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Authentic Leadership Through Recognition with Sarah McVanel (Part II) · Authentic Living

• 0:01
  Welcome to authentic living with Roxanne, a place where we have as conversations about
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  things that really matter in our lives.
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  And now here's your host, Roxanne Derhodge.
• 0:36
  Our interview last week was so good that we decided to turn it into a 2 part series.
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  If you missed last week, you'll find the link in the show notes.
• 0:45
  It's not mandatory that you listen, but we wanna make sure that you don't miss out on this
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  amazing conversation.
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  Right?
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  Because I it's like, what do you call it?
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  The what's it called?
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  The invisible shopper or the what is that?
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  Oh, the secret shopper.
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  Speaker.
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  The shopper kind of thing.
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  Right?
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  It's like, because really I I've and what would happen to me is is off times it'd have to deal
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  with lots of levels of leadership all the way to the front line because we would be leaning,
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  we would be rolling it out to the front line.
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  It was as confidential service.
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  We'll be seeing trends that wasn't happening.
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  So I would, you know, go for instance, I dealt with, the light, union for, the theaters in
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  Toronto.
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  So guess what they did?
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  Right?
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  So they took me behind the scenes about 10 minutes before production, to see the lion
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  king.
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  So here I am, and they said, we want you to see it through the eyes of what we go through.
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  And I said, Oh, boy.
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  This is gonna be fun.
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  I get to see the Lion King, but I get to see it behind the scenes.
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  Is Sarah the most amazing experience because it really showed me how to look at it from the
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  lens of perfection, what they had to create, and my challenge was we'd like you to count how
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  many mistakes you see.
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  So I'm like, alright then.
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  So I'm right on.
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  I'm, like, got my eagle eyes on.
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  I did not count once.
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  There was 35 glitches.
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  I did not see one because they're so quick at problem solving and fixing.
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  They were they're reconstructed, computers behind the scenes that could have good things.
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  So, again, from a psychological perspective, it allowed me to see potentially how the, you
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  know, how the actors would have to, you know, go on as normal and then how, you know, the
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  managers would have to manage them and all those things, but it it it's an aggregate that
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  allowed you to see it, right, and what people are doing their jobs from such a high level but
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  again, from, you know, the psychological element recognizing how could we support them,
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  understanding the pressures of the industry, Right?
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  Which is yeah.
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  And the connection between authenticity and recognition is how do you authentically
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  acknowledge, wow.
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  We overcame 35 issues as opposed to what sometimes happens, which is how did 35 things
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  happen?
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  We are professionals here.
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  How is it possible?
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  We had 35 mistakes.
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  So it's the the where you come at it by understanding and appreciating the pressures,
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  the stress, the, you know, that's kinda goes back to that 8% we were talking about.
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  So rather than than say, like, you're gonna need to work harder.
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  People know that already.
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  Instead, it is we appreciate that you're working harder.
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  So one of the things I think that we can do as leaders to truly authentically see to to be
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  behind the curtain like you Yes.
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  Your job as a leader is to make sure there aren't quality issues and competency gaps and
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  bullying, instability, and all the things that are that are terrible, that you, you know, you
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  have a responsibility to make sure that the that you're rowing in the right direction.
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  And then if that's not happening in the in the rowing term, they call it ketchup crab where
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  you you know, your your your lower shutters in the water, and it could really cause a problem
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  if that happens.
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  So you wanna be able to catch it before it becomes a really big problem.
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  And if you can't do that from up here, you cannot and I'm visually showing you can't go do
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  it from up on high in the ivory tower, as you say.
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  Looking down and clicky high heel shoes and pin straight suits.
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  If you really genuinely want to connect with the people who add the most value in the
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  organization, and I'm sorry to say leaders.
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  It's not the CEO.
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  The CEO's job is very important.
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  So CEOs, I love you of huge respect, not qualified to do your job, huge respect for you,
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  and who would the customer notice if you're gone tomorrow.
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  And for one day, you're only gone for one day.
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  The person who if the phone's not being answered or the care's not being delivered or
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  nobody gets their mail for an entire day, that's really visible.
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  That can create a huge bottleneck in the the whole reason for being So we need to
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  acknowledge by by putting ourselves in the shoes of those people.
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  We call it visible leadership and lean continuous improvement.
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  It's going to gammas with, like, you know, if you if you're actually in the the, let's say a
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  Toyota Toyota, they would say, you know, go to gamba, not it's which refers to us a a circle
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  where you stand in the circle and you watch and you studied.
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  That's what you did.
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  You went to Gamba, And when I was in a senior leadership role, I would hear on a Tuesday at
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  senior team what was broken.
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  And on Friday, I would spend it in scrubs or in runners or whatever wherever the quote problem
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  existed, that we couldn't figure out how to solve in senior team.
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  I'd go there and I'd try to study it.
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  And, you know, not only would I come back with greater information, and frankly, sometimes
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  Sometimes my clients my sorry.
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  My, my peers would respect that and other times they create waves, as you can probably imagine.
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  And And I'm not criticizing them.
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  They have their way of leading.
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  This this just I honestly didn't know how I would ever contribute in senior team if I
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  didn't go and study what was going on with the people who could understand it.
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  Here's what matters most to me, though.
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  The people who were experiencing pain of that issue not yet being solved or that we did not
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  have a good viable solution to, they needed to feel that somebody was listening.
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  The somebody was paying attention because even if it was such a colossal challenge that it was
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  even outside of the realm of anybody on senior team being able to such as in Ontario.
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  Well, every hospital, you have a backlog of beds of people in beds and emergency.
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  We can't create more beds.
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  We can't pull funding out of the air.
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  There's lots of things that we could probably do to iterate, and that's good organizations do
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  that.
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  Good hospitals do that.
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  And There will it's it's virtually impossible to have enough money and funding to do
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  everything you possibly would ever wanna do for a patient.
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  So what we can do is we can make sure that the people providing the care, the one experiencing
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  the strain of an overrun emergency department of the families worried about their the care
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  about, the hearing infection controls concerns that you have patients who should be isolated,
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  but you do not have another isolation room.
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  The worst thing that we can do for those people is let them suffer on their own.
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  And not go down there and say thank you or or ask a question or roll up our sleeves and do
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  something about it.
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  Undercover Boss is not just a reality TV show.
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  It needs to be how we authentically appreciate and acknowledge people because if there's
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  nothing you can do in that moment to fix it.
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  You can study it, and you can be with the people who are the ones struggling the most
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  with that issue.
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  And it can
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  be on the customer's side too.
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  Go and spend time with your customers.
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  It doesn't have to be the people providing you, and it could also be on the other side too.
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  Well, I
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  like the flip because understanding both ends, you know, and I, you know, with my tenure
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  working with lots of, companies in different sectors, I remember if one thing sticks out for
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  me, there was a suicide.
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  And, of course, there was a trauma response.
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  We responded within 24 hours.
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  It was a a hospital chain.
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  And, so I was there just kind of making sure everything was getting done and the CEO showed
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  up.
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  At the response.
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  And I I was shocked.
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  I was like, and so, you know, obviously, we were doing the day debriefing had been done and
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  all those things, and he just wanted to show up to say, I just wanted to show my face and just
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  say, this is a horrible thing to have happened and happened at one of the hotels.
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  And but I just wanna let you know this is this is horrific.
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  Because that person's lost someone and, you know, obviously, but you, as my staff, have had
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  to deal with this and you've dealt with it, in such an amazing way that I wanted to come to
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  show you that I know how difficult this must have been, but I'm so proud of how we as an
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  environment dealt with it.
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  And I was so I'm making sure on my end, my company end that everything flows.
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  That's kind of part of my role.
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  But again, for him coming down from corporate to the actual hotel to be able to show the
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  presence, it's it was pretty amazing.
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  And Like, you're right.
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  When when you think of leadership, right, especially through dire times, and, of course,
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  the situation I'm talking is one of those dire things.
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  And someone does something like that, you it sticks with you.
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  Yeah.
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  It it it sticks with you in your mind.
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  Right?
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  Like, versus kind of the leaders that, you know, would, and unfortunately, sometimes the
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  leaders to get back to work or, you know, we'll be okay or the ship coming in.
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  It's not, you know, gonna be okay, but this time, this last 18 months has shown us the
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  value of some of these examples that we've been using, right?
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  The ones that really stop to you know, really see how, you know, the Arabic battles of the
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  world, how are you really doing, Sarah?
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  Like, not the, what you're showing me, but how is it really in your life or stuff like that.
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  And that's value because we all wanna be validated Mhmm.
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  To feel like we're important and you know, when you're my senior leader, and I feel a
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  connection, and I feel a connection to the culture, then it's like, that's kinda like part
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  of my family, and I wanna do my best to optimally function, you know, because I want my
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  my culture and my family to survive.
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  Which is a different space, you know, compared to let me just get through the day, and they go
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  20 minutes at a time.
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  You know, let me try to on my on my days off look for what's better out there, which,
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  unfortunately, is the inauthentic end to things because people are just like, Like, we've seen
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  in with the new resignation with a lot of people.
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  People are voting with their feet based on their values now.
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  Yeah.
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  Yeah.
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  Right?
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  Yeah.
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  And, you know, it's when you think about all the things you gave, you know, about tragic
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  example of a suicide, we have COVID, we have natural disasters, we have cyber attacks.
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  There's it's not if we have something that is going to dramatically shake the people and that
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  we serve that we that we employ here.
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  It's it's what are we gonna do when it happens?
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  It's it's and it's not a fault of the organization or the industry or or, you know,
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  whatever has happened, to create that.
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  It's what do we do?
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  And that's really what tests our authenticity.
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  And it's what tests, if recognition is sincere.
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  Did that was that company gonna keep it going or not?
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  You know, an example that I hadn't thought about until, you know, you just shared that
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  which was beautiful is, I was the keynote speaker at a conference that where we were
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  talking about recognition, and they didn't have a formal closing keynote.
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  But I was curious.
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  I want to stick around.
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  They invited the general manager of the hotel to close out the conference.
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  And I thought, well, I don't know if there he's making plugged for.
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  Everybody come here and go into vacation.
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  It was Puerto Rico.
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  So, I don't know.
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  Is this is it this is the world's best I did.
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  Did you get a free conference by having the general manager come and speak?
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  And you know what it was?
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  It was brilliant.
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  He talked about a hurricane that had hit the island, just over a year before that and how
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  they as a leadership team.
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  Oh, sorry.
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  That was Siri.
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  She's talking about my Apple Watch.
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  The, the general manager talked about how they handled that response.
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  And what what he shared was he and all of the members of the leadership team basically moved
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  into the hotel.
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  Many of the surrounding hotels, unfortunately, had been catastrophically damaged.
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  So they had other people from those hotels that they welcomed in.
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  Any any of the family members of the staff who had lost their homes or wasn't safe to go home,
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  were allowed to live in the hotel.
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  I mean, they were at they were bursting capacity.
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  But, well, he said one of the proudest members, and you had had a long decorated career in
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  hospitality.
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  He said, my proudest memory to this point and likely will always be is when I and my entire
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  executive team and all of the leaders lived in this hotel, with our staff and their families
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  and our guests and the guests of other hotels, guests.
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  And we made sure that they had three meals a day and we we cleaned as best we could and we
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  we went and we used every single resource we had in the intercontinental hotels disposal.
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  To bring in supplies.
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  And, I mean, I get goosebumps when I share that story with you.
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  And I thought that is the best way to end the conference where you started talking about
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  authentic, meaningful recognition in the service based industry.
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  You have How smart?
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  How smart?
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  Ugh.
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  Doesn't that inspire you?
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  Like, they didn't have to do any of that.
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  Absolutely.
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  Absolutely.
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  Right?
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  Like, I mean, the the fact that is that, I mean, what a valuable way to demonstrate, like,
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  they were just being, which is part of their culture.
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  And, to be able to share that with anybody that what I mean, we all have to travel.
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  We all have to stay places and things like that, but would you not want to have your event
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  or, you know, your your getaway in an environment that's so validating in a in a time
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  of really such a need.
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  Versus the place to, you know, the 5 star or the whatever, just, you know, somebody that's
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  in line.
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  But, you know, I'm always amazed, from some of the leaders that I interviewed, that you had,
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  connected with me with.
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  What I've one one trait that they shared with me that was quite, interesting is they said
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  They're in alignment, whether they're at work or at home, with their values.
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  And they're often coming from a place of service And the one theme that I often heard as
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  well was that they they had something happened to them in their life that made them re realize
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  or reconfigure the concept of, performance, and it was more about service versus performance.
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  And, you know, it it was it was fascinating to listen to because then they were doing things
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  in their communities that were connected to their families that kind of impacted the that
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  just their overall concept of how they led you know, whether it was in their communities or at
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  home or at work, they would they were 1 and the same, but they had evolved, to a level to
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  recognize that I'm the representative where wherever I am, I'm going to be the same person
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  and that the growing that they did, you know, and a lot of these leaders had worked a lot on
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  themselves as well.
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  Not just to lead for outcome, but to lead so that, you know, they bring people on that
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  really wanna follow them, which I was already inspired by, most of their stories.
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  You can lead for outcome, You can lead for lead for impact, and then you can lead for purpose.
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  Like, those, I think, to me, those are the 3 levels.
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  And and some of the the folks that leave from a place of purpose, these are the folks who hear
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  that they are mentoring, that they are and and really pushing for equity and rights of people,
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  not only in their own organization in their their whole industry.
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  They may even be the ones who encourage their organization to become more philanthropic or,
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  have volunteer activities in days.
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  One organization that we partnered with for a nurses week or a, a virtual nurses week event
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  that my my colleagues and I run every year, is the Daisy Foundation, and that's a family that,
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  out of their losing their son, who's a who's a a young man, they just they saw the amazing
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  care that and and the connectedness of the leaders, the authenticity of the leaders, and
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  the genuine authentic care at the bedside.
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  And they decided to totally transform their mission in their life, and they built the Daisy
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  Foundation, which is now in over 100 organizations across the world, certainly in in
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  a lot of them in the US, What what are those is their mission is to try to have an easy way for
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  organizations to collect patient stories family family member stories and peer stories about
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  who what amazing care looks like.
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  So in other words, they took up this place of being so grateful for the care of their son
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  that sadly they lost.
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  And they channel that into a life's work.
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  So they they they could have written the note, which would be, you know, check-in the box that
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  it was it's the task.
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  It could have had an impact and to maybe write the CEO and the board or write a positive
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  positive note to the newspaper.
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  They and they elevated it to purpose because that was the most authentic way that they could
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  acknowledge the light that the forever impact that those nurses and leaders had on them.
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  And now I've created this incredible opportunity for thousands of people in any
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  given you're gonna be recognized.
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  So what you're saying around the the the connection around alignment between personal
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  and and a work, you can't have alignment without it being driven from a place of impact
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  and purpose.
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  So, you know, I I invite people who are listening to this and thinking, how do I
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  instead of how do I become more authentic, How do I come become more aligned with what I
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  believe my greatest most important mark is going to be in my career as a leader?
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  And if that is to to bring the next generation of of of leaders into of of different, maybe
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  diverse groups, that haven't been well represented, that's great.
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  For maybe for you, it's to increase quality standards for somebody else's creative learning
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  organization, whatever that is.
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  It is just it is just 1% better every day to end up having the most authentic version of
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  your of your purpose.
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  And one of the side benefits of that is it gets you out of the I'm too busy, disempowering
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  cycle that is sometimes leaders mental and and also tactical reality every day is how do you
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  make time for the most important things that authentic important impact in your life you
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  make the things that are most important you make happen.
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  So that's that's I mean, we could talk about this for hours I'm wondering if that has been
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  your experience as well.
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  Absolutely.
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  And I I, you know, in my book, I talk a lot about why did you become a leader to begin
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  with?
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  So what is your backstory?
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  You know, and I often think of my own, and it was because I grew up in a family of 6.
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  There was so many of us.
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  And, you know, at times in the school, I would get my voice would get lost.
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  So I wanted to ensure that, you know, in kind of doing the kind of work that I the path that
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  I took that everybody, that I would interface with with time would have a voice, right, and
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  look how it's evolved into what I do today.
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  And then in the latter part of the book, I talk a lot about what is your leadership legacy?
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  What legacy do you wanna leave behind And if you think about what you're saying about
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  meaning and purpose, is that does that not fit?
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  I might have an idea where I begin and like you said, you could, you know, you have all these
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  pressures as a leader, the tactical outcome driven things that you have to achieve, which
• 21:19
  we know as part of leadership, and but then how, you know, when you when it's value driven
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  and purpose driven to what is that imprint that I'm gonna leave behind then that really kind of
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  allows you to allot your time to kind of highest and best use of that time first with in
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  reference to what that that purpose is.
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  You know?
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  Love that.
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  Yeah.
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  Yeah.
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  And they're and that that's where only you can know.
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  Is, again, that other ingredient piece of authentic is that we can look to role models.
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  We can go to a conference and learn about practices and leading practices.
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  We can read books.
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  We can, talk to people that we really respect and get great council and, ultimately, you need
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  to decide what your legacy is and you need to decide.
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  And it can you don't have to decide today.
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  It's just it's that quest to understand And that's how we truly, you know, to your point
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  around leaving leave leading and leaving a legacy is that it's through our or everyday
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  experience, that little tiny imprint that we make that leaves.
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  And even if it gets like a tide coming in, it gets washed away for the day.
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  It was there for that period of time.
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  And all we have is this moment now.
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  If you win the lottery tomorrow and choose to retire or you You get another opportunity to
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  have even greater impact somewhere else.
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  Your your industry completely changes and and you're even just like today with remote work.
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  People are feeling a sense of greater, I'm hearing, greater sense of disconnection, and I
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  say, time to rebuild connection.
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  Maybe it existed before, and it just rewriting the story.
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  Perhaps it's it's wasn't it was an artificial sense of connection because you saw each other
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  and you thought that that was actual connection.
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  And and maybe lots of things in between.
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  The point is you can't do anything about the fact that some workplaces will never truly go
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  back to being face to face.
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  Some are going to be blended.
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  Some will be completely remote.
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  Whatever that is is is this is what now.
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  So what does your legacy look like now?
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  What is your purpose look like now?
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  Because the opposite of authentic is complaining about what what isn't present.
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  That's that's not solving it.
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  That's not finding out who you are.
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  That's not tapping into your resourcefulness.
• 23:40
  Whether it be your people that you reach out to, access information, access to resources,
• 23:46
  and and from like a tech or physical standpoint, So being in your own agent of your
• 23:54
  own design, designing your career, your life makes you more effective for everybody else,
• 24:00
  because it's an action.
• 24:02
  And even if you change course, that's okay.
• 24:05
  I mean, look at you and I have had many different careers in our time, and each time we
• 24:09
  hold we've left the one we left behind a little bit better off.
• 24:13
  We'd like to think that we did.
• 24:14
  I'm I'm I'm sure we did.
• 24:16
  And the point is it's all leading to now.
• 24:19
  And then it's it's something else.
• 24:20
  It's gonna lead to something else.
• 24:23
  If we don't recognize people along the way, hardwiring that impact is not hardwiring it
• 24:31
  into our our emotional DNA.
• 24:34
  Our the things we feel most dip deeply, I know you know this so well is as the type of expert
• 24:40
  that you are, in the psychosocial well-being realm of things, whether providing therapy or
• 24:46
  coaching and so forth, The things that we feel most deeply, we remember the most.
• 24:51
  Mhmm.
• 24:52
  So on your journey to have authentic purpose and contribute meaning recognize value support
• 24:59
  people along the way no matter what your core purpose is because you will leave a deeper
• 25:03
  imprint on them They will be more likely to be a part indoctrinated into your mission and your
• 25:09
  purpose, which makes your purpose faster, deeper, more meaningful in the end.
• 25:14
  So never underestimate the power of recognizing as part of your quest to fulfill the most
• 25:22
  important aspects, that is after they've read your book and and have clarified what that core
• 25:27
  purpose is.
• 25:30
  Masera, this has been amazing as usual.
• 25:32
  Thank you so much for, your time.
• 25:35
  Now now you said you were, you're gonna have a new addition of your book.
• 25:39
  If there are people that are, wanting to, get some of your other books or get, on a list or
• 25:46
  reaching out to you to consult, Where can they reach you?
• 25:49
  Greatness magnify.com.
• 25:51
  Yep.
• 25:52
  They and I'm on all forms of social media, including TikTok, much to my children's
• 25:56
  chagrin, So Sarah McVannell, m c v a n e l.
• 26:00
  So,
• 26:02
  I love her TikToks, by the way.
• 26:03
  I watch them all the time.
• 26:04
  I'm like, oh, no.
• 26:06
  This is a new one.
• 26:07
  She makes me giggle.
• 26:08
  So check those out because I checked them out, and I'm often giggling.
• 26:11
  I'm like, oh, that was a nice one.
• 26:13
  So again, for everybody, thanks so much for tuning in.
• 26:17
  It's a pleasure.
• 26:19
  I think I can say that without a doubt, it's always, an honor spending time with Sarah.
• 26:24
  Authenticity lends into, space that you need to be where you listen at a deep, profound level,
• 26:31
  to that legacy that you just imprint on the world.
• 26:35
  So spend time and awareness Get connected to who you are as a leader and put it out into the
• 26:41
  universe and see what comes back at you.
• 26:43
  So for everyone, if you're wanting to consult with me about authentic part leadership and
• 26:48
  your teams reach out to me.
• 26:50
  And we can have a chat.
• 26:51
  They all you gotta remember is chat with Roxanne, and we'll jump on a Coke.
• 26:55
  Thanks for tuning in to authentic living with Roxanne, creating the space for positive,
• 27:01
  healthy change.
• 27:02
  Roxanne is a keynote speaker psychotherapist, and coach to work with Roxanne, visit
• 27:08
  rocksandurhaj.com/blueprint.
• 27:12
  We'll see you next time.
• 27:14
  Unauthentic living with Roxanne.