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Inside My Private Coaching Session with Laura Brenner · Tiff Talks

• Tiffany: I thought maybe they're like clips or whatever that we could both use. Like and and I'm an open book. So I'm so excited. I'm sorry for the delay. Laura Brenner: Amazing. Yeah, I love. Don't worry. I love that you're an open book. I'm an open book too. And I'm so excited to review this with you. Knowing you, I think you're gonna Tiffany: Me yes. Laura Brenner: love it. Tiffany: Did it match? are you like, was it like, yeah, this makes sense, or were there any surprises? Laura Brenner: So I'll walk you through the results and then it will be good for you to have because it's a lot of information. So you're gonna wanna go through it probably another time. And then Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Okay. Laura Brenner: that's also why I always like to record this because it's a lot of information. So it's great. You're recording it. I don't even have to send it to you. You've saved me a step here. Tiffany: Yay! Laura Brenner: okay. So great. So do you have it where you're looking at The do you see the page with the round circles and the rings that okay. After that should be the bars. The bars. Okay. Tiffany: yeah, I see energetic pro I see the bars, yeah. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: So we're gonna get to that, but I'm gonna give you an introduction first, okay? And so Tiffany: Okay. Okay. Laura Brenner: what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna give you like an introduction of why I love this for everyone, including you. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: why it's so valuable. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And then we'll talk about w what it means. it's Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: in the context of energy. And it's also about leadership as well. So what all of it means. I'm gonna describe the different energy and then we're gonna look at your results. If you have questions at any point, feel free to interrupt me or let me know. I'm I'm gonna do a lot of the talking for this part because it's a lot to explain. Normally Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: during one of my coaching calls, you're doing a lot more talking than I am. So this Tiffany: Sure. I'm gonna vape at my will. Okay. So just okay. Laura Brenner: Go for it. Yeah. You we need to keep you awake. so yeah, so I'll ask you a few questions. and I'm gonna be taking notes here. So Me do one thing. I just want to I have all these windows open so I can look at the results and I can look at my notes and I can see Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: you. okay, so my first question that I have for you is knowing just after our discussions and knowing what you know, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: what would most wanna gain? from this assessment debrief and the knowledge that this assessment would give you. Tiffany: what would I want to gain? I mean, more confidence in what I'm doing. I know we talked about like the money stuff. I would definitely like to not hold on to that anymore. Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: and I think that generally just more confidence in knowing that what I'm doing is I don't know. I mean I guess that's the main thing is like the the money piece and the Yeah. Laura Brenner: S th but something about confidence came up twice also. Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: And actually you know what? I wrote it down and you said it exactly the same both times. You said confidence in what I'm doing. So Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: maybe some direction or something and feeling like is that what you mean by what I'm doing? Tiffany: I think like What do I mean? how can I get really specific? I am very confident in the message, but I still have a lot of I get bogged down in the is this gonna work? Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: am I am I just playing? You know, like that's kind of what my mom thinks, like that I'm just playing and that I need to get back to like serious work and real work. And and I think like there's that that whole thing about like you need to suffer to be successful. so I guess like confidence in the fact that this can be fun and successful. And confidence in myself to trust that this will become something that I am proud of both in terms of impact and in terms of financial like return. Laura Brenner: my next question is: Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: if that could impact specific areas of your life, what would you most want it to impact? I'm hearing money, I'm hearing career. and then your perspective on things also and success and Tiffany: Yeah, and I think yeah, I think success, I you know, I'm still very much in that grind, like the ha you have to suffer. my w you know, that one of the questions on there was like, I am satisfied with my work life balance. And I didn't know how to answer it because I'm having so much fun. Like Laura Brenner: Yeah. Tiffany: I am very satisfied, but like I don't feel like I'm being a very good mom. Cause, you know, like I only have my kids half the time. And when they're here, I have such a hard time. We've talked about it, like the whole pool thing, you know, like it's hard for me to value time spent with them as productive, you know, and I I know like that is the most productive thing that I can do. So I guess Laura Brenner: Yeah. Tiffany: kind of re I guess like giving myself permission to rest and enjoy them. Parenting is hard though just in general. Like I think especially for a only child that's a control freak, like it's just very chaotic hanging out with them. And it it's hard. and then when they're here there's so much guilt. And am I answering the right like in the right ways? Like I yeah, I'm Laura Brenner: Totally. Yeah. Tiffany: I feel so much guilt. And then when they're here, all I feel feel is guilt because I want to work and I want to be in front of my computer, but they're just sitting there on their iPads or playing video games. And I just sit there like I should go and do something. But like with the ADHD, there's like that. piece of the executive function to figure out what to do, then to get everyone on board and then to get everyone in the car. And then by then I'm like, it's too much. We're just gonna stay home and they're gonna be on their iPad. So I guess like reserving some of the energy that I have energy and enthusiasm, I would say. Like so it's not Laura Brenner: Okay. Mm-hmm. Tiffany: just energy willy-nilly, but energy that is positive and impactful and meaningful and deepening our relationship and making them feel seen and heard and like they need me. Laura Brenner: Yeah. it's so much good stuff to unpack. This is like so much of the stuff. I love how open you are, because this is the stuff I love to help people work through. It's just Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: and so I love this assessment too because it can apply to every area of your life. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: It's not just work. And it's called energy leadership. And I do Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: want to hear how you would define energy. Yeah, go ahead. Before I go into that. How would you when you think Tiffany: How do how do I def Laura Brenner: of def when you think of energy, how do you see energy? Tiffany: Ooh, that's hard. How do I define energy? So what's coming to mind is I I often think about myself as a stone in a like a very still pond. And so I think of my energy as like the ripples. So How big can I make my ripples? But also I want them to be positive ripples, you know? So like Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: energy is like. the way in which I affect the world around me and how Laura Brenner: Mm, mm. Tiffany: it how that can be used for positive or negative. I can put like negative energy out into the world or I can put positive energy out in the world. And so I think of energy as like How I interface with the world. And the effects that that brings. Laura Brenner: Yep. Yeah. It's like what I'm hearing is it's like a vibe. Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: Right? And I love describing energy as vibes because so many especially dentists, they're so in this tangible, physical, sciencey world. And to them, energy is physical. It's only physical. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: It's like I'm I have enough energy to run a marathon or I'm stuck on the couch. I don't have any energy. But energy is also mental. Emotional, spiritual. And it Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: like it's when when I say vibes, it's like, those patients who every single time they walk in your office, you're running late for them. And it's always the person who's gonna get pissed for you, pissed at you. And then you have that other patient who they're so awesome. And every time they're in everything's you're in the flow. everything's just smooth and flowing and easy. And you're like, I wish one time it could be late for that. Because they would be totally fine and we would move on and I'd catch up and they wouldn't get mad. But no, it always happens to that one, right? Tiffany: Can I can I tell you a quick story about this one coaching patient that I had a year ago or whatever? Laura Brenner: Uh-huh. Tiffany: I always messed up with him. So there I had this whole converse text conversation with him, thinking he was my my trainer, like my gym trainer. And like this whole conversation, like I don't know why. And I was like, he's like, I'm so confused. Like by the end, and I was like, my God. Like Laura Brenner: that's so funny. Yeah. So that's the person you'd want to be late for. That's the person you want to send that stuff to. Tiffany: Yes, he is so sweet. Yes. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And I always love that dental example because I feel like no matter how much you want it, it always happens to that one who's gonna get angry at you, right? And so Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: like I always use it as an example because we all can relate. And it's like they are showing up in your office with their energy. And their energy Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: is dictating how they see their reality. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: So they're seeing their world as that's something to get pissed off at, and that's and and and that's how that dictates their reality. So the person who's like Denny, you Tiffany: Whoa Laura Brenner: would never mind being late or doing that with that person because their energies different. And just like other people have energy, we have energy too. So this i and like energy shows up Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: in our in everything in our life. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And I love and this is called energy leadership. And I love looking at not how we're leading other people, because in dentistry we're like, I'm a leader to my practice, I'm the owner, I'm the leader, I'm the boss, right? But Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: looking at instead, how do you lead yourself? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: So I would describe leadership as how do I inspire and motivate myself? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And that is a reflection. That does reflect out into the world about how and and how you lead others, your kids, your Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: friends, everyone, your clients, your patients. So, like all that stuff that you told me at the beginning that's so important to you, you're seeing it through your energetic lens. Right? And so we're Tiffany: Got it. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: gonna map that out for you and you can start to see. And I love it because it gives you a language, like it Wait till you see. I I'll be curious to see because when I learned this, it was years after my career change. Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: And I couldn't believe how everything I had to go through in order to be successful at changing was going through the energy levels of this assessment. I couldn't believe Tiffany: Okay, let's do it. Laura Brenner: it. I was like, what? And so it really Tiffany: What? Laura Brenner: so but you can see it with your kids, you can see it with your family, relations everything, and it's just so cool. Okay, so any questions before I jump in even more? Okay. Tiffany: Nope. Laura Brenner: Okay. So it this assessment matters because the higher your energy, the more engaged Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: you are in life, and the more successful Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: results you get. The lower the energy, the harder it is to get what you want in life. And and it doesn't feel as good. So we have two different types of energy. We have anabolic energy and catabolic energy. So it's just like science class. This by Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: the way, this is all described in summary in that email I sent you that you Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: can refer back to later. So in science in in biology or whatever, it was like catabolic energy was breaking down destructive, it was cell death, right? It was destructive energy. So Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: I'm sorry, it was yeah, destructive Tiffany: Yeah, breaking it down. Laura Brenner: experience for the cells. In energy, energy that is catabolic is that breaking down, it's destructive, it could be harmful. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: and anabolic energy is growth oriented. Anabolism is cell growth, so it's growth oriented growth growth energy. So it's Very constructive. It feels really good. It's easier to get the results you want. There's more engagement. There's more connection. There are seven different levels of energy. And they're did they teach you any of this in that first module? No. Okay, that's great. I didn't think they did. very creatively, and that's where that round chart you'll see if you saw that in your email. very creatively named levels one through seven. So level Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: one is in the center of that of that graph, and it's like the lowest energy. And Tiffany: maybe this does ring a bell, but not really. Okay. Laura Brenner: Okay, it may some of the fun I they may have described some of the fundamentals. It took me a very long time to get this. Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: but now that I get it, it's just so amazing. so level one is the lowest, level seven is the highest. Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: and if you see that round do you do you have that round chart by the way? Tiffany: it's in my email. Laura Brenner: It's in the like PDF of the email. Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: It's not a big deal. It's basically all that chart is showing you, if you get to it, is that for every energy level we have different we have different thoughts and feelings that are associated with each energy level and our Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: thoughts and feelings r re create they like They lead to specific actions, which also lead to our results. Okay. And level one and two are catabolic. So they're that more destructive breaking down energy. Levels Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: three and above are anabolic. The higher I love the reason I was asking you to look at that chart, but it's so complex, is that level one is in the center. And in the Tiffany: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: middle of that is this little dark hole. And they describe it as ego level. And Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: I think. When I was stuck in dentistry, I felt like I was in a dark hole and I couldn't see my way out of it. And Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: that was like I couldn't see past my ego. Tiffany: I heard. Laura Brenner: And the more you get into higher energy, the more expansive your world gets, the more expansive your possibilities get. so what's Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: cool about this is your energy can shift. So I have no doubt that when you were Stuck in practice having a breakdown, your energy was very different than it is now. Tiffany: yeah. Laura Brenner: And we'll see that. And it'll be fun because I'll want you to tell me where you think it was based on what I teach you Tiffany: Well, Laura Brenner: and what you know. so this is why I love this because people can get stuck and be like, Well, I'm an introvert, so I don't like doing that, so I'm never gonna do that. That's your personality from a personality assessment. This is baby. This is your energy. So Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: it's your attitude, it's your perception, and that can change. Okay. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: So let's go through, unless you have any questions, we'll go through the levels. Okay. Tiffany: No? Okay. Laura Brenner: So level one is what we typically know as the victim level. at this level, it is the lowest level of energy. Like the lowest level of one is apathy. Okay. Tiffany: Okay. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: the typical, like, wait. Two things I want to tell you before I go through these. We use the words anabolic and catabolic instead of positive and negative because the work Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: we do, as you get into higher energy levels, you start to see that things aren't good and or bad. So Tiffany: huh. Laura Brenner: it's not like positive implies good, negative implies bad. We want to Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: remove any judgments on things. And Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: every level has advantages and disadvantages. So Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: while level one is the conflict as the victim level, it's I love to use the example of a d of an associate. You were an associate at one point, right? Yeah. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Laura Brenner: So as an associate, I was the biggest victim. Because Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: I a victim doesn't the way we're objectively defining it is a victim doesn't believe that they have control over the circumstances of their life. So they are living Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Laura Brenner: at the effect of everyone and everything around them. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And so I love the associate example of it because I remember Over and over they'd say, Well, if you want to be a good leader, suggest solutions when you're complaining about what you want to complain about. And every time I'd be like, Hey, I've got this great idea, my boss would be like, no, we've tried that, it doesn't work. As an associate, you go to your boss, you're like, hey, this isn't working. You're trying to be perky. Can you help me out? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: I've got this idea. And then my boss would always be like, No, we've tried that. That doesn't work. So not only was he dismissing my ideas, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: but my problem wasn't getting fixed. Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: So every single time a new problem came up, I would be like, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: there's no way I'm gonna be able to change this. So Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: I'm not even gonna bring it up. Like, why bother? Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: So if we're looking at the game of life, the life Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: as a game, level one is gonna say, There's no way I could ever win, so why bother trying? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Okay, so there's a lot of here's some feel- I forgot to tell you this also. You may hear some things from each level that don't sound like you. If Tiffany: Hmm. Laura Brenner: you hear things that do, go ahead and just note it somewhere because when I break, I'll ask you for examples and we'll talk about it so you can really absorb it. Tiffany: Okay. Okay. Laura Brenner: But here are some feelings that go along with level one. One you just said guilt, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: shame, worry. it's regretting. It's like thinking like thinking back on something you did or said and wishing you acted differently. it's Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: having trouble making decisions. avoiding decisions when you're not sure what to do and avoiding What was it? and avoiding confrontation and conflict. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: so because you took this yesterday, you'll remember probably some of the questions Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: a little more easily. usually people do it weeks in advance. And so by the time I describe this, they'll be like, my god, how do you know me so well? But Tiffany: Yeah, yeah. Laura Brenner: it's like the it's all there in the questions. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: so yeah. So level one is a lot of self. Blame. Okay. Tiffany: Yeah. Okay. Laura Brenner: When we get in it's it and and by the way, let me give you an advantage of level one. It's so much easier to protect yourself from having to take responsibility when things go wrong if you had no control in it. So there can be Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Right. Laura Brenner: advantages. And sometimes if someone's going through a really gr hard crisis, sometimes Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: we need to be the victim and have someone support us. Cause that's Tiffany: Great. Laura Brenner: just part of life. So but it is hard to affect change. When you're in level one. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Level two is also catabolic. It is even though it is s catabolic, it still has a lot more power than level one. So if level one is saying I have no control over the circumst over my life and everything is controlling me, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: level two is saying that also. But where level Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: one is gonna give up, level two is gonna say, I need to fight to get what I want. So Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: it can be a huge driver of success. That's an advantage for some people who have a lot of level two. That would be like, hey, mom, you didn't think I could do this business? I'll show you. So Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: you're gonna let proving her wrong drive you and create your fuel. That's Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: an advantage of level two. So a lot of people can get stuff done in level two. It's just the challenge is it's it's it's what we call the conflict level. Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: So yeah, you can be successful, but it doesn't really feel that great. So what if there's ways you can be successful at higher levels of energy? I don't need to convince you because you don't have a lot of level two energy, but if you did, you'd be arguing with me about this. That's what happens. Like every people in level two, it's like they in the game of life I'm gonna win and you're gonna lose. So there's a ton of judgment. It's black the world is black and white, right and wrong, good and bad. I Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: have to fight to get what I want. You can't trust people, you can't trust patience. I could never trust I'm not a very conflict person, but Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: so if you have more level one, your level two conflict might show up more like an internal resentment. Tiffany: Mm-hmm, okay. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: or annoyance where someone who's more level two is gonna be more vocal, not afraid to argue, not you know, so Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: Yeah, I think that's pretty much it on level two. Okay. Level three is where we start to get anabolic. So this is where we're turning a corner a little bit. And we just want to be positive. So Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: we're taking responsibility for how we feel. we are always trying to see the good in things. If level two is black and white, like people should pay for what they do wrong. Level three is like I can start practicing forgiveness. Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: Okay. It's I'm gonna win and I Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: hope you win too. So there's this new potential for shades of gray, like, maybe we both could win. But I'm still gonna make sure I win. Tiffany: Right. Okay. Laura Brenner: and people with a lot of level three energy, they can be they tend to be very successful in life because they're not gonna let anything stand in their way. they're really good at rationalizing. I'm gonna save some of the level three stuff 'cause Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: we'll go back to that when we talk about you. Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: But they're really good at rationalizing, so sometimes it's hard to see problems when you have a lot of level three. And and Tiffany: Mm-hmm. All right. Laura Brenner: we can trick ourselves into thinking that everything's fine. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: when it's not. This is where maybe you used to be way more in level two and that pain drove you to be like, I need to fix this problem. Whereas Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: dentists who are sitting in level three for their whole careers, they'll stay in for 25 years. They'll reach out to me and I'll have a conversation with them and they'll be like, they'll rationalize why they'll be like, you can hear it. They're trying to stay positive. yeah, you know, dentistry's been good to me. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: It's allowed me to have a good life. I've paid the bills. And then the more you talk to them, the more it comes out that they're like, it's crushing my soul. I hate it. But they've Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: they've stayed in so long. It's a an advantage. They've stayed Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: in so long because they've been able to stay positive and cope with it. But Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: what if they've spent all those years tolerating just good enough? Tiffany: Right. Got it. Yeah. Laura Brenner: Yeah. Okay. Level four in the game of life, it doesn't matter what happens to me. We need to make sure you win. This is what Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: I call the altruistic level. So this is where we're putting everybody else first. we there is a genuine this is really high energy level four. There's a genuine care and compassion for other people. We feel great when we help them. we l like we would rather give instead of receive. we're gonna we we we have a lot of sympathy. Like we're gonna feel sorry for people who aren't as fortunate as we are and we're gonna feel s we feel it's we f we feel s we feel sorry for those who l who are less fortunate and we feel sorry for what's coming to me is like giving bad news. We like when other Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: people are suffering Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: We feel bad for them, giving an injection. That's level four if you feel bad 'cause you care so much about them. It can also come with like a lot of people pleasing and perfectionism. Tiffany: Mm. Are you high level four? Laura Brenner: It's my primary. Is that why you were smiling? Tiffany: Yeah, because I knew when you started talking that this is not me. Like I am, I am not like I let people handle their own shit. Like I don't feel it for them. I can definitely empathize, but I don't get tangled in their but then you've always said, like, I'm an empath. I care what you So I was like, I bet that is like, Laura Brenner: Yes. Yes. Tiffany: yeah. Laura Brenner: So I've started 'cause I never we don't really use the word empath in the ELI and I've started Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Right, right. Laura Brenner: sometimes saying if I'm talking to people who don't know what it is, I'll use the Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: word empath 'cause that is what level four is Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: in the w yeah. So I was wondering, so that's why you were smiling, right? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Did level three resonate with you at all? Tiffany: yeah, I I definitely think that like when you said like responsible for one's feelings and like I'm gonna win and I want you to win too. Like I always say that like let's Laura Brenner: huh. Tiffany: look for the win-win. I'm always looking for the win-win, like whenever I'm even in these these meet and greets that I'm having with all these new people, it's always like I very much come from a place of how can we both find a solution where we both benefit. So Laura Brenner: Yeah. Tiffany: so that one sp spoke to me. And as soon as you started talking about level four, I looked and I was like, yep, that's not a very high one. Yeah. Laura Brenner: Yeah. Right. So let's talk about five because this is Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: where when you're like, I let people own their shit, basically, right? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: That's I can't wait to talk about the difference between three and five, and we'll talk about it when we talk about you because they're so similar. But Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: level five is the win-win. You just said win-win. That is the game of life. And it's different from three because three is saying, I'm gonna win and I hope you win too. Five is gonna say, either we both win or no one wins. Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: Okay, like we both have to win. And so this is why four there comes with a lot of self-sacrifice. And then Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: five is this like we're starting to let go of judgment here. everything in this life, there's a real purpose to everything in this life. Everything works out for the best. everything happens for a reason. We see opportunities Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: everywhere. Like you having so many ideas is your level five opportunities. Okay. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: it's when things go wrong. Being able to see opportunity even if it was something wrong and like solutions. Tiffany: Yeah. I this is very like resonant. Like everything that you're saying is very much like you know, in level one you said regret. Like it's interesting. Regret is an emotion I do not I don't I don't wanna say ever, but Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: like I don't ever regret. Anything, I everything bad that has happened has led to the next best thing. Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: I don't wish I had tried harder in the dental house. I don't Laura Brenner: Yeah. Tiffany: wish that I didn't break my shoulder because that led to my opiate addiction, because my opiate addiction led to rehab, and then rehab led to me realizing I was unhappy in my marriage, which led to me leaving, which led to I'm now with the most wonderful man ever. so Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: And when I close the practice, I'm like, okay, well, this is an opportunity to talk about it. And like let others pe feel like seen and heard and know that they're not alone and it's like an opportunity. Yeah. Laura Brenner: Yeah, totally. And that is very high l energy. I love level five. Like for me, it's just so powerful. and so as we're looking at this, the key to how how do we shift our lives is we shift our energy levels up. So Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: like for me, a lot of the work is to shift from my four into five, and I'll tell you why later, but so will wanna shift every level it's easier to shift up one level instead of going from one to five. Now because you naturally have five, it's gonna be great for you and very easy for you to see that. People who don't like most of the dentists I work with, they have a lot of one, two and or four. And Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: when you don't see opportunities in life, it's hard to s see them. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: You need other people to show you and then if you w even choose to believe them, that's the next level, right? But Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: so this is a real gift. Okay, let's do level six and seven really quickly. Level six is instead of a win just for you and me, it's a win for everyone. So if you feel like I'm gonna use the dental example because it's the easiest of like somebody who's in level six in dentistry is is saying, I love dentistry because it makes me feel good. And and Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: it's like the best thing in my life. I know how much it helps patients and they're winning. So I'm winning, patients are winning, my team is winning because I'm providing jobs for them and they love it too. And the community at large is winning because we're creating this amazing service in our s in our community. That's everyone winning. and it's a perspective. Level Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: six is Everybody, most people can experience it, but it's harder to sustain. It's we're starting to get into the really amazing woo-woo energy, high energy stuff. so this is where we have intuition, creativity, connection, flow, Purpose, trust, there's just no judgment here. Okay? Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: a little bit of the we're all connected type of stuff. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And then level seven, I don't usually do a lot, but we'll do we'll talk about it more with you because I think I don't usually 'cause there's so much work for people usually to get into f five and six that seven's like way it's way out there stuff. I mean it's like did you ever follow Eckhart Tolly? Tiffany: some. Not like a study student of him or anything. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: It's confusing, right? This is he's like level seven. Okay, where in the game of life, there is no such thing as winning and losing, because there is no game. It's all an illusion. Exactly. Tiffany: No game. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Laura Brenner: Yeah, you get it. So that's level seven. And level seven is hard to comprehend. It's something you can experience and But the minute you try to put words to it, it vanishes. So it's a very fleeting experience to comprehend. So those are all the levels. We're gonna look at your results now. Any specific thoughts or questions that you wanna add? Tiffany: No. Laura Brenner: Okay. So you have your chart, right? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Okay, so I okay, so what you see is That upper chart is okay. Yeah, that's funny. Tiffany: I'm gonna share screen. So Laura Brenner: I was I usually share it on mine, but I'll let you do it. Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: Amazing. Okay. So the upper chart. That is your energetic makeup at when you are at your very best. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: So when you're feeling good, when you're normal. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And so what you'll see is your your Level three and level five are tied at 18.4%. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And when you have two levels that are even, we default to the lower level because as humans, it's just easier to experience the lower energy levels. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: So we would say that you have a primary level three, secondary level five. Okay. And a tertiary level six. Okay, so it's a th I hate to s I a lot of times my language says like you're a three, five, six, but it's not what you are or who you are. It's just how your energy is swirling. So Okay. When so a lot of the stuff w that we end up talking about that i is maybe more I don't know, doesn't feel good is gonna be what happens when you're in your stress reaction. So that's the lower box. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Okay. that is Primary one, secondary two. So Tiffany: Ha ha ha. Laura Brenner: when you have a stressful event, Your energy shifts. from that upper box into that lower box. And you Tiffany: No. Laura Brenner: see your level one gets really high, followed Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: by two, and that's normal. Everybody has that reaction. What's Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: interesting, Tiffany, is that when I see although everybody has that, some people have level one as low as 40%, and some people have it as high as 70%. And When you have it at seventy percent, it's it's interesting. It's like these it's harder for them to show up to calls Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: and follow through. So I love doing this with clients because I know if I have a client, this has not happened to me in years, but at the beginning I would get clients who would invest in my coaching and then stop, they'd just disappear. Tiffany: What? No. Laura Brenner: Can you imagine? Yeah, they would disappear. They'd stop coming. Cause it was too hard for some reason or scary Tiffany: wow. Laura Brenner: or they just got they gave up. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Usually the people who are more likely to do that have that a like a closer to sixty, seventy percent level one. Cause imagine if level one you don't feel like you have control over your life and you're trying to change careers, you don't even believe that it's possible. So you're gonna give up, right? Tiffany: Right. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: So that's the only difference. Everybody's a one two. Really. and that's normal. And all of your results are normal. They're based on your life experiences. And when we average the top chart and the bottom chart, that's where we get your average resonating level of energy. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And yours is a three point four two. most of the people that I work with score between a two and a three. And the actual average for many people for most people is a two point four. So I love to say to my overachieving dentists always, even when they're two point six, I'll I always love to say to them, Congratulations, you're above average. Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: You're well above average. Yeah. Doesn't that feel good? You're higher, Tiffany: Yay. Yes. Laura Brenner: you're I think mine might be around there now, but the very first time I took this, mine was a 3.26. So your energy is higher than mine was. Like having years of b dentistry behind six years behind me. So Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: you the this is gonna serve you well. what one of the things I love to think is if we're talking about success in life, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: this is the kind of success I would want to Tiffany: So do you retake it? can I retake it? will I Laura Brenner: Yeah. Tiffany: still have access to it a year from now or Okay, gotcha. Laura Brenner: We would just have to send you a new assessment to retake it. But I, I had I told you I had cancer, right? So Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: when I was forty-four, so it was seven years ago. and so like I took this when I was in my coaching program and I was a four-three six. Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: And then after cancer, I was like, I feel different. Like I did a lot of work on myself to like heal emotionally from all of the trauma of it and the grief and all Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: of that stuff and I did a lot of work and I was like I just feel different. I'm gonna take this again. And my energy shifted my five increased so much that it it came s into second place and pushed everything down. So I then I went from Tiffany: Wow. Laura Brenner: a four three six to a four five three six. My seven got higher like I was like I just feel different. It's fun to see when you get that. So This ARL down here at the bottom is Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: really doesn't mean a whole lot. It's really just a marker that tells us the higher that number is, most people don't get above four on that. But the higher that number is, the higher satisfaction you have in all those fourteen areas of your life that you rated yesterday. Like what was the one you used an example earlier? I don't remember what it was, but Tiffany: I don't know. Laura Brenner: I don't yeah. But your areas where you are least satisfied are financial success, which makes sense, because you said that's Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: what you want to work on. and then after that was leadership ability and your health and wellness. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And so if you're to do this work and do all the things and change yourself from an energetic standpoint, you Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: not only will get the results in your life, but you would come back a year from now, for example, and retake this and your ARL would go up. And and and so it's just a marker to say the higher that number is, the more life satisfaction we have in all those different areas of life. Okay. Alright, so now we're gonna talk about what does this mean in the context of your life. Okay. Yes, that's you're reading Tiffany: Okay, I'm gonna stop sharing. Okay. Laura Brenner: my mind. That's usually when I start and usually when I stop. Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: So okay. Any questions? Okay, and this fun. Tiffany: No. Yes. Laura Brenner: It's the coolest. Okay. So I wanna share something with you that Doesn't apply to you now. It may have applied to you when you were stressed and triggered in different parts of your life. It might apply apply to you with your kids, actually. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: So okay, so but I'm let's see how I I usually like to describe it through dentistry because I am curious to see, given your experiences, if this Tiffany: Sure. Laura Brenner: relates. So This is like textbook. when you have a lot of level four energy. Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: And this isn't to you, but when you when dentists have a lot of level four energy, and I could see this happening very easily with parents, you Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: have a genuine care and compassion for others. It comes from such a good place. You want to help Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: them, you want them to win, you want them to have the best experience. So imagine being a dentist and you're like, I want all my patients to win and I want I never wanna mess up because I want them to Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: always have be happy. Underneath it is a a desire to be liked. Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: So that's the intention a lot of times with level four. So in a way, it seems really altruistic, but it's actually selfish. Right? And so Tiffany: Topish. Yeah. Yeah. Laura Brenner: what happens with that is we're we end up sacrificing ourselves so much, of course I can do these extra six fillings for you in 30 minutes, even though I don't have time, but I don't wanna right. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: what happens is we feel like it's on our like it's on us to be the hero, to fix everything for everyone else. Like They're we're owning their shit, like you said earlier. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: That shifts us down into levels one and two. And level one is like I did that crown prep and maybe I over prep over prepped it the occlusion and I didn't realize it till the end of the prep, and I'm gonna go home and I'm gonna ruminate all night over how I wish I did it differently. That's regret. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: or I'm gonna feel guilty for a conversation I had with my assistant, or I'm gonna feel guilty for messing up or perfing a tooth or whatever. So it's like the worry spiral that dentists have when they go home and never being able to let things go, worry, guilt, regret, that is hand in hand with level four. Does that resonate for you at any point in your life? Tiffany: I don't know, say more. I like Laura Brenner: when you were in practice, I know how long have you been out at this point? Has it been a year? Two two years. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Two ye two years, yeah. Laura Brenner: Okay. Can you think back to when w you were in practice? Did you worry a lot about your patients and outcomes and results or were you just so shut down that Tiffany: Yeah, I didn't do a lot of like I should have done that differently. I think it was like there was fear, like, I hope that patient doesn't call me hurting. But Like I said, regret is not an emotion that I really identify with. Laura Brenner: What about worrying and guilt? Tiffany: Worrying and guilt. Laura Brenner: Okay, l I feel like this would be really helpful. I I if it's not like light bulb resonating with you, it's not. So let's not try to fit you into that box. Tiffany: Yeah, no, no. Okay. Okay. Laura Brenner: But where I think that this could resonate resonate is with your kids, because the nature of your relationship to your children is that you Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: are the caretaker. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Yeah. I definitely right. Laura Brenner: You have to make them win. It's on you. It's all on your shoulders. So when things don't go right or Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: when you feel like you're not doing what you sh are supposed to be doing, that makes you feel guilty. Tiffany: Yes, I definitely feel guilty. I definitely when they leave I feel regret I should have done more. I should have hung out with him. Riker Laura Brenner: Yes. Yes. Tiffany: asked me to watch a movie and I didn't want to watch a movie and as soon as you say it you see his little and then it's like I shouldn't watch the movie. Laura Brenner: Yeah. Right. Yes. So Tiffany: Yes. Laura Brenner: it's like so that's the that is the perfect level for one dynamic. So because when you're in that relationship Because you are the caretaker, it almost forces you into more of that level four. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: So when you don't do what like when you don't put them first, that's Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: when you feel guilty. Right? And it makes a lot of sense. It's very natural. The Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: other thing that can happen with level four is it can shift us down into level two, which Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: is a lot of You know, I can't trust patients because you know, ev no matter how nice they are to you, if something goes wrong, the smallest thing they'll come after you and and like they could sue you or whatever or w if you're with a with your boss, like my bosses treat me like crap. I never I can't trust them. I have to fight to get for what to get what I want. I have to protect myself so they won't take advantage of me. That's level Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: two. But the level four to connection Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: is that like You're not gonna have a lot of this because your level two and four are both low. But a level four two connection would be like I'm showing up and doing so much work for you. I'm like working my tail off for you and you can't even thank me. You're coming back and telling me my tooth hurts. screw you. you suck. it's anger instead of that, guilt. Just to show you the different levels of how they show up. Does that make sense? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Sure. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Laura Brenner: Probably doesn't resonate at all for you. Yeah. Tiffany: No, not as much as other ones that we've talked about. Laura Brenner: And in your at any point in your career did any of that Tiffany: Well yeah, definitely there were points where I carried a lot of uncertainty, I think you leave dental school and how to treat like one tooth at a time. And then you get these patients that have a mouthful and you're like, I don't know if I treatment plan that right, or I don't know if I said that right, or doubt a lot of doubt Laura Brenner: Uh-huh. Tiffany: and guilt that maybe the way you presented it is gonna lead to them not having as good an outcome. Laura Brenner: Uh-huh. Yeah. Right. So there's a little bit of that level four Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: one in there. And so Gonna just sh say how these levels show up for you, cause they're your lowest, and then we're gonna move on into your highest. That's now it's gonna start resonating. But I just want you to get this. So Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: level one is feeling guilty for things you've done Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: and avoiding decisions when you're not sure what to do. Interestingly enough, one of the downsides to level five is because when we you're gonna love this, when we see opportunities everywhere. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: We can get that analysis paralysis. We see so many opportunities, we don't know what to choose. So yeah. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. my God. Okay. And aside, you have to go and see the Elizabeth Holmes movie. Laura Brenner: I cannot wait. I cannot wait. Tiffany: Okay, because like, okay, when you see it, can we talk about it? Because Laura Brenner: Yes. Tiffany: there are so many things in there, like I won't spoil Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: it, but like there are parts where I told Cameron I was like, I get it, because there was a point towards the end of my thing where I hired a financial consultant And I was explaining to Cameron, I kept him on because he made the decisions for me. I at the end, I was, I trust myself so little that Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: I didn't want to make I I had like executive function with the ADHD. I had the mistrust, and it was like I was paying him so I could check out. Laura Brenner: Right. Yeah. So you were in such a triggered state Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: that even though you that upper chart, you at your everyday best cannot really usually relate to guilt and avoidance, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: but you were triggered all the time. So Tiffany: All the time. Laura Brenner: you were in that level one avoidance, guilt, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: yeah, and and You even mentioned some level two things there. So that makes sense. Now, interestingly for you, level two is not that strong for you. But what you do might maybe experience sometimes, and this is what you just said, is that if I don't fight for myself, I don't get what I want. So you were tired of fighting for yourself. You just needed someone else to do it, right? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: you're also level two when con it like if you're confronted by a threat, you're you're gonna fight. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Not the strongest, but there is a little bit of those, right? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And trust. Tiffany: I can't trust Yeah, see this one, it like totally doesn't resonate. Like I am not a fighter and like I I over trust, you know? Like Laura Brenner: Uhhuh, me too. Tiffany: I'm I and and you know, these are conversations I had with Cameron. Like he's like, babe, you gotta like stop being so trusting. This was when I own the office. And Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: I said, I would rather bad things happen to me than go out into the world and be mistrusting of everyone. Like I'm like, that doesn't sound like a fun life, I don't Laura Brenner: Yeah. Right. Yeah I Tiffany: want to see everyone as the enemy. Like Laura Brenner: Totally. Yeah, I think that's great. That is, yeah. Tiffany: Yeah, that that would change who I am, Laura Brenner: Now, here's what's interesting. Let's let's get into your three and five, shall we? Tiffany: Okay, yes. Laura Brenner: Because I there I'm getting epiphanies as we're talking also. Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: But I really want to dig into these in more detail. So level three. the way this really showed up for you, like the strongest, was The you choose no you choose how you react. you're in charge of how you respond and react to situations. Along with that, is that you always take responsibility for how you feel. you accept others as they are without trying to change them. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: You will tolerate I use that word deliberately, tolerate working with others, even if they're not quite up to your level. you're gonna pivot and adapt if things are going wrong for you so that you can make it better. You don't spend a lot of time worrying, which actually is like the balance of level one. Level one is worrying, you don't spend a lot of time, but when you do get triggered, you probably worry. When Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: you're tr well, actually no, it's guilt for you, not worry. Yeah. Yes, Tiffany: Yes, it's guilt and shame. Yeah. Laura Brenner: exactly. you are forgiving. Tiffany: Very Laura Brenner: Yeah, you're an upbeat person. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And you're always trying to see the good in every person or situation, which is what you just described. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Laura Brenner: Right? It's like I'd rather get hurt than see the world this way. And that's really amazing. Okay, let's talk about I want to share about level five because the contrast of these two is what gets really interesting. Okay. So level five was like all the most the your strongest ones were the ones that I think are just so awesome that really, really are so important. So you believe there's a real purpose to life. Everything always works out for the best and that you can you know you can create any life for yourself that you choose. That's powerful stuff when you know that, right? Yeah. You also love the win-win so you like to consider all points of view so that everybody wins. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Then you make the most out of every opportunity presentative presented negative or positive, which is exactly what you did with your Instagram. As Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: a horrible negative opportunity, you made the most of it and made it positive in Tiffany: Yeah. Yeah. Laura Brenner: a really cool way. And you also see opportunities everywhere as you're thinking of dentor match and da da da right, and then you did your ADHD you'd like your printer and all the stuff. Okay, so that feels like you, right? Tiffany: Yes. Laura Brenner: Anything you want to say before I do the comparison of three and five? Tiffany: no. Laura Brenner: Okay. 'Cause this is where I'm curious. Actually, let me tell you a disadvantage of level five. Tiffany: Please. Laura Brenner: But this was the p I was having earlier when you were talking. Like you like I said, I love level five. It's so positive and anabolic and powerful. But there's a disadvantage. Is that when Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: you lose that level two judgment as you get into Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: five and six, you don't judge things anymore when Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: you see opportunities everywhere. Both levels five and six, people take a lot of risks. Tiffany: I am a you know I have a very high risk tolerance, which is interesting because I am with a man who is very low risk. And I we we talked about it once. I was like, are you worried that you picked someone who is not stabilizing in your life and it's gonna because I do I take big financial risks I take big yeah the yeah the Laura Brenner: huh. You bought your the way you bought your practice was a huge just yeah. Tiffany: way I left and was like I don't know I'll figure it out Laura Brenner: Yes. Tiffany: and interestingly he said it's what I love about you because you get me out of being overly cautious and you help me to take more risks. And and I appreciate that about him as well is that he grounds me a little bit, Laura Brenner: Yes. Tiffany: you know. Laura Brenner: Yes. And that's what can happen when you get people in a relationship or business partners when one is up in the clouds. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: It feels great to be up in the clouds, but we need someone who's looking Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: at the books and saying, Hey, this person's not doing anything. I'm identifying Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: these problems. We need to fix them. When you're up in the clouds like this, you can't always see that there are problems. So they keep going on and on and on. So you two are like an amazing match because you can lift him up and he can keep you grounded. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Laura Brenner: Yeah. it's it it'll be fun for you at some point to go back and think about what energy you think he has, but I used to work with two partners, Dennis, and one had a lot of level like f five, six and seven, and the other one had a lot of like three and four. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Laura Brenner: And it was very hard for the th lower one because she was always cleaning up the messes. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: But she was so important in that situation, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: so, but isn't that interesting? Like, so Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: as amazing as your level five is for you, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: it's it could get you into trouble. Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: Because you're just gonna take risks. And it's Tiffany: Yes. Laura Brenner: it's the yin and the yang. It's the good and the bad. It's well, I hate to use good and bad. It's the anabol it's the advantage and the disadvantage, you know? So Tiffany: Mm. Right. Sure, yeah. Right. Yeah. Laura Brenner: okay. So the three to five. So I look at level three as I'm trying to convince myself what I naturally know and believe in level five. level three is trying to see the good. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: So you're gonna have to like keep if you ever have those internal conversations where you're like, this is bothering me, but I'm gonna keep trying to like rationalize why it's okay. And it like does it ever spiral and you have to do it over and over if something's bothering you or Yeah. That's Tiffany: yeah. Laura Brenner: but like you can lift your you can pick yourself up, but you have to Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: like you might have to have a lot of negotiating with yourself to do that, right? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Right. Laura Brenner: That's your level three. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Your level five is just naturally I'm gonna make an opportunity out of this situation. Everything's gonna Tiffany: Thanks. Laura Brenner: be great. you know it and trust it in your core. Whereas level Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: three is like I'm trying. I'm rationalizing. I'm avoiding negativity so Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: that I can stay positive. So did you ever have this experience in practice where like every time you had an assistant who ev you asked them to do like, I don't know, put the topical in or whatever, or on my extraction setup, I always want this. And like they never do it. Have you ever had Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: an assistant with that? Like that? Tiffany: I've had bad assists I don't yeah, I'm sure, where it's like, dude, we just talked about this. Laura Brenner: Dude, we just talked about this for the 500th time, and then you're like, I you know what? I'm not gonna say anything. I'm just gonna go do it myself. You've had that? Okay. That's avoidance, right? That avoidance can either be coming from a level one avoidance or a level Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: three avoidance. Okay. Tiffany: Okay. Yeah. Laura Brenner: So if it's a level one avoidance, it's usually cause like and they could both be happening at the same time, by the way. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: But so the action is not what determines the energy level. It's the intention underneath it that determines it. So avoidance is the action. A Tiffany: Okay. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: level one avoidance is like, there's no point in trying. Because I've asked her 500 times and she never does. And maybe Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: even a little scared of conflict. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: A level three avoidance could be, well, if I get it, you're rationalizing. If I get it, we'll get done faster. I can get to lunch on time. She w our last patient was hard. She probably has a lot on her mind. I d and Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: I don't wanna I don't wanna rock the boat like I'm not gonna say anything because I just wanna keep the vibes positive. Do you hear how they're different? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Yes. Laura Brenner: So you probably have experienced both as we all have, but I'm sure the level three is stronger for you. Do you Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Laura Brenner: yeah. Do you ever feel like you don't see when things are wrong? Tiffany: All the time. Yeah. Laura Brenner: Or or do you ever feel like all the time you do? Tiffany: I mean, like, okay, so when I was with my ex, he started talking about me closing the practice years before I was ready to hear it. And because of our dynamic, I think part of it was he was sabotaging it because he has like control issues and he wanted me to be dependent and he didn't like it when I was winning. But I also think if I was open to hearing, like if it was a safe space, there probably were a lot of good points that he had, I just was so protective that I wasn't able to hear it. But like looking Laura Brenner: Okay. Tiffany: back, like I was a lot less stressed when I didn't own a practice. I was making a lot more money when I didn't own a practice. Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: so and I stayed in my marriage when it was so clear to everyone around me how toxic it was and how Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: mis you know, and I was just like, it's not that bad, you know, like Laura Brenner: That's level three. Tiffany: yeah, like it's not that bad. like we can work through it, yeah. Yeah, we can work through it Laura Brenner: And here's why Yeah. Tiffany: and like it's gonna get better. I think there was a lot of that denial like in my drug use too. I mean, I was like like a raging opiate addict and it was just like, well, it I'm not using when I'm working and it's all under control and everything will be fine and but it was not fine. Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Yeah. So there is a little denial in a way in level three. And like Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: the way it I experience it is taken me a very like a very, very long time to see this. Is I dismiss my feelings, which also separates me from my gut and my intuition. So if I'm you two. Tiffany: Yeah, I just I I did Laura Brenner: Tell me, tell me where you're yeah. Tiffany: I did a post where it was like I spent all these years questioning myself why can't I become the person that can carry this instead of questioning why did I construct a life that requires me to be someone I'm not. Laura Brenner: Mm, mm. Say that again, why didn't I? Tiffany: So I was asking the wrong question. Laura Brenner: Yeah, what was the first question? I heard them both and I got them, but I want Tiffany: Yes. Laura Brenner: to hear them again. Tiffany: Why can't I become the person that this life requires? Laura Brenner: huh. Tiffany: why can't I be more responsible? Why can't I be better yeah, I'm the problem. Laura Brenner: the problem. Yeah. Tiffany: instead of saying like I'm not built to be a business owner. I don't, I'm not good with money. I'm I hate spreadsheets. Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: I don't wanna look after insurance claims. I don't wanna call the lab at the end of the day. I I don't care about, the server that, the tech guy that says he's gonna come in once a month and I haven't seen him in six months. I, Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: you know, like Laura Brenner: Do you feel an avoidance in that stuff? Tiffany: a hundred percent. Laura Brenner: Yeah. Tiffany: I so after I let the practice go, I went and I worked for another office for six months. And I was like, this is why my practice failed. Like I write, like all of Laura Brenner: Right, yeah. Yes. Tiffany: these systems that they had that they did every single day, like I'm ashamed to say I don't know how to read an insurance like an EOB. Like I have never submitted a claim myself. I don't know codes, all of these things Laura Brenner: Yeah. Right. Tiffany: that like as a business owner, I knew that I needed to know how to do it, Laura Brenner: Right. Tiffany: at least to check to make sure other people were doing it. Laura Brenner: Mm. S so it's interesting because The remember, level three is also avoidance. So, like, there was pro there were probably times in your life where you were avoiding from your level one. Like, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: especially when things got really dark for you, there was probably a level one avoidance. but It sounds like the avoidance of insurance and all the tasks that you didn't like were just like, 'cause I wanna enjoy. Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: Like I wanna do what I like, so I'm gonna avoid. Is that what Tiffany: I don't know Laura Brenner: it felt like for you or? Tiffany: It feels like It's the same thing with money. It's like the fear that if I learn I will figure out how bad it is. Laura Brenner: Mmm. Yeah, I think there's a protection of staying positive in that. Tiffany: Right. So I am an impulsive shopper. I have Amazon packages delivered every single, you know, every single day. And I just wait till my bank sends me an overdraft notice. I don't look at it. I don't do my monthly report. Like, okay, how much did I actually spend on Amazon purchases this month? Like I just and it's this fear that if I know. I will feel even more guilt and even more shame. So it's like avoiding. learning to avoid Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: the pain, but it's like, Laura Brenner: Does it work? Tiffany: but but I can intellectualize the fact that I'm making it worse. Very ADHD. they I talk on the other one about the ADHD tax, all the food that we buy with the great intention of cooking it and then ended up throwing away two hundred dollars worth of groceries okay, so when I'm chatting with Claude, I'm like, be gentle. I, you know, like I have so much guilt and shame. Like, please be gentle with me. Like, as we walk through this, like help me through this step by step. Tell me what to do. So I'll say, okay, log on to this. Okay, press here. Okay, press here. Okay, this is your address, here's your address. Like put it in here, you know, like all I have Laura Brenner: Yeah. Tiffany: to do is like copy and paste. But it's like that. and the whole time, like, My heart is racing, I'm like flushing, I'm getting all of this you're so stupid, Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: you're a fucking doctor. how did you let it get this bad? You know, like Laura Brenner: Yeah. Tiffany: and then I like pretty much with money, like I feel that about everything. Like every time I get an Amazon like package, I'm so excited, and then I open it, and I'm like, fuck, I didn't need this, you know, like. I'll return it, but never do, and it's like even just like the returning it. I feel like that is admitting and facing the impulsivity. Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: And I know this will all be solved if I Laura Brenner: Right. Tiffany: just, okay, Tiffany, let's log into your bank account once a week. You don't just look at it. just look Laura Brenner: Yeah. Tiffany: at it. just open it and look at it. And that's it. And then close it. So hard. Laura Brenner: So it's like fascinating when we look at it through the energy levels because it's Tiffany: Yeah. Uh-huh. Laura Brenner: almost like, you know, level three is like, I am only gonna see the positive. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And so for you, there's a bucket that's negative. That there are things that are negative, like money and impulsive shopping and this and that. And Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: it's like because You're connecting it with those things with being negative. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: We're we're hiding from them and we're staying in the positivity. Tiffany: Yes. Yes. Yes. Laura Brenner: Yeah. And this is where level three is great. And it can be very harmful to us. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. And yes. Laura Brenner: Advantage everything has an advantage and a disadvantage. So I don't know. If there would be a key for you in the so why do why are we doing all of this? We're doing all of this to help maybe for you there is actually a benefit in getting more level one and two in some ways. Like if you felt more regret, it would drive you I'm I'm not saying this is true, but just a thought. Tiffany: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Laura Brenner: If in theory, maybe if you felt more regret, then it would drive you to not do it in the next time. But it sounds like you y you see what I'm saying? Tiffany: Yes, a hundred percent. Laura Brenner: So what happens is when we're in a lot of levels one and two, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: everybody w thinks like, I just need to be higher energy and high vibes and always happy and always positive and feeling good. And that to me is toxic positivity. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: But what you see is when someone has a lot of this level three energy. It will serve them to see problems. Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: It'll actually help you like shift into higher energies in the Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: weirdest way to see problems or because ign avoiding and not seeing the problems is making your problems bigger. But if you see Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: problems, you can make solutions, which is level five. Tiffany: Yeah. Right. Laura Brenner: So does that make sense? What do you think of that? Tiffany: Yeah, yeah. I definitely think that My everything will work out. Everything's gonna be fine. Can be keeping myself safe, but also like is what is creating the pro like I'm avoiding the negative feelings by avoiding the problems which are creating more problems. Laura Brenner: Yes, right, right, yeah. So it would be interesting to see could you raise your level three into some level four? That's where could you envision what that would look like with the kits? Tiffany: yeah. Laura Brenner: So let me do you want me to put it the terms to you so you don't have to know the numbers? okay. Tiffany: No, okay. So if I put them first more, then you know, I would not feel feel as much guilt and shame, which would allow me then to have the win win for everyone. Yeah. Laura Brenner: Yeah, pretty much. You're so smart. You're so smart. Tiffany: thank you. Laura Brenner: Right. Yes. Cause like for me, I need to do less of that. Cause it's dysfunctional for me. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: But for you, so I have this have you ever heard did you ever listen to India R? Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: She's a song I love called Back to the Middle and she describes these people who are on like the extremes. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Of life. And so I have this thing of like, we all need to come back to the middle. It's Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: like, if I am way too people pleasing and putting everyone first in level four, I Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: need to like come back to being more selfish Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: and putting myself first. And I love the word selfish, by the way. I think it's a really great word. Whereas Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: if somebody's not doing enough to factor in other people. They need to come back to the middle and be more selfless. Right? So like Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Laura Brenner: in a w so for you, that could be a good practice for you to practice looking like, why am I this is how I do this. Like, why am I perceiving what I'm seeing a h in front of me? Like what is what level is that coming from? And Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: when I see it, I can be like, I don't need to be like that. Like why am I trying to protect like the long guy from feeling bad about messing up my lawn when I'm the one suffer you know what I mean? Whereas like so anyway, what what are Yeah. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Okay, so I have a question. Are you changing Is the goal to change the feeling around the action or is the goal to do the action even though you don't like the feeling? Laura Brenner: yeah, I love that. It depends on the person, Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: right? So I think for you there's gonna be a little bit of not liking the feeling. Tiffany: So, okay, for my kids, right? knowing that he wants to watch a movie, but knowing that I don't want to commit the next three hours of my life to watching Superman again. Or, you know, like, Laura Brenner: Right, yeah. Tiffany: so is it that I'm supposed to change my mindset about that time being more well spent? Because that I have a lot. I have A really hard time I have Laura Brenner: Yeah. Tiffany: I have so much self-awareness and I am so Laura Brenner: Yes, right. Tiffany: sure in my emotions, Laura Brenner: Yeah. Tiffany: that I have a really hard time saying I'm gonna change my mindset. Laura Brenner: Right. Tiffany: So is it just I'm gonna do it anyway, even though I fucking don't wanna sit here and watch Superman for the third time? Laura Brenner: It's well one, it's a really hard pr it's a hard practice, right? But the way you phrased it in that first question about like, am I changing my mindset about just to me that's no. I'm gonna say no. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Because that's fixing the problem on the surface level. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Whereas when you have the ELI, you can see what's underneath it. Okay. So when it's like, mom, let's watch Superman, you want to say no. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Right? Okay, here's how I would do it. Let's walk you through it. Because I have a process that I am like created for myself, and I feel like it's really cool. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And it's noticing when I get triggered. Okay. Tiffany: Okay. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And when you Can start to practice these things consciously after the event, there's Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: gonna be a time where you're gonna just catch it in the moment. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Like a a year six months, a year from now. You're gonna be like, and then you're gonna be like, my God, I caught it. I did it. So notice the trigger, right? So Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: in this case, your trigger is probably gonna be like, I feel guilty because I said no, right? So, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: so note so For for both of us, because we have a lot of level three. Do you ever have the I feel anxious? I feel anxious and I don't know why. I feel anxious and I don't know why. And you can go on and on and on like that. I think that's a level three thing. Cause I think I dismiss my feelings. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Right? And so part of the work for me, because I am so like positive. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: is I don't see when I'm in pain. And then I can't fix it. And then when I'm my theory is when I'm sleeping at 2 AM, my defenses are down, my body's wakes me up and it's like, yeah, I didn't deal with that problem because logically it didn't feel like that big of a deal when I was awake. And now I never processed it. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: So for me, my work is to process when I have negative feelings, because I don't like to do that. So part of this noticing your triggers I think will be really valuable for you in that same way. Does that resonate? Tiffany: hang on, say that again. I was writing. Go ahead. Laura Brenner: yeah, no problem. I think part of just noticing that s step one, noticing the trigger and noticing what the feeling is is so Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: valuable for me because I don't I'm I block that stuff out. I'm when I try to be like what do I feel? I'm blank inside. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Do you have that? Tiffany: I think I'm the other way, Laura Brenner: You feel everything. Tiffany: I ruminate on Cameron says, you spend too much time thinking about it when if you just stopped thinking and just did the thing, Laura Brenner: Right. Tiffany: you would I I do all this Laura Brenner: But are you thinking about it after it goes wrong? Tiffany: I don't know. Laura Brenner: Yeah. Okay. So many good things we can play with here. So I do think th in this process I'm gonna show you, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: just I d I've I'm guessing that based on the fact that you're like Avoiding looking at the bills or the Amazon or the whatever is the trying to stay what feels positive for you. So there's a not wanting to see the shadow and Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No yes yeah. Laura Brenner: with that may come like you might not always see your feelings. Tiffany: Yes. In in that way, I'm definitely. Not acknowledging The there is I really shouldn't buy this. I'm gonna buy it anyway. Or really shouldn't buy it. Like that I'm not like Laura Brenner: you have that conversation. Yeah. So Tiffany: Yeah, yes. Laura Brenner: my theory is you can have that conversation all day long and you're gonna do what you want. So the Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: changing your mindset on that isn't the problem. The problem is what's the energy level underneath that's creating it, okay? Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: So let's go back to this process because I've I Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: have hijacked it by bringing in that other element. But I do think side note, it would be very good for you to really acknowledge, like, what am I feeling? Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: Right. So I'm good at thinking my feelings. I don't know if you're but not good at feeling them. Where are you? Are you good at thinking your feelings? Tiffany: I I think that that is a great way of describing it. Like, yes. Laura Brenner: Me too. Tiffany: so Joe Hudson, do you ever listen to him? Laura Brenner: No. Tiffany: okay, so he has this thing where he's like, all your problems will be solved if you give yourself to feel or you give yourself permission to feel the feeling that you're not letting yourself feel. So, like, so like Laura Brenner: Exactly. Exactly. Tiffany: if you're angry, like let yourself get angry. Okay, so then I've like spent a lot of time talking thinking about this. But I'm like Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: But how? okay, so okay, Laura Brenner: Totally totally Tiffany: so I feel I feel mad. Like okay, I'm mad. Like Laura Brenner: What does that feel like? Yeah, right. I don't know what that feels like. I can go into a story about all of it and blah blah blah blah blah. But that's thinking our feelings. Tiffany: yes, yes, yes. But so how do you Laura Brenner: That's a practice. We can do it together. Yeah, Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: it's a practice. So this will be a I don't know. I'm still working on it personally, but I feel like it's so such important work and and I do feel like I've changed and it's helping me and all that stuff. But Tiffany: Okay, so that is this it? Okay, like last night. So yesterday was my dad's birthday, and my dad passed away. And like Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. Tiffany: I went down and Cameron has a little like like recliner like in his desk. So I'll go and I'll sit there and I'm like, I'm feeling sad. Laura Brenner: Yeah. Tiffany: And then I was like, okay, I don't want to feel sad, I'm gonna go do something else. And I got up and I went back to work. Like, so is that it? Like I should have sat. Laura Brenner: Totally. That's that's our level that is our level three, 'cause it's like I do the same thing. It's like, okay, is this it? Can I move on Tiffany: right. So Laura Brenner: now? Is this it? Tiffany: so would have feeling my feelings would have been like when I started to tear up, letting myself, yeah. I don't like that. Laura Brenner: Cry. That's one of my best ways. I love crying now, so maybe we'll work on that. Crying. Crying is the tears are truth. It's the ultimate release. It's amazing. But I think that's a level three thing. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Yeah. And it serves us well because it feels good. And we're positive. And we do Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: and we get shit done out of that. Tiffany: And then I have this feeling, like last night I was like, it doesn't now that I'm saying it in this context, it's like, well, but I'm like it doesn't solve anything. It doesn't bring him back. yeah, like you Laura Brenner: To cry? yeah. But yeah, it but it heals something inside of you. This is a little different from the energy stuff that we can work on too, but it does heal Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: something inside of you. Tiffany: you Laura Brenner: I feel like every time I cry I've healed something. It doesn't mean it goes away. Tiffany: Right. Laura Brenner: But it is a relief. when I used to when I was dealing with my cancer, there Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: were s so many emotions. I would go in my back room and I would ugly cry like so hard. And Tiffany: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: I couldn't do anything about it. And I would just do it as long as I had to. And then when I was done, I could feel like it was like I was empty, you know, and it was like Okay, it's done and it didn't fix anything. I think there's this a thing that we feel like we have to fix also. it didn't fix anything, but it got it out. And I looking back Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: feel like that was part of why. Like I don't I don't really hold on of all the shit in my life, cancer's not the one I hold on to. And Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: I think it's because I let go of a so there's I think more happening when we experience our feelings than our tangible world we wanna admit. I think it's a Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: really important practice and I think if it's something you want to do, we can always I'm happy to walk through that with you. Tiffany: Well yeah, if it's true that everything will be solved if you learn how to feel your feelings, that sounds like a really beneficial thing to learn how to do. Well Laura Brenner: Totally. Totally. Yeah, exactly. Tiffany: and what's coming up now is it hasn't been until this stage of my life where feelings have been acceptable. my whole Laura Brenner: Yes. Tiffany: life with my Asian mom, I love her, but emotions were not okay. I was allowed to be happy and that's it. Like anything and it's interesting now because she one of the most like Touching things that she said. She was like, watching you parent makes me understand that when I was raising you. I didn't understand what it meant to care for your emotions. I thought Laura Brenner: Mm. Tiffany: my job was to care for your physical well-being and that was it. And watching you parent, I now see how much of the emotional support you miss from. Cameron cries all the time. He's so sweet. He's he's very enti all he cried. Like every Laura Brenner: That's amazing. Tiffany: single movie. Like I made him a video for his birthday, like just crying. And it Laura Brenner: Uh-huh. Tiffany: and it hasn't been till he I started dating him where I I let myself cry. like where it's permission. Sorry, I'm hijacking Laura Brenner: Mm-hmm. It's no, Tiffany: this. Laura Brenner: it's so good. It's so good. So all right. So I wanna walk th through this because this will be what I think is so powerful to help you change. Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: is like so notice that you felt so step one, notice that you are triggered. So the trigger you wanna ex do the example of. Did you like the one of the movies with your kids or something different? Tiffany: that's accessible right now, but I don't think that's a high emotional trigger. that's just more of an irritation, Laura Brenner: Okay, and let me throw this out there. It could be that it'd be fun to w walk through any example, but think of this like lifting weights. So the things that are less triggering are easier to see it with. So is that feel like a good example? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Okay, yeah, let's do this one. Uh-huh. Okay, sure. Yeah. Yeah. Laura Brenner: Okay, so you noticed tell me tell me the moment. So I felt so I noticed I was triggered and tell me this the story that triggered you. Tiffany: Okay, so so we get home at the end of the day. He hasn't seen me in three to you know, or five days, and he wants to spend time with me. As soon as we walk in the door, do you wanna watch a movie? And it's like that moment of like it's like that moment of am I gonna be selfish or am I gonna be selfless? Laura Brenner: Right, right. Okay, wait, let me ask you this. When did you feel the guilt? Was it in that moment or was it after? Tiffany: It was as soon as I saw his little eyes drop, or his little aw. Laura Brenner: Yeah. So he said, Are we gonna watch a movie? And what did you say? Tiffany: I said, I don't really want to watch a movie, Riker. And then yeah, then he yeah. Laura Brenner: Uh-huh. And then he was like, and you felt triggered. Okay. So so that's step one or two, whatever, is identifying Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: the story that triggered you. Okay, that made you feel bad. So Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: notice that you're even feeling bad about something. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Then identifying the story that makes you feel bad. And and where in whatever order, also, what is the feeling that that made you feel? Tiffany: Feeling that it made me feel. Laura Brenner: What's the feeling it made you think? To be more sp Tiffany: I love the feelings wheel. Do you keep do you have it? I used Laura Brenner: No. Tiffany: to have I used to have it printed. You don't have the feelings wheel? Do you know what the feelings wheel is? Laura Brenner: I'm sure it's a list of a bunch of feelings, but I I know all the feelings, I just think them, don't feel them. Tiffany: okay, so what was Laura Brenner: Yeah, think Tiffany: what was the feeling that I felt? I felt ashamed. Laura Brenner: Yeah, in that moment when you saw his disappointment ashamed. Okay. So you notice that you felt ashamed, you're identifying the story, okay? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: What about that st this is step three. What about that story it was the most troubling to you in that moment? That created that shame. Tiffany: That I am the only person that can provide him with that level of Safety and quality time and feeling he matters. I am the only one that can give that to him and I denied it. I denied him that feeling because I'm being selfish. Laura Brenner: Mm, mm mm so like Yeah. But you Let me ask you this Tiffany: huh. Laura Brenner: Knowing that in the moment, does that make you want to change your mind? Tiffany: No, because I'm still selfish. Laura Brenner: You still don't want to do it. Tiffany: I still am being yeah. I still don't want to sit there. I I Laura Brenner: Yeah. Right. Tiffany: still rather do what I want to do. Like I am very selfish. Like I want to do what I want to do when I want to do it. Laura Brenner: Yeah. I get it. I get it. I don't have kids, right? Tiffany: Yeah. Smart. Laura Brenner: I was always I always said I'm too selfish to have kids. same reason. I'm like I don't I don't want that shit. I always joke. I'll be like, how weird is it that we like we love our dogs the most when they're mimicking death? because Tiffany: I mean Laura Brenner: my dog is so intense. I love her so much, but she's a nut. And I'm like I wish she would just sleep. It's so cute when she sleeps. And then so that one day I was like, How weird is it that I love her the most when she's mimicking death? that just cracks Tiffany: Hm. Laura Brenner: me up so Tiffany: Yeah, this one is sleeping and man, he's so cute when he's sleeping. I know. Laura Brenner: And you're like, I love you. Yeah, totally. So I get it. So, so I think it's okay, so it's identify the feeling that you're triggered, identify the story, identify what about it is making you feel that feeling. Okay. So, I'm the only one who can give him The like I'm the only one that can give him that support and help him know that he matters. And so, is it like you're letting him down or you're not giving to him? What is it? Tiffany: Yeah, that I'm gonna scar him for life Laura Brenner: Uh-huh. Tiffany: or that I'm gonna forever imprint that he doesn't matter or That he won't feel loved. Laura Brenner: Uh-huh. Right. So it's interesting 'cause there's a conflict here 'cause even though you know that and you care about it, you still said, like, I'm gonna do what I want, I'm selfish. Right? So that is I'm gonna win and I hope you win too. Which is level three. So Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: I'm gonna the hint for you is always the thing that's gonna make you feel bad in some way. Is usually gonna come from your level three. Okay. Right? Is usually Tiffany: Okay. Okay. The bad feeling. Okay. Laura Brenner: when you go underneath it, it's you're gonna Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: and you it's like peeling back an onion. Why is this so troubling for why Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: is this so troubling to me? It's usually gonna be because you're slipping into level three thinking. Tiffany: Is that everyone? Laura Brenner: No, for me it's level four. But it's Tiffany: Got it. Okay. Laura Brenner: because it's your primary. This is why it's a little more if if if you were level four, I could be like, girl, I got you, and blah blah blah. It's a little more confusing for me to work through because it's not my level, my primary. Cause Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: for me, every time I find myself tr like in a bad way, usually, it's because I'm trying to do too much shit for other people. Right? Tiffany: Over functioning. Yeah. Laura Brenner: So for you, it's usually gonna be. Because you're trying to win and it doesn't matter really what happens to them, even though you hope they win too, but you're still doing it for you, right? So Tiffany: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: you could grow this level four. Tiffany: Level four. Laura Brenner: So it's looking at that moment and saying, this is like totally happening because my default way of thinking. I know that I'm being selfish here. But it's my default. And so when you see that it's your default, then you can start to say, huh, what if there's another way? Tiffany: So do you say, okay, I'm gonna play at level four until I realize that this is actually beneficial? Laura Brenner: Yeah, pretty much. I mean, ultimately when you get into that. So I'll I'll give you an example. So like every time I feel stuck in a corner, like backed in a corner or blah, you know, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: I realize that it's because I'm not allowing myself to create a solution because I'm worried about either hurting or offending the other person or whatever. And Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: so I just stay stuck. So for me it's a lot about like speaking up and being allowed to do I it's me being allowed to be selfish because I'm actually very selfish, but I disguise it with my level four. And it's like I wanna be allowed to be see, level four people were really sneaky, is like we don't want people to think we're selfish, so we're gonna act so giving. But we're really selfish, right? So Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: for me, it's like it's saying to myself, I'm allowed to ask for what I want. So one time my husband was asking me, I love the dumb things. He was it was years of realizing this and working on it and then one day he was asking me this stupid thing about he wanted me to move my car in the garage to the other spot and we were fighting about it and I realized in the middle of the fight I was like, wait a minute. You know what? you're not even gonna be here and you're wanting me to move my car so it's convenient for you for five seconds and you're making me feel guilty that I don't want to do it. And I I remember snapping into that, catching it in the moment and being like, I'm allowed to ask for what I want, right? And I s and then I said to him out loud, I was like, I s I don't rem w what did I say? It was like, I'm just telling you, like, this. So it's like I caught it in the moment that my default pattern is always gonna be like, I can't say what I want because he needs to like me. Right? So for you, I bet you your default pattern is seeing I know I don't want to do this because it's what I want to do. And then seeing how doing only what I want to do makes me feel worse. Tiffany: Yeah. Yours seems Laura Brenner: And then Tiffany: easier. 'Cause you combat Laura Brenner: Maybe it is. Tiffany: your you combat yours and then you get what you want. I combat mine and I don't get what I want, right? Laura Brenner: Well, yeah. But there's a level two in that actually, that if I I either get what I want or I don't get what I want, there's a black and white. So see, this Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: is what's cool about level two is you don't even realize you have it in you, but it's that I'm either getting what I want or I'm losing. Right. So your work that you will be really Tiffany: no. Laura Brenner: good at is how can I create a win win out of this, which is also my solution. Tiffany: Uh-huh. Okay. Level two Laura Brenner: That give you a little click? Tiffany: is Laura Brenner: Right or wrong, black and white, I win you lose. Tiffany: I win, I win, you lose. Okay. Laura Brenner: So see, you're combining in some of these moments Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: this I win you lose. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Whereas what if you did how could we both win? You don't even have to get into how can I if you want to say how could I help you win great. But I get it. I don't think it's good. I think it's very destructive. Could you get into how it's a win win? Okay, what is it? Tiffany: Okay, I I just came up with the best solution. Let's watch a thirty minute show together. Laura Brenner: Amazing. Try it. Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: Yeah. Tiffany: Or let me pick three that I actually want to watch that you might want to watch that isn't another Marvel movie. Laura Brenner: Exactly. Yeah, or I don't know if this is okay to do, but do you have to be s all focused on the movie? Tiffany: Yeah, like yes, cause I'll be there and I'll be on my phone and he'll be like, You're not even watching it. Laura Brenner: Yeah, okay. So that's great. It's better for y we know, logic. Look, and then it's starting to see how is this a win for me too? Because right now Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: you're only seeing it as how it's a lose for you. And I get it from the standpoint of when my dog wants to play, I'm like, Are you fucking kidding me? I don't want to do this. But Tiffany: Mm-hmm, right. Laura Brenner: I actually think that this some of these situations are some of your you ending up in level two energy, which is Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: I have to win or I'm losing and I don't want to lose. Which is also shifting you down into level one shame. Right? So this is where Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: you can start to practice th this is the same solution for me, which is step four. How can I win two? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Okay, how can I win too? Laura Brenner: Right? So because your default is making you win, it might be how can we both win? How can he win too? How can this other person win twos? How can we both win no matter what? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Does that sound like it would maybe be a little more interesting to try? Tiffany: Yes. Yeah. And I think for me is less black and white, my God, it's gonna be a three hour movie. Like I said, finding Laura Brenner: Exactly. Tiffany: a show that is half an hour. I can do that and not and and be totally present and be with him Laura Brenner: Yeah. Tiffany: and not feel like I'm ruining my night, And Laura Brenner: Right. Yes. Tiffany: and that would give him what he needs. And so that would be so I think. Part of it for me is shifting out of all or nothing. What what's all or nothing? Is that level two? Laura Brenner: Yeah. Level two. Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: Yep. Right. So I have to ask how can I win too? Which still means that they're winning. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: You have to ask how can they win too? Which still means you're winning. Tiffany: Okay, okay. Yeah. Laura Brenner: Okay. And and like what I would do right now this weekend, this week until we talk next time, Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: is just go through that process. You Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: you might not be able to do it if you if this you might be able to do with this specific one because it's so on your mind. But Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: you might find yourself having to replay scenarios in your head after. But think about every time you're like wiring your brain to see. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: That's the time you're gonna be like, wait a minute, pause. I'm seeing what I'm doing. how can they wouldn't do? Okay, and Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: then you'll come up with a solution in that moment. Because what's happening is we're both getting stuck in no solution. Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: We just have different solutions and we want to Tiffany: Uh-huh. Laura Brenner: get into those solutions. So it's not forcing you willpower to change. It's actually addressing the way you're seeing it. Does that do you see that? Tiffany: Yeah. I think one of the most powerful things that my dentist coach told me, like she said, you have two choices in every situation. You can change the way you're thinking or change your situation. But it's like when you refuse to do either. Laura Brenner: then you can change your default patterning. This is all default patterning that Tiffany: Yeah, like it right. Laura Brenner: creates your thinking. Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: I I would love to talk more about this and even in the context of Just how all of this is going on and we don't even know it. Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: And it's what's creating our reality. And so when you start Tiffany: Mm-hmm. And habit. Laura Brenner: to see, it's unconscious, right? When Tiffany: Mm. Laura Brenner: you start to see, like, I feel like I'm gonna lose if I do this, so that's making me make him lose, and he's my son, I don't want him to lose. Could I make it us both win? What would that look like? Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: Versus just being like no and then feeling like Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: shit afterwards. Tiffany: Right. Laura Brenner: So okay. Do you I know. I know. It's so cool. Okay. Tiffany: Man, I could talk to you forever. Like this is so interesting. Like Laura Brenner: So let's I I wanna hear more. We'll use I have to I do have to go though. but I would love Tiffany: You have to Yeah, you have to go. I wanna be respectful of your time. Laura Brenner: to let's add a 30 minutes on. Tiffany: Okay. Laura Brenner: We'll pick a time. I have to go because my husband's waiting for me to work out with him. Tiffany: Okay. Okay. Laura Brenner: And we'll pick a time. We'll do another 30 minute follow-up that will be part of this anyway. It's not an extra charge or anything. And then, if you have but do that practice and and notice and and Tiffany: Okay. Okay. Laura Brenner: just watch. Like it blew my I never knew how level four I was because I thought I was too selfish. It blew my mind to see. And it opened Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: my world. So that is my hope for you that like you're gonna see. It's gonna blow Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: your mind and you won't have expected that this was how it's happening for you. And that when Tiffany: Mm-hmm. Laura Brenner: you start to see it's in everything you do. Tiffany: Yeah. Laura Brenner: Then you're like, Whoa, okay, w how can I it this isn't how it has to be. So this is a process. Tiffany: So cool. I love this shit. I Laura Brenner: It's so cool. Tiffany: like it's fascinating. yeah. Laura Brenner: I know. Me too. Yeah. Have a great weekend. This was wonderful. Okay, bye. Tiffany: You too. my god, so fun. Okay. Bye.