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On the Road to WriterCon with Screenwriter Bob Saenz · WriterCon

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: This week on the writer Con podcast.
• 0:03
  Speaker 2: The first one is don't be boring, and the second
• 0:06
  Speaker 2: thing is don't give up.
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: Welcome to writer Con, a gathering place for writers to
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: share their knowledge about writing and the writing world. Your
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: hosts are William Bernhardt, best selling novelist and author of
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: the Red Sneaker books on writing, and Laura Bernhardt, Award
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: winning author of the want Land Files book series.
• 0:28
  Speaker 3: Thank you, Jesse ulrich A. There writers, thanks for joining us.
• 0:34
  Speaker 3: The writer Con excitement continues to build. We've got just
• 0:39
  Speaker 3: a few more weeks till the conference begins on August thirtieth,
• 0:43
  Speaker 3: so there is still time to register and join this
• 0:47
  Speaker 3: conference that offers over seventy speakers and more than ninety sessions.
• 0:53
  Speaker 3: What are we up to on agents now, because we
• 0:55
  Speaker 3: keep patting them every day well past ten, all open
• 1:00
  Speaker 3: to pitches and actively acquiring new writers. We got nine
• 1:06
  Speaker 3: contest categories and it is not, as we release this
• 1:10
  Speaker 3: too late to enter. There are many paths to publication today,
• 1:14
  Speaker 3: as anybody who's been listening to this podcast already knows,
• 1:18
  Speaker 3: but you can't use any of them if you don't
• 1:20
  Speaker 3: know how. So come to writer Con and learn how
• 1:24
  Speaker 3: to take best advantage of the tools that can make
• 1:28
  Speaker 3: your writing career more successful. Laura, you've been to a
• 1:33
  Speaker 3: writing conference or two to you think of a time
• 1:37
  Speaker 3: when you picked up something of value from a writer's
• 1:40
  Speaker 3: conference A time? Okay, well pick the best.
• 1:45
  Speaker 4: One every time. This industry is still in a state
• 1:51
  Speaker 4: of flux. It continues to moork and evolve. So every
• 1:55
  Speaker 4: year I learn something, I think most recently, most recently,
• 2:02
  Speaker 4: I probably picked up some really useful information about marketing
• 2:06
  Speaker 4: and promotion when I was at a writer's conference, and
• 2:10
  Speaker 4: I have put that to good use. And yeah, ready
• 2:15
  Speaker 4: to see what I can learn this year.
• 2:18
  Speaker 3: Fantastic, Jesse, you're gonna be there. You're not even writing,
• 2:22
  Speaker 3: but we still manage to get you down.
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: There every trimmer.
• 2:26
  Speaker 3: Of course, we do majorly put you to work, but
• 2:29
  Speaker 3: beyond that, what brings you back to the conference again?
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: I just I love being around creative people trying to
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: do creative things. There's a there's an energy to creators,
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: and as a creator myself, it is just a fun
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: way to like just like again, if you try to
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: boil everything down to a task that we have to
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: complete to complete our dreams, right, Writing is no different
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: than podcast production. Or anything else you look to. It's
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: it's learning how to best sit it down, it's learning
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: the rules, it's getting feedback, and it is then learning
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: how to take something that you love and make it
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: a skill that you can then hopefully get paid for
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: to do the rest of your life. And so I
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  Speaker 1: just love I get energized from people who are trying
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: to create things. And so I'm there talking to people,
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: usually running around, micing people up so we can then
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: make sure that people can listen to those presentations later.
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: And you know, just learning about all the different like
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: tools like advice and sort of experience that you get
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: from from hearing from you know, already published authors, from
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: agents and from publishers.
• 3:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, all right. Then our interview today is with
• 3:43
  Speaker 3: Bob Sand's, a multi talented scriptwriter who will be speaking
• 3:49
  Speaker 3: at writer Con this year.
• 3:51
  Speaker 5: Again.
• 3:51
  Speaker 3: He's I think, don't you get friend of writer Con
• 3:55
  Speaker 3: status at some point? I know on Saturday Night Live,
• 3:58
  Speaker 3: if you've hosted, you get a jacker. Can't we have
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: writer kon jackets for people like Bob?
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  Speaker 4: Yet? I love it. I'm behind this idea.
• 4:07
  Speaker 5: You're in charge of that, Laura.
• 4:09
  Speaker 4: Okay.
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  Speaker 3: Anyway, Bob is a very experienced screenwriter. He's worked in
• 4:14
  Speaker 3: television and film. He's also done some acting in both.
• 4:18
  Speaker 3: He wrote the movie Extracurricular Activities, which was a huge hit,
• 4:23
  Speaker 3: and he wrote Help for the Holidays and a bunch
• 4:26
  Speaker 3: of other good movies. We'll talk to him about his
• 4:29
  Speaker 3: screen work, plus his book on screenwriting, plus his new novel.
• 4:35
  Speaker 3: But the news, well, we have a special theme for
• 4:55
  Speaker 3: the news stories this time, which I know Jesse will
• 4:57
  Speaker 3: be excited to know, is we're amn novels. I mean,
• 5:01
  Speaker 3: last time we picked on the science fiction world with
• 5:05
  Speaker 3: the Hugo Award scandal. But they are not the only
• 5:08
  Speaker 3: genre in the news right now, for both good and
• 5:12
  Speaker 3: bad reasons. For instance, here are some of the recent
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: headlines pertaining to romance sales of Romanticy. Remember that we
• 5:20
  Speaker 3: told you it was the biggest thing last year. Last year, well,
• 5:23
  Speaker 3: sales of Romanticy nearly doubled during the first five months
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  Speaker 3: of twenty twenty four, like cut off at the end
• 5:32
  Speaker 3: of May, and they've already doubled last year. This thing
• 5:35
  Speaker 3: is exploding, perhaps in part as a result of that,
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  Speaker 3: more romance focused bookstores are opening up, and even if
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  Speaker 3: in the you know, regular bookstores Barnes and Noble or whatever.
• 5:48
  Speaker 3: They're putting romance in much more prominent positions. There's a
• 5:53
  Speaker 3: reason for that. Romance sales have increased from eighteen million
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  Speaker 3: copies talking about print in twenty twenty to more than
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  Speaker 3: thirty nine million in twenty twenty three. I mean, romance
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  Speaker 3: has always been the most popular genre, but this is
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  Speaker 3: just almost incredible. Teens are reading romance in record numbers
• 6:16
  Speaker 3: and fem gore. Yes, I said what it sounded like,
• 6:20
  Speaker 3: fe m g O. Ri is reinventing horror fiction with
• 6:26
  Speaker 3: this horror subgenre with I don't know, feminism and gore.
• 6:32
  Speaker 3: I would imagine it's possibly. I have read rooted to
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: a backlash against the you know, the torture porn horror
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  Speaker 3: movies that were popular for a while.
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  Speaker 5: But as if that weren't.
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  Speaker 3: Enough, that's not even the big story in the romance world.
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  Speaker 3: The biggest story is the collapse of r WA, the
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  Speaker 3: Romance Writers of America. Now you may be thinking, when
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: romance novels are doing so well, how can the RWA,
• 7:05
  Speaker 3: the voice of romance and romance writers be collapsing? But
• 7:10
  Speaker 3: somehow that is what has happened. They filed for bankruptcy.
• 7:14
  Speaker 3: They've canceled their annual conference, and it just seems very
• 7:19
  Speaker 3: perplexing that when the genre is reaching new highs URWA
• 7:24
  Speaker 3: is falling apart. They've suffered an enormous drop in membership,
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  Speaker 3: like eighty percent in the past five years, and I
• 7:35
  Speaker 3: suspect that would cause a crashing budgetary crisis. Apparently the
• 7:41
  Speaker 3: collapse comes after internal accusations that had to do with
• 7:46
  Speaker 3: charges of discrimination and exclusion, kind of what some are
• 7:52
  Speaker 3: calling systemic problems that have divided the group for decades,
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: and now the you know, the whole thing is cracked
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  Speaker 3: and fallen apart. Laura, can you explain this? This seems
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  Speaker 3: so weird and surprising.
• 8:10
  Speaker 4: The success of romance or the falling apart.
• 8:14
  Speaker 3: Of the bankruptcy of the Romance Writers of America.
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  Speaker 4: I have friends who are romance writers and did belong
• 8:28
  Speaker 4: to the organization who are choosing to leave as a
• 8:33
  Speaker 4: result of some of the issues that they have seen.
• 8:37
  Speaker 4: They've had some problems with accusations of bigotry and racism,
• 8:46
  Speaker 4: and I know a number of people who felt that
• 8:49
  Speaker 4: those accusations were strong enough, like they believed it enough
• 8:55
  Speaker 4: that they didn't want to be part of an organization
• 8:57
  Speaker 4: that could be prepared situating right problems like that.
• 9:05
  Speaker 3: You know to some extent that this was last week
• 9:09
  Speaker 3: too with the Hugrew Awards. It seems like everything old
• 9:12
  Speaker 3: is new again. I remember way back when, as you know,
• 9:16
  Speaker 3: I was the president of Novelists, Inc. An organization for
• 9:20
  Speaker 3: professional writers that started you know I at any rate,
• 9:28
  Speaker 3: a large percentage of the members were romance writers. And
• 9:32
  Speaker 3: actually how the organization was originally founded was by people
• 9:37
  Speaker 3: who left r w A because they were upset. I
• 9:40
  Speaker 3: think when OURBA started accepting associate members, that is members
• 9:45
  Speaker 3: who are not writers but you know, fans, readers and whatnot,
• 9:50
  Speaker 3: and then there's so many the writers couldn't get their
• 9:52
  Speaker 3: way on any of the votes, and so they decided
• 9:56
  Speaker 3: to get apart and you know, start a new group
• 10:00
  Speaker 3: that would be restricted to writers, which as you know,
• 10:03
  Speaker 3: it still is today. I think it's a terrific organization.
• 10:07
  Speaker 3: It's the most informative conference I go to every year.
• 10:12
  Speaker 3: But it also dates back to problems with RWA. Jesse,
• 10:17
  Speaker 3: knowing your passion for our mounts novels, can you shed
• 10:20
  Speaker 3: light on this?
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: It's not that strange that when something is hitting like
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: a peak, that the sort of overarching organizing organization has
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: issues because then, like so usually something has changed in
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: whatever that thing is when it gets you know, super popular,
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: and they probably just couldn't, like literally could not handle
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: whatever the new thing was, whether it's the different kinds
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: of authors, different kinds of fans, the different kinds of whatever,
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: and so there are probably so many schisms that already
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: existed that it just sort of blew itself apart.
• 10:55
  Speaker 5: So yeah, all right, work, what go ahead.
• 11:04
  Speaker 4: I was just going to say, as far as romance
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  Speaker 4: being as popular as it is today, even I've been even.
• 11:12
  Speaker 6: I've been reading a few, I think we're all just
• 11:14
  Speaker 6: very eager for. I think we're all eager for, like,
• 11:19
  Speaker 6: are happily ever after right now. I think that a
• 11:22
  Speaker 6: lot of people, honestly, since since COVID, I think people
• 11:26
  Speaker 6: have been longing for just a happier experience, and they're
• 11:32
  Speaker 6: finding that in the in the pages of romance.
• 11:36
  Speaker 4: There's always a happy ever after at the end, as
• 11:41
  Speaker 4: in life.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, and you know, again, we just celebrated our tenth
• 11:44
  Speaker 3: then anversary, except we actually haven't yet because we're recording
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: this in events, but we will.
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: Now if yeah, if if art really does reflect life.
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: What will happen is there will be a very tearful
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: like reforming of the r w A probably over let's
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: say Christmas.
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: But this time we do it right.
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  Speaker 3: Oh gosh, you guys are the romantics here? All right, Jesse,
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  Speaker 3: why don't we talk to screenwriter Bob SAMs.
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  Speaker 5: Bob, Welcome to the podcast.
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: Thank you, I'm happy to be here. Good to see
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: you guys.
• 12:41
  Speaker 3: All right, traditional first question, if you could offer writers
• 12:44
  Speaker 3: one piece of advice, what would it be?
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  Speaker 2: Actually, whenever I whenever I do that, I have two
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: because they kind of they go okay, hand in hand.
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: The number one. The first one is linked. The first
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: one is don't be boring. It's a really you'd be
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: surprised how many people don't think of that when they're
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: writing and thinking that they have to set things up
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: rather than tell their story. And the second thing is
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: don't give up. The people who give up that don't
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: succeed because there are so many rejections and so many
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: roadblocks and so many close but no cigars in this
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: writing business that you could get. You could get feeling
• 13:36
  Speaker 2: like you need to leave, and everybody gets them. Everybody
• 13:41
  Speaker 2: feels that way. And it's the people who persevere, the
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: people that press on through, that don't give up, are
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: the ones that end up succeeding.
• 13:50
  Speaker 4: It can be very discouraging. It's us buttons for punishment
• 13:54
  Speaker 4: that hang in there.
• 13:55
  Speaker 3: And perseverance is the key, which it has always been
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: central message at ryer Con. Speaking of which you're coming right.
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: I am helping teach a couple of classes. Be on
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: a couple of panels.
• 14:11
  Speaker 5: And talk a little bit about what you're speaking about
• 14:14
  Speaker 5: and what you're.
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: Doing and all, and doing a Monday and that too. Yes,
• 14:19
  Speaker 2: Monday class. I'll talk about the Monday class. I'm going
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: to do a Labor Day class. There are extra classes
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: that come to writer Con that happen on Monday. They're
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: all usually by people that you want to come and see.
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: So take a look at the list and there's some
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: really amazing people this year and some really cool topics.
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: I'm going to talk about screenwriting because that's what I
• 14:41
  Speaker 2: do and that's what I know, and I'm going to
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: do a three hour of screenwriting boot camp to talk
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: to people about what they want to know, what they
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: want to learn about it. You you get there and
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: you find out where people are in their journey and
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: then you take the class and make it fit where
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: they are in their journey.
• 15:06
  Speaker 4: Very cool. I hear a lot when people find out
• 15:10
  Speaker 4: I write novels. They say things like, don't you ever
• 15:14
  Speaker 4: want to write like for movies? Wouldn't that be more
• 15:16
  Speaker 4: fun to work in Hollywood? Which it sounds very glamorous
• 15:20
  Speaker 4: to everyone. But I'm curious how you even got started,
• 15:23
  Speaker 4: because I wouldn't know. I know novels now, but I
• 15:26
  Speaker 4: don't know the first thing about how you get started
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: with films. So how did you get started writing for
• 15:30
  Speaker 4: movies and television?
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: I was an actor and I was on a television
• 15:35
  Speaker 2: series called Nash Bridges.
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah cool.
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: I was the precinct sergeant in their precinct and I
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: had a part that grid. For people who are listening
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: to this, I'm holding my fingers about a half an
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: inch part at a very small recurring role on the show.
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: Don Johnson, who produced the show, kept me around for
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: six seasons. I'm not sure why, but I loved it,
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: and during that time I got to look at the
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: scripts every week, and I got to see what people
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: were doing and watching it, and I was I had
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: been in a bunch of movies as a actor with
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: very small parts, or originally when I started, I started
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: as an extra. There are some amazing movies where you
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: can see my elbow or shoulder playing a really major
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: role in some of the scenes. But during all those things,
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: I kept thinking, I really like what I'm seeing in
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: the in the writing part of it, and I thought
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: I should try and do this. So I wrote an
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: episode in nash Bridges. Found out that everybody on set
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: had an episode in Nash Bridges, including the guy who
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: watered the plants.
• 16:51
  Speaker 4: So I.
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: Pitched it to one of the producers one day and
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: he said, holy cow, I get pitched a lot of these,
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: and I go, gee, that's none. But he said, that's
• 17:01
  Speaker 2: a really good idea. Yeah, I like this. It's kind
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: of out of the box. And he said, all right,
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: I'll look at it. So he passes along to the
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: show runner, which was a guy named Carlton Q's and
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: Carlton Q sent me a really nice letter saying we
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: can't use your script. We're a w GA ouse. You're
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: obviously not in the WGA, and we have a writer's
• 17:24
  Speaker 2: room and that's how television works. On the other hand,
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: you have a lot of skill and you should keep writing.
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: This is it was. It showed me that you're going
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: to be able to do this someday, and I thought, wow, okay,
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: some encouragement from somebody who is, you know, a wheeler
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: dealer in the movie and TV business. So I decided
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: that I would keep writing, and I wrote. I wrote
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: some scripts and I wrote one script back there extracurricular
• 17:56
  Speaker 2: activities and extracurricular I should be able to say the
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: word and it opened every door in Hollywood and mire
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: eighteen years after it was written, it got made. But
• 18:11
  Speaker 2: it was a twelve year span between the time I
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: wrote my first script and I got my first produced movie.
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: Now I have twenty and it looks like twenty one
• 18:20
  Speaker 2: because I think Hulu has just picked up one of
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: my scripts, more original, but not sure yet we crossed.
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: The production company says they're waiting for the paperwork, so
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: that's a good home. It's been a long haul and
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: it's the learning curve has been like this, and I
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: appreciate every bit of help I got from people in
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: the industry that I knew, and I did it all
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: through networking, which is why I love what you guys
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: do at writer Coon because it's an opportunity for people
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: who are not in any of these industries, in the
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: publishing industry or in the film industry, or any other
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: industry that happens to be there, like video games or
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: or poetry or whatever else is going on at your
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: at your conference, that they have a chance to sit
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: around and openly network with some of the people that
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: are there that they would never meet in a million years.
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: And and everybody is really open and really friendly and
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: really giving your conference, and it makes it one of
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: the best ones of the year as far as I'm concerned.
• 19:33
  Speaker 5: Oh, thanks, thank.
• 19:34
  Speaker 4: You for that. Well, I have to say I think
• 19:37
  Speaker 4: that comes from the top down. Bill is very selective
• 19:41
  Speaker 4: in who he brings in so that we can we
• 19:45
  Speaker 4: can have the kind of vibe that you're describing.
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: So that's always great people, and it's always amazing people.
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: And and you have and you have you have you
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: have agents and publishers and all kinds of people to
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: come in. And they're not sitting over in a corner,
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: not talking to people, and they're not you know, saying,
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: giving down and giving a speech and then going back
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: to their room. They're actually they're actually interfacing with people
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: that are there and networking, and it's a it's a
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: really wonderful thing to kind of watch in the party what.
• 20:23
  Speaker 4: We hope for, which your story illustrates very well. It's
• 20:27
  Speaker 4: amazing what a little bit of encouragement can do, and
• 20:30
  Speaker 4: I think that you sharing your story really highlights that
• 20:34
  Speaker 4: for us.
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: It's one of the reasons that I try and be
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: encouraging to writers that that are trying to do this
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: for the first time. It's it's not a no, it's
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: not a zero sum game. Because somebody else succeeds doesn't
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: mean that somebody else fails. Everybody has the opportunity to succeed.
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: It's not easy, and it's very it's very difficult in
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: the long run because there's so much competition in there's
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: and it's to be honest with you, it's very hard
• 21:05
  Speaker 2: to write something good. It's very easy to write something mediocre.
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: It's it's very hard, and so people have to understand
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: that first time out, they're not going to write their
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: best work. They're not going to write something that people
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: are going to go nuts over. They're going to use whatever.
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: The first two or three things they write are to
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: learn the craft of writing and it's a craft, okay,
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: and there are there's so much to it, and your
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: conference helps teach people, you know, wherever they wrote, wherever
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: they are on the on the ladder that they're on
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: right now, their next step of where they should go
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: with their craft.
• 21:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's the idea. Thanks. All right, let's talk about screenwriting,
• 21:55
  Speaker 3: all right?
• 21:55
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you also wrote a book about screenwriting. How does
• 22:00
  Speaker 4: that's it?
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: It's called that's backwards. That's not the way it's work.
• 22:08
  Speaker 4: That's not the way it works.
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: And that's also not the way work. It's it's a
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: book about the business of screenwriting. There are a lot
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: of books out there about what goes where and why,
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: and there's some craft in it and there I talk
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: about the basics of screenwriting. But it's the second half
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: of the book that have caused it to sell every
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: day of the week, which I am grateful to God
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: for that. That it's about what you do once you
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: write your script, where you go with it, what you
• 22:44
  Speaker 2: do with it, how you how you market it, the
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: pitfalls of marketing once you get it seen, how you act,
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: how you respond if you go to meetings, what you
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: do in those meetings, how how you take those meetings,
• 22:59
  Speaker 2: how how you respond to the people in those meetings,
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: about listening and about all the things that you need
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: to know to be seen as a professional in the
• 23:09
  Speaker 2: industry rather than not a professional. I talk about how
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: the two things, and I know this is true in
• 23:15
  Speaker 2: publishing too, because I just went through it with my novel.
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: The two things that that agents and and publishers and
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: producers and everybody age else hates the most in writers
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: is fear and desperation.
• 23:33
  Speaker 5: Hey, did you just mention a novel? I thought about.
• 23:39
  Speaker 4: It.
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: It literally just came out right before the last writer con.
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: It's doing okay, but I understand that it's not. In fact,
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: I think William told me that it's not a sprint,
• 23:51
  Speaker 2: it's a marathon, and that first time novels my first
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: time novelists. Even though I'm people know me as a screenwriter,
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: sometimes don't you know, catch on right away. But it's
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: doing better than I thought it was going to do,
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: and it's doing well enough to where the publishing company
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: has asked me for a sequel. Nice. I'm very pleased
• 24:17
  Speaker 2: with that. And I got a New York publishing company,
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: which I was extremely grateful for. And it's been a
• 24:26
  Speaker 2: it's been a journey. It's a YA novel, it's kind
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: of The reviews have been spectacular. I'm very very happy
• 24:34
  Speaker 2: about that. And some people are calling it YA for
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: adults because it's got two levels of humor in it,
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: kind of like the old Bugs Bunny cartoons. It was
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: for the kids and the level for the adults. And
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: people seem to be enjoying it a lot, so I'm
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: I'm thrilled about that.
• 24:53
  Speaker 5: Oh, that's fantastic.
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: It's called it's called Jessica's Vampire Diary background and it's
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: a bram Soker. When he wrote Dracula, I wrote the
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: book as a diary. And since there's a van helsing
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: in this book, I thought I would write it as
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: a diary, too sweet.
• 25:20
  Speaker 3: Okay, what I was about to say was, was it
• 25:22
  Speaker 3: hard to adjust from, you know, writing screenplays to writing
• 25:26
  Speaker 3: a novel. They're pretty different.
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: You have no idea. Yeah, screenplays are writing a compelling
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: story in the least words possible. Novels you get to
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: do whatever you want. I mean, you get to write
• 25:41
  Speaker 2: all kinds of things. So when I wrote the novel
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: the first time through, I said, here's the story I
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: want to tell and here's what I want to write.
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: So I wrote the novel and I was done with
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: and I had seventy nine pages. Yeah, the reason I
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: had seventy nine pages is because I wrote a skeleton.
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: I wrote the basic bones without filling in everything else.
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: And I realized that I was still thinking like a
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: screenwriter and not thinking like a novelist. So I sat
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: down and opened my another part of my brain and
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: decided I would do the novelist part and found it was.
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: My wife says, whenever I come in and you're writing
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: a screenplay, you're very serious in your I can see
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: the concentration on your face. When she came in while
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: I was writing the novel, she said, you had a
• 26:32
  Speaker 2: smile on your face the whole time. I don't think
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: I've ever had as much fun writing anything as I
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: had writing this novel. That's wonderful.
• 26:43
  Speaker 4: Well, what does a typical writing day look like for you?
• 26:46
  Speaker 4: So what's your.
• 26:47
  Speaker 2: Process When I'm on deadline, when I have a script
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: that's do. When I have an assignment and I just
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: started one couple of days ago. I I write eight
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: hours a day, sit up here, and I'll take breaks
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: and go downstairs and andrew around, and sometimes I write
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: late at night or early in the morning. It just
• 27:13
  Speaker 2: depends on the muse. And then when I'm not writing
• 27:16
  Speaker 2: anything on assignment, I uh, I'm lazy, but write or
• 27:24
  Speaker 2: I play more golf than than I do when I'm
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: on assignment, but I write. I try to write every
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: day except for Sunday. Sunday is the only day I
• 27:32
  Speaker 2: don't write.
• 27:35
  Speaker 4: Would you call yourself a panther or a planner.
• 27:38
  Speaker 2: I'm a panther, okay, I am an absolute panser. I
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: know the ending, rock solid ending. I know the characters,
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: I know what I'm writing about. I know the basic storyline,
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: and I know like if it's an if it's a
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: if it's a screenplay, I know the first ten pages cold.
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: I know because I want to open up with something
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: that gets people to keep reading and then let my
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: characters take me on a journey on the pathway that
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: leads to that ending. I don't let them get off
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: that pathway.
• 28:12
  Speaker 4: Well, you say, and that's fine. You can call yourself
• 28:15
  Speaker 4: whatever you want, But you're saying you have the basic thanks,
• 28:18
  Speaker 4: the basic plot line, the basic outline for your story.
• 28:21
  Speaker 4: It sounds like.
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: I haven't written an outline. I know what story.
• 28:26
  Speaker 4: I want to tell in your mind, all right, so
• 28:30
  Speaker 4: tell me. I like to differentiate just because some people
• 28:34
  Speaker 4: hear a planner and think that you have to have
• 28:36
  Speaker 4: like this huge notebook outline full of stuff. Not necessarily.
• 28:41
  Speaker 4: I mean you can do some preparation and just know
• 28:43
  Speaker 4: where your story's going.
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: Yep. And as long as you have that rock solid
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: ending that you're shooting. Yeah, you want your character, your
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: your protagonist to get then you can let them do
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: all kinds of things on the way that they want to.
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: You know, you have to listen to your characters. You
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: have to pay attention to what's going on and not
• 29:07
  Speaker 2: be afraid to let them do things that you didn't
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: think of until they kind of helped you think of
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: them while you were we get there.
• 29:15
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that's fun. I like, there are people.
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: What are your voices?
• 29:26
  Speaker 3: So what are you writing on? Working on? I should
• 29:28
  Speaker 3: say what are you working on now? Or coming out next?
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: Or just finished a really interesting two short films for
• 29:40
  Speaker 2: La The La Baptist College in or University in southern
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: California is doing a really cool project for nine to
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: twelve year olds that they called me and asked me
• 29:56
  Speaker 2: if I would write a couple of the ten minute
• 29:59
  Speaker 2: short films and they had to be complete stories. And
• 30:03
  Speaker 2: they're calling a lot of professional screenwriters and asking them
• 30:06
  Speaker 2: to do it so that they can turn them over
• 30:09
  Speaker 2: to film students to have them make them. And I
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: told them yes, and I wrote a couple that are
• 30:15
  Speaker 2: pretty funny, and I hope and I with good message,
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: and I hope that they read one of them so
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: far and the other one they haven't read yet, but
• 30:25
  Speaker 2: they like the one they're read. So I was about that.
• 30:28
  Speaker 2: So I just finished that. I'm finishing up a project
• 30:34
  Speaker 2: that I'm doing with an animation studio for a half
• 30:37
  Speaker 2: hour animation show, and then I have to write the
• 30:40
  Speaker 2: sequel to Farmer and the Bell, which was a very
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: successful film that came out a couple of years ago
• 30:47
  Speaker 2: that they now want a sequel to. So I've signed
• 30:49
  Speaker 2: a contract and I'm going to write a sequel to
• 30:52
  Speaker 2: The Farmer on the Bell and that's what I'm doing.
• 30:54
  Speaker 2: And I have to write a sequel to.
• 30:55
  Speaker 3: The book, which might keep me busy for a while,
• 30:58
  Speaker 3: and I'm I'm a little bit busy.
• 31:02
  Speaker 5: Bob.
• 31:02
  Speaker 3: Thanks for being on the podcast and see you in
• 31:06
  Speaker 3: just a few weeks.
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's less than a month.
• 31:09
  Speaker 5: Now, all right, all right.
• 31:12
  Speaker 2: So thank you for having me. It's nice to see
• 31:15
  Speaker 2: you guys again. And everybody out there go to writer
• 31:19
  Speaker 2: or cut. It's worth it.
• 31:21
  Speaker 5: Thanks, all right?
• 31:27
  Speaker 3: Just a few parting words, Lara, who I've given no
• 31:31
  Speaker 3: notice and not give five seconds?
• 31:34
  Speaker 5: What are the five best things? Five reasons people should
• 31:37
  Speaker 5: come to writer.
• 31:38
  Speaker 6: Con Just five?
• 31:41
  Speaker 4: Oh my gosh, here we go. Okay, Family, you're gonna
• 31:45
  Speaker 4: you're gonna meet a wonderful network of people are going
• 31:50
  Speaker 4: to be there for you and and be lifelong friends.
• 31:53
  Speaker 4: Two you are going to learn more in three days
• 31:59
  Speaker 4: than you would believe is even possible. You'll need those
• 32:03
  Speaker 4: recordings that Jesse will be making for us so that
• 32:06
  Speaker 4: you can go away and take a few weeks to
• 32:08
  Speaker 4: kind of unpack and absorb everything. Three you will have
• 32:15
  Speaker 4: the opportunity to meet with agents and pitch if you're ready.
• 32:20
  Speaker 4: You will have the opportunity to meet one on one
• 32:24
  Speaker 4: in sessions with people who can guide you to be ready.
• 32:27
  Speaker 4: If you're not ready, and I'm one of them, ready,
• 32:30
  Speaker 4: but that's true.
• 32:32
  Speaker 3: If you're not ready, a better choice might be lunch
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: with the agents, and then you can just react anyway,
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: keep going you're lying?
• 32:39
  Speaker 6: Yep.
• 32:39
  Speaker 4: The four did I mention that I'm going to be
• 32:44
  Speaker 4: meeting with people one on one?
• 32:46
  Speaker 5: That was sure? Four.
• 32:49
  Speaker 4: Four You'll just have an opportunity to sing karaoke with us.
• 32:57
  Speaker 4: We have fun. Focus so much on how much you
• 33:02
  Speaker 4: now you're going to meet we did. That was super fun.
• 33:04
  Speaker 4: But we also have fun. It's not all just going
• 33:08
  Speaker 4: one one after one after one. You'd be welcomed with
• 33:11
  Speaker 4: open arms. We'll have so much fun. And five, I'm
• 33:15
  Speaker 4: going to be there, and surely you want to come
• 33:16
  Speaker 4: meet me?
• 33:17
  Speaker 6: Right?
• 33:18
  Speaker 4: You're right, you can meet with me. I promise you.
• 33:23
  Speaker 4: This isn't like other conferences where you show up and
• 33:25
  Speaker 4: you feel lost and you don't know where to go
• 33:27
  Speaker 4: and do. Everybody at this conference is going to welcome
• 33:30
  Speaker 4: you in and no one's going to let you feel
• 33:34
  Speaker 4: like an outsider like you you shouldn't be there. We
• 33:36
  Speaker 4: we we are very inclusive and we love all of
• 33:41
  Speaker 4: our We love all of our writers.
• 33:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, very well done. From now on, you do all
• 33:47
  Speaker 3: the pitches for writer Con fantastic. I hope we see
• 33:53
  Speaker 3: a lot of you there. Writer con dot com is
• 33:57
  Speaker 3: where you register.
• 33:58
  Speaker 5: And get lots of information.
• 33:59
  Speaker 3: About it all right until next time, keep writing and
• 34:04
  Speaker 3: remember you cannot fail.
• 34:05
  Speaker 5: If you refuse to quit. See you next time.