cohort. And he never said we have to be fair.
16:41
Speaker 1: He never said, you know what, this represents all men
16:44
Speaker 1: in these countries and sort of all men around the world.
16:48
Speaker 1: They never pretended like that was the case. But they
16:51
Speaker 1: had to start somewhere and um, and we're not pooping
16:54
Speaker 1: the whole study. Like the it was very robust. Uh.
16:59
Speaker 1: And if you carry out a study in seven countries
17:02
Speaker 1: with all of these men over twenty five years, it's
17:06
Speaker 1: you know, they weren't slouches or anything like that. No,
17:09
Speaker 1: but the very fact that he went around and said, oh,
17:12
Speaker 1: these people eat a Mediterranean diet, I'm gonna include them.
17:15
Speaker 1: These people eat what I consider the opposite of Mediterranean diet.
17:19
Speaker 1: Include them, yea, rather than saying like, we'll just pick
17:22
Speaker 1: these countries at random and and start studying them and
17:25
Speaker 1: see if the their cholesterol intake is low and then
17:28
Speaker 1: if so, if that correlates with the lower heart disease.
17:32
Speaker 1: He didn't do that, and that is definitely worth criticizing
17:35
Speaker 1: for sure. So let's I guess talk about some of
17:38
Speaker 1: these cohorts and what they who they were, uh, former Yugoslavia.
17:43
Speaker 1: He studied a couple of small towns um one that
17:47
Speaker 1: had the Western European diet and one that was on
17:50
Speaker 1: the Mediterranean diet largely. Finland was really interesting, I think
17:55
Speaker 1: out of all these, because he compared two villages in
17:59
Speaker 1: eastern and western Finland, because East Finlanders were recording a
18:05
Speaker 1: lot more heart attacks, in fact, supposedly like the highest
18:08
Speaker 1: record on planet Earth at the time. Yes, and for
18:11
Speaker 1: good reason too, you would think, because they would eat
18:14
Speaker 1: things like so great, this makes me hungry, Yeah, it
18:19
Speaker 1: kind of does. Actually, they would eat a fish soup
18:22
Speaker 1: that was just loaded with butter for breakfast. They would
18:26
Speaker 1: he was called the Loggers launch, which was described by
18:28
Speaker 1: one of the researchers as um, are you ready large
18:33
Speaker 1: hunks of meat, suspended and congealed fat, enveloped in a
18:37
Speaker 1: dark bread loaf, fully permeated by fat. I'm so sorry
18:41
Speaker 1: to our being of vegetarian listeners because you're probably turning
18:44
Speaker 1: it off right about now. Yeah, we should have spoiled
18:46
Speaker 1: our trigger warning this one yeah too late, which, by
18:51
Speaker 1: the way, I have to say, I have been really
18:53
Speaker 1: doing my best to eat far less meat. Um, not
18:57
Speaker 1: for health purposes, for ethical reasons, really sure, but I
19:02
Speaker 1: gotta say that does sound kind of good to me.
19:04
Speaker 1: Is like, if you put this in front of me
19:06
Speaker 1: and say, here's your chance to eat a uh Eastern
19:10
Speaker 1: Finland loggers lunch, I would I would take you up
19:13
Speaker 1: on it. I think, Yeah, I'm cut down on meat too. Yeah, yeah,
19:18
Speaker 1: I eat so. I don't mean a lot of red meat.
19:19
Speaker 1: Don't eat a ton of pork anymore, can especially especially
19:24
Speaker 1: pork from me. I I don't always eat meat, but
19:27
Speaker 1: when I do, I try not to. Uh So. Then
19:31
Speaker 1: so you've got your high fat diets in Finland. And
19:35
Speaker 1: then he said, all right, I need to, like you
19:37
Speaker 1: kind of mentioned earlier, I need to choose some some
19:39
Speaker 1: opposite in my view, opposite countries of what they eat.
19:45
Speaker 1: So where do you go. You go to Japan, of course,
19:48
Speaker 1: where they eat a lot of fish, and he went
19:50
Speaker 1: to a even a tiny little fishing village where they
19:53
Speaker 1: all ate almost all fish. And then again in Greece
19:56
Speaker 1: and the Greek islands, uh and in southern Italy also
19:59
Speaker 1: where they were obviously eating the Mediterranean diet. Right, So
20:03
Speaker 1: he takes all these different cohorts, takes all of their
20:06
Speaker 1: different diets and starts just kind of looking at um,
20:10
Speaker 1: all sorts of factors. That was one of the other
20:12
Speaker 1: reasons you said it was a very robust study. One
20:14
Speaker 1: of the other reasons that it was robust is because
20:16
Speaker 1: they looked at all sorts of stuff. It wasn't just
20:18
Speaker 1: their diet. They looked at things like, um, what they drank,
20:21
Speaker 1: and what they smoked, and how much they smoked and
20:24
Speaker 1: all this kind of stuff. It was a big, long study.
20:26
Speaker 1: And again they followed these guys for at least twenty
20:29
Speaker 1: five years, and some of the stuff that they found
20:33
Speaker 1: we're basically this and this is this is the two
20:36
Speaker 1: points that the Seven Countries study told the world, and
20:40
Speaker 1: they just so happened to be the two points that
20:42
Speaker 1: ansel Keys fully expected the seven countries to tell the
20:45
Speaker 1: studies to tell the world, and it was that if
20:48
Speaker 1: you have a high serum cholesterol, like a high concentration
20:52
Speaker 1: of cholesterol in your blood, then there you're there's a
20:56
Speaker 1: greater chance that you were going to die from cardiovass
21:00
Speaker 1: killer disease. Right and Eastern Finland where those loggers were
21:04
Speaker 1: eaten fat breads. That's a great name for a restaurant,
21:10
Speaker 1: fat bread Sure. Oh yeah, I think wow, if restaurants
21:15
Speaker 1: are still around in a few months, then we should
21:18
Speaker 1: open one called fat breads. Um. So, those fat bread
21:22
Speaker 1: eating loggers, they had average serum cholesterol levels of more
21:25
Speaker 1: than two sixty and there were more than four heart attacks,
21:30
Speaker 1: uh four heart attack deaths for every one middle aged
21:33
Speaker 1: men five years after the study started. Right, okay, so Chuck,
21:37
Speaker 1: I looked it up. They had an average of two sixty.
21:41
Speaker 1: The window of normal or acceptable or your your um
21:47
Speaker 1: you don't have like viscous blood is two d These
21:53
Speaker 1: guys were averaging to sixty. That's a lot. It is
21:57
Speaker 1: a lot. So the opposite of that was the former
22:01
Speaker 1: Yugoslavian place uh Dalmatia, where they had the Mediterranean diet
22:06
Speaker 1: and there men had an average serium cholesterol level and
22:11
Speaker 1: had one death per one men over that same period.
22:15
Speaker 1: And Dalmatia is where the Dalmatian dog they think is from.
22:18
Speaker 1: I kind of assumed that, but you never know, did you?
22:21
Speaker 1: It was worth saying anyway, Sure, this is a show
22:23
Speaker 1: about facts in trivia. That's right. Um. Did you have
22:27
Speaker 1: you ever been to Croatia? No? It is spectacular, man.
22:32
Speaker 1: It's on the Adriatic and it is incredibly gorgeous. You
22:37
Speaker 1: mean and I went on a cruise once that went
22:38
Speaker 1: through there, and it is I've just wanted to go
22:41
Speaker 1: back ever since. Was it one of those river cruises? No,
22:44
Speaker 1: it was again, it was on the Adriaca. It was
22:46
Speaker 1: a cruise all the way around Italy, from one side
22:49
Speaker 1: to the down past the boot and then up the other.
22:51
Speaker 1: It was love. Yeah, we're not like cruise people or
22:54
Speaker 1: anything like that, but we went with Um Shandon the
22:59
Speaker 1: Champagne Acre had a cruise that we're like, well, okay,
23:03
Speaker 1: this is the one we're gonna take, and uh it
23:06
Speaker 1: turned out to be really great because we're not like
23:08
Speaker 1: Italy fans. You we have nothing against Italy, but we
23:11
Speaker 1: were never like we got to go to Italy never,
23:13
Speaker 1: We're never cruise fans. And then after we got off
23:15
Speaker 1: of those were like, I want to go on another
23:17
Speaker 1: cruise and I want to go back to Italy and
23:19
Speaker 1: would a kill you to give me some more shand
23:21
Speaker 1: on did you just drink tons of champagne? Yes, that's wonderful.
23:25
Speaker 1: So the other thing that uh It said was the
23:29
Speaker 1: other conclusion was diets higher and saturated fats will correlate
23:34
Speaker 1: to more heart attacks. And the data did show a
23:37
Speaker 1: big correlation between saturated fat in the regular traditional diet
23:42
Speaker 1: and the heart attacks. And I think crete where saturated
23:46
Speaker 1: fats equal between eight and nine percent of daily calories,
23:49
Speaker 1: the average number of heart attack desper one hundred was
23:54
Speaker 1: basically zero over that five years. And in the US,
23:57
Speaker 1: where we only had the one cohort, I don't think
23:59
Speaker 1: we said they were railroad workers, right, Yeah, in Minnesota,
24:05
Speaker 1: Minnesota railroad workers, they had se saturated fats and their
24:10
Speaker 1: diet and they had more than three deaths per one
24:12
Speaker 1: during that five year period. Right, So all this stuff
24:15
Speaker 1: just totally backs up what what um ansel Keys was saying, right,
24:20
Speaker 1: and later studies that basically took the seven countries study
24:25
Speaker 1: cohorts and drilled down into them a little more. UM.
24:28
Speaker 1: There were two particular ones, the zoot Fins study from
24:32
Speaker 1: the Netherlands and the Hail Project. UM. Both of them
24:36
Speaker 1: looked at um just continued following people beyond the twenty
24:40
Speaker 1: five years, so like the Hail study was dedicated to
24:43
Speaker 1: looking at healthy aging, that kind of thing, and they
24:46
Speaker 1: turned up some other stuff that you UM now basically
24:50
Speaker 1: take his gospel as well, Like if you follow a
24:53
Speaker 1: Mediterranean diet, your risk of heart attack drops precipitously, I
24:58
Speaker 1: think thirt lower risk. UM, if you eat fish, it
25:03
Speaker 1: lowers your risk of dying from a heart attack. Like
25:05
Speaker 1: even just eating fish once or twice a week can
25:08
Speaker 1: drop your risk of a fatal heart attack by Like
25:11
Speaker 1: these were things that that came along, not not from
25:14
Speaker 1: the seven country study, but from that thing being continued
25:18
Speaker 1: on by supplementary studies. Yeah. And two of the big
25:21
Speaker 1: ones that people like myself and my wife like to
25:25
Speaker 1: spout is that you drink the two glasses of wine
25:29
Speaker 1: a day, you're actually healthier than not drinking at all.
25:33
Speaker 1: And if you eat that one square of dark chocolate
25:35
Speaker 1: a day, you're actually healthier as well. Uh, if you
25:39
Speaker 1: eat more than that and drink more than that, then
25:41
Speaker 1: it goes the opposite way. But that two glasses of
25:44
Speaker 1: wine and one square of chocolate is uh. People really
25:48
Speaker 1: like to tout that one who like to drink wine
25:50
Speaker 1: and eat chocolate. That's what they call a sweet spot. Yeah,
25:54
Speaker 1: so like seriously think about it, though, if you drink
25:57
Speaker 1: less than two wine two glasses of wine a date,
26:00
Speaker 1: you're you're likelier to die of heart disease than if
26:04
Speaker 1: you drink too. I mean that's what they're saying in
26:06
Speaker 1: the study at least, right, And I mean, like, I
26:08
Speaker 1: haven't seen anything that says Nope, that's not true, that's
26:10
Speaker 1: b s. But the everybody makes that case that you
26:14
Speaker 1: said to her, that makes that point that like, once
26:16
Speaker 1: you go beyond too, not only does it have the
26:18
Speaker 1: opposite effect, it gets really bad, really really fast. Yeah.
26:22
Speaker 1: And what you can't do also is be like, well,
26:24
Speaker 1: I haven't had any drinks for three nights, so I'll
26:26
Speaker 1: have five glasses of wine tonight and that averages out
26:29
Speaker 1: to super healthy. Yeah. Yeah, they say been shrinking is
26:33
Speaker 1: way worse for you, but then they also say that
26:35
Speaker 1: been shrinking is way better for you. We have no
26:37
Speaker 1: handle on what drinking does to you. I just know
26:40
Speaker 1: that drinking makes me feel like a S S the
26:43
Speaker 1: next day. Uh yeah, I mean older you get, you
26:48
Speaker 1: definitely have to pick and choose, dude, Like two beers can.
26:55
Speaker 1: I don't want to say wreck me the next day,
26:57
Speaker 1: but I am not love in life the next day
27:00
Speaker 1: necessarily two beers dude. Yeah, My whole deal is sleep
27:04
Speaker 1: Like I haven't had anything to drink for four nights,
27:09
Speaker 1: and that was after a pretty big couple of nights
27:12
Speaker 1: in a row for various reasons. And uh, I just
27:16
Speaker 1: I sleep so much better. I wake up feeling so
27:18
Speaker 1: much better. I mean it's irrefutable, you know. Um what
27:23
Speaker 1: I do try to do now though in my old
27:24
Speaker 1: ages is really drink a ton of water while I'm drinking.
27:30
Speaker 1: And uh I use now take these. Uh I don't
27:34
Speaker 1: know if I should buzz market the brand, but I
27:36
Speaker 1: take a little supplement that is that is you know,
27:40
Speaker 1: it's basically like a super vitamin that supposedly will help
27:44
Speaker 1: curb a hangover, and like, have you noticed that it
27:47
Speaker 1: actually has an effect? And if it does have an effective,
27:49
Speaker 1: do you think it's just power suggestion or does it
27:51
Speaker 1: really work? No? I think so, But it's not gobbled
27:54
Speaker 1: e cook. I mean it's BE twelve and like things
27:56
Speaker 1: that we know can probably help with a hangover. Yeah, yeah,
28:00
Speaker 1: Have you ever gotten a BE twelve shot? I haven't,
28:02
Speaker 1: Oh man. A lot of times they miss or it
28:06
Speaker 1: doesn't work, or it's watered down or something like that.
28:08
Speaker 1: It's really hard to get a good BE twelve shot.
28:11
Speaker 1: When it works, brother, you can tell a difference and
28:14
Speaker 1: you feel like a million bucks. You're not high, but
28:20
Speaker 1: you're like high on life kind of. You're not not high,
28:24
Speaker 1: I guess. Actually it's a really fair way to put it,
28:26
Speaker 1: to tell you how long does that last? Like basically
28:29
Speaker 1: all day you just feel great, You want to talk
28:31
Speaker 1: to strangers. You you're like totally large and in charge.
28:35
Speaker 1: You're getting stuff done. You never feel overwhelmed, like you're
28:38
Speaker 1: like having you have a sense of humor. It's just
28:41
Speaker 1: it just takes like all the best parts of your
28:43
Speaker 1: personality and like bulks them up. Not in any kind
28:46
Speaker 1: of speedy, manic way, but just you just feel like
28:50
Speaker 1: you're running on all cylinders and you just wish to
28:53
Speaker 1: God that like you were always like that, but and
28:55
Speaker 1: that's what you got hat too, So that's why you're
28:57
Speaker 1: not that's why you that's what you get one of
29:00
Speaker 1: those hangover next day places, right, like an ivy and
29:02
Speaker 1: a BEAT twelve shot. Yeah. Yeah, you could go to
29:05
Speaker 1: like a medical clinic or you know, a med spa
29:08
Speaker 1: or something like that, and they usually have it. Some
29:10
Speaker 1: chiropractors have them. Um have to do that. Yeah, I
29:14
Speaker 1: think you have to have some sort of medical degree
29:17
Speaker 1: to inject it or whatever. But I've always kind of
29:20
Speaker 1: been on the hunt to have B twelve prescribed to
29:23
Speaker 1: me so I can inject it myself. So I guess
29:27
Speaker 1: that there's any doctor listeners something you should know out there,
29:29
Speaker 1: Hit me up because I need a prescription to BE twelve. Please.
29:34
Speaker 1: Oh man, where were we? I think we're about to
29:37
Speaker 1: take a break. Yeah, let's take a break and we'll
29:39
Speaker 1: talk a little bit about the criticisms right after this.
29:52
Speaker 1: If you want to know, you're in luck. Just to
30:00
Speaker 1: exact fusion. Okay. So, I think we've kind of made
30:07
Speaker 1: it clear that there are some people out there, uh communists,
30:12
Speaker 1: Pinko's who hate the Seven Countries study, can't stand it,
30:17
Speaker 1: and they have a lot of very valid points. Yeah.
30:20
Speaker 1: I think one of the biggest criticisms is that it
30:22
Speaker 1: was a very correlative relationship and not a causal relationship. Yes,
30:28
Speaker 1: I mean that's kind of the biggest one. That and
30:31
Speaker 1: the fact that it's a study. It's a it's called
30:35
Speaker 1: an ecological study, which is uh, it's a study that
30:39
Speaker 1: at the time it was you know who was this,
30:41
Speaker 1: Dr Henry Blackburn, He was one of the original officers,
30:45
Speaker 1: said it was state of the art for the time.
30:47
Speaker 1: But he's like an ecologic study, and and correlation is
30:51
Speaker 1: pretty weak. Uh. If you're talking about trying to find
30:55
Speaker 1: a causal uh, I guess a causal inference. Yeah, Because
30:59
Speaker 1: the thing is is you're taking all of these people
31:01
Speaker 1: from all around the world and you're examining them to
31:06
Speaker 1: see you're trying to find out what's the underlying cause
31:11
Speaker 1: of their common affliction heart attacks, or what accounts for
31:16
Speaker 1: the absence of that affliction again heart attacks. But the
31:20
Speaker 1: problem is there's so many differences between somebody who is
31:24
Speaker 1: on a Mediterranean diet and lives in Crete and somebody
31:28
Speaker 1: who eats the loggers lunch in Finland. Besides just what
31:33
Speaker 1: they eat, there's so many other factors, so many different
31:36
Speaker 1: things involved that even if you can find a correlation
31:40
Speaker 1: like you like, like ansel Keys did between saturated fats
31:44
Speaker 1: and heart attacks. It doesn't mean that there's actually not
31:47
Speaker 1: something else at play. And that's the biggest, the biggest
31:51
Speaker 1: criticism of the study that most people widely level against it. Yeah,
31:56
Speaker 1: and it's also an epidemiological study which follows a pop elation,
32:01
Speaker 1: uh to something you know not so good for you
32:04
Speaker 1: over a length of time. But if you want to
32:07
Speaker 1: do that right, you can't, like you said, just they
32:11
Speaker 1: have to be the same age, the same sex, they
32:14
Speaker 1: have to do the same job, they have to be
32:16
Speaker 1: the same ethnicity, they have to be in the same place,
32:19
Speaker 1: and the only difference can be what they're eating, basically, right,
32:23
Speaker 1: And like, and I get what he was doing. He
32:25
Speaker 1: was trying to, you know, compare this type of diet
32:29
Speaker 1: to that type of diet in different places around the world.
32:32
Speaker 1: But it was just that's that's flawed, that's a flawed
32:35
Speaker 1: that's an adventure. That's not a study, right exactly, that's
32:38
Speaker 1: that's a that's a travel eating show basically. But it
32:43
Speaker 1: was almost like he was trying to cram a dozen
32:46
Speaker 1: studies into one rather than break it out and appropriately
32:50
Speaker 1: into each different study, Like I'm going to study these
32:53
Speaker 1: people and use this as the control. His study lacked
32:57
Speaker 1: a control group or control um variable. Yeah, right, and
33:03
Speaker 1: that's that's another big thing that's leveled against it as
33:05
Speaker 1: as a big flaw and makes you wonder, you know, Okay,
33:09
Speaker 1: is that correlation between saturated fat and heart disease even real? Yeah?
33:16
Speaker 1: I mean even when they tried to kind of drill
33:18
Speaker 1: down to an apples to apples, like in Finland, that
33:21
Speaker 1: was one place where they had. All. Right, at least
33:23
Speaker 1: we're all in the same country, so that's a good
33:25
Speaker 1: place to start. Uh, let's see here the two finished cohorts.
33:30
Speaker 1: I still love saying that, Um, they consumed relatively similar,
33:35
Speaker 1: similar levels of saturated fat. So in the West they
33:37
Speaker 1: had and the not a huge difference. That's so much though.
33:43
Speaker 1: What three? Yeah, the railroad workers in nineteen fifties Minnesota,
33:47
Speaker 1: we're eating of their diet was saturated fat. Yeah, close
33:54
Speaker 1: to a quarter of your diet was saturated fat. But
33:57
Speaker 1: the average number of heart attack deaths in the E
34:00
Speaker 1: was twice as high versus I think four death per
34:04
Speaker 1: one men versus two in the West. Yeah, so like
34:09
Speaker 1: that there's something else going on, Yeah, exactly, because their
34:11
Speaker 1: fat intake was similar but that you know that shouldn't
34:15
Speaker 1: there's what would account for a double the increase? So
34:18
Speaker 1: who knows? And they just the answer is they don't know.
34:21
Speaker 1: We don't know. We don't know what would account for that. UM.
34:25
Speaker 1: And there's there's a lot of other people who've looked
34:29
Speaker 1: at this and said, Okay, there's still like a lot
34:31
Speaker 1: to be said of this data. There's a lot you
34:33
Speaker 1: can extract from it. UM. And some people have come
34:36
Speaker 1: along the way and said, hey, you know, like you
34:38
Speaker 1: can you can run this stuff through statistical analysis. Apparently
34:42
Speaker 1: they did another that and they did when they originally
34:45
Speaker 1: looked at the data back in the fifties or sixties
34:48
Speaker 1: or seventies, and UM, they did it again for the
34:51
Speaker 1: twenty fifth anniversary of this study. UM. And one of
34:55
Speaker 1: the things that turned up was that sugar actually seemed
34:59
Speaker 1: to orally more strongly. Sugar intake in the diet seemed
35:04
Speaker 1: to correlate more strongly with heart disease, and even saturated
35:07
Speaker 1: fats did it was almost roughly the same. But the
35:10
Speaker 1: thing is that sugar bump. When you factored in saturated fats,
35:14
Speaker 1: the sugar bump disappeared. And so they said, oh, well,
35:16
Speaker 1: it's just an anomaly. It's really the saturated fats. From
35:19
Speaker 1: what I could tell, if you had a saturated fat
35:22
Speaker 1: bump and you factored in sugar, that would disappear as well.
35:26
Speaker 1: So some people have come to think, like, if it's
35:29
Speaker 1: not sugar, maybe it's a combination of sugar and saturated fats.
35:33
Speaker 1: That's actually the real problem. Not saturated fats on its own,
35:37
Speaker 1: but that it's not even necessarily sugar on its own,
35:39
Speaker 1: but this combination of the two. And that's led a
35:42
Speaker 1: lot of people, including one big critic of the Seven
35:45
Speaker 1: Countries study, to say, um, like it's processed food. That's
35:49
Speaker 1: what kills people. As processed food, this combination of bad
35:52
Speaker 1: fats and in sugar, that is really proving to be deadly. Yeah,
35:58
Speaker 1: and I think that's I think that's just so clear
36:01
Speaker 1: now that real food is far in a way better
36:05
Speaker 1: for you than processed food. Like, you can't, you just
36:09
Speaker 1: can't refute that, No, you you can't. I mean even
36:13
Speaker 1: if you just base it, and you know, we always
36:16
Speaker 1: make fun of anecdotal data, but if you just base
36:18
Speaker 1: it on how your body feels after you eat certain
36:22
Speaker 1: kinds of food and then after you eat processed food,
36:25
Speaker 1: the problem is is we don't know how to feed
36:29
Speaker 1: um seven billion people on this planet without processing food.
36:32
Speaker 1: You know, where's Norman Borlog, Yeah, I don't know. He's dead,
36:37
Speaker 1: dead in the cold ground. God doesn't care about anything now.
36:42
Speaker 1: So it hasn't been refuted, not necessarily, it hasn't been
36:47
Speaker 1: completely refuted to where they say, just throw this thing
36:50
Speaker 1: in the trash. Um. But I think the and hopefully
36:55
Speaker 1: we've gotten this point across is the damage that it
36:59
Speaker 1: did in the United States was we went all in
37:02
Speaker 1: on it and they said fat is is the killer
37:07
Speaker 1: and if you just avoid fat and eat these processed
37:10
Speaker 1: low fat foods, you're gonna be just fine. Yes, So
37:14
Speaker 1: like that, and you can't really lay that at ansel
37:17
Speaker 1: Key's feet. That was the Department of Health and Human Services.
37:22
Speaker 1: They just took these findings and ran with them. They
37:25
Speaker 1: were like, well, we don't have any clinical data yet.
37:27
Speaker 1: They're like, I can't hear you. I can't hear you.
37:28
Speaker 1: I'm already at the printers getting these posters of the
37:31
Speaker 1: food Pyramid Guide printed up UM. And that was definitely
37:35
Speaker 1: a huge problem that UM that created this larger problem
37:39
Speaker 1: because it led to this demization of all fats that
37:43
Speaker 1: food pyramid that showed the little bit at the top
37:46
Speaker 1: was like fats and sweets and stuff like that. Like
37:48
Speaker 1: it didn't say, you know, just this kind of fat
37:51
Speaker 1: or keep away from that kind of fact, it was fats.
37:54
Speaker 1: You Americans are too fat and dumb to understand that
37:56
Speaker 1: there's different kinds of fats, So just stay away from
37:58
Speaker 1: fats all together. And that that's really what led to this,
38:01
Speaker 1: because there are plenty of fats that are actually good
38:04
Speaker 1: for your heart, like things like fats found in fish,
38:07
Speaker 1: fats found in olive oil, and then even even potentially yeah,
38:12
Speaker 1: avocados are about as good as it gets and then
38:15
Speaker 1: potentially chuck. They're like the kinds of saturated fat that
38:19
Speaker 1: people tend to associate, like with a steak, as being
38:22
Speaker 1: bad for you. That's not necessarily true either. And again
38:26
Speaker 1: it seems to be like we talked about in that
38:28
Speaker 1: the peanut butter episode, those chemically processed or um industrially
38:34
Speaker 1: processed fats that change things that make peanut butter shelf
38:38
Speaker 1: stable and way more delicious, Like, those are the fats
38:42
Speaker 1: that are actually really bad for you. Those are the
38:44
Speaker 1: ones that you should avoid or eat in moderation, and
38:48
Speaker 1: that that kind of nuances needed to actually have a
38:50
Speaker 1: healthy diet, because we learned from this experiment that you
38:53
Speaker 1: can't just cut fats out all together. We need a
38:56
Speaker 1: lot of those fats to survive and be healthy. Yeah,
38:59
Speaker 1: and the evans as far as um because you would think,
39:03
Speaker 1: you know, this started in the nineteen eighties in America,
39:05
Speaker 1: so surely we all got a lot healthier, right because
39:08
Speaker 1: of the food pyramid and all the low fat food.
39:11
Speaker 1: We cut fat anyway you can slice it. We cut
39:13
Speaker 1: fat over two decades plus. People still, you know, think
39:18
Speaker 1: fat as the demon in a lot of circles, and
39:20
Speaker 1: America is as sick as we've ever been. Type two
39:24
Speaker 1: diabetes has increased, Oh man, this is crazy, a hundred
39:27
Speaker 1: and sixty six percent from nineteen eighty to twelve. I
39:32
Speaker 1: don't know about twenty twelve till now. Um, I would
39:35
Speaker 1: guess more of this. Yeah, I doubt if it reverse course. Uh.
39:39
Speaker 1: We have beaten down heart disease some, but we've also
39:43
Speaker 1: stopped smoking a lot more, and we've got better emergency
39:46
Speaker 1: room care and better drugs like statins and stuff like that.
39:51
Speaker 1: But it's still, you know, cardiovascular disease still kills people
39:55
Speaker 1: more than anything else in the US. Yeah, despite those
39:58
Speaker 1: advances in medical treatment, Um, it's still killing people more
40:03
Speaker 1: than anything else. And like even exercising hasn't helped. Like
40:08
Speaker 1: we exercise basically more than ever, but still a third
40:12
Speaker 1: of the country is obese. The third of the United
40:14
Speaker 1: States is obese, and all of this, Like, think about this,
40:18
Speaker 1: All of those things are happened while we cut fat
40:22
Speaker 1: essentially out of our diets. So that just goes to
40:24
Speaker 1: show you, like that that didn't work. That's not going
40:26
Speaker 1: to help that we have to rethink this whole thing
40:29
Speaker 1: for sure. Yeah, and again we're not poopooing the Mediterranean diet.
40:33
Speaker 1: There's also the flip side of this stuff with keto um,
40:38
Speaker 1: the Atkins diet and paleo stuff like that. You know,
40:42
Speaker 1: I think we've tried to you know, we're not gonna
40:44
Speaker 1: tell anyone how to eat, and we're not dietitians, but
40:46
Speaker 1: we've tried to preach over the past couple of years.
40:49
Speaker 1: You know, eat real foods, eat balanced diets, try and moderation,
40:53
Speaker 1: moderation and you know, calorie reasonable, calorie restriction and exercise. Yeah,
41:01
Speaker 1: and and I mean portion control. Two is it sucks
41:06
Speaker 1: when you first do it. It sucks to get used to,
41:09
Speaker 1: but once you get used to it, it's it's um,
41:12
Speaker 1: it's easy to maintain it. It's also easy to go
41:16
Speaker 1: back on when you're like, I'm gonna eat this whole
41:18
Speaker 1: box of Hamburger Helper tonight. I know, but how does
41:20
Speaker 1: that make you feel? It makes you feel like garbage? Yeah,
41:24
Speaker 1: ultimately emotionally and even if it's hitting a reward center.
41:29
Speaker 1: And trust me, there so many reasons that people don't
41:34
Speaker 1: eat the right things and eat too much of the
41:36
Speaker 1: wrong things, emotional reasons and psychological reasons, and we're not
41:40
Speaker 1: all that stuff is valid. But um, even if it's
41:44
Speaker 1: hitting that reward center, it will probably also make you
41:47
Speaker 1: feel awful emotionally and physically. It's true and like and
41:52
Speaker 1: also just to say like, we're definitely on our high
41:55
Speaker 1: horses right now, but we're no better than anybody else.
41:58
Speaker 1: Like we know, I'm still sixty pound. I mean, we
42:01
Speaker 1: had you mean and I split a whole roll of
42:03
Speaker 1: Pillsbury cinnamon rolls last Yeah, I know, tough to turn
42:09
Speaker 1: those down. Um, I can't even get this stuff. But
42:12
Speaker 1: it's just the it's the well, no chucking, you're right
42:17
Speaker 1: having it in your house is problem one. Not having
42:22
Speaker 1: it in your house actually is helpful. It's crazy, it's weird,
42:25
Speaker 1: but it actually works, especially during a quarantine when you
42:28
Speaker 1: can't just pop up or you don't feel like you
42:31
Speaker 1: should pop up to the store and get that. Ben
42:32
Speaker 1: and Jerry's right exactly, like, yeah, yeah for sure, because
42:35
Speaker 1: then you're you just your past around your kitchenutil this
42:38
Speaker 1: time you go to bed, but you didn't need anything
42:42
Speaker 1: get that. You know what I tried the other night?
42:44
Speaker 1: What that that peanut butter and whipped cream? Oh? What
42:49
Speaker 1: do you think? It's delicious? I'm sorry, I still haven't
42:52
Speaker 1: eating a peanut butter and mayo sandwich yet. No, it's
42:54
Speaker 1: really good. Emily made. She makes a good homemade whip cream.
42:57
Speaker 1: And it was Oh yeah, it was delish. Yeah, it's
43:01
Speaker 1: it's uh, it's hard to turn down. Now I want some,
43:05
Speaker 1: but you know, have a little bit of that one night,
43:07
Speaker 1: then I won't have any for a little while. Yeah.
43:09
Speaker 1: And even I think what I was gonna say earlier
43:11
Speaker 1: is walking around with this information is good and helpful,
43:16
Speaker 1: and like you're never going to always adhere to it
43:19
Speaker 1: probably wouldn't be that fun of a life to always
43:22
Speaker 1: adhere to it, but they're just knowing it and kind
43:26
Speaker 1: of using it as like a general compass or guide
43:28
Speaker 1: that will make you healthier and we'll make you feel better.
43:32
Speaker 1: And maybe at some point along the line, if you
43:33
Speaker 1: already have this info, you're gonna get a kick in
43:36
Speaker 1: the pants by something. Um, you're gonna hit like a
43:40
Speaker 1: period of growth, and that might be part of it.
43:43
Speaker 1: You might like loosen weight, you might get over a
43:45
Speaker 1: chronic disease, you might all sorts of things might happen
43:49
Speaker 1: because you know what to eat or how to start
43:52
Speaker 1: thinking about your food. It's just good to keep in
43:55
Speaker 1: your back pocket. At least it is. And uh, in
43:57
Speaker 1: the end it what doesn't matter anyway, because it all
43:59
Speaker 1: has to do with the health of your grandfather, right yeah.
44:04
Speaker 1: Um hey. One other thing I want to say is
44:06
Speaker 1: that critic Zoe dr Zoe Harcomb. She pointed out that
44:11
Speaker 1: actually the strongest correlation that the seven countries study turned
44:15
Speaker 1: up was um, the where the latitude of where the
44:19
Speaker 1: person lived sunshine, right yeah, And which is really strange
44:24
Speaker 1: until she points out and I'm not sure how much
44:26
Speaker 1: she was pointing this out to basically undermine the seven
44:29
Speaker 1: country studies, but it does make sense in a way too,
44:33
Speaker 1: is she's saying, well, um, we synthesize vitamin D uh
44:37
Speaker 1: in our skin from cholesterol in the skin when it's
44:41
Speaker 1: exposed to sunshine. Um, and vitamin D has a lot
44:45
Speaker 1: of protective qualities for the immune system, so maybe that
44:48
Speaker 1: has to do with it. Yeah, I'm glad you pointed
44:50
Speaker 1: that out. Yeah, well that's it for nutrition. We'll probably
44:54
Speaker 1: never talk about it again. That's not true at all.
44:57
Speaker 1: And since I said that, it's time for listener maiw
45:02
Speaker 1: all right, I'm gonna call this, uh, Jackhammers. Why did
45:07
Speaker 1: you do that? I don't know why not people asked me,
45:11
Speaker 1: asked on Twitter, They're like, why why I thought you
45:13
Speaker 1: guys hated this? And I said, yeah, I think Chuck's
45:15
Speaker 1: got some weird self loathing going on trolling and I
45:18
Speaker 1: just got caught up unfairly. Yeah. So we we have
45:22
Speaker 1: often and long made fun of our Jackhammers episode, and
45:25
Speaker 1: I re released it as a stuff you should have
45:28
Speaker 1: select just to be cheeky, and this is about that
45:31
Speaker 1: because Chris from Massachusetts really appreciated it. Hey, guys, just
45:35
Speaker 1: finished listening to stuff you should have select on Jackhammers,
45:37
Speaker 1: and I know you call it the most most boring,
45:40
Speaker 1: worst one, but I actually enjoyed it. I'm a mechanical engineer.
45:43
Speaker 1: In college, took a class on vibrations, which led to
45:46
Speaker 1: conducting research on noise. On the noise that a jackhammer makes.
45:50
Speaker 1: This is we did that show for this guy. Uh.
45:53
Speaker 1: The noise or the ring that you hear when a
45:55
Speaker 1: jackhammer strikes is the resonant frequency of the jackhammer Moyl
45:59
Speaker 1: point after being struck by the inner pile driver. I
46:03
Speaker 1: don't think we said any of that stuff. I was
46:06
Speaker 1: working with my professor on developing an inner damper to
46:09
Speaker 1: reduce that noise produced for the same reasons that you
46:14
Speaker 1: named in your podcast. Some of the concepts he developed
46:17
Speaker 1: we're quite amazing. You could take one of the moils
46:19
Speaker 1: he designed and drop it on a concrete floor and
46:22
Speaker 1: instead of alloud ringing you expect to hear, it would
46:25
Speaker 1: land with a soft thud. Unfortunately, the concepts never quite
46:29
Speaker 1: panned out, but we call them moils right exactly. Uh,
46:34
Speaker 1: but your podcast reminded me of the many nights spent
46:37
Speaker 1: in the lab collecting piles of data and the painful
46:39
Speaker 1: ringing that you mentioned in the show. Thanks for the
46:42
Speaker 1: countless amazing episodes. My girlfriend and I have gotten many
46:45
Speaker 1: hours of entertainment from your show and truly appreciate all
46:48
Speaker 1: the great content and laughs. Chris from Massachusetts. Chris, thank
46:53
Speaker 1: you for getting in touch and thank you for your
46:55
Speaker 1: attempted contribution to the world. Had it paid off, that
46:59
Speaker 1: really would have been something. But thank you for even trying.
47:02
Speaker 1: Um And if you want to be like Chris and
47:05
Speaker 1: let us know that you're an unsung hero, we want
47:08
Speaker 1: to hear about that. Uh. And if you know an
47:10
Speaker 1: unsung hero, let us know about that person too. You
47:13
Speaker 1: can send it in an email to Stuff Podcasts at
47:17
Speaker 1: iHeart radio dot com. Stuff you Should Know is a
47:22
Speaker 1: production of iHeart Radios. How stuff works for more podcasts
47:26
Speaker 1: for my heart Radio because at the iHeart Radio app,
47:28
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
47:33
Speaker 1: H