Transcript

Credlin | 7 October · Credlin

0:08
Speaker 1: Good evening and welcome to the show. I'm Jamie Rogers
0:12
Speaker 1: in for Peter Credlin. She is back tomorrow. Here's what's
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Speaker 1: coming up tonight. Three years since the horrors of October 7, tonight,
0:22
Speaker 1: how the world failed the Jewish community in the years
0:25
Speaker 1: that followed and why anti-Semitism has been allowed to become
0:29
Speaker 1: frighteningly normal. Labor's primary vote crashes to a record low 25%.
0:36
Speaker 1: Could Labor power brokers be considering a leadership challenge for
0:41
Speaker 1: a prime minister under pressure? Plus, the fallout from the
0:44
Speaker 1: ban of credit card surcharge grows with the tax commissioner
0:48
Speaker 1: forced into an emergency meeting as small businesses fight back.
0:53
Speaker 1: New South Wales coal mines could be forced to account
0:56
Speaker 1: for emissions overseas in a landmark climate ruling. But has
1:01
Speaker 1: the High Court crossed the line from interpreting the law
1:04
Speaker 1: to making it?
1:06
Speaker 2: The way the Australian law has typically worked in the
1:09
Speaker 2: past is that Australian governments, Australian companies are responsible for
1:14
Speaker 2: the emissions they generate in Australia. Traditionally, the emissions that
1:18
Speaker 2: are generated when that product is sent overseas They count
1:22
Speaker 2: towards that country's emissions rather than Australia's emissions. That's how
1:25
Speaker 2: the whole Paris Agreement works.
1:28
Speaker 1: Well, today marks three years since Hamas terrorists stormed into Israel,
1:33
Speaker 1: murdering more than 1,200 people, taking 251 hostages. Families were
1:40
Speaker 1: slaughtered in their homes. Young people hunted down at a
1:43
Speaker 1: music festival. And three years later, look at what's happened.
1:48
Speaker 1: Australia and much of the world has failed the Jewish community.
1:53
Speaker 1: October 7 should have been a moment of absolute moral
1:57
Speaker 1: clarity that we stand with our ally against terrorism. But instead,
2:03
Speaker 1: October 7 became the breeding ground for a new wave
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Speaker 1: of anti-Semitism that's left the Jewish community constantly threatened and attacked.
2:13
Speaker 1: Somehow Hamas disappeared from the story. And instead, much of
2:17
Speaker 1: the world's fury was directed at Israel. And we've watched
2:21
Speaker 1: it happen. This distinction between attacking Israel, attacking Zionism and
2:27
Speaker 1: attacking Jews has become dangerously blurred. In Australia, anti-Semitic incidents
2:34
Speaker 1: have run at more than five times the pre-October 7 average.
2:39
Speaker 1: Across the country, we've seen Jewish businesses, synagogues and even
2:43
Speaker 1: cars defaced. But still, it got worse. On December 14
2:49
Speaker 1: last year, Jewish Australians gathered at Bondi Beach to celebrate Hanukkah,
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Speaker 1: and 15 people were murdered. So what must it feel
2:59
Speaker 1: like to be a Jewish Australian today? The relentless protests,
3:04
Speaker 1: security at children's sporting matches, police outside schools, security at
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Speaker 1: community events, security outside synagogues. And for many Jewish Australians,
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Speaker 1: These aren't extraordinary precautions anymore. They're normal life. Executive Council
3:21
Speaker 1: of Australian Jewry co-chief executive Alex Rivchen summed that up
3:25
Speaker 1: on 2GB.
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Speaker 3: This is why even on a day like this in
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Speaker 3: a country like ours, when Jewish people have to meet,
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Speaker 3: it's under ridiculous levels of police security because that's the
3:37
Speaker 3: world that we live in, sadly.
3:40
Speaker 1: But how the hell do we allow that to become
3:42
Speaker 1: normal in Australia? But the failure didn't stop at protecting
3:46
Speaker 1: Jews here at home. Look at what happened to the
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Speaker 1: international narrative. Israel saw traditional allies, including Australia, turn their
3:54
Speaker 1: pressure towards them. With accusations of genocide, Israel became increasingly
4:00
Speaker 1: isolated internationally. And Benjamin Netanyahu called out what he described
4:05
Speaker 1: as the lies being told about his country in his
4:08
Speaker 1: recent address to the United Nations.
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Speaker 4: What genocidal regime gives a million polio vaccinations to the
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Speaker 4: enemy's population. What genocidal regime enables the distribution of two
4:24
Speaker 4: million tons of food into Gaza? That's a ton for
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Speaker 4: every person. Accusing Israel of genocide is the greatest lie
4:34
Speaker 4: of the century.
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Speaker 1: And here's the extraordinary thing. In the battle for the
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Speaker 1: international narrative, Hamas succeeded in shifting the world's attention away
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Speaker 1: from their atrocities and instead onto Israel's response. But how
4:51
Speaker 1: is Israel meant to manage the propaganda war when even
4:54
Speaker 1: Australia's foreign minister uses the world stage to direct her
4:58
Speaker 1: condemnation towards them?
5:01
Speaker 5: In the West Bank, the situation is worsening. In the
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Speaker 5: first six months of this year alone, settler violence has
5:06
Speaker 5: driven more than 15,000 children from their homes.
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Speaker 1: And just days ago, Britain's Green Party went even further.
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Speaker 1: It formally adopted a policy declaring Zionism a form of racism.
5:20
Speaker 1: And it backed the establishment of a single democratic state
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Speaker 1: across historic Palestine, rather than Israel and a Palestinian state
5:29
Speaker 1: existing side by side. So think about where this conversation
5:33
Speaker 1: has ended up. A mainstream British political party has adopted
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Speaker 1: a policy declaring the ideology behind the existence of the
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Speaker 1: Jewish state racist.
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Speaker 6: It's not acceptable in my view and in the view
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Speaker 6: of a lot of other people here in the UK.
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Speaker 6: It's shocking, you know, what's actually, I think this has
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Speaker 6: made the Green Party into an explicitly anti-Jewish party because
5:57
Speaker 6: all that Zionism means is the right of the Jewish
6:00
Speaker 6: people to their own homeland. It just means Jewish sovereignty,
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Speaker 6: Jewish self-determination. And if you're a political party that defines
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Speaker 6: yourself against one form of sovereignty, no other, just the
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Speaker 6: Jewish one, that makes you racist in my view. You're
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Speaker 6: singling out the Jewish people and Jewish nationhood for demonisation.
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Speaker 1: And while Israel became the focus of global condemnation, Jews
6:23
Speaker 1: were paying the price. In 2025, across seven of the
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Speaker 1: world's largest Jewish diasporas, more than 23,000 anti-Semitic incidents were recorded.
6:34
Speaker 1: It was the deadliest year for anti-Semitic violence in more
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Speaker 1: than three decades. And in the US, a 2025 FBI
6:42
Speaker 1: report revealed that nearly two thirds of all religious based
6:46
Speaker 1: hate crimes were directed at Jews. And what this shows
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Speaker 1: is anti-Semitism isn't a temporary surge. It's a sustained global crisis.
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Speaker 1: And that brings me to what we saw on our
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Speaker 1: streets today and currently right now. Protests in Sydney, Wollongong
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Speaker 1: and Melbourne. Just listen to the words used by the organisers.
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Speaker 1: Stand with the resistance in Palestine. Don't let Israel steal
7:14
Speaker 1: the date. But I'm sorry, Israel didn't steal October 7.
7:20
Speaker 1: Hamas did. And to me, what we saw today wasn't
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Speaker 1: about mourning Palestinians. It was deliberately provocative. And Alex Rivchen
7:31
Speaker 1: didn't mince his words.
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Speaker 3: They do it on this day because they choose to
7:35
Speaker 3: do it. They want to do it. They relish inflicting
7:39
Speaker 3: trauma and pain on their fellow Australians. They get a
7:41
Speaker 3: sick thrill out of it. These are the same people who,
7:44
Speaker 3: as October 7 was unfolding, and the good and decent
7:48
Speaker 3: were mortified and shocked by what they were seeing. These
7:51
Speaker 3: people jumped on social media and celebrated and organized the
7:55
Speaker 3: first rally to mark what they called the humiliation of Israel.
7:58
Speaker 3: So They want this day. They want to claim this day.
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Speaker 3: Any decent person would disassociate from it, but they're doing
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Speaker 3: the exact opposite. And in previous years, I was asked
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Speaker 3: what message I have for these people, and I appealed
8:11
Speaker 3: to their sense of shame and their sense of empathy
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Speaker 3: and humanity, and I realized they have none of those things.
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Speaker 3: So if people want to go off and do that
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Speaker 3: and celebrate this day and hold anti-Israel protests on the
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Speaker 3: day that 1,200 Israelis were slaughtered and 250 were dragged
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Speaker 3: off to captivity, let them be exposed and let them
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Speaker 3: be damned for it.
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Speaker 1: And organisers were urged to choose another date. And they didn't.
8:35
Speaker 1: And that choice matters. New South Wales opposition leader Kelly
8:39
Speaker 1: Sloan also condemned today's protests. Looking away is not an option.
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Speaker 5: And on this day, can I just say shame on
8:49
Speaker 5: you to the people who held protests on this day.
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Speaker 1: Of all days. Ms Sloan is right. It is shameful.
8:59
Speaker 1: There are 364 other days to protest. October 7 belongs
9:04
Speaker 1: to the victims of October 7. And if we continue
9:07
Speaker 1: to excuse hatred, normalise intimidation and look the other way,
9:12
Speaker 1: we should be deeply concerned about the country we are.
9:21
Speaker 1: More unintended consequences tonight from a government that doesn't understand
9:25
Speaker 1: how business works. The government wanted the headline, Ban credit
9:30
Speaker 1: card surcharges and save consumers money.
9:32
Speaker 7: Every time you tap, those little surcharges add up. Right now,
9:37
Speaker 7: they're costing Aussies $ 1. 6 billion each and every year. But
9:42
Speaker 7: from today, they're banned, saving you money every time you tap.
9:45
Speaker 7: So whether you're at the supermarket paying bills or buying
9:48
Speaker 7: a cup of coffee, the price you see is the.
9:50
Speaker 8: Price you pay.
9:53
Speaker 1: But here's the problem. They haven't made the card transactions free.
9:58
Speaker 1: They've just decided businesses should wear the cost instead of
10:01
Speaker 1: taking up the fight with the bank and payment providers.
10:05
Speaker 1: And now the cracks are really showing. The ATO will
10:09
Speaker 1: stop accepting credit card payments from November 30. They say
10:13
Speaker 1: they can't afford to absorb the merchant fees. You couldn't
10:16
Speaker 1: make this up. But the backlash is now so serious,
10:20
Speaker 1: the ATO Deputy Commissioner for Small Business, Rowan Fox, was
10:24
Speaker 1: forced to chair a meeting today with more than 20
10:27
Speaker 1: small business representatives. But one attendee in the meeting has
10:31
Speaker 1: spoken with the Daily Telegraph and said the ATO was
10:35
Speaker 1: completely unwilling to move on the decision and hypersensitive about
10:39
Speaker 1: the way they've buggered up the change. While another said,
10:44
Speaker 1: we basically got nowhere and there are a lot of
10:47
Speaker 1: bleep off people. We need Treasurer Jim Chalmers or the
10:52
Speaker 1: Finance Minister to sort these guys out. Now, Deputy Leader
10:57
Speaker 1: Jane Hume said the ATO should have already met with
11:00
Speaker 1: small businesses before announcing these changes.
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Speaker 5: I would have thought that this perhaps would have happened
11:07
Speaker 5: before the announcement was made, before the decision was made.
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Speaker 5: I think that that speaks volumes of what the priorities
11:14
Speaker 5: of government are.
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Speaker 1: But today's meeting exposed another serious problem. Small businesses already
11:21
Speaker 1: have payment plans in place with the ATO that allows
11:25
Speaker 1: them to repay their tax debts by credit card. And
11:29
Speaker 1: now with the ATO refusing to accept credit cards, these
11:32
Speaker 1: businesses are now forced to find another way to meet
11:36
Speaker 1: repayments or potentially risk defaulting on their payment plans. So
11:41
Speaker 1: businesses that did the right thing, negotiated a repayment plan,
11:45
Speaker 1: now have the rules changed underneath them. And the consequences
11:50
Speaker 1: also now flow onto renters. Macquarie Bank ended credit card
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Speaker 1: payments through its DEF system, a platform many Australians use
11:58
Speaker 1: to pay their rent. And Macquarie itself said there was
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Speaker 1: no like-for-like alternative for customers who rely on credit to
12:05
Speaker 1: make those payments. Then came the schools. Some private schools
12:09
Speaker 1: have announced that fees will no longer be able to
12:12
Speaker 1: be paid by credit card. And credit cards are the
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Speaker 1: second most common way that parents pay school expenses, with
12:19
Speaker 1: a third of families relying on them at some point.
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Speaker 1: Last night, a small business owner contacted me and said
12:26
Speaker 1: Westfield will no longer accept their rental payments by credit card.
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Speaker 1: Do we see the seriousness of what these changes have done?
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Speaker 1: This is what happens when policy is announced Without understanding
12:38
Speaker 1: how people and businesses actually manage their money in the
12:42
Speaker 1: real world, the government wanted to eliminate a surcharge. And
12:46
Speaker 1: for a small business already operating on wafer-thin margins, it
12:50
Speaker 1: could be the difference between making payroll and not. Because
12:55
Speaker 1: cash flow isn't an accounting technicality, it's survival. Well, let's
13:04
Speaker 1: head to Canberra now for tonight's political headlines with political
13:07
Speaker 1: reporter Cam Redden.
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Speaker 9: Good evening. The High Court has delivered a significant judgment,
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Speaker 9: the first of its kind relating to the consideration of
13:16
Speaker 9: greenhouse gas emissions for fossil fuel projects.
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Speaker 2: Now this seems to be a novel decision from the
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Speaker 2: High Court and it will take a little bit of
13:23
Speaker 2: time to understand its implications.
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Speaker 9: The court ruled on Wednesday that the NSW Planning Commission
13:29
Speaker 9: had made an error in approving the expansion of a
13:31
Speaker 9: Hunter Valley coal mine operated by Mack Energy. The error,
13:35
Speaker 9: they say, was placing inadequate conditions on the project to
13:39
Speaker 9: consider what's known as Scope 3 emissions, that is, emissions
13:42
Speaker 9: produced from Australian coal that's exported and burned overseas. As
13:47
Speaker 9: a result, the expansion cannot proceed unless Mack Energy starts
13:51
Speaker 9: its application process from scratch.
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Speaker 6: I mean, what is going to be next?
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Speaker 9: Is the High Court or any court of Australia going
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Speaker 9: to shut down our entire mining industry? The Coalition is
14:00
Speaker 9: ruling out further carve-outs for in-demand sectors as it promises
14:04
Speaker 9: the biggest slash to migration in Australian history.
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Speaker 6: Every time you provide carve-outs, there are people in this
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Speaker 6: country who've made a business model out of gaming systems.
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Speaker 1: Well, sure, but you've got control of that, don't you, Jono?
14:16
Speaker 1: I mean, you could say if you were on the
14:18
Speaker 1: skills list and you have studied that explicitly, we're going
14:20
Speaker 1: to give you a carve-out.
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Speaker 6: I do not accept that this is going to somehow
14:25
Speaker 6: cause a skills crisis.
14:26
Speaker 9: Cameron Redden, News 24, Canberra.
14:31
Speaker 1: Well, for more now on that dramatic decline for Labor
14:34
Speaker 1: and a better understanding of exactly what's led to it,
14:37
Speaker 1: let's bring in our Wednesday panel, Senior Fellow at the
14:40
Speaker 1: Menzies Research Institute, Nick Cater, and Head of Advocacy at
14:44
Speaker 1: Women's Forum Australia, Stephanie Bastian. Welcome to you both. Well, Nick,
14:49
Speaker 1: let's go through these numbers. Labor has dropped 9.6% since
14:54
Speaker 1: the election. That's nearly 1.5 million Australians who will no
14:59
Speaker 1: longer put a one next to Labor as it stands.
15:02
Speaker 1: Talk us through what you think some of the key
15:04
Speaker 1: drivers are here, because I feel like there's a lot
15:08
Speaker 1: of things to pick at here, but what for you
15:10
Speaker 1: is the driving force?
15:11
Speaker 10: Well, I think they're clearly losing votes to One Nation principally.
15:16
Speaker 10: And that remains, I think, the case that this is
15:18
Speaker 10: over immigration. Energy prices, of course, a big one. General
15:23
Speaker 10: running of the economy and the effect of these broken
15:26
Speaker 10: promises on property investors, largely mum and dad investors who
15:31
Speaker 10: invest for their retirement. So these are the people that
15:34
Speaker 10: are moving to One Nation. But I think what we're
15:36
Speaker 10: seeing now is a movement of Labour voters to the
15:40
Speaker 10: Greens with the new leader, David Shoebridge, who made that
15:44
Speaker 10: explicit appeal. He said he wanted to become the default
15:48
Speaker 10: party of the centre left. Of course, anybody on the
15:53
Speaker 10: left of the Labour Party will be tempted to move
15:56
Speaker 10: over to the purer party. So this is a terrible,
15:58
Speaker 10: terrible situation for Labour to find itself in, attacked at
16:02
Speaker 10: both ends. If it moves to one constituency, it loses
16:05
Speaker 10: the other and vice versa.
16:07
Speaker 1: You know, Stephanie, there's so much commentary around how it's
16:10
Speaker 1: so dire for the coalition at the moment. They're sitting
16:13
Speaker 1: there at 21%. But Labor, they really need to be
16:17
Speaker 1: looking at their numbers as well because they're in a
16:20
Speaker 1: world of pain. What do you think they need to
16:23
Speaker 1: be doing to start clawing some of these voters back
16:25
Speaker 1: and stopping them from going over to the Greens or
16:28
Speaker 1: One Nation?
16:30
Speaker 5: Look, you know, Jamie, I'm not sure if it's possible.
16:32
Speaker 5: Labor used to be the party of the worker. Now
16:35
Speaker 5: they're the party of the elites. You look at climate change,
16:37
Speaker 5: for example. They're bought into that hook, line and sinker.
16:40
Speaker 5: Yet people in Labor held seats haven't had, you know,
16:43
Speaker 5: I know of people who haven't had peeing this winter
16:46
Speaker 5: because they're still paying off last year's electricity bill. There
16:49
Speaker 5: are mums and dads on two income topping up their
16:51
Speaker 5: pantry at food bank. Labor is so out of touch.
16:55
Speaker 5: But what is going on in these communities? I mean, sport,
16:58
Speaker 5: another issue. I've spoken to so many parents in the
17:01
Speaker 5: last week where their girls are being at risk of
17:04
Speaker 5: being injured by male players or they're losing their spots
17:07
Speaker 5: to male players in sport. We obviously had the big judgment,
17:12
Speaker 5: the high court refused to overturn or have a hearing
17:15
Speaker 5: for Sal Grover's case. And so now we have a
17:18
Speaker 5: situation where girls do not have the legal right to
17:21
Speaker 5: single sex sports and spaces and they don't want to
17:23
Speaker 5: deal with this. They are so out of touch. They
17:25
Speaker 5: are locked in with their elite groups and their powerful
17:28
Speaker 5: lobby groups and they are ignoring the fact that Australians
17:31
Speaker 5: are suffering not only from these social issues but also
17:34
Speaker 5: in the economy as well. I don't think they can
17:36
Speaker 5: fix this.
17:38
Speaker 1: Well, let's take a look now at the migration policy
17:41
Speaker 1: that was unveiled yesterday by the Coalition. And, Nick, it's
17:45
Speaker 1: a real line in the sand moment. You know, we've
17:48
Speaker 1: obviously been calling for this policy for a little while.
17:50
Speaker 1: And Pauline Hansard then today lifted the stakes by releasing
17:54
Speaker 1: some modelling showing that her policy will save renters between
17:57
Speaker 1: $ 2, 000 and just under $ 4, 500 a year. We now have
18:02
Speaker 1: three very clear different choices here. The decision now is
18:07
Speaker 1: who's going to be able to prosecute the most and
18:09
Speaker 1: get the cut through, and ultimately who voters will back.
18:14
Speaker 10: Yeah, I think the Coalition's policy seems to me to
18:18
Speaker 10: hit the ball straight down the middle of the park
18:21
Speaker 10: and get this right. They're focusing on skilled workers. They're
18:24
Speaker 10: focusing on people who will be net contributors to the
18:27
Speaker 10: Australian economy and will therefore be net taxpayers to the
18:32
Speaker 10: Australian economy and will have a minimal effect actually on
18:35
Speaker 10: the economic outlook. But we have never had a guest
18:38
Speaker 10: worker policy in this country, not since 1788. We've always
18:43
Speaker 10: emphasised skill migration. And what we have now is a
18:46
Speaker 10: lot of people coming in for lower skilled jobs, filling
18:49
Speaker 10: up those kind of jobs. That is not the way
18:51
Speaker 10: we've run immigration up to now. And if we go
18:53
Speaker 10: down that path, we end up where we are with
18:55
Speaker 10: far too many migrants. I think that the One Nation's modelling, well, broadly,
19:01
Speaker 10: you'd think it's correct. If you reduce migration, you will
19:04
Speaker 10: reduce rental prices. But I wouldn't be putting too much
19:07
Speaker 10: store on those numbers. I see they've modelled those in-house,
19:11
Speaker 10: as it were. So I'd like to see how they
19:14
Speaker 10: got to those figures, because I don't think we should
19:16
Speaker 10: put any great faith in the accuracy of those.
19:19
Speaker 1: Well, Steph, we do have Senator Nampochimpa Price coming on shortly,
19:24
Speaker 1: but the Coalition has said that they're going to cut
19:26
Speaker 1: it down to 100,000 for two years. And there has
19:30
Speaker 1: been criticism regarding the skilled visa holders having to leave
19:33
Speaker 1: the country and then reapply. Do you think the Coalition
19:37
Speaker 1: should create some carve out so that the industries that
19:40
Speaker 1: we really need here aren't leaving and then having to
19:43
Speaker 1: come back?
19:45
Speaker 5: Look, I think any immigration policy needs to be seamless
19:48
Speaker 5: in how it's executed. That is certainly something that they
19:52
Speaker 5: should consider. If there are issues with people having to
19:54
Speaker 5: come and go, it then becomes very messy and it
19:57
Speaker 5: becomes a message that they can't sell very well. I
20:00
Speaker 5: think what the Coalition will have to grapple with, though,
20:04
Speaker 5: is that it's very obvious that One Nation's led the
20:06
Speaker 5: debate on immigration and they're well and truly committed behind
20:09
Speaker 5: the eight ball in delivering something tangible to voters. But
20:13
Speaker 5: what they need to do is they need to get
20:16
Speaker 5: their backbench in line because you have, you know, for example,
20:19
Speaker 5: Andrew McLaughlin and Paul Scar and these other Liberals leaking
20:23
Speaker 5: and briefing outlets like The Guardian when Angus Taylor does
20:27
Speaker 5: come forward with an immigration policy. So I think the
20:30
Speaker 5: public then lose faith that they're actually going to be
20:32
Speaker 5: able to deliver on this.
20:34
Speaker 11: So.
20:35
Speaker 5: In terms of the coalition being able to present something
20:39
Speaker 5: that the public are going to have faith in, they're
20:41
Speaker 5: going to have to really clean up their back room.
20:45
Speaker 1: Nick, today marks the third anniversary of the horrific attacks
20:50
Speaker 1: in Israel. Yet protesters have picked today to hold vigils
20:56
Speaker 1: for Gaza. Israel's ambassador to Australia is amongst those that
21:00
Speaker 1: are fiercely condemning these protests. There's one right now that's
21:04
Speaker 1: happening in Sydney. What do you make of organisers choosing
21:09
Speaker 1: today of all days to be out protesting?
21:12
Speaker 10: These are sick fanatics. That's all I can say about them.
21:15
Speaker 10: I mean, we remember the shock of October 7th and
21:18
Speaker 10: we know why we were shocked because of the terrible...
21:21
Speaker 10: events that happened in Israel by Hamas, by Palestinians, at
21:25
Speaker 10: the hands of Palestinians, brutal, sadistic, you know, well, we
21:29
Speaker 10: know what they were. And to be out there trying
21:32
Speaker 10: to claim this day as somehow sort of a liberation
21:35
Speaker 10: day for Palestine or whatever else they're carrying on with.
21:38
Speaker 10: These people have got no sensitivity. They've got no knowledge
21:41
Speaker 10: of history, no understanding of the complexity of the situation
21:44
Speaker 10: in the Middle East. And quite frankly, I think they
21:47
Speaker 10: should just pack up their banners and go home and
21:50
Speaker 10: leave the streets for people who just want to observe
21:52
Speaker 10: this peacefully and for people that are attending services this
21:56
Speaker 10: evening in memory of those terrible events.
22:00
Speaker 1: And Steph, what are your thoughts about what you're seeing?
22:03
Speaker 1: We have got some live vision playing now for our
22:05
Speaker 1: viewers at home. But it's a shameful, shameful day, I think,
22:10
Speaker 1: that we've got protesters who decide today is the day
22:13
Speaker 1: to be out there.
22:15
Speaker 5: Oh, absolutely. I think Nick summed it up perfectly. But
22:18
Speaker 5: I mean, we all saw what happened on October 7th.
22:21
Speaker 5: Over a thousand people murdered, hundreds taken hostage, rape used
22:25
Speaker 5: as a weapon of war against women. It was an
22:27
Speaker 5: absolute travesty what happened. And these people have hijacked the
22:32
Speaker 5: capital cities week after week for years since this has happened.
22:36
Speaker 5: And to hijack today of all days while a community,
22:39
Speaker 5: the Jewish community, is still grieving is just a disgrace.
22:43
Speaker 1: It really is, and we'll keep everyone at home up
22:46
Speaker 1: to date on those protests. Steph and Nick, thank you
22:49
Speaker 1: so much for your time tonight. All right, well, back
22:53
Speaker 1: to the Coalition's migration policy that was unveiled by Angus
22:57
Speaker 1: Taylor yesterday, and there were promises to offer a pathway
23:01
Speaker 1: out of the record intake and the pressure on housing
23:04
Speaker 1: and households. Here to discuss it is Shadow Minister of
23:07
Speaker 1: Skills and Training, Jacinta Nampochimpa-Price. Senator, welcome. It was definitely
23:14
Speaker 1: a long time coming, but we have got those numbers
23:17
Speaker 1: that has been released by your team. One of those,
23:20
Speaker 1: it's the pledge to allow 100,000 for the first two
23:23
Speaker 1: years and then progressively increase the intake after that. There's
23:28
Speaker 1: been some business groups that have warned the cuts could
23:31
Speaker 1: potentially worsen some workforce shortages, in particular the aged care
23:35
Speaker 1: and essential sectors. What do you make about some of
23:38
Speaker 1: those criticism?
23:41
Speaker 12: Yeah, look, The Coalition, we have worked very hard because
23:45
Speaker 12: what we want to do is ensure that we are
23:47
Speaker 12: delivering the biggest cut in immigration in our country's history
23:51
Speaker 12: and off the back of the fact that we have
23:53
Speaker 12: dealt with immigration as the Coalition in government previously very
23:57
Speaker 12: successfully and we want to continue that success going forward.
24:01
Speaker 12: So what we want to do is ensure that we are...
24:06
Speaker 12: What we've set out to do in this particular policy
24:09
Speaker 12: is address those problems those concerns in particular in terms
24:13
Speaker 12: of workforce shortages around the country, which we have listened
24:16
Speaker 12: to with small business right around the nation. So it's
24:20
Speaker 12: about strengthening our economy, delivering in terms of the workforce
24:25
Speaker 12: and improving on our social cohesion in our country. off
24:29
Speaker 12: the back of the fact that we've had a Prime
24:31
Speaker 12: Minister who has brought in 1.5 million more immigrants into
24:36
Speaker 12: our country. That's roughly the population of Adelaide, where our
24:40
Speaker 12: infrastructure has suffered as a result, our social cohesion has
24:43
Speaker 12: suffered as a result. But we want the skilled workforce,
24:47
Speaker 12: which is really important, especially where those workforce shortages exist.
24:52
Speaker 12: So we are effectively addressing those issues through.
24:55
Speaker 1: This migration, immigration program. that we are delivering.
25:00
Speaker 12: And also, as the Shadow Minister for Skills and Training,
25:03
Speaker 12: I know how important it is that this is one
25:06
Speaker 12: measure through our immigration, but that we also have to
25:10
Speaker 12: ensure that our Australian homegrown workforce is grown.
25:15
Speaker 1: Another area where there has been.
25:16
Speaker 12: A huge, this has been hugely disappointment from the current government,
25:21
Speaker 12: who has managed to shrink the workforce, which is why
25:25
Speaker 12: we've got these shortages that exist. So if we can
25:28
Speaker 12: do that in terms of immigration, as well as grow
25:31
Speaker 12: our workforce, a homegrown workforce in Australia, that is the
25:35
Speaker 12: aim going forward. But in terms of immigration, we are
25:38
Speaker 12: effectively addressing those issues. We have had the PBO analyse
25:43
Speaker 12: our policy to determine to make sure that we are
25:47
Speaker 12: supporting our economy going forward and those workforce shortages.
25:52
Speaker 1: Senator, I want to look now at this backlash over
25:55
Speaker 1: the surcharge charges. Small business owners, they've been going on
26:00
Speaker 1: the attack and so they should going hard on social media.
26:04
Speaker 1: I even had one business owner reach out to me
26:06
Speaker 1: last night saying Westfield's now not going to accept credit
26:09
Speaker 1: card payments for their rent. What are you hearing from
26:13
Speaker 1: small business about the impact that this is going to
26:15
Speaker 1: have on them?
26:18
Speaker 12: Look, small business has been doing it incredibly tough under
26:21
Speaker 12: the Albanese government. You know, in the last 12 months,
26:25
Speaker 12: almost 40% of small businesses paid themselves less than $ 40, 000
26:31
Speaker 12: or close to nothing in terms of their own wages.
26:35
Speaker 12: We're seeing an increase in insolvencies by the day, by
26:39
Speaker 12: the week going forward. And this is yet another kick
26:42
Speaker 12: in the guts for small businesses. where they have to
26:45
Speaker 12: absorb those costs somehow and for the ATO to then
26:49
Speaker 12: turn around and say that they're not going to accept
26:52
Speaker 12: credit card payments is a cash flow issue effectively for
26:58
Speaker 12: small business because they need to utilise their own credit
27:02
Speaker 12: card payment system to pay for things like to deal
27:05
Speaker 12: with BAS, to deal with PAYG and other tax obligations
27:10
Speaker 12: that they're affected with. So The government really needs to
27:13
Speaker 12: sort this out. The ATO needs to sort this out
27:15
Speaker 12: because the uncertainty is causing an environment whereby small businesses
27:22
Speaker 12: are looking to close the doors. In the coming 12 months,
27:26
Speaker 12: I've spoken to a lot of small businesses who are saying,
27:28
Speaker 12: you know, we've got to the point where we're likely
27:30
Speaker 12: going to shut the doors. We don't even want to
27:32
Speaker 12: pass on our business to our children because it's just
27:36
Speaker 12: too difficult. And they're talking about advising their kids to
27:42
Speaker 12: go on and get a government job. I mean, it's
27:44
Speaker 12: a terrible situation when the private sector's big competitor, the
27:47
Speaker 12: biggest competitor is the government itself, when the government should
27:50
Speaker 12: be getting out of the way and making life easier
27:53
Speaker 12: for small businesses to get on with employing Australians, providing
27:58
Speaker 12: apprenticeships and providing opportunity. It's just a really disappointing time
28:03
Speaker 12: right now.
28:05
Speaker 1: And reports coming out of this meeting today with the
28:08
Speaker 1: ATO and those 20 small businesses, And they've said that
28:12
Speaker 1: the ATO aren't going to be reversing their plans to
28:15
Speaker 1: stop credit card payments. What can the Coalition do? What
28:19
Speaker 1: can you do to get Labor to at least talk
28:23
Speaker 1: to people and consider pulling this back? Because it feels
28:26
Speaker 1: to me that it's an element of them not understanding
28:29
Speaker 1: the severity of what they've done. So how do we
28:31
Speaker 1: make them realise and get them to... Look, they've changed
28:34
Speaker 1: their position before. How do we get them to do
28:37
Speaker 1: it again?
28:38
Speaker 12: Look, Jamie, I think it's worse than that. I think
28:41
Speaker 12: it's not that they don't understand. They understand exactly what
28:44
Speaker 12: they are doing. It's the fact that they just don't
28:47
Speaker 12: care about small business. And, you know, we would absolutely
28:53
Speaker 12: scrap Labor's toxic taxes, ensure that these decisions are overturned.
28:58
Speaker 12: We're going to back in small business and continue to
29:01
Speaker 12: fight the government. We've got Senate estimates coming up very shortly.
29:05
Speaker 12: I'll be putting questions to the ATO and to the
29:08
Speaker 12: government on what they're effectively doing. We've seen backflips occur
29:14
Speaker 12: already in other policy areas. We're going to make sure
29:17
Speaker 12: that we fight hard for small business to get this
29:20
Speaker 12: overturned because it shouldn't be this difficult. But like I said,
29:24
Speaker 12: we will get rid of Labor's toxic taxes. We will scrap,
29:28
Speaker 12: we'll slash regulation where we know that it's unnecessary and
29:32
Speaker 12: it's causing a burden to small business. And we want
29:37
Speaker 12: to make sure that we get out of the way.
29:39
Speaker 12: A coalition government would get out of the way of
29:40
Speaker 12: small business and create an environment where it's going to
29:42
Speaker 12: support them to get on with the work that they
29:44
Speaker 12: need to do.
29:45
Speaker 1: That's what we would do. Well, Senator, small businesses, they
29:49
Speaker 1: certainly need you to be standing up for them and
29:52
Speaker 1: fighting for them. So keep up the great work. We'll
29:54
Speaker 1: chat to you again soon. All right, after the break,
29:57
Speaker 1: we will cross to Tel Aviv to see how Israelis
30:00
Speaker 1: have commemorated the third anniversary of the October 7 attacks.
30:04
Speaker 1: That's next. Welcome back. It's great to have your company.
30:14
Speaker 1: Coming up, we'll cross to Perth for a closer look
30:17
Speaker 1: at the Land Forces exhibition. But now to the third
30:21
Speaker 1: anniversary of the October 7 attacks in Israel, a day
30:24
Speaker 1: of terror that sparked a new era of warfare for
30:28
Speaker 1: the Middle East and an alarming rise of anti-Semitism around
30:31
Speaker 1: the world, including here in Australia. David Ehrlich grew up
30:36
Speaker 1: in suburban Melbourne but moved to Israel in the mid-90s.
30:40
Speaker 1: He now lives in a district that's about 10 kilometres
30:42
Speaker 1: east of Tel Aviv. We spoke to him last year
30:45
Speaker 1: when he was forced into bomb shelters as Iran launched
30:49
Speaker 1: its missile attacks on Tel Aviv. I'm pleased to say
30:52
Speaker 1: he joins us again. David, welcome. It's a sad time
30:57
Speaker 1: for Jewish Israelis and indeed the entire nation. Three years on,
31:02
Speaker 1: what's the mood like on the ground?
31:06
Speaker 11: I would say this... People are very, very solemn. There's
31:09
Speaker 11: a lot of emotion. There's a bit of grief. There
31:11
Speaker 11: are a lot of mixed feelings. People are asking questions
31:14
Speaker 11: still as how this happens. People are still digesting it,
31:17
Speaker 11: not understanding what went on and how it got through,
31:20
Speaker 11: you know, one of the toughest security systems in the world. Solemnity, emotion,
31:27
Speaker 11: grief and optimism for the future too.
31:31
Speaker 1: And I know just last week you visited many of
31:33
Speaker 1: the sites where these attacks took place. including what's now
31:37
Speaker 1: a car cemetery. So all the vehicles that were targeted
31:41
Speaker 1: that day are now all together. Tell us about this place.
31:46
Speaker 11: It's quite a remarkable place, the car cemetery. It became
31:50
Speaker 11: a car cemetery actually I think by accident because what
31:53
Speaker 11: happened is there were a lot of burnt out cars.
31:57
Speaker 11: There were people in the cars who were murdered by
31:59
Speaker 11: the terrorists and then the terrorists set the cars on
32:02
Speaker 11: fire with the dead people in them and they started
32:06
Speaker 11: bringing them to this lot and often it was very,
32:11
Speaker 11: very difficult to identify people in the cars because there
32:14
Speaker 11: was nothing left but ash. Sorry, I'm saying such terrible
32:17
Speaker 11: things on the show, but that's what it is. Anyway,
32:21
Speaker 11: someone had the idea to aggregate all the cars and
32:23
Speaker 11: put them together and create it as a memorial. Most
32:26
Speaker 11: of the cars are totally burnt out as you saw
32:28
Speaker 11: in the background. Some of them, there was a little
32:30
Speaker 11: bit of them left, so they put them in the
32:31
Speaker 11: front so people could see. They actually also had one
32:34
Speaker 11: of the vans of, terrorists, which was absolutely creepy and
32:38
Speaker 11: chilling to see, you know, amongst all these Israeli cars,
32:43
Speaker 11: which you can see are bullet-ridden, burnt out, no one
32:45
Speaker 11: in them survived, nothing. And then you see this big
32:48
Speaker 11: black terrorist car further down. You just have feelings of
32:53
Speaker 11: revulsion when you see it. You think there were people
32:57
Speaker 11: in those cars. They were once cars, made people happy. Horrific,
33:02
Speaker 11: horrific feeling. The stories behind them are absolutely brutal.
33:06
Speaker 1: And it would be so confronting standing there looking at
33:09
Speaker 1: all of those cars in front of you. The Bibas family, David,
33:14
Speaker 1: I really struggle looking at videos of those children. I'm
33:17
Speaker 1: a mum of two young boys and I find it
33:21
Speaker 1: really difficult looking at what happened to them. But there
33:23
Speaker 1: has been a memorial that's been set up. Can you
33:26
Speaker 1: please tell us about that?
33:28
Speaker 11: Yes, the memorial is... Well, as we went to visit
33:32
Speaker 11: it last week, and as our tour guide says, it
33:35
Speaker 11: leaves you with a box in your stomach. It's the
33:40
Speaker 11: footprints of the mother, her actual footprints and the actual
33:43
Speaker 11: footprints of her two children. And he set them in
33:46
Speaker 11: concrete because he said when they were kidnapped, their footprints
33:50
Speaker 11: were in sand and he didn't want the footprints to
33:52
Speaker 11: blow away. He wanted them to be immortalized forever. He took,
33:56
Speaker 11: I think, models of their shoes and made their footprints.
34:00
Speaker 11: So the footprints are actually 100% authentic. And with the baby,
34:03
Speaker 11: you can see this four footprints because when babies crawl,
34:07
Speaker 11: they sort of, their feet face backwards. So he set
34:10
Speaker 11: it as with the hands on the ground, as you
34:12
Speaker 11: can see, and then the feet facing backwards, because that's
34:14
Speaker 11: how a baby crawls. And he set it in concrete
34:17
Speaker 11: so it would never be blown away. The concentric circles
34:20
Speaker 11: are supposed to mark the passage of time. So the
34:23
Speaker 11: closest circle around the footprints represent now. And his idea
34:27
Speaker 11: was that as time passes and the circles, you know,
34:29
Speaker 11: go out, each circle is another year, another year, another year,
34:32
Speaker 11: another period, another epoch, that their memory will always remain intact.
34:37
Speaker 11: So they should never be forgotten. That was the idea
34:41
Speaker 11: behind the artist who did it, the sculptor who did it.
34:44
Speaker 11: When you look at it, you just look. You can't
34:46
Speaker 11: say anything. You know there were these two little children
34:50
Speaker 11: and their mother. You remember the redhead child there. Quite confronting.
34:57
Speaker 11: You just look at it and you don't see anything.
34:59
Speaker 11: There's nothing you can see.
35:01
Speaker 1: No, even just looking at it then, I find it
35:05
Speaker 1: even just quite confronting and emotional just looking at it
35:07
Speaker 1: through the TV. But tell us about the memorial at
35:11
Speaker 1: the Nova Music site. And you've said that the landscape
35:14
Speaker 1: there is actually quite similar to Australia and, in fact,
35:17
Speaker 1: poppies grow there seasonally.
35:18
Speaker 11: That is correct. The Western Negev, which is the southern
35:25
Speaker 11: western part of Israel, is full of eucalypt trees and
35:28
Speaker 11: the area looks very much like Australia with sort of
35:32
Speaker 11: same coloured sand and that sort of thing. During the winter,
35:37
Speaker 11: after the red, no sorry, just after the winter, come spring,
35:40
Speaker 11: the area is full of red poppies because the area
35:44
Speaker 11: is quite fertile. The sculptor there, the artist there, put
35:48
Speaker 11: these metal red poppies down and in the middle of
35:51
Speaker 11: them he put black poppies. He put the red poppies
35:53
Speaker 11: to symbolise hope and to symbolise what the area usually
35:56
Speaker 11: looks like. And he put black poppies in the middle
35:58
Speaker 11: to symbolise, you know, the burning and the suffering and
36:02
Speaker 11: the slaughter which had happened there. When you look at
36:04
Speaker 11: the Nova site, you see pictures, posters with little scan
36:11
Speaker 11: QR codes on them.
36:13
Speaker 5: And.
36:14
Speaker 11: then you can get the story behind each person. And
36:16
Speaker 11: instead of seeing a person, a live person, what you
36:18
Speaker 11: see is just this poster with a stake in the ground.
36:21
Speaker 11: And you read about this person. People just, they see
36:24
Speaker 11: a eucalypt tree very much reminiscent of Australian landscape. People
36:29
Speaker 11: just read about the people and you just walk through it.
36:31
Speaker 11: You have nothing to say. What they did in this
36:34
Speaker 11: picture is at the actual party, there were Coca-Cola freezers.
36:38
Speaker 11: And as you see, and they glued the bottles together
36:44
Speaker 11: that people were drinking, be it Coke, be it Corona,
36:46
Speaker 11: be it beer, whatever it happened to be, and left
36:49
Speaker 11: them on the fridges and on the tables as they
36:53
Speaker 11: were when the terrorists came. So I think you see
36:55
Speaker 11: a bottle of whiskey, a bottle of wine, a bottle
36:57
Speaker 11: of Coke, whatever it happens to be there. It's just
36:59
Speaker 11: like time is frozen, absolutely frozen. I mean, what was
37:05
Speaker 11: a very pastoral and very touristy sort of site, a
37:08
Speaker 11: very picnic-y site, a very family site, has just been
37:11
Speaker 11: turned into a, well, a harrowing experience, quite frankly. And
37:15
Speaker 11: the interesting thing is it's actually near the Anzac, the
37:17
Speaker 11: Australian Anzac Memorial, which is probably about a five-minute drive,
37:21
Speaker 11: if that, from there. So we often used to go
37:24
Speaker 11: and visit the Anzac Memorial, especially around Anzac Day. We
37:27
Speaker 11: used to take the kids there. Now you're confronted with
37:30
Speaker 11: this and that, and you remember the bravery of those soldiers,
37:34
Speaker 11: and then you see the actual sorrow of what these
37:37
Speaker 11: people were trying to defend once upon a time, you know,
37:39
Speaker 11: in the First World War. It's quite a contrast.
37:43
Speaker 1: And David, before I let you go, what is your
37:46
Speaker 1: hope for Israel now three years on from this devastating attack?
37:51
Speaker 11: That's a nice question, a very good question. Israel is
37:58
Speaker 11: here to stay. On a personal level, Israel, you know,
38:04
Speaker 11: every year they have the happy countries in the world. Israel,
38:08
Speaker 11: year after year after year, is voted in the top
38:13
Speaker 11: 10 happy countries of the world, up there with the
38:15
Speaker 11: Scandinavian countries and that sort of thing. Regardless of the
38:19
Speaker 11: fact that they're suffering this terrorist attack and what the
38:23
Speaker 11: Iranians did and this sort of thing, people are full
38:26
Speaker 11: of hope. People are full of cooperation. People get on
38:29
Speaker 11: with each other. There's a lot of intergenerational living. There's
38:33
Speaker 11: a lot of support. And if it's public support, private support,
38:38
Speaker 11: there's the we... mentality as opposed to the me mentality.
38:43
Speaker 11: And that's what makes Israel a very, very happy place
38:45
Speaker 11: at the end of the day. And I hope that
38:47
Speaker 11: that is what is going to conquer all this sorrow.
38:50
Speaker 11: And that is what's going to continue and be a
38:52
Speaker 11: light to the nations and infect other countries to make
38:56
Speaker 11: other countries happy too. The spirit of cooperation that goes
39:01
Speaker 11: on here and that is not going to be destroyed
39:03
Speaker 11: by this horrific terrorist attack. The terrorists are the ones
39:07
Speaker 11: who need to be punished, and the general population of
39:11
Speaker 11: Israel and of the world, peace-loving and good-loving people, fun-loving people,
39:15
Speaker 11: will keep going on forever. But I think that's the message.
39:18
Speaker 11: That's my message. Those are my thoughts.
39:20
Speaker 1: Well, it's a lovely message to end on. David, I
39:23
Speaker 1: really appreciate your time on what's a very tricky day.
39:25
Speaker 11: Thank you very much. Thank you for your amazing work.
39:28
Speaker 11: It's holy work that you do.
39:29
Speaker 6: Thank you.
39:30
Speaker 1: Thank you, David. Well, after the break, we'll cross to Perth,
39:35
Speaker 1: which has this week hosted the Land Forces Exhibition and
39:38
Speaker 1: not without controversy. That's next. Welcome back. Coming up is
39:48
Speaker 1: Week with Kel Richards with words. But first, tributes have
39:53
Speaker 1: flown for the father, an aspiring Army medical technician who
39:57
Speaker 1: died in the Northern Territory on Monday. Corporal Brendan Hannam.
40:01
Speaker 1: was a junior non-commissioned officer with the 5th and 7th
40:05
Speaker 1: Battalion Royal Australian Regiment and died as a result of
40:09
Speaker 1: a single vehicle rollover. Here to discuss this and more,
40:12
Speaker 1: Shadow Minister for Defence Industry and Defence Personnel, Phil Thompson. Phil, welcome.
40:20
Speaker 1: Corporal Hannam's death shows that men and women in uniform
40:24
Speaker 1: put their lives on the line even when they're not
40:27
Speaker 1: on a mission and no doubt his death will be
40:30
Speaker 1: widely felt, won't it?
40:32
Speaker 5: Absolutely.
40:33
Speaker 13: And my heart is with his family and his brothers.
40:38
Speaker 13: You know, this is a tragic accident that has occurred,
40:43
Speaker 13: but it reminds the nation that our brave men and women,
40:47
Speaker 13: whilst training, are also putting themselves at risk. The Australian
40:53
Speaker 13: Defence Force does dangerous things cautiously and it's always sad
40:57
Speaker 13: when tragedy strikes and we lose someone during training.
41:01
Speaker 1: Do you think Defence does enough to prevent training deaths
41:04
Speaker 1: like this one?
41:06
Speaker 13: I think that Defence has a lot of guardrails up
41:10
Speaker 13: in general, but we've got to also remember that we
41:16
Speaker 13: want people to train how they will fight. And being
41:21
Speaker 13: in the ADF, being in the Army, it is inherently risky.
41:25
Speaker 13: I know from my time in one area, based in Townsville,
41:29
Speaker 13: You do risky things, you do dangerous things cautiously and
41:33
Speaker 13: sometimes tragedy happens and sometimes people get injured and in
41:38
Speaker 13: this case someone has lost their life and that is
41:40
Speaker 13: something that no one will ever forget and his unit,
41:46
Speaker 13: his friends, his family, they'll always be with them in
41:49
Speaker 13: their heart. We want to make sure that when we
41:52
Speaker 13: are training we are doing it in a manner that
41:55
Speaker 13: is safe or safe enough what it can be for
41:59
Speaker 13: military training. But right now my focus is on providing
42:04
Speaker 13: any support that is needed to those that he's served
42:06
Speaker 13: with and his family.
42:09
Speaker 1: Well, Phil, you've been in Perth where the Land Forces
42:12
Speaker 1: exhibition has been hosted and we've seen protesters yet again,
42:16
Speaker 1: although they weren't as many as what we saw last
42:19
Speaker 1: time when it was in Melbourne. But organisers, they were
42:22
Speaker 1: ready this time around. But just tell us why this
42:25
Speaker 1: convention is so important.
42:29
Speaker 13: Well, it's important to showcase military defence industry from not
42:35
Speaker 13: just Australia, but around the world. And we as a
42:38
Speaker 13: small island nation need to have a very capable defence
42:43
Speaker 13: industry and defence force. We have the bravest, most equipped
42:49
Speaker 13: and smartest men and women that I think in any
42:52
Speaker 13: military around the world. But I want to make sure
42:55
Speaker 13: that they have the best equipment because if the balloon
42:57
Speaker 13: goes up, whether it's overseas or on our shore, they
43:00
Speaker 13: need to be able to fight. They need to be
43:02
Speaker 13: able to win. They need to be the most lethal
43:05
Speaker 13: on the battlefield. So having defence industry showcase what they
43:11
Speaker 13: could have or what they could have that is different
43:14
Speaker 13: I think, is extremely important. But it's more important that
43:17
Speaker 13: the end user, the warfighter, the person that uses the equipment,
43:20
Speaker 13: is on the ground looking at it and saying, this
43:23
Speaker 13: is what we would like. It was a bit disappointing
43:25
Speaker 13: to see Richard Miles and Pat Conroy, the Labor ministers
43:28
Speaker 13: in charge, run up and down the corridor very quickly
43:34
Speaker 13: and then get out of there. They didn't spend much
43:35
Speaker 13: time on the ground speaking to the end user or
43:38
Speaker 13: to defence industry. And I think That highlights what defence
43:41
Speaker 13: industry has been telling me and my colleagues like James
43:44
Speaker 13: Patterson and Leah Bly that the money seems like it's
43:46
Speaker 13: tied up elsewhere. And that's quite disappointing.
43:50
Speaker 1: Well, tell us, when you have been at this expo,
43:54
Speaker 1: is Australia leading the pack here in any area when
43:57
Speaker 1: it comes to Arsenal or any of the machinery that
44:02
Speaker 1: people can learn from us?
44:05
Speaker 13: Yeah, definitely around some areas. some drone defence side. We
44:09
Speaker 13: have some very capable organisations that have worked around the
44:13
Speaker 13: world in defence of drones and drones are the the
44:17
Speaker 13: new frontier at the moment on the battle space. So
44:20
Speaker 13: I would like to see more of these organisations used
44:25
Speaker 13: by the Australian Defence Force and through the Minister's office
44:29
Speaker 13: rather than other nations picking up these contracts. But these
44:33
Speaker 13: defence industry capability shows, you know, very large ones, showcase
44:38
Speaker 13: the SMEs, the small businesses who are the experts, all
44:42
Speaker 13: the way to the primes. But it's really great to
44:44
Speaker 13: see them when they start working together and putting the
44:47
Speaker 13: end user at the forefront of any decisions.
44:51
Speaker 1: Just quickly, Phil, it seems as though some momentum is
44:54
Speaker 1: shifting on Labor's unpopular fire sale of these defence assets.
44:59
Speaker 1: Do you think there's a chance that Victoria Barracks and
45:01
Speaker 1: some of these other sites, like HMAS Penguin and Lancer Barracks,
45:04
Speaker 1: could be saved?
45:06
Speaker 13: Well, I'd hope so. I think Richard Miles, Labor's Defence Minister,
45:10
Speaker 13: made some terrible comments that are very uneducated and something
45:13
Speaker 13: that is quite unbecoming of the Defence Minister, calling... Victoria Barracks,
45:17
Speaker 13: an old wine cellar. You know, this is our history
45:20
Speaker 13: that he's talking about. This is something that shouldn't be
45:22
Speaker 13: at a fire sale to rush out the door to
45:25
Speaker 13: prop up a bad budget. I'd hope that they will
45:28
Speaker 13: listen to the Coalition and to veterans and Defence Force
45:30
Speaker 13: members around the country and stop this fire sale of
45:33
Speaker 13: our Defence Force estates.
45:36
Speaker 1: And for all the viewers out there, there is a
45:38
Speaker 1: rally to save HMAS Penguin on Sunday in Balmoral and
45:41
Speaker 1: Senator Paterson has a petition on his website. And I
45:44
Speaker 1: had a look this afternoon and there's been more than
45:47
Speaker 1: 100,000 people that have signed it. So the fight is
45:49
Speaker 1: certainly not going to stop. Phil Thompson will speak to
45:52
Speaker 1: you again soon.
45:54
Speaker 9: All right.
45:55
Speaker 1: After the break, there is plenty of words to get
45:57
Speaker 1: through with Kel Richards. All right, let's get into it
46:06
Speaker 1: with our resident wordsmith and News24 presenter, Kel Richards. Kel, welcome.
46:12
Speaker 1: I've had a little bit of a look and there's
46:13
Speaker 1: some great, great words in here. Let's start off with
46:17
Speaker 1: Bruce wants to know the meaning behind back in a
46:20
Speaker 1: jiffy and why we say it.
46:22
Speaker 8: Well, it all revolves around the idea of using the
46:25
Speaker 8: word jiffy to mean a very short period of time.
46:28
Speaker 8: It was suggested to me it might come from Jiffy Firelighters,
46:30
Speaker 8: which is a lovely idea, but they were only invented,
46:33
Speaker 8: I have to tell you, in 1972. And the word
46:36
Speaker 8: Jiffy for a short period of time goes back to 1780,
46:40
Speaker 8: well before that. It started off as... Now, there are
46:43
Speaker 8: a whole lot of theories. I've got to say that
46:45
Speaker 8: other people will give you different theories. This is the
46:47
Speaker 8: one that appeals to me and I think is right.
46:49
Speaker 8: It started off as thieves slang for lightning. Lightning. So
46:53
Speaker 8: a thief who was very quick at nipping in and
46:55
Speaker 8: out of a house would say, I'll be in and
46:56
Speaker 8: out like lightning or in and out in a jiffy.
46:59
Speaker 8: Jiffy meaning lightning. So something very fast and very brief,
47:04
Speaker 8: like a flash of lightning. And I think it migrated
47:07
Speaker 8: from thief slang into our our main language. And the
47:10
Speaker 8: electronics industry has these days given it a specific number.
47:14
Speaker 8: According to the electronics people, a jiffy is now exactly
47:17
Speaker 8: 1 60th of a second. So when you're offering to
47:20
Speaker 8: do something in a jiffy, you know how long you're
47:22
Speaker 8: offering to do it in.
47:23
Speaker 1: Oh, I love it. The other one's from Graham, and
47:26
Speaker 1: he said that he spotted a beer called a brouhaha. Now,
47:29
Speaker 1: obviously a bit of a play on words, but what's
47:31
Speaker 1: the story behind it?
47:32
Speaker 8: A brouhaha is interesting. It's been in French since the
47:35
Speaker 8: 16th century, but only came into English around 1890 in
47:38
Speaker 8: a book by Oliver Wendell Holmes. And in French, it
47:41
Speaker 8: was used in drama on stage. And when the devil
47:45
Speaker 8: appeared on stage, his cry would be brouhaha. And there
47:50
Speaker 8: are two theories. One is, and the one that I
47:52
Speaker 8: think is correct is, it probably comes from a Hebrew word,
47:55
Speaker 8: which meant welcome. And it was the idea of the
47:57
Speaker 8: devil welcoming you or inviting you into his realm. The
48:00
Speaker 8: alternative suggestion, which I don't, I think it's unlikely. It
48:04
Speaker 8: says it comes from the bull baiting arena and was
48:06
Speaker 8: a taunt at the bull and is based on the
48:08
Speaker 8: Spanish-Italian word bravo. But I like the other explanations. It
48:12
Speaker 8: started off as the devil doing this brouhaha. Consequently, anything
48:16
Speaker 8: which is a riotous mess is a bit of a brouhaha.
48:19
Speaker 8: And the idea of a brewing company labelling their brew
48:23
Speaker 8: a brouhaha is just really, really clever. Well done.
48:27
Speaker 1: Well, Kel, love it. Thank you for those words tonight.
48:30
Speaker 1: It is now time for The Bolt Report.