Latest / The SOM Podcast / SPECIAL: Cold Stress, UV, and Community: Insights from an Arctic Research Trip

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SPECIAL: Cold Stress, UV, and Community: Insights from an Arctic Research Trip · The SOM Podcast

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  Speaker 1: This podcast is sponsored by orchid Live. Find out more
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: at orchidlive dot com. Hello. I'm Steve Randall and welcome
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: to the Some podcast. In this special episode, we're talking
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  Speaker 1: to one of the recipients of the annual Golden Jubilee Award.
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  Speaker 1: It's available to full SOME members, funding research to understand
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  Speaker 1: more about occupational health around the world.
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  Speaker 2: I'm Emma Wallace. I'm an occupational health physician with the
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  Speaker 2: Northern Ireland Civil Service, relatively new to the occupational health world,
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  Speaker 2: having come into it about three years ago. In a
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  Speaker 2: previous life, I was an anesthetics trainne so big change,
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  Speaker 2: but have been loving it so far.
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  Speaker 3: Excellent.
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  Speaker 1: Well, we're here to talk about a particular trip, but
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  Speaker 1: before we get to that, really interested in what drew
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  Speaker 1: you into occupational health having come from, you know, a
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  Speaker 1: different background.
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  Speaker 2: I think I was deciding that I was leaving anesthetics
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  Speaker 2: based on I suppose a combination of the acutely stressful
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  Speaker 2: nature of it and work life balance. And as I
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  Speaker 2: was getting ready to leave, one of the consultants had
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  Speaker 2: asked me had I considered occupational medicine and it wasn't
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  Speaker 2: something I'd honestly really thought about. It we don't get
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  Speaker 2: much exposure to it in medical school, and so looked
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  Speaker 2: a bit more into it and thought, actually the combination
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  Speaker 2: of toxicology, physiology, face to face interactions with patients actually
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  Speaker 2: getting a bit more time to have that more holistic
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  Speaker 2: approach to them, and just the novelty and unknown of
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  Speaker 2: occupational risks. I love novelty and learning new things. So
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  Speaker 2: all of that just really drew me in. And you
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  Speaker 2: had definitely no regrets since.
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  Speaker 1: Well, that's good to hear, and thank goodness you did
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  Speaker 1: get into occupational medicine because that led you to some
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  Speaker 1: and that of course led you to the funding that
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  Speaker 1: took you to the Arctic.
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  Speaker 2: So I've always loved physiology. That's been one of my
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  Speaker 2: passions for a long time. So even in occupational medicine,
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  Speaker 2: the rules or aspects that I was very drawn to
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  Speaker 2: were things like diving and altitude and thermal extremes because
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  Speaker 2: there was a really practical role of understanding physiology and
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  Speaker 2: applying it. So when I saw the Golden Hibili Travel Fellowship,
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  Speaker 2: I thought, actually, this is a great opportunity to get
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  Speaker 2: some on the ground practical experience, specifically in extreme cold stress.
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  Speaker 2: There didn't seem to be a lot out there in
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  Speaker 2: terms of occupational health positions or clinicians and their input.
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  Speaker 2: It was all very management based or health safety based
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  Speaker 2: rather than what we bring to it as clinicians. So
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  Speaker 2: that will dreaming in and there's a few stations both
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  Speaker 2: in the Arctic and the Antarctic. The Arctics obviously a
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  Speaker 2: bit more practical to get to, so I contacted the
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  Speaker 2: British Antarctic Survey Station manager who very kindly was happy
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  Speaker 2: to let me come visit and do a site risk assessment.
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  Speaker 2: And then I had had a few conversations with him,
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  Speaker 2: but in the application to PSALM and thankfully they also
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  Speaker 2: said yes, so it orders came together very quickly. I
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  Speaker 2: think application went in the April and I was out
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  Speaker 2: in July, so very quick turn around. A bit of
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  Speaker 2: a blur, but yeah, an incredible experience. So I'm so
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  Speaker 2: thankful to some to have been able to get out there.
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  Speaker 3: Wow, I mean, yeah, absolutely incredible.
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  Speaker 1: And I think that is one thing that crops up
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  Speaker 1: a lot in any conversation we have on this podcast
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  Speaker 1: is just the vast field of occupational medicine means that
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  Speaker 1: people can explore different things, you know, as you said,
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  Speaker 1: your trip to the Arctic was all about, you know,
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  Speaker 1: how people and their body respond to extreme cold temperatures
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  Speaker 1: and being able to sort of push the envelope a
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  Speaker 1: little bit on research.
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  Speaker 3: Must have been a proud moment for you.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, it was just on both a professional and of
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  Speaker 2: person whole level. It was a very changing trip. As
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  Speaker 2: maybe cliche as that signs incredibly privileged, I guess to
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  Speaker 2: be able to go with somewhere that not a lot
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  Speaker 2: of people get to go, especially as high up as
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  Speaker 2: I ended up going, But I think it definitely has
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  Speaker 2: sparked even more of an interest. It was quite a
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  Speaker 2: qualitative study, so I think the prospect of in the
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  Speaker 2: future being able to get a bit more stuck in
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  Speaker 2: hands on in terms of more quantitative research would be
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  Speaker 2: fab But it's definitely sparked something that hopefully I'll get
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  Speaker 2: to continue for a while.
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  Speaker 1: Well, let's talk, at the risk of turning this into
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  Speaker 1: a travelogue podcast, let's talk about the practicalities. How do
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  Speaker 1: you even get to the Arctic?
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  Speaker 2: Yes, So the place I was going is called Nielsend.
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  Speaker 2: It's the northernmost permanent settlement in the world, so literally
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  Speaker 2: as high up as you can go, So I got
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  Speaker 2: a flight from Dublin to Oslow, and a flight from
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  Speaker 2: Oslo to long Earbian, which is the capital of sorts
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  Speaker 2: of Svalbard, so it's a Svalbard's a collection of islands
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  Speaker 2: in the Arctic. And then from that capital, Longyearbn got
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  Speaker 2: in this terrifying cargo type plane that I think there
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  Speaker 2: were only thirteen or fourteen seats in its, surrounded by
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  Speaker 2: these folk in their military and polar suits, feeling incredibly
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  Speaker 2: out of place. So we twenty five minute flight in
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  Speaker 2: that plan. It was the most incredible views I've ever
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  Speaker 2: seen in my life. Mountain snowcap mountains everywhere, and the
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  Speaker 2: fjords and glaciers coming off and it was absolutely astounding.
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  Speaker 2: So I think that was one of the best twenty
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  Speaker 2: five minutes of my life. That was amazing.
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  Speaker 1: Well, I mean, you know a lot of people go
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  Speaker 1: on cruises and sort of check out the fjords and things,
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  Speaker 1: but to be flying over in that sort of experience
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  Speaker 1: you get to see just amazing stuff.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it just so shocked by the size
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  Speaker 2: of the glaciers. I'd never actually seen one in real
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  Speaker 2: life before, so an unreal experience. Highly recommend that anybody
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  Speaker 2: gets a chance to go up, but it's very strictly
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  Speaker 2: monitored in terms of who can actually go. They're obviously
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  Speaker 2: very keenly aware of the carbon footprints who they don't
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  Speaker 2: operate very many flights and you have to be an
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  Speaker 2: approved researcher to go up. So thankfully there's not too
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  Speaker 2: much tourist activity. I was there in July, which is
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  Speaker 2: their hottest, hottest period at four degrees celsius. So the
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  Speaker 2: landing for us was fine, but I know in the
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  Speaker 2: winter months it can be pretty sketchy, and the station
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  Speaker 2: manager said about landing on ice and the plane s
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  Speaker 2: getting and it's all been quite terrifying sometimes. I think.
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  Speaker 2: I think it is generally a pretty safe light and
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  Speaker 2: typically if the weather's bad, they just cancel them. So
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  Speaker 2: I think that was a bit of a fear for me,
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  Speaker 2: was I had a very small window because of all
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  Speaker 2: the connecting flights to get in a nut. But thankfully
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  Speaker 2: everything went smoothly.
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  Speaker 1: And so you land, you get out of the plane
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  Speaker 1: and it's what did you say, four degrees?
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  Speaker 2: Yeah it was. It was chilly, but not not as bad.
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  Speaker 2: You know, obviously in the winter it gets down to
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  Speaker 2: twenty so nowhere near reaching that a lot of different
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  Speaker 2: nations have research stations there, so obviously I was with
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  Speaker 2: the British one. And then there's a little museum and
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  Speaker 2: a bar and the remnants of an old railway track
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  Speaker 2: from when it used to be a coal mining community.
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  Speaker 2: So there's not really a lot beyond that very small
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  Speaker 2: site of huts basically, and then beyond that you've absolutely
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  Speaker 2: nothing for miles and miles except the odd little timber
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  Speaker 2: trapper hut from years gone by, So it's very very isolated.
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  Speaker 3: Wow.
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  Speaker 1: And so you start your research and what does that involve?
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  Speaker 1: What are you looking for, what are you trying to learn?
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  Speaker 2: As I said, this was a very quality of just
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  Speaker 2: sort of getting some practical experience and doing a bit
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  Speaker 2: of a risk risk assessment. So I was there for
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  Speaker 2: three and a half days, and I was staying on
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  Speaker 2: the station with the manager. And then there were four bioecologists,
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  Speaker 2: so most of them would only come out for sort
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  Speaker 2: of four to six weeks. It used to be that
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  Speaker 2: they would have come out for a lot longer, and
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  Speaker 2: certainly there's some staff for their year round, but there
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  Speaker 2: were these four bioecologists that I essentially followed around for
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  Speaker 2: the three and a half days, so whether that was
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  Speaker 2: going up the glacier to take samples, which was a
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  Speaker 2: lot of hiking, crossing some dodgy meltwater streams and rivers,
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  Speaker 2: doing some cycling across the place to get to the
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  Speaker 2: various glaciers to get samples, being out on the boat
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  Speaker 2: on the fjord as well. So essentially just cataloging risks
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  Speaker 2: as I saw them as a kind of observational walk
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  Speaker 2: through survey. And then I had a little handheld monitor,
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  Speaker 2: so I was checking things like the ambient air temperature, humidity,
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  Speaker 2: the noise and decibels, EUV levels, lux levels and PM
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  Speaker 2: two point five. So I was just trying to get
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  Speaker 2: a bit of a holistical round look at what the
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  Speaker 2: risks actually are right there summer, very very well addressed,
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  Speaker 2: like the thermal risk, and then some some may be
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  Speaker 2: a bit less so. And I think because of the
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  Speaker 2: cohort of people that would you know, put themselves in
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  Speaker 2: the Arctic for especially the manager, he's there for months
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  Speaker 2: and months at a time and they're not necessarily you know,
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  Speaker 2: the most concerned with their own well being sometimes. But
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  Speaker 2: the station manager of the British Antarctic Survey Station was
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  Speaker 2: was very good, very cluding a man of many, many talents,
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  Speaker 2: and I think that especially came in handy with navigation
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  Speaker 2: and you know, weather techs every day, and he was
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  Speaker 2: definitely an essential member of the team, but it is
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  Speaker 2: the only one right there for prolonged periods, so I
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  Speaker 2: imagine things things can get a bit isolating for him.
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  Speaker 2: There wasn't any direct physiology monitoring. I suppose the main
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  Speaker 2: The main thing that I noticed on myself was the
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  Speaker 2: physical nature of it and how much of a tool
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  Speaker 2: that could take with the amount of hiking and cycling cycling,
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  Speaker 2: and it really was much more physical than I expected,
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  Speaker 2: and especially getting in and out of the boat while
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  Speaker 2: you're wearing a full neoprene heavy buoyancy suit. And then
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  Speaker 2: I was there during the midnight sun period, so they'll
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  Speaker 2: get twenty four hours of darkness in the winter months
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  Speaker 2: and twenty four hours of light in the summer months,
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  Speaker 2: so I think that was the thing. Again, no physiological
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  Speaker 2: measurements in terms of Mystercrailian rhythm or any disruption that way.
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  Speaker 2: And obviously I was there for three days, so you're
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  Speaker 2: probably not going to see an impact in that time,
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  Speaker 2: but definitely noticed that nighttime routine and actual time of
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  Speaker 2: going to sleep slipped even in those three days because
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  Speaker 2: it's always bright outside, so you don't necessarily notice the
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  Speaker 2: hours creeping away. And it's the same with meal times.
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  Speaker 2: Those kind of slipped a bit. So I know there's
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  Speaker 2: been some studies in discircading rhythm disruption and in Arctic
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  Speaker 2: communities because of those really big variations, and they might
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  Speaker 2: have l like they're exposed to. I wasn't actually doing
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  Speaker 2: any of that while I was there and seeing with
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  Speaker 2: the thermal thermal rest scan vibration risk. I didn't have
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  Speaker 2: capacity to be carrying an accelerometer and doing you know,
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  Speaker 2: there was there was a lot more to have done
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  Speaker 2: if I'd had a few weeks to be out there.
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  Speaker 2: But again, some of this is maybe more more in
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  Speaker 2: the in the future to be to be looking into.
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  Speaker 1: That's that's part two of your trip, you know, still
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  Speaker 1: to be still to be scheduled at some point in
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  Speaker 1: the future. I mean, obviously, you know this has real experience,
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  Speaker 1: real world implications, this sort of research for people in
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  Speaker 1: those environments, but other things that you feel you can
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  Speaker 1: take away for more sort of general situations, more general locations.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, there are definitely a few things. I think both
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  Speaker 2: from a risk point of view out there and also
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  Speaker 2: the benefits of working out there, which which surprised me.
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  Speaker 2: So in terms of the risks I'd already alluded to it,
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  Speaker 2: I do think cooled in the UK is a bit
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  Speaker 2: of an underestimated risk and you know, even if you're
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  Speaker 2: going by the International ISO standards, the UK would often
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  Speaker 2: fall into that. You know, they kind of an extreme
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  Speaker 2: thermal environment in terms of cold is less than zero
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  Speaker 2: degrees celsius, which you know, for example in Belfast in
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  Speaker 2: January there that was fifteen days of the month, so
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  Speaker 2: you're talking fifty percent of the winter months potentially being
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  Speaker 2: in that extreme category and where they would recommend, you know,
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  Speaker 2: occupational health physician input at that level. But I think
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  Speaker 2: because we consider ourselves a milder climate, sometimes at risk
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  Speaker 2: maybe isn't taken quite so seriously. So in an ideal world,
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  Speaker 2: I think there'd be a bit more research into that.
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  Speaker 2: And also the EVE exposure was massive and again maybe
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  Speaker 2: underestimated here where we say we're a mild climate and
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  Speaker 2: don't really think about necessarily how much our outdoor workers
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  Speaker 2: are exposed and obviously worse out there because the ice
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  Speaker 2: is reflecting the EV so they and also with those
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  Speaker 2: of depletion, they get more of it anyway, so worse
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  Speaker 2: out there where you know, two out of the four
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  Speaker 2: researchers that I was with were quite badly, some burnt
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  Speaker 2: by the end of the three days that I was
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  Speaker 2: with them. And you don't necessarily expect here, But I
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: just wonder how much sun protection we're giving, how much
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  Speaker 2: advice we're administering, how much skin surveillance we're doing for
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  Speaker 2: people who are exposed year round. So that was another
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  Speaker 2: interesting thing. And then suppose in terms of massive benefits
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  Speaker 2: that I saw there when I expected it to feel
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  Speaker 2: very isolated from a community point of view, but actually,
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  Speaker 2: you know, all the researchers, all the nations at in
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  Speaker 2: the same canteens, so you had, you know, potentially fourteen
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  Speaker 2: fifteen different nations all coming together, mixing up who was
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  Speaker 2: eating with who, all having the same male times, and
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  Speaker 2: posters everywhere telling you that you weren't allud your phone, right.
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  Speaker 2: It was very heavily frind upon and no no TVs anywhere,
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  Speaker 2: you know, just real communication and relationship with each other.
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  Speaker 2: And then obviously the right side getting exercise and sun
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  Speaker 2: all day every day, which we can't necessarily replicate here,
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  Speaker 2: but I think for me it definitely showed what a
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  Speaker 2: workplace could look like with a bit more of that
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  Speaker 2: kind of community feel and you know, tempting to basic
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  Speaker 2: things like regular men times and getting out for some
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: exercise during the day and so those are really really
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  Speaker 2: simple things. I'm sure a lot of workplaces do very well,
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  Speaker 2: but yeah, certainly food for thought for me. Anyway, I
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  Speaker 2: hope that I'll get to work a wee bit more
• 14:19
  Speaker 2: on some of that, maybe more the risk side. The
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: hope is that I'm starting at an m fill to
• 14:27
  Speaker 2: hopefully turn into a PhD on cold exposure in the UK,
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: and especially looking at that question of actually how our
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: occupational health services doing the whole selection, protection preparation of
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: people who are going into cold environments. And certainly my
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: impression is that there's not a whole lot of you know,
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: specific intervention or health surveillance that we're doing. And it
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: might not necessarily be that that needs to be the
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: case for everyone, but I think there's some some cohorts
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: of particularly vulnerable workers that we do maybe need to
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: take a bit more note of. We knew some of
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: the physiological effects of called and how that can impact
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: health and disease. So people who do have COPD or
• 15:10
  Speaker 2: asthma or hypertension, are we actually doing anything above and
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: beyond for those people? Do we think they're at an
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: increased risk? What additional controls would be helpful for them?
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  Speaker 2: So those are all sorts of questions that hopefully I'll
• 15:24
  Speaker 2: get a bit of an opportunity to start to piece
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: together some answers for that.
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: Well, I mean, what an absolutely amazing experience and so
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: pleased that SOME was able to fund that trip for
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: you and to generate so many great insights that you've
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: brought back.
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: And thanks so much for coming on the Some podcast.
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: No Worries, Thanks so much for having me.
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: This podcast is sponsored by orchid Live. Orchid live is
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: a specialist occupational health software used by a number of
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: SOME members to run every aspect of their occupational health operations.
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: They hold healthcare records for over one million UK workers
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: and work with both in house OH teams and OH providers.
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  Speaker 1: You can find out more at orchidlive dot com.