Latest / Coffee People Podcast / Ibrahem Dalatte, Hands-On Coffee and Mooala Ambassador

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Ibrahem Dalatte, Hands-On Coffee and Mooala Ambassador · Coffee People Podcast

• 0:26
  Yeah, no problems. I'm pretty sure that I saw your
• 0:31
  name tag, but welcome to the coffee people.
• 0:33
  Podcast, Hi. Do you mind telling us the only
• 0:37
  time you have to look at the camera, who we are and why
• 0:40
  you're here at Coffee Fest, who you're working with?
• 0:42
  Hi, my name is Ibrahim Donetti, but a lot of people call me EB
• 0:46
  in the coffee industry right now.
• 0:49
  I'm out here at Coffee Fest with Mualla brands showcasing
• 0:53
  alternative notes for Steven. OK been a part of the coffee
• 0:57
  community for well towards a decade now.
• 1:01
  You know, competitive latte art, catering, been through UPS, low
• 1:08
  UPS, downs, lefts rights, the cheat codes to all things
• 1:11
  coffee. And I just love to take any
• 1:14
  opportunity to travel around and be surrounded by like minded
• 1:17
  people. And you know what?
• 1:19
  Better places than the coffee conventions just like best.
• 1:21
  That is definitely true. Alternative milks and latte art.
• 1:26
  Most people say they don't go together.
• 1:28
  Thoughts. So I think that kind of
• 1:33
  response. Usually stereotypical thinking.
• 1:35
  I apologize. No, no, no, no, You're good.
• 1:38
  The stereotypical thinking is for people that I'm going to be
• 1:42
  a little blunt, don't care to get better.
• 1:44
  Oh, OK, yeah. So, so, so the whole thing is
• 1:48
  like, if you, if you are disinterested at something in
• 1:53
  your core, no matter how much you like work at it, your
• 1:57
  progression is probably going to be slower compared to someone
• 2:00
  who's a lot more interested in it, right?
• 2:02
  Sure. So with latte art, I fell in
• 2:04
  love with it right away. I was really like, how do I get
• 2:07
  better at every single thing? At first, the toughest milk for
• 2:10
  me was almond milk. It was really hard at first,
• 2:13
  right? Much thinner, waterier.
• 2:16
  You got to let it sit. But then what do I do?
• 2:20
  I focus so much time at getting good at almond and then milk
• 2:23
  that like suddenly I like there was like a little running joke
• 2:28
  back home in the in the competitive scene where I became
• 2:32
  like the almond milk master. So it's like if it was an almond
• 2:36
  milk round, you better help you get me because like they're
• 2:39
  sorry I was going to win. You can alternative milks in
• 2:44
  general, even like right now. Muala, do you mind if I Muala
• 2:48
  just opened up their barista blend banana milk that they just
• 2:52
  launched this weekend And you know, people wouldn't be like
• 2:56
  banana milk skeptically, but it seems great.
• 2:59
  Like, you know, alternative. Every milk has a place in latte
• 3:03
  art. You just have to learn the sweet
• 3:06
  spots because No2 milks are the same.
• 3:08
  No, no two espresso machine steam powers are the same.
• 3:12
  No2 consistencies and cartoons are the same.
• 3:16
  It's all 80% texture and then the rest is technique.
• 3:20
  I'll put my hand back where I think it was continuity on, on
• 3:26
  that note of the texture and like the focusing on almond for
• 3:30
  a while and the what was the banana flavour?
• 3:32
  Banana milk, banana milk. You're here in a convention
• 3:37
  hall. How important is it that you get
• 3:40
  time to practice on the machine? Obviously you have experience in
• 3:43
  your skill and you can jump faster than someone who does it,
• 3:46
  but do you? Especially with alternative
• 3:48
  milk, do you think it's important to know the machine
• 3:51
  before you step behind, or can you apply similar techniques
• 3:55
  across the board? I mean, brewing and doing well
• 3:59
  in this type of setting has got to be challenging.
• 4:01
  So you could definitely do similar techniques across the
• 4:04
  board when it comes to any kind of machine.
• 4:05
  Right now, while I say no to machines are the same, it's
• 4:10
  true, but not in the way that it's impossible to adapt to
• 4:15
  certain machines. In fact, in the competitive
• 4:17
  latte art field, you go to different local coffee shops
• 4:22
  with different machines from yours.
• 4:24
  Sometimes the machines, like you could have the two same exact
• 4:28
  machines at different shops, but one was maintained, 1 wasn't.
• 4:35
  So what's going to happen with the unmaintained one?
• 4:36
  Maybe it's weaker and steam pressure than like the one
• 4:39
  that's going to maintain well at another shop.
• 4:41
  Maybe one group had portable to your pores faster than the
• 4:45
  other, right? It's all about adaptability,
• 4:48
  which at first might be a little tricky, right?
• 4:51
  Like a lot of home people, like the most common comment I get
• 4:56
  whenever I serve lattes at the shop, right?
• 5:01
  I'll always hear, wow, I can't get my latte art to look like
• 5:05
  this at home. And I'm like, Oh well, what do
• 5:07
  you steam on? And they'll say something like
• 5:09
  rebel like like no hate to rebel, obviously like really
• 5:12
  great home machine for people starting off their coffee
• 5:16
  journey. But in terms of mechanics
• 5:19
  compared to La Morazuka? Right.
• 5:22
  Or Slayer right? You you can't expect the same
• 5:27
  consistency if you steam the exact way on a Breville versus
• 5:32
  lawnmower is. Well sure, one is designed to
• 5:35
  make a couple of coffees a day maybe, and the other ones
• 5:37
  designed to be a workhorse and has the skill thing.
• 5:40
  Exactly. Yeah.
• 5:42
  So it's like I always tell people with Breville, you got to
• 5:45
  be a little more patient. You got to take the time to
• 5:47
  really learn how to hit that sweet spot and then just
• 5:51
  whatever you learn with that sweet spot on the Breville is
• 5:54
  not going to be translated to a La Marzoco because like people
• 5:58
  will be like, Dang, I let it sit way too long because on the
• 6:01
  Breville, that's what you have to do, right?
• 6:03
  Versus if you're going from La Marzoco to rebel, they're going
• 6:07
  to be like, wow, I let that sit way too short because on La
• 6:10
  Marzoco, that's what you have to do.
• 6:12
  What is the appeal for you to work events like this, sharing
• 6:16
  new products outside of all the money?
• 6:18
  I'm assuming you're collecting on the back end.
• 6:21
  But besides that, like when you're communicating with people
• 6:24
  or you're showing them the skill set that you have, what you
• 6:28
  know, why do you do this? I think the deeper answer to
• 6:32
  that is to bring hospitality back to the hospitality
• 6:37
  industry. I think coffee is one of those
• 6:41
  things that in which it's true hospitality because you're face
• 6:48
  to face with people every single day.
• 6:50
  It's like being a bar bartender, but like more PG13, right?
• 6:54
  And one thing I've noticed across the years is that
• 6:58
  hospitality has been dying in the hospitality industry itself.
• 7:03
  You got people behind your bars, like unable to like even produce
• 7:07
  a smile or like have a conversation.
• 7:09
  And it's just kind of like, what can I get you?
• 7:10
  All right, cool. This is your total right.
• 7:15
  I try to always be hospitable and show that it's fun to be in
• 7:20
  the coffee industry because I think it is one of the funnest
• 7:23
  industries that you could potentially be in.
• 7:26
  If you're willing to like showcase hospitality and
• 7:30
  enthusiasm and people come back specifically for you because
• 7:34
  they notice that you are the one that brings like the joy to it.
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  I, I always say there's no such thing, there's no such thing
• 7:43
  necessarily as like a bad cafe, but there's definitely bad
• 7:47
  baristas like people that like just don't bring that.
• 7:52
  And I've noticed that. Do you think?
• 7:55
  Do you? Think that loss in the
• 7:56
  hospitality sector of the hospitality part as you as
• 7:59
  you're describing it, do you think there's a reason for it?
• 8:02
  Do you think it is a of experience, a lack of caring, a
• 8:06
  changing of how businesses? Run I.
• 8:10
  Was in a cafe recently as an example.
• 8:12
  Never been there before. Seemed to have a pretty hopping
• 8:16
  crowd and it was noticed on the tables they had little signs
• 8:20
  that said to, to bust your own table essentially.
• 8:24
  Which, okay, I I get it. But also, it's one of those
• 8:28
  little hospitality things of like, when I came in, there
• 8:31
  wasn't a clean table for me to sit down at, right?
• 8:34
  Those are little things that might have not been accepted 15
• 8:38
  years ago, but now seem much more common.
• 8:40
  That's not the only place I've been there that no shame to
• 8:42
  that. But why do you think hospitality
• 8:46
  seems to be lacking in personality and generally that
• 8:50
  you think could maybe come back? So 1, I think one of the biggest
• 8:57
  factors was when COVID happened, right?
• 9:01
  Yeah. And everyone got put in like
• 9:04
  into these glass jars and could not interact.
• 9:07
  Especially if you were like younger, you spent a good couple
• 9:10
  of years not interacting with anybody and everything was all
• 9:13
  mine, all that society doesn't like like obviously societally
• 9:19
  it's like recovered a bit, but I don't think it just like
• 9:23
  recovers like like that, especially for the generation
• 9:26
  that mostly new screens for the better part of like 2 to three
• 9:29
  years, right, right. And now those younger people are
• 9:32
  now in the working class, unable to kind of like interact with
• 9:37
  people. For me, I've always been an
• 9:38
  extrovert, always. So when COVID happened to me, I
• 9:42
  felt like a butterfly in a glass, like a social butterfly
• 9:44
  in a glass jar, just like, let me out, let me out, let me out.
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  I can see people I'm I like, I can't do this.
• 9:50
  But even then, introversion got worse and people that were
• 9:54
  extroverts fell a little bit into the introversion thing
• 9:59
  because there was no need to like Co regulate or like charge
• 10:04
  batteries off of. So I think that was one thing
• 10:06
  that was like a big part of it, right?
• 10:08
  But then there's also kind of just like this new motion from
• 10:16
  like the younger working class of not burning yourself out for
• 10:22
  a pay that's not worth it, which I can agree to to an extent.
• 10:26
  And then there's the opposite end of businesses this like
• 10:31
  businesses poorly staffing and burning out what staff they do
• 10:37
  have in order to cut back on labor hours in which I'm kind of
• 10:41
  like, I'm someone that's kind of like, if you can't afford to
• 10:44
  staff your place properly at some point compared to like,
• 10:48
  like I've watched people solo mass rushes before and I'm
• 10:52
  always, I'm, I'm always a very heavy, like they should never
• 10:56
  only be one person behind the coffee bar person because
• 11:00
  they're still side work. Yeah, there's dishes, there's
• 11:04
  dishes, there's, there's garbage, there's all that stuff.
• 11:09
  Now you got you hope. We're back.
• 11:19
  We're talking about staffing. Yeah, yeah.
• 11:22
  So for me, I'm always like, like obviously on super slower days
• 11:26
  is different. I'm like, I, I know I see both
• 11:29
  ends, right. But if you actively know like
• 11:32
  your hours and like what your peak times are and don't like
• 11:36
  staff people accordingly to them, and you burn out your
• 11:39
  staff and then you end up losing more staff than you can keep.
• 11:43
  And then your experienced staff are leaving before your new
• 11:45
  staff is properly trained enough to handle the load that you're
• 11:49
  more experienced outfit. I I feel like this is like a
• 11:52
  very like like key thing in the coffee industry itself.
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  Like that's the most common thing.
• 11:58
  How much of that is that there's not enough staff to go around?
• 12:02
  As more and more people want to be coffee shop owners, coffee
• 12:05
  roasters, they want to get into that industry.
• 12:09
  I think. Is there, is there a feeder
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  program like Starbucks? A lot of people got their start
• 12:15
  there. They learned some basics.
• 12:16
  They moved on to a specialty new another thing like a lot of our
• 12:21
  industry leaders got their start in a place like that.
• 12:24
  Is there that type of feeder system now as companies are
• 12:29
  going into a business where labor costs are changing because
• 12:32
  the expectation and the need for what people get paid is
• 12:35
  changing? Yes, definitely.
• 12:38
  But there's also like this like hidden agenda.
• 12:41
  I've seen a lot of coffee shops on her do this and they've never
• 12:43
  pans well. Lack of transparency, assuming
• 12:47
  that staff with seniority will just train, train the newer ones
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  automatically because you don't want that weekly on your shift
• 12:58
  because then it's difficult to kind of maneuver around, right?
• 13:01
  So they'll just rely on that without promoting people without
• 13:06
  like, you know, giving activity like active training.
• 13:09
  Yeah, right. Which also burns out the person
• 13:12
  that like, you know, it has the seniority because they're not
• 13:14
  getting paid to train, but now have to because otherwise the
• 13:18
  choice is this other person's inexperienced and essentially
• 13:22
  not helpful to you. You got to help the person be
• 13:26
  helpful to you on your shift, right?
• 13:28
  Which is mutual burnout. In that point, you know, do you
• 13:35
  have a something, a piece of advice that you would offer?
• 13:39
  Like we we're talking a little bit about what the problems are.
• 13:42
  What piece of advice would you offer anyone listening or
• 13:45
  watching? Love what you do.
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  I, I think that is ultimately like the, the biggest thing I, I
• 13:55
  the most positive person, when surrounded by negativity all the
• 13:59
  time, will slowly become worn out and lose themselves in that
• 14:04
  negativity and probably become negative themselves.
• 14:08
  I'm I am guilty of that myself because when you're in it, you
• 14:12
  don't realize you're in it. You don't see it.
• 14:14
  And then when you get out of that environment, you just kind
• 14:18
  of look back at yourself and you're like, man, what was I?
• 14:23
  What was I doing? And I've definitely done that
• 14:24
  more than once in the environments that I'm in.
• 14:29
  If you don't love what you're doing, why are you like, I like,
• 14:33
  I get it. Jobs are like a thing.
• 14:35
  It's like if you don't love what you're doing, it's ultimately
• 14:40
  going to wear out yourself out. And I think that's why a lot of
• 14:44
  people are unconsciously happy in the industries that they're
• 14:48
  in. Coffee is one of those things
• 14:50
  that in particular that is so meticulous that you have to love
• 14:55
  it to a degree. Otherwise, it's just like, you
• 14:58
  wake up, yeah, let's say you're a roaster.
• 15:01
  You wake up, go roast some beans, you're like, that's good
• 15:04
  enough. But did you taste them?
• 15:06
  Did you, like, practice with them?
• 15:07
  You really Like, don't you care about making sure like, you're
• 15:10
  putting out the best of yourself and your product anymore?
• 15:14
  Love what you do so that it shows and what you do.
• 15:17
  Because like, like with me in particular, you know, a lot of
• 15:21
  people say they could taste the love in what I do and stuff like
• 15:24
  that, that that compliment could mean the world to me, you know?
• 15:27
  I really wanted to say we're not that kind of show.
• 15:30
  So I guess. Love what you do.
• 15:32
  Love what you do, that love, show that love, because that's
• 15:35
  what brings people back. Yeah.
• 15:37
  To like everything. And then like, like, even people
• 15:42
  who aren't as enthused will see your enthusiasm and it rushes
• 15:48
  off. Yeah.
• 15:49
  He inspires love, love. What you do because if you are
• 15:54
  not leading every single day, loving what you do and there are
• 15:58
  days that it will be harder of. Course, you don't have to love
• 16:01
  every minute. Yeah, you don't have to love
• 16:02
  every minute, but I always say with the coffee industry, it's
• 16:05
  still stressful, but I'd rather take the stress of the coffee
• 16:09
  industry than the stress of something I wouldn't want to do,
• 16:12
  like being a corporate banker or something like that.
• 16:13
  I don't think like that would overwhelm me because I'm not
• 16:16
  passionate about that. At least I'm passionate about
• 16:19
  coffee. So even like the not so great
• 16:21
  days are still great days. Yeah, love what you do.
• 16:26
  No bad days on the mountain. That's how I always feel.
• 16:30
  I know time is of the essence. You got this thing going on.
• 16:34
  There's a lot going on. Last question for you.
• 16:38
  You get a free moment sometime this week.
• 16:41
  You you wander into a new coffee shop that looks like they know
• 16:44
  what they're doing. What are you going to order?
• 16:48
  I like to order the most basic thing that you can order and
• 16:54
  then the more complex, it's not really complex.
• 16:59
  Iced vanilla latte with a double shot of espresso on the side.
• 17:05
  Iced vanilla latte because I feel like that is the hardest
• 17:07
  drink to mess up on any menu. It is so common.
• 17:10
  It is like literally the the basic thing that you can find at
• 17:14
  any. Your money maker?
• 17:15
  Yeah. So it's like if I drink it and
• 17:17
  it's a bad vanilla latte, I'm probably not going to come back.
• 17:22
  Right, but you risk it with the espresso on the side right away.
• 17:26
  Double shot to see if they dial in.
• 17:29
  OK. Because it kind of goes back to
• 17:32
  the there's the baristas who care and the baristas to who
• 17:34
  don't. Yeah.
• 17:36
  If the if if the shot taste dialed in, then like I know it's
• 17:40
  a good shot because like the breeze, there are baristas that
• 17:42
  like care. Yeah, you know, I always find it
• 17:45
  interesting. And it's, it's like a weird
• 17:47
  double standard. The place that I know does
• 17:50
  really good work and really does care.
• 17:52
  If I go in and it's a little bit less than normal, I'm much more
• 17:56
  likely to notice it than when I go to the place that's just OK
• 17:59
  because I know they care. Like what happened to Like, I'll
• 18:02
  actually be like, are you OK? There's something going on with
• 18:05
  you today because I know how good you are.
• 18:07
  Yeah, I know. And you know, every shop has
• 18:10
  like it's off days for like other reasons, rushes things
• 18:13
  like that. I've messed up behind the bar
• 18:15
  when I like have a good drinks, drink so many so many times.
• 18:18
  It's just a matter of like a daytime, the barista like, you
• 18:22
  know, it's all it's all a factor.
• 18:24
  But overall, like if you're a regular at a shop and you notice
• 18:28
  the shop has an off day, you're still likely to go back the next
• 18:31
  day because you know. Yeah, that it's.
• 18:33
  Probably going to be better. They do what?
• 18:35
  They do before we let you go, is there?
• 18:38
  How can people follow what you do or learn more about your
• 18:41
  latte art or. Is there?
• 18:43
  Anything you want to pitch and promote so we can share the
• 18:45
  audience? You could always follow my
• 18:48
  barista Gram at Ibrahim under Score de Latte.
• 18:55
  DA latte. DA latte and then the first name
• 18:58
  is IBRAHEM under score de latte, and that's my for Instagram for
• 19:05
  like my latte art or like when I visit other coffee shops hoping
• 19:09
  like to get like in the mindset of like making like, you know,
• 19:12
  more influencer type content of like going to shops like talking
• 19:16
  about things and talking about more hospitality type.
• 19:19
  You grew up in the wrong generation.
• 19:21
  At the school my life works at, they have an influencer program.
• 19:24
  Really. It's an elementary.
• 19:25
  School that's actually crazy. That is the craziest thing I've
• 19:28
  ever heard. Elementary school influencers.
• 19:31
  Ibrahim, pleasure to meet. You pleasure to meet you man.
• 19:34
  Thank you so much for having me. Yeah, it's a real thing.
• 20:19
  The. I mean, to be fair, she was, we
• 20:31
  were in California, but like. I'm from.
• 20:33
  Southern California, yeah, they have a whole influencer summer
• 20:36
  program, so you can do like a three-week thing where your kid
• 20:39
  can learn how to do vlogs, vlogs, Instagram, TikTok.
• 20:44
  Yeah, it's a whole thing. That's insane.
• 20:46
  The only thing any kid wants to do now as a job is be an
• 20:50
  influencer or YouTube. That's like the number one thing
• 20:52
  that they say and it's become real.
• 20:55
  It's a real, it's the real world.
• 20:57
  It is. It is.
• 20:59
  Are you?