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The Orgasmic Orgasm Episode! · Stuff Mom Never Told You

0:05
Speaker 1: Hey, this is Anny and Samantha. I'm welcome to stuff
0:07
Speaker 1: I've never told you production of I Heart Radio. Okay,
0:19
Speaker 1: so right off the bat, before we get into this
0:21
Speaker 1: one probably obvious f one the title, but a content
0:26
Speaker 1: warning just in case perhaps you're in a place mentally
0:32
Speaker 1: or physically where you do not need to hear a
0:36
Speaker 1: lot about um sex and or orgasms UM are. Also
0:41
Speaker 1: perhaps if you have someone younger in your life and
0:44
Speaker 1: you want to give this a listen before they listen.
0:47
Speaker 1: It's pretty straightforward. Some potential t M. I for sure
0:52
Speaker 1: brief mentioned of sexual assault, but just to put that
0:56
Speaker 1: out there, just to put that out of there, I
0:57
Speaker 1: am very we We joke a lot, Samantha and I
1:01
Speaker 1: and other co workers about our search history. Search history
1:10
Speaker 1: I really gotten interesting in the last I was like, look,
1:15
Speaker 1: we have some interesting topics. You take this one, I
1:17
Speaker 1: take the other one, and then people can just judge
1:19
Speaker 1: as far starts content later. Please don't it's a real
1:24
Speaker 1: message there. So I did have two questions that I
1:30
Speaker 1: ran by Samantha that I wanted to start this episode with.
1:33
Speaker 1: One do you remember your first orgasm? And two have
1:38
Speaker 1: you ever faked one? Yes? So I think I can't
1:42
Speaker 1: clearly remember my first orgasm, but I know I had
1:45
Speaker 1: one pretty young in age, because I masturbated often as
1:50
Speaker 1: a kid. And I say kid, I was pretty young,
1:52
Speaker 1: probably not too long after I started by period, when
1:57
Speaker 1: I really started figuring out my body. Of course, when
2:00
Speaker 1: comes to like abuse and such and the things that
2:02
Speaker 1: I had gone through, there's a whole level of conversation
2:04
Speaker 1: to that as well in trying to understand sex. So
2:08
Speaker 1: I sexually acted out before at that point in time,
2:11
Speaker 1: and I may have confused that to be an orgasm,
2:15
Speaker 1: but I was pretty young when figuring out my body.
2:18
Speaker 1: Will say it like that. I have also, yes, fate,
2:22
Speaker 1: I have faith on a couple of occasions, sometimes just
2:26
Speaker 1: because it was taking too long, or sometimes it was
2:31
Speaker 1: just because uh, I was just tired. That's typically it.
2:36
Speaker 1: Don't know if I might, you know what, I think
2:39
Speaker 1: one of the times, the first relationship or like consistent
2:43
Speaker 1: partner sex that I had, I may have. I think
2:46
Speaker 1: I faked because I felt bad. I thought that's what
2:49
Speaker 1: you're supposed to do. Wow, you're touching on so much
2:53
Speaker 1: stuff that we are going to do. Oh yeah, I
2:56
Speaker 1: am a stereotype for sure. No, No, no, it's not.
2:59
Speaker 1: It's not that at all. But we're going to get
3:02
Speaker 1: into some stuff around why women fake orgasms towards the end,
3:07
Speaker 1: and just touching on a lot of reasons that people gave. Yeah,
3:11
Speaker 1: I don't remember my first orgasm. I think I was
3:14
Speaker 1: probably a middle school I know I told a story
3:17
Speaker 1: on here before, but I told my friend I thought
3:18
Speaker 1: I was having one. When I would be like, get
3:21
Speaker 1: really into a TV show, my imagination would go wild.
3:26
Speaker 1: He's like, no, you're not, And looking back, I think
3:28
Speaker 1: it might have been. Yeah. I think so I was like,
3:36
Speaker 1: that's just the stomach crap, and I think I know
3:38
Speaker 1: the difference between the stomach crap. I don't know that
3:41
Speaker 1: they'd be like super aroused. They have been the conversation,
3:45
Speaker 1: but not necessarily for you personally. I have also told
3:52
Speaker 1: this story. I did not masturbate, and in fact, I
3:56
Speaker 1: didn't think that was the thing women could do until college,
3:58
Speaker 1: so I didn't like for my body at all. But
4:02
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure middle school I have never faked one.
4:06
Speaker 1: But I have and I'm going to talk about this
4:08
Speaker 1: a bit more later what I call heightened it, where
4:12
Speaker 1: I just feel like, unfortunately, sometimes people don't believe you
4:16
Speaker 1: unless you're like puting on this performance, right, but also
4:19
Speaker 1: sometimes it would help me get in the mindset, right. Yeah,
4:23
Speaker 1: and we're gonna be talking about that later. I know
4:25
Speaker 1: that's a really controversial topic, especially in feminist circles, so
4:31
Speaker 1: we're going to tackle all of that. Um So this
4:34
Speaker 1: was inspired by something that Samantha you brought to my attention,
4:39
Speaker 1: which is like this Twitter spat or something, right, So
4:44
Speaker 1: essentially what was happening was I think it was a
4:47
Speaker 1: podcast actually of four men who are talking about women
4:51
Speaker 1: in orgasm, and of course it got reposted and all
4:56
Speaker 1: over Twitter. It went viral because the dudes and I'm
4:58
Speaker 1: not even gonna mention the name because it's just the
5:01
Speaker 1: stupidity is just too much for me. Pretty much started
5:03
Speaker 1: off with if you're having an orgasm, that means you're
5:06
Speaker 1: being the man, because women aren't supposed to have orgasms.
5:09
Speaker 1: That's the man thing, which I was like, that is
5:12
Speaker 1: the stupidest, Like, I don't think i've ever heard that
5:15
Speaker 1: as a thing, Like typically i've heard that women can't
5:18
Speaker 1: have orgasms. I've been told that, but that it's a
5:21
Speaker 1: man thing. If you're doing it, you're trying to be
5:22
Speaker 1: a man. Seems like a whole different level to the
5:25
Speaker 1: fact that the white dude was like, I didn't know
5:27
Speaker 1: women could as we know, and I don't think it's
5:29
Speaker 1: biologically possible. And so they went on to say, yeah,
5:34
Speaker 1: so if the women are saying they have orgasms, they're
5:36
Speaker 1: lying and they're faking or they're trying to give men
5:38
Speaker 1: and they need to be shut down. That's really And
5:41
Speaker 1: I was like what. And of course this is like
5:46
Speaker 1: one of those moments of like, do you really want
5:47
Speaker 1: to say this out loud? Because this is just a
5:49
Speaker 1: self owned of how often you've never pleasured a woman,
5:53
Speaker 1: Like you're just telling on yourself about how bad it's sexy,
5:56
Speaker 1: really are, so you really need to be quiet, sir. Yeah. Yeah.
6:03
Speaker 1: When you told me that, I I thought it was,
6:07
Speaker 1: you know, absolutely ridiculous. But then I was looking at
6:09
Speaker 1: some of the history behind the orgasm and it's wild
6:11
Speaker 1: to me how recent people still had those kinds of
6:14
Speaker 1: beliefs like widespread. Right. I was waiting for at least
6:19
Speaker 1: one of them, since there are four of them, to
6:21
Speaker 1: say something anything to be like. But maybe it's because
6:26
Speaker 1: I didn't watch the entire tire YouTube or whatever video
6:30
Speaker 1: it was. I just watched the clip that was posted
6:33
Speaker 1: and I missed that part, but I'm not wasting time
6:36
Speaker 1: sure for beyond those twenty seconds of the clips, you know,
6:41
Speaker 1: we don't want that for you, Samantha. So yes, we're
6:44
Speaker 1: going to go over some aspects of women and orgasms.
6:49
Speaker 1: There have been past episodes on faking orgasms, the science
6:52
Speaker 1: of orgasms. We talked about it in our book club
6:55
Speaker 1: on Come as You Are and in our interview with
6:58
Speaker 1: the founder creator of Oh Say. And a lot of
7:02
Speaker 1: this is just scratching the surface. Um, this could go
7:06
Speaker 1: in so many different ways and like so much more
7:08
Speaker 1: in depth. If you want that, let us know or
7:10
Speaker 1: happy to do it. I was trying to wrangle it
7:13
Speaker 1: all and I got a little overwhelmed, to be honest, um.
7:18
Speaker 1: And disclaimer before we dig into the research, a lot
7:21
Speaker 1: of the research that's been done around orgasms relies on
7:26
Speaker 1: self reporting, which for obvious reasons and that isn't necessarily
7:31
Speaker 1: the most accurate or reliable information. So just to put
7:36
Speaker 1: that out there, right, So let's jump in with what
7:39
Speaker 1: what are they? Yeah, surprisingly tricky to define and from
7:43
Speaker 1: Merriam Webster, intense or proroximal excitement, especially the rapid pleasurable
7:48
Speaker 1: release of neuromuscular tensions at the height of sexual arousal
7:52
Speaker 1: that is usually accompanied by the ejaculation of semen in
7:55
Speaker 1: the mall and by vaginal contractions in the female. Yes,
7:59
Speaker 1: and they usually am involve an increased in sensitivity, heart rate, breathing,
8:02
Speaker 1: and muscle contractions. Certain brain areas lighting up more than
8:06
Speaker 1: thirty brain systems get activated, followed by a release of
8:10
Speaker 1: chemicals in the brain, sort of happening throughout. While it's
8:13
Speaker 1: hard to say for sure, science indicates that men and
8:16
Speaker 1: women experience orgasms pretty much the same, So we're not
8:18
Speaker 1: having like wildly different experiences. They're pretty similar. Most theories,
8:23
Speaker 1: and yes there are theories. We're gonna get into that
8:25
Speaker 1: more in a minute. UM suggest that there are four
8:27
Speaker 1: stages of orgasm NG excitement, plateau, orgasm, and resolution. That
8:32
Speaker 1: resolution stuff gets left out a lot though. However, there
8:35
Speaker 1: are a lot of issues with this, and not everyone
8:37
Speaker 1: experiences orgasms the same way. They vary for everyone, and
8:41
Speaker 1: not everyone orgasms every time or at all, right, so
8:45
Speaker 1: there are a couple of different types of orgasms available
8:48
Speaker 1: for women, clteral and vaginal, easiest for penises, but most
8:52
Speaker 1: difficult for people with vaginas, anal blended and erogenous zones
8:56
Speaker 1: like nipples. Um. Some also experienced multiple orgasms, right an yes, oh, yes.
9:06
Speaker 1: According to Jonathan Margolis is two thousand five work oh,
9:10
Speaker 1: the Intimate History of the Orgasm. The average person spends
9:13
Speaker 1: about twenty seconds a week in orgasm, which comes out
9:16
Speaker 1: to about twelve minutes a year or ten hours of
9:18
Speaker 1: the course of an average lifespan. And I blew by
9:21
Speaker 1: that to an our mark in quarantine, I think like
9:25
Speaker 1: five sessions covered that. Not to brag, but yes, I
9:29
Speaker 1: do have multiple orgasms. In fact, normally because I have
9:34
Speaker 1: that thing with numbers, I try to get one for
9:37
Speaker 1: every setting if it's like a three setting thing. So
9:40
Speaker 1: it's just easy for me, very lucky. Yeah. I can't
9:45
Speaker 1: get off by thinking and by food that one time,
9:47
Speaker 1: so still baffing the food thing. So the average woman
9:51
Speaker 1: takes about twenty minutes to come. And according to some sources,
9:55
Speaker 1: and while of men believe that the last woman they've
9:58
Speaker 1: been with have come, only sixty of women reported that
10:02
Speaker 1: that was the case. Higher than I thought. Yeah. Yeah,
10:06
Speaker 1: Only of women reliably orgasm during intercourse like penis vaginal intercourse. Specifically,
10:13
Speaker 1: one third of women rarely or never do. I definitely
10:17
Speaker 1: know some women who have never experienced in an orgasm.
10:20
Speaker 1: Numbers show somewhere between five never never experienced orgasms. That
10:26
Speaker 1: shakes out a bit differently. If we look at couplings
10:28
Speaker 1: between two women, were eight six percent report that they
10:31
Speaker 1: usually are always orgasm compared to about six straight women
10:35
Speaker 1: compared to straight men. These numbers do vary based on
10:39
Speaker 1: the study, but they generally fall out around the same
10:41
Speaker 1: way in terms of gap. Some of the reasons given
10:44
Speaker 1: for this orgasm gap, as it's called our prioritizing of
10:47
Speaker 1: male pleasure, lack of knowledge about the clitterests and fears,
10:50
Speaker 1: and suppression of female sexuality and pleasure. The study found
10:55
Speaker 1: the following behaviors increased the likelihood of orgasm. Ng received
10:58
Speaker 1: more oral sex, have longer lasting sex, reported higher relationship satisfaction,
11:04
Speaker 1: asked for what they wanted in bed, engaged in sexual
11:06
Speaker 1: emails or calls expressed to love during sex, acted out
11:09
Speaker 1: sexual fantasies, tried new sexual positions. So there's no correlation
11:14
Speaker 1: that has been found between orgasms and women and the
11:16
Speaker 1: number of children they have. Good to know, I've never
11:19
Speaker 1: heard of that, but apparently that was a popularly held
11:22
Speaker 1: belief to Yeah, there's so many wise tales. When it
11:25
Speaker 1: comes down to it, that's sex, isn't it. Yeah, probably
11:31
Speaker 1: we'll address that in another I'm trying to like, is
11:34
Speaker 1: it now that I'm thinking about it? Okay? Anyway, So
11:37
Speaker 1: let's talk about some problems. All of this cultural fascination
11:40
Speaker 1: with orgasm means it is a lucrative industry, very much so.
11:45
Speaker 1: Look as half of the prescription as now vibrators, lube,
11:49
Speaker 1: sex therapy, which can be very very expensive, medications, vitamins, classes, camps, pornography, exercises, surgeries, books,
11:59
Speaker 1: all kinds of jen gunther O b. G y N,
12:02
Speaker 1: a notorious MythBuster around female sexuality, told Catherine Smith at
12:06
Speaker 1: The Atlantic, the whole sex industry it's all about the
12:10
Speaker 1: female orgasm, the sense that it's not about the pleasure
12:12
Speaker 1: that gets you there. Patriarchal society wants women to be
12:15
Speaker 1: horny for men when the men are ready. It's like,
12:18
Speaker 1: of course, oh, mighty swordbear, you should be able to
12:20
Speaker 1: just twist a nipple and stick it in and in
12:22
Speaker 1: three seconds I'm going to arch my back and act
12:24
Speaker 1: like the most pressurable thing in the world is happening.
12:26
Speaker 1: To me. She also said her sons started walking out
12:30
Speaker 1: on watching Game of Thrones with her because she kept
12:32
Speaker 1: counting down the women characters climaxes. But this, she argues,
12:39
Speaker 1: is detrimental for women and men, and similar ways that
12:42
Speaker 1: porn can be in terms of what we think is normal.
12:46
Speaker 1: She said, there are countless different ways that women's sexuality
12:48
Speaker 1: can be weaponized against them. Pick away, and it exists.
12:52
Speaker 1: So the whole article from the Atlantic is worth checking
12:55
Speaker 1: out because I just didn't have any knowledge about the
12:59
Speaker 1: ins and outs of sex therapy, for instance, or sex camps.
13:03
Speaker 1: I didn't know, and and that article goes into some
13:06
Speaker 1: of that, which I'd love to come back and do
13:08
Speaker 1: a whole episode on. And Yeah, speaking of let's briefly
13:12
Speaker 1: go over some issues women face when it comes to
13:14
Speaker 1: difficulty orgasm NG. We've discussed before psychological issues like low
13:18
Speaker 1: self esteem or poor body image, or something like anxiety
13:21
Speaker 1: or an eating disorder that can affect sexual performance and
13:24
Speaker 1: ability to orgasm. There are medical issues like bolbodenia, vain niceness,
13:29
Speaker 1: and difficulty producing lubrication, to name a few. A at
13:32
Speaker 1: twenty ten analysis identified some top factors in sexual dysfunction.
13:37
Speaker 1: Relationship problems, stress, mental health issues, poor physical health, genetic
13:41
Speaker 1: urinary issues such as pelvic pain, a history of abortion,
13:44
Speaker 1: a history of female genital mutilation, sexual abuse, being religious,
13:48
Speaker 1: perhaps due to sexual shame and stigma. So the analysis
13:52
Speaker 1: found that things like communication, positive body image, exercise, and
13:56
Speaker 1: masturbation can help but improve a sexual dysfunction. Some people
13:59
Speaker 1: expire its, depressions, saidness, shame, inability, crying, self loathing, et cetera.
14:04
Speaker 1: After orgasm achieved through consensual, pleasurable sex, things like postcoital
14:09
Speaker 1: tristess or postcoital dysphoria. Some studies suggest over half of
14:13
Speaker 1: women have experienced postcoital dysphoria or PCD at least once,
14:18
Speaker 1: and a recent start we found that it often is
14:20
Speaker 1: linked more to unrealistic expectations than underlying medical condition. Yes, um,
14:26
Speaker 1: and this is kind of related to the petite more
14:28
Speaker 1: are the little death which is used to describe the
14:30
Speaker 1: unconsciousness people some people experience after orgasming, likening it to death.
14:36
Speaker 1: Um and something I've just learned about and experienced and
14:39
Speaker 1: foolishly did an experiment to test for research for this episode,
14:44
Speaker 1: and it took me off like a whole day. Are
14:47
Speaker 1: sex or orgasm Max, what a fool I am. So
14:52
Speaker 1: these are intense headaches that occurred during or after sexual arousal.
14:57
Speaker 1: They can be short lived, our last a few hours,
14:59
Speaker 1: are a couple of days, about three days. They're pretty
15:02
Speaker 1: rare and men are more likely to experience them than women.
15:05
Speaker 1: If you are someone who suffers from migraines, you're more
15:08
Speaker 1: likely to experience them as well. There are two types
15:11
Speaker 1: orgasma headache, which is intense throbbing pain during or after orgasm,
15:15
Speaker 1: or sexual benign headaches, which are these headaches that build
15:19
Speaker 1: during sexual arousal that kind of come from the neck
15:22
Speaker 1: and then go up. Some experience both at once, and
15:25
Speaker 1: they can be a one time thing. Are happening clusters
15:28
Speaker 1: over a six twelve month period. Some people have said
15:32
Speaker 1: they're around for life. Um. They happen because of muscle
15:35
Speaker 1: contractions and or a spike in blood pressure. Typically there
15:39
Speaker 1: are no underlying issues, but if there are any other symptoms,
15:44
Speaker 1: it could indicate something more serious is going on. As always,
15:47
Speaker 1: we are not a medical podcast, so do not come
15:51
Speaker 1: to us for medical advice. And this is by no
15:53
Speaker 1: means an exhaustive list of some of the problems around
15:56
Speaker 1: sexual dysfunction, but just a few that we wanted to
15:59
Speaker 1: touch on here. Wait, so how did you experiment? Said it?
16:05
Speaker 1: I don't understand. Okay, So I had. I had gotten
16:11
Speaker 1: a very very intense headache after orgasm NG like a
16:15
Speaker 1: month ago, and it was really bad, and I was like, wow,
16:18
Speaker 1: this must be a one time thing, I hope, And
16:21
Speaker 1: I looked it up and I found this. And then
16:25
Speaker 1: as I was researching this and I came across that
16:27
Speaker 1: orgasm headache, I was like, well, let's see if I
16:31
Speaker 1: get one again. Okay, I did, and I'm a little concerned. Yeah, Oh,
16:38
Speaker 1: it was awful, like it. It was an entire day
16:41
Speaker 1: of like a migraine level headache. So I hope I'm
16:44
Speaker 1: not in this like twelve months boat. But interesting, we'll see,
16:50
Speaker 1: We'll see, all right. So we did want to go
16:54
Speaker 1: over some history very briefly. But first we're gonna pause
16:56
Speaker 1: for a group break for work from our sponsor. And
17:12
Speaker 1: we're back, Thank you sponsor, And yes, we're back with
17:15
Speaker 1: a very brief history of the women's orgasm, of the
17:23
Speaker 1: of the women's So historically, society and cultural attitudes towards
17:27
Speaker 1: women's orgasms have fluctuated between intense interests and pretending as
17:32
Speaker 1: it didn't exist, which is hilarious. It's long been misunderstood
17:37
Speaker 1: and a source of repression, shame, and even fear, or
17:40
Speaker 1: the source of books or pamphlets trying to unlock its mysteries.
17:44
Speaker 1: In medieval times, it was commonly believed that to have
17:47
Speaker 1: a baby, a woman had to have an orgasm during sex.
17:50
Speaker 1: At the time, scienists thought that women's genitals were missed
17:53
Speaker 1: but inverted, so essentially they thought women had to ejaculate
17:57
Speaker 1: orgasm like men in order for conception to take place. Unfortunately,
18:02
Speaker 1: some people still use this line of thinking when it
18:04
Speaker 1: comes to sexual assault and rape that in order to
18:07
Speaker 1: get pregnant, and we've heard this recently, a woman has
18:09
Speaker 1: to orgasm, and then she has orgasms, she must have
18:12
Speaker 1: enjoyed it, so it's not rape, which is extremely incorrect,
18:17
Speaker 1: damaging and dangerous and the flat outlie and stop it
18:22
Speaker 1: and stop it. Then, of course there were the rampant
18:26
Speaker 1: diagnosis of hysteria or a wandering boom, which eventually may
18:30
Speaker 1: have led to the invention of the vibrator, first patented
18:34
Speaker 1: in the eighteen eighties, so that doctors wouldn't have to
18:36
Speaker 1: stimulate women in their offices. So if this is true,
18:39
Speaker 1: more of an invention for male relief than female pleasure. Certainly,
18:43
Speaker 1: the idea that for women orgasms were a medical necessity
18:46
Speaker 1: took some of the pleasure and fun out of it,
18:48
Speaker 1: and the American Psychiatric Association didn't drop hysteria as a
18:52
Speaker 1: medical diagnosis until. However, a recent study from my alma mater,
18:58
Speaker 1: Georgitech suggested that there's actually no evidence for this, and
19:02
Speaker 1: there were a few other detractors before this study. The
19:05
Speaker 1: doctors doing the manual massage and the reasoning for the
19:08
Speaker 1: vibraries in mentioned like maybe that never happened um, And
19:12
Speaker 1: the person who first put forth this hypothesis and popularized it,
19:16
Speaker 1: Rachel Maines, herself said it was always meant to be
19:20
Speaker 1: a hypothesis, though her writing does not necessarily clearly indicate that,
19:24
Speaker 1: but people ran with it, like I definitely had no
19:29
Speaker 1: doubt so that had happened, because I've just seen it
19:31
Speaker 1: so many places. German anatomist George Ludwig co Belt produced
19:36
Speaker 1: the first diagram of the clearteris sometime in the eighteen hundreds.
19:40
Speaker 1: We've done past episodes on the clarest, but to reiterate,
19:42
Speaker 1: as far as we know, it is the only human
19:45
Speaker 1: organ made entirely for pleasure, boasting a whopping eight thousand
19:48
Speaker 1: nerve endings, which is like a lot more than penis.
19:52
Speaker 1: It's like a lot um that being said. In eighteen
19:56
Speaker 1: fifty seven, a British kind of coologist by the name
19:58
Speaker 1: of William Acton wrote, the majority do you of women
20:00
Speaker 1: happily for them? Are not very much troubled by sexual
20:04
Speaker 1: feelings of any kind, happily for them? Okay? So in
20:10
Speaker 1: the nineteen forties, scientists Alfred Kinsey released all the sexual
20:14
Speaker 1: findings he'd uncovered from the thorough survey, yes, very thorough
20:18
Speaker 1: survey he completed in his work Sexual Behavior in the
20:20
Speaker 1: Human Female. This report called National Attention, and it did
20:25
Speaker 1: include several pieces of information about the female orgasm. For instance,
20:29
Speaker 1: Kinsey found that of women's survey reported getting their first
20:34
Speaker 1: orgasm through masturbation yes, while five percent got them through
20:38
Speaker 1: wet dreams. It took women on average four minutes to
20:41
Speaker 1: achieve orgasm during masturbation, and over ten percent experienced multiple orgasms,
20:47
Speaker 1: and in general women's orgasm abilities steadily increased until about
20:50
Speaker 1: fifty five or sixty nice those numbers and openness about
20:55
Speaker 1: sex helped demystify the female orgasm in the United States. Yeah,
20:59
Speaker 1: and I do think it's worth pointing out that a
21:01
Speaker 1: lot of scientific research into female sexuality and orgasms has
21:05
Speaker 1: been conducted by men. Yeah, it's changing, but I think
21:09
Speaker 1: there's a lot that says a lot to me. This
21:14
Speaker 1: whole thing might have opened the door to a lot
21:16
Speaker 1: of scientific inquiry in the sixties about why exactly women
21:20
Speaker 1: had orgasms and all the theories. One was that it
21:24
Speaker 1: proved the man so yes, very heteronormative, here was attentive, caring,
21:29
Speaker 1: and gentle, and would therefore be a good father. Others
21:33
Speaker 1: suggested it was a way of bonding with multiple partners,
21:36
Speaker 1: or that it sort of did a suction action to
21:39
Speaker 1: suck in more sperm, or that the pleasure means women
21:43
Speaker 1: will have more sex, which means more babies, which is
21:45
Speaker 1: good for the survival of the species. On top of this,
21:49
Speaker 1: scientific investigation was going into the female orgasm, revealing things
21:53
Speaker 1: like women could experience orgasm from clatoral or vaginal simulation.
21:58
Speaker 1: This was also the time of the sexual Revolution, when
22:01
Speaker 1: women's orgasm and sexual agency were linked to things like
22:05
Speaker 1: economic autonomy. Um that sexual repression went to fascism things
22:10
Speaker 1: like that. Right. So, the question as to why women
22:13
Speaker 1: orgasm is the ongoing subject of scholarly debate, the subject
22:17
Speaker 1: of books magazine covers, Yes, along with headlines like the
22:21
Speaker 1: best position to get her off Very good, And lately
22:24
Speaker 1: we've been hearing a lot about the health benefits of orgasming,
22:28
Speaker 1: including the startling finding that it may massively increase pain threshold.
22:33
Speaker 1: Yeah by nice, Okay. Some recent discoveries imply that the
22:38
Speaker 1: female orgasm used to be integral to conception. Some species
22:42
Speaker 1: are called reflex ovulators, meaning the females only produce an
22:46
Speaker 1: egg when stimulated, while others are spontaneous ovulators, meaning the
22:51
Speaker 1: females produce eggs without stimulation, like those of us with
22:55
Speaker 1: uterus is. The thinking is that evolution rendered the female
22:59
Speaker 1: orgasm and necessary for some species, humanity being one of them.
23:03
Speaker 1: As you might imagine, some people vehemently disagree, mostly on
23:07
Speaker 1: what exactly constitutes an orgasm when it comes to women.
23:11
Speaker 1: One person who has had some qualms with this theory
23:14
Speaker 1: is Elizabeth Lloyd, author of the Case of the Female
23:17
Speaker 1: Orgasm and affiliated faculty scholar at the Kanzie Institute for
23:20
Speaker 1: Research and Sex, Gender and Reproduction. In her book She
23:24
Speaker 1: delved into the twenty one published theories about the female
23:28
Speaker 1: orgasm that she could find and sorted them into some
23:30
Speaker 1: basic categories. There's the byproduct theory that hinges on the
23:34
Speaker 1: fact that for the first two months as babies are developing,
23:38
Speaker 1: we're all working off the same basic plan. So you've
23:40
Speaker 1: probably heard this before to explain why men have nipples,
23:44
Speaker 1: same principle. Men need orgasms, so women get them too.
23:48
Speaker 1: Then there's the pair bond theory. Basically, orgasm ng keeps
23:52
Speaker 1: women coming back for more and this strengthens the relationship.
23:56
Speaker 1: Lloyd's grit to point out that the evolutionary importance doesn't
24:01
Speaker 1: equal cultural or importance. That orgasming is important for women
24:04
Speaker 1: no matter the scientific why behind it. But yeah, I
24:09
Speaker 1: mean this is people are still unclear, they're still looking
24:13
Speaker 1: into it. Others think we just really don't know the
24:16
Speaker 1: answer to it yet. So will see see how that goes,
24:22
Speaker 1: see how that develops. There are some things that we
24:25
Speaker 1: wanted to talk about culturally speaking of, but first we're
24:29
Speaker 1: going to pause for one more group break for word
24:31
Speaker 1: from our sponsors, scare Back, Thank you. Sponsored Societally, we
24:48
Speaker 1: place a lot of importance on the orgasm as the
24:51
Speaker 1: end all, be all, the end game. But as we
24:54
Speaker 1: discussed in our come as you Are episode, that doesn't
24:56
Speaker 1: have to be the case, and that very line of
24:58
Speaker 1: thinking can make it harder to orgasm. Sex can be
25:02
Speaker 1: good without orgasm. Ng, Yes, it can be. Um, that's
25:08
Speaker 1: That's not to say if it's something you want, you
25:11
Speaker 1: shouldn't get it. But sometimes it just might not happen,
25:13
Speaker 1: and that's okay. Sometimes you might just not be in
25:16
Speaker 1: the mood. Are you know? There are plenty of reasons
25:19
Speaker 1: why the orgasm doesn't have to be this big deal
25:21
Speaker 1: that we're we've traditionally made it to be. Margol Is,
25:26
Speaker 1: who we mentioned earlier, wrote, it is as if the
25:29
Speaker 1: modern mythology and cult of orgasm has placed the sensation
25:32
Speaker 1: on such a pedestal, created such an aspirational super brand
25:36
Speaker 1: of it that women perfectly capable of orgasm refused to
25:38
Speaker 1: believe they are having a legitimate one. And that was
25:41
Speaker 1: actually one of the most shocking things for me. I
25:43
Speaker 1: guess it shouldn't be because here I am, like I
25:45
Speaker 1: think I was orgasming in middle school. Was so women
25:48
Speaker 1: weren't sure if they had ever orgasmic, or weren't sure
25:51
Speaker 1: like it was the question of like, are we all
25:53
Speaker 1: just lying about how good sex is and I actually
25:55
Speaker 1: have had an orgasm? Right? Right? So Margolis was a
25:59
Speaker 1: keep heart in really espousing the importance of the orgasm too.
26:03
Speaker 1: He also wrote much of the raw of violence and
26:05
Speaker 1: fundamentalist societies must them from the male's sexual frustration. Yeah,
26:09
Speaker 1: so it's interesting that he's like, we've really built it
26:12
Speaker 1: up into too much. But then this sort of adding.
26:16
Speaker 1: Sex educator Luxe Alptrom wrote about this in her book
26:20
Speaker 1: Faking It. The Lies Women Tell about Sex and the
26:22
Speaker 1: truth they reveal. That a woman's orgasm has become quote
26:26
Speaker 1: the primary, if not entire, purpose for pursuing sex, a
26:29
Speaker 1: sentiment that suggests that anyone who isn't able or doesn't
26:32
Speaker 1: want to achieve orgasm is some kind of freak or
26:34
Speaker 1: failure that can be a lot of pressure for both parties,
26:39
Speaker 1: for anybody, which can make it less pleasurable overall. In
26:44
Speaker 1: Alptrom's mind, a big part of creating this narrative was
26:47
Speaker 1: the popular two thousand for Ian Kerner Kunnel linguist manual
26:51
Speaker 1: She Comes First and Altroms words. This helped treat the
26:54
Speaker 1: female orgasm quote as a badge of honor and proof
26:57
Speaker 1: of a man's for reality, rendering women's actual needs to
27:00
Speaker 1: sires and authentic pleasure subordinate to the appeasement of the
27:03
Speaker 1: heterosexual male ego. I will say I brought this up,
27:08
Speaker 1: that we were researching this among a mixed group of friends, um,
27:12
Speaker 1: and all the women pretty much echoed that said, it's like,
27:17
Speaker 1: even if they are orgasming, it's not about them, right,
27:20
Speaker 1: That's how they felt. It's also become very very feminist
27:23
Speaker 1: and some sex to demand an orgasm, to never fake it.
27:26
Speaker 1: And I remember we talked about this on a past
27:28
Speaker 1: episode and some people wrote in angry that bridget I
27:32
Speaker 1: said she'd faked it and that people said you never should.
27:35
Speaker 1: But she was a big proponent of orgasms too. So
27:39
Speaker 1: let's get into it. Let's get into faking it. Right.
27:41
Speaker 1: So we've established that a good number, including myself, of
27:45
Speaker 1: women don't consistently orgasm during heterosexual intercourse, again, for a
27:49
Speaker 1: variety of reasons, and yet it's often tied into this
27:52
Speaker 1: sense of accomplishment of the male ego. Very true, So yeah,
27:57
Speaker 1: let's talk about it. Let's talk about faking it. Some
27:59
Speaker 1: surveys that us at least sixty six percent of women
28:01
Speaker 1: have faced it at least once, compared to about of men.
28:06
Speaker 1: A recent study out of the UK found women reported
28:09
Speaker 1: these main reasons for faking it. And yes, I do
28:13
Speaker 1: check off a lot of these lists, but I probably
28:15
Speaker 1: faked it like total three times, four times twice with
28:21
Speaker 1: the same partner though he was whatever. Because here's some reasons.
28:26
Speaker 1: She wants to make her partners feel good, because it
28:28
Speaker 1: turns her on, because she's insecure or afraid, because she
28:32
Speaker 1: wants to make the sex stop, because she's embarrassed, herself conscious,
28:36
Speaker 1: because she's worried that she can't reach orgasm. Some report
28:39
Speaker 1: issues of safety as well. Yeah, the interesting thing about
28:43
Speaker 1: these findings is that it shows several selfish reasons when
28:47
Speaker 1: the wisely accepted belief is that it has been all
28:49
Speaker 1: about the partner. I will say for myself again, it's
28:53
Speaker 1: not necessarily about the partner as much as a couple
28:56
Speaker 1: of times for sure about the partner, but more just
28:58
Speaker 1: like I just wanted to stop, just stop right right,
29:03
Speaker 1: And I don't know, like I think that's it's like
29:05
Speaker 1: it's a good ending. We're done. Thanks. Yeah, And this
29:10
Speaker 1: is something we've seen in all kinds of media. Usually
29:13
Speaker 1: a woman is telling a male friend that women fake it.
29:16
Speaker 1: He's like, oh, no, one has with me ever, and
29:19
Speaker 1: she rolls her eyes and demonstrates through a series of
29:22
Speaker 1: sounds and facial expressions that he has probably someone did,
29:26
Speaker 1: and his male ego is left shaken. When Harry met
29:29
Speaker 1: Sally is probably the most famous example with I'll have
29:32
Speaker 1: what she's having. But it's a plot point in things
29:35
Speaker 1: like Seinfeld. So there's the Seinfeld episode where Elane it's like, yeah,
29:39
Speaker 1: I faked it, and you know, Elane and Jerry used
29:41
Speaker 1: to date, and he's like, well, I'm not ground with me, right,
29:43
Speaker 1: and she was like uh. And then it sends Jerry
29:48
Speaker 1: on the spiral of like, just give you one more chance,
29:50
Speaker 1: I can do it. Um. But like asked around other
29:54
Speaker 1: women who like, have you ever faked it? And most
29:57
Speaker 1: of them say, when it's enough already and I want
29:58
Speaker 1: to get some sleep, Yeah, yeah, yeah, but you of
30:03
Speaker 1: course have a sex in the city of course. Well yeah,
30:08
Speaker 1: because we were doing a couple of episodes on different
30:11
Speaker 1: things and uh, I'm like, look, this points to a
30:14
Speaker 1: sex in the City episode in which your response says, hey,
30:18
Speaker 1: is there sex in the city? Episode about faking your orgasm.
30:20
Speaker 1: I was like, let me tell you, yes, uh, And
30:24
Speaker 1: which is funny because the person who is faking the
30:27
Speaker 1: orgasm is Miranda, who was probably the most staunch feminist
30:31
Speaker 1: of the show, who would absolutely be about like taking
30:33
Speaker 1: down the patriarchy. But she does it with a dude,
30:36
Speaker 1: and then she never talks to him again. Then they
30:39
Speaker 1: come back together because she has this moment of like,
30:42
Speaker 1: oh my god, what if I never find anybody I'm
30:45
Speaker 1: alone moment, So she goes back to this dude as
30:48
Speaker 1: she tells him, oh, yeah, I'm faking it because he
30:51
Speaker 1: she finally decides not to fake it for the first time,
30:54
Speaker 1: and when she tries to blame her and say, oh,
30:56
Speaker 1: are you one of those women who can't have an orgasm,
30:59
Speaker 1: in which her was on says no, I've had plenty,
31:02
Speaker 1: it's just with you. And he's like, no one's ever
31:04
Speaker 1: done that with me, and her response was like and
31:07
Speaker 1: so he goes through all the numbers of women that
31:09
Speaker 1: he has figured out yes, probably has faked it. She
31:13
Speaker 1: tries to teach them, you can never get there, so
31:15
Speaker 1: she again ghosts him. End of the story. Great episode though,
31:20
Speaker 1: but it is one of those things where they watch,
31:22
Speaker 1: which is hilarious. It's almost meta to the fact that
31:25
Speaker 1: they watch an episode of something and the girl on
31:30
Speaker 1: the show immediately climaxes and she goes into a hub
31:33
Speaker 1: about like, see, this is the why men don't know
31:35
Speaker 1: how to place women. We see this, she's immediately having sex,
31:38
Speaker 1: and they're like, yeah, but you're faking it. So that's
31:41
Speaker 1: why he thinks he's doing a good job. As well
31:44
Speaker 1: as the fact that that show in itself, they all,
31:47
Speaker 1: every single one of them have records every time except
31:50
Speaker 1: for that one episode, and it's always within thirty seconds.
31:54
Speaker 1: I'm like, who's calling the kettle black here? I mean,
32:00
Speaker 1: that's a really good point too, of which we've touched
32:02
Speaker 1: on briefly. But things like pornography and how we see
32:04
Speaker 1: it in media definitely influences all of it. It's not
32:08
Speaker 1: just men who think, oh, it's that quick, but even women,
32:11
Speaker 1: I think often internalize those messages messages and think there's
32:14
Speaker 1: something wrong with me that is taking so long or
32:17
Speaker 1: whatever whatever it is. So most sex therapists believe that
32:21
Speaker 1: faking it will build resentment and guilt while also decreasing
32:25
Speaker 1: the pleasure because the faker is busy performing. Some women
32:30
Speaker 1: have reported finding baking it empowering or a turn on,
32:34
Speaker 1: that it takes all the pressure off of the orgasm,
32:36
Speaker 1: especially if it's something difficult for them to to get to. UM.
32:39
Speaker 1: We can argue about all the reasons that difficulty might be,
32:42
Speaker 1: many of them patriarchy related, but some health and anatomy
32:46
Speaker 1: related to and we can't deny their experience. And we
32:49
Speaker 1: also can't deny that the other party may be hurt
32:52
Speaker 1: by this revelation. Right, A lot of women writing about
32:55
Speaker 1: why they fake say they don't want to hurt the
32:57
Speaker 1: man's feelings, but also that there are afraid they'll be
33:01
Speaker 1: hurt if they find out that they've been faking. One
33:03
Speaker 1: of them pointed out when men in general ever consistently
33:06
Speaker 1: put on a performance to not hurt the other person's feelings. Yeah,
33:10
Speaker 1: I mean that's a good point. I've definitely had conversations
33:13
Speaker 1: with men where they yeah, they just they're so blown
33:20
Speaker 1: away by that very thought of like, well, why would
33:23
Speaker 1: you do it? Yes, isn't it exhausting? I think another
33:29
Speaker 1: piece of this is we're not being totally honest with
33:31
Speaker 1: each other as women. When we're talking to her friends,
33:34
Speaker 1: we may paint sex the sex that we're having as
33:37
Speaker 1: great and because in pop culture, faking it means something
33:40
Speaker 1: fell short. Even if again the sex was great, we
33:44
Speaker 1: might not be open about that, Samantha and I aside,
33:48
Speaker 1: because we're pretty pretty talkative over other stuff. One study
33:54
Speaker 1: did find that straight women who hold anti feminist views
33:57
Speaker 1: are more likely to fake it. It also found that
33:59
Speaker 1: women who are on comfortable saying clitterists are more likely
34:02
Speaker 1: to fake orgasms. And there's a definite vin diagram there are. However,
34:06
Speaker 1: plenty of people who identify as feminists have faked it
34:08
Speaker 1: for a variety of reasons. Um, some that we've gone
34:11
Speaker 1: over here. And the thing is, sex can be pretty
34:15
Speaker 1: awkward and it can be kind of scary, especially when
34:18
Speaker 1: you're younger. And we're always promoters of honest communication, but
34:22
Speaker 1: you might not be there yet. Um in early days,
34:26
Speaker 1: when you're just learning each other's bodies and your own body,
34:28
Speaker 1: you might not know yourself either. It may take some
34:32
Speaker 1: enthusiastic consenting, experimentation or self discovery right. Also worth mentioning
34:37
Speaker 1: not everyone experiences orgasms the same way or even the
34:41
Speaker 1: same way every time, and some people are allowed someone quiet.
34:45
Speaker 1: There's no real way to know other than asking despite
34:49
Speaker 1: all the articles claiming otherwise communication is important. You'll Yeah,
34:55
Speaker 1: I found plenty of articles that were like, how don't
34:56
Speaker 1: know if she's faking um. Also, on a personal note,
35:02
Speaker 1: as someone who has never faked, I don't. I'm not
35:04
Speaker 1: saying I wouldn't. I just hasn't happened. UM. I have,
35:08
Speaker 1: like I said, heightened and that does sometimes help me
35:12
Speaker 1: get to the orgasm. UM. And I've always thought of
35:15
Speaker 1: it kind of in that way of like making yourself
35:17
Speaker 1: smile can't help you get in a better mood, um,
35:20
Speaker 1: even if it was a fake smile. And some research
35:22
Speaker 1: suggests that I'm onto something with the faking it and
35:25
Speaker 1: the orgasm or even just the kind of heightening your
35:28
Speaker 1: your reactions. But I've also seen this become a thing
35:32
Speaker 1: done for men so that it will actually believe you
35:35
Speaker 1: when you say you're enjoying something, so you feel like
35:38
Speaker 1: you have to act a bit more. And then at
35:41
Speaker 1: the same time, the whole faking it concept as to
35:44
Speaker 1: the not trusting women thing that is at play here,
35:47
Speaker 1: and as part of the reason many women fake it
35:50
Speaker 1: in the first place because they don't believe you when
35:52
Speaker 1: you say you're enjoying it, so you wake it, and
35:54
Speaker 1: then that's another reason women can't be trusting. Right, So
35:59
Speaker 1: if you don't express it exactly how they think it is,
36:01
Speaker 1: then you didn't have an orgasm, right even though you
36:04
Speaker 1: make but you're just a quiet person exactly. It's so frustrating.
36:10
Speaker 1: And I saw in in several scientific articles some version
36:14
Speaker 1: of if a woman doesn't achieve orgasm, it's not her faults,
36:19
Speaker 1: but it's the way that it was phrased. It made
36:22
Speaker 1: it sound like it was her pause so much blaming
36:26
Speaker 1: women um saying something is wrong with them. That once
36:29
Speaker 1: again adds all of this pressure and all of these
36:32
Speaker 1: unhelpful shows that take you out of the moment and
36:35
Speaker 1: probably make it more difficult to orgasm if that is
36:38
Speaker 1: the thing that you want. And yeah, we've seen this
36:41
Speaker 1: line of thinking lead to violence as well, which is
36:45
Speaker 1: a bigger topic than we're going to cover on this episode.
36:48
Speaker 1: But this is something that's been on my mind lately
36:51
Speaker 1: of this male ego of wanting to believe that they
36:55
Speaker 1: can always make women come, that they can't be with
36:58
Speaker 1: a woman who can't that it he's great, So the
37:01
Speaker 1: problem is with her right, or can't be in a
37:04
Speaker 1: steady loyal relationship with her. I found several articles with
37:07
Speaker 1: women who said, some dude broke up with me because
37:11
Speaker 1: he thought I wasn't orgasming enough or something what, And
37:15
Speaker 1: then that leads to experiencing these feelings of inadequacy again.
37:19
Speaker 1: But the numbers that we we mentioned earlier, of the
37:22
Speaker 1: rate of like heterosexual men orgasming versus heterosexual women, it
37:27
Speaker 1: doesn't add up right, and that those are probably not
37:30
Speaker 1: even totally accurate. It's it's these men who tell you
37:34
Speaker 1: that they are great in bed with no irony, who
37:37
Speaker 1: tell you that they'll show you pleasure unlike anything you've experienced,
37:40
Speaker 1: or that any other man can give you a bet.
37:43
Speaker 1: A lot of us have heard this before, where the
37:46
Speaker 1: female orgasm is their trophy, something that account to tally
37:50
Speaker 1: up and brag about, which, yes, makes it all about themselves.
37:54
Speaker 1: So even if in theory you think like, oh I
37:56
Speaker 1: love women, um, I'm a feminist and I always make
37:59
Speaker 1: sure of my lady's orgasm, it's about you. You're still
38:04
Speaker 1: making it about you. That being said, pleasing a partner
38:09
Speaker 1: and being able to please a partner is part of
38:11
Speaker 1: this whole thing um or ideally it should be. But
38:14
Speaker 1: the reasons behind it matters. Um, or at least they do.
38:17
Speaker 1: If we're going to untangle some of this fixation and
38:20
Speaker 1: preoccupation we have with the orgasm, and specifically women or
38:25
Speaker 1: female orgasm as well. Sorry, I'm loving to do you
38:31
Speaker 1: just rub your face half the time? Like sounding so
38:34
Speaker 1: I'm frustrated it is, I am Okay. So let's close
38:38
Speaker 1: out with some myths. Because of the long history of
38:42
Speaker 1: misunderstanding the orgasm and continual misunderstanding of the orgasm, miss
38:47
Speaker 1: runabound about the female orgasm. One of the big ones
38:50
Speaker 1: that we've already discussed that women who don't or can't
38:53
Speaker 1: orgasm have psychological problems, which is not always the case. Yes,
38:58
Speaker 1: that is not always the case. However, that being said,
39:02
Speaker 1: I know that for me this was difficult to like
39:04
Speaker 1: even the question at the top of like when you've
39:06
Speaker 1: had your first orgasm, it can be for people like
39:08
Speaker 1: us who've had sexual trauma of a painful question. And
39:13
Speaker 1: I've talked about that in therapy. It helps some people
39:16
Speaker 1: to reframe like sex and rape is separate things, um
39:22
Speaker 1: and we talked about that in our some in our
39:24
Speaker 1: Come as you Are book club, So definitely check that out.
39:28
Speaker 1: Another myth is that the vaginal orgasm from heterosexual intercourse
39:32
Speaker 1: is superior. Sigmund Freud himself made this claim, who also
39:37
Speaker 1: believed that sexual oppression was necessary for society to function.
39:41
Speaker 1: He said this knowing that the clark has had way
39:43
Speaker 1: more nerve endings than the vagina. You can see how
39:47
Speaker 1: this belief benefited men and yes, absolutely untrue. At the
39:51
Speaker 1: same time, there's also the myth that we started this
39:53
Speaker 1: whole episode with that vaginal orgasms don't exist at all.
39:57
Speaker 1: There's so much discourse and misinformation and pressure around all
40:01
Speaker 1: of this that one of the top Google results I
40:03
Speaker 1: saw when researching this topic was can a woman orgasm
40:07
Speaker 1: and not know it? Interesting? Yeah, it's also a myth
40:12
Speaker 1: that it's hard for women to orgasm. It's difficult and
40:15
Speaker 1: penis vagina intercourse for some, it can be for some,
40:18
Speaker 1: but share Height reported in the high Report that women
40:22
Speaker 1: quote could orgasm easily and regularly whenever they wanted. Vibrators
40:25
Speaker 1: are great, yell. There's also the myth that you have
40:28
Speaker 1: to have an orgasm to have good sex. Again, this
40:30
Speaker 1: is not true. Sometimes that intimacy alone feels nice and
40:34
Speaker 1: lovely and connected. The myth also is that women have
40:38
Speaker 1: to have an emotional connection to orgasm also not true.
40:42
Speaker 1: I don't don't think any has an emotional attachment to
40:45
Speaker 1: your violator. Maybe you do, I don't know. No, I
40:48
Speaker 1: don't either. I just I just I was just asking.
40:56
Speaker 1: It can't help, sure, but it's not necessary. And this
40:59
Speaker 1: is also one of those complicated things of like what
41:03
Speaker 1: is making love and all these things. Yeah, that's that's
41:06
Speaker 1: PRITI makes me cringe. Yeah, And I mean for some
41:10
Speaker 1: the emotional connection can make it more difficult. And then
41:13
Speaker 1: also the myth of this of like that's why women
41:17
Speaker 1: struggle to have orgasms compared to men, And we've talked before,
41:22
Speaker 1: like there's plenty of ways that that can be true
41:25
Speaker 1: or or one of the big reasons women have reported
41:29
Speaker 1: is that they just have their like so focused on
41:31
Speaker 1: their body when they're having sex that it takes them
41:33
Speaker 1: out of the pleasure of having sex. So there's a
41:36
Speaker 1: lot of stuff going on, but like, overall, that's not
41:39
Speaker 1: a true statement, Like there's a lot of nuances and
41:42
Speaker 1: stuff and right, and then I just want to add
41:45
Speaker 1: this in because I infuriated me. Um. So there's recent
41:49
Speaker 1: recently uh d C removed in a scene of oral
41:55
Speaker 1: sex between Batman and Catwoman from the Harley Quinn Show
41:57
Speaker 1: on HBO Max because quote, here, don't do that, I
42:06
Speaker 1: tell you. According to co creator Justin Halpern, they said,
42:10
Speaker 1: it's what we sell consumer toys for heroes. It's hard
42:13
Speaker 1: to sell the toy if Batman is also going down
42:15
Speaker 1: on someone butt but not sex in general. But okay,
42:19
Speaker 1: you want to connect toys as the reason for not oral,
42:23
Speaker 1: but regular sex is just fine, and that that makes
42:26
Speaker 1: no sense. Yeah, I didn't know what was happening, and
42:29
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, Twitter is blowing up about how
42:32
Speaker 1: heroes Batman specifically what didn't do oral? And I was like,
42:36
Speaker 1: what what is happening? Which I did not realize there
42:40
Speaker 1: was an explicit show about Batman happening. Had no clue,
42:43
Speaker 1: So I was like, what is happening? Because according to
42:48
Speaker 1: my notes, any of the heroes that I have seen
42:51
Speaker 1: don't have sex. They all sleep separate rooms. Most likely.
42:58
Speaker 1: That's how I know my comic book heroes. But all
43:02
Speaker 1: that to say, I was like, well, this is the
43:04
Speaker 1: most unlike, nonsensical, weird way to start a debate, like
43:08
Speaker 1: why why did First of all, again, this says a
43:11
Speaker 1: lot about you more than it does about anything else
43:14
Speaker 1: in society. The fact that you did that probably added
43:17
Speaker 1: more controversy than if you just left it alone. Yeah,
43:20
Speaker 1: and like you said, it's not like this is an
43:23
Speaker 1: explicit show, right, Um, it's not as if kids are
43:29
Speaker 1: you know, their audience. I'm sure that some kids are
43:32
Speaker 1: watching it, but should they be? No? Yeah, I mean,
43:36
Speaker 1: but yeah, it's an explicit show. And it's not as
43:38
Speaker 1: if these kids are going to stop buying Batman toys
43:42
Speaker 1: or comics because of something we've probably never seen and
43:45
Speaker 1: probably never would have heard about. Again, there was a
43:48
Speaker 1: couple of years ago they got in some trouble too
43:51
Speaker 1: because they there was a image of Batman naked and
43:57
Speaker 1: one of the comics and they took it out because
43:59
Speaker 1: they said it did and add to the plot. Everyone
44:01
Speaker 1: was like, well what about all those naked ladies? Right?
44:04
Speaker 1: Did they add? There's so many things that you want
44:07
Speaker 1: to question, like, well, none of this is necessary for
44:10
Speaker 1: the plot, so why like him eating I'm just talking
44:15
Speaker 1: to a random person on the side, I don't understand
44:17
Speaker 1: walking through the car not necessary? Many questions. Really, we're
44:22
Speaker 1: about to go off on a whole other tangent episode here. Yeah, yeah,
44:26
Speaker 1: there is so much more we could talk about and
44:29
Speaker 1: this whole thing so much that we should return to
44:31
Speaker 1: and that we want to return to. If there's anything
44:34
Speaker 1: in particular, listeners that you are like, please talk more
44:36
Speaker 1: about this, let us know. You can email us at
44:39
Speaker 1: stuffing da mom Stuff at ihart mea dot com. You
44:42
Speaker 1: can find us on Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast or
44:44
Speaker 1: on Instagram a stuff I Never told you. I thinks
44:46
Speaker 1: it's always to you are a super producer. Christina. Thank
44:48
Speaker 1: you and thanks to you for listening stuff I Never
44:51
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