Latest / The Overland Journal Podcast / Interview with Maggie McDermut, Land Cruiser owner and adventurer

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Interview with Maggie McDermut, Land Cruiser owner and adventurer · The Overland Journal Podcast

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to the Overland Journal podcast. I'm your host,
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: Scott Brady, and for this episode, my co host Matt
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: Scott is not with me because we are deep into
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: the outback of the Colorado Plateau. Now we're not going
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: to talk about exactly where we were because I've been
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: sworn to secrecy. So our guest for today is a
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: very special traveler and someone that has become very notable
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: within the industry, Maggie McDermott. She is very well traveled
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: as a solo traveler. She has been all the way
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: up through Alaska and through significant portions of the US
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: West in her EJ seventy four land Cruiser, and then
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: she has also traveled extensively in her Forerunner as well
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: nineteen ninety nine for Runner, and she was with us
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: for this particular outing in the desert, and we talk
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: a lot about her time with seven P International, and
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: we also talk about her experience traveling solo. And I
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: think that you'll enjoy my conversation with Maggie McDermott. We're
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: going to take a brief break and we will be
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: right back. This week's episode is supported in part by
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: Icamper to make innovative hardshell and soft sided roof tents
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: that are designed to survive long term overland use. Their
• 1:15
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• 1:19
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• 1:23
  Speaker 1: fitment of crossbars for carrying bikes and kayaks. Their Skycamp
• 1:28
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• 1:31
  Speaker 1: tent in the footprint of a much smaller clamshell model.
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: This is the perfect solution for smaller vehicles or on
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: vehicles where rackspace is dedicated to other systems. I Camper
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: believes that the best times are those spent traveling discovering
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: the world with those you love most. You can find
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: out more about their quality tents at icamper dot com. Maggie,
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: thank you so much for being on the podcast today.
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: We are in an undisclosed location according to mister Xavier,
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: so we've been out with a great group of folks
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: traveling in the back country, testing some product, grabbing some
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: content along the way, and I also thought this would
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: be a great opportunity for us to sit down and
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: have a podcast because you've lived a very interesting life
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: and you have some very cool vehicles, and you're well traveled,
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: and you've also worked a lot with seven P International,
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: So I think that there's a lot of great lessons
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: that we can talk about that you've learned in your
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: own journeys on this podcast. So thanks for being with us.
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: Oh, thank you for having me. I'm so excited to
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: be here.
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: Well, I think it would be fun to talk maybe
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: first about your first overland vehicle that you purchased, and
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: if it's different from the one that I know of,
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: then you should tell the whole story.
• 2:42
  Speaker 3: So I have a nineteen eighty six BJ seventy land
• 2:46
  Speaker 3: Cruiser that's imported from Japan, and it's not just my
• 2:49
  Speaker 3: first overland vehicle, that's the first vehicle I ever purchased.
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: Nice.
• 2:54
  Speaker 3: I kind of fell into land cruisers, honestly. By I
• 2:57
  Speaker 3: saw craigslisad for an FJ forty, probably six years before
• 3:01
  Speaker 3: I bought my car, and I just became obsessed and
• 3:05
  Speaker 3: I had to have a land cruiser, so I started
• 3:07
  Speaker 3: researching them, and the rabbit hole just kept getting deeper
• 3:11
  Speaker 3: and deeper and deeper, and that's when I saw the
• 3:13
  Speaker 3: import market and ended up deciding to buy one from
• 3:17
  Speaker 3: land Cruisers direct, and it's just been such an incredible
• 3:21
  Speaker 3: ride since.
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: Were What were some of the things about the BJ
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: seventy that really drew you to that vehicle?
• 3:29
  Speaker 3: Specifically, I wanted a diesel and that's what brought me
• 3:32
  Speaker 3: into the import market for Toyota's because they never sold
• 3:35
  Speaker 3: one in the US.
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: They sold diesel in.
• 3:39
  Speaker 3: The Canadian market for two years, but the JDM or
• 3:43
  Speaker 3: Japanese domestic market, imports have a tendency to be a
• 3:46
  Speaker 3: little bit cleaner and lower mileage. So that's kind of
• 3:49
  Speaker 3: how I fell upon land Cruiser's direct And it wasn't
• 3:53
  Speaker 3: like I was seeking out a seventy series.
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: I just wanted a diesel.
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and wanted diesel land Cruiser, Yeah, yeah.
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: No, the land Cruiser was like I was getting a
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: land Cruiser.
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: And what was it about the land Cruiser for you?
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: What was the draw to buy a land Cruiser for
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: your first car?
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: So I grew up horseback riding. I stole horseback ride.
• 4:13
  Speaker 3: I'm a bit avid hiker, so I've always been kind
• 4:16
  Speaker 3: of out and about in the back country, and I
• 4:19
  Speaker 3: wanted to have a vehicle that kind of aligned with that,
• 4:22
  Speaker 3: which is why I started looking up and researching four
• 4:25
  Speaker 3: by fours, and then I saw land Cruisers and like, well,
• 4:29
  Speaker 3: that's an intriguing vehicle, and as researching them more, the
• 4:33
  Speaker 3: longevity of them.
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: As well was a really really big draw.
• 4:36
  Speaker 3: I think I called Steve on my twenty second birthday
• 4:39
  Speaker 3: to commit to buying my vehicle.
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: So cool.
• 4:42
  Speaker 3: So I being twenty one, I was like, well, I
• 4:44
  Speaker 3: want a car that's gonna last a really long time. Sure,
• 4:47
  Speaker 3: So I bought a vehicle that had an engine that's
• 4:50
  Speaker 3: kind of known colloquially as a million mile engine.
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: That's why I have Beastie, the P seventy.
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: And it seems like you've named several of your vehicles,
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: so you have you have another veh that's actually out
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: with us today.
• 5:02
  Speaker 3: I do.
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: So I moved to Colorado.
• 5:04
  Speaker 3: Oh gosh, three years after I bought Beastie, and the
• 5:08
  Speaker 3: whole the hard cold morning starts, I just felt bad.
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: And maybe the salt on the roads.
• 5:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I just wanted to keep some of those harder
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: miles and harder starts off of just my old car.
• 5:18
  Speaker 3: And I ended up finding a I wasn't really looking
• 5:22
  Speaker 3: for a car, but I saw this kind of the
• 5:24
  Speaker 3: unicorn of forerunners. I bought a nineteen ninety nine Toyota
• 5:28
  Speaker 3: four Runners, so staying in the Toyota family.
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: But it's called the Highlander Edition.
• 5:33
  Speaker 3: There's not a lot out there about it, but it
• 5:35
  Speaker 3: has the stock of your locker, it's a manual, and
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: it has a sun roof, and that has become more
• 5:42
  Speaker 3: or less my winter car, my quick weekend trip car because.
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: It goes above fifty five miles an hour.
• 5:48
  Speaker 3: And his name is Frank the Forerunner, so I stuck
• 5:52
  Speaker 3: with the alliteration on that one. Definitely a fun car
• 5:54
  Speaker 3: to I think Frank has helped my confidence off road
• 5:58
  Speaker 3: because I'm not worried about hurting it as much because
• 6:01
  Speaker 3: parts aren't easier to find. Sure that's helped my learning
• 6:04
  Speaker 3: and driving ability off road because I'm not so cautious
• 6:07
  Speaker 3: all the time.
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: That's a very rare vehicle to have. It's the last
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: year of the manual transmission four Runner and it still
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: has the three point four Leader, which is a great engine,
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: a lot of longevity in it. And then to have
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: the rear locker all in conjunction and it looks like
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: you've you've only modified it lightly.
• 6:25
  Speaker 3: Yeah, So I threw an airb front bumper on it,
• 6:28
  Speaker 3: and that was that only happened because poor Frank was
• 6:32
  Speaker 3: hit by a bus when he was parked one day.
• 6:34
  Speaker 3: I used the insurance money and putting an RB on it.
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: I do have a little build out in the back,
• 6:39
  Speaker 3: which you know, obviously I wanted because I want to
• 6:41
  Speaker 3: be able to camp out of both my vehicles, and
• 6:43
  Speaker 3: then a roof rack to throw my skis up there,
• 6:46
  Speaker 3: and occasionally a bike and maybe some extra fuel if
• 6:48
  Speaker 3: I'm really feeling like I'm going to be out for
• 6:50
  Speaker 3: a long weekend. But it's I haven't really done anything
• 6:53
  Speaker 3: major to either of my vehicles, And.
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: It looks like you have the Forerunner mostly configured for
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: you to be able to sleep in the back of it. Correct, Yeah,
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: and why do you go for that decision?
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: Kind of that's safety. I do travel by myself pretty
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: much all the time, and as a solo female traveler,
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: just the safety aspect is a big part of it.
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: I want to be able to lock my doors.
• 7:15
  Speaker 3: I don't leave anything outside at a campsite most times,
• 7:18
  Speaker 3: so if I need to, I can just hop in
• 7:19
  Speaker 3: that front seat and get out of a situation. If
• 7:21
  Speaker 3: I feel uncomfortable, if I feel like, you know, somebody's
• 7:24
  Speaker 3: invading my area and I do that with both my vehicles.
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: Well, so you sleep in the seventy series as well.
• 7:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah, she's a little small, but I fit, and I
• 7:33
  Speaker 3: fit biagonally.
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: I've made it work.
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: It's also such a great way to camp. We had
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: the land cruisers set up that way and to be
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: able to not have to set anything up. There's no
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: roof tent to deploy, there's no ground tent to mess
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: with the poles or have the thin nylon rip or whatever.
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: You just Yeah, you have all the sound deadening and
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: the quietness of a vehicle, and they are more secure
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: for sure. I think at the times that I've slept
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: in gas station parking lots and developing countries, it's kind
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: of nice to know that you're locked in a little bit.
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: So yeah, that's definitely an upside for sure. Now, as
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: I remember, you took your seventy series and you did
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: a pretty big trip with that.
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: What was that so back in gosh, it feels like
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: a long time ago now.
• 8:16
  Speaker 3: In twenty eighteen, in the summer, I did a three
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: month trip with bast and drove to Alaska and Northwest
• 8:23
  Speaker 3: Canada and did that by myself with my dog, so
• 8:27
  Speaker 3: I did have some company, although she's not much for conversation,
• 8:31
  Speaker 3: but that definitely I just was very fertrinate. And I
• 8:34
  Speaker 3: was actually awarded the Change Your World Fund grant one
• 8:38
  Speaker 3: of the recipients that year, which helps fund the trip
• 8:40
  Speaker 3: and was a big factor to be able to take
• 8:43
  Speaker 3: three months off and explore. I pretty much drove all
• 8:46
  Speaker 3: the drivable roads in Alaska. So I did the Dalton Highway,
• 8:50
  Speaker 3: just beautiful scenery, seeing the tundra and actually getting to
• 8:53
  Speaker 3: the Arctic Ocean, and then the CANi Peninsula and Homer.
• 8:57
  Speaker 3: I just I love Alaska. Incredible, right, I'm maybe even
• 9:01
  Speaker 3: more obsessed with the Yukon. I spent a lot of
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: time driving around the Yukon as well, and also drove
• 9:06
  Speaker 3: the Dumpster Highway the first year that it was fully
• 9:08
  Speaker 3: open from Nuvik.
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: To tech Tia Actech. So that last section that they
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: just added.
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: The Summer Road.
• 9:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, so I drove that as well. Again, just
• 9:17
  Speaker 3: an incredible experience to have. The Yukon took my heart,
• 9:21
  Speaker 3: I saw. I spent a lot of time, as I said,
• 9:25
  Speaker 3: in the Yukon and did the North Canal Road, which
• 9:28
  Speaker 3: is fairly remote. You need a lot of range for it,
• 9:31
  Speaker 3: and I again did that by myself.
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: And did you make it to the Twitya River.
• 9:36
  Speaker 3: Or I did not hit the river more because I
• 9:39
  Speaker 3: was by myself and it was a really remote road,
• 9:42
  Speaker 3: so as I kept a really good eye on my
• 9:44
  Speaker 3: range and I had extra fuel with me, but I
• 9:46
  Speaker 3: needed to remember I had about two hundred miles to
• 9:48
  Speaker 3: drive back, so that was part of the consideration of
• 9:51
  Speaker 3: the turnaround point. Made it past the crossover into the
• 9:54
  Speaker 3: Northwest territories, but couldn't go as far as I wanted.
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's an elusive goal for many people. It's one
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: of the last remaining overland prizes in North America is
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: to complete the canol I.
• 10:08
  Speaker 3: I've talked to a lot of people about it and
• 10:10
  Speaker 3: wanting to do it, and that's.
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: Going to be the hard one.
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: It is. There's a lot of logistics to it, for sure.
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: It's good that those kinds of problems still exist people
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: can aspire to and learn and research, and I want.
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: That problem to always excist.
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: Now, what were some of the things that you learned
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: about either your kit or your vehicle setup or even
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: you on that journey. Usually you come away with some
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: pretty noticeable takeaways.
• 10:37
  Speaker 3: Honestly, I didn't really come away feeling like I wanted
• 10:41
  Speaker 3: to change my setup that much. But that also has
• 10:44
  Speaker 3: a lot to do with the fact that I spent
• 10:46
  Speaker 3: years in my car, camping, traveling, doing month long trips
• 10:51
  Speaker 3: that sort of stuff, with just boxes of gear, so
• 10:54
  Speaker 3: I could move my stuff around, and I really got
• 10:56
  Speaker 3: to know how I wanted to utilize the space within
• 10:59
  Speaker 3: the vehicle, so I didn't jump in to my vehicle
• 11:02
  Speaker 3: ownership and just you know, build it out right away.
• 11:04
  Speaker 3: I don't even think I would have built it out
• 11:07
  Speaker 3: if I didn't do the Alaska trip, but I definitely
• 11:09
  Speaker 3: needed some more organization for such a long trip. Personally,
• 11:13
  Speaker 3: I really felt like a kind of this is going
• 11:16
  Speaker 3: to sound odd, but a creative wakening. I feel like
• 11:18
  Speaker 3: I had set down my camera. I have a background
• 11:21
  Speaker 3: in photography, and I feel like I just got tired
• 11:24
  Speaker 3: of always seeing life through a camera in a lot
• 11:27
  Speaker 3: of ways. Obviously, with a trip like that, you're going
• 11:30
  Speaker 3: through such amazing landscapes, and I gave myself the time
• 11:33
  Speaker 3: that I felt like I wasn't going to be in
• 11:34
  Speaker 3: a rush, so I took the time to really kind
• 11:37
  Speaker 3: of get in touch with my camera again and that
• 11:40
  Speaker 3: hasn't really stopped. I've continued to photograph landscapes that I
• 11:44
  Speaker 3: go through.
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: It's I started writing a lot more. I have a.
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: Tendency to kind of hang out by myself a lot,
• 11:50
  Speaker 3: So it wasn't necessarily like it gave me the time
• 11:53
  Speaker 3: to be by myself. It more gave me kind of
• 11:57
  Speaker 3: the separation from home, life, family, friends, whatever, so I
• 12:01
  Speaker 3: could just be with myself and my own thoughts and
• 12:04
  Speaker 3: write them down. And I feel like that was kind
• 12:06
  Speaker 3: of the most important and I on like an even
• 12:09
  Speaker 3: more personal level, like was kind of going through a
• 12:12
  Speaker 3: really hard breakup and that trip made me get.
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: Over that breakup in a lot of ways.
• 12:17
  Speaker 3: Yeah, right, which I have always I always retreat into
• 12:23
  Speaker 3: the back country or I spent a lot of time
• 12:25
  Speaker 3: in Utah whenever I feel like uneasy about something or
• 12:29
  Speaker 3: I feel like I need to work through something. And
• 12:30
  Speaker 3: it's not necessarily the active like thinking and always on
• 12:34
  Speaker 3: the forefront of my mind processing, but just kind of
• 12:36
  Speaker 3: the space and the distance to just be. And that
• 12:40
  Speaker 3: was a lot of kind of that personal growth for
• 12:43
  Speaker 3: the Alaska trip was just being myself again.
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: It's amazing how much we grow when we are alone
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: with our own thoughts that those moments of stillness, and
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: for some people it's meditation. For other people it's a
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: hike alone in the outdoors, maybe a long drive, long
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: drive in a car. Three month driving a car, Yeah,
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: helps you sort a lot of things out. Yeah. I've
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: definitely had some pretty significant life changes alone in a
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: helmet on a motorcycle. Yeah for sure. Now, what were
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: some of the things that you liked most about your setup,
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: like what worked great for you, the things that you
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: would recommend to others to consider for their own Alaskan journey.
• 13:21
  Speaker 3: Honestly, the biggest upgrade is just having a fridge. It
• 13:24
  Speaker 3: seems simple and straightforward, but I didn't get one until
• 13:27
  Speaker 3: that trip, and it's like, wow.
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: I don't have to get ice all the time.
• 13:31
  Speaker 3: This is amazing, and that you really don't have to
• 13:34
  Speaker 3: do much to have a capable vehicle like or real drive.
• 13:37
  Speaker 2: Replace them with nonstock tires.
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: So what kind of tires did you put on your line?
• 13:42
  Speaker 3: I have the Toyot Open Countries on BST. Very satisfied
• 13:47
  Speaker 3: with those tires.
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and they survived the whole trip well, no flats
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: and everything.
• 13:52
  Speaker 3: Everybody says that you're gonna get a flat on the
• 13:53
  Speaker 3: Dalton or the dumpster.
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: I got none.
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: That's great, that's great. Yeah, it's interesting. You're right. The
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: even a stock land Cruiser with some good tires and
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: you just go pretty much anywhere in the world. And
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: that is something we talk about regularly on the podcast
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: is unfortunately there is this regular messaging that we get
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: on Instagram or whatever that the person that's doing all
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: this traveling has this highly modified vehicle, and the reality
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: is is that you just don't need them to be
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: modified much at all. And that's another great example of
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: you went and did everything you wanted to do and
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: probably remote camped a lot and a lot of unknown
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: roads and it did everything you asked it too.
• 14:33
  Speaker 3: Yeah, my family is not into off roading or four
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: wheel driving. We road tripped and we hiked and we
• 14:40
  Speaker 3: did get outside. But I kind of jumped into this
• 14:43
  Speaker 3: completely had first and for probably like two years, I
• 14:48
  Speaker 3: didn't even replace the tires on BST and the stuff
• 14:51
  Speaker 3: that I got my car through. I'm still astounded, like
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: slick utah mud, like that little car just made it
• 14:59
  Speaker 3: straight through. I hadn't done anything to it. Maybe change
• 15:02
  Speaker 3: the oil once or twice.
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, sure, And.
• 15:04
  Speaker 3: As I started to use it a lot more. I
• 15:06
  Speaker 3: needed some more maintenance, but it really doesn't take much.
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: What a great reminder, right, it's less.
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: Stuff to worry about breaking down the road.
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: Now, what was the organization that you went up there
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: for or with? I guess in conjunction with.
• 15:19
  Speaker 3: So the grant was the Change Your World Fund Grant,
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: which is by Concert Ventures, who was founded by Jonathan
• 15:26
  Speaker 3: Roseann Hansen, who also founded Overland Expo, and it was kind.
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: Of their way to give back.
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: And the whole fund was in honor of a young man, Alistair,
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: who volunteered who's actually from Australia, and he passed away
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: in twenty fourteen and from a traffic accident on his
• 15:44
  Speaker 3: around the world motorcycle trip. So the Hansons joined with
• 15:48
  Speaker 3: Alistair's parents and created this fund. You have to be
• 15:52
  Speaker 3: a millennial or under thirty to be able to apply,
• 15:56
  Speaker 3: because the whole idea was get the younger generation, young
• 15:59
  Speaker 3: adults out there exploring, seeing our environment, interacting with our environment,
• 16:05
  Speaker 3: and being kind of that next generation of Stewards. So
• 16:08
  Speaker 3: that's how I got involved with that, and still very
• 16:11
  Speaker 3: thankful for that opportunity.
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: But an amazing opportunity and How did the interaction with
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: the Hansens and with that organization, how did that help
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: you plan for the trip? Were they able to provide
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: additional assistance around logistics and things like that as well.
• 16:26
  Speaker 3: So there's three of us that were awarded the grant
• 16:29
  Speaker 3: that year, and we all had access to quite a
• 16:33
  Speaker 3: few instructors and teachers that we could call up and
• 16:36
  Speaker 3: be like, Hey, I have this question about this travel
• 16:39
  Speaker 3: plan or whatever our concern was. And then Jonathan and
• 16:42
  Speaker 3: Rosanne themselves made they were so available to us for
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: questions and help, and they also part of the program
• 16:50
  Speaker 3: as well. As you go to overl An Expo and
• 16:53
  Speaker 3: you have to take certain classes to kind of get
• 16:55
  Speaker 3: a underground standing about navigation and general medical care and logistics.
• 17:01
  Speaker 3: So that was part of it too, was getting to
• 17:03
  Speaker 3: go to Oberlin Expo and having our way paid there
• 17:07
  Speaker 3: as well and get that instruction from the various teachers
• 17:11
  Speaker 3: that are at Expo.
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: So many people have benefited so greatly from all those
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: courses and classes. If anything, it just gives that beginning
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: of confidence that those instructors provide because they're so they're
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: so skilled in doing that for sure.
• 17:25
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Expo Actually, well besides the grant definitely helped my
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: learning as well. Like I just kind of putted around
• 17:33
  Speaker 3: on my own for almost two years, and then I
• 17:35
  Speaker 3: had heard about Overlin Expo, and I was like, I
• 17:38
  Speaker 3: should probably go to that. Yeah, And I did, and
• 17:41
  Speaker 3: I kept going back and kept going back, and I
• 17:43
  Speaker 3: learned so much information and I went to you know,
• 17:45
  Speaker 3: I did the driving driving instruction classes and it kind
• 17:48
  Speaker 3: of got to the point that the director of the training,
• 17:52
  Speaker 3: Graham Jackson, reached out and he's like, do you want
• 17:55
  Speaker 3: to teach some classes? We would love to have some
• 17:57
  Speaker 3: more female instructors. And I was like, yes, I want
• 17:59
  Speaker 3: to share this, Like I'm so passionate about getting out
• 18:02
  Speaker 3: and getting people in their environment, and because it's been
• 18:06
  Speaker 3: kind of my one of my pieces of therapy. So
• 18:09
  Speaker 3: I love being able to teach and get other people
• 18:14
  Speaker 3: inspired to get out and connect with our environment, get
• 18:17
  Speaker 3: out of the concrete jungles that a lot of us
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: live in. So it's just been it's been so rewarding
• 18:22
  Speaker 3: in that sense as well. There's so much information to
• 18:25
  Speaker 3: learn and there's so much information that we can all share,
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: and I really like that sharing aspect because thus overliners
• 18:30
  Speaker 3: have a tendency to hang out by ourselves. So that's
• 18:33
  Speaker 3: I really appreciate that event and all the overland events.
• 18:36
  Speaker 3: There's so many now to be able to share with
• 18:38
  Speaker 3: the community and interact with the community.
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: And is that how you started to work with seven
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: P was through that?
• 18:43
  Speaker 3: Yeah, some of the classes that Graham brought me in
• 18:46
  Speaker 3: on were under the seven P name, and it's kind
• 18:49
  Speaker 3: of again, I just kept going down the rabbit hole
• 18:52
  Speaker 3: to the point that now I'm part of the driver
• 18:55
  Speaker 3: training team with seven P at Oberlin expot But then
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: also seven P does training out side of over and
• 19:01
  Speaker 3: Expo and I help with that do a lot of
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: marketing for them as well. Just an amazing group of
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: guys that kind of brought me under their wing in
• 19:08
  Speaker 3: a lot of ways, and amount of knowledge in that
• 19:10
  Speaker 3: group alone is suppressing.
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: And it's one of the reasons why we regularly recommended
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: seven P on this podcast is because, well it makes
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: a lot of sense to Matt and me because you're
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: talking about a group of many instructors. I think it
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: is not going to be as advantageous for a student
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: to go to a full drive training course with a
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: single instructor or just that sole proprietor that does a training.
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: It doesn't mean that that's bad for basic fo old
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: drive stuff. I think it's fine. But if your goal
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: is to travel around the world, or your goal is
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: to gain a deeper understanding where you go from the
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: one oh one course to the two to oh one
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: or the three to oho one or the four to
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: oh one, is that you have to engage with a
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: much larger group of trainers. Because if you look at
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: seven P for example, you have Nick who's got a
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: lot of experience in the north of Africa. You have
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: Graham who's crossed all of Africa and he's much more
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: technical minded and he's got those great skill sets. And
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: you've got all of these different instructors that have time
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: in different environments around the world. And it's that accumulation
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: of knowledge that is like a multiplier. I think of
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: the skills that they can teach in their courses. Whereas
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: it's a challenging thing for a solo instructor to actually
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: be able to impart much recent and relevant knowledge because
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: they probably have to work all the time, they're probably
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: not out traveling that much, and so as a result,
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: you get a very narrow window into the profession. So
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: I do like the fact and another one that's good
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: too is Overland Experts. They are in the Northeast and
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: again a large pool of instructors that help to each
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: other grow and learn. So I do think that seven
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: P is such a great organization, so.
• 20:49
  Speaker 3: They I can't sing their praises enough. I've also having
• 20:53
  Speaker 3: attended a lot of different classes from different instructors at Expo.
• 20:57
  Speaker 3: One of the thing that I also really appreciate about
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: seven P is I've never felt like I don't fit in,
• 21:03
  Speaker 3: and I feel like sometimes being a woman in a
• 21:06
  Speaker 3: very male dominated community and industry, it's hard. Sometimes you
• 21:11
  Speaker 3: don't always get the same instruction, you don't always get
• 21:14
  Speaker 3: the same respect in a lot of ways, which is
• 21:16
  Speaker 3: why I've also so appreciated the fact that they really
• 21:19
  Speaker 3: want female instructors because it's not just guys out there,
• 21:23
  Speaker 3: and it should just be guys.
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: Out there, so let's hope not like.
• 21:26
  Speaker 3: I've never felt like they have talked to me differently
• 21:29
  Speaker 3: or have instructed me differently because I'm a woman. I've
• 21:33
  Speaker 3: never had that experience with them, which is so important
• 21:36
  Speaker 3: to me, and that's why I want to say it,
• 21:38
  Speaker 3: because that's really made a difference it's.
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: A show of respect for sure. Absolutely if we want
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: to continue to diversify the industry, which I believe is
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: one of our greatest challenges right now, is making sure
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: that we do that. We want young families, and we
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: want females, and we want minorities properly represented in the space,
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: because otherwise it gets pretty boring if it's the same
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: kind of person doing all of the things. We need
• 22:04
  Speaker 1: to make sure we have that uniqueness and that diversity.
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: I believe within our ranks. I think that that's really important.
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: So that's great to hear that seven P has done
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: that properly. If you were to give a couple pieces
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: of advice for someone who is wanting to get driver training,
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: and maybe a couple of those little hacks or skills
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: that you teach in your courses that you could share
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: on this podcast.
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: It's okay to turn around.
• 22:28
  Speaker 3: I feel like when I first got into it, one
• 22:30
  Speaker 3: of the biggest things I had to remind myself of
• 22:33
  Speaker 3: was it is okay to turn around. Yeah, and just
• 22:37
  Speaker 3: always knowing that, you know what, if I can make
• 22:39
  Speaker 3: a thousand point turn, I can get myself out of
• 22:41
  Speaker 3: a situation if I need to, like that helped me
• 22:44
  Speaker 3: get onto some of these roads, and I was like, well,
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: I'm not really sure where that goes, but I really
• 22:49
  Speaker 3: want to see where that goes. It got me out there,
• 22:51
  Speaker 3: It got me on dirt. It got me exploring and
• 22:54
  Speaker 3: just knowing that, you know what, if something just isn't
• 22:57
  Speaker 3: in my skill set, that's fine, I can always turn around.
• 23:01
  Speaker 3: And then the more time you spend getting out there,
• 23:04
  Speaker 3: be prepared, have all your safety equipment, have a med kit.
• 23:07
  Speaker 3: I first got Max tracks because usually I traveled by myself,
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: so I wanted recovery equipment that I can use by myself.
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: So I had that with me just in case.
• 23:18
  Speaker 3: The more time I spent on dirt, the more I
• 23:20
  Speaker 3: understood how my vehicle moved over trails or moved over obstacles.
• 23:25
  Speaker 3: And then kind of the next step for me was
• 23:27
  Speaker 3: actually just going to Overlin Expo. The ticket price can
• 23:30
  Speaker 3: be a little expensive, but it definitely was for me.
• 23:32
  Speaker 3: At the time, I was a student and wasn't I
• 23:34
  Speaker 3: didn't have a full time job, but I made it
• 23:36
  Speaker 3: happen because I knew that that was going to be
• 23:38
  Speaker 3: such a great resource for me. So I spent a
• 23:41
  Speaker 3: lot of time on driving dirt roads. But then when
• 23:44
  Speaker 3: I was able to, I did go and I wanted
• 23:46
  Speaker 3: to get instruction. And I've learned so much And you
• 23:50
  Speaker 3: can learn so much just from those one two hour classes,
• 23:54
  Speaker 3: no doubt, but a lot of it's just trial and
• 23:56
  Speaker 3: errororn a lot of ways and over preparedness.
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: I think some things that you have learned from that group,
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: What are some of those aha moments that you had
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: with Nick or Graham or any of those other instructors
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: that you just really took away as being powerful.
• 24:11
  Speaker 2: There's so many.
• 24:13
  Speaker 3: Having a really short wheel based vehicle that's fairly tall,
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: it feels really tippy, and I have always I hate
• 24:23
  Speaker 3: off camber driving and that was always a really hard
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: thing for me to kind of push through. And it
• 24:28
  Speaker 3: was Graham kind of like early on when I wasn't
• 24:31
  Speaker 3: like teaching with them yet.
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: But it was at an expo.
• 24:35
  Speaker 3: That I was there early helping set up and then
• 24:38
  Speaker 3: I helped break down and there was an obstacle. It
• 24:41
  Speaker 3: was an off camber obstacle in the driving course, and
• 24:44
  Speaker 3: Graham knew I had this like extreme fear of just
• 24:46
  Speaker 3: like flopping my car, so he ended up he actually
• 24:50
  Speaker 3: got tim Huber, I know.
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: Taking Kelsey amazing.
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: Kelsey actually used to work for us.
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: Yes, I just remember that.
• 24:56
  Speaker 3: So Tim Hopton and Graham guided him into this position
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: so I could see how tilted beast you could get
• 25:05
  Speaker 3: and have it still be okay. Yeah, And that was
• 25:08
  Speaker 3: one of those like I couldn't. I wouldn't have gotten
• 25:11
  Speaker 3: myself into a position that was that off camber to
• 25:15
  Speaker 3: then learn, oh, like that's okay. Obviously each vehicle is
• 25:19
  Speaker 3: going to be different when it comes to that, but
• 25:21
  Speaker 3: that was kind of a big thing for me just
• 25:23
  Speaker 3: to be like, you know what, some pucker in your
• 25:26
  Speaker 3: seat is okay.
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: You will survive. But that was.
• 25:29
  Speaker 3: Definitely like kind of a learning curve because then I
• 25:31
  Speaker 3: could get I felt better getting on harder trails and
• 25:34
  Speaker 3: getting on hider obstacles. That has obviously improved my driving
• 25:38
  Speaker 3: because I understand my vehicle more and also it's gotten
• 25:41
  Speaker 3: me or it's opened up more possibilities for the trails
• 25:44
  Speaker 3: that I can do or I feel like I can do.
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: I still know that there's a line and I don't
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: want to step over it because I like my car.
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: But that was definitely a big one.
• 25:54
  Speaker 3: And there's just always every time we're out there's all
• 25:57
  Speaker 3: these nuggets that the guys will just kind of spew
• 26:00
  Speaker 3: out and you're like, wow, I never thought about it
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: that way. Sure, Dunk and Barber, if you know, Donk
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: amazing incredible person, just so hilarious but so smart. He
• 26:10
  Speaker 3: loves this hack of bringing sand unfilled sand bags along
• 26:14
  Speaker 3: and using them as attraction device. If you're stuck in sand,
• 26:18
  Speaker 3: or you're stuck in a riverbed with small pebbles or something,
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: you can fill sandbags and then line that up in
• 26:26
  Speaker 3: front of your vehicle or you know, behind if you're
• 26:29
  Speaker 3: trying to reverse out, and that can become attraction advice,
• 26:32
  Speaker 3: and then you just empty them out and they roll up.
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: To like that big clever.
• 26:37
  Speaker 3: That's a really great one. I always have sandbags in
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: my car. Now it's all that little stuff and now
• 26:41
  Speaker 3: I'm like, there's so much to think about. I can't
• 26:43
  Speaker 3: remember it all because I have it written down. Sure
• 26:46
  Speaker 3: it comes out when I'm using it.
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: But they all come together, even the stuff that we've
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: worked with over the last couple of days, like some
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: of the better deflation devices, yeah, the super siphon and
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: all of these little hacks and tools that we use
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: to make our trips a little bit better. It's great
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: to hear you talk about these experiences because I think
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: that our confidence is an accumulation of those experiences. So
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: if we can just put more and more of those
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: things together in a row or over a few years,
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: and surprisingly our confidence changes because we now have all
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: of Maybe it's like those sandbags, we've lined all of
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: those experiences up underneath to make the traveling easier.
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: Oh absolutely, I something as you know said it a
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: million times already. I travel by myself and that can
• 27:33
  Speaker 3: be a hindrance in a lot of ways for expanding
• 27:35
  Speaker 3: your knowledge. So that's something else that I've so appreciated
• 27:39
  Speaker 3: is being on trainings or being on trips with the
• 27:41
  Speaker 3: team and knowing like I trust those I trust those guys,
• 27:45
  Speaker 3: I know their skill sets, I understand their strengths, and
• 27:50
  Speaker 3: just having them spot me on something I know they're
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: not going to get me into a situation I don't
• 27:55
  Speaker 3: want to be in, so I can really trust them,
• 27:57
  Speaker 3: and getting that ability to get on harder obstacles and
• 28:01
  Speaker 3: just having the confidence that they're there and they're spotting
• 28:05
  Speaker 3: me and they know my vehicle's limitation and they know
• 28:08
  Speaker 3: my limitations. And that's really important too, because I feel
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: like sometimes that's hard where it's like, well, my vehicle
• 28:13
  Speaker 3: doesn't drive quite like a modern vehicle or whatever it is.
• 28:16
  Speaker 3: And all these guys like they have old Defenders. There's
• 28:20
  Speaker 3: old land Cruisers in the group. There's just all these
• 28:22
  Speaker 3: old vehicles and they've been doing it forever, so they
• 28:25
  Speaker 3: understand some of that as well, which has been really
• 28:28
  Speaker 3: really helpful.
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no doubt, there's something that's not only so charming
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: about those old vehicles, but I think very confidence inspiring
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: because it feels like that I'm driving an app in
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: most of these new cars, and there's so many electronic distractions,
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: and the cars so heavily relies on electronic aids to
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: accomplish its task that when you get into something so
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: analog like an old Defender. I mean the Defender that
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: I drive has no lockers and manual transmission, and it's
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: just it does have a centerferential lock, but no axle lockers.
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: It is very analog. But I don't have to worry
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: about like the LCD screen going out or the traction
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: control failing, and I think that that's actually a really
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: pleasant way to travel. I think about even our conversation
• 29:14
  Speaker 1: we had with Sinway this morning about the phones, and
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: he was he was looking at how do I get
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: a phone that only makes phone calls and receives texts?
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: No cam brick.
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so that way we have like less distraction in
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: our day. And maybe that's the case so often with vehicles,
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: but it's just going to get worse because now they're
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: going to be electric and they're going to be even
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: more of an app.
• 29:35
  Speaker 3: I'm just going to stick with my forty year olds
• 29:37
  Speaker 3: car for as long as possible.
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: It should last another forty years, right, I hope so sure?
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: And a special thanks to one of this week's sponsors,
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: Rumpel Blankets. Rumpel started literally in the back of a van.
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: Their story is interesting. They were on a surf and
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: ski trip through California and the founders of Rumpel were
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: sleeping in a van several miles up a dirt road
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: near a secret hot springs. It woke up the next
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: morning in sub zero temperatures in a car that wouldn't start.
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: They were outside of cell reception and confronted with the
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: real possibility of a long walk into town, so instead
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: they decided to bundle up in their sleeping bags and
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: drink whiskey while they waited for someone else to show up,
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: and that turned into hours, and the conversation extended on
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: to the subject of bedding and they came up with
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: Rumpel blankets. Their most popular product is the original Puffy blanket.
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: It is their flagship product and it's available in a person,
• 30:32
  Speaker 1: a two person, and a junior size. I have used
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: the two person for many years. I keep it as
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: part of my kit that lives in the vehicle just
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: in case I run into a situation similar to what
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: they did where I'm stranded and need some additional warmth
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: and insulation. It's also really useful for around the campfire
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: when you want that little bit of extra comfort. I'll
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: also use it when sleeping in the vehicle, and then
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: they are just the right size or a roof tent
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: as well. So these are really high quality blanket. It's
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: that are weather resistant, they're made from recycled materials, they're washable,
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: and they have very durable fabrics and construction, which makes
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: them ideal or overland travel. Check out Rumpel or your
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: next blanket. Now, I noticed that your recovery and camping
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: kit and all of your support equipment. It is very refined.
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: I can see that you spend a lot of time
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: with it. It all looks well used, very well organized too,
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: but not like pedantic or didn't seem ocd. It seemed
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: just like very accessible, well used. What are some of
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: the things that in that kit that you have that
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: you wouldn't live without in both of your vehicle part
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: of your permanent kit that you really have come to appreciate.
• 31:40
  Speaker 3: Definitely tools that you know, if you don't have the
• 31:43
  Speaker 3: tools and something goes wrong, you're out of luck. And
• 31:46
  Speaker 3: that's one of those like I don't want to need
• 31:48
  Speaker 3: it a lot, but what I have needed it, and
• 31:51
  Speaker 3: it's you know, it can be as small as my
• 31:54
  Speaker 3: back door stopped opening because it's full of dust and
• 31:57
  Speaker 3: the mechanism is jammed or whatever. I've had to undo
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: my whole backdoor opening mechanism. But if I didn't have
• 32:05
  Speaker 3: a screwdriver to do that, I couldn't have fixed that.
• 32:09
  Speaker 3: I we are just some of the things I've done, Oh,
• 32:12
  Speaker 3: toolkit and ratchet straps that have saved my butt. I
• 32:17
  Speaker 3: lost a tyrod end forty miles down of I guess
• 32:20
  Speaker 3: it's the forest service road equivalent in Canada. I don't
• 32:23
  Speaker 3: remember what they call them outside of Pemberton. And I
• 32:26
  Speaker 3: lost a tyrod end. It just completely failed. It failed,
• 32:30
  Speaker 3: so I had no steering and no service and I
• 32:32
  Speaker 3: was by myself and I fixed it with well, it
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: was a front rounder stretch it, so it was stretchy
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: and like the ratchet mechanism wasn't big enough that it
• 32:41
  Speaker 3: couldn't get tight enough.
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: So it was perfect, just.
• 32:44
  Speaker 3: Random thing that I had and that got me out
• 32:46
  Speaker 3: and got me probably.
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: Very slowly right like a kind of crawled along.
• 32:50
  Speaker 2: I probably like did twenty miles an hour.
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: So you so that I can visualize this, So where
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: the where the tyrod end goes into the knuckle of
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: the of the tire or was it the drag link
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: that comes from the steering.
• 33:04
  Speaker 3: Box draglink that comes so it was on the opposite
• 33:06
  Speaker 3: side and that one before it goes like the other
• 33:10
  Speaker 3: tyrod It failed at that point, okay, So like the
• 33:13
  Speaker 3: tyrod itself like is pretty much like that, and it
• 33:16
  Speaker 3: just went. And the mechanism that you can you can
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: tighten the tyrod, at least you can on mine, but
• 33:22
  Speaker 3: it was so rusted and corroded that I couldn't tighten
• 33:25
  Speaker 3: it back over.
• 33:26
  Speaker 2: The ball joint.
• 33:27
  Speaker 3: Sure, So that's why I had to like just ratchet
• 33:30
  Speaker 3: strap around it to.
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: Keep it together.
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: Stratch it save the day.
• 33:34
  Speaker 2: That was a little that's my proudest trail fix.
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: That's that's totally legit.
• 33:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, tools and I have a lot of now, I
• 33:43
  Speaker 3: have a lot of stratches with me and ratchets, and
• 33:47
  Speaker 3: I probably always carry more water than I need because
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: that's always another really important one.
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: You've got to have it, and with you doing as
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: much that country hiking and trekking that you do, you
• 33:57
  Speaker 1: probably need it for that to support those activities as well.
• 34:00
  Speaker 3: Medical kid's more important for that, which I have in
• 34:02
  Speaker 3: my car. I didn't know how much stuff you kind
• 34:05
  Speaker 3: of needed in the beginning, and I did alright, but
• 34:08
  Speaker 3: I've definitely learned it's nice to have a lot of
• 34:11
  Speaker 3: those things that you may not necessarily pull out all
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: the time, but you definitely want them.
• 34:15
  Speaker 1: Those essential pieces of kit, like having good communications, having
• 34:19
  Speaker 1: a good way to navigate it, which may just be
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: a map and a compass.
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: And paper maps.
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: One more thing on the tool role, because I think
• 34:28
  Speaker 3: it's just important. Tools don't do anything unless you have
• 34:31
  Speaker 3: the knowledge in terms of what to look for something's
• 34:33
  Speaker 3: going wrong. So that's something that I've also really been
• 34:36
  Speaker 3: very fortunate about. There's an amazing mechanic and I live
• 34:40
  Speaker 3: in Boulder, Colorado. There's an amazing mechanic that lives in the
• 34:43
  Speaker 3: Boulder area that's kind of like one of the most
• 34:45
  Speaker 3: sought after land cruiser mechanics.
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: And he kind of took me under his wing.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: And what's his name?
• 34:49
  Speaker 3: Robbie Attinson is people known by his mud handle, which
• 34:53
  Speaker 3: is powder Pig, but his company's Adventure off Road doesn't
• 34:56
  Speaker 3: have much of a web presence.
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: Though he hasn't been incredible.
• 35:00
  Speaker 3: I always would if I, you know, needed something fixed,
• 35:02
  Speaker 3: I call him up and I would plan that I
• 35:04
  Speaker 3: would leave the shop because I didn't want to like
• 35:06
  Speaker 3: invade his space or his time. But every time he
• 35:09
  Speaker 3: was like no, no, like I want to show you this,
• 35:11
  Speaker 3: so he would do the repair or whatever.
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: It was.
• 35:14
  Speaker 3: Like we did my water pump valve adjustment done knuckles
• 35:18
  Speaker 3: with Robbie. It was always he wanted to teach me
• 35:21
  Speaker 3: because he wanted to make sure that I, you know,
• 35:23
  Speaker 3: if I got into a sticky situation, I had some
• 35:26
  Speaker 3: idea like mechanically what was going on? So now I
• 35:30
  Speaker 3: can do a lot of stuff even at you know,
• 35:31
  Speaker 3: in my carpoard doing my own basic maintenance, or I
• 35:34
  Speaker 3: rebuilt my manual clutchbaster last year and I did that
• 35:38
  Speaker 3: by myself, with some nervous calls to my friends that
• 35:42
  Speaker 3: were like, am I doing this right?
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: That's been really important too.
• 35:45
  Speaker 3: And then that's also helped me understand what tools I
• 35:48
  Speaker 3: need in my toolkit. Because you have a land cruiser,
• 35:51
  Speaker 3: you need ten ten milimeters because they're all going.
• 35:53
  Speaker 2: To go missing.
• 35:55
  Speaker 1: That is so true.
• 35:56
  Speaker 3: But what my car needs isn't necessarily what somebody else's
• 35:59
  Speaker 3: car needs. So knowing the tools that you need to
• 36:02
  Speaker 3: your vehicle, I think is really important too.
• 36:04
  Speaker 2: So that was a good lesson for me.
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: When we were talking earlier today, you brought up several
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: guide books that you love, and one of the things
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: that we like to ask on the podcast is your
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: favorite books. Now, this can be fiction or nonfiction, and
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: it can be about adventure or not about adventure, but
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: maybe the books in your life that have been the
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: most having the greatest impression on you, or maybe the
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: books that you've gifted most often to other people. What
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: are some that come to mind for you?
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: Does it solitaire?
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that one has come up a lot.
• 36:36
  Speaker 3: I've heard Abby Honestly, his one of his lesser known books,
• 36:40
  Speaker 3: black Son is my favorite book, one of them, And
• 36:44
  Speaker 3: it's an odd you know, if somebody goes out and
• 36:45
  Speaker 3: reads black Son after this and you're like, why is
• 36:48
  Speaker 3: this her favorite book? That's just weird. But for some
• 36:51
  Speaker 3: there's just something about the story. It was the two
• 36:53
  Speaker 3: lead characters you can never quite figure out, and I
• 36:56
  Speaker 3: really liked that air of mystery because it was never solved.
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: I guess at least that's how I felt about it.
• 37:02
  Speaker 3: And then I'm actually almost done with one right now
• 37:05
  Speaker 3: that I'm like, this has been quite a story.
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: And it's a nonfiction.
• 37:09
  Speaker 3: It's a biography kind of called The Stranger in the Woods.
• 37:13
  Speaker 3: It's about a hermit that lived in the Main Woods
• 37:17
  Speaker 3: for twenty seven years and saw two people the entire time.
• 37:21
  Speaker 3: So kind of a little bit of an oddball, but
• 37:24
  Speaker 3: very endearing and just his whole Like the life story
• 37:27
  Speaker 3: of this man Chris Knight is just.
• 37:29
  Speaker 2: Fascinating to me.
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: Is it an autobiography?
• 37:31
  Speaker 2: That he did not write it? And it was kind
• 37:35
  Speaker 2: of odd.
• 37:36
  Speaker 3: Character He told this reporter that if anybody was going
• 37:40
  Speaker 3: to write a biography on him he could do it,
• 37:43
  Speaker 3: but then he ended up completely cutting this reporter out
• 37:45
  Speaker 3: of his life. And so the reporter was like, well,
• 37:48
  Speaker 3: he said, he wanted me to do his biography, So
• 37:50
  Speaker 3: I'm going to write his story because I think it's
• 37:52
  Speaker 3: a really interesting story.
• 37:53
  Speaker 2: Just general author, Well, I really.
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: Really enjoy having Marcus Aurelius's meditations around because that's you
• 38:01
  Speaker 3: don't have to actually like it's not a story. It's
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: just snippets and ideas. And I really appreciate that that
• 38:07
  Speaker 3: you can open it to any page and something on
• 38:10
  Speaker 3: that page is profound, but you don't have to get
• 38:12
  Speaker 3: stuck in a whole story.
• 38:13
  Speaker 2: So that's something too kind to think of the Emperor.
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: Of Rome, right, I mean, he's fascinating human being, and
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: how what he sacrificed for his people and even his
• 38:23
  Speaker 1: life in the end, you know, it's just amazing.
• 38:26
  Speaker 3: That's another important one. I read a lot of political
• 38:28
  Speaker 3: philosophy used to be a political science major, and I
• 38:31
  Speaker 3: really liked kind of the philosophy side of it and
• 38:34
  Speaker 3: policy analysis side of it.
• 38:36
  Speaker 2: But those are probably not very exciting. Those are great.
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: Those are great selections though, that you've shared. That's awesome.
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: Now since you talked about your favorite guide books earlier
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: or some of your favorite ones. What are some of
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: the guidebooks that you like, or maybe even the overland
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: training and concept books that you really like. What are
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: some of your favorites.
• 38:54
  Speaker 3: The one that you saw this morning, which is definitely
• 38:56
  Speaker 3: my favorite guidebook, it's Utah Backcountry Byway. Tony Hugel is
• 39:01
  Speaker 3: the author, and he doesn't just have a Utah guidebook.
• 39:05
  Speaker 3: He's done Done Colorado, Nevada, Desert, California. There's like six
• 39:11
  Speaker 3: within his Backcountry Byway series and I have all of them,
• 39:16
  Speaker 3: and it's just a very easyly understood, straightforward I feel
• 39:20
  Speaker 3: like the information isn't hidden, you know, it's like getting
• 39:23
  Speaker 3: there all right, I got to the beginning of the road,
• 39:26
  Speaker 3: what to see on the road, milemark numbers and average
• 39:29
  Speaker 3: times and difficulty and obviously the difficulty changes. But I've
• 39:33
  Speaker 3: really appreciated just how well laid out that book is,
• 39:36
  Speaker 3: or all of.
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: Them, because it's all in the same style.
• 39:39
  Speaker 3: The mark Kelly one's for Utah, but that's more like
• 39:41
  Speaker 3: technical like mountaineering and stuff like that. But I have
• 39:44
  Speaker 3: a climbing background too, so I have that interest, so
• 39:46
  Speaker 3: I really appreciate those. I think those books are harder
• 39:49
  Speaker 3: to understand because the information is not laid out well.
• 39:53
  Speaker 2: But the information is there. It's just a matter of
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: figuring out what he's.
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: Saying deciphering it. Yeah, if you were now you've had
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: all this experience and you've become a trainer, and you've
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: done this trip to Alaska, if you were able to
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: sit down your twenty two year old self that just
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: bought this land cruiser and give her some advice, what
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: would be It doesn't have to be you, anyone that's
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: new to overlanding, now that you've had these experiences, what
• 40:21
  Speaker 1: advice would you give them? What were some of your
• 40:23
  Speaker 1: takeaways or lessons learned or you think was most important?
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: Just do it.
• 40:28
  Speaker 3: Get out there, get exploring, see your environment, interact with
• 40:32
  Speaker 3: your environment, understand how to protect it as well. I've
• 40:35
  Speaker 3: always I've always kind of had that stewardship kind of
• 40:39
  Speaker 3: in me. I used to be on the executive committee
• 40:41
  Speaker 3: for Surf Wrider Foundation in the Santa Barbara chapter, and
• 40:44
  Speaker 3: we did a lot of pollution issues, land use issues,
• 40:47
  Speaker 3: So protecting the areas that we all love has always
• 40:50
  Speaker 3: been really important to me. Just getting out there and
• 40:53
  Speaker 3: doing it and connecting with where we are, I think
• 40:56
  Speaker 3: is just so important. I wouldn't necessarily tell younger me, like, oh,
• 41:01
  Speaker 3: avoid doing this or don't do this, because that's been
• 41:04
  Speaker 3: half the fun is just figuring out this life and
• 41:07
  Speaker 3: this process. And I've learned so much about myself that
• 41:12
  Speaker 3: that's why I appreciate this kind of travel so much
• 41:15
  Speaker 3: as well, is because I am who I am today
• 41:17
  Speaker 3: because of those hardships, because of learning on the road,
• 41:21
  Speaker 3: because of seeing these other environments. It all comes together
• 41:24
  Speaker 3: into who I am now. And I still have a
• 41:26
  Speaker 3: lot to learn, and I hope to have many, many
• 41:28
  Speaker 3: years to learn. I think it's just so important to
• 41:31
  Speaker 3: get out there and experience life, and the lessons will come,
• 41:35
  Speaker 3: and they should come and be open to lessons.
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: Maybe that's it. Do it and be open to learning.
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: That's great advice, Maggie. And if people wanted to learn
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: more about seven P and if they wanted to learn
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: more about you, where can they find that information?
• 41:50
  Speaker 3: Easiest way for me is on Instagram at Maggie McDermott's.
• 41:55
  Speaker 3: You'll get a mix of there's going to be off
• 41:57
  Speaker 3: roading and overlanding, but there's also going to be my
• 41:59
  Speaker 3: dog and horses and a lot of hiking, but just
• 42:02
  Speaker 3: generally outdoors. But if you guys have any questions, reach
• 42:05
  Speaker 3: out to me there. If you want to learn more
• 42:07
  Speaker 3: about seven P. Their instagram is seven P and it's
• 42:10
  Speaker 3: just the number seven, the letter P is and Paul
• 42:13
  Speaker 3: four by four and that's a great way to learn
• 42:15
  Speaker 3: about seven P and the websites up there as well.
• 42:18
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much for being on the podcast. Your
• 42:21
  Speaker 1: story is an inspiration and I think that you have
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: done already so much good for the industry. I'm thankful
• 42:27
  Speaker 1: that you're in it, and I just I look forward
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: to seeing what you're going to accomplish over the decades
• 42:32
  Speaker 1: to come and the journeys that you're going to take
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: with your land cruisers around the world. Maybe we'll have
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: you on the podcast up for your next big journey.
• 42:38
  Speaker 2: So thank you so much.
• 42:40
  Speaker 3: I've so enjoyed this entire week and being able to
• 42:43
  Speaker 3: sit here and have this conversation with you.
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: So thank you.
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: You're welcome, Maggie, Thank you again, and thanks everyone for listening.