Latest / Beyond Labels Premium / Episode #82: "Made in USA" Food Label Gets a Makeover: Public Comments Requests

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Episode #82: "Made in USA" Food Label Gets a Makeover: Public Comments Requests · Beyond Labels Premium

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: We have Hot Off the Press's update on the made in USA and the product of USA label for meat, poultry, and eggs.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_00: Joel and I did a podcast on this previously where Joel broke the bad news to everybody that if, like, say, for instance, chicken or beef was actually born, raised, and slaughtered in another country, and then it was transported to the US and quote, minimally processed, which could include just repackaging, the label could actually say product of USA on it.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_00: So that was a previous podcast.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_00: We gave the history on that.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_00: Update on this.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_00: Hello, welcome to another episode of Beyond Labels.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Dr.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_00: Cena McKella.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_00: I'm here with my amazing co-host, everyone's favorite farmer, Joel Salatin.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: So, Joel, we have an action-packed show today.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_00: And I want to start off by announcing that you and I have earned another badge of honor because we were censored again by YouTube.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_00: This time it was my fault.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_00: I spoke the truth about how modern medicine was born and how it was born out of lies and fear, and how that is still affecting us today.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_00: YouTube said that it was um it violated their medical misinformation policy because it contradicts local health authorities or the World Health Organization.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_00: So we got a strike, and so you might notice our listeners, nothing was uploaded to YouTube this week because we were not allowed to access our channel.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: And they also said that because one of my thoughts was okay, well, if we get banned from YouTube, we'll just create another channel, right?
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_00: And just start over again.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_00: But they say down here in the email they sent me that if your channel gets restricted or banned, you can't circumvent by creating another channel.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_00: They'll just terminate all your accounts.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_00: So we see the writing on the wall.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you know, you know, that this this whole this whole censorship thing is um, I mean, uh, I I think everybody who's gone through it just shakes their head at at our uh you know at our intoler at our intolerance in our culture today to uh to do anything.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_02: And and the and the problem is these private companies, YouTube and such, um, you know, they're not actually private companies, they're utilities.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_02: And I mean that that's what Congress uh uh when they when they gave them the concession uh about liability, in other words, you're not responsible for your content, that they carved out this special concession to them because Congress said, you know, you're not we'll we'll grant you uh non-libility and and agree that you're not you're not publishing content, so you're you're not you know you're not responsible for anything that's on it.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_02: And so uh so with that concession they got a special dispensation to kind of put them in the category of a utility.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_02: And um, I haven't heard of any utilities canceling your electricity because you didn't think right or speak right or say right.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_02: Um and and uh you know you can you you can use electricity for uh for pornography to build a bomb to do all sorts of things, uh, and you don't get your electricity banned.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_02: And so I mean I mean I'm I'm being pretty uh aggressive here at this thing, but uh when you think about a utility that these these have actually they they sought the protection of a utility, Congress granted them protection of a utility, and now they're acting like you know like a like a um a totally private uh you know private entity.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_02: And and uh you you can't you can't have it both ways.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_02: And so you you know you and I are both extremely uh you know private property and and you should be able to do what you want with what you have.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_02: Um I mean as long as it doesn't hit somebody else's nose or or whatever.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_02: Uh but but um but when you when you voluntarily come outside that private uh that private uh um that that private uh mystique uh then you forfeit you forfeit your ability to um uh you know to monitor and censor what comes in.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_02: It's like it's like you know, as soon as soon as you say we're open to the public.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, we deal with this on our farm.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_02: Um you know, we have we have a store here.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_02: And and uh because we have a farm store and don't uh and it's not a private club, we have to be uh disabilities compliant.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_02: We we can't we can't ban anybody from coming into our farm store uh even though it's right here next to the house because we are public.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_02: And and and so so that that that public access um does change the kinds of you know, the kinds of uh things that you're able the kind of exclusionary things that you're able to do, both philosophically and legally.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_02: And it's amazing that these companies who have forfeited their privacy and gone the public route and even gone to the utility route are able to exert this kind of influence on the public conversation.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_02: It's it it it it's it's like excluding somebody with a wheelchair, it's like excluding excluding uh uh you know somebody from your you know from your space.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_02: Anyway, enough of that.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, but yes, we did so that that's like a second strike, and I think Cena, if we get one more strike, we're banned forever, uh, or something like that.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_02: So three strikes.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: So if we get so first we got a warning, now we have a strike, the second strike we can't publish for two weeks, the third strike, um, it's removed permanently, but they also did make it um did make sure that I had to like agree to these terms when I got back into the account that um they could for any reason, if they thought that our whatever statement we made on YouTube was egregious enough, they could just immediately delete the account.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_00: So it could be tomorrow, we're now off the whole platform.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: And uh let me just piggyback on what you're saying, then we'll jump to our next topic.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_00: So we got another hot topic off the press.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I completely agree with you.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_00: If if YouTube and these social media platforms did not receive a carve out, a special carve out from Congress, I would be completely okay with them censoring us, right?
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: Completely okay with it.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_00: But because they got that carve out, I'm not okay with it.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_00: And nothing's gonna be done about it because they are in bed with the government, the CDC, the FDA.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: And hence why they censored us, because we told the truth, the true history of medicine, the true history of FDA.
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_00: And that's the really um alarming part to me is that just like they've done in the actual history books in the schools, they're they're trying to erase and change the history here of our food and medical system.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_00: And we just can't let that happen, right, Joel?
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, exactly.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_02: So, so what we are what we are realizing is that these broad public forums are not where are not where tomorrow's truth is going to happen.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_02: They're just not.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_02: And so we're we're struck with uh with well what do we do going forward?
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_02: You know, we you and I and uh and and Nolan behind the scenes, we can't just continue to give uh give time and effort to to this uh uh you know forever.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_02: Somewhere along the line, our our time and effort needs to be compensated a little bit.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, I can go out and raise some more chickens if I want to.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_02: Um so so you know what do we do?
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_02: So um at the top of this one, we just want to um encourage uh uh our listeners that this is gonna have to go by word of mouth.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_02: If you think this content is valuable, share it with somebody.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_02: Pick pick one, two, three, four, five friends, somebody that you think needs to hear this, and we're just we're just going to commit ourselves uh afresh to uh to word of mouth, to the power of the content moving it forward.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_02: Um and and we're gonna rest and trust in you, our listeners, our faithful listeners, to move it forward.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_02: And we're gonna be very content in however that moves.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_02: That's uh that that that's the strong point.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_02: But what we what what what I know from doing uh marketing courses and things is that uh most of us, you know, we're in our routine and we don't want to bother anybody.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_02: And the fact is uh that we don't uh we we we often don't share things because nobody asked us to.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_02: And so Cena and I are asking you to, and and we're gonna we're gonna be um you know uh uh reminding you to pick a friend, send this to them, and let's let's see if we can uh move our tribe forward without the um without the broad public you know uh forms without without going through the angst and the uh you know it's a it's a it's a bummer, you know, when you get censored in the public square uh and accused of of of miss of lying.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_02: I mean that that's that's um you know even though we know it's not it still doesn't do a lot for your psyche.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_02: No, it's no fun.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't, especially as a researcher, right?
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_00: This is my thing.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_00: This is I'm known for original source references, double, triple source, and now they're saying I'm lying, which you know I know that they're lying, but it's still like you said, it's still it's still hurtful.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: So we want to just get off the platform, like we we want to just take our tribe in a whole different direction of truth and light, and we need help to be able to do that.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_01: That's right.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, well, yay! All right, so you know, okay, off with the show.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_00: So we have hot off the press's update on the made in USA and the product of USA label for meat, poultry, and eggs.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_00: Joel and I did a podcast on this previously, where um Joel broke the bad news to everybody that if, like, say, for instance, chicken or beef was actually born, raised, and slaughtered in another country, and then it was transported to the US and quote, minimally processed, which could include just repackaging, the label could actually say product of USA on it.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_00: So that was a previous podcast.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_00: We gave the history on that.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_00: Update on this.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_00: On March 13th, there was a proposed rule submitted to the um filed in the Federal Register.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_00: It was um filed by the Food Safety and Inspection Services, which is actually part of the USDA.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_00: They're proposing to change the regulation that defines what it actually means to be made in the USA or to be a product of the USA.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_00: So they said they're doing this because there's quote, consumer confusion.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_00: So they need to better align the label claim so that consumers actually know what the claim means.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_02: I wonder, you know, Tina, I wonder who confused the consumer originally.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_00: Well, that was us, Joel, with our misinformation spreading, right?
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_00: So this is what the what they are proposing.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_00: This is what the food safety inspection services is proposing.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_00: That um that basically the you can only use the product product of USA or made in the USA label claim on meat, poultry, and egg products when they are derived from animals born, raised, slaughtered, and processed in the United States.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_00: I have to laugh because that should have been the original definition.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_02: Like yeah.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean, back back when back when this was done years ago, that was that was the uh that was the plea.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_02: That was the plea of the folks who wanted the country of origin labeling, uh, known as cool, C-O-O-L, cool country of origin labeling.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_02: And uh that was the plea of country of origin labeling, but of course the um you know the powers that be uh you know did not adhere to that.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_02: And so uh and so they're now going to uh you know I wonder I wonder how much it cost them, how much, how many people worked on this, how many papers got shuffled um to to deconfuse the customer, the the consumer.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_02: Um you know, think of the mounds of paper, the emails, and the sheer um, you know, the sheer effort that went into deconfusing the consumer.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, I'll tell you a little bit of the effort.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so this was inspired by an executive order, right?
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_00: So it started with the president um writing an executive order for the confusion to be, you know, remediated.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_00: And then that went to um so the the FSIS.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_00: And then they had to be like, yes, we're we have the regulatory authority.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_00: So so this is what they write.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_00: I I read the entire document in the Federal Register, and I tell you, Joel, if you're having problems sleeping, you should read these government documents.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_00: So this one, they're saying that um, so the agency has authority, like they have to claim this, right?
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: So, like just the time spent in writing this paper.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_00: So the time the president did, and you know, or you know, his minions to write this executive order to command them to do this.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_00: Then they wrote this document after they did like um, you know, inquiries into different organizations to get their feedback and in inquiries to the public.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, all the time and effort that took and the tax dollars.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and so what they're saying in here is that okay, we're declaring we have the power to do this because um under the Federal Meat and Inspection Act, we have power for poultry product labeling, uh, or you know, for beef.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_00: And then there's Poultry Products Inspection Act, which gives us the power to label under poultry.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: Then there's an Eggs product inspection act that gives us the power to label the eggs.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_00: So, like all of this, it's just so much, so much bureaucracy wrapped in more bureaucracy, right?
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um, even just the man hours to to document this.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_00: And then there's the cost that's gonna trickle down to the consumer.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_00: So they have proposed costs in here.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: That's if this passes, right?
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_00: This is a proposed rule that was submitted to the Federal Register.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: They are asking for comments.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_00: So if you want to comment on this, you have to do that before May 12th of this year.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then they will decide if it's gonna be the final ruling.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then that will be published as well.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_00: But comment period is by May 12th.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_00: Here's the cost factor that they're estimating.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_00: It says if finalized, the requirements in the proposed rule are estimated to result in a one-time relabeling cost for industry, annual record keeping costs, and a one-time market testing cost.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_00: They're assuming that it's gonna be$3 million.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_00: And what they're saying is the average, they think it's gonna affect$1,000 to 3,000 labels for small businesses that might have to change.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_00: And the average one-time cost to change the label is gonna be between$848 and$4,829 per label.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_00: So that's on the small businesses, and you know where that's gonna go, right?
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's gonna pass down to the to the consumer.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_00: So government created this problem, and now there's a loophole in it, right?
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_00: And now they're trying to fix the problem.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_00: Do we think there's gonna be another loophole?
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_02: Well, the the other the other issue, Cena, and I think this is really, really critical.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_02: People don't think about this.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_02: Whenever you have a new rule like this, you have an enforcement, you have an enforcement branch.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_02: So there's somebody, there's somebody running out, running around checking up.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_02: So if you um for for example, here at our farm, Sina, you'll notice our label does not say product of USA.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_02: Why?
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_02: The reason we don't have that on there is because any bureaucrat could come in here, I mean, uh not any bureaucrat, but uh, but you know, a an enforcement, an enforcement agent of the US duh could walk in here without a warrant, just anytime they want to, and demand documentation that the uh the meat, poultry, and eggs that that we were selling under that label were uh grown in the USA.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_02: Now that that sounds well, it we there they are.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_02: They're out there in the field.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, but I want to see what about this chicken?
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_02: What about this chicken?
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_02: What about this dozen eggs?
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_02: How do I know that what you've got out in the field is not just a front and you're actually buying a bunch of stuff from Mexico and and redoing it?
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_02: So now suddenly we're into this this massive uh um you know i i it it's it's a proving enforcement deal.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_02: And and so and so the big cost in this is the is is proving the validity.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_02: It's for the business to prove the validity of what it affixes the label to, which moves you into tracking.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_02: So you've got a you ideally you have to microchip your animals, microchip everything.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_02: So you've got a a uh a code, you know, imagine uh you know, a skew code, a skew code on every single animal walking around that then tracks uh uh uh uh it it's it's it's um so uh in in my in my view to to cut to the chase here, Cena, in my view, anyone who now affixes product of the USA on their label is probably overcharging you for product due to the compliance paperwork on the back end to protect themselves from an enforcement from an enforcement uh arm of the USD of the US duh.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_00: And what's alarming about that too, even beyond that, is like I said, I read the whole document, and they are not telling you what the compliance would look like.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_00: They're not telling you what is required in order for you to be in compliance.
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_00: So this is what it says in the document.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_00: Should the rule become final, FSIS would issue guidance as needed on recommended documentation to maintain compliance with U.S.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_00: origin labeling requirements.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_00: So they're waiting for the ruling to become final, and then they're gonna tell you how to become compliant with it.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_02: That's kind of like uh let's pass it and then we'll read it.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_00: That's what I was thinking.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_00: No, no, it was Pelosi saying, let's we gotta pass it to find out what's in it.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_02: Like yeah, yeah.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_02: But this the the this this documentation thing, uh to to prove it, I mean, uh I think I think most people have no clue of the the monitoring, the paperwork, the documentation, the boxes to check uh that you have to do for any of these, even private certifications like you know, animal welfare, stuff that's not government certification, um uh compliance, has has the amount of time, days, literally days, to uh to pass the compliance, which is one reason why you know our farm doesn't participate in any third-party uh certifications.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_02: Because frankly, I want to grow cows and chickens.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_02: I don't want to sit here at the desk and talk to uh talk to pe you know, talk to bureaucrats and fill out paperwork.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_02: Um and so so uh for for me a real easy thing to tell somebody if they want to know, you know, what where to buy something, uh I say I always said, you know, if they're advertising, if they're advertising.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_02: On television, they're probably, you know, bigger than you want to uh bigger than you want to uh patronize.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_02: Now, if they if they use these uh certification and especially government certification labels, they're probably more interested in paperwork than they are in actually producing something.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: Mike, you know, I was thinking about this over the weekend, and my question for you is what about when people go into the grocery store, right?
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_00: So those of us who have farmers around us, we can drive there, we can inspect the farm, right?
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_00: The full transparency, we know where that meat is coming from, uh, you know, for the most part.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you can also now order meat online so people can order from like Polyface and have it delivered, right?
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_00: But let's say somebody wants to just go into the grocery store and get and pick up their meat.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_00: And they do want to make sure that their meat was grown, uh, you know, raised, slaughtered, whatnot in America.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_00: So for them, wouldn't this label be a benefit?
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_00: Like, don't you what wouldn't, if they if that was a priority for them, that the meat had to be raised in America, wouldn't they be willing to pay a little more, you know, to make sure that it actually was in America?
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_00: So it's not that I'm in favor of government regulations, but I'm just saying plain devil's advocate here.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, no, no, I I I I get it.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_02: And um, and I I think I think that this would carry the same, uh, you know, if you're gonna buy at a supermarket, this would carry the same clout as an organic certification label, for example.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_02: Um and and so uh so if that's where you're going to go, yes, uh this is certainly a good, a good um, you know, uh we we we can say this is a positive change.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_02: Um I mean it it should have done this at the in the first place, of course, instead of uh wrangling around it for a decade.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_02: Uh but but here we are.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_02: And um and and it certainly will be less confusing.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_02: However, it certainly the the the the compliance cost is going to be much, much larger because in the old ruling, all you had to do was prove that it was repackaged in the U.S.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_02: Now it has to be you have to prove that it was born, raised, slaughtered, packaged in the U.S.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_02: So I want you to think about the train of things now that a person using this label uh has to comply with.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_02: And so my my uh my first take on it is that people will simply not use the label anymore.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_02: It'll be so onerous to prove all that tracking that that the label won't even be used.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: Well, that would be interesting if it went away.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, let's let the market speak and and let it go away.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because also let's not forget there seems to always be loopholes, you know, in carve outs when we have these government regulations, right?
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_00: And so one of the things, since it is a paper trail, I mean, we don't like to think about it because you know, we're truth seekers, but people can falsify these documents.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_00: We've seen this in the organic grain industry with falsified documents, and people have gone to jail for it.
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_00: So people do that, you know, like not people we know, but people actually do that.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_00: So there's an opportunity for the label to have a loophole.
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, go ahead.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, well, well, the the other thing is so so so imagine, okay, you're a you're a business and here come here comes the government enforcement agency.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_02: They come in, we want to see your documentation on this.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_02: And and and you suddenly realize that uh that that that you don't have something quite right.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_02: So you uh so you you you create something quickly, you know, in order to have the the paper trail correct.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_02: And it may or may not be it may or may not be correct, but but at least you've you know you've you've done something.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_02: That's right.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_02: These laws, you know, they they say that they make criminals out of us.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_02: Uh if you if you want to if you want to comply and be in the program, you fudge, you comply, you make up stuff just so when that inspector comes, that inspector will see, you know, uh um no, you know, no inconsistencies within the paper trail.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_02: That the bottom line result of this will be almost nobody will use uh a made in a USA label.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and then uh another thought I had, I want to get your take on it.
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_00: Let's say they do use the made in USA label, all right?
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_00: And then people pay attention to it, right?
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_00: Because that's a whole nother factor.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_00: How much does this really bother people, right?
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_00: Are they looking for that actually when they go into the store?
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_00: So let's say they are, and they go into the store and they're gonna grab that meat that says made in USA.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe there's us, you know, maybe there's ground beef sitting right next to it.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_00: And let's say that one was from, I don't know, New Zealand.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_00: All right, just throwing that out there.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_00: And now they've picked this made in USA meat.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_00: Isn't it possible that the USA meat was like industrial factory?
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_00: It's like not you're promoting now, supporting an industrial organization, whereas the New Zealand meat may have been a grass fed, you know, grass finish cow that now you're discarding because you're like, oh, I trust that USA label.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, isn't that maybe an unintended consequence of this?
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_02: It it certain it certainly is.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_02: Uh that's a that's an that's a perfect scenario uh for what can happen because this doesn't this doesn't uh this label doesn't speak to uh production modality uh at all.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_02: And so uh again, we come down, we come down to the point that um you know it if you're shopping at the supermarket, uh you're you're you know, you're already a little bit behind the you know, whatever, you know, but behind the the uh the knowledge base, the informed, the informed consent base, you're already behind that simply by uh purchasing there, which is why we say go beyond labels.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, and I want to get in a listener question while we have just a moment, all right?
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because this relates directly.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_00: So we have a listener, Heather.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I believe it's um is it Shukao?
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_00: Is that how we might tell?
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like that.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_01: Uh-huh.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_00: Shukao.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, she sent in an email about the episode we did on the USDA power grab regarding homeopathy.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_00: And her question is, how can the USDA, which as I understand it, is not a governing body chosen by U.S.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_00: citizens, how can they make laws?
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_00: This is in regards to the claim that natural remedies are illegal drugs not approved.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_00: Why are we entertaining this claim rather than teaching how it is illegal to make the claim?
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, well, the the answer, the the I think the real short answer to this, uh, and we are uh pushing our time here, is that the the con Congress passes what's called enabling legislation.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_02: And then they give that enabling legislation to an agency, to a government agency to implement.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_02: And so the fact is that these agencies do while they don't make the you know the initial enabling legislation, they do absolutely make the um uh what would be the right word?
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_02: I mean they make the law, they they make the actual uh uh line items uh in in the law.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_02: And so um so it the the the trick is the enabling legislation, uh and and the enabling legislation allows a whole domino effect of of agency of agency writing to happen.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_00: And so I'll add to that, um, this is why I call the bureaucracy the fourth branch of government, because that's how much power they actually have.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_00: So um FDA, because let's let's bring it around to the one that she was, the example she gave about homeopathy.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_00: So what what the FDA, what what they did was they said they didn't say flat out um homeopathic remedies are illegal.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_00: They said they were marketed illegally.
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_00: All right, that's their strategy for getting them pulled off the market, is by saying they're marketed illegally.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_00: But Congress gave FDA the authority to regulate medicines across the United States.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_00: States regulate the practitioners, right?
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_00: But the FDA, the federal agency, regulates medicines.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_00: That means the FDA can inspect manufacturers that are producing medicines.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_00: They're in charge of making sure the labeling is proper and legal, and they get to decide which medicines can and can't be sold in the United States.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_00: So they were actually granted that power, that authority.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um, one more quick example, because this is a topic that we've mentioned before, and then we'll close out.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_00: When we talked about how Congress passed the law that now genetically modified foods were gonna have to be labeled.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_00: And lots of people cheered, right?
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_00: Like, this is great.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_00: Finally, we're gonna have transparency.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_00: And we were like, okay, let's just wait for the loopholes to come out, right?
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_00: So, um, and now we already did a podcast and we showed you the loopholes.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_00: So I pulled up the document.
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_00: This was filed in the Federal Register, and I can put the link in there if you want to read it yourself.
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_00: But this is what happened.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_00: Congress passed the law, which amended the Agricultural Marketing Act of 1946.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_00: And it says the amended act, quote, directs the Secretary of Agriculture to establish the national mandatory bioengineered food disclosure standards for disclosing any food that is or may be bioengineered.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_00: It also directs the secretary to establish requirements and procedures necessary to carry out the new standard.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, then the secretary, the secretary, quote, delegated authority for establishing and administering these new rules and standards to the agricultural marketing service.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_00: You see, so Congress delegated it to the secretary.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_00: Secretary delegated it to the agricultural marketing service, and they actually wrote the meat of the law and how to enforce it.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_00: So that's why I'm saying they're like the fourth arm of the government.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_00: It's they're in essence writing the laws, and Congress is the one that's giving them that authority to do that.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_00: And the problem is because they're bureaucrats, we can't hold them accountable.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_00: And even as we see presidents have a hard time firing bureaucrats.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 33:15
  SPEAKER_02: You know, my uh one of my favorite things was when President Obama was elected, and all my liberal liberal friends were cheering and oh boy, everything's gonna be different now, different now.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_02: I had a friend say, well, except that there are 10 miles, you ready for this?
• 33:30
  SPEAKER_02: 10 miles of USDA offices that aren't gonna change.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_02: So about 10 miles of offices and and and none of those people are elected.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_02: Uh none of those people is uh, you know, is is uh uh accountable to the directly accountable to the people, and those don't change.
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_02: Doesn't matter if it's a democrat, republican, libertarian, well, maybe it would change if it was a libertarian, but but but certainly, certainly, you know, as we see these these uh uh political winds change, 10 miles of those USDA offices are career people that stay in there uh their whole career.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, that that's where we are.
• 34:16
  unknown: Oh wow.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_00: All right, thanks, Joel.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_00: So we kind of took you on a whirlwind right today, but we had a lot to update you on, and we're excited about it.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_00: And we're gonna keep you posted.
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_00: We'll let you know if the um that new proposed rule by the um by the USDA actually goes through.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um oh one quick update, then we'll we'll sign off in for the homeopathies since we brought that one up.
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um there is the Americans for homeopathy choice are actually trying to work with Congress to include to change the language, you know, that the um the regulation that the that they put forth, the USDA, sorry, the FDA put forth saying that the homeopathy was illegally marketed.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_00: They're trying to work with Congress to change the language in an upcoming appropriations bill that will make homeopathic medicines like meet the existing standards.
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_00: So they won't be unapproved new drugs.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_00: So there they just submitted that today, and so we'll keep you updated to see what happened.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_00: Did Congress bite?
• 35:22
  SPEAKER_00: Are they gonna help us or is that is it a done deal?
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_02: Wow, that's great.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks, Cena, for the update, and thank you all for listening.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_02: Again, if you like this content, please pass it on to your friends.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_02: We're gonna ask that.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_02: We're not gonna be embarrassed or ashamed about asking for that so that our tribe may increase and we may all go beyond labels.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks for listening.
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_02: We'll see you next week.