Latest / Wicked and Grim: A True Crime Podcast / The Murder of Russell and Shirley Dermond

Transcript

The Murder of Russell and Shirley Dermond · Wicked and Grim: A True Crime Podcast

• 0:07
  Speaker 1: The murder of Russell and his wife, Shirley. There's a
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: mysterious case that has plagued investigators in the Internet for decades.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: From the brutality to the disposal of their bodies, everything
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: about this case just leads to more and more questions.
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: Every resident in the exclusive gated community where the murder
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: took place was thoroughly questioned, as was every gardener, handyman,
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: and day laborer. Yet no one heard or saw anything.
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: This is the case of Russell and Shirley Dermott.
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: My name's Ben, I'm Nicole, and you're listening to Wicked
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: and Grim.
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: A true crime podcast. The following podcast.
• 0:54
  Speaker 3: And material for a mature audience listener discretion spoiler alert.
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: I was just sick and Nicole just got back from vacation,
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: so we are both semi exhausted for very different reasons.
• 1:27
  Speaker 4: But we're back.
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: I kind of feel like we had a little bit
• 1:30
  Speaker 2: of a break because, you know, we pre recorded our
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: last one a bit.
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: Early, and yeah, so we kind of had a week off.
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: Even though you guys didn't seem like you missed a beat,
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: we took a little bit of time, Nicole for relaxing
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: and me for relaxing, but for a completely.
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: Different Mine was a bit more enjoyable than your time.
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, sounds like it. I was in a heat wave
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: with a fever, so I was like covering myself in
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: blankets and having chills and heat waves. So that was
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: fun while you were paddle boarding on Okanagan Lake at
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: a cab in.
• 2:01
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it was kind of awesome.
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah it was.
• 2:03
  Speaker 4: It was so lovely. I don't know.
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I just enjoyed my time away and spending time
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: with family and warm weather. I mean, when the weather
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: is that hot, the only place you really want to
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: be is at a lake.
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: I feel like, yeah, wow, for me, it was the couch.
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: Well. I went thinking I wasn't going to really be
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: swimming because I'm like, the water's gonna be so dang cold.
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: But I know you had to and the water was
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: like nice.
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: Sang so jealous. Maybe next time.
• 2:31
  Speaker 4: I so sorry.
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: We do have to give a quick shout out, as
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: always to our amazing patriots ribbers, So the individuals who
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: signed up this week that get that behind the scenes
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: the exclusive content that are the exclusive episodes. Specifically, it
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: comes out at the end of the month, the last
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: day of the month. We have to thank Brandy, Kate Williams,
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: Amanda McCool Conners, and I believe McCool is actually like
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: one of their names because it's even in their email.
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: Oh that cool, right, love that, love it fain nighte
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: Gracie Dizago, Thank you very much. We appreciate all you
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: guys for signing up before and Patreon and supporting.
• 3:09
  Speaker 4: This show means a lot, Yeah, it really does.
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: We are just indie creators. It's just us doing the show,
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: the research, the writing, the production, you name it. It's
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: just us too. That's it.
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: Well most of you, well most fair enough is eighty
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: percent you? Twenty percent? Me?
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: Fair enough?
• 3:28
  Speaker 4: Fair It's still, but I should.
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: Say that's because I have another job exactly.
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: Where this production and other other productions that I work
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: with other companies, but this is primarily my job. So
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: this is Yeah, you.
• 3:40
  Speaker 4: Do a good job.
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: Thank you. I appreciate that.
• 3:43
  Speaker 4: Okay, So are we going to just dive right in here?
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: Should we just dive right in?
• 3:46
  Speaker 4: I think so?
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: This is quite the case. It's been on my list
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: for a while, and I'm going to admit something. I
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: was contemplating this being our two hundredth episode, right okay,
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: but I for I'm not going to say why or anything.
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: I just was like, you know what, I'm gonna do
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: it now.
• 4:03
  Speaker 4: I do know that part. I do know the why. Well,
• 4:07
  Speaker 4: I can't say why I know, but I know you
• 4:09
  Speaker 4: can at the end, I'll.
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: Say at the end for sure. But yeah, so I
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: swapped it out and we're gonna do this one today.
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: It's gonna be well, it's not gonna be good, but
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: it is quite the case of bucalo seatbelts. Because we're
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: going to get into this. You might want your thinking
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: caps on too for this one. Make sure you got
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: that strapped tightly on your head because you're probably gonna need.
• 4:28
  Speaker 4: It, so pay attention.
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: Basically, you don't really need to pay attention. Everything is
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: very obvious. There's no like tiny little clues or anything
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: you need to follows. It's pretty out there and obvious
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: with everything. Okay, but there's just a lot of questions
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: as a result, So put the thinking cap on for.
• 4:46
  Speaker 4: That, okay. Okay.
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: So on Saturday May third, in twenty fourteen, in the
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: city of Eatonton, Georgia, a couple was planning a party.
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: It was to be you know, a relish relative relative.
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: That's what it is looking for. Relatively lavish event, nothing
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: over the top by any means, but a nice one
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: to match the upscale gated community of Great Waters at
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: Reynolds Lake, Okney development where the story takes place. The
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: community primarily attracted retired professionals, you know, business executives and
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: successful entrepreneurs, many of whom were in their fifties, sixties
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: and even older. It was an oasis with big houses
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: perched in the lake on the water's edge, with the
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: amenities everywhere, anything you could hope for. One's like an
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: eighteen hole golf course.
• 5:37
  Speaker 4: I was just going to say a golf course.
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: Definitely a golf course, several clubhouses, dining options, tennis courts,
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: swimming pools, fitness centers, walking trails galore, and not to
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: mention everything one could dream of doing on the lakes,
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: pristine waters, especially when it comes to nice hot heat
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: waves like you were just doing right. Yeah, So all
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: that good good that's what they had at this gated community.
• 6:01
  Speaker 4: Sounds like a good life.
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: I definitely does sound like a good life here. Now.
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: Hewle and Peggy Winn were the couples who were putting
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: on this event, this party, this one at their home,
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: and they invited their friends and many neighbors in the
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: community as well to come along and enjoin and join it. Now,
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: this included Russell and Shirley Dermott. They were friends and
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: they were neighbors that lived just less than a mile
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: down the road. Russell was eighty eight years old and
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: Shirley was eighty seven years old, and they were regulars
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: at events like this. Russell Durman was born on June sixth,
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: nineteen twenty five, in Hackensack, New Jersey. After serving in
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: the United States Navy during World War Two, he transitioned
• 6:43
  Speaker 1: into business, specifically the fast food industry sector. Now. Shirley
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: Bell Wilcox was born on July seventh, nineteen twenty six,
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: in New Jersey and would marry the love of her life, Russell,
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: on December fifteenth, nineteen fifty. Together, the two built a
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: family and raised four children. They were two very happy
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: individuals together and also became very successful in the fast
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: food industry, particularly through the ownership of nineteen different hardy restaurants.
• 7:13
  Speaker 4: Oh wow, nineteen restaurants.
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: They did good then, definitely, and this is what afforded
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: them the comfortable lifestyle for sure.
• 7:24
  Speaker 3: So.
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: Upon retiring in nineteen ninety four, with their children taking
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: over the business operations, Russell and Shirley sought a more
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: tranquil setting for their golden years, and that's when they
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: made their move to the scenic and serene Great Water
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: Gated Community. And here they are awesome.
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: Good for them too, being eighty seven and eighty eight
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: and still going out and socializing, and that they were.
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: They were quite active for their age as well.
• 7:51
  Speaker 4: Yeah, they weren't expressive.
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: Oh, it definitely is like I strived to be like
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: that because they weren't just holding themselves up in their house. Yeah,
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: Like I don't think think that Russell was like a
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: golfer anymore. But he definitely went out and walked in
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: his trails. And Shirley had little clubs that she went
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: along with. I can't remember what club she was involved
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: with specifically, but she would go out with friends and
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: they were doing stuff. They were quite active. I mean
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: they're private still, but they were getting out there. They
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: were enjoying retirement, they were making friends, enjoying the community,
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: and with all the amenities on there, why wouldn't you But.
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: Well, yeah, you can only hope that you're still you know,
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: healthy enough to enjoy your life in your late eighties, right.
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: No kidding, no kidding. Many people are not lucky enough
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: to enjoy the retirement they set themselves up for, which
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: is unfortunate.
• 8:38
  Speaker 4: It is.
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah. So in this close knit community, Russell and Shirley
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: found a peaceful and private life. They were by neighbors,
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: very friendly, but yet private. Now they also maintained a
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: close relationship with their children and their nine grandchildren. However,
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: their eldest son, Mark struggled with addiction and substance abuse
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: throughout his entire life, which is unfortunate, and it created
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: a very distance, a gap, if you will, between his
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: parents and himself. Now, despite their efforts to try and
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: you know, help Mark as often as they could, trying
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: to say, you know what, we can give you any
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: assistance you need, he refused. He was reluctant and as
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: a result, it just limited any sort of contact. He
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: didn't want help. He was happy with his life and
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: what he was doing and that was that. Now. Tragedy
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: though eventually struck in two thousand when Mark was fatally
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: shot during a drug purchase in Atlanta. Now, this loss
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: was a significant blow to Russell and surely both, but
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: they moved forward, continuing to focus on the family that
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: they still had and their retired community life.
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: Dang, yeah, because you're not supposed to lose your kids.
• 9:51
  Speaker 4: That's hard.
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: No, there's a saying that a parent should never watch
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: their child go, and there's many different ways to say that,
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: but yeah, it's and I can't imagine that.
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh. Yeah, we don't have kids and we
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: can't even imagine that.
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: So yeah, now this brings us to the party invitation
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: to attend the Kentucky Derby Party, which was you know
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: the horse race, right, So it's Kentucky, Kentucky Derby Party
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: and it was to be on Saturday, May third, twenty fourteen.
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: As the party was getting going, came and it went
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: Hughle and Peggy Win, the ones who threw the party
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: and invited both Shirley and Russell to attend, noticed that
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: neither of them ever showed up. It wasn't like them
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: to miss something like this. They lived for the socialization
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: and for the community events. However, you know, things happen sometimes,
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: you know, some things just don't work out. Something comes
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: up and you need to help your kids or who knows,
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: maybe you get sick, maybe you end up in the hospital.
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: There's many reasons why this might not work out. And
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: since they were fairly private individuals, they're probably just dealing
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: with it exactly that privately and they would soon hear
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: from them.
• 11:07
  Speaker 4: And it would be explained.
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: It would be explained. Yeah, but they didn't. They tried
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: to get a hold of them. They tried to call
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: the Germans over the next couple days, several times in fact, now,
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: trying to get in touch and check in just to
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: make sure everything okay. Is something everyone's going to do,
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: and picking up that phone is exactly what everyone's going
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: to start with. That's exactly what they did. But with
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: each ring on the phone that went unanswered, more and
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: more nerves started to creep up their spine. Serious worry
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: began to overwhelm the Winds, and it would be three
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: days after the event, on May sixth, twenty fourteen, that
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: both hughle and Peggy Wind decided that they would make
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: their way to the friends home and check on them
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: personally instead of just trying to get them.
• 11:57
  Speaker 4: To answer before good plan.
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: So they walked over to the German's home at one
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: four seven Carolyn Drive, Eaton and Georgia. When they arrived,
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: they found yesterday's newspaper still stuffed inside the mailbox in
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: the front of the house. Then, after a bit more
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: looking around, they found the back door to the house
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: wide open. The wind slowly entered the large, thirty two
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: hundred square foot home and began calling the couple's names,
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: hoping to hear an answer, but there was nothing but silence.
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: They continued to slowly push further into the home, expecting
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: at any moment be greeted by either their friends welcoming
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: them into their home or a disastrous sight. But as
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: they moved on, they didn't seem to find either of
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: these things. The house was nice and clean, just as
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: Shirley had always liked to keep it. Nothing seemed to
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: be out of place as they searched from room to room. Now,
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: as the search continued, they did spot on the kitchen
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: table another newspaper. It was dated Friday, May two, twenty fourteen,
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: the day before the party, and the crossword puzzle in
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: the paper had been partially finished, which indicated they were
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: at least home on that particular day, But it left
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: the remaining question where were they now? The Winds continued
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: to search in the home, the garage, the bedroom, the bathroom,
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: room by room, you name it, but there was no
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: sign of anything. That is until they did another sweep
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: of the garage on their second time in there. That's
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: when they noticed Russell laying on the floor in a
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: pool of blood. He was laying between their Lexis SUV
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: and their Lincoln town car. They didn't see him the
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: first time around because laying here he was hard to
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: spot unless he specifically walked around the vehicles, and which
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: they did on their second pass, And this is when
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: they found the awful sight to make matters worse, Russell's
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: body was missing his head, Holy shit, and all the
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: blood pouring from where he laid was being dammed up
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: by towels to ensure it didn't spill under the garage
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: door into the open visible driveway.
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, Okay, that is like quite a scene.
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: Hey, no kidding, just brutal stumbling upon something like that.
• 14:29
  Speaker 4: Well a friend, right exactly.
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: That's it's going to scar you. Fortunately.
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: Well, how would you even for sure not was them?
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: You know, I'm sure there's other identifiable features. Maybe it's
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: the clothing, maybe it's you know, build or something like
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: that jewelry who knows now. The winds of course, immediately
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: dialed nine one one, and local law enforcement quickly arrived
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: to the scene. The police secured the area and began
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: a thorough investigation under the command of share Howard Sills.
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: They conducted a preliminary walk through of the home and
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: the garage to assess the situation. While they did indeed
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: have a clear crime scene in their hands with the
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: discovery of Russell's body, the fact still remained that Shirley
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: was missing.
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: Still, hey, okay, I was thinking they will be stumbling
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: across her too.
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: They weren't sure where she was. They searched the house
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: the surrounding area but found no sign of her, and
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: authorities began to suspect a potential kidnapping might be what
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: they're looking at, which meant every second that ticked by
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: could mean life or death for surely.
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: Well, yeah, quite a bit of time had already.
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: Passed, exactly, it's been several days by.
• 15:38
  Speaker 4: Now, oh shit, man, Yeah.
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: So investigators noted that there were no signs of forced
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: entry into the home, which means that it suggests that
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: the perpetrator might have known the Germans or have gained
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: access through other means, potentially like having a key or
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: something like that. Maybe just throwing random thoughts out there
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: for examples, not saying this is part of the case
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: or anything, but say an old contractory worked in the house,
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: previous owner, a neighbor who looked after your cat and
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: dog while you were on vacation. You know, that sort
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: of situation could be something like that, someone who knows
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: them because they have that person life or knows where
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: it's stored.
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: The house you said, too, was like quite clean and stuff,
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: so it wouldn't they wouldn't have been startled by whoever
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: was in the home.
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: Oh definitely. Yeah. Now, forensic teams collected evidence from the
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: crime scene, anything that they could, including any potential DNA
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: or fingerprints or other physical evidence that might help identify
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: the perpetrator. Now as you were just kind of alluding
• 16:39
  Speaker 1: to their the investigation team also noted that there was
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: no significant evidence of a struggle inside the home, which
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: only seemed to raise you know, more questions, especially when
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: the couple coupled sorry with the fact that nothing was stolen.
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: Oh okay, there was even Roleck's watches still left inside
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: the home.
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: Oh is shit, that's surprising exactly. And it was just
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: like quite the injury too that Russell has like, oh
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: my gosh, I can't get that out of my head.
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: No, it's not pretty. Yeah the cringe, like caught yourself
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: on that.
• 17:17
  Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, Okay.
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: It seemed though like this was a very specifically targeted
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: attack when you really take a look at all the
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: evidence so far, and though it was you know, a potential,
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: there was also it was also certain though that surely
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: didn't run off because her purse, her cell phone, and
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: her keys were all inside the home. Okay, so she
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: didn't run off at least on her own free will.
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: Otherwise she would have taken.
• 17:45
  Speaker 4: Some of these totally. Yeah, not all.
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: Law enforcement began interviewing neighbors and anyone who might have
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: had contact with the Germans in the days leading up
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: to the murder. They also checked surveillance footage from nearby areas.
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: Still nothing. Search for answers, and the search for Shirley
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: Durman intensified over the next few days. Their search soon
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: expanded to include surrounding communities, waterways, and wooded areas in
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: case she too had already been killed and her body
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: was laying dumped somewhere. You're good. Yeah, you're going to
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: say something.
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: Well, I'm just thinking, like gosh, like ha, like she's
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: eighty seven years old, like correct, Like what the hell
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: are they doing to her?
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah? Well, Sheriff Sills made the use of cadaver dogs
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: and divers to search Lake Okney and other nearby bodies
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: of water for any sign of Shirley. He posted billboards
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: all around and even offered public rewards for upwards of
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: twenty five thousand dollars or even more for any use sorry,
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: any useful information for someone to come forward. He even
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: brought in the FBI finally to assist with the investigation
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: and try and build a profile in who they were
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: eventually looking for him.
• 19:02
  Speaker 4: It's good now.
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: Unfortunately, the profile that they built was basically nothing. The
• 19:07
  Speaker 1: profile was someone who likes guns and knives.
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, okay, yeah, well, I mean what would they
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: have though, really, Like, it doesn't seem like they really
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: have any evidence here.
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: Nothing so far.
• 19:20
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: Now. The days continued to tick by one after the
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: other until finally, ten days after the investigation began, when
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: Russell's body was initially found laying in the garage May sixteenth,
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: twenty fourteen, they made another horrific discovery. Two fishermen were
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: out on the water of the lake enjoying their time
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: in the sun. They were approximately five miles from the
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: German's house and they noticed something unusual floating in the water.
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: They steered their boat towards it to get a closer look,
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: and that's when they discovered it was a lifeless human body,
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: slowly bobbing with the rhythmic motions of the wave.
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: Dang, okay it was. I was like, it's either gonna
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: be surely or the missing head.
• 20:06
  Speaker 4: I guess.
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: Well. They immediately contacted the authorities and Sheriff Howard Stills
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: and his team responded to the scene immediately. The body
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: was found way down with concrete blocks tied to their ankles,
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: which means this was no accident.
• 20:24
  Speaker 2: But it was still like floating kind of a yeah,
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: or it was shallow or something. Yeah, who knows.
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: Well, I'm not too sure. Like there's many reasons why
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: it could be like potentially, say detached. I don't know
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: if it was detached, but I'm saying it can detach
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: from like you know, decomp or maybe like the body
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: started floating. They didn't like have the short enough rope,
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: and you know it was still visible from the surface. Gosh,
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: it could be that the the body was still five
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: feet underwater, but it was visible on this sunny day.
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: Say that is a fucking nightmare, Like that is like
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: one of I know I've said this before, but holy shit,
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: I couldn't imagine stumbling across something like that.
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: No, that that'd be I probably would never go fishing again.
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it would just it would haunt you for life.
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: Really, Now, imagine if they hooked body, oh man, and
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: you like bring this in.
• 21:13
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: No, no.
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: So upon recovery of the remains, an autopsy was of
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: course conducted, which revealed that it was in fact the
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: body of Shirley Dermott. Her cause of death was from
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: blunt forced trauma to the head. There were no signs
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: of drowning, confirming that she was already deceased when the
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: body was placed into the lake. The autopsy finding suggested
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: that she had been killed with multiple blows to the
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: head from a blunt object, possibly a hammer. She was
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: still fully clothed and there was no evidence of sexual assault.
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: Now this is also a good time to tell you
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: about the autopsy results of Russell, so authorities went ahead
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: and looked at him. There was gunshot residue found on
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: his shirt, and it is believed that he was shot
• 22:04
  Speaker 1: in the head. There was no arterial spray from around
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: his body from his head being removed either, which means
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: it was likely done post mortem, and they're assuming most
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: likely done to try and conceal evidence of his death.
• 22:20
  Speaker 4: Oh okay, say magical for example.
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I didn't even go there, Okay. I was like,
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: that's some fucked up thing to take. Yes, honestly, it's
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: probably in the lake too.
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: Right, probably, But I mean they've it. It's a big
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: fucking lake like it. It's a big lake, and they
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: have sent divers, they've sent cadaver dogs like, they've they've
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: scoured it. They even had like little like robots like
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: out there where they're like looking at screens. It's down there. Nothing.
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: They haven't found it.
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: Nothing, But I feel like it would be it'd be
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: much easier to like conceal her way down ahead, and
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: like you know, there could be giant fish or something
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: in there that like couldn't make it like unrecognizable.
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: There's also the possibility of gaiters, eh, shit, right, yeah, yeah,
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: that's an area that has gaters. Yeah, is oh you good?
• 23:13
  Speaker 4: Yeah?
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: Oh man, Yeah, So it could honestly just be gone forever.
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: It could be very well, I mean at this point
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: it probably is so. But back to Shirley though, So
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: the brutality and the method of disposal indicated a very
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: high level of planning and intent to obscure the crime,
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: just like with Russell, and it seems like they did
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: a very good job and what they were trying to achieve.
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: As the investigation continued and the days turned to weeks,
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: two months, and now years, the case still remains unsolved
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: to this day, and Russell's head has never been recovered.
• 23:52
  Speaker 4: Dang, of course it does.
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: Sheriff Sills, however, is not letting go of this case.
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: When asked when he's going to retire, because I don't
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: know his age, but he's he's definitely getting up there,
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: like he's got a white mustache and white hair and
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: you know, and he's that typical like detective that you
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: see on TV where it's like I'm retiring next month
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: sort of look. And his response to this question was
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: simply by he's not He's not saying when he's going
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: to retire. He's not saying another twenty years. He's not
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: saying when this case is done, he said, he's not.
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: Well, I'm kay, you know, I don't feel like I've
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: ever really thought of it from like a perspective of
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: an investigator who you know is 'enable to solve a
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: case like that. Is that is fucking tough, hey, because
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: you're putting so much time and energy and effort into this.
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: Well by this time, it's ten years.
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and you're like, gosh it like we just need
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: some like a tiniest thing and we'll get this and
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: stuff like it's almost like that whole around the next corner,
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: around the next corner.
• 24:58
  Speaker 4: Right exactly.
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: Well, in that same interview, when they're asking him when
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: he's going to retire, they're all like, well, when you
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: like hope to solve this case, he's like this week,
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: like come on, now, let's we got this.
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: I mean, I love that he's not discouraged. That's so good. Yeah,
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: you can only hope that he gets that wish.
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: Oh, I support this. This dude, he is in it
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: to win it. And I think he's in it to
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: win it for all the right fucking reasons. Because even
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: if he did solve this case this week. I still
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: don't think he's going to retire.
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, that's just like he's good at his job, right,
• 25:33
  Speaker 2: Like he definitely cares. I feel like just I feel
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: like they. I just think it was someone really close
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: to them, to be honest, is my thought.
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: Very well could be. We'll talk about a little bit
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: of that at the end here. Okay, okay, our own
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: theories and stuff. Excuse me, sorry, I need a sip
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: of water.
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: Your illness is coming back for hot min to.
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: Day a little bit. Okay, So back to Sheriff Sills. Personally,
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: he had interviewed like hundreds of people at this point.
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: He's ensured that the couple's bank records had been reviewed,
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: their safety deposit box had been opened and gone through,
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: their wills looked at and scrutinized, their phone records pulled
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: apart with a fine tooth comb. Their three children actually
• 26:21
  Speaker 1: each went through separately a polygraph test as well, and
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: each and every one of them passed. Now, mind you,
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: we do know what those aren't the most accurate, but
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: even still that does say something.
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: Well you can only hope it wasn't their freaking kids.
• 26:36
  Speaker 1: Yes, there's also something that you guys might be screaming
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: at us out there. What about when his son was murdered.
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: What about when you know Russell and Shirley lost their
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: son to a drug related incident. What if that's connected.
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: That twenty four year old case has not been linked
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: to this case. It's proven they are not linked.
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I did briefly think about that, but I didn't
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: like that was it was a fourteen year gap between it,
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: right it was?
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Now to play devil's advocate here for the sake
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: of if you're thinking this could potentially be it, and
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know how they ruled out them
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: not being linked. I'm just gonna say, Okay, you know what,
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: they clearly did their due diligence to say it's not linked.
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: I'm going to leave it at that. But devil's advocate here,
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: the fourteen year difference. What if their son owed a
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: shit ton of money, okay, and that's why he was
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: shot in this drug interaction. And what if because of that,
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: this guy who shot their son is now in jail
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: serving a life sentence of twenty five years. What if
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: he got off in parole fourteen years later, and that's
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: when he goes back after their parents to try and
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: get the money.
• 27:52
  Speaker 4: Shit.
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: That makes a lot of sense, actually.
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: E except for the fact that there was nothing stolen.
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: Right right, Okay, yeah, okay, because yeah, honestly, you almost
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: feel like almost anyone unless they were also kind of
• 28:09
  Speaker 2: like well off themselves, would take something.
• 28:13
  Speaker 4: Yeah, write of value.
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: Or it has nothing to do with money, there's some
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: other reason behind it, some other vendetta.
• 28:21
  Speaker 2: They did own a lot of businesses too, and sometimes
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: people like in the business field, can get pretty agitated
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: about stuff.
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah, maybe it's potentially you know, I mean, there's a situation.
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: It's not I don't think it's going to come to blows,
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: but it's an agitated situation where locally we have a
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: locally owned coffee shop and right across the street a
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: Starbucks is opened up. Now you know what, like that
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: sort of thing could could happen. Maybe they opened to
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: Hearty's right next to a little mom and pop shop
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: and now they're closing down.
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but then you would think, because their kids are
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: now running it and have been for a while, that
• 28:59
  Speaker 2: it would you know, they would have been in danger
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: or something too.
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: Right, But what do people in a lot of like
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: mob scenario situations. Do they don't go after you, they
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: go after your loved ones. What if one of their
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: kids is into something nefarious with the business. Maybe who knows,
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: Maybe it's a what's that? Oh my god, the breaking
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: bad situation. The chicken shop owner dude, the chicken restaurant dude,
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: I can't remember anyways, he's like dealing drugs at this,
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: like right, this fast food chicken shop. It's something similar
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: like that, and then he pissed off another drug lord
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: and then they would go after his parents because this
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: has the writings of someone who knew what they were doing. Yeah,
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: and there's another piece of thing evidence here I want
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: to touch on that I didn't see anywhere else. We've
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: spoke about this in the podcast before hits lots of times,
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: like specific professionals will use a twenty two caliber gun
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: because it will enter the skull and not leave the skull. Now,
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: Russell's head was removed most likely to take evidence. Someone
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: who removed the head would most likely know the bullet
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: is still in the head, probably because they knew what
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: they were fucking doing on a hit. That's my theory,
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: but that makes too much sense to me to look.
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: Away, okay, So okay, this just came up. Though, how
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: come they would have left like Russell there but then
• 30:27
  Speaker 2: have taken Surely that does really make sense, does it?
• 30:31
  Speaker 4: Doesn't like at all?
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: Nope?
• 30:35
  Speaker 4: Huh okay.
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: So despite all these oh less.
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: Sorry, unless she potentially died later, there is a possibility.
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: Right, well, she didn't drowned, touche, And I believe the
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: autopsy don't know why. I believe the autopsy showed it
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: was the same day she died.
• 30:52
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: But yeah, like, despite all this, so all these thoughts,
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: all these questions, all these theories that that are coming up,
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: and all the hard work of Sheriff Sills, there's nothing
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: to show for it. There's no answers.
• 31:08
  Speaker 3: Now.
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: What they do know is, as I already mentioned that
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: this was likely a targeted attack. They believe there is
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: a minimum of two perpetrators, if not three or more,
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: involved in the murder of Russell and Shirley. The Germans
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: no longer owned a boat, and they had their dock
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: at the lake open and available for easy parking. It's
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: believed that whoever did this pulled up to the dock
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: on a very quiet evening in the darkness of night
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: and made their way up to the house from there.
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: But after that we're only left with questions.
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: Okay, so like they had a dock personally that didn't
• 31:50
  Speaker 2: have a boat. So then these people snuck up via
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: boat kind of thing.
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: Yes, they believed they pulled their boat up attached to
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: the dock, walked up from the shore, not from the
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: drive way or road.
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: Oh okay, it would probably be less noticeable.
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: Yes, walking up from there, got into the house one
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: way or another. We don't know how got into the house,
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: did whatever the fuck they did, and left on the
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: boat and dumped Shirley along the way.
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and that would be very easy for them to
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: dump Shirley too that way if they like arrived that way,
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: you know. Yeah, But then it's also doesn't super make
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: sense why they didn't also just dump Russell.
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: But I don't know exactly why did they dump Shirley,
• 32:36
  Speaker 1: you not Russell? Why did they cut his head off
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: to hide the evidence and not hers?
• 32:43
  Speaker 4: Gosh, I mean, holy heck.
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: I feel so bad for this investigator because this almost
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: seems like it's it could be like one of those
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: murder mystery kind.
• 32:53
  Speaker 4: Of things, you know.
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: Oh, it probably could a real.
• 32:57
  Speaker 2: Life fucking murder mystery where you just can't solve the shit.
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Now, there were some tips and theories that did
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: come in, like someone saying they saw a suspicious individual
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: on the property recently but couldn't offer a description at all.
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: That was it. There's a suspicious individual, that's the description, okay.
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: Or another person saying that they had a revelation that
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: it was actually an alligator attack. The alligator crawled up
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: into their home, bit off ruffles Russell's head, and then
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: took Shirley into the lake with it.
• 33:28
  Speaker 2: Okay, I don't I can't see that one even remotely,
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: like they would know for sure, Yeah for sure.
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah. So unsurprisingly, nothing ever came of either of these.
• 33:37
  Speaker 4: Okay, So this is where we're.
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: Left off, not knowing what the fuck happened.
• 33:43
  Speaker 4: Wow, However, is it solved?
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: There is one more thing that recently came up about
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: this case, only a couple months ago.
• 33:55
  Speaker 4: Oh shit, oh shit. Okay.
• 33:57
  Speaker 1: If I were to have done this case when I
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: originally discovered, I would not have this extra piece of information.
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: So thankfully I held off a little bit here. One
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: of the more promising leads out of this case has
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: come Afford so County Sheriff Howard Sills, still working hard
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: on the case, confirmed there was DNA evidence found on
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: Russell's shirt that does not belong to either him or
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: Shirley ding Dang, So, to quote him quote, it's probably
• 34:30
  Speaker 1: going to be whoever carried out these murders, or at
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: least someone who was a party to the crime. Now,
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: though the DNA is not from either of the victims,
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: there is a lot more testing that still needs to
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: occur with the evidence. But since the murder or murderers
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: are likely to be known to the Desmonds, finding a
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: match might not be out of the question.
• 34:54
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, Okay, this would be amazing to have
• 34:58
  Speaker 2: this solved.
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: Hey, Also, FBI Special Agent Andy Smith, So Agent Smith,
• 35:06
  Speaker 1: those who yeah, you know, if you know, they had
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: been a part of the who's been a part of
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: the FBI for twenty two years and working this case
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: for nine of those years, came out with a press
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: release on the eve of the ten year anniversary of
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: their murder. Special Agent Smith confirmed they too had leads
• 35:26
  Speaker 1: in the case, sorry, a new lead in the case.
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: They did not say exactly what it was. He did
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: say that they were reevaluating the cellular data. So to
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: quote him, there are several things that we have that
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: we're evaluating that no one knows. We do have leads.
• 35:44
  Speaker 1: We're looking for you, and we're not going to stop
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: until we get.
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: You, yes, because technology is always changing, right yeah, yeah,
• 35:53
  Speaker 2: and like this is it's there's still people, like good
• 35:56
  Speaker 2: people working on this.
• 35:57
  Speaker 4: So this is good.
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: So according to him, again what you just said, with
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: the advance advances in technology over the past decade and
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: the new leads they've developed, he is confident that the
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: team that's been working hard investigating this case will soon
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: be able to bring justice for Sureley and Russell and
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: their family and finally solve the case.
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, well yeah, because this fucker fuckers who
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: ever did this have been running free for the last
• 36:26
  Speaker 2: goddamn ten years.
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 36:28
  Speaker 4: That's some bullshit.
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and that is the case of Russell and Shirley Dermant.
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: Gosh, Okay, Like my fingers are crossed that something comes out.
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: I agree, because yeah, I just I mean, it's a
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: shame that they couldn't have solved it earlier and these
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: people didn't get to like just run their life for
• 36:47
  Speaker 2: ten years.
• 36:48
  Speaker 4: But better late than never.
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: Right, Oh no, kidding, Better late than never, one hundred percent.
• 36:53
  Speaker 1: That's why these guys are still working on it. It
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: was if it was like, oh, it's getting too late,
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: why would like just throw it aside? I can't imagine that.
• 37:00
  Speaker 4: Yeah, good on them, Good on them.
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: They are working fucking hard in this case. They are
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: dedicated to it, and they are determined to figure it
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: the fuck out.
• 37:09
  Speaker 2: I have a feeling it's going to surprise the shit
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: out of us who it is.
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: I'm going to put my money on it being one
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: of the kids getting into some shit with the business,
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: not being good with operations or whatever it was, took
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: over the business, got into some shit. Maybe they were
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: losing money, didn't tell mom and dad about it, and
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: then made deals with mob people. Who fucking knows. But
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: either way, someone who fucking knew that they were doing
• 37:36
  Speaker 1: a third party was either hired to kill the parents
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: or killed the parents as a fuck you to the
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: kids who got in shit.
• 37:47
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: Oh gosh, I really, I honestly really hope it's not
• 37:51
  Speaker 2: that one of the like one of the kids isn't
• 37:53
  Speaker 2: behind this. I don't say that's just devastating, but we
• 37:56
  Speaker 2: have heard that's her a thing before.
• 37:58
  Speaker 1: I don't think one of the kids is behind it.
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: I think one of the kids did something to piss
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: someone else off to make them do it.
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but don't you the guilt that you would just
• 38:06
  Speaker 2: admit that then.
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: You know, Oh why would they?
• 38:09
  Speaker 4: Why not? I don't know.
• 38:10
  Speaker 2: I wouldn't be at a hold shit.
• 38:12
  Speaker 4: And if I was shady, if you.
• 38:14
  Speaker 1: Had a gambling if you had a gambling addiction that
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: resulted in the murder of your parents, you'd fucking come
• 38:19
  Speaker 1: clean that said, Yeah, I have a gambling addiction. I
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: owe these guys' money and they want to get back
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: at me, so they killed my parents.
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: I would probably admit that because it's not like you're
• 38:30
  Speaker 2: going to be in trouble.
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they If you fucking do that and they have
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: no there's no evidence to back it up, you're dead next.
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: Because if the police come knocking on their door asking
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: fucking questions, your next in their fucking list. Well, I
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: don't know, because it's it's like they told you with
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: your parents, They warned you, and maybe now you made
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: the payment or something like that, and you have no
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: evidence to back up your claim nothing, But you just
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: fucking know.
• 39:00
  Speaker 4: Hmmm.
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: I don't know, man, Okay, something it's got to be solved.
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: We also have some dogs that like seriously need to
• 39:08
  Speaker 2: get outside right now. Apparently I think there's a mouse
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: or something running around that they want.
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: Okay, pause it real quick. We're gonna let the dogs
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: out whatever they were after they wanted it, because they
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: just bolted out that door.
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: Now. I went out briefly to make sure, like I
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: didn't have to save anything.
• 39:23
  Speaker 1: But or it's like a bear or something like that. Yeah, yeah,
• 39:26
  Speaker 1: fair enough, Okay, Yeah, So what's your theory? Where do
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: you think your head's at? What do you think happened?
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: So I told you mine, So it's only fair let's
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: hear it.
• 39:36
  Speaker 4: Oh man, do you have.
• 39:38
  Speaker 1: Any indication of what you think? Any clue?
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: I know, Hey, Like I just feel like a terrible
• 39:43
  Speaker 2: person because I don't want to say this if like
• 39:46
  Speaker 2: it isn't the case. But I sort of have a
• 39:48
  Speaker 2: little bit of a gut feeling that one of the
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: kids is behind it as well.
• 39:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, in which regard, I don't know, because like,
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: I don't think the kid is responsible. I don't think
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: the kid is linked to the parents' death. I think
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: the kid did something that pissed someone else off to
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: kill the parents as a you know.
• 40:11
  Speaker 4: Oh this is so tough. But I'm assuming too.
• 40:13
  Speaker 2: All the kids have kids themselves. But I mean, that
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: doesn't mean just because your parent can't be shady.
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: Well, I do know there's a total of nine nine grandkids.
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: I don't know how it's dispersed, though, could be one
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: family has nine kids. Who knows.
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: Potentially, Gosh, I don't know. I'm having trouble. I do
• 40:29
  Speaker 2: feel like a kid is involved, but I don't really
• 40:31
  Speaker 2: know why they would, you know, because a lot of
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: times it's money, right, So I'm like, but then nothing
• 40:39
  Speaker 2: was stolen, but they're going to get some sort of
• 40:41
  Speaker 2: like big ass inheritance. But they could be all like
• 40:45
  Speaker 2: wealthy someone on their own anyway, I don't know, man,
• 40:49
  Speaker 2: But who.
• 40:49
  Speaker 4: Else could it be?
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: Who else could it be if it wasn't something involving
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: the kid.
• 40:54
  Speaker 1: I agree. I'm going to reiterate. I do not think
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: the kids are responsible for killing their parents. But I
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: do think the kids, one of them did something to
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: piss someone else off that they wanted to send a
• 41:11
  Speaker 1: fucking message, and that's why their parents were attacked.
• 41:15
  Speaker 2: I was thinking to someone potentially within the community. But
• 41:18
  Speaker 2: no one else within the community has been at risk
• 41:21
  Speaker 2: or anything, right, Like, it's probably nothing else has happened.
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: Not that I'm aware of. No, so nothing. Yeah, that's
• 41:29
  Speaker 1: why I said, what you're thinking, cap on for this one,
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: because the evidence is is I mean, well it's barely
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: any evidence, but everything's just out there. It's just what
• 41:37
  Speaker 1: the fuck.
• 41:38
  Speaker 2: Unless they had some sort of business partner at some point,
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: you know that felt like they got screwed over. Yeah,
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: which is which is I guess another potential.
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's something I'd never thought about.
• 41:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like maybe they felt they were supposed to be
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: a part of all these nineteen restaurants or whatever, right,
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: and then something happened and like Russell and surely moved
• 42:00
  Speaker 2: on on their own. And there's some like serious hard
• 42:03
  Speaker 2: feelings and this person, just like hit rock Bottom, is
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: bankrupt and like, fuck you guys, and I.
• 42:08
  Speaker 4: Don't know very Hollywood, Yeah, launch a lot of Hollywood.
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: Movies, touche. Yeah, So that's the case. I'm curious to
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: what your guys' thoughts are, So make sure you shoot
• 42:19
  Speaker 1: us a message or an email or something like that
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: tell us where you think this goes. Yeah, because I mean,
• 42:26
  Speaker 1: as of right now, it could it could go anywhere,
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: but it does sound like it will be solved. Both
• 42:32
  Speaker 1: Agent Smith and Officer Sells are both seeming pretty confident.
• 42:37
  Speaker 4: Good.
• 42:38
  Speaker 2: So okay, and yeah, you probably made the right decision
• 42:40
  Speaker 2: not doing this as a live episode because people would
• 42:43
  Speaker 2: have been Yes.
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: That's why I didn't do live because it's unsolved and
• 42:47
  Speaker 1: people would probably beat me up.
• 42:50
  Speaker 4: So yeah, thank you for saving us.
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah, So when it comes to the two hundredth episode,
• 42:55
  Speaker 1: whether we're doing at our live event, I will be
• 42:57
  Speaker 1: doing a solved case And if you guys want to join,
• 42:59
  Speaker 1: you can get tickets. We have it posted on our
• 43:02
  Speaker 1: social media. You can get tickets. It is a local event.
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: It's only eighty tickets available, so it's a small little thing.
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: We're going to record the episode live in front of everyone.
• 43:11
  Speaker 1: Have a good time, do some dark prizes, have some drinks.
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: It's gonna be great if you're part of our Patreon
• 43:17
  Speaker 1: subscribers as well, if you're over there supporting us, we
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: will be streaming the event for you to see on Patreon.
• 43:24
  Speaker 2: And Trench has some damn good drinks. Yes, we're often
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: drinking Trench because they're good.
• 43:30
  Speaker 1: Trench is really good. They have my literally my favorite
• 43:32
  Speaker 1: beer I've ever had. There's another one that comes close,
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: but this one still beats it. So it's the Trench
• 43:38
  Speaker 1: thousand peaks favorite beer of all time. My close second
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: is dead Frog. They had one like, oh god, it'd
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: probably be like fifteen years ago. I had it and
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: it was like cracked pepper.
• 43:49
  Speaker 4: Oh they don't have it anymore.
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: I had it like once, oh shit, and it was
• 43:53
  Speaker 1: super good.
• 43:53
  Speaker 4: I bet you could.
• 43:54
  Speaker 2: You would have it again and be like, oh, this
• 43:55
  Speaker 2: isn't as good as I remember.
• 43:57
  Speaker 1: Maybe maybe, but the memory of it. Yeah, Trench even
• 44:01
  Speaker 1: beats the memory of it though. That's the thing.
• 44:03
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 44:04
  Speaker 2: Well, and Trench also has a Trench Peach tea.
• 44:07
  Speaker 4: That is like, it's like next level.
• 44:10
  Speaker 1: It's so damn good, and you're obsessed with the fruit
• 44:12
  Speaker 1: punch one too.
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: Well, I would say the tea is better.
• 44:15
  Speaker 4: The fruit punch one.
• 44:16
  Speaker 2: I really like too. It's just it's like a little
• 44:19
  Speaker 2: bit sweet and it makes me look like a small
• 44:22
  Speaker 2: child that had just drank a jug of kool aid.
• 44:26
  Speaker 2: Fair enough, My whole, my whole, Like lips are just
• 44:29
  Speaker 2: like cherry red.
• 44:31
  Speaker 4: It's funny.
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: Well, you get your mouth right in there. Clearly, this
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: is not a sponsored segment by Trench. By the way,
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: We do just really enjoy it. We wanted to pick
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: a place that we enjoy for our event, and we
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: picked there. It was a no brainer question for us,
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: so they're gracious enough to let us have it there.
• 44:47
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 44:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's very exciting.
• 44:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 44:49
  Speaker 1: So if you want to join, get those tickets, or
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: if you're not local, you can see us do it
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: on Patreon Live. You have all of our other links
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: down there too, social media's website, YouTube's the things. They're
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: all there to click and see, So click and see.
• 45:06
  Speaker 4: So until next time, stay wicked.