Latest / Partnerships Unraveled / 092 - Anurag Agrawal - How to Build an SMB Channel

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092 - Anurag Agrawal - How to Build an SMB Channel · Partnerships Unraveled

• 0:06
  Speaker 1: Welcome back to Partnerships Unraveled, the podcast where we unravel the mysteries about channel and partnerships on a weekly basis.
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: My name is Efe and I'm excited to announce our special guest, anurag Anurag.
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: How are you doing?
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: I'm doing great.
• 0:21
  Speaker 2: Efe, Thank you for having me on your podcast.
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: We're looking forward to the talk.
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: It's a pleasure to have you here, because we talk a lot about the SMB segment and the SMB channel and you're kind of one of the most knowledgeable people out there in the SMB channel.
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: So it would be great if you could give us an introduction, tell our audience who are you and what you do.
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: Sure, I'll be happy to.
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: So.
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: I'm the founder and chief global analyst at TechAisle, which is a global analyst firm that is really focused on three most complex segments of the market the SMBs, the mid-market and the channel partner ecosystem and we derive our intelligence from the ground up, essentially, which means that we conduct very large-scale studies with those three segments.
• 1:13
  Speaker 2: At the same time, we have a tremendous number of formal and informal dialogues to really understand their technology adoption, their business challenges.
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: Perfect.
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: So what we love to talk about on the podcast is that there's a shift that we are seeing in the market.
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: There's a trend that's happening.
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: So we see the biggest tech vendors out there, such as Cisco, microsoft.
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: They are really heading down market and targeting those mid-market and SMB customers.
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: Could you share your views on how this trend is happening in the market right now and the size of the opportunity the SMB segment provides to the tech vendors?
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: Sure.
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: So SMB segment has been there within the radar of most of the IT vendors for a long period of time, but it has always been a very challenging market to navigate Because, if you look at the total number of SMBs globally, it's about 250 million SMBs, but the real addressable market is about 75 million SMBs.
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: But not all SMBs are the same.
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: Some behave like consumers, some behave like an enterprise customer.
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: So it has been extremely challenging.
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: But now we are seeing that, you know, smbs are the ones that are bouncing back for the so-called economic downturns or the fears of inflation and all that.
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: So there is a renewed energy and vigor within the IT vendors to really address this particular market.
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: So, as per our own research, it is anticipated that by the end of 2024, smbs and the mid-tier firms, the mid-market firms, will spend about $1.4 trillion in IT.
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: This is excluding communication services.
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: So $1.4 trillion in IT and half of it is going to come from IT services alone.
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: And why is that?
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: Because, geared towards the expansion and new tech solutions, this SMB sector is actually on the cusp of a multi-year growth period.
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: Right, because you know these SMB segment.
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: The way you kind of think about is that they have got vast ambitions but limited means, and it has become a very cloud-proficient market unlike the enterprise customers, and they are very enthusiastic about AI, specifically Gen AI, which is poised for growth within the SMB segment in 2024.
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: So the adoption of strategic applications, many infused with AI, is also a key concern.
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: Right is also a key concern, right, and therefore these IT vendors are thinking about many different areas about AI, about security, about next gen of cloud adoption, about customer experience solutions, what employee experience solutions, and all sorts of other areas that these SMBs really want to adopt.
• 4:27
  Speaker 2: So that's the reason why we are thinking, seeing that IT vendors are starting to focus their attention on this growth segment.
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it definitely is a growth segment and traditionally a lot of the tech vendors that we've been talking about, they really focused on the enterprise segment and they were working with those big GSIs.
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: But now, as they head down market, they need to really rely on the channel, on those smaller partners, the VARs, msps, solution providers and working with those kind of partners.
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: It's a whole different game from working with the big GSIs, but therefore you actually need a completely different approach.
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: You mentioned that it's a really complex area.
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: So what are some of the complexities and challenges of activating those smaller long-tail partners for vendors?
• 5:20
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: So I think that's the number one inquiry we get at TechIsle as to how should we really activate that long tail partners?
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: You know also.
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: You know you talked about GSIs.
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: I'll come to your question in a minute, but we talked about the GSIs.
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: I mean, in this new world of Gen AI and looking at cloud adoption as well, the GSIs are building their own bench.
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: They want to keep their brand front and center, right.
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: So there is very little leeway for an IT vendor to really project themselves within the GSI community themselves.
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: Within the GSI community, specifically when the GSIs are focused on deploying best of breed of multi-vendor solutions within the end customer base, the smaller partners behave differently, right?
• 6:16
  Speaker 2: So what happens is the fact that the end customer or the vendor itself has to really understand that the channel's business priorities have changed.
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: The revenue sources and the deal structure have changed, the business growth strategies have changed, the channel sales positioning has changed and the channel sales compensation model is changing, right.
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: So it has become extremely complex for the IT vendors themselves, right?
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: And these channel partners, the smaller channel partners who serve the needs of the SMB community, are actually loyal to the end customer.
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: They are not loyal to the vendor, right.
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: So how do you drive that loyalty?
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: So one of the most important things that the IT vendor should think about is look at the partner's customers and work backwards from there.
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: That means they should look at it from a customer in perspective rather than product out perspective.
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: So nine out of 10 IT vendors really focus on the fact that, hey, I have got some widgets to sell, I have got some services to sell, and why doesn't the channel partner go and sell it for them?
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: But the channel is thinking about the customer itself, right, and that's where they have kind of think about that.
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: So what what the IT vendor needs to do is to really needs to identify the best paths, forward, ways of building preference and successful engagement that create a win, win, win.
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: Those three wins is for the customer, the vendor and the partners right, because the strong customer relationships start with understanding what target customers need and work backwards to identify the capabilities that the vendor should look for in the partner relationship.
• 8:20
  Speaker 2: I think that's where the IT vendors create some challenge for themselves.
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: Does it make sense?
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: Yes, that makes absolute sense.
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: So I think what you're saying is that, instead of saying, hey, I have a product and I need to sell this product and here's my product, partners go and sell it.
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: It should be focused on the customer and then work backwards from that point.
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: Am I correct?
• 8:49
  Speaker 2: Yes, you're right, because you see the fact that each partner has 4.6 meaningful vendor partnerships, that means they work very closely with 4.6 different vendors, right.
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: And when you have this kind of relationship where the average number of employee size within this smaller partner, these MSPs is about 50 or 60, right there, right, you do not have the capacity or the skill sets to really broaden your pace.
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: Go to a larger number of partners, because each partner has got its own sales playbook.
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: Each partner has got its own training mechanism, each partner has got its own incentives and things like that, right?
• 9:39
  Speaker 2: So these vendors are skating on very, very thin ice.
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: So what these vendors have to really focus on their attention is, okay, which is the partner that can work with them, that this partner is ready to drive their own products and services, their vendors' products and services within the customer base, right?
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: I mean, we have heard about stories where vendors work with partners and they say you know what it's an 80-20 rule?
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: 80% of the business comes from only 20% of the partners, right.
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: And then they have many different partners within their ecosystem that are very transactional.
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: They come in and they leave, right?
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: That's not a very good place to be in, right.
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: So what I'm saying is that the vendor should concentrate on three key enablers of business for these channel partners.
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: Whether you look at MSPs or resellers, or the RSIs, the regional SIs, those three business velocity enablers are sales, profitability and simplicity, and really, instead of merely providing tools for enablement, which many focus on, they should focus on genuine empowerment, right, that means.
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: What does that empowerment mean?
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: That these channel partners should become the sales advocates of the IT vendors instead of being the sales agent, right?
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: And this change necessitates a new approach to management and sales strategies and compensation and marketing essential technical management and sales strategies and compensation and marketing essential technical skills, and so on and so forth.
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: I think I said a lot more than you wanted there, but yeah.
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: That was an amazing answer.
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: Thank you for the in-depth answer.
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: That's absolutely the type of answer that I was looking for.
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: Now I want to get your opinion on something, Anurag, because you mentioned that you're the founder of TechAisle and you basically advise vendors, and you mentioned that a lot of the inquiries you get is about how can I activate my long-tail partners.
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: Now, what are the common mistakes that you see vendors make when building a program, an SME partner program, for their long tail or?
• 12:02
  Speaker 1: The question is really you know, what must vendors do to build a first class partner program to serve the SMB segment?
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: So I think you know I will repeat myself Most of the vendors they kind of focus on the enablement piece of it, right?
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: Hey, I need to have a good portal, I need to have a good incentive structure and so on and so forth right.
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: But they also need to create a pull in the marketplace.
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: Then they need to be able to drive some sense of belonging in the market in terms of both the vendor and the end customer.
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: You know we are in an era where the partner is looking for assistance and you need to become the advocate for that particular partner, right?
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: And the complexity also arises from the fact that you have a set of channel chiefs who rotate from one end customer, from one IT vendor to another IT vendor, not really thinking about new ways of engaging with the end and with the partner.
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: I think that's where it starts to become really, really challenging.
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: So you have to think about again.
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: Going back to the point about what am I doing to drive the business velocity of the end customer right?
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: What am I doing to make the business velocity of the partner?
• 13:37
  Speaker 2: What am I doing to drive the profitability of the partner?
• 13:41
  Speaker 2: How am I trying to make it as simple as possible for the partner to work with us.
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: If you start to work within those three areas, then you will start to become successful, because IT vendors need to realize that there is a shift in the core customers right From technologies to an organization-wide mix of personas.
• 14:06
  Speaker 2: There is a shift in the buying and selling models from fee for product service to approaches that involve outcome-based evaluation of the partner.
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: A shift in solution composition from monolithic systems to modular stacks right that address the target functionality by APIs right.
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: So you have to think about all those areas At the same time.
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: You have to say how do I engage with that partner, right?
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: I think that engagement piece of it is where a lot of vendors start to falter as well.
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: And you mentioned three points, and the first one was business velocity.
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: I think.
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: So, how do we help the sales process of the partner?
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: Now I want to ask a question where do you see marketing fit into that?
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: What's the role of marketing when it comes to engaging those partners or helping those partners increase their business velocity?
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: oh, it is an extremely important area, right, because the vendors should be focused on not only marketing to the partners but marketing through the partners to the partners and customer.
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: So both are absolutely essential and most of the vendors focus on either one of them.
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: They will either market to the partner not realizing what the partner is trying to communicate to the end customer, or they will market directly to the end customer without realizing that the marketing that they're doing to the partner is different from what they are telling the end customer.
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: So I think that's an important area from what they are telling the end customer.
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: So I think that's an important area.
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: But the marketing has many different components, right.
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: It's about digital assets, it's about use cases, it's about website content, it's about co-branded collateral.
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: So many of those areas you have to think about.
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: But then also depends upon what type of IT vendor I am, right, I am a hyperscaler, or I am a product person, or I am a security, which is both services and all that.
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: I think all of those elements we have to be taking into account, because marketing is kind of key today to raise the awareness, both the end customer and the partners.
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: And one more important point, if I may sorry to interrupt, is one of the changes that these IT vendors should really focus on is that they should look at competencies and specializations more than they look at certifications, because the end customer has also changed right what the end customer has also changed right, what the end customer is saying.
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: You know what I am qualifying a partner that works with me as a continuum.
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: They start with competencies hey, is the partner competent enough?
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: That means, does the partner have broad knowledge about the product or the solution that they're going to deploy?
• 17:41
  Speaker 2: Then the next level is specialization.
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: Now, if the partner has done some projects or they've got some deep knowledge in that particular area whether it's a cybersecurity area, whether it's networking or it's compliance or governance or whatever right.
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: The third is they look at track record.
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: Have the partner deployed similar projects in the past or not?
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: Then the fourth comes, the certification, and the fifth is partner tier.
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: Now, if you think about those areas, right, certification is number fourth on the list.
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: I understand why the IT vendors start to focus on certifications more, but, as one partner told me about four weeks ago, saying that you know what?
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: I don't want any more certification, I don't want another plaque on the wall because I cannot absorb it.
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: Plus, also, I cannot have my entire organization be certified on the same product, right.
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: So I think that's what the vendor should also start to focus attention on.
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's an amazing insight, Anurag, and I want to touch upon a point which we discussed in our previous chat, which was about incentives.
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: So when talking about marketing channel marketing MDF is the first thing that comes to mind, right, but you mentioned that you don't understand the obsession that vendors have about MDF.
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: You mentioned that it is a dying incentive.
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: I think like, especially within that SMB channel partner community, most partners don't even have the time or resources and knowledge to use MDF, and you mentioned that.
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: I think, if I'm not mistaken, that among the incentives that partners look for, mdf was placed 11th, which is very low.
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: So my question is what are the most important incentives SMB partners look for in a partner program?
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: Yes, you're absolutely right.
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: So you know we have been seeing this trend over the last five years, that the MDF has been losing its importance among the channel partner community, right.
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: So, yes, you are right that MDF currently ranks number 11th among a list of 15 top incentives that the partners really want from their vendors.
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: Right, it's not to say that it is absolutely gone away because, you know, 26% of the partners still prefer MDF, but it's not their top choice, right, the preference has shifted to SDF.
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: What is SDF?
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: It's a solution development fund.
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: Right, because what is it happening within the partner base is because of the fact, hey, I need to develop solutions on your platform.
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: Right, and because I need to create my own IP as well.
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: Right, and that's where the Solution Development Fund comes into the picture, and we have seen that it has been the top incentive requirement from the partners over the last three years or so.
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: The next that we see this year is outcome-based financing.
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: What is outcome-based financing?
• 21:05
  Speaker 2: Because the end customer remember, it's the end customer that is important.
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: End customer is looking at partners to deliver business outcomes.
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: Right, because in the past, a channel partner used to deploy a solution and they transferred the responsibility to the end customer to realize value from it.
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: The customer is saying no, no, no wait, I need you to be vested in my success.
• 21:32
  Speaker 2: So that's what the partner is saying to the IT vendor Some or the other, you need to be able to finance that outcome-based funding.
• 21:41
  Speaker 2: That means you know, I need to be able to recoup the investment till the time the business outcome is delivered to the end customer.
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: The third is the workshop slash, poc support right, which many of the IT vendors have started to focus their attention on the workshop, because workshop is a clear way of getting the leads right and showcasing the product and solution that the partner is offering to the end customer.
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: And POC, because workshops lead to POCscs and then pocs can lead to full projects, right.
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: So that's where a workshop and poc is the number three.
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: The number fourth are the the front end discounts right.
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: So.
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: So there is a shift in what the partners are asking for in terms of incentives from their IT suppliers.
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: Amazing insights, anurag, once again, you know these are.
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: We talk about MDF a lot and when you talked about incentives, you know that comes to mind.
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: That's one of the first things that's come to mind.
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: But you know the things that you mentioned.
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: I feel like there's not a lot of conversation, not a lot of people are talking about these incentives.
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: I think we should increase the awareness on these.
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: Absolutely true.
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: Absolutely true Because of the fact that they have not seen anything different, right?
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: Then I say you know what?
• 23:08
  Speaker 2: Mdf is easy, let us deploy it.
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: But it is tracking the ROI for MDF poses a challenge.
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: You know how do you measure compliance and so on.
• 23:17
  Speaker 2: So what the IT vendors are doing, becoming very creative.
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: They said okay, you know what, I am going to give you an MDF.
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: Or actually, I'm not going to give you an MDF, I am going to give you.
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: I'm going to say give you 50 leads, right, and I will consider that as mdf, right.
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: So they are.
• 23:43
  Speaker 2: They're playing around with this word mdf, right?
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: So, yeah, so so I think things, things are changing yeah, perfect.
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: Well, on the road today on linkedin I saw that, uh, you got your hands on the new co-pilot AI PCs, which is also a really hot topic in the SMB and mid-market segment.
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think 32% of SMBs and 64% of mid-market firms are now actively planning to purchase AI PCs.
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: It's definitely an interesting topic, you know.
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: We're looking forward to see how these products are going to evolve, but I would love to hear your thoughts on.
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: You know the trends that you're seeing in the AI PC market and, like what would be your recommendations be for the vendors who are competing for market share, especially within this segment?
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: That's a great question.
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: Yes, so AI-powered PCs or AI PCs, are exciting possibilities for streamlining the workflows and boosting productivities, right, and SMBs are kind of excited about that as well, because, you know, smbs are always at the cutting edge of technology adoption.
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: I mean, they get a pretty bad rap, but you know what.
• 24:56
  Speaker 2: They know how to adopt technology faster.
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: You know, to give you an example, when big data came out, you know, hey, enterprises were slow, but the SMBs wanted to move very fast, right.
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: So my advice would be to the PCOEMs to look at four different areas, right, one is to educate the market.
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: Right, there's a tremendous amount of education that is required.
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: For example, hp is doing something good.
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: They're calling it the AI university, right?
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: I mean, kobe Elbaz, the channel chief, launched it at HP Amplify earlier this year, which means that, hey, they kind of go and train the partners, then the partners can go and train the end customers as well.
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: But then this goes beyond that.
• 25:45
  Speaker 2: This talks about educating the market.
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: So develop the resources explaining how AI PCs or, for that matter, microsoft terminology, co-pilot plus PCs can transform business processes for vertical, specifically professional services or healthcare, or finance and manufacturing, right, how it can really enhance the decision-making and improve efficiency and productivity.
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: Why the decision-making?
• 26:14
  Speaker 2: Because then you will know, there is much better collaboration, and you know so, on and so forth.
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: Then the number two is they should focus on compatibility.
• 26:25
  Speaker 2: They should really prioritize this conversation around compatibility when it comes to the snapdragon pcs, which are these co-pilot plus pc which I got my hands on yesterday.
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: It is the new beautiful lenovo yoga slim 7x.
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: Right, absolutely fantastic.
• 26:44
  Speaker 2: I've been using it, um, all night long, to be honest with you, right.
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: So so what does compatibility mean?
• 26:50
  Speaker 2: You know, collaborate with the software developers, the isvs, to ensure that all critical business applications run smoothly on these new Snapdragon CoPilot Plus PCs.
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: Right, and offer compatibility checkers to help businesses assess their existing software before upgrading.
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: And then talk about this long battery life.
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: Right, this extended battery life for co-pilot plus PCs.
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: Right, I mean, apple's MacBook Air is legendary.
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: Right, for the long battery life, but then this comes extremely close, or even exceeds in some cases.
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: Right, it's a game changer for mobile professionals.
• 27:33
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: You know, emphasize the disadvantage in the marketing materials, addressing a major pain point for many laptop users.
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: You know you can get anywhere, depending upon the brand or the product.
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: It can be anywhere from 17 hours to 27 hours of battery life on a Snapdragon PC.
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: That is very good.
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: The fourth area could be very interesting.
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: That is very good.
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: The fourth area could be very interesting.
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: This PC as a service or device as a service has long been sought to be one of the panacea for the SMB customer, but never really took off right.
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: But here is an opportunity for the PC OEMs to look at it from a PC as a service or slash AI as a service, where they can bundle in these PCs with some AI consulting frameworks right, which will help, because our research is showing that today one third of SMBs are interested in PC as a service with AI, making it a viable solution to unlock the power of AI.
• 28:33
  Speaker 2: So I think there are many different areas that you can look at.
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: Thank you once again for that amazing answer, anurag.
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: For those who are listening, I'll make sure to put Anurag's LinkedIn in the description.
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: If you want to learn more about Tech Aisle, if you want to learn about the SMB channel, I honestly look at your LinkedIn.
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: I look at also the Tech Aisle website very often to get some data, to get some insights into the market.
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: Honestly, I recommend everyone who's listening to get in touch with Andrak to learn more.
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: Now, andrak, before I let you go, there's a question we like to ask to every single one of our guests, and that is you know we are a channel podcast and we always end with a referral.
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: So you know we are a channel podcast and we always end with a referral.
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: So who do you think that we should have next on the podcast?
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: Do you have a potential guest that you have in your mind, so I cannot recommend one.
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: I have to recommend two and specifically I will recommend two executives from Cisco.
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: They have worked tirelessly for the last year and a half to build an amazing SMB program for the Cisco customers and for the partners that are addressing the needs of the SMB customers Andrew Sage, and the other one is Luxie Torasingham.
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: Andrew Sage is in charge of the SMB program within Cisco and Luxie is in charge of partner marketing specifically on the SMBs.
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: Perfect.
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: Those are amazing recommendations.
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: On Ruck, Andrew and Luxie.
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: I've been following them.
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: I never had the chance to talk with them, but if been following them.
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: I never had the chance to talk with them, but if you're listening, I'll be reaching out to you.
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much for listening and see you in the next episode.