Latest / For All Nerds Show / Is Matt Murdock An Idiot Or What? (Born Again S02 Review Feat. Dr. Drea Letamendi & Eddy Overgold)

Transcript

Is Matt Murdock An Idiot Or What? (Born Again S02 Review Feat. Dr. Drea Letamendi & Eddy Overgold) · For All Nerds Show

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: A blind lawyer who can fight well, I'll be Darnell.
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: And what's up y'all, and welcome to another episode of
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: the four All Nerds Show. This is a very special episode.
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: It's your boy, DJ Ben I mean aka Blart Fent
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: buzz Outchi a method man splaining, Meek Millhouse Lebron Shame
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: here in the spaceship tonight, and I am joined by
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: two very special guests. I'll let them both introduce themselves,
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: but first, returning mister Eddie, tell them you know all
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: about yourself. All that good stuff was good, was good.
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: I'm Betty Overgold.
• 0:46
  Speaker 3: I come from Waving the Red Flag, the number one
• 0:48
  Speaker 3: relationship and culture podcast in the universe. You know aka
• 0:52
  Speaker 3: Eddie Button. I don't actually like that name. That's what
• 0:55
  Speaker 3: my co host of name. You actually quite hate that,
• 0:59
  Speaker 3: like Joe Wedding, Yeah, unfortunately, Yeah, but it's stuck. So
• 1:03
  Speaker 3: I guess that's I guess that's the one. You know,
• 1:05
  Speaker 3: Ja over Goold as well. I don't make music, but
• 1:08
  Speaker 3: I do make tunes.
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: Uh.
• 1:10
  Speaker 3: My card games, we got we got conversational card games.
• 1:12
  Speaker 3: It's a red Flag And in all seriousness, they keep
• 1:15
  Speaker 3: your dinner party, your cookout, your date night, you know,
• 1:18
  Speaker 3: vibrant and connection focused those website.
• 1:23
  Speaker 2: To do that. Yeah. Uh, doctor Drea, please introduce reintroduce
• 1:26
  Speaker 2: yourself to the foreigner.
• 1:28
  Speaker 4: It's fan so happy to be back. My name is
• 1:31
  Speaker 4: doctor Drea a k A. The Arkham Asylum Doc a
• 1:35
  Speaker 4: k A. Ethical therapist who does not slap her patience.
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: Ever. Ever, ever, It's never happened once.
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: That's one thing.
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: About ak.
• 1:48
  Speaker 4: Ak a co host of The Arkham Sessions, a podcast
• 1:53
  Speaker 4: all about the psychology and mental health of superheroes and
• 1:56
  Speaker 4: pop culture.
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: You know, as doctor Drea said, she does not slap
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: our patients. And that is the first indication that we
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: are here to talk about Daredevil Born Again, Season two,
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: Episode eight, basically the whole of season two. If you
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: have not seen it, you need to probably pause unless
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: you care about massive spoilers, because we are going to
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: distress everything. This is going to be a spoiler filled review.
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: That being said, what did you think overall of season two?
• 2:31
  Speaker 3: I don't know, Like Daredevil for me has always been
• 2:34
  Speaker 3: a you know, come secumsa kind.
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: Of a vibe.
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: But I'm not gonna lie.
• 2:39
  Speaker 3: By the time the entire thing ended, and we get
• 2:42
  Speaker 3: like him being like, yeah, fuck it, I'm Daredevil. I
• 2:45
  Speaker 3: actually love that, so they pull they brought it home
• 2:49
  Speaker 3: from me for the season, but I'm yeah, I'm so
• 2:52
  Speaker 3: so on Daredevil.
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: Unfortunately, so have you always been so so on Bear Devil?
• 2:57
  Speaker 3: Honestly always man like For me, I always looked at like,
• 3:01
  Speaker 3: would this be a crime drama that I would watch
• 3:04
  Speaker 3: if it weren't also a Marvel property? And I think
• 3:07
  Speaker 3: the answer was never yes for me, unfortunately, I think
• 3:10
  Speaker 3: because it felt like it was always trying to sell
• 3:12
  Speaker 3: as like, hey, this is like if we took the
• 3:15
  Speaker 3: Daredevil out of this, this is this is stacking up
• 3:17
  Speaker 3: with the Wire Sopranos, top boy, and it just never
• 3:22
  Speaker 3: did for me.
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: I was going to hit my boy up. I won't
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: name it, you know, I won't name drop all that one,
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: but I have to hit him and be like, yo,
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: are you watching The Devil? And I was tould be like,
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: because you know, he's a big fan of The Wire.
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: I like, it's like if The Wire was written by idiots. Oh,
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: I mean maybe not idiots, no notice, you know, I
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: want idiots, people who are not caring about law or
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: governments or.
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: How shit works.
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, oh reality, you know it's that it's it's if
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: the wire was not constrained by reality.
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: There we go, Okay, why are written by the cast
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: of SNL got.
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: It and it never ended story? Because stop either that's
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: the other problem.
• 4:07
  Speaker 3: But the guy keep getting out of prison. This isn't
• 4:14
  Speaker 3: because how is it grounded? But he keeps breaking out
• 4:16
  Speaker 3: of prison.
• 4:17
  Speaker 2: But doctor Trey would.
• 4:20
  Speaker 5: They're taking a note from Arkham Asylum.
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: Makes sense.
• 4:25
  Speaker 3: Batman is in a world where everybody, everything's getting blown
• 4:27
  Speaker 3: up all the time.
• 4:28
  Speaker 4: Okay, cool, Like yeah, yeah, you know that's a broken system.
• 4:32
  Speaker 4: This system is a little bit more grounded. We've got
• 4:35
  Speaker 4: to get real with that. I would say, look, I
• 4:38
  Speaker 4: love Daredevil isolated in kind of a vacuum, impeccable casting,
• 4:48
  Speaker 4: love Charlie Cox, just love what they're doing with the character.
• 4:51
  Speaker 4: Some of it is so true to the comics. Such
• 4:54
  Speaker 4: a celebration of of this character and his abilities and disability.
• 5:01
  Speaker 4: Truly almost like we failed him because when you see
• 5:07
  Speaker 4: the surrounding contexts and the environment, you know, everything from
• 5:12
  Speaker 4: the wigs on Karen, We've got to have a segment
• 5:15
  Speaker 4: on Karen's wigs, to the portrayal of the anti Vigilante team,
• 5:26
  Speaker 4: and then the producers walking that back and saying had
• 5:31
  Speaker 4: nothing to do with real sociopolitical context, even though this
• 5:35
  Speaker 4: was made in twenty twenty five.
• 5:36
  Speaker 5: I live in LA. I've left in LA when the
• 5:39
  Speaker 5: ice raids were happening.
• 5:40
  Speaker 4: These are real influences, these are real references, and so
• 5:45
  Speaker 4: for the producers to deny that really makes this fall
• 5:47
  Speaker 4: flat for me.
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: Do they have to? Though? That's kind of like Tony
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: Gilroy when he denied fascism when he was promoting and
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: or until you know, his NBA was up and he's
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: I just got it all about fascism.
• 5:59
  Speaker 4: Look, you know what's come around. You know, I get it.
• 6:01
  Speaker 4: You know, they they want to welcome all viewers. They
• 6:04
  Speaker 4: don't want to isolate anyone. I think in this day
• 6:06
  Speaker 4: and age, you got to you gotta just own it.
• 6:08
  Speaker 4: Why did you write this? You have to own it?
• 6:11
  Speaker 4: But you know, overall there are some problems with you know,
• 6:16
  Speaker 4: I agree with ed like you've either you have to
• 6:19
  Speaker 4: contextualize in what's grounded and what's real.
• 6:24
  Speaker 5: Or you you know.
• 6:26
  Speaker 4: Stand tent too's down with with the fantasy. And you
• 6:30
  Speaker 4: know where we're at with this because you're somewhere in
• 6:32
  Speaker 4: between where the legal system is using real legal references.
• 6:36
  Speaker 4: The psychology and mental health system is using those real references.
• 6:39
  Speaker 4: And then they're really not they're really not committed to
• 6:43
  Speaker 4: the full research of the way these systems work. So
• 6:47
  Speaker 4: and it could be Look, it could be that the
• 6:50
  Speaker 4: casual viewer doesn't know any better. But I walked out
• 6:54
  Speaker 4: of the room so many times with just my frustration
• 6:58
  Speaker 4: with where things were going.
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: All right, all right, well for me, I think I'm
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: in between the two of you. I am definitely a
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: dared of a coma book fan. Shout out to and
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: the SENTI back in the day and even all the
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: way up to who did the one recently? Who got
• 7:17
  Speaker 2: blinking on the name? But there was one that was
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: actually super fun and lighthearted and it wasn't so dark
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: and grim.
• 7:23
  Speaker 5: Was that Chip?
• 7:24
  Speaker 2: Was it? No, it's I think it's before is that is?
• 7:27
  Speaker 2: With chipmany fights, uh Claw and all that. I'm not Yeah, blur,
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: it's all blur. And even the new one right now
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: Stephanie is writing it on Stephanie Phillips and they said,
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: I've read the first issue of that that was pretty interesting.
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: So I'm definitely a dared of a comic book fan.
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: I thought the Daredevil Netflix series, where its time was
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: pretty incredible for its time. I felt like Born Again
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: so far has been Tantana. I wasn't a player of it,
• 7:57
  Speaker 2: but Tatana mentioned this on one show we were talking
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: about movie, and she said, it's trying to like Pokemon
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: when the first two Pokemon games came out, and then
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: they put out the third Pokemon game, and it was
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: trying of like a remix for the first two. And
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: that's how I feel like Born Again is it feels
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: like I'm watching the Netflix series but different, and it's
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: it's weird because it is a sequel, but it's not
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: at the same time because the same things keep happening,
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: like you said, Eddie, like dude keeps getting out of prison,
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: dude keeps doing back to prison, and that is I've
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: got some questions. I wrote some questions as I was
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: rewatching the finale, because the first time I watched the finale,
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: I cannot lie. I cracked up. Like there was certain
• 8:38
  Speaker 2: stuff I.
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: Thought was cool.
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: The courtroom scene, I am Daredevil, you know, and then
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: he throws the baton around. That was hilarious. But I mean, oh,
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: did you did you think like corny? Almost? Oh? No,
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: I mean full on hilarity corny. By the end of it,
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: I was rolling like I fell out of my chair
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: the first time I watched it.
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: That's the one part I kind of liked.
• 8:57
  Speaker 2: Oh no, that part was No, that part was cool.
• 9:00
  Speaker 5: I was like, Okay, let's do this.
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: No, I thought that was cool. Throwing the baton round.
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: I thought that was cool. Don't get me wrong, But
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: I also it's stretching the limits of reality. But if
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: by the end of the episode is when I'm falling
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: out my chair laughing when they slammed the you know,
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: the slammer on him, when King Peninnon sitting on the beach,
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: it we'll get to that. Oh my god, Oh my god,
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: like reality is just adured. First question I have is
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: Karen a sociopath or is everyone else? I'm pretty sure
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: they're using this term wrong. But my this was my
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: problem with this season. I felt like Karen was right,
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: and I felt everyone else was just a pure idiot wrong.
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: I mean, I can't speak to APD.
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: I guess that would be Drea's thing.
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: But like, no, I thought Karen was right and I
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: thought everyone else was wrong. Yeah, okay, so agree about Yeah?
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: I mean king Pin to die yes, And.
• 9:57
  Speaker 4: I think Daredevil is holding onto his is integrity and saying, look,
• 10:02
  Speaker 4: we're not going to it's it's very I mean, come on,
• 10:04
  Speaker 4: it's Batman right, Like, We're not going to stoop to
• 10:07
  Speaker 4: that level. We're not going to kill because they kill,
• 10:10
  Speaker 4: we have other means. Now, the problem I have with
• 10:13
  Speaker 4: this Daredevil is that he still believes in the system
• 10:16
  Speaker 4: in the same way that Beast sits in prison while
• 10:21
  Speaker 4: his call his colleagues are fighting the fight like he's like,
• 10:25
  Speaker 4: they even try to get him out, and he's like, no,
• 10:26
  Speaker 4: I'm going to sit in prison. This is the Daredevil
• 10:29
  Speaker 4: way of believe in the system, work within the system,
• 10:32
  Speaker 4: infiltrate the system. That's how you change it. Where in
• 10:36
  Speaker 4: this world, Karen is kind of right, if you don't
• 10:41
  Speaker 4: kill them, they will use the twisted, distorted and exploited
• 10:48
  Speaker 4: ways to use the system against you, and you sort
• 10:51
  Speaker 4: of have to believe Karen. And so I kind of
• 10:53
  Speaker 4: think she was right. And then they were, you know,
• 10:55
  Speaker 4: even the judges were, we're trying to scapegoat her and
• 11:01
  Speaker 4: use her as a like a symbol for the other
• 11:08
  Speaker 4: protesters and the other activists, and so yeah, I think
• 11:12
  Speaker 4: that kind of that didn't land well because the show
• 11:15
  Speaker 4: was sort of trying to create some pathology and Karen
• 11:20
  Speaker 4: that she wants that she's now a killer, and I'm
• 11:24
  Speaker 4: not sure that I can align with that.
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And the thing is, I know, like I get it,
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: as you know, I'm a long term det Oble fan.
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: There's a classic Punisher run from when I was a
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: kid when he chases down the Kingpin and he gets
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: to him and he's about to shoot him, and then
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: you know, people are like, yo, they're already downstairs in
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: the lobby killing each other over who's your takeover once
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: he's dead. So if you kill him and creates a
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: power vacuum, blah blah blah, the streets go to chaos,
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: blood in the streets, et cetera. And that's a good point, yes,
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: and that does make some sense. But yeah, yeah, it's
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: like jail won't fix that either, And so you're gonna
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: put him in jail, still gonna create the same power vacuum,
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: still create the same struggle. Even if he's on the street.
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: People constantly be coming for the throne, as we've seen
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: we all watched The Wire, you know, et cetera. So
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: it doesn't I don't know. It just it works but
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: it doesn't work, is how I feel. And I know
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: we had the same discression over Invincible and the Ville Trumites,
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: and I don't It's like after four seasons of this
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: come off fam and Bullseye and I get on the
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: other side of it. Is Daredevil's Catholic beliefs because even
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: in this last episode he really, you know, hammers Home,
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: I want to give you grace, you know, and you're
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: not the mardin to give me grace and all that,
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: and it was just I was trying not to laugh.
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: I don't know.
• 12:51
  Speaker 3: I think one thing that is like Matt Murdoch not
• 12:56
  Speaker 3: wanting to do that makes sense to me in the
• 12:59
  Speaker 3: way that like people can be stupid, Like it's not
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: bad writing to go like a guy who's Catholic and
• 13:03
  Speaker 3: doesn't believe it's his right and who is a lawyer,
• 13:06
  Speaker 3: is is gonna believe in the system to a fault
• 13:09
  Speaker 3: even when it constantly shows him that it doesn't work.
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: That makes sense from a character perspective, But the.
• 13:13
  Speaker 3: Motherfuckers he has around him, that doesn't make Like I
• 13:17
  Speaker 3: feel like Jessica Jones doesn't have a no kill role,
• 13:20
  Speaker 3: Like why does she just punch this man's head up?
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: Like I don't. I don't feel like.
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: In this episode, Jessica Jones punches a cop and he
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: goes out the window from at least the second floor.
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: Right, he's dead.
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: He's dead, Like punish sir r.
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: Karen.
• 13:36
  Speaker 3: There are so many people that don't mind. So it
• 13:39
  Speaker 3: just feels like bad writing that he doesn't seem to
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: have to manage anybody else who deeply disagrees with him,
• 13:44
  Speaker 3: Like nobody.
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: Else got this man, Like when the whole crowd was like.
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: Uh uh, fight back, fight back, fight.
• 13:50
  Speaker 3: Back, and on top of Kingpin and Matt is like, no, guys.
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: Come on, leave alone. He didn't mean to. It's like
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: they would and kill it. Yeah.
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, nobody had a knife. Nobody had a in America.
• 14:02
  Speaker 3: Nobody just was like, bro, just shoot.
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: Him, Like yeah, so he's not bulletproof, all right? So, Drea,
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: is Karen a sociopath or is it just everybody else?
• 14:13
  Speaker 5: I don't think she's a sociopath. I mean you're going
• 14:16
  Speaker 5: to get a nuanced ancer from me.
• 14:19
  Speaker 4: I do think she has PTSD right, her brother, she
• 14:22
  Speaker 4: was involved with the death of her brother. She did
• 14:26
  Speaker 4: she was involved with having to defend herself having to
• 14:29
  Speaker 4: be violent all of her training up till now, and
• 14:32
  Speaker 4: I notice that Karen was training throughout the whole season
• 14:36
  Speaker 4: with this vendetta and with this pent up energy.
• 14:40
  Speaker 5: She has never had this like rageful violence.
• 14:44
  Speaker 4: You know, if we think about what sociopathy is, lack
• 14:47
  Speaker 4: of remorse, no moral compass, doesn't you know, thinks they're
• 14:51
  Speaker 4: above the law. I'm not seeing those things with her,
• 14:54
  Speaker 4: but I am seeing a trauma response, which is like,
• 14:56
  Speaker 4: we're in a broken system, and in order to protect
• 15:00
  Speaker 4: myself and others, with the knowledge that I have and
• 15:03
  Speaker 4: the experiences that I have, I have to fight. I
• 15:05
  Speaker 4: have to get strong, and if I need to, I
• 15:09
  Speaker 4: will use violence for means of protecting myself and others.
• 15:13
  Speaker 4: So I think that there's a rationale for what's going
• 15:17
  Speaker 4: on with her. It's a little extreme, but I will
• 15:22
  Speaker 4: I won't say that she's a sociopath. I'll reserve that
• 15:26
  Speaker 4: for other characters.
• 15:29
  Speaker 3: Is there anything that she did that was unreasonable? Because
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: everything's not fresh in my in my head from you know,
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: across the entire I guess four seasons. But was there
• 15:39
  Speaker 3: anything that she did that was particularly extreme? We feel no,
• 15:45
  Speaker 3: given the context, because she was never like, hey, let's
• 15:50
  Speaker 3: let's let's let's go Yeah, she never did know, let's
• 15:53
  Speaker 3: go back in time and kill Wilson Fisk. It was
• 15:55
  Speaker 3: all very like, let's just kill people who already are
• 15:58
  Speaker 3: currently doing bad and will continue to do so, all
• 16:00
  Speaker 3: kinds of behaviors.
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: I mean even in the season, like at one point
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: when Matt throws his baton at her to stop her
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: from killing Bullseye, I felt that was more extreme, like
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: he could have walked in and just stopped her. He
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: didn't have to throw something at her. So true, Yeah, yeah, yeah,
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: MAT's quite abusive though, I mean that does what I'm saying,
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: My man is abusive and multiple different ways.
• 16:22
  Speaker 5: What really I mean about abusive?
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: I mean he lies to everyone, like whether or not
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: you want to say, okay, that's you know, to protect them,
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: then don't get in a relationship, Like if you're gonna
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: have a lot of people.
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: Don't subject them and rob them of the ability to decide.
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you're just doubling down and get it again, you know.
• 16:42
  Speaker 5: But he goes to church and praise on it.
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: But he's Catholic. A Catholic never did anything bad before.
• 16:50
  Speaker 3: Right now, you can never find an entry of a
• 16:53
  Speaker 3: Catholic doing the wrong.
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: I forgive anybody.
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: Right now basically a priest. Oh, I mean like he
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: goes to church and praise on everything. That doesn't make
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: him right. But yeah, I do think Mad is pretty abusive,
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: like most superheroes and relationships are abusive. But Matt is grimy,
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: Like because Matt got gained, that's what's worth about it.
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: Like Matt is a womanizer.
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean look at his like you know, call
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: sheet over the seasons.
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: She is crazy.
• 17:21
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I can't see it. But here's the thing. Like
• 17:25
  Speaker 5: the reason.
• 17:28
  Speaker 4: The reason I can't see it is that he's that
• 17:30
  Speaker 4: good because I like, I'm just an apologist for him.
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because the game, you know, the game is there,
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: Like you know, my man is smooth. He gives that
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: stare off of the space and you know they're just
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: like oh yeah, like.
• 17:45
  Speaker 3: Oh he somehow got six pack abs and a bunch
• 17:48
  Speaker 3: of scars. Also like an adorable like sort of puppy dog.
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and like they just ignore his cars, Like we
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: all right, we can get to doctor Glenn now, because
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: doctor is very like yeah, how did she not you know,
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: how does she over all those stars? Like he's not
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: like Bruce Wayne, who can be like off off, you know,
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: playing polo or whatever he does. You know, it's just no, dude,
• 18:14
  Speaker 2: your style.
• 18:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, if you're blind, I feel like you
• 18:17
  Speaker 3: get away with anything. I bumped into everything on the
• 18:20
  Speaker 3: way over here.
• 18:20
  Speaker 5: She did say no.
• 18:22
  Speaker 4: But Eddie's right, because she she did say she used
• 18:24
  Speaker 4: to worry about him, like falling. She said she's she
• 18:30
  Speaker 4: stays up at night worrying about him, you know, falling
• 18:33
  Speaker 4: down the stairs or trying to catch the subway and like.
• 18:38
  Speaker 5: Getting lost, like she has said that.
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: Now, obviously that's abusive, right, because this man like you
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: can get around. He is out there swinging around my rooftops,
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: and she's worried about him tripping and falling.
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: He did some crazy well, and that's.
• 18:53
  Speaker 5: What I think. That's when I think.
• 18:56
  Speaker 4: I think that's when she decided she's got to stay
• 18:59
  Speaker 4: the night with him to make sure he's okay.
• 19:04
  Speaker 3: The game is the game. Oh sorry, I'm just a
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: little hit it with the ray childs. Sorry, I can't
• 19:10
  Speaker 3: I can't see without you. Oh my gosh, Radar sense
• 19:14
  Speaker 3: as right, he can see everything, everything.
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: All right? So how do you feel about doctor Glenn?
• 19:23
  Speaker 5: Where do we even start with this.
• 19:25
  Speaker 4: So look, okay, so uh, doctor Heather Glenn is a
• 19:29
  Speaker 4: psychiatrist who first starts uh seeing, treating and seeing Matt Murdoch,
• 19:38
  Speaker 4: which already is a bad choice.
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 19:44
  Speaker 4: She then starts treating Fisk and Vanessa for couple's therapy,
• 19:50
  Speaker 4: and then Fisk hires her to be the commissioner of
• 19:53
  Speaker 4: mental health for the city. Uh, you know, so far
• 19:58
  Speaker 4: not not a great record. But but I'll say that
• 20:03
  Speaker 4: what the show decides to do, which kind of troubles me.
• 20:06
  Speaker 4: Actually the show uses real references to professional psychology, so.
• 20:12
  Speaker 5: She uses it. She uses an evalue.
• 20:14
  Speaker 4: She uses an evaluation that's actually real, the m mp I,
• 20:18
  Speaker 4: which is the Minnesota Multiphasic Personality Inventory. It's a valid test.
• 20:23
  Speaker 4: I've done it before. It's it's widely used. It's not
• 20:27
  Speaker 4: really reliable for diagnostic testing, but it's used in legal cases.
• 20:32
  Speaker 4: It's used by forensic psychiatrists and psychologists all the time.
• 20:36
  Speaker 4: The question she always starts with is the first question,
• 20:40
  Speaker 4: like do you like mechanics magazines? Which is like a
• 20:43
  Speaker 4: bizarre question to ask in twenty twenty six, like what
• 20:45
  Speaker 4: are you even doing?
• 20:46
  Speaker 5: Why are we doing this?
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: But nobody likes that.
• 20:48
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I like, yeah, you want to be talking about here?
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: What like the radio check?
• 20:57
  Speaker 5: Is that even a real.
• 21:00
  Speaker 4: So she is using She's using a very real evaluative tool.
• 21:06
  Speaker 4: But where I find the problem is if you know
• 21:09
  Speaker 4: the real real like that takes an hour and a
• 21:11
  Speaker 4: half to two hours to administer. This woman is not
• 21:13
  Speaker 4: doing this in a cell or in the setting, in
• 21:19
  Speaker 4: the prison setting. She's using real psych jargon like diagnostic terminology, psychosis, sociopathy,
• 21:29
  Speaker 4: anti antisocial personality disorder. And I like that when I
• 21:33
  Speaker 4: see that in shows like this, especially in a show
• 21:38
  Speaker 4: that has a wide audience, I really like when they
• 21:40
  Speaker 4: have done their research. The problem I have is there's
• 21:44
  Speaker 4: only a surface level. There's only a surface level accuracy
• 21:50
  Speaker 4: to it, because then they go bonkers on it like
• 21:53
  Speaker 4: they just use they It's almost as if they do
• 21:56
  Speaker 4: a quick and dirty Google search or a chat GPT
• 21:58
  Speaker 4: and no one has been advising them on how any.
• 22:01
  Speaker 5: Of this works.
• 22:02
  Speaker 4: So I do have some problems with once you start
• 22:05
  Speaker 4: to use real terminology, you then ground your story and
• 22:09
  Speaker 4: have to be pretty pretty accurate. I think with some
• 22:13
  Speaker 4: of the things that you're doing in the writing. I
• 22:15
  Speaker 4: tend to say, especially with superhero shows, supernatural, science fiction, fantasy,
• 22:22
  Speaker 4: mental health, and psychology. There's so much stuff you can do,
• 22:25
  Speaker 4: and you can really be creative, but as soon as
• 22:29
  Speaker 4: you use real terminology and real instruments and real processes
• 22:35
  Speaker 4: and real real things, you box yourself in because then
• 22:39
  Speaker 4: now you've got to be you've got to be accurate,
• 22:42
  Speaker 4: and you have to have fidelity to that. I think
• 22:44
  Speaker 4: that's just my professional opinion, because otherwise you're doing a disservice.
• 22:48
  Speaker 4: So you know, overall, I would say she starts out
• 22:52
  Speaker 4: being a likable character, and you know, ben like, this
• 22:56
  Speaker 4: is a real character in the comics. She wasn't a
• 22:58
  Speaker 4: psychiatrist or a psychologist, but Heather Glenn was a partner.
• 23:04
  Speaker 4: She was a romantic partner for Matt Murdoch and had
• 23:08
  Speaker 4: a lot of like mental illness and ended up having
• 23:10
  Speaker 4: a very tragic ending. She worked for a very elite
• 23:14
  Speaker 4: her father was a rich, wealthy person. She had this
• 23:17
  Speaker 4: elite background, and you know, it sounds like they kind
• 23:21
  Speaker 4: of grabbed this comic storyline and made it really interesting
• 23:24
  Speaker 4: with her being a psychiatrist, which I like, But they
• 23:29
  Speaker 4: it's as if they didn't really do a lot of
• 23:31
  Speaker 4: their homework and something that I absolutely hate is taking
• 23:35
  Speaker 4: a mental health professional and making her a villain, like
• 23:39
  Speaker 4: having her descend into mental illness or descend into violence
• 23:46
  Speaker 4: or homicidal tendencies, when like, that's not really the likelihood
• 23:51
  Speaker 4: for someone was such a robust training and like medical background,
• 23:56
  Speaker 4: that's probably not going to happen.
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: I did not know she came from the comics. I
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: think I might have read that at some point. Does
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: I mean, we're going down that path already, so this
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: isn't really a spoiler. But does she become mused as
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: well in the comics.
• 24:13
  Speaker 5: It's really sad.
• 24:14
  Speaker 4: In the comics, she has substance use disorders, drinks a lot.
• 24:20
  Speaker 4: I mean, look, the this is like late seventies, early
• 24:23
  Speaker 4: eighties when comics were.
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: Oh so this is rare, when Karen Page was doing.
• 24:28
  Speaker 5: Hair in comics, Yeah, yes, yes, and.
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: To read the comics like, yeah, Karen, Karen had a rough.
• 24:35
  Speaker 4: One, and similarly Heather, it was Yeah, Heather was drinking heavily,
• 24:41
  Speaker 4: and you saw it in the pages.
• 24:42
  Speaker 5: She was drinking heavily. She was fixated on Matt.
• 24:45
  Speaker 4: Murdoch, she had jealousy issues, and what I'll say delicately
• 24:50
  Speaker 4: is that she did take her own life in the comics,
• 24:52
  Speaker 4: and it is depicted very clearly what happens. There's no
• 24:56
  Speaker 4: connection to Muse or Lady Muse with this, with this original.
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: Character, I did not know they called her Lady Muse
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: in the comics.
• 25:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, because they the Lady Muses, that other, that other
• 25:07
  Speaker 3: like a whole other person.
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Well yeah, okay. First off, for the comics, Matt
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: Murdo just has like you know, we talked about a
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: cast and call like it's a horror show for his
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: you know, uh, female acquaintances because it's terrible. I did
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: not know that he's like two for two or three
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: for three or four for four. I don't know how
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: many it is of women he dates having horrible ends.
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: But as far as the show, I've just been like
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: whatever with Heather this whole season. I think I was
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: kind of done with her by the end of last season.
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: It was trying to like I didn't understand where they
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: were taking her character. I didn't like when she joined
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: up with Fist at the end of the last season,
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: and this whole season, like her staring at the Muse
• 25:57
  Speaker 2: mask and like you said, getting violent and all these things.
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: I like the one moment I did like was when
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: she was interacting with what's his name. I want to
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: call him, yeah, Buck, the arranger because I like Buck,
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: I think, Yeah, I think Buck is just one of
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: my favorite characters on the show. So I think anyone
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: interacted with him stoked, Like, damn, I don't want to
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: shout out Vanessa anymore because I found out about the actress,
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: but yeah, we know that character. When they were interacting
• 26:25
  Speaker 2: with Buck, I thought that was one of their better
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: moments as well.
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: What's up with the actress? Oh you don't want to say?
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, you know, the less said, the better. Yeah,
• 26:38
  Speaker 2: just you know, it's I was kind of sad about
• 26:41
  Speaker 2: Vanessa being gone, and now I'm not. I'll put it like, Okay,
• 26:44
  Speaker 2: you know.
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: I'm getting the idea to you.
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah so, but as far as where they're going with
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: doctor Glenn, I'm not looking forward to a third season
• 26:57
  Speaker 2: of this.
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, can I to you, Drea.
• 27:02
  Speaker 3: I was trying, like, I agree that that character is
• 27:05
  Speaker 3: like seems like weirdly written, and even even as like
• 27:07
  Speaker 3: a non you know, practitioner, it felt bullshitty, you know
• 27:11
  Speaker 3: what I mean, Like, even even I as like a
• 27:13
  Speaker 3: person who's like I don't know, but like whatever you
• 27:15
  Speaker 3: just said sounds like some bullshit, like why are you
• 27:17
  Speaker 3: asking about mechanics magazines? But I guess the idea of
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: like the corrupt academic professional is like a pretty common
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: one in narratives. You got your doctor, Hugo Strange, you get,
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: you got all of these kinds of like, yeah, they're
• 27:32
  Speaker 3: a psychologist or poison ivy whatever, where they're scientific practitioner
• 27:37
  Speaker 3: and then they use.
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: Their skills for something evil. Harley Quinn.
• 27:40
  Speaker 3: Yeah, like there's so many, there's so many doctors that
• 27:42
  Speaker 3: are just evil doctors. Everybody got PhD in villain, you know,
• 27:47
  Speaker 3: in the villain world, and so it feels like, yeah,
• 27:50
  Speaker 3: this is just you know, this is an evil psychologist.
• 27:53
  Speaker 3: And it feels like even in our world we've got
• 27:55
  Speaker 3: there are plenty of doctors who are willing to co
• 27:58
  Speaker 3: sign some bullshit for you know, fascistic regime, that kind
• 28:01
  Speaker 3: of thing, but there's usually bodies that I guess regulate that.
• 28:06
  Speaker 3: So like if she's like falsifying test, you know, falsifying
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: like inventories for court or sleeping with our patients, and
• 28:16
  Speaker 3: it just has no impact on her ability to still
• 28:19
  Speaker 3: practice as a psychologist, is that realistic or like, are
• 28:23
  Speaker 3: the things that she's doing even possible? I guess is
• 28:25
  Speaker 3: my question?
• 28:27
  Speaker 5: Or slapping her patients?
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like that's something you can get away with, like
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: get called for court.
• 28:33
  Speaker 5: Like, oh yeah, they called her out, you know.
• 28:37
  Speaker 4: Any Like, that's a great point because technically, yes, your
• 28:43
  Speaker 4: license can be revoked, you can be even you know, uh,
• 28:51
  Speaker 4: people can get litigious if Karen, you know, in this
• 28:55
  Speaker 4: in this scenario, she slaps Karen during an assessment, which
• 28:59
  Speaker 4: is like, I can't even like, who would do that?
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 29:02
  Speaker 4: But they wrote this character to be so uncontrolled and
• 29:08
  Speaker 4: so disregulated in this process, which is a clue that
• 29:11
  Speaker 4: you should not be doing this work if you can't
• 29:13
  Speaker 4: handle yourself and regulate yourself during heated situations like your
• 29:18
  Speaker 4: own client responding to you in angry ways. You know,
• 29:23
  Speaker 4: the only time that we can use any kind of
• 29:27
  Speaker 4: physicality is in defending ourselves if someone attacks us or
• 29:30
  Speaker 4: assaults us. But in general, you're right, like, in the
• 29:34
  Speaker 4: real world, any one of these agregious behaviors can lead
• 29:40
  Speaker 4: to your license being revoked, lawsuits cold, you may never
• 29:46
  Speaker 4: practice again. There's just so many deterrents that no one
• 29:49
  Speaker 4: would even fathom to do this. Now, let's give this
• 29:53
  Speaker 4: psych doctor the benefit of the doubt. Let's say that
• 29:56
  Speaker 4: she has a severe traumatic response because as her own patient,
• 30:01
  Speaker 4: muse assaulted her, caught her up and choked her right like,
• 30:06
  Speaker 4: tried to kill her and her her response to that
• 30:10
  Speaker 4: experience was one that I support, which is defend yourself,
• 30:15
  Speaker 4: fight back, And once Daredevil got in the room and
• 30:19
  Speaker 4: made some space, she did end up shooting this this
• 30:23
  Speaker 4: assailant for self defense. No one ever wants to be
• 30:27
  Speaker 4: in that situation. But up till that point, she hadn't
• 30:31
  Speaker 4: done anything wrong where I see did at that point,
• 30:37
  Speaker 4: I mean, yes, had done and lying about who she Yeah,
• 30:42
  Speaker 4: she's she's.
• 30:43
  Speaker 2: How was she? I can't remember. Was she already treating
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: him and did started sleeping with him or would she see.
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: Yes, they started treating him as crazy should come into
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: my office?
• 30:55
  Speaker 6: Is wild, you know, I honestly can't remember which I
• 31:00
  Speaker 6: think it was the other way, but either way, it's crazy,
• 31:03
  Speaker 6: Like if you're treating him and then you're like, yeah,
• 31:05
  Speaker 6: this guy needs help, but I'm gonna fuck him.
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: No, it's to you lose your license.
• 31:11
  Speaker 3: But I think another thing that I'm like, maybe the
• 31:15
  Speaker 3: part of the thing that I may be implying, is
• 31:16
  Speaker 3: that like in our world and in yeah, maybe in
• 31:19
  Speaker 3: our world more specifically, there's like a lot of corruption.
• 31:22
  Speaker 3: Like in our world, medical doctors go years and years
• 31:25
  Speaker 3: doing heinous like shit like malpractice. You know, suits that
• 31:29
  Speaker 3: are going back over like fifteen years of ignoring black
• 31:33
  Speaker 3: women's pain, or breaking bones on people, or making decisions
• 31:39
  Speaker 3: against the consent of patients in cosmetic procedures after the fact,
• 31:42
  Speaker 3: and then eventually they lose theirs. So I guess I'm wondering,
• 31:45
  Speaker 3: like as a as a layman who doesn't know how
• 31:47
  Speaker 3: the system of regulation for like a psychologist works, I'm
• 31:50
  Speaker 3: going like, yeah, if you're like working for the mayor
• 31:54
  Speaker 3: who's corrupt, and you've decided to be corrupt and you
• 31:56
  Speaker 3: beat the shit out of your patient, that seems like
• 31:58
  Speaker 3: something that could totally get so under the rug in
• 32:00
  Speaker 3: the short term.
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: But maybe that's not the case. But that's kind of
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: was the implication.
• 32:04
  Speaker 4: Of market well in this world, Yeah, you're right, and
• 32:06
  Speaker 4: you know, by the way, yes, this is this is
• 32:08
  Speaker 4: happening in our world. Youths being harmed, youths under the
• 32:12
  Speaker 4: care of doctors being harmed, just you know, compounding that
• 32:17
  Speaker 4: list of things. Yes, these things do happen, which is
• 32:20
  Speaker 4: why there's a system to address those egregious behaviors and
• 32:26
  Speaker 4: a system to correct this and to make sure that
• 32:29
  Speaker 4: practitioners are no longer able to practice.
• 32:34
  Speaker 5: And you know, you're right.
• 32:35
  Speaker 4: I think in this world where you sort of if
• 32:39
  Speaker 4: you're under the thumb of fisk, you sort of have
• 32:41
  Speaker 4: to do what you need to do to survive. Where
• 32:44
  Speaker 4: I think the writers were going with this is she
• 32:47
  Speaker 4: had the excuse to behave the way she did because
• 32:49
  Speaker 4: of the of the sort of political protection, the exploitative,
• 32:55
  Speaker 4: corrupt protection. But also I think they were going, you know,
• 32:58
  Speaker 4: they're going to write her to become Muse, right lady music.
• 33:03
  Speaker 4: So I think what they're trying to do is this violence,
• 33:09
  Speaker 4: This these outbursts, this lack of control, this psychopathy is
• 33:16
  Speaker 4: a result of Muse attacking her, and this is just
• 33:20
  Speaker 4: scientifically unsound, like what what we normally see are the
• 33:25
  Speaker 4: opposite of this. Typically survivors of assaults don't go and
• 33:29
  Speaker 4: reenact the assault on someone else, right, So I think,
• 33:33
  Speaker 4: like that's the concern that I have is she's you know,
• 33:37
  Speaker 4: she gets to reenact the choking with Buck.
• 33:41
  Speaker 5: She No, she's seeing now.
• 33:44
  Speaker 4: I will say sometimes the flashbacks, the hallucinations, the intrusive thoughts,
• 33:50
  Speaker 4: the memories, that's all real, that does happen. But the
• 33:54
  Speaker 4: decision to kind of make this character embody her assailant
• 33:59
  Speaker 4: and try to take on the identity of assailant. But
• 34:01
  Speaker 4: why for control? For power? Just in this world, this
• 34:07
  Speaker 4: is what you do. I'm it's so fragile, it's just
• 34:09
  Speaker 4: not it's not real to me.
• 34:13
  Speaker 3: Okay, then that's the that's not a common Yeah, that
• 34:16
  Speaker 3: makes it. Yeah, that's just amazing to Oh, it's very
• 34:19
  Speaker 3: uncommon for a person who experiences trauma to try and
• 34:22
  Speaker 3: like what if I become a serial killer, then I
• 34:24
  Speaker 3: won't you or like whatever. That's just not a thing
• 34:26
  Speaker 3: that trauma victims do.
• 34:28
  Speaker 2: Nice And it's even just like with black people in America,
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: how you know, the fear is that if we get power,
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: we're gonna do the same thing that was done to us.
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: And the reality is probably because we're empathetic and we've
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: seen what that's been done to you. And it's like
• 34:42
  Speaker 2: most victims, when you had something done to you traumatic,
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: you're not gonna be like, let me go do this
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: to other people that you know it's just does not
• 34:50
  Speaker 2: make sense all right. On that, I want to speak
• 34:52
  Speaker 2: about the psychology of some of the side characters like
• 34:56
  Speaker 2: Bullseye and what were they doing with Bullseye, Jessica Jones,
• 35:01
  Speaker 2: and Luke Cage this season, because I just have some
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: questions and some thoughts on that. But I really want
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: to know how did y'all feel about Bullseye and Daredevil's
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: just constant desire to save him and even the I
• 35:16
  Speaker 2: want to say anti heroing of bulls Eye this season,
• 35:19
  Speaker 2: which I kind of felt.
• 35:20
  Speaker 3: Real weird about, Like, look, the writing is kind of
• 35:24
  Speaker 3: shitty and too fast for kind of everything that is
• 35:27
  Speaker 3: my on a lot, But I feel like Bullseye makes
• 35:31
  Speaker 3: a lot more sense to me than That's behavior towards
• 35:34
  Speaker 3: bulls Eye makes a lot more sense to me than
• 35:36
  Speaker 3: towards Kingpin, because Kingpin seems trenched in like a type
• 35:40
  Speaker 3: of personality that makes a different style of behavior like
• 35:44
  Speaker 3: basically impossible, whereas Bullseye seemed like a lot of the
• 35:46
  Speaker 3: motivations that made him do fucked up things made him
• 35:50
  Speaker 3: is maybe taking responsibility off of him. But that, yeah,
• 35:53
  Speaker 3: towards those seem like they can be moved around, like
• 35:56
  Speaker 3: he actually to me, seems capable of being rehabilitated in
• 35:59
  Speaker 3: a way that isn't dangerous in the interim, if that
• 36:03
  Speaker 3: makes sense. He seems like he's capable of doing some
• 36:07
  Speaker 3: good while alive, Like I got more. But that's where
• 36:11
  Speaker 3: that's where I would start.
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: I have to I have to disagree there because I
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: feel like people are ignoring his body count, Like my
• 36:19
  Speaker 2: man has killed so many people over these four seasons,
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: and even if you just count the born again time,
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: like he killed Foggy. In that same episode, he kills Foggy,
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: he catches two other cats who just walk out of
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: the bar before you're just random, just you know, two
• 36:35
  Speaker 2: dudes just come out the bar and catch it. They're
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: doing so and I can't count how many other people.
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: And in this season they really, you know, made a
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: point where they're just like, Okay, he's just gonna kill
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: cops or whatever. And I thought that was kind of corny,
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: But I want to know how you felt about it, Dreft.
• 36:51
  Speaker 4: Yeah, So I'm looking for the turning point with Bullseye
• 36:55
  Speaker 4: if that tracks right when I think I'm following this
• 36:59
  Speaker 4: care character and trying to understand his motivation for just
• 37:03
  Speaker 4: about everything.
• 37:04
  Speaker 5: He does. But when when he's aligning with.
• 37:10
  Speaker 4: Daredevil and at all like the team, where's the motivation
• 37:14
  Speaker 4: for that?
• 37:14
  Speaker 5: Where is the turn? Please give me a critical incident
• 37:17
  Speaker 5: or some event.
• 37:18
  Speaker 4: Is it he almost lost his life at some point
• 37:21
  Speaker 4: he seems to kind of acquiesce and he's is he
• 37:24
  Speaker 4: is he honest when he asks Karen to go and
• 37:28
  Speaker 4: kill him, Like, is that him giving up or saying
• 37:33
  Speaker 4: I did everything I was going to do.
• 37:35
  Speaker 5: I just am looking.
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: For Yeah, that doesn't make I feel you right there,
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: because that I have to feel like that doesn't make
• 37:43
  Speaker 2: sense because if you are believing that you need to
• 37:46
  Speaker 2: do good things and murder someone in order to do
• 37:50
  Speaker 2: good things, like that's you're a good thing, you know,
• 37:52
  Speaker 2: murder someone bad? Why would you let someone else kill you? You
• 37:56
  Speaker 2: know you're Yeah?
• 37:58
  Speaker 3: Is not the point though, Like the whole thing is
• 38:00
  Speaker 3: like he feels he feels guilty, which is why he
• 38:02
  Speaker 3: wants to redeem himself. And there are two ways of
• 38:05
  Speaker 3: doing that. Remove myself entirely from the playing field, so
• 38:08
  Speaker 3: I can do no more harm and the ledger is clear.
• 38:11
  Speaker 3: Or I can do it through public work, so it's
• 38:14
  Speaker 3: like either execution or public service. Those are my two options,
• 38:18
  Speaker 3: but it seems like you have a vote in particular directions.
• 38:20
  Speaker 3: So I'm game for that too.
• 38:23
  Speaker 5: That's helpful. Yeah, I was trying to.
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: He's just trying to be helpful.
• 38:28
  Speaker 3: He's just like, hey, look I've got look comes out
• 38:30
  Speaker 3: whichever whatever works for you, Guys, two different samples here.
• 38:34
  Speaker 3: You can shoot me in the fucking head, somebody else
• 38:36
  Speaker 3: in the head. I'm the bullseye.
• 38:40
  Speaker 1: For everything.
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: On one thing, I did want to say.
• 38:47
  Speaker 3: He just connected something that that Ben said to what
• 38:52
  Speaker 3: you were getting into, Drea. There's the idea that like
• 38:58
  Speaker 3: he's done so many things that he can't be rehabilitated.
• 39:02
  Speaker 3: I guess I'm just curious of what psychology sort of
• 39:05
  Speaker 3: says around like the relationship between being able to be
• 39:08
  Speaker 3: rehabilitated or reconciliatory justice, and like how heinous or how
• 39:12
  Speaker 3: much volume of fucked up shit you've done.
• 39:16
  Speaker 5: That's a great question. Typically it depends.
• 39:20
  Speaker 4: I'm in the camp of always giving people chances, whether
• 39:23
  Speaker 4: it be the system failed you, your environment failed you,
• 39:26
  Speaker 4: you're just surviving. You know, you never really know what
• 39:29
  Speaker 4: someone goes through. Someone's willingness, determination, and like faith in something.
• 39:36
  Speaker 4: I think that's always important. Yeah, So that's my sort
• 39:40
  Speaker 4: of generic answer. The it's really interesting with especially with
• 39:45
  Speaker 4: social justice and rehabilitation and some of the movements that
• 39:52
  Speaker 4: we're seeing around like right now in our in our world,
• 39:56
  Speaker 4: like asking assailance and asking or portrayers to call in,
• 40:01
  Speaker 4: like let us call you in.
• 40:03
  Speaker 5: Are you willing to change? Do you understand the pain
• 40:06
  Speaker 5: you caused? Do you have remorse?
• 40:07
  Speaker 4: Do you have the ability to really be insightful about
• 40:11
  Speaker 4: the harms that you did? And I'd say that the
• 40:15
  Speaker 4: answer to that helps me better understand whether rehabilitation is possible,
• 40:22
  Speaker 4: And it really depends on the individual. Restorative justice is
• 40:27
  Speaker 4: such a like mixed bag. Some people absolutely are black
• 40:32
  Speaker 4: and white on this. It's not valuable, it's not worth it,
• 40:35
  Speaker 4: it doesn't work. But I think I'm a little bit
• 40:38
  Speaker 4: more in between where I think restorative justice can work
• 40:42
  Speaker 4: if someone has That's why I'm asking for the turning point.
• 40:47
  Speaker 4: Has someone had a critical event and experience a reconciliation
• 40:52
  Speaker 4: with where they're at with the harms that they did?
• 40:55
  Speaker 4: Can they identify and name the harms that they did?
• 40:59
  Speaker 4: And I think that in this show, I was expecting
• 41:02
  Speaker 4: I've been a little harsh on the writing. You know truly,
• 41:05
  Speaker 4: I have been enjoying season two and was all caught up,
• 41:09
  Speaker 4: like really, was was pretty dedicated to catching up on
• 41:14
  Speaker 4: this show. And I will continue to be a fan
• 41:17
  Speaker 4: of the show. And I think this is this is
• 41:19
  Speaker 4: the show that offers this kind of stuff, like tell
• 41:22
  Speaker 4: us more, tell us about restorative justice, tell us how
• 41:26
  Speaker 4: you know, tell us about the anti hero, tell us
• 41:28
  Speaker 4: about the so called criminal, the so called vigilante, the
• 41:31
  Speaker 4: so called you know, a disruptor who had to go
• 41:36
  Speaker 4: into a path that they did not expect to go
• 41:40
  Speaker 4: into because the environment is corrupt.
• 41:42
  Speaker 5: That's the story I want to hear.
• 41:45
  Speaker 2: All right, And that does lead to something with Luke
• 41:47
  Speaker 2: Cage that I wanted to talk about. Did either of
• 41:49
  Speaker 2: you watch both seasons of Luke Cage?
• 41:53
  Speaker 1: Hate that show?
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: Bro? Okay, well all right, I'm gonna I'm going to
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: season one, though I did watch the full thing, okay,
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: And see you didn't finished season two, right I stopped?
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah with the bush Master, Yeah I didn't, Yeah, Fish, Okay, Drea.
• 42:06
  Speaker 5: I don't remember I watched it.
• 42:08
  Speaker 4: And if I don't remember something, it means it didn't
• 42:11
  Speaker 4: didn't have an impact on me.
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: Okay, You're not missing anything. With that memory.
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: No, but I will make a point and that's what
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: I'll talk about here, because I felt like a lot
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: of people turned off on season two of Luke Cage
• 42:22
  Speaker 2: when he did the dab, which was understandable, but it
• 42:25
  Speaker 2: was making a point about Luke Cage and like, Drea, yeah, no,
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: it does, and the whole season does tie into that
• 42:34
  Speaker 2: because people get tired of him. He gets egotistical, he goes,
• 42:38
  Speaker 2: he gets in over his head, and then it's like
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: his environment forces him to make choices. And that's why
• 42:44
  Speaker 2: I was talking about I felt like I did when
• 42:48
  Speaker 2: they brought Luke back in this season. I was like, oh,
• 42:51
  Speaker 2: that's great, Luke, but I felt like they kind of
• 42:53
  Speaker 2: just threw everything under the rug from the end of
• 42:57
  Speaker 2: season two because at the end of season two it's
• 43:00
  Speaker 2: a spoiler, but you know, look, you ain't seen him
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: by now, you probably ain't gonna watch it. Luke becomes
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: the Godfather of Harlem, and the season ends with them
• 43:08
  Speaker 2: re enacting the whole Godfather's sequence when all the people
• 43:14
  Speaker 2: are coming to kiss his ring and he shuts the
• 43:16
  Speaker 2: door on. I can't remember Michael, Michael, I can't remember
• 43:22
  Speaker 2: her name. In the Godfather but in the Luke he
• 43:25
  Speaker 2: shuts the door on the night nurse on Rosario Darson's terror.
• 43:29
  Speaker 2: But it's a re enactment from the end of the
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: first Godfather film when everyone's coming in to kiss the
• 43:35
  Speaker 2: ring and he shuts the door on his wife after
• 43:37
  Speaker 2: telling her, Michael, did you kill anybody? And he's like no,
• 43:41
  Speaker 2: and then all these dudes coming and kiss his ring
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: and he shuts the door on her while she's standing
• 43:45
  Speaker 2: out there looking goofy. And so they did the same
• 43:47
  Speaker 2: scene and so I thought that was, Yes, that was
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: like that. That was what was very dope, Like he
• 43:52
  Speaker 2: took over the operations because he had to, and I
• 43:55
  Speaker 2: thought that was very dope, and a lot of never
• 43:57
  Speaker 2: finished the season, and so it was like I was
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: waiting for season three of Luke Cage because I was like, Yo,
• 44:03
  Speaker 2: this is a fire ending. Yes it might not have,
• 44:06
  Speaker 2: you know, been the best way to get there, but
• 44:07
  Speaker 2: when they got there and say, Yo, that's crazy. They
• 44:09
  Speaker 2: made this do the villain. And I'm one of those
• 44:12
  Speaker 2: people who have, yeah, who have an issue with the
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: anti heroes because I feel like our media training with
• 44:18
  Speaker 2: the way we absorb protagonists versus antagonists, doesn't allow for
• 44:23
  Speaker 2: a lot of gray area, and it doesn't allow us
• 44:25
  Speaker 2: to understand that just because someone is a protagonist doesn't
• 44:28
  Speaker 2: make them the hero. And then when they're an anti hero,
• 44:32
  Speaker 2: it clouds it way too much. And that's why was
• 44:35
  Speaker 2: my problem of the season with Bullsye, because I feel
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: like people won't you know, they'll just be like, oh, no,
• 44:40
  Speaker 2: he's a good guy, right, you know, or he's on
• 44:42
  Speaker 2: the side of detive on them.
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: And it's like this dude the monster.
• 44:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, this dude's a mass murderer. And then with Luke Cage,
• 44:49
  Speaker 2: it felt like they kind of just you know, like
• 44:51
  Speaker 2: I said, swept that under the rug, and he was
• 44:53
  Speaker 2: just off doing dirt and hard, you know, not in Harlem,
• 44:56
  Speaker 2: in the Middle East or wherever some war term country.
• 45:00
  Speaker 2: And now he's back and they're just ignore everything that
• 45:02
  Speaker 2: happened at the end of that season. And yeah, I
• 45:05
  Speaker 2: guess they, you know, realized a lot of people didn't
• 45:07
  Speaker 2: watch it ether.
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: So they could just do whatever they wanted.
• 45:13
  Speaker 2: As I'm saying all this, I realized that that's probably
• 45:16
  Speaker 2: what happened there. Like, look, we know the ratings, so
• 45:19
  Speaker 2: you know, there it is.
• 45:20
  Speaker 4: But yeah, I thought like, yeah, low key when he
• 45:23
  Speaker 4: walked in the room.
• 45:25
  Speaker 5: I was like, where was he? I don't know where
• 45:30
  Speaker 5: did it come from? It had lost its impact to
• 45:33
  Speaker 5: be to be about it.
• 45:34
  Speaker 4: But yeah, yeah, I don't think most most viewers are
• 45:37
  Speaker 4: going to track that his you know, his absence, which
• 45:41
  Speaker 4: is too bad because I'm a huge fan of Jessica Jones.
• 45:44
  Speaker 5: I think that that they they slept on that strang.
• 45:49
  Speaker 1: I thought that first season was the.
• 45:51
  Speaker 2: First season is one of the greatest things I've ever seen,
• 45:54
  Speaker 2: and then I hated it after that.
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: Like, I don't think I watched the second season.
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: They made some choices in that second season where it
• 46:01
  Speaker 2: was just like, yo, what happened? But yeah, I don't
• 46:05
  Speaker 2: think a lot of people watch that either. Know that
• 46:06
  Speaker 2: first season, though, was impeccable, impeccable. All right, Well, before
• 46:11
  Speaker 2: we get to the end of this, we have to
• 46:13
  Speaker 2: talk about the end of this episode. And this is when,
• 46:16
  Speaker 2: like I said, I was crying, laughing, all right. At
• 46:21
  Speaker 2: the end of this episode, king Pin is trapped in
• 46:24
  Speaker 2: the courthouse and a lot of you know, different things happened.
• 46:31
  Speaker 2: But my ques, I mean, I just have so many
• 46:35
  Speaker 2: questions about it. But why did the cops let the
• 46:38
  Speaker 2: rioters in that that was my I thought that was
• 46:42
  Speaker 2: to me, that was that was guilt.
• 46:44
  Speaker 3: The guy who had been burned had a change of
• 46:46
  Speaker 3: heart and was like, I realized, I'm fighting for the
• 46:49
  Speaker 3: bad guys. I'm a I'm a stormtrooper, so I'm gonna
• 46:51
  Speaker 3: knock I'm gonna knock a boy out from mayor of Kingstown,
• 46:54
  Speaker 3: and I'm gonna let everybody in.
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: That's what I know where you're from. Okay, but he.
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: Played he plays the exact same character a mayor of
• 47:02
  Speaker 1: King's down.
• 47:02
  Speaker 2: By the way, I believe it. He seems like the
• 47:04
  Speaker 2: dude the correct Yeah, but you let all these well
• 47:13
  Speaker 2: seemingly teenagers and younger in to.
• 47:17
  Speaker 1: Be Okay, I see what you're saying. I see what
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: you're saying.
• 47:21
  Speaker 2: Like you could have gone up there and done that yourself. Right.
• 47:24
  Speaker 3: It was like, hey, look, I'm just gonna say they
• 47:26
  Speaker 3: stormed the capitol.
• 47:27
  Speaker 2: I was.
• 47:28
  Speaker 3: I tried to stop a mister fisk. If he survives,
• 47:30
  Speaker 3: but if he dies, then cool problems. So you're right,
• 47:33
  Speaker 3: that is fucked up. He made a very strategic choice.
• 47:38
  Speaker 2: Like got they say in basketball. He made a business decision,
• 47:40
  Speaker 2: like he's not taking that dunk to the face. He
• 47:43
  Speaker 2: just stood out of the way, like I'm not getting
• 47:45
  Speaker 2: on that man's poster, but on that okay. Now, Like
• 47:49
  Speaker 2: I said this one, I'm just cracking up this when
• 47:51
  Speaker 2: I was talking about this show does not care about
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: realism or anything. King Finn is being offered a deal
• 47:55
  Speaker 2: by the DA I guess, right, the district attorney. I'm
• 47:59
  Speaker 2: guessing some one, the governor, somebody of power, you know,
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: who cares, some face power is given attorney general who cares.
• 48:08
  Speaker 2: You know, someone is giving him a deal. Right. They
• 48:10
  Speaker 2: give him a deal when he's inside before the rioters
• 48:14
  Speaker 2: come in. Right, they say, this is the deal. You
• 48:16
  Speaker 2: take this deal, you get to go no jail, We'll
• 48:19
  Speaker 2: put you on an eye. He's like, not f that,
• 48:21
  Speaker 2: and I'm gonna go out and kill like at least five, six, seven,
• 48:24
  Speaker 2: eight nine people. Yeah, But at the end of the episode,
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: tem Been's still on that island.
• 48:30
  Speaker 1: I mean, daredif al war the deal, Yeah.
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: Dared of himself watches him or is close enough to
• 48:37
  Speaker 2: see a murder. I mean, the whole crowd watched him
• 48:39
  Speaker 2: come out and throw a body onto the floor, and
• 48:42
  Speaker 2: somehow he gets the same somehow dinner him still like, no,
• 48:45
  Speaker 2: you're gonna take the deal like that. Like I said,
• 48:49
  Speaker 2: this is when I started cracking up and I could not.
• 48:51
  Speaker 2: Like they did a Darth Vader scene. They really wanted
• 48:53
  Speaker 2: to have this dude have his hallway fight. But he's
• 48:55
  Speaker 2: murdering a bunch of kids, like what they kids?
• 48:58
  Speaker 3: Because maybe that I think I did, it looked like
• 49:02
  Speaker 3: they were they were like high school he was. He
• 49:05
  Speaker 3: was breaking high schoolers in in half. Is okay, okay, okay,
• 49:10
  Speaker 3: they have mad So I didn't.
• 49:12
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean definitely the niece of Gosh helped me out,
• 49:16
  Speaker 4: the niece of a white white tager.
• 49:18
  Speaker 5: Yes, yeah, she's I mean, she's definitely youthful, and.
• 49:21
  Speaker 2: She she put in some work, like she was climbing
• 49:25
  Speaker 2: on the walls. Darvil sat there and watched her body
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: a cop two. That's another thing, but you know, we'll
• 49:30
  Speaker 2: get to that. But no, this man definitely killed several
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: youngish pens.
• 49:35
  Speaker 3: Okay you know what, Yeah, I didn't have that in
• 49:37
  Speaker 3: mind because I thought those were because because I saw like,
• 49:39
  Speaker 3: you know, like very very grown people in the crowd
• 49:44
  Speaker 3: fighting him. So I was like, okay, that's like the
• 49:46
  Speaker 3: guy who's like the one, like the one dude who
• 49:49
  Speaker 3: was Brave at the end of the hall, who was like, Okay,
• 49:51
  Speaker 3: I'm gonna like proactively fight you, and then King Pen
• 49:55
  Speaker 3: grabs his arm and just turns it into a pretzel
• 49:57
  Speaker 3: and turns him around.
• 49:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah. The first woman when he walked out and says boo, yeah.
• 50:05
  Speaker 1: Into the question threw the pews was crazy.
• 50:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, No, that was a kid. That dude's face and
• 50:10
  Speaker 2: you know, there was dead man's eyes and that dude
• 50:13
  Speaker 2: was a little kid like okay, yeah, you know it's
• 50:17
  Speaker 2: punching a child. Boo, who does this? Like what type
• 50:23
  Speaker 2: of fight?
• 50:24
  Speaker 1: And you still think you're the good guy.
• 50:26
  Speaker 2: Missed the boom and you're getting an island at the
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: end of this.
• 50:31
  Speaker 5: Well.
• 50:31
  Speaker 4: And that speaks of the psychology of a Fisk, which
• 50:35
  Speaker 4: is probably the most complicated individuals in this whole show.
• 50:39
  Speaker 5: I was going to say, I did it. There's a
• 50:41
  Speaker 5: lot of duality.
• 50:42
  Speaker 4: There's a lot clearly, there's a lot of choreography and
• 50:45
  Speaker 4: fight scenes that are pretty pretty well uh created and designed,
• 50:50
  Speaker 4: and and the the duality they were going with here
• 50:53
  Speaker 4: was the you know, the corridor fight with Daredevil and
• 50:57
  Speaker 4: then Fisk on his side, and how they were it
• 51:00
  Speaker 4: was culminating to meet in the middle, and I did, like,
• 51:04
  Speaker 4: there's something that this show does pretty well, and that's
• 51:07
  Speaker 4: the uh building, building the visceral feelings that one has
• 51:15
  Speaker 4: through you know, through through the visuals and and through
• 51:19
  Speaker 4: the choreography and and the colors, Like you really have
• 51:23
  Speaker 4: to see the dynamic of the way you know, Fisk
• 51:26
  Speaker 4: is representing anytime, Like the painting that he has is
• 51:30
  Speaker 4: this like off white beige painting. His suits are off
• 51:33
  Speaker 4: white or white. Meanwhile, you have Matt Murdoch daredevil painting
• 51:39
  Speaker 4: his in this season, his costume is painted black, but
• 51:45
  Speaker 4: those red you know, over time it gets tarnished, it
• 51:49
  Speaker 4: gets he gets beat and those those red, the red.
• 51:53
  Speaker 5: Colors come through and there's that duality there.
• 51:55
  Speaker 4: So there's lots of I think there's lots of thoughtfulness
• 51:58
  Speaker 4: in this show that I wish were a little bit
• 52:03
  Speaker 4: more you know, driven in other places, like some of
• 52:06
  Speaker 4: the writing visually, I think they're really going.
• 52:09
  Speaker 2: With something but that and that comes from the writing,
• 52:11
  Speaker 2: and I think you're right. I think it's like they
• 52:13
  Speaker 2: have good ideas and then they just don't carry it through,
• 52:18
  Speaker 2: Like like, you're right, that was a dope, because when
• 52:20
  Speaker 2: I'm rewatching, I'm like Okay, I get it. You know,
• 52:22
  Speaker 2: the two of them are having their own hallway fight scene.
• 52:24
  Speaker 2: But then when you stop to think about it for
• 52:26
  Speaker 2: a second, it's like fishes over here beating up on kids.
• 52:29
  Speaker 2: It's not like challenging for or anything for him. You know,
• 52:32
  Speaker 2: madd is having a real time. You know, they're fighting cops.
• 52:35
  Speaker 2: You know, Jessicak notts due out the window. I thought,
• 52:37
  Speaker 2: you know, the choreography on the show is always topping,
• 52:40
  Speaker 2: not like even though he's beat up on kids, like
• 52:43
  Speaker 2: you said that when he pretzels that dude, that shit
• 52:45
  Speaker 2: was amazing. He picked my man up. I was like,
• 52:48
  Speaker 2: broke dude against the wall, like you know, he was
• 52:51
  Speaker 2: putting in work on them kids.
• 52:53
  Speaker 3: It looked like a good fight. I was like, yeah,
• 52:55
  Speaker 3: I love I love this scene. I wasn't even thinking
• 52:56
  Speaker 3: about it as highles. I was just like, yeah, he's
• 52:58
  Speaker 3: bro he's beating up the crowd.
• 53:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but nobody gave him a challenge until they that's
• 53:03
  Speaker 2: all rushing.
• 53:04
  Speaker 1: They were just running, You're right. No one was like
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: all right.
• 53:08
  Speaker 2: No one would have No one caught him with the
• 53:10
  Speaker 2: right hook, you know, and he shrugged it off. Nothing
• 53:13
  Speaker 2: like it was like they ran up, you know, regulars.
• 53:16
  Speaker 3: This is like their first these are gen z ors.
• 53:18
  Speaker 3: This is their first protest. And they got beat to
• 53:20
  Speaker 3: ship by the mayor of New York.
• 53:22
  Speaker 5: And and and they looked good.
• 53:24
  Speaker 4: They had their little daredevil masks with the red horns
• 53:27
  Speaker 4: and the store.
• 53:28
  Speaker 2: Your one dude had the joint that it's like where
• 53:30
  Speaker 2: you folded from paper and all that, and he just
• 53:34
  Speaker 2: and they got folded in it like you touch the
• 53:37
  Speaker 2: time out.
• 53:38
  Speaker 1: I did not even recognize. Yeah, that's yeah, that's my
• 53:43
  Speaker 1: first protest. No Fisher Price.
• 53:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah oh no, that was more ass beating, like he
• 53:54
  Speaker 2: definitely killed several people, right, and then somehow you.
• 53:58
  Speaker 1: Did the skull crush on one of them.
• 54:00
  Speaker 2: Yes, and then miraculously Okay, And this is where like
• 54:05
  Speaker 2: I go back to the beginning where I asked, and
• 54:07
  Speaker 2: you know, thank you, Dread, because like you said, I
• 54:08
  Speaker 2: really like, you know, some of the things are doing,
• 54:11
  Speaker 2: you know, with the psychology everything in the visuals, his
• 54:14
  Speaker 2: white suit going to red with the blood all that,
• 54:16
  Speaker 2: like said, mirroring his painting getting destroyed and getting blood
• 54:20
  Speaker 2: on it. But then it's like it's Matt an idiot,
• 54:24
  Speaker 2: Like I just I don't get the ending of this show,
• 54:31
  Speaker 2: you know where my man is just like, oh, you know,
• 54:35
  Speaker 2: I wish you could have that, but I'm just to
• 54:37
  Speaker 2: wait for the college trunt come and get me and
• 54:38
  Speaker 2: arrest me in Why like, is that? Is that his
• 54:43
  Speaker 2: belief in the system, because see this is where it's like, Okay,
• 54:48
  Speaker 2: it goes back to like I said, when you're dating
• 54:50
  Speaker 2: the women, like why did you do it in the
• 54:51
  Speaker 2: first place? Are you just that much of an added
• 54:54
  Speaker 2: And I'm gonna answer my own question.
• 54:56
  Speaker 5: Yes, just like me, yes, perfect, I'm.
• 55:02
  Speaker 2: Going And if I had the abilities, I would stay
• 55:06
  Speaker 2: away from beating people's ass.
• 55:07
  Speaker 4: So you know, but this is this is his bear
• 55:11
  Speaker 4: to cross, like figuratively right, that he holds the guilt
• 55:15
  Speaker 4: and and the heaviness of having to defend the city.
• 55:19
  Speaker 4: That this is the trope of Daredevil that I think
• 55:22
  Speaker 4: sometimes works, which is that the burdensomeness of Daredevil is uh,
• 55:31
  Speaker 4: you know, insurmountable. And because he believes in the justice system,
• 55:35
  Speaker 4: of course he's going to let them take him to prison.
• 55:38
  Speaker 4: And this is why he didn't kill anybody, or why
• 55:40
  Speaker 4: he resisted killing people, because he knew that he is
• 55:43
  Speaker 4: the kind of person to understand that you reap what
• 55:47
  Speaker 4: you sew, and there will be consequences.
• 55:49
  Speaker 2: He's an accomplished to murder several times.
• 55:51
  Speaker 5: Over, absolutely absolutely, and he'll and.
• 55:55
  Speaker 4: He'll I know, he'll conceptualize that and his own way,
• 56:01
  Speaker 4: but you know I'll defend him.
• 56:04
  Speaker 1: It's inadorable.
• 56:07
  Speaker 2: Then he's a privileged boy.
• 56:09
  Speaker 1: He never did anything wrong.
• 56:10
  Speaker 2: Like I say, Jessica straight up punches this dude. I
• 56:13
  Speaker 2: mean he flies out the windows smooth like smooth out
• 56:17
  Speaker 2: the window, right checkers, No, but madd it is just like, oh, well, you.
• 56:22
  Speaker 3: Know, like, hey, look I said I don't kill people.
• 56:27
  Speaker 3: I didn't say my homegirl couldn't do that. That's not
• 56:29
  Speaker 3: I can't control her, but.
• 56:31
  Speaker 2: You can get her put in jail too. Like I've
• 56:33
  Speaker 2: always said, of the MCU heroes deserve prison time, like
• 56:40
  Speaker 2: major prison time, and I mean ninety essentially. Yeah, I
• 56:43
  Speaker 2: mean they're all corrupt cops at that, like they all
• 56:46
  Speaker 2: just do crime over and over again. And I've said
• 56:49
  Speaker 2: this for years. So and one side of me was like,
• 56:53
  Speaker 2: you know, I was cracking up laughing. I was also
• 56:56
  Speaker 2: really happy to see Matt go to jail because you know,
• 56:58
  Speaker 2: I felt like mostlim deserve Yeah. Oh, I've said this
• 57:01
  Speaker 2: for years, you know, long time on the show.
• 57:04
  Speaker 4: Yeah, what did you make of what did you make
• 57:07
  Speaker 4: of him passing by the other corrupt officers in the
• 57:14
  Speaker 4: in the prison?
• 57:15
  Speaker 1: Uh, we're all here.
• 57:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah. The way to show dealt with police in general
• 57:21
  Speaker 2: this season, and you know throughout it's it's just most
• 57:27
  Speaker 2: shows and the way they do with cops, it's always
• 57:30
  Speaker 2: there's a few, you know, bad apples, and if we
• 57:32
  Speaker 2: just got rid of them, you know, you know, here's
• 57:35
  Speaker 2: the good old boys, the good old cops. You know,
• 57:38
  Speaker 2: they're defending cherry and you know, here's multicultural you know,
• 57:42
  Speaker 2: all good cops, you know, and it's no all the
• 57:46
  Speaker 2: all cops, like you know the phrase, I don't need
• 57:49
  Speaker 2: to say it. You know, everyone is a cop. Like no,
• 57:53
  Speaker 2: the system is corrupt. And that's my problem with this
• 57:56
  Speaker 2: show because it's like, dude it then even the dude
• 57:58
  Speaker 2: who gets burned up, you know, he's like, oh, you know,
• 58:01
  Speaker 2: you know, take off the badge. I'm done with that. No,
• 58:04
  Speaker 2: you're still an evil cop fan. You gotta pay for that, Like,
• 58:08
  Speaker 2: I don't know that that's that's like that, that's you
• 58:15
  Speaker 2: end up in the same place as the people who
• 58:17
  Speaker 2: are the bad guys, and fist is free.
• 58:23
  Speaker 3: I mean that seems like because I feel like you
• 58:25
  Speaker 3: asked an interesting question, because it's kind of like that's
• 58:27
  Speaker 3: sort of the premise of every single superhero thing anywhere,
• 58:30
  Speaker 3: like Batman, Captain America, Iron who, like any superhero is
• 58:34
  Speaker 3: essentially a completely unregulated, like you know, user of violence
• 58:41
  Speaker 3: in pursuit of like protecting I don't you know property
• 58:43
  Speaker 3: a lot of the times, and they're judge, jury executioner.
• 58:47
  Speaker 1: They don't do due process. They break all kinds of
• 58:50
  Speaker 1: stuff that we would call you know, what do you
• 58:52
  Speaker 1: what do you know people's rights like not search and
• 58:54
  Speaker 1: seizure and breaking.
• 58:55
  Speaker 3: Int people's houses and stuff. They just do that stuff
• 58:56
  Speaker 3: all the time. So I feel like that's fair, But
• 58:59
  Speaker 3: that's feels like that's just a stock standard thing that's true,
• 59:01
  Speaker 3: as you said about everything, So then you still have
• 59:03
  Speaker 3: to sort of make a judgment in that world, like
• 59:06
  Speaker 3: given this, does this particular treatment feel any different relative
• 59:10
  Speaker 3: to all the other shows about super Cops.
• 59:15
  Speaker 2: It felt it felt different than the fact that darede
• 59:17
  Speaker 2: were went.
• 59:17
  Speaker 1: To jail Like that was different, which you think was good?
• 59:23
  Speaker 2: Yes, and no, I think it's good in the fact
• 59:25
  Speaker 2: that he does pay for his pride. I think no,
• 59:28
  Speaker 2: in the fact that it makes Matt murder the like
• 59:29
  Speaker 2: even more of an idiot than four season is of
• 59:32
  Speaker 2: this show has done. Like, dude, you know they're gonna
• 59:36
  Speaker 2: come and arrest you everyone. Keen Pitton is on a
• 59:39
  Speaker 2: beat somewhere. You're you're gonna just let him ride because
• 59:44
  Speaker 2: you're gonna go to prison for life, my man, possibly
• 59:47
  Speaker 2: death penalty longer. Yeah, yeah, I mean minimum one life sentence, minimum,
• 59:55
  Speaker 2: you know, possible death penalty for the accomplished the murder,
• 59:58
  Speaker 2: et cetera. They could be depend on you, you know,
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 2: WECo for all the things that you Jessica iron Frist
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 2: Luke did, You're done and you're let Kingpin ride. That's
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 2: what I mean. It's like you should be off runner
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 2: from the cops, find a kingpin and I don't know,
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 2: finishing them up. But then again, you agreed to letting
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 2: him get this deal after he murdered several people in
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 2: Fred What you say.
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I you know, I always look at things like,
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 4: what are they trying to set up? They're trying to
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 4: set up doctor Glenn to be Lady mused, They're trying
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 4: to set up I wondered that they were trying if
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 4: they were trying to set up this being the true
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 4: end of Kingpin and I. And now I'm kind of now,
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 4: I'm kind of regretting thinking that because.
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 2: I don't know if I don't think so, I've all right.
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 2: One thing is like, and this is like when I
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 2: watched the end of the series. I you know, we
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 2: got these preview episodes, so I saw this before i'd
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 2: even seen this Spider Man brand new day, right, that's
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 2: the new trailer, right, So when I saw the Spider Man, like,
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 2: so when I saw the end of this, I was
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 2: cracking up laughing because one, I thought, when are they
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 2: gonna return to this other than maybe next season? And
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 2: I you know, I had to think, okay, maybe you know,
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 2: a year from now, because you know, Marvel's notorious for
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 2: ignoring storylines. So I was like, damn, he's gonna leave
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 2: his man in prison, Like that's hilarious, you know. I
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 2: thought that was comedy. And then I saw the Spider
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 2: Man trailer and everyone started speculating and hadding. Having seen
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 2: the end of this, I'm like, yeah, he has to
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 2: be in it, right, Like he has to be breaking
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 2: dead out of jail. But that makes no sense again,
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 2: because why wouldn't Matt get broken out of jail when
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 2: Matt willingly went to jail.
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 3: I think if they come to him and go like, no,
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 3: we need you, like we need you today, and then
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 3: at the end of the movie, he'll be like, I'm sorry, guys,
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 3: like I go back to jail.
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 1: It's the low.
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 2: Charge on him. My man, How are they going to
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 2: happen that season? And no, I don't think that this
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 2: is going to be the end of Kingpin. I've heard
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 2: rumors that, you know, when Vincent's already shooting, they're already
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 2: shooting for the new season, and so Vincent allegedly is
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 2: already yeah, allegedly they there's a shot of Vincent somewhere
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 2: with a beard. Yeah, yeah, from the island time, you
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 2: know what I mean.
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well, ye, King pinn Flis is crazy work.
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 2: Crazy king pinning like the beach shirt would be amazing though. Yeah,
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 2: So no, the ending of this, I thought, Yeah, I
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 2: just I was refused. I just don't get how Matt
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 2: allowed this man to tape that deal at how the
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 2: DA governor whoever was who offered him the deal allowed
• 1:02:59
  Speaker 2: it to go down. How those cops didn't come in
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 2: and arrest him, you know, the one cop who wanted
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 2: to be a good cop. Whatever. Why didn't he come
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 2: in and arrested Why would he let these yeah, various
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 2: riders just run up in there like you know, you
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 2: don't know.
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 3: It is a waste the opportunity because because if he had,
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 3: if he had said, hey, we're going to turn against him,
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 3: you know what I'm saying, he we just we just said, hey,
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 3: Daredevil's not by himself.
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 1: Fist basically threatened to murder us.
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 3: If we didn't, you know, do his bidding. Fuck this,
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 3: I just knocked this guy out. Does any do any
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 3: of y'all have an issue with it? They obviously didn't,
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 3: like none of them went to shoot the protesters. If
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 3: you had had a scene where they go, Okay, cool,
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 3: we're the A v TF. We're now anti Fisk and
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 3: we're gonna leave the charge with guy Kingpins not bulletproof,
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 3: We're gonna probably would have been a better scene. But
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 3: then he would have been fighting the good like king
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 3: Pin would been fighting the good A v t F
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 3: while was fighting the bad ones.
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 1: And then they meet in the middle.
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 2: So yeah, and then they pay for their crimes for that.
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 2: You know, everybody gets beat up and then he's actually
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 2: fighting someone giving him a threat, you know, someone, They
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 2: could be hitting him with the sticks whatever. Yeah, instead
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 2: of him just body and a bunch of kids, which was,
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 2: like I say, it was hilarious to me.
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 5: But it felt unreal. I didn't know what I was.
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 2: Like.
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 5: If dog piled him, he's fine.
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 2: And then he's fine though, he's just like ah, whatever,
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 2: you know.
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 4: I will say just to defend, you know, I'm going
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 4: to defend Matt Murdoch.
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 5: He is a fundamentally, he is a narcissist.
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 1: He willingly.
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 4: It is the defense he willingly. He willingly turns around.
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 4: Let's let's the cop handcuff him. He waves. Notice he
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 4: waves not only the he says, I wave the advisement,
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 4: not the rights.
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, did you catch that?
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 5: I wave the advisement, not the rights. That's some narcissism
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 5: right there.
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 4: He's he's going in knowing he knows better than the
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 4: system that if anyone's gonna get him out of prison,
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 4: it's his own narcissistic self. I don't think he thinks
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 4: anyone's breaking him out. I think that he believes he's
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 4: gonna lost. He knows enough about the system to in
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 4: the same way that Karen got free in the middle
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 4: of her trial.
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 5: They bounced the trial because.
• 1:05:25
  Speaker 2: Like, I don't know enough. You know, my mother was
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 2: an attorney. I don't know enough. But it just felt
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 2: like you're gonna have to at least go back to
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 2: jail for processing something.
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 3: I feel like Matt is gonna be like, you know what,
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 3: I lied, I never was dared devil.
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 1: I feel like he's gonna hit one of those.
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 2: Because they do. They do that.
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 3: The room, Like he's gonna be like, oh, that was
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 3: New movie magic, Like because I feel like iron Man
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 3: has done that what like three times, like renigged on
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 3: the secret identity reveal, like.
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 1: I'm iron Man. No I'm not.
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 2: But iron Man can like have somebody else in the
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 2: suit the suit and fly itself. You know, there's a
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 2: lot of things.
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 1: He's gonna have Iron Shoe. You've seen this happen before.
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 3: Why, while we're on the topic of dumb ship that
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 3: people did one thing that I remember just writing down
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 3: and maybe I missed there actually was an explanation. But
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 3: why did Bullseye do all of that work to kill
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 3: all the to kill the gunman, fake himself into that situation,
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 3: get the sniper rifle, only to alert them that he
• 1:06:27
  Speaker 3: that he was the real bulls eye on the phone
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 3: like he was. He did all that work, got the
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 3: gun and was like, hey, I'm about to shoot you guys.
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and then like what was his plan? Was he gonna,
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 2: like you say, because he warned shoot fisk I thought
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 2: so too when he did all that, but then like
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 2: fist was nowhere near when he starts shooting, like well.
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 3: Yeah, because because he calls him on the phone, somebody
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 3: calls him to say, hey, line the shot up to
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 3: kill Matt. And instead of going yep, no worries, just
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 3: get everybody out and I'll shoot the person that you're asking,
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 3: he goes.
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 1: I'm actually I'm actually the bad guy. I hate you guys,
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 1: Like why is he did he do that?
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 3: And then they go, fuck, it's a trap, Like why
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 3: would you maybe I miss something like why do you
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 3: tell a trap?
• 1:07:05
  Speaker 2: I don't think you did.
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 5: So who caught the stray Buck?
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 1:07:15
  Speaker 1: Buck like in the stomach.
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 3: Oh damn, yeah, that's why he was shivering by the
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 3: bench and dumb lady lady muse took takes the coat
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 3: of because.
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 2: So Buck should be dead like a lot of people
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 2: because you were gut shot. You were sitting there forever,
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 2: and Matt had a whole speech, you know, while you
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 2: were just bleeding out. You know, he's over here talking
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 2: to Kingpin like that. That's what really killed me, Like
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 2: there are people lying there at their feet bleeding out
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 2: like that. Kingpin is just brutalized, and you're over here
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 2: talking to him having a speech.
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah, honestly the whole time doing all that speech, there
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 3: could have like some of them kids were still alive.
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 2: Yes, probably probably the.
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 3: Start of the speech, probably at the passed away is
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 3: it is?
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 5: It is wild?
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 4: Yeah, there are no first responders, there's no emergency services,
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 4: like there's nothing.
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 5: And I think, like you know, again, all these events
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 5: take place in such a such a small period of time.
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 4: It's it's like minutes, right, But I think that's where
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 4: you're trying to isolate and showcase like the peak you know,
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 4: of where this violence is going and where this corruption
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 4: is going. And I think I think we're naming that
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 4: it falls flat because it becomes a parody of itself.
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 4: It no longer holds any substance because it just like
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 4: loses the plot, which is unfortunate, you know, because again
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 4: you have so much opportunity here for that officer to say,
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 4: this is wrong. Let me, let's put our arms down,
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 4: let's let's work together something that while it would have
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 4: been somewhat unrealistic, Right, would at least have been satisfying
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 4: from the perspective of the corrupt officer got his come
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 4: up and right got knocked out. Which, by the way,
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 4: I thought that guy was a super because when he
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 4: was in other fights, he.
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 5: Kept he kept getting punched, he got his beat. Yeah, yeah,
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 5: in scenes.
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, at one point he gets his ass beat in
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 2: the kitchen. And then the funniest one for me is
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 2: he's the same couple walks in on Dary Devil and
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 2: then the throws his batoned him and damns them full
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 2: on in the face and dude drops the ground unconscious
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 2: and then he's right back up and that scene like
• 1:09:42
  Speaker 2: nothing ever happened the show. Is that for me, it's
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 2: like you said, the best it became a parody of
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 2: itself because it's like we on the early thing, you
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 2: saw King Pitt d this brutal violence and you're like,
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 2: oh my god, this is so epic. To me, it
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 2: was like silly this time around, Like when I think
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 2: it was last season when he crushes the guy's head,
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 2: it's like, oh my god, okay, what how extra can
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 2: they make it? Or in this season when he kills
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 2: the doctor in the hospital, I'm just like, come on, man,
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 2: this is just it's comedy.
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 4: And the kind of doctor would be like, bring it in,
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 4: bring it in. As he said that, first of all,
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 4: that doesn't usually happen.
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 1: They don't.
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 3: They're not allowed to hug you when your wife just died, or.
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 4: It's not like not allowed, it's just that you that's
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 4: not what you offer me. You all for condolences. There
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 4: are other things, but the whole like let me consolet
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 4: like as soon as he said that, I'm like, he
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 4: gonna die, yeah, and then you.
• 1:10:40
  Speaker 2: Know, he just kills him. A book is like, oh,
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 2: another job I got to clean up, and it just
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 2: you know, and then they just move on and that's
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 2: I mean, it becomes a comedy, a parody, and it
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 2: escalates to the point where you have king Pin just
• 1:10:52
  Speaker 2: busting up on a bunch of kids and dared of
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 2: a mask. It's just okay, I guess that's where're at now.
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 1: All right, great show, love it. I mean, like I said,
• 1:11:05
  Speaker 1: it's like Top Boy if it was in the MCU.
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like the thing is, I'll beat it here for
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 2: that season. I'm really anticipating this Punisher one shot that
• 1:11:15
  Speaker 2: they're about to drop like next week, and you know,
• 1:11:19
  Speaker 2: I'm here for it. I'm I'm gonna hopefully, you know,
• 1:11:22
  Speaker 2: we'll see either way. I know Punisher will be in
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 2: Spider Man, so I don't know how much connection this
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 2: next one shot will do. I don't think it's could
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 2: do much. I think this one shot is to be
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 2: really Punisher oriented, and then the Spider Man will get
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 2: like a Spider Man Punisher version, where like as we
• 1:11:37
  Speaker 2: see he will only be allowed to curse. So I
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 2: think that's cool too. I think Punisher is a character
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 2: like that where you can, you know, take him to
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 2: these different levels and even Daredable, Like I really loved
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 2: Daredevil in Chihole and how they kind of had his
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 2: powers a little bit heightened.
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 1: It just a crazy yeah.
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 2: But then with this, it felt like they took that
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 2: same the Kingpin that was an echo who was heightened
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 2: as well, and then they brought him back to this
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 2: where just became ridiculous. But it doesn't matter. I'll be
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 2: there for season three. We'll be here to review it.
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 2: What were your overall, you know, final thoughts on season two.
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 3: I mean, I don't know why, Like I just think
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 3: he's going to unreveal his identity, and I think I
• 1:12:19
  Speaker 3: thought it was a fun moment and I did like
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 3: that he was like, I'm going to quickly prove to
• 1:12:23
  Speaker 3: y'all that I'm there, devil.
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 2: That was that was a fun.
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 3: But you're blind, somebody says, predictably, and then he goes
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 3: anything and then they cut.
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 1: They cut to the cop band like a blind lady
• 1:12:35
  Speaker 1: who can fight? Well, I'll be dared, devil.
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 2: It should have had it pop up spree like invincible
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 2: right there, like a blind ord who can fight I'll be.
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 1: He must be.
• 1:12:50
  Speaker 2: What a?
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 1: What a?
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah? That's sadly, that's it would have better they've done that.
• 1:13:07
  Speaker 2: What you thoughts?
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 4: I do have thoughts, you know, I think this is
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 4: a show that makes decisions boldly, like we're going to
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 4: start this out with Foggy's murder right for real, Like
• 1:13:22
  Speaker 4: we're gonna really And I give it credit for certainly,
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 4: you know, the trope is a little bit outplayed, and
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 4: I wondered why this direction, and I think that.
• 1:13:35
  Speaker 5: This show does deliver. I'm still going to continue to
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 5: watch it.
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 4: This show delivers on making these critical events matter because
• 1:13:43
  Speaker 4: you see Karen totally unravel, you see a lot of
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 4: consequences for those kinds of things. Vanessa gets gets killed,
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 4: same thing, right, So I think this is a show
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 4: that does take some accountability for some of these bold decisions.
• 1:13:59
  Speaker 4: And in a way, I think that's what I'm here for,
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 4: is how are you going to make sense of these
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 4: tragedies and these traumas. And I honestly, anytime there's any
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 4: kind of mental health professional, I'm definitely on board to
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 4: see how does this work out in ways that I
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 4: can celebrate and point to as these are realistic examples.
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 4: But in the same way, I can also say, look,
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 4: this is actually not what would happen, and you know,
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 4: gives us reason to talk about that. So in a way,
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 4: while this wasn't my favorite season, I think the I
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 4: think I preferred the first season over this one. Yeah,
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 4: I do think that there's promise here, and I'll continue
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 4: to watch.
• 1:14:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think there's promise. And you also said somethingment like,
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 2: you know, I know you're a mental health professional. But
• 1:14:52
  Speaker 2: I'm like the person who, you know, I've experienced incarceration
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 2: and it's a big thing to me, and I really
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 2: don't I would like to see them handle that more
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 2: on this show, and then I would like to see
• 1:15:06
  Speaker 2: them handle it in the Spider Man film. Like I
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 2: think they need to show the repercussions of Matt actually
• 1:15:12
  Speaker 2: being in prison as well. You know, that's something that
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 2: I don't think they need. They've explored yet, and I
• 1:15:17
  Speaker 2: feel like they should, you know, they should show him. Yeah,
• 1:15:21
  Speaker 2: I hope they do, you know, I hope he has
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 2: not broken out of prison in the Spider Man film
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 2: or you know, maybe they'll do what you say, Sea three, Yeah,
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 2: and then.
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 5: He'll say, you want, like, what's that show?
• 1:15:32
  Speaker 2: No, I don't want to what I would like, I
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 2: didn't a good prison portrayal, to you. The greatest that
• 1:15:41
  Speaker 2: I've ever seen, in the toughest for me to watch
• 1:15:44
  Speaker 2: was and Or. The three episode arc of and Or
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 2: being in prison. That was the like, it was the
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 2: closest that I've ever seen to show how boredom and
• 1:15:56
  Speaker 2: routine are the most like Devin saving parts of it
• 1:16:01
  Speaker 2: and the psychological effects of it are more devastating than
• 1:16:04
  Speaker 2: anything else. I think that was the closest that I saw.
• 1:16:08
  Speaker 2: I've only watched I watched OZ back in the day,
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 2: so I have to watch it again. But it got
• 1:16:13
  Speaker 2: a lot of comedy in little just too over the top,
• 1:16:16
  Speaker 2: because to me, it's not it's the boredom that is
• 1:16:18
  Speaker 2: the like, the the monotony of prison is the thing
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 2: that it's like the most insane thing that people cannot understand,
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 2: and that looking at time when it doesn't pass and
• 1:16:30
  Speaker 2: how time, it's a lot to get into. But like
• 1:16:34
  Speaker 2: I fully understood relative relative time when you get locked up,
• 1:16:36
  Speaker 2: because shit moves a lot slower, and then it becomes
• 1:16:40
  Speaker 2: like Groundhall day where every day is that same, and
• 1:16:42
  Speaker 2: it just becomes like everything time moves slower than it
• 1:16:46
  Speaker 2: moves fast. It's very weird and it's very difficult to
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 2: the stribe. But I thought and Or was the best
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 2: of that, So shout out to Andor. And I don't
• 1:16:54
  Speaker 2: think many things should ever get that. And so I
• 1:16:56
  Speaker 2: don't want to see people do that either, because I
• 1:16:58
  Speaker 2: don't want to see you know, long ass, you know,
• 1:17:01
  Speaker 2: Matt in prison sequence. So I don't know how to
• 1:17:04
  Speaker 2: handle it because I don't want to see them walking back.
• 1:17:06
  Speaker 2: Like you said, I don't want them to do Oh
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 2: I'm not dared to. Well, you know that was somebody
• 1:17:10
  Speaker 2: else in the courtroom that day, Like that makes no sense.
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 2: So you know, I don't I don't know how to
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 2: handle it. And like I say, the way they handle this,
• 1:17:20
  Speaker 2: you know in the king Ben you know, get out
• 1:17:23
  Speaker 2: of jail, going to Paradise free card. I just don't
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 2: expect them to handle it. Well, I don't know. We'll
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 2: see you, all right, Eddie. Please let the people know
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 2: where they can find you at all that good stuff,
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 2: you know.
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I am Eddie Overgold.
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 3: You can find me at Eddie Overgold on everything, but
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 3: more importantly, you can find me as one of the
• 1:17:44
  Speaker 3: co hosts on Waving the Red Flag or a Relationship
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 3: and Culture podcasts. We cover neuroculture, we cover dating, we
• 1:17:50
  Speaker 3: cover sex, we cover hip hop, we cover media analysis,
• 1:17:55
  Speaker 3: all within what's going.
• 1:17:56
  Speaker 1: On with the culture.
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 3: And if you are interested in either of our conversational
• 1:18:00
  Speaker 3: card games you can grab those at shop dot wavnthredflag
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 3: dot com. We've got It's a red Flag which every
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 3: single card gives you a prompt that you get to ask, like,
• 1:18:08
  Speaker 3: is this thing of red flag and dating if he
• 1:18:11
  Speaker 3: you know, like still lives with his mom at thirty
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 3: five whatever, and then you and the folks that you
• 1:18:14
  Speaker 3: play with can have a conversation about that. This game,
• 1:18:18
  Speaker 3: in all seriousness, every single card has two options. One
• 1:18:21
  Speaker 3: that's like some dumb bullshit who would survive in a
• 1:18:25
  Speaker 3: zombie apocalypse? And the other side is something introspective, you know,
• 1:18:27
  Speaker 3: what are your three biggest fears in your career?
• 1:18:30
  Speaker 1: And so you get to decide what the nature of
• 1:18:32
  Speaker 1: the conversation.
• 1:18:32
  Speaker 3: Is, which is very similar to what you get on
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 3: our podcast, which is we like to say some of
• 1:18:36
  Speaker 3: the deepest and dumbest conversations you'll ever experience.
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 1: So that's waving the red flag on everything.
• 1:18:42
  Speaker 2: Andrea.
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 4: Folks can find me pretty much everywhere at doctor Drea Psychology,
• 1:18:49
  Speaker 4: and I invite people to check out The Arkham Sessions,
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 4: which is podcasts today co host. My whole mission is
• 1:18:57
  Speaker 4: to make mental health science free for everyone. Not all
• 1:19:01
  Speaker 4: of us have access to mental health treatment and high
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 4: quality services. We're not there yet right so, ethically and responsibly,
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 4: I like to disseminate mental health science through storytelling, entertainment, media,
• 1:19:18
  Speaker 4: comic books, science fiction, fantasy, pop culture. You can find
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 4: all our stuff on YouTube, Spotify. We have video now
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 4: we're covering clay Face trailers and all sorts of fun
• 1:19:30
  Speaker 4: stuff on the Archam sessions. Find us on YouTube and yeah,
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 4: reach out. Happy to connect with folks and I hope
• 1:19:37
  Speaker 4: they hope they connect with me.
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 2: And yes, this is as always your boy djbit, I mean,
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 2: one half of the For All Nerds. You can find
• 1:19:46
  Speaker 2: us For All Nerds pretty much everywhere. You're probably watching
• 1:19:50
  Speaker 2: us right now or listening to us on for All Nerds,
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 2: but if you're new to this, make sure you hit
• 1:19:55
  Speaker 2: follow subscribe on everything, especially on YouTube, because we're doing
• 1:19:58
  Speaker 2: a lot of big stuff on YouTube these days. And
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 2: it's for All Nerds, you know, one of the longest
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 2: running number one geek and pop culture podcasts from the
• 1:20:07
  Speaker 2: perspective of black people. It's me and my cost Taitana King,
• 1:20:12
  Speaker 2: and you can find us on everything. And if you
• 1:20:14
  Speaker 2: like the merch that I'm wearing, you can find that
• 1:20:17
  Speaker 2: on four All Nerds dot com. The only place to
• 1:20:19
  Speaker 2: get our exclusive butter ass stuff like this the Gucci Mandalorian,
• 1:20:24
  Speaker 2: and we got a bunch of other fly You had
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 2: a Dunk and Egg joint and a bunch of mother
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 2: fly you know geek weare, so head over to four
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 2: All Nerds dot com and get you some of that
• 1:20:33
  Speaker 2: and we'll be back for more. Thank you for joining us.
• 1:20:41
  Speaker 7: Hey, what's up? Internet's in a fanfam. This is Tatiana
• 1:20:44
  Speaker 7: King for four All All Nerds, and I want to
• 1:20:46
  Speaker 7: thank you so much for listening and watching the four Owners.
• 1:20:49
  Speaker 7: Make sure you like a subscribe to us only on YouTube.
• 1:21:54
  Speaker 2: For All Nerds Shows a member of the Loudspeaker's Network,
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 2: where we would always say rest in peace to our founder,
• 1:22:00
  Speaker 2: combat Jack.
• 1:22:01
  Speaker 5: For All Nerds show is powered by our listeners.
• 1:22:03
  Speaker 7: Everything we do, from our podcasts, live events, our website
• 1:22:07
  Speaker 7: are all independently funded. Please continue to support us through
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 7: our Patreon page at Patreon dot com.
• 1:22:13
  Speaker 5: Slash for All.
• 1:22:14
  Speaker 2: Nerds available now at for all nerds dot com. The
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 2: Gucci Mandalorian, the Variants, the Duncan Egg, the Lion Old Chief,
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 2: New designs coming soon.