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Spicy Fever dream (Paprika) - Anime Club · Anime Club Podcast

• 0:28
  Hey and welcome to Anime Club. How are you doing everyone?
• 0:32
  Hey. Oh.
• 0:36
  Great. My name is Chris and I am joined
• 0:40
  by Phoebe, and we've got a very special guest.
• 0:43
  I'm fluffing this intro this time.
• 0:46
  Live in a while, but whatevs, it'll be all right.
• 0:49
  But today we've got a special guest from wonk women of nerd
• 0:53
  culture. It is Sarah Peach.
• 0:58
  I'm to the smelly old Aqua classroom.
• 1:06
  Oh, well, yes, I thank you for asking me to come on.
• 1:08
  I've I'm not a massive anime nerd, but I do have little bits
• 1:14
  and bobs that I like and I have watched and yeah.
• 1:18
  Because it's like, we just want your like opinion on what we're
• 1:23
  watching this week. It doesn't matter if you've grew
• 1:25
  up watching anime or it was your first first experience, but you
• 1:29
  have watched a. Couple end of podcast.
• 1:34
  No, Yeah, yeah, I've watched a couple in my time.
• 1:38
  But yeah, that actually leads us up to be first question.
• 1:42
  What was your first intro in anime?
• 1:48
  I mean, I guess technically it was Pokémon.
• 1:52
  That's fine. Yeah.
• 1:55
  Yeah, well, my brother used to watch it years and years and
• 1:57
  years ago. But for my own, I'm kind of
• 2:00
  class in Pokémon as a second hand watching, so it wasn't
• 2:03
  technically mine. So the first proper proper one I
• 2:06
  watched of my own accord was Death Note.
• 2:10
  Yeah. OK, nice.
• 2:12
  I find off. I find that there's a lot of
• 2:14
  people who kind of like have that one as one of the first.
• 2:19
  Yeah, because there was a it was like the early 2000s.
• 2:23
  It was massive, wasn't it? Yeah.
• 2:25
  That was the first. It was huge.
• 2:26
  Proper live action adaptation. I mean, I know those others
• 2:30
  before right? But mainstream 1.
• 2:34
  I haven't seen the live action ones, but I did watch all of the
• 2:37
  anime. Oddly enough, I do have them on
• 2:42
  DVD, I've just never watched them.
• 2:45
  But yeah, yeah, I even named a few of my my rats that I had at
• 2:50
  the time after Shinigami. So we had like Rio, we had R.E.M
• 2:55
  and then we had like Light as well.
• 2:58
  Now to eat. Apples and like write stuff in
• 3:02
  notebooks. Well, I had one which was called
• 3:08
  DCI Gene Hunt. He liked to write a notebook, so
• 3:10
  I'm thinking he took the from the others.
• 3:13
  Yeah, yeah, The first rats I had were called DCI Gene Hunt and
• 3:17
  the Grim Squeaker. So Lights On and Terry
• 3:22
  Pratchett. Oh, great.
• 3:27
  But yes, basically Rio, Clayton L and R.E.M.
• 3:30
  Were were the were the next lot that we had after after the
• 3:35
  first two years so. I I have a soft spot for Death
• 3:38
  Note. It's some like some people get
• 3:40
  quite divided by it. I love it and but recently I
• 3:44
  have also been watching like people who've edited out all the
• 3:47
  inner monologues of Death Note so that it's and it's hilarious
• 3:52
  because it's just people like very intensely sitting at a like
• 3:56
  at a table together saying nothing.
• 3:59
  And you realise like how long, like how long people are just
• 4:04
  standing staring at each other in that anime.
• 4:06
  You think people would definitely have figured out?
• 4:11
  Like. Who had a guilty conscience
• 4:13
  because they're just sitting at the table like it's.
• 4:18
  Amazing to be fair, would you not think, oh it can't be him,
• 4:21
  he's a simpleton that he just stands there and just stares at
• 4:24
  us for a good 5 minutes. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 4:27
  There's no way he could pull that off.
• 4:30
  He's not a magic book. Yeah, Oh.
• 4:37
  Thought all me notes had disappeared for a second there.
• 4:40
  Oh. But yeah, see that happens when
• 4:42
  you mock. When you mock the Shinigami,
• 4:45
  they'll steal your. Do not, do not mock the
• 4:46
  Shinigami. See, I loved it at the time, but
• 4:51
  thinking back like I'm never going to watch it again, I don't
• 4:53
  think. I think it's a good, I think
• 4:57
  it's a good anime for its time. Sometimes we don't need to watch
• 4:59
  back. Sometimes the nostalgia is
• 5:01
  enough. I think it was kind of like
• 5:03
  Everybody has the emo phase and Death Notes, a very emo anime.
• 5:07
  Yeah, like at the time I watched Death Note, I was listening to,
• 5:10
  like, Evanescence. And My Chemical Romance.
• 5:12
  Yeah, yeah. Oh, did you like that?
• 5:16
  What's the last? The goth last called on that
• 5:18
  Mesa or something. Oh, no, the yeah, no, I didn't.
• 5:23
  I found her quite intolerable actually.
• 5:24
  Yeah. Yeah, good.
• 5:29
  But that. Is 1 of.
• 5:30
  The most important part of anime Club Snacks.
• 5:35
  Oh yeah. Wow.
• 5:37
  I feel like I have you both in spirit with me today.
• 5:41
  Because I have From yourself, Sarah.
• 5:45
  I've saved them. They come all the way back from
• 5:48
  the north with me. Oh wow.
• 5:54
  And then I've also got the Dubai chocolate.
• 5:56
  They've come all the way from Egypt via the north and then
• 6:00
  come on the trade across the country so.
• 6:03
  Honesty of the year. Travel.
• 6:05
  Snacks. These are a bit squished I
• 6:08
  think. I mean, at least.
• 6:12
  Rice takes us for the edible at least, yeah.
• 6:14
  Yeah, yeah, for sure. They'll still be fine.
• 6:17
  What about you guys? What have you got?
• 6:19
  You want to go first, Sarah? I've gone for an old classic
• 6:23
  that I like because recent ditch pretzels.
• 6:30
  Oh, that way. That way.
• 6:32
  My eyes look good. Disappearing into the ether as
• 6:35
  well. I know I.
• 6:37
  Know it's because that you exist on this earth.
• 6:41
  They're one of my favourite little monsters at the moment,
• 6:46
  so hi Eddie. Oh.
• 6:55
  You just cut out there. Yeah.
• 6:58
  He's hearing wrestling and I think he's trying to figure out
• 7:01
  where it's. Coming from Fair enough if you
• 7:08
  like that meme. If the dog wear it's kind of
• 7:10
  like people breaking in. Dog fast asleep.
• 7:13
  Here's the wrapper of a cheese 50 yards away.
• 7:15
  There's something happening. To be fair, it's more like
• 7:19
  friendly person approaches door, all hell breaks loose.
• 7:23
  Yeah. Someone ruffling something, all
• 7:25
  hell breaks loose. An actual robber comes.
• 7:28
  He probably would just like want attention.
• 7:31
  Yeah, I think he is completely useless as a guard as my my
• 7:38
  siblings. Soph likes to remind me that
• 7:40
  they were originally Chihuahuas, were originally bred for food.
• 7:44
  Like they weren't bred anything. Like they were just.
• 7:48
  That's a true. Thing there's records, there's
• 7:51
  records from Spanish conquistadors entering South
• 7:55
  America for the first time and describing Chihuahuas being sold
• 7:57
  on the street. Well, sure.
• 7:59
  Why short haired chihuahuas have like often have bald stomachs is
• 8:02
  because it's easier to skin a bulldog.
• 8:07
  I know it's very sad. Chinese crested dogs as well
• 8:10
  were also originally bred as as snacks.
• 8:13
  Street meats for that reason, I can see why, yeah.
• 8:17
  Shouldn't be? So there we go.
• 8:18
  Speaking of St. Meats, what have you got Chris?
• 8:22
  Well, so well Paul, I haven't got a cake.
• 8:28
  I was going to bring up the massive tiramisu cake but it was
• 8:31
  too big and Molly would kill. Us if I didn't.
• 8:35
  Yeah, that seems fair. That looks amazing.
• 8:38
  Like you, I do have some rice cakes that were kind of a gift
• 8:42
  to do is. I did.
• 8:45
  Fair, fair, you'll be pleased to know.
• 8:47
  Mine are. Ketchup flavour did.
• 8:51
  You get the yours BBQ faves. Yeah mine are BBQ.
• 8:55
  I let Chris pick and he purely based it on the character I
• 8:58
  think rather than. Flavour.
• 9:00
  To be fair, like barbecue and ketchup, I would eat both.
• 9:05
  Yeah, I mean, I think they both look delicious.
• 9:07
  So I was happy to let you pick because I'd be happy either way.
• 9:10
  If, if there'd been one I didn't like, I'd have just been like,
• 9:12
  Sarah bought this other packet, This packet for you, Sarah.
• 9:15
  Bought this one packet for you. Yeah, yeah.
• 9:19
  Specifically this one that I like is for me.
• 9:24
  And then I've also got a cheeky little beer because Sarah loves
• 9:29
  to have a beer and I thought I'll join her.
• 9:32
  And I'm a beer. I have a Vault City Jungle
• 9:35
  Juice. I love it.
• 9:36
  I love a fruity sour which you can't see.
• 9:39
  There it is. Nice.
• 9:43
  OK, you've got the force down. Yeah.
• 9:44
  Yeah, yeah, I will get a sponsorship from Vault City at
• 9:49
  some point add. Permission.
• 9:54
  Sorrow only eats Blues cake. Well, you heard right.
• 9:59
  Get onto there. I've already opened mine.
• 10:01
  Put a dipping sauce. Oh.
• 10:04
  You've got a dipping sauce. What?
• 10:06
  Yeah, the beer. Oh.
• 10:09
  I thought these were proper rice cakes.
• 10:11
  These are like crisps. These are like, Oh no, they're
• 10:14
  really good. They're really good.
• 10:16
  These this whole packet is going to be gone.
• 10:20
  Yeah. No.
• 10:29
  Right, so now we've got the snacks out the way.
• 10:33
  When when does Anime club become a mukbang?
• 10:36
  Yeah, exactly. I literally had I had a dream
• 10:39
  the other night. Appropriate, because we're
• 10:40
  talking about Paprika, where Anime Club descended into
• 10:45
  nothing but snacks. And it is.
• 10:51
  Yeah, it was just it was just snacks.
• 10:53
  We just did just an hour of snacks and forgot the anime.
• 10:57
  Should we just do it? Yeah, why not?
• 10:59
  Who? Needs anime when you've got
• 11:01
  snacks. But the whole thing is you can't
• 11:05
  watch anime without snacks. You have to have snacks.
• 11:11
  Yeah, you can't watch anime without snacks, but you can have
• 11:13
  snacks without anime. That is true.
• 11:16
  That is true, as as my dream proved the other day.
• 11:21
  Anna Make Love look bad. Journey of dream Why don't you
• 11:26
  get this dream back on the rails, Chris?
• 11:30
  Go on then. So today we're going to talk
• 11:32
  about Satoshi Kun's paprika, which is she will go through
• 11:39
  what it's about before work like.
• 11:43
  Can you explain what it's about? Yeah, I know.
• 11:47
  So basically it's set in the future.
• 11:51
  These, this team have developed a machine called the DC Mini
• 11:58
  that allows people to explore dreams to help psychiatric
• 12:03
  patients, which I mean, I don't know.
• 12:07
  Yeah. So I don't think that would
• 12:10
  actually be good in real life. Well, you see, I was thinking
• 12:15
  about this and they have started using ketamine to treat to treat
• 12:22
  certain like very serious like schizophrenia and.
• 12:26
  Yeah. And like depression and PTSD.
• 12:31
  So maybe it's really only one step away, that kind of
• 12:35
  psychedelic reality versus truth.
• 12:38
  I mean I'm not sure I'd like it as a as a therapy source, but I
• 12:42
  would like to see if I still dream because I haven't
• 12:45
  remembered a dream for like over 20 years.
• 12:49
  You just want to record your dream and I.
• 12:50
  Just want to record the dream and see what happens because I
• 12:53
  never remember them these days. Do a few dreams were like really
• 12:56
  boring though, Would you be disappointed?
• 12:59
  I'd watch 1 and then go OK and get on with it.
• 13:03
  But if there were interest and then I'd go, OK, maybe I'll
• 13:05
  watch a few more. Yeah, but I mean I.
• 13:12
  Said it's basically a crazy rabbit hole of nonsense that
• 13:15
  it's hard to keep track of, but it's kind of like I like the odd
• 13:19
  mind fuck movies. Yeah.
• 13:22
  You know, I'm a big fan of The Big Lebowski, Black Swan, stuff
• 13:26
  like that. Yeah, I mean, there is a a big
• 13:29
  overall story that's pretty weak, I would say.
• 13:33
  So basically there's DC Bitty gets stolen by someone, all of
• 13:38
  the team because they have been developing it and they've been
• 13:40
  around the the secretions that it secrets and everything like
• 13:44
  that. They're basically.
• 13:48
  Hang on, secretion, Secretion. The more you use the device, the
• 13:54
  more susceptible you become to the device.
• 13:56
  So it's basically like as you adjust to the device, it's
• 13:59
  easier for you to like fall into the pattern, the dream pattern,
• 14:03
  and it makes it harder to wake up.
• 14:05
  So you become like descent, like sensitized, desensitized to the
• 14:12
  machine. It doesn't secrete things.
• 14:17
  It does. Do you not know why they were
• 14:20
  covered in gel? No, they won't.
• 14:25
  Were they covered in gel like this is?
• 14:27
  The problem with this film is I'm not going to know if you're
• 14:29
  having me on or if I just got confused.
• 14:31
  No, no. So that's what they were saying.
• 14:35
  So this this DC MIDI is basically a clip that goes
• 14:40
  around your head there and it's got these little, little
• 14:43
  branches that come off it which secrete this stuff which
• 14:46
  releases dopamine and keeps you happy.
• 14:50
  Oh, is that not just kind of like saying that that that that
• 14:55
  the need, it's not, it's not secretion from them that it's a
• 14:58
  secretion from the machine? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 15:01
  Happy juice. Yeah, Happy juice.
• 15:03
  Happy Gel. Yeah.
• 15:04
  I was thinking more of a kind of like, you know, the gel they use
• 15:08
  on you when the like for an. Ultra.
• 15:10
  When they do like ultrasounds, yeah, yeah.
• 15:13
  I was thinking it was just something that made the
• 15:15
  equipment work better. What's the word I'm after?
• 15:19
  There's a word I'm left to like called like conductive
• 15:22
  something. Conductive fluids.
• 15:24
  That's what I was basically trying to say, Yeah, it's like a
• 15:26
  conductive fluid to make it work better.
• 15:29
  See, I thought of it as, do you know, when some animals, when
• 15:32
  they're, when they bite you, they're really some sort of,
• 15:35
  well, spit on you and make it a gnome so you kind of feel it.
• 15:39
  I thought it was kind of like that kind of deal.
• 15:41
  But it doesn't really matter. It's not part of the story
• 15:44
  anyway. One of them gets nicked though.
• 15:50
  Someone's been using one of these DC Midis for the crack and
• 15:54
  it's would have been a prototype one.
• 15:56
  It doesn't have like a fail safe 1 so you can enter other dreams
• 16:01
  Willy nilly whatever you want. It's like.
• 16:04
  Hooked. Up like a.
• 16:05
  Network. Yeah, and one of the developers
• 16:08
  deliberately didn't do it, even though he was asked to.
• 16:13
  Yeah, he's a bit of a. Dreams were for everyone.
• 16:18
  He's the socialist. It's the people's dream machine.
• 16:24
  So the the team have got to find out who stole it and this DC
• 16:30
  mini thief is trying to sabotage them by doing stuff like when
• 16:34
  they like jumping over railings and stuff or put like
• 16:40
  hallucinations in the brain because implants suggestive
• 16:45
  thoughts into the subconscious. So they see different worlds to
• 16:51
  what's actually happening. Like there's one point, alas,
• 16:55
  goes to jump over like a railing by the side of the road and then
• 16:59
  she realises she's in a balcony 10 stories up.
• 17:03
  And then he kills herself kind of thing.
• 17:06
  But yeah, and they've got. I mean, you see, the head of the
• 17:09
  team does actually jump out of a window several stories high.
• 17:13
  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But did you have any
• 17:22
  expectations going into it? Because I didn't know anything.
• 17:26
  All I've know is I've seen Tokyo Godfathers, which is a
• 17:29
  completely different film, same director.
• 17:32
  So I kind of knew about that animation animation style, but
• 17:36
  that's all I knew going in. I mean, I was a bit intrigued by
• 17:39
  it because I mean, although I haven't seen Inception, I know
• 17:42
  like what big it caused quite a ruckus when it came out.
• 17:47
  Like everybody was talking about it and it was, oh, oh, have you
• 17:50
  seen this? Have you seen this?
• 17:53
  Because a lot of people have described Paprika as being the
• 17:55
  movie that inspired it, inspired Inception.
• 17:59
  So I I was kind of like, this could be a really good like
• 18:03
  crazy movie. Yeah, it's it's if for people
• 18:09
  who've seen Inception, it's like if people were trying to stop
• 18:12
  the terrorists rather than they were the people doing the like
• 18:16
  Dream group. I haven't actually seen
• 18:20
  Inception, but. Well, now you've seen Kapika, so
• 18:24
  it's fine. You.
• 18:25
  Need to see Inception now. I like, I have any expectation.
• 18:32
  Well, I like, I had an expectation because I was like,
• 18:34
  oh, I remember watching this ages ago, but it's probably been
• 18:37
  five years since I've seen it. And there were a bit that I'd
• 18:40
  just forgotten because I'd forgotten how it's very like for
• 18:46
  something that has a relatively simple story, like, it doesn't
• 18:49
  have a lot of plot because the animation is so detailed, it's
• 18:53
  very easy to forget things. And then suddenly I remembered
• 18:57
  like, certain scenes, like, I was like, oh, yeah, at one point
• 18:59
  she does turn into a fairy. And oh, yeah, she does.
• 19:02
  Like, I was just like, like it was all coming back to me.
• 19:05
  And I was like, Oh yeah, that's like, it's, it's weird how a lot
• 19:09
  happens, but also nothing really happens.
• 19:12
  Yes, yes, it's one of those. Yeah, because it's just that
• 19:16
  it's like a feast for the eyes. Yeah.
• 19:21
  So yeah, that was my kind of only.
• 19:23
  I just remember I'm watching it being like I love the actual
• 19:27
  animation itself and how colourful it is and how twisty
• 19:30
  turny it is. I loved how it just didn't know
• 19:34
  what was coming next to me. Just even in the opening scene.
• 19:38
  I'm kind of like, hang on, what's going on here with this
• 19:40
  little? Oh, the clones.
• 19:44
  I did not. Yeah, I didn't expect for it to
• 19:46
  start in a circus. Yeah, and not knowing like,
• 19:50
  because like and I love the you were never sure if they're awake
• 19:52
  or not. Yeah.
• 19:55
  Yeah, because bits of it do happen in the waking world, but.
• 19:58
  Do they? Yeah.
• 20:02
  I was talking to you before about this because there's
• 20:07
  Paprika, who is the alter ego of the.
• 20:12
  I can't remember her name now. The Doctor.
• 20:16
  Cheever. Yeah.
• 20:18
  It's the alter ego of her. And at some points in the film,
• 20:22
  do you think is the, is Paprika talking to such and such or is
• 20:28
  it the, is it her like in the, when she sees the policeman who
• 20:35
  she is doing this dream therapy too?
• 20:39
  Because he's he's trying to, he's stressed because he's
• 20:43
  suffering from anxiety because of a particularly hard case that
• 20:46
  he's going through. And then it ends up that he's
• 20:48
  got trauma with his childhood best friend and where we used to
• 20:53
  make films with them, blah blah. But when you see them in the
• 20:58
  real world, he's talking to Paprika.
• 21:01
  So is that, is he awake when he's doing that?
• 21:04
  Is he a? Real world.
• 21:06
  Yeah, but yeah. And technically Paprika can't
• 21:10
  ever really exist in the real world.
• 21:13
  So like, is it that they've created an avatar for her that
• 21:18
  people can interact with while waking, or is it that he just
• 21:21
  didn't actually wake up yet? Yeah.
• 21:25
  And yeah, they communicate in weird ways as well because she
• 21:30
  at one point she gives them like a website to go to and she
• 21:33
  communicates that way because she was like, Oh yeah, it's all
• 21:35
  connected, kind of like the Internet.
• 21:37
  So why not use the Internet as a as a communication device?
• 21:42
  Yeah. So it's a bit mind fucking in
• 21:47
  that way where I think if you watched again the 2nd watch you
• 21:51
  might get more questions than answers.
• 21:55
  I think watching it a second time is a very good idea when
• 21:59
  like when you're just going into it completely blind, just
• 22:04
  because I get the feeling that when when I do watch it again,
• 22:07
  it will be I'll pick up on things that I didn't see first
• 22:11
  time around. Yeah.
• 22:13
  Because he does this in Tokyo Godfathers.
• 22:17
  So Toshi Khan loves to like stack like clues to the story
• 22:23
  into the animation and it's so detailed.
• 22:27
  And because he's, he's one of those like animators who kind of
• 22:32
  has like a really clear vision for how it's all going to work
• 22:35
  together from the start. So I also think with a second
• 22:40
  watch, you'll probably notice stuff in the background of the
• 22:44
  dream sequences that tell you what's happening.
• 22:47
  Even though you like like just on the 1st watch, you would miss
• 22:50
  it completely because you have no idea where like who's
• 22:53
  responsible and like what the different dreams mean to people.
• 22:57
  So. I remember seeing a quote by him
• 23:01
  with someone referencing a quote anyway, but he was saying that
• 23:03
  he would be absolutely crap at directing films.
• 23:07
  Because with when you when you've when you've got an anime,
• 23:10
  you've got every single detail in the background, every single
• 23:13
  movement. It's all done by hand.
• 23:15
  So you have complete control over everything.
• 23:18
  So I mean there is at least a eggs up I've definitely missed
• 23:22
  or there's probably hints to what's happening in the story
• 23:26
  based on just stuff in the background, not from what the
• 23:28
  characters are saying. And I think that's why it would
• 23:31
  be worth a second watch. And I just haven't.
• 23:34
  I haven't done it yet, so. I think going off that I, I was,
• 23:42
  it was it himself, the I'm, I'm sure that I've read somewhere
• 23:49
  that carrying on from that quote that it was you can't control
• 23:53
  people watching real movies, something along those lines.
• 23:57
  You can't control what the person looks at in a real movie,
• 24:00
  whereas in the anime you can actually just put everything in
• 24:03
  one shot that you want them to see.
• 24:05
  Yeah, yeah. And I do think he really loves
• 24:09
  it. And in terms of like, so he, so
• 24:11
  in Tokyo Godfather's he, a lot of the animators and junior
• 24:16
  animators were Studio Ghibli veterans.
• 24:19
  And the thing I always love about Studio Ghibli is how rich
• 24:22
  the background art is. And you really see that kind of
• 24:27
  like like animation training or approach in Tokyo Godfathers.
• 24:32
  And I feel like in Paprika, it's like the next step along where
• 24:36
  the background is the story in a long way because it has this
• 24:40
  like as you're merging from 1 scene to another in this like
• 24:44
  very trippy dream way, often the background will become part.
• 24:48
  Like you're like, we'll focus in on part of the background and
• 24:51
  then that becomes the focus point for all the starting point
• 24:55
  for the next, like sequence. And I think it's quite nice
• 25:00
  seeing the like, having what, like watched Tokyo Godfathers
• 25:04
  for Anime Club not long ago, being able to see that
• 25:07
  evolution, yeah, between the two.
• 25:11
  And kind of see where like a lot of the experiments that he does
• 25:14
  in Tokyo Godfathers with expressions and with like
• 25:18
  background detail, being able to see like where he took those
• 25:23
  experiments and put them into Paprika as well.
• 25:27
  Just wish. That.
• 25:29
  Because he did have an unfinished film as well.
• 25:31
  I would love to have seen that, even seen what it could have
• 25:35
  looked like. Yeah, yeah.
• 25:37
  Imagine how weird there is something about.
• 25:39
  So like, it's like with Mia Zaki's last film, The Boy in the
• 25:43
  Heron gets real weird. And there is something about
• 25:47
  anime directors as they come towards the end of their life,
• 25:51
  they seem to like create like these kind of like incredibly
• 25:56
  unhinged masterpieces. Take a lot of LSD basically.
• 26:00
  But I think there's something, obviously a lot of time sitting
• 26:04
  drawing or like an animating stuff in front of the computer
• 26:08
  over and over, day after day obviously does something to the
• 26:10
  brain, I think. I guess it's only so long that
• 26:13
  you spend like kind of creating all these worlds until you kind
• 26:16
  of actually find yourself in the world, just yourself.
• 26:19
  Yeah, exactly. That's a lovely quote.
• 26:22
  I love that. Yeah.
• 26:23
  Yeah. And that's that's a perfect
• 26:25
  description of this film is the kind of you think you're in a
• 26:29
  story and actually you're just discovering like people's selves
• 26:33
  through their dreams. Lovely.
• 26:36
  Yeah, actually talking about finding yourselves.
• 26:42
  Who do you think is your favorite character in this?
• 26:45
  Did you have any like attachment to them?
• 26:47
  Because I know every one of them is unique.
• 26:49
  And I'm going to apologise because I cannot remember any of
• 26:52
  the names, just what they look like.
• 26:53
  So I'll be describing them what they look like.
• 26:57
  In terms. In in me own terms, I've called
• 27:01
  them a couple of people different things to you in the
• 27:05
  Discord. But yeah, because a lot of them
• 27:11
  have their own styles because like you get them when you see
• 27:17
  them as a dream self, they're kind of like all their
• 27:21
  subconscious, either insecurities or what they would
• 27:24
  like to be is brought out in the dream world.
• 27:28
  So every character in this is different because I have
• 27:32
  different wants, different needs or different fears.
• 27:37
  Is there any that you relate to or that you like?
• 27:43
  I couldn't. The first time I saw the
• 27:46
  detective, I was going, what in the Jay Jonah Jameson is this?
• 27:53
  And so he became Jay Jonah Jameson to me.
• 27:58
  And isn't. Your favorite character?
• 28:01
  I, I think he is. I think he is.
• 28:03
  I mean, I, I, it's, it's one of those things that I kind of,
• 28:07
  because I watch a lot of true crime and like unsolved
• 28:09
  mysteries and things like that, I kind of not directly could
• 28:14
  relate to him more, but because of my own personal experiences
• 28:17
  in what. You had a point of.
• 28:19
  Reference. Yeah, I had a point of reference
• 28:24
  that like, obviously I could imagine how hard it would be for
• 28:27
  a policeman to have that one unsolved case that they could
• 28:29
  never get their head around or that they could just not find
• 28:33
  that lead on. Whereas I can't quite relate to
• 28:37
  working in a high tech secret lab, you know, Or I can't relate
• 28:43
  to being a dream avatar. As.
• 28:45
  Much as much as I thought Papika was cool and like she, you know,
• 28:50
  you just didn't know which way she was going to go next in the,
• 28:54
  in the transitions and all that, I kind of feel like I related to
• 28:58
  the policeman more. He had.
• 29:01
  He had a lot of what the fuck moments is going, what's going
• 29:04
  on? He did and he kind of like acted
• 29:06
  almost like a bit of a guide for the audience who were also going
• 29:10
  what the fuck's going on? For me, I really like to Toshi
• 29:14
  as as the and Paprika. They're the same person but
• 29:19
  different personalities. And I thought it was interesting
• 29:23
  for because so like I've like what have worked in healthcare
• 29:26
  and have worked with psychologists and psychiatrists.
• 29:29
  And I think one of the things that I have noticed is they are
• 29:33
  incredibly boundaried and incredibly, it's just part, it's
• 29:37
  part you, you have to be, I think to be able to do that job.
• 29:39
  And I thought the way that they that he had portrayed Latoshi as
• 29:42
  this incredibly boundary and kind of be in control character
• 29:46
  who has this very chaotic inner self, like this kind of rich
• 29:53
  chaotic inner self who's like very loose and kind of thinking
• 29:57
  on the fly. And it's interesting, I find it
• 30:01
  interesting that they that they are actually the same person and
• 30:05
  having that kind of because, because it's all about dreams
• 30:08
  and reality, that kind of duality of personality.
• 30:14
  You have like the. Person that you know at work
• 30:17
  versus the person that you feel like you are at home by
• 30:21
  yourself, Yeah. I kind of feel like maybe
• 30:24
  because Paprika was her other half in the dream world, that
• 30:27
  maybe she kind of dreamt of having a more carefree life and
• 30:30
  that's kind of where where Paprika came from on that side
• 30:33
  of things. Yeah, I think so.
• 30:36
  I think so. And I think also it's impossible
• 30:40
  to maintain that level of control.
• 30:42
  So like, like it has a place and a purpose.
• 30:46
  And for. Yeah, for her day job, it's
• 30:49
  really important that she is in control because she's, yeah, top
• 30:52
  secret lab star Dr. You've got to kind of have a game face.
• 30:59
  And I think and she kind of loses control of paprika.
• 31:02
  And I think it's that, like, you know, when you don't like feed
• 31:05
  your inner, your inner self enough, sometimes it just starts
• 31:09
  taking over. Yeah, because it was, there was
• 31:12
  that. Exchange where she was just
• 31:14
  like. Which where she was just like,
• 31:17
  oh, but you're you're part of me and like, why?
• 31:20
  Why don't you listen to us? And she was like, what?
• 31:22
  What's to make you say that you're not part of me kind of
• 31:24
  thing. The opposite, yeah.
• 31:27
  Is paprika the intrusive thought?
• 31:30
  Yeah, or is. Yeah, impulsiveness.
• 31:33
  Yeah. Or is Paprika the real version
• 31:35
  of Doctor Otoshi? And Dr. Otoshi is just the like
• 31:40
  the the facet, the kind of single part of Paprika who is
• 31:45
  the whole it's you, like they and they and you have like the.
• 31:48
  I think it's deliberately ambiguous, isn't it?
• 31:50
  Because you're I think as an audience you're supposed to take
• 31:52
  what is meaningful to you rather than it be spoon fed to you.
• 31:57
  It's a very philosophical argument that you could have for
• 31:59
  both beers there. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 32:02
  And I think both ways would be entirely right as well, which I
• 32:05
  kind of love. Like, like there is no right or
• 32:07
  wrong answer in this one. It's everyone can walk away.
• 32:11
  Yeah, with their own version of it.
• 32:14
  Yeah, you see, I've, I've viewed the the paprika as a as a very
• 32:20
  exaggerated opposite of her. So it was like it was kind of
• 32:24
  like what she wanted to be more like.
• 32:27
  But to an extreme, like I've noticed that all the different
• 32:33
  dream sequences, they're all to the extreme, like the altar
• 32:37
  selves, whether they're the big guy scientist in stuck inside a
• 32:41
  robot, giant robot or yeah, yeah, I was Professor X and he's
• 32:48
  he was a giant man who can walk because he's in a wheelchair.
• 32:51
  Tentacles. And also at times there's a tree
• 32:54
  like this kind of, I mean, it's the tree tentacles are creepy.
• 33:01
  And there are moments in this which which are unnerving
• 33:04
  because dreams aren't always like happy and light.
• 33:07
  There's like there is a darkness to this film as well.
• 33:11
  But like, that weird contrast between his dream being this
• 33:14
  like, beautiful natural forest and then him being like this
• 33:21
  kind of very like, like huge capitalist figure.
• 33:26
  He's the CEO. Do you know what I mean?
• 33:29
  He's probably a powerful man. Yeah, I thought the tree thing
• 33:34
  again, my interpretation was he was very much against the DC
• 33:40
  mini. He thought it was for leading
• 33:43
  the team that was developing it. He was very anti DC many
• 33:47
  invading people's dreams anti the technology that.
• 33:51
  They're like. And he like he mentions he wants
• 33:56
  to go back to the natural order, which I don't know, just let
• 34:00
  people suffer from mental health.
• 34:02
  I don't know what he was popping out about, but I thought the
• 34:06
  natural order was kind of like a go back to nature kind of tree
• 34:11
  roots kind of thing, like back in the past, yeah.
• 34:14
  Yeah. And he also has this weird thing
• 34:17
  where he wants to take them because his body's no longer
• 34:20
  working. He kind of like employs this guy
• 34:26
  to be his body. So he wants to use the device to
• 34:29
  kind of like pilot someone else's body so that he can
• 34:33
  experience. And I think at one point he's
• 34:35
  like my mind, your body. And it's like this like he wants
• 34:38
  to create the perfect humans. So there is also like a kind of
• 34:41
  slightly creepy, like perfect, perfect human thing happening in
• 34:50
  the natural order of it. It's like.
• 34:52
  Yeah. No one in this film is without
• 34:55
  their hypocrisy. Yeah, I mean, do you know the
• 34:59
  the guy who he was trying body, he was trying to control what,
• 35:05
  what was his motivation? Because I know when he was
• 35:07
  mentioning that he wanted to take over him, he was very like,
• 35:12
  oh, I don't want to talk about that.
• 35:13
  He's kind of like ashamed of it. Yeah, it's like, yeah, he, he
• 35:20
  because he's basically signed up to do it and then regrets it,
• 35:24
  doesn't he? Because he doesn't want to give
• 35:27
  over his body. Because he, I think he becomes
• 35:29
  like obsessed with paprika, basically, but not necessarily
• 35:33
  with Doctor Otoshi. It's with with the dream version
• 35:37
  of her personality. So they don't really go into his
• 35:39
  back story. But what I've imagined is that
• 35:44
  he's been working on the project.
• 35:47
  They've all been working together and he's like, been for
• 35:49
  like spending too much time in the dream and falling in love
• 35:52
  with Paprika. And then the doctor's been like,
• 35:55
  well, if you give me your body, you can be in the dream while I
• 35:59
  pilot your body. And you can have Paprika as,
• 36:02
  like, part of your payment because he kind of, like, has
• 36:06
  this, like, ownership or, like, sense that like, he's made a
• 36:11
  bargain and she's part of that deal.
• 36:13
  And it feels very kind of gross and yeah, yeah.
• 36:16
  Threatening. Yeah.
• 36:19
  Yeah, he's the worst character hands down, if that was your
• 36:21
  next question. It wasn't, to be fair, I think
• 36:26
  even when you see like horrible moments, like there was a,
• 36:30
  there's a moment where that guy puts his hand inside paprika and
• 36:35
  under. A skin.
• 36:37
  And it goes up and then peels are open to reveal the
• 36:42
  professor. That was like, really, that was,
• 36:45
  yeah, that was really awful that because I mean, it's, it's, it's
• 36:52
  very much essay and beyond, yeah.
• 36:57
  Like an intimate threat doesn't. It yeah, it's, it's a very
• 36:59
  controlling atmosphere, that one.
• 37:02
  And it's kind of like it's the I forgot what I was going to say.
• 37:13
  She knows how to get under your skin.
• 37:15
  So to have it flipped back on her literally is, is something
• 37:21
  really unexpected. She, she, I think that's the
• 37:23
  last thing she would ever think would happen to her in that.
• 37:28
  And like, she's just absolutely powerless when this happened.
• 37:31
  And I think she's kind of like taken more by the shock that it
• 37:34
  has happened. Yeah, and you and that's where
• 37:36
  the shifting because up until then she's like kind of almost
• 37:39
  controlling the dream. It's almost like a God like
• 37:42
  figure in it is able to like transition and outrun everyone
• 37:46
  and out think everyone. And in that moment she's like
• 37:49
  that it's reversed and now she's kind of on the run after that
• 37:54
  and it becomes like it's like where the stakes kind of ratchet
• 37:57
  up a bit. Yeah.
• 37:59
  Isn't isn't it after that she transforms as well because she's
• 38:03
  like the the Monkey King? Is it the which is flying
• 38:07
  through the on the cloud and everything?
• 38:09
  Come from. Goku, Yeah.
• 38:10
  Yeah. Which is lovely.
• 38:14
  Oh, I loved it. Yeah, Yeah.
• 38:18
  And actually they have loads of and, and I think this is part of
• 38:21
  like the dreaming. It's like almost like the this
• 38:25
  is a shout out to Tony, who I know has been to a Carl Jung, a
• 38:30
  Carl Jung seminar. But Carl Jung talks about dreams
• 38:33
  in terms of like archetypes and iconography.
• 38:36
  And I think it's very much of that philosophy in terms of how
• 38:39
  like the dream iconography, because you have that, you have
• 38:43
  the Sphinx, you have the fairy, you have like all of these like
• 38:48
  very iconic kind of dream figure or like mythical figures that
• 38:53
  appear in the dream that she inhabits and switches between.
• 38:56
  She's a mermaid at one point. And each time it sort of changes
• 39:02
  the tone of the dream a bit, yeah.
• 39:07
  Did you have a did you have a favorite dream?
• 39:14
  Because I know you've got the, the policeman, you've got the
• 39:17
  the weird doll guy. And which I know you mentioned
• 39:20
  it because no one likes weird dolls and no.
• 39:24
  My favorite dream? Yeah, you get the, you get the
• 39:28
  the boss man who's basically on a power trip.
• 39:32
  There's loads of different dreams you can choose from.
• 39:36
  Yeah, I like, there's one dream that sticks with me.
• 39:41
  I don't know if it's my favorite, like I wouldn't want
• 39:43
  to be in it, but it's the one where she becomes a mermaid and
• 39:47
  he comes up as a giant whale. Oh God, yes.
• 39:51
  That and it feels very dark and scary but also very beautiful
• 39:56
  but and very weird because it's just his face but whale body and
• 40:01
  he like eats her. That's when she became like a
• 40:07
  little fish in a big pond. Yeah, exactly.
• 40:11
  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I quite like the whole
• 40:16
  sequence because it goes from, I think it goes Sphinx, fairy,
• 40:19
  mermaid. And that whole sequence happens
• 40:22
  really quickly as well because she is like trying to escape
• 40:25
  him. So she does lots of different
• 40:28
  changes very quickly and I quite like the way that they morph and
• 40:33
  it like it change it like every and it's kind of the same with
• 40:39
  with other parts of the film. Like every transition is
• 40:42
  different. And like you said, like you're
• 40:44
  never quite sure what's going to happen next because you're not
• 40:46
  sure how it's going to shift because it keeps you guessing
• 40:50
  the whole time. And like, oh, is that going to
• 40:52
  be the thing that triggers another shift?
• 40:54
  Or is that going to be like, is she going to dive into that
• 40:56
  telly or is the telly going to break out?
• 40:58
  But like what's what's happening like?
• 41:01
  I really liked like one of the really early transitions, which
• 41:04
  is considering what transitions are in this movie.
• 41:08
  It was a really simple one. It was the one at the quite
• 41:11
  early on where she's going through the office and she goes
• 41:14
  like she's in the computer screen and then walks out of the
• 41:16
  computer screen and puts the coat on the sleeping worker.
• 41:19
  And I just think that that is like, for something so simple,
• 41:23
  it really makes you go, wait, what?
• 41:25
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's where it starts to
• 41:27
  get weird as well, because it's kind of normal.
• 41:31
  That sets the tone for the rest of the film, doesn't it?
• 41:35
  Yeah. Montage.
• 41:37
  Isn't that where she's she's going home from the, from the
• 41:41
  policeman's dream. She wakes up the hotel room with
• 41:44
  him, and then she starts going home.
• 41:47
  Do you remember that rightly? She's she's dipping in and out
• 41:50
  of cause and then she turns back into a normal life form.
• 41:56
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 41:59
  Yeah, yeah. No, it's that's a really lovely
• 42:01
  bit. It's just seamless as well.
• 42:06
  Yeah. Very point from the side of the
• 42:07
  truck into the car and stuff like that.
• 42:09
  Well. But there's M throat throat.
• 42:15
  Is this themes of like critiquing scientific
• 42:19
  technology, like people wanting to go back to the old way and,
• 42:25
  and it kind of talks about incent going into people's
• 42:29
  dreams, but do you think that kind of resonates now with AI?
• 42:40
  Yeah. Because I mean, I know it's been
• 42:42
  on for a while, but you get like deepfakes.
• 42:44
  I know we've played around in the Discord where Lee's made a
• 42:51
  weird AI video of me where it's to say, oh, obviously it's, I
• 42:55
  haven't done that, but it's weird singing yourself in there.
• 42:59
  But yeah, think it resonates it, Yeah.
• 43:05
  I mean, I kind of felt that that what you talked about there with
• 43:08
  the deepfakes, I kind of felt it was there was one company that
• 43:11
  was kind of doing a nice thing with it, which was like when
• 43:15
  there were, I remember seeing an advert, was it on YouTube or the
• 43:19
  TV or something like that where what they've done was there was
• 43:22
  like a little old grandma in our seat.
• 43:24
  And what they did was that brought a picture of our husband
• 43:27
  when he was younger back to life because he passed on and like
• 43:30
  they made him say something to her and like she was, oh, this
• 43:33
  is so lovely. I kind of liked that idea for
• 43:37
  the sake of like, it's like a memory of a loved one type of
• 43:40
  thing. But where it's going these days,
• 43:43
  I don't really like it at all. But the consent thing, I mean,
• 43:49
  if you're going to have this therapy, you've kind of got to
• 43:52
  give them consent for it. But yeah, if people are just
• 43:56
  reading your dreams, you clearly haven't given them consent for.
• 44:00
  That, yeah, I think it's interesting because this was
• 44:03
  made in 2000 and is it 2011? 6. 2000 and one 2006.
• 44:09
  It feels a lot earlier, though the style of it feels a lot
• 44:13
  earlier. Yeah, the styles very unique to
• 44:17
  his kind of film making and he kind of establishes that in the
• 44:21
  90s almost. So it kind of carries that that
• 44:23
  energy thematically. I think it's more relevant than
• 44:27
  it was when it was made. Like it feels like he foresaw
• 44:31
  something. What I think is interesting is
• 44:33
  that it doesn't say one way is right or wrong.
• 44:37
  So there is criticism to be found in.
• 44:39
  Let's go back to the old ways. There is criticism to be found
• 44:43
  in. Let's go into people's dreams
• 44:45
  and, and just kind of and have no sense of privacy and no sense
• 44:50
  of self or like boundary between intimate self and, you know,
• 44:57
  outside world. What I think it does is it's is
• 45:01
  it, is it it's like a cautionary tale of like we have to pay
• 45:06
  attention to this consciously so that we don't sleepwalk into
• 45:11
  situations that are dangerous and that we don't sleepwalk into
• 45:15
  extremes. Like I think I personally think
• 45:18
  the film is asking for progress with guidance.
• 45:23
  So that idea of like, because I think at the time it was made a
• 45:29
  lot of the discourse around like the Internet and, and privacy
• 45:34
  software and, and even like you data mining.
• 45:38
  A lot of that was about the fact that the regulations in Japan
• 45:43
  weren't keeping up quick enough with the way that people were
• 45:47
  using technology. And I think that and for that
• 45:51
  and in our world today, AI is the thing that is progressing
• 45:55
  too quickly for us to be able to regulate it safely.
• 45:59
  So I think that's why it kind of resonates because actually the
• 46:02
  problem still exists. It's just moved into a different
• 46:05
  area of how we're interacting with technology.
• 46:08
  So I think that's the kind of if, if there is a message to be
• 46:12
  found from this other than it isn't reality.
• 46:14
  Weird. I think that I think that's what
• 46:18
  it's calling for. I don't think it's calling for
• 46:21
  no progress or all the progress. I think it's calling for a
• 46:25
  balance of like, let's progress, but consciously and
• 46:28
  philosophically and in a way that isn't harmful to people and
• 46:33
  does consider consent and does consider repercussions of
• 46:37
  decisions about sharing information.
• 46:41
  Yeah. All of that.
• 46:44
  Yeah. I don't think there's much more
• 46:48
  I can add to that. Yeah, yeah.
• 46:50
  So I went off on, I've been thinking about this nearly
• 46:53
  non-stop. Yeah, but I do find it like I
• 46:56
  because I find myself like desperately wanting to use AI
• 47:01
  and seeing it as this really useful thing.
• 47:03
  And I do think like places like therapy and healthcare and all
• 47:07
  these and education, like AI can be an incredible tool.
• 47:10
  And also I see like the the dangers of it really clearly.
• 47:14
  So it is. Yeah.
• 47:15
  I feel like Paprika resonates with me more now than ever.
• 47:21
  I think we've we've talked about it in the discord quite a lot as
• 47:24
  a group. What about EA?
• 47:26
  Because people that are very against it, and there's people
• 47:30
  that don't care until it's like, whoa, this is getting too much,
• 47:35
  you know what I mean? But it's like, I think we've
• 47:38
  always came to the conclusion it's OK to use as a mindless
• 47:42
  tool, but not for anything creative.
• 47:46
  Yeah. Like that's basically where
• 47:49
  where we're at because it's just like one.
• 47:52
  It can never be truly creative or corner of the middle at least
• 47:56
  anyway. Just steal stealing all that
• 47:59
  ideas. Yeah, It should be something
• 48:02
  that is adding to human experience, not replacing human
• 48:06
  experience. I think it feels, it feels like
• 48:09
  that's where we've like, that's the kind of, I don't even think
• 48:12
  we've kind of ever been able to pin it down.
• 48:14
  And I, and I'm sure even in that statement, people have different
• 48:17
  ways of interpreting that because it is such a big beast
• 48:21
  to grapple with. Oh.
• 48:23
  Definitely. So what did you think of Satoshi
• 48:28
  Kun's style of storytelling? Because he does have a very
• 48:34
  unique. Everything's contrasting and it
• 48:38
  misleads you quite a lot or it leads you without holding your
• 48:42
  hand, which I think is very unique, especially for 2006 is
• 48:49
  more like I was going to see like a think in persons that
• 48:54
  way, but I don't know. But then why did we all watch
• 48:58
  it? Exactly.
• 49:00
  Most of it went over my head. Good question.
• 49:10
  Yeah, you go ahead, Sarah. Go on.
• 49:12
  Oh God, this is me thinking. This.
• 49:15
  Is me thinking, I think it kind of like it all really depends on
• 49:20
  the individual because there and how you feel on the day that you
• 49:25
  watch it. I think you need to be in the
• 49:26
  right frame of mind to watch Paprika because there are days
• 49:30
  when I would not have been able to take anything in from this
• 49:34
  movie at all. Now I'm not saying I took much
• 49:36
  in from it, but I took in more than that I might have on
• 49:40
  another day. Some days you just need to watch
• 49:45
  men and muscle cars blow shit up.
• 49:48
  You turn your brain off movie. That's what I call it.
• 49:50
  It's a T-shirt. For you.
• 49:55
  Men in muscle cars blushing up. Yeah, yeah.
• 50:01
  But no, because, because there are some days when you just need
• 50:06
  that you need to turn your brain off.
• 50:07
  But there are some days when you kind of like maybe you've had
• 50:10
  not so much of A brain taxing day and you think, right, I've,
• 50:13
  I've, I've my brain's still got enough energy in it to like
• 50:17
  concentrate on something a little bit more in depth, which
• 50:22
  is when you don't necessarily need your hand being held going
• 50:25
  through the movie and you need to explore the movie at your own
• 50:28
  pace or you need to rewatch the movie several times.
• 50:35
  But but yeah. Yeah, I think that's a really
• 50:39
  good, really good summation. Like I would, I would say this
• 50:43
  isn't like an escapee anime unless you've seen it before, in
• 50:47
  which case you can probably like relax a bit more the first time
• 50:51
  you want the need to pay attention.
• 50:54
  So you're right, go in with the right headspace.
• 50:56
  I think I quite like, I quite like how character focused it
• 51:01
  is. So like, that's one of the
• 51:05
  things that I quite like about Satoshi Khan's work in general,
• 51:08
  is that it's like it's usually more about the characters story
• 51:13
  than it is like an overarching story.
• 51:15
  There is always an overarching story, but that tends to be very
• 51:18
  loose and very simple. And then the characters
• 51:21
  themselves add to the complexity.
• 51:26
  Yeah, I, I enjoy it, but I also, I think watch at your own pace
• 51:30
  is a great, a great tip because my attention span is not great.
• 51:36
  Like I don't get distracted easily.
• 51:37
  And there were a few times where I was like, oh, going to have to
• 51:39
  wind that back because I'm clearly have missed something.
• 51:42
  Suddenly everything changed because I looked away for like 5
• 51:45
  seconds. That's what I found out when I
• 51:48
  tried to watch it while I was doing like a few other bits and
• 51:51
  bobs that weren't necessarily taxing because I wasn't focused
• 51:56
  on the screen at all times. I found that I've probably
• 52:00
  missed a couple of the pointers as to who this is.
• 52:02
  The story over here. It's a story.
• 52:05
  I really think this is 1. Watching in Subs might actually
• 52:08
  help you pay attention. Yes, I I did watch it in dub and
• 52:13
  I had every intention of watching it so before before we
• 52:16
  were recorded. But yeah, unfortunately I just
• 52:18
  ran out of time. No, same.
• 52:22
  What about you, Chris? What did you think?
• 52:27
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 52:34
  I. Thought we'd lost him for a
• 52:37
  minute there. I'm dying in this heat at the
• 52:40
  minute. I was fiddling poop.
• 52:42
  Tell us. About.
• 52:45
  It, yeah, See, I don't know. I don't think I'm going to watch
• 52:49
  it again because I've got what I've got from it and I'm OK with
• 52:52
  that. Yeah, yeah.
• 52:55
  And also I do some of the some of the films just not supposed
• 52:58
  to make sense. Like yes, some of it's not
• 53:01
  supposed to like have a decision.
• 53:03
  Some of it's not supposed to like.
• 53:06
  You know what? I think that's something that
• 53:07
  people forget. I think that's the thing that
• 53:10
  people forget. Not every single movie in every
• 53:12
  single scene in those movies has to have a deeper meaning or in
• 53:18
  comparison to the rest of the movie.
• 53:20
  Sometimes it's all about the overarching story.
• 53:23
  And, you know, somebody's sitting there having a cup of
• 53:25
  coffee reading like, I don't know, The Lancet or something
• 53:30
  like that might not have anything to do with the movie,
• 53:33
  but it might have everything to do with the movie at the same
• 53:35
  time. Just it depends on like very
• 53:38
  much on the individual movie. Again.
• 53:40
  Yeah. And I think you could sit and
• 53:43
  dissect everything of this movie and find something from it.
• 53:46
  I think you could also just sit back and be like, let's not
• 53:48
  overthink it and just accept that it's going to be weird at
• 53:51
  times. Probably an easier watch.
• 53:56
  I think that's what I'm, I'm like because it's like with
• 53:58
  games like multi choice games like say Skyrim or something
• 54:03
  like that, I'll do, I'll do 1 playthrough and then I'm done
• 54:05
  with it. I'm not repaying back because
• 54:07
  I'm like, that's the experience I've got and that's what I'll
• 54:10
  stick with. I know, I know, you guys don't,
• 54:12
  but I. Have very specific runs.
• 54:17
  Yeah. Yeah, see, I'm like because all
• 54:19
  the different ones and I'm like. Those are.
• 54:23
  The critics last name and I can't buy them.
• 54:26
  Exactly, Storm crew. Did you?
• 54:31
  Oh, OK. I I like to.
• 54:32
  I just like complete Skyrim side side thing.
• 54:35
  I like to run the game and not choose sides.
• 54:37
  It's a little bit harder, but it's rewarding.
• 54:40
  Yeah. You can make it through the game
• 54:42
  without ever siding with either with either side in the civil
• 54:45
  war and it's fascinating. Well.
• 54:48
  Do you want to know what I did? You have to be really careful
• 54:51
  because you can accidentally side with them at any point.
• 54:54
  Well I killed orthodox and I didn't side with the blades.
• 55:01
  No regrets. You killed party snacks.
• 55:05
  Yeah, you didn't side with the Blades, so you got the worst of
• 55:09
  both worlds. You got the Oh my God.
• 55:13
  That's my experience. And you stood by that.
• 55:17
  Stood by it. That's what I got from it.
• 55:20
  That's what I take. From IT party snacks.
• 55:22
  I'm a man of my blade. I'm a crackle of my blade.
• 55:28
  The worst thing I do is I tend to like go, I'll I'll come out
• 55:32
  and I'll go and get the Dragonstone and then I'll just
• 55:34
  kind of like bugger off until I'm level 50 odd and then I
• 55:37
  might consider giving the Dragonstone to white room.
• 55:42
  To do all the side quests before I even touch the main quest
• 55:45
  line. I also did one run where it was
• 55:49
  do everything the Daedra tell you to do, and that was, that
• 55:53
  was insane because I did things that I never thought I would do
• 55:56
  in my life. But it's quite fun.
• 56:02
  So yeah, listen to the devil, kids.
• 56:10
  The devil made me do it, yeah. Yeah.
• 56:14
  Right. So I'll, I'll move on.
• 56:17
  I've only got a few more questions.
• 56:18
  Like please move on before anime club becomes satanic.
• 56:22
  Well, Anime Club's going to become Skyrimic.
• 56:25
  Yeah, Daedra worthy. Skyrim.
• 56:28
  Yeah, I've only, I've only played at 11 playthrough and
• 56:31
  that's enough. It's fine.
• 56:33
  Oh, but in one playthrough you killed Partha.
• 56:37
  Yeah, yeah, you looked at this. Funny.
• 56:38
  That's a bit that I think funny. The.
• 56:44
  Blades are the ones who tell you to kill parfenacs.
• 56:52
  If you could enter someone's dream, it would it be.
• 56:56
  Is this in the in paprika or just anyone?
• 57:01
  Anyone you want. It could be a fictional person,
• 57:04
  it could be a real life person, it could be a dead person, but
• 57:08
  they would have to be alive for them to dream.
• 57:11
  Can I pick an animal because I like Eddie dreams and he makes
• 57:14
  the weirdest noises and twitches and body it and I'm like what?
• 57:18
  Like he sounds like he's like hunting something.
• 57:21
  But this, this is a creature who has never haunted more than like
• 57:24
  a snack caught on the carpet. Do you know what I mean?
• 57:28
  Like, he's not like, I don't know what is I what can he in
• 57:31
  his reference? Is he dreaming that's making him
• 57:34
  make those noises? And sometimes I wonder he's been
• 57:36
  dreaming about like what happened before he was rescued.
• 57:40
  Is he dreaming about like the pigeons in the garden and how
• 57:43
  much he hates them? Like, what's going on?
• 57:45
  I. Wonder if he's like listening to
• 57:48
  his ancestors and running away from the cooking pot.
• 57:53
  Yeah, maybe there's also part of me that hopes that sometimes
• 57:56
  you're dreaming about me, but that's because we're
• 57:59
  codependent. What about you, Sarah?
• 58:06
  I've got no idea, Yeah. No, that's fine.
• 58:08
  You don't have to answer. Because I love I have a thing.
• 58:14
  To be fair, I don't have an answer, but I kind of, I kind of
• 58:16
  want to go into Trixie's dreams be turtle.
• 58:19
  Oh yeah? What's Trixie dreaming about, do
• 58:21
  you think? Only.
• 58:22
  Because because you've got a turtle, they don't smile, they
• 58:25
  don't give you any like, affection back.
• 58:27
  And I want to know what to think of.
• 58:30
  You want to know if you're doing a good job.
• 58:33
  Yeah. Does she see me as like, a good
• 58:37
  parent or is she like Molly? No, she doesn't.
• 58:43
  It's a feeder. Molly won't touch the worms.
• 58:51
  Trixie dreams of worms and freedom, says Molly in the chat.
• 58:56
  You know what I think? Probably I, I think I would like
• 59:01
  to see the dream of a goose. Do they really only dream of
• 59:04
  violence? Oh, that's a good one.
• 59:09
  Isn't do geese? Really only dream of violence.
• 59:12
  Because I was thinking, does that all what about I think but
• 59:15
  it was told you, but it was a goose.
• 59:17
  Whether he's goose, Goose's neck is toilet paper.
• 59:21
  Or was it a swan? I think it's a swan.
• 59:24
  I remember that. I think it's a swan.
• 59:26
  Yeah. Because I was going to say it
• 59:28
  would just be PTSD from that. Yeah, were they alive when
• 59:33
  they're being used as toilet paper?
• 59:35
  Yeah, how else would you use them again?
• 59:38
  That feels dangerous. Stuff them and wash them off.
• 59:44
  Yeah, I probably would have gone with theme.
• 59:46
  Kind of like, you know, like a loofah just get like, so it's
• 59:49
  like I'm imagining stuff in like a straight like neck straight
• 59:56
  out. So that's the handle body, the
• 1:00:02
  tail feathers on the tail. Yeah.
• 1:00:05
  I thought there was like you could go from chest to beak and
• 1:00:09
  then use the beak for minutes. I don't think I want an A live
• 1:00:16
  swan's beak near my. No, no.
• 1:00:22
  Never lived. I think that feels like that.
• 1:00:25
  I, I, I I've been bitten to the I've been bitten on my hand by a
• 1:00:28
  swan before which drew blood, so I don't think I'd want them near
• 1:00:31
  the other end. They're vicious, and if it's
• 1:00:33
  geese, it's even worse. Have you seen the inside of the
• 1:00:35
  Hell Mouse? Yeah, the true spiny tongue.
• 1:00:40
  Yeah. I think you've never lived until
• 1:00:44
  you've put yourself in a dangerous situation.
• 1:00:46
  So I've. Been in many dangerous
• 1:00:49
  situations Chris. I just don't need a goose or a
• 1:00:52
  swan involved. There's the quote for you.
• 1:00:56
  Yeah, yeah. So I asked Phoebe before this,
• 1:01:00
  and do you have any questions that want answered that you want
• 1:01:05
  answered? And you came up with, do you
• 1:01:08
  think at the end of the film the policeman was awake or asleep?
• 1:01:14
  Yeah, because I just can't decide and I was kind of curious
• 1:01:19
  what you guys thought and you very helpful said does it
• 1:01:22
  matter? And I was like, well, probably
• 1:01:24
  not. Yeah, it could.
• 1:01:26
  My my opinion was was it kind of resolved his anxiety where?
• 1:01:33
  He yeah. He talked to his dream best
• 1:01:36
  friend as a child and basically said don't worry, I forgive you
• 1:01:41
  for not continue on and finishing the films that were
• 1:01:44
  made because you are living that life now.
• 1:01:47
  You are a policeman, you live action every day and I'm proud
• 1:01:51
  of you. Whatever.
• 1:01:52
  And you eventually got to see started going to see films
• 1:01:57
  again. So with that being resolved, I
• 1:02:00
  thought even if it's resolved in his dream or in real life, it's
• 1:02:05
  it's the same outcome either way.
• 1:02:06
  So it doesn't really matter. But what did you think, Sarah?
• 1:02:12
  No, I like your way of thinking on that one.
• 1:02:15
  He resolved that side of things. And I kind of get the feeling
• 1:02:18
  that he's a bit more at peace with the with the unsolved case
• 1:02:23
  as well in a way, after all the kind of illusions of him being
• 1:02:28
  the victim, him being the shooter and all of that all at
• 1:02:30
  the same time. It's kind of one of those things
• 1:02:35
  where, I mean, unsolved cases, I imagine will like Burrow into
• 1:02:41
  your brain and kind of like rot it away eventually.
• 1:02:43
  And unless you kind of get to the point of I might not be able
• 1:02:47
  to see this, I need a fresh pair of eyes, get something else to
• 1:02:50
  look at type of. But I think he's kind of come to
• 1:02:54
  peace with that side of it a little bit as well.
• 1:02:57
  So the anxiety with the childhood friend and that he's a
• 1:03:02
  bit more at ease with. So I think he's kind of gone
• 1:03:05
  through that and he's awake at the end.
• 1:03:09
  Because the other question I have is that is any of the bit
• 1:03:15
  that doesn't involve the detective real at all?
• 1:03:18
  Or is that does the detective in order to have his therapy, need
• 1:03:23
  a crime to solve? So they like say his dream is
• 1:03:26
  the crime itself. Like that was the other thought
• 1:03:29
  I had. Was that like?
• 1:03:31
  That's a good thought. Like actually does the does the
• 1:03:34
  DC mini ever get stolen or is that all a dream as well?
• 1:03:37
  And it. But it's the detective's dream.
• 1:03:39
  And by having a crime to work on, yeah.
• 1:03:43
  Like. That he's like, that's his
• 1:03:45
  method for therapy. Don't know.
• 1:03:48
  Yeah, because it's kind of like one of those things where then
• 1:03:52
  come back to that unsolved case will definitely as a detective
• 1:03:56
  knock your confidence and, you know, make you go, am I really
• 1:03:59
  in in a job that I can do full stop if I can't solve this one
• 1:04:03
  case? So that would that would make a
• 1:04:06
  lot of sense for them to like the therapy side of it is we'll
• 1:04:09
  give him a case in his dreams to solve and like.
• 1:04:13
  And she's back up and she starts off the film by giving him
• 1:04:17
  therapy. You know, like, is that, is that
• 1:04:20
  the actual, like, is that the entrance point?
• 1:04:23
  And then everything after that is just none of it's real.
• 1:04:27
  Yeah, it's kind of like the initial meeting and then your
• 1:04:29
  treatment plan. Yeah, what confused me is you've
• 1:04:33
  got this Todd Boiled detective, right, who obviously deals with
• 1:04:37
  shootings, killings. Maybe he's not daily, but he's
• 1:04:41
  dealt. With a.
• 1:04:42
  Few like bad cases, and the source of his anxiety is his
• 1:04:47
  childhood friend to not being able to make films with them
• 1:04:50
  anymore. It's funny what the brain
• 1:04:54
  latches on to. Yeah, but but then hold.
• 1:04:59
  On to that stuff he doesn't understand.
• 1:05:00
  I I remember some random ass shit from my from my childhood.
• 1:05:07
  I don't see it. Surely you see more heroin
• 1:05:10
  anxiety inducing things than oh I left me to join the police
• 1:05:14
  force instead of finishing that film.
• 1:05:17
  Yeah, but Chris, those more harrowing things, the brain
• 1:05:21
  often buries them. Yeah.
• 1:05:24
  In order, I think, I think you've, you've got to be of a
• 1:05:27
  certain type of brain to be like a detective or a crime scene
• 1:05:30
  investigator or something like that, because you've got to get
• 1:05:33
  through your life after seeing all this shit, you know, I mean,
• 1:05:37
  watching some of these like true again, true crime things that
• 1:05:40
  you see, I can't imagine being in the place of the person who
• 1:05:47
  is the 1st on scene police wise and sees the absolute horror of
• 1:05:52
  what's in front of them. How do you get past that with?
• 1:05:57
  Obviously some people. Will do it with therapy, but
• 1:06:00
  yeah, therapy. But some people will, will just
• 1:06:03
  bury it and they'll bottle it up.
• 1:06:07
  And I think that kind of that could be why the anxiety from
• 1:06:13
  his youth is coming through because he's kind of buried the
• 1:06:16
  rest of the horrible cases. True, true, Let's say that.
• 1:06:24
  But I can also. See that was that was my only
• 1:06:26
  question I could think of. Yeah, because my my last, last
• 1:06:30
  question about it is so like when we talked about before you
• 1:06:34
  take what you, what you, what you take from the end of this
• 1:06:38
  film or the whole film in general.
• 1:06:40
  Are there any questions that you had after you watched it?
• 1:06:46
  Or is there any like impressions or thoughts you had afterwards
• 1:06:50
  where you thought, Oh yeah, that's really interesting that.
• 1:06:55
  I get very existential after watching films like this.
• 1:06:57
  I'm like, nothing's real, the only thing that's certainly
• 1:07:01
  death so might as well just crack off.
• 1:07:06
  That's the feeling I get left with by this film, which sounds
• 1:07:10
  awful but it's actually quite nice.
• 1:07:12
  I enjoy that few days. So if you 2 like an existential
• 1:07:17
  crisis triggered by beautiful anime, check out Paprika.
• 1:07:24
  I mean, this is I kind of went as I can see a lot of people
• 1:07:30
  switching this movie off early on because they're not in the
• 1:07:34
  right frame of mind. They're just kind of like, no,
• 1:07:36
  this is not for me type of thing.
• 1:07:38
  Yeah, it's a hard watch and I wouldn't recommend it as
• 1:07:44
  something to get someone into anime.
• 1:07:47
  It's not, it's not a first watch anime at all.
• 1:07:52
  I don't think it's necessarily lacking in that, although again,
• 1:07:55
  that's personal opinion. The director clearly wanted a
• 1:08:01
  mindfuck movie, so it will always be that no matter what
• 1:08:05
  you're it's achieved its objective.
• 1:08:09
  It's it's it's, it's likely that you don't necessarily have to
• 1:08:12
  understand it, but you need to just experience it.
• 1:08:20
  Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I I enjoyed it.
• 1:08:23
  It wasn't my favorite anime at all by a long way, but I'm kind
• 1:08:26
  of I'm glad I watched it and it came to a all right conclusion.
• 1:08:32
  But I'm kind of, it kind of left me with a feeling of oh, at the
• 1:08:38
  end. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:08:41
  So. What one of the one of the weird
• 1:08:44
  questions that I thought in me head after after I watched it
• 1:08:48
  because I thought, right, So this, this, it's like an
• 1:08:52
  amalgamation of loads of people's dreams in this dream
• 1:08:54
  world and they're all flowing and then they're connected.
• 1:08:57
  Why is there no weird sex dreams in there?
• 1:09:00
  There probably was. Did you not get any of the like?
• 1:09:07
  The hand. Inside, a woman, when the head
• 1:09:11
  of the department was the big emperor man and she basically
• 1:09:18
  comes to paprika, comes to him as a little slave girl wanting
• 1:09:20
  to express her gratitude and sinks into him and he floats up
• 1:09:24
  into the sky and explodes. Yeah, that's what I'm saying,
• 1:09:28
  sucking everything up. Little naked lady.
• 1:09:34
  The tentacles going into her mouth.
• 1:09:37
  Yes. There's so much, Chris, what I
• 1:09:40
  find weird, isn't it? Chris, did you watch the video
• 1:09:42
  right here? No, not do you know?
• 1:09:48
  Do you know, do you know why? Probably the weird little freaky
• 1:09:51
  dolls like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:09:54
  They get my attention all the time because like, dolls are
• 1:09:57
  weird. Unnerving.
• 1:09:59
  Aren't they? I don't understand.
• 1:10:01
  People. I mean there probably is nice
• 1:10:03
  people who collect them, but I haven't met any.
• 1:10:07
  Yeah. And on that note.
• 1:10:13
  Yes. We're going to wrap up.
• 1:10:17
  Yes, I mean. Chris, even if you look, if you
• 1:10:20
  look at the image you've used for like under our beautiful
• 1:10:23
  faces on the on the YouTube page, there are a couple of
• 1:10:25
  naked dolls complete, like completely naked dolls.
• 1:10:27
  Anyway, Yeah. So.
• 1:10:34
  Yeah, Should we talk about what's caught up next week?
• 1:10:37
  Yeah, so we've got Saturday back and watch Sarah.
• 1:10:43
  If you've enjoyed this chat, come and watch Sarah with her
• 1:10:45
  equally lovely Co woman of not Co.
• 1:10:49
  Woman. Of not what what?
• 1:10:53
  Sorry, the heat's got me doing nerd fest.
• 1:10:57
  That's where the ends trying to. Yeah.
• 1:11:00
  Running. We got Laura Johnson in who
• 1:11:03
  works with the people who organize Nerd Fest for for a
• 1:11:08
  little chat about what's going to happen and that cosplay stuff
• 1:11:10
  that she does and things like that, which.
• 1:11:12
  Is going to be lovely and we also have Rumble cast.
• 1:11:15
  So Jake and Sleep are going to see a local wrestling show, a
• 1:11:19
  live show and they're going to be reviewing what they saw and
• 1:11:23
  it's like a kind of love letter to wrestling.
• 1:11:26
  I'm sure it will be anyway. And any and an invitation to go
• 1:11:30
  find your local wrestling because as Jake reminded me the
• 1:11:34
  other day on top grumps, there's no need to give your money to
• 1:11:38
  the big guys because there are loads and loads of independent
• 1:11:41
  wrestling arenas in your area. So come on to the nerdy up North
• 1:11:46
  Channel for that on Saturday. On Sunday we have the Sunday Pod
• 1:11:49
  is back and they will be doing Silence of the Lambs, which one
• 1:11:55
  of the greatest films of all time.
• 1:12:00
  On Monday, of course, we have Monsters and slasher Ween, but
• 1:12:02
  not to like override what they're talking about.
• 1:12:05
  This week, Sammy has asked me to do a very big shout out.
• 1:12:08
  Please, please, please, if you haven't already, go and support
• 1:12:11
  the Sleigh Kickstarter. They're so close to getting the
• 1:12:16
  money they need. They've got they've got two more
• 1:12:19
  days. So yeah, if you can go and
• 1:12:23
  support them if you haven't already.
• 1:12:24
  Jimmy Simpson, who you all know from It's Always Sunny in
• 1:12:30
  Philadelphia, they've done an episode where they talk about it
• 1:12:33
  as well, which you can find on the I think it's on the Monsters
• 1:12:37
  playlist in the Nerdy up North Channel.
• 1:12:40
  And then on Tuesday, top grumps are doing Man Borg.
• 1:12:45
  Man Borg. Is it a Borg?
• 1:12:47
  It's both, which is another classic crisp pick, so I'm sure
• 1:12:52
  the special effects will be terrible.
• 1:12:55
  The plot will be nonexistent, but it will still be incredibly
• 1:12:58
  funny. There's there's also some
• 1:13:00
  special stuff we've got lined up for that episode, which I'm not
• 1:13:03
  spoiled, but you'll have to watch.
• 1:13:06
  But yeah, making some special effects.
• 1:13:09
  Is Chris Man Borg because of the?
• 1:13:11
  Homegrown man Borg if Chris comes in with tinfoil taped to
• 1:13:16
  his face. And then of course, we also have
• 1:13:21
  Countdown for Doomsday. The next episode is yet to be
• 1:13:24
  confirmed, but if you're needing your to get your Marvel fix in
• 1:13:28
  the meantime, go check out the Black Panther episode, which is
• 1:13:31
  still up from last week, and that will tide you over until
• 1:13:35
  Infinity War will be the next one that they do.
• 1:13:39
  Thank you all. That's it.
• 1:13:40
  I think that's it for promos. I've rattled through stuff.
• 1:13:43
  Yeah. Just to say that the link for
• 1:13:45
  the kickstart like is in the comments and the just the just
• 1:13:50
  under $10,000 off and there's 50.
• 1:13:54
  Hours. Left, so it's like the final
• 1:13:56
  push for it. At the minute it's like I've
• 1:13:59
  I've backed it. Get a shout out.
• 1:14:00
  Once you're done. It's yeah, yeah, sure.
• 1:14:02
  It's like £17.00 for the first tier which gets you the film and
• 1:14:09
  bragging rights. Everything so as well.
• 1:14:13
  Got a love Bragging rights. Yeah, got a love.
• 1:14:15
  Bragging rights, yeah. I just wanted to share out for
• 1:14:20
  anybody who's up in Sunderland over the weekend because Graham
• 1:14:25
  the Velvet Snatch is doing the next Nerdy Up North quiz at Geek
• 1:14:29
  Retreat in the town centre. And this month's theme is
• 1:14:34
  comics, although Graham has said it might be.
• 1:14:38
  How hot am I and how much cooler do I wish I was?
• 1:14:42
  Love that and. The this month they are raising
• 1:14:45
  money for mind. Great.
• 1:14:51
  Yeah, so that's 5 till 8 at Geek Retreat on Saturday.
• 1:14:55
  Great. Thank you so much, Sarah.
• 1:14:59
  Tomorrow. Thanks for coming on, Sarah of.
• 1:15:02
  Course, thank you for inviting me.
• 1:15:04
  It's all right. Anytime, anytime you see an
• 1:15:07
  anime and you fancy watching, just talk about us.
• 1:15:11
  Yeah. But yeah, I think that's it for
• 1:15:13
  an anime club. Awesome.
• 1:15:17
  Hey, break, bye. Don't wait there.
• 1:15:21
  What we're doing next week. Oh gosh.
• 1:15:26
  We might do some pre recording and stuff but next week we'll be
• 1:15:29
  doing Konoki with the mysterious Mr. Paul who has seen some anime
• 1:15:37
  before. He's seen one anime.
• 1:15:39
  He's. Seen one exactly 1 anime and I
• 1:15:43
  think he thought it was mid so this will be It'll be
• 1:15:45
  interesting. One of my all time favourites.
• 1:15:50
  See if we can bring him round. I know I'm secretly hoping he
• 1:15:54
  likes it because otherwise I'll have put him through something
• 1:15:56
  that he doesn't like and then have to hear him.
• 1:16:00
  But if he doesn't like it, we'll all just block him.
• 1:16:04
  But on that note, yeah, see you next week.
• 1:16:06
  Bye bye.